# Glycine Airman 22 (24hr Hand Adjustment??)



## grotty

Happy New Year Everyone 

I'm new to this Glycine forum, and also to Glycine watches, and was wondering if someone can help me on a recent problem I experienced on an Airman22 GA I was intending on purchasing.

I actually just got back from the watch store (AD) after seeing an Airman22 GA I had them order. I noticed that the 24hr hand did not align with the dial indices (The 24hr hand only seems to move in hourly intervals, as opposed to 'sweeping', so I assume that the 24hr hand should align perfectly with what is indicated on the dial. As is, the hand lies almost perfectly mid-way between any 2 given hour markers, making it almost impossible to tell what time it is). The AD suggested that the watch be taken to an authorized service center for examination and adjustment. I did not buy the watch, and do not intend to, until I have an idea what is wrong. Has anyone ever had this problem before, and if so, how did you fix it?

I thought I read something similar to this problem here before, but could not find the thread.

Thanks in advance for your help and advice.


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## Sodiac

I seem to remember this problem being discussed here in the forum a couple of years ago. I think even some members contacted Glycine, or someone from Glycine posted a note about it. But I haven't heard anything about it in some time. Perhaps your watch store had an old stock Airman? It sounds like it needs correcting, so you might be better off buying a newer example from a reputable authorized dealer.


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## jarnould

*Picts of mine

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*on a Orange Nato
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*on it's original leather strap *


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## grotty

Sodiac said:


> I seem to remember this problem being discussed here in the forum a couple of years ago. I think even some members contacted Glycine, or someone from Glycine posted a note about it. But I haven't heard anything about it in some time. Perhaps your watch store had an old stock Airman? It sounds like it needs correcting, so you might be better off buying a newer example from a reputable authorized dealer.


Hello, and thank you for the reply.

I did find a thread on another WUS forum about GMT hand alignment problems others have had with the ETA 2893-2. I'll try to paste a link to it but sorry if it doesn't go well...I'm still not sure how to post links:

https://www.watchuseek.com/f275/alignement-gmt-hand-am-i-expecting-too-much-530347.html

In the meantime, I have contacted the AD and they say they are still trying to figure out how to fix the problem. No progress here. However, I did manage to find out that there was ANOTHER Airman22 GA sitting in the same service center WITH THE SAME PROBLEM. This one sent by another customer after also complaining that the GMT hands do not align. Also, according to the AD, the watch that I intended to purchase was not an old stock, but of a newer batch...although I cannot confirm this because I do not have the watch with me and do not know the S/N of the watch. If this is true, (only my personal assumption) the alignment problem still seems to persist, even with recently manufactured movements (again, only assuming at this point -- hoping this is not the case).

I will post follow-ups of this incident, until I successfully obtain my first Glycine Airman


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## grotty

jarnould said:


> *Picts of mine
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> *on a Orange Nato
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> *on it's original leather strap *


Wow...That is nice  I'm surprised how good it looks on a Nato. Somehow I've never imagined an Airman on a Nato... Super!!


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## Sodiac

I've owned about 20 Glycines, and to be honest, the quality is spotty, which is a shame. There have been other threads about this issue before. The good thing is, they should fix the problem. So I take it you have not purchased the watch yet, but are waiting to see if the AD can get it fixed? It shouldn't be a big deal, just a re-installation of the hand?


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## Jazzmaster

Just a month ago, I purchased a brand new Glycine Airman Base 22 GMT from an AD. Right out of the box, the GMT hand was off by about 25 minutes -- so, on the hour, the GMT hand was halfway between hour markers. Utterly unusable. I played with setting the GMT hand and actually got it to "reset" so that it worked properly -- but that fix was only temporary. As soon as I tried to set the GMT hand to a new time zone, my fix disappeared.

OK, so that's the bad news. The good news is that I called the US rep, who said that they could reset the GMT hand so that it would work properly. I sent it off for warranty repair and, sure enough, the GMT hand works perfectly now.


