# Doxa Sub 300T



## jonny deacon (Jan 6, 2016)

Hey guys --- new to Doxa, and the current offering of the Sub 300T has recently caught me eye ---

Any experience with this model? Thoughts?

Leaning toward the Caribbean or the Aquamarine dial btw

















Thanks gentlemen!


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## Heuer (Dec 22, 2007)

I vote for the Caribbean. I think the aqua might get old quickly.


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## devmartin (Nov 27, 2017)

I have one of the newer model 300t prod and I love it. The fit and finish is really are very well done. I can't see it ever leaving my collection. I agree between those two go for the Caribbean but that's me go with your gut. 

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## Bob Dobbs needs Slack (Oct 18, 2016)

Heuer said:


> I vote for the Caribbean. I think the aqua might get old quickly.


I ended up with a Project Aware 1500T in the aqua dial... I found it piss cheap and had intended to flip it.

Within a few minutes of arrival, it was a keeper. That aquamarine dial is really striking.
Most commented upon watch by females of the species by far.... and the comments have all been positive.

The Aqua does require a bit of thought on clothing matches, but it really is a unique and very nice looking color overall.


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## nitron135 (Jul 6, 2017)

+1 for Caribbean, the new orange fish on the crown is the same for all varieties and would fit in better with the Caribbean bezel/handset. But really have to go with what you are gravitating to, that’s the only right choice.


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## MKN (Mar 27, 2012)

I was all set on buying a Professional 300T as soon as they start shipping from Germany to EU (end of April) but then I learned that they use Standard grade 2824-2s and just doesn’t time with the asking price. 
Quite disappointed 


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## Anders_Flint (Jan 26, 2019)

I've got the 300T professional, I love it, really solidly built, the dial printing is flawless (unlike some much more expensive brands.. looking at you Rolex!), it keeps better than cosc time too at just +4s per day. However it's not perfect, the lume is rubbish and the bezel has a bit of side to side play, although, none of those are a deal breaker. 
Some folks have also said they didn't like the engraved and painted crown, but to be fair I'd rather have a small painted Jenny fish on the crown compared to the massive caseback filling one on the 1200t, but each to their own.

+I dont think they're using standard grade 2824-2s, more likley elabore or top grades, is there an easy way to tell? Looking at the movt in mine, its using an Incabloc shock (+decorated bridges and rotor) so I wouldnt have thought standard grade, unless they've just dressed it up.


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## nitron135 (Jul 6, 2017)

Anders_Flint said:


> I've got the 300T professional, I love it, really solidly built, the dial printing is flawless (unlike some much more expensive brands.. looking at you Rolex!), it keeps better than cosc time too at just +4s per day. However it's not perfect, the lume is rubbish and the bezel has a bit of side to side play, although, none of those are a deal breaker.
> Some folks have also said they didn't like the engraved and painted crown, but to be fair I'd rather have a small painted Jenny fish on the crown compared to the massive caseback filling one on the 1200t, but each to their own.
> 
> +I dont think they're using standard grade 2824-2s, more likley elabore or top grades, is there an easy way to tell? Looking at the movt in mine, its using an Incabloc shock (+decorated bridges and rotor) so I wouldnt have thought standard grade, unless they've just dressed it up.
> ...


Could you pass along a movt photo?


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## Anders_Flint (Jan 26, 2019)

nitron135 said:


> Could you pass along a movt photo?


Sorry, i would, but she's since been resealed and pressure tested (only to 100m as that's all my tester will go to) and I'd rather not take the back off again if I dont have to, maybe when shes a little less new and precious I'll take another look (and make sure to snap a pic).

When I took it off the first time, I admit I'd had a few to drink and my curiosity got the better of me, I instantly wished I hadn't.

I never thought to snap a pic when I took the back off first time round, just had a quick look, slapped some silicone grease on the gasket and closed it back up.

For anyone else with one, who is willing to take their caseback off, I'd strongly recommend a Burgeon 8008, took mine off without issue and being a ball, didnt leave scratches!


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## MKN (Mar 27, 2012)

Anders_Flint said:


> I've got the 300T professional, I love it, really solidly built, the dial printing is flawless (unlike some much more expensive brands.. looking at you Rolex!), it keeps better than cosc time too at just +4s per day. However it's not perfect, the lume is rubbish and the bezel has a bit of side to side play, although, none of those are a deal breaker.
> Some folks have also said they didn't like the engraved and painted crown, but to be fair I'd rather have a small painted Jenny fish on the crown compared to the massive caseback filling one on the 1200t, but each to their own.
> 
> +I dont think they're using standard grade 2824-2s, more likley elabore or top grades, is there an easy way to tell? Looking at the movt in mine, its using an Incabloc shock (+decorated bridges and rotor) so I wouldnt have thought standard grade, unless they've just dressed it up.
> ...


