# Best bang for buck ABC watch?



## diulastar (Feb 21, 2009)

I mainly came over to this forum to check about the Timex Ironman but it has come to my attention that some of these newer age digital watches are capable of a lot of cool things.

What's the best value for an ABC watch?


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## grinning (Apr 5, 2009)

right now, highgear altis, bought from campmor.com.


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## Mystro (Oct 26, 2008)

Highgear Altis. Always was even at full price.:-!


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## ghound79 (Jul 15, 2009)

I like the Casio PAG 80. Great watch with alot of features.


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## jnewell (Jul 19, 2007)

Altis Ti from Campmor. 2nd choice, PAG40 from Costco if the $80 sale is still on.


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## diulastar (Feb 21, 2009)

Not gonna lie, the Altis looks plain boring from an aesthetic standpoint.

What's the difference between say, the PAG80 and the PAG40 mentioned in this thread?


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## ghound79 (Jul 15, 2009)

diulastar said:


> Not gonna lie, the Altis looks plain boring from an aesthetic standpoint.
> 
> What's the difference between say, the PAG80 and the PAG40 mentioned in this thread?


PAG 80 has solar power not batteries like the PAG 40. Display is a tad different. I have both and like them. I prefer thePAG 80 for field use as hate to get stuck out in the woods and need batteries.


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## Queen6 (Aug 2, 2006)

Best technical/field ABC Timex WS4 puts many far more expensive ABC watches to shame, extremely accurate field tool makes few compromise from it`s intended purpose.

Best all round sports orientated ABC Highgear Altis or Casio PRW-1300 (Casio`s new PRW-2000 is a better watch, only the 1300 can be found with better discounts) either can be used as a daily wearer with ease.

Most durable Casio PRG-80 large extremely durable, verging on G-Shock survivability.









Q-6


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## DragonJade (May 14, 2007)

I would say a Casio 1300: ABC + solar + atomic. Can't beat it for the price.


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## BenL (Oct 1, 2008)

There's no compass, but I thought I'd throw the G-Shock Riseman (GW-9200) in the mix.


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## Urashima Taro (Oct 21, 2009)

I know that the OP has made up his mind but for future reference to this post I would recommend the Tech4o line:

Trail Leader 1, 2 or Pro:

Trail Leader 1 - US$114 (Amazon.com as of Nov 2009)









Trail Leader 2 - US$104 (Amazon.com as of Nov 2009)









Trail Leader Pro - US$165 (Amazon.com as of Nov 2009)









All of them pack much instruments into that "tiny" form that it is the closest we have to a Star Trek Tricoder in this century! Here is a list of what they can do:

*Trail Leader 1 and 2 Features*

Trail Leader Speed & Distance Mode:

* Speed
* Distance
* Pace (min/mile)
* Calories
* Steps
* Exercise/moving time
* Fully Adjustable Personal Profile
* 10 day memory

Trail Leader Digital Compass Mode:

* 1° increment resolution
* Adjustable declination
* Bearing Lock
* Reverse Bearing
* Distortion warning

Trail Leader Altimeter Mode:

* Current Altitude
* Altimeter Lock
* Reference Altitude
* Altitude Alarms
* 48hr Altitude Graph
* 24hr max + min altitude
* Altitude Difference Calculator
* Total Ascent
* Total Descent

Trail Leader Barometer Mode:

* Current Pressure
* Barometer Lock
* Pressure adjustment
* 48hr Pressure Graph
* Current Temperature
* 24hr max + min temperature and pressure
* Weather Forecaster

Time, Date, Day, 2 Alarms, 50lap Chronograph, 6 Timers, Dual Time Zone, Stainless steel construction and recessed lens are designed for the long haul

*Trail Leader Pro Features*

Trail Leader Pro Speed & Distance Mode:

* Speed
* Distance
* Pace (min/mile)
* Calories
* Steps
* Exercise/moving time
* Fully Adjustable Personal Profile
* 10 day memory

Trail Leader Pro Digital Compass Mode:

* 1° increment resolution
* Adjustable declination
* Bearing Lock
* Reverse Bearing
* Distortion warning

Trail Leader Pro Altimeter Mode:

* Current Altitude
* Altimeter Lock
* Reference Altitude
* Altitude Alarms
* 48hr Altitude Graph
* 24hr max + min altitude
* Altitude Difference Calculator
* Total Ascent
* Total Descent

Trail Leader Pro Barometer Mode:

* Current Pressure
* Barometer Lock
* Pressure adjustment
* 48hr Pressure Graph
* Current Temperature
* 24hr max + min temperature and pressure
* Weather Forecaster

Time, Date, Day, 2 Alarms, 50 lap Chronograph, 6 Timers, Dual Time Zone, Temperature, CDT, 2.4Ghz HRM, PC Link Capability, Stainless steel construction and recessed lens are designed for the long haul

All of this for less than two Benjis! Now, nothing is perfect in life so what is the drawback? The drawback is that these guys are not G-Shocks, Pathfinder or even Core material in the sense of being water proof to maybe no more than 50m but they are designated as water resistant (so some light rain, hand washing and human sweat). The module is the mecca if only we could just find a way to fit it inside a G-Shock suit!!!

Here is an actual picture from WUS member "Chucky":










I would say that if a Suunto Core and/or a Highgear Altis is not for you because of price or lack of features then try these guys out.

Kind regards,

Urashima Taro


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## Isthmus (Feb 13, 2006)

ghound79 said:


> PAG 80 has solar power not batteries like the PAG 40. Display is a tad different. I have both and like them. I prefer thePAG 80 for field use as hate to get stuck out in the woods and need batteries.


Solars still use batteries.


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## Urashima Taro (Oct 21, 2009)

Isthmus said:


> Solars still use batteries.


That is correct! But they are re-chargeable batteries that are said to last about 20 years. The price premium on solar Casio watches may not justify it since Casio themselves are adding 10 year batteries on some of their watches that do not consume much power. Eitherway, it is nice to know that with Solar watches you will not worry of the battery dying with a need to replace it at the most inopportune time.

Kind regards,

Urashima Taro


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## ghound79 (Jul 15, 2009)

Urashima Taro said:


> That is correct! But they are re-chargeable batteries that are said to last about 20 years. The price premium on solar Casio watches may not justify it since Casio themselves are adding 10 year batteries on some of their watches that do not consume much power. Eitherway, it is nice to know that with Solar watches you will not worry of the battery dying with a need to replace it at the most inopportune time.
> 
> Kind regards,
> 
> Urashima Taro


Correct hard to find them in the woods.


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## duke4c (Feb 12, 2006)

Urashima Taro said:


> That is correct! But they are re-chargeable batteries that are said to last about 20 years. The price premium on solar Casio watches may not justify it since Casio themselves are adding 10 year batteries on some of their watches that do not consume much power. Eitherway, it is nice to know that with Solar watches you will not worry of the battery dying with a need to replace it at the most inopportune time.
> 
> Kind regards,
> 
> Urashima Taro


Not a problem with any Suunto. Before a trip simply invest about 50 cent in a battery and change it yourself. It requiers 0 knowlege about watches and it takes roughly 15-30 sec.

Once you do that you just know that you're good for at least a year or so.

Plus I think that altris (and it's clones including St.Moritz) also have user replacable batteries.

This technology alone makes "solar" a bit of a mute point where I even wonder "why bother with solar?".

But that's just my oppinion.

SIDENOTE: Casio can claim whatever they want. However truth remains that no Li based rechargable batteries is made to last longer than 10 years. Actually anything over 3 to 5 is quite amazing. Once 5 year is up ability to recharge dramatically decreases. Take a look at your cell phone, cordless phone or any other device that uses rechargable batteries... they're all supposed to last "forever" but we all know that this is far from truth... while one can argue that watches do not spend all that much power I like to think that this is far from truth especally considering power hungry features of atomic ABC watch.

