# Any interest in an MKII made professional field watch of a different sort? [Long Post]



## nyc_paramedic

Trying to gauge any interest in the following; comments, suggestions, and constructive criticism is appreciated. Sorry for the long winded preface.

My foray into watches began roughly thirteen years ago, when I first started working in the emergency medical services, circa 1996. I don't remember the exact circumstances, but the watch I ended up purchasing just prior to entering the academy was a Tag Heuer F1 Formula One. These were quite popular at the time. They were available in different colors, with stainless steel or synthetic nylon (colors as well) straps, sapphire crystal, synthetic nylon bezel, and stainless steel case with screw down back. The crown was not a screw down. At the time, I don't think I paid more than $250 USD for it new. My particular piece stood up to substantial amounts work abuse over the next ten years, was very accurate with its ETA quartz movement, and the battery lasted almost three years between changes. My complaints were few and relatively minor: I almost lost the watch on a few calls from the spring bars popping off; the crown was not a screw down and I didn't trust getting the watch very wet; for a 38mm(?) watch the face was very small and sometime hard to read at times.

After the watch finally stopped working properly after ten years I began researching for its replacement; learning that Tag had discontinued the classic F1. I learned a bit about watches after researching many brands: quartz vs. automatic; acrylic vs. sapphire; fixed bars or spring bars, etc.

I wanted a watch that was tough, accurate, legible under many conditions, had fixed bars, and most importantly that it be of a smaller size (39mm?) and had a slimmer profile. Several models were quite close but not what I specifically looking for.

Bell & Ross Type Demineur: (https://www.watchuseek.com/showthread.php?t=180681) was a good candidate. There were no fixed bars, although the earlier Sinn branded models did have that. I really did appreciate it's smaller size; the watch was very comfortable when I did try one on. Seemed that the snag factor was quite low. The dial was very utilitarian and legible. I also the appreciated the fact that the battery for that particular movement _(ETA_ 955.612) was good for 7 years. I was suspect of it's very high MSRP and upon further research I realized that B&R is really a marketing and not a watch company. I believe B&R is currently asking over $1000 USD for this model.

Marathon Navigator: This little plastic watch was very comfortable to wear at work. I happen to pick one up new on eBay for a very fair price. This piece doesn't seem much smaller that my MKII Blackwater, but I noticed that it's not as tall and hence feels less bulky on the wrist. I also felt as if the fixed bars somehow made the watch wear better on my wrist as compared to others with spring bars. The tritium vials were very nice, especially when working the night tour. The most accurate watch that I have had lately. After being tossed in a drawer for over a year the watch only gained 10 seconds. The rest of the watch seemed kinda cheap though. The snap on back and the cheap no screw down brass crown --which lost all it's black color after only several months of wear-- did not inspire any confidence for long term wear.

MKII Blackwater: This is the watch that I am currently wearing (for 2 years?) after deciding that the Navigator would not be a long term durable watch. I had been following the Blackwater since its inception and thus, was very disappointed when I found out that the fixed bars option was going to be abandoned. But the watch presented and enormous value for the workmanship offered. The case seems bulletproof, the curved domed crystal is beautiful, and the sterile dial options were invaluable for a true professional work watch. My complaints are minor but no less irritating: I have popped off the spring bars on more than one occasion; the watch is thicker and taller than I would have liked for my medium sized wrist; I have to re-set the time every three to four weeks because the movement isn't as accurate as a quartz.

So, is there any interest in a new MKII professional field watch that isn't necessarily based on a previous military design and/or a huge chunk of a metal dive watch? Perhaps what a current standards military issue watch really should be?

Suggestions:

39mm-40mm diameter and a low profile design
Precision quartz with long battery life and end-of-battery indicator
Fixed or screw bars
Sterile dial 
Screw down crown and back
Sapphire crystal
Pre-assembled for low cost.

Perhaps the watch could come pre-assembled from Switzerland with only one set (determined by the MKII community) of dial and hands.

Then again, maybe no one cares for such a piece. Any cooments would be appreciated. Thanks for reading.


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## Steve356

I am not sure exactly what type of watch you are proposing here  you'll have to be a little more specific on the style . 
some comments on the other watches you listed:

Bell & Ross Type Demineur: (https://www.watchuseek.com/showthread.php?t=180681) was a good candidate. There were no fixed bars, although the earlier Sinn branded models did have that. I really did appreciate it's smaller size; the watch was very comfortable when I did try one on. Seemed that the snag factor was quite low. The dial was very utilitarian and legible. I also the appreciated the fact that the battery for that particular movement _(ETA_ 955.612) was good for 7 years. I was suspect of it's very high MSRP and upon further research I realized that B&R is really a marketing and not a watch company. I believe B&R is currently asking over $1000 USD for this model.
-----------
you can buy a used one for half that or a little more. It's a very nice watch from a very good company. It is certainly not just a marketing company(whatever that means, what would you call MKII then?). They design the watches and manufacture them in their own factory in Switzerland. Sinn made early models did not have fixed bars. spring bars only. the MSRP is high because B&R is a high end company. it is no more expensive than a quartz watch from other Swiss brands like Breitling or Omega.

Marathon Navigator: This little plastic watch was very comfortable to wear at work. I happen to pick one up new on eBay for a very fair price. This piece doesn't seem much smaller that my MKII Blackwater, but I noticed that it's not as tall and hence feels less bulky on the wrist. I also felt as if the fixed bars somehow made the watch wear better on my wrist as compared to others with spring bars. The tritium vials were very nice, especially when working the night tour. The most accurate watch that I have had lately. After being tossed in a drawer for over a year the watch only gained 10 seconds. The rest of the watch seemed kinda cheap though. The snap on back and the cheap no screw down brass crown --which lost all it's black color after only several months of wear-- did not inspire any confidence for long term wear.
------
this was also made in steel.

MKII Blackwater: This is the watch that I am currently wearing (for 2 years?) after deciding that the Navigator would not be a long term durable watch. I had been following the Blackwater since its inception and thus, was very disappointed when I found out that the fixed bars option was going to be abandoned. But the watch presented and enormous value for the workmanship offered. The case seems bulletproof, the curved domed crystal is beautiful, and the sterile dial options were invaluable for a true professional work watch. My complaints are minor but no less irritating: I have popped off the spring bars on more than one occasion; the watch is thicker and taller than I would have liked for my medium sized wrist;
-------
wow, you must really be tough on your watch if the full size spring bars keep breaking on you. try the single shoulder spring bars from countycomm from the Marathon SAR model.

I doubt a smaller quartz watch will be made in the future as there's probably not too much interest. 
Look at timefactors.com PRS-17 model. it's 38mm and available as both quartz and automatic. nice and legible.


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## Yao

*I guess we will see if there are any other interest...*

doing a quartz watch is something that I had in mind and working with some "pros" to develop a watch was also something that I am interested in. Let me know if you have a case style in mind. It doesn't have to be exact.

I am familiar with the B&R watch....if it makes any difference to you Cartier owns a good chunk of the company now and B&R does have its own facilities now in Switzerland. They aren't the private label/marketing company that they started off as.

