# New STOWA Logo. Official announcement. :-)



## Jörg Schauer

Hello everybody,

for a few weeks we now have a new Logo.

This Logo was already used for 2 - 3 watches (*Antea 390 with A 10 *movement and *24 H Racing Countdown* and *GMT Worldtimer* watch) 
and in our communication (Facebook, Onlineshop,...)

Of course we will add this new Logo* step by step *to *all watch models.*

But this procedure will need* appr. 6 - 12 months.*

Watches being already ordered and confirmed will of course be delivered with the old logo.

The time and procedure to change all watches is a hard way, but we have to do it without exception.

Changing the logo is never easy, but there are reasons for it and now we have to do it ;-)

The new Logo was suggested by Hartmut Esslinger, founder of frog design
(one of the most famous industrial designers in the last 40 years).

*The procedure will be like this:*
1 - all ordered watches with the old Logo will be delivered with the old Logo

2 - if we show a watch in the shop with new Logo it is only possible to have it with the new one

3 - if you want to have the new Logo, you have to cancel your order and wait until the new model with the new Logo is available (Maybe this needs a long time - yet we can't say when it will be, also the movement we use and prices can change - it depends on the supplier situation.)


*IMPORTANT:*
The Onlineshop is always up to date, so please have a look at the models before you order.

You will receive exactly what you have ordered 

This is the easiest way to do it.

Right now we can't exactly determine the date all modells will be available with the new Logo. 
This depends on the orderquantitie and the suppliers possibilities and the movement situation.

*Different reasons cause this situation:*
1 - at the moment we have no possibility to know which and how many movements we will get 
from ETA and other suppliers in 2014 .
(We already have ideas and wishes but no confirmations from movementsuppliers.)

2 - we don't know exactly how long we have to work with the old Logo dials we have in stock, this depends 
of course on how much our customers will order. (For each single watch this will be different!)

3 - we already have long term orders for dials under way and we have to wait which dials could be changed to the new logo.
This also depends on our suppliers.

So, please always have a look in the Onlineshop to be updated.
We will also inform you via newsletter, please sign in at our Onlineshop.


If you have a watch in progress you will get it with the old Logo like you ordered it. 
If you want to have the new Logo please cancel your existing order by mail and wait a few months till we launch step by step the new Logo version of your watch.
(Please be advised again that we have no precise informations which movement and which price we have to demand for the new Logo version of your dreamwatch.)

I know that now the discussions are starting: Which is better? old or new? ;-)

My feelings are torn between as well.

Of course the new one is the future, but i also respect the old one.

The design of the STOWA watches are clear and unique and the quality is really good.

If you decide to keep the old Logo order existing or to change it into the new one this is up to you:

It is a small change on the dial, a lot of people only see it at second glance.

I love my "old" Logo watches.

And I will love my new ones ;-) as well because I try to keep STOWA's design-language which always should be clear and easy.


One critical point maybe is the increasing price for future new models.

For some of them we have to use the new Soprod A10 movement which is much more expensive than the ETA 2824-2 movement.

But we have to change more models to the A10 movements as ETA is not supplying the quantitie of 2824-2 we need.

So if I should decide I would keep my existing order with the old Logo dial and wait what's coming up in the future. 
(Of course this is the best guarantee to get exactly the watch you have chosen for exactly the price you have planned.)

And this, and we always want to tell the truth, is the best and easiest way to keep the confusion as small as possible for us as a producer as well ;-)

But you as clients are always the base and mostly important for our business model and if you want to have the new Logo on your existing order you can cancel easily by mail and we confirm ASAP.**

 Best regards

Jörg Schauer


** Maybe it can be possible in the future to change the old Logo dial during a service into the new Logo dial, this is always worth a question or discussion. We will make offers for this.(at least when we know exactly which dials fit the actual model) But please be advised that this only makes sense during a normal service or repair in which the watch has to be disassembled completely. Making it outside a normal service is too expensive.


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## flyingpicasso

There will certainly be a lot of discussion about this--I'll go ahead and jump in. I think incorporating the stylized W logo into the dial is good, though I much prefer the look of the STOWA script in the old logo. The A10 seems to be a great alternative to the ETA--one that I would have gladly paid more for, so I for one would not balk at a small price bump due to the movement change.


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## eliz

Hi Jorg

Thanks for the informative post, as always! The new logo is pretty neat I'd say but... the heritage of Stowa lies in the old logo with the bigger and curvy S. It's thoughtful of you guys to allow people to change dials in the future when their watch gets serviced but until then, I think I'd be more satisfied with the old Logo on my flieger. 

Cheerios


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## Torrefies

I think the new logo will match the aesthetic of the sportier watches much better (testaf, prodiver, etc) than it will the more clasic design of the antea. Sporty or dressy though, the new logo would never deter me from getting another Stowa.


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## some.idiot

I like the big curvy S.

This might be a good compromise on a dial (from eliz's signature):


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## Francois Boucher

The old script/logo was incredibly good, as it aged extremely well. Sad to see it go.

Thank you for all the information, Jörg! It is nice to see you so close to your clients/fans!


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## bigdog

I don't mind the combining of the two existing historic logos. However, One doesn't see BMW, Porsche, MB Changing their corporate logos just because they figured it was time for a change. Changing logos "just for the sake of change" is not really a good reason for making said change. Especially when a design "guru" whom makes money from such a change suggests the change. I see that as a conflict of interest. It is Stowa that will loose if "Frog" is wrong for changing Stowa's logo even though Stowa is wildly popular and can't even meet demand for their products. Frog and Herr Esslinger have nothing to loose. Most companies only re-brand with a new logo after having closed, Gone bankrupt. Then reopen with a new direction. Then it's appropriate to change. To me. It just dilutes the history of the brand. Just the same as Swatch "buying" the logo of Hamilton watch company then putting said logo on run of the mill mass produced Swiss watches. This will sound harsh. But. The only time Herr Esslinger should speak and make suggestions.(with all due respect to him) Is when he is "hired" to make suggestions. And even then he is not infallible. The German people and the old companies of Germany pride themselves on tradition. Don't throw part of that tradition out the window.


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## Kronprinz

*Never change a winning Logo?*

Stowa has a new logo.
I'm fascinated by Stowa watches, and I'll be fascinated by them in the future, too.
What Jörg Schauer probably hoped now to change the logo is not understandable for me.:roll:
It would have been understandable for me if it had happened, when Jörg Schauer has taken over the company Stowa to underline the start of the new era.
But now- why?
You read in the descriptions of the Stowa watches of reduction to the essentials (for example, no seconds hand, or the words "Made in Germany" not on dial) .
And now You find the modified Stowa logo printed on the dial of a Stowa Antea 390...:-|
What is the sence of the destruction of the old logo, which was telling a big history?
I do not understand.
Among other things, the reason why I had then decided against buying a Nomos Tangomat was the subtle, beautiful and tidier design of the Stowa Antea dial.
Now it's history.
I love my Stowa Antea with "old logo" and I have to accept in the future the new Stowa logo on my next Stowa watch...:think:

Excuse my english is not perfect...


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## Nolimits

I'm very disappointed by this, one of the things I like about Stowa is how true and respectful you are to your history. Most of your models are updated versions of previous Stowa models and the historical element really appeals to me. I could just about handle a change to the logo like maybe the font, but the slanted "S" should stay. 

All in all this is a change I'm not very happy with, I really feel disappointed by Stowa here.


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## turtje

I'm a bit surprised to. If you like mechanical watches you'll probably like the history of certain brands. That history is partly incorporated in a logo that has served the brand so well for such a long period of time. I really like that beautifully curved stowa S. I'm sad as well to see it go and I don't see a good reason to do so.


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## zpyder

What about the fliegers with option for "no logo"? I assume this won't change.

To be honest, I don't really get why someone would want to "upgrade" their watch to the new logo. Rather, I could understand if someone could request at a service to have the dial "retrofitted" with the old logo if available.

Though my flieger is without logo, I imagine in 20+ years, this logo change could add value to the old watches as it adds a bit more history to the brand. An enthusiast would be able to say "that is a Stowa from before the logo change in 2013" etc?

I don't get though why new dials, if they need to be different in shape to accomodate different movements, couldn't be printed with the old logo. Maybe an option like with the fliegers, instead of "no logo" or "with logo", how about "with new logo" and "with old logo"?


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## Francois Boucher

*Re: Never change a winning Logo?*

Actually, it is a bit surprising to want to change that script&#8230;

Just think of the Breitling "B"&#8230; everyone knows what that "B" is, as soon as one sees it, even alone, by itself. Ebel's E, same&#8230; The Ω&#8230; I don't have to tell anyone what that stands for&#8230; The Zodiac logo, the Seiko font, the Montblanc logo and font&#8230; Tutima's T isn't Tissot's. I'm quite certain you "see" them in your mind's eye as you read this&#8230; Apple's special, compressed Garamond font. All are so immediately significant!

The long, curvy S spells Stowa for anyone who knows anything about watches&#8230; loud and clear. For 86 years?

That kind of brand recognition is worth a fortune&#8230; Why throw that away?


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## zpyder

*Re: Never change a winning Logo?*

Could it be that there is/was a risk of the S being confused with the Sinn S? I know they're different side by side, but I guess there could have been the chance at some point Sinn may have said "They're using our italic S design" or vice versa?


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## frogger17

I like the new logo. :-! Just my opinion, as is the rest of this.

Everybody is entitled to their opinion and people have different tolerances for and emotional reactions to change. Take the fliegers, for example. While it may be closer to the original than IWC's, Laco's fans might point to the curved lugs and say Stowa has compromised on authenticity, but I think you'd be hard-pressed to find any Stowaristi who agrees.

Who knows what business reason caused Jorg to change the logo, but it's his business and I'd rather Stowa continue to be successful and offer the great values they do. And part of that success could be the modernization of a somewhat outdated logo. Lots of companies do it, and not just to re-brand themselves after failure. There was a time when Mercedes really only marketed to the wealthy and this was part of their "brand." But then they decided to become accessible to more people and they are better off for it.

It's great that Jorg is again reaching out to his most devoted clientele through this forum, knowing that there will be some very vocal dissenters.


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## Francois Boucher

*Re: Never change a winning Logo?*

That could not happen: Sinn was established in 1961, Stowa in 1927&#8230; and I believe the long curvy S was present at least in the thirties, and maybe from the inception&#8230;


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## Francois Boucher

*Re: Never change a winning Logo?*

Brand recognition definition by Investopedia.
*
Definition of 'Brand Recognition' *

The extent to which the general public (or an organization's target market) is able to identify a brand by its attributes. Brand recognition is most successful when people can state a brand without being explicitly exposed to the company's name, but rather through visual signifiers like logos, slogans and colors.

*Investopedia explains 'Brand Recognition' *

To measure brand recognition and the effectiveness of promotional campaigns, many companies will perform experiments on study groups. Both aided and unaided recall tests may be used. With similar products, brand recognition will result in higher sales, even if both brands are of equal quality.
​Yes&#8230; Stowa had two immediately recognizable logos (&#8230;well, a logo and a script "S"), apart from their full name. Now, they have one.


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## chickenlittle

I prefer the old logo as Stowa's history is what drew me to this particular brand. Maybe I should order the Antea KS now and hope I will get the old logo instead.


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## MichaelKG

*Re: Never change a winning Logo?*

Can anyone show me exactly what is meant by the old and new logo?

I googled the Antea (stowa site with the new logo and then OLD google pics) and I really see no difference.


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## Shieze

chickenlittle said:


> I prefer the old logo as Stowa's history is what drew me to this particular brand. Maybe I should order the Antea KS now and hope I will get the old logo instead.


You don't need to hope if the pictures on the site for the watch are still showing the old logo. So far only the white dial 390 was the only antea that was changed.


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## Quartersawn

I've been on the fence for a year about buying an MO. This pushed me over the edge - I want my MO to have the same logo the original deck watches had 70 years ago. So I just ordered one.

I think the new logo is nice but I am a prisoner of tradition and much prefer the original logo.


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## Francois Boucher

*Re: Never change a winning Logo?*

The logo, in itself, has not changed:










But the script has; old on the left, new on the right:


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## KiwiWomble

*Re: Never change a winning Logo?*

old one is much bettter, a real art deco feel....new one looks like an insurance firm....


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## Takemusu

*Re: Never change a winning Logo?*

Unless Stowa is repositioning itself in the market, changing their philosophy, or making a substantial change, this move is highly questionable IMHO. If it is being made without substantial marketing fanfare, it is also highly questionable and a HUGE missed opportunity. Businesses only change brands in the dark of night for two reasons. First, because they do not fully understand the power of a brand launch, or Two, to hide something.

As a designer myself I often see poor adherence to brand standards from the CEO level on down. No one seems to realize or understand the power of brand recognition or history anymore....Often a decision maker just wants something different, not understanding that different is not always better.


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## MichaelKG

*Re: Never change a winning Logo?*



Francois Boucher said:


> The logo, in itself, has not changed:
> 
> But the script has; old on the left, new on the right:


Thanks, I didn't even see the new logo on the site.

I don't think the new one is ugly but I would have kept it original.


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## LesDavidson

Not a positive step for me for many of the reasons already posted. The Antea just doesn't look 'right' IMHO....


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## d88

Sorry Jorg, I don't like the new logo design at all. The new logo typeface is far too generic and bland for my liking. At least the old logo was unique, looked classy and had a sense history and prestige about it, the new logo has nothing of these qualities.

I appreciate you may be trying to move Stowa from a reliance on the historical older model and look to something more modern, however the new logo design is a mistake and hopefully will be rectified sooner rather than later.


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## uncleed

*Re: Never change a winning Logo?*

You see the direction with the new watches....he is still preserving the old designs but is bringing newer ones to the market...maybe he felt he needed to update the logo as well, to put his stamp on it. I like the old design personally
.


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## Francois Boucher

*Re: Never change a winning Logo?*

Maybe there is some legal reason compelling the change of logo/script?


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## MasterBlaster300

*Re: Never change a winning Logo?*

I have to agree that I prefer the simplicity of the old logo. Hope Jorg clarifies the reasons for the change.
Also, I have an KS Antea on order, will that have the old style? Plus given the new prices and logo, I might order a Marine Original Roman, but will it have the old or new logo. Is there a deadline for new vs old Logo?

b.
ps. While I am not happy about the new logo, I do thank Stowa for giving us advanced warning about the price increase!

edit!! Ok, I see Jorg answered some of my questions here.
https://www.watchuseek.com/f36/new-stowa-logo-official-announcement-868533-post6375575.html


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## CM HUNTER

I understand changing the logo for the reason of moving ahead in the future with new designs. Up until now, except for the new TESTAF and 24hr and GMT models, ALMOST every single watch Stowa put out was based on historical models in some way (even the chronographs were based off of marine, pilot, and pocket watches). So having a new logo for the new design direction I can understand.... but to throw away the original logo altogether I can't understand.

Keep the classic logo for the historically based models and use the new logo for the "new direction" models. The older ones don't change at all, just keep doing what you've been doing. The new logo goes on the obviously larger dials. Easy to keep up with and both the future and past are cohesive.


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## suaku

Hi Jorg

I have loved your designs and creations since I started buying watches. The simple clean looks, sans serif fonts, well thought dials with matching date wheel usually at 6oclock, no number/markers "cut away", etc. These are the things that Stowa fans love and appreciate.

But the new logo looks to be opposite of the design cues you and Stowa have stood for. This is most puzzling. Do you really feel that the new logo is right and looks better?

I can only hope that the logo is not phased out completely.


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## Polaroid

Often I think people on watch forums overreact to the tiniest little details. Not this time. 

The old Stowa logo is so distinctive and beautiful, I can say that it was a large part of both my initial and continuing attraction to the brand. 

My first Stowa is due to be shipped in a few weeks, and I can say with 100% certainty that if it was coming with the new logo I would cancel the order. 

Is it too much to ask to have the modern design only on modern watch styles? Or just continue with the old version! Unlike the new one, it could go with anything.


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## MasterBlaster300

Saxon007 said:


> I've been on the fence for a year about buying an MO. This pushed me over the edge - I want my MO to have the same logo the original deck watches had 70 years ago. So I just ordered one.
> 
> I think the new logo is nice but I am a prisoner of tradition and much prefer the original logo.


That makes two of us! Between the new logo and price increase I decided to order a MO Roman today!
Always wanted to get an MO Roman with the Unitas movement! But I already have an Antea KS on order.
I was going to wait till next year to get an MO but,
oh well, better sooner then later. You never know, the old logo versions may become more of a collectible in the future.


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## Polaroid

*Re: Never change a winning Logo?*



Francois Boucher said:


>


This picture has me feeling like it must be April Fool's day. If it weren't coming straight from Jörg I would not believe Stowa would switch to that characterless design.


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## Polaroid

Jörg Schauer said:


> ** Maybe it can be possible in the future to change the old Logo dial during a service into the new Logo dial, this is always worth a question or discussion.


I wouldn't worry much about this part, I can't imagine anyone is going to want to have it done.


