# ALS Odysseus



## Buddhabelly

I love ALS watches. What’s not to love? Well, I found a few things that, to me, are presenting some difficulties to possess them.

Most of them are Hand Wind. As part of a rotation, I don’t pull a watch out just to wind it and put back. Especially now with my severely arthritis fingers, hand winding is not a joy at all. I sold my Lange 1 and 1815 because of this… Also, Many of the sub dials are hard to read. Especially the perpetual calendar sub dials…. Which leads to one of the most recent offerings, the Steel Odysseus. But then it’s in the vaporland of hard to get watches, or more precisely, impossible to get at retail.


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## diracpoint

I believe WG Odysseus is more easily available from the boutiques, although, since supply is low wait time is longer. Also, there are various saxonia automatic models, with simple dials ...

To be honest, I really don't see the appeal of the Odysseus ... 🤷‍♂️ or, most of the hyped ss blue dial watches on integrated bracelets ... JMHO


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## weisscomposer

---


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## mlcor

It does seem like kind of a negative post. However, in a more positive vein, I would recommend looking at the ALS Saxonia annual calendar. Automatic, easy to read the subdials (not to mention the big date), and you only have to exert yourself once a year in February by pressing on a pusher.


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## Buddhabelly

I merely pointed out My Personal shortcomings that impacted my ability to enjoy Lange watches, which I love. Also I contacted the ALS Boutique which is half way across the country and they told me no Odysseus. It’s not a negative post. Don’t do it.


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## GrouchoM

@Buddhabelly - Are you familiar with these Horofix Watch Crown Winder Tool Available in 10 sizes

Sent from my SM-G991U using Tapatalk


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## Buddhabelly

GrouchoM said:


> @Buddhabelly - Are you familiar with these Horofix Watch Crown Winder Tool Available in 10 sizes
> 
> Sent from my SM-G991U using Tapatalk


No. I was not aware. Thank you sir. My hands thank you. 😁


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## AnonPi

GrouchoM said:


> @Buddhabelly - Are you familiar with these Horofix Watch Crown Winder Tool Available in 10 sizes
> 
> Sent from my SM-G991U using Tapatalk


What a cool tool.


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## diracpoint

GrouchoM said:


> @Buddhabelly - Are you familiar with these Horofix Watch Crown Winder Tool Available in 10 sizes
> 
> Sent from my SM-G991U using Tapatalk


Very interesting! I was not aware of this as well. Thank you!

I wonder if the metal grips of the winder will damage the grooves on the winding crown after repeated use ...


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## moting

diracpoint said:


> Very interesting! I was not aware of this as well. Thank you!
> 
> I wonder if the metal grips of the winder will damage the grooves on the winding crown after repeated use ...


I would be also interested to know if anyone has experience using this tool for ALS watches and the size used.

My 1815 Up/Down requires many turns in order to fully wind it.


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## GrouchoM

I believe there are electric manual watch winders, too.

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## GrouchoM

GrouchoM said:


> I believe there are electric manual watch winders, too.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G991U using Tapatalk


Here you go





Orbita Winders & Cases Sempre







www.prestigetime.com





Sent from my SM-G991U using Tapatalk


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## kritameth

Any Odysseus thread deserves pictures!


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## rsittner

weisscomposer said:


> A list of things you don't like. What a fantastic contribution to the forum!


First paragraph forum rule #2... 2. Members will be kind and courteous, and respectful to other members and the Moderators. No direct or indirect personal attacks or insults of any kind will be allowed. Posts which antagonize, belittle or humiliate other members and/or the Moderators will not be tolerated, nor will racism, sexism, bigotry or foul language. 

Please read the forum rules above any main forum before posting again.


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## ancreanchor

Beautiful watch- I thought those overhangs were crown guards but I guess not


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## Buddhabelly

ancreanchor said:


> Beautiful watch- I thought those overhangs were crown guards but I guess not


I think they are date and day-of-the-week changers. Nice implementation.


