# Forstner A-12: Bulova Astronaut "reissue", $475



## Scbr24

I didn't find a thread on this so hopefully it's not old news, Forstner (bracelets brand) is making an almost 1:1 Astronaut reissue, the specs are:


39mm in diameter (vs 38mm of the original)
39mm lug to lug (hooded lugs)
12.3mm thickness
Same style of bracelet, 5 link, screws, milled clasp
Quartz GMT movement without seconds hand
50m of WR
USA assembled
Preorder price of $475

It doesn't a have a release date yet.










































I like it A LOT. All I want now is for it to not be another limited edition microbrand unicorn watch. In case it is, hopefully the fact that it's quartz puts off enough people so it doesn't sell out immediately after launch.

EDIT: Forstner confirmed it's not a limited edition/production watch.


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## Mmpaste

I think it looks good as well. The 2014 (iirc) reissue with the 262 movement was begging me to take it home but I never did. Got the creamsicle snorkel instead. Anyway, I really wanted the reissue to be a gmt as that was what caught me while looking at vintage. Sadly, no go. This micro goes down in size, has the gmt and pretty much looks great overall. Thanks for heads up; I'll do some thinkin'.


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## tayloreuph

What’s the bracelet size? Because a period correct JB Champion bracelet will cost the same as that whole watch. 


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## Scbr24

tayloreuph said:


> What’s the bracelet size? Because a period correct JB Champion bracelet will cost the same as that whole watch.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


I believe it’s 18mm with taper down to probably 16mm, but I’m just guessing. Someone asked if their bracelet could fit an original Astronaut and they said it could be done if you file down the end link to 17mm, but I don’t imagine filing it down from 20mm, hence why I think it’s 18mm.


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## Nokie

Very nice. Adds a lot of character to the watch, IMHO.


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## TimeOnTarget

I like the fact that it is realistic homage which maintains the look and feel of the original. 

I don't "need" another watch, but this is quite tempting.


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## HABUMIKE

It makes no sense without a sweep second hand. A quartz watch without a sweep second hand is like a sports car without a speedometer.


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## BigBluefish

I like it. I’ve been hoping that Bulova would do this since I learned of the Lunar Pilot. There was a pretty good little article on the original watch online that I read awhile back. A little pricey but I’ll seriously consider picking one up.

But I kinda agree with HABUMIKE. Not a
dealbreaker for me but..,why no second hand? My little Newmark chrono has no seconds hand, but on (or, NOT on) the A-12 it just looks odd. Why?


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## Scbr24

BigBluefish said:


> I like it. I’ve been hoping that Bulova would do this since I learned of the Lunar Pilot. There was a pretty good little article on the original watch online that I read awhile back. A little pricey but I’ll seriously consider picking one up.
> 
> But I kinda agree with HABUMIKE. Not a
> dealbreaker for me but..,why no second hand? My little Newmark chrono has no seconds hand, but on (or, NOT on) the A-12 it just looks odd. Why?


I guess the "feature" is associated with dress watches, I think this is the first non chronograph-tool watch I've seen without seconds hand. Personally, I don't really mind it.


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## tayloreuph

The Moon version of the Accutron II is odd, but has the sweep seconds hand. I’m in agreement, without the seconds hand, what’s the point? With the 24hour hand, it just makes the symmetry odd. 


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## HABUMIKE

All attempts to remake the Accutron Astronaut have been cursed. About 10 years ago, Bulova remade the watch with a non-rotatable bezel, and installed an automatic movement, this to "honor" the original watch, no less! Forstner's watch would have been perfect with a sweep second hand, but is absolutely stillborn without one. 

Why can't jewelry designers stay away from trying to make useful tools?? They always miss the point in one way or another.


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## Scbr24

HABUMIKE said:


> All attempts to remake the Accutron Astronaut have been cursed. About 10 years ago, Bulova remade the watch with a non-rotatable bezel, and installed an automatic movement, this to "honor" the original watch, no less! Forstner's watch would have been perfect with a sweep second hand, but is absolutely stillborn without one.
> 
> Why can't jewelry designers stay away from trying to make useful tools?? They always miss the point in one way or another.


