# I am so DISAPPOINTED about MKII sapphire crystal !!!!!!!!



## sevens (Nov 2, 2010)

Hello everyone,

I would like to share you the information that makes me really disappointed about MKII sapphire crystal.

This problem happended to me second time (the first is on my nassau, and now the second on my Kingston).

It does have some minor scratches on the crystals that being announced as sapphire by MKII.

Please refer to following photos.


















I have been owned and used a lot of watches (cheaper and more expensive in many kinds); but I NEVER face same problem, then I think that the sapphire crystal of MKII is much lower in term of quality.

I feed really sad and so disappointed and very worrying on any new purchase of mkii watches.


----------



## longstride (Jan 13, 2011)

I think that there would be little or no hardness difference - a Sapphire crystal is a Sapphire crystal regardless of the supplier, so the Vickers hardness would be equal for all Sapphire crystals - MKII or otherwise.

The MKII's do have a dome which would expose the crown of the crystal to scratching, that said it would have to be something very hard to actually Marr the surface of the crystal - do you know what it was scuffed against?


----------



## sevens (Nov 2, 2010)

longstride said:


> I think that there would be little or no hardness difference - a Sapphire crystal is a Sapphire crystal regardless of the supplier, so the Vickers hardness would be equal for all Sapphire crystals - MKII or otherwise.
> 
> The MKII's do have a dome which would expose the crown of the crystal to scratching, that said it would have to be something very hard to actually Marr the surface of the crystal - do you know what it was scuffed against?


I have many other watches with dome sapphire crystals and I never face the same problem. 
I only have been using my watches in normal condition (office working) that should not be in severe conditions. 
For my nassau, I just changed crystal from original one to new sapphire crystal from other party (double dome as well); and so far so good.

If you look at some other sales on forum, I remmember that other user was also under same trouble with his mkii kingston; that makes me worry about mkii's crystal quality.


----------



## Triton9 (Sep 30, 2011)

Sapphire despite being much harder than mineral crystal will still get scratches if very rough treatment given.


----------



## sevens (Nov 2, 2010)

Triton9 said:


> Sapphire despite being much harder than mineral crystal will still get scratches if very rough treatment given.


I do understand, but coincidentally the trouble only happened to my mkii watches that makes me feel really worry.


----------



## sevens (Nov 2, 2010)

This is other sale post from a member and he faced same problem.

https://www.watchuseek.com/f29/fs-m...red-triangle-bezel-configuration-4255410.html


----------



## MrDagon007 (Sep 24, 2012)

It is probably a coincidence. sapphire is sapphire no matter the vendor, unlike mineral glass where bigger differences exist


----------



## J.D.B. (Oct 12, 2009)

Are they "sapphire coated" or fully sapphire? I have several full sapphires that have been tagged hard by my steel "doorjamb from hell" and are unmarked. How does one go about actually testing a crystal to see what it's made of?


----------



## MKIISRVC (Sep 20, 2016)

There is no difference in the Sapphire crystals we use on our watches. All manufacturers use the same materials. Although Sapphire is technically more scratch resistant. It is not scratch proof. You can still scratch a Sapphire crystal.


----------



## sevens (Nov 2, 2010)

J.D.B. said:


> Are they "sapphire coated" or fully sapphire? I have several full sapphires that have been tagged hard by my steel "doorjamb from hell" and are unmarked. How does one go about actually testing a crystal to see what it's made of?


There is no "sapphire coated".

Most of sapphire crystals on the market are artififial fully sapphire.


----------



## MrDagon007 (Sep 24, 2012)

sevens said:


> There is no "sapphire coated".
> 
> Most of sapphire crystals on the market are artififial fully sapphire.


Actually the affordable brand Dan Henry mentions in the specs for their nice 1970 diver the following: "Sapphire coated double domed mineral glass with Anti-Reflective treatment".

I wondered myself how that would work.


----------



## sevens (Nov 2, 2010)

MrDagon007 said:


> Actually the affordable brand Dan Henry mentions in the specs for their nice 1970 diver the following: "Sapphire coated double domed mineral glass with Anti-Reflective treatment".
> 
> I wondered myself how that would work.


I talked with some friends and expert in glass industry. 
All of them said to me that it is nearly impossible to make "sapphire coated" to the mineral glass. (techinically it is impossible). 
If yes, tt does cost an arm and a leg (much more expensive than producing artificial sapphire).


----------



## paul.bluedog (Jan 18, 2014)

I once got some marks on my Fulcrum that looked a bit like this. I think it was actually some sort of metal residue left after I scraped it on something. It rubbed off easily when I put a bit more effort in. 

Can you actually feel the scratch?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Aceldama (Sep 7, 2013)

paul.bluedog said:


> I once got some marks on my Fulcrum that looked a bit like this. I think it was actually some sort of metal residue left after I scraped it on something. It rubbed off easily when I put a bit more effort in.
> 
> Can you actually feel the scratch?
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Had this same issues with my LRRP. What I thought was a scratch was material from the wall I scraped.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## J.D.B. (Oct 12, 2009)

sevens said:


> I talked with some friends and expert in glass industry.
> All of them said to me that it is nearly impossible to make "sapphire coated" to the mineral glass. (techinically it is impossible).
> If yes, tt does cost an arm and a leg (much more expensive than producing artificial sapphire).


Thanks for the pointer. I see quite a few ads saying "sapphire-coated" out there.


----------



## powerband (Oct 17, 2008)

It is a statistical coincidence. I had a scratch on an Omega and another on a Longines. Since the two scratches appear on different brands, I thought little of them. Had both scratches appear on the same brand, however, it would have been easy to draw a conspiracy theory. It's what we systematically do as humans: make connections where none exist.

