# Question for Ball owners re Tritium tubes



## UofRSpider

Hello Ball owners, I have always been interested in Ball watches but do not like look of the Tritium tubes. They look out of place to me and honestly don't know why they continue using them with today's advanced lume options. I guess my question is, with the new lume options out there today, why does Ball continue to use these? I have never owned a Ball watch and have not seen the tubes in action so maybe I am missing something.

I really like several of their models, just don't care for the squared/ rectangular tubes.


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## Alysandir

UofRSpider said:


> I guess my question is, with the new lume options out there today, why does Ball continue to use these? I have never owned a Ball watch and have not seen the tubes in action so maybe I am missing something.
> 
> I really like several of their models, just don't care for the squared/ rectangular tubes.


To answer your second comment first, not every Ball watch uses the squared-off double-wide tubes; many use very thin tubes or even micro-dots.

As to why one would favor a tritium tube over, say superluminova, simply put:

1. Tritium does not need to be charged.
2. Tritium provides a constant glow that does not fade over time. 
3. While fully-charged superluminova can provide an initially more intense glow, after about an hour tritium will be the more intense of the two.
4. The tritium tubes, unlike older generations of tritium paint, can be replaced by Ball for a nominal fee (when I last spoke with Mr. Hess, the figure $35 part cost for replacing all tubes on a dial was proposed as a potential price point.

Personally, I wear my Ball in bed, whether my bed in in my bedroom, in my car, or under the stars; I never have to wonder what time it is or fumble for a flashlight. I also wear it out when I'm walking about after sundown, never having to worry about finding a streetlight. But mostly I wear my Ball because it's a tough watch that can take a beating; the tritium lume is just a bonus.

Maybe lume isn't your thing, maybe superluminova is fine for you? That's perfectly fine. For me? I prefer the reassuring glow in the dark instead of squinting with my old, terrible eyesight.

Regards,
Alysandir


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## timefleas

Alysandir covered your questions well. Today's "advanced" or "new" lume options still don't come anywhere near what a tritium tube is capable of, if you are thinking past the first hour or two in darkness. Some Ball designs accentuate the look and shape of the T-tube, while others have designs where you hardly notice them at all (I prefer the more obscure variations myself)--so, there are choices--but it sounds like you already have you mind made up--if you like the look of some of the watches, but don't like the tritium tubes, then Ball is probably not the best watch for you.


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## Nokie

Ball has a very extensive model line, so look around as some of their tritium placements on the dials are not as prominent as others.


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## UofRSpider

Thanks for the responses. The major problem is, I have no AD anywhere near me...I am definitely not flying blind and ordering one from the internet - I want to see and feel the watches and feel their robustness, hands on. I have bought several quality timepieces through internet sales and luckily haven't made a mistake, yet.

I totally like some of their models and they really speak to me (from a damn computer screen).


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## Fatz028

Your best bet would call Martin Pulli in Philadelphia. He would be able to help you out. He might be able to email you multiple pics of the one you want. Rob from Topper Jewelers could also help you. I can grantee you that they are not flimsy watches and are very solid. I own 3 in the Trainmaster line and they are more of a dress watch and they feel solid. I could only imagine what what the other lines are like.


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## Alysandir

UofRSpider said:


> Thanks for the responses. The major problem is, I have no AD anywhere near me...I am definitely not flying blind and ordering one from the internet - I want to see and feel the watches and feel their robustness, hands on. I have bought several quality timepieces through internet sales and luckily haven't made a mistake, yet.
> 
> I totally like some of their models and they really speak to me (from a damn computer screen).


If you're in northern VA, there's an AD in Gambrills MD. Beltway, 50 east, 3 north. Little Treasury Jewelers. Ask for Chris.

Regards,
Alysandir


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## samanator

UofRSpider said:


> Hello Ball owners, I have always been interested in Ball watches but do not like look of the Tritium tubes. They look out of place to me and honestly don't know why they continue using them with today's advanced lume options. I guess my question is, with the new lume options out there today, why does Ball continue to use these? I have never owned a Ball watch and have not seen the tubes in action so maybe I am missing something.
> 
> I really like several of their models, just don't care for the squared/ rectangular tubes.