BTW nice to see you here.


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## heb

*The "Reactor" watch company already makes your type of watch*

Hello,

Check them out.

heb


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## bigal

*Interesting...*

I for one would be interested in exploring a MKII quartz model. I have both autos and quartz in my collection and enjoy wearing both.


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## nyc_paramedic

Steve356 said:


> I am not sure exactly what type of watch you are proposing here  you'll have to be a little more specific on the style .
> some comments on the other watches you listed:
> 
> Bell & Ross Type Demineur...
> 
> you can buy a used one for half that or a little more. It's a very nice watch from a very good company. It is certainly not just a marketing company(whatever that means, what would you call MKII then?). They design the watches and manufacture them in their own factory in Switzerland. Sinn made early models did not have fixed bars. spring bars only. the MSRP is high because B&R is a high end company. it is no more expensive than a quartz watch from other Swiss brands like Breitling or Omega.


Specifics? I didn't have anything set in stone. I was trying to see if there _any _interest in a MKII quartz amongst the community.

But in a sentence: a true tool watch; accurate long lasting quartz movement; fixed or screw pins; screw down crown and back; medium sized with a slim no snag design. Affordable for field personell would be a plus, i.e., medics, firefighters, UPS, FedEX, and especially military.

As far as B&R, they market, advertise, and promote their watches very heavily. These costs get passed on to the consumer. Slick marketing companies try to evoke an experience with their consumer, much like B&R does with their grand pictures of air force pilots. I feel MKII is much more direct and in touch with what their buyers want. The fact that Bill offers sterile dials (no big ampersands!) is a testament to this. And I misspoke about the earlier Sinn models having fixed bars; someone mentioned that it was really screw bars, but if that's not the case either then I wouldn't even want one used. And I really do think that over $1000 for that particular quartz model is way too much money.

The way I see it, someone who has the money will pay the money for the B&R to have the "experience" of wearing a tool watch. The MKII will be purchased by folks who really need a serious tool watch at honest price. I could understand if you disagree.



Steve356 said:


> Marathon Navigator...
> ------
> this was also made in steel.


 The key word here is *was*. It also did not offer a screw down crown or back.



Steve356 said:


> MKII Blackwater...
> wow, you must really be tough on your watch if the full size spring bars keep breaking on you. try the single shoulder spring bars from countycomm from the Marathon SAR model.


Well, yes. The work is rough, tough, and very dirty at times. But I also have co-workers who bust up watches _all_ the time. So it's not that I'm clumsy, it's just the nature of the job.



Steve356 said:


> I doubt a smaller quartz watch will be made in the future as there's probably not too much interest.
> Look at timefactors.com PRS-17 model. it's 38mm and available as both quartz and automatic. nice and legible.


Well, that's why I posted. To see if I got any replies. I guess the community will speak up in due time.

I'll look at the PRS-17 again, but I could have sworn they did not offer fixed or screw pins, and I didn't see any threads on the crown. It's also seems a bit thicker that I would like.

Thanks for your reply.


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## Andre B

Hello,

similar to B&R, you can use Sinn product...no marketing to be paid....

Andre


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## Steve356

*Re: I guess we will see if there are any other interest...*



Yao said:


> doing a quartz watch is something that I had in mind and working with some "pros" to develop a watch was also something that I am interested in. Let me know if you have a case style in mind. It doesn't have to be exact.
> 
> I am familiar with the B&R watch....if it makes any difference to you Cartier owns a good chunk of the company now and B&R does have its own facilities now in Switzerland. .


I thought it was Chanel ? well, one of those French names :-d
a quartz watch would be nice. I liked the old Sinn EZM2 dial and hand design. I guess the OCN dial is pretty close. the hands would have to be new to fit a quartz movement though right?
I am afraid a lot of people will turn out to be snobs about quartz though, so unless it can be done economically (that is significantly cheaper than a comparable MKII mechanical model), it might not be worth your while. 
I wonder how many quartz vs. automatic models timefactors sells for their 2 models that have both movements - PRS 17 and 18.
how about a quartz chronograph with that central minute counter? a quartz EZM1 would be a hit with the right case and dial/hands IMHO.


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## bompi

*Re: I guess we will see if there are any other interest...*

It seems you're right about Chanel Horlogerie (see the French Wikipedia B&R page).
By the way, although Cartier has a French origin, it's fully owned by Richemont, which is Swiss/South-African, I think.


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## nyc_paramedic

*Re: I guess we will see if there are any other interest...*



Yao said:


> doing a quartz watch is something that I had in
> mind and working with some "pros" to develop a watch was also
> something that I am interested in. Let me know if you have a case
> style in mind. It doesn't have to be exact.


I am ecstatic to think that this interests you. I did not give the
case style much thought because I didn't know if there would be any
interest. The B&R Type Demineur (or the older Sinn 810 on which it's
based on) and the plastic Marathon Navigator (too similar to the MMT?)
originally came to mind. The case style of the Marathon Maraglo field
Watch (http://countycomm.com/MARAGLOWDESCRIP.htm) is very comfortable
and does not attract any attention when worn, but the case is very
small. A bigger 39-40mm size perhaps? I could also understand if
people wanted a rotatable bezel; the one on my MMT gets used all the
the time at work.

These are just *some* suggestions. I would love to hear yours as well.
Did you have anything specific in mind regarding the quartz movement?
What do you think of the ones that offer 7-10 year battery life.



Yao said:


> I am familiar with the B&R watch....if it makes any
> difference to you Cartier owns a good chunk of the company now and B&R
> does have its own facilities now in Switzerland. They aren't the
> private label/marketing company that they started off as.


Considering the new asking price of the Demineur, it makes little
difference. And now that I know that you are interested in developing
a quartz tool watch, I'd rather give MKII my money.



Yao said:


> BTW nice to see you here.


Thank you. It's nice to see MKII doing well since I've purchased my
MMT from you. It is taking quite a beating at work, not to mention the
abuse it gets in the kitchen from some serious cooking.


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## nyc_paramedic

Andre B said:


> Hello,
> similar to B&R, you can use Sinn product...no marketing to be paid....


They seemed to have discounted the model 810 a while back.

Going through the list at the USA Sinn site (http://www.watchbuys.com/) reveals only two quartz models: The Sinn UX EZM and UX SDR. Two very high priced chunky dive watches.


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## Yao

*Two ideas that come to mind if I may pick your brain...*

why not a CWC W10?

Then there was that watch that Bob on MWR did with Nick at countycomm.com For some reason I can't find the pic now. I guess they discontinued that watch.

Interested to hear your thoughts.


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## Yao

*Founds the pic....;*

although if it was discontinued perhaps that is a sign...


