# Anti- Mont Blanc rant



## Atoning Unifex

Dear fellow Pen Enthusiasts,
I have had enough of my Mont Blanc Starwalker Ballpoint pen.
The cap has a plastic thread (screw top) that has become 'threaded' 3 times now. So now the cap does not 'lock' at all.
The first 2 times were under warranty ( I lost the 1st pen and bought another as it was a gift from my wife and did not want to appear careless!),
but this time is ex-warranty.
I thought all they would do would be to replace the plastic thread insert but was surprised to learn they change the entire outside of the cap and pen shaft so that the rubber squares align.
The MB representative said that due to German excellence this is what they need to do. My reply was that the plastic thread should be metal to avoid this rubbish design in the first place.
The cost to fix it was AU$420 and the cost of a new pen approx AU$600. 
Given the ridiculous cost, it's almost better to buy a new pen and avoid this crappy design in the first place!
Needless to say, I now agree that MB is a pen brand that people buy when they first enter the rarefied world of pens (like Rolex and watches) and then move on when they discover other better quality and better designed pens.
I am taking this up with MB.

Thanks for reading.


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## Kittysafe

A beautiful looking pen, I'm surprised they would use cheap plastic parts, especially in such a crucial threading component.

You can buy a beautiful Caran d'ache or Cross pen for $100-$150 and you will love them.
I have never owned a Mont Blanc or Rolex, so I guess I just have never been drawn to "name brand" poser status symbol products
at least not without careful research... It's no different from the Apple cult craze.


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## D N Ravenna

Plastic is not necessarily a bad thing. I have a rare fountain pen made in Japan where the inner liner on the cap is plastic. Unless you look, you would never know the difference. Certainly it does not show in the pen's operation.

The Speedy Pro, prior to Omega putting on a display back, used a plastic piece. It worked perfectly well. But knowing that it would be visible, Omega introduced a new bridge and one more jewel.

the problem with the MB is they chose to use plastic in the wrong place.

Cheers!
Dan


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## Kittysafe

I'd say plastic is always a bad thing. Why? For one it's cheap and not environmentally friendly. Also the chemicals used to harden plastics are very unhealthy and stunts the growth of fetal brains in unborn babies... of course you won't be drinking or eating out of the pen so that aspect is not a big deal, but come on, if you're going to charge high end prices, you should use quality materials, and not plastic.


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## Seele

Kittysafe,

I'd like to see how electrical wiring works without that cheap and nasty plastics... 

Seriously, at another forum there's a thread started by someone about the exact same thing, the problem was with his Montblanc 149 which kept rusting, and got the same reaction from Montblanc HQ in Germany. He's totally off the brand now, but then there are still no shortage of people who are convinced that they are the absolute epitome and aspire to their products. Perhaps the sheer volumes of fake Montblancs and fake Rolexes are stemmed from the same mentality, I suppose.


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## Kittysafe

Seele said:


> Kittysafe,
> 
> I'd like to see how electrical wiring works without that cheap and nasty plastics...
> 
> Seriously, at another forum there's a thread started by someone about the exact same thing, the problem was with his Montblanc 149 which kept rusting, and got the same reaction from Montblanc HQ in Germany. He's totally off the brand now, but then there are still no shortage of people who are convinced that they are the absolute epitome and aspire to their products. Perhaps the sheer volumes of fake Montblancs and fake Rolexes are stemmed from the same mentality, I suppose.


You're right, it's a slippery slope, and you can't get too worked up about it, just do your best, when it comes to what I drink or eat I'm pretty careful, or chemicals in laundry detergents, since I wear clothing almost all the time... but in a pen, I'm not too worried about the plastic, but I do expect high quality parts if I am spending $100+ on a pen, I don't think that's asking too much... and I do not believe a Mont Blanc should have plastic parts considering the reputation and price.

Btw I received a beautiful Caran d' Ache Ecridor Retro Rhodium Ballpoint Pen - Silver 890.487
for my birthday which is in 2 weeks, and its a wonderful pen... $100, and it has some plastic in it as well, so maybe my thinking on this is wrong, or not thought out about why they use plastic for certain pieces.


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## D N Ravenna

Not to digress too much, but saying something has plastic is about the same thing as saying something has metal. There are metals that are poisonous (Pb, Cr6+, Hg, and so on) and metals that are good for our uses. Plastics also span the gamut as some leach out chemicals and some do not. A positive feature of some plastics is that they add lubricity (as evidenced by the use of the movement in older Speedy Pros).

I expect a device to work well under pressure, be it a fountain pen or a watch. If it fails, then someone used the wrong materials. 

