# Future of Old logo Grand Seikos??



## Maxy (Aug 15, 2011)

Suddenly the forum sales corners is flooded with Old Grand Seiko watches. The prices keep dropping as they get 'bumps'. What do you think is the future of Old Logo Grand Seikos? Will they continue to fall down?

Personally, I think it will fall down further. Reason? Like in 60's Grand Seiko was just 'Grand Seiko' and then they added 'Seiko' on the top. If that happened now, we can assume that discontinued versions will continue to increase and be in demand whereas currently they are actually removing the clutter on the dial and improving(thought not done very aesthetically IMO).

Where do you guys see the future of Old GS ?


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## theEntreriCode (Mar 3, 2015)

Maxy said:


> Suddenly the forum sales corners is flooded with Old Grand Seiko watches. The prices keep dropping as they get 'bumps'. What do you think is the future of Old Logo Grand Seikos? Will they continue to fall down?
> 
> Personally, I think it will fall down further. Reason? Like in 60's Grand Seiko was just 'Grand Seiko' and then they added 'Seiko' on the top. If that happened now, we can assume that discontinued versions will continue to increase and be in demand whereas currently they are actually removing the clutter on the dial and improving(thought not done very aesthetically IMO).
> 
> Where do you guys see the future of Old GS ?


I think prices should come down in the future. Especially once they start migrating their core lines over to the new branding. The reason they haven't done so yet is that they're refining the aesthetics. I'm expecting further drop in value in the future.

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## Mavrobasilis (Sep 13, 2008)

As I don't like the new logo very much, this would be a very nice development. I don't intend to sale mine and I never bother with the resale value of my toys; it only matters whether they were worth the price when bought. So the prospect of eg the old dial snowflake prices collapsing is most welcome. Better still if people are desperate enough for the latest logo to affect the prices of LE too, I'll be a very happy man indeed!

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## KazeKei (Jan 11, 2012)

Happy to see price goin down for the old version so I can snatch up a few!


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## KrazyK (Apr 24, 2016)

For a seiko fan, i like the original styling and don't care about the logos. Both ways appeal to me and they are all different. If they mimicked my same watch with the new logo it would be different, maybe. But I can foresee a drop now, but later, depending on style and who wants what, the values could come back due to tight demand. So far the new ones don't appeal to me as much as the originals. 


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## pukka (Feb 28, 2015)

New release models always mean there's a potential for some great bargains on the used market. Can't wait to snag me one, I've been wanting a Snowflake for a while now.


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## Crate410 (Jun 14, 2011)

Dont refer to them as grand seiko. Ther are old models and so are no longer grand seikos.


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## happyscrappyheropup (Feb 6, 2013)

Were Grand Seikos known for holding their value? I've always seen pre-owned GS as a deal because used prices were so good. 

-- Wayne


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## bluedialer (Sep 16, 2011)

Crate410 said:


> Dont refer to them as grand seiko. Ther are old models and so are no longer grand seikos.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## valuewatchguy (Jun 16, 2012)

Crate410 said:


> Dont refer to them as grand seiko. Ther are old models and so are no longer grand seikos.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


How about the watch formerly known as grand seiko...

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## Crate410 (Jun 14, 2011)

valuewatchguy said:


> How about the watch formerly known as grand seiko...
> 
> Sent from my SM-N920P using Tapatalk


Great choice!

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## Mavrobasilis (Sep 13, 2008)

Yes! Let's all do some former GS bashing and drive the values really low! :-D 

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## valuewatchguy (Jun 16, 2012)

Mavrobasilis said:


> Yes! Let's all do some former GS bashing and drive the values really low! :-D
> 
> Sent from my D5503 using Tapatalk


No way, could never bash what i believe is the best made and best value in watches today......that is even more true now with the price increases they announced at Basel on some models.

I think as long as the new logo is priced higher RRP than the old logo that the preowned prices stay steady and may even go up.....that is the rolex strategy.

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## theEntreriCode (Mar 3, 2015)

valuewatchguy said:


> No way, could never bash what i believe is the best made and best value in watches today......that is even more true now with the price increases they announced at Basel on some models.
> 
> I think as long as the new logo is priced higher RRP than the old logo that the preowned prices stay steady and may even go up.....that is the rolex strategy.
> 
> Sent from my SM-N920P using Tapatalk


No no no! The old watches were terrible. Everyone should hawk them at low prices. Their resale is terrible it should fall further!

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## Crate410 (Jun 14, 2011)

valuewatchguy said:


> the best made and best value


That simply is impossible.

The best made of anything will always be very expensive... except for maybe cakes or cookies.

Best value is usually not the best made. Its true for watches, cars... many things in life.

They are two vary different concepts that are in most cases (including watches) mutually exclusive.

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## valuewatchguy (Jun 16, 2012)

Crate410 said:


> That simply is impossible.
> 
> The best made of anything will always be very expensive... except for maybe cakes or cookies.
> 
> ...


Okay

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## Crate410 (Jun 14, 2011)

valuewatchguy said:


> Okay
> 
> Sent from my SM-N920P using Tapatalk


Okay

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## ahonobaka (Jan 27, 2017)

Complete derailment of the thread, but something I've been meaning to get off my chest. Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, and this being the internet, opinions are certainly to be expected, and unfortunately more often than not, opinion degrades into trolling. At the end of the day, taste and opinion in luxury goods (like most things in life) is subjective; What speaks to one person doesn't necessarily need to speak to another. And it shouldn't have to! Variety is the spice of life. If I told you I like apple pie, but you were an ardent fan of key lime, would you go on and on about all the faults of apple pie to convince me that ONLY key lime pie is the worthiest pie to eat? Simply doesn't make sense to me.

What I do suspect, however, is a deeper sense of insecurity to a perceived "threat". And this does go both ways with ardent "GS ONLY" fans as well who will never buy swiss; But luxury goods are essentially steeped in storytelling and perceived worth and value. If your whole life, "Key Lime Pie Co." was what you saw everyone else eating, and it was the most recognizable form of delicious pastry predilection that gave you instant pie cred, it is without doubt that you'd do everything to get your hands on it, and eat as much of it as you could. But what happens when you get full on all the Key Lime Pie Co. pie in the world, and you find that you aren't happy? Something is missing somehow, but key lime is all you've ever known or were told to care about, and you own 4,5, maybe even 10 pies, but it didn't give you everything you were hoping for? And suddenly, Apple Pie Co. from around the world comes out with a different sort of pie, a new approach using apples instead of limes, and a few dollars cheaper, BUT just as tasty to other people? Then of course, your initial reaction would be, "Ludicrous! That isn't PIE! Where is all the lime?! Something so cheap CAN'T taste good!". Because when you've banked all that time and money into key lime pie and you find yourself "full", but fundamentally unhappy (status and wealth can't buy happiness), you instantly fear that maybe you may have been wrong, and that perhaps Key Lime Pie co. was pulling your strings all along when they've been charging you for "prestige" and "branding", when a different kind of pie was being made at a lower price. 