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## some.idiot

CM HUNTER said:


> I understand changing the logo for the reason of moving ahead in the future with new designs. Up until now, except for the new TESTAF and 24hr and GMT models, ALMOST every single watch Stowa put out was based on historical models in some way (even the chronographs were based off of marine, pilot, and pocket watches). So having a new logo for the new design direction I can understand.... but to throw away the original logo altogether I can't understand.
> 
> Keep the classic logo for the historically based models and use the new logo for the "new direction" models. The older ones don't change at all, just keep doing what you've been doing. The new logo goes on the obviously larger dials. Easy to keep up with and both the future and past are cohesive.


Agree with this. The new Flieger would be cool with the new logo, but the "classic" older models should keep the old design.


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## Shieze

*Re: Never change a winning Logo?*

I first thought people were over reacting but the side by side picture makes me dislike the new logo as well. I like the idea of the thinner movement but the new logo may push me to a used special edition Antea.


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## knight427

some.idiot said:


> Agree with this. The new Flieger would be cool with the new logo, but the "classic" older models should keep the old design.


I also agree with Hunter's suggestion to split the logos according to new design vs classic. But I don't think I care nearly as much as most of the people posting in this thread. The logo change won't effect my current or future buying decisions in any way.


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## valmak

i think this is a great move Jorg. wasn't a big fan of the old design. it was too old school. like the updated design.


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## Tanjecterly

*Re: Never change a winning Logo?*

I, too, like the old logo better. Given a preference, I'd purchase Stowa watches with the old logo. I suspect there'll be an uptick in demand in the old logo watches.


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## Tanjecterly

Not really digging the new logo, but it'll probably grow on me. There may be an uptick in demand, however, on the old "S" logo watches! Those watches will become collectibles.


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## Decius

bigdog said:


> However, One doesn't see BMW, Porsche, MB Changing their corporate logos just because they figured it was time for a change.


Oh, they do this too. Mercedes:









Volkswagen:








A look at some car companies logos design evolution

Still, I think the combination on the Seatime would be the best logo, incorporating the old typographical version and the logo both. The new one looks very modern, more fitting for all the new, minimal dial watches, not for the classic ones.


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## StufflerMike

I am old fashioned and do not really care what successfull designers say or advise. I love the old logo with its curvy S very much.









However, I have to admit the new logo looks good on the new watches with their more technical layout (TeStaf, GMT, 24-Count-down).


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## Andrzej

Whilst it would not affect my buying decision, I prefer the "old" logo. 

If there were to be a change, like Mike said in one of his first posts, I would have liked the "W" above the Stowa with the original script retained, rather than alongside and the new script.


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## nothenorm

I prefer the old "S"towa as well : )​


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## Takemusu

Decius said:


> Oh, they do this too. Mercedes:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Volkswagen:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> A look at some car companies logos design evolution
> 
> Still, I think the combination on the Seatime would be the best logo, incorporating the old typographical version and the logo both. The new one looks very modern, more fitting for all the new, minimal dial watches, not for the classic ones.


These are both great examples of how you create a change without losing identity. These logos evolved, and always for a reason, never really throwing away brand recognizability.


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## d88

stuffler said:


> I am old fashioned and do not really care what successfull designers say or advise. I love the old logo with its curvy S very much.
> 
> View attachment 1101584
> 
> 
> However, I have to admit the new logo looks good on the new watches with their more technical layout (TeStaf, GMT, 24-Count-down).


I wouldn't call it old fashioned Mike, I'd say the (old) logo design is distinctive, unique and clearly marks out a Stowa from other watch brands.


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## bigdog

And the fonts in all the above examples except the 1939 VW are the same throughout the years. As I said. I have no issue with the combining of the two existing logos to make a third. I just think the stylized "S" should remain. Of course cars are a necessity. Thus folks will put up with more change. Watches aren't a necessity. Watches are certainly more of a luxury. As such. There are things one shouldn't change. Even on new models.


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## Jörg Schauer

Hello everybody,

many thanks for the feelings about the new Logo.
We knew that it will be a discussion, but the way back is not possible and we don´t want it.

I think the best sample is the Mercedes and VW Logo history.

Like everybody can see, there are sometimes bigger steps necessary, sometimes smaller ones.

But this and many other samples show us that the step forward is always a step forward.

Of course it will need time to accept this.

*And i fully respect thoose people who likes the older one better.*

Although my best friend likes the older one better, but this doesn´t stop me to launch the new one ;-)

We should have a look to the future and to the past.

But never just keep something because it is old and good.

I am always thinking, respect the old but create new ones if you have the feeling that it will be better.

But it is like many other thinks if we talk about design and taste.

There are many different existing and this is good !

There are black and small watches outside, there are white and big watches outside, no matter, if they designed in a good balance i can respect both and i don´t say that one of thoose is rubbish ;-)

The same with Logos of companies.

You like it or you don´t.

But this is only a small point of the decision to buy or not.

There are much bigger reasons to buy a watch.

Quality, price relation to quality, uniqueness, design, service and so on ;-)

So, we know that it was the right step, we also know that some people don´t agree at the moment.

We respect all of thoose.

Best regards

Jörg Schauer


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## Kronprinz

You also must look to FIAT- they changed back to their classical logo after many years until now...:-!


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## d88

The analogy with the VW and MB logos, although interesting and true to an extent regarding their evolution,is a little misleading in that when you buy a car the logo badge in relation to the overall size of the car proportion wise, is minuscule. A watch manufacturer doesn't have the luxury of this, in that every little detail on the dial stands out and therefore the design is subject to more intense scrutiny, more so than a logo badge on a car. I'd also say that the logo, as part of the overall dial design is every bit of important as the other components that make up a watch.

Of course there is a valid argument that the new design may be better suited to the new (modern) watches that Jorg manufactures and I understand that, however on the classic style Stowa's such as on the Bauhaus inspired Antea's, the new logo just looks out of place.


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## SelmerSuperAction80II

I respect the decision made by Jorg, BUT I Love my three Stowa watches with the OLD logo.


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## sandymcg

I don't really mind the old vs. new part of this, although it is a bit ironic that with so many watch companies trying to create a "history", Stowa seems to be de-emphasising its history. However, I do think that the new logo is technically badly designed in the sense that there is no visual distinction between the "logo" part and the text part. On a watch face, it would be much better to have the logo part above and centered on the "Stowa" text. The way it is at the moment, there's a moment of disorientation as you try to work out what's text and what's symbol.


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## martin_blank

Considering the underlying theme of most of stowa's line I don't think anyone is going to be missing out on nods to the past...

I like the new logo/ font. It looks cleaner and more mature. I always felt the curved 's' looked like it was off centered/ out of balance. 

It's always better to leave something a bit too early than a bit too late..


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## J_Hack

Herr Schauer... 

Is there a specific time frame for the change in each models logo? For example are all of the Marine style changing first then the Antea and so forth? Or is it just as the new dials come in they will begin to change over to the new logo? I am waiting on a Dagaz and thinking of selling off my preorder to place an order for an Antea KS. So knowing this may make the decision for me of whether to cancel or not. Like others, I too prefer the old style 'S' as opposed to the new logo.

In addition to this - did anyone notice the Prodiver has Limette hands available now?! I haven't browsed the online shop for awhile and they look great!


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## bigdog

Well. I see it was a mistake to bring up the auto logo's. Bad choice on my part. Most folks need a car. Most folks (like my wife) see a car as a way to get from point A to point B. Therefore. They are seen by most as a tool to get a job done. Then they trade them for a new one.

Watches on the other hand are something that will generally last longer than the owner and be handed down to others. I suppose I just view it as rather sad that many historic & successful companies choose to "mess" with something that does not need to be "messed" with. Especially when it is done in the name of being trendy or "changing with the times". There isn't a reason that I can think of to not put on the classic Stowa logo on a new watch. I wonder what the Bible and other classic stories would look like if the Esslinger's of the world got hold of them?


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## StufflerMike

Andrzej said:


> Whilst it would not affect my buying decision, I prefer the "old" logo.
> 
> If there were to be a change, like Mike said in one of his first posts, I would have liked the "W" above the Stowa with the original script retained, rather than alongside and the new script.


Thanks Andrzej for chiming in. When we had to decide on the logo of the first bunch of (limited) Seatime watches long time ago the reason to go for the "old" "W" and Stowa with its curvy "S" was: "If Stowa is proud of its history and Stowa is rightfull being proud and if the Seatime in modern shape is a homage to former Seatime watches then it has to be the old logo. It will need some time to get used to a modern two-part-logo on a watch which rightfully was is called a homage. Bringing together contemporary taste/design with "vintage" and "homage" watches is an ambitious endeavour. Good luck Stowa.


----------



## 92degrees

This seems like a tempest in a teapot to me. In a way that speaks well of Stowa -- people are so passionate that they get worked up about tweaks to a logotype.

I've worked in branding for 26 years (corporate identity is my area of expertise). I think the old logo is appealing for many reason but hardly think Stowa has thrown away or lost any brand equity by making this change.

I do not recall any instance when I've been involved in the redesign of a corporate ID that everyone was happy. We used to joke that if 20% love the new ID, 20% hate the new ID, and 60% hardly notice or care, then that's par for the course.

It's interesting to me that the old logos on my PD, which I'm wearing right now, do not match. Look at the "S" and the "A" and the width of the logo. I don't recall anyone crying over this. It's quaint, like the old logo itself.


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## bigdog

92degrees said:


> This seems like a tempest in a teapot to me. In a way that speaks well of Stowa -- people are so passionate that they get worked up about tweaks to a logotype.
> 
> I've worked in branding for 26 years (corporate identity is my area of expertise). I think the old logo is appealing for many reason but hardly think Stowa has thrown away or lost any brand equity by making this change.
> 
> I do not recall any instance when I've been involved in the redesign of a corporate ID that everyone was happy. We used to joke that if 20% love the new ID, 20% hate the new ID, and 60% hardly notice or care, then that's par for the course.
> 
> It's interesting to me that the old logos on my PD, which I'm wearing right now, do not match. Look at the "S" and the "A" and the width of the logo. I don't recall anyone crying over this. It's quaint, like the old logo itself.
> 
> View attachment 1101927


So then explain why one would seek to change a logo if 60% don't notice and 20% don't like it. So your basing a logo change on a 20% minority. What's the point then?

When it comes to common items such as household goods, Soap, Food company logo's. I'm in the I don't care column. I look at it from the point of view that if a company like Stowa goes down the road of logo change due to a fad/ change of direction. Then what will they (Stowa) change to or compromise to the cult of fad and wanting to "change with the times".


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## Peter Atwood

I totally agree with Steve. You guys are making mountains out of mole hills. I love the old logo but if you are truly paying attention you will see that is has not exactly been consistent through the years. I like the REALLY old one the best:









Just look at the S above, now that is nice!


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## 92degrees

bigdog said:


> So then explain why one would seek to change a logo if 60% don't notice and 20% don't like it. So your basing a logo change on a 20% minority. What's the point then?


I said 60% hardly notice or care -- I did not say that it was pointless. People respond to subtle changes in design without recognizing that they are effected. Coke has updated their typography many, many times. Facebook updated their logo recently as well -- from what I've read on the subject the vast majority of users have not noticed. Design is often an endless cycle of refinement and evolution. Car manufacturers often make relatively small tweaks to a model for new year -- changes that most people will not recognize -- the change may be for production reasons, cost efficiency, aesthetic reasons...


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## chickenlittle

Changing the logo on a watch seems more akin to changing the formula to New Coke in my opinion, rather than simply changing typography on a soda can.


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## eliz

By the look of things, there seem to be a majority support for the old logo.
I'm just glad my flieger's on the old logo. So YAY, increased value.


----------



## 92degrees

chickenlittle said:


> Changing the logo on a watch seems more akin to changing the formula to New Coke in my opinion, rather than simply changing typography on a soda can.


Your opinion is as valid as mine -- I'm not arguing with you -- I just don't see how this represents Stowa "changing its formula."











eliz said:


> By the look of things, there seem to be a majority support for the old logo.
> I'm just glad my flieger's on the old logo. So YAY, increased value.


I've owned a particular model of car for over 20 years. There are minor updates most years and major updates less frequently. Every change has been generally met with criticism -- "the new grill ruins the car! the new wheels are ugly! I prefer the old door pulls!" So it goes until the next change when people say they prefer an earlier version. Just an observation.


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## StufflerMike

92degrees said:


> View attachment 1102043


"Better" (sometimes) is the enemy of "good". Not always just a saying. Just saying.


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## NikAlex

I am totally against the new logo on older models! I'll take this "logo" may be only at the new models, but with great regret ...


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## bigdog

92degrees said:


> I said 60% hardly notice or care -- I did not say that it was pointless. People respond to subtle changes in design without recognizing that they are effected. Coke has updated their typography many, many times. Facebook updated their logo recently as well -- from what I've read on the subject the vast majority of users have not noticed. Design is often an endless cycle of refinement and evolution. Car manufacturers often make relatively small tweaks to a model for new year -- changes that most people will not recognize -- the change may be for production reasons, cost efficiency, aesthetic reasons...


I didn't claim that you said it was pointless. I asked you what is the point of changing a logo if 60% don't see the change, 20% don't like it. My bigger question is WHY the change. It's my understanding (or more about how I see it as a consumer) that most companies change a logo to coincide with a change in the company. Or to distance themselves from problems of the past. I.E. New ownership that fixes a products real or perceived problem area, Emergence from bankruptcy, Reviving a name from a no longer existing company.

Facebook? Who cares. It a free internet site. Same with Google. Also. Who cares about cheap consumable products. In the arena of cheap consumer products a logo change is more about getting noticed amongst the sea of other logos on the store shelf. I wouldn't think that would apply to Stowa. As chickenlittle points out. Coke tried to foist a new formula on the public. How did that work out?

As per the poster pointing out a subtle change in the angle of the stylized S as a logo change. Nice try.


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## chickenlittle

92degrees said:


> Your opinion is as valid as mine -- I'm not arguing with you -- I just don't see how this represents Stowa "changing its formula."


I buy a watch for its look. I buy a soft drink for its taste. Hence why I used this analogy. Not that I'm saying that New Coke was a bad idea...LOL.


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## Francois Boucher

bigdog said:


> As per the poster pointing out a subtle change in the angle of the stylized S as a logo change. Nice try.


I was trying to find the right words&#8230; you did. ;-)


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## StufflerMike

NikAlex said:


> I am totally against the new logo on older models! I'll take this "logo" may be only at the new models, but with great regret ...


It's time now to order an old logo, go hurry up. That's what I am going to do. Not decided on the model yet.


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## ccapri

Hello everybody. This is my first time in a forum EVER.
But as a designer especialized in corporate (brand) identity and product packaging, (for 20 years now...) I couldn't resist. 


Jörg:


Excuse me if I´m rude, english is not my first languaje. I wrote this entry many times trying not to be sarcastic, but this is the dumbest move I've seen since the "new Coke".


Lets see: you had a logo (wordmark) with two "parts", the name with a recognizable S, used since 1938, I guess, but still modern, and a symbol, great for a watch crown, but nothing special (yes, it´s historical, but too clumsy to be easily remembered like the S). So what are you doing? well, you are keeping with the strange symbol and ditching your signature S in favor of a nice but too generic tipography (gerenal public will probably perceive it as an Arial, helvetica or geneva or, if you are german, a Din). 


In spite of the opinion of a very well respected industrial designer, people, no matter how clever they are, can be wrong. (this count for this text also, of course).


Will you notice the bad impact of your "new" logo? probably not, because stowa is growing. But I´ll never buy a watch like antea with this two pieces logo, Nomos is allways there, so why bother with your watch? 


How many people think like me?, well, as this seem to has been a personal desition, you don't know, but, I´m sure, many.


It was necessary? Absolutely not. But again you are leading a growing company, going to races, designing new and modern watches, even a gmt!!! Of course you need a new logo!!! A brand new image according to this...well I´ve seen this pattern, this frame of thinking too many times over this 20 years, so you are not alone...but wrong...


So please, keep you old logo, if you still can, and focus in your production, the time for a change was many years ago, when you bought the company, not now.


Besides you are confusing industrial designer with other type of designers, like brand designers, graphic designers, marketing and others . Next time, if you build a new home call and electrical engineer instead of an architect...you will be "almost there".


Of course, this is only my opinion, many people will be against it, or not, and I don´t try to argue with anybody, nor to be rude, but my english is rusty. So pardon me, and sorry if I offended somebody.


Now I´ll order a black antea daydate while they still are "old branded". 
Cheers.


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## flame2000

Some how, I find the old Stowa font used to be more retro to the eye. The new font just seems too modern for a classic watch like the Antea. I am kind of disappointed with this decision.


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## 92degrees

bigdog said:


> I didn't claim that you said it was pointless. I asked you what is the point of changing a logo if 60% don't see the change, 20% don't like it. My bigger question is WHY the change. It's my understanding (or more about how I see it as a consumer) that most companies change a logo to coincide with a change in the company. Or to distance themselves from problems of the past. I.E. New ownership that fixes a products real or perceived problem area, Emergence from bankruptcy, Reviving a name from a no longer existing company.
> 
> Facebook? Who cares. It a free internet site. Same with Google. Also. Who cares about cheap consumable products. In the arena of cheap consumer products a logo change is more about getting noticed amongst the sea of other logos on the store shelf. I wouldn't think that would apply to Stowa. As chickenlittle points out. Coke tried to foist a new formula on the public. How did that work out?


I can't answer the "Why." Only Jörg can speak to that point. I see in his official statement language such as "future" and "design of the STOWA watches are clear and unique" and "STOWA's design-language which always should be clear and easy."