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## GrouchoM

kritameth said:


> Any Odysseus thread deserves pictures!
> View attachment 16373025
> View attachment 16373027


Planning a second watch for 2022, @kritameth?

Sent from my SM-G991U using Tapatalk


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## rnosky

I appreciate this perspective on Lange, especially the Odysseus.


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## tyyreaun

diracpoint said:


> Very interesting! I was not aware of this as well. Thank you!
> 
> I wonder if the metal grips of the winder will damage the grooves on the winding crown after repeated use ...


I have that tool. It's great, but it will absolutely cause scratches - including on the case itself if you let the claw wander too far up the crown. It's not too bad on a steel crown on a tool watch, but I would not recommend it on softer metals like gold.

I have considered coating the claw in something like liquid latex to prevent scratches, but never got around to trying. I also don't think that'll help with the claw tips leaving marks on the crown itself.


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## GrouchoM

tyyreaun said:


> I have that tool. It's great, but it will absolutely cause scratches - including on the case itself if you let the claw wander too far up the crown. It's not too bad on a steel crown on a tool watch, but I would not recommend it on softer metals like gold.
> 
> I have considered coating the claw in something like liquid latex to prevent scratches, but never got around to trying. I also don't think that'll help with the claw tips leaving marks on the crown itself.


Since its clamps on the crown, can you put something soft between it in the crown like a thin piece of soft plastic or cotton?


diracpoint said:


> Very interesting! I was not aware of this as well. Thank you!
> 
> I wonder if the metal grips of the winder will damage the grooves on the winding crown after repeated use ...



Sent from my SM-G991U using Tapatalk


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## tyyreaun

GrouchoM said:


> Since its clamps on the crown, can you put something soft between it in the crown like a thin piece of soft plastic or cotton?


It'd probably work, but I think it'd be fiddly keeping everything in position. I'm not sure I'd suggest cotton since the claws would probably poke through that easily. They are fairly sharp - I stuck my pinkie in them to check, and while it wasn't enough to break the skin, it did leave a surface mark.

Something like plastic or latex should work. Not sure how much of a hassle it'd be to keep that all stable while turning the crown, though. For anything other than a flat-sided crown, keeping the claws from slipping is also a bit of a challenge. It was actually something of a mess on an Omega Aqua Terra, where the crown tapers inwards towards the case - the claws kept sliding towards the case while turning the tool, and threatened to scratch it.


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## GrouchoM

Here's an interesting hand held but electric one by Omega








Watch crown winding tool | OMEGA®







www.omegawatches.com





Sent from my SM-G991U using Tapatalk


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## sea_urchin

weisscomposer said:


> A list of things you don't like. What a fantastic contribution to the forum!


Get out the wrong side of bed this morning?


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## CFR

Sorry to hear about the arthritis challenge to hand-wind watches. And I know what you mean about not being able to see the small printing on watches like the Langematik Perpetual! I could set and read the Perpetual dial just fine 15 years ago, but not anymore.

The steel Odysseus Datomatic is not intended for sale to the "general public" due to supply and demand. The same is true for many limited edition Langes. This wasn't the case with Lange's limited edition watches 10-20 years ago, but it's the case today. Lange wants to use the higher-demand models to satisfy/"reward" existing customers first, and they also don't want people buying the more sought-after watches just to flip them a few months later. They want to disincentivize that behavior. It's unfortunate that Lange's marketing for the steel Odysseus led people to believe that anyone can just walk in and buy it. This has turned a lot of people off to the brand.

So are there any past or present Langes with an automatic movement that you like and that are regularly available? Personally, I love the old Sax-0-Mat movements, and these movements are available preowned with many different cases and dials (such as the old Langematiks with or without Big Date).