Meanwhile, the apple pie fans KNOW they aren't eating key lime. To them, it's just as good because maybe they prefer apples over limes, and are a bit sour over all the pretense and egos of Key Lime fans. They enjoy the variety, the sweetness of the apple, while maybe even dabbling with some key lime here and there, or even cherry! And at the end of the day, they are satisfied, because at the end of the day, they're eating apple pie to satisfy themselves, and not others. And at the end of the day to them, IT'S ONLY PIE.

So to all of the "Swiss only" types out there; We get it, swiss made watches are steeped in tradition, quality, pursuit of excellence and prestige. I have nothing but respect for them, and of course will continue pursuing many a Rolex, etc. in my lifetime. But I also like Grand Seiko. And some models of GS, I like even more than certain models of Rolex. And who cares? They're JUST WATCHES after all, and it's my money to spend. 

So please, keep trolling, and maybe we'll feed you from time to time, because the ego is a delicate thing when threatened, and we get you might feel insecure from time to time. But I'd rather have an open mind about all things in life, and will continue to dabble in non-swiss, ALONG with swiss. The world is round, I like apple pie, and good god man, they are JUST WATCHES! And to all the GS fans out there, a smile and a nod to you all!


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## Mavrobasilis (Sep 13, 2008)

I would like to explicitly state that I have not been trolling a jot. The business's rebranding is indifferent to me, I absolutely love the watches, I like the old face a bit more and I will be very happy if my next GSs come with a lower price due to the market's perception of the brand reinvention. 

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## T1meout (Sep 27, 2013)

valuewatchguy said:


> How about the watch formerly known as grand seiko...
> 
> Sent from my SM-N920P using Tapatalk


This totally cracked me up.

My pie is tastier than yours!


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## Laso1 (Oct 10, 2012)

I like Cherry Pie.


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## Mark355 (Dec 25, 2012)

I won't try to predict the market, but I will say I had no problem with the old branding. I like the Seiko name and am proud to have it on my watch. I don't find it cluttered. It's not a Daytona with the Old Testament on the dial.


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## sierra11b (Jan 7, 2011)

Having once owned the SBGA029 I find myself wanting it back because 1) it was the best GS I ever owned out of the 4 that didn't quite meet snuff for personal reasons, and 2) I like the Seiko at the top and font the way it currently stands. I fear they'd mess it up with a newer font design and it would appear too empty.

Has there been a new dial revealed on the venerable GS SD diver yet?


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## valuewatchguy (Jun 16, 2012)

sierra11b said:


> Having once owned the SBGA029 I find myself wanting it back because 1) it was the best GS I ever owned out of the 4 that didn't quite meet snuff for personal reasons, and 2) I like the Seiko at the top and font the way it currently stands. I fear they'd mess it up with a newer font design and it would appear too empty.
> 
> Has there been a new dial revealed on the venerable GS SD diver yet?


Before
And after










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## Mark355 (Dec 25, 2012)

Looks unbalanced to me. I think the "Grand Seiko" should still be at 6 o'clock. Maybe I need to get accustomed to it...


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## valuewatchguy (Jun 16, 2012)

Mark355 said:


> Looks unbalanced to me. I think the "Grand Seiko" should still be at 6 o'clock. Maybe I need to get accustomed to it...


If it was up to me, and it's definitely not , I would have put the logo on top with a text and Grand Seiko on the bottom

But what do I know I only have the watch formerly known as Grand Seiko....lol

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## Tseg (Mar 29, 2014)

Grand Seiko at top = fashion brand

All the 'under the radar' types will now seek flight. Owning an original Sieko-GS-Grand Seiko is like owning the Heurer before the Tag made its appearance. Just saying.


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## Nom de Forum (Oct 17, 2012)

I sure am glad I bought a new "Original" Grand Seiko Snowflake before they are completely replaced by the "New Coke" Grand Seiko Snowflakes.


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## Laso1 (Oct 10, 2012)

Like before the change there are some I like and some I don't like. Personally I kinda like the change overall.


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## bluedialer (Sep 16, 2011)

The change is okay, except on the spring drives with power reserves. I'm afraid unless they can fix it, it may be time for the power reserves to go bye bye. The power reserve needs to be repositioned, or the "GS" or other small symbol needs to be put next to it ("Grand Seiko" down there would not work; it's too long).... Otherwise, let's face it, it's just plain ugly now. It really is.


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## Zinzan (Oct 9, 2014)

Maxy said:


> Suddenly the forum sales corners is flooded with Old Grand Seiko watches.


I think flooded is an exaggeration.

I like the idea of getting rid of SEIKO at 12 o'clock. But yes, they probably have more work to do on proper placement of the Grand Seiko logo on the different watch faces.

And ideally, the power reserve would not be on the dial, anyways.


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## theEntreriCode (Mar 3, 2015)

bluedialer said:


> The change is okay, except on the spring drives with power reserves. I'm afraid unless they can fix it, it may be time for the power reserves to go bye bye. The power reserve needs to be repositioned, or the "GS" or other small symbol needs to be put next to it ("Grand Seiko" down there would not work; it's too long).... Otherwise, let's face it, it's just plain ugly now. It really is.


I'm sure it's only a matter of time before an applied lion logo makes it way to 12 or 6. Satori shall be achieved by Seiko. Err wait it's Grand Seiko now.

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## G07 (Nov 20, 2008)

Can someone Photoshop and just put the GS below 12 position and leave "Grand Seiko" and "Automatic" or Spring Drive above 6? Might balance dial??? New branding, especially on SD with PR in no mans land just looks terrible IMHO ...

And this is coming from a GS lover 



Zinzan said:


> I think flooded is an exaggeration.
> 
> I like the idea of getting rid of SEIKO at 12 o'clock. But yes, they probably have more work to do on proper placement of the Grand Seiko logo on the different watch faces.
> 
> And ideally, the power reserve would not be on the dial, anyways.


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## whineboy (Aug 12, 2012)

Zinzan said:


> I think flooded is an exaggeration.
> 
> I like the idea of getting rid of SEIKO at 12 o'clock. But yes, they probably have more work to do on proper placement of the Grand Seiko logo on the different watch faces.
> 
> And ideally, the power reserve would not be on the dial, anyways.


