# Tornek Rayville Please



## Neily_San

Hi all,

I sit here, as I write this, with a wonderful P300 ( with date ) on my wrist. I took off the metal bracelet and put it on the supplied NATO. It looks absolutely amazing. It constantly draws the eye. The clarity, crispness and precision of the dial is mesmerising. The bezel is brilliantly legible when viewed straight and reflects all sorts of fabulous colours at other angles.

After the watch finally cleared UK Customs ( after 2 weeks ), it has not left my wrist for a week and I am a very happy man.

Except .... I struggle to describe this ... I have a strange and tiny piece of emptiness inside. A little void where something is missing. Where something used to be. It took me some days to work out what it was ... for the first time in almost 10 years my "incoming list" is now empty. I no longer harbour that small ( often suppressed ) feeling of excitement and anticipation that the P300 has provided for so many years.

So, as an open plea to Bill, will you please take my deposit for a Tornek Rayville. I really don't mind how long the wait, but would prefer something a little less than 10 years ;-)










To those who have received your P300s - enjoy them. For those still waiting - I hope it will not be much longer now.

:-D
Neily

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## Pentameter

seconded


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## Semper Jeep

Thirded. (Is that a word?)


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## whatclay

I believe Bill all but confirmed an upcoming RTW TR in his recent Worn & Wound interview


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## TheMeasure

I’m just as excited as the next guy to see the MKII TR re-released. I do believe it will happen soon. Seems like the P300s and KWs are moving along and I’m sure once those are in a good place we’ll hear something. 

I hoping for some slight dimension changes, especially a 20mm lug width vs the previous 22mm. 


IG: th3measure


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## acheongtk

Yes please!


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## NWP627

Please bring it on Bill, as soon as you are able.


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## Deacfan

It's about time for another black box from Bill's workshop!


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## slcbbrown

Happen to be wearing my Stingray, today.


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## TwentiethCenturyFox

As an owner of the original stingray I very much would like to add the tornek to the collection. Stunning watch design.


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## Thieuster

Inspiring thread! Result? I replaced my P300 for my Tornek today...

Menno


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## Neily_San

How many others amongst us is unspeakably desperate for Bill to start taking deposits for the T-R ?


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## at2011

I hope I'm still alive when this project moves forward, I'm at the saddest point in my life and the only cure is when Bill starts taking Tornek deposits.:---(


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## Deacfan

I've got my deposit saved. Anyone else?


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## poisonwazthecure

Why would he be taking deposits for a ready to wear?


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## Randy9999

poisonwazthecure said:


> Why would he be taking deposits for a ready to wear?


The Tornek Rayville probably won't be a "ready to wear." Rather, it will likely be a special project - hence, the deposits.


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## poisonwazthecure

Randy9999 said:


> The Tornek Rayville probably won't be a "ready to wear." Rather, it will likely be a special project - hence, the deposits.


But it's listed under ready to wear on his website?


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## heb

I hope you are all young enough to still enjoy the watch IF/WHEN it ever comes to fruition; it will take awhile.


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## Neily_San

heb said:


> I hope you are all young enough to still enjoy the watch IF/WHEN it ever comes to fruition; it will take awhile.


I don't mind a wait. I will be happy enough once I get a deposit down and know that the process is underway.

Anyone else suspect the T-R will be Benchcrafted and the Stingray will be RTW ?

:-D
Neily

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## poisonwazthecure

Neily_San said:


> I don't mind a wait. I will be happy enough once I get a deposit down and know that the process is underway.
> 
> Anyone else suspect the T-R will be Benchcrafted and the Stingray will be RTW ?
> 
> :-D
> Neily
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


That is sort of my suspicion as well but who knows?


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## slcbbrown

Wearing my Stingray, right now. Looking forward to a TR option.


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## acheongtk

Still waiting. I really hope it would open soon tho


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## Stev0

If this thread is the closest we have to a waiting list. I’ve just joined the queue.....


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## redhed18

Same price as the Hawkinge RTW right? Right?


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## sleauxdaddy

Stingray owner, but I'm in!!


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## Thieuster

I wonder what will be the difference between the watches from the small batch Bill produced (and sold) already and the ones that are in the pipeline now!

Something like: '...back in the handbuilt-days...' Or: '... in the past when Bill still able to put a Swiss movement in his watches...'


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## redhed18

Thieuster said:


> I wonder what will be the difference between the watches from the small batch Bill produced (and sold) already and the ones that are in the pipeline now!
> 
> Something like: '...back in the handbuilt-days...' Or: '... in the past when Bill still able to put a Swiss movement in his watches...'


Wasn't the Paradive originally "benchcrafted" and the new lot is RTW? Maybe the same kind of changes.

Price?


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## bbckfh

a) It didn't happen without a picture - let's see that p300!
b) Yep, I'd love a T-R. The original ones are gorgeous.


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## TheMeasure

Thieuster said:


> I wonder what will be the difference between the watches from the small batch Bill produced (and sold) already and the ones that are in the pipeline now!


Yeah it will be interesting to see the changes. I'm really hoping for 20mm lugs. I believe the first gens that Bill made had 22. Personal preference but the 20mm looks better proportioned especially if the case is close to the original. I'd also like Bill to find a creative way to have something that looks like a humidity indicator.. similar to how the text on the first ones represented the indicators.

IG: th3measure


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## Thieuster

TheMeasure said:


> Yeah it will be interesting to see the changes. I'm really hoping for 20mm lugs. I believe the first gens that Bill made had 22. Personal preference but the 20mm looks better proportioned especially if the case is close to the original. I'd also like Bill to find a creative way to have something that looks like a humidity indicator.. similar to how the text on the first ones represented the indicators.
> 
> IG: th3measure


I totally agree. 20mm would be a good change.

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## longstride

Everyone is obviously salivating like Pavlov's dog for this one. Any chance of it being this year do you think?


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## Neily_San

When I first started this thread in May I rather hoped Bill would open ordering before the end of the year. Given it is now almost October and he has just released the Hawkinge AGL I am starting to think we will hear nothing further about the TR / Stingray until mid-next year. Am I being too unrealistic ?

Neily 


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## whatclay

From an IG post for the Hawkinge AGL


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## longstride

Well thats promising!


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## allendrummer

i really look forward to this watch!!


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## Thieuster

I'm gonna wear mine today! *inspired*

Menno


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## longstride

What are the chances of the T-R launching at the WindUp Watch Fair this year?


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## dboulders

longstride said:


> What are the chances of the T-R launching at the WindUp Watch Fair this year?


I might have missed this but does that basically confirm that the T-R will be apart the RTW line?

Either way I hope it release or at least is available to view at Windup. I'm going with a bunch of WIS from NYC on Friday morning. If anyone wants to join shoot me PM and lets link up!


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## longstride

Yes the T-R has been advertised as being an upcoming RTW watch in the MKII catalogue for the last couple of years.....as I said with some luck we may see it this year.


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## Maruzen

I hope so. Holding off on buying the Paradive


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## redhed18

Anyone know the size specs on the T-R? 

Like are those 20mm or 22mm lugs?

Really hoping it won’t be huge...


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## TheMeasure

redhed18 said:


> Anyone know the size specs on the T-R?
> 
> Like are those 20mm or 22mm lugs?


Haven't seen any specs about the RTW TR. I'm really hoping it's slightly smaller than the Gen 1 run. Especially downsizing the lugs from 22 to 20mm.

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## Thieuster

Indeed that would be better


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## Emceemon

Maybe tomorrow lol


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## Semper Jeep

Emceemon said:


> Maybe tomorrow lol


Unfortunately it wasn't that.


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## Deacfan

Not what I had hoped for.....


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## TheMeasure

A member asked in another thread so thought I'd put what I know here. This is far from an official MKII update. 

I was in NYC last week for WindUp and spent some time catching up with Bill. It was a friendly conversation about life, watches, etc.. nothing close to a formal Q&A about MKII which I wouldn't have wanted. So while i wish I had more details to share along with pics I don't. No prototype was present. 

The Tornek Rayville is coming. I believe even a few weeks ago someone re-posted a comment from MKII's IG where designs are with the vendor and awaiting sign off. The release date is still TBD. The TR is going to be in the RTW line. Bill did shrink the proportions slightly from his original TR. It will have 20mm lug width and I think the case width will be 40mm-ish (don't quote me on the case width). I was excited to hear this as I believe this new size will be better proportioned. I was in either way, but I'll love it even more with the smaller size. I'm hoping more people feel the same. I asked about the differences between the TR and Stingray as both are listed. The main difference is that the TR will have the Tornek Rayville branding while the Stingray will have the MKII branding.. I'm guessing similar to how the first TR's and Stingrays were done. As far as the options of dials, bezels, and dates/no dates that wasn't discussed. 

Cheers!

IG: th3measure


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## redhed18

TheMeasure said:


> The Tornek Rayville is coming...


Massive fist pump! 
Thanks for this update!


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## TheMeasure

redhed18 said:


> Massive fist pump!
> Thanks for this update!


My pleasure!


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## Deacfan

Good news on a rainy afternoon!


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## Thieuster

A slightly smaller TR than the original would be a massive step forward. If you're still on the fence: buy it. The smaller shape + 20mm will be perfect! I may even be tempted to buy one.

From a collector's PoV: I'm glad that there will be a difference between the first-run-of-nine and this RTW batch.


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## Emceemon

Agreed! This will have superbly classic proportions.

I kind of Wish the price will be under 1000$ (no Soprod movement). I would really like to buy one.... the Canadian dollar is so weak now 

Envoyé de mon iPhone en utilisant Tapatalk


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## TheMeasure

Emceemon said:


> I kind of Wish the price will be under 1000$ (no Soprod movement)...


I didn't ask about pricing or movement, but I'm sure it will have the NE15, same as the other RTW pieces.

IG: th3measure


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## Neily_San

TheMeasure said:


> I was in NYC last week for WindUp. The Tornek Rayville is coming. I believe even a few weeks ago someone re-posted a comment from MKII's IG where designs are with the vendor and awaiting sign off. The release date is still TBD. The TR is going to be in the RTW line.


Great news !!

I can't wait.

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## Arthur

I sold my last MKII over a year ago. This was the White dial Key West ( although I was a vocal proponent of this one, for some reason it never bonded). The day it arrived, I lamented the purchase of it over the Black/gilt dial version. The MKII’sthat got the most wear and love were my Stingrays. I went through three of them, but they all got a lot of wear and were great watches. Having said that, I have always wanted a Tornak Rayville. Of course that has been Impossible, as there were only 9 built. Possibly there is a chance now to finally own one! Encouraging news that they will be part of the RTW line, as I don’t believe I have enough years or patience to wait out the time involved in a custom build. 


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## maxward

Any more recent news or rumors regarding a release date for this model? Hoping for end of year or sooner. Thanks.


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## TheMeasure

maxward said:


> Any more recent news or rumors regarding a release date for this model? Hoping for end of year or sooner. Thanks.


Nothing since WindUp. As much as I'd love to see a release before end of year, I don't think that will happen. Hopefully early part of 2020.

IG: th3measure


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## Neily_San

TheMeasure said:


> As much as I'd love to see a release before end of year, I don't think that will happen. Hopefully early part of 2020.
> 
> IG: th3measure


In reality I am not even particularly worried when the release date happens to be ( forgive me if I have missed-understood, I have taken "release date" to be the date when first orders ship ). I just want Bill to take my deposit so that I can be confident that I will eventually receive a TR.


Neily

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## TJ Boogie

I'm extremely excited for this!


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## Stev0

I'm hoping Bill gives us a little heads-up on this thread before release 

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## maxward

I’ll second that! It looks like there’s a good bit of pent up demand for this model. I hope to not lose out on an opportunity to put a deposit down on one.


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## maxward

Sorry, double post


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## boatswain

Sorry to add to the demand but...subscribed !

I would love to check out a MkII and the RTW seems like a great place to start. None of the available RTWs grab me but I like the TR aesthetic and reading above that it will be 40ish sounds great.


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## TheMeasure

boatswain said:


> Sorry to add to the demand but...subscribed


Good to have you here boatswain, no need to apologize.

The TR/Stingray will be a great first MKII.


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## boatswain

TheMeasure said:


> Good to have you here boatswain, no need to apologize.
> 
> The TR/Stingray will be a great first MKII.


Thanks 

I'll be curious to see what the final specs and price shake out as.

I would be a fan of it coming in around 40mm if that is still up for debate.

I've snooped around this sub forum looking for info on the this model and the previous one. Certainly leaves me wanting to know more about both in a good way.

I'll keep it locked here and I look forward to either tidbits trickling out or the grand reveal.


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## Stev0

I don't want a lot for Christmas
There is just one thing I need... 
Tornek-Rayville please...


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## Neily_San

Goodbye 2019. Another year passes without any sign of the TR/Stingray. Let’s hope 2020 is the year !

:-D
Neily 


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## TJ Boogie

Neily_San said:


> Goodbye 2019. Another year passes without any sign of the TR/Stingray. Let's hope 2020 is the year !
> 
> :-D
> Neily
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


+1


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## tmoris

Hey guys, hope everyone is keeping good health and enjoying their watches! 

I havent been around for some time and just popped in to check on TR's status. I can see on the TR page  that a $450 deposit has already been collected from some and that ordering is closed at this point. Did I miss it? I have been signed up on this TR mailing list for quite a few years now and Im pretty sure I wouldnt have missed an email on the subject, unless the mailing list had been purged and a new one established.

On the other hand by reading this thread, it appears I didnt miss anything and my above deduction is false?


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## clouser

tmoris said:


> Hey guys, hope everyone is keeping good health and enjoying their watches!
> 
> I havent been around for some time and just popped in to check on TR's status. I can see on the TR page  that a $450 deposit has already been collected from some and that ordering is closed at this point. Did I miss it? I have been signed up on this TR mailing list for quite a few years now and Im pretty sure I wouldnt have missed an email on the subject, unless the mailing list had been purged and a new one established.
> 
> On the other hand by reading this thread, it appears I didnt miss anything and my above deduction is false?


You haven't missed anything. It looks like the TR will be in Bill's RTW line, so I'm sure there won't be any deposits collected. They'll just be posted for sale on the MKII website one day, and it'll be a mad rush to try and buy one before they're all gone.


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## clouser

tmoris said:


> Hey guys, hope everyone is keeping good health and enjoying their watches!
> 
> I havent been around for some time and just popped in to check on TR's status. I can see on the TR page  that a $450 deposit has already been collected from some and that ordering is closed at this point. Did I miss it? I have been signed up on this TR mailing list for quite a few years now and Im pretty sure I wouldnt have missed an email on the subject, unless the mailing list had been purged and a new one established.
> 
> On the other hand by reading this thread, it appears I didnt miss anything and my above deduction is false?


You haven't missed anything. It looks like the TR will be in Bill's RTW line, so I'm sure there won't be any deposits collected. They'll just be posted for sale on the MKII website one day, and it'll be a mad rush to try and buy one before they're all gone.


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## Deacfan

Neily_San said:


> Hi all,
> 
> I sit here, as I write this, with a wonderful P300 ( with date ) on my wrist. I took off the metal bracelet and put it on the supplied NATO. It looks absolutely amazing. It constantly draws the eye. The clarity, crispness and precision of the dial is mesmerising. The bezel is brilliantly legible when viewed straight and reflects all sorts of fabulous colours at other angles.
> 
> After the watch finally cleared UK Customs ( after 2 weeks ), it has not left my wrist for a week and I am a very happy man.
> 
> Except .... I struggle to describe this ... I have a strange and tiny piece of emptiness inside. A little void where something is missing. Where something used to be. It took me some days to work out what it was ... for the first time in almost 10 years my "incoming list" is now empty. I no longer harbour that small ( often suppressed ) feeling of excitement and anticipation that the P300 has provided for so many years.
> 
> So, as an open plea to Bill, will you please take my deposit for a Tornek Rayville. I really don't mind how long the wait, but would prefer something a little less than 10 years ;-)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> To those who have received your P300s - enjoy them. For those still waiting - I hope it will not be much longer now.
> 
> :-D
> Neily
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


I'm trying really hard not to look at this picture every day.....


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## redhed18

Siri sucks - delete!


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## thetony007

so nothing confirmed directly from Bill yet i presume? did op perhaps get a dm at least..?


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## Neily_San

thetony007 said:


> so nothing confirmed directly from Bill yet i presume? did op perhaps get a dm at least..?


I am waiting for news just like everyone else, I am afraid. I am really hoping 2020 will be the year !

All the best. 
:-D
Neily

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## Emceemon




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## boatswain

Oh boy...



Very excited to see what's coming....


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## Neily_San

Emceemon said:


> View attachment 14861643


Above is just an image. Can you copy the link to register interest ? I REALLY don't want to miss out on this.

Neily

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## Neily_San

Neily_San said:


> Above is just an image. Can you copy the link to register interest ? I REALLY don't want to miss out on this.
> 
> Neily
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


Don't worry .... I tracked it down. Found it on Instagram. Phew !

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## boatswain

Shall we idly and wildly speculate for a couple hours about specs and pricing? Will it have changed from the original TR?



I'm hoping it comes in at 41mm or smaller


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## incomplet

Looking forward to this! Loving my paradive. Will be good to add a TR to the collection!


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## gwold

boatswain said:


> Shall we idly and wildly speculate for a couple hours about specs and pricing? Will it have changed from the original TR?
> 
> 
> 
> I'm hoping it comes in at 41mm or smaller


Deposit (not price) is listed on the TR page: $450.00. RTW collection.

Edit: Sorry folks, I clearly didn't read that correctly.


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## TheMeasure

From MKII's IG page, reiterating what the update said.


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## boatswain

As this is my first potential MKII and RTW preorder what’s the usual drill?

Is it a 50% up front scenario?


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## gwold

I swear I signed up to be notified months ago, when the TR and the SRII first hit the Boutique. However, I've signed up again just to be safe.

It's interesting that the TR link on the Boutique, today, is a 404. The only way to get to the Notify Me today seems to be through the IG post.


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## Emceemon

gwold said:


> I swear I signed up to be notified months ago, when the TR and the SRII first hit the Boutique. However, I've signed up again just to be safe.
> 
> It's interesting that the TR link on the Boutique, today, is a 404. The only way to get to the Notify Me today seems to be through the IG post.


Strange. Around 5pm EST I registered again on the website.

He is working on it now 

Envoyé de mon iPhone en utilisant Tapatalk


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## redhed18

Was ist das "Waer" ?


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## TheMeasure

boatswain said:


> As this is my first potential MKII and RTW preorder what's the usual drill?
> 
> Is it a 50% up front scenario?


With the Benchcrafted series, it's historically been 50% deposit up front then the remainder down the road.

From memory I can't recall any RTW series requiring a deposit. They all required the full amount up front. However that could all change.


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## redhed18

Sure looks like a $450 deposit to me










http://boutique.mkiiwatches.com/rea...e/pre-order-stingray-tornek-rayville-118.html

There's no way the watch will go for $450 even.


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## Emceemon

redhed18 said:


> Sure looks like a $450 deposit to me
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://boutique.mkiiwatches.com/rea...e/pre-order-stingray-tornek-rayville-118.html
> 
> There's no way the watch will go for $450 even.


Yeah maybe, but this 450$ deposit amount is there since 2 years at least. I doubt he would have figure the amount 2
Years prior. 

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## Omegatron24

agreed. Zero chance the cost is $450. Probably on par with the Paradive...I'd guess $900.


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## TheMeasure

As others have mentioned, I think the total cost will be similar to the Paradive. While $450 may or may not be a deposit amount, that amount has been there for years.


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## boatswain

Looks like the newsletter is out now


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## tmoris

Yey! Finally! Received my preorder link, looking very much forward to entering the game again after so many years


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## tmoris

And I will say it again as I did years ago, IMHO the Tornek Rayville brand has potential of becoming a strong resurrected brand enabling Bill to do something similar that Vendom/Stallone did to Panerai (even though perhaps not at that magnitude). As much as I like MKii, I would rate TR's potential as higher in the longterm..


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## Semper Jeep

First thing I did when I got to the office this morning was push back a meeting that was set to begin at 10:00 tomorrow.


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## Awesom-O 4000

So is this going to be like the Halios Seaforth release, where you have to get one in the first 3 seconds?


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## 2500M_Sub

Probably out on this one, see the dimensions are 40mm and 48.50 lug to lug, IMHO the watch should have it’s original dimensions or if I had my way slightly larger. I have a Helson skindiver and think it’s on the small side and this will be even smaller. Guess all the complaining about the size of the first version worked. 

Regards

Ren


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## boatswain

I only got the TR notice. 

Can anyone share what the differences are between the new TR and the stingray 2?



Thanks!


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## 2500M_Sub

boatswain said:


> I only got the TR notice.
> 
> Can anyone share what the differences are between the new TR and the stingray 2?
> 
> Thanks!


From what I know and I am no expert the previous version was 42mm X 49.50 lug to lug and 22mm lug width. The upcoming version is 40mm and 48.50 lug to lug and 20mm lug width. Also previous version had a eta movement. Sorry this is the difference between the previous watches, the TR and Stingray 2 would be the same except for the dials I would imagine.

Regards

Ren

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## TJ Boogie

Agreed Ren, I'd love it if the original dimensions were adhered to. I'd love to feel what the original TR felt like on my wrist -- with the MKII look.


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## TJ Boogie

boatswain said:


> I only got the TR notice.
> 
> Can anyone share what the differences are between the new TR and the stingray 2?
> 
> Thanks![/QUOTE
> 
> As far as I know, No said date on the Stingray II release, or any specs so far on the aforementioned Boatswain. Only said specs on the TR in the notice and Q4 2020 or Q1 2021 release |>


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## heb

Omegatron24 said:


> agreed. Zero chance the cost is $450. Probably on par with the Paradive...I'd guess $900.


The $450 makes sense given its NH-15 movement. But of course, you will have to pay double that. So....not so much.


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## boatswain

Okay so it's just the TR going now then?

Stingray 2 will be later?

I got the info for the TR. 

Just pondering what to do...

I like the 40mm size.

I do wish there were some more detailed renders though, especially of the case profile and up close on the dial. Those would be helpful before plunking down on the preorder for me.


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## TheMeasure

Awesom-O 4000 said:


> So is this going to be like the Halios Seaforth release, where you have to get one in the first 3 seconds?


While I think the spots will go quickly, I don't think it will be like the Seaforth Gen II ordering. I doubt many microwatch releases can replicate that frenzy. At the time the Seaforth had a lot more publicity, and was more widely desired amongst the community. While the Seaforth was never labeled limited edition, the Gen II run was going to be the last, so all that drove demand especially with flippers who if could get one, could make a decent profit. The TR while may be released in limited batches is not limited to "X" number of pieces.


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## TheMeasure

I think a few of asked the differences between the TR and Stingray. 

I’m guessing the cases will be the same. What i do know is the TR has the Tornek Rayville branding and the Stingray will get the MKII branding. I think there will be subtle differences in dial and bezel layouts. The TR will look like the TR and I would think the Stingray will have options that more resemble the vintage Blancpain Fifty Fathoms. Prob similar to how Bill did his first gens TR and Stingray models. 

This release is for the TR only, Stingray will be at a later date.


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## JFingers

I just set my alarm so I can pre-order the Acrylic version tomorrow. I like the 40mm, because I have small wrists.

Blue skies, y'all!
-only Jake


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## boatswain

Shiny acrylic vs matte aluminum is a tough choice. 

Acrylic feels closer to the original TR while the aluminum works well with bead blasted case and tool vibe. 

Matte ceramic or sapphire would have been nice too.


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## sleauxdaddy

Alarm set!!


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## TJ Boogie

x2 for a not-so-early 7am PST wakeup call for a piece of history in its own right


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## mleok

The $450 deposit locks in a final price of $895, and the estimated delivery is the last quarter of 2020 or the first quarter of 2021. It is a SII NE15 movement, and given the poor experience I've had with the 6R15, I'm probably going to pass on this.


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## Arthur

I have had three Stingrays, the one I really regret selling the most was my first one that had the acrylic insert with lume. Very few of these were made because at the time the rejection rate was very high. Been trying to find another one for ten years with no success.i have had two more over the years, and I will tell you they were really great watches. My problem,for years, I had a very bad case of”flipitis” !! I had lots of watches and I was constantly churning my collection. Now, I am much older and I realize that there are a few watches that I want, and with those in hand, I’m pretty satisfied. I have wanted a TR for many years, missed out badly on that first group of 8 or 10, but I have never given up as I knew in my heart that at some point, Bill would resurrect the venerable TR. I hope I can get in on the first trance.



Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


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## rtl

mleok said:


> The $450 deposit locks in a final price of $895, and the estimated delivery is the last quarter of 2020 or the first quarter of 2021. It is a SII NE15 movement, and given the poor experience I've had with the 6R15, I'm probably going to pass on this.


Is the NE15 movement that bad? The PD3 uses the same movement and mine has been fine. What was wrong with your 6R15?

I have been waiting for MKII to come out with the new Stingray/TR so I am excited about this.. but more than 1 person has lamented this movement..


----------



## rtl

Double tap


----------



## mleok

rtl said:


> Is the NE15 movement that bad? The PD3 uses the same movement and mine has been fine. What was wrong with your 6R15?
> 
> I have been waiting for MKII to come out with the new Stingray/TR so I am excited about this.. but more than 1 person has lamented this movement..


I've had three 6R15s in the SARB033 and SARB035, and I found them to have poor accuracy and noticeable anisochronism and positional variance. They're just rather inconsistent performers, and I much prefer the Miyota 9015 or ETA 2824-2 movements for their accuracy.

In a $900 watch with a year long wait, I think I'll wait to see real life photos before making a final decision about whether it's a watch I have to have. I'm also a bit miffed that something from their "Ready to Wear" line has a year long lag time. Wasn't the point of that line that they would be ready to order, unlike their "Benchcrafted" line?

Also, according to the specifications, it appears to have a choice between an acrylic or aluminum bezel insert, even though the crystal is sapphire. At that price, it should have a sapphire bezel as well.


----------



## at2011

mleok said:


> I've had three 6R15s in the SARB033 and SARB035, and I found them to have poor accuracy and noticeable anisochronism and positional variance. They're just rather inconsistent performers, and I much prefer the Miyota 9015 or ETA 2824-2 movements for their accuracy.
> 
> In a $900 watch with a year long wait, I think I'll wait to see real life photos before making a final decision about whether it's a watch I have to have. I'm also a bit miffed that something from their "Ready to Wear" line has a year long lag time. Wasn't the point of that line that they would be ready to order, unlike their "Benchcrafted" line?
> 
> Also, according to the specifications, it appears to have a choice between an acrylic or aluminum bezel insert, even though the crystal is sapphire. At that price, it should have a sapphire bezel as well.


Don't care. Still getting one. Waited for so long I will not be denied.


----------



## at2011

at2011 said:


> I hope I'm still alive when this project moves forward, I'm at the saddest point in my life and the only cure is when Bill starts taking Tornek deposits.:---(


FEW MORE HOURS AWAY I CAN DECLARE I'M FULLY CURED!!!!


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## Stev0

Please can someone confirm exactly what time we are anticipating ordering to open please?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


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## Randy9999

mleok said:


> I've had three 6R15s in the SARB033 and SARB035, and I found them to have poor accuracy and noticeable anisochronism and positional variance. They're just rather inconsistent performers, and I much prefer the Miyota 9015 or ETA 2824-2 movements for their accuracy.
> 
> In a $900 watch with a year long wait, I think I'll wait to see real life photos before making a final decision about whether it's a watch I have to have. I'm also a bit miffed that something from their "Ready to Wear" line has a year long lag time. Wasn't the point of that line that they would be ready to order, unlike their "Benchcrafted" line?
> 
> Also, according to the specifications, it appears to have a choice between an acrylic or aluminum bezel insert, even though the crystal is sapphire. At that price, it should have a sapphire bezel as well.


Oh my goodness.


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## tmoris

YOUR ORDER HAS BEEN RECEIVED

that was a pretty overloaded BE server experience  would be curious to see the load graph


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## JFingers

Ordered!


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## Semper Jeep

In! |>



tmoris said:


> YOUR ORDER HAS BEEN RECEIVED
> 
> that was a pretty overloaded BE server experience  would be curious to see the load graph


It took 9 minutes from the time I loaded up the active sales page until my order was finally received. I had to hit "continue" multiple times on a few of the screens because things were freezing up. I wonder how quickly these first 75 slots will go...


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## Randy9999

Successfully ordered!


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## tmoris

back in the game after 10 years or so


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## sleauxdaddy

In. Website was sloooooooooowwwwwww! Looks like the first few slots at least are going quick.


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## sleauxdaddy

Stev0 said:


> Please can someone confirm exactly what time we are anticipating ordering to open please?
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


10 AM EST. 18 minutes ago.


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## Neily_San

Getting worried now ! 

I refreshed the sales page and hit purchase within seconds of it opening. I have been fighting through the checkout process for 10 minutes. I have finally reached the ”place order” button and keep receiving a pop up stating “there was an error processing your order. Please contact us or try again later”. Argghhh !!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


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## Stev0

Can anyone who has had both acrylic and aluminium version bezels on MKII watches in the past share any insight into which one to choose? 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


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## Pentameter

Neily_San said:


> Getting worried now !
> 
> I refreshed the sales page and hit purchase within seconds of it opening. I have been fighting through the checkout process for 10 minutes. I have finally reached the "place order" button and keep receiving a pop up stating "there was an error processing your order. Please contact us or try again later". Argghhh !!
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


same thing was happening to me. Just keep trying - it should go through eventually


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## Pentameter

double post


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## Semper Jeep

Neily_San said:


> Getting worried now !
> 
> I refreshed the sales page and hit purchase within seconds of it opening. I have been fighting through the checkout process for 10 minutes. I have finally reached the "place order" button and keep receiving a pop up stating "there was an error processing your order. Please contact us or try again later". Argghhh !!
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


The page now says "ordering closed" again. It sounds like the first 75 slots are filled.


