# ETA precidrive movements.



## seikokiller (Mar 20, 2013)

Hello.

I know these movements can be found in the certina DS2, in both a three hander and a chrono, and a couple of other certina chronos (that's where I first discovered the word precidrive), but surely certina can't be the only brand employing these movements?

Looking at the ETA website, they seem to currently have 22 movements they are calling precidrive out of the 92 quartz movements they produce in total. Surely we'll start seeing these in more watches? Or are they already in watches, and I just don't know about it?

ETA SA Manufacture Horlogère Suisse: Products

Frankly I wouldn't be surprised, given how little marketing certina seem to have done with their precidrive watches. With the information available online between certina and their retailers, you'd struggle to figure out these even were thermocompensated quartz.

Anyone have any information about watches using these, or care to speculate about how common these might be in future?

I certainly hope we see stuff from other swatch group brands using these movements.


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## ronalddheld (May 5, 2005)

Have you done any searches in this forum?


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## seikokiller (Mar 20, 2013)

ronalddheld said:


> Have you done any searches in this forum?


A quick one yes.

Sorry if I missed anything.

Lots of threads discussing the Certina watches I'm aware of, and a thread asking if the precidrive movements are thermocompensated (which they clearly are), but nobody asking or answering my question.

Which would be: are these movements currently being used in any other watches, or does anybody have any information to suggest they will be, or care to speculate on this?

it seems strange to me that there are so many precidrive movements available, but only three or four watches made by one brand using them at present.


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## chris01 (Jan 5, 2011)

seikokiller said:


> Hello.
> 
> I know these movements can be found in the certina DS2, in both a three hander and a chrono, and a couple of other certina chronos (that's where I first discovered the word precidrive), but surely certina can't be the only brand employing these movements?
> 
> ...


Puzzling, isn't it? Considering that ETA were supposed to be withdrawing the sale of their movements to companies outside the Swatch Group, what on earth are they going to do with them? The other mid- and high-range SG companies have very few quartz watches left in their inventory, so is it all down to Certina, with their very patchy marketing? It's hard to believe that the average buyer of one of the fashion brands, or a plastic Swatch, is going to give a **** about thermocompensation.


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## Sabresoft (Dec 1, 2010)

chris01 said:


> Puzzling, isn't it? Considering that ETA were supposed to be withdrawing the sale of their movements to companies outside the Swatch Group, what on earth are they going to do with them? The other mid- and high-range SG companies have very few quartz watches left in their inventory, so is it all down to Certina, with their very patchy marketing? It's hard to believe that the average buyer of one of the fashion brands, or a plastic Swatch, is going to give a **** about thermocompensation.


I'm not sure if the restrictions on sales of movements applies to quartz or just their mechanical range.

ChristopherWard has been adding new TC models and so must be able to acquire them. The disappearance of TC models from brands like ML and Chopard is probably due more to a tendency towards mechanical movements only and a failure to appreciate that many buyers of quartz watches do so because they appreciate the better accuracy of quartz, or the superior accuracy of TC.

This emphasis on the charm of mechanical watches may be paying dividends to watch companies right now, but if attitudes of buyers change in the coming years many companies may regret not having invested some effort in a credible line of quartz, and especially TC quartz models.

Breitling has the right idea. They only sell COSC certified watches, both mechanical and quartz. I just wish they did a quartz version of the Navitimer.


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## seikokiller (Mar 20, 2013)

chris01 said:


> Puzzling, isn't it? Considering that ETA were supposed to be withdrawing the sale of their movements to companies outside the Swatch Group, what on earth are they going to do with them? The other mid- and high-range SG companies have very few quartz watches left in their inventory, so is it all down to Certina, with their very patchy marketing? It's hard to believe that the average buyer of one of the fashion brands, or a plastic Swatch, is going to give a **** about thermocompensation.


It makes no sense to me, purely from the point of view of their R&D costs.

They must have invested to some extent in designing and manufacturing these new movements, or the changes to existing movements to make them precidrive or power drive, and were yet to see more than a couple of them in a couple of watches.

I'm hoping they'll roll precidrive quartz out to tissot (sort of the opposite of what they did with powermatic 80 which went tissot, then certina).

In the long run, I can't see this sudden proliferation of thermocompensated movements not ultimately resulting in more thermocompensated quartz throughout the swatch range, right?


