# New MM300 - SBDX023 this Nov2018



## aclaz (Aug 13, 2018)

The rumours are spreading like wildfire...









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## aclaz (Aug 13, 2018)

Finally with sapphire crystal and ceramic bezel 









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## paulyosh (Oct 26, 2015)

I'm glad the MM will live on, but another $1000 for a sapphire crystal and ceramic bezel? Ouch...


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## javito (Mar 1, 2018)

I think will have a higher price at the beginning, then when the hype end maybe the prices will be near $ 2300...


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## Rosenbloom (May 9, 2016)

Finally confirmed "MARINEMASTER" is gone. :-(


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## aclaz (Aug 13, 2018)

What got me excited is a ‘blue’ MM300 - SBDX025, truly hope all these rumours are true 


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## azura123 (Dec 27, 2012)

marine master gone and added X logo


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## fast08 (Sep 3, 2016)

Another 1000 sours the deal really


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## VintageVagabound (Jan 15, 2018)

aclaz said:


> Finally with sapphire crystal and ceramic bezel
> 
> 
> 
> ...


For what it's worth they said they said $3000 not Euro. It would be about 2500 euro if Seiya is correct


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## Jesus Jones (Feb 6, 2017)

Makes sense, black, blue, green and a special edition...


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## sticky (Apr 5, 2013)

I was moaning about hitting a dry spell and the green MM300 was the bright spot on the horizon but the price soon turned me arid again.


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## fast08 (Sep 3, 2016)

any change in the movement?


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## subdiver (Jan 31, 2010)

fast08 said:


> any change in the movement?


No.


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## cg_wilson2003 (Oct 10, 2011)

Interesting, still prefer the original.


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## 6R15 (Mar 3, 2015)

with the ceramic and sapphire, it seems like they're now trying to compete with the Omega Seamaster Professional and Tudor Black Bay. Problem is, the MM300 has always been stupid thick for only 300m WR. They really need to fix that or make it say 600m WR to compete with the Planet Ocean/Pelagos


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## fast08 (Sep 3, 2016)

subdiver said:


> No.


bummer but I guess expected ...


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## subdiver (Jan 31, 2010)

Three New Seiko Marine Master 300 ? Available Soon! | JustWatch.Watch


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## 24jewels (Sep 2, 2018)

After releasing two limited editions (SLA019J1, SLA027), Seiko is finally back to normal production model of the 300m. :-!


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## Ottovonn (Dec 9, 2011)

Rosenbloom said:


> Finally confirmed "MARINEMASTER" is gone. :-(


Yup. I'm not a fan of the marine master text going in favor of the "x." Soon that text will go the way of the dodo. That said, I think the new mm300 looks all right.

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## Hale color (Aug 21, 2010)

Of the new changes I like:

ceramic bezel
sapphire crystal (though never had an issue with the hardlex)

Dislike:
thicker bezel (really?!)
flat crystal (vs domed)
no "pip" in bezel lume triangle
new text, plus X on dial
giant price increase


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## aclaz (Aug 13, 2018)

will definitely get a blue one 









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## Ottovonn (Dec 9, 2011)

aclaz said:


> will definitely get a blue one
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Oh damn. I think I may get over my dislike of the X with a blue MM300.

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## Rosenbloom (May 9, 2016)

No "MARINEMASTER", yet the blue one is interesting. 
But if the bezel is getting thicker, that would be another deal breaker for me.


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## javito (Mar 1, 2018)

I will get the blue one for sure. The black is too boring for me. Even in my black Sub also...


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## superultramega (Feb 24, 2016)

Not impressed with improvements and I dislike the 12-o'clock bezel marker. Too block-y or triangle-y.


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## fast08 (Sep 3, 2016)

Why did they get rid of the MarineMaster writing???


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## ahonobaka (Jan 27, 2017)

Classic Seiko forum responses here IMO...I say don't knock it until you hold one in your hands. The black was very nice next to my MM300, and I hardly noticed the height difference. Overall it feels more...quality and better finished next to the tooly/less refined SBDX. For years people complained about lack of sapphire and ceramic bezel, and now that they have both, it's too expensive. I get it, we want everything in our Seiko's and at the lower pricing we've known for years, but my guess is this is a global model and we won't see prices drop under $2500 (even that seems quite low; $2750 seems more in line) and that's just the new reality. But why can't Seiko ask for more money?

As far as the Prospex logo, if you're still hating on it after all these years, I'm surprised you're still on this subforum. Plenty of other brands out there to try.


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## anrex (Jul 30, 2017)

Here is a blue Zimbe


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## Jidomaki (Aug 28, 2017)

anrex said:


> Here is a blue Zimbe
> View attachment 13460691


Wait...so the Zimbe has a lume pip?


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## anrex (Jul 30, 2017)

Jidomaki said:


> Wait...so the Zimbe has a lume pip?


Correct, just like the SLA017, but with a crazy-gorgeous blue bezel.


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## aclaz (Aug 13, 2018)

anrex said:


> Correct, just like the SLA017, but with a crazy-gorgeous blue bezel.


Plus crazy price for subtle variants 

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## anrex (Jul 30, 2017)

aclaz said:


> Plus crazy price for subtle variants
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


You are correct. I did pay a King's ransom for this piece; but I was in a hunt for a Zimbe for a while. With the other two MM300's I have, I did receive both those watches at a very good price. So I can only look at this as a collection of a fair dollar cost average. Some times you have to pay up for one's desire.


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## aclaz (Aug 13, 2018)

anrex said:


> You are correct. I did pay a King's ransom for this piece; but I was in a hunt for a Zimbe for a while. With the other two MM300's I have, I did receive both those watches at a very good price. So I can only look at this as a collection of a fair dollar cost average. Some times you have to pay up for one's desire.


You are indeed a certified MM300 fanatic... don't get me wrong I like the aesthetics of Zimbe but I pegged my limits 

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## anrex (Jul 30, 2017)

aclaz said:


> You are indeed a certified MM300 fanatic... don't get me wrong I like the aesthetics of Zimbe but I pegged my limits
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Funny thing, a year ago, I thought that the SLA017 was an ugly watch. Once I heard that this style on this Marine Master was to be discontinued, I just shrugged my shoulders with an OK, so what attitude. But, there was an opportunity to buy the SLA017, well *****, I need to stop (...I just love watches of all sorts)...


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## anrex (Jul 30, 2017)

aclaz said:


> You are indeed a certified MM300 fanatic... don't get me wrong I like the aesthetics of Zimbe but I pegged my limits
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


I hope I did not get off topic, but thanks for the compliment.


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## ulfur (Dec 1, 2014)

Nice model


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## Memento Vivere (Dec 31, 2011)

Not to be snarky, but this is what everyone pushed them for; Sapphire and Ceramic.

Did you not expect to have to pay for it? 

Regardless, I'm going to miss the hardlex. It gives the black dial on my SBDX017 a very warm and appealing look. I was never one that thought this watch "needed" sapphire. I'm glad I have the 017 though, because I think it's the perfect variant of the MarineMaster. End of an era, IMHO. This isn't the same watch.


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## manofrolex (Jul 9, 2012)

Sapphire and ceramic looks just fine to me


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## Bgsmith (Nov 6, 2015)

These new models look great but I am glad I grabbed an SBDX017 about a month ago simply because of the price of the new ones, I have been saying I was going to get possibly a Speedmaster or Grand Seiko for my 40th birthday in about a year and a half, I may just grab one of these now.


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## fast08 (Sep 3, 2016)

Agreed, not the same , hopefully original marinemaster value goes up


Memento Vivere said:


> Not to be snarky, but this is what everyone pushed them for; Sapphire and Ceramic.
> 
> Did you not expect to have to pay for it?
> 
> Regardless, I'm going to miss the hardlex. It gives the black dial on my SBDX017 a very warm and appealing look. I was never one that thought this watch "needed" sapphire. I'm glad I have the 017 though, because I think it's the perfect variant of the MarineMaster. End of an era, IMHO. This isn't the same watch.


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## BigBluefish (Aug 13, 2009)

double post


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## BigBluefish (Aug 13, 2009)

Well, I'm glad to see the MM300 isn't truly gone. But:
Don't really care whether it's Hardlex / Sapphire on this watch;
Prefer the older "Marinemaster" to the Prospex "X"; 
Prefer the more traditional bezel insert, but don't dislike the ceramic.
In the black version, I'm not sure but the change in appearance of the bezel and that horrible "X" do kind kill the aesthetic for me, The blue (just blue, not the Zimbe/PADI whatever it is) looks good. 
Still, I think I'd rather pay $1,500-ish for a used SBDX017 (maybe they'er not that cheap, now?) than say $2,500 for the new model


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## aclaz (Aug 13, 2018)

BigBluefish said:


> Well, I'm glad to see the MM300 isn't truly gone. But:
> Don't really care whether it's Hardlex / Sapphire on this watch;
> Prefer the older "Marinemaster" to the Prospex "X";
> Prefer the more traditional bezel insert, but don't dislike the ceramic.
> ...


When the SBDX017 was released in Aug2015 its SRP was just a little over USD1,500 and prices then immediately zoomed between USD2,000 to 2,500; now pre-owned pieces are still being sold above the USD2,000 mark so for a sapphire and ceramic bezel a USD500 increase is just fair for a Nov2018 issue MM300 

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## aalin13 (Apr 2, 2010)

It's good to see the MM300 return and upgraded in regular production, but personally I prefer my SBDX001. The original dial and lume pip looks more classic, whereas the new design looks more modern to me. Both nice, but I just prefer the original design.

As for the price, I think 50,000 JPY increase for sapphire and ceramic is justified. People are comparing the list price to street price here when they talk about the price increase of $1,000, when in reality, it's a $500 increase in list price, which will likely translate to $300-400 increase in street price.

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## Bgsmith (Nov 6, 2015)

aclaz said:


> When the SBDX017 was released in Aug2015 its SRP was just a little over USD1,500 and prices then immediately zoomed between USD2,000 to 2,500; now *pre-owned pieces are still being sold above the USD2,000 mark* so for a sapphire and ceramic bezel a USD500 increase is just fair for a Nov2018 issue MM300
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Yup to the bold part.

Picked one up a little over a month ago for $1850 as it did not come with the stock rubber strap, jumped on this "deal" as I had been looking for one for a while and most are/were listed in the $2000-2250 range.


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## M1K3Z0R (Dec 3, 2012)

I like the blue one, is that a bit of a sheen I see on the dial? Assuming Seiko stock pics are still garbage as usual, I hope the dial is sunburst blue either Aquis, DSSD, blue rolex or save the ocean. Might also just be me, but it looks as if the hands gained a little length, or maybe they made the dial smaller hmmm...


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## Bob Dobbs needs Slack (Oct 18, 2016)

Overall, I like it... it continues the line and evolution of the 01 and 17. The blue looks like it might be a stunner in person.

That said, I'm pretty partial to the Marinemaster text on the dial vs the prospex X and am very happy that I have a 17 in my collection. Similarly, I prefer my pre-X Shogun to the current offering.


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## Robotaz (Jan 18, 2012)

I like them all. I think the $300-$500 cost adder we’ll see on the street is well worth it.


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## boostmiser (Jun 17, 2008)

Value Proposition: If Seiko wants to charge $3K for a watch, why wouldn't it differentiate it from other brands by labeling it as a Grand Seiko vs. X? In my mind, it's hard to justify a $3K seiko when they make $25 watches. It's got to be different, exclusive, set apart from the others.


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## biscuit141 (Jun 17, 2016)

Anyone have a side by side showing the domed hardlex vs flat sapphire and the difference in bezel height?


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## ahonobaka (Jan 27, 2017)

boostmiser said:


> Value Proposition: If Seiko wants to charge $3K for a watch, why wouldn't it differentiate it from other brands by labeling it as a Grand Seiko vs. X? In my mind, it's hard to justify a $3K seiko when they make $25 watches. It's got to be different, exclusive, set apart from the others.


Fundamentally, Seiko is not a luxury brand (though they're trying to work themselves upmarket into the $1000+ range as of late), but a brand that covers ALL ranges from the entry level all the way up to professional grade. In fact, $3K professional demarcated watches are not new to Seiko, and they've had separate consumer grade AND professional tool grade diver's co-exist in their portfolio for literal decades. For some, the watches' qualitative features are more than enough to justify price jumps on Prospex vs. PROFESSIONAL/MASTER models, however I do totally get that the western preclusivity of equating watches as "luxury" in these higher price ranges begets a "need" for brand equity. Throw in the repetitive use of "Professional Specs" in ProSpex on "PROFESSIONAL" models, and it's all just a cluster of bad marketing coupled with the wrong consumer expectations...


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## aclaz (Aug 13, 2018)

biscuit141 said:


> Anyone have a side by side showing the domed hardlex vs flat sapphire and the difference in bezel height?












The SBDX017 (left)has a thinner bezel

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## Robotaz (Jan 18, 2012)

That’s significant, and disappointing.


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## metalgear (Dec 10, 2013)

Look at how much we are willing to pay for used and limited editions.


boostmiser said:


> Value Proposition: If Seiko wants to charge $3K for a watch, why wouldn't it differentiate it from other brands by labeling it as a Grand Seiko vs. X? In my mind, it's hard to justify a $3K seiko when they make $25 watches. It's got to be different, exclusive, set apart from the others.


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## manofrolex (Jul 9, 2012)

Robotaz said:


> That's significant, and disappointing.


Never ever noticed it after I switched to the PS300


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## Marlsgee (Apr 5, 2018)

makes sense


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## aclaz (Aug 13, 2018)

Robotaz said:


> That's significant, and disappointing.


That's the toll for a sapphire upgrade, I've read that to meet the same failure stress point of a hardlex the sapphire will be thicker.

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## anrex (Jul 30, 2017)

Wearing the SLA017 (Gen 2 of the original MM300) does have a better balance than the green SLA019 (with sapphire). Wore both these watches in rotation the last few days, and the SLA017 wore the best. Not to distract against the MM300 with sapphire would be a bad design, but Seiko should be able to redesign a thinner profile between both, the bezel and the monocoque case. We are only talking about 300 meters of depth rating. If Seiko was savvy, which they are with their other model lines, they should use titanium. Below are great wearing watches, that are light, well balanced, and a 500 meter rating with a titanium case.


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## GregoryD (Jan 31, 2009)

I like the upgrades. But I really wish Seiko would improve the bracelet and clasp, which have always been disappointing.


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## Bgsmith (Nov 6, 2015)

GregoryD said:


> I like the upgrades. But I really wish Seiko would improve the bracelet and clasp, which have always been disappointing.


This, put half links in the bracelet, love the look of it hate the way it wears on my wrist, have my SBDX017 on an Angus Jubilee.


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## Maddog1970 (Sep 28, 2015)

anrex said:


> Wearing the SLA017 (Gen 2 of the original MM300) does have a better balance than the green SLA019 (with sapphire). Wore both these watches in rotation the last few days, and the SLA017 wore the best. Not to distract against the MM300 with sapphire would be a bad design, but Seiko should be able to redesign a thinner profile between both, the bezel and the monocoque case. We are only talking about 300 meters of depth rating. If Seiko was savvy, which they are with their other model lines, they should use titanium. Below are great wearing watches, that are light, well balanced, and a 500 meter rating with a titanium case.


I never had any issues with my MM300 sitting properly on my wrist, or ever complained about weight.....

Now, realizing the Green 300 is thicker and has a longer L2L, I am actually finding it sits flatter and even more stable on my wrist....now, this could just be me and my flat 7.5" wrist, but this is as about a perfect fit for me as exists in my watch box!









What I have discovered, is that it's impossible to take a decent iPad photo looking down your arm!


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## Maddog1970 (Sep 28, 2015)

X 2


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## T1meout (Sep 27, 2013)

boostmiser said:


> Value Proposition: If Seiko wants to charge $3K for a watch, why wouldn't it differentiate it from other brands by labeling it as a Grand Seiko vs. X? In my mind, it's hard to justify a $3K seiko when they make $25 watches. It's got to be different, exclusive, set apart from the others.


Why you ask? Because with exception op HAQ, the GS brand is reserved for $4,5k+ price range.:-d


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## Xerxes300 (Jul 3, 2017)

i would rather drop to a $800 for a sbdc053 or sbdc063 than jump to a $3k SBDX023


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## ahonobaka (Jan 27, 2017)

Xerxes300 said:


> i would rather drop to a $800 for a sbdc053 or sbdc063 than jump to a $3k SBDX023


We all have different reasons for choosing the watches that we do; Personally I'm done with sub $2k Seiko's...Lots of interesting models in this range but between the MM300 and my SKX/Turtle, there's no reason for me to go the middle route. Sold off my Sumo, Tuna, 053, etc. accordingly. Jump all in is my line of thought!


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## Robotaz (Jan 18, 2012)

Man, that bezel looks a lot thicker. How much do the specs say?


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## hooliganjrs (Dec 30, 2011)

If it don't say 'Master' she ain't in my watch box (lol)! I will wait anxiously in the wings for real world pics before passing judgement.









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## aclaz (Aug 13, 2018)

hooliganjrs said:


> If it don't say 'Master' she ain't in my watch box (lol)! I will wait anxiously in the wings for real world pics before passing judgement.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Absolutely right, so far all the news are based on conjectures 

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## Ottovonn (Dec 9, 2011)

hooliganjrs said:


> If it don't say 'Master' she ain't in my watch box (lol)! I will wait anxiously in the wings for real world pics before passing judgement.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Thanks for snapping me back to reality haha

I was briefly mesmerized by a stock photo of the blue one. The marine master text will be sorely missed!

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## aclaz (Aug 13, 2018)

I like them all, I am a CSDE 










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## Maddog1970 (Sep 28, 2015)

As much as I like the "Marinemaster" text, I have zero issue with the X or the text on the new green beast......GR300?


