# NEW FLIEGER TO1 TESTAF on its first outdoor experience ..... ;-)



## Jörg Schauer (May 2, 2005)

today i took the first watch with me to make a test during a 2 hour black forest mountainbike trip with two of my friends. ;-)

here are some pictures.

on the wet grass..........

in the forest...........

in the small river..............



my first impression was that the weight is realy great and not to much: 115 gramms with a rubber strap on my 17.5-18.00 cm wrist which is 6.89 - 7 inches.
(the new Flieger weight is between a STOWA chronograph with leathertsrap: 100 gramms and a Marine Original with Milanaisestrap: 130 gramms)

it was a good experience today ;-)

i love our black forest.

best regards

Jörg Schauer


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## Ham (Jan 15, 2013)

Great shots, thanks for sharing.


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## BaggerRyder (May 4, 2012)

Great looking piece!


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## Berkut (Sep 11, 2009)

Great pics, and great watch!


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## Damradas (Oct 4, 2008)

This is really a nice Stowa Flieger. I love this one! Great Job, Jörg!


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## The Naf (Mar 31, 2012)

Looks great!

The Naf


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## cheapshades2012 (Dec 24, 2012)

Great shots. Very sharp images.Thanks 
(How do you get them so sharp?)


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## sandymcg (Dec 16, 2012)

Very nice - in these shots, sort of reminds me of the Pelagos, which is not a bad looking watch either. All titanium and chunky. And not often you see a flieger watch underwater(!)


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## pansem (Nov 24, 2012)

nice pic～～！

but this new model looks a little bit thick to me


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## oca_9i (Sep 9, 2009)

Tks for the nice pics but I would prefer it in the air in on the pilot wrist left arm


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## zpyder (Jun 17, 2010)

pansem said:


> nice pic～～！
> 
> but this new model looks a little bit thick to me


I think so too. Looking at it, a comfortable thickness would be from the base to the edge under the bezel, so I guess losing about 1/3 of the thickness


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## ssbowtie1 (Mar 31, 2013)

Its only 13mm high (almost 2mm shorter than the chrono watches).


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## root (Feb 28, 2012)

ssbowtie1 said:


> Its only 13mm high (almost 2mm shorter than the chrono watches).


Yes, but the thickness of the bezel is 1/3 of the complete casing that makes it 'feel' too thick. I own a 1938 Chrono that is actually thicker, but appears more in tune to me. But I am more a dresswatch kinda guy, so I guess my opinion of this watch is somewhat biased. I like the dial and front-end look of the watch though.


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## Tanjecterly (Mar 13, 2013)

This is truly a gorgeous watch! Good job on the design.


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## Mooyizz (Jun 21, 2011)

just ordered one. i only hope its delivered before the July date indicated on the site


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## surfers (Jul 31, 2011)

Really beautiful.


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## tatt169 (May 21, 2012)

You really put this one through it's paces Jorg, great pictures also!


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## Hoppyjr (Aug 11, 2006)

Great looking watch! 

Jorg: Please get these released sooner that July 




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## brainless (Jan 3, 2008)

@ Jörg Schauer:


> *NEW FLIEGER TO1 TESTAF on its first outdoor experience ..... ;-)*
> 
> today i took the first watch with me to make a test during a 2 hour black forest mountainbike trip with two of my friends. ;-)
> 
> ...


Hello Jörg,

how comes you are already wearing one of those eagerly awaited watches?
Well connected to the watchmakers in Engelsbrand?? :think:

It's a beautiful watch :-!

Volker ;-)


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## Hoppyjr (Aug 11, 2006)

The lack of a screw down crown makes me a little uneasy. Maybe it shouldn't, but it does...


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## Robotaz (Jan 18, 2012)

This is the only fleiger-type watch to get my attention in a long time. Finally a larger Sinn/Damasko look for bigger wrists, and smaller ones, too. I may just have to get one.


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## arnz3 (Dec 8, 2011)

Great pics!!! Now at least everyone that unable to attend the Basel world know what Stowa will put in their showcase.


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## mko (Feb 16, 2006)

Wow! I was not a fan of this watch initially, but this is truly a modern take on an old classic! I want one : )


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## pjw (Mar 5, 2012)

Fantastic detailing & proportion. A very desirable piece!


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## Flashharry (Jan 17, 2007)

I love titanium watches and Fliegers and this ticks all the boxes, except for one thing for me, I would have liked the minute markers to have been lumed as well as per the FOLE.


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## dust4 (Apr 3, 2013)

Great Watch.