Thats quite interesting- I just had an email from Doxa stating that they use Standard grade in the 300T.

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## Anders_Flint (Jan 26, 2019)

MadsNilsson said:


> Thats quite interesting- I just had an email from Doxa stating that they use Standard grade in the 300T.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


I guess it could be a standard grade but with a few polished bridges, and a different balance shock, it wouldnt be the first time a company has sharpened up a cheaper movt. For me at least I'm not too bothered, as long as the timekeeping is good (which it is).


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## MKN (Mar 27, 2012)

Anders_Flint said:


> I guess it could be a standard grade but with a few polished bridges, and a different balance shock, it wouldnt be the first time a company has sharpened up a cheaper movt. For me at least I'm not too bothered, as long as the timekeeping is good (which it is).


I guess you are right, I just feel more comfortable with this price point when the movement grade is a bit higher.

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## MJM (Sep 16, 2009)

Been a doxa fan for years. Currently without one but been thinking of getting another. They are tough and the bracelets are crazy comfy. Honestly many folks beat them up and scratch them and they still look cool. They’re an adventure watch at a reasonable price. 


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## devmartin (Nov 27, 2017)

nitron135 said:


> Could you pass along a movt photo?


This is movement shots of the current 300t I have no idea how to tell the different levels though.









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## nitron135 (Jul 6, 2017)

Thanks posting! That looks like incabloc shock protection which would point to ‘Top’ grade rather than standard. Others with more knowledge can correct me..

Perhaps they are using the top grade movements they have left and then switching to standard?

Either way, Doxa does not go overboard in the decoration..


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## Anders_Flint (Jan 26, 2019)

Good shots, at least someone had the common sense to snap a pic while the caseback was off!

Just to add to the confusion though, mine was slightly different, same Incabloc shock, but my rotor had an orange Jenny fish on it, and the top bridge was polished.. beginning to get the feeling they're just using whatever they can lay their hands on!


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## MKN (Mar 27, 2012)

That really is very strange - two kinds of Top grade movement and a CD who states Standard grade. 
I think I’ll write them again and ask for clarification


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## sticky (Apr 5, 2013)

Those were the two colours I struggled with - in the end I went Caribbean and have been very pleased with the watch.


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## nitron135 (Jul 6, 2017)

Anders_Flint said:


> Good shots, at least someone had the common sense to snap a pic while the caseback was off!
> 
> Just to add to the confusion though, mine was slightly different, same Incabloc shock, but my rotor had an orange Jenny fish on it, and the top bridge was polished.. beginning to get the feeling they're just using whatever they can lay their hands on!


Do you have a picture of yours by chance? Would be nice to start tracking.


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## jonny deacon (Jan 6, 2016)

Appreciate the input gentlemen - order has landed and I must say, I'm truly impressed with the 300T - now I "get" Doxa, the allure - these are a lot of fun -

Unfortunately made the mistake of ordering both dials, so I could see 'em, make the right choice, etc -

And now I have 2 Doxas haha


















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## devmartin (Nov 27, 2017)

"The mistake" hahaha funny. Those look awesome enjoy them!

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## MJM (Sep 16, 2009)

Are you average or do you like to stand apart? 


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## nitron135 (Jul 6, 2017)

jonny deacon said:


> Appreciate the input gentlemen - order has landed and I must say, I'm truly impressed with the 300T - now I "get" Doxa, the allure - these are a lot of fun -
> 
> Unfortunately made the mistake of ordering both dials, so I could see 'em, make the right choice, etc -
> 
> ...


Whoa, nice! They do read so very differently, hard to tell that it's the same model.


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## Anders_Flint (Jan 26, 2019)

jonny deacon said:


> Appreciate the input gentlemen - order has landed and I must say, I'm truly impressed with the 300T - now I "get" Doxa, the allure - these are a lot of fun -
> 
> Unfortunately made the mistake of ordering both dials, so I could see 'em, make the right choice, etc -
> 
> ...


That aquamarine looks stunning, and to be fair, so does the Caribbean, I'd keep both


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## NYMets0018 (Aug 9, 2019)

How is the movement running? Anything noticeable with being fast or slow?