You mention other options, but do you realize all of those have a shorter life span than the GTLS tubes by almost 30%. GTLS are the standard for high end gun sites and any application were illumination must be guaranteed. The better question would be why aren't more other brands using this technology. I pretty much have had or do own every low, medium and high end diver made. The only two of the current crop of conventional lume watches that can almost match the through the night lume are the Pelagos (which will last twice as long any Seiko) and the BP fifty Fathoms Bathyscape. The ROLEX Explorer II will also, but not a diver. Every GTLS watch will best everything else. By best I'm not talking about seconds after charging(and doesn't it bother you that you have to charge it?), but 1 2 or 3 hours after charging. Not really the torch you think it is? I don't think there is a single conventional lume watch that can match a Ball one hour after charging. Look for all the over time multi watch photo sets that have been posted over the years. After 30 minutes most of those barely register. So again I asked why do others not use the vastly superior technology?


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## samanator

UofRSpider said:


> Thanks for the responses. The major problem is, I have no AD anywhere near me...I am definitely not flying blind and ordering one from the internet - I want to see and feel the watches and feel their robustness, hands on. I have bought several quality timepieces through internet sales and luckily haven't made a mistake, yet.
> 
> I totally like some of their models and they really speak to me (from a damn computer screen).


Our forum sponsor is know for being the best to deal with. Call Rob at Toppers and talk with him. He is pretty good at guiding people to the right watch.


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## voiceman

I have owned a Ball Skindiver with the thick tritium tubes and a Trainmaster with thin, short tubes and love the remarkable lume. Both very solid pieces and extremely comfortable on the wrist. I never found the look of the tubes to be distracting and I actually like the accents they lend to the overall look of the watch.


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## crash525

UofRSpider said:


> Hello Ball owners, I have always been interested in Ball watches but do not like look of the Tritium tubes. They look out of place to me and honestly don't know why they continue using them with today's advanced lume options. I guess my question is, with the new lume options out there today, why does Ball continue to use these? I have never owned a Ball watch and have not seen the tubes in action so maybe I am missing something.
> 
> I really like several of their models, just don't care for the squared/ rectangular tubes.


Sorry if this is out of place but i just purchased two deep blue watches with tritium tubes. One t25 round and the other t100 square. Both work remarkably well at night and low to moderate light situations. I can understand the tubes might look out of place but they have there need in watches.

This is what i saw with my eyes no photo adjustment. This juat gives a good indication on how bright it will be all the time. In day light when the tubes are not visibly glowing they are not to noticeable.


















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## umarrajs

Having owned more than 2 dozen watches over one time or other...........in the lume department, nothing come close to Ball tubes...........in fact this is one reason which attracts me to Ball. No other Swiss manufacturer in the same price range is using this type of lume. The second best (way down the road) lume has been Seiko Prospex Marinemaster Professional (aka Darth Tuna).


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## crash525

umarrajs said:


> Having owned more than 2 dozen watches over one time or other...........in the lume department, nothing come close to Ball tubes...........in fact this is one reason which attracts me to Ball. No other Swiss manufacturer in the same price range is using this type of lume. The second best (way down the road) lume has been Seiko Prospex Marinemaster Professional (aka Darth Tuna).


Do you by chance have another tritium watch to compare it to? I always hear that ball has the best tritium and seen it compared online but it is hard to determine if the photos are adjusted or not.

I had seen a youtube review of a t100 flat tube deepblue and they said the lume was not bright. I see mine and think alot different but i dont have much to compare it to.

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## timefleas

I had a Deep Blue with T100 and the tubes on that were just as bright as on my Fireman Night Train DLC II, also with T100--obviously I didn't do an objective luminosity reading, but to my eyes, there was little to distinguish between them, in terms of brightness. However, the Ball provides tritium AND an outstanding case, dial & movement combo--that's where Deep Blue comes up short, but then they (DB) are catering to a different, lower priced market.


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## Sixracer

I find a big difference between my Balls watches. Perhaps is it driven by the color? My first, the Fireman Night Train blew my mind. I was a little surprised the DLC Glow seemed so much dimmer. The Skin Diver is bright enough but still doesn't compare to the Night Train.

DLC Glow................Ski Diver..................Night Train









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## Ducati_Fiend

I recently purchased a new Engineer GMT magnate and I have to say I'm extremely disappointed with the tritium lume on this model. The build quality and fit/finish is top notch but the lume is horrible. The only thing I own that I can compare it too is a Deep blue with T100 tubes and it glows very bright. Despite this lume issue I intend to hold on to the watch as it is extremely well built and very nice looking.


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## GreatScott

My dive master has remarkable lume as well, I had the same concerns with the squared off numbers and now i hardly notice it. I now wish I had discovered it years ago. My only concern is how long it will last, I know it states 25 years but I hear it fades over time, does anyone know how long before it becomes average lume?