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## Buddhabelly

CFR said:


> Sorry to hear about the arthritis challenge to hand-wind watches. And I know what you mean about not being able to see the small printing on watches like the Langematik Perpetual! I could set and read the Perpetual dial just fine 15 years ago, but not anymore.
> 
> The steel Odysseus Datomatic is not intended for sale to the "general public" due to supply and demand. The same is true for many limited edition Langes. This wasn't the case with Lange's limited edition watches 10-20 years ago, but it's the case today. Lange wants to use the higher-demand models to satisfy/"reward" existing customers first, and they also don't want people buying the more sought-after watches just to flip them a few months later. They want to disincentivize that behavior. It's unfortunate that Lange's marketing for the steel Odysseus led people to believe that anyone can just walk in and buy it. This has turned a lot of people off to the brand.
> 
> So are there any past or present Langes with an automatic movement that you like and that are regularly available? Personally, I love the old Sax-0-Mat movements, and these movements are available preowned with many different cases and dials (such as the old Langematiks with or without Big Date).


Thank you for your empathy, insight and suggestions. Unfortunately mine is rheumatoid arthritis, which is an autoimmune disease, brought on by the effects of a horrendous chemotherapy treatment period. I had to sign a check yesterday and couldn’t recognize my own hand writing (it will be fun for the bank to compare the signature. Lol… ). But I am not complaining, just dealing with each day.

I will keep an eye for the old Langematiks as your suggestion, while hoping they will introduce more automatic movements once they see how successful the Odysseus has been. I have time. (Hopefully 🤞🤞).


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## watchpanda

Completely understand. My Lange 1 on the champagne dial is pretty hard to see - so much so that I'm actually using my phone more to tell the time. Maybe I need glasses  But you can't beat the beauty of ALS products.


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## GrouchoM

tyyreaun said:


> It'd probably work, but I think it'd be fiddly keeping everything in position. I'm not sure I'd suggest cotton since the claws would probably poke through that easily. They are fairly sharp - I stuck my pinkie in them to check, and while it wasn't enough to break the skin, it did leave a surface mark.
> 
> Something like plastic or latex should work. Not sure how much of a hassle it'd be to keep that all stable while turning the crown, though. For anything other than a flat-sided crown, keeping the claws from slipping is also a bit of a challenge. It was actually something of a mess on an Omega Aqua Terra, where the crown tapers inwards towards the case - the claws kept sliding towards the case while turning the tool, and threatened to scratch it.


The Bergeon 31409 isn't metal at the tip


> Swiss made watchmaker's tool includes aluminum body and part #4137 elastomer tip. Replaceable tip is 10.5mm wide, 88º shore.











Crown Winding Tool Bergeon 31409


You'll find Bergeon watch repair tools and other quality products for professional jewelers and watchmakers at Cas-Ker Co. We're your one-stop-shop for everything from top-of-the-line precision tools to rare vintage watch parts that can't be found anywhere else.



www.jewelerssupplies.com





Sent from my SM-G991U using Tapatalk


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## CFR

Buddhabelly said:


> Thank you for your empathy, insight and suggestions. Unfortunately mine is rheumatoid arthritis, which is an autoimmune disease, brought on by the effects of a horrendous chemotherapy treatment period. I had to sign a check yesterday and couldn’t recognize my own hand writing (it will be fun for the bank to compare the signature. Lol… ). But I am not complaining, just dealing with each day.
> 
> I will keep an eye for the old Langematiks as your suggestion, while hoping they will introduce more automatic movements once they see how successful the Odysseus has been. I have time. (Hopefully 🤞🤞).


The Saxonia Outside Date in white gold (381.026) is a current Lange model that might interest you. It has an automatic movement, it's legible, and the retail price is lower than the steel Odysseus Datomatic. Here's the link. You can use the Historic Data and Annual Prices tabs on this spreadsheet to do more research.