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## Kirkawall (Mar 28, 2015)

Mine is around -3/4spd. Pretty good for a 2992A2 and easy to regulate to even tighter tolerances. All my DOXAs have run close to COSC or better, and maintain that over time. Dates also switch over at midnight or just before.


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## nitron135 (Jul 6, 2017)

Kirkawall said:


> Mine is around -3/4spd. Pretty good for a 2992A2 and easy to regulate to even tighter tolerances. All my DOXAs have run close to COSC or better, and maintain that over time. Dates also switch over at midnight or just before.


300T is 2824..


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## jonny deacon (Jan 6, 2016)

devmartin said:


> "The mistake" hahaha funny. Those look awesome enjoy them!
> 
> Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk





nitron135 said:


> Whoa, nice! They do read so very differently, hard to tell that it's the same model.





Anders_Flint said:


> That aquamarine looks stunning, and to be fair, so does the Caribbean, I'd keep both


Thanks gents ---

The Caribbean blue dial paired with the orange/white accents is pretty special, and will readily admit that offering is more apt for daily wear. The blue changes from a very deep navy indoors to a dark royal in direct sunlight. If I had to pick one, I'd say this would be tough not to crown.

Really thought the Aquamarine would go back, but that Tiffany blue is truly eye-catching, and stickers were soon removed. Really a shade of turquoise that is difficult to grasp until you see it in person --- just be warned! Should look great with a summer tan, this one flat out makes me smile ---

Quick note between the two that I've noticed --- the dial of the Aquamarine appears ever-so-slightly larger, though of course they are the same size. I realize lighter dials normally wear a bit bigger, but here I think the illusion has to do with the hour markers. The Caribbean hour plots are outlined in white, the Aquamarine in black. The Aquamarine markers appear slimmed, the Caribbean fatter, the latter of which appears to eat more dial. Both looks are slick - just a fun nuance between 'em, and one that is certainly handy when you are attempting to talk yourself into both 



NYMets0018 said:


> How is the movement running? Anything noticeable with being fast or slow?


Both performing well within COSC --- got one at +3/spd and one is dead spot on --- not too shabby for the ol' 2824 --- do it Doxa


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## MKN (Mar 27, 2012)

I’m case anyone cares I followed up with Doxa CS about movement grades. They say that some of the early models might have been assembled with elaboré grade but they are supposed to only contain standard grade ones going forward. 
Seems pretty ridiculous.


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## nitron135 (Jul 6, 2017)

MadsNilsson said:


> I'm case anyone cares I followed up with Doxa CS about movement grades. They say that some of the early models might have been assembled with elaboré grade but they are supposed to only contain standard grade ones going forward.
> Seems pretty ridiculous.
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


As we guessed. Congrats to everyone who snagged an early model.


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## Anders_Flint (Jan 26, 2019)

MadsNilsson said:


> I'm case anyone cares I followed up with Doxa CS about movement grades. They say that some of the early models might have been assembled with elaboré grade but they are supposed to only contain standard grade ones going forward.
> Seems pretty ridiculous.
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


That makes it even more confusing since the one pictured definitely doesnt look like an elabore grade (no bridge decorations), and since it has an Incabloc shock it doesnt appear to be standard either.

The only explaination I can think of, is that they've ordered standard grade movements then upgraded the shock and balance wheel, otherwise, the movement pictured looks to be an undecorated top grade 2824-2.

I guess I could be mis-remembering my grades though (please correct me if I am wrong), but from what I recall of visual identification clues for the grades:

*Standard=* undecorated / etachoc shock / balance wheel with straight spokes
*Elabore=* decorated but otherwise identical to standard
*Top=* can be decorated or not / incabloc shock / balance with flared spokes
*COSC=* identical to top but with a stamped serial to indicate it's been sent for certification.

I guess if it is standard grade, that puts it in line with previous models, 600T/1000T and 1200T all used standard grade, unless it was the limited run COSC variants.

Edit* there is another possibility, maybe eta have upped the specs of what is considered a standard model??


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## nitron135 (Jul 6, 2017)

I asked Doxa two years ago and all the movements were Top grade or COSC at the time.

The step down to Standard is a new (post-Marei) development for sure. I guess that’s also why they had stock of Top grades they were going through.


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## Anders_Flint (Jan 26, 2019)

nitron135 said:


> I asked Doxa two years ago and all the movements were Top grade or COSC at the time.
> 
> The step down to Standard is a new (post-Marei) development for sure. I guess that's also why they had stock of Top grades they were going through.


Well, this is a 1000T movement, it certainly looks to be standard grade, no decoration and etachoc shock.