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## chris01 (Jan 5, 2011)

seikokiller said:


> It makes no sense to me, purely from the point of view of their R&D costs.
> 
> They must have invested to some extent in designing and manufacturing these new movements, or the changes to existing movements to make them precidrive or power drive, and were yet to see more than a couple of them in a couple of watches.
> 
> ...


I want to see a 30-year anniversary celebration Longines VHP PreciDrive, preferably in Ti. They can even charge a bit more than the Certinas if they want!


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## migo (Jun 4, 2006)

chris01 said:


> Puzzling, isn't it? Considering that ETA were supposed to be withdrawing the sale of their movements to companies outside the Swatch Group, what on earth are they going to do with them? The other mid- and high-range SG companies have very few quartz watches left in their inventory, so is it all down to Certina, with their very patchy marketing? It's hard to believe that the average buyer of one of the fashion brands, or a plastic Swatch, is going to give a **** about thermocompensation.


Maybe they don't want to draw attention to it. TC movements can now be done pretty cheap, so they can stealthily add it to various low end models, and then someone buys a Swatch with it and notices it keeps better time than their Casio or Timex and their preconceptions about Swiss watchmaking are confirmed.


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## chris01 (Jan 5, 2011)

migo said:


> Maybe they don't want to draw attention to it. TC movements can now be done pretty cheap, so they can stealthily add it to various low end models, and then someone buys a Swatch with it and notices it keeps better time than their Casio or Timex and their preconceptions about Swiss watchmaking are confirmed.


I think that 'cheap' may be the key issue. If they're producing some kind of modular (and programmable) architecture then they can offer a wide range of quality/functionality options at lower cost than the old method of making a new movement for each installation. Seems like the motor industry, e.g. VAG, who can use the same engineering in everything from Skoda to Audi, and the only real differences are in the packaging, marketing and price. Even the range of engine performance is largely controlled by the electronics.


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## svorkoetter (Dec 12, 2012)

migo said:


> Maybe they don't want to draw attention to it. TC movements can now be done pretty cheap, so they can stealthily add it to various low end models, and then someone buys a Swatch with it and notices it keeps better time than their Casio or Timex and their preconceptions about Swiss watchmaking are confirmed.


I don't think that the average (non-WIS) person would even notice that one quartz watch is more accurate than another.


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## artec (Oct 31, 2006)

I'm afraid Svorkoetter is right...and if the buyer of a "more accurate" quartz watch noticed any accuracy claim about so many (or so few) seconds a year, he'd probably attribute it to public relations puffery, ie normal exaggeration, and ignore it.

While it's certainly hard to guess what ETA is up to with the added TC movements, and no-one to take them to the ball. Chopard didn't make much noise about accuracy in their last TC watch and Omega doesn't even train their Boutique staff about the merits of TC in their one example, so perhaps any additions will be by stealth!


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## tribe125 (Mar 7, 2006)

In the grander scheme of things at Swatch HQ, it might not have taken a great deal of time or money to develop the movement.

For the moment, it gives Certina something to hang their hat on, and who knows, maybe that's the objective for now?

In a couple of weeks I'll be in the heart of Certina-land (Poland), and I'll be interested to see what prominence they are given. There are probably half-a-dozen Certina dealers within walking distance of our apartment, but I was trying my best to avoid watch shops when I was last there...


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## chris01 (Jan 5, 2011)

tribe125 said:


> In a couple of weeks I'll be in the heart of Certina-land (Poland), and I'll be interested to see what prominence they are given. There are probably half-a-dozen Certina dealers within walking distance of our apartment, but I was trying my best to avoid watch shops when I was last there...


If you happen to spot the new DS-2 3-hander anywhere, will you please try to get a detailed spec.
DS-2 | Certina


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## tribe125 (Mar 7, 2006)

What is it you want to know?


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## chris01 (Jan 5, 2011)

tribe125 said:


> What is it you want to know?


If you could fill in the blanks and get confirmation of what I think I know, it would be very useful.


Movement
ETA F06.411Sec/year??Battery life??EOL indicationYESFunctionsH,M,S,dateIndependent hour handNOPerpetual calendarNOQuick date adjust??Diameter40 mmHeight9.45 mmLug-to-lug??Lug width??Band width at clasp??Weight inc. bracelet??CrystalsapphireAR 0/1/2??Water resistance10 barWarranty2-yearInternational??


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## Haqnut (Nov 13, 2006)

svorkoetter said:


> I don't think that the average (non-WIS) person would even notice that one quartz watch is more accurate than another.


The average Japanese native may if they used the trains a lot. Perhaps that's one of the reasons why HAQs were restricted to their domestic market?!