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## Ducati_Fiend

GreatScott said:


> My dive master has remarkable lume as well, I had the same concerns with the squared off numbers and now i hardly notice it. I now wish I had discovered it years ago. My only concern is how long it will last, I know it states 25 years but I hear it fades over time, does anyone know how long before it becomes average lume?


I can tell you that the Deep blue I mentioned in the post just above yours is 9 years old and I cant tell any difference at all


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## samanator

Ducati_Fiend said:


> I can tell you that the Deep blue I mentioned in the post just above yours is 9 years old and I cant tell any difference at all


Is that true. I believe Deep Blue did not make GTLS watches until 2010-2011.

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## Sixracer

Since we are talking tritium the life question is pretty easy to answer. 

The tubes glow due to tritium gas in the tubes throw off beta particles that hit a lume paint inside the tube. (Don't worry, the beta particles can only penetrate a few millimeters of air let alone a steel case and sapphire crystal) 

Tritium has a half life of 12.3 years. So it will throw off 1/2 the beta particles in 12 years and be half as bright. In 24 years it will be 1/4 as bright as new.

I have a 1991 Marathon Navigator that is dim but still glows...about 1/4 what it used to. It is enough for night time viewing. 




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## Alysandir

Ducati_Fiend said:


> I recently purchased a new Engineer GMT magnate and I have to say I'm extremely disappointed with the tritium lume on this model. The build quality and fit/finish is top notch but the lume is horrible. The only thing I own that I can compare it too is a Deep blue with T100 tubes and it glows very bright. Despite this lume issue I intend to hold on to the watch as it is extremely well built and very nice looking.


For my personal curiosity, is your GMT Magnate marked on the dial as "T<25" or "T" at roughly the 7:30-8:00 part of the dial? This marking states the concentration of the luminous material with "T<25" indicating less than 25 parts per million and "T" as less than 100 parts per million. (Some early Ball dials will be marked "T<100" which is a mistake, but means essentially the same as "T")

The reason I ask is that T<25 is noticeably dimmer than T, so that may be the reason your Ball doesn't floor you compared to the Deep Blue with T tubes. (Ball makes T<25 because that's the highest that's permitted in many markets, plus some consumers prefer a less vibrant lume.)

Regards,
Alysandir


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## Ducati_Fiend

samanator said:


> Is that true. I believe Deep Blue did not make GTLS watches until 2010-2011.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


It's possible that I bought it in 2010 but I could have swore that it was 2008/2009. Anyway, I rarely wear it but I took it fishing the other night and it's still a torch.


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## Ducati_Fiend

Alysandir said:


> For my personal curiosity, is your GMT Magnate marked on the dial as "T<25" or "T" at roughly the 7:30-8:00 part of the dial? This marking states the concentration of the luminous material with "T<25" indicating less than 25 parts per million and "T" as less than 100 parts per million. (Some early Ball dials will be marked "T<100" which is a mistake, but means essentially the same as "T")
> 
> The reason I ask is that T<25 is noticeably dimmer than T, so that may be the reason your Ball doesn't floor you compared to the Deep Blue with T tubes. (Ball makes T<25 because that's the highest that's permitted in many markets, plus some consumers prefer a less vibrant lume.)
> 
> Regards,
> Alysandir


Well, That explains it. T25. Love the watch but it sure is dim. Thanks for the input Alysandir! I tried to post a pic but I don't have enough posts


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## Alysandir

Ducati_Fiend said:


> Well, That explains it. T25. Love the watch but it sure is dim. Thanks for the input Alysandir! I tried to post a pic but I don't have enough posts


I imagine that the comparison is something like this?









Regards,
Alysandir


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## Ducati_Fiend

Alysandir said:


> I imagine that the comparison is something like this?
> 
> View attachment 11086914
> 
> 
> Regards,
> Alysandir


Yep, maybe even a little dimmer than that pic shows. This watch was a grey market buy. My timegrapher has it running perfectly @0+/-. Another odd thing is the COSC certificate is from 2008. I assume that is the movement before it was ever put into the watch. I may look into having the tubes replaced with T100's. Supposedly it's not that expensive (Around $400 according to the guy at Ball I talked to)


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## GreatScott

Sixracer said:


> Since we are talking tritium the life question is pretty easy to answer.
> 
> The tubes glow due to tritium gas in the tubes throw off beta particles that hit a lume paint inside the tube. (Don't worry, the beta particles can only penetrate a few millimeters of air let alone a steel case and sapphire crystal)
> 
> Tritium has a half life of 12.3 years. So it will throw off 1/2 the beta particles in 12 years and be half as bright. In 24 years it will be 1/4 as bright as new.
> 
> I have a 1991 Marathon Navigator that is dim but still glows...about 1/4 what it used to. It is enough for night time viewing.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


thanks!