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## *2112

added it to my cart, enter $$ info etc, then errored out on the final submit !!!! Man i am bummed


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## Stev0

... and ordering has closed!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


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## clouser

My PayPal payment went through, but the MKII website wouldn't let me finalize my order. I've already sent MKII a message to see what the deal is.


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## SkidPilot

I must have gotten in at the last minute, quite difficult to make the connection; lots of traffic obviously and I'm in a place with limited internet. Happy to have made the order, it will join my Blackwater, Graywater, Key West, and Paradive.


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## tmoris

WOW! that was quick! true MKii preorder style, baby 8)

edit: mine went through at 10:06:15


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## Neily_San

Gutted !!

Finally went through .... to this page :










Image was cropped. Page states the item is now out of stock !

Seems 75 must have gone REALLY quickly. I was on this within seconds. I feel somewhat let down by technology.

:-(

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


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## Pentameter

Stev0 said:


> Can anyone who has had both acrylic and aluminium version bezels on MKII watches in the past share any insight into which one to choose?
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


Its really down to personal preference. I believe the original TR had an acrylic bezel, so going with that is more true to the original style, where as acrylic is obviously a softer material and if you are really concerned with it holding up in the environment, aluminum may be a better option for you.


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## pokpok

My order went through at 10:06.

So excited for this watch!!


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## robodoc183

Began order at 10:00:01 and completed it at 10:06:54; took nearly seven minutes holding my breath through ordering and checkout to make it through the server, but I'm in!


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## TJ Boogie

clouser said:


> My PayPal payment went through, but the MKII website wouldn't let me finalize my order. I've already sent MKII a message to see what the deal is.


Same here


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## WastedYears

TJ Boogie said:


> Same here


Same for me as well. But I am not too worried as the same thing happened to me with the Key West order, and iirc the order still went through.


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## TJ Boogie

WastedYears said:


> Same for me as well. But I am not too worried as the same thing happened to me with the Key West order, and iirc the order still went through.


Awesome, thanks man |>


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## Hogan

Do I have to wait a year for the sweatshirt?


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## Arthur

WastedYears said:


> Same for me as well. But I am not too worried as the same thing happened to me with the Key West order, and iirc the order still went through.


Wow!! That must be the slowest server in the world! I had the same thing happen. placed order, payed with PayPal , payment went through then got a message "unable to complete order" I checked the order link on my phone and it was still open. I too sent a message to see if my order actually was placed? I have and idea that it was so slow that the automatic cutoff activated while payments were still coming in. We shall see.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


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## Arthur

Hogan said:


> Do I have to wait a year for the sweatshirt?


If you're in,I believe the sweatshirt deal will be pretty soon according to the info on the website. You will get an email asking for your size and shipping info.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


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## boatswain

I sat this one out for now in the end.

It sounded from the notification email that there would be opportunity again down the road beyond the 75 and that it is "not limited".

I think seeing some real world pics and getting closer to delivery time will be a help to me.

Congratulations to those that made it through.


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## Nanda

I had a lot of luck and am one of the 75. I had the same issues with the server. The whole thing reminded me of the chaos at Halios when the Seaforth could be ordered. A day of many long faces. Not nice.


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## Nanda

Double Post.


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## Pentameter

boatswain said:


> It sounded from the notification email that there would be opportunity again down the road beyond the 75 and that it is "not limited".


This is correct, although it also said the price may end up changing later, and by pre-ordering you lock-in the $895 price.


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## Majnp

EIGHTEEN minutes after ten the order finally went through! So happy to be one of the lucky 75. Now for the year long wait.....


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Maruzen

Same for me. The site indicated 'unable to complete order' but I shortly received an email from PayPal confirming funds were accepted at 10:15. Though according to the site, the order was never completed and in my order status there is no record of it. So good to know that others had the same issue. I was concerned that I sent money for nothing


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## Jim C.

For those that didn't get confirmation, have you logged into the MkII store and checked your account? Mine has the pre-order listed.


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## *2112

Mine is stuck for eternity in my cart ... rubbing it in! It's my own dumb fault for not verifying my site password earlier


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## Maruzen

Jim C. said:


> For those that didn't get confirmation, have you logged into the MkII store and checked your account? Mine has the pre-order listed.


I have checked the my account three times and still nothing. However, in another thread Jim mentioned they are working through the emails so hopefully I can confirm later.


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## Arthur

Maruzen said:


> Same for me. The site indicated 'unable to complete order' but I shortly received an email from PayPal confirming funds were accepted at 10:15. Though according to the site, the order was never completed and in my order status there is no record of it. So good to know that others had the same issue. I was concerned that I sent money for nothing


That is exactly my case. Funds were transferred. We will not know if we are in until either one of two things happen, the 450.00 USD will be refunded back to our PayPal account or we get an email from MKII that our order was accepted. At this point, I have not gotten either a refund or a confirmation that my order was accepted.

My speculation as to what happened was the website was overwhelmed and slowed to a crawl. The order link was definitely open when I placed my order at around 10:07 ( I literally clicked the link at 10:00:15) I was logged in and the cart was active. I went directly to my PayPal account and sent the money. By the time the Paypal hit, the order link was closed. If it were me, I would honor all the orders that were actually in place when the orders closed. I doubt that we are talking about more than a handful. And since this is not a limited edition like the 300 or Key West the first 75 is just an arbitrary number

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


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## Arthur

Well I got my answer this morning, and it wasn’t good !


Hi Arthur,

Looks like we don't have an order number in the system for you. If you were billed via PayPal even though the order did not process on our side all refunds have been completed as of last night. It may take a few days to complete. 

We do apologize your still on the email list and there will be another chance to order later in the year. 

Thank you for choosing MK II watches.

Best, 
Jim @ MK II
Watchmaker 



Ticket Details
Ticket ID: GKD-988-30062
Department: Order Status
Type: Order
Status: Closed
Priority: Normal


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


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## TJ Boogie

Jim C. said:


> For those that didn't get confirmation, have you logged into the MkII store and checked your account? Mine has the pre-order listed.


Bummer, that's a negative -- we'll still have a chance to order later in the year apparently (for those not a part of the 75).


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## TJ Boogie

Jim C. said:


> For those that didn't get confirmation, have you logged into the MkII store and checked your account? Mine has the pre-order listed.


Bummer, that's a negative -- we'll still have a chance to order later in the year apparently (for those not a part of the 75).


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## Arthur

I suppose so.I hope that once all the first flurry of activity is over, there will be and opportunity to order.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


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## dboulders

I'm so pissed I missed this. If anyone has a change of heart and wants out please send me a DM. Funds ready at any time!! 

And congrats to those who snagged one!!


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## brianmazanec

Was giddy to get through right before! I adore my Gen 2 paradive (not the rtw one) and can't wait to add this to my collection. 

Sent from my SM-N960U using Tapatalk


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## Stev0

Pentameter said:


> Its really down to personal preference. I believe the original TR had an acrylic bezel, so going with that is more true to the original style, where as acrylic is obviously a softer material and if you are really concerned with it holding up in the environment, aluminum may be a better option for you.


Thanks for your reply. I thought I needed to specify bezel option on paying the deposit but now know it's specified on final payment. Still in two minds...

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


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## OmegaCosmicMan

:think: Thought I would add some thoughts about the bezel options...

The original TR bezel insert was probably bakelite - an early formulated, hard, fairly durable plastic material.

From Wikipedia: "Bakelite"

"....was the first plastic made from synthetic components. It is a thermosetting phenol formaldehyde resin, formed from a condensation reaction of phenol with formaldehyde."

So, like all plastics, acrylic could ultimately be subject to degradation from exposure to ultraviolet light and to certain chemicals or oily substances and certainly some types of solvents. It is also not very hard and could be damaged easily by abrasion, and it could fracture, chip, crack or break if struck hard enough. As a 'plastic' - acrylic is fairly durable, but it is a 'plastic' - who knows what physical properties of the material will change (or not change) over the years. Will it shrink or remain dimensionally stable? Will it become brittle and weak? How 'durable' is it? How long do you expect it to last?

But acrylic could be made to have a luminous material placed on the underside or inside so as to give markings that remain visible in the dark, and it could be made to show an appearance ranging from matte to semi-gloss to a full glossy surface like shiny glass.

One advantage of acrylic could be - minor scratches or defects could be mitigated by 'polishing out' if not too deep.

On the other hand, an aluminium bezel insert (as MKII has been producing them in some previous watches like Ist and 2nd generation Paradive and Graywater) is very very durable. I have dented and scratched them, but they haven't broken, and they have not fallen off yet. It takes a lot of force or a very sharp object or edge to ding them up, but they take a licking. As aluminium inserts age and wear, they do so in a manner (in my opinion), that seems to be a more attractive demonstration of 'wabi-sabi'.

:think: Each material has its perceived advantages, and each has its own unique functional appearance (and some perceived weakness).

To each his own. b-) The acrylic bezel could have a very attractive appearance and could have a cool feature in being able to show a luminous light source through (or from within) the bezel material.

_(I can't tell and don't know if this would be the case for this modern TR - the description, photos, specification and artists conceptual drawings aren't very clear on this, so I don't really know what either bezel would Really look like. One of the reasons why.... "I'll wait and see'.....)_

The aluminium bezel inserts are very durable and can withstand exposure to chemical, sunlight and solvents, but they can be dented or scratched, and once that is done, the damage could not easily be 'polished out'.

It is fairly easy to replace a bezel insert, *Provided* _*the replacement parts are available*_.

So if 'durability' is a concern for you and you tend to be 'hard' on your watches, or wear them while working around hard tools,hard surfaces, sharp-edged surfaces, or chemical or solvent exposure, and you want them to last, I would think the aluminium insert might be a better choice.

And if appearance is important to you, and you don't mind the possibility of the insert being damaged by being struck or scratched or abraded, or you are not concerned about it retaining the same appearance many years from now, then perhaps the acrylic would be your choice.

:think: ....Anway... Looking forward to seeing these in the wild. It has been a long wait.

So....To those of you who made the pre-order....Congrats!

....and pictures please, once they are available....;-)


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## boatswain

OmegaCosmicMan said:


> :think: Thought I would add some thoughts about the bezel options...


Good summary 

I feel like I would probably go for the aluminum at this point.

If the other choice was sapphire I may have gone that route.

Looking forward to seeing what the inserts and the rest of the watch looks like in real life.


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## Jim C.

I like the acrylic on my 1st generation Helson Skindiver.


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## WastedYears

WastedYears said:


> Same for me as well. But I am not too worried as the same thing happened to me with the Key West order, and iirc the order still went through.


I went back in to my e-mail and could no longer find the PayPal confirmation. For a second I though I had imagined receiving it, but upon checking the PayPal account I see that the payment is still there.

Weird.

[edit]
Nevermind. I pinned the PayPal e-mail, which is why I missed it in the inbox. Je suis l'idiot.


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## Maruzen

Arthur said:


> Well I got my answer this morning, and it wasn't good !
> 
> Hi Arthur,
> 
> Looks like we don't have an order number in the system for you. If you were billed via PayPal even though the order did not process on our side all refunds have been completed as of last night. It may take a few days to complete.
> 
> We do apologize your still on the email list and there will be another chance to order later in the year.
> 
> Thank you for choosing MK II watches.
> 
> Best,
> Jim @ MK II
> Watchmaker
> 
> Ticket Details
> Ticket ID: GKD-988-30062
> Department: Order Status
> Type: Order
> Status: Closed
> Priority: Normal
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


24 hours later, I got the exact same message. So it appears quite a few had the same problem. I contacted Jim again to confirm the refund, but still have no indication that one was provided. I would have preferred losing at the time than believing for 24 hours that I had one and still be out the money days later, lol.


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## tmoris

luminous insert > any other insert

that simple in my book


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## tmoris

..


----------



## Arthur

tmoris said:


> luminous insert > any other insert
> 
> that simple in my book


I agree. The one watch that I lament selling as much as any that I have sold was a Stingray with the acrylic insert. They were pretty scarce and didn't hang around long as the rejection rate for the inserts was inordinately high. Like an idiot, I sold it years ago and have regretted the sale ever since. I have put WTB posts up several times here and time zone with absolutely no luck. I even considered the Helson Skindiver mainly because it has a lume acrylic insert.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


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## Stev0

I’d 100% pay a premium for a sapphire bezel (if you’re listening Bill! 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


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## mleok

Stev0 said:


> I'd 100% pay a premium for a sapphire bezel (if you're listening Bill!


The Helson Skindiver has a sapphire bezel, just saying. It's silly to pair an acrylic bezel with a sapphire crystal.


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## Jim C.

mleok said:


> The Helson Skindiver has a sapphire bezel, just saying. It's silly to pair an acrylic bezel with a sapphire crystal.


My Helson (lume shot shown above) is the first version with acrylic insert, acrylic crystal and ETA 2824-2. I understand why most microbrands won't use acrylic, but I love it on this watch.


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## mleok

Jim C. said:


> My Helson (lume shot shown above) is the first version with acrylic insert, acrylic crystal and ETA 2824-2. I understand why most microbrands won't use acrylic, but I love it on this watch.
> 
> View attachment 14882971


I understand a watch that uses acrylic for both the bezel and the crystal, but not sapphire for the crystal but acrylic for the bezel.


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## clouser

For everyone who’s PayPal got charged but your order didn’t go through, check your email. MKII is honoring those orders!!!


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## TheMeasure

clouser said:


> For everyone who's PayPal got charged but your order didn't go through, check your email. MKII is honoring those orders!!!


Thanks for the update. I was wondering today when my PayPal credit was going to show up. Sounds like we'll also get a sweatshirt as well. Really refreshing to hear this!


----------



## Arthur

Man, I just got the email a little bit ago. That truly made my day!! As I said another post, this really makes a lot of sense. Obviously, the folks who were allowed to make a PayPal or credit card payment still had and open ordering portal. MKII did the right thing to honor the orders that came in before the portal closed. I can appreciate what happened, there was a great deal of interest and when there are lots of orders coming in over a very short time frame. There were bound to be some overlap in orders and payments.
I really appreciate what they did to address this issue.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


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## Maruzen

That is indeed good news. I wonder how many of those orders there are. Regardless, looking forward to it.


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## drunken-gmt-master

mleok said:


> I understand a watch that uses acrylic for both the bezel and the crystal, but not sapphire for the crystal but acrylic for the bezel.


It may sound counterintuitive, but I have that combo on my Paradive, because the high domed crystal is actually more likely to get scratched than the bezel based on my experience w/my Benrus Type II.


----------



## mleok

drunken-gmt-master said:


> It may sound counterintuitive, but I have that combo on my Paradive, because the high domed crystal is actually more likely to get scratched than the bezel based on my experience w/my Benrus Type II.


But is there any disadvantage to having the bezel also in sapphire? I know cost was an issue for a while, because of the lack of economies of scale, but Helson seems to have been able to find a supplier for the Skindiver's sapphire bezel.


----------



## TheMeasure

mleok said:


> The Helson Skindiver has a sapphire bezel, just saying. It's silly to pair an acrylic bezel with a sapphire crystal.


When the time comes to choose my TR config, I'm going with the acrylic insert. That will be my second watch that has sapphire crystal and acrylic insert. My other is a Paradive. I love the combo. The acrylic really adds to the vintage vibe and mine has held up well. I like the idea that over time my crystal should be pretty much blemish free and the insert will have aged/wabi/patina nicely. I don't purposely beat up my Paradive but I don't baby it either. I get that it is not everyone's cup of tea, but that's why Bill offers the anodized aluminum insert. I don't think there is a wrong choice, both look great simply personal preference.

Cheers.


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## drunken-gmt-master

mleok said:


> But is there any disadvantage to having the bezel also in sapphire? I know cost was an issue for a while, because of the lack of economies of scale, but Helson seems to have been able to find a supplier for the Skindiver's sapphire bezel.


No real disadvantage to having a sapphire bezel, but acrylic was aesthetically closer to the original Benrus (MKII's only alternative is anodized aluminum). There is no option for a matching acrylic crystal, anyway.


----------



## mleok

TheMeasure said:


> When the time comes to choose my TR config, I'm going with the acrylic insert. That will be my second watch that has sapphire crystal and acrylic insert. My other is a Paradive. I love the combo. The acrylic really adds to the vintage vibe and mine has held up well. I like the idea that over time my crystal should be pretty much blemish free and the insert will have aged/wabi/patina nicely. I don't purposely beat up my Paradive but I don't baby it either. I get that it is not everyone's cup of tea, but that's why Bill offers the anodized aluminum insert. I don't think there is a wrong choice, both look great simply personal preference.
> 
> Cheers.


I understand the appeal of the lumed acrylic insert (but I prefer that it be paired with an acrylic crystal), and I would pick that over the aluminum insert. I just think there's no real downside to having a lumed sapphire insert option. Where it becomes more of an issue is if the lumed insert is itself domed, like in the modern Fifty Fathoms, which can add dramatically to the cost.


----------



## davebw226

great looking new project


----------



## itibiertia0887

Sorry for this stupid question, but which model is the TR a homage of? the Stingray?


----------



## mleok

itibiertia0887 said:


> Sorry for this stupid question, but which model is the TR a homage of? the Stingray?


This article explains everything,

https://www.revolution.watch/war-hero-the-tornek-rayville-tr-900/

The watch is a homage of the Tornek-Rayville TR-900, which is based on the designs of the Blancpain Fifty Fathoms, that was produced by Rayville and imported to the US by Tornek for use by the SEALs.

And the Stingray is a homage of the Blancpain Fifty Fathoms.


----------



## TheMeasure

itibiertia0887 said:


> Sorry for this stupid question, but which model is the TR a homage of? the Stingray?


TR is a homage to the Tornek Rayville TR-900

Stingray would be a homage to the Blancpain Fifty Fathoms Milspec


----------



## at2011

TheMeasure said:


> TR is a homage to the Tornek Rayville TR-900
> 
> Stingray would be a homage to the Blancpain Fifty Fathoms Milspec


Since Bill owns the rights to the Tornek-Rayville name, shouldn't the TR-660 be referred to as a "reissue" and the Stingray a "homage" since the BP Fifty Fathoms name is still owned by Blancpain?

Sent from my SM-N975U using Tapatalk


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## TheMeasure

at2011 said:


> Since Bill owns the rights to the Tornek-Rayville name, shouldn't the TR-660 be referred to as a "reissue" and the Stingray a "homage" since the BP Fifty Fathoms name is still owned by Blancpain?
> 
> Sent from my SM-N975U using Tapatalk


I understand what you're saying. I don't feel homage and reissue have to be mutually exclusive. At the same time I don't have a preference either way. I'm good with reissue, homage, inspired by etc.


----------



## Neily_San

clouser said:


> For everyone who's PayPal got charged but your order didn't go through, check your email. MKII is honoring those orders!!!


A quick question : has everyone who posted a query on the Customer Service portal received an email response ?

Like others my order stalled at the final step of Checkout ( still there ) and I submitted a query shortly thereafter asking if the order would be honoured. So far I have heard nothing.

Fingers still crossed.

Neily

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


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## Arthur

Neily_San said:


> A quick question : has everyone who posted a query on the Customer Service portal received an email response ?
> 
> Like others my order stalled at the final step of Checkout ( still there ) and I submitted a query shortly thereafter asking if the order would be honoured. So far I have heard nothing.
> 
> Fingers still crossed.
> 
> Neily
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


I received and email several days ago stating that they were adding me to the order list as they received my PayPal funds even though my order didn't register in the system. 
I got a second email from Jim @ MKII yesterday.

Hi Arthur,
Once we have an order created the E-boutique should email you those details. I have added you to the list we are working on.

Best, 
Jim @ MK II 
Watchmaker 
I know of one other member for sure that has gotten the same first email that his order would be honored as he got his a PayPal in even though his order didn't go through.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


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## mleok

at2011 said:


> Since Bill owns the rights to the Tornek-Rayville name, shouldn't the TR-660 be referred to as a "reissue" and the Stingray a "homage" since the BP Fifty Fathoms name is still owned by Blancpain?


Well, it doesn't have the Promethium-147 lume and the moisture indicator, so it's still a bit closer to a homage, than a reissue.


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## Maruzen

Arthur said:


> I received and email several days ago stating that they were adding me to the order list as they received my PayPal funds even though my order didn't register in the system.
> I got a second email from Jim @ MKII yesterday.
> 
> Hi Arthur,
> Once we have an order created the E-boutique should email you those details. I have added you to the list we are working on.
> 
> Best,
> Jim @ MK II
> Watchmaker
> I know of one other member for sure that has gotten the same first email that his order would be honored as he got his a PayPal in even though his order didn't go through.
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


I received the exact same second email from Jim yesterday. So we just have to wait until they manually input the order. I have no idea how long that will take because I no idea how many are on that list. I believe he is only honoring orders for those who paid but didn't receive a piece. So if your order stalled out but you didn't pay anything then you won't receive any notification.


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## Maruzen

Arthur said:


> I received and email several days ago stating that they were adding me to the order list as they received my PayPal funds even though my order didn't register in the system.
> I got a second email from Jim @ MKII yesterday.
> 
> Hi Arthur,
> Once we have an order created the E-boutique should email you those details. I have added you to the list we are working on.
> 
> Best,
> Jim @ MK II
> Watchmaker
> I know of one other member for sure that has gotten the same first email that his order would be honored as he got his a PayPal in even though his order didn't go through.
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


I received the exact same second email from Jim yesterday. So we just have to wait until they manually input the order. I have no idea how long that will take because I no idea how many are on that list. I believe he is only honoring orders for those who paid but didn't receive a piece. So if your order stalled out but you didn't pay anything then you won't receive any notification.


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## MHe225

Neily_San said:


> A quick question : has everyone who posted a query on the Customer Service portal received an email response ?
> 
> Like others my order stalled at the final step of Checkout ( still there ) and I submitted a query shortly thereafter asking if the order would be honoured. So far I have heard nothing.
> 
> Fingers still crossed.
> 
> Neily
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


Will be interesting to see what Bill does in your case. I ended up in the exact same predicament last year (2 years ago) with one of Stowa's LE's - order stalled after I entered all payment info. Emailed Stowa, no answer. When I sent a reminder, I was too late - most pieces were gone and my preferred LE number and all possible acceptable alternatives were gone.

Somehow I've missed the emails on Tornek Rayville and only learned that ordering had opened up when I read the drama here. This is the first one I'm missing since 2010 ..... (full disclosure: I passed on the Crucible as I feel it's too similar to the / my Hawkinge)


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## Arthur

MHe225 said:


> Will be interesting to see what Bill does in your case. I ended up in the exact same predicament last year (2 years ago) with one of Stowa's LE's - order stalled after I entered all payment info. Emailed Stowa, no answer. When I sent a reminder, I was too late - most pieces were gone and my preferred LE number and all possible acceptable alternatives were gone.
> 
> Somehow I've missed the emails on Tornek Rayville and only learned that ordering had opened up when I read the drama here. This is the first one I'm missing since 2010 ..... (full disclosure: I passed on the Crucible as I feel it's too similar to the / my Hawkinge)


I believe the key here is did your payment process? If you went to PayPal and the payment went through that would indicate that the order portal was still open. In my case the PayPal went through and then when I was directed back to the order portal to complete the order I got a message that there was a problem with the portal. But the money was in MKII's account.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


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## at2011

mleok said:


> Well, it doesn't have the Promethium-147 lume and the moisture indicator, so it's still a bit closer to a homage, than a reissue.


But if you own something, why would you make a homage of it when you can just reissue with a slightly different take? I just interpret the word "homage" as someone making a tribute or close copy of something they do not own in honor of it, not sure if anyone shares the same opinion, I could be wrong.


----------



## mleok

at2011 said:


> But if you own something, why would you make a homage of it when you can just reissue with a slightly different take on it? I just interpret the word "homage" as someone making a tribute or close copy of something they do not own in honor of it, not sure if anyone shares the same opinion, I could be wrong.


Even though MKII owns the rights to the name, it isn't really Tornek-Rayville, it is a zombie brand revival.


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## at2011

mleok said:


> Even though MKII owns the rights to the name, it isn't really Tornek-Rayville, it is a zombie brand revival.


Yes, understood it's not an original TR, but since he owns the brand now, he makes another run for it albeit the difference, a "reissue" then. If I bought the rights to the Swatch name fast forward 2050 assuming the company became bankrupt, and I'm referring to the colorful watches of the 80s, and I make another batch in 2051 with different colors and designs but with the same case and dimensions, I wouldn't consider it a "homage" right? It's still a Swatch watch, but only reissuing it for the next generation.


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## Hogan

mleok said:


> Even though MKII owns the rights to the name, it isn't really Tornek-Rayville, it is a zombie brand revival.


Except zombies are real.

The TR-660 isn't.

Not yet at least...


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## at2011

Hogan said:


> Except zombies are real.
> 
> The TR-660 isn't.
> 
> Not yet at least...


Bottom line is, the final product should be good with updated movement and improved water resistance rating. Just hoping Bill would put in the caseback treatment and markings with an MK II spin similar to the original.


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## mleok

at2011 said:


> Yes, understood it's not an original TR, but since he owns the brand now, he makes another run for it albeit the difference, a "reissue" then. If I bought the rights to the Swatch name fast forward 2050 assuming the company became bankrupt, and I'm referring to the colorful watches of the 80s, and I make another batch in 2051 with different colors and designs but with the same case and dimensions, I wouldn't consider it a "homage" right? It's still a Swatch watch, but only reissuing it for the next generation.


Let's just say it isn't cut and dried. I would be more comfortable calling it a reissue if the brand was continuously in existence between the time of the original and the new watch. It's also different if you bought the tooling to produce the watch as opposed to just the name itself.


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## TJ Boogie

To the gentlemen who've placed orders and have money will Bill, and didn't receive an email -- I'd log in, and send an email to MkII. I did, and I got the email confirming they got my money, and that unless I specifically ask for my money back, I'm now a part of the pre-order which consists of a huge group of people. 
Per the TR reissue debate, I think having the name patented counts for a lot. Although we've seen companies like Tudor do homages to Rolex pieces, and other companies do reissues that are homages to their own classics. There are a lot of elements to think of when considering reissue v homage, or is it both a homage/reissue/homage - as The Measure said (although to be both I'd allude to MLeok's argument that we'd have to see an active water moisture indicator, although I'd forego the Promethium-147 for some strong Super-LumiNova. 
Regardless, I'm stoked to see Bill's rendition, and hope it falls closely within the original's size specs -- I don't know how much watch we'll get for +/-1000, but let's keep fingers crossed


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## mleok

The TR-900 was in response to the MIL-W-2217.6A specification,

MIL-W-22176 A WATCH WRIST SUBMERSIBLE NON-MAGNETIC

and you can see from Section 3.2.2, the requirement calls for a radioactive luminous compound.


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## Hogan

at2011 said:


> Bottom line is, the final product should be good with updated movement and improved water resistance rating. Just hoping Bill would put in the caseback treatment and markings with an MK II spin similar to the original.


I'm not sure the NE15 can be considered an "updated movement".


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## at2011

Hogan said:


> I'm not sure the NE15 can be considered an "updated movement".


Cakes of deception.

Sent from my SM-N975U using Tapatalk


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## Hogan

at2011 said:


> Cakes of deception.
> 
> Sent from my SM-N975U using Tapatalk


Cakes indeed.

Makes one wonder how much Tornek-Rayville on the dial is really worth.

I was expecting something of a bit better spec all around.

That's my problem I know.

MKII will sell every one they produce...even at the somewhat fluid price.


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## Thieuster

mleok said:


> Even though MKII owns the rights to the name, it isn't really Tornek-Rayville, it is a zombie brand revival.


Oh like Volkswagen did when they reintroduced the Bugatti brand?

If Blancpain was to re-introduce the TR brand, the whole WiS world would be stopped in their track, in awe. Bill made a very smart move many years ago. And basically is he doing where Blancpain left off:

When Blancpain produced the TR, it was a simple-but-effective watch company. The movements were bought from Anton Schild. A simple design with a wonderful buzzing sound when you shook your wrist. (My dad had a Fifty Fathoms that he lost when he was sailing north of Scotland. As a young kid, I sat next to him on the sofa and listened to the buzzing sound when he shook his wrist! He didn't mind losing the watch: just an old French(...) watch he lost. He replaced it with a Seiko from a marine hardware & optical store).

The later Blancpains for the Bundeswehr were cases from Von Buren (Squale) with a Rayville signed ETA 2873 movement (nowadays easily bought on eBay for less than $40). In fact, Blancpain produced simple, rugged tool-watches! Cousteau's crew wore them, along with LeJour, Nivada and Lip Nautics. Nowadays also wonderful watches but they've never reached the 'status' of a FF or TR.

Blancpain piggy-back'ed on the adventurous documentaries of Cousteau. Like Omega did with the astronauts and Rolex did with deep-sea exploration. Imho, Blancpain only dropped the ball at a certain point: leaving the name Tornek Rayville on the shelf!

Bill's rejuvenation of Tornek is picking up where Blancpain stopped. That makes it - together with the lawful rights of using the name- the resurrection of Tornek Rayville.


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## Hogan

The Bugatti comparison is interesting.

When Romano Artioli acquired the brand in 1987, he built a factory, designed a car from the ground up, and produced & sold that car by 1991.
Pretty impressive...but the company went belly up by '95.

VW bought the name in '98. The giant auto maker took 7 years to bring out a new car with the Bugatti nameplate.

Mk II has owned the Tornek-Rayville name since '06.
At this point it deserves better than a Seiko engine...err...movement.


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## Thieuster

Surely, Bill is in no position to buy anything else than what's on offer for an artisan watchmaker. What can he do? Begging for ETAs? Asking around for spare Anton Schild movements? Remanufacture Lemania movements? His only way is buying the best movement at a reasonable price. Apart from that: personally I don't mind Seiko movements. A well-regulated Seiko (or Soprod for that matter) can be as accurate as any other watch that's sold by Bill. He has a reputation for accurate watches. Essentially that's what a TR should be: rugged and accurate. A tool with a reliable engine


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## mleok

Thieuster said:


> Surely, Bill is in no position to buy anything else than what's on offer for an artisan watchmaker. What can he do? Begging for ETAs? Asking around for spare Anton Schild movements? Remanufacture Lemania movements? His only way is buying the best movement at a reasonable price. Apart from that: personally I don't mind Seiko movements. A well-regulated Seiko (or Soprod for that matter) can be as accurate as any other watch that's sold by Bill. He has a reputation for accurate watches. Essentially that's what a TR should be: rugged and accurate. A tool with a reliable engine


I would prefer a Miyota 9015 or a Soprod A10 over the SII NE15.