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## tallguy

Neat idea, although I bet a seiko quartz or citizen ecodrive diver would fit your bill. I bet you see most of your co-horts, as well as the cops, wearing G-Shocks and Timex Ironman, much like most of the military guys. Gotta tell ya, I just bought two of these and although the springbars are cheesy, they are tough and accurate buggers! Great lume too! http://www.pmwf.com/Phorum/read.php?10,61249,61249#msg-61249


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## perfectlykevin

What about a current MKII case, such as the Vantage, but with a long-life quartz movement? I'm in search of an afordable and durable field watch. Quartz would be cool and I'd love to see a day/date option too. 

Kev


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## nyc_paramedic

*Re: Two ideas that come to mind if I may pick your brain...*



Yao said:


> why not a CWC W10?
> 
> Then there was that watch that Bob on MWR did with Nick at countycomm.com For some reason I can't find the pic now. I guess they discontinued that watch.
> 
> Interested to hear your thoughts.


Thoughts? After a quick search on this watch, I would say no: Simple press back, no screw down crown; questionable water resistance. Would it survive a simple day of snorkeling (something I partake in as well) or shallow diving? Does have the fixed bars though.

I did come across this thread regarding the updated Precista PRS-10: http://www.watcharoo.co.uk/prs10.htm Bummer, no fixed bars or screw pins.

Another suggestion for MKII case style:









The Hamilton style looks a bit more modern and refined. I have a co-worker that happened to buy a used Gruen watch that is very similar looking to the Hamilton case style. It wears very well with a uniform and the bulky orange safety coats that we are wearing this time of year. After I pointed out the simple press back and non-screw down crown, he understood that it probably wasn't very water resistant.

Bill, what'ya think?


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## nyc_paramedic

*Re: Founds the pic....;*



Yao said:


> although if it was discontinued perhaps that is a sign...


If I recall correctly, that was the watch made by Timex with the built in electronic compass. It also looks like a very very thick watch.


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## nyc_paramedic

*Re: Two ideas that come to mind if I may pick your brain...*



Yao said:


> why not a CWC W10?
> 
> Then there was that watch that Bob on MWR did with Nick at countycomm.com For some reason I can't find the pic now. I guess they discontinued that watch.
> 
> Interested to hear your thoughts.


Thoughts? After a quick search in this watch, I would say no: Simple press back, no screw down crown; questionable water resistance. Would it survive a simple day of snorkeling (something I partake in as well) or shallow diving? Does have the fixed bars though.

I did come across this thread regarding the updated Precista PRS-10: http://www.watcharoo.co.uk/prs10.htm Bummer, no fixed bars or screw pins.

Another suggestion for MKII case style:









The Hamilton style looks a bit more modern and refined. I have a co-worker that happened to buy a used Gruen watch that is very similar looking to the Hamilton case style. It wears very well with a uniform and the bulky orange safety coats that we are wearing this time of year. After I pointed out the simple press back and non-screw down crown, he understood that it probably wasn't very water resistant.

Bill, what'ya think?


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## suddha

I don't visit this forum often but thought I'd chime in, from a lurker perspective. I would also be interested in a tool quartz, with long-life battery. Something not dive-specific, but with ample WR. I like to beat on my watches and never take them off. The only downside of quartz to me has always been battery life. So a 10-year battery would be nice.

I concur about the tough little TAG F1. And they do still make that model, though it's quite a bit more than the $250 the OP paid back in the '90s. They got a lot of flack as a toy or fashion watch. But they take a lot of abuse.

Bill brought up CWC. CWC also makes a quartz military diver in a smaller size, with fixed bars and a screwed caseback. It can be had for considerably less than a grand or even cheaper used. Not sure of battery life.

I think St. Moritz/Momentum also makes some rugged quartz models with LL batteries. Their titanium Himalaya is used by a lot of outdoorsmen as a simple, affordable tough piece.

Naturally, it'd be great to see MkII come up with the true quartz tool for WIS's though. |>


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## nyc_paramedic

*Re: The "Reactor" watch company already makes your type of watch*



heb said:


> Hello,
> Check them out.


I went to www.reactorwatch.com. I looked through their sport an elite lines. They are all mostly thick chunky dive watches or really flashy dress watches. Their beefy screw bars seem, from the pictures posted, to be only compatible with their bracelet designs. Doesn't seem to compatible with passing through a simple nato band.

Thanks for the suggestion.


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## Yao

*How tall for you is "too tall"?*

curious if you have a specific number in mind when it comes to overall height of a watch.



nyc_paramedic said:


> I went to www.reactorwatch.com. I looked through their sport an elite lines. They are all mostly thick chunky dive watches or really flashy dress watches. Their beefy screw bars seem, from the pictures posted, to be only compatible with their bracelet designs. Doesn't seem to compatible with passing through a simple nato band.
> 
> Thanks for the suggestion.


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## nyc_paramedic

*Re: How tall for you is "too tall"?*



Yao said:


> curious if you have a specific number in mind when it comes to overall height of a watch.


I don't have a pair of calipers in my electronics tool box. Yesterday, I was going back and forth between the MMT and the plastic Marathon Navigator, with the Navigator seeming less bulky. I don't know the specs of the B&R Type Demineur but when I tried it on once at Tourneau, it seemed very comfortable. Especially when putting on my safety coat with the tight ribbed cuffs.

I'm sorry if I can't give and exact number.

P.S. My wrist measures at 6 and 3/4".


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## obie

*Re: How tall for you is "too tall"?*

The B&R Demineur is very comfortable. Here are a few pics of mine on a 7 3/4" wrist. I have one if Bill wants to take a look at it.


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## nyc_paramedic

*Re: How tall for you is "too tall"?*

Yes, it really is. If the watch came with decent screw strap bars I would probably pay their silly asking price and be done with it. But in my humble opinion, a true working tool watch should have fixed or screw pins.

And in regards to the quartz movement, another reason I am such a proponent of it is because work schedules. Many field personnel don't work a 5 day work week. For example, I will do several sixteen hour shifts and then have maybe three or 4 days off consecutively. If I don't wear my automatic MMT on my pass days the movement will have to be reset before I go to work again. You don't need to futz with a quartz in this manner, less so if it doesn't have a date window. Firefighters work 24 hour shifts; I think (if it hasn't changed) NYC cops work 5 on two off then 5 on and three off.


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## Steve356

Have you looked at Seiko quartz divers? many of them are designed to use the special Seiko thick spring bars, which are about 2.5mm thick or so. I don't think those will budge without major damage to your arm. 
models I like are SHC033 and SHC015. I think they were recently discontinued but should still be available new from many retailers. or used.
they are about 42mm in diameter and 11mm thick. also has the day indicator which I think you would find very useful if you work irregular days b-)


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## Yao

*Always liked that watch....*

a nice clean design.



obie said:


> The B&R Demineur is very comfortable. Here are a few pics of mine on a 7 3/4" wrist. I have one if Bill wants to take a look at it.


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## Agent J

*Re: Founds the pic....;*

Yes yes yes.

Tritium please!


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## kkmark

*What about the JLC c631 (Meca-Quartz) movement?*

...that way you could have a mechanical chrono module with a quartz movement. You'd have date and chronograph functions, the watch would not need to be adjusted (and the watch could be sold at a higher price point).

