# IWC Portuguese 3714 - Real, fake or franken???



## usaus409 (Dec 6, 2012)

My friend is trying to sell me his IWC Portuguese 3714 which he bought about a year ago off ebay. I love the watch but am leary of anything not from an AD but can't pass up a good deal so I am considering it. When inspecting it, I noticed a couple of issues that I can't seem to make sense of that hopefully I can get some help with.

1st: On the dial, the number 4 isn't curved like I have seen with the gen. Is this a fake dial?
2nd: The papers appear to have the model number and serial number lightly scratched out with a simple "3714-45" filled in. Huge red light here.
3rd: There is a fish on the crown, is this accurate for this model?

It appears to me the movement is genuine but you guys can probably tell better than me. Is it possibly a franken watch with a fake case/dial and gen movement?

My friend has graciously allowed me to keep it for the night to "inspect" it. So let me know if additional pictures would help. Looking forward to the responses.


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## gyang333 (Jun 12, 2010)

That looks legit. This is a pre-2007 model with the fish on the crown and embossed numerals. I don't believe there are any replicas that are embossed?

btw, thanks for the movement shot, that's a really nice picture, and it saves me from opening mine up to take a high quality picture 

edit: this is a review of the same model as the one you posted, pre-2007 with the embossed numerals: The Breitling Watch Blog » IWC Portuguese Chronograph

There's a pretty nice shot of the face, do the numerals match up to yours? http://blog.breitlingsource.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/05/iwc_portuguese_02.jpg


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## usaus409 (Dec 6, 2012)

Appreciate the response and thanks for the link. The picture looks similar but I cant say it is exact, very minor differences. For instance "SCHAFFHAUSEN" is lined up with the middle of the 3 numeral whereas this watch has it slightly below. Also "SWISS MADE" at the bottom appears to be smaller than in the picture/video. 

Also,any thoughts on the paperwork? Those were obviously changed and you can see the slight discoloration in the picture where the real information was erased. I would feel a lot more comfortable if there was matching paperwork.


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## portauto (Nov 3, 2010)

Be sure to check the differences between the 3714-01 and 3714-45. I'm concerned about the fish crown being that this is a newer 45 model, I believe it should be a Probus Scafusia. The warranty card concerns me as well.

Kindest Regards,
Portauto


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## usaus409 (Dec 6, 2012)

This definitely should be a 3714-01, it has one of the old straps on it so I guess we know the warranty card is no good which isn't exactly comforting. I would go straight to an AD tomorrow for an authentication but the closest is over 100 miles away.


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## gyang333 (Jun 12, 2010)

portauto said:


> Be sure to check the differences between the 3714-01 and 3714-45. I'm concerned about the fish crown being that this is a newer 45 model, I believe it should be a Probus Scafusia. The warranty card concerns me as well.
> 
> Kindest Regards,
> Portauto


oh good catch. the 45 has the new deployant clasp. perhaps the warranty card was written later and they just messed things up? Do the serial numbers line up?


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## usaus409 (Dec 6, 2012)

There is no serial number on the warranty card. I have not edited any of the pictures, the discoloration you see in the pictures is on the card. It is obvious what was written there previously has been somehow erased.


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## portauto (Nov 3, 2010)

Noticed that the warranty card is stamped by Carol's Watch & Jewellery Centre in Hong Kong. If you check their website and also IWC's website you'll note that they aren't an authorized dealer (or are no longer an AD).

That warranty card has too many problems to feel comfortable with this watch, I'd suggest passing on this one if you can't have it authenticated

Kindest Regards,
Portauto


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## usaus409 (Dec 6, 2012)

Really appreciate the advice. Think we are on the same page. With be tough parting with it in the morning but I guess I can part with a couple thousand more for the extra piece of mind of an AD watch.


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## gyang333 (Jun 12, 2010)

usaus409 said:


> Really appreciate the advice. Think we are on the same page. With be tough parting with it in the morning but I guess I can part with a couple thousand more for the extra piece of mind of an AD watch.


and also note that even if it's indeed legit, it might not have had a full service, in which case you'd have to factor that cost into buying this used watch, as opposed to a brand new one, or a more recent one.


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## diaby2afc (Jan 25, 2012)

The watch looks legit. How does the caseback look and what is the serial number? 

Since this is an older model and was bought used last year, I don't think the warranty card is of much use since any service won't be covered.

I'm not sure what he's offering but eBay and some sales here do occasionally pop up at about $4-4.5k for authentic used ones.

Oh, to be sure of the movement there should be a "cal 79350" inscription on there. It's rather small so look carefully.


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## timefleas (Oct 10, 2008)

Normally, when people have the kind of questions that you ask, it is best simply to buy from a source that you can completely trust--you should NEVER rely on feedback you get on forums such as these, based on a couple of pictures as supporting evidence. If you know the watch well enough, and you know what to look for, that is one thing. On the other hand, if you don't, don't rely completely on the word of strangers, no matter how well intentioned they might be, in the case of a purchase involving several thousand dollars. In other words, if you have to ask these questions, then probably it you would be better off not buying the watch. Further, taking it to the local AD will usually not solve your problems--for the most part, they will not verify authenticity just by bringing it into the showroom--rather you would have to leave it for some sort of servicing, during which time its authenticity would be examined--they won't work on a counterfeit IWC. Finally missing paperwork can often be explained easily (if the seller is completely trustworthy), and not be an impediment to a purchase, while questionable paperwork in fact can be a clear signal that something is wrong. I would always lean towards caution, rather than risk.