I'd love a Snowflake but the front power reserve does not appeal to me. Put the PR on the back, like on the SBGD001, and I'll open my wallet.


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## metalgear (Dec 10, 2013)

i feel seiko is getting ready for a BIG push behind the Grand Seiko branding.

if they are successful, then the original Seiko headed Grand Seiko's will be an oddity and possibly rarity, and it is possible that prices do go up.

no one really knows, i guess, this watch collecting stuff is pure voodoo. look at the prices of vintage rolex divers now - did you anticipate that it would go up this high?


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## Cobia (Nov 24, 2013)

The new logo is infinitely better imo, and now that GS has broken away theres no point having seiko on the dial, its exactly what you wouldnt want if you were GS, so the new logo is a no brainer, i recon it looks a lot better too has a lot more style than the generic seiko logo with the generic font.


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## valuewatchguy (Jun 16, 2012)

Cobia said:


> The new logo is infinitely better imo, and now that GS has broken away theres no point having seiko on the dial, its exactly what you wouldnt want if you were GS, so the new logo is a no brainer, i recon it looks a lot better too has a lot more style than the generic seiko logo with the generic font.


Is the lion an old or current logo of grand seiko?










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## eblackmo (Dec 27, 2014)

I think it depends on how much love there will be for the new branding. The current GS lineup could easily hold it's value if the original logo complete with SEIKO becomes more sought after due to the new logo/branding change. Although you have to remember seikos focus with GS is really the japanese market. With international sales almost being an afterthought. Which I confirmed in a roundabout way while talking to the guys at the seiko boutique in aus. What's the future for my snowflake? Get on my wrist.  People think about this sort of ****e way to much. Is overthinking it good or is it bad?


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## T1meout (Sep 27, 2013)

valuewatchguy said:


> Is the lion an old or current logo of grand seiko?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


The lion logo is as old as GS itself and showcased on the caseback of the very first GS ever released.

Personally I doubt that the lion logo will ever permanently replace the GS dial logo given it's made from 18k gold and would incur a considerable price increase across the board. It may be featured occasionally, but won't become the norm.


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## eblackmo (Dec 27, 2014)

valuewatchguy said:


> Okay
> 
> Sent from my SM-N920P using Tapatalk





Crate410 said:


> Okay
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Okay


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## valuewatchguy (Jun 16, 2012)

T1meout said:


> The lion logo is as old as GS itself and showcased on the caseback of the very first GS ever released.
> 
> Personally I doubt that the lion logo will ever permanently replace the GS logo on the dial given its made from 18k gold and would incur a considerable price increase across the board. It may be featured occasionally, but won't become the norm.


I saw that it showed up on the caseback of the 62GS historical collection. I hope they do that again on future releases.










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## T1meout (Sep 27, 2013)

valuewatchguy said:


> I saw that it showed up on the caseback of the 62GS historical collection. I hope they do that again on future releases.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


So do I. I'm a great fan of the lion logo. Before settling for the SBGW047 I searched high and low for a SBGW095, but it wasn't to be. Unfortunately the lion logo is only reserved for models which meet tight accuracy specifications and is used relatively sparingly by the company.


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## bluedialer (Sep 16, 2011)

T1meout said:


> The lion logo is as old as GS itself and showcased on the caseback of the very first GS ever released.
> 
> Personally I doubt that the lion logo will ever permanently replace the GS dial logo given its made from 18k gold and would incur a considerable price increase across the board. It may be featured occasionally, but won't become the norm.


If they ever did make a tiny dial applique with the lion (which I'd like, but don't anticipate), it wouldn't absolutely need to be made of gold anyway. Besides that though, such a small amount of gold is negligible price wise (or should be) on a per piece basis. Rolex and Omega indices are made of gold, seemingly without charging a price premium based on that.


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## T1meout (Sep 27, 2013)

bluedialer said:


> If they ever did make a tiny dial applique with the lion (which I'd like, but don't anticipate), it wouldn't absolutely need to be made of gold anyway. Besides that though, such a small amount of gold is negligible price wise (or should be) on a per piece basis. Rolex and Omega indices are made of gold, seemingly without charging a price premium based on that.


Well as is the case with all veblain goods the law of diminishing returns applies. It may not cost much to fit a single watch with gold indices, bezel or logo. But on a mass production scale it all adds up. I won't argue that Rolex aren't worth the price they charge. I own two of them. For decades they have been applying gold accents on many SS models, but I'm certain that these applications have been factored into prices many times over. Which from a business perspective is totally understandable.

Except for rereleased previous models, so far all GS lion logos are made out of solid gold. The 50th anniversary line being the perfect example of this.


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## ed delr (Oct 2, 2013)

Short answer I do not know.

Long answer.
i do not think anyone knows, not even the folks at Seiko.

i have come across some discussions in the past suggesting that Seiko should come up with a luxury brand for the Grand Seiko movements much like what Toyota did to the Lexus. Some people were suggesting that the brand Seiko on an impressive movement like the Grand Seiko weighs it down and prevents it from claiming its rightful place in the luxury watch market. Some of us may have heard the phrase it's only a Seiko after someone asks about your Grand Seiko. Seiko is a victim of its own success in the watch mass market that it is not seen and will probably not be seen as a luxury brand. I think this is exactly what the folks at Seiko are trying to do, create a luxury watch brand for the grand Seiko. Whether they will be successful or not only time will tell. Creating a separate "Grand Seiko" brand out of the Seiko brand may just create enough brand differentiation and brand separation to make Grand Seiko a distinct luxury brand. If it's a success people will call it a brilliant idea. If it fails then we're back to the old Grand Seiko, I guess.

Remember the failed New Coke rebranding in 1985? One April 23, 1985 coke decided to launch a new Coca Cola and discontinue the old one. After so much money on market research and 200,000 taste tests indicating that consumers preferred the New Coke, the market clearly rejected the new Coke and Coca Cola had to do a complete turnaround. On July 11, 1985, the management of Coke had to announce that they are bringing back the "Classic Coke".
The luxury watch market is so unpredictable and at times can defy logic that I think no one can predict how the market will respond to this move of Seiko. I can only hope that they are right, for if they are then Grand Seiko as a brand will truly join the ranks of the luxury watch brands worldwide.


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## pukka (Feb 28, 2015)

ed delr said:


> Seiko is a victim of its own success in the watch mass market.





ed delr said:


> I can only hope that they are right, for if they are then Grand Seiko as a brand will truly join the ranks of the luxury watch brands worldwide.


