# Piaget Polo S opinions?



## JMFrost (Apr 28, 2012)

Wrote up this bit of news yesterday but curious to hear what everyone else is thinking about the new Piaget. Yes it's pricey for steel, yes it looks a bit like the Patek Nautilus 5711, but I still kinda dig it and I think it was a smart move on their part.

Swiss Watchmaker Piaget Hunts New Buyers with $9,350 Steel Watch - Bloomberg









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## josephashburnnn (Jun 22, 2016)

JmastineF said:


> Wrote up this bit of news yesterday but curious to hear what everyone else is thinking about the new Piaget. Yes it's pricey for steel, yes it looks a bit like the Patek Nautilus 5711, but I still kinda dig it and I think it was a smart move on their part.
> 
> Swiss Watchmaker Piaget Hunts New Buyers with $9,350 Steel Watch - Bloomberg
> 
> ...


Looks more Aquanaut than Nautilus.


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## mpalmer (Dec 30, 2011)

It reminds of both the PP Nautilus and the Glashutte Original Senator Seventies. It has an attractive price point (especially if one can wrngle a decent discount off retail). I like it. I would like to know more about the particulars of the movement and the power reserve. I would also like to know the water resistance and if it has a screw down crown.


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## Solomente (Feb 24, 2015)

Would have to see one I person I think. Worried that 42mm would be too big. As far as the price, not sure why it seems high (besides the ridiculous pricing of basically all Swiss watches). An Aquanaut or RO in steel cost WAY more.


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## murokello (Aug 3, 2012)

The date seems not to be centered in these.


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## Watchbreath (Feb 12, 2006)

Been a fan of Piaget for a looong time, pricey, they don't come off the line like Oreos.


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## tony20009 (Sep 25, 2013)

I like the look of the watch. I think it's a sweet deal in comparison to an Aquanaut, even though the watch looks like the "love child" of a Nautilus and Aquanaut. Indeed, were I considering an Aquanaut, I don't think there's any way I'd buy it over the Polo S. Yes, the styling is similar yet clearly different...a bit dressier too...but at about half the Aquanaut's list price and being equal on movement merit as far as I'm concerned, it's a "no brainer" in my mind...at least if the basic styling cues it and the Aquanaut share are the keys.

I guess it all comes down to which "hat" I'm wearing when I decide. With my "consumer who wants a very nice watch hat" on, it's the Piaget easily. With my "by brand collector's hat" on, it'd depend on from which maker I don't already have a watch.

Not that it's relevant here, but, IMO, the only thing wrong with the "regular" Polo is its size. Perhaps Piaget will bother to make it in a 40-42mm size? Overall, I just think the Polo 45 a nicer looking watch than is the Polo S and Aquanaut. _De gustibus....

_ All the best.


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## PJ S (Apr 29, 2013)

As I also remarked elsewhere, I can see where the similarity to the Aquanaut (with a sort of Nautilus style dial) is being made, but the fact is that Piaget already has an XL version of this - the Emperador Coussin.



Take said Emperador, reduce case from 46mm to 42mm, beef up bezel width a bit, and add a somewhat mediocre bracelet (which unfortunately has an overall cheapening effect) - et voila&#8230;a Polo S (not to be confused with a pseudo-sporty Volkswagen model that may share the same name convention, in the future or past).

I'm warming to the grey dial version, but as mentioned above, there's exceedingly strong competition from GO's Seventies.


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## murokello (Aug 3, 2012)

PJ S said:


> As I also remarked elsewhere, I can see where the similarity to the Aquanaut (with a sort of Nautilus style dial) is being made, but the fact is that Piaget already has an XL version of this - the Emperador Coussin.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


This one looks so much better.


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## drhr (Mar 14, 2011)

While much respect for Piaget, do not like any of their offerings at least so far . . .


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## aaroniusl (Nov 3, 2015)

I have quite abit of respect for Piaget as I understand they manufacture and provide quite a no of high end movements to many high end watch brands. Was quite interested in this model when it was announced but the more I look at it, the more I lose interest. It is like a cross between the Nautilus and the Aquanaut. I prefer something with a more unique identity.


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## scjones88 (Dec 12, 2014)

From my perspective, I have always found something to be a bit "off" to me with the Nautilus and Aquanaut. The Polo appears to balance the styles of the Nautilus and Aquanaut in a very attractive way (at a much better price point). Hopefully one of the blogs writes a comparison review in the near future.


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## drhr (Mar 14, 2011)

scjones88 said:


> From my perspective, *I have always found something to be a bit "off" to me with the Nautilus and Aquanaut. The Polo appears to balance the styles of the Nautilus and Aquanaut in a very attractive way* (at a much better price point). Hopefully one of the blogs writes a comparison review in the near future.