This is the movement from the 2002 Marei reissue 300t, it looks to be a visual match for the one in the new 300t, no decoration, but the Incabloc shock.








_Both pics from doxa300t.com
_

The confusion continues, although it's a fascinating subject to research


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## MKN (Mar 27, 2012)

I am not a movement expert by any means but I have owned I un-decorated elaboré grade movements before. So I’m not sure that decoration alone is an indicator. 


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## MKN (Mar 27, 2012)

Anders_Flint said:


> Well, this is a 1000T movement, it certainly looks to be standard grade, no decoration and etachoc shock.
> View attachment 15017945
> 
> 
> ...


The Marei 300T in the second picture looks to have a nickel balance wheel (judging by the spokes) meaning standard or elaboré

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## Anders_Flint (Jan 26, 2019)

MadsNilsson said:


> The Marei 300T in the second picture looks to have a nickel balance wheel (judging by the spokes) meaning standard or elaboré
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Well spotted, I guess then if they were using standard/elabore movements with Incabloc shocks back in 2002, they probably still are


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## njhinde (Mar 25, 2017)

The fact that I can now order within Germany without loads of tax and customs hassles, far outweighs any questions about the movement for me. I would also normally only wear it for a couple of days at a time before switching to one of my other watches (at most for a couple of weeks whilst on holiday), so whilst accuracy is of course important, it is not a defining factor in my case.

Once this global situation calms down, Doxa is quite likely to receive some of my hard-earned cash. Or maybe Mühle-Glashütte (I also want a SAR), but that's for a different forum ;-)


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## drumcairn (May 8, 2019)

If it is standard grade as it seems to be then the 300T price (especially in Europe) really is ridiculous for the sum of its parts - are we all stupid!! LOL


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## MKN (Mar 27, 2012)

drumcairn said:


> If it is standard grade as it seems to be then the 300T price (especially in Europe) really is ridiculous for the sum of its parts - are we all stupid!! LOL


I quite agree. I can't abide by the price.

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## njhinde (Mar 25, 2017)

Ok, then I'm stupid ;-). I do accept your point though: it does seem expensive for a regular steel dive watch.

But still much better than what was previously about 2.4k in total (to order new, when in Europe)... now that was indeed a ridiculous price - for anyone outside the US.

And I guess that if I want the watch, and don't want to get fleeced on the 2nd hand market, it is what it is.


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## bricem13 (Apr 6, 2010)

To the Op congrats on the subs. How is the bezel action? some folks mentioned side to side play - I assume 3-9 kind of play. What is the general consensus on the bezel action?


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## FishTime (Jun 21, 2018)

For what it's worth, on the "Movement" tab of the Specs on Doxa's website it says "Decorated by Doxa":

https://doxawatches.com/products/sub-300-t

ETA 2824-2
Automatic, self-winding
38 hours Power Reserve
Frequency 28800.0 vph (4.0 hz)
25 Jewels
Decorated by DOXA

https://doxawatches.com/products/sub-300-t


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## saffron62 (Oct 26, 2017)

Do you mind if I ask your wrist size? I'm interested in the 300T but I'm apprehensive about the case size. I've read they wear small, which is good, but I don't have access to try one on. Thank you.


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## HAR (Feb 25, 2015)

The aquamarine dial looks stunning!


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## jonny deacon (Jan 6, 2016)

bricem13 said:


> To the Op congrats on the subs. How is the bezel action? some folks mentioned side to side play - I assume 3-9 kind of play. What is the general consensus on the bezel action?


bezel action is solid, but will admit it is a bit closer to Seiko than Rolex....more clicky than smooth, if that helps

there is a little 3-9 play/wiggle as well...but design/history/aesthetics/capability/fun factor far outweigh these minimal hiccups imo -- highly recommend the 300T



kreugal said:


> Do you mind if I ask your wrist size? I'm interested in the 300T but I'm apprehensive about the case size. I've read they wear small, which is good, but I don't have access to try one on. Thank you.


6 7/8 to 7, depending on the day's sodium take



HAR said:


> The aquamarine dial looks stunning!


thanks sir!


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## lonewitness (Mar 8, 2017)

Guys - I was thinking of getting the 300T orange dial but a bit confused by Doxa's past releases. I don't know how thick it is but is it worth waiting for a 2nd hand Sub300 etc? I am not a fan of the aqualung version as I prefer a cleaner dial.


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## FishTime (Jun 21, 2018)

lonewitness said:


> Guys - I was thinking of getting the 300T orange dial but a bit confused by Doxa's past releases. I don't know how thick it is but is it worth waiting for a 2nd hand Sub300 etc? I am not a fan of the aqualung version as I prefer a cleaner dial.