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## LuckyTime35

I know it's not everyone's cup of tea but I actually legit love this A Lange model


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## bkny

@Buddhabelly Have you considered the white gold version of the Odysseus? I was in the boutique looking at other models earlier this year, and they happened to have one on hand. I previously had no interest in the model, but I tried it on and was really blown away—the gray dial is spectacular, with the corrugated finishing around the edges. And I think the white gold version is more available than the steel (or at least it was earlier this year—not sure if that’s changed), though there was a significant wait time.


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## Buddhabelly

bkny said:


> @Buddhabelly Have you considered the white gold version of the Odysseus? I was in the boutique looking at other models earlier this year, and they happened to have one on hand. I previously had no interest in the model, but I tried it on and was really blown away—the gray dial is spectacular, with the corrugated finishing around the edges. And I think the white gold version is more available than the steel (or at least it was earlier this year—not sure if that’s changed), though there was a significant wait time.
> 
> View attachment 16375668


Thanks for your input. I actually like that white gold a lot. I am not into the blue dial steel craze like many lately. In fact in my original and all follow on posts I don’t think I mentioned blue/steel exclusively… just automatic. The problem was there are 2 AD’s in my area, neither has an Odysseus. When I contacted the Chicago boutique, they told me No too.

Thanks to all. I was just relating. There are so many fine watches, and I like Complications, a lot. So the real issue is funds and wrist time. 🙂 As I said, I’d sold my Lange 1 and 1815 because I didn’t want to keep winding, and just wanted to get auto wind pieces from the great German watch house.


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## Pongster

Buddhabelly said:


> Thanks for your input. I actually like that white gold a lot. I am not into the blue dial steel craze like many lately. In fact in my original and all follow on posts I don’t think I mentioned blue/steel exclusively… just automatic. The problem was there are 2 AD’s in my area, neither has an Odysseus. When I contacted the Chicago boutique, they told me No too.
> 
> Thanks to all. I was just relating. There are so many fine watches, and I like Complications, a lot. So the real issue is funds and wrist time. 🙂 As I said, I’d sold my Lange 1 and 1815 because I didn’t want to keep winding, and just wanted to get auto wind pieces from the great German watch house.


If my understanding is correct, Odysseus are boutique-only offerings and it cant be your first purchase. I may be wrong though. Good luck with your hunt.

when i was looking for my second Lange, i wanted an automatic as well. But seems, they rarely make automatics.


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## mario1971

moting said:


> I would be also interested to know if anyone has experience using this tool for ALS watches and the size used.
> 
> My 1815 Up/Down requires many turns in order to fully wind it.


How many? My 815 Up / Down takes about 55 turns of crown to complete. It takes about 1 minute - no effort ...


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## Buddhabelly

I am starting to put my eyes on the ALS Saxonia Annual Calendar in white gold. 300.026

Does anyone know a source with some discount on it? Or have come across a mint pre-owned?


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## mlcor

Buddhabelly said:


> I am starting to put my eyes on the ALS Saxonia Annual Calendar in white gold. 300.026
> 
> Does anyone know a source with some discount on it? Or have come across a mint pre-owned?


You could try Burdeen's in IL. I've bought many pieces there, including my AC (also in white gold).


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## mbalmz

Buddhabelly said:


> I am starting to put my eyes on the ALS Saxonia Annual Calendar in white gold. 300.026
> 
> Does anyone know a source with some discount on it? Or have come across a mint pre-owned?


I suspect you ought to be able to get about ~15% off msrp from an AD or a trusted reseller who can source one. 

I got my ALS through Thanh at takuyawatches.com (brand new sourced thru an AD) and couldn’t have been happier. 

the downside is it won’t win you any “brand relationship” points to put toward something tougher to get, like an odysseus—for that you’d need to go thru a boutique and pay full freight.


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## Buddhabelly

mbalmz said:


> I suspect you ought to be able to get about ~15% off msrp from an AD or a trusted reseller who can source one.
> 
> I got my ALS through Thanh at takuyawatches.com (brand new sourced thru an AD) and couldn’t have been happier.
> 
> the downside is it won’t win you any “brand relationship” points to put toward something tougher to get, like an odysseus—for that you’d need to go thru a boutique and pay full freight.


