# Orkina from eBay, what a joke!



## banyanleaf

I fell for the look of an Orkina open heart on eBay. Too late for me to read the posts here about mushroom brands to curb my impulsive move. Too late and I am so regretful now.

It is just such an experience to share with you. 

When the watch arrived from Hong Kong, my jaw fell to the ground. Not only the quality of the watch very poor, it is missing a hand!!! Attached is a picture. The hand is NOT in the watch to be seen. In addition, the watch runs 3 minutes fast every HOUR!

I contacted the seller, here is the reply:

* "I am afraid we did not notice the detail. We thought it was shaked too much and the hand is shaking out. We will require our warehouse be careful in checking and will reflect the problem to our supplier. Thank you.*
*But I am afraid according to our company's policy, buyer should afford the returning shipping cost. You could see it in our listing. Hope you could kindly understand."*

What a joke! A hand can be "shaked" out of the watch and disappear! Be careful of glass/metal penetrating hand in an Orkina watch! It might get into your body without notice!

My hearty advice: don't ever try this watch and seller (shopping.power), because you will end up paying shipping for the lousy product and get nothing in return!


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## cdvma

It might have fell into the movement.


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## banyanleaf

The only possibility, if it did fall into the movement, was through the flying wheel. And it would very likely jam the movement. The watch still runs, though.


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## nderwater

That's an attractive movement (not to mention watch; must be the 'Swiss Design')... when it works. Early Magico's featuring that movement were notorious for their movement failures. It's discouraging to hear your experience - and the total lack of quality control on the side of the seller. I'm hoping you didn't spend very much on the watch?


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## Guest

"Swiss design" ! Nice joke.:rodekaart


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## workaholic_ro

Swiss design (??), made in Orkina Faso (!!) :-|:-(


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## banyanleaf

It does look very attractive in photo. But with a close look of the real thing, the quality is the worst mechanic watch I have ever seen.

My following advice: always use American Express to order online. It has saved me a few times. I will let the seller talk to AmEx about their product quality and shipping policy.

BTW, I will open the watch and see if the missing hand is inside.



nderwater said:


> That's an attractive movement (not to mention watch; must be the 'Swiss Design')... when it works. Early Magico's featuring that movement were notorious for their movement failures. It's discouraging to hear your experience - and the total lack of quality control on the side of the seller. I'm hoping you didn't spend very much on the watch?


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## sapcmc

We all know there are no miracles. When you see a mechanic watch selling for 5 USD or less on ebay what can you expect :rodekaart?
Probably that guy selling them even has good rating over there.
Caveat Emptor !!!!


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## banyanleaf

No miracle was expected, but at least all hands should be present.

Wait...what did you say, 5 USD? I was ripped off...darn...I paid 40% more than your price. Still, you are pretty good with the price. Of course, the bloated shipping charge is times more than the watch's price.


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## watch88

sapcmc said:


> We all know there are no miracles. When you see a mechanic watch selling for 5 USD or less on ebay what can you expect :rodekaart?
> Probably that guy selling them even has good rating over there.
> Caveat Emptor !!!!


I agree. Sorry to say this ... you get what you pay for. o|

I think the seller rating is fake. All feedbacks are fake!! Too good to be true!


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## watch88

banyanleaf said:


> .....the bloated shipping charge is times more than the watch's price.


It's impossible for me to believe if there is any quality to it. I make watches. The movt itself costs more than the bid price. So it's a scam. All feedbacks are a scam. Made up by same person but in different names.


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## watch88

My advice: use common sense to judge whether it's a good buy. I think we all know that, but still we make mistakes sometimes. Too bad.


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## frankheiss

workaholic_ro said:


> Swiss design (??), made in Orkina Faso (!!) :-|:-(


looks like Borat's watch.
haha Orkina Fasso. hahaha
a good one
~Frank


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## banyanleaf

Watch88, my apology if my venting hurts your feeling in such an unintended way. I know I am not spending this amount of money to get a Rolex. But I am not willing to pay even a penny on something that is not functioning or vastly different than the advertisement claims. To me, that is a piece of JUNK. And as a customer, I am not willing to pay for shipping for something that has quality problem but not damaged by shipper. That is what I am trying to say here.

It doesn't matter who makes the watch. If a hand can fall off in normal conditions, I would say it is a serious manufacturing problem. There should be no condolence to wasting materials on products that are terribly made to stand normal use. To me, to pay more for something that is not worthy is to encourage such waste. After all, it is what the seller asks for. If you want to blame, blame the seller. o|


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## jakisbck

I have that same Movt in my Magico and havent had a bad thing to happen to it yet.