One example is the IWC GST Chronograph, which I currently wear. But this IWC is lacking a few key features. For example, it does not have a GMT bezel so crossing timezones is an issue.

I travel about 3-4 months of the year to the U.S., Europe and Asia (I live in Canada) and resetting the watch is something I'd rather not do, not to mention trying to attend meetings whilst trying to remember what time it is in the other location.

If the requirement is for a _*functional*_ professional field watch, and function only, then a cheap Timex Ironman would likely do.

But I take it that nyc_paramedic, among others, are looking for a _*formal*_ (some might use the word "dressy") professional field watch that can be worn in uniform or with a suit. And has a few other features.

And is an MK II, of course.

Best,

Ken


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## Pierre_S

*Re: Two ideas that come to mind if I may pick your brain...*

Thank you for starting this thread. I would be very interested in buying a watch of the sort that is being discussed here. Long battery life and maybe a thermocompensated ETA movement would be the perfect match for a purpose-built case like the Hamilton one you've suggested above. Great idea. I truly hope that Bill considers such a watch seriously.

Pierre


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## nyc_paramedic

*Re: Two ideas that come to mind if I may pick your brain...*



Pierre_S said:


> Thank you for starting this thread. I would be very interested in buying a watch of the sort that is being discussed here. Long battery life and maybe a thermocompensated ETA movement would be the perfect match for a purpose-built case like the Hamilton one you've suggested above. Great idea. I truly hope that Bill considers such a watch seriously.
> Pierre


Thanks for the interest and reply.

I forgot to mention that there should be a discussion on thermo-comp quartz movements. I don't know how much more expensive or more accurate than a standard quartz they are; maybe Bill can elaborate on this. But I think Bill could sell more watches to field personnel if the watch was not too expensive.

I brought up the Hamilton as an example because it seems like a nice low profile design, buy I wouldn't want a watch with too small dimensions or too small of a watch face to read at work.

I tried looking up the case dimensions of the B&R Type Demineur but alas, no such specs are given on their website or the PDF owner's manual.

Anybody else have a recommendation for a case design?


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## nyc_paramedic

*Re: Always liked that watch....*



Yao said:


> a nice clean design.


I agree. I would be happy with a sterile dial or something very simple and to the point, e.g. MKII P1. P for professional.


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## obie

*Re: Always liked that watch....*

The B&R Demineur is 39mm in diameter and probably not more than 10mm tall. It has hooded lugs so it should fit almost any wrist diameter because they do not stick out from the case.


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## zinman74

*Sure there is, from a fellow medic out on the left coast''...*

Hello there NYC, nice to see another medic on here. The name's Raf and i work as a medic both on the ground and in the air. In my 16 year EMS career, i have always considered a good, ledgeable watch to be required equipment. Somehow, over the past 5 years or so, i grew into a real WIS. Though my collection has been thinned and culled over the years, I am slowly re-building it.

I agree with you about the Bell & Ross. I always liked the Demineur but never wanted to pay for it, even second hand.

Currently, I am wearing a cheap Citizen NY2300-09E Automatic Diver on a Bond Zulu. It lumes pretty well and came with sturdy spring bars, though it's probably not quite as solid as the competition from Seiko, it was half as expensive.

My main work watch, which I have had longer than anything else in my current collection, is a Sinn EZM3 on bracelet. I bought it off the forum about 2 years ago in mint condition. At first, before it got the crap beat out of it on the job, it was keeping to about 3 seconds per day. It's at about 6 or 7 now, but still lumes, looks and wears like a true tool watch. I will probably never flip it, as I have done with many lesser watches because I truly love it (it also isn't worth much in the shape it's in, with some good niks, scuffs and gouges on the case, scratches on the bezel and a bracelet that is more scuff than original pearl finish).

The CWC Quartz diver was a beautiful work piece, decent lume, fixed bars and accurate. The mineral crystal sucked though and when I dropped it, the bezel got damaged pretty bad and actually came off. I sold it as a fixer because it's impossible to get parts for those.

There have been many others. My ideal tool watch would be as follows:

-Good lume, preferably with lume on the second hand as well as either numbers or large indices on the dial.
-38 to 44mm case size but cas length of no more than 50mm
-timing bezel with lume dot or chronograph function, or both. If it's a chrono, the second hand would be lumed.
-Independent second time zone.
-Satin or blasted finish
-Black dial
-Wr > 100m, screw down crown.
-Able to be worn on bracelet, Zulu or NATO.
-Between $300 and $900

thoughts?

*
*


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## Yao

*Well we could also loosely base the watch on this...*

IWC BUND Ocean

Ronda currently makes a watch with a second time zone function that is quartz but you will end up sacrificing battery life as it doesn't have a Li battery.



zinman74 said:


> Hello there NYC, nice to see another medic on here. The name's Raf and i work as a medic both on the ground and in the air. In my 16 year EMS career, i have always considered a good, ledgeable watch to be required equipment. Somehow, over the past 5 years or so, i grew into a real WIS. Though my collection has been thinned and culled over the years, I am slowly re-building it.
> 
> I agree with you about the Bell & Ross. I always liked the Demineur but never wanted to pay for it, even second hand.
> 
> Currently, I am wearing a cheap Citizen NY2300-09E Automatic Diver on a Bond Zulu. It lumes pretty well and came with sturdy spring bars, though it's probably not quite as solid as the competition from Seiko, it was half as expensive.
> 
> My main work watch, which I have had longer than anything else in my current collection, is a Sinn EZM3 on bracelet. I bought it off the forum about 2 years ago in mint condition. At first, before it got the crap beat out of it on the job, it was keeping to about 3 seconds per day. It's at about 6 or 7 now, but still lumes, looks and wears like a true tool watch. I will probably never flip it, as I have done with many lesser watches because I truly love it (it also isn't worth much in the shape it's in, with some good niks, scuffs and gouges on the case, scratches on the bezel and a bracelet that is more scuff than original pearl finish).
> 
> The CWC Quartz diver was a beautiful work piece, decent lume, fixed bars and accurate. The mineral crystal sucked though and when I dropped it, the bezel got damaged pretty bad and actually came off. I sold it as a fixer because it's impossible to get parts for those.
> 
> There have been many others. My ideal tool watch would be as follows:
> 
> -Good lume, preferably with lume on the second hand as well as either numbers or large indices on the dial.
> -38 to 44mm case size but cas length of no more than 50mm
> -timing bezel with lume dot or chronograph function, or both. If it's a chrono, the second hand would be lumed.
> -Independent second time zone.
> -Satin or blasted finish
> -Black dial
> -Wr > 100m, screw down crown.
> -Able to be worn on bracelet, Zulu or NATO.
> -Between $300 and $900
> 
> thoughts?


----------



## nyc_paramedic

*Re: Sure there is, from a fellow medic out on the left coast''...*



zinman74 said:


> Hello there NYC...


Hi there!



zinman74 said:


> I agree with you about the Bell & Ross. I always liked the Demineur but never wanted to pay for it, even second hand.