You are 100% correct. Seiko have a unique problem in that their GS line is inevitably associated with their more mainstream and cheaper models. Rolex et al don't have the same issues to contend with - no-one is comparing a Sub to an SKX. Seiko need to drop the baggage if they are to be taken seriously in the luxury marketplace. So far they have done well with the serious watch enthusiast, but in order to grab the spontaneous/non-enthusiast market, where the casual buyer is comp shopping, they need to work on their market perception. I don't think that they will be able to break free simply through "consumer education" it needs to be an entirely separate watch brand. GS watches are some amazing timepieces, arguably dollar for dollar better propositions than the brands they are pitting themselves against. I have nothing against Seiko as a brand, I enjoy their watches, have owned many and still have a few, recently picking up the new turtle, BUT, in this instance, they are nothing more than a boat anchor they need to free themselves from.


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## Mavrobasilis (Sep 13, 2008)

Is it just me then thinking it's bloody amusing to sport a magnificent but cost-wise totally unassuming piece of engineering?


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## Laso1 (Oct 10, 2012)

ed delr said:


> Remember the failed New Coke rebranding in 1985? One April 23, 1985 coke decided to launch a new Coca Cola and discontinue the old one. After so much money on market research and 200,000 taste tests indicating that consumers preferred the New Coke, the market clearly rejected the new Coke and Coca Cola had to do a complete turnaround. On July 11, 1985, the management of Coke had to announce that they are bringing back the "Classic Coke".
> The luxury watch market is so unpredictable and at times can defy logic that I think no one can predict how the market will respond to this move of Seiko. I can only hope that they are right, for if they are then Grand Seiko as a brand will truly join the ranks of the luxury watch brands worldwide.


There is a huge difference compared to the New Coke (which I have seen referenced a few times). That was a different product, formula and taste, not just a name or logo change. It is my understanding that the GS core product will remain the same with new models added to expand the line. Seiko started adding to the line over the last few years anyway. As long as the design/build and quality does not change I see no reason for the "rebranding" to be rejected the same way New Coke was. If anything I think GS will continue to blend new technology with old world hands on craftsmanship to deliver the very best watch they can. As far as prices, I do not look forward to the new increases, however it is still a better deal than other brands with similar quality. The pre-owned market may bounce around a bit but watches are not reallly a good or reliable investment item anyway (with a few possible exceptions).

"One Step Ahead Of The Rest"


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## tacotom (Jan 6, 2015)

G07 said:


> Can someone Photoshop and just put the GS below 12 position and leave "Grand Seiko" and "Automatic" or Spring Drive above 6? Might balance dial??? New branding, especially on SD with PR in no mans land just looks terrible IMHO ...
> 
> And this is coming from a GS lover


original







improvement?


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## pukka (Feb 28, 2015)

^^^^ I think it would look better with the "GS" up top and larger, with "Grand Seiko" below just above spring drive.


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## Ajax_Drakos (Aug 20, 2014)

I have seen no evidence of a price drop isolated to GS watches. There's been a price drop across the board, and GS watches just happen to be caught up in it along with everyone else. 

Let's settle down -- nobody is going to be buying a Snowflake for $1,500 anytime soon.


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## Squeaks5635 (Mar 13, 2017)

Ajax_Drakos said:


> Let's settle down -- nobody is going to be buying a Snowflake for $1,500 anytime soon.


Actually I would buy a snowflake for $1500 right now.


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## pukka (Feb 28, 2015)

Ajax_Drakos said:


> Let's settle down -- nobody is going to be buying a Snowflake for $1,500 anytime soon.


We can wait


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## T1meout (Sep 27, 2013)

pukka said:


> You are 100% correct. Seiko have a unique problem in that their GS line is inevitably associated with their more mainstream and cheaper models. Rolex et al don't have the same issues to contend with - no-one is comparing a Sub to an SKX. Seiko need to drop the baggage if they are to be taken seriously in the luxury marketplace. So far they have done well with the serious watch enthusiast, but in order to grab the spontaneous/non-enthusiast market, where the casual buyer is comp shopping, they need to work on their market perception. I don't think that they will be able to break free simply through "consumer education" it needs to be an entirely separate watch brand. GS watches are some amazing timepieces, arguably dollar for dollar better propositions than the brands they are pitting themselves against. I have nothing against Seiko as a brand, I enjoy their watches, have owned many and still have a few, recently picking up the new turtle, BUT, in this instance, they are nothing more than a boat anchor they need to free themselves from.


You make a compelling argument were it not that GS doesn't nearly produce the amount of watches that the large Swiss luxury brands do. In terms of volume GS is comparable to Panerai which targets/ appeals to a niche market aswell. Granted all brands would love to be popular to the likes of Rolex, but as long as they sell out of stock, notoriety isn't an absolute necessity.


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## T1meout (Sep 27, 2013)

tacotom said:


> original
> View attachment 11487330
> 
> improvement?
> View attachment 11487346


No!


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## pukka (Feb 28, 2015)

T1meout said:


> You make a compelling argument were it not that GS doesn't nearly produce the amount of watches that the large Swiss luxury brands do. In terms of volume GS is comparable to Panerai which targets/ appeals to a niche market aswell. Granted all brands would love to be popular to the likes of Rolex, but as long as they sell out of stock, notoriety isn't an absolute necessity.


I get what you are saying but my point is this - when you have developed a brand based on a lower price point, it's harder to grab the high end market based on all the marketing you have done previously to cement your low(er) cost market position. To use the car industry as an analogy - do you think it's harder for Kia to sell a luxury K900 for ~$55,000 or Mercedes to sell a E-Class. Both are the same pricepoint and arguably equal in quality and luxury, however there's less 'perceived' luxury in the Kia brand than the Mercedes. How do car companies overcome this perception? They split the brands. Nissan, Toyota, Honda have all done it. Toyota probably the most successfully with even more differentiation with Scion/Toyota/Lexus.

The issue here is not really whether Grand Seiko *should* be separate, the reality is Seiko believe it should be and that's why they are rebranding the dials in an effort to put more emphasis on the Grand Seiko brand and less on Seiko. I am merely offering an explanation as to why it might be happening.


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## Zinzan (Oct 9, 2014)

As stated earlier, I don't see a flood of used GS for sale since the rebranding. And I don't expect them to suddenly sell for dirt cheap. I like the idea of getting rid of SEIKO at 12 o'clock, but it's not a deal breaker for me. I'll still consider an old dial GS if the right deal presents itself down the road.

That said, Topper Jewelers does have a sale on their old GS stock, but you have to contact them to get prices.

http://www.topperjewelers.com/?p=blog&article=grand-seiko-post-basel-sale-event

I don't think there is anything that Seiko can do to have Grand Seiko seen in the same light as Rolex to the mainstream consumer. And I don't think they are really trying to do that.