The new 300T is just a hair under 14mm thick. Case diameter is 42.5mm.


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## Smoke325 (Jan 17, 2016)

I just received my 300t sharkhunter and love it. Perfect size for my 7 inch wrist and very comfortable. With the turtle style case, much more comfortable than the seiko re issue. It’s a buck or two but you know where you spent that money.


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## HaiovR (May 1, 2020)

I would go for the Caribbean


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## Pegasus (Jan 23, 2008)

HaiovR said:


> I would go for the Caribbean


That's the one I've got, the dial is really nice.

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## Blue UT6 (Nov 4, 2008)

HAR said:


> The aquamarine dial looks stunning!


Yes it does. Even better with the matching strap.


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## Chronomatic (Jan 12, 2013)

Hey all! This watch recently caught my eye, particularly the orange version (“professional?”). Does anyone happen to know the lug width? I have a strict no non-20mm width due to my strap collection (haha) and would appreciate any insight. I didn’t readily see it on their website or on a google search. 

Also can anyone comment on the ability to swap straps on this bad boy? I have a slight issue with my 2020 Seamaster 300m in that the lug holes are too close to the case so it makes fitting straps difficult. I worry about this watch since it looks like it has short lugs. 

Finally, I tried looking at the second hand market to see if I can grab one for a good price. Everything seems likes it’s a special edition and the latest version of the 300t is scarce. Maybe that’s a testament to everyone wanting to keep theirs. 


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## nitron135 (Jul 6, 2017)

Chronomatic said:


> Hey all! This watch recently caught my eye, particularly the orange version ("professional?"). Does anyone happen to know the lug width? I have a strict no non-20mm width due to my strap collection (haha) and would appreciate any insight. I didn't readily see it on their website or on a google search.
> 
> Also can anyone comment on the ability to swap straps on this bad boy? I have a slight issue with my 2020 Seamaster 300m in that the lug holes are too close to the case so it makes fitting straps difficult. I worry about this watch since it looks like it has short lugs.
> 
> ...


20mm lugs. No special problems swapping straps.

Until recent 300T and the 200, everything was limited runs (though some were 1200 per color and never sold through). Latest 300T hasn't been out long and many people here prefer the 1200T that 300T is based on, perhaps look for those.. Haven't seen Doxa subs loose too much value yet though.


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## Chronomatic (Jan 12, 2013)

nitron135 said:


> 20mm lugs. No special problems swapping straps.
> 
> Until recent 300T and the 200, everything was limited runs (though some were 1200 per color and never sold through). Latest 300T hasn't been out long and many people here prefer the 1200T that 300T is based on, perhaps look for those.. Haven't seen Doxa subs loose too much value yet though.


Thank you for that! Is the 1200T thicker than the 300T? Why do people prefer it more?

Last question, is the 300T a domed crystal or flat? I think it's flat based on the stock photos. Is that why it's considered thinner than the 1200T?

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## Smoke325 (Jan 17, 2016)

Lug width is 20mm, I have my sharkhunter on an MK strap. The crystal is flat but has a slight rise over the bezel. After 7 days of continuous wear, it loses about 3 seconds a day. I have wanted a Doxa for awhile and pulled the trigger with the rubber band on it. Very good for diving but prefer a waffle or NATO for office wear.


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## Chronomatic (Jan 12, 2013)

Smoke325 said:


> Lug width is 20mm, I have my sharkhunter on an MK strap. The crystal is flat but has a slight rise over the bezel. After 7 days of continuous wear, it loses about 3 seconds a day. I have wanted a Doxa for awhile and pulled the trigger with the rubber band on it. Very good for diving but prefer a waffle or NATO for office wear.


Yea I'm going to need to buy one. The professional has been haunting my dreams

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## Anders_Flint (Jan 26, 2019)

This may be helpful, somebody has posted a nice video review/comparisson of the 2019 300T on youtube:


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## Chronomatic (Jan 12, 2013)

Anders_Flint said:


> This may be helpful, somebody has posted a nice video review/comparisson of the 2019 300T on youtube:


Thank you, appreciate it! I just bought a Seamaster so this is turning out to be an expensive quarantine 

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## David76 (Dec 24, 2015)

My favorite doxa sub 300t color

professional>sharkhunter>searambler>etc.....

If you buy a doxa sub300t for the first time, orange color is recommended. If you choose between these two, i recommend caribbean.


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## jwellemeyer (Jan 29, 2019)

There is something about the exact shade of orange of the professional that is really enticing. 