Yeah, it's a shame. Now Bill has to hear us clamor and beg him for a tool watch, like hungry little children.



zinman74 said:


> Currently, I am wearing a cheap Citizen NY2300-09E Automatic Diver on a Bond Zulu. It lumes pretty well and came with sturdy spring bars, though it's probably not quite as solid as the competition from Seiko, it was half as expensive.


After giving it much thought, I think that fixed bars or beefy screw pins are an absolute prerequisite for this type of watch. But again, just one man's humble opinion.



zinman74 said:


> My main work watch, which I have had longer than anything else in my current collection, is a Sinn EZM3....


That looks like a clean design. Not too big at 40.8mm, but a bit on the thicker side. Not a bad suggestion at all actually.



zinman74 said:


> The CWC Quartz diver was a beautiful work piece, decent lume, fixed bars and accurate. The mineral crystal sucked though and when I dropped it, the bezel got damaged pretty bad and actually came off. I sold it as a fixer because it's impossible to get parts for those.


Yeah, the mineral glass is a poor choice for a durable piece. That, and the press back case and battery hatch don't inspire much water-resistance confidence.



zinman74 said:


> There have been many others. My ideal tool watch would be as follows:
> 
> -Good lume, preferably with lume on the second hand as well as either numbers or large indices on the dial.
> -38 to 44mm case size but cas length of no more than 50mm
> -timing bezel with lume dot or chronograph function, or both. If it's a chrono, the second hand would be lumed.
> -Independent second time zone.
> -Satin or blasted finish
> -Black dial
> -Wr > 100m, screw down crown.
> -Able to be worn on bracelet, Zulu or NATO.
> -Between $300 and $900
> 
> thoughts?


I would only take issue with the second time zone. As Bill said, it would sacrifice battery life. I also think that the first watch in this series (yup, wishful thinking) should be: simple; supremely durable, super low maintenance; low cost.

If the community voted for a non-date watch and Bill used an accurate movement with 7-10 year battery life, I could envision a watch where one would only touch the crown twice a year for setting daylight savings. I would also strongly agree for the satin or blasted finish; 'tis a big plus for law enforcement and military personnel.

Would I love to see a GMT quartz version later on? Hell yes. Even if it was a chunkier diver. I'd buy one just for snorkeling.


----------



## nyc_paramedic

*Re: What about the JLC c631 (Meca-Quartz) movement?*



kkmark said:


> But I take it that nyc_paramedic, among others, are looking for a _*formal*_ (some might use the word "dressy") professional field watch that can be worn in uniform or with a suit. And has a few other features...
> Ken


I am not asking for a dressy watch at all. This would be strictly a tough-as-nails super-accurate field watch.


----------



## k7lro

*Re: What about the JLC c631 (Meca-Quartz) movement?*



nyc_paramedic said:


> I am not asking for a dressy watch at all. This would be strictly a tough-as-nails super-accurate field watch.


If it was all this and a GMT also (hour hand sets independent of the GMT hand), I'd jump on it in a NY second. :-! |> |> |> |>


----------



## kkmark

*Re: What about the JLC c631 (Meca-Quartz) movement?*



nyc_paramedic said:


> I am not asking for a dressy watch at all. This would be strictly a tough-as-nails super-accurate field watch.


Why not a Timex Ironman then? Is there something about a steel watch that you prefer?


----------



## nyc_paramedic

*Re: What about the JLC c631 (Meca-Quartz) movement?*



kkmark said:


> Why not a Timex Ironman then? Is there something about a steel watch that you prefer?


Durability.

I made the mistake of wearing my Ironman to work; totally destroyed after 4 months. That, and the plastic was scratched so badly that the time wasn't legible with quick glances. More like _get the watch very close to your face and squint_ legible.

I _do _love the Ironman for my cross-country runs though...

I wish I could find my old Tag to post some photos. Besides the obvious wear and tear, there's also a nice small wedge of the sapphire crystal missing.


----------



## urbancowboy

*Re: Sure there is, from a fellow medic out on the left coast''...*



nyc_paramedic said:


> Hi there!
> 
> Yeah, it's a shame. Now Bill has to hear us clamor and beg him for a tool watch, like hungry little children.
> 
> After giving it much thought, I think that fixed bars or beefy screw pins are an absolute prerequisite for this type of watch. But again, just one man's humble opinion.
> 
> That looks like a clean design. Not too big at 40.8mm, but a bit on the thicker side. Not a bad suggestion at all actually.
> 
> Yeah, the mineral glass is a poor choice for a durable piece. That, and the press back case and battery hatch don't inspire much water-resistance confidence.
> 
> I would only take issue with the second time zone. As Bill said, it would sacrifice battery life. I also think that the first watch in this series (yup, wishful thinking) should be: simple; supremely durable, super low maintenance; low cost.
> 
> If the community voted for a non-date watch and Bill used an accurate movement with 7-10 year battery life, I could envision a watch where one would only touch the crown twice a year for setting daylight savings. I would also strongly agree for the satin or blasted finish; 'tis a big plus for law enforcement and military personnel.
> 
> Would I love to see a GMT quartz version later on? Hell yes. Even if it was a chunkier diver. I'd buy one just for snorkeling.


first time poster, long time lurker...

i agree with nyc paramedic about almost everything he has posted here. i do similar work and would love to have a tough quartz that i could rely on.
minor points:

1. my dream work watch would need to have a date. i check my watch for the date several times a day.

2. i would love to have it be at least 200m water resistant. that would make it much more valuable if your job (or playtime) take you into the water.

3. timing bezel.

4. i would much prefer a single time zone face that is very simple and uncluttered.

i recently bought a hamilton khaki 3 to use for work. put it on a NATO band and it's ok so far. i'm sure the spring bars would not hold up to much abuse. but as far as the numbers and hands go, i think the face is really easy to read:
http://www.overstock.com/Jewelry-Watches/Hamilton-Khaki-III-Mens-Quartz-Watch/2457903/product.html

i would love to see a work watch with that kind of simple layout.

looking forward to seeing what Mr Yao comes up with...


----------



## nyc_paramedic

Bill,

Have you given any thought to the quartz tool watch? Anything you would like to share? Maybe some opinions on a case style, or your thoughts on some of the currently available quartz movements?

I would understand if you are too busy with the current projects.

Thanks.


----------



## Yao

Here are some thoughts:





































Problem with the movement is that long life and thickness of the watch will be at odds. A Li movement is almost as thick as a mechanical movement. A low-drawing NiC battery movement can be used to make the watch much thinner but battery life is I think 3-5 years.

What are you thoughts on this and the designs considered?

I will probably also be at the WUS meet in April in NYC if it is actually held.



nyc_paramedic said:


> Bill,
> 
> Have you given any thought to the quartz tool watch? Anything you would like to share? Maybe some opinions on a case style, or your thoughts on some of the currently available quartz movements?
> 
> I would understand if you are too busy with the current projects.
> 
> Thanks.


----------



## Yao

Naturally I would end up doing something pretty different with any of these designs. The first two are probably still patented and the last two would need some modernizing.