Just goes to show how subjective and personal this passion is cause I feel exactly the same way but in reverse, somehow there is just something "off" with the watch, even without the comparison. Then when I do compare, it gets even more pronounced . . . maybe I'm already too brainwashed/eyewashed with the Naut and Aqua . . . .


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## mlcor (Oct 21, 2013)

drhr said:


> While much respect for Piaget, do not like any of their offerings at least so far . . .


Not even this one (the only one I'd like to own)?:


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## KtWUS (Mar 19, 2016)

drhr said:


> While much respect for Piaget, do not like any of their offerings at least so far . . .


Agreed. I like the idea of the 900P ultra thin but I prefer the more traditional ultra-thin movements like the VC1955 or the JLC MUT Jubilee.


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## Watchbreath (Feb 12, 2006)

"traditional ultra-thin movements", Piaget is the leader of that pack.


KtWUS said:


> Agreed. I like the idea of the 900P ultra thin but I prefer the more traditional ultra-thin movements like the VC1955 or the JLC MUT Jubilee.


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## WTSP (May 6, 2012)

Hmm, the looks don't strike me as distinctive and interesting enough to make it in the marketplace beyond diehard Piaget fans. The 1110P and 1160P calibers are quite traditional and don't really have any interesting features, other than being very thin and having a vertical clutch on the chrono.









Piaget is amazing in certain segments, such as thin skeleton watches. It seems that sport watches are a tough nut for them to crack.


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## KtWUS (Mar 19, 2016)

Watchbreath said:


> "traditional ultra-thin movements", Piaget is the leader of that pack.


That's why I respect them. But in terms of current production it doesn't seem like it though. Their manual ultra thin 430/830P doesn't seem to be as pretty/thin as JLC 849 or the VC 1003 (a close cousin of the 849?).

Their automatics fare much better but I prefer manual winds myself!


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## Watchbreath (Feb 12, 2006)

Wanna drool, check out the Cal 608P.


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## Cybotron (Dec 7, 2006)

This article sums it up.

https://monochrome-watches.com/opinion-piaget-polo-s-polo-s-chronograph-steel-specs-price/


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## drhr (Mar 14, 2011)

mlcor said:


> Not even this one (the only one I'd like to own)?:
> 
> View attachment 8784050


 We have generally the same taste in watches mlcor, but that one will never be one for me . . . if it sported numerals rather than stick indices that might've turned the tide :think:


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## Crate410 (Jun 14, 2011)

Its an aquanaut homage!

On a serious note its not for me. I can see how some would like this design. But not me.


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## mpalmer (Dec 30, 2011)

A double barrel movement with an 85 hour power reserve is fairly nifty.


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## KtWUS (Mar 19, 2016)

Watchbreath said:


> Wanna drool, check out the Cal 608P.


Wow that's pretty whacked  Not quite traditional, but marvelous technical feat.


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## Watchbreath (Feb 12, 2006)

Cartier has a similar movement and me thinks it's where they got the idea from. Me thinks it's the Cal 9451.


KtWUS said:


> Wow that's pretty whacked  Not quite traditional, but marvelous technical feat.


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## Watchbreath (Feb 12, 2006)

Piaget doesn't make knockoffs.


Crate410 said:


> Its an aquanaut homage!
> 
> On a serious note its not for me. I can see how some would like this design. But not me.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Crate410 (Jun 14, 2011)

Watchbreath said:


> Piaget doesn't make knockoffs.


You do know I was kidding right?

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## jpohn (Jun 19, 2009)

In a vacuum, like the design except the seconds hand counter weight, which reminds me of a label on a pepper shaker.

Given that the design is hardly original, it will sink or swim on the execution of the details. Dimensions and movement specs are both competitive, so it's down to little things like the bracelet quality, feel of the pushers, reflection of light across the dial, comfort, etc.

Tempting to label it a Nautilus clone, but a few brands had similar designs in the 70s.

Worth further inspection.


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## tony20009 (Sep 25, 2013)

jpohn said:


> In a vacuum, like the design except the seconds hand counter weight, which reminds me of a label on a pepper shaker.
> 
> ....


This is going to read so wrong, but I'm writing it anyway....

Lord help me not to end up willfully eating somewhere that has labelled pepper shakers. LOL I'm fine with the words "salt" or "pepper" as one may find on paper packets; however, the quantity of holes is all I care to see on actual shakers now that my kids have learned their ABCs and can decide for themselves whether they want salt or pepper. LOL

All the best.


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## JMFrost (Apr 28, 2012)

Solomente said:


> Would have to see one I person I think. Worried that 42mm would be too big. As far as the price, not sure why it seems high (besides the ridiculous pricing of basically all Swiss watches). An Aquanaut or RO in steel cost WAY more.


It actually wears pretty small for a 42. Bigger than nautilus and aquanaut but not by much.