These strike me as very common reasons to update an older identity. I'm involved with work done for these reasons every day.

With regard to FB and Google, these examples were chosen because more people see and respond to those identities every minute than people see the Stowa logo in a year.

New Coke is a fascinating case study of a company making a change to a product based on poorly conducted focus groups -- they did not test the new formula in a manner that reflected the way people actually use the product. They offered test subjects a shot glass sized sample of New Coke and people generally enjoyed the flavor. People don't drink a shot of soda; people drink a full can.

I don't have much more to add. The reactions are interesting to me. I may take this opportunity to buy another watch from Jörg just because I'm always looking for an excuse. My best professional opinion is that in a short amount of time this will pass like so many things do and will only be revisited on occasions by new posters asking "what's the story with the logo?"


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## genabob

on the bigest Russian speaking watch forum is a discussion of the new logo. All forum members and Stowa fans disappointed and not those who would like the new logo.


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## Francois Boucher

genabob said:


> on the bigest Russian speaking watch forum is a discussion of the new logo. All forum members and Stowa fans disappointed and not those who would like the new logo.


Well, as another poster said, maybe 80% of the buyers do not care, but it seems to me almost all those who do care enough to post on a Stowa forum, here and in Russia, dislike the new logo&#8230;

That debate is even drawing in people who never posted in a forum before!

It's fascinating.


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## NikAlex

stuffler said:


> It's time now to order an old logo, go hurry up. That's what I am going to do. Not decided on the model yet.


but, it may be a marketing ploy, rather than a new logo?))


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## flyingpicasso

NikAlex said:


> but, it may be a marketing ploy, rather than a new logo?))


I had this thought as well and, if true, would be genius indeeed! I don't think that's the case, though, and for that I am disappointed, yet very happy to be wearing today my "historical logo" Marine. Unlike some others the new logo would keep me from buying a Stowa in the future. The elegant, yet faintly retro "old" font adds to the look and feel of the dial whereas the new blocky font leaves me cold. Dislike.


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## bigdog

flyingpicasso said:


> I had this thought as well and, if true, would be genius indeeed! I don't think that's the case, though, and for that I am disappointed, yet very happy to be wearing today my "historical logo" Marine. Unlike some others the new logo would keep me from buying a Stowa in the future. The elegant, yet faintly retro "old" font adds to the look and feel of the dial whereas the new blocky font leaves me cold. Dislike.


I agree. It will only be used for me. If Herr Schauer want's a new modern line that drifts away from the classic pieces of Stowa. Perhaps it should fall under the banner of his existing self named brand. Or even a new third brand.

Per 92degrees post. "New Coke is a fascinating case study of a company making a change to a product based on poorly conducted focus groups -- they did not test the new formula in a manner that reflected the way people actually use the product. They offered test subjects a shot glass sized sample of New Coke and people generally enjoyed the flavor. People don't drink a shot of soda; people drink a full can."

Which dovetails nicely with the fact that Herr Schauers post seemingly indicates that the new logo was the result of a single (albeit well respected) person specializing in industrial design. Not PR or marketing.


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## kai1839

Wow! And I thought the no seconds flieger was a bad idea. How about a quartz line? That will really get the forum fired up.


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## dhracer

I can understand the new logo and the reasons but I firmly think that to update the old watches makes no sense - in my view the new logo is suited to the new style watches (and possibly the flieger :think: ) because of the more industrial look.

I think in time people will get used to the new logo.


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## superkick10a

J_Hack said:


> In addition to this - did anyone notice the Prodiver has Limette hands available now?! I haven't browsed the online shop for awhile and they look great!


Thanks for the hint - indeed it looks nice. I ever loved the limette colour. The Logo of the Divers is to me better than the new and the old logo


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## frank_be

Dear Joerg,

I don't like the new Logo because I don't like the font. The old font has letters that have a constant width. That's the part of the looks I like so much. And of course the curved "S". The new logo font doesn't have that. Maybe it can work very good on the new, more modern watches, but for the more "heritage" watches I think it's a no-go.

In fact the first time I remember seeing the Stowa brand was from the silver KM pocket watch that Helmut Sinn sold in a limited series during the beginning of the nineties.

I immediately fell in love with that dial. All fonts were just perfect. Imagine how happy I was with the Marine watch with the silver dial.

Now with the new logo that charm would be gone for me. I really can't imagine a Marine watch with the new logo. It's completely losing it's heritage feeling. You know for me a dial has to be perfect ;-)

So for me the only option in the future would be a Stowa watch that has no logo. b-)


Anyway, It's your decision and I still very much respect that. I do believe that the newer watches won't suffer from the new logo. But if I had a logo option on a Stowa watch, I would always go for the original.


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## Takemusu

To cast my vote, I would have opted for a more evolutionary change in the logo that does not so wholly ignore the past. Then spent time STANDARDIZING the logo(s) usages across all applications. 

Also as to New Coke, there is a theory that New Coke was simply a way to get the Classic Coke formula switched from cane sugar to high fructose corn syrup during the time it was off the shelves. Coke got a brief new bump from New Coke, then when interest tanked, reintroduced "Classic Coke" as the old formula with the high fructose corn syrup change...with the gap, no one could tell the difference...


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## bigdog

kai1839 said:


> Wow! And I thought the no seconds flieger was a bad idea. How about a quartz line? That will really get the forum fired up.


It's an interesting subject. I.E. How far can one change a company that has a well respected history. And not lose sight of that history. Or disenfranchise the current customers. For me the answer is simple. It does not require a new logo for a brand to make new products. Not sure how or why companies came to think they have to have new logo that reflects the current products. Quite the opposite. The original logo is a sign of quality since 1927. I see the rapid fire changing of logos these days by a multitude of companies as a direct result of slick PR/Marketing firms convincing companies that the key to the future is to change your identity. I'm sure that it has nothing to do with putting a large bag full of Euro's into said PR firms bank accounts. I truly think that even if Stowa heads in a new direction with new watches. That in itself does not nor should it relegate the original logo to the scrap heap. I'm also from the generation born in the 1950's. I have witnessed the ever growing & changing demographic that not only doesn't care about the history of anything. They seem to actively seek to remove all traces of history in the effort to "be hip, modern & trendy". So when I see the original Stowa logo being modified due to an opinion by a trendy designer. It just makes me cringe. Will it hurt Stowa by changing the logo? No not really. I don't see myself buying one though. But I'm sure I'm in the minority.


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## frank_be

Kronprinz said:


> You also must look to FIAT- they changed back to their classical logo after many years until now...:-!


That reminds me of the "FS" logo from the Italian national railroad company. They have been changing that so many times.
And the Belgian railroad logo - which is practically the same as the Bentley logo - has only changed once 10 years after the first (Somewhere around 1850??). Since then it has never changed.


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## Francois Boucher

frank_be said:


> That reminds me of the "FS" logo from the Italian national railroad company. They have been changing that so many times.
> And the Belgian railroad logo - which is practically the same as the Bentley logo - has only changed once 10 years after the first (Somewhere around 1850??). Since then it has never changed.


Hey! I had never seen that Belgian Railways logo. You're right!


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## The Naf

I know I'm in the very small minority (on this forum anyway) but I like the new logo. And I especially think it suits the antea models...I know almost everyone here will disagree with me but here are my thoughts:

The Antea design is clean, industrial and has a lot of sharp edges. The new logo seems to be the same. The stylized S though nice is more organic and fluid and dare I say not very consistent with the Bauhaus design elements of the rest of the dial. 

I know there is a lot of talk of heritage and tradition & granted this is a valid point. However, I don't think Jorg has shown any major disrespect to the brand or its haritage...you and I may give a big deal about a stilized S but to the rest of the general population all it is is a slight updating of the font and incorporating the crown logo in the dial as well...hardly a major departure from their traditional logo. In fact it may even be argued that the stylized S only represents a font and that the W is a true logo and hence why the change is not really of a logo but of the font...either way I strongly believe a company should only have one logo and obviously a chosen script for the brand name...that being said this seems more like an updating of the font...

anyway that's just my two pennies and everyone is entitled to their two pennies aren't they? 

edit: and after all that I'll probably still order something with the old logo because: 

1. I can't wait for an update that may take 4-6 months dragging the whole waiting process to 7-9 months :-D
2. Design aside the models with the old Logo would seem to be more interesting to have in ones collection and possibly more sought after in the future :-D


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## PhilthyPhil

What bad timing (no pun)! I just decided to buy a Stowa after many many research and ambivalence between Stowa and 2 other brands. I started saving and I expect to be able to afford one in September 2013, but this news is really discouraging  If the old logo isn't available anymore when I'm ready to order, I'll have to pass.


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## jaka

PhilthyPhil said:


> What bad timing (no pun)! I just decided to buy a Stowa after many many research and ambivalence between Stowa and 2 other brands. I started saving and I expect to be able to afford one in September 2013, but this news is really discouraging  If the old logo isn't available anymore when I'm ready to order, I'll have to pass.


 I'm the same way. I am saving for a 1938, but if I do not have the funds in time to get one with the old logo, I will spend it on something else. I know it is a small thing, but at that price, it is the details that really matter to me. It is one of those funny things where if the new logo had always been around, I wouldn't care. However, that is not the case, so I will always know that I liked the old version better.


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## inter71

bigdog said:


> So when I see the original Stowa logo being modified due to an opinion by a trendy designer. It just makes me cringe. Will it hurt Stowa by changing the logo? No not really. I don't see myself buying one though. But I'm sure I'm in the minority.


I alos cannot see myself buying a Stowa watch with a new logo. When I look at a dial of a new Antea 390, the logo and script on the dial do not look right to me. Essentially, if the dial of a new Antea 390 date/date will have the same logo and script, I will opt for buying Nomos Tangomat. Meanwhile I've decided to place an order for Marine Original matt white arabic numeralas to have the watch with the script I like.


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## CM HUNTER

It's going to be real interesting to see how many that say they will not buy a Stowa with new logo eat their words in the future. It's right here in black and white to look back on.

Personally, there's no way in the world I would ever let a font type of all things keep me from purchasing a Stowa.

Lets recap what people appreciate about Stowa that brings them here in the first place: 

1) An unwavering attention to detail and amount of QC second to none.
2) A price to quality ratio that can not be matched.
3) Customer service that has ALWAYS gone above and beyond. Just to name a few.

Now I'm going to forget about all of this like it doesn't matter because of a font change... I can't even say that with a straight face. Not in this lifetime. Try going somewhere else in the German watch world and get as much for your money. Good luck since Stowa is no longer on your radar... supposedly.


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## frogger17

+1

Full disclosure: I did say I liked the new logo.

I personally chose a Stowa as my next watch based on the CM HUNTER's list, and to be clear, it was a no-logo flieger.

I don't discount the very real feelings everyone has, but are the core values of Stowa really changing? The analogy of Coke's formula change has been brought up. And granted, the Stowa logo is more important than Coke's packaging, but the formula change is much closer to something along the lines of Stowa saying that they will discontinue all MO, flieger, and Antea production, which they are not doing.


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## The Naf

CM HUNTER said:


> Lets recap what people appreciate about Stowa that brings them here in the first place:
> 
> 1) An unwavering attention to detail and amount of QC second to none.
> 2) A price to quality ratio that can not be matched.
> 3) Customer service that has ALWAYS gone above and beyond. Just to name a few.
> 
> Now I'm going to forget about all of this like it doesn't matter because of a font change...Try going somewhere else in the German watch world and get as much for your money.


Nailed it!


----------



## jaka

CM HUNTER said:


> It's going to be real interesting to see how many that say they will not buy a Stowa with new logo eat their words in the future. It's right here in black and white to look back on.
> 
> Personally, there's no way in the world I would ever let a font type of all things keep me from purchasing a Stowa.
> 
> Lets recap what people appreciate about Stowa that brings them here in the first place: 1) An unwavering attention to detail and amount of QC second to none.
> 2) A price to quality ratio that can not be matched.
> 3) Customer service that has ALWAYS gone above and beyond. Just to name a few.
> 
> Now I'm going to forget about all of this like it doesn't matter because of a font change... I can't even say that with a straight face. Not in this lifetime. Try going somewhere else in the German watch world and get as much for your money. Good luck since Stowa is no longer on your radar... supposedly.


It is true that Stowa is a great watch for the money, and the logo change would definitely not stop me from buying a Stowa, but it might stop me from buying a specific one. I agree with many posters that the new logo is great for some if the newer designs, but I do not like it on some older ones (1938 in my case). For me, the aesthetics have to be perfect to keep a watch, I find myself flipping $500 watches over little details, and I see that magnifying for a $2000 watch. There are numerous quality watches in that price range that I love, and a small change that I don't like definitely bumps it down a few spots on the wish list. Having said that, Stowa makes fantastic watches and I would not dismiss the brand over something like this, I would just wait until something else catches my eye! (Or watch the sales forum for an old logo version)


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## genabob

CM HUNTER said:


> It's going to be real interesting to see how many that say they will not buy a Stowa with new logo eat their words in the future. It's right here in black and white to look back on.
> 
> Personally, there's no way in the world I would ever let a font type of all things keep me from purchasing a Stowa.
> 
> Lets recap what people appreciate about Stowa that brings them here in the first place:
> 
> 1) An unwavering attention to detail and amount of QC second to none.
> 2) A price to quality ratio that can not be matched.
> 3) Customer service that has ALWAYS gone above and beyond. Just to name a few.
> 
> Now I'm going to forget about all of this like it doesn't matter because of a font change... I can't even say that with a straight face. Not in this lifetime. Try going somewhere else in the German watch world and get as much for your money. Good luck since Stowa is no longer on your radar... supposedly.


Let's divide people into "just consumers that need a good watch for a good price". And "watch enthusiasts".
Those who need a watch with good quality / price ratio will buy watches Stowa as before.
Those who are interested in the history of watches, who need a watch with a soul can turn away from Stowa.
Look at the website Stowa. Speaking of Antea they point out that these watches were created in 1938. And the design is almost identical to the Antea KS with Antea 1938. And that's exactly what I would choose the Stowa Antea, and not Nomos.
but now with the new logo is the similarity is not so clearly.
Now what will stop me from buying Nomos? Price? in fact it is not such a big deal!

Or Imagine the MO with a new logo??


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## GioDoe

A few weeks ago I ordered a Flieger no-logo, but after the recent events I am now puzzled. Should I stick with my original choice and get it without the old logo, or wait a bit longer and get it without the new logo?

Sorry, just kidding trying to kill the waiting time :-x


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## StufflerMike

Tough question.
Welcome to the Official Jörg Schauer & Stowa Forum and welcome to Watchuseek as well.


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## GioDoe

stuffler said:


> Welcome to the Official Jörg Schauer & Stowa Forum and welcome to Watchuseek as well.


Thank you and all the people who contribute to make this forum so interesting and entertaining

G.


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## Ian_O

I don't normally write comments on watch forums (I never have anything to say which others will find interesting  ) but I'm so amazed by this announcement that I'm moved to write.

I've been a huge fan of Stowa for a long time. Not just the watches themselves, but the company philosophy, the personal approach to customers from the people at the top and the commitment to preservation of the history of the brand. The reason I'm so surprised by this turn of events is that it seems completely at odds with all of those things.

It's Jörg's company, so of course he can do whatever he wants, but I'm surprised he's not more concerned by the strength of opinion amongst the company's biggest supporters (i.e. the enthusiasts on this forum). I'm also surprised he has made this decision based on advice from someone (as far as I know) without a proven track record in watch design. You see, this is far more than a simple logo change. People on here have compared it to car manufacturers changing their logos (although I must say my Mercedes-Benz still includes examples of the original 1926 laurel leaf logo at many places around the car) and drinks companies changing theirs. This is entirely different. Nobody (at least nobody I know) buys a car based on the design of the manufacturer's logo, as it's such a minor part of the whole car. Nobody buys a soft drink based entirely on the design on the can. When I buy a watch, and I'd like to think I'm not the odd one out here, I make the choice based on a number of factors, such as quality, workmanship, value for money, even company reputation, but mainly design and appearance. This is where my non-watch enthusiast friends think I'm odd but I can honestly say that every one of my favourite watches gives me a moment's pleasure each time I look at it on my wrist. That's why I love watches. My favourites give me pleasure every time I wear them.

The design of a watch is therefore of vital importance to the purchaser and wearer. The biggest part of that design is surely the face, and the logo is a key part of the watch face. To me, a different logo changes the whole look of a watch so not only are Stowa changing their branding and distancing themselves from all that history and heritage which I thought they were keen to preserve, they are also fundamentally changing the design of all the watches we've come to know and love over the years.

Maybe some people prefer the new logo. I'm sure many do. Personally, I think the font is bland and too small, and with the symbol to the left of the letters it looks unbalanced and just plain wrong. Again this puzzles me. Over the years I have come to believe Jörg is a top-notch watch designer for whom even the tiniest detail is important and crucial to achieving the perfect balance in the design of his products. This sudden change seems at odds with his design philosophy.

I also buy watches from a very small British company who have an active online forum. The man in charge of that company often posts initial ideas for new designs on the forum and people then comment, criticise and suggest tweaks. This approach seems to work well and their watches have a strong following as a result. Many comments result in tiny changes to such things as logo design and positioning, and it often surprises me what a difference that makes to the appeal of a design. I'm sure many of you know the company to which I'm referring.