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## grotty

*SOLVED!! Re: Glycine Airman 22 (24hr Hand Adjustment??)*

After spending nearly 3 months, I am happy to announce that I have at last, solved the Airman22 24Hr hand misalignment issue. And... here I am today, WITH my new Airman22! Since I do not have a decent camera with me now, I will try to take and upload pictures later tonight, but I would like to inform everyone that the alignment problem has been corrected (to a tolerable level, anyway -- everyone has different tolerance thresholds ). For those interested, I have summarized below what I went through to get this watch. In the end however, from what I experienced and from what I heard from others with similar experiences, I believe it is pretty safe to say that the Glycine Airman22 (the GMT model and GA model) with the ETA 2893-2 movement does have alignment issues with the GMT hand / 24Hr hand. I do not know whether this is due to a flaw in the design of the movement, or just simply poor quality control at the manufacturer, but it does seem to happen. I guess the lesson here is that if you are in the market for a multiple time-zone Airman22, check the GMT hand alignment before you make any purchase, and have it serviced because servicing will more or less correct the problem. I would like to apologize for not replying/posting in a timely manner for those who have read this thread and were wondering what had happened. So here we go:

(1) After confirmation from the AD that the watch was in stock, I went to the AD to make my purchase. After completing the payment, the staff began to show me how to set the time on the watch (i.e. which crown position adjusts which hand). It was at this point I became puzzled because I could not tell what time it was...even though the minute hand was pointing 12, the GMT hands indicated a position between 2 hour markers.

(2) Initial observation revealed that the GMT hands were misaligned, but were not always off by the same amount of time in all positions. Some hours are off more, while some were near perfect.

(3) The AD advised that the watch be taken to an authorized technician. After about one week, I was told that the first technician who had inspected the watch was not able to locate the source of the problem, and the watch had to be inspected by another person. I do not know whether the first technician was just inexperienced, or whether the problem was complicated enough that someone with more experience/expertise became necessary. The repair took approximately 2 weeks.

(4) I had toyed with the idea that the watch may have been a leftover old stock with alignment problems. I also got advice on this forum that this could be an old stock, because there seemed to be threads about alignment issues a few years earlier. Although I have yet to check the serial number of this watch, the AD has told me that this was "fresh stock". Clarification is needed here.

(5) While the watch was sitting in the repair shop, there was another watch (same Glycine, same model), with the same problem.

(6) Do the hands align 100% perfectly after servicing? Not quite. On some hours, the hands can be slightly (very slightly) off. I have been informed that any alignment deviation I see is "standard" for this movement, and that GMT movements are prone to have slight deviations. Since I do not have any other GMT watches to compare to (this is my first), I just judged whether or not what I saw in front of me was acceptable or not. I judged acceptable. However, as I wrote before, everyone has different tolerance levels, and some may feel uncomfortable with what I feel is acceptable. I would strongly recommend that you inspect the alignment of the GMT in all 24 positions before purchasing.

(5) For Reference 
https://www.watchuseek.com/f275/alignement-gmt-hand-am-i-expecting-too-much-530347.html

Thanks for reading, and sorry for the delayed reply.


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## Jazzmaster

*Re: SOLVED!! Re: Glycine Airman 22 (24hr Hand Adjustment??)*

It is unfortunate that the problem that both you and I experienced exists to begin with. After the anticipation and excitement leading up to the arrival of the Glycine Airman, it is certainly discouraging to experience such a flaw. Add to that the fact that no one wants to turn around and send their brand new watch off for repair. Be that as it may, my own experience turned out well, and it sounds as if yours did, as well. Glad to hear it!

As far as the precision of the GMT hand on the ETA 2893-2 -- there is apparently some gear backlash that is inherent in this movement, which explains why the GMT hand may not line up precisely on all of the hours. Nevertheless, any imprecision should be small. If one is expecting micro-precision in this regard, it may be necessary to adjust expectations a bit. I say this based upon having three different watches (different manufacturers) with this movement. One of these watches is off by just a couple of minutes -- something which annoyed me at first, but something I gradually accepted as being within the acceptable performance range for the ETA 2893-2. And, in terms of function, this kind of minor imprecision does not get in the way of being able to tell at a glance what the time is in a second time zone.

Here are a couple of other threads that illustrate some misalignment issues:

Steinhart Ocean GMT with Lots of Pics

Steinhart Vintage GMT Hand -- Is it Off?