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## braidn (Aug 18, 2018)

seokpyo said:


> My favorite doxa sub 300t color
> 
> professional>sharkhunter>searambler>etc.....
> 
> If you buy a doxa sub300t for the first time, orange color is recommended. If you choose between these two, i recommend caribbean.


No love for the yellow divingstar?


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## texwatch (Nov 10, 2019)

I don't think you can wear either one everyday but for sunny days or anytime you are enjoying the outdoors it's looks amazing.


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## ross2187 (Sep 16, 2016)

Crazy question: I'm thinking of a Doxa 300T for my next watch. What are they putting the caseback of this iteration, is it the sailboat logo? Anyone have any pictures?

Thanks!


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## FishTime (Jun 21, 2018)

ross2187 said:


> Crazy question: I'm thinking of a Doxa 300T for my next watch. What are they putting the caseback of this iteration, is it the sailboat logo? Anyone have any pictures?
> 
> Thanks!


It's the Doxa sailboat on the current iteration


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## Raym0016 (Oct 31, 2012)

Sorry for the smudges. It says Doxa 300t 50th anniversary edition 1969-2019 Patented Bezel (with numbers) Water Resistant


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## FishTime (Jun 21, 2018)

Raym0016 said:


> Sorry for the smudges. It says Doxa 300t 50th anniversary edition 1969-2019 Patented Bezel (with numbers) Water Resistant


Speaking of the above, my 300T purchased in March says the same, which initially threw me off because I thought the 2017 models were the 50th anniversary (1967-2017).

Appears the *SUB 300* 50th was 1967-2017 and the *SUB 300T* 50th was 1969-2019.

I didn't realize the SUB 300T was introduced that long after the SUB 300...was it really two full years?


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## cuthbert (Dec 6, 2009)

devmartin said:


> This is movement shots of the current 300t I have no idea how to tell the different levels though.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


This is definitely a standard grade ETA with improved antishock system, but again it´s a base grade, not even elabore...I am very happy to have purchased the Sub300 back in time.


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## Anders_Flint (Jan 26, 2019)

cuthbert said:


> This is definitely a standard grade ETA with improved antishock system, but again it´s a base grade, not even elabore...I am very happy to have purchased the Sub300 back in time.


To be fair to Doxa, the previous version of the 300T also used a standard grade movement (as did the 600T,1000T and 1200T).


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## nitron135 (Jul 6, 2017)

Anders_Flint said:


> To be fair to Doxa, the previous version of the 300T also used a standard grade movement (as did the 600T,1000T and 1200T).


I don't think that that's accurate. 1200T used Top, at least according to Doxa support at the time. 300 50th used COSC.


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## Anders_Flint (Jan 26, 2019)

nitron135 said:


> I don't think that that's accurate. 1200T used Top, at least according to Doxa support at the time. 300 50th used COSC.


I can only go from the evidence I've seen, and from what I've seen of the 1200T movement, it looks to be the exact same as in the 2002/3 300T and the one in the current 300T, ie standard, with incabloc upgrade.

And I'd be a little sceptical of the COSC grade in the 300 too (at least until I see one), Doxa themselves have said in the past that its perfectly possible to COSC certify a standard grade movement, so COSC cert doesn't necessarily mean its a top grade that's been sent for certification.


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## nitron135 (Jul 6, 2017)

Anders_Flint said:


> I can only go from the evidence I've seen, and from what I've seen of the 1200T movement, it looks to be the exact same as in the 2002/3 300T and the one in the current 300T, ie standard, with incabloc upgrade.
> 
> And I'd be a little sceptical of the COSC grade in the 300 too (at least until I see one), Doxa themselves have said in the past that its perfectly possible to COSC certify a standard grade movement, so COSC cert doesn't necessarily mean its a top grade that's been sent for certification.


COSC grade has to be serial numbered by standard, doesn't it? And hard to believe that Doxa regulated and sent hundreds of standards for testing. Where did you see Doxa talk about this?


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## Anders_Flint (Jan 26, 2019)

nitron135 said:


> COSC grade has to be serial numbered by standard, doesn't it? And hard to believe that Doxa regulated and sent hundreds of standards for testing. Where did you see Doxa talk about this?


It was a reply on this forum quite some time ago where they were talking about the movements used in the 1000T and indeed a post where they claimed the 1000T was using elaboré grade movements (spoiler... they werent).

The jist of their comments was that the grade isn't everything when it comes to accuracy, an they'd seen lower grade movement beating COSC and vice versa.