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## tribe125 (Mar 7, 2006)

chris01 said:


> If you could fill in the blanks and get confirmation of what I think I know, it would be very useful.
> 
> 
> MovementETA F06.411Sec/year??Battery life??EOL indicationYESFunctionsH,M,S,dateIndependent hour handNOPerpetual calendarNOQuick date adjust??Diameter40 mmHeight9.45 mmLug-to-lug??Lug width??Band width at clasp??Weight inc. bracelet??CrystalsapphireAR 0/1/2??Water resistance10 barWarranty2-yearInternational??


To be honest, I think that could be beyond me. The shop assistants won't know most of it, so I'd have to sit down with the watch, the manual, a ruler and possibly a set of scales - when I'm primarily interested in a different watch. ;-)

I'll keep an eye out for literature - if it's in English.


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## chris01 (Jan 5, 2011)

tribe125 said:


> I'll keep an eye out for literature - if it's in English.


Thanks. I was hoping you might find something on paper, even if it's in some other language. The level of info provided by Certina on their website is abysmal. I tried emailing their UK manager (of something) about the watch a month ago, and am still awaiting a response. Even a 'get lost' would show some sign of life.


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## tribe125 (Mar 7, 2006)

I think I've established one small thing by Googling - the lug width seems to be 21mm.


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## seikokiller (Mar 20, 2013)

I would like to know if it has a screw down case back...


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## chris01 (Jan 5, 2011)

seikokiller said:


> I would like to know if it has a screw down case back...


Most unlikely - the DS-2 chrono and 3-hander are both rated 10 bar WR and both employ the "DS concept" (which seems to be related to WR). The chrono has a pressed in back.


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## glen8ak (Jul 13, 2018)

seikokiller said:


> Hello.
> 
> I know these movements can be found in the certina DS2, in both a three hander and a chrono, and a couple of other certina chronos (that's where I first discovered the word precidrive), but surely certina can't be the only brand employing these movements?
> 
> ...


I had this same question, I thought the ETA movement was actually used elsewhere, but don't know exactly where, and this question still hasn't been answered! For those who doubt there is a market for it, why then are all the high end Citizen and Seiko going to HAQ? It definitely has a market and the Precidrive is a pretty great way to get into it at the low end.

One question I have, if you get a Precidrive 3 hander, is the sweep of the second hand smooth or is it 1 beat/second? Can someone answer that?


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## gaijin (Oct 29, 2007)

glen8ak said:


> One question I have, if you get a Precidrive 3 hander, is the sweep of the second hand smooth or is it 1 beat/second? Can someone answer that?


1 beat/second.

HTH


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## chris01 (Jan 5, 2011)

glen8ak said:


> I had this same question, I thought the ETA movement was actually used elsewhere, but don't know exactly where, and this question still hasn't been answered! For those who doubt there is a market for it, why then are all the high end Citizen and Seiko going to HAQ? It definitely has a market and the Precidrive is a pretty great way to get into it at the low end.
> 
> One question I have, if you get a Precidrive 3 hander, is the sweep of the second hand smooth or is it 1 beat/second? Can someone answer that?


If you have infinite patience, browsing Christopher Ward's ludicrously unorganised website may lead you to their C7 Rapide Chronograpch COSC, which uses a PreciDrive. At one time they had one or two others I think, plus some older ETA TCs. But you can lose the will to live trying to find anything.

I believe that Tissot also had a PreciDrive watch, but again you really have to be desperate to bother looking.

Currently I think Certina's PD offerings are (almost) unique, quite attractive and decent value. Unfortunately, only the more expensive chronos have an independent hour hsnd; none of the 3-handers has it.


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## gangrel (Jun 25, 2015)

PreciDrives are floating around in other companies' watches. CW as mentioned. Sinn 434 (?), a ladies' quartz. UniformWares has a line. Wempe has a nice, but pricey, model.

Certina is the main PreciDrive user now. Tissot had a couple models but they basically dropped all the men's watches...or maybe all but one. Longines, of course; they're not claiming PreciDrive because they don't want you to think it's made by ETA, and the movement isn't available to anyone but Longines at this point.

AFAIK, there's Seiko, Citizen, and Breitling outside the Swatch Group that produce at least COSC-accuracy, non-RF/GPS quartz at this point. If you see a current-production piece that's listed as high-acc, TC, or quartz chronometer, and it's not from one of the 3 brands outside Swatch, or maybe an Omega...it's a PreciDrive from ETA.


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