I have no doubt that in the short term, sales of Stowa watches will rocket as a result of this announcement by Jörg. Many people (me included) will be ordering watches hastily so they can get them with the "old" logo. I do wonder though, whether short term gain will result in long term pain as Stowa fans turn their back on the watches they used to love as the designs lose that special appeal? I sincerely hope not.


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## CM HUNTER

I see a lot of comments about how it affects the history of Stowa to change a font on a logo. Seriously.

A font in no way changes what Stowa has done in the past at all (which is to build high quality watches). Just like when Jorge took over the company, that major change in ownership (a much bigger episode than a font change) didn't take away from the history of Stowa either. It actually gave it a future.

From one seeking not only a high quality German Made watch, but a high quality German Made watch from a company with a great history, I'd buy a new Stowa with the new logo in a heartbeat. The history of a company doesn't change just because a font type does.


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## Fischer

As I understand it, Stowa's company identity is now expressed through this design:








It consists of a logo made up of a graphic and the company name plus a strap line which emphasises what the company believes is important about itself. It is very nicely designed. Taken as a whole, I can't fault it as a piece of graphic design for print or web site. The three elements - graphic, name and strap line - work well together. The design has a nice balance without being symmetrical. It is perfect for use on company documentation.

However, it is not possible simply to cut up a good piece of design and use the pieces separately, which is what I think has been done here. Take away the strap line, stick what remains on a watch dial, and everything changes:








Without the strap line to unify and balance it, I think the design takes on a clumsy one-sided look. I've always thought that the crown was a good place to put the W graphic, leaving only the name on the dial. Placing the graphic centrally above the name, as on the Seatime, would also work better than having the graphic and the name side by side.

It is a lot to ask of a piece of graphic/typographical design that it should be suitable for company documentation as well as modern and classic styles of watch dial. I'm sure it can be done but this design doesn't do it. Just my opinion. At the end of the day the only opinion that matters is Jörg's.


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## Sli

As I will see, there is a lot of feedback for the new logo which is really bad. 
So, I asked to myself: Should I really post here? But after I have seen the dial with its new logo at the Antea 390, I told to myself: Yes you must!

Sorry Jörg, but I hope that you will change your mind! It's certainly your decision changing the logo - but one of your strengths is to hear to your customers.

I will definitely not buy a Stowa with this dial - sorry!


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## canard

I’ve been staring at the new logo for the last few minutes, and I’m sorry to say that it doesn’t click with me. It is certainly sportier than the traditional logo and would be great on the Flieger TO or the Prodiver, but it seems a little too thick and muscular to cooperate with the design of watches like the Antea, Marine or 1938. 

Updating the logo is not necessarily a bad idea, but I wish they had worked more with the older logo in creating the new design (for example, finding a way to reference the traditional Stowa “S”). I know that a great deal of thought and discussion must go into decisions like this, but the end result just looks kind of basic and perfunctory to my eyes.

That said, the new logo will not stop me from buying more Stowa watches in the future.


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## anachy

I think its only a logo change.. Microsoft and Nike and other big company have changed their many times and they still sell.
The new one looks good on the GMT world time but don't know why it isn't on the Antea 390. maybe too small or just doesn't suit classy dial as the others said.
maybe Stowa could use both of them


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## CCCP

Thank you for the information. I much preferred the old Stowa logo because it's true to history (and vintage models), but all brands logo evolve with time and I'm sure I'll get used to the new one with time.


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## peitron

PhilthyPhil said:


> What bad timing (no pun)! I just decided to buy a Stowa after many many research and ambivalence between Stowa and 2 other brands. I started saving and I expect to be able to afford one in September 2013, but this news is really discouraging  If the old logo isn't available anymore when I'm ready to order, I'll have to pass.


Order now, you probably won't be billed until September anyway.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD


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## turtje

CM HUNTER said:


> I see a lot of comments about how it affects the history of Stowa to change a font on a logo. Seriously.
> 
> A font in no way changes what Stowa has done in the past at all (which is to build high quality watches). Just like when Jorge took over the company, that major change in ownership (a much bigger episode than a font change) didn't take away from the history of Stowa either. It actually gave it a future.
> 
> From one seeking not only a high quality German Made watch, but a high quality German Made watch from a company with a great history, I'd buy a new Stowa with the new logo in a heartbeat. The history of a company doesn't change just because a font type does.


I agree. For me too, this new logo wouldn't stop me from getting a Stowa watch with the new logo on it. I am also convinced that this new logo will grow on several Stowa-enthousiasts that don't like the logo right now. It's not like the new logo is horrendous or anything close to that.

I just like the old logo better and I can't see any good reason to change it. I'm glad I have a Partitio with the old logo.


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## some.idiot

CM HUNTER said:


> I see a lot of comments about how it affects the history of Stowa to change a font on a logo. Seriously.
> 
> A font in no way changes what Stowa has done in the past at all (which is to build high quality watches). Just like when Jorge took over the company, that major change in ownership (a much bigger episode than a font change) didn't take away from the history of Stowa either. It actually gave it a future.
> 
> From one seeking not only a high quality German Made watch, but a high quality German Made watch from a company with a great history, I'd buy a new Stowa with the new logo in a heartbeat. The history of a company doesn't change just because a font type does.


I get where you're coming from here. I think the issue that Stowa might want to be concerned about (and might not) is that there are a lot of options for very similar-looking watches out there, and if the potential customer can choose between a logo they like and a logo they don't like, they might go elsewhere with their money. It's a small piece of the watch as a whole, but we're dropping a good chunk of money on a piece of jewelry whose small details are something we relish.

Would I have bought my MO with the new logo if I thought it was at odds with the "classic" look of the watch? Maybe not. Maybe I would have gone with a similar watch from another company whose overall aesthetic I liked better.

Either way, my next Stowa will be a no-logo flieger. I had originally planned on maybe buying an Antea KS and Prodiver as well, but I'll have to revisit my feelings on the new logo on those watches at that time.


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## flyingpicasso

Let's forget the Mercedes and Coke analogies. What would happen if JLC decided to change their font to this: JAEGER-L*E*COULTRE. 

Now imagine that font on this watch (photo credit to Kibi) and ask yourself if you would be more likely or less likely to buy that watch. To me the answer is clear, and so it is with Stowa. Don't get me wrong--I will always be a huge Stowa fan and proud owner, but will always be nostalgic for the old font.


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## hydroidsouvlaki

I think Fischer hit the nail on the head. The logo works in its entirety.

I think it's also an issue of scale. Compared to, say, the large banner at the top of this page, the new logo looks slightly squashed on a watch face. I would reserve judgement until I actually see an 'in the flesh' photo though, as computer mock ups (which I think the stock photos are) may be exaggerating or even creating this perception.


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## CM HUNTER

I personally like the fact that the actual Stowa logo is prominently on the dial now and not just the word Stowa. Instead of just being lost on the crown, it's now a big part of the company branding. Isn't the logo a part of Stowas history as well? Now that the emphasis is less on the font and more on the logo, people have a problem with it... I don't get it. 

Not trying to make comparisons between the two brands by no means, but since people like to throw around examples like this, here's one to ponder: What would the Rolex logo/branding be without the famous crown.... just the word Rolex in a fairly plain Times New Roman type of font. The crown is the signature part of their logo. Why can't the W Stowa logo have its place for a change?


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## some.idiot

Rolex has huge brand name recognition, though. Unless Stowa is planning on shooting for mass production, I think its biggest strength is its history, quality, design aesthetics, and loyal following. Messing with one of those factors may or may not work in its favor depending on how it's received, and it seems like its reception is not as tremendous as one would hope.

Stowa has been making a lot of changes recently with new models, changes to old models (6oclock subdial on a flieger) and this new logo. I'm sure a lot of what is causing so much upset here is just that we don't like change.


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## CM HUNTER

some.idiot said:


> Rolex has huge brand name recognition, though. Unless Stowa is planning on shooting for mass production, I think its biggest strength is its history, quality, design aesthetics, and loyal following. Messing with one of those factors may or may not work in its favor depending on how it's received, and it seems like its reception is not as tremendous as one would hope.
> 
> Stowa has been making a lot of changes recently with new models, changes to old models (6oclock subdial on a flieger) and this new logo. I'm sure a lot of what is causing so much upset here is just that we don't like change.


Rolex got all of that name recognition with that simple font and prominent crown... they didn't start off prominent. That's precisely my point. Who cares if Stowa never gets as big as Rolex (they never will and im glad about that fact).The point is a simple font together with a distinctive logo sure didn't deter people from snatching up Rolexes like crazy.

You hit the nail squarely on the head with your very last sentence "I'm sure a lot of what is causing so much upset here is that we just don't like change."


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## Sli

CM HUNTER said:


> You hit the nail squarely on the head with your very last sentence "I'm sure a lot of what is causing so much upset here is that we just don't like change."


Sorry, I don't think that "change" is the only reason. Yes, there are more watch types now in Stowa's portfolio. But, you can choose between them.

At the end of the day, it is quite good, that Stowa is going on with its own process - bringing out more models which dip into the past, and models that are really new like the Flieger Testaf.

The problem for me, and I think for many others is, that the new logo design does not fit to the dials of the old models. I think that it fits only to the new Flieger Testaf.

And the logo design belongs to the entire design of a watch. It is definitely not suitable to a discussion about logo modifications of companies which are not acting as a watchmaker - like VW, Mercedes, etc... Nobody cares about it, if they changes their logos!


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## redwatch

*How about a poll?*

Can we take a poll and see how many people favors the new logo vs the old logo? Personally I love the old logo.


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## Polaroid

CM HUNTER said:


> The point is a simple font together with a distinctive logo sure didn't deter people from snatching up Rolexes like crazy.


I think the key word there is distinctive. The most distinctive part of the Stowa logo is the name with the elegant S. if anything, that logo could have been made bigger. The "W" icon on the other hand can't be compared to the Rolex crown. I mean, it's a crown! I don't like it, but there's no confusion about what it is or the message it conveys. The Stowa icon is interesting because its been around a while, but the connection to the brand or what it even is isn't clear. I don't think many people could draw it from memory without looking at it. I assume it might have something to with Walter Storz, but if I had no idea who he was it wouldn't make much sense that the icon would be an abstracted letter from the middle of the company's name. It's also a little too busy to scale down small enough for the dial, but looks good on the crown.

If anyone does know what the "W" icon represents I would like to know. I feel like every letter in Stowa is in there except for the S, but why that would be done, I don't know.

Edit- some clever googling led me to stuffler,mike's verdict:



stuffler said:


> to sum it up: Nobody really knows.





stuffler said:


> A chap on a german watch forum tried to visualize his interpretation....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ....but he got into trouble with the "S" of Stowa. However, a nice try I guess.


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## Julyan

Am I blind or why didnt I find a comparison in this thread between the old and new logo.


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## CM HUNTER

Polaroid said:


> I think the key word there is distinctive. The most distinctive part of the Stowa logo is the name with the elegant S. if anything, that logo could have been made bigger. The "W" icon on the other hand can't be compared to the Rolex crown. I mean, it's a crown! I don't like it, but there's no confusion about what it is or the message it conveys. The Stowa icon is interesting because its been around a while, but the connection to the brand or what it even is isn't clear. I don't think many people could draw it from memory without looking at it. I assume it might have something to with Walter Storz, but if I had no idea who he was it wouldn't make much sense that the icon would be an abstracted letter from the middle of the company's name. It's also a little too busy to scale down small enough for the dial, but looks good on the crown.
> 
> If anyone does know what the "W" icon represents I would like to know. I feel like every letter in Stowa is in there except for the S, but why that would be done, I don't know.
> 
> Edit- some clever googling led me to stuffler,mike's verdict:


I mean distinctive in the sense that it took some creative process to come up with and that's unique to the brand. A crown is a generic item not unique to Rolex as a branding item. Same with wings used by Breitling etc... No one may know what the hell it is, but it's unique to the Stowa brand only, and like it or not, it's Stowa's logo. The stylized S was probably a two second after-thought kinda thing to do, *and is not the Stowa logo*. I hope Jorge isn't too offended by all those that would rather see a slightly fancy S on the dial instead of the actual company logo. I'm sure he's not because he's Jorge, but he has every right to be.


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## nothenorm

I agree we need to move towards the future and also keeping a balance to the past.

For example, one move forward with progress and improvements .... so in this case, design and function in a watch is important and if the improvement is better, why not!

But I kept looking at the new logo, and personally I do not feel the new logo is an improvement, Sorry Jorg!

Of course this is very subjective because there will always be others who can appreciate the new logo, cheers anyway ; )


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## CM HUNTER

Julyan said:


> Am I blind or why didnt I find a comparison in this thread between the old and new logo.


The logo hasn't changed. It's still the same. It's just prominent on the dial now and the Stowa font has slightly changed. The whole thing together now looks like the logo at the top of this page minus the _Watches Made In Germany Since 1927 _part.


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## genabob

*Re: How about a poll?*



redwatch said:


> Can we take a poll and see how many people favors the new logo vs the old logo? Personally I love the old logo.


Here: https://www.watchuseek.com/f36/new-logo-poll-869276.html


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## StufflerMike

*Re: How about a poll?*

:think::think: We already have one...


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## some.idiot

Julyan said:


> Am I blind or why didnt I find a comparison in this thread between the old and new logo.


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## Jörg Schauer

Hello everybody,

i have added a few pictures and descriptions for the new Logo. ;-)
New STOWA Logo, official new pictures ! ;-)

best regards

Jörg Schauer


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## DJP31

Ian_O said:


> I don't normally write comments on watch forums (I never have anything to say which others will find interesting  ) but I'm so amazed by this announcement that I'm moved to write.
> 
> I've been a huge fan of Stowa for a long time. Not just the watches themselves, but the company philosophy, the personal approach to customers from the people at the top and the commitment to preservation of the history of the brand. The reason I'm so surprised by this turn of events is that it seems completely at odds with all of those things.
> 
> It's Jörg's company, so of course he can do whatever he wants, but I'm surprised he's not more concerned by the strength of opinion amongst the company's biggest supporters (i.e. the enthusiasts on this forum). I'm also surprised he has made this decision based on advice from someone (as far as I know) without a proven track record in watch design. You see, this is far more than a simple logo change. People on here have compared it to car manufacturers changing their logos (although I must say my Mercedes-Benz still includes examples of the original 1926 laurel leaf logo at many places around the car) and drinks companies changing theirs. This is entirely different. Nobody (at least nobody I know) buys a car based on the design of the manufacturer's logo, as it's such a minor part of the whole car. Nobody buys a soft drink based entirely on the design on the can. When I buy a watch, and I'd like to think I'm not the odd one out here, I make the choice based on a number of factors, such as quality, workmanship, value for money, even company reputation, but mainly design and appearance. This is where my non-watch enthusiast friends think I'm odd but I can honestly say that every one of my favourite watches gives me a moment's pleasure each time I look at it on my wrist. That's why I love watches. My favourites give me pleasure every time I wear them.
> 
> The design of a watch is therefore of vital importance to the purchaser and wearer. The biggest part of that design is surely the face, and the logo is a key part of the watch face. To me, a different logo changes the whole look of a watch so not only are Stowa changing their branding and distancing themselves from all that history and heritage which I thought they were keen to preserve, they are also fundamentally changing the design of all the watches we've come to know and love over the years.
> 
> Maybe some people prefer the new logo. I'm sure many do. Personally, I think the font is bland and too small, and with the symbol to the left of the letters it looks unbalanced and just plain wrong. Again this puzzles me. Over the years I have come to believe Jörg is a top-notch watch designer for whom even the tiniest detail is important and crucial to achieving the perfect balance in the design of his products. This sudden change seems at odds with his design philosophy.
> 
> I also buy watches from a very small British company who have an active online forum. The man in charge of that company often posts initial ideas for new designs on the forum and people then comment, criticise and suggest tweaks. This approach seems to work well and their watches have a strong following as a result. Many comments result in tiny changes to such things as logo design and positioning, and it often surprises me what a difference that makes to the appeal of a design. I'm sure many of you know the company to which I'm referring.
> 
> I have no doubt that in the short term, sales of Stowa watches will rocket as a result of this announcement by Jörg. Many people (me included) will be ordering watches hastily so they can get them with the "old" logo. I do wonder though, whether short term gain will result in long term pain as Stowa fans turn their back on the watches they used to love as the designs lose that special appeal? I sincerely hope not.


I agree with everything posted here, and know exactly which English company referred to. I pulled the trigger yesterday on a Flieger as for me the logo is an intrinsic part of what I am buying, and it has great history to it.

I suspect there will indeed be a spike in orders and possibly an increased demand in the future for old logo models in the pre owned market, but on the flip side the quality and VFM should ensure strong future sales.

We also tend to have short memories, but perhaps not so in the WIS world...

Personally I also think the new logo is unbalanced, but ask 3 people and you'll get 4 opinions!

I know this from trying to get marketing material agreed with my co Directors! Luckily now I only input on regulatory disclosure requirements.

And now a long wait for my Stowa!

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## owenjm

Hi all,

Long-time lurker (amazing forum, btw) who's signed up for an account just to post in this thread. Like many here, I've admired Stowa for some time as a company producing beautiful watches at very competitive prices. Personally, I feel that the logo change takes away some of the beauty of this design, and it's such an odd decision that it sadly makes me question the overall design philosophy of the company.