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## JMFrost (Apr 28, 2012)

PJ S said:


> As I also remarked elsewhere, I can see where the similarity to the Aquanaut (with a sort of Nautilus style dial) is being made, but the fact is that Piaget already has an XL version of this - the Emperador Coussin.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I totally agree with you, and am leaning towards the silver chrono myself.

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## ynp (Aug 28, 2015)

I tried the Polo S at a dealer in Moscow. The watch looks very good with the blue face. I liked the position of the date window at six o'clock. The blue color was clean and luminous. The steel bracelet was very well done and it was very comfortable. It reminds me the new bracelet on the PP Aquanaut, it eludes the quality. I liked the Chronographs better than the three hand watched. But I do not wear Chronographs. 
I was seriously hooked and spent my lunch near the boutique trying to justify the purchase. The Polo S was cheaper than anything else of the same quality. 
I finished my lunch and went next doors and bought a VC Oversees Blue for relatively more money. 

I wanted a steel sports watch for summer time. The Polo S is too dressy for my liking and there is no rubber strap option. The VC Overseas works better for me. 


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## Urik81 (Jun 10, 2014)

Nothing to me here besides a "poor" man's Nauti/Aqua trying hard to be less than USD10K. Richemont, why are you doing this to Piaget? The brand can do much better than homage watches!


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## Watchbreath (Feb 12, 2006)

Once again, Piaget does not make "homage" or in this case, a knockoff.


Urik81 said:


> Nothing to me here besides a "poor" man's Nauti/Aqua trying hard to be less than USD10K. Richemont, why are you doing this to Piaget? The brand can do much better than homage watches!


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## Urik81 (Jun 10, 2014)

It is not a knockoff, just a redundant and secondary design.



Watchbreath said:


> Once again, Piaget does not make "homage" or in this case, a knockoff.


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## dberg (Jan 7, 2014)

ynp said:


> I tried the Polo S at a dealer in Moscow. The watch looks very good with the blue face. I liked the position of the date window at six o'clock. The blue color was clean and luminous. The steel bracelet was very well done and it was very comfortable. It reminds me the new bracelet on the PP Aquanaut, it eludes the quality. I liked the Chronographs better than the three hand watched. But I do not wear Chronographs.
> I was seriously hooked and spent my lunch near the boutique trying to justify the purchase. The Polo S was cheaper than anything else of the same quality.
> I finished my lunch and went next doors and bought a VC Oversees Blue for relatively more money.
> 
> ...


Did you get the new VC Overseas? If so, what color. Love that watch.


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## ynp (Aug 28, 2015)

dberg said:


> Did you get the new VC Overseas? If so, what color. Love that watch.


No. I bought the ultramarine VC Overseas , the 2015 model. The new Overseas were not available at the time even at the Moscow boutique.

When I was picking up my wife's VC Essentielles 11060 watch from the service, I tried the new VC Overseas Chrono and the World Time (or whatever it's called ). They are classy and very tempting, but I spent my budget for Swiss watches for this year. I will most definitely buy a new Raketa Submarine 24 hours and another Russian watch. And I'm still waiting for the annual calendar from Ochs und Junior. ...

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## kclee (Jul 4, 2014)

Understand Piaget doesn't do knockoffs but it looks like a lady nautilus.. I rather like the upstream more


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## TempusFazool (Apr 29, 2014)

I see what they are trying to do and I must say I'm not a fan, would rather go for a Nautilus.


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## mpalmer (Dec 30, 2011)

I don't think this is a knockoff or a homage. And since this is a way different price bracket than the Nautilus, I don't see there would be competition for buyers. I think a better comparable would be the Glashutte Original Senator Seventies.


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## JMFrost (Apr 28, 2012)

Exactly. This whole "I'd rather have a nautilus" is a great answer in concept but it's basically like saying I'd rather have an IWC chrono than a Sinn.

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## dinexus (Nov 18, 2012)

Tried one on in Vegas last week, came away extremely impressed. The size is perfect and the finishing is truly next-level.


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## ivanos (Jun 25, 2016)

ynp said:


> I tried the Polo S at a dealer in Moscow. The watch looks very good with the blue face. I liked the position of the date window at six o'clock. The blue color was clean and luminous. The steel bracelet was very well done and it was very comfortable. It reminds me the new bracelet on the PP Aquanaut, it eludes the quality. I liked the Chronographs better than the three hand watched. But I do not wear Chronographs.
> I was seriously hooked and spent my lunch near the boutique trying to justify the purchase. The Polo S was cheaper than anything else of the same quality.
> I finished my lunch and went next doors and bought a VC Oversees Blue for relatively more money.
> 
> ...


What a plot twist. My glasses almost fell to the ground when I suddenly see the VC Overseas popping out...


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## hydrocarbon (Aug 18, 2008)

Urik81 said:


> It is not a knockoff, just a redundant and secondary design.


