# Must de Cartier tank - what to look for to authenticate?



## PaulMorphy (Jan 5, 2021)

I am looking for a Must de Cartier tank for my wife on Ebay, till we save for a Cartier. I am concerned about fakes.

Are there any Cartier tanks (or Must de Cartier) without the Cartier branding in the 7 or 10 numeral? There is someone on Ebay claiming it it's authentic, even though this feature it's absent- the markings on the case back look good, otherwise - but it could be an authentic case back only, lol. 

I have looked at many models, many tanks have very similar looking cabochons - but some look different- such as sticking farther away from the crown (being long and narrow) while others look like a lighter shade of blue, but it could be lighting.

If anyone has pics of real vs fake Must de Cartier , or would be really helpful. 

Gratefully yours,


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## rodammiles (Nov 8, 2020)

much easier if you show us the watch before you want to buy it and many here can tell you if its fake or not.


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## PaulMorphy (Jan 5, 2021)

rodammiles said:


> much easier if you show us the watch before you want to buy it and many here can tell you if its fake or not.











Vintage Cartier Tank Ladies Wrist Watch 18 K Gold Electro Plated Wind Up. | eBay


Also band has been replaced but the buckle is original ,watch is Wind up.



www.ebay.com





Here is an example of one I am watching- thanks!


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## benbenny (Jan 24, 2016)

This is an mid 1970s Pre - De Must. They were introduced somewhere between 1973 and discontinued in 1976 when all the three branches reunited and became one. Its because of the success of these models that made Cartier introduce the De Must line.

These have no Cartier markings in the 10 or 7. The Cartier markings were introduced somewhere after 1976.

The case looks ok to me. The dial has the right color. The dials on these were white when they were released but almost all have developed a tropical spider dial and turned to a off-white creme color. This is because of the type of lacquer Cartier used in that time period. But it looks like the dial is off center? I also don't like the way the Cartier logo is written. It should be written in one single line without gaps between the letters. This one has a gap between the letter R and T? Is it a redial? Hard to say without seeing it hands under the magnifier glass.

It has an ETA 2512 movement which is the correct one for that type of watch and time period. But I never seen the Cartier branding like this before. The original movement was probably broken and they outsourced an other 2512 movement and replaced it and decorated the wheels with some paint reading Cartier to make it look legit.

This probably also explains why the dial sits off center. They replaced the movement but didn't take the time to align it correctly on the movement, or the dial is refinished and stamped off center. Cartier would had never released a dial like that after inspection.

The crown is also doesnt look correct for this model and time period.

Too much issues with this watch im afraid.


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## PaulMorphy (Jan 5, 2021)

benbenny said:


> This is an mid 1970s Pre - De Must. They were introduced somewhere between 1973 and discontineud in 1976 when all the three branches reuineted and became one. Its because of the success of these models that made Cartier introduce the De Must line.
> 
> These have no Cartier markings in the 10 or 7. The Cartier markings were introduced somewhere after 1976 when De Must line was introduced.
> 
> ...


Thank you for that info- I was not sure about the dial because it did not say "must de..." and it was vermeil- but your explanation helps a lot. Upon closer inspection, I can see the dial off center, leaning toward the 3o'clock side. I am glad I don't have to discard all the examples that don't have the Cartier in the numbers....

I have seen specimens that are "must de" but don't have the Cartier printing in the numerals. Is this a sign it is a fake or are there years/ models with the "must de" on the dial without that dial feature?

Thanks in advance.


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## benbenny (Jan 24, 2016)

PaulMorphy said:


> Thank you for that info- I was not sure about the dial because it did not say "must de..." and it was vermeil- but your explanation helps a lot. Upon closer inspection, I can see the dial off center, leaning toward the 3o'clock side. I am glad I don't have to discard all the examples that don't have the Cartier in the numbers....
> 
> I have seen specimens that are "must de" but don't have the Cartier printing in the numerals. Is this a sign it is a fake or are there years/ models with the "must de" on the dial without that dial feature?
> 
> Thanks in advance.


Some early Must De Cartier will not have the branding in the numerals. But this is a difficult question beacuse Cartier also produced many different style of dials which didn't have these markings.

I for example like these kind of Cartier watches on a woman.

Cartier Must with a blue Lapis Lazuli dial.