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## hooliganjrs (Dec 30, 2011)

Ottovonn said:


> Thanks for snapping me back to reality haha
> 
> I was briefly mesmerized by a stock photo of the blue one. The marine master text will be sorely missed!
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Ha, my pleasure sir! I must admit it is very easy for a person (myself included) to sit back and go "eh, mine is better" when a new version releases of something you already own, but kudos to Seiko for giving us enthusiasts what we were after (sapphire and ceramic), even if it is at the cost of making added (sorry but un-neccessary IMO) tweaks to the dial language, pip, thickness, etc. Although I will profess hardlex really doesn't offend me. I can see both sides of the sapphire/hardlex debate when you're talking about a $2k watch during its hay day. All-in I guess I'm getting older (wiser doubtfully) and trying to exude some patience until this new beast is in the wild. Now off to make some popcorn as the Seiko madness continues 

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## aclaz (Aug 13, 2018)

Maddog1970 said:


> As much as I like the "Marinemaster" text, I have zero issue with the X or the text on the new green beast......GR300?
> 
> View attachment 13471341












Yup, love that sun burst green dial 

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## manofrolex (Jul 9, 2012)

Xerxes300 said:


> i would rather drop to a $800 for a sbdc053 or sbdc063 than jump to a $3k SBDX023


To each his own but you get what you pay for. I have owned lower end seikos mid range seikos and higher end seikos as well as a GS and each price point clearly highlights what you get for each piece. Switch it up from one to the next and you will clearly see the differences.

This 









Not in the same universe as this










And on a different planet than this


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## shiraz (Jun 15, 2011)

To ahonobaka: Aren't you being a little preachy here? Not liking the dreaded cheap Prospex logo stamped on a million $200 Seikos vs the MarineMaster is a very valid argument. Paying $2,700 for a Seiko or any watch in this day and age of declining interest in wrist watches is still a very high price. Furthermore telling people to look for other brands if they do not like the changes or wondering why they are still on this forum is cocky.


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## shiraz (Jun 15, 2011)

ahonobaka said:


> Classic Seiko forum responses here IMO...I say don't knock it until you hold one in your hands. The black was very nice next to my MM300, and I hardly noticed the height difference. Overall it feels more...quality and better finished next to the tooly/less refined SBDX. For years people complained about lack of sapphire and ceramic bezel, and now that they have both, it's too expensive. I get it, we want everything in our Seiko's and at the lower pricing we've known for years, but my guess is this is a global model and we won't see prices drop under $2500 (even that seems quite low; $2750 seems more in line) and that's just the new reality. But why can't Seiko ask for more money?
> 
> As far as the Prospex logo, if you're still hating on it after all these years, I'm surprised you're still on this subforum. Plenty of other brands out there to try.


To ahonobaka: Aren't you being a little preachy here? Not liking the dreaded cheap Prospex logo stamped on a million $200 Seikos vs the MarineMaster is a very valid argument. Paying $2,700 for a Seiko or any watch in this day and age of declining interest in wrist watches is still a very high price. Furthermore telling people to look for other brands if they do not like the changes or wondering why they are still on this forum is cocky.


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## shiraz (Jun 15, 2011)

There is something peculiar about Seiko and their relentless pursuit of higher prices for their higher spec models. They seem to make a few changes that do not elevate the art of watch making (a sapphire crystal here, a ceramic bezel there) and suddenly the price goes up by $1000. Conversely they downgrade by making models that look similar to the old ones but the movement is a lower grade. 
My "ouch" factor triggers every time the new high end models come out with their price tags. I think the fanboys are to blame by not expecting higher quality when the price goes way up. A tuna goes from $500 to $1,500 in a few years by changing the polish or a couple of cosmetic screws; a MarineMaster goes from $1500 to $3,000 without enough justification.


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## Simon (Feb 11, 2006)

shiraz said:


> There is something peculiar about Seiko and their relentless pursuit of higher prices for their higher spec models. They seem to make a few changes that do not elevate the art of watch making (a sapphire crystal here, a ceramic bezel there) and suddenly the price goes up by $1000. Conversely they downgrade by making models that look similar to the old ones but the movement is a lower grade.
> My "ouch" factor triggers every time the new high end models come out with their price tags. I think the fanboys are to blame by not expecting higher quality when the price goes way up. A tuna goes from $500 to $1,500 in a few years by changing the polish or a couple of cosmetic screws; a MarineMaster goes from $1500 to $3,000 without enough justification.


They are all at it though - I bought an Omega Speedy Moonwatch in 1991 on sale for £400 - and it is now £3500 - that's an incredible hike in price in real terms, many times inflation. A Rolex Deepsea, at launch at £4800, 1 year later when I bought it £5700, 9 years later £9050. Many Seiko, unlike Rolex sports, can be had at modest discount too - this makes a new Marine Master 300 Prospex (whatever the name) or a new Emperor Tuna well-less than a third the price of a Rolex Deepsea. That's a huge price gap with a modest gap in quality (Rolex bracelet & movement being superior). Looked at it that way, as one coming from buying higher end Swiss watches for 30 years, Seiko high end divers seems like a bargain!


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## Godfather111 (May 18, 2018)

I was late in getting the SBDX017 a few months ago, after Seiko had discontinued the Marinemaster 300, so I paid a hefty premium at US$2,000 for a brand new one. 

No offense to owners here, but I didn't like the new design of the Green MM300, and I knew that Seiko would ultimately go in that design direction. 

That said, it seems like I made the right choice getting the 017.


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## VintageVagabound (Jan 15, 2018)

Godfather111 said:


> I was late in getting the SBDX017 a few months ago, after Seiko had discontinued the Marinemaster 300, so I paid a hefty premium at US$2,000 for a brand new one.
> 
> No offense to owners here, but I didn't like the new design of the Green MM300, and I knew that Seiko would ultimately go in that design direction.
> 
> That said, it seems like I made the right choice getting the 017.


I'm not sure that's a hefty premium over the MSRP. It's hard to determine whether the new series will have a positive effect on the value of the old ones. Once they announced this new series I saw a bunch of new ads for SBDX017. It looks like owners are trying to unload before a perceived drop in value. Maybe they'll be wrong but I am guessing the value would be more if Seiko never made another MM (as maybe some thought).


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## Rosenbloom (May 9, 2016)

In Hong Kong the price of a new 017 keeps going up. It's now about US$2430. 
A year ago it was about US$1600.


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## Jidomaki (Aug 28, 2017)

boostmiser said:


> Value Proposition: If Seiko wants to charge $3K for a watch, why wouldn't it differentiate it from other brands by labeling it as a Grand Seiko vs. X? In my mind, it's hard to justify a $3K seiko when they make $25 watches. It's got to be different, exclusive, set apart from the others.


What about Credor?
Might be a bad example, but in Japan an NSX is Honda. Same "Honda" as some 660cc econo car.
Honda/Toyota/Nissan realized early on about what you said and created Acura/Lexus/Inifiniti.
Purely for export purposes lol (except Lexus, they are domestically also Lexus now).
I don't get why people "overseas" have to have a label put on to differentiate something?
Cannot a company make a high-end piece and also affordable pieces?
Is it all about branding vs actual specs/quality?
But a Corvette is still a Chevy...so maybe not...


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## Bgsmith (Nov 6, 2015)

Jidomaki said:


> What about Credor?
> Might be a bad example, but in Japan an NSX is Honda. Same "Honda" as some 660cc econo car.
> Honda/Toyota/Nissan realized early on about what you said and created Acura/Lexus/Inifiniti.
> Purely for export purposes lol (except Lexus, they are domestically also Lexus now).
> ...


A lot of people in the U.S. are very materialistic and overly concerned with brand more than anything, that is why Rolex is so popular among people that have money but aren't necessarily watch enthusiasts, because others will know they have an expensive watch.

Same reason why Hyundai should have created a high end brand for their now more expensive cars in the U.S., no matter how good one of their high end models may be a lot of people don't want to be seen driving a Hyundai.


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## boostmiser (Jun 17, 2008)

I think we learned this back in marketing 101. How to differentiate your product to command a premium price. The dive specs on this watch may be in line with Rolex dive specs. But Rolex is perceived as a more upscale brand with a proven history and therefore people will pay more. Seiko has the history and could easily slide this watch into the grand Seiko line, charge more and people would still jump all over it. Same as people pay for a $9 cup of coffee at Starbucks. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Bgsmith (Nov 6, 2015)

boostmiser said:


> I think we learned this back in marketing 101. How to differentiate your product to command a premium price. The dive specs on this watch may be in line with Rolex dive specs. But Rolex is perceived as a more upscale brand with a proven history and therefore people will pay more. Seiko has the history and could easily slide this watch into the grand Seiko line, charge more and people would still jump all over it. Same as people pay for a $9 cup of coffee at Starbucks.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


This, and exactly the reason why I have no issues spending $2-3k on a Seiko, it is a fraction of the cost of the high end Swiss divers but can hold its own with them regarding utility, accuracy (for the most part) and style/design, the materials and finishing may not be as up to par but that does not substantiate the 5x price some of these other watches command if you ask me.


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## TwentiethCenturyFox (Mar 8, 2014)

Love Ssiko but man that is stiff. However, overall the MM has always been undervalued.


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## ahonobaka (Jan 27, 2017)

shiraz said:


> To ahonobaka: Aren't you being a little preachy here? Not liking the dreaded cheap Prospex logo stamped on a million $200 Seikos vs the MarineMaster is a very valid argument. Paying $2,700 for a Seiko or any watch in this day and age of declining interest in wrist watches is still a very high price. Furthermore telling people to look for other brands if they do not like the changes or wondering why they are still on this forum is cocky.


Preachy? For sure, but just calling it how I see it, tired of beating around the bush and honestly Seiko forums somehow bring out the whiniest sides of people (myself included admittedly). Not sure why that is but something particularly unique in the watch hobby that you don't see in others. "Dreaded cheap stamped Prospex logo" is subjective; Did people hate on the Suwa and Daini symbols back in the day too? Have you been swapping out your dials on all your watches the past few years? My point is after all this time, I don't think Seiko is going to suddenly say "DROP EVERYTHING: we NEED to stop using the Prospex symbol because the internet hates it!", so complaining about it at this point is moot. Does one complain about granny smith apples because they don't like how apple pie tastes? I wouldn't, I'd just grab the next slice of pecan or peach cobbler.

That said, I think you're still confusing street price versus actual sticker price. $1500 to $3000 is simply not true, you're taking the lowest street price against the new highest MSRP. And yes, $2700 is A LOT of money, no argument there.

TLDR: Watch guys complain too much on the internet; Don't like it, don't buy it! Seiko only cares about your $ spent.


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## mdkmdk (Dec 5, 2017)

Does anyone know if the new models will have fully lumed bezels, or just partially like the SLA019? Personally, I think the partially lumed bezel on the 019 is a big swing in a miss. It just looks incomplete, almost like they forgot to finish the watch. It feels like they're trying to compete with the Pelagos' lumed bezel but in a half-ass way. Either go back to the old bezel lume or make it fully lumed, which would be really really cool!


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## Ottovonn (Dec 9, 2011)

ahonobaka said:


> Preachy? For sure, but just calling it how I see it, tired of beating around the bush and honestly Seiko forums somehow bring out the whiniest sides of people (myself included admittedly). Not sure why that is but something particularly unique in the watch hobby that you don't see in others. "Dreaded cheap stamped Prospex logo" is subjective; Did people hate on the Suwa and Daini symbols back in the day too? Have you been swapping out your dials on all your watches the past few years? My point is after all this time, I don't think Seiko is going to suddenly say "DROP EVERYTHING: we NEED to stop using the Prospex symbol because the internet hates it!", so complaining about it at this point is moot. Does one complain about granny smith apples because they don't like how apple pie tastes? I wouldn't, I'd just grab the next slice of pecan or peach cobbler.
> 
> That said, I think you're still confusing street price versus actual sticker price. $1500 to $3000 is simply not true, you're taking the lowest street price against the new highest MSRP. And yes, $2700 is A LOT of money, no argument there.
> 
> TLDR: Watch guys complain too much on the internet; Don't like it, don't buy it! Seiko only cares about your $ spent.


I don't think any of us really believes that our comments will influence Seiko's design team or the corporate big wigs. That said, a large part of forum discussion is to discuss our opinions on certain watches. Changes to a much beloved model will stir up controversy and as a result, folks will naturally want to share their views, both negative and positive. Unfortunately, a lot of these views will be repeated ad nauseam since a good many of us think alike.


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## Robotaz (Jan 18, 2012)

I am longing for the day people get flamed for bringing the Prospex logo. It’s coming, just not soon enough for me. 

The Prospex logo thing is the epitome of first-world problems to the point it’s f’ing embarrassing.


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## manofrolex (Jul 9, 2012)

Robotaz said:


> I am longing for the day people get flamed for bringing the Prospex logo. It's coming, just not soon enough for me.
> 
> The Prospex logo thing is the epitome of first-world problems to the point it's f'ing embarrassing.


But but the X


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## shiraz (Jun 15, 2011)

Is it whining for one to say "I don't like the X" or one is simply expressing his impression about the change? If the watch shows up at a street price of roughly close to before, one can overlook that issue.
To me as a collector value and the lower purchase price compared to MSRP are necessary to feel good about my purchase. Otherwise if you want something badly enough you can buy at full price any time. 
The JDM models never sell for anything more than 20% markdown. Either the Japanese laws and dealer arrangements prevent the discount or the dealers we know maintain price discipline. Regards


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## RogerP (Mar 7, 2007)

Robotaz said:


> I am longing for the day people get flamed for bringing the Prospex logo. It's coming, just not soon enough for me.
> 
> The Prospex logo thing is the epitome of first-world problems to the point it's f'ing embarrassing.


That day is long overdue, IMO. With all the weeping, wailing and gnashing of teeth, you'd think the X heralded the very end of civilization as we know it.


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## RogerP (Mar 7, 2007)

jmanlay said:


> But but the X


Fantastic strap for that watch (which is also fantastic).


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## DarthVedder (Jun 12, 2011)

Some of the talking points around here are really dumbfounding. 

MSRP is just an starting point, but the market always establishes the true price that reflects the value of a watch (what people are actually willing to pay). Most regular edition watches are overpriced at MSRP, but many limited editions are actually underpriced (who wouldn't love to find a SDGZ013 or SBDC027 at their initial price for example, and even the very expensive SLA017 has kept its price). 

* $1000+ premium for just sapphire and a ceramic bezel!! No. It's actually a $400 premium, which IMO is very reasonable considering that the SBDX017 was released a few years ago and had a MSRP of $2600, but it regularly sold for a bit less than $2K. We'll see where the SBDX023 actually settles (I'm guessing around $2,500). 

* $3000 is Omega Seamaster Pro territory!! Again, if we use MSRP, the Omega is a $4,400 watch, but $3K is the price that reflects its true value. Personally, if given the choice, I'd take the new MM300 over the Omega/Tudor Black Bay, but that's just my opinion. Objectively, the new MM300s are very competitive against those watches and if the price goes down a bit (like it will likely do), they still are a very solid value proposition. 

* $3000 for a Seiko!! Sure, why not? If you don't like paying that for a Seiko SBDX023, they you wouldn't be paying it for a "whatever new brand name" that everyone knows is still a Seiko SBDX023. Seiko already has Grand Seiko and Credor for higher end watches, and creating and positioning a new Japanese entry level premium brand is more difficult than promoting a well known and well regarded brand.

I guess time will tell, but the SDBXxxx has always been a successful and very well regarded watch, and Seiko has been able to sell whatever quantities they make. I don't think this will stop with this new iteration.


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## RogerP (Mar 7, 2007)

ahonobaka said:


> That said, I think you're still confusing street price versus actual sticker price. $1500 to $3000 is simply not true, you're taking the lowest street price against the new highest MSRP. And yes, $2700 is A LOT of money, no argument there.





DarthVedder said:


> Some of the talking points around here are really dumbfounding.....
> 
> * $1000+ premium for just sapphire and a ceramic bezel!! No. It's actually a $400 premium, which IMO is very reasonable considering that the SBDX017 was released a few years ago and had a MSRP of $2600, but it regularly sold for a bit less than $2K.


Thanks for that welcome dose of reality. Man, I thought I sucked at math.


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## aclaz (Aug 13, 2018)

The dreaded 'X' on a brown Crafter Blue strap 









Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## stefanus (Aug 16, 2017)

I don't mind the Prospex logo at all but cannot understand why Seiko decided to drop the Marine Master name from the face. It is iconic and provides a point of difference from the other Prospex watches.


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## JoeOBrien (Aug 2, 2013)

stefanus said:


> I don't mind the Prospex logo at all but cannot understand why Seiko decided to drop the Marine Master name from the face. It is iconic and provides a point of difference from the other Prospex watches.


From their perspective it will be a marketing or brand recognition move; to push Prospex as the more 'serious' line and to make sure they can be clearly identified. Arguably it makes very little difference to the MM line - obviously this is speculation, but I have to imagine that most MM300 buyers are fussy watch enthusiasts who might be deterred by things like this. Perhaps it was also an attempt to clean up or modernize the dial. Either way it doesn't make any sense - very few people are going to buy a MM300 _because_ it has the X on the dial, but clearly there are plenty who are put off by it.


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## Robotaz (Jan 18, 2012)

It’s simple marketing. There’s no mystery. There were too many levels and permutations from the SKX to the SBGA. Deleting Marinemaster and expanding Prospex is common sense. 

People need to get over the X and fonts and look forward to what Prospex will bring with the high end being dramatically improved Marinemasters. The SD tuna, ceramic emperors, and now ceramic/sapphire MM300 are something Seiko has been working on for years. It’s a great development. And there aren’t 15 layers of Seiko now.

It’s a no-brainer. Get over it and enjoy it.


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## manofrolex (Jul 9, 2012)

JoeOBrien said:


> Either way it doesn't make any sense - very few people are going to buy a MM300 _because_ it has the X on the dial, but clearly there are plenty who are put off by it.


There, I am one them ...what have I done ???


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## JoeOBrien (Aug 2, 2013)

You missed a word or two in your post, I don't get what you mean - are you saying you bought it _*because*_ it has the X on the dial? I think what you mean is you bought it _despite_ the X, because it doesn't bother you. It doesn't bother me either. I'm just saying that fewer people are going to make a decision to buy a MM - a very niche, watch enthusiast piece - based on the Prospex branding, versus the number of people who might be put off by it. Therefore the branding on the MM line is rather a useless exercise compared to the lower lines.