My Japanese fountain pen uses plastic in the inner liner so as not to scratch the section. I can live with that.

;-)

Dan


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## Kittysafe

I completely agree with that Dan. For example, I use a french press to make my coffee, I use a stainless steel chopstick to stir, and a stainless steel scooper, etc... I don't use any plastic when it comes to coffee because plastic tends to effect the flavor through heat transference, it leeches into the liquid. Best to just stay away from it.


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## Atoning Unifex

The thing i liked the most were the rubber squares.
It was quite comfortable to hold and the centre of gravity was just right for me.
Shame about the poor design.


Kittysafe said:


> A beautiful looking pen, I'm surprised they would use cheap plastic parts, especially in such a crucial threading component.
> 
> You can buy a beautiful Caran d'ache or Cross pen for $100-$150 and you will love them.
> I have never owned a Mont Blanc or Rolex, so I guess I just have never been drawn to "name brand" poser status symbol products
> at least not without careful research... It's no different from the Apple cult craze.


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## Atoning Unifex

D N Ravenna said:


> the problem with the MB is they chose to use plastic in the wrong place.
> 
> Cheers!
> Dan


I hear that brother!


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## Atoning Unifex

Just a follow up on my complaint to Mont Blanc.
The representative from Australia replied to me within 24 hours and basically said:

"Thank you for emailing us at Montblanc and taking the time to let us know 
about your Montblanc Fine liner. Unfortunately the rubber and steel Starwalker is the only writing instrument that needs both parts changed when the thread breaks, as (like you said) need the squares to be aligned, hence why the price is $420. I am sorry to hear about your disappointment in our writing instrument. The ball point is just a twist mechanism so there is nothing to take off or screw on, which might be more appropriate for you, if you would like to purchase a new pen. Please do not hesitate in contacting us if you need any further information,"

i.e. Buy another MB pen without the plastic mechanism.Satisfactory reply? I think not but then again, not expecting much.


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## Kittysafe

What a ****ty reply... the least they could do imho if they want to be a good company that actually cares about their customers is to offer you a full refund or trade in replacement, seriously, that's just a company who does not care about their customers. Companies are so stupid nowadays treating people this way, because the internet makes your reputation get around very fast and you wind up losing far more money in missed potential sales than if you took an immediate small loss to do the right thing.


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## Atoning Unifex

Thx for your comments Kittysafe.
I might let them know I have mentioned this episode on WUS.
That should have them quaking in their boots!!!!!


Kittysafe said:


> What a ****ty reply... the least they could do imho if they want to be a good company that actually cares about their customers is to offer you a full refund or trade in replacement, seriously, that's just a company who does not care about their customers. Companies are so stupid nowadays treating people this way, because the internet makes your reputation get around very fast and you wind up losing far more money in missed potential sales than if you took an immediate small loss to do the right thing.


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## Snoweagle

I just purchased my very first Montblanc three days ago and yet to start using it.....

...now a bit worried.


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## DragonDan

I like how they say "WHEN the thread breaks"


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## Drop of a Hat

My old man has carried the same solid gold mont blanc since the early 90s when he got it as a gift. Never had a problem whatsoever.

Sent via Tapatalk


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## Kittysafe

Someone should buy them a copy of gary vaynerchuk's book, the thankyou economy.


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## johant

MB quality is not what it used to be, it seems. I have a MB #24 from the early 1970's that still writes like a dream. It has seen many miles on paper, and I am not handling it extremely carefully, but it is still dependable as ever.


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## Kittysafe

johant said:


> MB quality is not what it used to be, it seems. I have a MB #24 from the early 1970's that still writes like a dream. It has seen many miles on paper, and I am not handling it extremely carefully, but it is still dependable as ever.


No product is as quality as they used to be... look at food industry for example. Small wholesome company that uses real honey and quality oats (Kashi) gets bought by huge corporation (Kellogg) and keep it very quiet even on the website the relationship mind you, and start replacing slowly, honey with high fructose corn syrup and oats with GMO. It has become harder and harder to find quality products with real ingredients and not a bunch of ******** replacements that are cheaper, full of chemicals and carcinogens.

We have a huge cancer epidemic in this world post industrial revolution, it's not hard to put two and two together, start doing some research to discover what's going on and why.


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## Kittysafe

Equally bad is someone who is anti something simply because it is popular, without finding out why, or researching the product in any way.
I know people who hate the movie Titanic simply because it made so much money and they really saturated the market with it. That doesn't
make the movie bad though.

Same can be said for Rolex or Mont Blanc... if you're going to rail against something, you should know why, and maybe have a good reason.