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## nderwater

Your Magico was probably made in '03 or '04 - so if it's still ticking, you got one of the good ones. Which is terrific, because they're great looking watches for the money. It was my Magico automatic which first got me into collecting watches.


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## srmdalt

nderwater said:


> Your Magico was probably made in '03 or '04 - so if it's still ticking, you got one of the good ones. Which is terrific, because they're great looking watches for the money. It was my Magico automatic which first got me into collecting watches.


Same here, although I have sold or traded them since. I like that one in the pic.


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## banyanleaf

Who manufactures the movement?


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## watch88

banyanleaf said:


> Watch88, my apology if my venting hurts your feeling in such an unintended way. I know I am not spending this amount of money to get a Rolex. But I am not willing to pay even a penny on something that is not functioning or vastly different than the advertisement claims. To me, that is a piece of JUNK. And as a customer, I am not willing to pay for shipping for something that has quality problem but not damaged by shipper. That is what I am trying to say here.
> 
> .... After all, it is what the seller asks for. If you want to blame, blame the seller. o|


Hi banyanleaf, no one got hurt. No need to apologize. But just do not be over-excited when we see an item which seems to be a big bargain. All things are not created equal. :think: I am saying this as a consumer myself of society although I am a manufacturer of watches based in Hong Kong with factory in China. Take care!


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## gigfy

watch88 said:


> Hi banyanleaf, no one got hurt. No need to apologize. But just do not be over-excited when we see an item which seems to be a big bargain. All things are not created equal. :think: I am saying this as a consumer myself of society although I am a manufacturer of watches based in Hong Kong with factory in China. Take care!


Watches88, please post a few of your watches for us to see (purely for informational purposes ;-)). Or maybe put up a few on the FS forum. :-!

I'd love to see what you've got.

Cheers,
gigfy


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## watch88

banyanleaf said:


> Who manufactures the movement?


There are probably hundreds (if not thousands) of movt makers in China. Those who make quality movts are Shanghai, Seagull, and Tienjin. By quality, I mean that you will get the kind of quality you expect with the money you pay. :-! That means, their movement itself can cost USD20, 30, 40, 50, 80, 100, 1000, 3000 per piece !!!!!!!!!!! depending on grades and complexity/functions you want.

Now I would like to tell some manufacturing tricks here. :rodekaart Those watches (people mentioned everywhere on the Net) which are sold so cheaply are most likely assembled with movements and/or materials (e.g. the casing, dials, design,... etc) which would probably not last long. Imagine, if the cost of a movt is already say $30, how can the seller (manufacturer) manage to sell the watch at $30 or less, or even just a little higher say $40 or $50 or $60? (unless the movts are bought in large quantity). Now, we have not factored in costs of materials/parts (e.g. cases, dials, buckles, caseback, transparent or not... etc). How about labor costs? Well, yeah labor in China is cheap compared to developed countries, but still a cost that needs to be factored in. So, if a manufacturer wants to satisfy consumer demands of cheap watches, he has to cut *costs or efforts* somewhere. For example, level of quality check, buy and use cheap parts (e.g. cheap hands, non-stainless steel caseback, poor watch resistant, wrapped instead of solid stainless steel band, ... etc. etc. etc. ) All these things add up to form a complete cheap watch !!! and people are crazy about it. :-! and later only find it to be as cheap as the price for that kind of complexity watch. :-x

So, there are indeed a lot of players in the field but there are only a few (if not couple of) leaders. Not every movement is created equal. Not every watch maker exists with equal quality! Buy with common sense. Choose your supplier/seller wisely. o|


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## watch88

gigfy said:


> Watches88, please post a few of your watches for us to see (purely for informational purposes ;-)). Or maybe put up a few on the FS forum. :-!
> 
> I'd love to see what you've got.
> 
> Cheers,
> gigfy


Well, I actually custom-make watches according to customer's designs / specifications. In other words, we only make watches who are market-driven / demanded as customers know their own market. We help create their brandname watches. Sorry, for integrity reasons, I'm afraid I can't show watches I have made before for my clients. However, if you're interested, you can visit our website here: www.giovinowatch.com to see some standard models which are only shown as samples and demonstration. Of course, like I said, if you have your own designs and are interested in building your own brand name, we will be pleased to make it for you. :-!


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## banyanleaf

For some reason the seller turned around and said they didn't understand the situation and now willing to send me a replacement. :-!


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## watch88

banyanleaf said:


> For some reason the seller turned around and said they didn't understand the situation and now willing to send me a replacement. :-!