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## Arthur

I agree with Thieuster. One problem with ETA Is availability. Three years ago or so when all the preliminary planning for the TR was getting going, the smart money was betting that the Swatch group was going to completely stop selling movements and even parts to everyone outside the Swatch group. Now things have changed and Swatch’s lower end watches are getting slammed by Apple and other smart watches. Because of this,Swatch has changed tactics and is anxious to sell movements. There are several problems here. One, movements are not universally interchangeable. ETA 2824’s and Sellita SW200’s are interchangeable, but you can’t interchange a Myiota 9015. So you design a case to fit a movement. If you decide that you want to go from the Seiko movement to ETA, you may well have to redesign the case to fit the new movements. 

Another is price. I have an account with a reputable parts house. I know Bill gets a better price because he buys in quantity, I usually buy one or two. Looking at the comparison between the ETA 2824 and the SII 6R35, the ETA is around 100$ more expensive. When you are marketing a watch at this price point, 100$ is a big consideration. Honestly, I haven’t had much experience with Seiko watches. Had a couple of Monsters and sold them on, no problems with the movement, however they were certainly not close to COSC movements. Have had tons of watches with ETA 2824 movements. Most were pretty accurate and were/or real workhorse movements. Another movement mentioned here is the Myiota 9015. I have three watches with that movement and thus far they have been very good. The only knock that I hear all the time is the very loud rotor. I’m a little hard of hearing so I’m blissfully unaware of the noise. 
I believe that the most important aspect of the whole picture is regulation. Most of these movements are either machine regulated or unregulated. If these watches are regulated any and all of these movements can be regulated to pretty tight specs. If you are looking for a super accurate watch, you should either buy a quartz or move to a watch with a higher grade movement, which means a pretty big price jump. I believe that Bill will deliver a quality watch that should satisfy most everyone. 


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## mleok

Arthur said:


> I agree with Thieuster. One problem with ETA Is availability. Three years ago or so when all the preliminary planning for the TR was getting going, the smart money was betting that the Swatch group was going to completely stop selling movements and even parts to everyone outside the Swatch group. Now things have changed and Swatch's lower end watches are getting slammed by Apple and other smart watches. Because of this,Swatch has changed tactics and is anxious to sell movements. There are several problems here. One, movements are not universally interchangeable. ETA 2824's and Sellita SW200's are interchangeable, but you can't interchange a Myiota 9015. So you design a case to fit a movement. If you decide that you want to go from the Seiko movement to ETA, you may well have to redesign the case to fit the new movements.
> 
> Another is price. I have an account with a reputable parts house. I know Bill gets a better price because he buys in quantity, I usually buy one or two. Looking at the comparison between the ETA 2824 and the SII 6R35, the ETA is around 100$ more expensive. When you are marketing a watch at this price point, 100$ is a big consideration. Honestly, I haven't had much experience with Seiko watches. Had a couple of Monsters and sold them on, no problems with the movement, however they were certainly not close to COSC movements. Have had tons of watches with ETA 2824 movements. Most were pretty accurate and were/or real workhorse movements. Another movement mentioned here is the Myiota 9015. I have three watches with that movement and thus far they have been very good. The only knock that I hear all the time is the very loud rotor. I'm a little hard of hearing so I'm blissfully unaware of the noise.
> I believe that the most important aspect of the whole picture is regulation. Most of these movements are either machine regulated or unregulated. If these watches are regulated any and all of these movements can be regulated to pretty tight specs. If you are looking for a super accurate watch, you should either buy a quartz or move to a watch with a higher grade movement, which means a pretty big price jump. I believe that Bill will deliver a quality watch that should satisfy most everyone.


For what it's worth, $900 is hardly a cheap watch, and the cheapest Tissot with a Powematic 80 COSC movement has a MSRP of $925, and goes for substantially less on the grey market.


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## Thieuster

No, $900 is a lot of money. But as Arthur wrote: the movement you'll use and the case design are set in stone from day one. Then, $900.00 is a lot of money. However, I visited Luxembourg last week and was stopped in my tracks when I spotted a Seiko dealer with nearly the complete 2020 catalogue on display, including Grand Seikos. Anyway, Seiko's prices are through the roof at the moment. Simple SKX watches for around $200 - $300 are no longer available. The lowest price in the window-shop was 478 euros/ ± $450. Then it went up, reaching 1000 euros instantly. We all know - and is written here- that Seiko movements are not the epitomy of accuracy.

I think that the TR 'as is' is a great deal: Bill's attention to detail, a limited run of watches, a well-sounding brand-name on the dial and accuracy. What's not to like?


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## MrDagon007

My Hawkinge and Paradive 3 are as accurate as my ETA watches (actually the Paradise 3 is my most accurate watch with margin) - hence no problem for me that the TR has the NE15.


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## Hogan

Thieuster said:


> I think that the TR 'as is' is a great deal: Bill's attention to detail, a limited run of watches, a well-sounding brand-name on the dial and accuracy. What's not to like?


The waiting?


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## Jim C.

Hogan said:


> The waiting?


It's the hardest part.


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## Thieuster

True! Nobody looks to be happy with that. But it is what it is. You know that it's a reality before you hand over the money.


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## Arthur

mleok said:


> For what it's worth, $900 is hardly a cheap watch, and the cheapest Tissot with a Powematic 80 COSC movement has a MSRP of $925, and goes for substantially less on the grey market.


I never mentioned the word cheap in my post. I was trying to make a point about movements, availability, compatibility and price. I agree a $900.00 watch is not a cheap watch. However this price range, from say750.00 to 1000.00 dollars is a very competitive range. There are tons of watches within that price range, from boutique brands to major brands.because it is very competitive, a 100.00 dollar crease in price may be the difference between someone buying that watch or switching to another brand. I will concede that MKII has a very strong following, and perhaps moving to a different movement and a subsequent price increase would have little or no affect on sales. Problem is there is no way to measure this, because folks that shop around and decide on another brand are not going to email or text you and say " I really like you watch, but I bought brand X because it was 100.00 dollars cheaper. In a perfect world everything would be standardized, so you could offer a watch with several movement choices at different price points. Unfortunately that world doesn't exist.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


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## Thieuster

Returning to the engine analogy: my Porsche 914 in 'European trim' has a 2.0 liter 4 cyl + fuel injection engine like the ones in the VW 411. Real Porsche fans don't want to associate that engine with Porsche... it has to be a flat 6! Until they notice that those cars are outside their reach, pricewise. Solution: they turn to a 'modded' 914-6: a 4 cyl car with a replacement 6 cyl engine. Even on display and for sale at my official Porsche dealer! The main dealer allows a homage / mod / replica inside his posh showroom with a price tag on the windshield! (https://www.luxuryandexpensive.com/s01.php?sp=en&ag=2&cur=eur&pp=aa&bnr=30531 - and the 'stance' of that car is horrible)

Or potential buyers turn to the 912: the 4cyl version of the 'regular 911' only to find out that the engine in that car is again... the VW411 engine. And suddenly it is no longer addressed as "... only a VW product." 
Can you see the analogy with watch homages? And with the 'what's under the bonnet' discussion? Just showing how much 'snobism' troubles a person's capability to make the right decisions.


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## izmarkie

I was on the fence due to already having an FFF and a Precista PRS-50. I passed because of the lack of no-rad symbol, but now I am not sure. Clearly I don't mind a homage to a watch I will probably never get a chance to own, let alone want to shell out the necessary cash for, but I don't understand how anyone could feel that a brand like MKII was not going to keep the spirit of the original with enough integrity to satisfy other like-minded people. I'm sure it's a thousand times closer to the original than my Seiko, and probably more in line with the originals than my PRS-50, but I could still love those even if I owned the real thing.


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## izmarkie

Thieuster said:


> Returning to the engine analogy: my Porsche 914 in 'European trim' has a 2.0 liter 4 cyl + fuel injection engine like the ones in the VW 411. Real Porsche fans don't want to associate that engine with Porsche... it has to be a flat 6! Until they notice that those cars are outside their reach, pricewise. Solution: they turn to a 'modded' 914-6: a 4 cyl car with a replacement 6 cyl engine. Even on display and for sale at my official Porsche dealer! The main dealer allows a homage / mod / replica inside his posh showroom with a price tag on the windshield! (https://www.luxuryandexpensive.com/s01.php?sp=en&ag=2&cur=eur&pp=aa&bnr=30531 - and the 'stance' of that car is horrible)
> 
> Or potential buyers turn to the 912: the 4cyl version of the 'regular 911' only to find out that the engine in that car is again... the VW411 engine. And suddenly it is no longer addressed as "... only a VW product."
> Can you see the analogy with watch homages? And with the 'what's under the bonnet' discussion? Just showing how much 'snobism' troubles a person's capability to make the right decisions.


65,000 euro!?!?! I would require an LT4 crate engine in it for that price :-d


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## Hogan

Thieuster said:


> Returning to the engine analogy: my Porsche 914 in 'European trim' has a 2.0 liter 4 cyl + fuel injection engine like the ones in the VW 411. Real Porsche fans don't want to associate that engine with Porsche... it has to be a flat 6! Until they notice that those cars are outside their reach, pricewise. Solution: they turn to a 'modded' 914-6: a 4 cyl car with a replacement 6 cyl engine. Even on display and for sale at my official Porsche dealer! The main dealer allows a homage / mod / replica inside his posh showroom with a price tag on the windshield! (https://www.luxuryandexpensive.com/s01.php?sp=en&ag=2&cur=eur&pp=aa&bnr=30531 - and the 'stance' of that car is horrible)


Speaking of Porches...I'm going to Emory Motorsports tomorrow.

They actually build stuff you can buy.


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## Thieuster

Wow! I won't mind seeing pics of that! Perhaps not allowed here, but PM me if you like!


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## longstride

MKII's RTW series does fulfill the reality of wearing a classic without the risk of damaging or losing an original.
Both my Hawkinge and Paradive are amongst the most worn watches I have, no complaints about either for fit, finish, quality or accuracy, the use of a Seiko movement is more of a plus than a minus - The TR will be another hit for MKII of that I have no doubt.


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## Quartersawn

Without having to read all 23 pages of this thread it looks like there is now a pre-order, pre-payment and year long wait for this watch? Is this model different than the Ready to Wear watch?

https://www.mkiiwatches.com/ready-to-wear


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## Jim C.

This is the Ready to Wear watch. MkII opened the pre-order for the first 75 watches on Feb 13th for people on their 'Notify' list, and due to a glitch in their ordering system, added a couple more. The pre-orders sold out pretty quickly.

I think the intent is to have them listed in stock sometime after the pre-orders ship.


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## Randy9999

The name isn't "patented" because names aren't patented... Inventions are patented. Names are trademarked. Bill actually does now own the Tornek-Rayville trademarked name — on file with the United States Patent & Trademark Office (USPTO). I think the confusion arises because the same federal government agency registers both patents and trademarks. Since Bill does own the trademark, this new watch isn't a homage at all; in fact, it's just the actual latest release of a very old trademarked brand.


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## Hogan

Randy9999 said:


> Since Bill does own the trademark, this new watch isn't a homage at all; in fact, it's just the actual latest release of a very old trademarked brand.


I'd call it a new model from the Mk II brand.

But yeah...it's great it's finally seeing the light of day.


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## Jim C.

If only the watches were as quick to ship... b-)


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## Hogan

I'm putting this out there!

Anyone who wants to sell their sweatshirt I'll pay fair market value...

XL or larger.

You can keep the watch...


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## Thieuster

Jim C. said:


> If only the watches were as quick to ship... b-)
> 
> View attachment 14919197


How dare you! Only posting this without (essential) background information about where to get, price etc. ;-)


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## Thieuster

Jim C. said:


> If only the watches were as quick to ship... b-)
> 
> View attachment 14919197


How dare you! Only posting this without (essential) background information about where to get, price etc. ;-)


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## tmoris

Thieuster said:


> How dare you! Only posting this without (essential) background information about where to get, price etc. ;-)


The jacket is part of the TR pre-order 

On a side note.. Now that Im waiting for my TR, I have also discovered the Baltic Aquascaphe  watch with the blue gilt dial and it caught my interest!

Looking forward to receiving both!


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## tmoris

.


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## Jim C.

Thieuster said:


> How dare you! Only posting this without (essential) background information about where to get, price etc. ;-)


I'll trade my place in line and the jacket for your original MkII T-R.


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## at2011

Hogan said:


> I'd call it a new model from the Mk II brand.
> 
> But yeah...it's great it's finally seeing the light of day.


So does this mean that all new Blancpains, Omegas, Hamiltons or Breguets are just new models of Swatch?

Sent from my SM-N975U using Tapatalk


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## Hogan

at2011 said:


> So does this mean that all new Blancpains, Omegas, Hamiltons or Breguets are just new models of Swatch?


When they start putting the name "Swatch" on the dial face of a Speedmaster...I'll agree with you.


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## Hogan

at2011 said:


> So does this mean that all new Blancpains, Omegas, Hamiltons or Breguets are just new models of Swatch?


When they start putting the name "Swatch" on the dial face of a Speedmaster...I'll agree with you.


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## at2011

Hogan said:


> When they start putting the name "Swatch" on the dial face of a Speedmaster...I'll agree with you.


Precisely my point. Just because ownership of the name changed hands doesn't mean that this watch isn't a real TR.

Sent from my SM-N975U using Tapatalk


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## Hogan

at2011 said:


> Precisely my point. Just because ownership of the name changed hands doesn't mean that this watch isn't a real TR.


It's all good.

I think it's cool that they're bringing it out finally. I'm sure it'll be a nice little watch.

Tornek-Rayville was never a consumer brand in the first place.


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## MrDagon007

longstride said:


> MKII's RTW series does fulfill the reality of wearing a classic without the risk of damaging or losing an original.
> Both my Hawkinge and Paradive are amongst the most worn watches I have, no complaints about either for fit, finish, quality or accuracy, the use of a Seiko movement is more of a plus than a minus - The TR will be another hit for MKII of that I have no doubt.
> 
> View attachment 14913435


Hi, what is that strap on your Paradive? Beautiful. Mine is still on the factory rubber.


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## Arthur

Got my Tornek Rayville jacket this afternoon. I am impressed by the quality. Nice and heavy with a lining that looks like it would keep you warm!
I would have bought the watch without the added "perk" but it sure is nice that Bill seems to throw in something extra for the early buyers. Thank you Bill and MKII









Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## brianmazanec

Agreed. I got mine today too and it is of very high quality. 

Sent from my SM-N960U using Tapatalk


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## Hogan

I'm starting to regret not be able to get my pre-order through.

That jacket looks cool!


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## Semper Jeep

My jacket is out for delivery today. I agree it looks great (I'm looking forward to receiving it) but like others, I would have bought the watch without the jacket.

FWIW, I actually have quite a few things from American Trench (I'm wearing some American Trench socks today!) and I've always been impressed with their quality. I've got an olive drab peacoat from them that is so much nicer than any other peacoats I've handled in the same price range (and those more $$$$ than the American Trench one) and it blows the Sterlingwear peacoats out of the water - Sterlingwear is the brand that had the contract with the military and was sold at the Navy Exchange and in the uniform stores when I served.


----------



## NWP627

Received my jacket today. Fantastic piece of kit. Thank you Bill.


----------



## Hogan

Looks like I'm gonna have to buy an homage sweatshirt...lol


----------



## tmoris

Did you guys get the s&h returned to your card/paypal by american trench yet?


----------



## brianmazanec

I did 

Sent from my SM-N960U using Tapatalk


----------



## KingKF1221

back in the game after 10 years or so  but hard to order one!


----------



## Hogan

KingKF1221 said:


> back in the game after 10 years or so  but hard to order one!


You're early.

Check back in a year or so...lol


----------



## KingKF1221

Hogan said:


> You're early.
> 
> Check back in a year or so...lol


LOL, darn !!


----------



## itibiertia0887

I feel exactly the same


----------



## Maruzen

tmoris said:


> Did you guys get the s&h returned to your card/paypal by american trench yet?


Not yet. I ordered last Tuesday and have received neither a shipping notice nor a refund. I believe they have to get reimbursed from MkII first, so...


----------



## tmoris

brianmazanec said:


> I did
> 
> Sent from my SM-N960U using Tapatalk





Maruzen said:


> Not yet. I ordered last Tuesday and have received neither a shipping notice nor a refund. I believe they have to get reimbursed from MkII first, so...


Thank you both. Will wait a bit more then..


----------



## TheMeasure

tmoris said:


> Did you guys get the s&h returned to your card/paypal by american trench yet?


I ordered my jacket last week on the 2nd. Just received a notification today from American Trench stating my refund has been processed.

My credit should be posted here in a few days.


----------



## Semper Jeep

I got a notification on Saturday from AT that my shipping was refunded.

FWIW, I'm not generally a hoodie or sweatshirt guy but I wore the heck out of that TR sweatshirt this weekend!


----------



## Semper Jeep

I got a notification on Saturday from AT that my shipping was refunded.

FWIW, I'm not generally a hoodie or sweatshirt guy but I wore the heck out of that TR sweatshirt this weekend!


----------



## Maruzen

tmoris said:


> Thank you both. Will wait a bit more then..


Just received notification of refund from both American Trench and PayPal. So you should get yours soon.

I paid with my PP balance so it was immediate. CC might take a couple of more days.


----------



## Maruzen

tmoris said:


> Thank you both. Will wait a bit more then..


Just received notification of refund from both American Trench and PayPal. So you should get yours soon.

I paid with my PP balance so it was immediate. CC might take a couple of more days.


----------



## Arthur

Got mine a couple of days ago.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


----------



## TJ Boogie

Got mine. Super stoked for the jacket and watch, both look fantastic |>|>|>


----------



## itibiertia0887

Maruzen said:


> Not yet. I ordered last Tuesday and have received neither a shipping notice nor a refund. I believe they have to get reimbursed from MkII first, so...


Sorry May I ask how you were able to order it?


----------



## incomplet

Wow I just got mine, really high quality. Actually considering buying a trench from American trench. The weight of the jacket is heavy and the inner fleece feels really durable. 

Sent from my Pixel 3 XL using Tapatalk


----------



## Maruzen

itibiertia0887 said:


> Sorry May I ask how you were able to order it?


The jacket was part of the package for ordering one of the Tornek Rayville pieces. So there was a private link for those who had an order. However, I think American Trench is going to release them to the general public soon. They might have already, but haven't checked.


----------



## Maruzen

itibiertia0887 said:


> Sorry May I ask how you were able to order it?


The jacket was part of the package for ordering one of the Tornek Rayville pieces. So there was a private link for those who had an order. However, I think American Trench is going to release them to the general public soon. They might have already, but haven't checked.


----------



## TheMeasure

For those interested, American Trench has the TR sweatshirt up on their site. No private link needed.


----------



## thejollywatcher

Oops 

Wrong thread.

Sent from my flat 6.5" wrist.


----------



## TJ Boogie

The jacket's great! Thanks Bill!


----------



## Maruzen

According to the American Trench website, pre-orders are open on the jackets until the 19th. After that, they won't be available.


----------



## Hogan

Maruzen said:


> According to the American Trench website, pre-orders are open on the jackets until the 19th. After that, they won't be available.


I ordered one...saved me from having to make my own homage jacket...lol


----------



## KingKF1221

incomplet said:


> Wow I just got mine, really high quality. Actually considering buying a trench from American trench. The weight of the jacket is heavy and the inner fleece feels really durable.
> 
> Sent from my Pixel 3 XL using Tapatalk


time to share some pohtos with us !


----------



## Maruzen

Hogan said:


> I ordered one...saved me from having to make my own homage jacket...lol


Initially, I wasn't very interested in the jacket. However, after seeing them about, I'm looking forward to getting it. The quality seems to be very good, so worth paying for I think.


----------



## TheMeasure

Is there anyone else who has not received your sweatshirt or at least tracking info that was part of the TR watch pre order? 

Simply curious as to where American Trench might be in their fulfillment. I know they’re a smaller shop too so I’m not expecting Amazon Prime shipping speed here. 

And it could be I chose a more popular/common size so maybe it’s back ordered.


----------



## Arthur

TheMeasure said:


> Is there anyone else who has not received your sweatshirt or at least tracking info that was part of the TR watch pre order?
> 
> Simply curious as to where American Trench might be in their fulfillment. I know they're a smaller shop too so I'm not expecting Amazon Prime shipping speed here.
> 
> And it could be I chose a more popular/common size so maybe it's back ordered.


You might want to contact them just to see where they are with your order.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


----------



## mtbmike

TheMeasure said:


> Is there anyone else who has not received your sweatshirt or at least tracking info that was part of the TR watch pre order?
> 
> Simply curious as to where American Trench might be in their fulfillment. I know they're a smaller shop too so I'm not expecting Amazon Prime shipping speed here.
> 
> And it could be I chose a more popular/common size so maybe it's back ordered.


Also not heard anything in a week. Figure Large are back ordered.


----------



## TheMeasure

Arthur said:


> You might want to contact them just to see where they are with your order.


I'll shoot them an email next week if I don't hear anything. Was seeing how many might be in the same boat but then again everyone who orders isn't necessarily a member here or posts regularly.

Cheers



mtbmike said:


> Also not heard anything in a week. Figure Large are back ordered.


I ordered a L too.. prob a popular size.

Thank you both.


----------



## Hogan

There's more chat about the sweatshirt than the watch...lol

Can anyone post what the specs are on the watch?

All I saw was the movement to be used...


----------



## Jim C.

Hogan said:


> There's more chat about the sweatshirt than the watch...lol
> 
> Can anyone post what the specs are on the watch?
> 
> All I saw was the movement to be used...


From the pre-order page...


----------



## Maruzen

TheMeasure said:


> Is there anyone else who has not received your sweatshirt or at least tracking info that was part of the TR watch pre order?
> 
> Simply curious as to where American Trench might be in their fulfillment. I know they're a smaller shop too so I'm not expecting Amazon Prime shipping speed here.
> 
> And it could be I chose a more popular/common size so maybe it's back ordered.


I ordered mine about the same as you and the same size. I contacted them two days ago and was informed that it would ship in 4-6 weeks (backordered like you expected). However, due to the current situation, I was told to expect 6 weeks. When my refund came, I also received a message stating the item hadn't shipped yet. Nothing else. Feeling like you guys, I contacted them. So we have to wait for both the watch and sweatshirt, lol.


----------



## brianmazanec

I ordered a large and got it over a week ago. It's awesome and worth the wait! 

Sent from my SM-N960U using Tapatalk


----------



## Arthur

Maruzen said:


> I ordered mine about the same as you and the same size. I contacted them two days ago and was informed that it would ship in 4-6 weeks (backordered like you expected). However, due to the current situation, I was told to expect 6 weeks. When my refund came, I also received a message stating the item hadn't shipped yet. Nothing else. Feeling like you guys, I contacted them. So we have to wait for both the watch and sweatshirt, lol.


I suspect that they made a certain number of each size, and with the additional watch orders approved, probably ran out of the Large size as it is more than likely the most popular. It will be worth the wait as it is a really nice jacket. Only problem here is it's now " short sleeve" weather in the south!!

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


----------



## TheMeasure

Maruzen said:


> ... I contacted them two days ago and was informed that it would ship in 4-6 weeks (backordered like you expected). However, due to the current situation, I was told to expect 6 weeks.


I figured it was something similar. Thank you for sharing this update and confirming.


----------



## TJ Boogie

Did anyone save a screenshot of the new Tornek Rayville rendering? Thanks in advance either way, I forgot to :/


----------



## Randy9999

Hogan said:


> I'm starting to regret not be able to get my pre-order through.
> 
> That jacket looks cool!


It was karma hard at work... because the universe knew you would eventually become the main person arguing against the standalone integrity of the Tornek-Rayville trademark. (Lol!)


----------



## TheMeasure

TJ Boogie said:


> Did anyone save a screenshot of the new Tornek Rayville rendering? Thanks in advance either way, I forgot to :/


Here you go.


----------



## TJ Boogie

TheMeasure said:


> Here you go.
> Thank you good sir!


----------



## TJ Boogie

TheMeasure said:


> Here you go.
> Thank you good sir!


----------



## Hogan

Randy9999 said:


> It was karma hard at work... because the universe knew you would eventually become the main person arguing against the standalone integrity of the Tornek-Rayville trademark. (Lol!)


Yeah...my bootleg "Tornek-Rayville homage" sweatshirt project was in development hell.

American Trench beat me to market...lol


----------



## TheMeasure

For those still waiting on their TR sweatshirts, I reached out to American Trench today and here’s their response. 


“The jackets were dropped off at the screen printer today! We expect to get them back in about a week or so and then we will begin shipping.”


----------



## Maruzen

TheMeasure said:


> For those still waiting on their TR sweatshirts, I reached out to American Trench today and here's their response.
> 
> "The jackets were dropped off at the screen printer today! We expect to get them back in about a week or so and then we will begin shipping."


Thanks. I had done the same yesterday (not seeing your message) and the response was similar:

"We have the jackets in and we have sent them out to be screen printed. I am assuming they will be ready to ship out in less than 2 weeks.

Our apologies for the lengthy delay, our manufacturers are only able to work at half capacity at this time and have been prioritizing masks and other protective garments. Once it ships you will be emailed a tracking number."


----------



## Stev0

Would love a progress update on TR watch production - out of pure interest as opposed to impatience (although the anticipation is building! 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


----------



## Neily_San

The last update on the website is from Bill’s COVID-19 statement in March :

“Tornek-Rayville: The project is proceeding as planned. We will update you as we hear from vendors about lead times and potential impact.”

Anyone heard anything further since via other channels ?
( Not complaining ... just interested )

:-D
Neily 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


----------



## TheMeasure

This was just posted on MKII's IG story


----------



## WastedYears

So 2021..


----------



## TheMeasure

WastedYears said:


> So 2021..


Since no new timeframes have been given since the TR was announced in Feb, I'm guessing it's still the following. Optimistically I'm hoping for end of year.

Lead time: Shipments are currently estimated to begin Q4 2020 or Q1 2021. Please note that this is a rough estimate and may change based on a review of the samples, pending confirmation by the vendor, and/or QC of the received watches


----------



## TheMeasure

Double post..


----------



## Maruzen

I had wondered why the long wait when we ordered and then when I saw the update about the drawings it made sense. If the order was just placed, a 6-7 month wait time is about right.


----------



## Neily_San

Update from Instagram :










All the best. 
:-D
Neily

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


----------



## Semper Jeep

Neily_San said:


> Update from Instagram :
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> All the best.
> :-D
> Neily
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


Hopefully it's happy news.


----------



## boatswain

I was just reminded about the TR when I stumbled on a pic of an old sting ray.

Still hoping we see a sting ray update too soon. 

Happy waiting to the TR folks!

I may kick myself for not ordering...


----------



## longstride

Fingers crossed!


----------



## at2011

Still hoping I won't die of COVID by the time it ships. Praying as hard as I can to be alive by the time it gets to me. 

Sent from my SM-N975U using Tapatalk


----------



## at2011

Shipment estimated Q2 2021.

Sent from my SM-N975U using Tapatalk


----------



## at2011

Late Q2, 2021.

Sent from my SM-N975U using Tapatalk


----------



## K1w179

I'm obsessed with this watch but not enough to put money down then wait that long. 

Sent from my SM-G950F using Tapatalk


----------



## Maruzen

I usually avoid lengthy waits but knew I would still want this piece regardless.


----------



## tmoris

This is my 4th plank waitlist (Kingston, KeyWest, P300, TR2) and the one Im actually most excited about


----------



## Semper Jeep

Disappointing news but not really unexpected.


----------



## bombaywalla

at2011 said:


> Late Q2, 2021.
> 
> Sent from my SM-N975U using Tapatalk





Maruzen said:


> I usually avoid lengthy waits but knew I would still want this piece regardless.





tmoris said:


> This is my 4th plank waitlist (Kingston, KeyWest, P300, TR2) and the one Im actually most excited about


So, what is BY doing that makes the wait sooooooooooooooooooooo long. I know BY's a perfectionist but even then after the TR is well into production, what is causing such a massive delay?
Don't say COVID-19! Because even prev watches like Kingston, Paradive Gen2, etc had enormously long waits & there was no COVID-19 back then........... 
In the P300 thread I read that one user waited 10 years to get his P300!!


----------



## at2011

Sometimes the journey makes the reward more special.

Sent from my SM-N975U using Tapatalk


----------



## WastedYears

I'm a bit annoyed by the fact that apparently only plank owners are able to access the TR instagram account.


----------



## raptus

For some unknown reason, I was sure this watch was going to be 42 mm and I had just written it off as being another one of those dive watches I can’t wear. 

Now I see it’s spec’ed to be 40 mm and that has me excited; is that the original size of this piece, by the way?

A MKII-quality watch with the looks of the traditional Fifty Fathoms is a super interesting proposition. Can’t wait to see some more pictures.


----------



## jh9t

WastedYears said:


> I'm a bit annoyed by the fact that apparently only plank owners are able to access the TR instagram account.


Don't be, I'm a plank owner and don't have access to the TR Instagram account. I sent my request over 3 weeks ago lol


----------



## Maruzen

jh9t said:


> Don't be, I'm a plan owner and don't have access to the TR Instagram account. I sent my request over 3 weeks ago lol


Same. I assume Bill is waiting until he has something to share.


----------



## tmoris

bombaywalla said:


> In the P300 thread I read that one user waited 10 years to get his P300!!


Actually I believe everyone of the plankowners waited 10+ years


----------



## sleauxdaddy

jh9t said:


> Don't be, I'm a plan owner and don't have access to the TR Instagram account. I sent my request over 3 weeks ago lol


Same here!! :-(


----------



## rtl

sleauxdaddy said:


> Same here!! :-(


Lol I sent a request over a month ago. Just sent another message if I would be approved soon..