I get your point, but is there a (cheap) quartz gmt movement with sweep seconds hand available on the market? I don’t think there is, you got seikos VK movements but I’m pretty sure they don’t have a gmt. You are stuck with either a regular quartz second hand or an automatic movement (which would jack up the cost). In some way this is the best choice to stay true to the original and keep an affordable price.


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## HABUMIKE

Scbr24 said:


> I get your point, but is there a (cheap) quartz gmt movement with sweep seconds hand available on the market? I don’t think there is, you got seikos VK movements but I’m pretty sure they don’t have a gmt. You are stuck with either a regular quartz second hand or an automatic movement (which would jack up the cost). In some way this is the best choice to stay true to the original and keep an affordable price.


I would pay double or triple what Forstner is asking. You can't stay true to the original without a sweep second hand, and no one in the A-12 or X-15 programs would have used that watch without it.


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## Scbr24

Preorders start on December 15 at $475, shipped in May.


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## Buff52

What connection does Forstner have with Bulova? Original watch was an Accutron or Bulova-Accutron right? 
And no seconds hand would be a put off for me. It’s like watching the watches heartbeat i would miss that.


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## tayloreuph

Buff52 said:


> What connection does Forstner have with Bulova? Original watch was an Accutron or Bulova-Accutron right?
> And no seconds hand would be a put off for me. It’s like watching the watches heartbeat i would miss that.


None seemingly. JB Champion supplied the bracelets for the Astronaut. So this is an Homage? Or an intellectual property issue…


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## hooliganjrs

I want to 'like' this watch, I truly do but something just seems off with what Forstner is doing here - maybe it's just me? I have issues with 50m water resistance on this type of watch (I'm also assuming no screw down crown), missing seconds hand is the big taboo here on something that is representing a mission critical timing device plus it just looks funny imo. In reality - I only have 2 grievances with this watch but unfortunately, they are big enough for me to pass on this one. I will say that the bracelet and overall design were 'almost' enough to sway me but as others have stated already - Forstner really missed an opportunity here on the movement. Even my cheap Maratac quartz GMT field watch manages to keep the seconds hand so not sure why the smoke and mirrors with removing the seconds hand to eliminate the persona of a quartz watch? 🤔


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## tayloreuph

I just want the bracelet. 


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## gregmech26

I like it.


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## vmgotit

Not for me, but glad this works for you! No second hand killed it for me. Vance.


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## simpletreasures

Garbage


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## HABUMIKE

None seemingly. JB Champion supplied the bracelets for the Astronaut. So this is an Homage? Or an intellectual property issue…


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Forstner is related to J. B. Champion, and their remakes of the astronaut band are the real thing, and not homages, selling for a lot less than homages. I have three of them, and they are terrific.

I pleaded with Forstner to put a sweep second hand in their A-12 Astronaut, but they said they had "thought it out." More is the pity, because not having the sweep second hand is a huge and disqualifying mistake. If they "thought it out," it was without talking to a single pilot. The watch costs less than $500, and many (myself included) would have paid 3 times that WITH A SWEEP SECOND HAND.


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## TheSouthernEscapement

Bulova just needs to make a UHF GMT (true travelers GMT) movement and rerelease this watch! Ohh and make it solar.


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## Ed B.

Add me to the list. No second hand -- no me.


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## HABUMIKE

Ed B. said:


> Add me to the list. No second hand -- no me.


I keep hoping they'll withdraw the watch and install a sweep second hand, like I suggested to them, but I don't think they will. They said they "thought it out," but that doesn't seem possible.


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## Stu47

TheSouthernEscapement said:


> Bulova just needs to make a UHF GMT (true travelers GMT) movement and rerelease this watch! Ohh and make it solar.


We can be friends. . Solar all the things. The graining on the bezel is nice. But no second hand? Whiskey Tango Foxtrot.


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## Buff52

November Foxtrot Whiskey! What a bunch of Delta Alphas! 
I always when looking at my watch zero in on the seconds hand. I really don’t know what they are thinking?


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## Margarets Dad

For double or triple the price, I'd just buy a mint original Astronaut. Why bother with imitations?


