# Archimede vs Stowa fliegers



## xherion (Jun 29, 2017)

Hi all,

I am interested to get a flieger since i don't have one yet in my small line up.

I had considered all the options from Steinhart, Archimede, Laco, Stowa, Damasko, Alpina, etc, and i shortlisted only Archimede Pilot GMT (42mm) and Stowa Klassic Sport 90th anniversary edition (43mm).

Looking for your opinions between the two.
In general how is Archimede vs Stowa in terms of quality of case / dial / hands / movement (both ETA 28XX)?

Some pros and cons (my opinion only):

Archimede:
+ GMT function
+ Dash of red on GMT hand makes it less boring
+ Ickler case
- 20mm strap rather than 22mm (minor)
- Date window, although it's integrated nicely

Stowa:
+ History (although i don't really put this in high priority)
+ Vintage look
+ No date
- Dial a bit too sterile
- No complications

Archimede:








Stowa:


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## CM HUNTER (May 16, 2011)

Using the search function on this site will bring up plenty of general comparisons between these two brands from the German forum.

Between these two models in general, the Ickler case is still an asset, the movement in the Archimede will be a little more advanced just based off the complication, lume will be identical, strap quality will be similar. The Stowa will have the flame blued hands which is usually a plus against an Archimede, but considering this particular Archimede is using black outlined hands, that "plus" is irrelevant. 

Pretty much comes down to you deciding between German Made versus German assembled, and as you put it, bland (yet historic) styling or a more interesting one.


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## xherion (Jun 29, 2017)

Thanks CM Hunter, i did search before but the relevant threads were like back in 2008-2010, didn't want to resurrect such an old thread.

Thanks again for your thought, really useful.


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## mph57 (Nov 20, 2006)

I really think these two companies produce a product that has really nice value for the money. I've owned both a Stowa and Archimede Flieger. To me, they are very close in quality. I would rank the Stowa "1a" and the Archimede "1b"...they're that close to mine eyes. Suggestion...perhaps consider the Stowa B dial version if you think the A version is too sterile? Also, did you take a look at the Muhle Glashutte Terra Sport? Nice watch...maybe a notch up from the two you're considering. FWIW I held onto the Stowa longer than the Archimede. 

Cheers!

mph57


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## Gerrard8 (Jun 7, 2015)

+1 for Muhle Glashutte Terrasport.
I have owned both Muhle and stowa pilot watches.

Muhle has much better:
watch case in term of workmanship.
watch case design (proportion, lug shape etc).
movement.
water proof.

Some other details:
stowa has much better lume, but has a bit patchy markers and numbers. Visually, it seems they are glued onto the dial. 
Muhle's lume is poor (not bothered in my case). Instead, I got nicely printed dial, snow white numbers and markers.
stowa has well regarded heat blued hands, silver hands on Muhle have better contrast against the inky black dial.
Muhle's triangle/dots at 12 are also better designed and look sharper. 
Muhle's red elements are cool.

In general, Muhle's pilot watch is well thought, a bit unique, and has quite some in-house work into it.

For the two watches in OP, I will go for Archimede, mainly due to watch case and overall design. 
If I like vintage style, Laco will be the choice.


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## xherion (Jun 29, 2017)

Thanks a lot guys for the nice inputs.
Will look into that Terrasport!


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## xherion (Jun 29, 2017)

I looked at the Muhle Glashutte Terrasport IV GMT, it's a nice watch, but the price is about twice of Archimede pilot GMT, so probably not in my consideration for now.


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## StufflerMike (Mar 23, 2010)

First step to make is to decide what you really want, a Flieger ? If so the Archimede GMT (flieger inspired) is not for you. If you want/need a GMT than Archimede might be the right choice. 
In a nutshell: compare a flieger to a flieger, compare a GMT to a GMT. Might be the better basis for a decision.

Pics of the new Archimede GMT in my report on the WatchUSeek visit to Pforzheim last week on our German Watches Forum.


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## maysatanong (Oct 10, 2016)

love gmt of archimede 

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## dariomac (Feb 9, 2015)

You must consider Muhle Glashutte Terrasport II , I did a search for the last month for a pilot watch and i end with it after check several reviews and pros and cons of the usual suspects . of course i was not easy to get one in mexico . i have to import it from Germany


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## mooonman321 (Feb 19, 2016)

Xherion- what did you decide? I'm in a similar position as you.

Dariomac- is that the OEM strap for the Muhle? The watch is fantastic but I'm surprised to see the raised lines where the strap meets the case? Is the material rubber?


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## xherion (Jun 29, 2017)

Currently decided on Archimede pilot chrono, but will wait a bit more before pulling the trigger.

Stowa for me is bit small at 40/41mm, there are 90th limited editions at 43mm but the chrono has no running second and i don't fancy the bezel on klassik sport.



mooonman321 said:


> Xherion- what did you decide? I'm in a similar position as you.
> 
> Dariomac- is that the OEM strap for the Muhle? The watch is fantastic but I'm surprised to see the raised lines where the strap meets the case? Is the material rubber?


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## mooonman321 (Feb 19, 2016)

Good call on the Archimede chrono, it's a great design. I think the Stowa chrono is unique because I haven't seen anyone else making fliegers put the single subdial on the right plus the design of the subdial is unique. I understand your desire for the running seconds but the lack of it on the Stowa doesn't bother me. Unfortunately it's more than I want to spend right now. Good luck with your decision.