Cheers,
Jazz


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## heb

*Re: SOLVED!! Re: Glycine Airman 22 (24hr Hand Adjustment??)*

Whew! Nice job grotty.

Can you imagine what we would do with all that spare time if all our new wristwatches didn't have any quality control, or other, issues?

I don't think we ever have to worry about it.

Good luck,
heb



grotty said:


> After spending nearly 3 months, I am happy to announce........


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## grotty

*Re: SOLVED!! Re: Glycine Airman 22 (24hr Hand Adjustment??)*

A bit late, but here is my new Airman 22!


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## Jusantti

*Re: SOLVED!! Re: Glycine Airman 22 (24hr Hand Adjustment??)*

The cause to misalignment can also be bending of the dial holding pins. My base 22 dropped to hard surface and apparently the movement bended one of the dial pins. Hands were aligned at 24: and about 1mm off at 12:00. Fixed with a new dial.

For sale: a base 22 dial for repair:-d


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## Yunsung

*Re: SOLVED!! Re: Glycine Airman 22 (24hr Hand Adjustment??)*

I have been doing some reading up on this model as I am thinking of making a purchase.

Hopefully there are more opinions then what has already been stated, or even better, the users that have had the problems - how is the GMT hand alignment issue been since?

I have read through all of the useful links posted throughout this thread, but the general impression I get is that it is luck whether or not they have this problem.


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## whifferdill

*Re: SOLVED!! Re: Glycine Airman 22 (24hr Hand Adjustment??)*

Glycine have had a history of hand alignment issues - even on the purist watches, but my motto is still to 'keep it simple' and I am happy with the purist version - makes more sense to me and, there are less problems........


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## Yunsung

*Re: SOLVED!! Re: Glycine Airman 22 (24hr Hand Adjustment??)*

What do you mean by keep it simple?


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## whifferdill

*Re: SOLVED!! Re: Glycine Airman 22 (24hr Hand Adjustment??)*



Yunsung said:


> What do you mean by keep it simple?


As in, the less hands there are, the less likely something will be / become misaligned.


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## Twix2247

Just received my Airman 1953 Vintage edition. Because this a purist watch the main hour hand is the 24 hour hand. It too is suffering from the same problem the Base 22 watch mentioned in this forum is having. The hour hand alignment is off by 25 min. I will be taking an AD when I get back home this December, I just feel that for the money spent quality control should have been better.


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## Yunsung

Twix2247 said:


> Just received my Airman 1953 Vintage edition. Because this a purist watch the main hour hand is the 24 hour hand. It too is suffering from the same problem the Base 22 watch mentioned in this forum is having. The hour hand alignment is off by 25 min. I will be taking an AD when I get back home this December, I just feel that for the money spent quality control should have been better.


I thought this problem was only to do with traditional GMT movements? So when you have 3 main hands and the GMT hand does not correspond with the main hour hand. Your purist must be totally unusable it sounds?


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## whifferdill

Yunsung said:


> I thought this problem was only to do with traditional GMT movements? So when you have 3 main hands and the GMT hand does not correspond with the main hour hand. Your purist must be totally unusable it sounds?


It's not a new problem, unfortunately - I had a misalignment issue with my Special II and my experience was not incommon, so as the poster says, there's a problem with Glycine's quality control - fortunately my Base 22 is fine.


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## Twix2247

Yunsung said:


> I thought this problem was only to do with traditional GMT movements? So when you have 3 main hands and the GMT hand does not correspond with the main hour hand. Your purist must be totally unusable it sounds?


It does make it difficult. My hope is that it can be fixed by the AD (Saltzmans) and not have to be sent back to Glycine. Other than that I love the watch. Pretty effective since work uses 24 hour time and I constantly reference Zulu time. I do like how it is some what of a limited edition too, only 600 to be made. They just should do a better job of ensuring the watch is functioning properly before shipping. Especially for a 60th anniversary edition.


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## LH2

I purchased a new Base 22 Purist version mid-March. Right out of the box, the hands were out of sync. When the hour hand was square on the hour marker, the minute hand would be at :40.

AD got me a shipping label and the watch spent just over 2 weeks at the repair facility for the U.S.