That's good at least!:-! I mean it is a joke to buy a watch without a hand! ;-) Well, actually, since it is mechanical (automatic self winding?) in nature, sometimes it is easy for anything like the hands to fall off due to bumpy transportation in the process *IF *the watch was not assembled and QC-ed properly. But good that the seller is replacing it. Congrats!

Who is paying the shipping cost? You or the seller?


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## Chascomm

banyanleaf said:


> Who manufactures the movement?


I've seen at least two movements with that exact dial layout. The better known one is the PTS (Liaocheng) ML-7101, as used in the infamous Montres Allison watches made by Million Smart. Probably that is what is in your Magico. However I have seen another (cheaper?) calibre that appeared to be based on a conventional calibre but with the balance-wheel relocated to the dial-side.

So far every current Chinese mechanical movement whose that I've tracked down has been made by a factory that was set up as a State-owned enterprise back in the command-economy days. None of the new players actually make their own movements. PTS for example subcontract to Hangzhou and Liaocheng.

The number of ex-State enterprises has declined rapidly in the last decade. Some, like Jilin, Xi'an and Beijing number 2 have simply closed. Others, like Dalian and Yantai have been swallowed up by Sea-Gull Group, and I'm not sure what exactly they currently contribute to the group. That still leaves some small-time provincial enterprises who have never had a website and would be impossible to find unless you visited the town where they are located. All of these made the Standard watch from raw metal to finished product, but would be unlikely to have the resources for developing the enhancements necessary to compete on the international market.


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## ad-hawk

I'm quite late to find this discussion about ORKINA today but luckily it's not too late for me before I get more curious about it (and usually ends up buying it). When I see it on Ebay, see the price, see the info if it's mechanical, and especially the 'Swiss Design' thing, I check the net and found their homepage
www.evolution-time.com/*Orkina*.html - I also find their About Us page http://www.evolution-time.com/Us.html - clearly states that their background is achitectural and marine reparing. I suspect that this is a Chinese product from Chinese manufacturer - deducted from those facts crossed with my exp. It was then I found this post.

Thanks for alerting me. If your replacement works as is (I'm not saying the accuracy) - I just wonder how magnificent this toy can work (self-winding?) at that price.


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## Chascomm

The latest crop of Orkina seem to share much in common with the watches produced by Shenzhen Fineat Watch & Clock Co. As far as I know there are no mechanical movement manufacturers in Shenzhen (the city is too new to have any links to the old state-run watch enterprises), however there are many watch case, dial, accessories manufacturers. So Orkina is not the product of a _manufacture_ (pardon my French) like Shanghai, Dixmont or Sea-Gull. Rather it is the kind of brand whose product range will change constantly according to the availability of bought-in components. Like Invicta, but cheaper. The consquences for the consumer are that, while an immediate replacement for a defective new purchase should be readily available, the prospects of repairs or replacement parts a year or so down the track are not good at all.


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## watchman1577

Orkina is a great watch...I bought one on ebay and love it. things shipped across the world break sometimes. you should put up pictures of the UPS truck and cry about that


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## curt1628

I bought an orkina a few months ago and actually got a watch of way higher quality than I had expected! It keeps precise time losing no more than 20 seconds a day which I think is pretty good considering I only payed 30 dollars for it.


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## Pawl_Buster

curt1628 said:


> I bought an orkina a few months ago and actually got a watch of way higher quality than I had expected! It keeps precise time losing no more than 20 seconds a day which I think is pretty good considering I only payed 30 dollars for it.


You actually got one of those very rare Anikro watches. The are made to the highest standards and no expense was spared on QC :-d


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## alll87

jakisbck said:


> I have that same Movt in my Magico and havent had a bad thing to happen to it yet.


such a nice watch!!!!!! i love it!!!!


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## gigfy

curt1628 said:


> I bought an orkina a few months ago and actually got a watch of way higher quality than I had expected! It keeps precise time losing no more than 20 seconds a day which I think is pretty good considering I only payed 30 dollars for it.


Hi curt1628. Welcome to the forum. :-!

I'm glad you like your watch. Some of those lower end watches have had poor QC problems. I'm glad you got a good one. Keep us informed on how it's running.

BTW, why are your pictures a mirror image?

Cheers,
gigfy


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## curt1628

gigfy said:


> Hi curt1628. Welcome to the forum. :-!
> 
> I'm glad you like your watch. Some of those lower end watches have had poor QC problems. I'm glad you got a good one. Keep us informed on how it's running.
> 
> BTW, why are your pictures a mirror image?
> 
> Cheers,
> gigfy


I used photobooth, it reverses every picture, sorry for that! Will keep you informed!


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## Pawl_Buster

curt1628 said:


> I used photobooth, it reverses every picture, sorry for that! Will keep you informed!