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## manofrolex (Jul 9, 2012)

JoeOBrien said:


> You missed a word or two in your post, I don't get what you mean - are you saying you bought it _*because*_ it has the X on the dial? I think what you mean is you bought it _despite_ the X, because it doesn't bother you. It doesn't bother me either. I'm just saying that fewer people are going to make a decision to buy a MM - a very niche, watch enthusiast piece - based on the Prospex branding, versus the number of people who might be put off by it. Therefore the branding on the MM line is rather a useless exercise compared to the lower lines.


I bought it because i like it not because of some crazy gravitational pull by the X. The dilemma between the X and Marinemaster imho is just insignificant to me. I always felt the name marinemaster sounded quite silly anyway but didn't care even when I had my MM300. Why you ask (I know you didn't) because I liked the overall package. I am superficial that way, I look at the whole shabang not just the x or MM. The marinemaster has arrived ok sure sound like something Costenza would say in the famous marine biologist episode but either est buy jest you like and for God's sake can se move on from the X factor .


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## Robotaz (Jan 18, 2012)

jmanlay said:


> I bought it because i like it not because of some crazy gravitational pull by the X. The dilemma between the X and Marinemaster imho is just insignificant to me. I always felt the name marinemaster sounded quite silly anyway but didn't care even when I had my MM300. Why you ask (I know you didn't) because I liked the overall package. I am superficial that way, I look at the whole shabang not just the x or MM. The marinemaster has arrived ok sure sound like something Costenza would say in the famous marine biologist episode but either est buy jest you like and for God's sake can se move on from the X factor .


I'm the same way about MM. It sounds a bit silly to me, too. I think having the entire line of Prospex makes a lot more sense, but I certainly can appreciate the history of the MM name and all that.


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## meiguoren (Jul 17, 2015)

Robotaz said:


> I'm the same way about MM. It sounds a bit silly to me, too. I think having the entire line of Prospex makes a lot more sense, but I certainly can appreciate the history of the MM name and all that.


I quite like the Marinemaster name. Seemed to set it above the propex line. It has a Grand Seiko movement and outshines the Propex line significantly. Happy to have an original MM300!


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## Ottovonn (Dec 9, 2011)

The new SBDX023 needs a new nickname since the Marinemaster text has been removed: maybe something like the "X300."


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## ahonobaka (Jan 27, 2017)

I recall the SBEX005 having a Prospex symbol a couple years back: https://www.seiko-watch.co.jp/collections/en/prospex/SBEX005

And now the new Tuna's: https://www.seiko-watch.co.jp/collections/en/prospex/SBBN042

...Which is to say, get used to it because it's not going anywhere especially after all these years. The only distinction now is the "PROFESSIONAL" text on the higher range models so buy everything up while you can!


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## LordBrettSinclair (Sep 22, 2015)

Ottovonn said:


> The new SBDX023 needs a new nickname since the Marinemaster text has been removed: maybe something like the "X300."


Me like. Or 'X-Master'


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## NYDan (Mar 23, 2008)

Ottovonn said:


> The new SBDX023 needs a new nickname since the Marinemaster text has been removed: maybe something like the "X300."


Someone already nicknamed it the "Night Ocean"


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## metalgear (Dec 10, 2013)

Who knows when seiko will actually release a sbdx300

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## Rosenbloom (May 9, 2016)

Ottovonn said:


> The new SBDX023 needs a new nickname since the Marinemaster text has been removed: maybe something like the "X300."


Agreed. Or "PS300".


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## shiraz (Jun 15, 2011)

Ottovonn said:


> The new SBDX023 needs a new nickname since the Marinemaster text has been removed: maybe something like the "X300."


How about MarineProspector?
Funny how the guys who are exasperated about people whining about the X keep the whining alive. For them it is like scratching a large pimple that is "painful/pleasurable".


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## shiraz (Jun 15, 2011)

Glad the Hour and Minute hands were not copied from other Prospex offerings to homogenize the family design language.


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## manofrolex (Jul 9, 2012)

Big X again today


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## seisnofe (Feb 1, 2011)

picture from a Spanish seller:


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## LordBrettSinclair (Sep 22, 2015)

^ I like that and will probably buy one.


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## JoeOBrien (Aug 2, 2013)

This is a mock-up I did a few weeks ago, just posting it here because it looks identical to the promo image in the second post. Can't really tell if the bezel is lumed in the same way as the SLA019.


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## LordBrettSinclair (Sep 22, 2015)

You nailed it, except the '300M' text is redder on the pics I've seen.


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## cg_wilson2003 (Oct 10, 2011)

shiraz said:


> How about MarineProspector?
> Funny how the guys who are exasperated about people whining about the X keep the whining alive. For them it is like scratching a large pimple that is "painful/pleasurable".


In fairness the face pretty much makes the watch. Adding a line of text or deleting it can change the whole make up of the watch. I think most of the gripe is the Prospex line is rather new and it takes a long time for branding to stick. That transition takes time and staying the coarse, they can't change there mind in 3 years. To me the old MM300 face and text follows in the line of high end Swiss divers but with Japanese engineering.

Both the new and old are very nice watches none the less.


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## cg_wilson2003 (Oct 10, 2011)

Double.


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## shiraz (Jun 15, 2011)

Now it comes down to the price. Would you guys be willing to dole out a lot more cash than you needed to on the previous version? 
How much more is fair? At what price the increase becomes unreasonable?


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## aalin13 (Apr 2, 2010)

shiraz said:


> Now it comes down to the price. Would you guys be willing to dole out a lot more cash than you needed to on the previous version?
> How much more is fair? At what price the increase becomes unreasonable?


As I said in a previous post, I think street price increase of $300 - $400 can be expected, and I'd say is a reasonable amount for the added features.


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## HmJ_FR (May 19, 2017)

... hate this X logo...


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## davym2112 (Mar 5, 2017)

HmJ_FR said:


> ... hate this X logo...


Wow, that's original. Never heard that complaint before....

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## aclaz (Aug 13, 2018)

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## thrty8street (Jul 20, 2013)

cg_wilson2003 said:


> In fairness the face pretty much makes the watch. Adding a line of text or deleting it can change the whole make up of the watch. I think most of the gripe is the Prospex line is rather new and it takes a long time for branding to stick. That transition takes time and staying the coarse, they can't change there mind in 3 years. To me the old MM300 face and text follows in the line of high end Swiss divers but with Japanese engineering.
> 
> Both the new and old are very nice watches none the less.


You hit the nail on this. The x just ruins the watch for me, making the watch look "cheaper."

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## Simon (Feb 11, 2006)

In aclaz's pic above I genuinely think the new font and format is more 'professional' and balanced - 
but in normal size on dial, my aging eyes wont see any of it without a loupe - just white dots/lines
I wear dive watches for the big lumed hands, contrasty dials and legibility
X....???? what X ?????

I understand folk not liking the new Rolex case lugs compared to the old or the new ceramic bezels versus old tool ally inserts - 
which substantially alter the overall design/direction of the watch - but a subtle tiny font change to a seiko dial and some folk here make it a deal-breaker and rule out one of the finest dive watches ever made....

Ive come to high end Seiko divers this summer from Rolex - i gotta say I didnt even read the text before purchasing - 
its the watch - case, weight, shape, movement, hands, colour, overall aesthetic, pedigree, quality, legibility etc etc but logo versus script???? Nah

come on - I mean - seriously?


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## Ottovonn (Dec 9, 2011)

aclaz said:


> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Yesterday I asked a non-WIS what she thought about these two sets of text. She argued that the Prospex labeled text was more visually appealing since it looked less cluttered and that the logo gave the text some more oomph by tapping into brand power, similar to how Apple uses the, well, apple logo. She also liked how the Prospex "X" topped off the rest of the text, making it appear more balanced.

I still think the MARINEMASTER text is better lol


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## Ottovonn (Dec 9, 2011)

Double Post!


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## barutanseijin (Sep 18, 2017)

Ottovonn said:


> aclaz said:
> 
> 
> > Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
> ...


I agree with Ottovon's non-WIS consultant. The X makes for less clutter compared to "MarineMaster"

However, if "Prospex" is supposed to indicate 'professional specifications' the "Professional" is now redundant. They should lose that, too.


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## Robotaz (Jan 18, 2012)

Ottovonn said:


> Yesterday I asked a non-WIS what she thought about these two sets of text. She argued that the Prospex labeled text was more visually appealing since it looked less cluttered and that the logo gave the text some more oomph by tapping into brand power, similar to how Apple uses the, well, apple logo. She also liked how the Prospex "X" topped off the rest of the text, making it appear more balanced.
> 
> I still think the MARINEMASTER text is better lol


I like the Prospex text better. However, I don't like how they ditched engraved crowns for the cheesy etched logo. Look at the tuna SBDB009 vs the 013. Night and day. "S" crown blows the logo thing away.


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## goat_keeper (Aug 29, 2018)

You all realise it's actually not an X, but a stylised PS. Right?


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## HmJ_FR (May 19, 2017)

They talk about 320,000 jpy street price here in Japan. 2800 USD.


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## barutanseijin (Sep 18, 2017)

goat_keeper said:


> You all realise it's actually not an X, but a stylised PS. Right?


What about it? Is that supposed to make it better or worse somehow?


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## goat_keeper (Aug 29, 2018)

barutanseijin said:


> What about it? Is that supposed to make it better or worse somehow?


I think better, it's an abbreviation for Professional Specification, not just an X.


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## aclaz (Aug 13, 2018)

barutanseijin said:


> I agree with Ottovon's non-WIS consultant. The X makes for less clutter compared to "MarineMaster"
> 
> However, if "Prospex" is supposed to indicate 'professional specifications' the "Professional" is now redundant. They should lose that, too.


As there are Seiko divers with PS or 'X' logo on their dials but those are good only for air diving up to 200m (class 1) so the "Professional" here points to the watch itself being a HE-GAS Divers (class 2) water resistant to a depth of 300m therefore is not redundant.

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## Tanker G1 (Feb 28, 2016)

aclaz said:


> As there are Seiko divers with PS or 'X' logo on their dials but those are good only for air diving up to 200m (class 1) so the "Professional" here points to the watch itself being a HE-GAS Divers (class 2) water resistant to a depth of 300m therefore is not redundant.


The '300m' tells you that.

*Professional Specifications Automatic Professional 300m* doesn't tell you anything different than *Professional Specifications Automatic 300m*

The second 'Professional' is indeed redundant.


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## JoeOBrien (Aug 2, 2013)

goat_keeper said:


> You all realise it's actually not an X, but a stylised PS. Right?


It's the P and S from Prospex, stylised into the X from Prospex. It's an obvious X shape. It's an X. Someone always has to bring this up like they're Indiana Jones translating a hieroglyphic. We know. It doesn't change anyone's appreciation of it being on a dial.


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## aclaz (Aug 13, 2018)

Tanker G1 said:


> The '300m' tells you that.
> 
> *Professional Specifications Automatic Professional 300m* doesn't tell you anything different than *Professional Specifications Automatic 300m*
> 
> The second 'Professional' is indeed redundant.


If you eliminate the 'Professional' it will be displaying that a X automatic 300m diver has the same specs/class as the X automatic 200m which obviously is not.

Bear in mind class 2 ranges from 200m to 1000m.

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## HmJ_FR (May 19, 2017)

That's correct, Seiko missed something here.


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## amngwlvs (Sep 14, 2018)

JoeOBrien said:


> It's the P and S from Prospex, stylised into the X from Prospex. It's an obvious X shape. It's an X. Someone always has to bring this up like they're Indiana Jones translating a hieroglyphic. We know. It doesn't change anyone's appreciation of it being on a dial.


I laughed way too hard at that.


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## DarthVedder (Jun 12, 2011)

So is the new MM300 twice as professional as the other divers?


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## Robotaz (Jan 18, 2012)

amngwlvs said:


> I laughed way too hard at that.


LOL, me too


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## aclaz (Aug 13, 2018)

DarthVedder said:


> So is the new MM300 twice as professional as the other divers?


I don't understand the premise of your question; anyways the two main groups are the Seiko Diver's and Seiko Professional Diver's both are products using PROSPEX - Seiko's cutting edge technology.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## shiraz (Jun 15, 2011)

Robotaz said:


> I like the Prospex text better. However, I don't like how they ditched engraved crowns for the cheesy etched logo. Look at the tuna SBDB009 vs the 013. Night and day. "S" crown blows the logo thing away.


Glad you brought up the "cheesy etched crown" X logo issue versus the engraved. Definitely cheapening the watch. Let's pay an extra $500 for that. 
Strange we are still calling it the MarineMaster. It is a mystery.
Toyota developed the LandCruiser as an alternative to LandRover; for decades they have kept the name and carried on.
Do you guys think Seiko people look at these forums at all?


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## DarthVedder (Jun 12, 2011)

aclaz said:


> I don't understand the premise of your question; anyways the two main groups are the Seiko Diver's and Seiko Professional Diver's both are products using PROSPEX - Seiko's cutting edge technology.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Because it's a Professional Specifications Professional (Prospex professional) watch...


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## aclaz (Aug 13, 2018)

DarthVedder said:


> Because it's a Professional Specifications Professional (Prospex professional) watch...


It's an automatic Professinal 300m tool watch with Prospex technology









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## Rosenbloom (May 9, 2016)

aclaz said:


> It's an automaric Professinal 300m tool watch with Prospex technology


In other words, it's an automatic Professional 300m tool watch with Professional Specification technology. :-d


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## aclaz (Aug 13, 2018)

Rosenbloom said:


> In other words, it's an automatic Professional 300m tool watch with Professional Specification technology. :-d


Exactly the word professional points to two different things 

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## DarthVedder (Jun 12, 2011)

aclaz said:


> It's an automatic Professinal 300m tool watch with Prospex technology
> 
> 
> 
> ...


My post was a joke, don't take it too seriously .


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## TACSTS (May 11, 2008)

Are we still expecting a SBDX025 (blue) at some point in the near term?


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## aclaz (Aug 13, 2018)

DarthVedder said:


> My post was a joke, don't take it too seriously .


My bad 

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## DarthVedder (Jun 12, 2011)

TACSTS said:


> Are we still expecting a SBDX025 (blue) at some point in the near term?


BTW, what do you mean with "PROSPEX technology"? Say, what technology does a Turtle have that the SKX is lacking?


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## LeeMorgan (Jun 3, 2012)

DarthVedder said:


> BTW, what do you mean with "PROSPEX technology"? Say, what technology does a Turtle have that the SKX is lacking?


|>


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## aclaz (Aug 13, 2018)

Link to original post below:
https://lamecaniquedesmontres.blogspot.com/2018/09/nouvelle-mm300-seiko-sbdx023.html?m=1

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## aalin13 (Apr 2, 2010)

aclaz said:


> Link to original post below:
> https://lamecaniquedesmontres.blogspot.com/2018/09/nouvelle-mm300-seiko-sbdx023.html?m=1
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


That is some serious mark up for the European market, going from € 2100 to € 3200. They forgot to mention for the Japanese market, the increase is from ¥270,000 to ¥320,000, which is a much smaller increase.


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## LordBrettSinclair (Sep 22, 2015)

^ I'm not paying those prices, although ADs have offered me two already (so pre-orders can't be that crazy).


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## hungdangnguyen23 (Mar 21, 2018)

When Seiko pulls this kind of bullsh*t, it only encourages people to buy from homage companies like Merkur. Taking out MarineMaster and replacing it with Prospex? Charging an extra 1200 euros for sapphire (which should be included anyways at this pricepoint) and a ceramic bezel? WTF?

I'm not in the market for an SBDX due to my wrist size, but if I was, I would definitely consider a Merkur without hesitation. 
https://www.watchuseek.com/f74/merkur-mm-comes-up-9015movt-seiko-sbdx001-homage-4242450.html

The MarineMaster design isn't as well-renowned and integral to Seiko's DNA like the Submariner to Rolex. So Merkur's straight-up homage that basically replicates the design language of the Seiko isn't objectionable like it would be for Rolex replicas IMO.


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## matthew P (Aug 1, 2013)

hungdangnguyen23 said:


> When Seiko pulls this kind of bullsh*t, it only encourages people to buy from homage companies like Merkur. Taking out MarineMaster and replacing it with Prospex? Charging an extra 1200 euros for sapphire (which should be included anyways at this pricepoint) and a ceramic bezel? WTF?
> 
> I'm not in the market for an SBDX due to my wrist size, but if I was, I would definitely consider a Merkur without hesitation.
> 
> The MarineMaster design isn't as well-renowned and integral to Seiko's DNA like the Submariner to Rolex. So Merkur's straight-up homage that basically replicates the design language of the Seiko isn't objectionable like it would be for Rolex replicas IMO.


I wouldn't consider those at any price point.... nasty homages however they are branded.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## hungdangnguyen23 (Mar 21, 2018)

matthew P said:


> I wouldn't consider those at any price point.... nasty homages however they are branded.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


So what's the alternative? Cough up Grand Seiko money for a non-Grand Seiko? Ridiculous. If I wanted this watch I would go secondhand older model anyways, axing the MarineMaster name is a terrible mistake IMO.

Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk


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## aclaz (Aug 13, 2018)

hungdangnguyen23 said:


> So what's the alternative? Cough up Grand Seiko money for a non-Grand Seiko? Ridiculous. If I wanted this watch I would go secondhand older model anyways, axing the MarineMaster name is a terrible mistake IMO.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk


Never bought a pre-owned (yet), my best alternative is to pre-order with my AD, he always gives me a 20 up to 25% discount on the MSRP. 
So far he said no release date yet when the new MM300 will come.