Cheers


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## Queen6 (Aug 2, 2006)

duke4c said:


> Not a problem with any Suunto. Before a trip simply invest about 50 cent in a battery and change it yourself. It requiers 0 knowlege about watches and it takes roughly 15-30 sec.
> 
> Once you do that you just know that you're good for at least a year or so.
> 
> ...


Agreed, changing the cell is a relatively easy task, and solar equally offers some real world advantage and disadvantage; 
I have one PRG-80 from 2005 and it has been through the long dark winters of north west and eastern China, deep cold of Mongolia to the heat of the Middle East and the battery shows no signs of degrading in comparison to it`s much newer brother the PRG-80YT. On the other hand when the cell does give up, the watch will become dead weight in the field environment, although I rather think the warning signs will be obvious well before that point.








PRG-80L-2VDR Auto EL, hourly signal & alarm have been on since 05 and still going strong, it`s been stripped & cleaned a couple of times to remove the gunk, however the case has never been opened |>

How long the cell will last in the solar powered Protrek`s is undeterminable due to too many variables, certainly five years is a minimum, let`s see if someone asks again in another five to ten ;-)

just a final note; I believe the cell in the Protrek`s is a capacitor as opposed to a rechargeable battery and it`s lifecycle is therefore much longer.

Q-6


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## duke4c (Feb 12, 2006)

Queen6 said:


> Agreed, changing the cell is a relatively easy task, and solar equally offers some real world advantage and disadvantage;
> I have one PRG-80 from 2005 and it has been through the long dark winters of north west and eastern China, deep cold of Mongolia to the heat of the Middle East and the battery shows no signs of degrading in comparison to it`s much newer brother the PRG-80YT. On the other hand when the cell does give up, the watch will become dead weight in the field environment, although I rather think the warning signs will be obvious well before that point.
> 
> 
> ...


There was quite a bit of discussion about this on G-Shock forum way back. General concensus seem to be (and biggest criticism of Casio in general) is their decision to change battery type in newer models.

Older solar models have way bigger battery than need be. They took forever to charge and same for discharge. As advantage there were quite a few examples of original RISEMAN dating back to 1998 still going strong today but this was mostly atributed to oversized battery.

Newer models have much smaller battery and some question ability of this cell to sustain charge after 10 year period. Will it work or not this really remains to be seen.


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## Valynor (Aug 9, 2009)

duke4c said:


> SIDENOTE: Casio can claim whatever they want. However truth remains that no Li based rechargable batteries is made to last longer than 10 years. Actually anything over 3 to 5 is quite amazing. Once 5 year is up ability to recharge dramatically decreases. Take a look at your cell phone, cordless phone or any other device that uses rechargable batteries... they're all supposed to last "forever" but we all know that this is far from truth... while one can argue that watches do not spend all that much power I like to think that this is far from truth especally considering power hungry features of atomic ABC watch.


This is not correct.
The cells used for solar watches are made of a completely different chemistry than your usual Lithium-Ion cellphone packs. They have in common that they both use Lithium and that's about where the similarity ends.

Here's just a little overview over some Lithium-based batteries: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lithium_battery#Chemistries
Most of them have vastly different specifications.

-Valynor


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## Urashima Taro (Oct 21, 2009)

duke4c said:


> Not a problem with any Suunto. Before a trip simply invest about 50 cent in a battery and change it yourself. It requiers 0 knowlege about watches and it takes roughly 15-30 sec.
> 
> Once you do that you just know that you're good for at least a year or so.
> 
> ...


Hello duke4c,

Thank you for providing your perspective. I agree with some of what you state in your post but not everything. Yes, the replacement of batteries on those specific models that you mention are easy and economical but you missed my point. These watches are designed to be used outdoors and usually there are no ideal place or moment to change them if you go out in the "wild" like I have done in rain forests of South and Central America where it rains most of the time and conditions are not too friendly. For the regular Joe out there at a short hike or swim this would be easy but not all conditions are the same. I am not against interchangeable battery watches, I own a couple, but each watch has a purpose in mind and that is why I have the collection. Hope you understand, if not I am fine with having different opinions.