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## Neptukker (Jun 8, 2011)

It's not a 3714-45. The fish is indead the sign for that and i believe that the movement in the 'older' models are gold plated like the pictures. It couldn't be a 3714-45 bij that reasons.
Maybe it's a genuine watch but the papers are wrong, maybe a mistake, maybe fraud. Look also at this link to learn more: IWC Portuguese 3714 Review - The IWC Area -
The writer talks about 'replica' but i think he meant the (slightly) changed version from IWC


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## gyang333 (Jun 12, 2010)

Neptukker said:


> It's not a 3714-45. The fish is indead the sign for that and i believe that the movement in the 'older' models are gold plated like the pictures. It couldn't be a 3714-45 bij that reasons.
> Maybe it's a genuine watch but the papers are wrong, maybe a mistake, maybe fraud. Look also at this link to learn more: IWC Portuguese 3714 Review - The IWC Area -
> The writer talks about 'replica' but i think he meant the (slightly) changed version from IWC


almost all the information here is inaccurate.

1)from sometime in 2007-2011, the 3714-01 was still the model name for the Probus Scafusia crown, and applied numerals. IWC did not change model names in 2007 when they made the changes. the 3714-45 is different from the post 2007 3714-01 only in that the 3714-45 comes with the deployant clasp and different strap length.

2) the 3714-45 movement is still gold plated, but now the movements are made by ETA, and not modified by IWC anymore.

3) that link you provided indeed is comparing a genuine 3714 to a replica, that whole forum is for replica watches...


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## diaby2afc (Jan 25, 2012)

gyang333 said:


> 2) the 3714-45 movement is still gold plated, but now the movements are made by ETA, and not modified by IWC anymore.


If that's the case, I would think the price of this watch should at least decrease or stay the same. But it's increased recently. Am I missing something?


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## gyang333 (Jun 12, 2010)

diaby2afc said:


> If that's the case, I would think the price of this watch should at least decrease or stay the same. But it's increased recently. Am I missing something?


the recent price increase (from about a year ago) was because they added the depoyant clasp as standard on the 3714. i believe the increase was the same amount that they would charge for the clasp if you bought it separately from IWC.


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## Ernie Romers (Apr 27, 2005)

Please note that linking to replica watches sites may lead to a suspension of your account.


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## usaus409 (Dec 6, 2012)

diaby2afc said:


> The watch looks legit. How does the caseback look and what is the serial number?
> 
> Since this is an older model and was bought used last year, I don't think the warranty card is of much use since any service won't be covered.
> 
> ...


I took another look this morning. I found a "c79240" on the movement, not 79350. There is also what appears to be a serial number on the edge of the movement. This number does not match the number on the case.

By the way, I passed on the watch but now my friend is worried he is carrying a fake. Does the above information help at all in determining authenticity? I realize it wont be 100% by pictures but maybe I can try giving him some piece of mind (or not).


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## diaby2afc (Jan 25, 2012)

usaus409 said:


> I took another look this morning. I found a "c79240" on the movement, not 79350. There is also what appears to be a serial number on the edge of the movement. This number does not match the number on the case.
> 
> By the way, I passed on the watch but now my friend is worried he is carrying a fake. Does the above information help at all in determining authenticity? I realize it wont be 100% by pictures but maybe I can try giving him some piece of mind (or not).


The 79240 refers to an older movement before they switched to the current 79350. So that's legit.

About the mismatch between serial numbers, could be suspect but also could be valid reasons as to why it was switched out. Just don't know.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I747 using Tapatalk 2


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## gyang333 (Jun 12, 2010)

diaby2afc said:


> The 79240 refers to an older movement before they switched to the current 79350. So that's legit.
> 
> About the mismatch between serial numbers, could be suspect but also could be valid reasons as to why it was switched out. Just don't know.
> 
> Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I747 using Tapatalk 2


don't the case number normally not match the movement number?


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## Blunderact (Aug 7, 2012)

Here is the crown with "probus scafusia" of my new port with deployant buckle. Got it from a boutique.


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## diaby2afc (Jan 25, 2012)

gyang333 said:


> don't the case number normally not match the movement number?


Oh, I thought they were supposed to be

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I747 using Tapatalk 2


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## baldbrah (Mar 19, 2012)

usaus409 said:


> I took another look this morning. I found a "c79240" on the movement, not 79350. There is also what appears to be a serial number on the edge of the movement. This number does not match the number on the case.
> 
> By the way, I passed on the watch but now my friend is worried he is carrying a fake. Does the above information help at all in determining authenticity? I realize it wont be 100% by pictures but maybe I can try giving him some piece of mind (or not).


sorry to bring up old thread. i was in the market for the 3714 and also noticed that the watch i was looking at, no papers or box, also have a mismatched serial number, the one on the movement and the one on the back of the case. i stayed cleared and wondered why the price was so attractive.


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