Sent from my HUAWEI NXT-L29 using Tapatalk


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## aalin13 (Apr 2, 2010)

hungdangnguyen23 said:


> When Seiko pulls this kind of bullsh*t, it only encourages people to buy from homage companies like Merkur. Taking out MarineMaster and replacing it with Prospex? Charging an extra 1200 euros for sapphire (which should be included anyways at this pricepoint) and a ceramic bezel? WTF?
> 
> I'm not in the market for an SBDX due to my wrist size, but if I was, I would definitely consider a Merkur without hesitation.
> https://www.watchuseek.com/f74/merkur-mm-comes-up-9015movt-seiko-sbdx001-homage-4242450.html
> ...


Homage is an homage, I don't get how buying a MM300 homage is any less objectionable than a Sub homage.

I agree the price increase in Europe is absurd, but as I stated above, the degree of price increase is regional. Many of us buy from the like of Chino, Higuchi and Seiya, and based on the price increase in JPY, I think the actual street price would be much closer to the SBDX017 than the European RRP suggests.


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## JoeOBrien (Aug 2, 2013)

hungdangnguyen23 said:


> So what's the alternative? Cough up Grand Seiko money for a non-Grand Seiko? Ridiculous.


Why do people always act like watches can be priced only according to where they sit in the pecking order, and not by their actual attributes? 3200 EUR is Grand Seiko money.... if you want a quartz. If you want an automatic Marinemaster, you're not just going to buy a GS quartz instead because it's 'better'. People are saying the same thing about the Presage SJE073. "I could get a GS for that!!" Yeah, a plain, basic, dress quartz. Not an automatic with a nice dial, or a 300m automatic diver.

I'm not saying 3200 EUR isn't expensive, but non-GS watches are allowed to be priced higher than the cheapest GS, if they have features that warrant it.


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## OHL (Jan 8, 2018)

so, any more pictures of this?


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## DarthVedder (Jun 12, 2011)

JoeOBrien said:


> Why do people always act like watches can be priced only according to where they sit in the pecking order, and not by their actual attributes? 3200 EUR is Grand Seiko money.... if you want a quartz. If you want an automatic Marinemaster, you're not just going to buy a GS quartz instead because it's 'better'. People are saying the same thing about the Presage SJE073. "I could get a GS for that!!" Yeah, a plain, basic, dress quartz. Not an automatic with a nice dial, or a 300m automatic diver.
> 
> I'm not saying 3200 EUR isn't expensive, but non-GS watches are allowed to be priced higher than the cheapest GS, if they have features that warrant it.


Some people just want a brand on the dial or a badge.

But that's ok. Their money, their choices.


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## aclaz (Aug 13, 2018)

DarthVedder said:


> Some people just want a brand on the dial or a badge.
> 
> But that's ok. Their money, their choices.


Buying an entry level watch based on a brand on a dial. Are you really serious? Another one of your jokes, right?

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Monkeynuts (Dec 23, 2012)

Tbh I think the price is worth it the sbdx017 was definitely under priced so well done owners 
I think anyone who has handled one would agree it’s top of its game


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## Lucien369 (Nov 4, 2014)

Some could say that removing Marinemaster from the MM300’s dial is like Rolex removing Submariner from the dial of the Submariner. 

I think we can agree that it would be totally absurd for Rolex to do that.


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## thrty8street (Jul 20, 2013)

Lucien369 said:


> Some could say that removing Marinemaster from the MM300's dial is like Rolex removing Submariner from the dial of the Submariner.
> 
> I think we can agree that it would be totally absurd for Rolex to do that.


I like this analogy.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## DarthVedder (Jun 12, 2011)

aclaz said:


> Buying an entry level watch based on a brand on a dial. Are you really serious? Another one of your jokes, right?
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


No. Just stating the fact that many people like to pay for a brand/badge, regardless of actual specs. That was the point of the post I was responding to, claiming that the price of the new MM is "Grand Seiko" territory. Some people will prefer the Grand Seiko, even if it doesn't have the specs to match the MM. Some people would prefer to pay for, say, a very basic Rolex Oyster Perpetual over a Grand Seiko Spring Drive GMT, just because it's a Rolex.


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## DarthVedder (Jun 12, 2011)

Lucien369 said:


> Some could say that removing Marinemaster from the MM300's dial is like Rolex removing Submariner from the dial of the Submariner.
> 
> I think we can agree that it would be totally absurd for Rolex to do that.


Yes, it would be absurd for Rolex to do that... But the Submariner is a far more established brand than the Seiko Marine Master, which isn't even a Seiko exclusive (Fortis).


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## aclaz (Aug 13, 2018)

DarthVedder said:


> Yes, it would be absurd for Rolex to do that... But the Submariner is a far more established brand than the Seiko Marine Master, which isn't even a Seiko exclusive (Fortis).


If I may add... within Seiko alone the 'Marinemaster' labeling is spread across to a wide range of professional divers variants like SBDB009 MM600 Spring Drive Tuna, SBDX014 MM1000 Emperor Tuna, SBEX003 MM1000, SBBN031 MM300 Tuna, SBBN037 MM300 Tuna just to name a few and therefore not an SBDX001, 017 exclusive.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## DarthVedder (Jun 12, 2011)

aclaz said:


> If I may add... within Seiko alone the 'Marinemaster' labeling is spread across to a wide range of professional divers variants like SBDB009 MM600 Spring Drive Tuna, SBDX014 MM1000 Emperor Tuna, SBEX003 MM1000, SBBN031 MM300 Tuna, SBBN037 MM300 Tuna just to name a few and therefore not an SBDX001, 017 exclusive.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


I guess that the new iterations of all of these will be Prospex Professional, if they aren't already.

I love the MarineMaster name, but I understand Seiko's strategy in creating a unique line. The Prospex 300m looks insanely cool, so I guess I'll have to learn how to live with the X.


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## shaneotool (Apr 3, 2013)

This release seems like a real lazy effort by seiko. Same exact case and bracelet they have had for close to 20 years. I found the old one wore a little too tall - and this one is even taller due to the bezel redesign.

That being said, I still would like to check out the blue one..


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## shaneotool (Apr 3, 2013)

dp


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## Travelller (Apr 24, 2012)

...and I payed a whole lot more for this one and it has _neither the "MARINEMASTER", nor the ProSpex logo_ :rodekaart
:-d ;-)










_...But what's really missing on this reference is the applied "SEIKO" logo..._ :think:


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## Ottovonn (Dec 9, 2011)

shaneotool said:


> This release seems like a real lazy effort by seiko. Same exact case and bracelet they have had for close to 20 years. I found the old one wore a little too tall - and this one is even taller due to the bezel redesign.
> 
> That being said, I still would like to check out the blue one..


Having owned the original SBDX001, I think a slimmer case and a re-designed bracelet, in addition to the ceramic bezel and sapphire crystal, would more than justify the price-hike.

Like you, I'm very interested in the blue model; I hope folks will post real world images of it soon.


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## aclaz (Aug 13, 2018)

Travelller said:


> ...and I payed a whole lot more for this one and it has _neither the "MARINEMASTER", nor the ProSpex logo_ :rodekaart
> :-d ;-)
> 
> _...But what's really missing on this reference is the applied "SEIKO" logo..._ :think:


I got one too #904/1500... but why the SLA025 has neither the MM300 nor the 'X' is for the simple reason that it is a 1968 Divers Re-creation.
Bear in mind that the MM logo was first introduced on the SBCN005* late 90s and Prospex is Seiko's lastest technology.

*corrected mistypo on 1st posting

Sent from my HUAWEI NXT-L29 using Tapatalk


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## DarthVedder (Jun 12, 2011)

aclaz said:


> I got one too #904/1500... but why the SLA025 has neither the MM300 nor the 'X' is for the simple reason that it is a 1968 Divers Re-creation.
> Bear in mind that the MM logo was first introduced on the SBDC005 late 90s and Prospex is Seiko's lastest technology.
> 
> Sent from my HUAWEI NXT-L29 using Tapatalk


SBDC005?? The Orange Sumo? What did it have to do with the MM logo/branding?


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## aclaz (Aug 13, 2018)

DarthVedder said:


> SBDC005?? The Orange Sumo? What did it have to do with the MM logo/branding?


Thanks for spotting it, DarthVedder mistypo should be SBCN005 Transocean Marinemaster.

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## Glacier (Oct 28, 2015)

New improved bracelet would be amazing!

Even just keeping the original’s height rather than slimming it down would be sweet!!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Travelller (Apr 24, 2012)

aclaz said:


> ... but why the SLA025 has neither the MM300 nor the 'X' is for the simple reason that it is a 1968 Divers Re-creation...


 That was stated in jest (& hence the wink emoji) - I pity the fool who doesn't know what they are getting with their €5K... :-d
I do wish it had an applied logo (there was no wink emoji on that statement... ;-) )

🍻


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## LordBrettSinclair (Sep 22, 2015)

Er, want one now?

Is this grey dealer in Italy ahead of the game or what? And the price looks suspiciously reasonable...

https://www.chrono24.com/seiko/prospex-sea-full-steel-black-dial-auto-professional-300m--id9341068.htm


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## Sabeking (Aug 5, 2013)

Maddog1970 said:


> As much as I like the "Marinemaster" text, I have zero issue with the X or the text on the new green beast......GR300?
> 
> View attachment 13471341


For the first time, yesterday, I tried on a MM300. It was the green one. I don't care if it has "Marinemaster", X, thicker bezel, or whatever... the watch is awesome. Find me a watch, at this price point, that is more awesome! I have been a Rolex fanboy for a long time. Rolex is Rolex! They do things good... Seiko is on a charge and I'm onbord as the product, at all the price points, is AWESOME!

We all have our likes and dislikes; however, the watches are great across the board.


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## aclaz (Aug 13, 2018)

LordBrettSinclair said:


> Er, want one now?
> 
> Is this grey dealer in Italy ahead of the game or what? And the price looks suspiciously reasonable...
> 
> https://www.chrono24.com/seiko/prospex-sea-full-steel-black-dial-auto-professional-300m--id9341068.htm


Saw these specs on an Indonesian On-line shop; taking pre-orders with no price posted :

New Ocean Night 300 MM Marinemaster at Baselworld 
Edge is a ceramic edge. Enhance the durability and beauty of the bezel on the Bezel. 
Seiko's 8L35 Automatic Mechanism 
Waterproof 300 meters, made of one piece or one piece construction. 
Coatings and housings are strong and durable than the stainless steel, up to 4x.
This is a line that can be stretched without having to cut the cable. 
Expected to launch in October.

Seiko wristwatch Male SLA021J SLA021 Night Ocean 
Dark brown dial with ceramic making more attractive than usual
Automatic movement 8L35 Caliber inhouse Seiko only movement 
300 water resistance 
One piece construction
Diashield clotting on both body and bracelet
Adjustable bracelet without any tools needed. 
Estimate launching October

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## butcherjp (Jun 14, 2011)

It appeared on the french seiko online store:

https://www.seikoboutique.fr/prospex/612-montre-homme-acier-automatique-divers-prospex-sla021j1.html

3200 euros (on order, soon available), same as the green limited... pricey....


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## LordBrettSinclair (Sep 22, 2015)

^ Ouch. Is this an LE?


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## Cpt Canuck (May 27, 2018)

Remember, the french are used to being pushed around and surrender quickly. Foreign product prices tend to be higher as a result 

Watch I am currently saving for: Fortis B-42 Official Cosmonaut


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## Bwool (Feb 24, 2012)

Yape, there is a black and a blue version as far as i know.


aclaz said:


> The rumours are spreading like wildfire...
> 
> 
> 
> ...


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## Bgsmith (Nov 6, 2015)

Glacier said:


> *New improved bracelet would be amazing!
> *
> Even just keeping the original's height rather than slimming it down would be sweet!!
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Anyone have any specifics on this? I really wish my 017 had half links.


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## 2500M_Sub (Apr 12, 2008)

Have to say, I hate the gold colored seconds hand. They should have only done that for the green model. Styling fail in my book. 

Regards,

Ren


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## Norrie (Sep 23, 2011)

Looks like the blue one has a sunburst like the green. If so, that's gonna look killer.


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## JoeOBrien (Aug 2, 2013)

2500M_Sub said:


> Have to say, I hate the gold colored seconds hand. They should have only done that for the green model. Styling fail in my book.


It's a bit odd to deviate from the styling of the original in any way, but of course there's already a fairly significant difference with the dial logo. I guess they just wanted to differentiate it more from the original.


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## thrty8street (Jul 20, 2013)

Cpt Canuck said:


> Remember, the french are used to being pushed around and surrender quickly. Foreign product prices tend to be higher as a result
> 
> Watch I am currently saving for: Fortis B-42 Official Cosmonaut


Lol!

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## thrty8street (Jul 20, 2013)

Bgsmith said:


> Anyone have any specifics on this? I really wish my 017 had half links.


We have micro adjustment at the clasp?

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## Londonboy (Oct 23, 2007)

Just read the whole thread, usual differences of opinions (all fair and valid etc)

I had an 001 for many years, sold it in early 16 to a fellow member here

The new versions seem great but for me I still prefer the original version (001) and I won't be troubling anyone to sell me their 017 or the newer ones if I ever decide to buy another


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## matthew P (Aug 1, 2013)

2500M_Sub said:


> Have to say, I hate the gold colored seconds hand. They should have only done that for the green model. Styling fail in my book.
> Ren


Agree - the second hand already has enough presence in SS, not a fan of the gold color.


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## matthew P (Aug 1, 2013)

2500M_Sub said:


> Have to say, I hate the gold colored seconds hand. They should have only done that for the green model. Styling fail in my book.
> Ren


Agree - the second hand already has enough presence in SS, not a fan of the gold color.


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## aclaz (Aug 13, 2018)

2500M_Sub said:


> Have to say, I hate the gold colored seconds hand. They should have only done that for the green model. Styling fail in my book.
> 
> Regards,
> 
> Ren


Based on its history gold hands appeared only on LEs:
SBDX003 w gold hands n markers
SBDX012 w gold hands n markers plus white n red tipped second hand
SBDX021 w gold second hand only

so the probability of having gold hands for the new non-LE version is very low.

Sent from my F3216 using Tapatalk


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## Travelller (Apr 24, 2012)

aclaz said:


> Based on its history gold hands appeared only on LEs:
> SBDX003 w gold hands n markers
> SBDX012 w gold hands n markers plus white n red tipped second hand
> SBDX021 w gold second hand only


SBDX003 w gold hands n markers n text
SBDX012 w gold hands n markers n text plus white n red tipped second hand n gold bezel-text
SBEX007 w gold hands n markers n text plus white n red tipped second hand n gold bezel-text

As for the SBDX021, the gold seconds-hand / 300m text could/should have also been done in silver / white, imho... :think:


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## Cpt Canuck (May 27, 2018)

I also don't like the 300m text color. Stuck out so bad on the green LE.

Watch I am currently saving for: Fortis B-42 Official Cosmonaut


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## ahonobaka (Jan 27, 2017)

I'm not as particular, but the text color certainly did not stand out in a negative way for me when the black dial sales sample was revealed at Topper earlier this year. I've said it before, but it definitely had a more refined feel to it, and the dial itself is more inky matte black than grainy black as on the currently 017's.


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## denisd (Dec 6, 2006)

thrty8street said:


> Cpt Canuck said:
> 
> 
> > Remember, the french are used to being pushed around and surrender quickly. Foreign product prices tend to be higher as a result ?
> ...


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## Bgsmith (Nov 6, 2015)

thrty8street said:


> We have micro adjustment at the clasp?
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Yes there are micro adjustments, I am talking about half links in the bracelet though, so it forms to the wrist better at the clasp.

I doubt they changed anything with the bracelet, just wishful thinking.


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## manofrolex (Jul 9, 2012)

denisd said:


> thrty8street said:
> 
> 
> > Lol!
> ...


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## aclaz (Aug 13, 2018)

Bgsmith said:


> Yes there are micro adjustments, I am talking about half links in the bracelet though, so it forms to the wrist better at the clasp.
> 
> I doubt they changed anything with the bracelet, just wishful thinking.


Here are side by side photos of the SLA019 (Left) & SBDX017 (unadjusted w tag). Basically the same bracelets.









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## rrivera117 (Oct 20, 2017)

2500M_Sub said:


> Have to say, I hate the gold colored seconds hand. They should have only done that for the green model. Styling fail in my book.
> 
> Regards,
> 
> Ren


agree 100%


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## aclaz (Aug 13, 2018)

Just saw my AD and picked up my Presage SJE073 anyways the good news he said the black MM300 will come this Thursday... price to follow, definitely has gold second hand.

SLA021J









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## 24jewels (Sep 2, 2018)

The gold seconds hand makes no sense in the overall design. It upsets me! I guess I'll passsssss


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## ahonobaka (Jan 27, 2017)

Waiting for yonsson to chime in...

__
http://instagr.am/p/BpSMNFon3Ph/


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## Travelller (Apr 24, 2012)

aclaz said:


> ...the good news he said the black MM300 will come this Thursday... price to follow, definitely has gold second hand...