----------



## Majnp

New email from Bill. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Neily_San

Excerpt from Bill’s email this week :

“The IG account: We completed the review of all the requests but we haven't added everyone that has been confirmed yet. We also haven't posted anything yet to the IG account because of the need to evaluate the samples in a timely manner.”

So, it would appear no-one is missing anything ... yet ;-D

Neily 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


----------



## Neily_San

Yesterday I received a confirmation that my request to join the Tornek Rayville IG group has been accepted. 

If I recall correctly only a handful had previously been accepted. There are now 61 followers, so a significant batch of requests must have been processed alongside mine. 

Still no content published within the group. 

:-D
Neily 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


----------



## MrDagon007

On a tangential note, the American Trench TR jacket is splendid, enjoying it now that it is getting colder.
I missed the watch preorder but could snag one of the last spare jackets from the American Trench website.


----------



## mtbmike

TR watch fans head over to TZ's Blancpain forum for some great images/details of the 2017 & 2020 Fifty Fathoms MILSPEC.

*Firty Fathoms MIL-SPEC Limited Edition For HODINKEE*


----------



## alangloi

mtbmike said:


> TR watch fans head over to TZ's Blancpain forum for some great images/details of the 2017 & 2020 Fifty Fathoms MILSPEC.
> 
> *Firty Fathoms MIL-SPEC Limited Edition For HODINKEE*


Nice watch, but at $14.4K it is for the few.


----------



## Semper Jeep

alangloi said:


> Nice watch, but at $14.4K it is for the few.


I'd sell my MKII collection for that one! ....or at least for a downpayment towards that one.


----------



## tripreed

I'm looking to purchase a dive watch in the next few months, one that will be an heirloom that I can pass along to my future son who is due to be born in April. I've done a ton of research (that's the most fun part, right?) and narrowed it down to just a couple of options, with the MKII Tornek Rayville as a dark horse candidate. It is just very frustrating not knowing whether this will be available by then, and if it is, if I can even purchase one. I heard Bill on the January 6 episode of the Worn & Wound podcast where he was supposedly wearing his Tornek Rayville, but was disappointed that he offered no real update on it. The more that I've listened to Bill and read about his background, I appreciate his obsession with quality and details, but the lack of insight is frustrating.


----------



## TheMeasure

tripreed said:


> I'm looking to purchase a dive watch in the next few months, one that will be an heirloom that I can pass along to my future son who is due to be born in April....


Hey tripreed -

I think it's awesome that you'll be doing this for your future son.

I believe the last update for timeframes, Bill was targeting late Q2 2021 to begin deliveries for the plank owners. I'm unsure of when general ordering would open up, I'd guess shortly after but that's just my guess. Unfortunately I think there are still a lot of uncertainties and potential for moving target dates given COVID's current and future impact.

As you mentioned, Bill had his TR prototype on during that podcast and that TR production had started, so that's promising.

If you haven't already I'd encourage you to sign up for the TR notifications on the MKII Boutique page. While notifications and updates are far and few, they do come via that route.

Cheers!


----------



## Stev0

Question to plank owners / potential future TR owners - which bezel option will/would you choose, aluminium or acrylic and why?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


----------



## TJ Boogie

Stev0 said:


> Question to plank owners / potential future TR owners - which bezel option will/would you choose, aluminium or acrylic and why?
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


Acrylic. While it's more prone to scratches, they can be buffed out. Also, acrylic was used on the original, and holds up well in longevity.


----------



## TheMeasure

Stev0 said:


> Question to plank owners / potential future TR owners - which bezel option will/would you choose, aluminium or acrylic and why?
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


When the time comes to choose my TR config, I'm going with the acrylic insert. I love the fully lumed look. The acrylic really adds to the vintage vibe and my Paradive acrylic insert has held up well so I'm not concerned about durability. I like the idea that over time my crystal should be pretty much blemish free and the insert will have aged/wabi/patina nicely. I don't think there is a wrong choice, both look great simply personal preference.


----------



## boatswain

Oh man. 

I know I sat this one out at the time but I sure am curious to see how these turn out.


----------



## brianmazanec

How do we know the information on choices? Did I miss something? 

Sent from my SM-G991U using Tapatalk


----------



## TheMeasure

brianmazanec said:


> How do we know the information on choices? Did I miss something?
> 
> Sent from my SM-G991U using Tapatalk


IIR in the the TR Pre-Order announcement email, it was mentioned you'd be able to choose bezel insert and strap options. No mention of what the strap options will be yet, but the bezel options were listed only as an FYI.

I don't believe you missed anything. People are simply wondering that when it comes time to choose a config, what bezel insert are they planning on picking.. acrylic or aluminum.


----------



## brianmazanec

TheMeasure said:


> IIR in the the TR Pre-Order announcement email, it was mentioned you'd be able to choose bezel insert and strap options. No mention of what the strap options will be yet, but the bezel options were listed only as an FYI.
> 
> I don't believe you missed anything. People are simply wondering that when it comes time to choose a config, what bezel insert are they planning on picking.. acrylic or aluminum.


Got it, thanks!

Sent from my SM-G991U using Tapatalk


----------



## Stev0

It would be great to have a lumed bezel however the pip at 12 and graduation markings to 15 had me favouring the aluminium bezel. I've no experience with modern acrylic bezels so interested to hear about other people's perspectives particularly with MKII watches.
















Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


----------



## at2011

I'm more bothered by the crown than the bezel, would've been nicer if it was made similar to the original. Just hoping the watch won't look anything like those cheap Chinese knockoffs on the most popular online auction site. 

Sent from my SM-N975U using Tapatalk


----------



## boatswain

It would have been nice to see a prototype before preordering. Or I imagine now for those that have ordered to be able to see what’s coming. 

Just to see how the details are executed in reality. Really that’s what held me back at the time the preorder opened. I just couldn’t jump in based on 1 2D drawing. 

Hopefully some pics come out soon to tide folks over. 

Happy waiting to all those on the preorder list.


----------



## TheMeasure

at2011 said:


> I'm more bothered by the crown than the bezel, would've been nicer if it was made similar to the original. Just hoping the watch won't look anything like those cheap Chinese knockoffs on the most popular online auction site.
> 
> Sent from my SM-N975U using Tapatalk


I'm really hoping for a crown closer to the original as well vs what we see in the rendering.


----------



## TJ Boogie

Does anyone know if the moisture indicator will be the same as the previous (white text over blue)? Or may we see something similar to the original, or something completely new altogether?


----------



## brianmazanec

Saw the first photo hit Instagram. Looking good!









Sent from my SM-G991U using Tapatalk


----------



## boatswain

brianmazanec said:


> Saw the first photo hit Instagram. Looking good!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my SM-G991U using Tapatalk


Thanks for sharing!

Looks promising. Love what appears to be a blasted finish.


----------



## TJ Boogie

I’m stoked to nab one! Looks great so far. The history of the TR is amazing.


----------



## Neily_San

TJ Boogie said:


> Does anyone know if the moisture indicator will be the same as the previous (white text over blue)? Or may we see something similar to the original, or something completely new altogether?


Anyone else think that Insta shot has a B&W filter ? Can't really be sure if the colours on the indicator ?

Neily

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


----------



## boatswain

If I remember right the Pre-order render had a grey indicator with no colour. I was hoping for a pop of blue but I don’t remember seeing it for these. I could be wrong though.


----------



## at2011

Color looks like titanium. Is it supposed to be stainless steel?

Sent from my SM-N975U using Tapatalk


----------



## TheMeasure

The TR was confirmed that it will have a blasted finish. 

I'm pretty sure the "moisture indicator" will be like the renderings posted earlier in the thread.. top half black w/ white or grey writing (can't quite tell) and grey bottom with white writing. I too would've liked some blue in there, but am ok that Bill is keeping that exclusive to the original batch of TRs.


----------



## WastedYears

What movement is going to be in the TR? Can't seem to find that info on the MKII website.

[edit]
Nevermind, I found it in this thread. It's a SII NE15 movement. I was hoping for a no-date movement, but so be it.


----------



## brianmazanec

Next Instagram post up.









Sent from my SM-G991U using Tapatalk


----------



## Stev0

brianmazanec said:


> Next Instagram post up.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my SM-G991U using Tapatalk


Am I reading these illustrations too literally to think the acrylic bezel version (right) will have the circular moisture indicator and the aluminium bezel version (left) will not?

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


----------



## brianmazanec

Stev0 said:


> Am I reading these illustrations too literally to think the acrylic bezel version (right) will have the circular moisture indicator and the aluminium bezel version (left) will not?
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


Interesting, maybe!


----------



## at2011

Stev0 said:


> Am I reading these illustrations too literally to think the acrylic bezel version (right) will have the circular moisture indicator and the aluminium bezel version (left) will not?
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


The image on the right is that of the original TR. If you look for TR images online, you'll find this one. The one on the left is MKII version. The images has nothing to do with the actual function of the moisture indicator, I suspect the built version will be purely aesthetic as the first MKII TR. There's actually a moisture indicator paper available for purchase online, hope to see a good mod in the future.

Sent from my SM-N975U using Tapatalk


----------



## brianmazanec

New update:


Tornek-Rayville Update

Dear TR Series 3 Plankowners,
Update:

We will be assembing additional samples this week with the aim of getting catalog shots taken as well as additional shots for the IG account. We had been waiting on improved acrylic insert samples which have since arrived. The catalog shots will be required for the final order page which we hope to have completed and active in the April/May timeframe.

Currently we are working on details for the project including (hopefully) a custom strap as well as the instruction card. The illustrations for the instruction sheet have been completed and now we need to layout the rest of the details of the sheet including copy and how and where we will print them.

There are some other "things" we are working as on well but we'll be saving that for later in the process.

As many of you noticed we have launched an updated web store. We hope that this will make your experience with the final order submissions more convenient as well as enjoyable. That was the change we had hinted at in our last update. 
Thanks again for your support and patience. Stay safe!
Best,
Bill and the Mk II Team



Sent from my SM-G991U using Tapatalk


----------



## boatswain

That’s good hearing!


----------



## brianmazanec

New insta post.









Sent from my SM-G991U using Tapatalk


----------



## Neily_San

Wahoooooo !! A picture of a finished TR ( with aluminium bezel inlay ) just released on IG.










Looks absolutely amazing. Hopefully this bodes well for shipping starting soon.

:-D
Neily

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


----------



## john_marston

Is the price known? And what’s the movement? It looks really good


----------



## *2112

Neily_San said:


> Wahoooooo !! A picture of a finished TR ( with aluminium bezel inlay ) just released on IG.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Looks absolutely amazing. Hopefully this bodes well for shipping starting soon.
> 
> :-D
> Neily
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


 Looks amazing! I'm sorry i missed out on the pre-order


----------



## boatswain

Awesome looking forward to seeing more. 

Preparing to kick myself for passing on the pre order. 

Though I also assume a second round of ordering may be possible in the future. And hopefully more pics will be out at that time.


----------



## TheMeasure

john_marston said:


> Is the price known? And what's the movement? It looks really good


Price per MKII:
$895 plus S&H. Price may stay the same or may go higher, not sure at this point.

Movement:
Made in Japan SII NE15 (Rotor features Côtes de Genève), quickset date, hack setting, automatic with manual winding capability.


----------



## TheMeasure

boatswain said:


> Awesome looking forward to seeing more.
> 
> Preparing to kick myself for passing on the pre order.
> 
> Though I also assume a second round of ordering may be possible in the future. And hopefully more pics will be out at that time.


Yes since the TR will be in the RTW line, you'll have other opportunities down the road.


----------



## tripreed

Anyone have a larger image of the finished watch? If you're looking at Instagram in your browser, you can add "media/?size=l" to the end of the URL and it will show the full-size picture which you can save. For example, https://wwwDOTinstagramDOTcom/p/CNBbKyYLTLA/media/?size=l (substitute periods for DOT, it was automatically formatting it as a shortened URL)


----------



## john_marston

TheMeasure said:


> Price per MKII:
> $895 plus S&H. Price may stay the same or may go higher, not sure at this point.
> 
> Movement:
> Made in Japan SII NE15 (Rotor features Côtes de Genève), quickset date, hack setting, automatic with manual winding capability.


Thanks for the info.

Interesting movement choice, never see it used. Overall a bit too pricey for me. Looks like there's plenty of demand though.


----------



## *2112

tripreed said:


> Anyone have a larger image of the finished watch? If you're looking at Instagram in your browser, you can add "media/?size=l" to the end of the URL and it will show the full-size picture which you can save. For example, https://wwwDOTinstagramDOTcom/p/CNBbKyYLTLA/media/?size=l (substitute periods for DOT, it was automatically formatting it as a shortened URL)


was this posted under the TornekRayville account? Bummer if it is, as MK hasn't accepted my friend request  Any chance you post the larger image here??


----------



## TheMeasure

tripreed said:


> Anyone have a larger image of the finished watch? If you're looking at Instagram in your browser, you can add "media/?size=l" to the end of the URL and it will show the full-size picture which you can save. For example, https://wwwDOTinstagramDOTcom/p/CNBbKyYLTLA/media/?size=l (substitute periods for DOT, it was automatically formatting it as a shortened URL)


I tried what you suggested. I'm also uploading the image on the Tapatalk app to WUS so not sure if it will lessen the quality of the image.


----------



## tripreed

TheMeasure said:


> I tried what you suggested. I'm also uploading the image on the Tapatalk app to WUS so not sure if it will lessen the quality of the image.


Oh yeah, much better! Thanks!


----------



## *2112

you da man


TheMeasure said:


> I tried what you suggested. I'm also uploading the image on the Tapatalk app to WUS so not sure if it will lessen the quality of the image.


you da man! Thanks - i can't wait until ordering is re-opened


----------



## at2011

Vintage TR operating instructions


----------



## BobbyMike

Sorry about the dirty fingernails, was changing the sparkplugs in the Land Cruiser earlier.


----------



## Neily_San

BobbyMike said:


>


Fabulous ! In what publication was that printed ?

:-D
Neily

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


----------



## TheMeasure

Neily_San said:


> Fabulous ! In what publication was that printed ?
> 
> :-D
> Neily
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


It's from the GP-1/0, Issue 1.









GP-1/0, Issue 1


Please see below for more details




boutique.mkiiwatches.com





Cheers!


----------



## Neily_San

TheMeasure said:


> It's from the GP-1/0, Issue 1.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> GP-1/0, Issue 1
> 
> 
> Please see below for more details
> 
> 
> 
> 
> boutique.mkiiwatches.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Cheers!


OK, thanks.

I really wanted to buy this.

In fact, I had it in my Basket within minutes of the release notification. 
However, with shipping to the UK, it was around $100 for a 44 page magazine. I really just couldn't justify the cost.

Enjoy !
Neily

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


----------



## brianmazanec

Some new stuff in Instagram...
















Sent from my SM-G991U using Tapatalk


----------



## TheMeasure




----------



## boatswain

TheMeasure said:


>


Now we are talking


----------



## brianmazanec

Has to mean we're close 

Sent from my SM-G991U using Tapatalk


----------



## TheMeasure

boatswain said:


> Now we are talking


Haha for sure! I was leaning towards the acrylic insert option and now it's a lock.


----------



## TheMeasure




----------



## boatswain

Man. Bead blasted cases so look SO good.


----------



## incomplet

boatswain said:


> Man. Bead blasted cases so look SO good.


One of the reasons I live the zenith shadow revival, that sandblasting!!

Sent from my Pixel 5 using Tapatalk


----------



## TheMeasure

I'm nitpicking and it's not a deal breaker..
But I do wish the tip of the crown had more of a half dome to it versus what appears to be a fairly flat edge.


----------



## at2011

TheMeasure said:


> I'm nitpicking and it's not a deal breaker..
> But I do wish the tip of the crown had more of a half dome to it versus what appears to be a fairly flat edge.


I was thinking the same thing too and even commented on it earlier. But when I was looking at other TR images online, I found this image and thought this might be the look Bill was gunning for.


----------



## TheMeasure




----------



## TheMeasure

at2011 said:


> I was thinking the same thing too and even commented on it earlier. But when I was looking at other TR images online, I found this image and thought this might be the look Bill was gunning for.


Good point. I did see that one and a handful of others with that same or similar crown. The crown on this RTW TR looks to be the same (maybe slightly scaled down) as Bill's 1st Gen TR as well.


----------



## Avidrider

Awesome I wondered if it was ever going to happen!


----------



## brianmazanec

New insta









Sent from my SM-G991U using Tapatalk


----------



## boatswain

brianmazanec said:


> New insta
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my SM-G991U using Tapatalk


And there it is!


----------



## at2011

Wow! Can't believe this is really happening!

Sent from my SM-N975U using Tapatalk


----------



## boatswain

Any word on when these will be ready?

And as they are RTW, if there will be more than just the preorders available?

Happy waiting to all in the queue.


----------



## Semper Jeep

The photo posted on Instagram looks awesome. I cannot wait for mine!

I'm looking forward to this more than I was for my 300.


----------



## tripreed

The lug-to-lug looks much longer than I anticipated. Maybe he (Bill?) has small wrists.

Can anyone re-post the image from Instagram using the trick to view full-size versions of Instagram images? Easiest methods to view full size Instagram Photos - TheTechMirror.com


----------



## TheMeasure

boatswain said:


> Any word on when these will be ready?
> 
> And as they are RTW, if there will be more than just the preorders available?
> 
> Happy waiting to all in the queue.


Last update I got in mid June said watch shipment to begin in August (fingers crossed). Here was the explanation for the delay.

"Watch shipment: Delivery, originally expected at the end of this month, has been delayed until the end of July. The delay is not related to the production of the TR watch specifically but related to a project the vendor is working on for another client that precedes our order in their schedule."

Unfortunately I haven't seen anything mentioned on when ordering will reopen.

Cheers!


----------



## boatswain

TheMeasure said:


> Last update I got in mid June said watch shipment to begin in August (fingers crossed). Here was the explanation for the delay.
> 
> "Watch shipment: Delivery, originally expected at the end of this month, has been delayed until the end of July. The delay is not related to the production of the TR watch specifically but related to a project the vendor is working on for another client that precedes our order in their schedule."
> 
> Unfortunately I haven't seen anything mentioned on when ordering will reopen.
> 
> Cheers!


Thanks TM


----------



## TheMeasure

tripreed said:


> The lug-to-lug looks much longer than I anticipated. Maybe he (Bill?) has small wrists.
> 
> Can anyone re-post the image from Instagram using the trick to view full-size versions of Instagram images? Easiest methods to view full size Instagram Photos - TheTechMirror.com


Here you go. The length prob looks longer than it is due to most likely a cell phone pic and the close distance of the lens to the watch and wrist. To get a true idea of how a watch actually looks on the wrist the shot needs to be taken from a few feet away.


----------



## tripreed

TheMeasure said:


> Here you go. The length prob looks longer than it is due to most likely a cell phone pic and the close distance of the lens to the watch and wrist. To get a true idea of how a watch actually looks on the wrist the shot needs to be taken from a few feet away.


Excellent, looks great! Thanks for posting.


----------



## john_marston

How long has this been in the works now?


----------



## Jim C.

john_marston said:


> How long has this been in the works now?


The initial announcement and orders were in Feb 2020. This link should take you to @Emceemon's post with an image of the announcement.









Tornek Rayville Please


I’ll second that! It looks like there’s a good bit of pent up demand for this model. I hope to not lose out on an opportunity to put a deposit down on one.




www.watchuseek.com


----------



## TheMeasure

Final order placed! Acrylic insert (Yeager Style of course) with the Khaki strap FTW!


----------



## TJ Boogie

Love it!! I regret cancelling mine, I just have an unworn Tornek Rayville sweatshirt 
Next order 🤞


----------



## boatswain

TheMeasure said:


> Final order placed! Acrylic insert (Yeager Style of course) with the Khaki strap FTW!


Nice TM!

Nice to see a crisp final pic too

You're going to make me regret passing on this one aren't you&#8230;


----------



## Semper Jeep

TheMeasure said:


> Final order placed! Acrylic insert (Yeager Style of course) with the Khaki strap FTW!


Same same!


----------



## JFingers

TheMeasure said:


> Final order placed! Acrylic insert (Yeager Style of course) with the Khaki strap FTW!
> ...


I, too, went for the acrylic (Yeager style, natch), though on rubber, because I really like the MKII rubber straps.

Sooo stoked about this one! If it comes before we leave on a bit of a vacation, it might just take the place of my Paradive as my adventure watch... We'll see!

Blue skies, y'all!
-only Jake


----------



## pokpok

Placed order as well. Went with the Acrylic and khaki strap. Easy choice.


----------



## mtbmike

Acrylic rubber as well. Hope I like the strap as much as Jake ☺


----------



## boatswain

mtbmike said:


> Acrylic rubber as well. Hope I like the strap as much as Jake


If it's the Biwi strap that's been used before it is my absolute favourite rubber strap. Superbly comfy.


----------



## eldasher

So is this watch available for pre-order now? Looks great. Knowing my luck has been with MK II, it’s probably too late, like everything I’ve tried to get from them for the past 5 years 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## anthony808

Placed my order for the acrylic on khaki strap but added a black strap as well. The rubber straps are awesome but I already have 2.


----------



## Toh

Made a last minute decision to go from aluminium inlay to acrylic!

Can't wait.









Sent from my PH-1 using Tapatalk


----------



## brianmazanec

So I'll admit, I'm not sure between aluminum and acrylic. Any perspectives on that I should think about before making my selection? 

Sent from my SM-G991U using Tapatalk


----------



## alangloi

brianmazanec said:


> So I'll admit, I'm not sure between aluminum and acrylic. Any perspectives on that I should think about before making my selection?
> 
> Sent from my SM-G991U using Tapatalk


Are the dials different? Can you post a pic of the watch with the aluminum bezel?


----------



## alangloi

I noticed that the bezel minute markers from 0 to 15 are gone from the release watches. Makes for a cleaner bezel.


----------



## brianmazanec

alangloi said:


> Are the dials different? Can you post a pic of the watch with the aluminum bezel?


I'm not sure

Sent from my SM-G991U using Tapatalk


----------



## Majnp

Super pumped delivery is close! Final looks great. Acrylic on khaki ordered 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Stev0

Deleted post


----------



## Maruzen

Acrylic / khaki. I also wanted the rubber strap, but don't want to wait an extra month or so.


----------



## Maruzen

TJ Boogie said:


> Love it!! I regret cancelling mine, I just have an unworn Tornek Rayville sweatshirt
> Next order 🤞


Generally I'd be the same. Priorities change. Focus changes. I usually lose interest. However, I had wanted this watch for years so expected that I'd still want it. And I couldn't have the sweatshirt without the watch


----------



## JFingers

eldasher said:


> So is this watch available for pre-order now? Looks great. Knowing my luck has been with MK II, it's probably too late, like everything I've tried to get from them for the past 5 years
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


It is open for the plank owners. General release will be available later this summer/fall if I remember correctly.

-only Jake


----------



## WastedYears

alangloi said:


> I noticed that the bezel minute markers from 0 to 15 are gone from the release watches. Makes for a cleaner bezel.


They're still there on the aluminium bezel.

I too went for the acrylic/khaki combo. Looking forward to getting it!


----------



## TheMeasure

alangloi said:


> Are the dials different? Can you post a pic of the watch with the aluminum bezel?


Dials are the same.

Acrylic

















Aluminum
















Side profile shots of the acrylic but would be the same for the aluminum.


----------



## brianmazanec

This may be a dumb question, but where do you see on the site which is acrylic and which aluminum. I'm logged in but don't see it in specs for either the 1101 or 1001.

Sent from my SM-G991U using Tapatalk


----------



## Toh

brianmazanec said:


> This may be a dumb question, but where do you see on the site which is acrylic and which aluminum. I'm logged in but don't see it in specs for either the 1101 or 1001.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G991U using Tapatalk


That's actually true, I couldn't find the specs too.

I assumed AC (1101) is acrylic while AL (1001) is aluminium.

I also assumed that only aluminium inlay has a lumed pip.

Sent from my PH-1 using Tapatalk


----------



## TheMeasure

brianmazanec said:


> This may be a dumb question, but where do you see on the site which is acrylic and which aluminum. I'm logged in but don't see it in specs for either the 1101 or 1001.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G991U using Tapatalk


Good eye, a miss on MKII's part. The insert material is not listed in the specs section. It's mentioned in the CONCEPT section but not specifically spelled out within the model.

As another member mentioned it's assumed that one will know the difference between AC vs AL.


----------



## john_marston

where are you guys ordering this? I don't see it on the website


----------



## brianmazanec

john_marston said:


> where are you guys ordering this? I don't see it on the website


Only plank holders have access now, but I think the site is supposed to go generally live on the 20th.

Sent from my SM-G991U using Tapatalk


----------



## longstride

Both versions look fantastic - personally I would go for the Acrylic, more 'authentic' in keeping to the original T-R watches.


----------



## tmoris

Aluminium doesnt have an allround lumi bezel. So easy Acrylic for me on rubber and additional khaki and black fiber straps! Looking fwd to it!


----------



## MrDagon007

I like what I see on the prelaunch site however 14.70mm is really quite thick for a 40mm watch, wonder if it will look unbalanced high. The side photos with the nato suggest that it is better to order it on rubber strap, otherwise it will sit even higher.
My U50 is a svelte 11.15mm with still 500m WR, yes its movement is thinner but not 3.6mm thinner.


----------



## AMSKurt

Pre order already sold out after I woke up 😂😂..


----------



## TheMeasure

AMSKurt said:


> Pre order already sold out after I woke up ..


It hasn't gone live yet.

Per MKII:

Pre-order will open at 10 am EST on Wednesday July 21st. Until then the status on the page linked above will say "Sold Out".


----------



## TheMeasure

For those that haven't signed up for the TR notifications or maybe missed the last one, the Pre-Order opens tomorrow July 21st at 10a ET.

Here's the details from the email




Tornek-Rayville TR-660 Pre-order
Thank you for your interest in Tornek-Rayville. I would like to give you an update on the project and give you advance notice of the details of the upcoming pre-order.
*Status:* The watches are expected to be delivered in the next few weeks. After we receive them we will be QC'ing the pieces in preparation for fulfillment of the Plankowner customer orders. Plankowner customers are currently making their final selections.
*Pre-order Offer:* We will be accepting deposits for pre-orders of the TR-660. Your pre-orders will being to ship after we complete the fulfillment of the Plankowner orders. The following are the details for your review:

*Slots available:* 175 (This is not a limited edition. We are limiting the size of the pre-order for administrative reasons.)
*Deposit amount:* $450 (For this amount you will lock in a price of $895 plus S&H. Expected regular MSRP will be $949 plus S&H.)
*Final Order placement:* You will be notified via email to make your final selection (bezel and strap options) later this year. At that point in time the balance of your payment ($445.00 + S&H or $475.00 +S&H, depending on strap selected) will be due and you will submit your delivery address.
*Versions:* There is an acrylic insert version and an aluminum insert version. Both are non-date.
*Lead time: *Shipments for this pre-order stage are anticipated to begin in Dec. 2021 or Q1 2022. Given this estimate we can not guarantee delivery in time for the winter holidays. Please note that this is a rough estimate and may change based on the QC of the received watches.
*Cancellations:* Please note that unlike in the past there will be a $35 cancellation fee. The reason for this is that neither of our payment processors refunds fees for refunded payments anymore.
*Ordering Details:*
If the Plankowner stage was any indication demand may be strong. We recommend that you take the opporutnity today to set up your account on the new site and contact us if you have any problems setting up the account. Setting up your account early should give you an edge during the checkout phase.
The site is password protected until 10 am EST Wednesday July 21st but you have been granted early access to set up your account if you wish:
Tornek-Rayville.us
Password: switchback

Account Registration
Please note that the site is currently password protected. You can access the site by clicking on the upper right hand corner of the site and entering the above password.
Ordering link

Pre-order will open at 10 am EST on Wednesday July 21st. Until then the status on the page linked above will say "Sold Out".
Please select "Free Shipping" at checkout
*NOTICE! NOTICE!* This mailing list *will be rolled over* into the Tornek-Rayville Newsletter subscription list. If you do not wish to be added to the Newsletter list please click "Unsubscribe" in the bottom left hand corner of this email.
Thank you for your interest and support!
HQ, Tornek-Rayville​


----------



## john_marston

So was that a pre-pre-order then 😂


----------



## GregoryD

I just pre-ordered! Was not expecting it, but I've long lusted after the TR so it was an easy decision.

Didn't see anywhere to specify bezel or strap options, so I'm assuming that will be confirmed later.


----------



## Athram

Pre-ordered as well. Looking forward to it, not sure I can wait until December though!


----------



## alangloi

That was interesting. TR not available on the MKII webpage (with an account), but was available on the Tornek-Rayvill website/page (after setting up an account on the TR website). I requested one. Only option at this time is the acrylic bezel apparently. I see that the bezel option will be available on the future email where you make your selection.


----------



## Stowe

Ordered! Along with a kerchief set and a khaki strap to throw into the mix. I'll definitely be going for acrylic when the time comes. That's one of my favorite features of Gen. 3 Paradive.


----------



## reluctantsnowman

Ordered.. now comes the wonderful wait.. Also waiting for my Paradive


----------



## Forsythjones

Can someone explain to me what a plankowner is?


----------



## Jim C.

Forsythjones said:


> Can someone explain to me what a plankowner is?


Plankowner

In the context of Bill's watches, he usually opens a very limited number of pre-orders when a new watch is first introduced and refers to those as plankowner orders. For the TR-660, there were around 75 spots available when he opened ordering in Feb 2020.


----------



## TheMeasure

Nice article over on Worn & Wound about the TR, plus a lot of pics .









Tornek-Rayville Returns With TR-660 Dive Watch - Worn & Wound


Tornek-Rayville is back in action with the TR-660 dive watch that brings back the glory of the original TR-900.




wornandwound.com


----------



## GregoryD

Looks like the pre-order is sold out now, but the TR won't be a limited edition, just released in batches.