I orderd one


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## K2LINOS (Mar 14, 2009)

i love that watch!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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## Tony A.H (Aug 2, 2009)

hello

it's my First Time on Jorge Schauer & STOWA Forum (I think ).

anyways. just Learned about the TESTAF Project through a Friend who Forwarded me this Thread, cause He Knows I LOVE Pilot Watches, Especially, Larger Diameter Pilots.
the Sizes I Wear are 46,2 mms and 47,5 mms.. these Diameters are in my Comfort Zone and don't like to Wear anything Smaller than that.
to be Honest. I've emailed STOWA a few Years ago discussing the Possibilities of Making a Larger FLIEGERs. but No Luck. so I gave up on the Brand and Never looked back.

but I must say that Mr Schauer has done a Superb Job with this One :-!. 
size isn't Large at all by my Standard. (we all Know that Pilot Watches are meant to be Worn Big). but Wish it was 47,5mm Only Because with that Bezel ?, the Watch will Wear Smaller than the Suggested 45/ 46mm . 
i'm also surprised that the Case Height is only 12,9mm .!! looks more like 16 mm to me.

all in all, it's a Great looking Watch. and I Commend Him for taking a Gutsy Move by going up in Size .

Cheers


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## FoCsU (Sep 6, 2007)

Oh crap this thing is really growing on me  Never before understood the fascination on Fliegers but this thing is just awesome...
Is it possible to see in-wrist shots in mildly dark conditions to see the lume in effect?
And how effective is the lume, any glow left after 5-6 hours in the dark?
(nighttime legibility)

The size is worrying me also, but with a 7-7,5" wrist this shouldnt be a problem....
Dont see a lot of Stowas here in Finland, Jörg what sort of volumes have you sold to Finland recently?


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## The Naf (Mar 31, 2012)

This may answer some of ur questions:

https://www.watchuseek.com/showthre...STAF, official announcement from Jörg Schauer


The Naf


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## FoCsU (Sep 6, 2007)

The Naf said:


> This may answer some of ur questions:
> 
> https://www.watchuseek.com/showthread.php?p=6200893
> New STOWA Modell TESTAF, official announcement from Jörg Schauer
> ...


Yes it did, thanks!


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## Nats (Dec 12, 2006)

Hoppyjr said:


> The lack of a screw down crown makes me a little uneasy. Maybe it shouldn't, but it does...
> 
> Sent using Tapatalk


Yup. They were just a screw down crown away from really nailing it o|

For a Flieger I can see not having one but they use this watch for the base of their GMT and 24h "Sportwatches". I'm sorry but how do you have a 200m sport watch without a SDC?!?! I know the technology exists to do this but come on. I would think most people who dig dive/sport watches will have a SDC high on their lists of requirements.

Just sayin'


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## Nats (Dec 12, 2006)

That all being said, it is a beautiful piece and is climbing closer to the top of "The List" :-!


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## Hoppyjr (Aug 11, 2006)

Screw crown and 22mm lugs and it would be perfection. 

This said, I'm certain this will be a terrific watch. My ProDiver was really well built. 


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## soaking.fused (May 3, 2012)

Love this new kit. Amazing hand set, fit and finish. What a striking piece to view in the Black Forest's wild, this.

well done Jorg. As this may be one flieger that visits the desert in the future.


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## puck42 (Jun 19, 2013)

I am very interested in the new Flieger - I wait for more pics from users, so I can decide if the size fits me. Today I found another two watches that compete (in my opinion) with the Flieger TO1 Testaf: the Damasko DA36 and the Sinn 856. What I like on these two watches is the fact that they are made for durability with special "hardening" techniques. The outer AR coating of the Sinn seems to be relative scratch proof as well.
How resistant are the Stowa watches in general and the new Flieger? The only thing I can find is, that it is made of Titan - which could be a little more harden than metal. Is there also a special Stowa "hardening" process applied or is the case just at about 200 HV and the outer AR coating scratches more easily than the glass itself? Which type of Titan and metal is used for Stowa watches (I like details, the homepage could show more of that).


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## StufflerMike (Mar 23, 2010)

Titanium is fairly hard, although not as hard as some grades of heat-treated steel be it tegimented (kolsterized) or ice-hardened. There is no special hardening process applied by Stowa, at least no such process has been mentioned by Jörg and he would have done so if.....
The steel used by Stowa is 316L, very common as you know. No martensitic stuff though. The Ti used by Stowa can't be any other than grade 2 (210 Vickers) or grade 5 (about 350 Vickers). The Technical Standard for Pilot's Watches does not require a certain case hardness, see 3.2.

Some more info (thanks to a fellow mod):

The normal annealed austenitic stainless steels, 316L and 316L VM, have 150 - 190 HV on a Vickers Hardness scale. They can achieve 250 - 300 HV, when they are cold hardened (note: Ice hardened 316L & 316VM tool steels may achieve 600 – 700 HV; these are very expensive). The hardened austenitic stainless steel used in watches’ cases (316L or 316L VM) has 200 - 240 HV.