----------



## caesarmascetti

Yao said:


> Here are some thoughts:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Problem with the movement is that long life and thickness of the watch will be at odds. A Li movement is almost as thick as a mechanical movement. A low-drawing NiC battery movement can be used to make the watch much thinner but battery life is I think 3-5 years.
> 
> What are you thoughts on this and the designs considered?
> 
> I will probably also be at the WUS meet in April in NYC if it is actually held.


The B&R looks similar case shape anyway to the SeaFighter, maybe it's just me. I like the IWC.


----------



## AgentX

I recently picked up a Vantage overseas after my old workhorse of a Swiss Army watch finally died in an African rainstorm. I really, really like it and wear it with the bracelet or a thick rubber strap with a deployment clasp.

However, I do wish it was thinner. I wear it while working, and it's chunky under a dress shirt and suit jacket cuff. I wear other stuff up my sleeve for work sometimes, too, and there's not much room in there. It gets my wrist caught up while reaching back from the front seat to open up a car door or behind a desk, etc., and it's just heavy.

Love the style, but would be very interested in something about half the thickness and maybe a few mm shaved off the total case width, closer to the size of the original Rolex upon which it's based. I love mechanical/auto movements, but high quality quartz makes sense, too. When you consider that a mechanical watch should get service as often as a quartz watch should need a new battery, the more accurate, maintenance-free movement really makes sense. Sure, the hand doesn't sweep so nicely, but it tells the time.


----------



## JDS (Ohio)

*Re: I guess we will see if there are any other interest...*



Yao said:


> doing a quartz watch is something that I had in mind and working with some "pros" to develop a watch was also something that I am interested in. Let me know if you have a case style in mind. It doesn't have to be exact.
> 
> I am familiar with the B&R watch....if it makes any difference to you Cartier owns a good chunk of the company now and B&R does have its own facilities now in Switzerland. They aren't the private label/marketing company that they started off as.
> 
> BTW nice to see you here.


As long as you are talking a break from tradition, I've wanted a watch that would fit my preferences for my occasional backpacking trips:

Titanium case
Tritium tubes in the hands and markers
Diver's bezel or a military style 1-12 hybrid
Black or blue dial
Good quartz movement with field replaceable battery, solar, or automatic mechanical.
Sapphire crystal, or a really tough and thick acrylic, like the one on the original Benrus Type I or Type II.
100 meters or better water resistance
Fixed bars might be useful to some, but really isn't that important to me.
The 1990s issued Marathon steel Navigator is getting close to the bull's eye, and I have one of them that LL Bean relabeled and sold in their catalogs; except that the movement is a little squirrelly, the minutes hand is way too close in length to the hour hand, and the crystal is a bit thinner than I'd like. Fix those issues and make it out of titanium (hey EVERY ounce counts when you are a chronic over packer!), it'd be a killer field watch. Of course, then I'd probably want a matching Mark II compass to fit on the strap with it...;-)

And it might even fill a paramedic's needs too. Unless he needs it sterilizeable too, that is. I wonder if ANYone has ever made an autclaveable watch?


----------



## Chrome

*Re: I guess we will see if there are any other interest...*

+1 on a titanium case, tritium tubes, and some way to track elapsed time (rotating bezel).

As far as sterilizing watches, I've bleached watches in 10% solution and not had a problem. I doubt anyone's made an autoclaveable watch, that's a lot of heat and pressure to deal with.

Later,
Chrome...


----------



## nyc_paramedic

*Re: I guess we will see if there are any other interest...*



JDS (Ohio) said:


> As long as you are talking a break from tradition, I've wanted a watch that would fit my preferences for my occasional backpacking trips:
> 
> Titanium case
> Tritium tubes in the hands and markers
> Diver's bezel or a military style 1-12 hybrid
> Black or blue dial
> Good quartz movement with field replaceable battery, solar, or automatic mechanical.
> Sapphire crystal, or a really tough and thick acrylic, like the one on the original Benrus Type I or Type II.
> 100 meters or better water resistance
> Fixed bars might be useful to some, but really isn't that important to me.
> The 1990s issued Marathon steel Navigator is getting close to the bull's eye, and I have one of them that LL Bean relabeled and sold in their catalogs; except that the movement is a little squirrelly, the minutes hand is way too close in length to the hour hand, and the crystal is a bit thinner than I'd like. Fix those issues and make it out of titanium (hey EVERY ounce counts when you are a chronic over packer!), it'd be a killer field watch. Of course, then I'd probably want a matching Mark II compass to fit on the strap with it...;-)
> 
> And it might even fill a paramedic's needs too. Unless he needs it sterilizeable too, that is. I wonder if ANYone has ever made an autclaveable watch?


You know, Precista makes the Titan Commander, which is exactly what you are looking for.

From Timefacors:

_*Case*_
_* Brushed titanium case with polished screw back, sapphire crystal with anti-reflective coating, screw down crown, unidirectional carbon fibre bezel and water resistant to 200 metres/660 feet. The black dial has luminous glass vials at each hour point and also on the hands, including the seconds hand. The vials shine pale green in colour except the vial at 12, which shines red. *_
_*Dimensions*_
_* 
46mm diameter to the tip of the crown (40mm for bezel), 45.5mm lug tip to lug tip and 11mm thick. Lug spacing is 22mm and the watch head alone weighs just 40 grammes. *_
_*Movement*_
_* 
Ronda quartz 5 jewels with 40 month battery life and EOL (end of life indicator). Supplied with 12 months guarantee and choice of NATO or Rhino strap, please indicate which in the "comments" box on the order form, thank you.*_ 
No. Fixed. Bars. Sigh...

Link: http://www.timefactors.com/precista.htm Last watch at the bottom of the page.


----------



## nyc_paramedic

*Re: I guess we will see if there are any other interest...*



Chrome said:


> As far as sterilizing watches, I've bleached watches in 10% solution and not had a problem. I doubt anyone's made an autoclaveable watch, that's a lot of heat and pressure to deal with.


Worst biologicals that I have ever gotten on my watch was brain matter. Most emergency room departments have a soiled utility room with an industrial grade disinfectant soak for endoscopes and such; things not easy to autoclave.

I used a small basin, a fresh mix of some of the aforementioned solution, and about a 15 min soak whilst finishing up paperwork, then a fresh water rinse.

Bleach should be fine as well. I think the ration is 10:1. Repeated dippings in bleach might cause some fading of painted bezels and what not.


----------



## JDS (Ohio)

*Re: I guess we will see if there are any other interest...*

Careful with the bleach, chlorine will cause corrosion of most stainless steels if you aren't careful. It shouldn't flake or bubble, but it will cause a bronze discoloration. We used to get a lot of problems with parts that had been put through aqueous cleaning systems that were hooked up to straight city water, the chlorine levels would spike usually in the summer and we'd start to get 300 or 400 series stainless parts that had those brownish stains on them.

As far as I know however, titanium is unaffected by chlorine.