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## Alysandir

Ducati_Fiend said:


> Yep, maybe even a little dimmer than that pic shows. This watch was a grey market buy. My timegrapher has it running perfectly @0+/-. Another odd thing is the COSC certificate is from 2008. I assume that is the movement before it was ever put into the watch. I may look into having the tubes replaced with T100's. Supposedly it's not that expensive (Around $400 according to the guy at Ball I talked to)


My understanding is that all COSC certificates are issued for uncased movements.

As for having the tubes replaced, that's an interesting bit of information, as my understanding is that no one knows yet exactly what the cost will be. When I had the pleasure of meeting Mr. Hess last year, he said then that he didn't know what the replacement cost would be, but thought it would be nominal (he mentioned a figure under 100 USD). But he did make it clear that it's a service that Ball intends to offer; I just don't know of any case yet where someone's actually submitted it for that service yet.

One concern I would have is that they may not be agreeable to installing T tubes in a T<25 watch because then the marking on the dial would be incorrect and that could ultimately get them into trouble. That's a question I would definitely ask them before sending your watch off.

Regards,
Alysandir


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## crash525

Ducati_Fiend said:


> Yep, maybe even a little dimmer than that pic shows. This watch was a grey market buy. My timegrapher has it running perfectly @0+/-. Another odd thing is the COSC certificate is from 2008. I assume that is the movement before it was ever put into the watch. I may look into having the tubes replaced with T100's. Supposedly it's not that expensive (Around $400 according to the guy at Ball I talked to)


My t25 deepblue watch seems brighter. Could there be a discrepancy in how the tritium tu es are made or from different manufacturers?

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## Ducati_Fiend

Alysandir said:


> My understanding is that all COSC certificates are issued for uncased movements.
> 
> As for having the tubes replaced, that's an interesting bit of information, as my understanding is that no one knows yet exactly what the cost will be. When I had the pleasure of meeting Mr. Hess last year, he said then that he didn't know what the replacement cost would be, but thought it would be nominal (he mentioned a figure under 100 USD). But he did make it clear that it's a service that Ball intends to offer; I just don't know of any case yet where someone's actually submitted it for that service yet.
> 
> One concern I would have is that they may not be agreeable to installing T tubes in a T<25 watch because then the marking on the dial would be incorrect and that could ultimately get them into trouble. That's a question I would definitely ask them before sending your watch off.
> 
> Regards,
> Alysandir


You are correct, The Ball rep told me on the phone that it would be a full service and he said that I should think twice about it because sometimes when you get it back it may not be running as accurately as when you sent it in. I'm sure it would still have to be within COSC spec's though. He didn't ask about the T25 deal but if I ever decide to deal with the tubes I'll check first. Thanks for your assistance!

Regards,
Ted


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## drewhenson

Tritium tubes are the way to go. I wish more watches had tritium. Waaay better than the quick fading stuff that's used today.


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## Collectionist




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## ChuckMiller

It's been so long ago but I think I bought my first Ball from them. The original gen1 Night Train.



Alysandir said:


> If you're in northern VA, there's an AD in Gambrills MD. Beltway, 50 east, 3 north. Little Treasury Jewelers. Ask for Chris.
> 
> Regards,
> Alysandir


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## Ard

UofRSpider said:


> I have never owned a Ball watch and have not seen the tubes in action so maybe I am missing something.
> 
> I really like several of their models, just don't care for the squared/ rectangular tubes.


You are indeed missing something and it is possible you are looking too close to find something you don't like. I won't attempt to convince you that the markers / tritium tubes are for you but they are as much a part of a Ball watch as the 5 point crown logo is to a Sub or Date-just.

My tubes are way cool, especially after dark


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## morrison2951

You can't miss this! 

Others also posted in the Tritium Showcase thread.


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## morrison2951

ChuckMiller said:


> It's been so long ago but I think I bought my first Ball from them. The original gen1 Night Train.


Hey Chuck- good to see that you are still on the Ball Forum.

It was actually Vera's Fine Jewelers in Midlothian, Va where you and I literally found the last NIB Gen 1 UTC tri color Night Trains as I still have it and the paperwork.

I also purchased a Gen1 43mm tri color Fireman on SS from them as well. Sadly, they are no longer a Ball AD as I'm told.


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## ChuckMiller

morrison2951 said:


> Hey Chuck- good to see that you are still on the Ball Forum.
> 
> It was actually Vera's Fine Jewelers in Midlothian, Va where you and I literally found the last NIB Gen 1 UTC tri color Night Trains as I still have it and the paperwork.
> 
> I also purchased a Gen1 43mm tri color Fireman on SS from them as well. Sadly, they are no longer a Ball AD as I'm told.