That's rather generous of you.

Of course it's a plagiarized watch. I'm surprised that they didn't call this unoriginal mess the "Aqua-not" or the "Not-ilus".


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## Crate410 (Jun 14, 2011)

ivanos said:


> What a plot twist. My glasses almost fell to the ground when I suddenly see the VC Overseas popping out...


That post was better written than 95% of movie plots today.

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## vese (Nov 27, 2014)

Ehh..too close to the aquanaut.


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## harryst (Nov 5, 2012)

The watch has 2 things going on for it

a) This earlier post: https://www.watchuseek.com/f381/piaget-polo-s-opinions-3393842-4.html#post33611946 
b) It is currently advertised - just saw it - on a huge billboard on I-87 (southbound), driving into Manhattan (iirc the same billboard recently had an ad to the effect "Audi - rings are for champions"). Very exciting...



JmastineF said:


> ....and I think it was a smart move on their part.


Very smart (esp in view of the target audience).

...overall, a high caliber watch (for those of us who are fans of copying/plagiarizing, that is. Who can claim (s)he has never done it, really? => it strikes close to home!!!)

Any further comment that comes to mind violates some forum guideline...

-- h


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## m0c021 (Feb 17, 2014)

Something about the case/bezel shape that looks awkward to me.

I love the 6 o'clock date placement. Like the hands and indices. The dial horizontal stripes are okay but could have been a better design.

I think it is the combination of a Genta (inspired) design with a circle case? The bezel looks like it would fit better on a more square (aquanaut, nautilus, etc) or just a more jagged/straight lines (royal oak) design.

A lot of elements on this piece that I like quite a bit. Right in my budget range too. Just can't pull the trigger though.








Looks great from this angle/distance. IMO








Something looks off in this angle/distance. Again IMO


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## PJ S (Apr 29, 2013)

May be worth a read:
http://www.watchprosite.com/page-wf...118/pzt-0/dv-true/wf.responses.open_bLoB_s-0/
http://www.watchprosite.com/page-wf...698/pzt-0/dv-true/wf.responses.open_bLoB_s-0/

If you haven't yet, go try one on - then you'll know for sure, how it looks and feels.


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## m0c021 (Feb 17, 2014)

PJ S said:


> May be worth a read:
> http://www.watchprosite.com/page-wf...118/pzt-0/dv-true/wf.responses.open_bLoB_s-0/
> http://www.watchprosite.com/page-wf...698/pzt-0/dv-true/wf.responses.open_bLoB_s-0/
> 
> If you haven't yet, go try one on - then you'll know for sure, how it looks and feels.


Thanks for the links. I will give it a read. This watch doesn't fascinate me enough to drive several hours for a wrist test. Maybe if I happen to the in the area where there is an AD.


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## Dapuma (Oct 11, 2015)

If it was 40mm not 42, it would be more interesting


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## hydrocarbon (Aug 18, 2008)

^
Well, that and not being such an obvious copy of this:


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## TroutRunner (Jan 10, 2012)

Does anyone know if the bracelet has a microadjust mechanism? I like how Glashutte Original and Rolex have bracelet adjustments on the fly.


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## PJ S (Apr 29, 2013)

^
Standard butterfly, I believe – which means standard link removal/addition to size for preferred fit.


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## TroutRunner (Jan 10, 2012)

Thanks.


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## PJ S (Apr 29, 2013)

^
No problem, and now that I think about it, that’s one area Piaget could’ve stolen a march on their more expensive competitors, and especially at this price point.
Either the industry doesn’t see a need for engineering adjustable clasps or they’re all just far too lazy or complacent with the status quo.

Similarly the quick strap change mechanism – VC has adopted it for the new Overseas models, including the straps and bracelet as a complete package (but at too high a price), and Hublot have added it to a number of their models (and it looks to have been well executed). Again, the industry is missing a major trick for some of their models.
Given the current slump they’re facing, you’d think a few would start to realise the rewards are there if they'd innovate rather than stagnate.


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## TroutRunner (Jan 10, 2012)

I agree with you. 

I feel myself being pulled to the higher end. I love the older VC Overseas, 3 hander, date with the white guilloche dial, but worry that the bracelet without a minor 5mm extension might bug me during the day. The AP RO might have the same issues for me. 

I was looking for other white face options that would give me the option to not wear the bracelet loose knowing I'll swell some when it heats up. GO Observer fits the bill but more dress in my opinion, even the Rolex Polar Explorer and DJII have and easy adjustable bracelet. I'll have to look into the GP Laureato to see how it's bracelet works. I wish more of the JLC's came on a bracelet.

I think the new VC Overseas with strap options and quick change is out of my price range. 