One thing I've been surprised nobody's pointed out so far is how well the old stylised "S" fitted in with the Antea face. I'd always assumed that the font of the Antea numbers and the "S" were directly related -- just look at the curve of the S compared to the tail of the "9" on the dial, for example. It creates an intimate connection between the face font and the logo, and naturally draws the observers' eyes from the dial numbers to the brand name. Together, the logo and the numbers made, in my subjective opinion, the most beautiful watch face I've ever seen. But the connection between the numerical font and the Stowa "S" was an objective fact -- they made sense and went together perfectly. All of this is completely lost with the new logo on the Antea face.

While I realise that Jörg has made his decision, I hope that it might be possible for Stowa to retain one watch model with the old logo as a homage to the history of the company. In my mind, the Antea KS would fit this best; but I do hope that at least one Antea carries the beautiful font connection that I've outlined above.

Owen

ps -- I'm also surprised that someone with the initials JS would want to move away from a stylised "S" that, with the vertical downstroke, was in fact the letters J and S combined!


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## flyingpicasso

Polaroid said:


> If anyone does know what the "W" icon represents I would like to know. I feel like every letter in Stowa is in there except for the S, but why that would be done, I don't know.


Someone in a long-ago thread surmised that it was a stylized W representing Walter with a watch dial in the middle. That is the best-sounding explanation I've heard. For what it's worth I happen to like the logo and think having the logo on the dial is good, but I'd rather have it paired with the old font like on the divers.


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## frogger17

The overwhelming majority on the forum have expressed that they really loved the stylized "S", even apart from the historical significance, and cannot fathom why it would be changed. I'll offer up my personal preference for public vilification. 

While I am fairly indifferent to the font of the new name style, I like it because of the combination of the logo, which i really like, with the name in a different font. In other words, I always disliked the stylized "S", which I found to be antiquated, and dreaded wanting a particular watch that came with it.

To those who argue that the stylized "S" is consistent with the Bauhaus style, I wholly concede the argument. While I'm not a fan of the Bauhaus style and would never purchase a watch in that style, I can objectively agree that the stylized "S" matches the Antea line perfectly.

It would be wonderful if Stowa could accommodate everyone's personal preference, but if only one stays, I prefer the old one leave.


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## some.idiot

flyingpicasso said:


> Someone in a long-ago thread surmised that it was a stylized W representing Walter with a watch dial in the middle. That is the best-sounding explanation I've heard. For what it's worth I happen to like the logo and think having the logo on the dial is good, but I'd rather have it paired with the old font like on the divers.


This is how it should look, IMO


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## Chris-John

CM HUNTER said:


> I personally like the fact that the actual Stowa logo is prominently on the dial now and not just the word Stowa. Instead of just being lost on the crown, it's now a big part of the company branding. Isn't the logo a part of Stowas history as well? Now that the emphasis is less on the font and more on the logo, people have a problem with it... I don't get it.
> 
> Not trying to make comparisons between the two brands by no means, but since people like to throw around examples like this, here's one to ponder: What would the Rolex logo/branding be without the famous crown.... just the word Rolex in a fairly plain Times New Roman type of font. The crown is the signature part of their logo. Why can't the W Stowa logo have its place for a change?


I think restoring the logo to the face is ok. Old watches had it. I probably wouldn't do it, but I wouldn't object too much either. Is the loss of the old S and font which is bothersome.


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## Jörg Schauer

again thanks for all the statements which i fully and completely respect. and it is like many of you said: changings are always difficult and often it is not easy to explain the whole story. here are many(i want to say the most) realy educated people. This is not usual and i am happy to have the chance to hear so many different feelings, emotions and critical statements. of course i read them and think about them. but i also know that i have to hear on my inner voice and in german we say:"Bauchgefühl", this all says me to keep the way.
and i tell you that (like always in the last 23 years of my proffesion), i have to "carry" the risc by my own........and i will do, like i did many times before.

only one example: i think it was the year 2003 or 2004, i was so busy with my schauer brand that stowa ( i bought the brand 1997) was free for purchase because i could not handle two brands. it nearly kills me. i decided to sell it and the price was realy "small", but nobody wants!
"ok" i thought: to keep it small and nearly unknown is not good. so i decided to give more of my time to stowa and to make it as a direct selling brand. through internet, only through internet. this was new. but it was a possible way and i did it. i never thought that it will works worldwide. the idea was only for germany. but the collectors worldwide has been interested....now we active sell to more than 70 countries worldwide. this was something nobody suspected. the complete concept was the key for this succes. design. price quality relation:best value for money. new interpretation of old designs.....and so on.of course the logo has its part of the watchdesign.but never as so important than we think. some or mostly of you remember when i was the first (its true, you can search) who hiden the logo on the dial. For example on the airman watches. it was not easy to make this decision and i have to be strong for all the critic i got. some told me it is impossible to sell watches without logo. airman without logo since 3 years is our best selling modell. what i want to say is that i never know whats happen. and of course i have to take the risc by myself!!, only by myself!!!.
But i also want to say that i always give new things, new situations the chance to "work" on me.
with more informations i can change my mind. maybe today, from my todays view(with my available informations i have), i maybe don't like something.
but maybe with more informations i get every day my feelings can change(sometimes they have to change because the new facts don't allow to follow the actual way) ,

My only wish is that you give the new Logo a chance because believe me: Mr.Esslinger(the man behind steve jobs/apple design in 1982, responsible for the first apple computer and later again responsible for the snow white apple design) and me, we have had realy reasons for the changing of the logo!)
So for me it is clear that the new logo is like it is and will be like this as long as possible and maybe so long that some new facts maybe enlarge our (my)personal horizont that i feel it is time to change again.
(like so many big brands did from time to time).

Stowa is small and unknown, but we are lucky to have people and customers around us who realy, resly interested in the brand.

So interested that they spend a lot of their limited time here to discuss and try to keep their watchbrand alive!

Stowa is alive, the new logo doesn't damage anything.

It is a step forward!!

if i don't believe, who else should?

You will see it.

best regards and please remind you that we always will do our best to built one of the best watches in the market.

This is our reputation and this we will keep!

Jörg Schauer
Designer and CEO of the Stowa brand


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## CM HUNTER

They continue to criticize you and question you time and time again, yet, in the end, they also continue to flock to Stowa for a fine timepiece. This time, like all others, will be no different, and all of this complaining will be for nothing. We will just have all of these documented cases of the criticism this time, then notice the same people a few months from now proudly post pictures of their new Stowa.


----------



## The Naf

Jörg Schauer said:


> again thanks for all the statements which i fully and completely respect. and it is like many of you said: changings are always difficult and often it is not easy to explain the whole story. here are many(i want to say the most) realy educated people. This is not usual and i am happy to have the chance to hear so many different feelings, emotions and critical statements. of course i read them and think about them. but i also know that i have to hear on my inner voice and in german we say:"Bauchgefühl", this all says me to keep the way.
> and i tell you that (like always in the last 23 years of my proffesion), i have to "carry" the risc by my own........and i will do, like i did many times before.
> 
> only one example: i think it was the year 2003 or 2004, i was so busy with my schauer brand that stowa ( i bought the brand 1997) was free for purchase because i could not handle two brands. it nearly kills me. i decided to sell it and the price was realy "small", but nobody wants!
> "ok" i thought: to keep it small and nearly unknown is not good. so i decided to give more of my time to stowa and to make it as a direct selling brand. through internet, only through internet. this was new. but it was a possible way and i did it. i never thought that it will works worldwide. the idea was only for germany. but the collectors worldwide has been interested....now we active sell to more than 70 countries worldwide. this was something nobody suspected. the complete concept was the key for this succes. design. price quality relation:best value for money. new interpretation of old designs.....and so on.of course the logo has its part of the watchdesign.but never as so important than we think. some or mostly of you remember when i was the first (its true, you can search) who hiden the logo on the dial. For example on the airman watches. it was not easy to make this decision and i have to be strong for all the critic i got. some told me it is impossible to sell watches without logo. airman without logo since 3 years is our best selling modell. what i want to say is that i never know whats happen. and of course i have to take the risc by myself!!, only by myself!!!.
> But i also want to say that i always give new things, new situations the chance to "work" on me.
> with more informations i can change my mind. maybe today, from my todays view(with my available informations i have), i maybe don't like something.
> but maybe with more informations i get every day my feelings can change(sometimes they have to change because the new facts don't allow to follow the actual way) ,
> 
> My only wish is that you give the new Logo a chance because believe me: Mr.Esslinger(the man behind steve jobs/apple design in 1982, responsible for the first apple computer and later again responsible for the snow white apple design) and me, we have had realy reasons for the changing of the logo!)
> So for me it is clear that the new logo is like it is and will be like this as long as possible and maybe so long that some new facts maybe enlarge our (my)personal horizont that i feel it is time to change again.
> (like so many big brands did from time to time).
> 
> Stowa is small and unknown, but we are lucky to have people and customers around us who realy, resly interested in the brand.
> 
> So interested that they spend a lot of their limited time here to discuss and try to keep their watchbrand alive!
> 
> Stowa is alive, the new logo doesn't damage anything.
> 
> It is a step forward!!
> 
> if i don't believe, who else should?
> 
> You will see it.
> 
> best regards and please remind you that we always will do our best to built one of the best watches in the market.
> 
> This is our reputation and this we will keep!
> 
> Jörg Schauer
> Designer and CEO of the Stowa brand


This statement...deserves way more likes! Unfortunately I only have one to give :-(

edit: so I "liked", "Unliked", "liked", "unliked" and "liked" :-D


----------



## Francois Boucher

Jorg, 

I truly respect your courage, and your "guts" in this change.

I think we all said enough about this. You have been incredibly patient all through this. I tell you: if I was the Stowa head honcho, this thread would have been locked a long time ago! ;-)

Stowa is such a fine company, offering fantastic quality in beautiful, original watches, and a great spirit, that a small logo change will certainly not affect its value.

We all know that.


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## CM HUNTER

Francois Boucher said:


> Jorg,
> 
> I truly respect your courage, and your "guts" in this change.
> 
> I think we all said enough about this. You have been incredibly patient all through this. I tell you: if I was the Stowa head honcho, this thread would have been locked a long time ago! ;-)
> 
> Stowa is such a fine company, offering fantastic quality in beautiful, original watches, and a great spirit, that a small logo change will certainly not affect its value.
> 
> We all know that.


Amen!


----------



## The Naf

Francois Boucher said:


> Jorg,
> 
> I truly respect your courage, and your "guts" in this change.
> 
> I think we all said enough about this. You have been incredibly patient all through this. I tell you: if I was the Stowa head honcho, this thread would have been locked a long time ago! ;-)
> 
> Stowa is such a fine company, offering fantastic quality in beautiful, original watches, and a great spirit, that a small logo change will certainly not affect its value.
> 
> We all know that.


Agreed. Enough has been said. The decision has been made by the only one with any right to make it. The person who has placed Stowa ahead of the brand bearing his own name...the person who gave Stowa life and hope...the person who has taken incredible pains to retain and promote Stowa's proud history through its line of watches...Jorg you are a very patient man and you deserve a whole lot of credit for what you have achieved with the Stowa brand till date. A fine example of a person who lives his crafts as apposed to merely making money through it! Good luck!


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## Polaroid

Thank you Jörg, for your both your open mind and your openness to revealing many of the inner workings and design processes that are too often hidden away. 

Even when responses aren't positive, many companies have to pay lots for test markets and usability research. At least here it's free!

I may have expressed dislike for the logo but I will certainly be showing off my new watch for years. 

Thanks again Jörg.


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## jonobailey

Sorry to revisit an old thread, I have only just chanced upon this thread and am really disappointed with the change.

While I respect Stowa's success under jorg's control I am very confused. 

The new style certainly suits the sports/tool/diver watches, but for the Antea, Partito and Marine it just seems odd, surely the heritage font/logo should remain of the heritage styles?

Anyway I probably wouldn't buy one of these with the new logo as such does any one have any idea how long the 'old stock' will remain?


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## StufflerMike

jonobailey said:


> ?...does any one have any idea how long the 'old stock' will remain?


Only Jörg knows, it is done step by step and the process will take 6 to 12 month but I am sure you read his posts.


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## ev13wt

So the TO1 shows the old logo n the dial, so that is what we get?

I really don't care much about logos. If the product is cool and quality, the logo will be seen as cool and quality. Doesn't even matter that much what the logo looks like. 

As long as it doesn't change too much. In this case, I like the thinner font. This is more modern. The "S" being bigger in the old logo works great, but not with the actual logo in front of the stowa lettering. It would look very unbalanced.

I personally would have not changed from the tall S. If I must, I'd have reduced it to either the logo part without lettering or just the S from the old logo. But since I am a customer, I'll take whatever the brand gives. 

That said, I like the new logo. I also like the old logo. What I really like is NO logo. Alone from the fact that it can start a conversation about the brand.


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## ScreenKiller

I think the new logo is good. It defines the brand better. not to mock stowa or anything but the old logo was just the word STOWA with a special "S".
And every big brand need a symbool that says. "oh" thats stowa.
I really like the design of the new logo very simple and straightforward. 
And on the black forest flieger the design looks simply stunning , its a tad faded so it isn't in your face all the time. but when you look closely you can clearly see the logo.


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## CM HUNTER

ScreenKiller said:


> I think the new logo is good. It defines the brand better. not to mock stowa or anything but the old logo was just the word STOWA with a special "S".
> And every big brand need a symbool that says. "oh" thats stowa.
> I really like the design of the new logo very simple and straightforward.
> And on the black forest flieger the design looks simply stunning , its a tad faded so it isn't in your face all the time. but when you look closely you can clearly see the logo.


My sentiments exactly.

Most companies have an actual logo to go along with their company name. Some of these logos are so iconic, the presence of the actual name of the company is not even necassary. I'm not saying that the Stowa logo would ever get to be that iconic, but at least now it's at the forefront of the companies design, and recognized as part of the brand, instead of taking a backseat.

It's a new time for Stowa. No longer are watches just coming out that are based off of old historic models. If new and updated models can be introduced that takes people out of their usual Stowa comfort zone, then an update to the logo should accompany that as well. It is, and it actually makes sense to me. Stowa shouldn't rely on past designs for their future, they should focus on fresh designs to propel them forward... that includes logo and all.


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## chickenlittle

Sorry but fresh doesn't mean better in my opinion. Miley Cyrus is "fresh" but honestly how many people will be listening to her music 10 years from now whereas you can still hear classics like the Beatles on the radio today. And I still don't understand how a barely visible logo can be considered the forefront of anything.

I am happy that my Antea will be delivered to me with the old and boring non-logo Stowa typeface. I also disagree that a company needs a logo at all on their watch. There is no logo on a Nomos Tangente as far as I can tell and they look perfectly good to me.


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## ScreenKiller

I don't know why but I'll think she will be around for a while. 

Sent from my HTC One using Tapatalk 4


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## Chris-John

CM HUNTER said:


> . Some of these logos are so iconic, the presence of the actual name of the company is not even necassary.


And many companies have a font to write their name so distinctive that it identifies the brand all by itself. If I showed you the F from Ford, you'd know what it was from, apart from the logo. If I showed you the C from coca cola, the same. Would they dump their font?


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## ScreenKiller

But I still insist that a symbol is easier to recognize then a font

Sent from my HTC One using Tapatalk 4


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## CM HUNTER

Well fresh and different is where Stowa is headed, so like it or not, stay tuned. The watches are staying... a fancified S is all that's actually leaving, so not a big deal in the grand scheme of things. The logo is at the forefront because it's actually on the dial instead of being relegated to marketing materials. It's faded out on purpose so the overall design of the watch can take precedence and be appreciated, not the logo of all things.

I can't buy the argument that an actual company logo should take a backseat to an S, even just typing that sounds goofy. 

The argument that Nomos looks fine without a logo, is because they never had one to take a backseat in the first place. If they did have one, I'm sure they would respect enough to not just toss it aside. As far as the F for Ford goes, I wouldn't recognize it at all... it's just an F. But you could just show me that iconic blue oval and I'd know what it was in two seconds. A generic fancified S is not that relatable like the distinctive, unique only to Stowa, Walter Storz logo.


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## canard

I really want to find a way to like the new logo, but I just can't.

My problem with it is that it is too much of-the-moment. A friend of mine has been working on a clothing label for a number of years, and she has got to the point where she had a logo created for it. She was telling me about the process of working with graphic designers, and everything they recommended to her is consistent with the new Stowa logo. In terms of its basic layout, it also looks pretty much like what the designers came up with for her company. It seems that something distinctive is being traded for something that will soon look generic.


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## senna89wc12

I prefer the old logo much more than the new one. The distinctive S of the old logo will be timeless. The old logo is also way more versatile as it looks good on both the classical and sportier Stowa watches. I think the new logo will look great on the sport watches such as the Prodiver, Seatime, TESTAF, 24 Racing Countdown and GMT Worldtime. Unfortunately, the new logo looks awkward on the classical Stowa models no matter how I look at it.


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## makoto

I agree with ScreenKiller and CM HUNTER.

One thing to realize is that when I showed some of my friends pictures to help me decide different Stowa watches, they thought that the watches with the old logo were from the brand "Towa."