Now that they have moved their branding to 12 o'clock, it makes no sense to move GS or Grand Seiko to 6 o'clock.


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## T1meout (Sep 27, 2013)

pukka said:


> I get what you are saying but my point is this - when you have developed a brand based on a lower price point, it's harder to grab the high end market based on all the marketing you have done previously to cement your low(er) cost market position. To use the car industry as an analogy - do you think it's harder for Kia to sell a luxury K900 for ~$55,000 or Mercedes to sell a E-Class. Both are the same pricepoint and arguably equal in quality and luxury, however there's less 'perceived' luxury in the Kia brand than the Mercedes. How do car companies overcome this perception? They split the brands. Nissan, Toyota, Honda have all done it. Toyota probably the most successfully with even more differentiation with Scion/Toyota/Lexus.
> 
> The issue here is not really whether Grand Seiko *should* be separate, the reality is Seiko believe it should be and that's why they are rebranding the dials in an effort to put more emphasis on the Grand Seiko brand and less on Seiko. I am merely offering an explanation as to why it might be happening.


I completely understand and applaud Seiko's decision to attempt to distinguish GS from their mainstream products, but IMHO not much has changed. The name Seiko still appears on the dial albeit less prominently. Either way, it's fine by me. The brandname never bothered me to begin with. I just hope they succeed in properly balancing their dials.


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## pukka (Feb 28, 2015)

T1meout said:


> .......I just hope they succeed in properly balancing their dials.


This is key. Clean and simple and something that appeals to both existing and potential clientele.

The rebranding doesn't bother me either, I'll be a buyer and whichever deal comes my way I'll be more than happy with.

I personally think the power reserve should be on the movement to clean up the dial more. I'll get my flamesuit ready.....


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## Laso1 (Oct 10, 2012)

pukka said:


> I get what you are saying but my point is this - when you have developed a brand based on a lower price point, it's harder to grab the high end market based on all the marketing you have done previously to cement your low(er) cost market position.
> 
> The issue here is not really whether Grand Seiko *should* be separate, the reality is Seiko believe it should be and that's why they are rebranding the dials in an effort to put more emphasis on the Grand Seiko brand and less on Seiko. I am merely offering an explanation as to why it might be happening.


I think you are correct in regard to marketing. However there are a lot of younger customers moving into the market with the ability to search for and to research products that did not exist 20 years ago. I think it may not take as long for the new identity to cement itself into the minds of the up and coming high end watch consumers.

I think about when GS came back into the market how excited I was, and very few of my watch buddies knew what I was talking about. Now in the watch community at least almost everyone is aware of the GS reputation and quality.

When the Spring Drive was released it was ridiculed as a glorified quartz watch, with many people skeptical of it's success. It seems to have passed the test. This demonstrates that new things can and will become accepted.

I would venture to guess that Seiko is not looking for an overnight change in perception and are looking ahead for a long term change in the perception of the GS.

In a couple of years we will loose sight of this debate and the new branding will not be new it will just be the brand we are use to seeing. Sure a few of us "old timers" will still complain (like those that still can't fathom why a watch would ever be over 36 or 38mm in width) because we like tradition and don't want change. just look back a few years when Rolex introduced the larger watches and read the older forums that bashed the DJ 2 and some others. They have proven to be accepted and desired watches. The same will happen with the GS rebranding.


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## T1meout (Sep 27, 2013)

pukka said:


> I personally think the power reserve should be on the movement to clean up the dial more.


So do I, but I highly doubt it given the existence of the SBGD001.
The chance of GS releasing a SS SpringDrive with the PR indicator on the movement in the near future is as likely to happen as Rolex releasing a SS GMT II with a ceramic bicolor Coke bezel. It ain't gonna happen.


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## T1meout (Sep 27, 2013)

Laso1 said:


> Just look back a few years when Rolex introduced the larger watches and read the older forums that bashed the DJ 2 and some others. They have proven to be accepted and desired watches. The same will happen with the GS rebranding.


Lol, bad example Laso1 given Rolex ceased DJ2 production last month. But they did introduce an even larger Seadweller.


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## ahonobaka (Jan 27, 2017)

Word to the wise: 

If you were interested in getting a GS with the old dials, do so NOW, or at least as soon as you can. There are some HEAVY discounts coming through the pipeline as of today, so call up your favorite AD and get on it. Many models are already selling out, and the pricing cannot be beat. 

That said, I'm soon to be (once I get it) a proud owner of my very own GS Diver!


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## Laso1 (Oct 10, 2012)

T1meout said:


> Lol, bad example Laso1 given Rolex ceased DJ2 production last month. But they did introduce an even larger Seadweller.


LOL Touche. That slipped my mind.


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## matthew P (Aug 1, 2013)

I like the new branding on the dress watches but not so much on the spring drive divers..... prefer the seiko up top on those and the clutter on the bottom half.

But I like mine on rubber so what do I know.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## KazeKei (Jan 11, 2012)

So... only until seiko get GS watches a service center ONLY for the GS then I would think it's a good change. 


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## WillC310 (Oct 29, 2012)

ahonobaka said:


> Word to the wise:
> 
> If you were interested in getting a GS with the old dials, do so NOW, or at least as soon as you can. There are some HEAVY discounts coming through the pipeline as of today, so call up your favorite AD and get on it. Many models are already selling out, and the pricing cannot be beat.
> 
> That said, I'm soon to be (once I get it) a proud owner of my very own GS Diver!


Yes, I am able to confirm that's the case. I picked up a SBGA149 at a nice discount from my local AD today (Toppers). Spring Drive and Titanium  I was actually in there a week or two ago and saw it and thought about it. Then Toppers announced they were clearing them out so I called them up and was told what the discount was. I stopped by today, checked the watch out again in person and was a bit on the fence. Rob was there and offered a little more incentive and BAM! I was sold.


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## Tseg (Mar 29, 2014)

Based on my SBGJ001 serial number that was purchased late in 2015 through a US AD it was the 66th watch of this model produced in October 2014... With the first of these watches being produced earlier in 2014. Assuming now only a couple thousand are produced and sold before the dial change I really hope GS takes off and they sell tens/hundreds of thousands of the new dial of this model. Long term, finite 'old style' oddities from a model that then becomes iconic and sold in masses tend to be coveted and capture a significant premium. Not saying that will happen here... But if it doesn't, neither the old dial nor new dial will hold any particular compelling value long term. Just saying.