----------



## JDS (Ohio)

*Re: I guess we will see if there are any other interest...*

Thanks for the link. I saw those and gave it serious consideration, but they still have the same too short minute hand issue for me that the Navigator has. I usually have to take a second look to differentiate visually the hour and minute hands, which may not be a really big issue, but it still just bugs me anyway. The steel Navigator itself is pretty much on target except for that issue and the unreliable movement (I think the little clip that maintains battery contact might have been lost during a battery change).

I still might try one of the Precistas out anyway; tritium tubes are fantastic when you can't reach over at 4:00 AM and flip on a lamp to read the time.


----------



## nyc_paramedic

Yao said:


> Here are some thoughts:
> 
> Problem with the movement is that long life and thickness of the watch will be at odds. A Li movement is almost as thick as a mechanical movement. A low-drawing NiC battery movement can be used to make the watch much thinner but battery life is I think 3-5 years.
> 
> What are you thoughts on this and the designs considered?


My recommendation is to stick with the long-life Li battery movement. If my MMT was a quartz with fixed bars I would be supremely happy --even at its current thickness. The taper on the case a makes a huge difference.



Yao said:


> I will probably also be at the WUS meet in April in NYC if it is actually held.


What is WUS? A simple Google search reveals nothing. Is it open to the public?



Yao said:


> Naturally I would end up doing something pretty different with any of these designs. The first two are probably still patented and the last two would need some modernizing.


Can you patent a design? Has the fallacy of "intellectual property" creeped into watch designs as well?

Several ideas to toss around:

What if you designed a hybrid of the B&R and Porsche design? Keep the round case of the Porsche and add the bezel of the B&R?

What about replicating the current Marathon Navigator but in steel? It seems a bit thinner and smaller overall. (Too similar to a MMT to make it an interesting project??)

I do like the Hamilton and CWC style, but they have no rotating bezel Might be a big turn-off for some, especially those who might use the watch for occasional diving.

And now for something _completely _different:

How about the O&W early bird case in a quartz but with a 12 hour dial? Case height (in your gallery section) is listed at 10.81 mm. Hmm... not too thick. Case seems a bit small at 37.3mm, but if you sized it up just a bit, it might just be perfect. The dial and hands are a thing of beauty. The scalloped bezel is gorgeous.

I would buy it if you built it wit the 24 hour dial. Do they even make a 24hour movement in quartz these days?


----------



## nyc_paramedic

AgentX said:


> ... When you consider that a mechanical watch should get service as often as a quartz watch should need a new battery, the more accurate, maintenance-free movement really makes sense. Sure, the hand doesn't sweep so nicely, but it tells the time.


That is exactly how I feel about a heavy-duty work watch.


----------



## Yao

> Can you patent a design? Has the fallacy of "intellectual property" creeped into watch designs as well?


Yes you can patent a design. Actually they are called "design patents" The life I believe is something like 25 years, although I am not sure if extensions are possible.


----------



## nyc_paramedic

Yao said:


> Yes you can patent a design. Actually they are called "design patents" The life I believe is something like 25 years, although I am not sure if extensions are possible.


Ahh... Too bad.

And what of the Early Bird? If I remember correctly from a long ago email, you have a soft spot for this particular piece. So, I would understated completely if you wanted to reserve this homage for an automatic movement.


----------



## urbancowboy

i can't wait to see a bullet-proof, low profile 200m field watch from mkII. 

maybe you could keep costs down by offering a rubber strap as an option, but selling the watch itself without a strap. that way people could put on their own bands (NATO, etc) without ever removing the bars.


----------



## Recht

I'd be satisfied with a quartz version of the Blackwater. Ronda movement with 10 year battery life, let's go with C3 lume for longer brightness (or even tritium tubes), and screwed bars for added security.


----------



## bmwktmbill

Not everyone's favorite company but this watch comes the closest to what you are asking for. Mine is accurate to around 5 seconds a day. Price is about $170usd which is very fair given what the competition charges.

I am a RN and a motorcycle traveler so I need the Trit tubes and the battery replacement feature. If you go to Telford Services the prices are better, depending on what they have in stock.

Check it out.
bill

http://www.mwcwatches.com/shop/prod...d=100&osCsid=efe63fb878d4a53e78bc2b0c1f62065a




























Trit tubes in the dark.


----------



## k7lro

bmwktmbill said:


> I am a RN and a motorcycle traveler so I need the Trit tubes and the battery replacement feature. If you go to Telford Services the prices are better, depending on what they have in stock.


Ever hang out on advrider.com? I see the KTM in your name.


----------



## bmwktmbill

k7lro said:


> Ever hang out on advrider.com? I see the KTM in your name.


Yes, must be getting close to 1800 posts. I am an idiot.
bill


----------



## obie

bmwktmbill said:


> Yes, must be getting close to 1800 posts. I am an idiot.
> bill


Small world... 3 years there but only 6 posts...


----------



## k7lro

bmwktmbill said:


> Yes, must be getting close to 1800 posts. I am an idiot.
> bill


Been there since 2002 myself with over 10,000 posts. I think I'm the bigger idiot. Here's one of my threads from 2005 regarding Copper Canyon.

Recently, I've cut w-a-y back and don't post too much. Threads that I do keep up with are the one regarding watches & kayaks.

Here's my goodbye to the 950 thread which explains my changing priorities in life. Since that thread, I've completed the Alabama trip and will be in the Amazon in almost 90-days.

I'm still working out and making good progress - my leg-press went from 155 pounds to 400, I can do 130 crunches with 80 pounds and just this morning, I saw something on the scales that I have seen since the early 90's..... 206 pounds - from a high of pushing 245. I'm down to almost a 38" waist from a 44". I'm in better shape than most 30 year olds.

Time on advrider is enjoyable but ultimately, too much time on any site can be time not spend doing things that will benefit you more.

Like - going to the gym... talk to you later. :-d


----------



## nyc_paramedic

Trying to keep this thread alive.

Bill,

Any updates or thoughts on your first professional quartz design?


----------



## tomr

Although I am relatively new to this forum, I did get here in time to get on board for the Kingston (phase 2 order). However, I was initially searching for a good utilitarian quartz watch with a long-life battery and either tritium tubes or very good lume. I gave serious consideration to two Precista models by Timefactors, but neither design was that appealing to me.

Although the Kingston was a bit of a impulse buy, and I would never want in a quartz configuration, there are two other MKII designs which I like and believe would be good considerations to offer as a quartz model, and they are the Vantage and the Blackwater. I like both, although the Vantage would probably be a better fit on my 6 1/2 inch wrist. Either way, I definitely concur with the sentiment and recommendation for a MKII quartz model.

Thanks to Bill, for continuing to listen to the input from his customers, and providing such desirable results.


----------



## JDS (Ohio)

Revisiting the question, I realized my contribution to the discussion has been piecemeal and solution specific. That's probably the wrong approach to take for what is essentially a basic VOC discussion, my aplogies.