----------



## Knoc

Hesitated and missed.
Luckily more batches to comes.
Alerts on and looking forward to this!


----------



## alangloi

fyi: I logged to my account onto the TR website (Tornek-Rayville) this morning at 3 AM Eastern time and saw that the TR watch is available to order (Thursday, 22 July 2021). (I was up after coming back from a walk with my pug. )


----------



## jaegodylan

Still some up on the site at the moment as well. Roughly 10 am BST.


















 TR-660 Pre-Order (50% Deposit)


Ordering Opens: November 3rd 2022 at 10 am EST. Product details and specifications detailed below.




tornek-rayville.us


----------



## stamsd

I ordered mine @10am yesterday when the site opened. I must say I have gone back and forth in my mind a few times already about a micro-brand using a Seiko movement for $1k. This will be my first MKii of any kind and I am hanging my hat on Bill's reputation for quality (and hoping he/ they regulate the poop out of these). I have owned one of the other BP homage w/ Seiko movement micros for 15% of the price, so fingers crossed. I think these sold out so quickly yesterday because some folks thought the pre-order price was the total for the watch (as mentioned in an IG post) at first and then canceled. This was mentioned and addressed in an email I got overnight from Mkii. Am I buying this for the dial? Maybe? Sounds like I have 'til tomorrow to change my mind without penalty. I have never seen one of the original MKii T-R watches come up for sale, but those had ETA movements.


----------



## Knoc

The option to order is still there, but once added to the cart, items get updated to out of stock.
I could have sworn sometime yesterday that the "add to cart" option as greyed out shortly after the pre order was open.


----------



## GregoryD

stamsd said:


> I ordered mine @10am yesterday when the site opened. I must say I have gone back and forth in my mind a few times already about a micro-brand using a Seiko movement for $1k. This will be my first MKii of any kind and I am hanging my hat on Bill's reputation for quality (and hoping he/ they regulate the poop out of these). I have owned one of the other BP homage w/ Seiko movement micros for 15% of the price, so fingers crossed. I think these sold out so quickly yesterday because some folks thought the pre-order price was the total for the watch (as mentioned in an IG post) at first and then canceled. This was mentioned and addressed in an email I got overnight from Mkii. Am I buying this for the dial? Maybe? Sounds like I have 'til tomorrow to change my mind without penalty. I have never seen one of the original MKii T-R watches come up for sale, but those had ETA movements.


I've had the same thought regarding the use of the 6R15 movement, but I'm mostly satisfied knowing that these are regulated in 3 positions. Seiko themselves puts a version of this movement (6R35) in $1000+ watches and doesn't regulate it at all.


----------



## boatswain

Feel like I am going to regret passing a second time on the TR. though hopefully with some patience down the road I can have a shot to nab one. 

Also curious if a stingray will come out under the TR brand.


----------



## alangloi

Knoc said:


> The option to order is still there, but once added to the cart, items get updated to out of stock.
> I could have sworn sometime yesterday that the "add to cart" option as greyed out shortly after the pre order was open.


The TR website has been adjusted to show "sold out", can't add the TR watch to the cart.


----------



## alangloi

stamsd said:


> I ordered mine @10am yesterday when the site opened. I must say I have gone back and forth in my mind a few times already about a micro-brand using a Seiko movement for $1k. This will be my first MKii of any kind and I am hanging my hat on Bill's reputation for quality (and hoping he/ they regulate the poop out of these). I have owned one of the other BP homage w/ Seiko movement micros for 15% of the price, so fingers crossed. I think these sold out so quickly yesterday because some folks thought the pre-order price was the total for the watch (as mentioned in an IG post) at first and then canceled. This was mentioned and addressed in an email I got overnight from Mkii. Am I buying this for the dial? Maybe? Sounds like I have 'til tomorrow to change my mind without penalty. I have never seen one of the original MKii T-R watches come up for sale, but those had ETA movements.


The NE15C movement alone sells on ebay for $175. I have had my PD3 (*acrylic dial*) with the NE15B movement for *four years*, worn daily. *Still looks like new.* That being said, the TR watch as with the PD3 will have (I suspect) the ghost date position. Whether the movement is actually regulated or just timed (to see if it is within specs) is debatable. Love the PD3 12 hour bezel. And my PD3 has blue lume, where as the TR lume will be the traditional green.

*I do look forward to receiving my TR watch in the near future. *


----------



## JCW1980

Posting on the MKII forum for the first time in a very long time. I haven’t owned a MKII for 7 or 8 years now, but I fondly remember the quality and charm of my Vantage and Kingston.

I got in on the TR pre-order in the first few minutes yesterday morning, and I’m really looking forward to this watch. Bill’s first run of TR’s has been the stuff of legend, and I’ve held a quiet obsession for them since I first heard of them and devoured the history years ago.

Full of anticipation and looking forward to the wait! 
🙂👍


----------



## Maxer

Athram said:


> Pre-ordered as well. Looking forward to it, not sure I can wait until December though!


Hi man!

Can you please send me a PM 😀


----------



## alangloi

As we wait, let me be the first to ask: will there be a BBB (bead blasted bracelet) in the future for the TR?


----------



## NWP627

alangloi said:


> As we wait, let me be the first to ask: will there be a BBB (bead blasted bracelet) in the future for the TR?


As a bracelet guy that would be fantastic!


----------



## brianmazanec

NWP627 said:


> As a bracelet guy that would be fantastic!


Yes!

Sent from my SM-G991U using Tapatalk


----------



## fish70

stamsd said:


> I ordered mine @10am yesterday when the site opened. I must say I have gone back and forth in my mind a few times already about a micro-brand using a Seiko movement for $1k. This will be my first MKii of any kind and I am hanging my hat on Bill's reputation for quality (and hoping he/ they regulate the poop out of these). I have owned one of the other BP homage w/ Seiko movement micros for 15% of the price, so fingers crossed. I think these sold out so quickly yesterday because some folks thought the pre-order price was the total for the watch (as mentioned in an IG post) at first and then canceled. This was mentioned and addressed in an email I got overnight from Mkii. Am I buying this for the dial? Maybe? Sounds like I have 'til tomorrow to change my mind without penalty. I have never seen one of the original MKii T-R watches come up for sale, but those had ETA movements.


I set up an account two days before the pre-order day and was 100% sure I was going to buy it. By the time I got home from work the watch was sold out (I couldn't tell until I hit the "buy" button). I am happy I missed it now because AAFES had a big 1 day Omega sale and I got a Seamaster for not much more than 3 times the price of this one. Sometimes things work out


----------



## Spherejdesign

Order web is open now


----------



## mtbmike

"The US Navy Bulova UDT was introduced in 1958 and very few were produced"









Not many details yet on this Limited Edition Bulova.


----------



## TheMeasure

Saw a couple TR pics on IG over the weekend. Thought they be appreciated here.


----------



## alangloi

TheMeasure said:


> Saw a couple TR pics on IG over the weekend. Thought they be appreciated here.


appreciated - yes; I lost my IG password and can never log on there again...


----------



## js187

mtbmike said:


> "The US Navy Bulova UDT was introduced in 1958 and very few were produced"
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Not many details yet on this Limited Edition Bulova.


Rectangle moisture indicator doesn't quite hit the same...


----------



## mtbmike

id.guy has a new video up.


----------



## gwold

Bill joined James & Jason on their Grey NATO podcast, in today's edition, and naturally they spent some time discussing the TR-660.

The Grey NATO - 155 - MKII, Tornek-Rayville, And The Early Days Of Microbrands With Bill Ya&#8230;


----------



## alangloi

Is there any significance to "660" (and for that matter the original "900") on the TR name? Upon reflection, I guess the 660 refers to the 200m water resistance. Did the original TR-900 have a water resistance of 900 feet?


----------



## Spherejdesign

mtbmike said:


> id.guy has a new video up.


Nice video


----------



## bluedevil704

Anyone miss out on the TR660 pre-order and want mine? I can have Bill switch the order over. PM me!


----------



## reluctantsnowman

bluedevil704 said:


> Anyone miss out on the TR660 pre-order and want mine? I can have Bill switch the order over. PM me!


Why the change of heart?


----------



## Rengoku

bluedevil704 said:


> Anyone miss out on the TR660 pre-order and want mine? I can have Bill switch the order over. PM me!


I would be interested, if its still available


----------



## Omegatron24

Does anyone know if the water ingress indicator is actually functional on this? I can't find anything about it on the site.


----------



## JCW1980

Omegatron24 said:


> Does anyone know if the water ingress indicator is actually functional on this? I can't find anything about it on the site.


I don't recall reading anything "official" about it actually being an indicator. I did notice ID.Guy called it an indicator a couple of times in his video. I doubt it's a functioning indicator&#8230; if it was I feel sure Bill's description on the site would have mentioned something about it.


----------



## TheMeasure

Omegatron24 said:


> Does anyone know if the water ingress indicator is actually functional on this? I can't find anything about it on the site.


It's not functional.


----------



## WastedYears

I'm wondering whether it would be feasible to mount a functional water ingress indicator onto the dial of the TR. After all, it's not much more than a specialized piece of paper attached to another piece of paper that acts as a colour reference.

I wonder if anyone still makes these and makes them available for sale. Maybe I need to stop by the Blancpain boutique and ask.


----------



## at2011

WastedYears said:


> I'm wondering whether it would be feasible to mount a functional water ingress indicator onto the dial of the TR. After all, it's not much more than a specialized piece of paper attached to another piece of paper that acts as a colour reference.
> 
> I wonder if anyone still makes these and makes them available for sale. Maybe I need to stop by the Blancpain boutique and ask.


Cobalt Chloride Test Paper [Vial of 100 Strips] for Water, Moisture and Humidity Detection: Amazon.com: Industrial & Scientific

Leak Detection Test Sheets for Water & Gas Leaks (indigoinstruments.com)

Humidity Indicators, Humidity Sensors in Stock - ULINE

MICRO ESSENTIAL Test Strips 1 EA Testing Parameter: Water Finder - 3VDU4|3VDU4 - Grainger

PET/ Polyester Tape : 3M 5557 Water Contact Indicator Tape - Industrial Tape and Supply Co.

and so many more.


----------



## WastedYears

at2011 said:


> Cobalt Chloride Test Paper [Vial of 100 Strips] for Water, Moisture and Humidity Detection: Amazon.com: Industrial & Scientific
> 
> Leak Detection Test Sheets for Water & Gas Leaks (indigoinstruments.com)
> 
> Humidity Indicators, Humidity Sensors in Stock - ULINE
> 
> MICRO ESSENTIAL Test Strips 1 EA Testing Parameter: Water Finder - 3VDU4|3VDU4 - Grainger
> 
> PET/ Polyester Tape : 3M 5557 Water Contact Indicator Tape - Industrial Tape and Supply Co.
> 
> and so many more.


Thanks for posting those. The watch would look great with a blue/pink indicator installed imo.


----------



## *2112

Maybe Bill can sell some TR dials separately for us to mess around with  
Doubtful, but a man can hope!



WastedYears said:


> Thanks for posting those. The watch would look great with a blue/pink indicator installed imo.


----------



## WastedYears

*2112 said:


> Maybe Bill can sell some TR dials separately for us to mess around with
> Doubtful, but a man can hope!


I agree that it's doubtful he'd make those available. However, one could easily use non-premanent adhesive to mount the indicator to the dial.


----------



## at2011

So when will we see the first wrist shot of this new TR?

Sent from my SM-N975U using Tapatalk


----------



## eldasher

In theory, first series of production is supposed to be sent out in December, according to the website when I ordered. Who knows. I prefer to not think about it and just image I bought something perishable that has since been consumed and long forgotten when I order long lead items like this 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## brianmazanec

I think those of us who are plank holders were told ours may ship by the end of this month. 

Sent from my SM-G991U using Tapatalk


----------



## mtbmike

patiently said:


> I think those of us who are plank holders were told ours may ship by the end of this month.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G991U using Tapatalk


Hoping to see one soon but "to be honest our projections of past projects have never been that precise" 
My order is on rubber strap with September stock anticipated. I have patiently waited many moons for the arrival in the past but am slightly more optimistic this round!


----------



## TheMeasure

Stories from the Tornek Rayville IG page.


----------



## Maruzen

TheMeasure said:


> Stories from the Tornek Rayville IG page.


The last shot the information is rather vague. The way It reads is that they will begin shipping straps that people ordered separately.

Bill had mentioned in the last message in July that the watches were slated to arrive at the end of July or first of August. However, they just arrived. So I would imagine it will be mid-September before any of the watches ship.


----------



## mtbmike

They June Update was watch shipment was to begin in August. Rubber orders September. Strap orders in the photo will start to ship as the straps get QC'ed. It's going to be soon, I'll be waiting a tad longer for the Rubber strap.


----------



## mtbmike

More details. 








In-Depth: An Ultra-Rare Bulova Military Dive Watch Resurfaces, Thanks To One Passionate Collector


It's the first time the Bulova MIL-SHIPS-W-2181 has been released.




www.hodinkee.com






mtbmike said:


> "The US Navy Bulova UDT was introduced in 1958 and very few were produced"
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Not many details yet on this Limited Edition Bulova.


----------



## nitron135

I asked Bill about the indicator at the nyc windup and he said something like that he experimented and it wasn’t going to work properly with what was available to him. No reason to doubt that but maybe if Bulova got it sorted now, there is more hope..


----------



## TheMeasure

Maruzen said:


> The last shot the information is rather vague. The way It reads is that they will begin shipping straps that people ordered separately.
> &#8230;.


I'm hoping he meant orders in which Plankowners selected the fabric strap option, will start shipping within the next week. For logistics and cost reasons, I can't see Bill only shipping out just straps. But that's just my guess.


----------



## *2112

The recently announced Bulova MIL-SHIPS has a moisture sensing paper strip, man it would have been great if Bill added that to the TR


----------



## nitron135

*2112 said:


> The recently announced Bulova MIL-SHIPS has a moisture sensing paper strip, man it would have been great if Bill added that to the TR


Yeah, see two posts up. Here is hoping.


----------



## Maruzen

TheMeasure said:


> I'm hoping he meant orders in which Plankowners selected the fabric strap option, will start shipping within the next week. For logistics and cost reasons, I can't see Bill only shipping out just straps. But that's just my guess.


i would have to agree. It makes sense. Though the impression Bill gave a month a ago was he he planned to check all of them first, then start shipping. And that added two-three weeks. Since the watches just arrived, maybe he plans on doing a small batch and shipping to expedite things. Who knows. Anyway, a new pic would be nice.


----------



## at2011

*2112 said:


> The recently announced Bulova MIL-SHIPS has a moisture sensing paper strip, man it would have been great if Bill added that to the TR


The Bulova looks odd because of the tiny lug width. I prefer the more balanced look of the TR-660 where the lugs aren't "squeezed". The Elgin A-11 has 16mm lug width, but it's also a tiny watch at 32mm which is ok. This Bulova is 41mm with 16mm lugs.


----------



## Devonian

Man, I got the Kingston and P300 planks but with covid focus and work issues I missed this project entirely. Congrats to all that got in! 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## NWP627

at2011 said:


> The Bulova looks odd because of the tiny lug width. I prefer the more balanced look of the TR-660 where the lugs aren't "squeezed". The Elgin A-11 has 16mm lug width, but it's also a tiny watch at 32mm which is ok. This Bulova is 41mm with 16mm lugs.


I thought the same thing when I read 41mm case and 16mm strap. To me that's a deal breaker.


----------



## QuadSculls

Thanks for pointing out that narrow lug width issue. Crossing that watch off my list.


----------



## ripper

From IG Stories


----------



## TheMeasure




----------



## at2011

QuadSculls said:


> Thanks for pointing out that narrow lug width issue. Crossing that watch off my list.


Didn't mean to discourage you from buying it, I hope you still would. Once you have it in your hands you'll be the judge whether the lug width works visually on your wrist. Besides, it's got a killer caseback design 100 times better than the TR-660.

Sent from my SM-N975U using Tapatalk


----------



## QuadSculls

at2011 said:


> Didn't mean to discourage you from buying it, I hope you still would. Once you have it in your hands you'll be the judge whether the lug width works visually on your wrist. Besides, it's got a killer caseback design 100 times better than the TR-660.
> 
> Sent from my SM-N975U using Tapatalk


No worries, and you merely pointed out a proportion inconsistency that diminishes its good looks for me (remember, taste is totally subjective). As far as casebook design, not something that I ever consider. I do look at the front view, obviously, because that is what I see when a wear a watch. To go one step further, display backs appeal to many, but not me. I prefer to spend my time looking at other things besides working watch movements.


----------



## TheMeasure




----------



## Majnp

Is everyone else getting to the point of ordering new straps in anticipation? I ordered it on the Khaki NATO but have a Cincy Straps black vintage NATO on the way and am thinking about a Tropic for a slightly more polished look. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## ripper

From IG

 I can't wait for mine.


----------



## ripper

Our acrylic's


----------



## MrDagon007

Not sure if this interesting and appropriate kickstarter strap was mentioned:









The Tornek-Rayville TR-900 Milspec watch strap recreated.


The 1960's ribbed strap for dive watches




www.kickstarter.com


----------



## dt75

MrDagon007 said:


> Not sure if this interesting and appropriate kickstarter strap was mentioned:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Tornek-Rayville TR-900 Milspec watch strap recreated.
> 
> 
> The 1960's ribbed strap for dive watches
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.kickstarter.com


Rob Fraser makes really great straps. Glad he's doing this project


----------



## brianmazanec

Insta update.























Sent from my SM-G991U using Tapatalk


----------



## pkrshang

brianmazanec said:


> Insta update.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my SM-G991U using Tapatalk


I wonder if Bill is referring to shipment dates for the Plankowners? As a preorder customer, I am still confused when my 660 will be ready.


----------



## brianmazanec

pkrshang said:


> I wonder if Bill is referring to shipment dates for the Plankowners? As a preorder customer, I am still confused when my 660 will be ready.


Has to be plankowners.

Sent from my SM-G991U using Tapatalk


----------



## at2011

brianmazanec said:


> Has to be plankowners.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G991U using Tapatalk


Cryptic message.

Sent from my SM-N975U using Tapatalk


----------



## TheMeasure

pkrshang said:


> I wonder if Bill is referring to shipment dates for the Plankowners? As a preorder customer, I am still confused when my 660 will be ready.


Plankowners for sure.

Original pre-order shipments were estimated for Dec. 2021 or Q1 2022. This could obviously change.


----------



## brianmazanec

More
















Sent from my SM-G991U using Tapatalk


----------



## brianmazanec

New









Sent from my SM-G991U using Tapatalk


----------



## ripper

From IG


----------



## Knoc

We will need videos and pics etc from all you plank owners!


----------



## TheMeasure

ripper said:


> From IG


It's starting to get exciting&#8230;


----------



## TheMeasure




----------



## QuadSculls

TheMeasure said:


>


That hits very close to home, my Old Man served in UDT 22, still have his Kabar.


----------



## TheMeasure

QuadSculls said:


> That hits very close to home, my Old Man served in UDT 22, still have his Kabar.


Very cool.

Outside of the irreplaceable sentimental value, those are priceless.


----------



## brianmazanec

Here we go...









Sent from my SM-G991U using Tapatalk


----------



## Semper Jeep

Who’s going to be the first lucky forum member to get a tracking number?


----------



## Neily_San

Anyone receive a shipping notification yet ?

Getting exciting !
:-D
Neily 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


----------



## brianmazanec

Not yet here


----------



## TheMeasure

Neily_San said:


> Anyone receive a shipping notification yet ?
> 
> Getting exciting !
> :-D
> Neily
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


Unfortunately no. However I think my order is one of last planks to go through so I’m guessing I still have a little bit before I see any movement on my build.


----------



## Neily_San

From Instagram :










I wonder if this means the aluminium bezel watches will ship first ?

:-D
Neily 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


----------



## Maruzen

I'm curious as to how the shipping process will work. A couple of pieces a day or some each week. There was mention in the pre-order email that none would ship until all plankowner pieces were shipped. I dismissed it at the time, but now wondering if it will indeed take a couple of months.


----------



## TheMeasure

Neily_San said:


> I wonder if this means the aluminium bezel watches will ship first ?


Found this in a plank owner update regarding shipping order. 

“Note that shipments will be scheduled in the order in which your original deposit was submitted not your final selection as long as your final selection is received by July 31st, 2021.”


----------



## WastedYears

I'm normally pretty good at waiting, but after eagerly anticipating Sept. 25th when shipping was to begin, it is a bit of a disappointment to find out that only 2 watches went out that day.


----------



## TheMeasure




----------



## pokpok

Just got an email update on my plank order that says 

Status: 5.0 Preparing for Shipment
Ships: Oct-02-2021

Can't wait for it to arrive!


----------



## Maruzen

pokpok said:


> Just got an email update on my plank order that says
> 
> Status: 5.0 Preparing for Shipment
> Ships: Oct-02-2021
> 
> Can't wait for it to arrive!


Awesome. Looking forward to seeing it in the wild


----------



## Neily_San

pokpok said:


> Just got an email update on my plank order that says
> 
> Status: 5.0 Preparing for Shipment
> Ships: Oct-02-2021
> 
> Can't wait for it to arrive!


… and it starts !!!
:-D
Neily 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


----------



## Semper Jeep

pokpok said:


> Just got an email update on my plank order that says
> 
> Status: 5.0 Preparing for Shipment
> Ships: Oct-02-2021
> 
> Can't wait for it to arrive!


I got the same update.🤙


----------



## Knoc

Hot damn. Never been more excited for a shipping notification that wasn't mines.


----------



## boatswain

Looking forward to seeing these TRs land!


----------



## NWP627

pokpok said:


> Just got an email update on my plank order that says
> 
> Status: 5.0 Preparing for Shipment
> Ships: Oct-02-2021
> 
> Can't wait for it to arrive!


Received the same update - 10/02 shipping date


----------



## TheMeasure

Glad it has begun. Looking forward to all the early plank-owners sharing their new TRs here. Based on the update, Bill’s goal is to have all planks shipped by end of Oct. While I’d be lying if I didn’t say I wish I was one of the first to receive the TR, I’m ok with the current projected timeline. It gives me time to enjoy my 1st Gen Orange Monster which has become a traditional staple during the month of Oct for me.


----------



## pokpok

Just got tracking number for my watch! It's happening!


----------



## reeder1

I’m jealous of you guys getting these, but I’m happy you’re getting them! I screwed up my ordering because I just wasn’t fast enough-thought I was ready but the order wouldn’t go through and then it was sold out. If any of you all get cold feet or know someone who has cold feet, get in touch. I’m an easy sale!

Enjoy these!!! Stay healthy and have a good weekend!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Semper Jeep

Woo hoo! Mine is out for delivery today!


----------



## at2011

The eagle has landed!


----------



## ripper

Wow. Congratulations!
Please give us some impressions to please our impatience 

Mine is preordered and I can't wait till december (I hope )


----------



## Knoc

at2011 said:


> The eagle has landed!


Ok. So we need you to book the day off. 
Cause we gona need pics, videos, and a full run down.


----------



## at2011

Some more pics, Size wise, it wears slightly smaller than the SKX, Benrus and the US Secret Service watch. Just love the acrylic bezel😁😁😁, watch is pretty hefty, similar to the Benrus in weight. Overall feel is just solid. Very well made and a beautiful watch at that. Hats off to Bill and his team for bringing this back!👍👍👍 Almost forgot, I thought it was gonna come with the tiny compass in one of Bill's pics but no, it's not included I guess.


----------



## Knoc

^ Solid and appreciate the pics man.
Knowing its coming from Bill, its gona be dialed in.
Im locked in for that July pre-order and hoping something by end of the year.
Right on.


----------



## Semper Jeep

at2011 said:


> The eagle has landed!



Looks great! And I have to say I'm a little jealous I didn't get to post mine up first. lol


----------



## at2011

Semper Jeep said:


> Looks great! And I have to say I'm a little jealous I didn't get to post mine up first. lol


Can't wait for fellow owners to saturate this forum with tons of amazing photos soon👍😊 I'm just not that good at photography.


----------



## Semper Jeep

at2011 said:


> Can't wait for fellow owners to saturate this forum with tons of amazing photos soon👍😊 I'm just not that good at photography.


I'm no good at photography either but mine just landed a few minutes ago:


































And side-by-side with the Sting Ray I've been wearing the past few days:










I don't have a fancy micrometer to take measurements, but it feels like the TR sits considerably more flush against my wrist than the Sting Ray does. The strap that came with the TR is also pretty nice - I was anticipating that it would be too stiff right out of the box and I'd put it aside for one of my well worn NATO straps, but it's really pretty pliable and very comfortable.


----------



## Semper Jeep

A couple more shots in some natural light:


----------



## pokpok




----------



## pkrshang

Keep those pictures coming for us preorder people. Drooling over them!


----------



## Majnp

Lume shots please! 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## boatswain

Looking great!


----------



## at2011

As requested.


----------



## MrDagon007

It still looks a little thick for its diameter to me…


----------



## Maruzen

MrDagon007 said:


> It still looks a little thick for its diameter to me…


Agree. I'm not really sure why it had to be that thick.


----------



## valuewatchguy

Maruzen said:


> Agree. I'm not really sure why it had to be that thick.


I think proportions would be off to be much thinner. 

Shifting the dimensions from the mid case to case back like the original would have helped the slab sided looks. 

Overall the pics from @pokpok make me glad I got in on the pre-order these early shots are great reassurance that I chose well!


----------



## ripper

Is there any curve on the crystal or is it totally flat?
Can I ask for a side profile picture?


----------



## valuewatchguy

What is a Plank Owner?


----------



## Jim C.

valuewatchguy said:


> What is a Plank Owner?


Plankowner

In the context of Bill's watches, he usually opens a very limited number of pre-orders when a new watch is first introduced and refers to those as plankowner orders. For the TR-660, there were around 75 spots available when he opened ordering in Feb 2020.


----------



## valuewatchguy

Jim C. said:


> Plankowner
> 
> In the context of Bill's watches, he usually opens a very limited number of pre-orders when a new watch is first introduced and refers to those as plankowner orders. For the TR-660, there were around 75 spots available when he opened ordering in Feb 2020.
> 
> View attachment 16160344


OK thank you I appreciate the info. That’s not me then I only got in on the pre-order starting in July 2021.

Congrats to all the plank owners


----------



## Maruzen

valuewatchguy said:


> I think proportions would be off to be much thinner.
> 
> Shifting the dimensions from the mid case to case back like the original would have helped the slab sided looks.
> 
> Overall the pics from @pokpok make me glad I got in on the pre-order these early shots are great reassurance that I chose well!


Maybe a little thicker than I generally like, but you’re right, it does look really good. A tough 18 months, but just a couple more weeks


----------



## alangloi

ripper said:


> Is there any curve on the crystal or is it totally flat?
> Can I ask for a side profile picture?


per the TR webpage: "Double domed sapphire crystal, with anti-reflective coating on interior surface only" 

So it appears to be similar, if not the same, as the Paradive Gen 3 crystal. With the TR case thickness actually a tad bit thinner. That being said, both appear to be mission functional. To me, the PD3 seems more refined design wise, than the TR. Look forward to getting my pre-order 2nd email later this year to send more $$$ for the TR prior to shipping...


----------



## valuewatchguy

ripper said:


> Is there any curve on the crystal or is it totally flat?
> Can I ask for a side profile picture?


Worn and Wound's article had this picture, so it looks like a very modestly domed glass


----------



## at2011

ripper said:


> Is there any curve on the crystal or is it totally flat?
> Can I ask for a side profile picture?


Here's a pic of the side profile.









Sent from my SM-N975U using Tapatalk


----------



## pokpok

Some initial impressions of the TR-660 after 24hrs.


Nytex strap is a little stiff out of the box but it is starting to take shape now. Can't wait until it breaks in completely so the watch can sit a little closer to my wrist.
Bezel is easy to grip and turn. Bezel action is smooth and weighty with minimal clicking noise.
Watch is thick but no complaints since the proportions should be similar to the original. No issues of top heavy feeling or wobble from the size of the watch on my 6.75in wrist.
Acrylic bezel markings look 3d when viewed at an angle.
So far it is running -1 second per day.

More random pics of the watch. Enjoy.


----------



## TheMeasure

pokpok said:


> Some initial impressions of the TR-660 after 24hrs.
> 
> 
> Nytex strap is a little stiff out of the box but it is starting to take shape now. Can't wait until it breaks in completely so the watch can sit a little closer to my wrist.





Thanks for the pics and the first impressions. 

I’ve found rolling up straps tightly and using a rubber band to hold the roll for a few days helps speed up the break in period for Natos and similar style single pass straps. I’ll probably do this on my Nytex strap when it arrives. 










Cheers!


----------



## pokpok

^^^ doing that now. thanks for the tip!

Slow day at work right now so I'm trying on different straps.


----------



## ck2k01

TheMeasure said:


> Thanks for the pics and the first impressions.
> 
> I’ve found rolling up straps tightly and using a rubber band to hold the roll for a few days helps speed up the break in period for Natos and similar style single pass straps. I’ll probably do this on my Nytex strap when it arrives.
> 
> [/IMG]https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20211005/aec3929ff4b35b60a1d98df64a0f53da.jpg[/IMG]
> 
> Cheers!


While I didn’t jump in on the TR-660 preorder, I did grab one of the Nytex straps, as I liked the look of the weave and color that straddled olive green and khaki. 

It was indeed quite stiff upon arrival. So I’m pleased to report that applying your suggestion overnight worked a charm 




















Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## TheMeasure

ck2k01 said:


> While I didn’t jump in on the TR-660 preorder, I did grab one of the Nytex straps, as I liked the look of the weave and color that straddled olive green and khaki.
> 
> It was indeed quite stiff upon arrival. So I’m pleased to report that applying your suggestion overnight worked a charm


That’s awesome to hear, glad it worked. For the really stubborn straps I’ll roll it one way for a day or two then reverse the roll for another day or so. I’ve only had a couple straps that seemed to be immune to this treatment haha. 