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## Tseg (Mar 29, 2014)

I wonder if in the future one may be able to pay to have the old dial swapped out for a new dial during service? Not that I would do it.


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## T1meout (Sep 27, 2013)

Tseg said:


> I wonder if in the future one may be able to pay to have the old dial swapped out for a new dial during service? Not that I would do it.


I hope that in the future they still have enough old dials available so as not to have to replace the original dial with a new one during maintenance.


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## tacotom (Jan 6, 2015)

in reference to another request... not sure this is right either.


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## TightLines612 (Jun 29, 2016)

matthew P said:


> I like the new branding on the dress watches but not so much on the spring drive divers..... prefer the seiko up top on those and the clutter on the bottom half.
> 
> But I like mine on rubber so what do I know.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Great looking combo.

Who makes the strap?


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## Squeaks5635 (Mar 13, 2017)

T1meout said:


> I hope that in the future they still have enough old dials available so as not to have to replace the original dial with a new one during maintenance.


I feel like they will swap the dials if needed during maintenance for models that have had their dial changed. However, Limited Editions that will not be produced with a new style dial will likely be safe from this problem. Otherwise you would have an even more limited edition.


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## matthew P (Aug 1, 2013)

TightLines612 said:


> Great looking combo.
> 
> Who makes the strap?


It's a bonito that I shaved down from 24mm and turned inside out to not have the taper / down slope....... prefer the flat side - luckily theres no text or branding.

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## itsKibble (May 24, 2016)

I'm very much hoping they increase as a seller. But I do also agree that they will probably fall. It's a true shame.


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## robhaa (Jan 24, 2015)

Would love the prices to drop, as I'm not a fan of the balance of the new dials. 


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## Wysie (Sep 18, 2011)

I find it very amusing that watches with the old logos are being let go at lower prices actually. For one, if it's about perception, it's not like the new logo doesn't contain the word "Seiko".

Good time to get a GS if you're in the market for one I guess .


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## oldskoolbiker (Dec 31, 2009)

I was waiting to get a GS but with the old logo going out I wanted to get one of those. I hope eventually they will be worth more than the new logo, but I don't really care. I picked up a SBGA031.


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## jenyang (Oct 17, 2015)

T1meout said:


> This totally cracked me up.
> 
> My pie is tastier than yours!


Can't wait for delivery of my formerly known as grand seiko sbga001 to eat with some day old pie.

Sent from my LG-H918 using Tapatalk


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## T1meout (Sep 27, 2013)

SBGJ021, a.k.a. Purple Rain brought to you by the watch brand formerly known as Grand Seiko.

We want more pie!


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## Makhdoom (Dec 31, 2014)

I think the Lion should go up top where you usually find the famous crown, and Grand Seiko should stay at the bottom, with the stupid GS droped from the dial.


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## Tseg (Mar 29, 2014)

Makhdoom said:


> I think the Lion should go up top where you usually find the famous crown, and Grand Seiko should stay at the bottom, with the stupid GS droped from the dial.


Whoa there... the applied GS is my favorite part.


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## eresaru (Feb 17, 2017)

What I do not understand is that: 
Everyone seems to hate the new logo and text placement. The production of "old-style" watches is slowly being stoped and the SKUs are discontinued. Logic says, that everyone that is in the market for a GS will be after one of the finite number of old style watches, thus driving prices up. How come people are expecting the prices of the old ones to drop? Or is it strictly a temporary thing while ADs clear out their stock?


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## ljb187 (Nov 6, 2009)

Remove the "Grand Seiko" and "GS" and put 'em on the new models. Leave Seiko where it is on the old models and sell 'em as SARBs. Everybody wins!


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## gatormac (Apr 22, 2014)

I just snatched up one of the last SBGM027s on the market. Why? Because I have been planning to buy this in the future, but I like the old style with Seiko on top and I know the price is going to go up. So I snatched it up barely in time. Grand Seiko is for WIS types who know what they are anyway, and we know it's the same brand with simply a changing around of the logo. Plus, I enjoy the more stealthy aspect of having Seiko on top. 

I'm sure there are lots of Grand Seiko enthusiasts like me (in relative terms to this niche market), so I am not too worried about the value going down anymore than it would previously. Frankly, I think all the buzz about this change is much to do about nothing. All they have done is move Grand Seiko to the top. Big deal. I can't imagine anyone overly concerned about that wanting a GS anyway.


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## cheesa (Jun 12, 2013)

I love the new branding and have got to admit, since it was announced I have been put off buying GS watches with the old style branding. Silly I know!


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## pukka (Feb 28, 2015)

cheesa said:


> I love the new branding and have got to admit, since it was announced I have been put off buying GS watches with the old style branding. Silly I know!


Nope, I feel the same way....when I get a GS, it will be with the new branding, but that's just my choice. Plenty of people choose to prefer the Seiko branding over the new style and that's what will ultimately make the 'previous' iterations future cult classics.

Ultimately, they are both the exact same watch, it's not like GS are adding new features and compromising quality - preference is all purely down to aesthetic. Can't lose either way.


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## Allan_de_dub (Oct 18, 2016)

I think I would prefer the logo as it is on the SBGW253 but not sure if it will work as well on a more modern or sporty design.


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## ljb187 (Nov 6, 2009)

gatormac said:


> I just snatched up one of the last SBGM027s on the market. Why? Because I have been planning to buy this in the future, but I like the old style with Seiko on top...Grand Seiko is for WIS types who know what they are anyway, and we know it's the same brand with simply a changing around of the logo. Plus, I enjoy the more stealthy aspect of having Seiko on top.



I agree with you about the old style...I didn't love it, but prefer it to the new version on most models.
I disagree about it still being the same brand - clearly Seiko doesn't feel that way anymore. In 2017 there's Seiko and Grand Seiko. The latter now firmly established with aspirational pricing to allow the line to compete in the mid-luxury market with the Rolex(s) and Omegas of the watch world.
I never really got the stealthy thing either. The admirably pedestrian "Seiko" on the dial only projected a foot or so from these watches, but their shininess is noticeable across a room. I own a Casio Oceanus Manta which sparkles like Dorothy's ruby slippers, a Citizen Chronomaster with indexes that glisten like diamonds and had a Spring Drive which was comparable in presentation to a Datejust with a fluted bezel and polished center links. In fact, I bought the Citizen to be a "business watch" but found it too conspicuous...it may be "just a Citizen"...and it's a thing of beauty...but it shines and reflects more than anything short of a Harry Winston creation....hence my preference for Nomos' Orion Weiss for such purposes.