The super annealed austenitic stainless steel 904L has circa 150 - 190 HV and the cold hardened super austenitic stainless steel 904L can achieve 250 - 300 HV (note: Ice hardened 904L tool steels may achieve 600 – 700 HV; these are very expensive). The hardened super austenitic stainless steel used in watches’ cases has 200 - 240 HV. There are no differences in hardness between 316L, 316L VM and 904L stainless steels used in watches.

The SUG's patented special non-magnetic U-boat HY-100 high yield low-alloy Ni-Cr-Mo submarine steel for Sinn watches (contains C, Mn, P, S, Cu, Si, Ni, Cr, Mo, V and Ti and the MIL-S-16216K and MIL-S-16216 specifications set certain material composition, "weight % plus additional material if needed", requirements for it; but the exact composition of it is classified information) has 300 - 400 HV, usually around 350 HV. The U-boat steel used Sinn watches’ cases have circa 350 HV.

Vickers hardness (HV) of steel and coatings simplified:

CrNiMo 316L & 316L VM austenitic steels aka normal stainless steels (chromium nickel molybdenum) 150 – 190 HV

CrNiMo 316L & 316L VM hardened austenitic steels aka hardened normal stainless steels (chromium nickel molybdenum) 250 – 300 HV

Ø CrNiMo 316L & 316L VM watches usually have 200 – 240 HV

NiCrMoCu 904L super austenitic steel aka super stainless steel (nickel chromium molybdenum copper) 150 – 190 HV

NiCrMoCu 904L hardened super austenitic steel aka super stainless steel (nickel chromium molybdenum copper) 250 – 300 HV

Ø NiCrMoCu 904L used in Rolex watches usually have 200 – 240 HV

CrMoN ice hardened martensitic steel aka ice hardened, e.g. 440A stainless steel, (chromium molybdenum nitrogen) 600 – 700 HV

CrNiMo 316L/316L VM & NiCrMoCu 904L steels Tegimented/Kolsterized 1,000 – 1,200 HV

Ni-Cr-Mo HY-100 steel - (submarine steel contains contains C, Mn, P, S, Cu, Si, Ni, Cr, Mo, V and Ti) has 300 - 400 HV

Ø Ni-Cr-Mo HY-100 steel used in Sinn watches usually have circa 350 HV

HY-100 steel - Tegimented/Kolsterized (submarine steel contains C, Mn, P, S, Cu, Si, Ni, Cr, Mo, V and Ti) 1,500 HV

HY-100 steel PVD hardened & Tegimented/Kolsterized (submarine steel contains C, Mn, P, S, Cu, Si, Ni, Cr, Mo, V and Ti) 2,000 HV


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## ElGreco (Jul 9, 2011)

Hi guys



stuffler said:


> Titanium is fairly hard, although not as hard as some grades of heat-treated steel be it tegimented (kolsterized) or ice-hardened. There is no special hardening process applied by Stowa, at least no such process has been mentioned by Jörg and he would have done so if.....
> The steel used by Stowa is 316L, very common as you know. No martensitic stuff though. The Ti used by Stowa can't be any other than grade 2 (210 Vickers) or grade 5 (about 350 Vickers). The Technical Standard for Pilot's Watches does not require a certain case hardness, see 3.2.
> ...


I certainly hope that the case is grade 2 or above although a tough case is not required by the TESTAF standard. I buy mechanical watches because they have a potential to last. I have a DA36 and a non tegimented EZM3. I am not so happy with EZM case since it scratches pretty easy. I have not yet managed to scratch the DA36 case and it is still in a flawless condition (amazing!) altough I wear the watch pretty often. I know that customers can sometimes be very demanding and always want the best stuff for the best price. I would have no problem to spend 30 - 50 € more for a tougher case.
I really really like the looks of the TO1. I think Jörg and his team designed a very nice watch which could get one of their best selling watches (... just my personal opinion). I would be happy if Jörg could give us a short update about the TESTAF certification process and some details about the titaium which will be used in the TO1. I would be even happier if Jörg could post a couple more pictures in order to make the long wait easier. 

Cheers

ElGreco


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## ev13wt (Oct 21, 2013)

Nats said:


> Yup. They were just a screw down crown away from really nailing it o|
> 
> For a Flieger I can see not having one but they use this watch for the base of their GMT and 24h "Sportwatches". I'm sorry but how do you have a 200m sport watch without a SDC?!?! I know the technology exists to do this but come on. I would think most people who dig dive/sport watches will have a SDC high on their lists of requirements.
> 
> Just sayin'


Urban legend of sorts. Sinn has a 1000m watch whose chrono pushers can be operated underwater. Its all in the type of sealing technology used. This legend ties in close to the "Don't swim with a 50m water-resistant watch. With some you can even dive, with some its just some value the watch barely passes. Depends on the manufacturer.

Naturally, due to the increased radius on a SDC when it is screwed down, it can be tougher against shocks to it. If the shaft size is sufficient, it doesn't matter either. Both can be broken with enough force.


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