I like the old logo and think that it fits very will with the Bauhaus style of the Antea. I think both the old and the new logo fit well with the Partitio, but speak in different ways. 

We can argue all we want about how the new logo affects the current watches, but I think many are missing the best part. I think it is quite likely that the logo change is a part of a bigger picture. If Stowa is changing their logo because they are trying to refine their brand, then this can only be interpreted as exciting news. No company can do the exact same thing forever. If Stowa sticks to only doing retro watches, then other companies will start to take away their market share. I am someone who is not only a fan of particular Stowa watches, but also a fan of the company itself. 

As a result, when I see things like a new logo, and a new watch with the TESTAF certification, I get excited. I am very interested to see what Stowa will have in the next few years as I think there may be some very interesting new models. I just hope that they do not eliminate some of their models, as I need to save up some more before acquiring my next Stowa


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## Chris-John

ScreenKiller said:


> But I still insist that a symbol is easier to recognize then a font


Not when it's a complex symbol that is 2mm high.


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## Orsoni

I respect Jorg's opinion on his logo after all, he is the one with the final say and he knows far more about the watch business than I will ever know.

That being said, I find that I have a visceral attraction to the old logo that I can't quite explain. It can't be the long history of the logo as, I've just discovered the Stowa brand just a few short months ago.

With that in mind, I have decided to purchase a Stowa Antea 365 while they are still available with the old logo


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## chickenlittle

I would be curious to know how many people cancelled their outstanding order (old logo) or postponed their purchase knowing the new logo is coming. That versus the number of people who hastened their purchase before the old logo is gone from their desired model. I'm in the latter camp.


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## ev13wt

makoto said:


> As a result, when I see things like a new logo, and a new watch with the TESTAF certification, I get excited. I am very interested to see what Stowa will have in the next few years as I think there may be some very interesting new models. I just hope that they do not eliminate some of their models, as I need to save up some more before acquiring my next Stowa


Yea, but the TO1 has the old logo. Timing could have been better there... 

The new "based on TO1" 24h and GMTs have the new logo.

Will the upcoming "TO2" TESTAF Chronograph have the old or the new logo? Or will there be an updated TO1 with the new logo? Very confusing. For a German company, pretty chaotic...


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## CM HUNTER

ev13wt said:


> Yea, but the TO1 has the old logo. Timing could have been better there...
> 
> The new "based on TO1" 24h and GMTs have the new logo.
> 
> Will the upcoming "TO2" TESTAF Chronograph have the old or the new logo? Or will there be an updated TO1 with the new logo? Very confusing. For a German company, pretty chaotic...


I don't see any confusion at all. It's been clearly stated that every Stowa model, both historic designs and fresh from the mind of Jorge designs, will get the new logo. (Doesn't fresh from the mind of Jorge designs sound exciting, can't wait).

The Testaf is simply the first model in the Stowa line up that is not at all based off of an old Stowa model. It's on a whole new level for a pilot watch for Stowa, as stated by the company, and is obvious by its specs. I think coming up with this model, and thinking about future models for the brand, is what initially triggered the idea for a fresh new direction for the logo as well. Hence the timing and why the first Testaf has the old logo... it most assuredly won't keep it.


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## StufflerMike

ev13wt said:


> Yea, but the TO1 has the old logo.


Right, as already drafted in April 2013.


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## Jörg Schauer

Hello everybody,

just came along to this thread and i can give you some new infos after we launched the new logo a few months ago.

1. Testaf watch was already in the pipeline and parts (especially the dial) has been under production when we launched the new Logo.

2. All in all we have still a increasing in selling's, every months in the relation to last years months (since many years).

The result is that after launching the new Logo nothing happened negative 
(thanks for this, al the things we do are based on personal feelings and you never know if you found the right way or not, it doesn´t matter if you stand completely behind a decision or not. Sometimes the reality shows you if it was good or not, in this case my feeling was right)

3. Especially the Antea 390 with new Logo is ordered more than before, maybe it belongs to the new movement A10 (i realy don´t know).

4. Also the new Marine Automatic in silver and with the new Logo is ordered like always or more.
(this watch also contains the new Soprod A10 movement)

5. Of course all new modells and the next series of the older modells will have the new Logo.

For me, as i look on it every day many many times it is realy nice and i am happy to did the decision to relaunch the good old STOWA Logo to the new look.

But i completely understand the people who still need a bit time to accept the new Logo, we hope they will do in the future.

Have a look at the new Logo on the Antea 390 and Marine Automatic, it is well integrated and printed in grey, i think this is realy nice and fits the modells perfect.

Best regards

Jörg Schauer


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## CCCP

Jörg Schauer said:


> Have a look at the new Logo on the Antea 390 and Marine Automatic, it is well integrated and printed in grey, i think this is realy nice and fits the modells perfect.


I'm so glad I already own an Antea 390... anyway the watch is so nice it will be easy to sell despite the new logo ;-)


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## CM HUNTER

CCCP said:


> I'm so glad I already own an Antea 390... anyway the watch is so nice it will be easy to sell despite the new logo ;-)


Or because of it. Like the owner stated, overall sales are the same or better than they were for certain models after the logo change. Regardless of an improved movement, people wouldn't buy the watch if they were that offended by a logo. Obviously more could care less about a logo change than those that do. Good to see as Stowas future rides on it and at the end of the day, regardless of personal opinions, that's what really matters. Looks like Stowas future is as bright as ever.


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## pwr2blv

Just curious, if I ordered a new Antea KS (35.5mm) from Stowa today, would it come with the new logo or the old logo? Would it still come with the 7001?


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## StufflerMike

pwr2blv said:


> Just curious, if I ordered a new Antea KS (35.5mm) from Stowa today, would it come with the new logo or the old logo? Would it still come with the 7001?


I'd email Stowa. The KS comes woth the 7001, currently there is no other option.


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## Nithy

pwr2blv said:


> Just curious, if I ordered a new Antea KS (35.5mm) from Stowa today, would it come with the new logo or the old logo?


I emailed Stowa about this when I ordered my KS back in July. I was told by Stowa that you get the watch as it is described and pictured on the website. So if the store shows the old logo you will get the old logo. However, perhaps their intentions have changed so you should email them to be sure.


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## pwr2blv

Great info, thanks! I did send an email to Stowa, if there is any difference in response I will be sure to pass it along.


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## shoelover

Ok so let me get this right..on the dial the new logo will be Stowa with watches made in Germany since 1927 written underneath...surely not?...that could possibly be a deal breaker for me, With a beautiful dial on the M/O this would totally spoil it...arghhh why fix something that aint broke?


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## StufflerMike

shoelover said:


> Ok so let me get this right..on the dial the new logo will be Stowa with watches made in Germany since 1927 written underneath...surely not?...that could possibly be a deal breaker for me, With a beautiful dial on the M/O this would totally spoil it...arghhh why fix something that aint broke?


Look at the pics on the Stowa website and you are in the know.


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## CM HUNTER

shoelover said:


> Ok so let me get this right..on the dial the new logo will be Stowa with watches made in Germany since 1927 written underneath...surely not?...that could possibly be a deal breaker for me, With a beautiful dial on the M/O this would totally spoil it...arghhh why fix something that aint broke?


Look at the actual watches with the new logo, not the logo used for the website... of course Made In Germany Since 1927 will not be on the dial.

So, all that is happening is the swapping out of a stylized S for the Walter Storz exclusive logo and making the S match the rest of the text that has always been there. Nothing dramatic at all. And the logo is done in a low key grey so that beautiful dial design can take precedence.


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## Bobby75

I ordered a Stowa back in march I think it arrived about October. It had the old logo on it so I shouldn't worry about it.

I doubt there has been any significant drop in sales due to the new logo. New customers will probably not notice any significant differance.

I remember a few years back watch forums were full of Stowa watches now it seems to be mostly high end stuff (IWC, Rolex) and cheap diver watches.


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## SPaulMac

Well, this thread was an interesting read. Certainly a passionate lot. While I'm happy that my recently ordered Antea KS will sport the older style logo due to it's historically derived face, I have to say I enjoy the new logo. It speaks to a forward looking attitude for the new Stowa and it's cleaner, more up-to-date design should appeal to younger buyers.

Frankly I feel the new logo appears more "German" (at least the modern Germany), which is a nice way to set Stowa watches apart from their European and Asian competitors and emphasize the country of origin.


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## jferreir

My personal preference is for the old logo, especially for the more classic designs. Ultimately, though, I doubt this change will result in any discernible difference in sales. Sales might go up or down, but I suspect that will have more do with the price/performance ratio relative to the competition than anything else. 

In my case, I'm just happy I placed my order when I did (Antea 365). I prefer the Soprod A 10 over the ETA 2824, and yet I like the older logo best for this model. I wonder how many Antea's will ship with this configuration? Historically speaking, it has a certain crossover appeal.


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## robertl

Has anyone received a Stowa with the new logo on it yet? I only see a few models on the website with the new logo, and I'm expecting the MO I ordered last week to have the old logo per the website.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Shieze

If the watch you ordered shows the old logo then you will get the old logo. They have only moved to the new logo for a few models so far.


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## Bijick

To me the "s" from the old logo says elegant, yet powerful. Which describes many things German, to me. I'm not too hot on the new one. I'm waiting on a PD to ship soon, the pics on their website shows the old s still so I'll get that I'd assume, but maybe jorg has been reading these comments because it does seem like it's taking an awfully long time to make the switch. I didnt see many new logos in the pics and it's been 10 months since this announcement. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## flappylove

Maybe it was all just an elaborate marketing ruse, to get us all to rush and buy all the watch models with the beloved old logo


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## fuzzyb

Bijick said:


> ...but maybe jorg has been reading these comments because it does seem like it's taking an awfully long time to make the switch. I didnt see many new logos in the pics and it's been 10 months since this announcement.





flappylove said:


> Maybe it was all just an elaborate marketing ruse, to get us all to rush and buy all the watch models with the beloved old logo


Or maybe it was explained in Jörg's original post .

I can only imagine the logistics involved with changing over every single dial in their lineup. Not only do they have to plan orders for the new models, they must also account for all of the previous orders, as well as any orders that came in from the time they made the announcement until the time they officially change over.

I am a fan of the old font with the stylized "S" but I can see why Stowa as a brand would want to move forward with a new logo, particularly with new models such as the TESTAF in the lineup. I am also hopeful that a further evolution will happen where the logo is located above the STOWA. Only time will tell. Until then, I will continue to enjoy the Stowas I have with the old logo and look forward to receiving Stowas with the new logo (I already have one on order and I think it will look great with the new logo).



Jörg Schauer said:


> Of course we will add this new Logo* step by step *to *all watch models.*
> 
> But this procedure will need* appr. 6 - 12 months.*
> 
> ...
> 
> Right now we can't exactly determine the date all modells will be available with the new Logo.
> This depends on the orderquantitie and the suppliers possibilities and the movement situation.
> 
> *Different reasons cause this situation:*
> 1 - at the moment we have no possibility to know which and how many movements we will get
> from ETA and other suppliers in 2014 .
> (We already have ideas and wishes but no confirmations from movementsuppliers.)
> 
> 2 - we don't know exactly how long we have to work with the old Logo dials we have in stock, this depends
> of course on how much our customers will order. (For each single watch this will be different!)
> 
> 3 - we already have long term orders for dials under way and we have to wait which dials could be changed to the new logo.
> This also depends on our suppliers.


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## Bijick

fuzzyb said:


> Or maybe it was explained in Jörg's original post .


Well I know he reads this forum often and takes note, all I was saying was that he may be taking peoples' criticisms into consideration. He gave a very loose 6-12 month estimate but after 10 months there hasn't been as many watches with the new logo.

It just seems to me that such a proven customer oriented CEO would take into account the feedback of his customers in this thread.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## CM HUNTER

New models means a new direction, hence the new logo. Therefore, the decision to do it isn't going to change, but people's feelings about it undoubtedly will.


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## canard

Your point about the new logo suiting the many of the new models is good. However, I think many of us here just don't see the new logo as being in accord with the aesthetic of Stowa's more traditional offerings.

Large clothing companies will often offer multiple lines, and sometimes the logos for these lines will be different. What I would love to see Stowa do is to use the new logo for watches like the TESTAF, Prodiver and anything similar that may be in the pipeline. If the company designated, say, a heritage line for the more traditional models (including the Antea, Marine, 1938, Partito and Flieger), and either offered them with the older logo or just made it available as a special order, I think everyone would be happy.

Whether something like this would be possible for a small company is another question.


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## flappylove

CM HUNTER said:


> New models means a new direction, hence the new logo. Therefore, the decision to do it isn't going to change, but people's feelings about it undoubtedly will.


A move to new models/new direction could be more of a turn-off and a bigger problem than the new logo, if Stowa move more to the big garish (e.g. prodiver style) watches that so many other brands already churn out.


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## CM HUNTER

flappylove said:


> A move to new models/new direction could be more of a turn-off and a bigger problem than the new logo, if Stowa move more to the big garish (e.g. prodiver style) watches that so many other brands already churn out.


New models include the chronographs and all of the Testaf models. Don't see those as fitting into what you state. The Testaf is large, but it's also made of Titanium and purposefully built, with a certification that proves as much.

Can't really see Jorge going into that direction, but who knows? Just like a 40mm pilot is too small for some peoples liking, maybe some new Stowa models won't be for everybody.


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## flappylove

CM HUNTER said:


> New models include the chronographs and all of the Testaf models. Don't see those as fitting into what you state. The Testaf is large, but it's also made of Titanium and purposefully built, with a certification that proves as much.
> 
> Can't really see Jorge going into that direction, but who knows? Just like a 40mm pilot is too small for some peoples liking, maybe some new Stowa models won't be for everybody.


I agree, and i'm not suggesting he would go in the direction. 
I was just making the point that a new direction would do more harm to a brands identity than a new logo would. 
The way Stowa designs its models to compliment its history creates just as strong a link to the brands history as the logo does.


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## CM HUNTER

flappylove said:


> I agree, and i'm not suggesting he would go in the direction.
> I was just making the point that a new direction would do more harm to a brands identity than a new logo would.
> The way Stowa designs its models to compliment its history creates just as strong a link to the brands history as the logo does.


Ah, I see your point. Hopefully, neither move will hurt them.

It's been reported by Jorge that the models with new logo have not seen a dip in sales, so that's good. And I've seen numerous posts where customers that avoided the small flieger have ordered the larger new generation Testaf, so that's good as well.

As long as Stowa keeps the originals while adding the new (and they are), and as long as people keep in perspective that it's just a simple logo change and no change in overall watch design or quality, Stowa will be just fine.


----------



## flappylove

CM HUNTER said:


> ...and as long as people keep in perspective that it's just a simple logo change and no change in overall watch design or quality, Stowa will be just fine.


Agreed. As long as their quality, integrity and fair pricing is maintained they will be fine. 
Beyond that it is just personal taste and no company can make everyone happy in this regard. 
The big watch thing is my personal problem (anything bigger than 38mm is vulgar to my eyes.) I know this is my problem not everyone else's, but it already excludes me from many/most brands so I hope it doesn't exclude me from future Stowa models (and i'm sure the fashion for big watches will pass eventually.)


----------



## svetoslav

So happy my MO is with the old logo. The new one is too generic for my taste. When something is working, don't touch it!!!


----------



## tonywalk

I can't find any love for the new logo. Thankfully I was able to order my Antea 365 A10 with the old one which I love to bits


----------



## fedechan

svetoslav said:


> When something is working, don't touch it!!!


I agree!


----------



## BreadCrumbs

I can't get myself to like the new logo; it's the reason why I bought a used Antea.


----------



## zephyrnoid

Since I've still got a bad taste in my mouth RE: a watch loss, I haven't caught this thread till now.
I'm big on ID design and really big on typography so consider this an expert opinion.
I have a personal predilection for offbeat touches in all my designs and that extends to logos.
In fact, I'm famous for little accidents that really make words sTand out.
Thus:
- The offbeat font change (script) in the old stowa's 'S' was very fitting, particularly when harmonizing with the more vintage face features such as roman numeral markers on the older styled watches. 
- The straight up regular sans font for 'towa' harmonized well with the geometric Bauhaus dials and sans Arabic markers.
- I really like the new logo picon ( stylized 'W' ) but would not have added it to a full spelling of 's t o w a' as that would constitute overkill something we try to avoid in minimalist design.
- It's a difficult conundrum to resolve and while I credit your designer for coming up with a lovely picon, it's meaningless next to the text aspect of the logo and if any character epitomizes the Stowa brand, it's the S not the W.
- I would have simply redone the old logo with different fonts or developed a style guide that dictates that different watch groups get a certain logos.


----------



## MilkAndSugarPlease

I'm a new member, hi everyone. I also prefer the old logo if I'm honest. The 'S' looked awesome.
However, in Jörg we trust. I think it's safe to say that he knows what he's doing


----------



## jro2329

Sorry about my reply

the writer is my freind who are interested in watch.

he wrote this repl to make fun of ,,,

just joke.

sorry if you are upset becasue of my reply


----------



## hidden830726

jro2329 said:


> jorg.... you are good watch maker but you are not good CEO.
> 
> many people who like stowa watch are unpleasant beacuase of you.
> 
> stowa's future is not positive


Troll?

stowa's future is not positive, its very very very positive


----------



## elbilo

jro2329 said:


> jorg.... you are good watch maker but you are not good CEO.
> 
> many people who like stowa watch are unpleasant beacuase of you.
> 
> stowa's future is not positive


I'm just curious what your judgement is based on? If I recall correctly, they reported increased sales since they started their new chapter.


