# Movement in a B42?



## Gor (Aug 28, 2007)

Hi. May someone tell me if there is a "normal" movement to the B42? I saw at eBay one with the ETA movement 2836-2. It's that correct? That movement is common in very different brands, but it's right to a B42?


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## J.D. (Aug 15, 2006)

Gor said:


> Hi. May someone tell me if there is a "normal" movement to the B42? I saw at eBay one with the ETA movement 2836-2. It's that correct? That movement is common in very different brands, but it's right to a B42?


Yes that is correct, the current B-42s have ETA movements. Depending on the complications of the watch, there will be a different designation; 2836-2 denotes the day-date complication. 2824-2 is just the date, 2893-2 is a GMT movement. ETA Valjoux 7750 and Lemania 5100 movements can be found in chronographs. And yes, ETA movements are very common in a variety of brands.


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## Gor (Aug 28, 2007)

J.D. said:


> Yes that is correct, the current B-42s have ETA movements. Depending on the complications of the watch, there will be a different designation; 2836-2 denotes the day-date complication. 2824-2 is just the date, 2893-2 is a GMT movement. ETA Valjoux 7750 and Lemania 5100 movements can be found in chronographs. And yes, ETA movements are very common in a variety of brands.


Thanks a lot, J.D.! All the Best.


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## Gopher (Dec 27, 2007)

All ETA movements of the same caliber # are not the same. There are different quality grades: starts with Standard --> Elabore --> Top --> Chronometre. The differences are in some key components (barrel spring, shock protection, jewels, balance wheel, hairspring, regulator, etc.) and the number of positions (2, 3, 5) in which the movement is regulated (and to difference tolerances). I have also heard of a fifth grade, Economy, which is lower than Standard, but I have not run across one of these.

The first two common grades, Standard and Elabore, are very similar in components (may differ only in shock protection and regulator). The Top and Chronometre Grades use the same components, with the only difference being COSC certification of the Chronometre Grade. These two grades use improved balance, balance spring, shock protection, regulator, jewels, etc.

Fortis uses the Top Grade, which is the best non-COSC grade. (Both of my Fortis models run within COSC specs.) This is significant -- there can be 2X price difference (or more) for a movement from Standard to Top -- especially on the lower-end models where the movement cost represents a greater % of the price.

It's odd that few (if any) manufacturers advertise which movement grade they use. I had to pull this info. out of Fortis. I trust they're telling the truth.


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## Gopher (Dec 27, 2007)

Funny aside: When I first asked this question of the US distributor for Fortis (LWR Time), the representative I got on the phone had no idea what I was asking. I had to educate him on movement grades. So this info. is not as common as you would expect. I did find others at LWR who were knowledgeable on the subject.


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## SilverFlox (Jun 23, 2012)

Gopher said:


> All ETA movements of the same caliber # are not the same. There are different quality grades: starts with Standard --> Elabore --> Top --> Chronometre. The differences are in some key components (barrel spring, shock protection, jewels, balance wheel, hairspring, regulator, etc.) and the number of positions (2, 3, 5) in which the movement is regulated (and to difference tolerances). I have also heard of a fifth grade, Economy, which is lower than Standard, but I have not run across one of these.
> 
> The first two common grades, Standard and Elabore, are very similar in components (may differ only in shock protection and regulator). The Top and Chronometre Grades use the same components, with the only difference being COSC certification of the Chronometre Grade. These two grades use improved balance, balance spring, shock protection, regulator, jewels, etc.
> 
> ...


Hi, all.
Here is my small contribution to this (quite old) thread.

I have a Fortis B-42 OFFICIAL COSMONAUTS GMT 3 TIME ZONES watch and having some accuracy / power reserve problems I decided to write a mail to the Fortis headquarters.
Here is the very kind and very fast answer of Mrs Michèle Defranz of FORTIS UHREN AG:

*The movement in your watch ref. 649.10.11 is an ETA 2893-2 N and it is an elaboré movement.*

Do ALL Fortis movements are "Top Grade" as member Gopher points out and mine is an exception and that is what explains my problems?


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## WiZARD7 (Apr 4, 2012)

Mine Fortis also have an elaboré movement. If you check pictures of Fortis watches with see through case back, you won't see any Top Grade movement, at least I've never saw...