Cheers!


----------



## David Woo

to all the plankers posting photos, congrats and thanks for the shots.


----------



## Neily_San

Yay !!!









I am getting excited …

:-D
Neily 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


----------



## NWP627

It's here after six long years of hoping and waiting. Thank you Bill and Staff, it was worth the wait.


----------



## MrDagon007

The natos all look good but make a thick watch sit even higher. Would probably wear it on the soft rubber strap.


----------



## valuewatchguy

MrDagon007 said:


> The natos all look good but make a thick watch sit even higher. Would probably wear it on the soft rubber strap.


It would probably look great on an Erika Original that doesn't add any signicant thickess.


----------



## boatswain

I imagine the TR will look great on pretty Much anything. 

I’d be tempted by a matte grey or black nato. Or a nice plain Biwi rubber. 

Enjoy folks!

So….when’s the next order window?!


----------



## mtbmike

Rubber strap feels good. Thanks to those who recommended them.


----------



## pokpok

After a week of use, watch is averaging +1.7 seconds per day.


----------



## boatswain

For those with the acrylic bezel, how does it look compared to a sapphire insert?

Does it have a softer less shiny appearance?

Just curious if it works better with the matte vibe of the TR than a sapphire insert would.


----------



## MrDagon007

mtbmike said:


> Rubber strap feels good. Thanks to those who recommended them.


Biwi natural rubber straps are world class comfy. Use them on 3 watches incl 2 mkiis.


----------



## MrDagon007

boatswain said:


> For those with the acrylic bezel, how does it look compared to a sapphire insert?
> 
> Does it have a softer less shiny appearance?
> 
> Just curious if it works better with the matte vibe of the TR than a sapphire insert would.


I have the paradive 3 with acrylic insert. It does look similar to a sapphire insert on another watch.
It adds a bit of poshness to the look, in my opinion. Which may be desired or not.


----------



## ripper




----------



## LosAngelesTimer

Got to handle one at an event on Saturday. Overall, I was very impressed with the execution. Everything feels solid. The bezel action is almost Seiko-like in that the clicks are soft and perhaps a little less positive than on something like a Pelagos. Legibility is excellent, which is no surprise given the source material. The blasted finish is very pleasant in hand. I really dig the simple, toolish appearance. It's a watch I'd consider as an outdoor/beater if I didn't already own a Pelagos - the fact that they're even in the same conversation says a lot about the TR.


----------



## brianmazanec

Arrived today, a pleasant surprise with delivery on Columbus day! Really like it... Was thinking of flipping but the size is great wears smaller than I expected which is great in my case. Bezel action so fantastic and love the domed sapphire. Extremely well built. May be in regular rotation with my Pelagos and Paradive.























Sent from my SM-G991U using Tapatalk


----------



## boatswain

LosAngelesTimer said:


> Got to handle one at an event on Saturday. Overall, I was very impressed with the execution. Everything feels solid. The bezel action is almost Seiko-like in that the clicks are soft and perhaps a little less positive than on something like a Pelagos. Legibility is excellent, which is no surprise given the source material. The blasted finish is very pleasant in hand. I really dig the simple, toolish appearance. It's a watch I'd consider as an outdoor/beater if I didn't already own a Pelagos - the fact that they're even in the same conversation says a lot about the TR.




Interesting note on the bezel action. 

Does it have the same rubbery dampened feeling of a Seiko too?


----------



## brianmazanec

Another, outside









Sent from my SM-G991U using Tapatalk


----------



## brianmazanec

TR with its first cigar









Sent from my SM-G991U using Tapatalk


----------



## JFingers

Not much to add that hasn't already been said. I'm super stoked to break it in this week! One small notice is that the rubber strap is perhaps just a little more matte than the rubber strap that came with my Paradive3, but only noticeable when they are right next to each other....

Blue skies, y'all!
-only Jake


----------



## TheMeasure

JFingers said:


>


Congrats man! Now just get that bezel in the correct position.


----------



## JFingers

Good call! Fixed!


----------



## TheMeasure

JFingers said:


> Good call! Fixed!


Much better. Enjoy it! 

Love seeing all the TR pics roll in. Keep em going.


----------



## brianmazanec

Tossed it on an Erika's









Sent from my SM-G991U using Tapatalk


----------



## rtl

Got mine today. Great build quality as usual from Bill/MKII. Excited to wear this for a bit to see how accurate it is. It is a bit tall though on my wrist with the nato. Took a few pictures next to its distant cousin? Brother from another mother? Anyway enjoy!


----------



## Neily_San

Neily_San said:


> So, as an open plea to Bill, will you please take my deposit for a Tornek Rayville. I really don't mind how long the wait, but would prefer something a little less than 10 years ;-)
> 
> :-D
> Neily


Well … it was certainly less than 10 years since I plead with Bill to take my deposit. In fact, it was only 2 years, 5 months and 12 days before my Tornek Rayville 660 arrived. 










Who knows, it may even be the first TR to hit UK shores 

Ironically, given that I started this Topic with a request to take my deposit, on the day the Plank Orders opened the ordering system froze part way through my transaction and, by the time it re-freshed, they had sold out !! I am eternally grateful to fellow Forum Member Pentameter who agreed to sell me his second Plank spot. 

Of course, once again I now have no MKII / TR on pre-order ;-)

All the best
:-D
Neily 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


----------



## reluctantsnowman

Hate to ask this question, but any idea how the orders are being shipped?


----------



## TheMeasure

reluctantsnowman said:


> Hate to ask this question, but any idea how the orders are being shipped?





TheMeasure said:


> Found this in a plank owner update regarding shipping order.
> 
> “Note that shipments will be scheduled in the order in which your original deposit was submitted not your final selection as long as your final selection is received by July 31st, 2021.”


----------



## reluctantsnowman

I placed my order on July 21st, but didnt recieve a final selection yet.. Interesting


----------



## TheMeasure

reluctantsnowman said:


> I placed my order on July 21st, but didnt recieve a final selection yet.. Interesting


What I posted was for the Planks. Not sure of the shipping order for those Pre Orders placed in July. 

I’m sure you’ll get a shipping order update when you receive the notification for final payment and config choice. 

Cheers!


----------



## dcam1075

reluctantsnowman said:


> I placed my order on July 21st, but didnt recieve a final selection yet.. Interesting


Last I heard for those that put down a deposit in July (non plankowner) would be making final selections toward the end of the year with delivery most likely in early Q1 ‘22. I recently received my P300 so I am happily Mkii honeymooning for the moment but I am really excited for the TR!


----------



## reluctantsnowman

dcam1075 said:


> Last I heard for those that put down a deposit in July (non plankowner) would be making final selections toward the end of the year with delivery most likely in early Q1 ‘22. I recently received my P300 so I am happily Mkii honeymooning for the moment but I am really excited for the TR!


Ah, same as the Paradive.. thanks 

Sent from my SM-G998U using Tapatalk


----------



## brianmazanec

So far so good









Sent from my SM-G991U using Tapatalk


----------



## pkrshang

Just talked to Bill and preorder shipments start in November.


----------



## TheMeasure

TR has arrived!










Initial thoughts… 
I love the weave of the Nytex strap. Very fitting for the TR. A little stiff, but a quick rinse and rolled up in a rubber band should break it it nicely. Can’t find any rough edges. Holes are nicely sealed and no rough parts on the stitching around the hardware. Even where the extra layer was cut to make it a single pass is nicely finished. 

Bead blasted finish feels nice. 

Proportions look and feel good on the wrist I know some have concerns on the height. No concerns here even on a thicker leather NATO I don’t mind it, but that’s all subjective, no right or wrong. It would add to the height but a vintage style top hat crystal would be killer! 

Alignment of the insert and hands at all the cardinal points is spot on as always. 

The acrylic insert is slightly different from what I can recall on my Gen 3 Paradive (I no longer have it so can’t directly compare). The Paradive insert had more of a rounded feel, maybe that was to match the slope of the bezel? The TR insert is certainly flat as can be. As mentioned before the numbers and markings have this 3-D look to them. Its a cool look and adds some depth to the insert itself. They also look a little sharper than the numbers in the Paradive’s insert. 

I’m digging the green lume and glad Bill seems to be trending back towards using it more going forward. Had the TR on last night and could still see it after 7+hrs with adjusted eyes to the dark. 

While my Nytex breaks in, I’ve been swapping straps like crazy. Favorites in no particular order are Ute, Maratac and Phenome. Even had it on a Haveston canvas and tried out a couple two piece leather and suede straps as it’s that season here. All look great IMO. 

I’ll try and bust out the macro lens and get some more pics up later this week. 

Cheers!


----------



## boatswain

TheMeasure said:


> TR has arrived!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Initial thoughts…
> I love the weave of the Nytex strap. Very fitting for the TR. A little stiff, but a quick rinse and rolled up in a rubber band should break it it nicely. Can’t find any rough edges. Holes are nicely sealed and no rough parts on the stitching around the hardware. Even where the extra layer was cut to make it a single pass is nicely finished.
> 
> Bead blasted finish feels nice.
> 
> Proportions look and feel good on the wrist I know some have concerns on the height. No concerns here even on a thicker leather NATO I don’t mind it, but that’s all subjective, no right or wrong. It would add to the height but a vintage style top hat crystal would be killer!
> 
> Alignment of the insert and hands at all the cardinal points is spot on as always.
> 
> The acrylic insert is slightly different from what I can recall on my Gen 3 Paradive (I no longer have it so can’t directly compare). The Paradive insert had more of a rounded feel, maybe that was to match the slope of the bezel? The TR insert is certainly flat as can be. As mentioned before the numbers and markings have this 3-D look to them. Its a cool look and adds some depth to the insert itself. They also look a little sharper than the numbers in the Paradive’s insert.
> 
> I’m digging the green lume and glad Bill seems to be trending back towards using it more going forward. Had the TR on last night and could still see it after 7+hrs with adjusted eyes to the dark.
> 
> While my Nytex breaks in, I’ve been swapping straps like crazy. Favorites in no particular order are Ute, Maratac and Phenome. Even had it on a Haveston canvas and tried out a couple two piece leather and suede straps as it’s that season here. All look great IMO.
> 
> I’ll try and bust out the macro lens and get some more pics up later this week.
> 
> Cheers!


Congrats and looks great TM

Really looking forward to seeing your pics going forward. Along with general thoughts as you spend time with it. 

Enjoy!


----------



## TheMeasure

Quick and dirty photoshop blend. My pic wasn’t a perfect match to the TR-900 shot I pulled off the web.. so not all lines up perfect. But I feel it gives you a good idea.


----------



## pkrshang

Preorder bezel selection emails are out!


----------



## eldasher

Thanks for the heads up. All sorted.


----------



## pinchoff

I want to congratulate MKII-TR for having designed and produced one of the most beautiful watches in my collection. This Tornek-Rayville is a top design, proportions are perfect, case, insert, crown, dial and hands. Everyone likes it. It is a great watch. It stands out over my IWCs, Omegas, and Glasshutte Original. And it is a dream and a honor wearing such an iconic machine.
Long wait we’ll deserved.
Thank you, Bill and team


----------



## ripper

Congrats for all the new owners! It's great to read all this positive reactions.
After reading @pinchoff post I had no doubt making a final paymant for pre-order today.


----------



## Maruzen

ripper said:


> Congrats for all the new owners! It's great to read all this positive reactions.
> After reading @pinchoff post I had no doubt making a final paymant for pre-order today.


You guys are so lucky only having to wait a few months. It has been just under 20 months for the Planks. All of these posts have been keeping me going. Finally received my shipping notice yesterday. Soon...


----------



## onefishtaco

Maruzen said:


> You guys are so lucky only having to wait a few months. It has been just under 20 months for the Planks. All of these posts have been keeping me going. Finally received my shipping notice yesterday. Soon...


I've just discovered this and wow... can't imagine the torture of waiting/planking as long as some of you guys did! 

I'm buying one for each wrist, if they'll let me


----------



## Knoc

Paid final balance and aluminum bezel it is.
Shake and bake!


----------



## reluctantsnowman

pkrshang said:


> Preorder bezel selection emails are out!


Are these for the July 21st orders? I havent gotten any email yet


----------



## pkrshang

reluctantsnowman said:


> Are these for the July 21st orders? I havent gotten any email yet


Yes they are, check your junk email.


----------



## reluctantsnowman

pkrshang said:


> Yes they are, check your junk email.


Yep, not there. Just wrote Jim an email 

Sent from my SM-G998U using Tapatalk


----------



## dcam1075

Woot, Woot! My order is officially in! 

Acrylic bezel with rubber strap. I already purchased the Nytex strap in both colors separately so good to go! Now for the 2nd half of the wait!


----------



## Semper Jeep

Other than wearing my Garmin Fenix 6x for my morning run, my TR 660 has not left my wrist in the 2 weeks+ since it's arrived. This is the longest I've stuck with a single watch in years!


----------



## valuewatchguy

Semper Jeep said:


> Other than wearing my Garmin Fenix 6x for my morning run, my TR 660 has not left my wrist in the 2 weeks+ since it's arrived. This is the longest I've stuck with a single watch in years!


Thats a heck of a testimonial !


----------



## TheMeasure




----------



## dcam1075

TheMeasure said:


>


This image is not making the wait any easier!  

But it does instantly validate my choice of acrylic bezel!

Thank You!!


----------



## pinchoff

dcam1075 said:


> This image is not making the wait any easier!
> 
> But it does instantly validate my choice of acrylic bezel!
> 
> Thank You!!


Acrylic is soft and warm. Love it!


----------



## brianmazanec

Only getting better









Sent from my SM-G991U using Tapatalk


----------



## rtl

Is there anyone that missed the pre orders that is interested in a TR660 with acrylic bezel? I tried it on for a week but I just can't see this cracking my rotation between a Blancpain Fifty Fathoms and Tudor BB58. I was in on the plank orders and I didn't have my FF No Radiations at the time.. but I think this deserves more wristtime than I can give to it. Pm me and we can discuss the details! 

Sent from my SM-G986U using Tapatalk


----------



## TheMeasure

dcam1075 said:


> This image is not making the wait any easier!
> 
> But it does instantly validate my choice of acrylic bezel!
> 
> Thank You!!


Haha glad it could help!


----------



## reluctantsnowman

reluctantsnowman said:


> Yep, not there. Just wrote Jim an email
> 
> Sent from my SM-G998U using Tapatalk


Wrote an email a few days ago, no response. Am I the only one left out?


----------



## valuewatchguy

reluctantsnowman said:


> Wrote an email a few days ago, no response. Am I the only one left out?


you may try hitting him up on his social media accounts. I have had reasonable success with IG messages to Bill in the past.


----------



## reluctantsnowman

valuewatchguy said:


> you may try hitting him up on his social media accounts. I have had reasonable success with IG messages to Bill in the past.


Thank you Sir. dm on insta sent. Ugh, the wait 

Sent from my SM-G998U using Tapatalk


----------



## TheMeasure

As promised, hope you enjoy. 


















































































Cheers!


----------



## ripper

Thank you @TheMeasure .
Your pictures are fantastic. 
The watch looks very well made. 
I will come back often to your pictures during my waiting.


----------



## TheMeasure

ripper said:


> Thank you @TheMeasure .
> Your pictures are fantastic.
> The watch looks very well made.
> I will come back often to your pictures during my waiting.


YW!
I appreciate those kind words!


----------



## Toh

Awesome photos as usual, TheMeasure! 

I just received the shipping notification, can't wait!!!

Sent from my PH-1 using Tapatalk


----------



## boatswain

Wow!
Great pics TM

Really shows of the 3D bezel markings. 

I guess with acrylic they must be able print the lumed numbers as they would on a dial then pour the acrylic overtop in a mold? Or perhaps route into the bottom of an already made disk and fill with lume? But from those pics they look a lot like lume printed on a dial. 

Either way, a very very cool and unique detail!


----------



## Arthur

Just got my shipping notice this evening!! Waiting a long time for a TR, ever since I saw the photos of the original MKII/ Tornek Rayville’s that Bill made in that very limited run. Photos to follow when it arrives.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


----------



## Maruzen

Arthur said:


> Just got my shipping notice this evening!! Waiting a long time for a TR, ever since I saw the photos of the original MKII/ Tornek Rayville’s that Bill made in that very limited run. Photos to follow when it arrives.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


I had been wondering whether you had yours yet. Mine shipped on the 19th, but probably won’t get to Japan until Monday. Likely mid-week. You might have yours first, lol.


----------



## onefishtaco

Mine just arrived (shoutout to @rtl for being awesome) and this watch is THE business. Love the tool aesthetics and feeling on wrist. 

Dare I say it might stop me from getting a Pelagos for the 3rd time... this might just do the job instead! 

I threw it on an Erika's MN for maximum comfort:


----------



## Arthur

Mine arrived today. Waiting for me when I got home from work. It is everything I expected and wished for. As I have said before, I have long been a fan of the original Tornek Rayville’s and Fifty Fathoms. Unfortunately, by the time I could afford one, they were more precious than diamonds! Also there were some really authentic looking fakes coming out of Vietnam which made buying one more risky. So, long story short, I have waited patiently for Bill’s release of the “new” TR.
So here are a few quick and dirty photos I took this evening.


































Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


----------



## TheMeasure




----------



## onefishtaco

Took pics underwater, and it cost me a new phone so hope you enjoy! (IP68 rating of water submersion at 3ft/30 minutes was a lie! Phone died in 10 inches of water.)

It managed to upload these to the cloud with its final breath... I tried to capture the domed crystal effects underwater. 

Disclaimer: I'm no photographer, sorry I couldn't do @TheMeasure level of quality!


----------



## valuewatchguy

onefishtaco said:


> Took pics underwater, and it cost me a new phone so hope you enjoy! (IP68 rating of water submersion at 3ft/30 minutes was a lie! Phone died in 10 inches of water.)


Thanks for taking one for the team ! ✌


----------



## TheMeasure

onefishtaco said:


> Took pics underwater, and it cost me a new phone so hope you enjoy!….
> 
> View attachment 16201558


Oh man sorry to hear about your phone. I’m loving this domed distortion shot though!

And look at how the markings in the acrylic pop!


----------



## TheMeasure

Toh said:


> Awesome photos as usual, TheMeasure!
> 
> I just received the shipping notification, can't wait!!!


Thanks man, can’t wait for you to get it. It will compliment your other MKII pieces nicely. 



boatswain said:


> Wow!
> Great pics TM
> 
> I guess with acrylic they must be able print the lumed numbers as they would on a dial then pour the acrylic overtop in a mold? Or perhaps route into the bottom of an already made disk and fill with lume? But from those pics they look a lot like lume printed on a dial.


Thanks B! 

Yeah I think you’re on track with the acrylic insert. It’s a cool look and nice subtle detail for sure.


----------



## dcam1075

Woot, Woot!

Preorder shipment rough estimate update by original deposit order number, we are getting close!!

“Having said that here is a rough guide as to when your order could ship. Please note that this is sequenced according to your original deposit order number not your final selection watch order number:”

November: 1093-T though 1174-T
December: 1175-T through 1259-T
January: 1260-T through 1360-T


----------



## ripper

December


----------



## alangloi

My pre-order is 14xx-T; Does that mean sometime in the distant future?  OK; I see my initial first half pre-order was 12xx-T. December - Yea!!


----------



## TheMeasure

Some “B-side” shots that I was going to scrap but then realized the different angles of the TR would be appreciated here.


----------



## valuewatchguy

dcam1075 said:


> Woot, Woot!
> 
> Preorder shipment rough estimate update by original deposit order number, we are getting close!!
> 
> “Having said that here is a rough guide as to when your order could ship. Please note that this is sequenced according to your original deposit order number not your final selection watch order number:”
> 
> November: 1093-T though 1174-T
> December: 1175-T through 1259-T
> January: 1260-T through 1360-T



NOVEMBER!!!!!


----------



## dcam1075

TheMeasure said:


> Some “B-side” shots that I was going to scrap but then realized the different angles of the TR would be appreciated here.


Definitely appreciate the different angles and great strap combo!!


----------



## dcam1075

valuewatchguy said:


> NOVEMBER!!!!!


Right there with ya!!


----------



## onefishtaco

valuewatchguy said:


> Thanks for taking one for the team ! ✌





TheMeasure said:


> Oh man sorry to hear about your phone. I’m loving this domed distortion shot though!
> 
> And look at how the markings in the acrylic pop!


#TeamTornek lol. 

I'm back with monochrome shots in water beads, my daughter was playing with these and thought it looked pretty darn neat. 

Using a crappy back-up phone, but think they turned out okay!


----------



## Dixan

I need one. Congrats to all taking delivery.

🍻


----------



## TheMeasure

onefishtaco said:


> #TeamTornek lol.
> View attachment 16205287


Haha I love those water beads, a lot of fun. They do make for great watch prop shots!


----------



## onefishtaco

TheMeasure said:


> Haha I love those water beads, a lot of fun. They do make for great watch prop shots!


I'm quickly learning how hard it is to capture quality shots like yours! Things I noticed afterwards... the bezel not aligned, and the hour/minute hands blocking the name... and some dust on the dial!!! doh! 😅

BTW just in case anyone was wondering... the bezel action is toddler approved!


----------



## GregoryD

TR has been getting some press lately, including on Hodinkee. If anyone wants some entertainment, I'd recommend reading the comments for this article. Some of the commenters are not pleased, as the TR doesn't pass their own personal gatekeeping requirements.









Dawn Of The Dead: Four Frighteningly Good Watch Brands Just Came Back From The Grave


They're alive! But don't call them zombies. This is genuine rebirth and resurrection on the wrist.




www.hodinkee.com


----------



## nitron135

GregoryD said:


> TR has been getting some press lately, including on Hodinkee. If anyone wants some entertainment, I'd recommend reading the comments for this article. Some of the commenters are not pleased, as the TR doesn't pass their own personal gatekeeping requirements.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dawn Of The Dead: Four Frighteningly Good Watch Brands Just Came Back From The Grave
> 
> 
> They're alive! But don't call them zombies. This is genuine rebirth and resurrection on the wrist.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.hodinkee.com


Indeed, some questioning of where Bill got off resurrecting the brand without a blancpain/swatch war chest at his disposal


----------



## pinchoff

Another capture of its shapes, colors and textures…

No need for words. Image talks for its own. 











Enviado desde mi iPhone utilizando Tapatalk Pro


----------



## onefishtaco

nitron135 said:


> Indeed, some questioning of where Bill got off resurrecting the brand without a blancpain/swatch war chest at his disposal


I listened to a podcast with Bill talking about the Tornek-Rayville trademark, he actually said nobody wanted it!

Easy to argue the current BP Fifty Fathoms is also just a trademark. A few acquisitions of Blancpain went by before new management re-released the Fifty Fathoms in 2007. 

I'm actually glad Swatch doesn't own it. Because then we'd be looking at a Hodinkee LE Tornek-Rayville for $20,000 

Instead, we got the Tornek-Rayville that likely would've been issued today. Modern issue military watches are easy to service and cheap to replace (Look at Marathon & CWC)

The original was never meant to be a luxury/shinny watch with a decorated movement like BP currently sells (which I actually love BTW). 

They were a tool conforming to U.S. military specification MIL-W-22176 to get a job done. Most of which were disposed of afterwards. 

As a bonus, Tornek-Rayville came to life due to the 1933 "Buy American Act"... and thanks to Bill, I own an *American* Tornek-Raville! 

Couldn't have said that if it had come from Swatch


----------



## at2011

Swiss brainwashing did a number on those critics and I could care less. What bothered me was that one of them took a decade to learn about Blancpain. Seriously? Hasn't he heard of the internet? If it takes a decade to learn about a watch brand then doesn't that fall under the realm of "lazy"? His credibility is shot at this point.


----------



## eldasher

Whenever I get mine, I’ll try something a bit different. I like the idea of a tool watch on a luxury strap. Perhaps a tapered cocoa colored alligator strap with deployment buckle. I probably have such a strap already from Breitling. Very excited to play with this watch. 

Another idea is perhaps an Oysterflex rubber strap with a Glidelock buckle. I believe they come in brown rubber. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## TheMeasure

That Hodinkee article and comment section was entertaining. While not all Hodinkee readers/supporters are this way, it’s not shocking their elitist attitude looks down on the TR, but other brand resurrections are ok. Honestly I’d be more worried if Logan Baker and company were raving about and giving the TR glowing reviews lol. 

Here is my “budget Blancpain look without any affiliation to the history of Blancpain or to its current structure as part of the Swatch Group.”


----------



## TheMeasure

Seems like the majority of the TRs in the wild are acrylic inserts. Here’s a nice look at aluminum insert. 

Pics from TYS IG.


----------



## TheMeasure

eldasher said:


> …I like the idea of a tool watch on a luxury strap. Perhaps a tapered cocoa colored alligator strap with deployment buckle…
> 
> Another idea is perhaps an Oysterflex rubber strap with a Glidelock buckle. I believe they come in brown rubber.


Please post pics when u get it. Interested to see the different looks. 

I’ve tried a couple two piece straps on my TR and love the look.


----------



## clouser

I read the comments on Hodinkee. It makes me chuckle when pretentious people get their panties in a wad.

There’s nothing about my TR that I don’t like. It looks like I’m one of the only plank owners who went with the aluminum bezel insert.


----------



## brianmazanec

clouser said:


> I read the comments on Hodinkee. It makes me chuckle when pretentious people get their panties in a wad.
> 
> There’s nothing about my TR that I don’t like. It looks like I’m one of the only plank owners who went with the aluminum bezel insert.


Agreed. It's more sad than anything. I actually almost got the aluminum... Love the acrylic but frankly wish I got both! 

Sent from my SM-G991U using Tapatalk


----------



## clouser

brianmazanec said:


> Agreed. It's more sad than anything. I actually almost got the aluminum... Love the acrylic but frankly wish I got both!


It was hard for me to decide between acrylic and aluminum. I used to have an MKII Stingray with acrylic bezel that I liked a lot, but for some reason, the aluminum bezel just looked better to me on the TR. I've always been a fan of bezel minute marks between the pip and 15.


----------



## Knoc

clouser said:


> I read the comments on Hodinkee. It makes me chuckle when pretentious people get their panties in a wad.
> 
> There’s nothing about my TR that I don’t like. It looks like I’m one of the only plank owners who went with the aluminum bezel insert.


Def digging it. I'm literally last on the recent pre -order and went aluminum as well.


----------



## antitesis

And yes, it's awesome.


----------



## TheMeasure

Nice to see some aluminum inserts making their way to owners. Congrats all!


----------



## Arthur

at2011 said:


> Swiss brainwashing did a number on those critics and I could care less. What bothered me was that one of them took a decade to learn about Blancpain. Seriously? Hasn't he heard of the internet? If it takes a decade to learn about a watch brand then doesn't that fall under the realm of "lazy"? His credibility is shot at this point.


Either he is incredibly wealthy and never held a real job, or he is a perfect example of the “perpetual academic” who has five or ten useless degrees and is too lazy to work, so he devotes his life to becoming the worlds greatest expert on some arcane subject that holds the interest of himself and ten others in the world! Insufferable snobs hold absolutely no interest to me as their useful contribution to society is so minuscule that it could reside on the head of a pin. And as you said, most if not all of his years of research could have been done in 2% of the time on the internet! 
I can guarantee you that had Bill produced this watch as a limited edition with a custom Swiss movement and a price tag north of 10 grand, these same guys would be falling all over themselves to get one, or even better have sold the trademark to Swatch and the “new” TR bearing little resemblance to the original selling for 20 grand. 
The nice thing is I’m confident that Bill is quite content with what he is producing, and could care less about what the Swiss watch snobs have to say. Personally I’m glad that the “new” TR has a strong connection to the original and is in a price range that is affordable to most everyone who admires the watch.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


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## clouser

Arthur said:


> Either he is incredibly wealthy and never held a real job, or he is a perfect example of the “perpetual academic” who has five or ten useless degrees and is too lazy to work, so he devotes his life to becoming the worlds greatest expert on some arcane subject that holds the interest of himself and ten others in the world! Insufferable snobs hold absolutely no interest to me as their useful contribution to society is so minuscule that it could reside on the head of a pin. And as you said, most if not all of his years of research could have been done in 2% of the time on the internet!
> I can guarantee you that had Bill produced this watch as a limited edition with a custom Swiss movement and a price tag north of 10 grand, these same guys would be falling all over themselves to get one, or even better have sold the trademark to Swatch and the “new” TR bearing little resemblance to the original selling for 20 grand.
> The nice thing is I’m confident that Bill is quite content with what he is producing, and could care less about what the Swiss watch snobs have to say. Personally I’m glad that the “new” TR has a strong connection to the original and is in a price range that is affordable to most everyone who admires the watch.


I couldn't have said it better myself. Also, all those haters seem to have forgotten that the original TR was built to be a workhorse...not a luxury watch. Bill has brought this watch back with that same workhorse mentality, but with keen attention to detail, and they just can't stand it.


----------



## andrewlogan1987

TheMeasure said:


> That Hodinkee article and comment section was entertaining. While not all Hodinkee readers/supporters are this way, it’s not shocking their elitist attitude looks down on the TR, but other brand resurrections are ok. Honestly I’d be more worried if Logan Baker and company were raving about and giving the TR glowing reviews lol.
> 
> Here is my “budget Blancpain look without any affiliation to the history of Blancpain or to its current structure as part of the Swatch Group.”


What article was this? I'd love to go laugh at the comments

Sent from my Pixel 5 using Tapatalk


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## valuewatchguy

everyone who has a connection (real or imagined) to an original will never look at a remake as being as good as the original.

Not sure how many Jeep Grand Wagoneer fans are clamoring for the new model......now imagine if Nissan was the brand that brought back this automotive icon.

Let them have their moans and groans. It doesnt change this watch in the least and they will fade away as more TR660 owners get one in hand. Bill owns the brand. He has been an obvious purveyor of military inspired watches for a long time. This TR660 is right in his wheelhouse. I will say that I don't think I would have bought one if it was under the MKII label. It would have just been another homage then.....Helson has had one out for years, Machester Watch Works did one 4 or 5 years ago, and i'm sure I can find one on ali-express currently.