I got my new (still has the plastic on the crystals) Airman back yesterday. The good news is the hands are aligned now.

The bad news is that my Airman is the version with the 12-on-top dial, and the date wheel clicks over at noon instead of midnight.

I don't know if it left the factory this way, or if this happened during the warranty work to align the hands.

Now I'm waiting for the service center to respond to my email about the latest problem. It's been 24 hours. 

I know they spend a good bit on overnight shipping a watch, but I cannot believe they didn't notice this before shipping it back to me.

So I've 'owned' an Airman for 3 weeks that I haven't worn, because it needs a second trip in for warranty work. I want to love this watch, but Glycine QC seems to need some work.


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## Emre

that sucks, had the same issue with a Tissot Navigator 24 hour dial-date change at 12 noon.Generally watch services they really don't look at the dial and start acting so as all watches are 12 hour dials, or never have dealt before with a 24 hour watch. When I pointed that its a 24 hour watch ( 12 on top ) the guy said : ahhh I thought its just accessory! Spend 15 more minutes and date change started to switch at 24 o'clock finally.If the AD doesn't know what their product is, is waist of time.


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## Uwe W.

LH2 said:


> I purchased a new Base 22 Purist version mid-March. Right out of the box, the hands were out of sync.


It's been known to happen with that ETA movement. I've seen many, many reports of misaligned GMT hands, even though it was different manufacturers, the watches used the same movement.



LH2 said:


> The bad news is that my Airman is the version with the 12-on-top dial, and the date wheel clicks over at noon instead of midnight.


That's ridiculous, and I certainly feel for you. Whoever installed the hands on that watch was clearly not paying attention, or the wrong dial was installed on the watch, either way it's totally unacceptable. It's unfortunate that all of this is happening to you, but for what it's worth this isn't representative of the norm for Glycine watches.


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## Aquavit

Uwe W. said:


> It's been known to happen with that ETA movement. I've seen many, many reports of misaligned GMT hands, even though it was different manufacturers, the watches used the same movement.
> 
> That's ridiculous, and I certainly feel for you. Whoever installed the hands on that watch was clearly not paying attention, or the wrong dial was installed on the watch, either way it's totally unacceptable. It's unfortunate that all of this is happening to you, but for what it's worth *this isn't representative of the norm for Glycine watches.*


I'm not so sure about that, given I had the same problem (posted on my own thread) there is certainly something of a pattern here.

Mine was blamed on being dropped in transit but I'm not convinced considering that a fair few more have surfaced with the same issue (including purist dials).


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## Uwe W.

Aquavit said:


> I'm not so sure about that, given I had the same problem (posted on my own thread) there is certainly something of a pattern here.
> 
> Mine was blamed on being dropped in transit but I'm not convinced considering that a fair few more have surfaced with the same issue (including purist dials).


Ah, but that's an issue with the ETA 2893-2, not a fault of Glycine's QC. There are other manufacturers that are also experiencing the same hand alignment problem, and in most cases that I've read about, it was with watches that were individually shipped via a courier or postal system. And with respect to getting the wrong dial version, I suspect that was a screwup at the AD level.

I'm pretty sure if you read through this sub-forum that you'll find there are very few complaints about the quality of Glycine's products. I personally own three and they're all flawless in performance and build. No doubt you're having some pretty bad luck, it would certainly leave me with a bad taste in my mouth, but I still believe that Glycine puts out a very good quality watch.

Please keep us posted on this issue; I really hope that everything is resolved to your satisfaction.


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## jbbusybee

Hi Larry

Sorry your having these problems, but as said Glycine do make a great watch and I've not had any problems with the 2893 in Glycine or Muhle Watches....mind you I am quite fussy and do check every one as it comes in and before it goes out. if you need any help, you've got my direct email.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD


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## LH2

My Airman is at the U.S. service center (again) fixing the date changing at noon issue. Second time is a charm I guess. 

My opinion of Glycine is not what it was, although I like the two that I own. I won't be buying another.


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## jbbusybee

I've got 2 Purists arriving next week, I'll check them very carefully they certainly won't go to the customers like this.

 Larry


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD


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## Uwe W.

jbbusybee said:


> I've got 2 Purists arriving next week, I'll check them very carefully they certainly won't go to the customers like this.