My kindest regards,

Urashima Taro


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## Urashima Taro (Oct 21, 2009)

Queen6 said:


> PRG-80L-2VDR Auto EL, hourly signal & alarm have been on since 05 and still going strong, it`s been stripped & cleaned a couple of times to remove the gunk, however the case has never been opened |>


Hello Q-6,

Wow! That is a beautiful specimen that you posted here. How did you make it look showroom new? What did you strip out without the opening the case? Sir, you have a very good watch there.

Kind regards,

Urashima Taro


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## Queen6 (Aug 2, 2006)

Urashima Taro said:


> Hello Q-6,
> 
> Wow! That is a beautiful specimen that you posted here. How did you make it look showroom new? What did you strip out without the opening the case? Sir, you have a very good watch there.
> 
> ...


Easy old toothbrush, liquid soap and warm water, just removed the metal covers, end pieces and strap, this pictures a couple of years old now and the blue PRG is still holding up well. the Protreks`s are generally very resilient and tend to hide wear and tear very well.

The biggest problem with wear on the 80 is if the black hard coating on the bezel gets damaged, it`s very resistant to abrasion, however it wont stand up to being ground up against hard surfaces. The strap in time will also break down shedding its outer layers, it does take several years of continuous wear for this to happen, and can be replaced relatively easily.

I have used the PRG-80 in the field since it`s release and now have three, so they tend to get rotated, although the one most worn now is a modified PRG-80YT, on divers Strap this lets me wear the watch over jackets etc with ease and is a very robust solution.

PRG-80 on 24mm Hirsch "Extreme" natural rubber dive strap

























I did the mod initially for practical reasons as I don't wear watches on bracelet in the field for practical and safety reasons, and needed a strap long enough to wear over cold weather gear etc. Aesthetically the heavy duty dive strap is a perfect match for the all black Protrek and is #1 of #4 that I know to have been converted.

I would recommend a PRG-80 as a field watch to one and all, they are easy to read, set up, and live with. My assignments generally last for 2-3 years and an be in some pretty extreme conditions; 100% humidity of the sub tropics to less than 10% humidity in the western deserts of China, deep cold of north eastern China/Mongolia to the searing heat and UV of the Middle East. The only climate my ABC`s have not been exposed to is the polar regions. Here in Qatar it`s nothing to have a temperature differential of >25C (77F) between the heavily AC indoors to the outside world.

Sadly Casio does not does not develop individual models and is drifting to less field focused ABC`s. The PRG-80 is now a five year old design and very much superseded by far more technical & accurate ABC`s with greater functionality offered by the competition. The Timex WS4 is now my primary field ABC with the PRG-80 as a backup. I still rate the 80 as one of, if not the most durable ABC on the market, and this alone will always ensure it`s use.

Q-6


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## duke4c (Feb 12, 2006)

Urashima Taro said:


> Hello duke4c,
> 
> Thank you for providing your perspective. I agree with some of what you state in your post but not everything. Yes, the replacement of batteries on those specific models that you mention are easy and economical but you missed my point. These watches are designed to be used outdoors and usually there are no ideal place or moment to change them if you go out in the "wild" like I have done in rain forests of South and Central America where it rains most of the time and conditions are not too friendly. For the regular Joe out there at a short hike or swim this would be easy but not all conditions are the same. I am not against interchangeable battery watches, I own a couple, but each watch has a purpose in mind and that is why I have the collection. Hope you understand, if not I am fine with having different opinions.
> 
> ...


I actually do understand and I have no problem with it.

Same as you I was marely providing different perspective on things.

That's why we have different options when we purchase our next watch.

Every technology has it's own pluses and minuses. When choosing which one to purchase one has to be aware of all "angles" and make an educated decision what to go with.

All in all different perspectives as "cool" and so are the choices. After all fun is in the "hunt" (in other words searching and reading about your next purchase). ;-)

Cheers :-!