Not to say they'd necessarily bother trying to COSC cert a standard grade as its probably fair to say that a higher % of top grades will make COSC cert vs standad ones, but I'd certainly be interested to see inside a 50th anny sub 300 just to be sure.

Below is their original post/message verbatim:

"DOXA uses Elabore or COSC grade ETA 2824 for the SUB 1000T, and mostly Top grade 2892, 2893, 2894 and 7750 movements for our other pieces in the DOXA family. Every watch is then regulated separately after its assembly. Prior to the SUB1000T, which means, the 300, 600 and 750 ranges (until the price increase from 2008) standard 2824 were used.

You will find the majority of DOXA SUB750 and 1000s have a very high accuracy, we still like to emphasize that the movement grade is not the relevant measure for its accuracy. We sometimes see standard 2824 with a better accuracy and better amplitude regularity than a COSC 2824, and also vice versa.

The ETA classification is not communicated to us (the manufacturer) only as an accuracy indicator. It is given more as a quality criteria for the parts used and their grade of finishing. Sometimes with the higher grade, a correlation with the better accuracy is understandable, but it is not mandatory, and we have learned from experience, not always the case.

You will find many high $$ ETA based watches ranging somewhere bet. $10k to $100k, and accuracy is definitely not a measurement for the price paid. So finally, we regulate every watch that leaves the factory to the maximum it can give.

DOXA"

*Back to the original question of the 1200T movements, it has just occurred to me that the 1200T had quite a long production run and I believe spanned across a change in management. I will concede that the possibility exists that they were switched to standard grade for later runs, and in fact the 1200t I have seen was from early 2019. If anyone can cough up a moment shot of an earlier 1200T using a top grade 2824-2 I will be happy to eat my words.


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## cuthbert (Dec 6, 2009)

nitron135 said:


> COSC grade has to be serial numbered by standard, doesn't it? And hard to believe that Doxa regulated and sent hundreds of standards for testing. Where did you see Doxa talk about this?


Yes this is correct and each Sub300 came with the COSC certificate with the movement serial number, in my case 6144. Otherwise the entire COSC certification would be a farce.



Anders_Flint said:


> I can only go from the evidence I've seen, and from what I've seen of the 1200T movement, it looks to be the exact same as in the 2002/3 300T and the one in the current 300T, ie standard, with incabloc upgrade.
> 
> And I'd be a little sceptical of the COSC grade in the 300 too (at least until I see one), *Doxa themselves have said in the past that its perfectly possible to COSC certify a standard grade movement,* so COSC cert doesn't necessarily mean its a top grade that's been sent for certification.


If you are referring to your post above this is not true: they say they can find a standard ETA with better accuracy than a COSC grade one, not that they can get a standard grade ETA certificated by COSC.


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## Anders_Flint (Jan 26, 2019)

cuthbert said:


> Yes this is correct and each Sub300 came with the COSC certificate with the movement serial number, in my case 6144. Otherwise the entire COSC certification would be a farce.
> 
> If you are referring to your post above this is not true: they say they can find a standard ETA with better accuracy than a COSC grade one, not that they can get a standard grade ETA certificated by COSC.


Yes, but you kind of missed my point, a 2824-2 doesn't _have_ to be top spec+ serial number to get a cosc cert, a standard grade with serial would also be sufficient, you can't always equate having a cosc certificate with it being a higher grade movement.

All the COSC cert requires is the movement to meet its timing specs and be individually identifiable (serial numbered), there's absolutely no reason that couldn't apply to standard grade, which is why I won't believe Doxa used top grade in any watch until I see it for myself.


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## nitron135 (Jul 6, 2017)

Anders_Flint said:


> Yes, but you kind of missed my point, a 2824-2 doesn't _have_ to be top spec+ serial number to get a cosc cert, a standard grade with serial would also be sufficient, you can't always equate having a cosc certificate with it being a higher grade movement.
> 
> All the COSC cert requires is the movement to meet its timing specs and be individually identifiable (serial numbered), there's absolutely no reason that couldn't apply to standard grade, which is why I won't believe Doxa used top grade in any watch until I see it for myself.


Sounds like you are asking someone to open their sub 300 cosc. I am not opening mine but would love to see someone else's .


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## Anders_Flint (Jan 26, 2019)

nitron135 said:


> Sounds like you are asking someone to open their sub 300 cosc. I am not opening mine but would love to see someone else's .


Would love them too, but would also never recommend anyone do that, especially not just to satisfy my curiosity!