Thank you sir, good morning.

I sent Thanh an email asking if he knows of one available. So far no reply yet. Had dealt with him before. Stand up guy.
I will go to my local AD and see one Tuesday. Hopefully they will do 15%. They have 1 in stock. Ought to be willing to deal, right?


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## mbalmz

Buddhabelly said:


> Thank you sir, good morning.
> 
> I sent Thanh an email asking if he knows of one available. So far no reply yet. Had dealt with him before. Stand up guy.
> I will go to my local AD and see one Tuesday. Hopefully they will do 15%. They have 1 in stock. Ought to be willing to deal, right?


I’d bet so—at least 10% or something. 

Post some pics if you get it! I’ve got the 1815 annual calendar but really dug the saxonia version as well.


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## mebiuspower

It is more impressive in person than in photos. Lots of interesting details on the dial & case and it stands out from other sport watches from other brands.


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## Buddhabelly

I finally saw the 330.026 in person at the local AD. I like it and will get it, but no discounts. Nothing! They even gave me a line about multiple people lining up for it in the next couple days. 🙄 it only has been on their website like 2-3 weeks. 🙄

So I will look and wait for a pre-owned.


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## Watchretriever

Buddhabelly said:


> I finally saw the 330.026 in person at the local AD. I like it and will get it, but no discounts. Nothing! They even gave me a line about multiple people lining up for it in the next couple days. 🙄 it only has been on their website like 2-3 weeks. 🙄
> 
> So I will look and wait for a pre-owned.


Great choice, I am also considering that model. Very surprised to see no discount available, especially when you see a brand new one with box and papers on Chrono24 available for almost 10k below retail.


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## mlcor

Buddhabelly said:


> I finally saw the 330.026 in person at the local AD. I like it and will get it, but no discounts. Nothing! They even gave me a line about multiple people lining up for it in the next couple days. 🙄 it only has been on their website like 2-3 weeks. 🙄
> 
> So I will look and wait for a pre-owned.


Obviously I'm biased, since I own one, but I think you'll be very pleased when you land one. I'm not that surprised about the no discount thing, it's just the crazy world of upscale watches right now. This isn't the type of watch I'd buy gray market, since it's pretty complicated. I'd buy a used one but only if it were from someone who was also an AD, because then I know any problem would be taken care of. I bought mine new, and it had a problem that needed to go back to Lange to get fixed. Turnaround wasn't too bad, just a month. I don't think they're particularly prone to issues, it's a movement that's been around a long time, but if there is a problem, I'd much rather have the warranty, or at least the knowledge that the dealer I bought from has a good relationship with Lange.


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## Buddhabelly

For whoever that may be interested, I was perusing the watch dealer sites this morning, and it seems like Watchbox has an Odysseus 2021 model Pre-owned coming. blue/steel at $85 IIRC…

Just a community public broadcast if anyone is looking….


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## hotlesbianassassin

This is what my local boutique sales associate told me about the white gold Odysseus (I placed an order on November 23, 2021) when I asked about rumors that the white gold Odysseus is no longer being sold at boutiques: 
"...due to demand we closed the white gold Odysseus order window last Nov 25th. You order was the last we took in fact. The reorder window will likely occur early 23 but thats just an estimate. So you are very fortunate to have placed when you did as so many of my other clients missed out."


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## Buddhabelly

Some guy on the Rolex forums claimed he was offered one (a WG) at a boutique. Walked in and bought it.


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## B.Kohr

Buddhabelly said:


> Some guy on the Rolex forums claimed he was offered one (a WG) at a boutique. Walked in and bought it.


That seems very odd, given the gray price/that I was told flat out that I'd have to buy another model, then give a deposit and wait a year.


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## hotlesbianassassin

Buddhabelly said:


> Some guy on the Rolex forums claimed he was offered one (a WG) at a boutique. Walked in and bought it.