----------



## MHELKIOT

When I see such a watch I think STOWA logo and future is very positive...


----------



## enyn90

the new logo looks good on some of the newer models, but not the older ones. i wanted to get the marine original, but :roll:


----------



## brainless

jro2329 said:


> jorg.... you are good watch maker but you are not good CEO.
> 
> many people who like stowa watch are unpleasant beacuase of you.
> 
> stowa's future is not positive


There are two departments in my ' archive for replies ' referring to such insane posts:
- The first one is titled ' Ignore '
- The second department's name is ' Don't even ignore '

I decided to put this footless and rude remark of_ jro2329_ in the second department....

Volker :roll:


----------



## H_J_R_

Archive it under bad comedy.


----------



## Zinzan

Yeah, this is a strange post. Looks like this guy bought two Stowa's recently, both with the new logo, and loved them. Then he's been quietly lurking and suddenly posted this?

Maybe a drunk post? Or a girlfriend or someone posted as him as a joke, or maybe they are tired of him and his Stowa's?


----------



## hidden830726

I think he is just trolling to tick our nerf. He seems to be a nice person. In fact, everyone is nice in this world.


----------



## dcg

I specifically ordered my MO in Roman numerals because it was still shown on the site with the old logo. Even went so far as to confirm via email that I'd receive the old logo as shown on the site. It arrived today and....new logo. Not a good feeling to open the box and see that.


----------



## enyn90

I feel you, the marine is one of the model that looks much better with the old logo.



dcg said:


> I specifically ordered my MO in Roman numerals because it was still shown on the site with the old logo. Even went so far as to confirm via email that I'd receive the old logo as shown on the site. It arrived today and....new logo. Not a good feeling to open the box and see that.


----------



## Zinzan

dcg said:


> I specifically ordered my MO in Roman numerals because it was still shown on the site with the old logo. Even went so far as to confirm via email that I'd receive the old logo as shown on the site. It arrived today and....new logo. Not a good feeling to open the box and see that.


That would certainly be disappointing. I'm sure you sent them a note right away? Let us know how they handle it--I think it almost definitely will be resolved to your satisfaction, one way or another.


----------



## dcg

enyn90 said:


> I feel you, the marine is one of the model that looks much better with the old logo.


I very much agree.



Zinzan said:


> That would certainly be disappointing. I'm sure you sent them a note right away? Let us know how they handle it--I think it almost definitely will be resolved to your satisfaction, one way or another.


I did; I received a response that they are closed for a holiday today, and operating with a smaller crew tomorrow, so it may be Monday before I hear back.

My watch had been delayed for a couple of weeks (which I understand; things happen), but to open the box and see the wrong logo was a major disappointment after all the anticipation.


----------



## Zinzan

Hmmm... I guess you probably ought to keep it untouched/unworn in hopes that they have one they can swap out with you.


----------



## SFSteve

Hardly a mistake of the same magnitude but my new Flieger arrived today...with the wrong strap! Oops. I'm sure that mistake will be corrected; hope yours is, too, because I'm with you on the logo preference.


----------



## mreyman73

I own one Stowa: Flieger, no logo or date. I wish Stowa would make more models with the sterile dials, especially the Marine watches. That was going to be my next purchase, and I will probably still buy one, but the old logo is sexy. The new one, a bit cluttered for my sensibilities. 

I can understand both sides of the logo debate. I agree with the old logo for classic watches argument and new logo for new watch designs. I also agree with those who have said that the new logo W symbol right next to the new STOWA word font is a bit much. Separating them somehow would be preferential to me. But then again, I prefer a sterile dial, so a no logo offering for each model would be ideal.


----------



## H_J_R_

As a major Stowa fan I agee that the new logo just isn't as fit as the old one for the classic lines.. I like the new logo but on the classic flieger and especially on the marine models it does not sit right. I really love the new logo on the more modern designs and IMO Stowa would ideally keep the old loga on the classic designs and the updated logo on the modern watches.

gr, HJR


----------



## hidden830726

H_J_R_ said:


> As a major Stowa fan I agee that the new logo just isn't as fit as the old one for the classic lines.. I like the new logo but on the classic flieger and especially on the marine models it does not sit right. I really love the new logo on the more modern designs and IMO Stowa would ideally keep the old loga on the classic designs and the updated logo on the modern watches.
> 
> gr, HJR


Flieger shouldnt have logo. Period.

Marine, yup.


----------



## LH2

Took delivery of a new flieger with logo this week with the handmade German silver rotor... The logo is _very_ subtle, and not nearly as visible as it appears in website photos. Basically, the logo model looks like a no-logo under most lighting conditions at a typical viewing distance.


----------



## hidden830726

LH2 said:


> Took delivery of a new flieger with logo this week with the handmade German silver rotor... The logo is _very_ subtle, and not nearly as visible as it appears in website photos. Basically, the logo model looks like a no-logo under most lighting conditions at a typical viewing distance.


Ok)-|, that sounds right


----------



## enyn90

agree, but it depends whether the printing of the dial is done in-house or not.

anyway anyone knows how much work of a stowa watch is done in-house?



H_J_R_ said:


> As a major Stowa fan I agee that the new logo just isn't as fit as the old one for the classic lines.. I like the new logo but on the classic flieger and especially on the marine models it does not sit right. I really love the new logo on the more modern designs and IMO Stowa would ideally keep the old loga on the classic designs and the updated logo on the modern watches.
> 
> gr, HJR


----------



## mreyman73

LH2 said:


> Took delivery of a new flieger with logo this week with the handmade German silver rotor... The logo is _very_ subtle, and not nearly as visible as it appears in website photos. Basically, the logo model looks like a no-logo under most lighting conditions at a typical viewing distance.


Pics?


----------



## dcg

I received an email first thing this morning apologizing for the inconvenience. The individual who can confirm what can be done is out today, so I'll be hearing early next week. Hoping for the best!


----------



## H_J_R_

hidden830726 said:


> Flieger shouldnt have logo. Period.
> 
> Marine, yup.


I am not so strict on that i guess. I too prefer the fliegers ohne logo. But when it does have one i would still choose the old Stowa logo.

gr, HJR


----------



## SParis

dcg said:


> I specifically ordered my MO in Roman numerals because it was still shown on the site with the old logo. Even went so far as to confirm via email that I'd receive the old logo as shown on the site. It arrived today and....new logo. Not a good feeling to open the box and see that.


That's disturbing because I did the same thing. I ordered 2 watches, (a Partitio and and a black MO) which was a financial stretch, because I wanted to get them before the logo changed. I emailed with my order to confirm that they would come with the old logo as shown on the website, and to to inform them that it was very important to me that they have to old logo. They answered that the watches would be as they are shown on the website.

They are due around the end of May.

I'll follow up here when they arrive.


----------



## Lodan

I'm surprised this is still an active thread. Both logos have their charm but all watches have that beauty and quality that we have come to expect from Stowa


----------



## hidden830726

Lodan said:


> I'm surprised this is still an active thread. Both logos have their charm but all watches have that beauty and quality that we have come to expect from Stowa


The only explanation is people like their stowa and have not much active thread available to vent Stowa awesomeness


----------



## dcg

Happy to report that Stowa has informed me I can return my MO and they will update the dial for me!


----------



## SFSteve

dcg said:


> Happy to report that Stowa has informed me I can return my MO and they will update the dial for me!


Congrats -- though I'm sorry you'll have to endure extra waiting. But I can relate to that a little. I recently received a Flieger that was mounted on the wrong strap (not the one I ordered and really not to my taste). One e-mail exchange and a replacement was posted. I got that yesterday and...it's the wrong strap again! (Although it's a different wrong strap this time.) Another e-mail exchange produced an "out of office until June 7" reply. This does not mean that customer service is poor, of course, but I think it qualifies as kind of lame. So I have my watch, but it does not look like it's supposed to and I still haven't worn it.


----------



## dcg

I have also received the out of office reply, but still tend to receive responses rather quickly (taking into account time zone differences). I'm sure you won't be waiting until the 7th for a response. 

The wait is of course a bit of a drag, but I'm just happy that the replacement dial is available and I'll get what I ordered. The timing is unfortunate as my Speedy is with Omega at the moment, so for the time being I'm relegated to using the iPhone as a timepiece.


----------



## frank_be

dcg said:


> so for the time being I'm relegated to using the iPhone as a timepiece.


No Apple Watch ? ;-) You "need" one to see your heart rate go up when your Stowa arrives.


----------



## Mainspring13

just noticed the new logo... not digging it. hopefully I can order a MO with the old logo. new logo is not a good fit for the classic lines of MO imho.


----------



## dcg

frank_be said:


> No Apple Watch ? ;-) You "need" one to see your heart rate go up when your Stowa arrives.


I wandered in the Apple store the other day and they were pushing them HARD . Fortunately, my Speedy was returned ahead of schedule!


----------



## Lenny_Goofoff

*a bit late maybe, but why new logo?*

do not want to be considered as a troll, but i'm partial to the old one and don't like new one at all. 
great suggestion here - keep old logo on the heritage models 

__
https://www.reddit.com/r/Watches/comments/2zdtxe


----------



## StufflerMike

*Re: a bit late maybe, but why new logo?*

Don't feel like doing a search ?
Merged with a randomly chosen thread covering the issue.


----------



## hidden830726

*Re: a bit late maybe, but why new logo?*



Lenny_Goofoff said:


> do not want to be considered as a troll, but i'm partial to the old one and don't like new one at all.
> great suggestion here - keep old logo on the heritage models
> 
> __
> https://www.reddit.com/r/Watches/comments/2zdtxe
> 
> View attachment 12813807


To me, the old logo represent history, the new logo however, represent the future. That's why the new logo also looks more modern. We should respect jorg vision to modernise the brand.

You can still get the old logo with certain model (not sure if it's still the case), but I'm sure that you can always get some lovely stowa preowned with old logo at sales corner or watchrecon.

Maybe one day, there will be an old logo LE, but for now, let's stand by it.

Just like "The Last Jedi", some don't like it because it deviate from the old formula, or destroying a legacy, but hey, I'm just grateful that I get to see more star wars, spin-off and more melenium falcon.

Sent from my SM-G930F using Tapatalk


----------



## Lenny_Goofoff

my apologies to the community and the mod. 
should search it up first

yet new logo it IS painfully generic (default Adobe Myriad type)
so strange to see such lazy work from renowned designer
(i.e. mr. Esslinger)


----------



## JacobC

New logo looks like it came out of a first-year graphic design class. Lame.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro


----------



## brainless

There are pros and cons either way. But it seems the antagonists do outnumber the advocats - in this forum at least.
I also prefer the original (don't want to say 'old' b-) ) logo to the new one.

You should know that there is a history with the STOWA logo - it went through many stages in the last 90 years.

In the beginning you got a watch with a *clean dial* (pocket watch from 1931 or even earlier); only case and lids were marked with STOWA








Then there appeared a *STOWA* with an elegantly curved *S*,
before WW II







and after WW II








This watch shows *STOWA *and the predecessor of the well known *logo*:








Here is a *STOWA* plus an *underline*, shaped like an arrow








*STOWA* plus the 'modern' *logo*








*STOWA *plus *underline *plus *logo*








*STOWA* plus *underline* plus *logo *plus *specification*








....and back to the roots, just *STOWA* and nothing else - or did I miss something? :think:








Regarding the specifications (sub brands, series of models, sales channels, etc. etc.) there were a lot of different inscriptions, such as 








*66 *(in a circle)*; PARAT; PARAT S; PALLAS; Regent; Convertible; R *(in a circle)*; 666; Precision; EXTRA; AMOR; PRIMA; MEMO-Time; Meeting Remember; Mini-Alarm; PILL-ALARM; Mini-Electronic; Min-Stop; rhombus *(graphic)*; Sport; Stabil; Sweety; Worldtimer; Totomat*; 
...and not to forget: *Seatime*, this trade mark was registered in 1958 already.

Would it be wrong to hope that there will be another, new/original STOWA logo after the current one? 
While there's life, there's hope,

Volker ;-)

PS:
Does anybody know the brands _La Cloche_ and/or _Editia_?
Both were made in Germany.


----------



## X2-Elijah

Hmm. 

I like both logos. Imo depending on the particular watch, one or the other works better. E.g. on the B2B Anteas, the new logo is absolutely spot-on. On the marine originals with leaf-blade hands, the old logo seems more appropriate. 

Technically, the new logo is more balanced than the old one - old one has a higher left side than the right side, so more 'weight' on the left. On the other hand, the new logo is very wide and 'flat', almost as if to accommodate a sub-line or underscript.

*shurg* either way. Both are nice logos - simple and straight-to-the-point, occupying no more space than necessary on the dial.


P.S. regarding fonts - isn't the "towa" part of both logos using the same font anyway? (sure look similar either way, no?)


----------



## CM HUNTER

X2-Elijah said:


> Hmm.
> 
> I like both logos. Imo depending on the particular watch, one or the other works better. E.g. on the B2B Anteas, the new logo is absolutely spot-on. On the marine originals with leaf-blade hands, the old logo seems more appropriate.
> 
> Technically, the new logo is more balanced than the old one - old one has a higher left side than the right side, so more 'weight' on the left. On the other hand, the new logo is very wide and 'flat', almost as if to accommodate a sub-line or underscript.
> 
> *shurg* either way. Both are nice logos - simple and straight-to-the-point, occupying no more space than necessary on the dial.
> 
> P.S. regarding fonts - isn't the "towa" part of both logos using the same font anyway? (sure look similar either way, no?)


Yep, you nailed it exactly. People getting so passionately upset about the new look when it's literally the same exact font with one letter being changed, and actually a better placement of the logo itself. I dont get it. Seems this is just a case of when purists can get over something as opposed to there really being anything to moan about.


----------



## whineboy

VFMpro said:


> Yep, you nailed it exactly. People getting so passionately upset about the new look when it's literally the same exact font with one letter being changed, and actually a better placement of the logo itself. I dont get it. Seems this is just a case of when purists can get over something as opposed to there really being anything to moan about.


Silly to even argue, the change is well-established and the thread suddenly revived 2.5 years after the last

I don't think the fonts are the same at all - yes, they are both sans serif, but if you look at the shapes of the letters, they are clearly different (e.g., on one the O is close to circular, the other, laterally compressed, and the proportions of the A and T are also very different). The thickness of the lines also differs.

If I see can see these differences as an ordinary person, a graphic designer would see far more. We can't say the fonts are the same.

It's been years since the logo change. Let the old Stowa logo rest in peace.


----------



## X2-Elijah

whineboy said:


> I don't think the fonts are the same at all - yes, they are both sans serif, but if you look at the shapes of the letters, they are clearly different (e.g., on one the O is close to circular, the other, laterally compressed, and the proportions of the A and T are also very different). The thickness of the lines also differs.


That logo-only picture posted before is *utterly misleading.* Compare the _actual logos printed on the watches_. There is no "thick line" logo on any watch.

Straight from stowa shop:















The 'towa' parts are the same font, or near-as-makes-no-difference.


----------



## whineboy

X2-Elijah said:


> That logo-only picture posted before is *utterly misleading.* Compare the _actual logos printed on the watches_. There is no "thick line" logo on any watch.
> 
> Straight from stowa shop:
> View attachment 12820025
> 
> View attachment 12820027
> 
> 
> The 'towa' parts are the same font, or near-as-makes-no-difference.


Respectfully disagree, the As, Os and Ts are quite different. As is line thickness. Just because both fonts are simple does not mean they are the same.

We can agree to disagree, neither of us will convince the other. After all, this is a dead issue, old vs. new.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


----------



## ads75

We are talking about this again?


----------



## StufflerMike

ads75 said:


> We are talking about this again?


Good observation.


----------



## CM HUNTER

whineboy said:


> Silly to even argue, the change is well-established and the thread suddenly revived 2.5 years after the last
> 
> I don't think the fonts are the same at all - yes, they are both sans serif, but if you look at the shapes of the letters, they are clearly different (e.g., on one the O is close to circular, the other, laterally compressed, and the proportions of the A and T are also very different). The thickness of the lines also differs.
> 
> If I see can see these differences as an ordinary person, a graphic designer would see far more. We can't say the fonts are the same.
> 
> It's been years since the logo change. Let the old Stowa logo rest in peace.


Not arguing at all. Just stating my personal observation as I see it. As you say yourself "just because they are both simple doesn't make them the same". I say simple is simple, and that's what most of the negative feedback centers around.


----------



## ALEXO

*Mulling over the new logo's place in Bauhaus*

I understand that Hartmut Esslinger was involved in convincing Stowa to change its logo in 2013 and that he has some influence in the design community, but I'm unable to find the reason this was extended to the historical Antea models. I can't get over the incongruity of the new logo in these Bauhaus watches, as the angularity and sharp points of the triangular icon detract from the aesthetic. It is too superfluous for Bauhaus. The logo is perhaps fitting for the modern designs, but such a design that is essentially unchanged from that historically made by Stowa should be honoured with the old logo, I think. It is something I see in the Partitio watch, and I find it regrettable that it is not considered for the Antea.