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## Daniel Hunter

I actually like this watch design alot. I already have two of the Bulova Moonviews and this one really did it for me. I placed a pre-order and have been waiting. The web site still says shipping late June or early July but I haven't gotten a shipping notice and they haven't responded to my emails asking when these will ship.


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## Buff52

Hang in there. It could be a number of reasons why it’s taking longer. Be persistent in trying to contact them.


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## HABUMIKE

Buff52 said:


> Hang in there. It could be a number of reasons why it’s taking longer. Be persistent in trying to contact them.


It may very well be that they don't have enough pre-orders. The absence of a sweep second hand will be a dealbreaker for many, including me.


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## Daniel Hunter

I emailed them again yesterday and they haven't responded. Clearly there's an issue somewhere and they've buried their collective heads in the sand.


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## tayloreuph

Daniel Hunter said:


> I emailed them again yesterday and they haven't responded. Clearly there's an issue somewhere and they've buried their collective heads in the sand.


Shipping or transport issues? I’d like to see how the bracelet measures up to the original vintage ones! Might be worth it just for that, scrap the watch, keep the bracelet


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## FL410

tayloreuph said:


> Shipping or transport issues? I’d like to see how the bracelet measures up to the original vintage ones! Might be worth it just for that, scrap the watch, keep the bracelet
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


That’s what I’m thinking.


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## Daniel Hunter

_Update_

I finally heard back from Forstner and they apologized for the delay and offered an additional bracelet of my choice. Still no firm date on when the watches will ship but it does appear that they are at least trying to appease customers for waiting.


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## Daniel Hunter

And I'm still waiting...


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## tayloreuph

Daniel Hunter said:


> _Update_
> 
> I finally heard back from Forstner and they apologized for the delay and offered an additional bracelet of my choice. Still no firm date on when the watches will ship but it does appear that they are at least trying to appease customers for waiting.


Watch and a spare bracelet? Don’t most of theirs cost about the same as the watch?


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## Daniel Hunter

No, they aren't quite that much.

And at this point a promise is meaningless without some follow through. Two weeks ago I was told "soon". A week ago I was told they should ship out "this week". To date I've received no shipping notice or response to my email questioning if or when the watches will actually ship.


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## HABUMIKE

Daniel Hunter said:


> No, they aren't quite that much.
> 
> And at this point a promise is meaningless without some follow through. Two weeks ago I was told "soon". A week ago I was told they should ship out "this week". To date I've received no shipping notice or response to my email questioning if or when the watches will actually ship.


At this point, I would call, not email.


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## Daniel Hunter

They don't list a phone number on their web site.


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## EmanJL

This is their (Forster Support) response to me on 7/19 after a few queries & their free bracelet email.

“Production of first batch is complete and we're in the process of packaging and getting ready for shipments! I expect they'll start going out soon, but I appreciate your patience.”


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## Daniel Hunter

Not holding my breath…


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## Daniel Hunter

Received this today...

"I expected them to ship last week, and unfortunately the packaging process wasn’t complete by then. Working as fast as we can here."


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## EmanJL

Daniel Hunter said:


> Received this today...
> 
> "I expected them to ship last week, and unfortunately the packaging process wasn’t complete by then. Working as fast as we can here."


I’m a huge fan of their bracelets. But I think full watch production is much more involved and they probably underestimated just how challenging this was going to be. I’m hoping that the final product (A-12), will be worth the wait.


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## Daniel Hunter

So am I.

I agree that they most likely underestimated the difficulty of launching a new product. I worked in product management for several years and it's never easy and things often go wrong that are out of your control. Open communication with customers who pre-ordered and pre-paid would pay huge dividends in maintaining credibility.


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## EmanJL

Daniel Hunter said:


> So am I.
> 
> I agree that they most likely underestimated the difficulty of launching a new product. I worked in product management for several years and it's never easy and things often go wrong that are out of your control. Open communication with customers who pre-ordered and pre-paid would pay huge dividends in maintaining credibility.


I agree completely. I’ve purchased multiple Forstner bracelets, and expected that I would receive regular communications on the progress of the A-12. I believe now that this was a missed opportunity to communicate with their dedicated customer base, and show a level of transparency and honesty that would ensure customer support moving forward. Still hopeful for a great addition to my collection.