YES, Vera's, wow, the memories. Until last week I was maintaining with just one Ball but everyone needs a pair so I ordered the new model Moon Phase.

If you would, post a pic of your gen-1 tri-color Fireman.


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## morrison2951

ChuckMiller said:


> YES, Vera's, wow, the memories. Until last week I was maintaining with just one Ball but everyone needs a pair so I ordered the new model Moon Phase.
> 
> If you would, post a pic of your gen-1 tri-color Fireman.


Just the lume shot right now- it's the white dial version on SS and what I had considered as the closest resemblance to the vintage Ball watches.


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## morrison2951

ChuckMiller said:


> YES, Vera's, wow, the memories. Until last week I was maintaining with just one Ball but everyone needs a pair so I ordered the new model Moon Phase.
> 
> If you would, post a pic of your gen-1 tri-color Fireman.


Here you go- classy.


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## ChuckMiller

That looks great. Personally I am a big fan of white dials with dark numbers and hands. For my eyes its the best contrast and legibility. Don't ever sell that one.



morrison2951 said:


> Here you go- classy.
> View attachment 11612898


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## morrison2951

I won't. It really reminds me of the vintage Ball watches right down to the black circular hour markers and it has the blue tubes to boot! 

Sorry for the blurry picture that doesn't do it justice.


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## samanator

Since I like people to understand this Lume I need to correct a few statements in this thread ironically from the Deep Blue owners. Deep Blue as a company has a habit of bad information with regards to the tubes. Understand there are no such things as T (T100 for non Ball watches) and T25tubes. They are all the same. These ratings are the total content as tritium for the watch and these are the applicable license for that level. T25 is zero the 25 mci of tritium, and T/T100 is greater than 25 mci and less than 100mci of tritium. 


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## ChuckMiller

samanator said:


> Since I like people to understand this Lume I need to correct a few statements


Thank you for that, Michael.


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## zoobilz

Wow, interesting thread... I am trying to get an estimate on re- luming my new used EHC from about ?2008. LOVe the watch, but was disappointed re: the level of brightness compar d to several other older lower end watch s I have including luminox. The Ball is barely visible next to it. I haven't been able to get even a ballpark estimate on costs from Ball, and can barely get a response to my inquiries. I'd love to have my watch serviced and the tubes replaced, but not for $1000 as the original poster was indicating f I understood. Has anyone actually had a tune up and re-lume done? Can you share cost and turn around time?


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## Alan From New York

If all tritium is equally bright, why does Ball make some watches with T25 and some T?


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## samanator

Alan From New York said:


> If all tritium is equally bright, why does Ball make some watches with T25 and some T?


These are licenses for content. If you use a higher number of tubes you have a higher tritium content for the watch. The best way to illustrate this are the Standard Spacemaster (T25) and the Spacemaster X-lume (T). The tubes on the indexes and hands on the standard Spacemaster are identical to those on the X-lume. The difference is the X-lume has tubes also for all the second marks between the index that push it well into T limit. They are the same brightness and the exact same tubes where shared between the two watches. One just has a whole bunch of extra tubes. You can also get there with fewer numbers, but bigger tubes in size like on the EMII Aviator that has larger tubes. Sometimes it a combination of both size and number. Also remember in some cases between a T25 and a T watch a single tube could make it one or the other. The License used is based on total Tritium content for the watch so any fraction over 25mci will make a T25 watch a T watch. Very few come near the 100mci limit. Some of the higher tritium content watches are the mentioned Spacemaster X-lume, Storm Chaser DLC Glow, Aviator, Aviator Dual time, and both the 43mm and the 46mm versions of the Night Train which was one of the first T watches.

Spacemaster X-Lume









Standard Spacemaster on the left (note it only has tubes on the hands, the pip, and the 5 minute indexes)









Spacemaster X-Lume lit up...count the 80 tubes









The EMII Aviator Dual Time on the Left and the Fireman Storm Chaser DLC Glow on the right


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## Alan From New York

samanator said:


> Spacemaster X-Lume
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Standard Spacemaster on the left (note it only has tubes on the hands, the pip, and the 5 minute indexes)
> 
> Spacemaster X-Lume lit up...count the 80 tubes


Ordered a Captain Poindexter today. Very impressed with those 80 tubes.


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## ac7ss

I don't care for the tritium numbers on a dial, they look too much like LEDs, I have the Fireman Night Train II and using the 75 tubes, it looks like a normal watch in the light, but casts shadows in the dark. 