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## Cussler (Dec 16, 2009)

Just pulled the trigger o PRG40 MO3 (rubber strap) Hope I'll like it


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## JERSTERCA (Apr 4, 2008)

Cussler said:


> Just pulled the trigger o PRG40 MO3 (rubber strap) Hope I'll like it


Lots hear say is has one of the clearest screens out there. I just noticed amazon does not have there black and white PRG40 guess they sold out.

Dont forget we like photos post some after you get it


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## Queen6 (Aug 2, 2006)

JERSTERCA said:


> Lots hear say is has one of the clearest screens out there. I just noticed amazon does not have there black and white PRG40 guess they sold out.
> 
> Dont forget we like photos post some after you get it


True the 40 has one of the highest contrast levels you will find on a digital, most likely due to it`s large power source (4X replaceable SR927W batteries). This makes the watch extremely readable in virtually all conditions, and it is a duplex display.









Q-6


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## Cussler (Dec 16, 2009)

PRG40 my vote... Snatched one yesterday for $80..


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## JERSTERCA (Apr 4, 2008)

Queen6 said:


> True the 40 has one of the highest contrast levels you will find on a digital, most likely due to it`s large power source (4X replaceable SR927W batteries). This makes the watch extremely readable in virtually all conditions, and it is a duplex display.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Hey Q-6 have you replaced batteries in yours yet. :think: I saw some photos that made it look easy but thats not always the case. I know these are the best value and I really like all the info on the main screen.


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## Queen6 (Aug 2, 2006)

JERSTERCA said:


> Hey Q-6 have you replaced batteries in yours yet. :think: I saw some photos that made it look easy but thats not always the case. I know these are the best value and I really like all the info on the main screen.


Nope, still going strong. I dont see it being a big problem, and there is plenty of info out on the 40.

Q-6


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## jumpinjack (May 8, 2009)

Q6..............Just love that Ti PRG40 model. It gets in my rotation quite frequently! Merry Christmas!:-!


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## jefrox (May 18, 2009)

*my vote b-)

Happy Holidays folks!*








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## wave180 (Oct 7, 2009)

^Nice!


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## kiwiiniraq (Dec 26, 2009)

where do I buy this prg with the black resin strap????


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## Queen6 (Aug 2, 2006)

kiwiiniraq said:


> where do I buy this prg with the black resin strap????


Welcome and heres the answer in this post PRG-80YT Strap Conversion, only four exist that we know of, this being #1

PRG-80YT-1VDR on 24mm Hirsch "Extreme" natural rubber dive strap

































Q-6


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## kiwiiniraq (Dec 26, 2009)

Thanks Q6, much appreciated. Next question....where do I get the black face PRG-80??? Every one I have seen has the grey face...need the black! Was sold 2 days ago on the all black suunto....not now!


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## Queen6 (Aug 2, 2006)

kiwiiniraq said:


> Thanks Q6, much appreciated. Next question....where do I get the black face PRG-80??? Every one I have seen has the grey face...need the black! Was sold 2 days ago on the all black suunto....not now!


That`s going to very much depend on your location, I would start by looking at Casio.com and see if the PRG-80YT is released in your region.

If not then you will need to buy one online, they should be priced around $220 - $240, Singapore is often a good source for good deals on PRG`s.

If you are looking for a negative (black) Casio look for the PRW-1300Y (PRG-110Y) or the new 
PR-1500Y (PRG-130Y) the 80 is positive only (grey), just remember the negative display`s are far less readable in lowlight conditions.

PRG`s do not have "Atomic" clock reception and as a rule can be found with better pricing.

Q-6


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## Urashima Taro (Oct 21, 2009)

Another "Best-bang-for-the-buck" ABC watch is the:

Weather Master VII (picture by WUS - Catch22):









which can also go by the name of:

Dakota Weather Master V









Marathon Adanac Navigator II:









Canyon CNS-SW3 Ski Master:









The "Swiss Made A-B-C-T Movement" put together by VTrek for all of these ABC watches is at par of the likes of High gear Altis, Suunto and Timex WS4 at a decent price of around US$100.