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## EmanJL

Just got notification from them that the order has shipped… Ears burning?


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## Daniel Hunter

Yes, I believe so.....

I clicked on the tracking number and it only shows a label has been created. So they generated a tracking number, nothing has actually shipped yet.


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## EmanJL

Daniel Hunter said:


> Yes, I believe so.....
> 
> I clicked on the tracking number and it only shows a label has been created. So they generated a tracking number, nothing has actually shipped yet.


the A-12 has landed, and looks great! No extra bracelet…


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## Daniel Hunter

Same here. 
The watch looks great but apparently the promise of an extra bracelet was a hollow one.


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## TedG954

It looks to be an excellent homage. Being quartz is absolutely correct for this watch. A-12 was the original designation for the SR 71 when it was first flown by the C.I.A.

My 1963 Astronaut


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## Daniel Hunter

Very true but the original had a tuning fork movement and a second hand.


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## Daniel Hunter

I just emailed Forstner and received a reply almost immediately. The bracelets will be shipping separatel.


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## tayloreuph

Pics or it didn’t happen 


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## Daniel Hunter

Here’s mine


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## tayloreuph

Size wise it looks legit. How’s the crown feel, does it press against the wrist?


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## HABUMIKE

It's a beautiful watch. It just needs a sweep second hand, like any pilot watch.


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## Daniel Hunter

No the crown doesn’t hit my wrist. It’s a nice little watch. A sweep second hand would be nice but it wasn’t a deal breaker for me.


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## HABUMIKE

Daniel Hunter said:


> No the crown doesn’t hit my wrist. It’s a nice little watch. A sweep second hand would be nice but it wasn’t a deal breaker for me.


It's actually a beautiful watch. I'm very tempted, even without the second hand. Wear it in good health!


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## HABUMIKE

At the beginning of this thread, last September, people were complaining about Forstner stealing the Astronaut design from Bulova, which stopped making it in 1973. Well, I bought my first Astronaut in 1971, and despite people like myself begging and pleading with Bulova to remake the watch, they never have, even though they have remade everything else. As far as I'm concerned, Forstner should be considered legally and ethically in the clear.


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## minuteman62

HABUMIKE said:


> and despite people like myself begging and pleading with Bulova to remake the watch, they never have, even though they have remade everything else. As far as I'm concerned, Forstner should be considered legally and ethically in the clear.


 Wouldn't this be '*Kind of an Astronaut Remake*'? It's certainly not an exact duplicate but the stuff being sold today is a tribute anyway.


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## Daniel Hunter

I have two of those. The action of the sweeping second hand is great but I wish the bezel could be turned.


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## tayloreuph

Daniel Hunter said:


> I have two of those. The action of the sweeping second hand is great but I wish the bezel could be turned.


Ah, you mean the reissue Moon Watch. The bezel of my vintage Astro turns


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## Daniel Hunter

Yes, the Moonview.

The bezel is fixed and some people complain that the case is too large.


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## minuteman62

I had a variety of Astronaut Themed watches all snuggled together in this pic. I got rid of the Bulova Moonview and the Bulova Moon Watch. I kept the vintage 1968 Day/Night Astro 'T' (Far left) and the Omega 3570.50 Speedmaster. The rest was just reissued 'stuff' I lost interest in real quick. But at least I tried them. 











Vintage Non-reissue Accutron Astronauts I own.


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## A4S

Been told it is still weeks away before they arrive in the UK and just remembered we bought them back in December last year


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## Daniel Hunter

I'm still waiting on my extra promised bracelet.


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## HABUMIKE

That's the most stunning collection I've ever seen! I hope they are insured and safely locked away.


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## Daniel Hunter

Has anyone that ordered and received one of these watches also received the extra bracelet they were promised? I haven't yet and I'm wondering if this is actually going to happen.


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## A4S

As above, was told it was weeks till we saw one of these at least in Europe. Doubt we will see any extra bracelet.


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## DLT222

Gents

As the owner/importer of Forstner for the UK/EU I would firstly like to say thanks for being patient in waiting for these.