This is my first tritium watch, I have 10 year old tritium sights on my sidearm though so I know what to expect over time. It leaves the other watches in the dark. They can be seen after 8 hours, but nothing like this.


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## Herman65

I just received mine today. (Ball Engineer HydroCarbon Magnate) and very disappointed in the lume as well. My Fireman Enterprise had much better lume and thought the Magnate would be the same. If it weren't for the amazing build quality and fit, I'd flip it. Just too awesome a watch not to keep.


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## paintingtiger

Herman65 said:


> I just received mine today. (Ball Engineer HydroCarbon Magnate) and very disappointed in the lume as well. My Fireman Enterprise had much better lume and thought the Magnate would be the same. If it weren't for the amazing build quality and fit, I'd flip it. Just too awesome a watch not to keep.


Let's see it. How about a wrist shot?


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## wickets

agree...hide in a closet and take pics!!


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## KeepTime

The only non-tritium watch I own that comes close to Ball's lume is my OG Citizen EcoZilla. I can pull the Citizen from my nightstand drawer after DAYS in the dark, and still tell the time in pitch black. If it's been "charged" in sunlight within 24 hours, it will glow almost as bright as the T tubes, all night. 

In terms of standard lume, the best watches I own are:

Citizen Eco 300m diver
Breitling Hercules
Bulova Chronograph (unknown model)

The worst lume:

Invicta oris copy
Invicta Bolt
Invicta breitling copy
(Notice a pattern?)


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## Tycho Brahe

I think you’d be hard pressed to tell whether there was lume or tritium on these indicies .....until it was several hours into darkness that is!


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## Mgmcaleer

I just bought my first Ball watch, a Skindiver I. I need glasses to read but when I wear the Ball watch to bed, and wake in the dark, I can read what time it is because of the AMAZING lume on this watch. I am amazed how bright and clear it is. I have never had a watch this bright and clear in the dark. The tritium tubes are a big plus to me.


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## Mgmcaleer

The lume on those watches just blows me away. My next Ball will have ~80 tubes. I love it.



samanator said:


> These are licenses for content. If you use a higher number of tubes you have a higher tritium content for the watch. The best way to illustrate this are the Standard Spacemaster (T25) and the Spacemaster X-lume (T). The tubes on the indexes and hands on the standard Spacemaster are identical to those on the X-lume. The difference is the X-lume has tubes also for all the second marks between the index that push it well into T limit. They are the same brightness and the exact same tubes where shared between the two watches. One just has a whole bunch of extra tubes. You can also get there with fewer numbers, but bigger tubes in size like on the EMII Aviator that has larger tubes. Sometimes it a combination of both size and number. Also remember in some cases between a T25 and a T watch a single tube could make it one or the other. The License used is based on total Tritium content for the watch so any fraction over 25mci will make a T25 watch a T watch. Very few come near the 100mci limit. Some of the higher tritium content watches are the mentioned Spacemaster X-lume, Storm Chaser DLC Glow, Aviator, Aviator Dual time, and both the 43mm and the 46mm versions of the Night Train which was one of the first T watches.
> 
> Spacemaster X-Lume
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Standard Spacemaster on the left (note it only has tubes on the hands, the pip, and the 5 minute indexes)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Spacemaster X-Lume lit up...count the 80 tubes
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The EMII Aviator Dual Time on the Left and the Fireman Storm Chaser DLC Glow on the right


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## ChuckMiller

Mgmcaleer said:


> The lume on those watches just blows me away. My next Ball will have ~80 tubes. I love it.


Which one is next?


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## Sixracer

More pics of my Balls...
Fireman Storm Chaser DLC Glow, Skindiver 
Engineer Master II Skindiver, Trainmaster DLC. 
(All have "T" designation on dial)

Love the tritium, though I wish the hands had double tubes or something to give them a bit more pop vs the indices. The bezel on the Skindiver, wow!










Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Precise

I have a dozen tritium watches, but the tubes on the hour and minute hand on my brand new Ball Hydrocarbon NEDU diver are just too narrow. I expect more visibility for a diver. And my Deep Blue tritium puts my new NEDU to shame.


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## 13gsc13

I agree with Sixracer - they need double tubes or brighter tubes on the hands - sometimes hard to distinguish in the dark
Sold all my Balls and have gone to Deep Blue because of their readability in the dark


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## 13gsc13

Sorry for double post


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## kennylorenzo

I have a Deep Blue Scuba Diver T100 and the tubes are outstanding.


