# Cost of complete service from Zenith NJ service center?



## jj69

I recall asking this same question here a little over a year ago. I don't recall ever getting a definitive response, so I think it's worth revisiting. 

I have a Rainbow Chronograph (not the Flyback diver, but the one that looks like a Daytona). It was purchased 14 months ago as NOS. I immediately noticed that it was losing at least 2 full minutes per day - a sure sign that it's ready for a complete service. 

Upon calling Zenith's service center in NJ about one year ago, I was told that I had to send the watch in before I could be quoted any service price. They would not even tell me the "standard" price for a compete EP movement service, which I would think should be pretty standardized. At the time, I was not willing to blindly mail my new watch off to NJ with no clue about how it would be repaired and the costs involved. For the most part, I'm still not willing to do so. 

So that brings me to my question. Has anyone here had an El Primero serviced by the NJ center in the past year? What did they charge you? How long did it take? The more details you can provide, the better! 

Especially let us know what model you sent in. I would love to know if the price of service varies depending on model. 

Thanks in advance!


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## Aless

Hi

Dont know if this is any help. I shipped a 70s defy to Zenith for renovaton and service it cost me about 1230 usd. (thread https://www.watchuseek.com/showthread.php?t=218216) Good luck;-)

Cheers!


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## bnotejfunk

Hello,

Service cost depends on :

- time spend to perform service
- spare parts to be exchanged
- inflation

Some years ago, I had my vintage EP (TV screen model from 1975) serviced with some ordinary spare parts replaced like hands, crown, pushers and gaskets for about CHF 650, that correspond to USD 550.

But considering that Zenith prices are continuously increasing, today's cost may certainly be much higher, see reply from Aless.

Hope this helps.

Regards,

Pascal


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## D N Ravenna

So far, most manufacturer's will not release a set price. They prefer you to send a watch in and have them quote the repair. That can be useful if several parts are needed. It would be nice if they could say it will be X plus parts.....

Dan


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## Hary

I just collected my Rainbow from servicing. LVMH Singapore charged me USD 400 incl. head+bracelet polishing for regular servicing, took me about 1 month to get the watch back.


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## D N Ravenna

Hary said:


> I just collected my Rainbow from servicing. LVMH Singapore charged me USD 400 incl. head+bracelet polishing for regular servicing, took me about 1 month to get the watch back.


That is quite an attractive price! Thanks for sharing.

:-!

Dan


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## jj69

Thanks to everyone for the feedback so far. If Zenith is charging $400 for an EP service, then that seems about average to me. From what I've found, most independent watchsmiths charge $400 - $475 for an EP service. I'm now wondering whether it makes sense to send the watch to NJ at all. If a reputable professional watchsmith charges the same price, my guess is that I'll have the watch back much sooner. I also won't have to take any risk by sending the watch through the mail. 

Has anyone had good luck having an EP serviced by a local watchsmith?


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## Acme

Hello!

Regarding EP service:

I don't know a watchmaker, that claims to likely repair, or even clean an EP. My friend (watchmaker) didn't think to risk it either. As EPs are mostly expensive and delicate movements, I think it is worth having them repaired professionally. (I my self have very limited, but good experience with Zenith repairs done by professionals)

Regards: Acme


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## D N Ravenna

It is not that the movment is delicate, it is that it requires different lubrication thanks to its hi-beat. I don't think it is likely that many watchmakers will have the proper lubricants on hand.

Outside of that, it is just like any other chronograph movment.

Cheers!

Dan


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## ishimaru

Do you mind sharing the location/address of LVMH Singapore?


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## Hartmut Richter

From the Zenith website:

LVMH WATCH AND JEWELLERY (SINGAPORE) PTE LTD
250 NORTH BRIDGE ROAD
32-04 RAFFLES CITY TOWER
179101 SINGAPORE 
TEL.: + 65 6 338 68 48

Good luck!