So, in that spirit, here's my $0.02 US. For me a perfect quartz tool watch would be:
Classic, matte black dial diver in appearance, much like Bill's current stable.
Titanium case - light weight and non-magnetic
Long life battery, with some sort of unobtrusive low battery indicator (like the usual double second jump for a low battery).
Ideally, a user replaceable batter (what if I'm in the middle of nowhere when the battery starts to go south?).
Anti-magnetic movement non-ferro magnetic hands etc.
42mm Case
30mm dial
22mm lug width
Thick, crylic crystal, like Rolex used to use.
Tritium tube makers, like the ones on the CSAR. In fact, if this tool watch were a chronograph, I'd say the CSAR dial would be just about ideal, just the way it is. I'd buy one if the whole watch weren't so freaking big.
Tritium tube hands, but with notably longer minute hand - again, like the CSAR
Date only, at the 4:30 position, C-3 super luminova white on black numerals.
Unidirectional 5-55 minute diver bezel, like the CSAR. I could live with a 1-12 hr insert though, like the Blackwater / Benrus Type I
Trit tube "pip" at the 0/12 position on the bezel.
200 meters WR.
Option of spring bars, screwed pins, or solid bars. For spring or screwed bars, use the toughest ones we can.
Strap choices to include a nice, LONG length tropic style strap (for warm weather comfort), but with only a 2mm taper. I love the old style basket weave look with small perforations, but this would need to be thick enough at the lug end to match the watch, while thinning appropriately, down toward the buckle .
An optional accessory / spare part kit, to at least include a couple of sets of spare spring or screwed bars, a spring bar tool or screw driver (as appropriate), a spare bezel insert, and a couple of spare acrylic crystals. These are the sort of things you are likely to ding up and need to replace at some point. Also, maybe a tube of poly watch? The accessory kit could be an extra charge option though, to keep costs down for those on a budget (though I certainly wouldn't turn my nose up at one as a freebie for pre-ordering;-)).
Of course, an even cooler approach would be to also have options to configure it for the individual user, just like almost all MK II watches. Perhaps at a minimum, a dial / hand set that does NOT use tritium tubes, but either the usual C1, or the brighter C3 super-luminova? A couple of options there would be great, especially if you could buy a set of both, in case you changed your mind after owning for a bit, or the trit tubes began to dim. Another option choice could be between diver and a 12 hour bezel insert.

Finally, I'd want the MK II logo on the dial, the sterile dial approach doesn't usually appeal to me.

Of course it isn't like Bill doesn't already have enough on his plate.:-d

Sorry for the long post, but what the heck.


----------



## nyc_paramedic

Bill,

Would the current MMT Blackwater case be able to accept a quartz movement like the Ronda 715Li?


----------



## obie

A watchcase is made for a specific movement, and unless a quartz movement would have the same dimentions as the ETA automatic movement (2824-2) or whatever movement a watch was made for, it wouldn't fit. Additionally there would be different movement clamps, etc. that would need to be made to fit the movement within the watch.


----------



## nyc_paramedic

Thanks Obie. Please excuse my ignorance on these matters; I'm trying to learn.

Would you happen to know anything about the ETA Thermoline (thermo-compensated quartz) movements? Link: http://www.swisstime.ch/pgs/rwi-pgs-prod-lgs-en-idp-1531.html
Are they prohibitively expensive? Are there greater technical challenges in using these compared to the ubiquitous 2824?

Would Bill or any of the other MKII fans be interested in an MKII super quartz?


----------



## Yao

nyc_paramedic said:


> Bill,
> 
> Would the current MMT Blackwater case be able to accept a quartz movement like the Ronda 715Li?


the ISA 1198 is the closest substitute to the 2824 but like Obie said then you have the have a new movement ring made for it.


----------



## nyc_paramedic

Yao said:


> the ISA 1198 is the closest substitute to the 2824 but like Obie said then you have the have a new movement ring made for it.


Is that considered a decent (durability, accuracy) movement? A quick Google search reveals: http://www.pmwf.com/Phorum/read.php?4,74760,75053 So it seems that it's used in some of the Marathon watches.

Have you given any recent thought on the quartz project based on the interest in this thread? Would this be something that would happen in the far future because of other projects in the works?

Thanks.


----------



## urbancowboy

nyc_paramedic said:


> Would Bill or any of the other MKII fans be interested in an MKII super quartz?


i'm still interested in a high quality quartz tool watch. the closest i've seen so far is the seiko sbcm 023

http://www.higuchi-inc.com/seikoperdiver.html

and the marathon.

it would be nice if someone would combine the best aspects of both of those watches.
(in my mind, the dial of the marathon with the movement/battery of the seiko).


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## Yao

nyc_paramedic said:


> Is that considered a decent (durability, accuracy) movement? A quick Google search reveals: http://www.pmwf.com/Phorum/read.php?4,74760,75053 So it seems that it's used in some of the Marathon watches.
> 
> Have you given any recent thought on the quartz project based on the interest in this thread? Would this be something that would happen in the far future because of other projects in the works?
> 
> Thanks.


I have something in mind but it probably wouldn't be ready until 2011 and that is assuming that I get this idea off the ground. Right now it is literally just an idea.


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## Plissken

*Re: I guess we will see if there are any other interest...*



nyc_paramedic said:


> You know, Precista makes the Titan Commander, which is exactly what you are looking for.
> 
> From Timefacors:
> 
> _*Case*_
> _* Brushed titanium case with polished screw back, sapphire crystal with anti-reflective coating, screw down crown, unidirectional carbon fibre bezel and water resistant to 200 metres/660 feet. The black dial has luminous glass vials at each hour point and also on the hands, including the seconds hand. The vials shine pale green in colour except the vial at 12, which shines red. *_
> _*Dimensions*_
> _*
> 46mm diameter to the tip of the crown (40mm for bezel), 45.5mm lug tip to lug tip and 11mm thick. Lug spacing is 22mm and the watch head alone weighs just 40 grammes. *_
> _*Movement*_
> _*
> Ronda quartz 5 jewels with 40 month battery life and EOL (end of life indicator). Supplied with 12 months guarantee and choice of NATO or Rhino strap, please indicate which in the "comments" box on the order form, thank you.*_
> No. Fixed. Bars. Sigh...
> 
> Link: http://www.timefactors.com/precista.htm Last watch at the bottom of the page.


Isn't that just a Traser in all but name?


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## Plissken

I think a 36mm time only watch would be just the ticket. If it's a field watch you just need the time right?


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## JDS (Ohio)

Personally, I find a timing bezel pretty handy in the woods. A chronograph function could be overkill for my uses, but might still be useful for some people. For me though, it would probably just look cool, and never get used except in town. Still, assuming it didn't add weight or some other drawback it would be better to have a function you never actually need than need one you don't have.

I think the traditional field watch was an outgrowth of the earlier military issue watches, and a product of the days before rotating bezels and chrono functions being common place. Rather than fewer functions, I suspect it was mainly distinguished from other watches by it's plain but legible dial and more rugged construction. The other,fancier watches just didn't have the rotating bezel either, and chronographs were probably too delicate.

Just my $.02 though, YMMV.


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