TR


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## PJ S (Apr 29, 2013)

^
The new Overseas 4500V will offer a solution to your wrist expansion (see mlcor's review thread in this section), but the GP Laureato 81000 won't – like the Nautilus and RO, you will just have to wear loose.
The only option, although silver rather than white, is the GO Seventies – although the RG indices and hands may be a turn-off.
Just be aware the GP is also silver, but possibly like the AP 15400, it give the impression of being white.


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## Dapuma (Oct 11, 2015)

hydrocarbon said:


> ^
> Well, that and not being such an obvious copy of this:


Isn't that why people would buy it, good brand similar to another popular watch at 1/3 to 1/2 the price


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## WTSP (May 6, 2012)

Ryan Reynolds has helped me to grasp the concept of this watch. It's the Patek Nautilus crossed with the Reverso.















I guess it looks good on him, but it's still not selling it for me.


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## tony20009 (Sep 25, 2013)

WTSP said:


> Ryan Reynolds has helped me to grasp the concept of this watch. It's the Patek Nautilus crossed with the Reverso.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I don't know...It's still very Aquanaut looking to me. Indeed, it's so much so that were I in the market for the Aquanaut, I'd actually have a hard time buying it instead of the Polo S. It's so similar that I'd have to be fully committed to owning the Patek literally because it's a Patek to buy it instead of the Piaget.

All the best.


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## 991C4S (Apr 6, 2015)

I love it. I think it is a great take on a classic design. I tried one on in NYC a few weeks ago. Although it may be slightly too large for me, it wore very nice!


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## hydrocarbon (Aug 18, 2008)

Dapuma said:


> Isn't that why people would buy it, good brand similar to another popular watch at 1/3 to 1/2 the price


That's one way of looking at it.

However, there are far more attractive (i.e. non-plagiarized) options for the price. Regardless of price, I'd prefer a watch with some originality. It's disappointing, as Piaget should be able to do better than an imitation of Patek's also-ran pseudo-sports model.


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## WTSP (May 6, 2012)

tony20009 said:


> I don't know...It's still very Aquanaut looking to me. Indeed, it's so much so that were I in the market for the Aquanaut, I'd actually have a hard time buying it instead of the Polo S. It's so similar that I'd have to be fully committed to owning the Patek literally because it's a Patek to buy it instead of the Piaget.
> 
> All the best.


Nautilus, Aquanaut, tomāto, tomäto...










This is starting to be a very crowded market segment.










Of course beauty is in the eye of the beholder and each model will have subtle variations that attract some buyers and repel others. I hope Piaget has some success with this, but I'll still be holding out for an Altiplano.


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## tony20009 (Sep 25, 2013)

WTSP said:


> *Nautilus, Aquanaut, tomāto, tomäto...
> *
> 
> 
> ...


Red:
Well, in terms of the guts, yes. Aesthetically, however, my "tomatoes" don't have prominent flanges on both sides. LOL

Blue:
Yes, it is. Hublot is another that uses the portal design theme.

Green:
You really don't have to "hold out." They are readily available. The Altiplano Square is even "affordable" pre-owned and bought from Tourneau, who are not known for offering the best prices on pre-owned watches.

All the best.


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## dbostedo (Feb 26, 2014)

tony20009 said:


> Hublot is another that uses the portal design theme.


I think it's a porthole design theme, no? Although a Portal design theme might appeal to a different market segment : https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Portal_(video_game)


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## JMFrost (Apr 28, 2012)

Say what you will, it's a completely different watch on the wrist than it is in photos.










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## tony20009 (Sep 25, 2013)

JmastineF said:


> Say what you will, it's a completely different watch on the wrist than it is in photos.


Would you mind adding a bit of context and detail to that observation? It may be that you have in earlier posts I've not seen. If so, let me know and I'll seek them.

Nice watch. It looks lovely on your wrist. Enjoy.

All the best.


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## JMFrost (Apr 28, 2012)

tony20009 said:


> Would you mind adding a bit of context and detail to that observation? It may be that you have in earlier posts I've not seen. If so, let me know and I'll seek them.
> 
> Nice watch. It looks lovely on your wrist. Enjoy.
> 
> All the best.


Had it on loan for a week from Piaget. I'm a writer so they leant it to me so I could have a closer look. The way it fits on the wrist is significantly different than the Aquanaut or Nautilus. Both case and bracelet have more heft and substance (in 3 hand as well as chrono). Feels much more casual.

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## tony20009 (Sep 25, 2013)

JmastineF said:


> Had it on loan for a week from Piaget. I'm a writer so they leant it to me so I could have a closer look. The way it fits on the wrist is significantly different than the Aquanaut or Nautilus. Both case and bracelet have more heft and substance (in 3 hand as well as chrono). Feels much more casual.


TY


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## hydrocarbon (Aug 18, 2008)

That chrono seems like a very expensive way to look at badly-mangled Arial. 

I have no idea why so many luxury companies struggle with even the basics of typography.