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## The Kit (May 10, 2006)

WiZARD7 said:


> Mine Fortis also have an elaboré movement. If you check pictures of Fortis watches with see through case back, you won't see any Top Grade movement, at least I've never saw...


Does that incl. the alarm editions as well? I know that Fortis name them F2001, but is an eta7750 elabore or top grade that is the basis?


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## WiZARD7 (Apr 4, 2012)

The Kit said:


> Does that incl. the alarm editions as well? I know that Fortis name them F2001, but is an eta7750 elabore or top grade that is the basis?


If I remember correctly, there are some COSC watches from Fortis, so they are not elabore...
I don't know what is in the alarm editions.


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## Beechparty (Apr 10, 2013)

I was under the impression that Fortis uses a standard grade ETA 2836-2 in their B42 models. Although my B42 does run better then a standard would.


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## Lamhewtot (Oct 26, 2013)

Correct me If I'm wrong, but I believe that the B-42 has a top grade movement. This is because it features a incabloc shock absorber, as stated on their website, which, I believe comes only with top and chronometer grade movements.


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## El Gato (Nov 24, 2013)

Lamhewtot said:


> Correct me If I'm wrong, but I believe that the B-42 has a top grade movement. This is because it features a incabloc shock absorber, as stated on their website, which, I believe comes only with top and chronometer grade movements.


 You are correct, B-42 diver day/date is ETA movement 2836-2, if you look at the movement (easier done if you have a glass case back) you can see a small screw that can be adjusted to five marker lines. Five adjustment markers = top quality.


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## Gopher (Dec 27, 2007)

Interesting updates on the grade levels. I was taking Fortis's word for it regarding the Top Grade, since I have not cracked open any of my three Fortis models (Flieger Chrono, Pilot Pro Day/Date, B-42 Marinemaster). I asked my question a few years ago about my models, all of which are 2007 or newer. Maybe there are differences depending on age of the watch as well as specific model.

What I do know is that all three of mine have run very accurately and consistently for 4-6 years. I am due for servicing, so may find out for certain then.

Would like to hear if any others know definitively the grades within their models.

Sent from my RM-820_nam_att_100 using Tapatalk


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## dinexus (Nov 18, 2012)

I'd be curious to know what's in my Spacematic as well. If I crack it open, what would I be looking for exactly?


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## heb (Feb 24, 2006)

dinexus said:


> I'd be curious to know what's in my Spacematic as well. If I crack it open, what would I be looking for exactly?


Hello, Look at the shape of the spokes on the balance wheel. If they have a curved, concaved shape, the wheel is made of glycudor (sp?); Top Grade movement. If they have straight sides, the wheel is made of nickel; a lower grade, Elaborate movement. Very high probability that your Fortis will be of the latter type. heb


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## cerberusshk (Jan 15, 2012)

I bought a B42 Flieger Black Day/Date recently. On Fortis website it said the movement is 26 jewels. But when I look at the back of my watch, it only wrote 25 jewels. Does anyone know why this happens? Is there any problen of my watch? Thanks 

Sent from my LG-F180S using Tapatalk


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## PJ S (Apr 29, 2013)

If not a typo, then 26 would've indicated a Sellita movement was planned, instead of the ETA one.


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## cerberusshk (Jan 15, 2012)

I see. So it means fortis may have two different movements in the same watch? 

Sent from my LG-F180S using Tapatalk


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## PJ S (Apr 29, 2013)

Quite possibly since Sellita have been contracted by ETA in the past, and may still be, to manufacture movements for them, when they need extra capacity.
As the ETA movements' patents have long since expired, Sellita make effectively clones, and for some reason, have deemed the need/benefit of an extra jewel in some (all?) of theirs.
So, if ETA can't offer a manufacturer all the movement quantities they need, then they'll typically revert to a Sellita, which is a straight drop in.
It's not uncommon, as Christopher Ward does likewise, and even divulges it in their specs.

Similar thing happens in the LCD TV market – one manufacturer I know, uses Sharp panels, but when demand increases and Sharp can't offer all the panels they require for a production run, then Samsung fills in the shortfall.


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