A golden seconds hand (and gilt 300m) is not good news imho... :-(

~~~~

/OFF-TOPIC (-ish)
There's a NOS SBDX001 going for €2K... should I make a move? I really like the "updates" found in the SBDX017 ...but a "first gen" always makes for a nice addition to the collection, particularly at the price point... :think:
The only "unworn" SBDX001 hosted on Chrono24* is going for €3.7K... and the SBDX017 is averaging ~2.5K (unworn) but with only two(!) available...

_*Alas, there are NO SBDX003 or SBDX012 on chrono24... _


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## RabiesVax (Aug 28, 2015)

I'm a big fan of the gold seconds hand but overall I am happy to have the SBDX017. Can't wait to see what comes next for Seiko!


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## aclaz (Aug 13, 2018)

Golden 2nd hand or not will definitely get the blue MM300 or should we coin it as XP300 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## cadomniel (Nov 20, 2010)

i prefer SBDX017 vs the new version. Personally the gold accents ruined it for me. The gold seconds hand somewhat works on the green dial version. But Gold on black and gold 300m is too much.


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## aclaz (Aug 13, 2018)

cadomniel said:


> i prefer SBDX017 vs the new version. Personally the gold accents ruined it for me. The gold seconds hand somewhat works on the green dial version. But Gold on black and gold 300m is too much.


I can live with the golden accents as the upgrades are more important - sapphire crystal and ceramic bezel

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## ahonobaka (Jan 27, 2017)

Now if we can only get in the metal images of the blue...


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## Norrie (Sep 23, 2011)

Yeah, that blue is gonna be a winner. Wouldn't be surprised if a few greens hit the market to trade for the blue. Especially if it has a sunburst dial which it looks like it might. History tells us that everyone has a whinge about new changes before release dates and once they hit the market, the same people will step over themselves trying to buy one. I love the 17 but I'd rather pay extra for the ceramic and sapphire than pay what people are asking for 17s these days. One seller has one on ebay for $30,400. Yep, that's USD.


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## Norrie (Sep 23, 2011)

Is the blue pegged for release with the black?


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## aclaz (Aug 13, 2018)

Norrie said:


> Is the blue pegged for release with the black?


My AD said yesterday that the blue maybe out sometime next month but the black one will arrive at his shop tomorrow (Thursday). I will definitively pass-by to see the SLA021J. 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Norrie (Sep 23, 2011)

aclaz said:


> My AD said yesterday that the blue maybe out sometime next month but the black one will arrive at his shop tomorrow (Thursday). I will definitively pass-by to see the SLA021J.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Pics or it never happened.


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## Norrie (Sep 23, 2011)

ahonobaka said:


> Waiting for yonsson to chime in...
> 
> __
> http://instagr.am/p/BpSMNFon3Ph/


Looks like they have. Click the link and behold the new mm300.


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## aclaz (Aug 13, 2018)

Photo from my AD - MSRP in HKD for the black one...









Approx USD2,900

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Norrie (Sep 23, 2011)

A few pics floating around the web now. It’s beautiful. No surprises. Gold second hand, gold 300, Prospex X, flat/matt black dial.


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## LordBrettSinclair (Sep 22, 2015)

I like it, despite finding the gold sweep hand meh.

I'm not sure I like it *enough* to shell out all that cash for one, though.


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## DarthVedder (Jun 12, 2011)

$2900 at an AD. I'm guessing $2400 once it starts hitting the gray market. Not bad at all, just have to be a bit patient.


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## Norrie (Sep 23, 2011)

I'm not able to embed pics right now but check out these pics

__
http://instagr.am/p/BpUONpLBQfh/


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## K1M_I (Apr 28, 2017)

Much better photos, but still wouldn't change my 017 to the new one. I really don't get the second hand, it feels like they just wanted to change something and not just the MM text to X. Sapphire and ceramic bezel are good upgrades, but yea, I'm keeping my 017!


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## amngwlvs (Sep 14, 2018)

Norrie said:


> Yeah, that blue is gonna be a winner. Wouldn't be surprised if a few greens hit the market to trade for the blue. Especially if it has a sunburst dial which it looks like it might. History tells us that everyone has a whinge about new changes before release dates and once they hit the market, the same people will step over themselves trying to buy one. I love the 17 but I'd rather pay extra for the ceramic and sapphire than pay what people are asking for 17s these days. One seller has one on ebay for $30,400. Yep, that's USD.


Haha, I've been watching that listing for a while. It was $3000USD iirc and then got relisted as the $30,400. I'm convinced it's a typo but I'm watching it anyways to see how long it takes for them to realize. Unless they're hoping someone accidentally commits to buy at that price. :think:


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## OHL (Jan 8, 2018)

The 12 o'clock marker not being a sharply pointed triangle upsets me.


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## MrTickles (Jun 19, 2013)

Frankly, I like it....like the gold second hand, like the black color tones and half lumed bezel. Yes, I wish it said MarineMaster, but you have to give Seiko something to do in 10 years when they re-issue it again.

If $2400 grey market price holds, its a fairly good value.


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## Simon (Feb 11, 2006)

aclaz said:


> I can live with the golden accents as the upgrades are more important - sapphire crystal and ceramic bezel


Indeed - good upgrades - looks great - and gold accents against black is a Seiko Signature


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## NYDan (Mar 23, 2008)

Well, I love my sbdx017, but I have to admit that I like the looks of the new one as well. I actually think the X balances out the dial nicely and I don't mind the gold. I'd have to see in the metal to determine how I feel about the flat sapphire and ceramic bezel. I like the scratch resistance for sure, but the sbdx017 has such a beautiful feeling with the gently curved crystal below the bezel. I'd have both if I could.
Dan


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## yonsson (Feb 20, 2012)

yonsson said:


> Correct! Sloppy by me, SLA021 is correct, don't text and drive and so forth.
> These are from a Thai-seller on Facebook l, just search for SLA021 in Facebook and you'll find the pics.


Posted in the general news thread.


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## anrex (Jul 30, 2017)

So I guess I have the last issued model of the MM300 with the old school tech of Hardlex Crystal and Lacquer Bezel, but with the "PS" X. The Zimbe SLA027 was released in July.


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## ahonobaka (Jan 27, 2017)

Thank you Simon for calling out the historical gold on black basis; I'll be honest, when I held the new black back in June, I asked myself "Do I need this, already owning the SBDX017"?

My answer at the time was, "Probably, yes", but only if we don't get a new GS diver next year. The blue could sway me as well, but these are winners IMO once you get them in hand. $2400 would be a steal...


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## aclaz (Aug 13, 2018)

OHL said:


> The 12 o'clock marker not being a sharply pointed triangle upsets me.


If the new SLA021 has exactly the same bezel as the SLA019 (except its color) then topmost marker, pointed or not its new lume won't upset me 









Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Kiwimac99 (May 19, 2017)

A friend of mine has the 1000m Hi-Beat unit - the 700 piece limited edition. It's nice but to be honest I prefer the standard 017 version.

Also - what IS "Zimbe"? The person I bought my 017 from sold it because he had bought a Zimbe - and neither of us really knew what Zimbe was.


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## Tanker G1 (Feb 28, 2016)

MrTickles said:


> If $2400 grey market price holds, its a fairly good value.


Honest question, can someone tell me what makes this watch worth roughly $2k more than a Sumo? I've been doing some homework on the unique case and 8L35. I've also been following this thread to try and learn what the MM300 is all about and I'm honestly struggling to see the value proposition. I love Seiko and recently bought a SBGA229 so it's not about not being able to afford it. What's so special about the MM300 that I'm not seeing?


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## 24jewels (Sep 2, 2018)

Kiwimac99 said:


> Also - what IS "Zimbe"? The person I bought my 017 from sold it because he had bought a Zimbe - and neither of us really knew what Zimbe was.


Zimbe is a Thailand limited edition seiko


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## Kiwimac99 (May 19, 2017)

24jewels said:


> Zimbe is a Thailand limited edition seiko


Yes, I know. But what IS it? Is Zimbe a cartoon? A dive company? A person?


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## 24jewels (Sep 2, 2018)

anrex said:


> The Zimbe SLA027 was released in July.


I like how the minute hand of the Zimbe is long enough to reach the indices. A longer minute hand should have been part of the upgrades


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## 24jewels (Sep 2, 2018)

Kiwimac99 said:


> Yes, I know. But what IS it? Is Zimbe a cartoon? A dive company? A person?


A whale shark

Jinbei in Japanese


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## Kiwimac99 (May 19, 2017)

Tanker G1 said:


> Honest question, can someone tell me what makes this watch worth roughly $2k more than a Sumo? I've been doing some homework on the unique case and 8L35. I've also been following this thread to try and learn what the MM300 is all about and I'm honestly struggling to see the value proposition. I love Seiko and recently bought a SBGA229 so it's not about not being able to afford it. What's so special about the MM300 that I'm not seeing?


Have you actually handled one in the metal? If not, I recommend doing so as much will become clear.

I've owned Rolex Sea Dwellers (old pre ceramic ones) and frankly in terms of fit and finish, with the exception of the bracelet, there is very little difference. The Rolex movement is COSC certified and this one is not is about all the extra you get for another $10,000 or so. If Seiko had put a regulated version of the same movement in and charged another $500 it would have been a huge bargain compared to the Swiss equivalent.

The bracelet is merely adequate, I will concede. It works - and works well - but the Oyster bracelet with Glidelock is orders of magnitude better in terms of machining, fit and finish etc. The Seiko bracelet is a fine bracelet but it's not an excellent bracelet. That said, neither is the one on my Grand Seiko: I think Seiko should get their act together as far as bracelets go.


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## Kiwimac99 (May 19, 2017)

24jewels said:


> A whale shark


Ah ha! So is it a specific individual one, or just the generic Thai term for them?


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## 24jewels (Sep 2, 2018)

Kiwimac99 said:


> Ah ha! So is it a specific individual one, or just the generic Thai term for them?


I believe it is whale shark in Thai.

(Thailand for the conservation of the Whale shark)


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## rosborn (Oct 30, 2011)

I love it and I would love to own one but I really can’t justify the price, though I have absolutely no doubt it is well worth it...maybe for my 55th birthday in two years. My next purchase will be a SBDC061 and that may just have to do. Damn, I love Seiko watches!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


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## ahonobaka (Jan 27, 2017)

24jewels said:


> I believe it is whale shark in Thai.
> 
> (Thailand for the conservation of the Whale shark)


"Zimbe" is a stylized romanization of the Japanese word "jinbei", which means "whale shark" as mentioned previous. Not sure what it is in Thai to be honest though!

@Tanker G1, Kiwimac hit the nail on the head in my experience. You need to see it in the metal, it's well above the Sumo in very obvious qualitative ways no contest, though the Sumo is better bang for buck (not my personal focus or care).


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## aclaz (Aug 13, 2018)

rosborn said:


> I love it and I would love to own one but I really can't justify the price, though I have absolutely no doubt it is well worth it...maybe for my 55th birthday in two years. My next purchase will be a SBDC061 and that may just have to do. Damn, I love Seiko watches!
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


The SBDC061/SPB077J1 is a nice divers/tool watch, Bruce Williams, watch enthusiast at YouTube called it the MM200, but just check the bezel markers as I read some who bought theirs w misaligned ones.

You can also check a more current model SBDC065/SPB083J1 as it has a sun burst blue dial.

I highly recommend you to get yourself a Marine Master 300 sometime in the future.

Yup, love those Seiko Divers, too!

Sent from my HUAWEI NXT-L29 using Tapatalk


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## krpdm (Oct 28, 2014)

Untitled by jppellet, on Flickr

Don't like the X, lack of MM, gold second hand, etc and so forth?????
Don't bloody buy one!


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## cadomniel (Nov 20, 2010)

rosborn said:


> I love it and I would love to own one but I really can't justify the price, though I have absolutely no doubt it is well worth it...maybe for my 55th birthday in two years. My next purchase will be a SBDC061 and that may just have to do. Damn, I love Seiko watches!
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


I just got my SBDC061 today. Its also a great watch. A couple years ago I would have never bought anything larger than a Submariner but the Seiko's really wear well with their case shape that hugs the wrist. I also have the SBDC053 and saw a youtube video that said the SBDC061 wears smaller even though its 44mm and it is true it does wear smaller. 
It definitely makes me want an MM300 even more since it has similar dimensions except taller


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## Simon (Feb 11, 2006)

ahonobaka said:


> Thank you Simon for calling out the historical gold on black basis; I'll be honest, when I held the new black back in June, I asked myself "Do I need this, already owning the SBDX017"? My answer at the time was, "Probably, yes", but only if we don't get a new GS diver next year. The blue could sway me as well, but these are winners IMO once you get them in hand. $2400 would be a steal...


Thanks AH - I think its fantastic - a natural evolution of a classic - but I would be amazed if it comes in grey market as low as $2400 (never in the UK) - I think for some time it will be premium priced - the GS divers are so wonderful - but the upgrades on the Prospex300 make the GS diver at 3x the cost look an unattractive proposition.


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## Simon (Feb 11, 2006)

krpdm said:


> Untitled by jppellet, on Flickr
> 
> Don't like the X, lack of MM, gold second hand, etc and so forth?????
> Don't bloody buy one!


Great pic - wonderful watch - long requested modest upgrades take it to the next level as a premium product - as for the slight price hike, seems a bargain at a third the price of a ubiquitous Rolex Sub - the gold hand against black is Seiko signature on divers going back to 1968 - replacing MM with PS/X actually balances out the dial type - its a total winner IMHO. Sure the original MM was all business - but this upgrade remains all business with some added class. I want one.


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## anrex (Jul 30, 2017)

Kiwimac99 said:


> Yes, I know. But what IS it? Is Zimbe a cartoon? A dive company? A person?


I maybe wrong, but I think "Zimbe" means whale shark in Thai, hence the whale shark emblem.


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## JoeOBrien (Aug 2, 2013)

Tanker G1 said:


> Honest question, can someone tell me what makes this watch worth roughly $2k more than a Sumo? I've been doing some homework on the unique case and 8L35. I've also been following this thread to try and learn what the MM300 is all about and I'm honestly struggling to see the value proposition. I love Seiko and recently bought a SBGA229 so it's not about not being able to afford it. What's so special about the MM300 that I'm not seeing?


What makes any expensive thing worth more than a less-expensive thing? If you had never handled the GS diver, only seen pictures and read threads about it, would you have been able to see the value proposition in that over a Sumo? Similarly, the MM300 has a GS-based movement and exactly the same clasp mechanism as the GS diver. Why would anyone pay $4000 more for the GS?

You've already answered half of your own question by mentioning the movement and the case (i.e. the extra engineering that goes into a 300m He diver vs a 200mm 'air' diver). The rest is in details that you won't get from reading and pictures.


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## aclaz (Aug 13, 2018)

Kiwimac99 said:


> Ah ha! So is it a specific individual one, or just the generic Thai term for them?


A bit of a backgrounder, Thailand has the fast-growing market for Prospex models with 50% growth in 2016; Seiko in 2017 as a marketing push turned Thailand as their base in Asia. Their aim was to double their sales of mid to high-end models seeking those born in the 80s and 90s with high purchasing power. 
As part of the 'push' in July 2017 a marketing campaign selling Limited Edition exclusively in Thailand was officially launched with the whale shark as its icon termed Prospex Zimbe Limited Edition.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## barutanseijin (Sep 18, 2017)

krpdm said:


> Don't like the X, lack of MM, gold second hand, etc and so forth?????
> Don't bloody buy one!


Isn't this a place to discuss watches? People will disagree. That's life.

As for the MM300, i can live with everything but the increased thickness. I won't buy one -- not that it makes a difference to anyone else.


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## MrTickles (Jun 19, 2013)

Tanker G1 said:


> Honest question, can someone tell me what makes this watch worth roughly $2k more than a Sumo? I've been doing some homework on the unique case and 8L35. I've also been following this thread to try and learn what the MM300 is all about and I'm honestly struggling to see the value proposition. I love Seiko and recently bought a SBGA229 so it's not about not being able to afford it. What's so special about the MM300 that I'm not seeing?


Value is going to be in the eye of the beholder. It is hard to fully describe without handling it, but having owned a bunch of Seiko's the quality of the MM300 is just a step above any of the cheaper divers and has a utilitarian beauty that some of the GS models lack...maybe its the heft of the solid steel, the depth of the dial, the great handset, the ratcheting bracelet and for me the consistency of the movement vs cheaper models, or some of the history vs the GS.

Of all the watches I have owned, the MM300 is still the one that made me smile the most when I looked at it. Technically are my Rolex/Tudor maybe better....possibly but not by drastic margins and I love the way the MM300 goes under the radar. Your experience with the watch may vary and as such it might not be worth what it is to me. I made the mistake of selling it and will hopefully acquire the new model when it comes out.


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## LordBrettSinclair (Sep 22, 2015)

^ As good a reasoning as any of why we love certain watches and not others.


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## Tanker G1 (Feb 28, 2016)

JoeOBrien said:


> What makes any expensive thing worth more than a less-expensive thing? If you had never handled the GS diver, only seen pictures and read threads about it, would you have been able to see the value proposition in that over a Sumo? Similarly, the MM300 has a GS-based movement and exactly the same clasp mechanism as the GS diver. Why would anyone pay $4000 more for the GS?
> 
> You've already answered half of your own question by mentioning the movement and the case (i.e. the extra engineering that goes into a 300m He diver vs a 200mm 'air' diver). The rest is in details that you won't get from reading and pictures.


Appreciate the thought provoking response. Yes I appreciate the engineering that goes into making a 300m watch, but perhaps maybe not enough to shell out for it. The thought that it's worth X because it compares favorably to a $10k watch is a position that only makes me question the value of the $10k watch. I should have been more clear on trying to understand the MM300 on its own merits but that's not fair either as I'm here on my end comparing relative values between different Seikos. With spring drive and GS level finishing, it was pretty easy for me to see the value of a GS diver over a Sumo.

I have a Transocean too. IMO it's beautiful. Ceramic bezel, sapphire, 50hr PR, accurate, paid ~ $1k. I love it. If asked why it's worth $1k I'd struggle for an answer as well. I thought hard about spending $1k on it while comparing the relative value to other Seikos. If it was $1,200 I probably don't have it. So maybe instead of why is it worth a price I can't seem to understand, I should have posted why do you love it?


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## Tanker G1 (Feb 28, 2016)

MrTickles said:


> Value is going to be in the eye of the beholder. It is hard to fully describe without handling it, but having owned a bunch of Seiko's the quality of the MM300 is just a step above any of the cheaper divers and has a utilitarian beauty that some of the GS models lack...maybe its the heft of the solid steel, the depth of the dial, the great handset, the ratcheting bracelet and for me the consistency of the movement vs cheaper models, or some of the history vs the GS.
> 
> Of all the watches I have owned, the MM300 is still the one that made me smile the most when I looked at it. Technically are my Rolex/Tudor maybe better....possibly but not by drastic margins and I love the way the MM300 goes under the radar. Your experience with the watch may vary and as such it might not be worth what it is to me. I made the mistake of selling it and will hopefully acquire the new model when it comes out.


This is what I've been looking for. Good stuff. Thank you.


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## Maddog1970 (Sep 28, 2015)

Worth every $ it cost me.....IMHO of course...


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## Maddog1970 (Sep 28, 2015)

X2


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## aclaz (Aug 13, 2018)

Tanker G1 said:


> Appreciate the thought provoking response. Yes I appreciate the engineering that goes into making a 300m watch, but perhaps maybe not enough to shell out for it. The thought that it's worth X because it compares favorably to a $10k watch is a position that only makes me question the value of the $10k watch. I should have been more clear on trying to understand the MM300 on its own merits but that's not fair either as I'm here on my end comparing relative values between different Seikos. With spring drive and GS level finishing, it was pretty easy for me to see the value of a GS diver over a Sumo.
> 
> I have a Transocean too. IMO it's beautiful. Ceramic bezel, sapphire, 50hr PR, accurate, paid ~ $1k. I love it. If asked why it's worth $1k I'd struggle for an answer as well. I thought hard about spending $1k on it while comparing the relative value to other Seikos. If it was $1,200 I probably don't have it. So maybe instead of why is it worth a price I can't seem to understand, I should have posted why do you love it?


I have 3 Sumos (031, 033 & 057) and have the SBDX017 & SLA019. As already mentioned in a couple of responses to your query, you really have to handle/ wear the watch to get a 'feel' of its value.
The MM300 has a 'rock solid' feel you can immediately sense it is a robust, high-quality made time piece. 
And what makes it stand out from almost all of the divers watches is its monoblock case which even the GS diver (being an air dive tool) doesn't have.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## ahonobaka (Jan 27, 2017)

Simon said:


> the GS divers are so wonderful - but the upgrades on the Prospex300 make at GS diver at 3x the cost look an unattractive proposition.


This is significant to me; Exactly the reason why a new GS diver is likely soon


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## krpdm (Oct 28, 2014)

ahonobaka said:


> This is significant to me; Exactly the reason why a new GS diver is likely soon


Untitled by jppellet, on Flickr
IMG_2750 by jppellet, on Flickr

Had the same "problem"


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## rosborn (Oct 30, 2011)

aclaz said:


> I have 3 Sumos (031, 033 & 057) and have the SBDX017 & SLA019. As already mentioned in a couple of responses to your query, you really have to handle/ wear the watch to get a 'feel' of its value.
> The MM300 has a 'rock solid' feel you can immediately sense it is a robust, high-quality made time piece.
> And what makes it stand out from almost all of the divers watches is its monoblock case which even the GS diver (being an air dive tool) doesn't have.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Absolutelyagree. For me, the MM300 makes all Swiss divers pale in comparison. The diver "I" would favorably compare to the MM300 is the Sinn UX.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


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## yukailiao9801 (Oct 26, 2018)

I had a SBDX001 for 2 years, but I sold it few months ago.
The watch was magnetized easily (running about 1 min/day, and twice a year ), it makes me upset.
Now the new mm300 is coming out, and I pre-ordered one already a few days ago.
Because the good looking of mm300 still attracts me. (What's more it has upgraded to the sapphire glass and ceramic bezel)
Was anyone's mm300 magnetized before? and how often?


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## aclaz (Aug 13, 2018)

yukailiao9801 said:


> I had a SBDX001 for 2 years, but I sold it few months ago.
> The watch was magnetized easily (running about 1 min/day, and twice a year ), it makes me upset.
> Now the new mm300 is coming out, and I pre-ordered one already a few days ago.
> Because the good looking of mm300 still attracts me. (What's more it has upgraded to the sapphire glass and ceramic bezel)
> Was anyone's mm300 magnetized before? and how often?


added upgrades from the SBDX001 is dia shield which was applied in SBDX012 and yes it has magnetic resistance feature... below is the link to the SLA019 specs https://www.seiko-watch.co.jp/collections/en/prospex/SBDX021

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## aalin13 (Apr 2, 2010)

yukailiao9801 said:


> I had a SBDX001 for 2 years, but I sold it few months ago.
> The watch was magnetized easily (running about 1 min/day, and twice a year ), it makes me upset.
> Now the new mm300 is coming out, and I pre-ordered one already a few days ago.
> Because the good looking of mm300 still attracts me. (What's more it has upgraded to the sapphire glass and ceramic bezel)
> Was anyone's mm300 magnetized before? and how often?


Have had mine for about 2.5 years now and it has never been magnetised. The new one has the same degree of anti-magnetism, so not sure why you think it'll be any different. If magnetism is an issue, consider watches with silicon hairspring instead.

Sent from my Pixel using Tapatalk


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## yukailiao9801 (Oct 26, 2018)

aalin13 said:


> Have had mine for about 2.5 years now and it has never been magnetised. The new one has the same degree of anti-magnetism, so not sure why you think it'll be any different. If magnetism is an issue, consider watches with silicon hairspring instead.
> 
> Sent from my Pixel using Tapatalk


Yeah...I'm curious about there's nobody had the magnetized issue?
I had considered between sla021 and tudor pelagos which has a silicon spring, but it looks boring.


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## aalin13 (Apr 2, 2010)

yukailiao9801 said:


> Yeah...I'm curious about there's nobody had the magnetized issue?
> I had considered between sla021 and tudor pelagos which has a silicon spring, but it looks boring.


It shouldn't be any more susceptible to magnetism than other mechanical watches, so may be there are machinery that you come in contact with that is causing the problem?

I've even taken my mm300 through airport multiple times without an issue.

Sent from my Pixel using Tapatalk


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## aclaz (Aug 13, 2018)

Saw this on a another forum...
Blue is SLA023J1









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## aclaz (Aug 13, 2018)

Confirmed by 2 ADs here in HK SLA023J1 will be released next year


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## Travelller (Apr 24, 2012)

Travelller said:


> /OFF-TOPIC (-ish)
> There's a NOS SBDX001 going for €2K... should I make a move? I really like the "updates" found in the SBDX017 ...but a "first gen" always makes for a nice addition to the collection, particularly at the price point...


Opinions, anyone...? :think:


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## impalass (Mar 31, 2010)

Travelller said:


> Opinions, anyone...? :think:


In my bias opinion go for it, probably the only NOS 1st gen in the world and the price seems reasonable.

My (bought new) SBDX001 is 5 years old problem free and never been magnetized.


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## jason042779 (Oct 30, 2014)

Yeah, would like to see slimmer profile, improved movement, bracelet or just something more than sapphire/ceramic to truly justify the new SKU.


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## 24jewels (Sep 2, 2018)

I was hoping the blue variant would have a different color for the seconds hand


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## Bgsmith (Nov 6, 2015)

I have to say I saw a pic of the new MM300 on Instagram the other day as I follow the mm300 hashtag and at the first quick glance I thought it was a Sumo and was wondering why the #mm300 was being used.


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## nolte (Jun 28, 2016)

Bgsmith said:


> I have to say I saw a pic of the new MM300 on Instagram the other day as I follow the mm300 hashtag and at the first quick glance I thought it was a Sumo and was wondering why the #mm300 was being used.


can you link the pic?
EDIT: really what I'm wondering is if it was an SPB077 (et al.) that someone erroneously tagged...


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## aclaz (Aug 13, 2018)

It is here! SLA021J 









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## JoeOBrien (Aug 2, 2013)

It's a little disappointing that they didn't bother with a new waffle strap. I know the newer silicone straps are actually better quality than the MM300 one, but it was something else that set the watch apart from generic Prospex models. I suppose it's a moot point since most people will use aftermarket straps anyway.


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## aclaz (Aug 13, 2018)

JoeOBrien said:


> It's a little disappointing that they didn't bother with a new waffle strap. I know the newer silicone straps are actually better quality than the MM300 one, but it was something else that set the watch apart from generic Prospex models. I suppose it's a moot point since most people will use aftermarket straps anyway.


In my case another disappointing news is that the blue one will not be officially issued by Seiko HK, that means I have buy from the grey market 

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## aclaz (Aug 13, 2018)

Black one will be officially launched on 9th November...









Note: the above were translated from its original web site

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## katuiran (Apr 6, 2015)

The SLA021 is finally out.










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## cadomniel (Nov 20, 2010)

there is a blue SLA027 on ebay right now already


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## aclaz (Aug 13, 2018)

cadomniel said:


> there is a blue SLA027 on ebay right now already


That is the Zimbe LE which was released last August. The coming blue MM300 is SLA023J

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## manofrolex (Jul 9, 2012)

krpdm said:


> Untitled by jppellet, on Flickr
> 
> Don't like the X, lack of MM, gold second hand, etc and so forth?????
> Don't bloody buy one!


I am w this guy same complaints coming through gets old quick. You don't like it don't buy it but the same people who moaned about the lack of ceramic and the lack of sapphire are now *****ing about the fact they have to pay more . Goes to show you can never please everyone nor should you attempt to do so

Use your wallet to vote and to vote I did


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## DarthVedder (Jun 12, 2011)

jmanlay said:


> I am w this guy same complaints coming through gets old quick. You don't like it don't buy it but the same people who moaned about the lack of ceramic and the lack of sapphire are now *****ing about the fact they have to pay more . Goes to show you can never please everyone nor should you attempt to do so
> 
> Use your wallet to vote and to vote I did


I can't afford to vote right now!!!


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## manofrolex (Jul 9, 2012)

DarthVedder said:


> I can't afford to vote right now!!!


that is ok it is worth the wait


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## DarthVedder (Jun 12, 2011)

jmanlay said:


> that is ok it is worth the wait


Of course&#8230; I'm only half joking... Once the regular version starts hitting grey market, the price will come down a bit.


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## Simon (Feb 11, 2006)

but it may go up


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## manofrolex (Jul 9, 2012)

Simon said:


> but it may go up


that is possible too. I think they hit a home run w the SLA019 sure they could be thinner, sure the clasp could be less bulky but overall it works


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## DarthVedder (Jun 12, 2011)

Simon said:


> but it may go up


Usually only happens with discontinued watches and numbered limited editions... We'll see, but I hope I can snag one at with a small discount in a few months...

Unless it's such a huge hit that Seiko can't keep up with the demand, and in that case I'd have to wait a bit longer.


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## yukailiao9801 (Oct 26, 2018)

The list price of SBDX001 was $105000 in Taiwan, but SBDX023 is $103000. It's weird.
Anyway, I'll order one.


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## aclaz (Aug 13, 2018)

katuiran said:


> The SLA021 is finally out.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Lume shot please 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## TheJubs (Oct 10, 2016)

Any news/pics of the blue version? Thought I remembered reading that it would be released in November too, so figured we'd see pics of it by now.


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## ahonobaka (Jan 27, 2017)

__
http://instagr.am/p/BpnL3yWD51B/

Joe has his photo up


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## Beau M (Aug 24, 2017)

Good to know! I've swam with whale sharks, sounds like an excuse for a new watch 

*edit meant to respond to the Zimbe comment


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## Maddog1970 (Sep 28, 2015)

Gnomon has the black SBDX023 for $3080US....get it while you can!


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## simonp67 (Aug 10, 2015)

rosborn said:


> Absolutelyagree. For me, the MM300 makes all Swiss divers pale in comparison. The diver "I" would favorably compare to the MM300 is the Sinn UX.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro












The UX is an awesome watch, I'm on the fence on if I'd compare the MM 300 to it or not. The MM 300 is incredibly well built, a bullet proof tool watch which the UX is as well so is my Rolex SD and my Tunas - sense a theme? Lol I can't imagine selling any of them and rotate through them each week if I was forced to have only one of those Seikos though I think the MM would win out.

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## ahonobaka (Jan 27, 2017)

Just want to give a shout out to the Gnomon product photos, probably the best pictures out there right now for this model...


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## TheJubs (Oct 10, 2016)

ahonobaka said:


> Just want to give a shout out to the Gnomon product photos, probably the best pictures out there right now for this model...


Agreed. You can always count on Gnomon for fantastic product photos. Just need to see the blue model now...


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## TACSTS (May 11, 2008)

Am I the only one that think $3k is a bit much for this? And I have a SBDX017 - it’s a great watch. But if I were shopping for a diver in the $3k range I don’t know if that’s where my money would go. At $2500 with the ceramic bezel and sapphire I could see it. I wonder if prices will settle anymore. It’s basically the same as the “limited” 019.


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## aclaz (Aug 13, 2018)

TACSTS said:


> Am I the only one that think $3k is a bit much for this? And I have a SBDX017 - it's a great watch. But if I were shopping for a diver in the $3k range I don't know if that's where my money would go. At $2500 with the ceramic bezel and sapphire I could see it. I wonder if prices will settle anymore. It's basically the same as the "limited" 019.


$3,000 is the MSRP Seiko Boutiques (at least in HK) offers up to 15% discount.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## katuiran (Apr 6, 2015)

The cheapest I’ve seen is US$ 2,500 for the SLA021.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## TACSTS (May 11, 2008)

I was just going on what Gnomon had it listed for. Aren’t they usually pretty competitive on pricing?


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## LinuxJonCB (Jul 12, 2018)

I really am excited about the new bezel and crystal. 

I'm not excited about them dropping the MarineMaster name on the dial. And as someone who paid $1500 for an SBDX001, I cannot fathom paying $3k for it....


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## ahonobaka (Jan 27, 2017)

Give it some time, the price will settle. Or work with your AD on better pricing. Personally I would do around $2750 if I had a choice, but it just came out and it’s a “hot new model”, no reason anyone would start lowballing out the gate IMO


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## aclaz (Aug 13, 2018)

ahonobaka said:


> Give it some time, the price will settle. Or work with your AD on better pricing. Personally I would do around $2750 if I had a choice, but it just came out and it's a "hot new model", no reason anyone would start lowballing out the gate IMO


Yup, it is not an LE so hopefully like the SBDX017, Seiko will mass produce the SLA021 for the next 3 years...
SBDX017 ran from Aug 2015 to Jul 2018.

Sent from my HUAWEI NXT-L29 using Tapatalk


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## Maddog1970 (Sep 28, 2015)

TACSTS said:


> I was just going on what Gnomon had it listed for. Aren't they usually pretty competitive on pricing?


$3080US


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## Maddog1970 (Sep 28, 2015)

X2


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## JoeOBrien (Aug 2, 2013)

TACSTS said:


> Am I the only one that think $3k is a bit much for this? And I have a SBDX017 - it's a great watch. But if I were shopping for a diver in the $3k range I don't know if that's where my money would go. At $2500 with the ceramic bezel and sapphire I could see it. I wonder if prices will settle anymore. It's basically the same as the "limited" 019.


You're making the same mistake as everyone else who doesn't like the price of the 021. You're comparing the retail price of a brand new model to the price you got used to seeing the 017 sell for. Gnomon is selling the 021 at about 5% less than the expected US retail price (SLA019 was $3250). The list price of the 017 was $2600, not $2000 which is what it was selling for most recently. So of course the new model isn't going to be priced at $2500.


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## aclaz (Aug 13, 2018)

SLA021J now on display at Seiko Boutique, TST HK at HKD23,900 (USD3,000)










Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## T1meout (Sep 27, 2013)

It’s baffling that people would even think that Seiko would have permanently seized production of their best selling regular production high end diver. To me this was an impossibility. It wasn’t a question of if, but when they’d be releasing the upgraded version. All this hype for nothing. This was an absolute given all along.


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## Glacier (Oct 28, 2015)

The gold second hand and line of words is awesome!
To me that's even more significant than the crystal and bezel upgrades!!

Wish the bezel either have full or just 12 o'clock marker lumed... the half-assed one-third of markers lumed (i.e., to 20min mark) looks off... 

The other wish would of course be a bracelet upgrade and I wouldn't mind paying more for that for sure~


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## Dub Rubb (Jul 29, 2017)

Just got these sent with a watch I purchased, and figure this was a good place to share.









Sent from my LG-M322 using Tapatalk


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## MrTickles (Jun 19, 2013)

Saw it live and in person today....was impressed, but biased since I loved the SBDX001. The gold hands are subtle and look great, the bezel is higher but the cermaic insert sits lower than the metal rim, I miss the 'Marine Master' but the reality is only a real nerd like me would ever notice. I am really thinking this one might be my next one......having worn the Pelagos for almost 2 years I sort of miss the heft of the MM300. Saw the SLA019 too....was a great watch and the color is so well executed but I think I might still like the black better IMHO.

(had problems with the upload, sorry if anything is wonky)


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## aclaz (Aug 13, 2018)

MrTickles said:


> Saw it live and in person today....was impressed, but biased since I loved the SBDX001. The gold hands are subtle and look great, the bezel is higher but the cermaic insert sits lower than the metal rim, I miss the 'Marine Master' but the reality is only a real nerd like me would ever notice. I am really thinking this one might be my next one......having worn the Pelagos for almost 2 years I sort of miss the heft of the MM300. Saw the SLA019 too....was a great watch and the color is so well executed but I think I might still like the black better IMHO.


yup, only MM300 diehards will ever notice if it has an 'X' or MM on the dial, my SBDX017 from the angle shot it looks like it has a gold second hand 









Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Rosenbloom (May 9, 2016)

Finally saw one at a watch shop in Hong Kong today. The second hand and "300m" in gold color are subtle and nice. If there were still "MARINEMASTER" on the dial, I think I'll buy one.
Is the blue version coming also? That will be quite tempting even with the "X" on the dial.


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## aclaz (Aug 13, 2018)

Saw a Zimbe at approx $3,300










Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## aalin13 (Apr 2, 2010)