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## tony20009 (Sep 25, 2013)

hydrocarbon said:


> That chrono seems like a very expensive way to look at badly-mangled Arial.
> 
> I have no idea why so many luxury companies struggle with even the basics of typography.


Are you certain Arial is the font they used?










All the best.


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## hydrocarbon (Aug 18, 2008)

^ 
100% certain. Despite all that inept stretching they've done, I'd recognize those lame, dumpy numbers — especially the "2"s — anywhere.


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## tony20009 (Sep 25, 2013)

hydrocarbon said:


> ^
> 100% certain. Despite all that inept stretching they've done, I'd recognize those lame, dumpy numbers - especially the "2"s - anywhere.


Let me make sure I understand you. Your earlier remark connotes Piaget poorly implemented the Arial font on the watch and screwed up one or more of the digits. Your remark above implies you just don't care much for the Arial font. Which is it?

I'm asking because one of those things matters to me an other doesn't come close to mattering to me.

All the best.


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## JMFrost (Apr 28, 2012)

Whoa, mucho snark! It's simple, easy to read, and isn't some overblown "look at my fancy font choice". Still laughing at how much people love ****ting on this watch....

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## hydrocarbon (Aug 18, 2008)

tony20009 said:


> Let me make sure I understand you. Your earlier remark connotes Piaget poorly implemented the Arial font on the watch and screwed up one or more of the digits. Your remark above implies you just don't care much for the Arial font. Which is it?
> 
> I'm asking because one of those things matters to me an other doesn't come close to mattering to me.
> 
> All the best.


These aren't mutually-exclusive statements, though.

It's not only the dismal way in which it's executed that's unacceptable on a luxury product of this price, but it's also the very presence of Arial itself. Both demonstrate a complete lack of awareness of what should be a core competency within watch design.

Arial is the poster child for the general typographic decline of the late twentieth and early twenty-first centuries. Funny how we watch nerds obsess about the history of wristwatches, yet so many of us ignore the rich history - or indeed, even the basics - of such an essential element as their lettering and numbering.

This is a legitimate issue when we're talking about nice watches, for which every detail counts. Clearly, I need to elaborate the problem. Type selection is massively significant in watch design, regardless of whether the person attempting the designing is aware of it. In this case, they definitely weren't.

I appreciate the way that screenfont.ca once put it:
_What's wrong with Arial?_

Essentially, you didn't make a choice, presumably because you don't know how. Arial is a sorry excuse for a grotesk.

_"But the fonts we're using are just fine with our customers."_

Since this is essentially the same argument as "Comic Sans is just fine with our customers," it's difficult to take it seriously.

Arial is despised by expert designers. It's a cut-rate knockoff of Helvetica; it's inconsistent within itself, with some letters more reminiscent of humanist sansserifs; and it's overused, chiefly by virtue of being associated with Microsoft Windows, which for many designers is a dealbreaker right there. If you're going to use a grotesk, use a historically accurate and legitimate grotesk, not a clone.

We find that proponents of using Arial for captions and subtitles all but invariably say they "just" use Arial, rather demonstrating that they haven't given it much thought. Or they've given it a tiny bit of thought ("Well, I obviously wouldn't use Palatino") but, through ignorance or through simple bad attitude, they don't give the matter serious consideration. "I can read it and it doesn't look too fancy" sums up this attitude.

We're saying that captions and subtitles _[and watch dials!]_ are a demanding, even high-performance application of typography. If you want people to actually read and understand words that display for an instant and then wink or scroll out of existence, you've got to be serious. You can't just use whatever font's installed on your commodity Windows box that you also happen to use in company printouts. (And did you actively choose Arial in that case, or did you just let Microsoft Word choose it for you?)

*Without question the most important reason not to use Arial is because it makes you look like a rube.*​
Perhaps some Swiss watch companies are aware of the irony of choosing a poor-quality knockoff of an original Swiss design, and it's their idea of a joke. But it's infinitely more likely that whoever drafted this doesn't know what he's doing.

It's not just that it's the lazy, depressing, default choice on everything that's dull and tedious, from lame office computers to parking tickets.

The main problem is that it's a cheap, nasty excuse for a typeface that has no business on this watch. Its history is especially unsuited to a Swiss one, as it's a lower-quality ripoff of a legitimate (though overused) typeface that's even named after the country's Latin name of Confoederatio Helvetica, and only exists to dodge licensing fees.

I see no philosophical difference between the origins of Arial and a fake watch.


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## tony20009 (Sep 25, 2013)

hydrocarbon said:


> These aren't mutually-exclusive statements, though.
> 
> It's not only the dismal way in which it's executed that's unacceptable on a luxury product of this price, but it's also the very presence of Arial itself. Both demonstrate a complete lack of awareness of what should be a core competency within watch design.
> 
> ...