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## Sambation (Apr 6, 2013)

My new 2019 Sub 300T which arrived on Tuesday, is doing around +12 sp/d, similar to my Sub 200. Hopefully it'll settle down as the movement breaks in, but at least it runs fast and not slow.

Love the watch though, love it so much I wear it to sleep  What a stunner it is in the flesh, and feels fantastic.


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## Sambation (Apr 6, 2013)

DP


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## cuthbert (Dec 6, 2009)

Anders_Flint said:


> Yes, but you kind of missed my point, a 2824-2 doesn't _have_ to be top spec+ serial number to get a cosc cert, a standard grade with serial would also be sufficient, you can't always equate having a cosc certificate with it being a higher grade movement.


Can you show me a standard grade ETA with serial number? And do you think they are stupid to offer their chronometer grade with all the improvements like the glucydur balance wheel?


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## Anders_Flint (Jan 26, 2019)

cuthbert said:


> Can you show me a standard grade ETA with serial number? And do you think they are stupid to offer their chronometer grade with all the improvements like the glucydur balance wheel?


You misunderstand. As I said, a higher % of top grade movements will of course make the cut for COSC cert, its just perfectly possible that lower grades could also be certified. Any manufacturer can request serial numbered movements direct from ETA, its an upgrade option just like anything else.


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## ross2187 (Sep 16, 2016)

nitron135 said:


> Sounds like you are asking someone to open their sub 300 cosc. I am not opening mine but would love to see someone else's .


I actually emailed Doxa last week as I'm getting ready to purchase a 300T, and it's a standard movement.


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## ross2187 (Sep 16, 2016)

Are you in the US? I haven't gone all the way through to checking out as they don't have the Professional. Did they charge you tax and shipping? Thought it was a bit odd that it wasn't shown up front.. Guess all sites are different.



Sambation said:


> My new 2019 Sub 300T which arrived on Tuesday, is doing around +12 sp/d, similar to my Sub 200. Hopefully it'll settle down as the movement breaks in, but at least it runs fast and not slow.
> 
> Love the watch though, love it so much I wear it to sleep  What a stunner it is in the flesh, and feels fantastic.
> 
> View attachment 15184227


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## nitron135 (Jul 6, 2017)

ross2187 said:


> I actually emailed Doxa last week as I'm getting ready to purchase a 300T, and it's a standard movement.
> View attachment 15185925


You asked about the current 300T. It is using a standard grade movt and is not a chronometer.

We were talking about the 300 (no T) 50th anniversary, a quite different watch from two years ago, with a cosc certifies chronometer 2824.


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## Sambation (Apr 6, 2013)

ross2187 said:


> Are you in the US? I haven't gone all the way through to checking out as they don't have the Professional. Did they charge you tax and shipping? Thought it was a bit odd that it wasn't shown up front.. Guess all sites are different.


I'm from Israel, and DOXA hardly replied to my emails, I purchased from Jura Watches in the UK. I paid VAT of 17%.

Sent from my ONEPLUS A6003 using Tapatalk


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## cuthbert (Dec 6, 2009)

Anders_Flint said:


> You misunderstand. As I said, a higher % of top grade movements will of course make the cut for COSC cert, its just perfectly possible that lower grades could also be certified. *Any manufacturer can request serial numbered movements direct from ETA, its an upgrade option just like anything else.*


Again...show me a standard grade ETA with serial number. I am curious as ever the chronometer grade ones don´t get it.

And also show me lower grade ETAs that are COSC certified...hold on, you can´t! These movement don´t exist besides in your mind.



Sambation said:


> My new 2019 Sub 300T which arrived on Tuesday, is doing around +12 sp/d, similar to my Sub 200. Hopefully it'll settle down as the movement breaks in, but at least it runs fast and not slow.
> 
> Love the watch though, love it so much I wear it to sleep  What a stunner it is in the flesh, and feels fantastic.
> 
> View attachment 15184227


Sharp looking watch, congratulations!


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## Anders_Flint (Jan 26, 2019)

cuthbert said:


> Again...show me a standard grade ETA with serial number. I am curious as ever the chronometer grade ones don´t get it.
> 
> And also show me lower grade ETAs that are COSC certified...hold on, you can´t! These movement don´t exist besides in your mind.
> 
> Sharp looking watch, congratulations!


All I said was that the possibility existed based on some lower grades technically meeting the timing requirements and the fact that a serial engraved bridge is an upgrade option.

My original post was intended to correct the misconception that all previous subs were using high grade movements, and that I'd be interested to see inside a 50th anniversary sub 300 to visually verify the grade used, its the only modern Doxa for which I haven't seen the movement.


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