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## excelerater

Alysandir said:


> To answer your second comment first, not every Ball watch uses the squared-off double-wide tubes; many use very thin tubes or even micro-dots.
> 
> As to why one would favor a tritium tube over, say superluminova, simply put:
> 
> 1. Tritium does not need to be charged.
> 2. Tritium provides a constant glow that does not fade over time.
> 3. While fully-charged superluminova can provide an initially more intense glow, after about an hour tritium will be the more intense of the two.
> 4. The tritium tubes, unlike older generations of tritium paint, can be replaced by Ball for a nominal fee (when I last spoke with Mr. Hess, the figure $35 part cost for replacing all tubes on a dial was proposed as a potential price point.
> 
> Personally, I wear my Ball in bed, whether my bed in in my bedroom, in my car, or under the stars; I never have to wonder what time it is or fumble for a flashlight. I also wear it out when I'm walking about after sundown, never having to worry about finding a streetlight. But mostly I wear my Ball because it's a tough watch that can take a beating; the tritium lume is just a bonus.
> 
> Maybe lume isn't your thing, maybe superluminova is fine for you? That's perfectly fine. For me? I prefer the reassuring glow in the dark instead of squinting with my old, terrible eyesight.
> 
> Regards,
> Alysandir


How long do the Tritium tubes stay bright?

My understanding is they have a "halflife" of 10-12 years


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## Sixracer

See my earlier post:



Sixracer said:


> Since we are talking tritium the life question is pretty easy to answer.
> 
> The tubes glow due to tritium gas in the tubes throw off beta particles that hit a lume paint inside the tube. (Don't worry, the beta particles can only penetrate a few millimeters of air let alone a steel case and sapphire crystal)
> 
> Tritium has a half life of 12.3 years. So it will throw off 1/2 the beta particles in 12 years and be half as bright. In 24 years it will be 1/4 as bright as new.
> 
> I have a 1991 Marathon Navigator that is dim but still glows...about 1/4 what it used to. It is enough for night time viewing.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## vulcan666

I got a Ball watch, a Trainmaster Eternity, just to be a nighttime watch. I put it on a NATO strap so it's comfortable at night. I just love throwing it on and being able to read the time all night.

But the darn thing is so nice-looking that I want to wear it in the day too. I'm putting it back on its nice leather strap, and getting a cheap Isobrite with tritium for nighttime duty.

I know the OP has received plenty of answers but will just add my 2 cents, that tritium is absolutely the best night-watch solution because you don't have to charge it to read it hours (or years) later. Until the tubes wear out, it's lit all the time! No mucking about with holding your lumed watch up to a light or blasting it with UV to get a glow that might last to 3 am.


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## k9shag

My Ball Fireman II is almost completely dim. Not sure why or if it is worth the cost of replacing.


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## ChuckMiller

k9shag said:


> My Ball Fireman II is almost completely dim. Not sure why or if it is worth the cost of replacing.


Yowza, how old is it?


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## k9shag

ChuckMiller said:


> Yowza, how old is it?


Not sure I am not the original owner. Is there a way to tell the age?


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## k9shag

ChuckMiller said:


> Yowza, how old is it?


Not sure I am not the original owner. Is there a way to tell the age?


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## timefleas

k9shag said:


> My Ball Fireman II is almost completely dim. Not sure why or if it is worth the cost of replacing.


Can you provide a picture? I can tell you the age if you do. Likely what you have is a second generation Fireman--they came out in 2009 and were in production for a couple of years. Since they have green tritium, which is the strongest color, they shouldn't be "dim" at this stage. They do look dim when compared to luminova especially in the first hour or so, but well into the night, they should still beat out everything. In the following link, a review I did here a decade ago, you can see the Fireman I and II. I still have the Fireman I, and it still is my night time watch (movies, etc.) and it hails from a few years earlier than the II, having past it's "half life" last year.

You can compare the night shot of my Fireman I, which I took five minutes ago, with the shot in the review--same watch, but the one below is ten years later (it is now 13 years old).

https://www.watchuseek.com/f239/due...d-generation-ball-fireman-watches-286027.html


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## k9shag




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## k9shag

sorry dupe


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## timefleas

Yours is indeed the second generation Fireman, about ten years old. Your shot is unusually dark and with no associated dial elements visible isn't really a fair depiction of its brightness--it makes the lume look weaker than it actually is, rather than depicting it naturally--by having the background unusually dark, the foreground (tritium tubes) have been darkened as well. Best lume shot would be that watch alongside a luminova-lumed watch taken after both have been sitting in the dark for at least 5 hours, with a longer exposure and/or larger aperture--if the Ball isn't noticeably brighter than the superluminova, then you have a problem, and a quite unusual one at that. Many people expect tritium to be bright--it's not, it is more understated than luminova, especially in the first hour or two after being immersed in darkness, but it should beat everything out by the end of the night--those rated at T25 (such as the Fireman I and II) do look "dim" at first glance, since T25 is far weaker than the brighter T100, as discussed and illustrated extensively earlier in this old thread.