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## bluedialer (Sep 16, 2011)

ljb187 said:


> I disagree about it still being the same brand - clearly Seiko doesn't feel that way anymore. In 2017 there's Seiko and Grand Seiko. The latter now firmly established with aspirational pricing to allow the line to compete in the mid-luxury market with the Rolex(s) and Omegas of the watch world.


It's only marketing. Clearly Seiko wants to market it that way. But all they've done is move a few things on the dial, raise prices, and buy some new advertisements.
The watches are the same quality, and they are still Seiko. Like Credor are still Seikos made by Seiko Watch Corp., and there's nothing wrong with that. They are two very distinct groups within Seiko, but that has always been the case with GS. I mean we've been posting on this dedicated forum for quite some time before this "rebrand," and there's never been much question about it because there has always been a distinct difference between GS and other Seikos. They're still all Seiko watches.


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## Tseg (Mar 29, 2014)

eresaru said:


> What I do not understand is that:
> Everyone seems to hate the new logo and text placement. The production of "old-style" watches is slowly being stoped and the SKUs are discontinued. Logic says, that everyone that is in the market for a GS will be after one of the finite number of old style watches, thus driving prices up. How come people are expecting the prices of the old ones to drop? Or is it strictly a temporary thing while ADs clear out their stock?


Maybe it is apples and oranges, but I noticed the used old Tudors with 3rd party movements have declined in price significantly more than the used new in-house movement Tudors that are basically the same, but a bit fatter with more lines of text on the dial (that was met with revulsion by the watch community when launched). With that said, being a degreed economist I'm siding with your logic. I much rather have a watch that has had finite production than a nearly identical watch with unlimited production potential.


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## Tseg (Mar 29, 2014)

bluedialer said:


> But all they've done is move a few things on the dial, raise prices, and buy some new advertisements.


Bigger than what you state above, what GS has done is create fairly sizable buzz for a watch brand coming out of what has been a pretty pedestrian showing for the watch industry at Baselworld in 2017. Is it marketing? Absolutely... but the entire luxury watch market is primarily about marketing. It certainly is not going to hurt sales of the brand and I believe will significantly help it.


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## ljb187 (Nov 6, 2009)

bluedialer said:


> It's only marketing. Clearly Seiko wants to market it that way. But all they've done is move a few things on the dial, raise prices, and buy some new advertisements.
> The watches are the same quality, and they are still Seiko. Like Credor are still Seikos made by Seiko Watch Corp., and there's nothing wrong with that. They are two very distinct groups within Seiko, but that has always been the case with GS. I mean we've been posting on this dedicated forum for quite some time before this "rebrand," and there's never been much question about it because there has always been a distinct difference between GS and other Seikos. They're still all Seiko watches.


This was a great answer, but I'm still inclined to disagree. If they were all still Seiko watches they'd all still say "Seiko" on the dial. While the rebranding is still in its very early stages, I think the difference will become more pronounced over time. I do like the distinction of saying they're both made by Seiko Watch Corp since to me that's the more accurate description. Very seldom do I use car analogies, but doesn't Mercedes make both the E Class and Smart Cars? Nobody's saying the Smart Car is still a Mercedes. Following that same line of thinking, in the same way few would agree a Tudor is actually a Rolex, I'd offer the analogy works for the SBGA127 vs the SARB017. One of those watches is a now Grand Seiko while the other is just a plain ol' Seiko (I'm wearing it right now as a matter of fact).


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## ahonobaka (Jan 27, 2017)

Curious to hear what people are hearing/seeing from boutiques and AD's regarding increased buzz? In talking with a local AD, apparently many calls about "when are you getting the new dials?" were coming in as soon as they showed at Basel. Not sure if that was the AD hyping things up on top of the hype to generate interest (it is sales after all), but the impression I got is that many eyebrows were raised with the dropping of "SEIKO", and hopefully this shows to be true. New dial or not, the one thing I'd like is for GS to succeed, make more watches, and give me more things to buy for years to come! ;D


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## T1meout (Sep 27, 2013)

For a company that's attempting to hype their GS rebranding they are not really doing a good job. Neither German nor Dutch GS website has been updated with any of the new BW 2017 releases, and there is no mention whatsoever about the new direction the company has taken. Baffling. Buzz you ask? More like a whimper.


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## gatormac (Apr 22, 2014)

I like the distinction of GS vs Seiko and I always have, while still liking that they are connected. Pretty much as you say. But my point is that changing logos to different locations doesn't change that. GS are still made by the same people and places that made them before. That was already distinct. My Grand Seikos still say GS and Grand Seiko, it's just at the bottom instead of the top. The new Grand Seikos still have "Seiko" in the name. I don't disagree that it is probably good from a marketing standpoint, but my point is that fans of Grand Seiko are still going to like them either way, while they may prefer the new way or the old. I'll probably add another GS down the line and that one will be with the new logo most likely. I'm ok with that, even if I prefer the old.


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## Tseg (Mar 29, 2014)

T1meout said:


> For a company that's attempting to hype their GS rebranding they are not really doing a good job. Neither German nor Dutch GS website has been updated with any of the new BW 2017 releases, and there is no mention whatsoever about the new direction the company has taken. Baffling. Buzz you ask? More like a whimper.


Interesting... the US website is showing off in its full new glory.


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## bluedialer (Sep 16, 2011)

I'm certainly a fan of GS, don't get me wrong. I guess what I'm getting at is GS were already and have long been superb watches and distinct from other Seiko lines. An SBGA was already a Grand Seiko and distinct from a SARB. The mini hype going on now is that these same watches are now somehow different, better, higher end, "next level" so to speak, and that's only a result of marketing with no real substance in (improvements to) the product quality behind it. I have to understand that I'm looking at this as a "WIS" who already had a great appreciation for Grand Seiko, and the change was more a move to try to affect the nonWIS masses, or those WIS who still could not quite look past the "SEIKO" name on the dial (even though "Seiko" continues to be on the dial anyway) ... But in the end it's just marketing to try to reach these people, with no actual upgrade in the already "grand" product.

But it's true, it's still early in whatever Seiko is trying to do with Grand Seiko. Maybe they will make actual improvements to the product to bring actual substance into this marketed illusion of a newly elevated distinguished brand. But as of now it's all just perception and speculation while the product is basically the same thing it's always been.


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## tomatoes (Sep 13, 2012)

The exceptional quality of GS isn't going to change whatever the new
dials look like, compared to the models on their way out.

So i'm not sure what the fuss is all about in this thread.


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## T1meout (Sep 27, 2013)

Tseg said:


> Interesting... the US website is showing off in its full new glory.