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## Atoning Unifex

This problem could be resolved in 2 ways.
1stly: Don't use plastic which undergoes constant stress or is part of a moving mechanism e.g the thread in a cap
2ndly:If there is a problem, make sure the cost of fixing it isn't 70% of the purchase price of the original item. I would be prepared to pay 10-20% max.


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## Kittysafe

Atoning Unifex said:


> 2ndly:If there is a problem, make sure the cost of fixing it isn't 70% of the purchase price of the original item. I would be prepared to pay 10-20% max.


Yep, seems like a real scam when companies do that. The same can be said of the Roomba vacuum... my mom owns them because she cannot vacuum manually
anymore at 70 years of age and particular physical issues now. The Roomba apparently has a kill timer inside that makes it die after 6 months, every time, even
if it's just the battery that needs replaced, it costs almost as much as buying a new Roomba... this is indicative of the scam.


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## Atoning Unifex

I'll make sure to avoid Roomba vacuums!!


Kittysafe said:


> Yep, seems like a real scam when companies do that. The same can be said of the Roomba vacuum... my mom owns them because she cannot vacuum manually
> anymore at 70 years of age and particular physical issues now. The Roomba apparently has a kill timer inside that makes it die after 6 months, every time, even
> if it's just the battery that needs replaced, it costs almost as much as buying a new Roomba... this is indicative of the scam.


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## Kittysafe

Ya, after she told me that, I would definitely steer clear... and they're really only good for very large spaces anyway.


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## Ben_hutcherson

Kittysafe said:


> real ingredients and not a bunch of ******** replacements that are cheaper, full of chemicals


What do you propose that the "real" ingredients are full of if they're not full of chemicals?


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## Kittysafe

Ben_hutcherson said:


> What do you propose that the "real" ingredients are full of if they're not full of chemicals?


You're being far too literal.


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## Ben_hutcherson

Kittysafe said:


> You're being far too literal.


No, I'm not.

You use "chemicals" as if they're dirty words. I'd just like to know what you eat that doesn't contain "chemicals"

I also am always quite amused by the folks who automatically equate anything synthetic with "bad" and anything natural with "good." Just as Socrates what he thought of the all natural Hemlock tea he drank


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## Kittysafe

Okay you're being too literal and uninformed. What I mean are unnatural chemicals that are bad for you, like high fructose corn syrup, caramel color, sugars, salts, flavor protectors, 
there are many chemicals one should stay away from when it comes to what you put IN your body and what you put ON your body.


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## Ben_hutcherson

Kittysafe said:


> Okay you're being too literal and uninformed. What I mean are unnatural chemicals that are bad for you, like high fructose corn syrup, caramel color, sugars, salts, flavor protectors,
> there are many chemicals one should stay away from when it comes to what you put IN your body and what you put ON your body.


I guess since you have it all figured out, I'll just go back to working on my Chemistry Ph. D.

(just because something is made in the lab doesn't automatically make it bad...try reading some peer-reviewed literature on ALL of the things you mentioned).


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## Kittysafe

Ok ok, even though I feel Ive learned and lived quite a lot with regards to food and health, I am not a PhD in chemistry,
so tell me about the goodness of high fructose corn syrup, artificial sugar, salt and caramel color.

Because yes, you're being too literal and treating me like I'm an idiot.


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## Atoning Unifex

At the rate this discussion is happening, this thread will be shut down faster than you can 'chemical'


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## Kittysafe

True, let's get back on topic here. Personally, the only Mont Blanc I have ever owned I found at a garage sale for 50 cents, which was an amazing find, and I love this pen.
I've owned it now for about 5 years and it still works great, I haven't even replaced a cartridge or anything. The threading is all metal in it though, there's no plastic.


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## Kittysafe

Ben_hutcherson said:


> I guess since you have it all figured out, I'll just go back to working on my Chemistry Ph. D.
> 
> (just because something is made in the lab doesn't automatically make it bad...try reading some peer-reviewed literature on ALL of the things you mentioned).


You know I really really really hate it when people say, "Well, you know chemicals are in everything." That just really pisses me off and totally misses the point. And usually says to me that anything else I say will not make any difference.

Chemicals that are not found in natural foods are bad. End of subject. When you get food out of a test tube:BAD! When you get edible food found in nature: GOOD! How hard is that to understand?

And besides those facts, High Fructose Corn Syrup (HFCS) is a horrible drug that is being given to our kids and marketed towards the kids. Nearly every conventional cereal, oatmeal, "fruit snacks", prepackaged ******** has HFCS. It has been found to make the cells crave more HFCS, causing obesity. People actually go into withdrawals if they don't get enough HFCS. I couldn't make this crap up. I'll have to find those reports I was reading. I'm somewhat certain it was on ewg.org. But that could be wrong. I know that the woman formerly of the FDA wrote a book about it and I would love to read it to learn more. Especially about the mercury in the HFCS.