I can only tell you what I am being told and facing not Forstner US in terms of the watch. 

I have not seen any watches as yet over this side of the pond. I do know there have been several issues that were well out of Forstner's control. The worst thing is they were not huge things, more like simple things that should have been done by respective manufacturers. This has delayed the release of this by quite a bit. 

The last thing I want, more so Forstner wan, is the item to be sent to you and it not work etc. So to address these issues they halted orders.

As a distributor, Forstner are facing huge supply issues also. This, like many other companies across the world right now. It is not an excuse, more the fact that we simply cant make stuff fast enough due to possible costs to manufacture, supply of metals etc, but more so people like you buying our products, too that we thank you again.

We know it's not great, all we ask is that you bare with us and be patient - added to what you have already given.

We simply don't have time to sit and answer all the threads that may be possibly created on forums etc, what we do have time for is listening to your calls and reading your emails with potential issues, order checking etc, as without people like you, the dedicated watchfam, we have no business - Be it in the US, UK or the rest of the world.

As soon as I get the A12 this side of the pond, all the pre-orders will be fulfilled as soon as they land, that I promise you all.

Thanks again for being patient - It means a lot.

Darren

Director - Forstner Bands UK/EU


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## HABUMIKE

DLT222 said:


> Gents
> 
> As the owner/importer of Forstner for the UK/EU I would firstly like to say thanks for being patient in waiting for these.
> 
> I can only tell you what I am being told and facing not Forstner US in terms of the watch.
> 
> I have not seen any watches as yet over this side of the pond. I do know there have been several issues that were well out of Forstner's control. The worst thing is they were not huge things, more like simple things that should have been done by respective manufacturers. This has delayed the release of this by quite a bit.
> 
> The last thing I want, more so Forstner wan, is the item to be sent to you and it not work etc. So to address these issues they halted orders.
> 
> As a distributor, Forstner are facing huge supply issues also. This, like many other companies across the world right now. It is not an excuse, more the fact that we simply cant make stuff fast enough due to possible costs to manufacture, supply of metals etc, but more so people like you buying our products, too that we thank you again.
> 
> We know it's not great, all we ask is that you bare with us and be patient - added to what you have already given.
> 
> We simply don't have time to sit and answer all the threads that may be possibly created on forums etc, what we do have time for is listening to your calls and reading your emails with potential issues, order checking etc, as without people like you, the dedicated watchfam, we have no business - Be it in the US, UK or the rest of the world.
> 
> As soon as I get the A12 this side of the pond, all the pre-orders will be fulfilled as soon as they land, that I promise you all.
> 
> Thanks again for being patient - It means a lot.
> 
> Darren
> 
> Director - Forstner Bands UK/EU



Darren:

If there is still time for you to do so, I cannot stress strongly enough how badly the A-12 needs a sweep second hand. No pilot watch lacks the means to measure passing seconds. If you take the time to re-engineer the A-12, you will receive far more orders for it than otherwise.

I asked the US manager about doing this last year, and he said that they had "thought it out." That's not possible. If they had thought it out they would have included a sweep second hand. No pilot cares about the thickness of his watch. This is what comes of designers making decisions without consulting the real world.

Please consider doing this, and thank you.


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## DLT222

HABUMIKE said:


> Darren:
> 
> If there is still time for you to do so, I cannot stress strongly enough how badly the A-12 needs a sweep second hand. No pilot watch lacks the means to measure passing seconds. If you take the time to re-engineer the A-12, you will receive far more orders for it than otherwise.
> 
> I asked the US manager about doing this last year, and he said that they had "thought it out." That's not possible. If they had thought it out they would have included a sweep second hand. No pilot cares about the thickness of his watch. This is what comes of designers making decisions without consulting the real world.
> 
> Please consider doing this, and thank you.



I don't actually have any control on what gets designed etc. I am just the importer and distributor.

I will however feed your message back to Forstner.

D


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## HABUMIKE

DLT222 said:


> I don't actually have any control on what gets designed etc. I am just the importer and distributor.
> 
> I will however feed your message back to Forstner.
> 
> D


Thank you. I hope you have better luck than I did, because the A-12 deserves better than being turned into useless junk by foolish designers.


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