----------



## TheMeasure

andrewlogan1987 said:


> What article was this? I'd love to go laugh at the comments
> 
> Sent from my Pixel 5 using Tapatalk


Here you go. 









Dawn Of The Dead: Four Frighteningly Good Watch Brands Just Came Back From The Grave


They're alive! But don't call them zombies. This is genuine rebirth and resurrection on the wrist.




 www.hodinkee.com





Cheers!


----------



## andrewlogan1987

TheMeasure said:


> Here you go.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Dawn Of The Dead: Four Frighteningly Good Watch Brands Just Came Back From The Grave
> 
> 
> They're alive! But don't call them zombies. This is genuine rebirth and resurrection on the wrist.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.hodinkee.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Cheers!


Thank you this is hilarious

Sent from my Pixel 5 using Tapatalk


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## at2011

Just dismayed at the audacity of these so-called "experts" to label someone's effort as "lazy" when the only expertise they possess is trashing someone else's hard work. The negative spin on this piece wasn't well disguised either.

Sent from my SM-N975U using Tapatalk


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## Joe90

Even Blancpain is a revival by Swatch.
Having said that I really like the brand and I can’t see why TR can’t be considered any differently than BP.

If Swatch (or another group) had revived TR and threw as much money at it as they did for BP I doubt there would be many people complaining…


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Maruzen

Another acrylic in the wild. Even though it arrived last week, yesterday was the first chance to get it out. Just a quick, not so great shot.

Initial impression is very good. It’s a well-balanced piece, light and lean despite the height. I thought I would need to change straps, but pleasantly surprised by the comfort right out of the box. Besides, my wife says it looks awesome as is. So it will stay this way for a while.


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## TheMeasure

I’ve been changing straps a lot on the TR. It looks good on just about anything. Thought I’d show it on a variety of two piece straps. I didn’t mount them, simply laid the straps in the lugs, so not 100% realistic look as your strap won’t be up against the case and there is slight gap.


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## pkrshang

at2011 said:


> Just dismayed at the audacity of these so-called "experts" to label someone's effort as "lazy" when the only expertise they possess is trashing someone else's hard work. The negative spin on this piece wasn't well disguised either.
> 
> Sent from my SM-N975U using Tapatalk


Here is a lecture on the 50 fathoms by the so called expert. I wouldn't discount him entirely but I do disagree with his opinions on the revival of TR.


----------



## antitesis

So essentially he is complaining about the movement? Huh...

In Watch Industry, a Feud Over What Makes a Timepiece Swiss-Made

Market Focus China: What The Swatch Group Produces In China – Raymond Weil’s Penetration Of The China Market – Roamer: An Example In The Mid-Range

Swatch watches Swiss made?

'Swiss-made' label lacks precision for watch industry

The list goes on...
I wonder what I'd find if I open a "Real BP"?

He might be an "expert" but he makes no sense. And, oh, BTW, I just spent the last 30 min reading about BP, TR, the Vietnam War, and the watches that were made for certain units. I think I can hold a good conversation with the 10 years of spending learning over BP....

Whatever.
Bill brought back an icon. I love what he did, it feels awesome, it looks good, I'm sure it will perform great, and, more importantly to me, these watches are "field serviceable" because of the movement they use. A true tool and mil watch in my opinion. Bill stands behind his products, has an outstanding service, and is one of the most knowledgeable guys about mil watches I know producing amazing pieces that are quality made and we can afford.

Bill, if you read this, keep on doing what you do. The new TR is amazing.


----------



## dcam1075

I don’t feel I need to wade in too deeply with this topic, but in my way over simplified attempt to reconcile Kingston’s position versus what Bill has done with the TR boils down to this for me and I thinks it speaks to the “authenticity” of a revival in general.

If the DoD put the watch spec back out today to watch manufacturers which watch do you think would win the contract and end up in military circulation. The watch(s)Blancpain has recently created in their revamp of the 50 Fathoms or what Bill has done with the Tornek Rayville? 

I think the answer is obvious, and in some ways harkens back to the origin story of the TR, the buy American act and the general purpose built design. 

I also feel the two revivals can and should live together harmoniously in the watch collecting community just as they did in the ‘60s. Luxury vs Pure Function


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## dcam1075

TheMeasure said:


> I’ve been changing straps a lot on the TR. It looks good on just about anything. Thought I’d show it on a variety of two piece straps. I didn’t mount them, simply laid the straps in the lugs, so not 100% realistic look as your strap won’t be up against the case and there is slight gap.


Thanks for sharing these, definitely digging them, especially the brown leather. That is a combo I had not really considered. Good food for thought while I patiently await mine to arrive!


----------



## brianmazanec

Still enjoying
















Sent from my SM-G991U using Tapatalk


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## onefishtaco

The TR feels like the right choice on a rainy day. Mounted on a Bonetto Cinturini deployant. 

For those experimenting with straps: 1.5mm spring bars won't work on this watch case. They slip right through the lug holes. Use 1.8mm at minimum.


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## TheMeasure

onefishtaco said:


> ….For those experimenting with straps: 1.5mm spring bars won't work on this watch case. They slip right through the lug holes. Use 1.8mm at minimum.


Yeah Bill made the TR so it accepts the Seiko fat bars. So any spring bar with the 1.1mm tips should be snug. You may even be able to go with 1.2mm tips. 

I’m rocking some shoulder-less bars that I believe are 1.78 with 1.1 tips that extend 2.5mm.


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## boatswain

TheMeasure said:


> Yeah Bill made the TR so it accepts the Seiko fat bars. So any spring bar with the 1.1mm tips should be snug. You may even be able to go with 1.2mm tips.
> 
> I’m rocking some shoulder-less bars that I believe are 1.78 with 1.1 tips that extend 2.5mm.


Those are solid looking bars


----------



## DuckaDiesel

I apologize if this has already been answered but when is the next round going to be available for order/preorder? 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


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## Jim C.

DuckaDiesel said:


> I apologize if this has already been answered but when is the next round going to be available for order/preorder?


Q1 2022 per the web site.









TR-660 Pre-Order (50% Deposit)


Ordering Opens: November 3rd 2022 at 10 am EST. Product details and specifications detailed below.




tornek-rayville.us


----------



## valuewatchguy

TheMeasure said:


> Yeah Bill made the TR so it accepts the Seiko fat bars. So any spring bar with the 1.1mm tips should be snug. You may even be able to go with 1.2mm tips.
> 
> I’m rocking some shoulder-less bars that I believe are 1.78 with 1.1 tips that extend 2.5mm.


is that the OEM strap? Love that weave on it!


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## TheMeasure

boatswain said:


> Those are solid looking bars


Yeah it’s about as close as you can get to fixed bars without being locked into fixed bars.


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## TheMeasure

valuewatchguy said:


> is that the OEM strap? Love that weave on it!


Yes! It’s the OEM Nytex. I’m really digging the weave too. My strap has taken some time to break in, but I can tell it’s going to be a nice comfortable strap for a long time to come.


----------



## Toh

Took its time to land in Sydney!









Sent from my PH-1 using Tapatalk


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## pinchoff

So attractive











Enviado desde mi iPhone utilizando Tapatalk Pro


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## valuewatchguy

Toh said:


> Took its time to land in Sydney!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my PH-1 using Tapatalk


great combo with the green canvas!


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## JFingers

In time for the announcement of the TR "Bombs Away" watch mug!

Blue skies, y'all!
-only Jake


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## onefishtaco

Toh said:


> Took its time to land in Sydney!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my PH-1 using Tapatalk


Great strap, where's it from?


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## valuewatchguy

onefishtaco said:


> Great strap, where's it from?


betting money thats a Drunk Art Strap


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## Toh

It's actually from Clover Straps!

Sent from my PH-1 using Tapatalk


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## valuewatchguy

Toh said:


> It's actually from Clover Straps!
> 
> Sent from my PH-1 using Tapatalk


dang it! thats why i shouldnt bet


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## pkrshang

Anybody have a Bulova Mil Ships for comparison?


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## WastedYears

I received my TR today, and I'm infatuated. The watch looks so much better irl than it does in the pics online! I love the proportions, the size, the fact that the lack of rotor noise rivals a couple of my watches with swiss movements and even those awesomely fat, shoulderless springbars (I hope Bill makes those available to purchase seperately at some point). He totally knocked this one out of the park, and that's coming from someone who wasn't 100% happy with the Key West.

Currently I have it on an Artem sailcloth while the khaki strap breaks in.


----------



## Maruzen

WastedYears said:


> I received my TR today, and I'm infatuated. The watch looks so much better irl than it does in the pics online! I love the proportions, the size, the fact that the lack of rotor noise rivals a couple of my watches with swiss movements and even those awesomely fat, shoulderless springbars (I hope Bill makes those available to purchase seperately at some point). He totally knocked this one out of the park, and that's coming from someone who wasn't 100% happy with the Key West.
> 
> Currently I have it on an Artem sailcloth while the khaki strap breaks in.
> 
> View attachment 16231787


I've had it on the wrist 10 days and infatuation would be a good way to describe it. I need to take some more photos.

How do you like it on the Artem strap?


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## WastedYears

Maruzen said:


> I've had it on the wrist 10 days and infatuation would be a good way to describe it. I need to take some more photos.
> 
> How do you like it on the Artem strap?


I like it well enough, though I am still not completely sold on sailcloth straps in general. I wear em more for looks than anything else - I generally prefer the comfort of canvas or leather.


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## brianmazanec

Thank you to all of you veterans out there.









Sent from my SM-G991U using Tapatalk


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## TheMeasure

A little lume action


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## boatswain

TheMeasure said:


> A little lume action


Looking great! 

How would you stack the lume up?

Is it about equivalent to good Superluminova?


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## TheMeasure

boatswain said:


> Looking great!
> 
> How would you stack the lume up?
> 
> Is it about equivalent to good Superluminova?


I would say it’s equivalent to good Superluminova. It blows away C1 (no shocker there) unfortunately I don’t have any C3 lumed watches. But here it is against the P300 (BGW9) which I feel is one of the better lumed MKIIs. 

Quick snap from my mobile, so it’s a little fuzzy and picks up some light noise from the lumed markers.


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## boatswain

TheMeasure said:


> I would say it’s equivalent to good Superluminova. It blows away C1 (no shocker there) unfortunately I don’t have any C3 lumed watches. But here it is against the P300 (BGW9) which I feel is one of the better lumed MKIIs.
> 
> Quick snap from my mobile, so it’s a little fuzzy and picks up some light noise from the lumed markers.


Super helpful! And looks pretty darn good. 

I was worried it was similar to C1. But it’s clear with how it stacks up against the 300 that the TR is very good indeed!

Thanks again and enjoy!


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## TheMeasure

pkrshang said:


> Anybody have a Bulova Mil Ships for comparison?


I got to see the Bulova a couple months back but didn’t have the TR yet. Met up with my buddy today and got to compare the two. He’s got the Swiss Made LE. I’d say the fit and finish between the two are pretty equal. I love the domed crystal and the distortion that comes with it. The size is great and very wearable. The LE has a nicely done caseback. The OEM strap is great and the functioning moisture indicator is cool. The push to turn bezel is fun. 

A couple things I don’t like.. the lume is weak, especially on the bezel. The 16mm lug width, is a deal breaker for me. 

Snapped a couple pics for comparison.


























And few bonus pics as a treat. 




















And it’s certainly feasible to add a functioning moisture indicator to the TR if one wanted.


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## David Woo

TheMeasure said:


> I got to see the Bulova a couple months back but didn’t have the TR yet. Met up with my buddy today and got to compare the two. He’s got the Swiss Made LE. I’d say the fit and finish between the two are pretty equal. I love the domed crystal and the distortion that comes with it. The size is great and very wearable. The LE has a nicely done caseback. The OEM strap is great and the functioning moisture indicator is cool. The push to turn bezel is fun.
> 
> A couple things I don’t like.. the lume is weak, especially on the bezel. The 16mm lug width, is a deal breaker for me.
> 
> Snapped a couple pics for comparison.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And few bonus pics as a treat.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And it’s certainly feasible to add a functioning moisture indicator to the TR if one wanted.


so what did you think of the bulova? i saw one recently and was impressed, even with the strap.


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## TheMeasure

David Woo said:


> so what did you think of the bulova? i saw one recently and was impressed, even with the strap.


I put my thoughts above in the post you quoted. 

Cheers!


----------



## WastedYears

Anyone know where I could get a bead blasted deployant clasp? It looks like Hadley Roma had a sand blasted one, but that seems to be sold out everywhere.


----------



## Stowe

@TheMeasure Thanks for those comparison shots. I just read up on the Bulova. It has some cool history that obviously intersects with the Tornek Rayville.


----------



## Semper Jeep

Today is the first day since I got my TR in early October that I decided to wear something else. Scrolling through here and looking at some of the photos is making me regret that decision.


----------



## dcam1075

TheMeasure said:


> I got to see the Bulova a couple months back but didn’t have the TR yet. Met up with my buddy today and got to compare the two. He’s got the Swiss Made LE. I’d say the fit and finish between the two are pretty equal. I love the domed crystal and the distortion that comes with it. The size is great and very wearable. The LE has a nicely done caseback. The OEM strap is great and the functioning moisture indicator is cool. The push to turn bezel is fun.
> 
> A couple things I don’t like.. the lume is weak, especially on the bezel. The 16mm lug width, is a deal breaker for me.
> 
> Snapped a couple pics for comparison.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And few bonus pics as a treat.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And it’s certainly feasible to add a functioning moisture indicator to the TR if one wanted.


Thanks for this comparison! I was hoping someone would post a side by side. I think these are different enough that one could justify having both in a collection, especially if vintage military is your thing. They represent two different things in my mind, a concept for a military watch based on the current spec of the day but never saw daylight and then the watch that actually went into production. 

Great comparison!


----------



## dcam1075

I figured while I am waiting for my TR to ship I might as well start breaking in the Nytex








strap so I can hit the ground running when it arrives!


----------



## steveb7az

I'm hoping to acquire a TR when the next window opens. In the interim can someone answer a question for me? Some of the images that have been posted show "MKII" below the Tornek-Rayville name while others, including plank owners show "U.S." below the name. Is that an option during ordering?


----------



## TheMeasure

steveb7az said:


> I'm hoping to acquire a TR when the next window opens. In the interim can someone answer a question for me? Some of the images that have been posted show "MKII" below the Tornek-Rayville name while others, including plank owners show "U.S." below the name. Is that an option during ordering?


In short, no the branding text is not an option. Only the bezel insert and strap(s) are your options of choices. 

So the ones with the MKII branding on the dial were Bill’s original run of the TR, years ago. There was only like 7 of those produced and they also have blue text in the moisture indicator area. 

The new TR-660 has no MKII branding and the U.S. under the TR name. Also the moisture indicator area is black and grey. 

There’s more differences but those to me are the easiest ones to spot. 

Cheers!


----------



## onefishtaco

Orange you glad drilled lugs make strap changes so easy? 

Strap: Bonetto Cinturini 400CT


----------



## Toh

Still trying on different straps... Good excuse for this watch to stay on the wrist!









Sent from my PH-1 using Tapatalk


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## steveb7az

TheMeasure said:


> In short, no the branding text is not an option. Only the bezel insert and strap(s) are your options of choices.
> 
> So the ones with the MKII branding on the dial were Bill’s original run of the TR, years ago. There was only like 7 of those produced and they also have blue text in the moisture indicator area.
> 
> The new TR-660 has no MKII branding and the U.S. under the TR name. Also the moisture indicator area is black and grey.
> 
> There’s more differences but those to me are the easiest ones to spot.
> 
> Cheers!


 Darn...I like the look of the original run just a wee bit better than the current. MKII and Bill have established a good reputation and, in my opinion, having the MKII name helps promote their brand.


----------



## Omegatron24

Has anyone who pre-ordered in July received shipment notification yet? I'm in the first set of orders that his email said had a 'hopeful' target November ship date...can't wait to get mine!


----------



## dcam1075

Omegatron24 said:


> Has anyone who pre-ordered in July received shipment notification yet? I'm in the first set of orders that his email said had a 'hopeful' target November ship date...can't wait to get mine!


I am in the July ordered, November ship cohort as well. No shipping notification yet, but I am not surprised. I imagine it will be in the back half of the month if not early December.


----------



## valuewatchguy

dcam1075 said:


> I am in the July ordered, November ship cohort as well. No shipping notification yet, but I am not surprised. I imagine it will be in the back half of the month if not early December.


SAME status here......


----------



## steveb7az

TheMeasure said:


> That Hodinkee article and comment section was entertaining. While not all Hodinkee readers/supporters are this way, it’s not shocking their elitist attitude looks down on the TR, but other brand resurrections are ok. Honestly I’d be more worried if Logan Baker and company were raving about and giving the TR glowing reviews lol.
> 
> Here is my “budget Blancpain look without any affiliation to the history of Blancpain or to its current structure as part of the Swatch Group.”


I went looking for the story on Hodinkee and also found it interesting. As several others have pointed out some on Hodinkee look down on the TR, but their article on the Bulova MIL Ships seemed rather kindly written and some of the comments also seemed favorable. Could it be that Hodinkee took more kindly to the Bulova since they offer it for sale in their store?


----------



## dcam1075

Mother Fu****

I just had this email hit my inbox and I got super excited that my TR just shipped!










Then I opened it and realized it was the tracking for the “Bombs Away” mug I had ordered. 

Geez.


----------



## EZ01

steveb7az said:


> I went looking for the story on Hodinkee and also found it interesting. As several others have pointed out some on Hodinkee look down on the TR, but their article on the Bulova MIL Ships seemed rather kindly written and some of the comments also seemed favorable. Could it be that Hodinkee took more kindly to the Bulova since they offer it for sale in their store?


Absolutely. Hodinkee is and will always shill for the things they sell and higher end pieces they get to review for the content. They started with high horology and as time went on you can tell when they started to really sell out. I remember it very clearly too. It was when they started to feature Seiko (nothing against the brand by the way, I have a few of them, but at that time it was all higher end brands that were being featured). If you asked me back then if I would believe that Hodinkee would be writing an "article" on Bulova, I would not believe you. If you told me there were selling them, I definitely would not believe you. Hodkinee is pure advertising at this point and anyone who reads what they write seriously is being finessed. Just look at the collaborations they do. They use flowery language and talk up the collaboration but it's all just lazy designs with a premium price tag. Just look at that Timex they just released.

TR being bought and restarted is no difference than what they did with Blanpain and Benrus (naming these two just off the top of my head). Some entity bought the rights to the name and started making watches and used the brands historic relevance as the marketing. The difference is that TR is not selling on the Hodinkee store and is not making limited editions to sell on the Hodinkee store. Blancpain is. The newly revived Benrus (owned by some investment firm) is.


----------



## phillycheez

I've had the pleasure in owning quiet a few MKII's over the years and this is my favorite. He has really upped the standards of his watches particularly in the sub $1,000 models. I am pretty impressed with the all around quality of this watch. 

Also after reading the stuffy comments on Hodinkee.. it made me really reflect on my watch hobby experiences and the douches that surround it. I look forward to Bill producing more models of the TR that never existed. It will be high entertainment value when it pisses off a guy who spent a decade of his life researching Tornek-Rayville. Some guy who thinks the only way TR should be revived is by involving elements that make the watch $20k+. I am sure Allen Tornek who was under cutting Rolex by almost half the cost at the time would agree with you... 

Keep it up Bill!


----------



## valuewatchguy

phillycheez said:


> I've had the pleasure in owning quiet a few MKII's over the years and this is my favorite. He has really upped the standards of his watches particularly in the sub $1,000 models. I am pretty impressed with the all around quality of this watch.


All the positive comments from you multiple MKII owners is really making this first timer very happy that I got in on this TR660. I was going to get the TR in before selling anything to offset it and let it compete for itself for wrist time in the collection. But I decided over the weekend to sell something else in advance in anticipation of the TR Delivering soon-ish.


----------



## dcam1075

Woot, Woot!

Just received an email notification that my TR had moved to the shipping phase with an estimated shipment date of 11/27. Shouldn’t be too long now!!


----------



## reluctantsnowman

dcam1075 said:


> Woot, Woot!
> 
> Just received an email notification that my TR had moved to the shipping phase with an estimated shipment date of 11/27. Shouldn’t be too long now!!


What was your order number?


----------



## dcam1075

reluctantsnowman said:


> What was your order number?


1115-T


----------



## dcam1075

And, just got shipping confirmation!!


----------



## TheMeasure

Really loving the Nytex… it’s sooo good.


----------



## JamesJackson

Just got my shipping confirmation. Initial order number 1102. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## dcam1075

Mine showed up yesterday! I was part of the July Order batch. Super Stoked!


----------



## boatswain

dcam1075 said:


> Mine showed up yesterday! I was part of the July Order batch. Super Stoked!


Looks great!

Enjoy


----------



## eldasher

Just got my email saying it’s shipping first week of December. Still don’t know if I’m ready to wear it. Can’t seem to stop using the Tudor Black Bay GMT and I have a Black Bay P-01 that has never been worn either, just sitting in its box since I bought it. 

I tend to save things for special milestones in my life. I’ll probably do the same with this beauty when it arrives. Just happy to have one secured. 

In the meantime, I’ll enjoy the watch through ur wonderful photos and stories. 

Cheers

W


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## ripper

eldasher said:


> Just got my email saying it’s shipping first week of December. Still don’t know if I’m ready to wear it. Can’t seem to stop using the Tudor Black Bay GMT and I have a Black Bay P-01 that has never been worn either, just sitting in its box since I bought it.
> 
> I tend to save things for special milestones in my life. I’ll probably do the same with this beauty when it arrives. Just happy to have one secured.
> 
> In the meantime, I’ll enjoy the watch through ur wonderful photos and stories.
> 
> Cheers
> 
> W
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


What was your order number?
Im at the beginning of December scheduled numbers.


----------



## eldasher

ripper said:


> What was your order number?
> Im at the beginning of December scheduled numbers.


1404-T

Not sure what that means 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## eldasher

ripper said:


> What was your order number?
> Im at the beginning of December scheduled numbers.


Found a different order number too 1169-T


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Knoc

Tentative shipping schedule - based on your *1st* payment deposit confirmation number:


November: 1093-T though 1174-T
December: 1175-T through 1259-T
January: 1260-T through 1360-T


----------



## valuewatchguy

I got an email this weekend that said mine was in final assembly with a expected shipping date of 4th of December

I was near the end of the November comfirmation numbers. 

Today is 30 November


----------



## antitesis

New watch, vintage-looking shot...


----------



## TheMeasure




----------



## ripper

That's bloody good picture.  
But doesn't make my waiting time easier


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## TheMeasure

ripper said:


> That's bloody good picture.
> But doesn't make my waiting time easier


Haha thank you! Maybe I’ll try another picture later in the week for ya!


----------



## ripper

Update from IG


----------



## steveb7az

Would someone know when the next opportunity to order one of these beauties will open? Other than signing up for their mailing list is there anything else I need to do to be alerted?


----------



## stamsd

I have not dug through all of this, but has someone found a bracelet that may work for these?


----------



## valuewatchguy

stamsd said:


> I have not dug through all of this, but has someone found a bracelet that may work for these?


Even if you found one that fit, the finish will be hard to match


----------



## TheMeasure

steveb7az said:


> Would someone know when the next opportunity to order one of these beauties will open? Other than signing up for their mailing list is there anything else I need to do to be alerted?


Can’t recall if the next opportunity to order was addressed or not. My guess would be Q1 of 2022. But the best way to find out is sign up for the notifications on the TR website as you’ve already done. You can follow the TR Instagram page, but from what I’ve seen that’s more of a heads up an email notification is coming shortly thing.


----------



## TheMeasure

stamsd said:


> I have not dug through all of this, but has someone found a bracelet that may work for these?


I saw this guy post his TR with a Hadley Roma bracelet. 
If you go to his post he has a short wrist roll video, showing more of the bracelet. 


__
http://instagr.am/p/CWjIYfCrC3t/


----------



## eldasher

I would think a Damasko bracelet would work. They tend to have bead blasted finish. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## stamsd

That does not look horrible, but if there were end links that would work it would open up a world of possibilities. I am on the December delivery schedule and working through scenarios.


----------



## pkrshang

Anybody get a December delivery update yet as promised?


----------



## ripper

pkrshang said:


> Anybody get a December delivery update yet as promised?


Not yet and im almost at the beginning of the December order delivery numbers.


----------



## pkrshang

ripper said:


> Not yet and im almost at the beginning of the december order deliverie numbers.


Same...


----------



## ripper

I just got shipping notification. My order is on the way


----------



## pkrshang

ripper said:


> I just got shipping notification. My order is on the way


Darn, still no update. My initial order was 119X.


----------



## ripper

Mine was 118x.


----------



## TheMeasure




----------



## JFingers

TLDR: Phillips Watches is auctioning off a Tornek-Rayville, estimating $50-100k. Don't people know they can get a new one for less than a Grand? 

Blue skies, y'all!
-only Jake


----------



## valuewatchguy

If my tracking is correct I will get my end of the list November delivery tomorrow.


----------



## pkrshang

Finally received a tracking number for my December delivery. Hopefully I can get it before I go off for vacation.


----------



## valuewatchguy

very quick shot

I’m very surprised how small the watch wears. It looks much bigger in pics.


----------



## boatswain

valuewatchguy said:


> View attachment 16284052
> 
> 
> very quick shot
> 
> I’m very surprised how small the watch wears. It looks much bigger in pics.


Looks great! Congrats 

Really nice on that nato.


----------



## valuewatchguy




----------



## ajw45

valuewatchguy said:


> View attachment 16284052
> 
> 
> very quick shot
> 
> I’m very surprised how small the watch wears. It looks much bigger in pics.


Wow that looks stunning! I'm crossing my fingers for a larger version one day, the original at 41mm was big for the time, would love to see this blown up to 42-43mm....


----------



## eldasher

Watch came in today. I like it more than the Paradive. Still not ready to celebrate anything so I’m saving it for a special occasion. 

Some quick photos and a comparative with the Tudor GMT for size. I do like the bead blast finish. 

Cheers

W










































Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## pkrshang

eldasher said:


> Watch came in today. I like it more than the Paradive. Still not ready to celebrate anything so I’m saving it for a special occasion.
> 
> Some quick photos and a comparative with the Tudor GMT for size. I do like the bead blast finish.
> 
> Cheers
> 
> W
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


It looks as big as the Tudor GMT!


----------



## eldasher

pkrshang said:


> It looks as big as the Tudor GMT!


It’s not really. The Tudor is slightly bigger but the Tudor’s dial sits much higher, so does the crystal to legibility is better. The TR is very elegant and proportionally the case thickness is nicer and that dimension carries through to the more delicate lugs. I find the proportions of the TR nicer but the dial isn’t as legible, feels more cramped because it’s smaller and sits deeper. 

40mm TR vs 41mm BB GMT isn’t that big a deal. I do wish the BB GMT was thinner. 

Both lovely watches. In my opinion the TR would be better if it has a COSC movement. It’s a watch the deserves such a movement. For the price though, it’s near impossible to beat it as a package. 

Cheers

W


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## pkrshang

eldasher said:


> It’s not really. The Tudor is slightly bigger but the Tudor’s dial sits much higher, so does the crystal to legibility is better. The TR is very elegant and proportionally the case thickness is nicer and that dimension carries through to the more delicate lugs. I find the proportions of the TR nicer but the dial isn’t as legible, feels more cramped because it’s smaller and sits deeper.
> 
> 40mm TR vs 41mm BB GMT isn’t that big a deal. I do wish the BB GMT was thinner.
> 
> Both lovely watches. In my opinion the TR would be better if it has a COSC movement. It’s a watch the deserves such a movement. For the price though, it’s near impossible to beat it as a package.
> 
> Cheers
> 
> W
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Is the lug length longer on the GMT? They look relatively similar at a glance.


----------



## eldasher

A few more comparative photos. TR 660 vs BB P-01. First is based on a real military watch, the other based on a conceptual military watch. BB GMT photos added for size reference.

You can get a sense of the scale of the TR, really nice proportions. 

Cheers

W



















































Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## eldasher

pkrshang said:


> Is the lug length longer on the GMT? They look relatively similar at a glance.


Yes, lug to lug they’re about the same: 50mm 

Edit: Technically the TR is 48.5mm lug to lug. Side by side you’d be hard pressed to see that 1.5mm difference…or maybe I’m just old and my eyesight isn’t what it used to be. 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## valuewatchguy




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## valuewatchguy




----------



## TheMeasure




----------



## brianmazanec

Peak MKII









Sent from my SM-G991U using Tapatalk


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## eldasher

Comparing the TR-660 to BB-58. Diameter wise they’re closer to each other than the TR to the BB GMT. 

Thickness though, the BB-58 looks thinner.


















































Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## valuewatchguy

eldasher said:


> Comparing the TR-660 to BB-58. Diameter wise they’re closer to each other than the TR to the BB GMT.
> 
> Thickness though, the BB-58 looks thinner.
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


killing me with that yellow tape on the TR660......rip it off quick, its less painful that way!


----------



## eldasher

valuewatchguy said:


> killing me with that yellow tape on the TR660......rip it off quick, its less painful that way!


…someone should let MK-II know we prefer clear tape. Just not ready to wear the TR yet but I will certainly enjoy taking the tape off and remember you the day I decide to wear it. 

Cheers

W


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## andrewlogan1987

Mine finally shipped, hopefully it won't be too long before it lands in Scotland

Sent from my Pixel 5 using Tapatalk


----------



## valuewatchguy

these inexpensive canvas straps from Aliexpress make good pairings for the TR. just pop out the built in quick release spring bars and use your own fat bars for security.


----------



## pkrshang




----------



## ripper

@pkrshang you got it! Congrats!! Mine departed JFK airport on Saturday. Since than no update on tracking. I hope it flies to Poland directly


----------



## pkrshang

ripper said:


> @pkrshang you got it! Congrats!! Mine departed JFK airport on Saturday. Since than no update on tracking. I hope it flies to Poland directly


Finally! I was surprised it got to me before Christmas!