I know. The US Website was updated during the launch of the new collection while BW 2017 was still in progress.


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## gatormac (Apr 22, 2014)

tomatoes said:


> The exceptional quality of GS isn't going to change whatever the new
> dials look like, compared to the models on their way out.
> 
> So i'm not sure what the fuss is all about in this thread.


Yeah, and I'm not sure what else they can do to dramatically improve the product without driving it from competing with the likes of Rolex to competing with the likes of Patek, which seems to be more of what Credor does. There are things they can do in terms of marketing though.


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## bluedialer (Sep 16, 2011)

GS isn't as good as Rolex/Omega/IWC in all ways. They have weak points they can work on.... Improve bracelets and clasps, case thickness, movement finishing (no, not asking for hand movement finishing), use of solid gold dial markers, continue to work with case engineering and materials.
And I'm sure we can all agree on this, MUCH higher quality GS dedicated after sales customer service.

There are also issues with lemons and consistency of the product. Eg. Rusting seconds hand (??), clasp alignment and inconsistent finishing (I've experienced this multiple times)


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## T1meout (Sep 27, 2013)

bluedialer said:


> GS isn't as good as Rolex/Omega/IWC in all ways. They have weak points they can work on.... Improve bracelets and clasps, case thickness, movement finishing (no, not asking for hand movement finishing), use of solid gold dial markers, continue to work with case engineering and materials.
> And I'm sure we can all agree on this, MUCH higher quality GS dedicated after sales customer service.
> 
> There are also issues with lemons and consistency of the product. Eg. Rusting seconds hand (??), clasp alignment and inconsistent finishing (I've experienced this multiple times)


Can I get an Amen!


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## pukka (Feb 28, 2015)

bluedialer said:


> GS isn't as good as Rolex/Omega/IWC in all ways. They have weak points they can work on.... Improve bracelets and clasps, case thickness, movement finishing (no, not asking for hand movement finishing), use of solid gold dial markers, continue to work with case engineering and materials.
> And I'm sure we can all agree on this, MUCH higher quality GS dedicated after sales customer service.
> 
> There are also issues with lemons and consistency of the product. Eg. Rusting seconds hand (??), clasp alignment and inconsistent finishing (I've experienced this multiple times)


I agree with everything you mentioned. I think the rebranding is a great idea to differentiate the GS brand from the mainstream Seiko line, but if it's in a effort to try to elevate it further into the mid price luxury market (see price increase), there's a lot of tiny details they need to work on to make them a truly worthy consideration alongside say, Rolex as it was already mentioned.


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## gatormac (Apr 22, 2014)

bluedialer said:


> GS isn't as good as Rolex/Omega/IWC in all ways. They have weak points they can work on....


But you can say that about anyone. In other ways they are superior to those on the list, such as case and dial finishing, movement innovation such as the spring drive, and Rolex movement finishing is nothing to get excited about. Your point is well taken though. As we have discussed, there can certainly be good outcomes from changing organizational structure, and that is a lot more significant than where words are placed on a dial.


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## bluedialer (Sep 16, 2011)

True, GS excels in ways those other brands may not. But other things I mentioned, it becomes a question of, if those "other" middle high tier brands can do this or that, then why can't GS too? Movement wise, those other brands have some pluses over GS mechanicals... It's very competitive. It all ideally drives improvement among all competitors though!


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## 1stiski (Apr 26, 2012)

Best part is , at some point I'll be able to have two versions of a solidly built watch . Bring on the new and I'll still enjoy the old .


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## Maxy (Aug 15, 2011)

*Reviving an old thread. So, its been almost a year now. So what is the consensus about the re-branding? The older Seiko - GS pieces are dropping or do they still hold their value? *


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## catlike (Aug 7, 2009)

Well I welcomed the re-branding, I always thought GS should have their own identity without the Seiko logo being the dominant text on the dial. 

Having said that, I still have my old logo Snowflake and I haven't had the slightest urge to flip it in favour of of an SBGA-211. 

Maybe I would if anyone I knew had the slightest idea that there was any difference between Seiko & Grand Seiko?........nah, I still wouldn't :-d


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## ahonobaka (Jan 27, 2017)

To be honest I haven't followed pricing, but I will say IME that retailers were quick to sell the older models aggressively last year after Basel. As the last shipments of old dials came through, and supply is now dried up, they're no longer willing to go as deep.


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## omega__1 (Sep 6, 2009)

I like pie!

Sorry, that key lime vs apple pie post made me hungry. I think the more important question is cake vs. pie. Clearly pie>>>cake. 

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


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## Lokni (Dec 14, 2017)

Timeless Luxury Watches was able to get answers from GS to a variety of questions from customers, as found in the following article. 
https://timelessluxwatches.com/reviews/tour-grand-seiko-gs-qa/

The 4th question and interpretation by the author on the dial revision follows. 

*Q: What's the feedback been on the dial revision?
*
*A: The feedback from the media as well as consumers has been, over all, very positive, especially outside Japan. In Japan, where Grand Seiko, in its old logo style, had been well recognized and established in the minds of the consumers, there have been quite a few Grand Seiko fans who rushed to buy the existing inventory of the old logo Grand Seiko out of the fear and nostalgia that such will become no longer unavailable in the near future.
*
"My take: This was one of the most frequently asked questions for GS and it's easy to see why. It's very interesting to note the difference between Japanese and non-Japanese attitudes towards the new dial style. I suspected that might have been the case, with Japanese watch collectors not sharing some of the hangups about Japanese watches as Western watch collectors."


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## Lokni (Dec 14, 2017)

5th question, answer and author comment from https://timelessluxwatches.com/reviews/tour-grand-seiko-gs-qa/

*Q: Is GS considering revising the dial again?*
_*A: At this moment, there is no such plan, even though we don't deny the possibility of adopting an old logo style for a recreation of a historical model.*_
"My take: This comment is interesting in how unambiguous it is. I'd have thought they'd have reserved all ability to change dials, but they're pretty much straightforwardly saying no, except for pieces that are honoring historical GSes (and these are quite common with a few LEs every year, so this isn't a revelation), they're going to be sticking with the new dial for a long time. If you like the old dial, therefore, go ahead and get it now. If you like the new dial, then you can probably be as patient as you'd like without fear of them going away anytime soon."


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## ten13th (Nov 2, 2013)

At end of the day the desirability of particular watch will drive the price on the pre-owned market. For high volume models just the logo alone will not have a large variance in price, as there will always be people that appreciate the authentic root of the brand that will seek out Seiko/ Grand Seiko logo watches. While some people like the cleaner dial of Grand Seiko logo watches. 

Only time will tell. 


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