Hartmut Richter


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## vbomega

D N Ravenna said:


> It is not that the movment is delicate, it is that it requires different lubrication thanks to its hi-beat. I don't think it is likely that many watchmakers will have the proper lubricants on hand.
> 
> Outside of that, it is just like any other chronograph movment.
> 
> Cheers!
> 
> Dan


I know it's a very old thread, but this caught my attention. Dan, I am holding a Zenith service document in my hands, and the lubricants used in the movement are:
Moebius 9010; Jismaa 124 (for most chrono parts); Moebius D5, Moebius 9415, and KT22.
Jismaa 124 is nowadays often substituted for Molykote, and Moebius D5 for HP1300 (synthetic). For pallet stones Moebius 9415 is used, which is standard for any pallet stones these days, and all professional watchmakers have these. 
Bottom line is - all lubricants specified by Zenith are normally in stock at any professional watchmaker. Even I have all of these lubricants, and I am not a professional watchmaker. 
Also, EP movement is indeed very delicate, and quite complicated compared to an average chronograph. But I don't think 36K beat rate requires anything special here except for very careful escape wheel pivots and pre-lubricating escape wheel teeth with 9415 instead of applying to pallet stones (per Zenith recommendation). For some reason I don't see them recommending epilame treatment that helps to hold oil in place.

Just my 2c.


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## D N Ravenna

vbomega said:


> I know it's a very old thread, but this caught my attention. Dan, I am holding a Zenith service document in my hands, and the lubricants used in the movement are:
> Moebius 9010; Jismaa 124 (for most chrono parts); Moebius D5, Moebius 9415, and KT22.
> Jismaa 124 is nowadays often substituted for Molykote, and Moebius D5 for HP1300 (synthetic). For pallet stones Moebius 9415 is used, which is standard for any pallet stones these days, and all professional watchmakers have these.
> Bottom line is - all lubricants specified by Zenith are normally in stock at any professional watchmaker. Even I have all of these lubricants, and I am not a professional watchmaker.
> Also, EP movement is indeed very delicate, and quite complicated compared to an average chronograph. But I don't think 36K beat rate requires anything special here except for very careful escape wheel pivots and pre-lubricating escape wheel teeth with 9415 instead of applying to pallet stones (per Zenith recommendation). For some reason I don't see them recommending epilame treatment that helps to hold oil in place.
> 
> Just my 2c.


All I can do is pass on what I've heard. More than once on this forum there has been talk of using a dry lubricant...

Thanks for the update!

Dan


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## Hessu

EP service manual can be downloaded from Ranft. I guess it's more like, servicing EP without manual, a watchmaker can miss places that need oiling.


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## Hartmut Richter

The answer to all these questions can probably be found on page 12 of the service manual. There you see an explosion diagramme of the basic movement, showing where oils need to go - and the lever and escapement wheel are both free of lubricant (except for their pivots). If you compare it to other movements, e.g. the ETA 2892, you are supposed to apply a "special oil for lever pallets" in this area.

It is well known in some circles that the El Primero has a "dry lubricant" for the escapement. This is based on Molybdenum bisulphide. I used to think that it is applied just like oil and adheres to the surface much better than ordinary oils. I have now come to the conclusion that it is used as a permanent coating and therefore makes oiling unnecessary.

Hartmut Richter


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## vbomega

Hartmut Richter said:


> The answer to all these questions can probably be found on page 12 of the service manual. There you see an explosion diagramme of the basic movement, showing where oils need to go - and the lever and escapement wheel are both free of lubricant (except for their pivots). If you compare it to other movements, e.g. the ETA 2892, you are supposed to apply a "special oil for lever pallets" in this area.
> 
> It is well known in some circles that the El Primero has a "dry lubricant" for the escapement. This is based on Molybdenum bisulphide. I used to think that it is applied just like oil and adheres to the surface much better than ordinary oils. I have now come to the conclusion that it is used as a permanent coating and therefore makes oiling unnecessary.
> 
> Hartmut Richter


Hartmut, this is exactly what I was referring to. Looking at page 12, the escape wheel teeth appear to be pre-oiled with Moebius 9415 (special oil for pallet stones) - see upper left corner of Page 12 for oil-to-symbol translation. As I stated in my earlier posting, only escape wheel teeth are oiled (or pre-oiled), and not pallet stones.
I am not sure how to read "pre-oiled" here - is it oiled at the factory with something and then 9415 by watchmaker, or pre-oiled by watchmaker with 9415 before placing into the movement.
It would be great if a Zenith trained watchmaker could clarify this part.


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## Hartmut Richter

Good point. I also read "pre-oiled" as an indication that the watchmaker doesn't have to apply anything during servicing but I could well be wrong. Time for the experts (31jewels & co.) to step in here.....

Hartmut Richter


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## vbomega

But then what happens when the watch is in for a service? There is no indication that it shouldn't be cleaned... which would remove factory lubrication.


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