Could any one offer me good reasons why this new logo belongs on an Antea? I'm willing to have my mind changed with a compelling story, and I would love to support Stowa with another purchase. As it stands, I can't help but think that this was an absent-minded change to a perfectly designed historical model.


I'm looking to have my emotions swayed. It seems unlikely, but you all seem to have a good understanding of things and may be able to help. Thank you, all.


----------



## SJR3

*Re: Mulling over the new logo's place in Bauhaus*

I also much prefer the old logo. It's funny, I would wager that at least 80% of Stowa fans prefer the older logo, and not merely for nostalgic/historical reasons, but aesthetics as well. Since we all know Jörg reads these forums, I wonder if he would ever be persuaded to change back to the old logo, or at least offer it as an option for some watches. I would immediately buy an Antea 41 and a Flieger Classic with the old logo.


----------



## SaoDavi

*Re: Mulling over the new logo's place in Bauhaus*

Theres so many options already I can't see picking between two logos.

They already have logo, no logo, date, no date, and different dial colors. The possible combinations after additional an "old logo" option would be untenable.


----------



## joeabroad

*Re: Mulling over the new logo's place in Bauhaus*



SJR3 said:


> I would immediately buy an Antea 41 and a Flieger Classic with the old logo.


Have to say I'm of the same mind. The only Stowa I own has the old logo (granted, it's over 70 years old), and as I learn more about the modern brand I find that I am only looking at watches with the old logo. If I buy an Antea or Flieger, it will have to be a used one with the old logo. So, adding my vote, in case anyone is counting.


----------



## JacobC

I'm usually not super prone to hyperbole or anything but I don't think I'd buy a watch with the new logo on it.


----------



## ALEXO

JacobC said:


> I'm usually not super prone to hyperbole or anything but I don't think I'd buy a watch with the new logo on it.


This feels like New Coke to me. Some marketing guy comes in and sells a company some simple branding heuristic that does the opposite of what it promises or fixes something that isn't broken. The beauty of the watches and the quality of the work were enough to increase the old logo's respect and symbolism. Altering this process so soon seems so strange. Why a new direction, when the company was clearly heading in a positive direction and was being praised by the public? Why frustrate that?

Any logo can work provided it is backed by a legitimate and principled company, which Stowa is. The company builds the brand, not the other way around, so I can see the new logo gradually being assimilated into the public's tastes. I'm really more concerned about the new logo's intrusion on the bauhaus watches, which have a particular aesthetic and design principle. The Antea is diminished by the anachronistic addition of an icon with no pedigree, place, or function. An option for the old logo would be appreciated on these designs, at least.


----------



## JacobC

ALEXO said:


> This feels like New Coke to me. Some marketing guy comes in and sells a company some simple branding heuristic that does the opposite of what it promises or fixes something that isn't broken. The beauty of the watches and the quality of the work were enough to increase the old logo's respect and symbolism. Altering this process so soon seems so strange. Why a new direction, when the company was clearly heading in a positive direction and was being praised by the public? Why frustrate that?
> 
> Any logo can work provided it is backed by a legitimate and principled company, which Stowa is. The company builds the brand, not the other way around, so I can see the new logo gradually being assimilated into the public's tastes. I'm really more concerned about the new logo's intrusion on the bauhaus watches, which have a particular aesthetic and design principle. The Antea is diminished by the anachronistic addition of an icon with no pedigree, place, or function. An option for the old logo would be appreciated on these designs, at least.


Well said


----------



## rasmusp

For what it is worth, I would also still prefer the old logo on classic models such as the antea watches.

I tried a friend's antea ks yesterday and the new logo lacks elegance. It doesn't help that it is gray either.

For the more modern models it looks perfectly ok.


----------



## Tiemen_S

*Re: Mulling over the new logo's place in Bauhaus*



ALEXO said:


> I understand that Hartmut Esslinger was involved in convincing Stowa to change its logo in 2013 and that he has some influence in the design community, but I'm unable to find the reason this was extended to the historical Antea models. I can't get over the incongruity of the new logo in these Bauhaus watches, as the angularity and sharp points of the triangular icon detract from the aesthetic. It is too superfluous for Bauhaus. The logo is perhaps fitting for the modern designs, but such a design that is essentially unchanged from that historically made by Stowa should be honoured with the old logo, I think. It is something I see in the Partitio watch, and I find it regrettable that it is not considered for the Antea.
> 
> 
> Could any one offer me good reasons why this new logo belongs on an Antea? I'm willing to have my mind changed with a compelling story, and I would love to support Stowa with another purchase. As it stands, I can't help but think that this was an absent-minded change to a perfectly designed historical model.
> 
> 
> I'm looking to have my emotions swayed. It seems unlikely, but you all seem to have a good understanding of things and may be able to help. Thank you, all.


Well, as far as compelling stories go, the logo sure does not seem to have appeared out of thin air. If you take a look at the year 1956 on stowa's history page stowa.de/en/history+stowa , you can clearly see the logo's icon behind the artpiece.

On the topic of the typography: I get why the curvy S is so iconic in itself and dear to a lot of fans. I like the "old look" it has, too, but at the same time find the (S) having a weirdly distracting presence.

This imposes a problem however, since you have two icons for your brand that don't mix well (the icon being quite angular and the (S)towa too curvy in comparison and non-uniform in height). 
My perception is that they opted to surely keep the "icon" and provided it with better matching typography that's all exactly aligned with the height of the body of said icon.

I for one especially like how it sits on the crown. At least it's better than some lonely (S) since the whole word doesn't fit (and bare polished crowns tend to look cheap rather quickly). I guess there probably is more to the slight change in font to better match the icon as well.

And as far as bauhaus, simplicity and practicality go, I believe you should have one combination that simply works instead of having to maintain two contradicting icons for your brand.

Bear in mind most of the above is my perception, but my own story is compelling enough for me to buy an Antea 365


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## joeabroad

*Re: Mulling over the new logo's place in Bauhaus*



Tiemen_S said:


> Well, as far as compelling stories go, the logo sure does not seem to have appeared out of thin air. If you take a look at the year 1956 on stowa's history page stowa.de/en/history+stowa , you can clearly see the logo's icon behind the artpiece.


I've seen that, too. I wonder if anyone has torn themselves away from this riveting thread long enough to look into the history of that funny "W," pre-Esslinger. It does turn up on a lot of vintage Stowas. Here's one with a simplified version of the W, although it is such a poor redial that I doubt that it looked much like this originally:


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## Tiemen_S

Whoa, that's one peculiar piece right there! It deserves a different strap, though


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## dr mojo

Like a majority of those who have chimed in over 25 pages, I struggle to understand the decision to change this logo across the entire STOWA product line, in particular the Antea models. It simply does not conform to the style and character of the watch, and personally is visually jarring enough to prevent me from buying the watch. And believe me, I’ve really tried to fall in love with it - it hs spent time in my cart on the STOWA website, but I just can’t get past it. I actually prefer the dial with the historically-appropriate logo to the Nomos Tangente, specifically having all indices numbered instead of just the 12, 2, 4, 8, 10, and even if it was priced at the same $2k as the Tangente, I’d favor it. As a final, last ditch effort, I emailed customer service asking for a favor but they confirmed no silver dials are available for the Antea, even with my offer to pay a significant premium if they could dust one off. With the newer, more rigid logo seemingly stamped as an afterthought onto a timeless and classic dial, I just can’t get past the dissonance of the dial design. As a result, I’m going to go with the Nomos. I would still love some day to be able to add an Antea Klassik KS to my collection, so hopefully Jörg hears the chorus of collectors who want to be able to own the more classic-styled watches without having this new logo and typeface superimposed on an otherwise balanced, cohesive dial.


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## joeabroad

I hear you. I searched for a long time to find a pre-owned Antea with the old logo, and probably overpaid when I did, but I'm very glad that I did. I love looking at it, and I don't think I would love looking at the new logo. The best way I can put it is that I find it both aesthetically disturbing, and historically disturbing. And for a company which has made its mark with close adherence to history, it just makes no sense to me.


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## dr mojo

That's a good-looking piece, joeabroad. Glad your efforts paid off and you were able to come across a decent quality Klassik KS. The whole ensemble just looks _right_, in contrast to the newer models that unfortunately draw your eye to the STOWA logo and send your brain whizzing trying to figure out what exactly it is about it that's out of place. Truly an instance where the saying holds true: They just don't make 'em like they used to!

I too have scoured the deep, dark corners of the internet trying to find someone looking to part with one. As you said was your experience, I plan to be looking for a while as all it takes is a quick look at this beauty to realize there aren't going to be a lot of folks putting these watches on the auction block. The search continues...

Your comment on the historically disturbing aspect of it is also spot on and something previous posts have rightly emphasized. There is a long list of manufacturers out there that don't even remotely come close to having the historical significance of STOWA, and that I'm sure are envious of the position of those that have a well-documented, truthful, and meaningful place in the history of watchmaking. Some will even try to extend their skillset from manufacturing watches to manufacturing history in an effort to appear more long-tenured and pedigreed. With a long, respectable history, STOWA doesn't have to change a thing. The renaissance of vintage-inspired releases we've seen over the past several years just goes to show that collectors place tremendous value on a historically-accurate re-edition - Breitling Navitimer Ref. 806 released last week is just one prime example of this, going as far as getting the exact number of beads on the bezel to match the original 1959 edition.

It's a move that makes less and less sense the more I contemplate it. I was honestly just glad to find this thread and realize I'm not alone in thinking this is nuts. Until STOWA reconsiders, I'll cross my fingers I can have the same success you did on the pre-owned market.


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## Epiphanes050

I definitely prefer the old logo ... It seems like Stowa is trying to go the Nike route and have some sort of abstract design that serves as a stand-in for their name. While I understand the appeal, their old logo has decades of visibility and a simple, Bauhaus aesthetic that is so quintessentially German. Not a fan of the change ... which is why I plan to get my Flieger without a logo on the dial.


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## Ursa Major

joeabroad said:


> I hear you. I searched for a long time to find a pre-owned Antea with the old logo, and probably overpaid when I did, but I'm very glad that I did. I love looking at it, and I don't think I would love looking at the new logo. The best way I can put it is that I find it both aesthetically disturbing, and historically disturbing. And for a company which has made its mark with close adherence to history, it just makes no sense to me.


Perfectly said. I won't "not"buy a Stowa with the new logo, but I much prefer the old one - and at this point we're well past a decent "you'll get used to it" interval.


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## Ursa Major

Since Stowa offers the most customization in ordering of any watch brand I can think of, I'm surprised it doesn't offer the old logo as an option. I would happily pay $100 or more for the old one (if this has been suggested before in the thread, apologies that I missed it).


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## StufflerMike

I do not think that this is going to happen. Already in 2013 Jörg wrote this:



> Hello everybody,
> 
> many thanks for the feelings about the new Logo.
> We knew that it will be a discussion, but the way back is not possible and we don´t want it.
> 
> I think the best sample is the Mercedes and VW Logo history.
> 
> Like everybody can see, there are sometimes bigger steps necessary, sometimes smaller ones.
> 
> But this and many other samples show us that the step forward is always a step forward.
> 
> Of course it will need time to accept this.
> 
> And i fully respect thoose people who likes the older one better.
> 
> Although my best friend likes the older one better, but this doesn´t stop me to launch the new one
> 
> We should have a look to the future and to the past.
> 
> But never just keep something because it is old and good.
> 
> I am always thinking, respect the old but create new ones if you have the feeling that it will be better.
> 
> But it is like many other thinks if we talk about design and taste.
> 
> There are many different existing and this is good !
> 
> There are black and small watches outside, there are white and big watches outside, no matter, if they designed in a good balance i can respect both and i don´t say that one of thoose is rubbish
> 
> The same with Logos of companies.
> 
> You like it or you don´t.
> 
> But this is only a small point of the decision to buy or not.
> 
> There are much bigger reasons to buy a watch.
> 
> Quality, price relation to quality, uniqueness, design, service and so on
> 
> So, we know that it was the right step, we also know that some people don´t agree at the moment.
> 
> We respect all of thoose.
> 
> Best regards
> 
> Jörg Schauer


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## dr mojo

I have to respectfully disagree with Jörg on this one. While the Mercedes-Benz and VW logos have evolved, each evolution has emphasized the most recognizable and iconic elements of their logos while trending toward greater simplicity. You don’t see the name Mercedes-Benz in the updated font anywhere on its new models, except for on the enamel badge on the hood - ironically enough this is their 1926 logo they’ve chosen. Same for VW - they’ve cleaned up the logo over time to emphasize the design elements present in the stylized VW they use today. If the redesign was analogous to Mercedes and VW, they’d have emphasized the iconic scripted S that STOWA enthusiasts would rightly recognize as a core element of the brand identity. Instead, they were convinced to discard it entirely. I’d actually make the case that their complete overhaul flies in the face of how Mercedes and VW have tastefully allowed their logos to evolve over time. 

If we want to stay in the realm of German brands, one cannot ignore the BMW logo, widely regarded as one of the best logos in automobile graphic design. It has remained consistent over a 100+ year history and is credited as a major contributor to their commercial success. Even more closely related to STOWA is the logo of Braun, with the large A in the middle not too dissimilar from the historic scripted S. They’ve stayed true to their heritage and the logo is virtually untouched from its original form.

One other interesting point on all of this is that at least as far as I can tell, all of STOWA’s design awards have been given to watches that feature either no logo or the traditional logo. Time will tell if they are able to continue winning as many awards now that the stodgy new font is emblazoned on their current designs. 

Fortunately, we live in a world where free market principles guide our lives, and no one can force us to buy or wear a watch we don’t freely choose to. Companies that ignore their most informed and vocal customers will find themselves lagging their peers as those customers align themselves with brands that listen to the market and marry consumer preferences with their own stylistic creativity in a harmonious way. If STOWA wants to remain relevant and able to attract and retain talented staff that will propel the company and its designs into the future, ignoring their customers is a great way to ensure they don’t accomplish that goal.


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## StufflerMike

> Fortunately, we live in a world where free market principles guide our lives, and no one can force us to buy or wear a watch we don't freely choose to. Companies that ignore their most informed and vocal customers will find themselves lagging their peers as those customers align themselves with brands that listen to the market and marry consumer preferences with their own stylistic creativity in a harmonious way. If STOWA wants to remain relevant and able to attract and retain talented staff that will propel the company and its designs into the future, ignoring their customers is a great way to ensure they don't accomplish that goal.


Fortunately, the logo change started 6 years ago and Stowa watches still sell like hotcakes and won some awards here and abroad since then (2019 Goldene Unruhe, Red Dot Design). So Stowa did manage to remain relevant, the demand for Stowa watches is unbroken. Jörg had to reduce the production of Schauer watches to answer the demand on Stowa watches (which I think is a real pity). Not seeing Stowa ignoring their customers. As you said, we live in a free world and no one can force you to buy or wear a watch you don't want to wear.


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## Zinzan

While I do prefer the old logo, and sold my new logo Antea KS with hopes that Stowa will one day release a “heritage” Antea LE with the old logo, I think it would be naive of me to suggest that the “new” logo is a mistake. As Mike points out, Stowa continues to do fine 6 years later.


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## brainless

It's a hypothetic consideration only - but who knows how Stowa's business would have grown *with* the original logo?!
Mike Stuffler doesn't mention the increase of models, plant facilities, number of employees and specifically the new co-partners influence - referring to economical and monetary aspects. These are all reasons for growth too.
I know some friends who delayed or even put the purchase on the back burner..............because of the changed logo only. Two of them preferred buying a used watch with the original logo than ordering a new timepiece in Engelsbrand.

On the other hand I do understand Joerg Schauer. His self-confidence demands not only being the successor of the 'old' Stowa company and to transform vintage models in current designs, but to demonstrate the change in the logo too.

My point of view is: Stowa would have been even more successful if they had kept the original logo.
I won't stop supporting the brand and people in Engelsbrand, but I don't think I can start loving the new logo anytime.

We live in a free world and no one can force me to share an opinion I don't want to share,

Volker ;-)


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## DECO665

I like it!


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## Christo

DECO665 said:


> I like it!


Just looking at Stowa again after a log pause when the Fleiger Original was sadly discontinued (was on the list for one)
The Marine Red 60 has sparked my interest, but have to say not keen at all one the new logo; the emblem and new font name together just look wrong to me.
Please Stowa offer the old logo as an option


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## seungbum81

Recently I purchase used Stowa with old logo and am waiting for the delivery.
I am looking forward to comparing side to side


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## robi1138

I really don't understand all the hub-bub about a stupid logo. Personally, I think the new one looks a lot classier.


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## M6TT F

I also prefer the new one. Typographically, the S on the old one is awful


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## flyingpicasso

robi1138 said:


> I really don't understand all the hub-bub about a stupid logo. Personally, I think the new one looks a lot classier.
> 
> View attachment 14548423


Based on these presentations I might agree with you, but the old logo on the dial looks much more elegant. I'm looking at the curvy S on my old Marine right now and love it. To each his own, though.


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## Zinzan

M6TT F said:


> I also prefer the new one. Typographically, the S on the old one is awful


I love that old S on a Stowa dial.


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## M6TT F

Zinzan said:


> I love that old S on a Stowa dial.


As do many others. Just not for me. So unbalanced

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## Cost&Found

looks great!


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