I guess you don't believe that dioxin and sodium laurel sulfate are bad either. Just because you have a PhD doesn't mean you are smarter or more wise about such things.

But hey good luck with your little Ph D. And I'm done.

Now back to Mont Blanc Talk.


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## johant

Kittysafe said:


> Chemicals that are not found in natural foods are bad. End of subject.


Well, that's a very restrictive statement, isn't it?

Besides, the "food from a tube" came from you Americans anyway ;-)

There are useful additives, and also additives one could do without. But saying "natural is good, manufactured is bad" is a bit of a shortcut, in my view.

Getting back to MB pens; I feel that you have to buy a 149 or a "limited edition", if you want to have a quality guarantee. After having owned a "Generations" that leaked, and having seen two smaller MB pens with cracked plastics :-( I think that their lower end lines are not that terrific, and that the plastics they used before the 1970's were better at long term survival. The 70's and 80's pens are notorious for developing hairline cracks and leaks, unfortunately.


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## Kittysafe

We should take this up on Facebook sometime, would be fun, my link is in my sig, if you're interested in talking more about food 

Wrong link is there, the right one is: http://www.facebook.com/catnipdream


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## johant

Kittysafe said:


> We should take this up on Facebook sometime, would be fun, my link is in my sig, if you're interested in talking more about food
> 
> Wrong link is there, the right one is: Jonathan Berman | Facebook


You don't do "artificial" foods, but you do Facebook?? ;-)

But seriously, I keep far away from Facebook, for privacy concerns, and because I don't like sites that want to capitalize on my digital identity.


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## Kittysafe

johant said:


> You don't do "artificial" foods, but you do Facebook?? ;-)
> 
> But seriously, I keep far away from Facebook, for privacy concerns, and because I don't like sites that want to capitalize on my digital identity.


That's usually considered a logical fallacy. Ad Infinitum. Taking stuff to the extreme.

Just because you don't like unnecessary additives doesn't mean you only eat things that don't cast a shadow


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## Ben_hutcherson

Kittysafe said:


> You know I really really really hate it when people say, "Well, you know chemicals are in everything." That just really pisses me off and totally misses the point. And usually says to me that anything else I say will not make any difference.
> 
> Chemicals that are not found in natural foods are bad. End of subject. When you get food out of a test tube:BAD! When you get edible food found in nature: GOOD! How hard is that to understand?


I thought I was done with this thread, but wow! I'm not.

Why is food made in a test tube automatically bad?

Everything that you've posted is a knee-jerk reaction based on suppositions. In science just because you think something is bad doesn't make it so.

Your statements show NOTHING but ignorance on your part.



> And besides those facts, High Fructose Corn Syrup (HFCS) is a horrible drug that is being given to our kids and marketed towards the kids. Nearly every conventional cereal, oatmeal, "fruit snacks", prepackaged ******** has HFCS. It has been found to make the cells crave more HFCS, causing obesity. People actually go into withdrawals if they don't get enough HFCS. I couldn't make this crap up. I'll have to find those reports I was reading. I'm somewhat certain it was on ewg.org. But that could be wrong. I know that the woman formerly of the FDA wrote a book about it and I would love to read it to learn more. Especially about the mercury in the HFCS.




With any claim like this, it's important to dig in and read the real references you're citing rather than simply reading news reports from the media.

And, more importantly, these references need to be read _critically_ to ensure that the authors' finding are valid.

To use your mercury in HFCS, there has been _exactly _one paper published which looked at mercury content in these.

Here it is if you want to read it for yourself

Environmental Health | Full text | Mercury from chlor-alkali plants: measured concentrations in food product sugar

While I won't deny that the mercury shouldn't be ignored, some perspective is in order. Over half of the samples had no detectable amount of mercury. Using the sample with the largest amount of mercury, the amount of mercury in a typical soft drink would less than the daily mercury exposure from an amalgam filling.

Furthermore, I have a real problem with the authors' data in that they offer no statistical analysis. Frankly I'm not sure how this was allowed to be published without having this.

Perhaps even more telling is the fact that this paper was published 3 years ago, and has not been cited a single time.

I'd be curious to see if you have peer-reviewed references to back up your other claims. If you're going to argue this, the burden of proof is on you to show the citations.


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## Ray MacDonald

This thread is way off topic. Let's move on. And I say that as a food scientist with over 40 years in the business.


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