In the reports I've read on this issue they never leave the AD or manufacturer with misaligned hands. The consensus seems to be that the problem occurs during the final transport to the consumer, which we have to assume was a very rough one. I don't recall the exact details about this particular issue, but apparently ETA is aware of it.


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## jbbusybee

Hi Uwe

Yes I am pretty sure this is the case too, I've seen some shocking 'packing' especially on Glycine watches. I have a good relationship with Glycine and they have strict instructions on how I like all my watches shipped.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD


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## kiwitan

I have got a brand new 2 month old airman base 22 before the gmt hand suddenly became misaligned. Sent back to service center and the watch technician was kind enough to replace a misaligned gear. 2 weeks after repair the same hand became misaligned. He again set it right. Now I am waiting to see if it happens again.

The watch has never been subjected to rough wear or had its time adjusted during the 9pm to 3 am window. It really makes me regret getting this brand



Sodiac said:


> I've owned about 20 Glycines, and to be honest, the quality is spotty, which is a shame. There have been other threads about this issue before. The good thing is, they should fix the problem. So I take it you have not purchased the watch yet, but are waiting to see if the AD can get it fixed? It shouldn't be a big deal, just a re-installation of the hand?


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## Uwe W.

kiwitan said:


> The watch has never been subjected to rough wear or had its time adjusted during the 9pm to 3 am window. It really makes me regret getting this brand


That's a shame and unfortunate. Of course it's also something that could have happened with any other brand. If you sift through the posts in this sub-forum you'll find that what you're experiencing is a rare exception and not the norm. There was an issue with the GMT hand alignment a while back - it was not a problem exclusive to Glycine, but with the ETA movement itself - so maybe yours is a hangover from that period? Main thing is that it gets fixed and it sounds like you're at least getting good service.


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## madengr

Just opened a new AB22 purchased from mail order AD with same alignment issue; 25 minutes off. Is the GMT hand supposed to move only in full hour increments when turning the crown? Mine seems to slip into 1/2 hour increments in a couple of positions. So I'm wondering if something is off in the movement, or if the GMT hand is simply misaligned on the pinion.


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## madengr

Watch was repaired by authorized service center, under warranty. Alignment now perfect.


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## powerband

madengr said:


> Watch was repaired by authorized service center, under warranty. Alignment now perfect.


So was the hand merely off on the pinion or was something off in the movement?

Sent from my slingshot using Tapatumble


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## UofRSpider

Steinhart lol.


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## powerband

UofRSpider said:


> Steinhart lol.


Definitely, but I hope not to the same frequency.

Sent from my slingshot using Tapatumble


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## andras53

The issue apparently still exists. I just received a brand new Base 22 GMT and the GMT hand is useless (off by about 1/2 hour). I bought this to replace my Steinhart Ocean GMT Vintage but guess what.... my Steiny stays and the Glycine is going back for a refund and I will never look at Glycine again! 
The first post in this thread is from 2012 so in six years Glycine has not seen fit to fix this issue on a watch that retail for well over a grand?!?


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## Rosims

andras53 said:


> The issue apparently still exists. I just received a brand new Base 22 GMT and the GMT hand is useless (off by about 1/2 hour). I bought this to replace my Steinhart Ocean GMT Vintage but guess what.... my Steiny stays and the Glycine is going back for a refund and I will never look at Glycine again!
> The first post in this thread is from 2012 so in six years Glycine has not seen fit to fix this issue on a watch that retail for well over a grand?!?


Just got my Base 22 Mystery 3days ago, same problem out of the box....really sucks because I thought Glycine was good. After reading this thread, I am just sending it back for a refund. At least until I find a different brand. too bad I thought this was a really cool looking watch. You would think they have had time to figure out how to make the hands align with the dial......


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## geoxman

Rosims said:


> Just got my Base 22 Mystery 3days ago, same problem out of the box....really sucks because I thought Glycine was good. After reading this thread, I am just sending it back for a refund. At least until I find a different brand. too bad I thought this was a really cool looking watch. You would think they have had time to figure out how to make the hands align with the dial......


maybe NOS.
I just received one and it is fine. good luck


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