MrTickles said:


> Saw it live and in person today....was impressed, but biased since I loved the SBDX001. The gold hands are subtle and look great, the bezel is higher but the cermaic insert sits lower than the metal rim, I miss the 'Marine Master' but the reality is only a real nerd like me would ever notice. I am really thinking this one might be my next one......having worn the Pelagos for almost 2 years I sort of miss the heft of the MM300. Saw the SLA019 too....was a great watch and the color is so well executed but I think I might still like the black better IMHO.
> 
> (had problems with the upload, sorry if anything is wonky)
> 
> ...


Not sure if it's just the photo, but the dial colour seems to have changed. This looks more like an inky black than before, but could just be the lighting as well.


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## ahonobaka (Jan 27, 2017)

aalin13 said:


> Not sure if it's just the photo, but the dial colour seems to have changed. This looks more like an inky black than before, but could just be the lighting as well.


^Not just the photo, it is indeed an inkier black that's really apparent in person as well. Less grainy than the OG's


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## Den807 (Aug 16, 2010)

just wanna ask you guys, does this generation of mm300 also suffer from the misalignment of the dial, chapter ring, and the bezel?


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## ahonobaka (Jan 27, 2017)

^Curious if that was even an issue with the 001 or 017’s in the past? My 017 is completely fine. Maybe check the tolerances on the green LE to see how the new models fare?


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## zaratsu (Jul 27, 2013)

My SLA019 lines up as close to perfect as my eyes can tell without a loupe.

Sent from my Pixel XL using Tapatalk


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## Rosenbloom (May 9, 2016)

I asked a watch shop in Hong Kong this afternoon. They are selling the new MM300 for HK$16800 (US$2153), even cheaper than a new SBDX017 (HK$18800, US$2410)
The shop owner said he personally loved "MARINEMASTER" more than "X" on the dial.


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## aclaz (Aug 13, 2018)

Japan released their SBDX023

https://www.seiko-watch.co.jp/collections/en/prospex/SBDX023

Sent from my HUAWEI NXT-L29 using Tapatalk


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## riorio (Mar 8, 2017)

Yeh but this one comes with ceramic bezel and sapphire glass like the SLA019 / SBDX021, right? In this case I'd rather have a better quality watch than caring whether there's a stupid logo on the dial...


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## lovie479 (Oct 3, 2012)

Den807 said:


> just wanna ask you guys, does this generation of mm300 also suffer from the misalignment of the dial, chapter ring, and the bezel?


Unfortunately, it does!


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## Jidomaki (Aug 28, 2017)

^Is that a photo you took? Just looks like a half click(?) off from center?
I have never personally seen any SBDX001 or 017s with any alignment issues.


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## lovie479 (Oct 3, 2012)

Jidomaki said:


> ^Is that a photo you took? Just looks like a half click(?) off from center?
> I have never personally seen any SBDX001 or 017s with any alignment issues.


The bezel is fine. Chapter ring is the issue as other entry Seiko models. Still wondering if the watch is really crafted in Shizuku-Ishi watch studio as they claimed.









The watch is not mine though. It's from Thai Seiko Facebook Group.


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## lovie479 (Oct 3, 2012)

Duplicate post.


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## davym2112 (Mar 5, 2017)

Rosenbloom said:


> I asked a watch shop in Hong Kong this afternoon. They are selling the new MM300 for HK$16800 (US$2153), even cheaper than a new SBDX017 (HK$18800, US$2410)
> The shop owner said he personally loved "MARINEMASTER" more than "X" on the dial.


What shop in Hong Kong was that ?

Sent from my SM-G9350 using Tapatalk


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## manofrolex (Jul 9, 2012)

zaratsu said:


> My SLA019 lines up as close to perfect as my eyes can tell without a loupe.
> 
> Sent from my Pixel XL using Tapatalk


Same here


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## JoeOBrien (Aug 2, 2013)

lovie479 said:


> Still wondering if the watch is really crafted in Shizuku-Ishi watch studio as they claimed.


Just because a watch is made in the same place as GS doesn't mean it's receiving the same care as GS. The MM is just a tool dive watch, I sincerely doubt it's being hand-assembled by the same people who put Grand Seikos together. Maybe the movement is, but the assembly might be done elsewhere in the facility.


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## Rosenbloom (May 9, 2016)

davym2112 said:


> What shop in Hong Kong was that ?


Please see #23, #24:

https://www.watchuseek.com/f21/seiko-watch-shopping-hong-kong-guide-2687809-3.html

I bought almost all my seikos from them. The shop owner said a discount could be given to a returning customer like me. I did not buy one today because I am more fond of the new blue MM300. I'll wait. 
You may whatsapp Ms.Chan, the shop owner, for the final price you may get.

Happy watch hunting!


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## Maddog1970 (Sep 28, 2015)

lovie479 said:


> Unfortunately, it does!
> View attachment 13621211


Um, not sure if your joking here or not....it's not aligned 'cos the bezel needs to be turned another click......

Rule of thumb is that if the lumed triangle at 12, dashes at 3 &9 AND the 30 are misaligned, you have:
- drunk to much or
- um, the bezel needs turning


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## Maddog1970 (Sep 28, 2015)

jmanlay said:


> Same here


And yeah, much like my previous SBDX017, my 021 is perfect......

Loving it even more now with the yellow crafter strap.....


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## aclaz (Aug 13, 2018)

Both for keeps 









Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## lovie479 (Oct 3, 2012)

Maddog1970 said:


> Um, not sure if your joking here or not....it's not aligned 'cos the bezel needs to be turned another click......
> 
> Rule of thumb is that if the lumed triangle at 12, dashes at 3 &9 AND the 30 are misaligned, you have:
> - drunk to much or
> - um, the bezel needs turning





lovie479 said:


> The bezel is fine. Chapter ring is the issue as other entry Seiko models. Still wondering if the watch is really crafted in Shizuku-Ishi watch studio as they claimed.
> 
> View attachment 13621275
> 
> ...


Please look carefully at 6 O'clock marker.

If you need a loupe, just me send me your address!!


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## Maddog1970 (Sep 28, 2015)

lovie479 said:


> Please look carefully at 6 O'clock marker.
> 
> If you need a loupe, just me send me your address!!


What I see, in all seriousness, is a low quality picture, made poorer by cropping AND a real nice glint on the bottom right corner of the marker that makes it appear to be off.....not to mention the angle the watch is being held at....

I look at the 12 o'clock marker ......looks spot on to me.....

Look hard enough and you can find imperfections with many things......


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## manofrolex (Jul 9, 2012)

Maddog1970 said:


> What I see, in all seriousness, is a low quality picture, made poorer by cropping AND a real nice glint on the bottom right corner of the marker that makes it appear to be off.....not to mention the angle the watch is being held at....
> 
> I look at the 12 o'clock marker ......looks spot on to me.....
> 
> Look hard enough and you can find imperfections with many things......


What I see is a really hard and intense focus to somehow downgrade the new MM300 with the now "it is misaligned " narrative. 
So let me summarize, the new Mm300:
- is sooo much taller
- is sooo expensive
- is too Prospex less MM300
- is misaligned 
- has a second hand color that hurts my eyes

So frankly why bother. that is pretty much the sentiment of a bunch of folks here that NEVER will be pleased .
If the price was lower then the issue would be text or that ceramic is too shiny or whatever else to bit&& and moan about .


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## Maddog1970 (Sep 28, 2015)

jmanlay said:


> What I see is a really hard and intense focus to somehow downgrade the new MM300 with the now "it is misaligned " narrative.
> So let me summarize, the new Mm300:
> - is sooo much taller
> - is sooo expensive
> ...


Spot on, I love mine......


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## anrex (Jul 30, 2017)

aclaz said:


> Both for keeps
> 
> 
> 
> ...


For myself, all three are for keeps...


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## lovie479 (Oct 3, 2012)

duplicate post


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## lovie479 (Oct 3, 2012)

Maddog1970 said:


> What I see, in all seriousness, is a low quality picture, made poorer by cropping AND a real nice glint on the bottom right corner of the marker that makes it appear to be off.....not to mention the angle the watch is being held at....
> 
> I look at the 12 o'clock marker ......looks spot on to me.....
> 
> Look hard enough and you can find imperfections with many things......


It's fine to me if you can not handle the truth, it hurt a lot for a Seiko fan boy, JUST LIKE ME.

I just want to point out for other Seiko fans that they may have chance to get the watch like that since many of us have to order the watch online, and they might not as lucky as you.

My first reply aim to answer that question.

Perfectly aligned or misaligned may depend on one's eyes, but I wont pay $3000 for a new imperfect wrist watch, or this model if i do not see the actual watch first.

No offence, sometime people may need a hearing aid than a loupe to help them really see what they try to see.

Enjoy your watch in good health.

PS. I had a chance to see this watch in person. I saw what it was and I do not drink.


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## manofrolex (Jul 9, 2012)

lovie479 said:


> It's fine to me if you can not handle the truth, it hurt a lot for a Seiko fan boy, JUST LIKE ME.
> 
> I just want to point out for other Seiko fans that they may have chance to get the watch like that since many of us have to order the watch online, and they might not as lucky as you.
> 
> ...


Problem is as described before your picture is at an angle and not straight on and even straight on camera lenses can be very deceiving .
Case in point below my sla019 is perfectly aligned but if you look at 6 oclock the market looks off and so does the bezel pip at 12, why because the picture is at an angle ..


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## Maddog1970 (Sep 28, 2015)

lovie479 said:


> It's fine to me if you can not handle the truth, it hurt a lot for a Seiko fan boy, JUST LIKE ME.
> 
> I just want to point out for other Seiko fans that they may have chance to get the watch like that since many of us have to order the watch online, and they might not as lucky as you.
> 
> ...


Am I the only one having a Jack Nicholson flash back!

The ONLY way to truly be 100% sure about the condition of ANY watch, is to handle it in person.....clearly you did, and passed on it, for which someone else will be grateful for.

For the record, I have purchased ALL my seikos on line, some "expensive", others not....and to date I am 100% happy with what is in my watch box......

My watch box that will be adding another "expensive" Seiko purchased on line, hopefully tomorrow!


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## Maddog1970 (Sep 28, 2015)

anrex said:


> For myself, all three are for keeps...











Oh wow, that zimbe looks so good on that seatbelt nato!
Nice triplets!


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## Simon (Feb 11, 2006)

jmanlay said:


> Problem is as described before your picture is at an angle and not straight on and even straight on camera lenses can be very deceiving .
> Case in point below my sla019 is perfectly aligned but if you look at 6 oclock the market looks off and so does the bezel pip at 12, why because the picture is at an angle ..


This is an oft overlooked point; sure Seiko QC should tighten up and some misaligned wrong'uns clearly slip through the net even on high end Japanese watches, but often when folk cry foul it is the watch angle to eye which has caused an appearance of being offset. I have often looked at watches and thought I initially saw misalignment only to move the angle of the watch minutely and its perfect - the misalignment is an angle to eye perspective distortion. I also think thick dive watch convex crystals bend image perspective.


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## Simon (Feb 11, 2006)

Maddog1970 said:


> Am I the only one having a Jack Nicholson flash back!
> 
> The ONLY way to truly be 100% sure about the condition of ANY watch, is to handle it in person.....clearly you did, and passed on it, for which someone else will be grateful for.
> 
> ...


Maddog - you aint helping me bro - every time you buy one I feel compelled to buy one - stop it, please.


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## Rs444 (Jul 19, 2018)

All this talk about misalignment issues got me worried. I gave the girls a once-over and they look fine to me;-)


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## therealfolkblues (Oct 26, 2018)

Rs444 said:


> All this talk about misalignment issues got me worried. I gave the girls a once-over and they look fine to me;-)
> 
> View attachment 13626357
> 
> ...


That's a beautiful watch case! Where did you get it?


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## Rs444 (Jul 19, 2018)

Everest


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## Rosenbloom (May 9, 2016)

Four in one shot. Bravo! :-!


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## Maddog1970 (Sep 28, 2015)

Simon said:


> Maddog - you aint helping me bro - every time you buy one I feel compelled to buy one - stop it, please.


Each year I set myself either a watch budget or max number in my watchbox.

This year, I have blown both, mostly due to Seiko (not helped tho by Zenith and Damasko) and the tuna affliction I have....

I have had my Bumblebee for a while and just love the way the Darths are put together, so after splashing for an Emporer, I just couldn't stay away from the Goldie reissue (not to mention the SBDX021).

I have culled a few to help - my SBDX017, a Doxa 1500pro to name but a few - and ordered yesterday what will be my last purchase of 2018 - honest.

It should be here today, and I will throw up some pics when it arrives.......

Not gonna let the cat outta the bag, but it is a tuna......


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## Maddog1970 (Sep 28, 2015)

Duplicate postage


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## Maddog1970 (Sep 28, 2015)

Rs444 said:


> All this talk about misalignment issues got me worried. I gave the girls a once-over and they look fine to me;-)
> 
> View attachment 13626357
> 
> ...


very, very nice.......the girls are looking amazing!


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## aclaz (Aug 13, 2018)

Sharing a post at Instagram...









Sent from my HUAWEI NXT-L29 using Tapatalk


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## anrex (Jul 30, 2017)

Rs444 said:


> All this talk about misalignment issues got me worried. I gave the girls a once-over and they look fine to me;-)
> 
> View attachment 13626357
> 
> ...


No misalignment here either, my three girls say hey


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## Norrie (Sep 23, 2011)

jmanlay said:


> Problem is as described before your picture is at an angle and not straight on and even straight on camera lenses can be very deceiving .
> Case in point below my sla019 is perfectly aligned but if you look at 6 oclock the market looks off and so does the bezel pip at 12, why because the picture is at an angle ..


Don't forget the trickery added by pea sized wide angled phone lenses held 15-20cm away from the watch. A standard SLR lens (or the human eye) taking the shot from 3ft away will tell a very different story.


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## Mike Ibz (Oct 3, 2018)

Hello! I'm late to this party but I have the SLA019 and absolutely love the watch. It's responsible for getting me into watches and SEIKO! (among other brands). It's also responsible for a buying binge that resulting in the acquisition of the SLA017, SBDX013, Rolex Yachtmaster, Submariner (Ceramic and coming in 6 weeks) and 31mm DateJust for the Misses.

The MM300 in all its' forms is a very special thing. From it's 70's inspired styling, fabulous value (even at today's prices) and solid build quality. I truly believe this watch is worth every penny and punches well above its' weight. But hey, I'm sure that is nothing new to (mostly) everyone here and something said many times in these forums.

I LOVE THE MM300! God help my bank balance, but I want the SDBX023!


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## MGFrank610 (Nov 4, 2018)

I am excited that Seiko released the SBDX023, the prices on the 17 keep going up. I’d rather spend a little bit more on a new watch.


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## MGFrank610 (Nov 4, 2018)

I am excited that Seiko released the SBDX023, the prices on the 17 keep going up. I’d rather spend a little bit more on a new watch.


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## riceknight (Jul 14, 2018)

Talking about the new price. The addition of sapphire and ceramic matches the price increase, you can't compare aftermarket sapphire crystal and ceramic inserts. These new parts will be made in house by Seiko and are of a much higher grade, plus the R&D involved in developing and implementing.


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## subdiver (Jan 31, 2010)

Sorry ! Wrong thread


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## Travelller (Apr 24, 2012)

So, new owners, let's see 'em


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## Robotaz (Jan 18, 2012)

riceknight said:


> Talking about the new price. The addition of sapphire and ceramic matches the price increase, you can't compare aftermarket sapphire crystal and ceramic inserts. These new parts will be made in house by Seiko and are of a much higher grade, plus the R&D involved in developing and implementing.


I got mine for $2300 including PayPal's shameless, bend-me-over currency fees buying from Spain. I see old ones going for more now. It's a wash and time for both to come down a little.


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## perfectlykevin (Feb 16, 2006)

I've seen pics of a new blue MarineMaster much like the SBDX023 with blue ceramic bezel insert and blue dial. Has there been any news on this model? I've only seen pic on Google when searching for "SBDX023"

Thanks!


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## TheJubs (Oct 10, 2016)

perfectlykevin said:


> I've seen pics of a new blue MarineMaster much like the SBDX023 with blue ceramic bezel insert and blue dial. Has there been any news on this model? I've only seen pic on Google when searching for "SBDX023"
> 
> Thanks!


There were murmurs that the blue version was originally slated to release last month in conjunction with the new mm300, but apparently it's been pushed to next year. Whether it's a regular production model or a limited edition like the green remains to be seen.


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## Travelller (Apr 24, 2012)

*/OFF-TOPIC *



Travelller said:


> ... There's a NOS SBDX001 going for €2K... should I make a move? I really like the "updates" found in the SBDX017 ...but a "first gen" always makes for a nice addition to the collection, particularly at the price point...





impalass said:


> In my bias opinion go for it, probably the only NOS 1st gen in the world and the price seems reasonable.
> My (bought new) SBDX001 is 5 years old problem free and never been magnetized.


Done! :-! And I'm glad it's the 1st gen... I'm no longer a fan of this Dia-Shield crap*
_(* 'cause it doesn't really work that well and once you get a scratch, it's there for life.. :-( )_


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## Degr8n8 (Nov 28, 2012)

If you're no longer a fan of that "diashield crap", I'll be more than glad to take that diashield coated SLA025 on the right of your photo.


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## Travelller (Apr 24, 2012)

Degr8n8 said:


> If you're no longer a fan of that "diashield crap", I'll be more than glad to take that diashield coated SLA025 on the right of your photo.


Wait for the full story - then maybe you'll appreciate where I'm coming from. Or not.
I have two models with DiaShield, love them both but would be happier if they weren't PVD treated.

_p.s. SLA025s are still readily available - 13 on chrono24. Happy shopping._


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## RogerP (Mar 7, 2007)

Happy Monday.


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## Tomkant (Mar 23, 2018)

I just bought this watch. Should arrive this week. I was considering Sinn Hydro ux too but I like the look of Seiko more. There is something special in classical Seiko diver watches. It is expensive but I have looked this watch so much and I decided this is the one watch for me. I paid 2 350 eur for it and I thought it was ok deal too.


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## Tomkant (Mar 23, 2018)

It is here and it is beautiful


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## K1M_I (Apr 28, 2017)




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## riceknight (Jul 14, 2018)

K1M_I said:


> View attachment 13718911


Awesome photo man!


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## Robotaz (Jan 18, 2012)

[email protected] said:


> I just bought this watch. Should arrive this week. I was considering Sinn Hydro ux too but I like the look of Seiko more. There is something special in classical Seiko diver watches. It is expensive but I have looked this watch so much and I decided this is the one watch for me. I paid 2 350 eur for it and I thought it was ok deal too.