TY for answering the questions I asked. I fully understand how you feel. I don't agree with much of it, but I do understand your views on the matter, and that's all I sought.

All the best.


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## hydrocarbon (Aug 18, 2008)

^
My pleasure; I find that discussion of actual design issues beats the typical "what watch should I buy?" fare.

But to be fair, they certainly aren't the only offenders. Here's one of the worst I've seen:









_(undistorted type shown for comparison)_

One further point: leaving aside the issue of type _selection_, avoiding type _distortion_ - as Piaget and Patek have so egregiously done here - is pretty much the first thing that you learn in any area of visual design study. There's simply no question that they lack competence in this field.


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## tony20009 (Sep 25, 2013)

hydrocarbon said:


> ^
> My pleasure; *I find that discussion of actual design issues beats the typical "what watch should I buy?" fare. *


Red:
I agree with that. In a very big way.

I just don't want to talk about a font, much less that found on subdials of chronos -- which I don't generally like to begin with -- when I know I can't read whatever's written there anyway. Even if it's the most beautiful font known to man, I still couldn't see it clearly. As I said, it was just my being curious about what you had to say.

All the best


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## JMFrost (Apr 28, 2012)

hydrocarbon said:


> These aren't mutually-exclusive statements, though.
> 
> It's not only the dismal way in which it's executed that's unacceptable on a luxury product of this price, but it's also the very presence of Arial itself. Both demonstrate a complete lack of awareness of what should be a core competency within watch design.
> 
> ...


If we are going down the dialogue of font choice I have a question for you. If you were forced to a choice between the two, say you're being gifted one of two hypothetical watches of respectable quality, and you HAD TO pick one. Would you rather have a clean, simple and we'll executed dial that used a font that you do not care for, or would you rather have 5 lines of text (the Tudor Pelagos haiku for example) in a font that you are more of a fan of?

Sent from my HTC 10 using Tapatalk


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## hydrocarbon (Aug 18, 2008)

JmastineF said:


> If we are going down the dialogue of font choice I have a question for you. If you were forced to a choice between the two, say you're being gifted one of two hypothetical watches of respectable quality, and you HAD TO pick one. Would you rather have a clean, simple and we'll executed dial that used a font that you do not care for, or would you rather have 5 lines of text (the Tudor Pelagos haiku for example) in a font that you are more of a fan of?


Well, since I do like Rolex, I'd obviously go for the one with the short story on the dial. 

(But Tudor is another frequent Arial offender, by the way. And one of the main reasons that I got rid of an otherwise-lovely Reverso GMT was its heavy use of another Windows-default cliché, Times New Roman.) 

However, it shouldn't be unreasonable to expect a skillfully-executed dial design in a watch that costs as much as a decent used car. And it's not like nobody notices these things - think about how much difference in valuation a "fat font" insert or a single red line on the dial of a vintage Submariner can make, for example. Nomos absolutely embarrasses the big guys (other than a very select few including fellow Germans Lange) in this department.

It can't be that difficult to pay attention to this stuff, yet very few bother, and this carelessness is part of why so many current watches are destined to be forgotten.


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## JMFrost (Apr 28, 2012)

hydrocarbon said:


> Well, since I do like Rolex, I'd obviously go for the one with the short story on the dial.
> 
> (But Tudor is another frequent Arial offender, by the way. And one of the main reasons that I got rid of an otherwise-lovely Reverso GMT was its heavy use of another Windows-default cliché, Times New Roman.)
> 
> ...


See here is where we differ. Skillfully executed dial design certainly is a must, but once got get into the minutia of typeface selection you lose me. Are you suggesting they should be coming up with their own dedicated font? Preference of font is painfully subjective. As is general design taste for that matter.

The fact is it takes some incredible skill to master things like guilloche and enamel work for that matter, but watch makers and watch designers aren't all necessarily going to specialize in typography. They'll find a font that they like, and that their bosses approving the design will like, and that's where it ends. I swear, I'm OCD enough with my watches as it is before even looking at fonts, and I'd hate to have that be yet another criteria for me to be fussy about.

Speaking of fonts, name these 3 (or maybe 4)!









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## hydrocarbon (Aug 18, 2008)

JmastineF said:


> See here is where we differ. Skillfully executed dial design certainly is a must, but once got get into the minutia of typeface selection you lose me. Are you suggesting they should be coming up with their own dedicated font? Preference of font is painfully subjective. As is general design taste for that matter.
> 
> The fact is it takes some incredible skill to master things like guilloche and enamel work for that matter, but watch makers and watch designers aren't all necessarily going to specialize in typography. They'll find a font that they like, and that their bosses approving the design will like, and that's where it ends. I swear, I'm OCD enough with my watches as it is before even looking at fonts, and I'd hate to have that be yet another criteri[on] for me to be fussy about.
> 
> Speaking of fonts, name these 3 (or maybe 4)![...]


