# Help with authentication of vintage Cartier Tank



## llettep (Jul 29, 2013)

Hello, I purchased a vintage Cartier Tank with Jaeger LeCoultre movement. I have been assured that it is authentic, but I want to run in by the experts here. I understand Cartier has used a variety of movements from Piaget, Audemars, JLC, etc. in the past.

I have a week or so to determine whether or not I will keep the watch. It is keeping perfect time. The absence of any writing on the case back concerns me, but perhaps that is just due to age. I have included a variety of images below. Any thoughts would be greatly appreciated.


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## Kansha (Jun 13, 2010)

I dont see the Cartier leg on the VII. Not sure when that started though.


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## llettep (Jul 29, 2013)

Kansha said:


> I dont see the Cartier leg on the VII. Not sure when that started though.


Thanks for your response. I believe (though not 100% sure) that was a more recent development. I saw a fair number of tanks from reputable stores without Cartier on the VII.


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## Kansha (Jun 13, 2010)

llettep said:


> Thanks for your response. I believe (though not 100% sure) that was a more recent development. I saw a fair number of tanks from reputable stores without Cartier on the VII.


I did a little research online. The Cartier 7 leg started in the 1960s. Before the 1960s, Cartier only made less than 100 Tanks in any given year.,Yours looks legit but might be a redial.


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## llettep (Jul 29, 2013)

Kansha said:


> I did a little research online. The Cartier 7 leg started in the 1960s. Before the 1960s, Cartier only made less than 100 Tanks in any given year.,Yours looks legit but might be a redial.


interesting. may i ask what gives you the impression that it could be a redial? It looks good to me, but maybe too good for a 50+ yr old watch. It was stressed to me that the dial is original, though I don't have any assurance beyond the seller's word. helpful to have someone with more expertise than me weigh in.

Thanks again


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## Kansha (Jun 13, 2010)

Hello,

Well I am not an expert, but I do have an interest:








The one on the left is a 1928 ladies Tank in sterling silver. On the right my modern Tank Solo XL auto.

But here is why I think yours is a redial, if authentic. A true expert would say 'this JLC movement was in watches from X year...'

Cartiers newer than the mid-1960s should have the Cartier 'VII' leg. If yours doesn't have that, it would have to be older than the mid-1960s. 
However, that looks an authentic JLC movement. But it looks too modern and clean to be older the the 1960s. At least to me.

I also do not see the 'Swiss Made' or 'Swiss' or even 'Paris' that a Cartier should have (at least in the pics you have posted).
These details point to me as a redial.

Further, I have read that Cartier engraves 'Cartier' on the caseback of each watch; yours is also missing this.

Likely a redial, possibly a new caseback also. 
Need a better expert than me, but that is my view.


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## Kansha (Jun 13, 2010)

Actually it gets worse.

I was looking at your case and comparing it to Cartier Tank images in eBay and elsewhere. 
ALL Cartier Tank watches have the 2 little screws on each side holding the case together; you can see them on my 1928 case and in many other images.

Also, your caseback is a snap-in and doesn't fit. The corners are cut off and not consistent. Cartier cases are always high quality.

So, I think your case is wrong. 

Dial is wrong also.

The movement might be right: the winding crown looks correct (it is likely a new winding crown on my own 1928 Tank shown above: too shiny. Possibly a repair at some point).

So you either have a frankenwatch or a fake.


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## llettep (Jul 29, 2013)

this is all very helpful and exactly why I posed my inquiry here. Thank you very much for the help.

The lack of swiss/paris/swiss made on the dial concerned me. I ignored it for the moment though.

The case back concerned me more. Both the way it attached as well as the lack of engraving on the back seemed odd. I took it to a well regarded (as I understand it) vintage watch shop here in NY and they told me that the markings on the inside of the case back are legitimate for its age...which makes me wonder how those could be authentic, but the case wrong. Any ideas?

They offer an authentication service, and their watchmaker returns tomorrow to open up and evaluate the watch. I will bring these two items up (case back and lack of swiss/paris/swiss made on the dial). Do you believe there is anything else I should consider?

edit: in addition, the watch shop here said that the case back had probably been polished and therefore the engravings were no longer visible.


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## Kansha (Jun 13, 2010)

'Being helpful' was the spirit in which I meant my posts 

I think that the engraving on the back would be very difficult to polish off without being very noticeable. Did you buy the watch from them? Can you get your money back or a trade? There are just a lot of 'red flags' for me, sorry.


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## llettep (Jul 29, 2013)

yeah, it was guaranteed authentic. so if i can prove that it is not (i believe i have a fair case) I can get my money back. They have some other tanks that are more recent and have all of the hallmarks mentioned above. There is potential for trade, so i'll look into that too. I was hoping for a true vintage example from the 60s or early 70s. This one was markedly less expensive than others I'd seen. Must have been too good to be true!


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