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## dariomac (Feb 9, 2015)

No , it is not the OEM strap for the Muhle , i have it on OEM bracelet , it is a used rubber strap from Bonetto Cinturini .


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## dariomac (Feb 9, 2015)

mooonman321 said:


> Xherion- what did you decide? I'm in a similar position as you.
> 
> Dariomac- is that the OEM strap for the Muhle? The watch is fantastic but I'm surprised to see the raised lines where the strap meets the case? Is the material rubber?


No , it is not the OEM strap for the Muhle , i have it on OEM bracelet , it is a used rubber strap from Bonetto Cinturini .


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## gatorguy959 (Feb 9, 2015)

Stowa is top notch, plus they actually made watches in WWII which is cool. Also check out Aristo-Vollmer.


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## Stoner1974 (Jun 29, 2017)

I bought an Archimede and liked it, but kept comparing to Stowa and eventually bought one. Now I will likely sell the Archimede, Stowa finish is much better. The archimede did not have heat blued hands, curved crystal, decorated movement (I have 6498 in both). Also the painted marks are white white, and the thinner strap also bugged me. The ONLY thing that the Archimede has over my stowa is that the tick marks in the seconds subregister on the Archimede have lume and the stowa does not. This not an issue if you go ETA 2824.

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## Michael49 (Jan 28, 2015)

Just purchased a Archimede 39 pilot and couldn't be happier with it. Only thing I wish it had was a screw down crown. Personally, for this type of watch I prefer a flat crystal vs a curved one.


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## mooonman321 (Feb 19, 2016)

Michael49 said:


> Just purchased a Archimede 39 pilot and couldn't be happier with it. Only thing I wish it had was a screw down crown. Personally, for this type of watch I prefer a flat crystal vs a curved one.


 Can you post any pictures of the Archimede? I'm between that (or the 42mm version) and a Hamilton khaki pilot.


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## Michael49 (Jan 28, 2015)

mooonman321 said:


> Can you post any pictures of the Archimede? I'm between that (or the 42mm version) and a Hamilton khaki pilot.


I should be able to take some tomorrow and post them. My wrist is small and 40mm is about as big as I can go


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## nolte (Jun 28, 2016)

It's awesome how different we all are and how much we have to choose from!
I really really like and the sterile non branded type-a fliegers.


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## Michael49 (Jan 28, 2015)

Here's a few shots of the Archimede 39 pilot on my puny 6.5" wrist . It's on a grey nato. Really liking this watch. Love the thin profile (9.9mm) and the display back - I know some don't like this but I enjoy showing it to people who have never seen an automatic watch (like most people under 40 . Love the deep black matte dial. And, for me, a date window is a must - and this one is functional and non-intrusive.


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## StufflerMike (Mar 23, 2010)

Case finish wise I'd go for the Archimede, a touch more elaborated.Movememt wise I can't see any difference, both are standard grade ETA.


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## radarcontact (May 29, 2010)

Stowa is 40mm, Archimede is 42. Case quality of Archimede is better. Stowa has more refined dial and handset while they appears more rugged in the Archimede. The Stowa crystal is flat and appears thin, the crystal on the Archimede is slightly domed and with double AR (additionally I ordered). Both are great, but if I had to pick one, I would choose Archimede.









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## Michael49 (Jan 28, 2015)

One thing that I also prefer about the Archimede is the numbers/markers are white. The second watch shown above (? Stowa) has "yellowish" print (from the Lume I assume) - reminds me of my Maratac mid-pilot - which has more of a "military/utilitarian" feel than the Archimede - the Archimede is a bit more refined in my view. I like my Maratac as well, but its a very different pilot watch from the Archimede.


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## atwoodt (May 24, 2012)

I think both are awesome and have been debating picking one up. I like the Stowa as it is iconic. Plus they make a Paderborn model where I went to school for a brief time....


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## Gerrard8 (Jun 7, 2015)

Paderborn model? I thought it is from Laco..



atwoodt said:


> I think both are awesome and have been debating picking one up. I like the Stowa as it is iconic. Plus they make a Paderborn model where I went to school for a brief time....


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## KJRye (Jul 28, 2014)

I can't speak to the Archimede, but I just picked up a Stowa Klassik 40, and it is exceptional. The quality of the case, dial, lume, and those blued hands especially, it's an incredible watch.

In the end though, the size is what I love. I tried 43 and 44mm fliegers, and just didn't like the sizing for a watch I would wear often. I knew I wanted 40mm, and that's part of why I love the Stowa. If someone is more comfortable with the 42mm, that would be a big factor.









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## gatorguy959 (Feb 9, 2015)

Stowa. But check out Muhle as well.


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## Quartersawn (Nov 20, 2008)

radarcontact said:


> ...The Stowa crystal is flat and appears thin...


A flat crystal must be a recent addition. I've had 3 Stowa fliegers and all came with a (slightly) domed sapphire crystal at no extra charge.


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## propforall (Dec 15, 2017)

The 45mm archimede vs the 40mm stowa, in case that helps. Neither with date









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## umarrajs (Oct 18, 2012)

Favorite flieger: Laco Erbstuck............with the vintage look and historically correct proportions (of course not 55mm!). Thermally blued hands, manual wind, high quality and unique strap:


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