While I'll grant that it has a significant element of subjectivity, good design is a lot less subjective than it first appears once you start to look at its principles. 

One doesn't have to specialize in typography at all for this stuff, but it's reasonable to expect at least _some_ familiarity with its basics. The application of type or skilled hand lettering is essential to making a watch dial, and the way that working with type and lettering combines æsthetics and function to communicate information visually is the same principle as that of a nice watch; they're very complementary disciplines. For someone that purports to design watches to be entirely oblivious of such an essential element makes me fundamentally doubt that they know what they're doing - guillochéd and enamelled though the dial may be.

It's like seeing someone wearing a fine bespoke (or in this case, off-the rack) suit with neon green Crocs. You can use exactly the same arguments about how the shoes are a detail doesn't matter and that it's just being fussy to care about such things, but to anyone who knows how to dress, the overall impression is pretty poor.

I certainly don't mean to single out Piaget here; I've seen far worse from others that really ought to know better. Patek Philippe is one of the most jaw-dropping examples of how a maker can go from master to mangler in this craft:










(As far as the Tutima goes, I instantly spot Helvetica, the subdials use the same numbering that Singer used for manual Daytonas and that still appears on the Speedmaster, as well as the Rodania Geometer whose dial design it appropriated, which is a story in itself. The others I don't know offhand, but they're reasonably well-chosen, as most were before every dude with a PC started thinking they could do this stuff themselves without any knowledge.)










And yes, many good watchmakers do come up with their own bespoke typefaces and/or continue to employ those who know how to produce high-quality hand lettering; it's one of the things that separates the wheat from the chaff. 

Excellent further reading for anyone who's interested in the subject: Watch the Type - Journal - &Larry


















_image source from link above
_
These watches are all about the details. Simply put, when you buy a luxury product, you're mostly buying a feeling. The feeling I get when I see commodity-box default type selection is that the manufacturer doesn't care enough pay attention to the details, and is content to disregard the tradition of skilled dial making in favour of doing it the cheap and ignorant way.


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## PJ S (Apr 29, 2013)

Somewhat fascinating information, hydro, and probably worthy of its own thread to discuss in even greater detail – for now, let’s stick with the whole of the Piaget Polo S watches.


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## JMFrost (Apr 28, 2012)

PJ S said:


> Somewhat fascinating information, hydro, and probably worthy of its own thread to discuss in even greater detail - for now, let's stick with the whole of the Piaget Polo S watches.


I'm going to side with you here... Suit and crocs vs a font choice is quite the example of going micro to macro. Also, a more accurate argument would be picking apart a pinstripe suit because the pinstripes don't align at the sleeves. A detail that some care about and others do not. Pretty sure the entire universe will protest suit and crocs combo....

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## WTSP (May 6, 2012)

PJ S said:


> Somewhat fascinating information, hydro, and probably worthy of its own thread to discuss in even greater detail - for now, let's stick with the whole of the Piaget Polo S watches.


... lest someone interfere with more digressions.


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## tony20009 (Sep 25, 2013)

Wow! I had no idea the topic of fonts would captivate more than just Hydro. LOL Maybe the fact that the watch has multiple fonts in use on the dial will help. I don't know what fonts they all are, nor do I want to know. I can see there are different ones present. LOL










-- How To Spot Arial - Notebook - Mark Simonson
-- Fonts, typefaces and all things typographical - I love Typography (ILT)
-- The Scourge of Arial - Notebook - Mark Simonson
-- Monotype's Other "Arials" - Notebook - Mark Simonson

Carry on....I have no more to say, nor do I want to be responded to re: fonts. I will say I find the banter about them entertaining, which I why I said "carry on." I'm quite content to keep watching y'all have at it. LOL










All the best.


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## PJ S (Apr 29, 2013)

^
Are you sharing that popcorn, or hogging it all for yourself?


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## Vanquish1612 (Jun 15, 2019)

I own a Polo S, three hand, blue dial, it was a gift from my wife for my 35th birthday. I think the watch looks great in a suit or in a swimsuit. I’m a desk diver and so often prefer to wear one of my ceramic pieces on a day to day basis. The brushed metal bezel is too easily scratched. The dial details are really nice and I like the way the light catches the blue.


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## grabber (Apr 25, 2021)

kclee said:


> Understand Piaget doesn't do knockoffs but it looks like a lady nautilus.. I rather like the upstream more
> 
> View attachment 9373202
> View attachment 9373210


Ha, maybe on your wrist.. I owned a nautilus and just got one of these. I like it just as much and looks incredible in the flesh. Not to.mention significantly cheaper and less chance of getting recognised/robbed. So underrated.


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## Bugra (Mar 2, 2014)

I'm really loving this watch. Very underrated!

Not fan of the bracelet altough it was very comfortable.


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