Kind regards,

Urashima Taro


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## sharper (Nov 3, 2009)

Queen6 said:


> I did the mod initially for practical reasons as I don't wear watches on bracelet in the field for practical and safety reasons, and needed a strap long enough to wear over cold weather gear etc.
> 
> Q-6


I sometimes wear my watch over my jacket during snow sports as well, curious as to the safety reasons of wearing a watch on a bracelet.


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## Queen6 (Aug 2, 2006)

sharper said:


> I sometimes wear my watch over my jacket during snow sports as well, curious as to the safety reasons of wearing a watch on a bracelet.


A bracelet is far more likely to cut into the flesh if you get hung up on it or it`s fowled in machinery, they are more complex to release and the likes of "Tri fold" clasps quickly deform locking them in place. Bracelets are conductive and those that work with high voltage equipment and or areas are simply adding to any risk by wearing them in these situations. A strap can be cut easily by anyone in the event of an emergency, with a bracelet you will be waiting for the emergency services to release you potentially aggravating any injury.

Unfortunately although infrequent it does happen people are needlessly injured in the workplace, and or the field due to bracelets jewellery etc. Most don't think about it until it`s too late, something as innocuous as a new watch can very quickly change your way of life in the wrong circumstance, rings being a prime example. Certainly in my industry the wearing of jewellery, metal banded watches etc is at very least frowned upon or simply banned.

18 years with the military and 10 in Oil & Gas, I have seen my fair share of incidents and unfortunately accidents, so the question is why put yourself in harms way, the risk may be very low however the consequences can be very high :think:

Straps will always be preferable for field work, and more so with ABC`s (accurate temperature measurement) as you have the freedom to strap the watch over cold weather gear, or on your kit.

Q-6


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## JERSTERCA (Apr 4, 2008)

Queen6 said:


> A bracelet is far more likely to cut into the flesh if you get hung up on it or it`s fowled in machinery, they are more complex to release and the likes of "Tri fold" clasps quickly deform locking them in place. Bracelets are conductive and those that work with high voltage equipment and or areas are simply adding to any risk by wearing them in these situations. A strap can be cut easily by anyone in the event of an emergency, with a bracelet you will be waiting for the emergency services to release you potentially aggravating any injury.
> 
> Unfortunately although infrequent it does happen people are needlessly injured in the workplace, and or the field due to bracelets jewellery etc. Most don't think about it until it`s too late, something as innocuous as a new watch can very quickly change your way of life in the wrong circumstance, rings being a prime example. Certainly in my industry the wearing of jewellery, metal banded watches etc is at very least frowned upon or simply banned.
> 
> ...


I did that a couple of weeks ago in Las Vegas when I wanted to check the temperature. I just put my Rriseman on my camera strap and watched it go from a low of 37 degrees at 7 am up to a warm 51 :-d:-d I was freezing. Thats not too cold for a lot of folks but for a So Cal native I was cold. I was dressed correctly, until my wife asked me to give her my coat o|


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## sharper (Nov 3, 2009)

Thanks for the answer Queen6 :-!


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## Queen6 (Aug 2, 2006)

sharper said:


> Thanks for the answer Queen6 :-!


Your welcome, it`s a free world and we all make our own choices in life, however if the post raises people`s awareness it`s only a good thing.

Q-6


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## isometrus (Apr 29, 2010)

Canyon Weathermaster CNS-SW7


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## leaningtower (Mar 31, 2010)

Thank you Isometrus! I just placed an order on the Canyon CNS-SW7 Weather Master. I would like to thank also Cal..45, for his great reviews on the Weather Master. He has the negative display version, but the module is exactly the same. These watches are a steal, compared to prices of the most famous ABC brands. |>


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## BenL (Oct 1, 2008)

Probably the Pathfinder PAW1300.


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