----------



## Omegatron24

I'm very curious to hear people's experience as they see how well it keeps time. I've worn mine all but one day since it arrived (11 days ago), and its at +16 sec per day. Definitely within spec, but hoping it gets better (assuming the whole concept of 'breaking in' a mechanical watch is real).


----------



## eldasher

Omegatron24 said:


> I'm very curious to hear people's experience as they see how well it keeps time. I've worn mine all but one day since it arrived (11 days ago), and its at +16 sec per day. Definitely within spec, but hoping it gets better (assuming the whole concept of 'breaking in' a mechanical watch is real).


I had the same issue with the Paradive. It was just so darn fast! I took it to a watchmaker and had him regulate it. Haven’t worn it since to see. I do wish they were regulated better. Even better if MK-II offered a COSC upgrade movement when we order, that would be perfect. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Stowe

Received my shipping notification last night! The Paradive maybe getting a rest during holiday travel.


----------



## TheMeasure

Omegatron24 said:


> I'm very curious to hear people's experience as they see how well it keeps time. I've worn mine all but one day since it arrived (11 days ago), and its at +16 sec per day. Definitely within spec, but hoping it gets better (assuming the whole concept of 'breaking in' a mechanical watch is real).


That seems really fast. I’ve owned a handful of the RTW watches, all share the same movement and none of mine have ever been close to +16 a day. While maybe not COSC specs, mine have been very accurate.. at most maybe +/- 5 a day being the worst.


----------



## NWP627

stamsd said:


> I have not dug through all of this, but has someone found a bracelet that may work for these?












Shark mesh - as close to bead blasted as I could come.


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## TheMeasure




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## Maruzen

TheMeasure said:


> That seems really fast. I’ve owned a handful of the RTW watches, all share the same movement and none of mine have ever been close to +16 a day. While maybe not COSC specs, mine have been very accurate.. at most maybe +/- 5 a day being the worst.


When I wore mine for 19 days straight, I believe I lost 1-2 seconds per day. Very pleased with mine.


----------



## VincentG

I was fortunate to have owned a TR-900 for a few years, I was cautious to wear it much back then, wore it to a few watch meets and to Ferrettis in Montecatini Terme, we swapped and he let me handle his Air Command, he had never seen a TR in the flesh. One of my pics of it made it into a mil watch calendar, I am looking forward to a TR that I don't have to "worry" about  Bill has done an awesome job on this watch, it was nice to see a pic alongside the Bulova ty.


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## at2011

Omegatron24 said:


> I'm very curious to hear people's experience as they see how well it keeps time. I've worn mine all but one day since it arrived (11 days ago), and its at +16 sec per day. Definitely within spec, but hoping it gets better (assuming the whole concept of 'breaking in' a mechanical watch is real).


Could be magnetized. A $10 demagnetizer from the bay should set it straight.


----------



## Omegatron24

at2011 said:


> Could be magnetized. A $10 demagnetizer from the bay should set it straight.


Thanks for the suggestion! This was actually the first thing I checked, and the compass doesn't even budge from it.

Some good news though - I did a more careful timing (I don't have the instrument to measure it): just wore it many days, made sure it was totally wound, then carefully set it to time.gov and documented the 24 hour different. Its still +11 seconds. But I did notice that on Bill's timing sheet, it notes that it runs fastest when the crown is facing up (away from gravity). This matters because I'm left handed, and wear my watch on the right wrist..so crown faces up most often. For every bench-made MKii I've bought, I've noted this to Bill in my order (though I have no real verification that he does anything with that...but those ran within COSC). I suspect that a righty would have better luck timing this one.


----------



## tmoris

So after a month of waiting for my TR to clear customs it has just arrived (Prague, CZ, EU) and after having followed Bill for over 10 years and having had both the Kingston and KeyWest I have to say that the TR brand seems to have the most potential to me. I like both the design and its heritage, hope Bill can make this fly!

I havent followed the forum here in much detail recently, so Im sure everyone has seen this many times, but will still attach a couple of my pics (in not very favourable light conditions).

I like the paperwork accompanying the watch, makes for a nice touch! And I absolutely love the bezel insert lume, I needed this so much!  

A couple of Qs on my part, hope someone can chime in with answers:

after winding the movement I listened to it and it doesnt sound like its 4Hz, more like 3Hz. Is that the case?
the crown pulled into position #2 (as shown in the paperwork) does nothing. I assume this is because the movement actually features a date complication which is not used by TR.. or .. ?
what does the TR logo represent (featured on the green card and also on the clasps)? Didnt find this in neither the paperwork nor the TR website
the bezel clicks in a completely different way than any other watch I ever head. Anyone knows whats the underlying technology and how does it work?

Overall, very happy with my TR, its on my wrist as Im writing these lines


----------



## valuewatchguy

tmoris said:


> A couple of Qs on my part, hope someone can chime in with answers:
> 
> after winding the movement I listened to it and it doesnt sound like its 4Hz, more like 3Hz. Is that the case?
> the crown pulled into position #2 (as shown in the paperwork) does nothing. I assume this is because the movement actually features a date complication which is not used by TR.. or .. ?
> what does the TR logo represent (featured on the green card and also on the clasps)? Didnt find this in neither the paperwork nor the TR website
> the bezel clicks in a completely different way than any other watch I ever head. Anyone knows whats the underlying technology and how does it work?
> 
> Overall, very happy with my TR, its on my wrist as Im writing these lines


Seiko SII NE15 is a 3Hz movement








Seiko SII NE15C Japan Made Automatic Movement


Seiko SII NE15C Automatic Watch Movement, 3 Hands, Date at 3




timeconnectioninc.com





This watch has the ghost date position because the NE15 is designed with a date at 3 oclock

TR Logo ....???? Not sure maybe someone else knows

Bezel click......patented Billyaotech....seriously not sure but it does feel great to use. I'd personally like a little more clickiness but overall well executed.


----------



## TheMeasure

tmoris said:


> [*]what does the TR logo represent (featured on the green card and also on the clasps)? Didnt find this in neither the paperwork nor the TR website


It appears to be an updated trident logo from the TR900. You can see it here on those original operating instructions. 










I don’t know the backstory of why Allen Tornek or Blancpain chose it. Maybe its ties to Greek Mythology, Poseidon, the sea and ocean? I’m just guessing.


----------



## Stowe

Wow! What a well-executed piece. It has a vintage flair, but at the same time feels very modern. My Paradive is a bit worried that it may not be the favored steed in the stable any longer.


----------



## pkrshang

I feel like the bezel action is very Seiko like. Very similar to a skx or turtle.


----------



## tmoris

TheMeasure said:


> It appears to be an updated trident logo from the TR900. You can see it here on those original operating instructions.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I don’t know the backstory of why Allen Tornek or Blancpain chose it. Maybe its ties to Greek Mythology, Poseidon, the sea and ocean? I’m just guessing.


Love that! Had no idea the connection of Bill's watch and the original TR is so close. Perfect!


----------



## andrewlogan1987

Sent from my Pixel 5 using Tapatalk


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## at2011

TheMeasure said:


> It appears to be an updated trident logo from the TR900. You can see it here on those original operating instructions.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I don’t know the backstory of why Allen Tornek or Blancpain chose it. Maybe its ties to Greek Mythology, Poseidon, the sea and ocean? I’m just guessing.


I think it's a graphic symbol to denote depth rating. The arrow pointing downwards into a wave/the ocean - 400 foot "under water".

Sent from my SM-N975U using Tapatalk


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## TheMeasure

at2011 said:


> I think it's a graphic symbol to denote depth rating. The arrow pointing downwards into a wave/the ocean - 400 foot "under water".
> 
> Sent from my SM-N975U using Tapatalk


Ohhhh I totally see that now! Thanks! I couldn’t find much on it and saw one publication refer to it as a “trident” so just assumed that’s what it was.


----------



## WastedYears

Great new review of the TR-660 up on Worn & Wound.

Review: the Tornek-Rayville TR-660 - Worn & Wound


----------



## valuewatchguy

WastedYears said:


> Great new review of the TR-660 up on Worn & Wound.
> 
> Review: the Tornek-Rayville TR-660 - Worn & Wound


I thought the review was a bit quirky, very wordy, meandering in thought, but relatively fair. I do take exception to the comments about the watch not being comfortable on the wrist because I certainly haven’t experienced that neither have I heard those type of comments made by other owners.


----------



## eldasher

That review is okay. Perhaps it’s just me, but I don’t give these sort of reviews any weight. It just as well been a review of a bottle of spring water. “So it comes in a clear plastic bottle. I find the bottle shape pleasing. Opening the cap, there’s a nice click to the cap seal breaking….” 

The production is good. 

W


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## gnosenzo

Y


TheMeasure said:


> It appears to be an updated trident logo from the TR900. You can see it here on those original operating instructions.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I don’t know the backstory of why Allen Tornek or Blancpain chose it. Maybe its ties to Greek Mythology, Poseidon, the sea and ocean? I’m just guessing.


You actually just need to look slightly to the right of the symbol for the answer you seek—it’s a “Low-Mu” symbol, indicating the watch’s nonmagnetic status. In this case, nonmagnetic meaning built to have a low magnetic signature (part of the requirement for that watch driven by Navy EOD), as opposed to the more typical “antimagnetic” or similar descriptions you’ll see of watches that are relatively unaffected by magnetic fields. There’s an example (poorly printed) here on page 47, 3.6.


----------



## at2011

gnosenzo said:


> Y
> 
> You actually just need to look slightly to the right of the symbol for the answer you seek—it’s a “Low-Mu” symbol, indicating the watch’s nonmagnetic status. In this case, nonmagnetic meaning built to have a low magnetic signature (part of the requirement for that watch driven by Navy EOD), as opposed to the more typical “antimagnetic” or similar descriptions you’ll see of watches that are relatively unaffected by magnetic fields. There’s an example (poorly printed) here on page 47, 3.6.


The anti magnetic symbol looks more like an inverted magnet. The Mu symbol looks like a "u" with a straight left line protruding past the bottom curve of the "u" and is more compact and asymmetrical. I think this is just a wave with an arrow pointing downward. Allen Tornek couldn't be that smart.









Sent from my SM-N975U using Tapatalk


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## gnosenzo

I’m


at2011 said:


> The anti magnetic symbol looks more like an inverted magnet. The Mu symbol looks like a "u" with a straight left line protruding past the bottom curve of the "u" and is more compact and asymmetrical. I think this is just a wave with an arrow pointing downward. Allen Tornek couldn't be that smart.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my SM-N975U using Tapatalk


I’m familiar with what Mu looks like. I’m also familiar with what historic and modern “Low Mu” symbols used by Navy EOD look like and that’s absolutely one of them. It doesn’t really matter if Allen Tornek is that smart since it’s a military symbol, not something he designed.


----------



## at2011

gnosenzo said:


> I’m
> 
> I’m familiar with what Mu looks like. I’m also familiar with what historic and modern “Low Mu” symbols used by Navy EOD look like and that’s absolutely one of them. It doesn’t really matter if Allen Tornek is that smart since it’s a military symbol, not something he designed.


I still think it's a wave, otherwise all military watches would've adopted the symbol for antimagnetism for their watches, which has always been an inverted horseshoe magnet. Since the TR is the only milwatch that has it, it's a wave.


----------



## gnosenzo

at2011 said:


> I still think it's a wave, otherwise all military watches would've adopted the symbol for antimagnetism for their watches, which has always been an inverted horseshoe magnet. Since the TR is the only milwatch that has it, it's a wave.


The reason it wasn’t adopted by other watches is because, again, there is a difference between nonmagnetic (Low Mu) as used here and antimagnetic. One is about keeping your watch running on time after exposure to magnetic fields. The other is about not setting off mines you happen to be diving near (low mu). VERY few watches besides the TR-900 have ever been built with that in mind to my knowledge. It is, in my opinion, one of the most unique and fascinating aspects of the history of that watch. But if you want to believe it’s a fancy wave logo, feel free. Just don’t be surprised if you see that same logo scribed on certain other old, specialized military equipment that are neither watches, nor have any affiliation with Tornek.


----------



## at2011

gnosenzo said:


> The reason it wasn’t adopted by other watches is because, again, there is a difference between nonmagnetic (Low Mu) as used here and antimagnetic. One is about keeping your watch running on time after exposure to magnetic fields. The other is about not setting off mines you happen to be diving near (low mu). VERY few watches besides the TR-900 have ever been built with that in mind to my knowledge. It is, in my opinion, one of the most unique and fascinating aspects of the history of that watch. But if you want to believe it’s a fancy wave logo, feel free. Just don’t be surprised if you see that same logo scribed on certain other old, specialized military equipment that are neither watches, nor have any affiliation with Tornek.


But I wasn't talking about "other watches", I was specifically talking about US military watches. If this symbol is standard US military then all US milwatches should have it. I've never seen this logo before on any US military equipment. please show examples of this symbol used in US military applications. Otherwise, it's a wave symbol. Unlike the Brits or the French, US military uses only text on their issued watches. Pretty boring, but it's the same across the board, Hamilton, Elgin, Bulova, Waltham, Marathon, Benrus, Gallet, Stocker & Yale, etc.


----------



## gnosenzo

at2011 said:


> But I wasn't talking about "other watches", I was specifically talking about US military watches. If this symbol is standard US military then all US milwatches should have it. I've never seen this logo before on any US military equipment. please show examples of this symbol used in US military applications. Otherwise, it's a wave symbol. Unlike the Brits or the French, US military uses only text on their issued watches. Pretty boring, but it's the same across the board, Hamilton, Elgin, Bulova, Waltham, Marathon, Benrus, Gallet etc.


It’s not a thing for all US military watches, it’s a specific requirement from Navy EOD.


----------



## at2011

gnosenzo said:


> It’s not a thing for all US military watches, it’s a specific requirement from Navy EOD.


The Blancpain FF is the same exact watch and it doesn't have the wave symbol. Please show us other Navy EOD examples, until then it's a wave symbol.


----------



## gnosenzo

Here’s an example on a later (1980’s) dive regulator’s low-mu marking:










I know what you’re about to say—“That’s an L, not an Arrow! Still a wave logo.” Things change over time, and for a while several such markings were in use. Here’s a clip from MIL-DTL-19595B (I linked to this earlier), which is the military standard for low-Mu equipment:









As you can see, though somewhat poorly printed, it’s a somewhat wavy mu with a downward arrow through it. Sorry that I don’t have a repository of photos of 1960’s EOD equipment on hand.

Oh and here is a link to an article mentioning the fact that regarding magnetic signature requirements: “The watch that was spawned from this contract was the Tornek-Rayville TR-900, a Fifty Fathoms look-alike, although in reality it was quite different. Materials, especially for the case and the movement escapement, were unique and difficult to source.”


----------



## at2011

gnosenzo said:


> Here’s an example on a later (1980’s) dive regulator’s low-mu marking:
> 
> View attachment 16316003
> 
> 
> I know what you’re about to say—“That’s an L, not an Arrow! Still a wave logo.” Things change over time, and for a while several such markings were in use. Here’s a clip from MIL-DTL-19595B (I linked to this earlier), which is the military standard for low-Mu equipment:
> 
> View attachment 16316005
> 
> As you can see, though somewhat poorly printed, it’s a somewhat wavy mu with a downward arrow through it. Sorry that I don’t have a repository of photos of 1960’s EOD equipment on hand.
> 
> Oh and here is a link to an article mentioning the fact that regarding magnetic signature requirements: “The watch that was spawned from this contract was the Tornek-Rayville TR-900, a Fifty Fathoms look-alike, although in reality it was quite different. Materials, especially for the case and the movement escapement, were unique and difficult to source.”


It's not a watch and it doesn't look anything like the TR900 wave logo where the arrow is longer and is drawn from upper right corner to lower left corner. This is an "L" drawn straight and vertical in the middle of a wave. Still not the same unless your vision is impaired. "Things change over time" sure, but show us how by using several examples of this change. Is it even on the spec sheet of the TR900? Cause that would be the best proof.


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## valuewatchguy

FWIW: I've sent a message to Bill Y as to the origins of his logo. I'll comment here with his reply.


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## gnosenzo

at2011 said:


> It's not a watch and it doesn't look anything like the TR900 wave logo where the arrow is longer and is drawn from upper right corner to lower left corner. This is an "L" drawn straight and vertical in the middle of a wave. Still not the same unless your vision is impaired. "Things change over time" sure, but show us how by using several examples of this change. Is it even on the spec sheet of the TR900? Cause that would be the best proof.


Alright, here you go, the best proof I can provide at the moment.

The Tornek-Rayville TR-900 was built to meet the specification MIL-W-22176A (you can find that engraved on the back of the case, and listed on the top of the operating instruction sheet you listed).

If you read MIL-W-22176A, you’ll find the following at bullet point 3.18:









If you would like to read further into MIL-W-22176A, you can find it Here. Sorry that I didn’t have that at the beginning, I wasn’t expecting this to turn into such a debate. In any case, I for one, would love to get back to lovely content of the TR-660 while I anxiously wait for the opportunity to order one of my own.


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## TheMeasure

gnosenzo said:


> Y
> 
> You actually just need to look slightly to the right of the symbol for the answer you seek—it’s a “Low-Mu” symbol….


Ohhh!! I had looked those operating instructions over multiple times. I probably would have never made the connection as I didn’t know what a Low-mu symbol was or had even heard of it before. 

Thanks!

Also I read the Worn & Wound article and they mention it there too.

Cheers!


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## Hogan

Nice that Bill put the low-mu symbol on the clasp...


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## at2011

That's exactly what it is, the symbol for "non-magnetic" showing the arrow and the Mu symbol combined applied to a specific watch built to a definitive set of specifications. Thanks for highlighting that in the spec sheet. It was never a debate, it was more a search for facts. The spec sheet is actually a good read, lots of interesting stuff in it that brought about the creation of the original TR. By the way, Mu is actually an Egyptian hieroglyphic symbol for water. I wouldn't have known.


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## brianmazanec

Belated merry Christmas!









Sent from my SM-G991U using Tapatalk


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## brianmazanec

Festivities continue









Sent from my SM-G991U using Tapatalk


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## TheMeasure




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## valuewatchguy




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## valuewatchguy




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## CarpetRyd

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## valuewatchguy

This is just a quick commentary on these Cheapest Nato Straps ribbed nylon straps. 

These were recently on sale (and still are) between $6 and $8 and honestly they are some of the best values I have found for nylon straps. For all practical puposes they feel the same as the TR oem strap. The TR strap has a much nicer buckle but the keepers look very similar. The TR Strap has been trimmed to be a single pass but that is easily done to the CNS strap. 

I've been wearing the CNS strap for about 1 week straight and at this point it has molded to my wrist. It is no more or less comfortable than the TR strap. The weaves look very similar but not identical. 

With the discounts CNS offers i ordered 6 of these for like $38 delivered to the USA.


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## valuewatchguy




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## brianmazanec

TR in the Gulf of Mexico. First dip in the ocean.






























Sent from my SM-G991U using Tapatalk


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## TheMeasure

brianmazanec said:


> TR in the Gulf of Mexico. First dip in the ocean.


Nice! 
What’s that strap you got on there?


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## brianmazanec

TheMeasure said:


> Nice!
> What’s that strap you got on there?


A Barton Cordura... I got it originally for my paradive but with the taper it looked too small. But better match for the TR. Cordura® Fabric and Silicone Hybrid

Sent from my SM-G991U using Tapatalk


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## brianmazanec

Sunset TR









Sent from my SM-G991U using Tapatalk


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## valuewatchguy




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## DuckaDiesel

Quality is exceptional, very well made watch.
I am impressed.
Beautiful to look at, just not sure it sits well on my wrist, may be too flat. 



















Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


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## boatswain

DuckaDiesel said:


> Quality is exceptional, very well made watch.
> I am impressed.
> Beautiful to look at, just not sure it sits well on my wrist, may be too flat.
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Looks great! Especially on the Erikas


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## Knoc

January 19th 2022 Update-
Next batch coming!


Pre-order will open at 10 am EST on Thursday January 20th. Until then the status on the page linked above will say "Sold Out".
Please select "Free Shipping" at checkout

@boatswain - Im looking at you to get in on this order. Mines slated to ship this week.


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## alas26

DuckaDiesel said:


> Quality is exceptional, very well made watch.
> I am impressed.
> Beautiful to look at, just not sure it sits well on my wrist, may be too flat.
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This looks brilliant on that grey M&N!


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## boatswain

Knoc said:


> January 19th 2022 Update-
> Next batch coming!
> 
> 
> Pre-order will open at 10 am EST on Thursday January 20th. Until then the status on the page linked above will say "Sold Out".
> Please select "Free Shipping" at checkout
> 
> @boatswain - Im looking at you to get in on this order. Mines slated to ship this week.


Ha! 

I was juuust doing a little research…

I don’t have the excuse I did from the original preorder of no real pics available. 

—

Congrats on your heading out soon! 

—-

I’m curious for owners how much lug “float”there is?

I saw one pic where it looks like the case back raise the lugs off the wrist a fair bit…
But that may just be how that person was letting it sit on their wrist. 

Does it sit down snug against the wrist or is the case raised up a fair bit?

Thanks!


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## valuewatchguy

sorry for the dark photo. This is on a roundish 7.25 wrist


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## boatswain

valuewatchguy said:


> View attachment 16377293
> 
> 
> sorry for the dark photo. This is on a roundish 7.25 wrist


Super!

Thanks VWG much appreciated. 

That looks pretty good there.


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## OCDwatchguy

valuewatchguy said:


> View attachment 16373171


What strap is that?


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## OCDwatchguy

What’s the general consensus on which insert is better, aluminum or acrylic?


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## WastedYears

OCDwatchguy said:


> What’s the general consensus on which insert is better, aluminum or acrylic?


It might be difficult getting a consensus on that seeing that there's probably very few people that have both versions to make a comparison, and that personal preference between the two materials in general plays a large role.

In my case I have never been a huge fan of aluminium inserts and I love the 3D look of the numerals in the acrylic insert.


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## valuewatchguy

OCDwatchguy said:


> What strap is that?


Canvas Strap made by dialboliq straps from Germany. I've had it for a few years., This is a better look at it.

good watches come and go but great straps last forever!


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## valuewatchguy

OCDwatchguy said:


> What’s the general consensus on which insert is better, aluminum or acrylic?


I chose acrylic because of the vintagy look to it. That being said it will pick up hairline marks on it sooner. The lume is a cool bonus. I am a fan of aluminum inserts on a lot of watches and could have gone both ways here. ButI'l happy with my choice. In pics I find nothing to complain about with either.


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## VincentG

OCDwatchguy said:


> What’s the general consensus on which insert is better, aluminum or acrylic?


The TR-900 has acrylic so why not stick with that? I do miss this watch even though it never received a whole lot of wrist time.


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## Joe90

Finally on the pre-order, batch #2! 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## 2500M_Sub

Joe90 said:


> Finally on the pre-order, batch #2!
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Congrats, I pre-ordered too. passed on the first batch but could not resist the second time around!

Regards,

Ren


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## mgshoutman

HI all, this week I got an email that a second batch was ready to be ordered. 

Yesterday I actually had one in my basket but hesitated on one detail of the watch that made me empty the basket.

Could someone elaborate on the detail of the water indicator which is not as the original. Why is this done ? Even Bulova did this job with the MIL-SHIPS-W-2181 very well with a functional water indicator in the right design…..

Thanks!


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## ripper

After 46 days in international transit it finally arrived.

Im happy with the quality. Just a quick pic from phone. Will post more in few days.


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## valuewatchguy

mgshoutman said:


> HI all, this week I got an email that a second batch was ready to be ordered.
> 
> Yesterday I actually had one in my basket but hesitated on one detail of the watch that made me empty the basket.
> 
> Could someone elaborate on the detail of the water indicator which is not as the original. Why is this done ? Even Bulova did this job with the MIL-SHIPS-W-2181 very well with a functional water indicator in the right design…..
> 
> Thanks!


No clue why it was left out. Would have been nice but not a deal breaker for me. I think the TR660 looks way better than the Mil-Ships so it was an easy decision for me.


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## mgshoutman

valuewatchguy said:


> No clue why it was left out. Would have been nice but not a deal breaker for me. I think the TR660 looks way better than the Mil-Ships so it was an easy decision for me.












Therefore my interest why the water indicator as with the TR-900 was left out. Blancpain and Bulova did is this aspect a much better job but we may disagree here 

but as you can see the TR is still I my heart


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## reluctantsnowman

On the site, it says shipping date is 1/22/22. Do they actually ship on that date?

Status: 5.0 Preparing for Shipment
Estimated Ship Date: Jan-22-2022


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## Knoc

^ Ive got the same status update as well.


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## TheMeasure

mgshoutman said:


> Could someone elaborate on the detail of the water indicator which is not as the original. Why is this done ? Even Bulova did this job with the MIL-SHIPS-W-2181 very well with a functional water indicator in the right design…..


Here’s the explanation you might be looking for. This is on the Operating Instructions for the TR.


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## ripper

Testing. 
No diving, sking.


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## reluctantsnowman

Its onw, Wohooo


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## ripper




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## TheMeasure




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## boatswain

DuckaDiesel said:


> Quality is exceptional, very well made watch.
> I am impressed.
> Beautiful to look at, just not sure it sits well on my wrist, may be too flat.
> 
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DD

That looks great  especially on the grey Erikas. 

Can you share your wrist size?


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## clouser

DuckaDiesel said:


> Quality is exceptional, very well made watch.
> I am impressed.
> Beautiful to look at, just not sure it sits well on my wrist, may be too flat.
> 
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I forgot I had a grey Erika’s laying around, so I put it on last night.


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## DuckaDiesel

boatswain said:


> DD
> 
> That looks great  especially on the grey Erikas.
> 
> Can you share your wrist size?


7 inch wrist but very flat and somewhat skinny. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


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## boatswain

DuckaDiesel said:


> 7 inch wrist but very flat and somewhat skinny.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


Thanks!


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## TheMeasure




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## ripper

@TheMeasure this is cool!


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## TheMeasure

ripper said:


> @TheMeasure this is cool!


Really great shots man!! Nicely done.


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## brianmazanec

New strap









Sent from my SM-G991U using Tapatalk


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## Knoc




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## TheMeasure

Found this on IG and figured it would be appreciated here. I have no affiliation with the account just thought it was cool to share. The account is captured in the screen shot and I grabbed the caption. 

If you go to “handwoundautomatic” page he’s got even more photos. The mod looks very well done.


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## WastedYears

I can count on one hand the number of times where a stranger commented on my watch. Most of the time it's because I'm wearing a Rolex, or something that looks like a Rolex.

But this morning while having a coffee outside a bakery with my buddy, a guy with his lady friend passed us and did a double take when he saw the TR-660 on my wrist. He actually knew it was the re-issue and was quite excited to catch one in the wild. We had a quick talk about price and availability, I let him handle the watch and commented on his 39mm Explorer and they went on their way.


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## TheMeasure

WastedYears said:


> I can count on one hand the number of times where a stranger commented on my watch. Most of the time it's because I'm wearing a Rolex, or something that looks like a Rolex.
> 
> But this morning while having a coffee outside a bakery with my buddy, a guy with his lady friend passed us and did a double take when he saw the TR-660 on my wrist. He actually knew it was the re-issue and was quite excited to catch one in the wild. We had a quick talk about price and availability, I let him handle the watch and commented on his 39mm Explorer and they went on their way.


That’s pretty cool. The odds of someone even recognizing the TR and knowing it was the re-issue is crazy. Especially as a random encounter in public.


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## WastedYears

TheMeasure said:


> That’s pretty cool. The odds of someone even recognizing the TR and knowing it was the re-issue is crazy. Especially as a random encounter in public.


Agreed. Where there not the "guy code" preventing us men from bromancing strangers, I would have set up a play date to compare watches then and there


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## TheMeasure

Assessment of the TR-660. It’s worth a read. 









SWIMPRUF | Jason Heaton | Substack


Adventures: underwater, topside, and in the armchair. Click to read SWIMPRUF, by Jason Heaton, a Substack publication with thousands of readers.




swimpruf.substack.com





Just click the “let me read it first”. I didn’t have to create a profile or subscribe.


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## boatswain

Saw ABTW also has a review up.


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## Ryanonarcher

will be headed to the alchemist relumer in short order…


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## OCDwatchguy

Ryanonarcher said:


> View attachment 16517819
> 
> will be headed to the alchemist relumer in short order…


What relume do you do you have in mind?


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## Ryanonarcher

OCDwatchguy said:


> What relume do you do you have in mind?


I am drawn to the exact look as posted above a few posts


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## Ryanonarcher




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## antitesis




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## steveb7az

Is it just me or are the few TR660s that pop up in the sales forum all acrylic? Anyone time I've looked in that section of the forum or even on Watch Recon the only TR660s for sale are acrylic.


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## dt75

I just got a TR-660. I'm considering an upgrade to a ETA 2824. I understand the hour and minute have should fit but the second hand will need modifications to make a bigger hole. Anyone else considered doing this?


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## VincentG

I would not consider it an "upgrade" unless you plan to use a 2824 chronometer grade, the NE 15/6r15 is a great movement imo and can be professionally regulated to very nice spd.


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## dt75

VincentG said:


> I would not consider it an "upgrade" unless you plan to use a 2824 chronometer grade, the NE 15/6r15 is a great movement imo and can be professionally regulated to very nice spd.


Fair point. I just think a 28800 best rate would look buttery smooth on this watch.


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## Darwin

dt75 said:


> Fair point. I just think a 28800 best rate would look buttery smooth on this watch.


True... but the watch it pays homage to had a movement that ran at 18000 bph!


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## dt75

Darwin said:


> True... but the watch it pays homage to had a movement that ran at 18000 bph!


Another fair point. I think I'll keep it as is, thank you.


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## Jarett

Hello guys, a small question please. How many TR-660 watches have been produced so far?


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## VincentG

Jarett said:


> Hello guys, a small question please. How many TR-660 watches have been produced so far?


Im am just guessing but with plank holders and everything 2500-3000.


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