I think they will be good investments and are now for sale for reasonable prices. I think they will be very collectable as they are still sleepers and still fairly unknown.


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## benbenny (Jan 24, 2016)

I just had a quick look of I could find one for sale. But it seems that they are increasing in price.
I was buying these for around $500 about 10 years ago. People are waking up I guess.

Found this one. Guess the seller doesnt know what it is. He is not mentioning that it has a lapis dial but described it as an blue dial. I found other listing that are asking up to $700 a $800 more for the lapis version.

All these are not real lapis stone i need to mention. They were blue dials with applied gold dots. But looks cool. Like a nightsky with stars









Must de Cartier Tank Paris Vermeil Plaque Manual Wind Blue Dial Watch 20.5 MM | eBay


Make Supersized seem small. Case size 20.5 mm x 20 mm. From the heart of Jewelers Row in Philadelphia we bring to your doorstep authentic heirloom quality watches and jewelry. Case thickness 6 mm.



www.ebay.com


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## PaulMorphy (Jan 5, 2021)

benbenny said:


> I just had a quick look of I could find one for sale. But it seems that they are increasing in price.
> I was buying these for around $500 about 10 years ago. People are waking up I guess.
> 
> Found this one. Guess the seller doesnt know what it is. He is not mentioning that it has a lapis dial but described it as an blue dial. I found other listing that are asking up to $700 a $800 more for the lapis version.
> ...


Hi Beny,
You seem very knowledgeable- are there "must tanks" with the white (now cream dial), art deco roman numerals and black hands? Was it common, as a cost saving measure to forgoe the blued hands?

I am looking for an example for my wife as I save for a Cartier tank, in good condition while I save .... I figure if I get her mens model, then I can wear it once I get her "forever watch." It is hard to justify spending over 1k since that is money that can go to the forever watch.

Would it be a poor decision to pick one up that is not functioning and then buy a replacement Cartier movement- I have seen them on ebay available for just a few hundred (I am ta lo king about quartz versions). Thanks for your opinion.

Thanks again,


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## Sergeant Major (Dec 13, 2019)

PaulMorphy said:


> I am looking for a Must de Cartier tank for my wife on Ebay, till we save for a Cartier. I am concerned about fakes.
> 
> Are there any Cartier tanks (or Must de Cartier) without the Cartier branding in the 7 or 10 numeral? There is someone on Ebay claiming it it's authentic, even though this feature it's absent- the markings on the case back look good, otherwise - but it could be an authentic case back only, lol.
> 
> ...


I can show you one my wife does not wear and she needs beer money Two tone and sizes at about 8inches (she wears up toward the elbow, plus she is an ex Lithuania basketball ball player) and additional steel and gold links . Phigora authenticated papers are with it. If your wife likes, maybe we can hook her up!


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## benbenny (Jan 24, 2016)

PaulMorphy said:


> Hi Beny,
> You seem very knowledgeable- are there "must tanks" with the white (now cream dial), art deco roman numerals and black hands? Was it common, as a cost saving measure to forgoe the blued hands?
> 
> I am looking for an example for my wife as I save for a Cartier tank, in good condition while I save .... I figure if I get her mens model, then I can wear it once I get her "forever watch." It is hard to justify spending over 1k since that is money that can go to the forever watch.
> ...


unfortunately i can not answer a few of your questions because I have no knowledge of these.

What I can say is. Buying a larger size Tank watch is a better investment these days. Me personally I would not invest my money in a quartz watch. Quartz watches lose their value. If it ever brakes down you will need to buy a new movement to get it running again. And maybe in a few dozens of years you can not even find the batteries anymore for the movement.

A mechanical movement is the way forwards. You can always get it fixed and parts are available or can be made on demand. You can for example a 100 years old cartier with a mechanical movement that is broken and can get it fixed today with no problems. You can not say that in100 years of a quartz watch. That is one of the reasons why mechanical watches are better investments and more collectable.


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## benbenny (Jan 24, 2016)

This looks like an good auction house to buy these watches from.
Seems that these Must watches go for much cheaper than offered on the bay and other sites.



Aspire Auctions


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## cwembridge79 (2 mo ago)

rodammiles said:


> much easier if you show us the watch before you want to buy it and many here can tell you if its fake or not.


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## cwembridge79 (2 mo ago)

Is this real or fake


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