LOL ... I thought you were making a joke on the QC :-d


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## bluloo

I have two Orkina's. 
They are the cheapest watches I own but they were also the cheapest watches I've ever purchased. One was actually a deal because Herc sells the same watch for ~4x what I paid.

;-)

Aside from the floating and broken screw in the back of one auto (which I replaced from a spare parts watch), the build and material quality is better than what I'd expect for an ~$15 watch.

I would never expect a seller to pay return shipping on such an inexpensive watch, nor would I bother myself.

Glad it all worked out in the end.


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## Pawl_Buster

bluloo said:


> I have two Orkina's.
> They are the cheapest watches I own but they were also the cheapest watches I've ever purchased. One was actually a deal because Herc sells the same watch for ~4x what I paid.
> 
> ;-)
> 
> Aside from the floating and broken screw in the back of one auto (which I replaced from a spare parts watch), the build and material quality is better than what I'd expect for an ~$15 watch.
> 
> I would never expect a seller to pay return shipping on such an inexpensive watch, nor would I bother myself.
> 
> Glad it all worked out in the end.


When we are talking $10 to $20 for these things; they are pretty good value...even if we have to do our own QC.

My new Artrons are performing wonderfully after almost a week ;-)


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## Bern52

Hey everybody. This is my first post here and I wanted to let you know that I took a chance on an Orkina from ebay and so far I am very pleased.

A few things that I am not completely happy about are;
They sent it to me wrapped in bubble wrap and inside a cardboard box. No watch storage box and no paperwork. The only bit of instruction I received was an email that said not to get the watch wet and not to adjust the day and date between 9PM and 3AM! The back of watch says clearly that it is stainless steel and water resistant!

The watch looks very nice, but the inside of the crystal seems to have some smudges. If I ever have to open it, I clean it at that time.

nice00watch sent the watch quickly, provided a tracking number and the thing keeps GREAT time.

For less than $30, delivered, I took a chance and so far so good.


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## jason_recliner

I know this is an old thread but I just had to respond as it is just too funny. I would have kept the watch. Sure it is missing a hand, but what did it cost, maybe $20? Cheap laughs IMO.


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## mikiejack

I was tempted by this one but the price put me off. Very nice design though.
Military Men watch Automatic fashion date-day M.Bk on eBay (end time 01-Jan-11 14:33:48 GMT)


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## James Haury

The hand could be preventing a part from returning fully that would cause the fast running or it could be a warped mainspring,Take it to a watchman and have it looked at.


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## Stone Hill

One thing I have learned over the last few months, that is there is some cheap fun to be had on Ebay. I have a Shanghai that I paid around $25 for and it is great. I also have this military style watch that I just got and it was around $35. For the few weeks I have had it, it has been great. I have gone crazy with the cree led flashlights. I have gotten some nice ones way under $10 with shipping. So for those who say "you get what you pay for" That saying does not always hold water. I have had many things that I did pay full price for and had them fail. I say do your research and take a gamble from time to time. You might just have some fun.


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## Orof

Like me 
Buying a full-priced Alpha Carbon watch for 71$ as my first quality machanical watch, just to see all the defects that watch had, i dont know where to start.
returned the basterd to alpha and bought my cheap 25$ cjiaba watch that i love for its look.

btw, i bought that same cjiaba watch twice just to find it defective each time, now i bought it at the 3rd time, i must be cursed with bad luck with machanical watches


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## Reecek

Orof said:


> Like me
> Buying a full-priced Alpha Carbon watch for 71$ as my first quality machanical watch, just to see all the defects that watch had, i dont know where to start.
> returned the basterd to alpha and bought my cheap 25$ cjiaba watch that i love for its look.
> 
> btw, i bought that same cjiaba watch twice just to find it defective each time, now i bought it at the 3rd time, i must be cursed with bad luck with machanical watches


No, not bad luck!! I'd say that Chinese QC, in general, over the last month or so, has gotten really bad, possibly the Christmas rush!!:think:


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## chrisbo28

> I have gotten some nice ones way under $10 with shipping. So for those who say "you get what you pay for" That saying does not always hold water. I have had many things that I did pay full price for and had them fail. I say do your research and take a gamble from time to time. You might just have some fun.


Yip, it is just a tendency and more likely to have more lemons with the $10 to $20 than for $60+ watches due to QC. :roll:


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## Pyrrhus

Eyki has cheap watches with tourbillon too. It'd be better to check them out at local stores instead of ordering online due to shipping costs. It's like ordering a bottle of soda for a dollar plus 5 dollars for the delivery while grocery store is only few blocks away.


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