I guess it depends on when he bought it. When I went, I was told there's an 8 to 12 month wait (hence, I'm expecting mine to arrive sometime in the middle of the year), so it's highly unlikely that someone went into a boutique recently and was able to purchase one that they had in stock (they do have one display model floating around from boutique to boutique, which I was able to play around with and which convinced me to get my own). But a year or so ago? I guess that's possible.


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## Buddhabelly

hotlesbianassassin said:


> I guess it depends on when he bought it. When I went, I was told there's an 8 to 12 month wait (hence, I'm expecting mine to arrive sometime in the middle of the year), so it's highly unlikely that someone went into a boutique recently and was able to purchase one that they had in stock (they do have one display model floating around from boutique to boutique, which I was able to play around with and which convinced me to get my own). But a year or so ago? I guess that's possible.


His original post was 2 DAYS ago, followed by his “I bought it” post yesterday.
I just don’t believe it. 🤷🏻‍♂️


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## Buddhabelly

Lange Odysseus White Gold - Rolex Forums - Rolex Watch Forum


Lange Odysseus White Gold Watches (Non-Rolex) Forum



www.rolexforums.com


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## hotlesbianassassin

Buddhabelly said:


> Lange Odysseus White Gold - Rolex Forums - Rolex Watch Forum
> 
> 
> Lange Odysseus White Gold Watches (Non-Rolex) Forum
> 
> 
> 
> www.rolexforums.com


Interesting. I can think of specific circumstances in which what he claims could have happened, such as someone else having ordered it but deciding not to buy it after all (the deposit is not refundable but it is transferable, so perhaps the person who ordered the Odysseus decided to go with another watch). But yeah, not sure. What I do know is that the boutiques are currently (and supposedly since November 25) not taking orders for the white gold Odysseus and won't for a long time. At least what's what my boutique guy told me on January 31 after I asked him about a rumor that the white gold Odysseus is being discontinued (which my boutique guy said is not true) and that the boutiques stopped taking orders.


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## CFR

Buddhabelly said:


> Lange Odysseus White Gold - Rolex Forums - Rolex Watch Forum
> 
> 
> Lange Odysseus White Gold Watches (Non-Rolex) Forum
> 
> 
> 
> www.rolexforums.com


The OP of that thread also said this, to clarify: _I think there is a misunderstanding. I did register interest in this watch with the Boutique last year. I didn’t just walk in off the street and buy it _


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## Gavstar

That was me! 😀 My experience with the Lange Boutique was excellent. I hadn’t purchased anything from them before (indeed I hadn’t purchased a Lange before). I’m delighted with this watch. It wears very comfortably and has a nice sporty look which I love. It also has a heft to it which makes a nice alternative to my 5711.


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## NewWatchGuy1559

Gavstar said:


> That was me! 😀 My experience with the Lange Boutique was excellent. I hadn’t purchased anything from them before (indeed I hadn’t purchased a Lange before). I’m delighted with this watch. It wears very comfortably and has a nice sporty look which I love. It also has a heft to it which makes a nice alternative to my 5711.
> View attachment 16433784


It is beautiful. Wear it in good health!


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## Watchretriever

Gavstar said:


> That was me! 😀 My experience with the Lange Boutique was excellent. I hadn’t purchased anything from them before (indeed I hadn’t purchased a Lange before). I’m delighted with this watch. It wears very comfortably and has a nice sporty look which I love. It also has a heft to it which makes a nice alternative to my 5711.
> View attachment 16433784


looks awesome. How does it wear size wise compared to the 5711? The end links make me worried it’ll wear large.


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## Gavstar

The end lugs curve down nicely so it doesn’t wear that large. I’d say it wears 1 or 2mm larger than the 5711. I have 6.75 inch wrists and am very happy with the fit (the photo makes it look bigger than it does in practice). However I think smaller than this and it may start to be too big.


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