It is actually a decent deal.

I tried to tell people during Black Friday and nobody listened. I bought mine for 1960€.


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## Travelller (Apr 24, 2012)

K1M_I said:


> .....


Beautiful shot! T4S b-)


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## OHL (Jan 8, 2018)

K1M_I said:


> View attachment 13718911


is there actually lume on the 5, 10, 15 and 20 markers? I see some pictures with, some without.


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## shiraz (Jun 15, 2011)

Maybe it is headed for a street price of $2,200 once things settle down.


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## Robotaz (Jan 18, 2012)

shiraz said:


> Maybe it is headed for a street price of $2,200 once things settle down.


You can already find that if you keep your eyes open.


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## peltro500 (Apr 5, 2018)

Robotaz said:


> You can already find that if you keep your eyes open.


Really? Can you pm me the link/contact info? thanks.


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## K1M_I (Apr 28, 2017)

OHL said:


> is there actually lume on the 5, 10, 15 and 20 markers? I see some pictures with, some without.


There is lume, but it's a bit weaker than other markers. This photo shows it better:


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## Robotaz (Jan 18, 2012)

peltro500 said:


> Really? Can you pm me the link/contact info? thanks.


I bought mine on a Black Friday sale at relojesdemoda.com for about $2200.


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## Robotaz (Jan 18, 2012)




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## Maddog1970 (Sep 28, 2015)

Robotaz said:


>


Lots have slammed the colour choices on the 023.....personally I think it rocks!

Nice buy Robotaz!


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## Robotaz (Jan 18, 2012)

Maddog1970 said:


> Lots have slammed the colour choices on the 023.....personally I think it rocks!
> 
> Nice buy Robotaz!


I was one of those complaining about the gold until I saw how black it is in person. It's not the old MM with gold.


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## Robotaz (Jan 18, 2012)

Good lord how long is this double post business going to go on? Years?


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## Maddog1970 (Sep 28, 2015)

Robotaz said:


> Good lord how long is this double post business going to go on? Years?


2 things....

1) good on you for owning your previously closed mind!
2) some kind sole, can't recall who, advised me that to work around the double post, you just click the thread title in the reply bar...it takes you back to the thread and your original post is there.....assuming what I have said makes sense!


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## Robotaz (Jan 18, 2012)

Maddog1970 said:


> 2 things....
> 
> 1) good on you for owning your previously closed mind!
> 2) some kind sole, can't recall who, advised me that to work around the double post, you just click the thread title in the reply bar...it takes you back to the thread and your original post is there.....assuming what I have said makes sense!


Yeah I know about that, but I use Tapatalk and I've not seen it double post WUS before. Hmm.


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## peltro500 (Apr 5, 2018)

Thank you.


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## K1M_I (Apr 28, 2017)




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## Travelller (Apr 24, 2012)

K1M_I said:


> ...


Awesome photo! b-)
I prefer the MM300s on rubber but the stock rubber strap that came with mine (SDX001) is way too stiff to be of any practical used.
Would you recommend this strap?


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## K1M_I (Apr 28, 2017)

Travelller said:


> Awesome photo! b-)
> I prefer the MM300s on rubber but the stock rubber strap that came with mine (SDX001) is way too stiff to be of any practical used.
> Would you recommend this strap?


Thanks!!
Have you used the hot water, cool water treatment to shape the strap. I got mine really good with that. Unfortunately the SLA021 came with a different rubber strap, I really liked the 017 strap. ISOfrane works really well, super comfortable. You might also want to check the Borealis version, I haven't tried it, but heard good things.


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## subdiver (Jan 31, 2010)

I like the Borealis Strap


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## Tomkant (Mar 23, 2018)

With her buddies..


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## Travelller (Apr 24, 2012)

K1M_I said:


> ...Have you used the hot water, cool water treatment to shape the strap. I got mine really good with that. Unfortunately the SLA021 came with a different rubber strap, I really liked the 017 strap. ISOfrane works really well, super comfortable. You might also want to check the Borealis version, I haven't tried it, but heard good things.





subdiver said:


> I like the Borealis Strap...


Thanks for the feedback, gents :-!
I just visited the Borealis site and unfortunately they're sold out of the 20mm, but I'll keep an eye on them.
I haven't tried _reshaping_ the OEM strap - will look into it, thanks ;-)


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## Robotaz (Jan 18, 2012)

K1M_I said:


> Thanks!!
> Have you used the hot water, cool water treatment to shape the strap. I got mine really good with that. Unfortunately the SLA021 came with a different rubber strap, I really liked the 017 strap. ISOfrane works really well, super comfortable. You might also want to check the Borealis version, I haven't tried it, but heard good things.


Someone will certainly trade you if you post in the WTB/WTT forum. I would in a heartbeat if I had one of the old ones to trade.


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## biscuit141 (Jun 17, 2016)

Travelller said:


> Thanks for the feedback, gents :-!
> I just visited the Borealis site and unfortunately they're sold out of the 20mm, but I'll keep an eye on them.
> I haven't tried _reshaping_ the OEM strap - will look into it, thanks ;-)


I was going to tell you to check out the Toxic NATOs magnum strap, similar to Isofrane and Borealis and I heard from an owner of both Borealis and Toxic straps that they are nearly identical. Unfortunately Terry is out of stock of the 20mm black as well, you can email Terry and ask when he expects to have stock. He is a cool dude and sells out of Colorado Springs if you are in the USA it will have faster shipping than Borealis.


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## zaratsu (Jul 27, 2013)

[email protected] said:


> With her buddies..


The SLA021 really looks a class above the other two when you put them side by side. Love it!

Sent from my Pixel XL using Tapatalk


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## Tomkant (Mar 23, 2018)

zaratsu said:


> The SLA021 really looks a class above the other two when you put them side by side. Love it!
> 
> Sent from my Pixel XL using Tapatalk


100% agree. There is no competition here actually. SLA021 smashes them (no offense to Sumo / Samurai)...with SLA021 you get what you pay for.


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## shiraz (Jun 15, 2011)

Robotaz said:


> I bought mine on a Black Friday sale at relojesdemoda.com for about $2200.


Does this price include the EU sales tax from this Seller in Spain or is it added later for European buyers?


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## Robotaz (Jan 18, 2012)

shiraz said:


> Does this price include the EU sales tax from this Seller in Spain or is it added later for European buyers?


Does not include VAT.


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## Shipmate (May 7, 2017)

No way I will spend $3,000 for a Seiko MarineMaster that has the shiddy "X" logo and no longer has MarineMaster on the dial. That gawdam "X" is like putting on a "5" on the dial. Not only is it on the dial, but it's also on the crown. What is wrong with just Seiko and an "S" signed crown?


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## riceknight (Jul 14, 2018)

Shipmate said:


> No way I will spend $3,000 for a Seiko MarineMaster that has the shiddy "X" logo and no longer has MarineMaster on the dial. That gawdam "X" is like putting on a "5" on the dial. Not only is it on the dial, but it's also on the crown. What is wrong with just Seiko and an "S" signed crown?


 I personally don't care about the X, but I do think Marinemaster on the dial looked pretty cool. That said, I sold my sbdx017 because I couldn't get over no ceramic inlay or sapphire. Really happy with my sbdx023 even if it cost a bit more, I prefer it over my SMPc which cost far more.


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## Shipmate (May 7, 2017)

riceknight said:


> I personally don't care about the X, but I do think Marinemaster on the dial looked pretty cool. That said, I sold my sbdx017 because I couldn't get over no ceramic inlay or sapphire. Really happy with my sbdx023 even if it cost a bit more, I prefer it over my SMPc which cost far more.


I got my Omega Seamaster Profession (2017 model w/ceramic bezel) for $2900 new on Jomashop. I don't think a Seiko Prospex with an unregulated movement is worth the same as a COSC certified, co-axial escapement movement. I love my Seikos (2gen Monster, Turtle, SBDC051), but one of the things I appreciate about them is their affordability - it adds to their charm. $3,000 Seiko isn't so cute. I'll wait like I usually do and in a year the price will come down a few hundred bucks; I expect it will come down to about $2,500.

Plus, someone was telling me the seconds hand looks poorly done... like someone spray painted it unevenly. Has anyone else seen the watch in person? Is the seconds hand coated in gold or just some cheap imitation spray?


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## ahonobaka (Jan 27, 2017)

^I'll be honest, the MM300 or PS300 might not be for you if you like Seiko for the value. I can't speak towards the second hand as it's been a while since I've handled either the green or black new dials, but the SBDX001 was a great value against it's same era Submariner equivalent. SBDX017 crazy much less so against it's equivalent year Sub, but it was carried more by it's own legend at that point. And now the new ceramic/sapphire models even more less so since only the ceramic and sapphire were added on (movement still not regulated, bracelet still the same aside from potentially different diashield, price increased). Seiko is trying to move upmarket, so there will be less of a value play moving forward, and at this price point. I honestly believe you have to be a huge Seiko fan to appreciate it's other qualities outside of price, in order to buy one. That said, they are going for and under $2500 USD if you know where to look/who to ask!

Not ragging on the watch of course; Am an SBDX017 owner looking to buy the new black as well (just waiting to see the new blue dial, or what GS releases for Basel 2019).

The real question is, if the Omega was good enough, why are you still looking at the Seiko? 

Devil's advocate of course, I completely understand why!


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## Memento Vivere (Dec 31, 2011)

Shipmate said:


> I got my Omega Seamaster Profession (2017 model w/ceramic bezel) for $2900 new on Jomashop. I don't think a Seiko Prospex with an unregulated movement is worth the same as a COSC certified, co-axial escapement movement. I love my Seikos (2gen Monster, Turtle, SBDC051), but one of the things I appreciate about them is their affordability - it adds to their charm. $3,000 Seiko isn't so cute. I'll wait like I usually do and in a year the price will come down a few hundred bucks; I expect it will come down to about $2,500.
> 
> Plus, someone was telling me the seconds hand looks poorly done... like someone spray painted it unevenly. Has anyone else seen the watch in person? Is the seconds hand coated in gold or just some cheap imitation spray?


Seiko have never been about solely making "affordable" watches. They have a long history of making world class quality watches, and it seems like you're suffering from a perception problem regarding the brand. That they "should" simply be affordable watches, because of (insert Swiss marketing reasons).

You might just be surprised the first time you handle a MM300 in person. Personally, between it and the SMP, I went with the MM300 - twice. With that said, the SMP is of course a fantastic watch, but the MM300 to me is far more interesting. I really think you'll be tremendously surprised by the quality of Seiko's high end offerings, as you sound like someone without much experience in that department.


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## Rosenbloom (May 9, 2016)

Shipmate said:


> ... I expect it will come down to about $2,500. ...


In Hong Kong, a new SBDX023 is selling for HKD16800 (about USD2153). Still not very cheap though.


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## riceknight (Jul 14, 2018)

Shipmate said:


> riceknight said:
> 
> 
> > I personally don't care about the X, but I do think Marinemaster on the dial looked pretty cool. That said, I sold my sbdx017 because I couldn't get over no ceramic inlay or sapphire. Really happy with my sbdx023 even if it cost a bit more, I prefer it over my SMPc which cost far more.
> ...


I paid $2700 for my new mm300, and I paid $3,400 for my SMPc, both were purchased in store and come with official warranty.

The MM300 is +1 sec, the SMPc is +5. But I know that's just luck.

The new mm300 second hand is not painted or sprayed, it looks like it could be polished raw brass, under macro the edges are not perfectly smooth, but the flat surface is not uneven.

My Seamaster is really nice, and yes it's worth the extra money I guess, but some things like the bezel action are not as good as on the MM300.


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## Shipmate (May 7, 2017)

GregoryD said:


> I like the upgrades. But I really wish Seiko would improve the bracelet and clasp, which have always been disappointing.


I completely agree. We're getting the same bracelet and clasp that's been out for nearly 20 years (sbdx001 was late 2000).


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## Shipmate (May 7, 2017)

ahonobaka said:


> The real question is, if the Omega was good enough, why are you still looking at the Seiko?
> 
> Devil's advocate of course, I completely understand why!


Because I'm addicted to buying watches... duh. I thought that's why we were all here for... to get a quick fix until the next watch purchase.


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## wwwppp (Jun 17, 2014)

Rosenbloom said:


> In Hong Kong, a new SBDX023 is selling for HKD16800 (about USD2153). Still not very cheap though.


Can i know which shop is selling at this price? I'll be going HK next month, hoping to score one there.


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## Sassi (Mar 11, 2018)

Got mine yesterday. Could not be happier. b-)


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## K1M_I (Apr 28, 2017)

With my 6306


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## Den807 (Aug 16, 2010)

does anyone know how mich this will cost in japan? going there in a few months 🙂


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## Sassi (Mar 11, 2018)

I just finished testing the power reserve of my new SLA021J1. It ran for 57 hours and 42 minutes. It ran very consistently up to 53h 30min. At this point I went to sleep. Just by chance I woke up 10 minutes before the watch stopped. The last timing is from 57h 30min. At that point the watch had lost time. b-)

Test was conducted dial up.









Very happy with the results.


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## subdiver (Jan 31, 2010)

Is it a Marinemaster 300 or a Prospex 300 ?
Seiko don‘t call or write about the SLA021 Marinemaster?


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## zaratsu (Jul 27, 2013)

subdiver said:


> Is it a Marinemaster 300 or a Prospex 300 ?
> Seiko don't call or write about the SLA021 Marinemaster?


Marine Master.

... at least that's what Seiko wrote on the Tag.









Sent from my Pixel XL using Tapatalk


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## subdiver (Jan 31, 2010)

Thank you


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## Shipmate (May 7, 2017)

Rosenbloom said:


> In Hong Kong, a new SBDX023 is selling for HKD16800 (about USD2153). Still not very cheap though.


$2200 would be a good deal on the new MM300.

I think I will do what someone else wrote, and wait until after Baselworld 2019 in March to see what Seiko releases before I decide to buy.


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## shiraz (Jun 15, 2011)

jmanlay said:


> What I see is a really hard and intense focus to somehow downgrade the new MM300 with the now "it is misaligned " narrative.
> So let me summarize, the new Mm300:
> - is sooo much taller
> - is sooo expensive
> ...


You summed it up. Mostly right you are.


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## shiraz (Jun 15, 2011)

therealfolkblues said:


> That's a beautiful watch case! Where did you get it?


Maybe you should add the rumored Blue version as well to rest assured that no misalignment exists. Enjoy your collection


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## Tom_W (Apr 21, 2014)

Anyone tracking the best price delivered to the US?


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## aafanatic (Feb 25, 2008)

So far the lowest price for new with tags has been $2,500 on ebay. $2,850 from Seiya in Japan.
I was wondering if there is any reason to get the JDM SBDX023 vs the ROW SLA021?


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## TKiteCD (May 7, 2017)

Rosenbloom said:


> Finally confirmed "MARINEMASTER" is gone. :-(


Yeah, they ruined it with the new "X" dial. So much for Seiko and heritage.


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## ahonobaka (Jan 27, 2017)

PROFESSIONAL means more to me and has more heritage in my opinion, older than the MARINEMASTER text. All personal preference though, the new dials are more balanced in my eyes


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## riceknight (Jul 14, 2018)

Marinemaster sounds cool, but not as cool as sapphire and ceramic


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## weirdestwizard (Nov 11, 2013)

That's a good point, what is the difference between a SLA021 and SBDX023? 

Seiya only shows the SBDX vs gnomon shows both


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## riceknight (Jul 14, 2018)

weirdestwizard said:


> That's a good point, what is the difference between a SLA021 and SBDX023?
> 
> Seiya only shows the SBDX vs gnomon shows both


I guess sbdx is for jdm but they seem to be exactly the same


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## Tom_W (Apr 21, 2014)

I’ve also seen SLA021J1 and I thought J indicated JDM.


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## weirdestwizard (Nov 11, 2013)

Awesome thanks guys! The more I see these new models the more I like them, that price is a tough pull though. 

I seem late to the party when it comes to 017s, they go fast!!


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## DeVillean (Jul 7, 2013)

Was the blue mm300 at basel?


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## aclaz (Aug 13, 2018)

saw this on another WUS thread, as posted to be released in October 2019 









Sent from my HUAWEI NXT-L29 using Tapatalk


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## DeVillean (Jul 7, 2013)

looks great, thanks


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## Clint Pockets (Oct 21, 2018)

Release date is finally set for November 9, 2019. What took so long?


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## amngwlvs (Sep 14, 2018)

Tom_W said:


> I've also seen SLA021J1 and I thought J indicated JDM.


This is way old but I happened to see it so...

J indicates Japan as the country of origin. JDM implies the market for which the watch is intended to be sold.

SBDX023 - To be sold in the Japanese Domestic Market.
SLA025J1 - Made in Japan but intended for sale in the international market.


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## aclaz (Aug 13, 2018)

the long wait is over, my order finally arrived









Sent from my HUAWEI NXT-L29 using Tapatalk


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## boatswain (Sep 4, 2014)

aclaz said:


> the long wait is over, my order finally arrived
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Oh wow! Awesome!



Congratulations.

I like this one a lot. I look forward to seeing what you think and enjoying some pics


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## Randy63 (May 28, 2008)

aclaz said:


> the long wait is over, my order finally arrived
> 
> 
> 
> ...


That's a great looking watch. Are these available now? The Seiko site says they're not supposed to be released until November 9th.

Thanks,

Mr. Blue


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## aclaz (Aug 13, 2018)

Mr. Blue said:


> That's a great looking watch. Are these available now? The Seiko site says they're not supposed to be released until November 9th.
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> Mr. Blue


yes, did got mine last night same SRP as the SLA021

Sent from my HUAWEI NXT-L29 using Tapatalk


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## aclaz (Aug 13, 2018)

more photos, this time taken by me









Sent from my HUAWEI NXT-L29 using Tapatalk


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## amngwlvs (Sep 14, 2018)

Damn, what a great looking piece! Congrats!


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## Randy63 (May 28, 2008)

aclaz said:


> yes, did got mine last night same SRP as the SLA021
> 
> Sent from my HUAWEI NXT-L29 using Tapatalk


That's good to know. I'll be in Tokyo next week and would love to pick one up. Seiko will sell a ton of these.

Mr. Blue


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