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## wickets

k9shag said:


> sorry dupe


I have an ohio whose brightness is similar to yours... If you want a new watch with lighthouse type brightness I totally get it, but your fireman is quite decent all things considered


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## monster623az

So does Ball actually replace tubes on older watches? It is stated here in the beggining of the thread but hear different stories searching elsewhere.


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## timefleas

Yes, they do, and so do other companies--also as noted earlier in this thread. Ball may actually replace the entire dial, when available, but for older watches, tube replacement is possible.


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## Hoots

Never sell your Balls!


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## wgarbo

All, 

OK.

Tube replacement cost. I've searched for the last hour and have not found any sort of somewhat definitive answer. So, what would it cost to replace the tubes in a Ball Fireman Storm Chaser Pro Panda dial chronograph? If I've missed something in my search, I apologize. 

Best


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## BundyBear

wgarbo said:


> All,
> 
> OK.
> 
> Tube replacement cost. I've searched for the last hour and have not found any sort of somewhat definitive answer. So, what would it cost to replace the tubes in a Ball Fireman Storm Chaser Pro Panda dial chronograph? If I've missed something in my search, I apologize.
> 
> Best


Yes, you're doing it wrong. This same question has been asked multiple times and was answered within this thread.

Because people don't have the exact same watch as yours, it is quoted to be from USD$400 up to US$1,000 if the whole dial is replaced and includes service.

Our long time member @timefleas posted elsewhere the following;



timefleas said:


> If they (Ball) have the dial, they may switch it out, if not, then the tubes are replaced. Ball is not the only company that can install new tubes--I had one of my watches "re-tubed" by Bonding Co Ltd in Hong Kong. Wherever you go, the tubes are usually about $20 apiece, plus the cost of opening up the watch--Ball will usually require a complete movement overhaul when doing this, other places will only do so if you ask. Bonding allowed me to choose my own color scheme for the new tubes, Ball will usually use the existing scheme.


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## Jim Smyth

To the original OP. I bought my Ball because of the tritium tubes. Its so cool to go from normal to low/no lighting with no degradation to viewing the time.


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## wgarbo

Tube replacement for $400-$1000 does help me-thank you. I guess searching for an hour ain't enough. Sorry everyone.


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## Sixracer

I think I may have said earlier in this thread, the half life of tritium is 12.3 yrs. When the tritium in the tubes throws off an electron it excites a pigment making it glow. Bottom line is I doubt you would need a replacement for a decade or two.

I have a Marathon with tritium circa 1991. After 29 yrs it still glows visibly enough at night. About 1/4 it's original after ~2 half-lives.

Now for a few gratuitous pictures:
Skindiver:







29yr old Marathon








Night Train


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## morrison2951

Love the Night Train! Still have mine.


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## CMY21

My new Engineer M Marvelight, untouched photo in total darkness. Love it......


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## morrison2951

Sweet! Green definitely is the brightest for the tubes.


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## hogwldfltr

I'm not certain about tritium induced luminosity; with Super-Luminova the brightness by color is as shown below.


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## jkingrph

I have on old Wyler watch my parents got me when I was in jr high school back about 1958. It had a lum that seemed to last all night. At that time it was a small amount of radium in the paint. Looking at a history of lum, it was banned about 1968,

Here's a link to the history of lume.

https://gearpatrol.com/2017/02/13/how-watch-lume-works/


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## attila350

UofRSpider said:


> Hello Ball owners, I have always been interested in Ball watches but do not like look of the Tritium tubes. They look out of place to me and honestly don't know why they continue using them with today's advanced lume options. I guess my question is, with the new lume options out there today, why does Ball continue to use these? I have never owned a Ball watch and have not seen the tubes in action so maybe I am missing something.
> 
> I really like several of their models, just don't care for the squared/ rectangular tubes.


You are definitely missing the point, now with the T100 tubes it's almost like having a flashlight on your wrist. Not recommended for sniper's working at night...


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## attila350

drewhenson said:


> Tritium tubes are the way to go. I wish more watches had tritium. Waaay better than the quick fading stuff that's used today.


You got that right, I wish I could get them on my Rolex, and a few of my other favorites, especially on my Tutima,also on a few of my fishing watches...


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