Sapphire is sapphire.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## OmegaCosmicMan (Apr 1, 2011)

:think: It would seem that another 'connection' or 'common circumstance' ...is.... *You *-- the owner, and how you wear or use them, and what you have exposed the watches to...

_*Sapphire is Sapphire*_. It is pretty dang hard and scratch-*resistant* -- to a point.

There are many other substances that are harder, and _sharp_, and combined with properties such as sharpness, like volcanic ash, or certain grinding abrasives or grit, could allow those substances to cut or scratch the sapphire surface.

:think: Before you describe the material properties in unfavorable terms, perhaps it would be wiser to review _what you may have inadvertantly done_ to create or cause the circumstances that lead to the damage you have described.

--- Best ---


----------



## TwentiethCenturyFox (Mar 8, 2014)

Well having owned several other MkII's I have never experienced this with my Stingray, Seafighter, or LRRP. As previously stated there is not a "graduated" scale for sapphire hardness or durability.


----------



## powerband (Oct 17, 2008)

There are thousands of owners before and besides you. If something was uniquely wrong with the sapphire MKII uses, wouldn't you think this has been reported already?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## longstride (Jan 13, 2011)

I think it's pretty rare for a sapphire to be scratched - Things that can scratch a Sapphire crystal could be...

* Another Sapphire
* Diamond
* Tungsten Carbide (now being used in jewlery)
* Silicone Carbide (used in concrete moldings like statues and garden furniture)

...did we hear from *sevens *again - was it a real scratch or was it a rub mark that could be cleaned off?


----------



## sevens (Nov 2, 2010)

longstride said:


> I think it's pretty rare for a sapphire to be scratched - Things that can scratch a Sapphire crystal could be...
> 
> * Another Sapphire
> * Diamond
> ...


Thanks. 
It is real scratch. I would try the diamond paste and report.


----------



## consum3r (Sep 19, 2014)

Pardon my ignorance but, do these have outer AR coating? Just a thought.


Sent from my cranium via manual interface with a tactile input device.


----------



## Cobia (Nov 24, 2013)

Sapphire is easy to scratch regardless of the hype.
Ive scratched sapphire crystals with ease, anybody doubting that go and very gently brush it on a brick or stone surface and youll have no doubt.


----------



## Darwin (Jan 28, 2012)

Cobia said:


> Sapphire is easy to scratch regardless of the hype.
> Ive scratched sapphire crystals with ease, anybody doubting that go and very gently brush it on a brick or stone surface and youll have no doubt.


Agreed. I've scratched two. Ironically, I have six Seikos with hardlex, including my SBDX001 from 2003, which I've worn to do everything from stacking firewood to snorkeling to weed-eating and mowing the lawn. Not a scratch on the crystal.

The two I've scratched are a circa 2000 Citizen Promaster World Timer and a current generation OWC Snowflake (not my scratch, actually, and it's a pinhole divot - but it's there). Neither bother me in the slightest, but I USE my watches.


----------



## BSHt013 (Feb 27, 2008)

Darwin said:


> ...to weed-eating and mowing the lawn. Not a scratch on the crystal...


This is the most impressive thing I've read on WUS in a while. Air high-five to you sir.


----------



## Yellowdrive (Jul 16, 2013)

Until I received my Key West, I never took my Nassau off my wrist. At one point, I thought I had scratched the crystal; I could feel a little groove and it was visible up close. After a few days, I went looking for it again and it was gone. It was just some hardened residue from who-knows-where that got removed after several days worth of rinsing, rain, dish washing, the occasional shower, etc... At first, I was impressed with myself; "I'm hard enough on my watch to scratch sapphire!". I'll just have to keep at it...


----------



## Darwin (Jan 28, 2012)

I should add that I've had my Kingston since September 2013 and have used it in much the same way as the MM300 and no scratches on its sapphire crystal, either...



thach said:


> This is the most impressive thing I've read on WUS in a while. Air high-five to you sir.


----------



## MadMex (Jun 18, 2010)

None on mine after a few years...


----------



## Chromejob (Jun 18, 2010)

I have four Mk II watches that I wear daily, and each has been dinged against door jams (not sure if I've hit a brass strike plate yet), washing machine tubs, counters, car doors, etc. I live in a hot, humid clime where long sleeved shirts aren't worn much so the watches are exposed. => Not a one has a single scratch on the domed sapphire crystals. 

I'd say OP gouged his Kingston up against something harder than sapphire, despite claims to the contrary. It happens. Sapphire isn't impossible to scratch, just very very difficult. Try hard enough and you'll scratch it. 

So to your disappointment ("!!!!!!!!") I say, "Boo hoo hoo. That crystal didn't scratch itself sitting in a watch box, and certainly didn't happen inside a shirt cuff. Get over it."


----------



## Morgan24 (Aug 15, 2016)

I think the sapphire on my Kingston is fantastic....


----------



## TheDude (Jan 27, 2009)

I have a small chip on the crystal in my Rolex SeaDweller but it’s 33 years old. Bought it that way and it’s completely usable.




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## jwk7443 (Nov 13, 2012)

Scratches are not a big deal unless you make it one. If it gets worn, its gonna happen, even on sapphire. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## jupiterfang (Mar 27, 2010)

Sapphire coating probably is more expensive than solid sapphire. They are hard, but there is still possibility to get it scrached


----------



## Matthew Janicki (Dec 19, 2009)

Same thing happened to me to my Stowa and a Rolex Explorer I... It’s natural. Shi* happens 


Wysłane z iPhone za pomocą Tapatalk


----------



## STEELINOX (Mar 20, 2006)

Darwin said:


> Agreed. I've scratched two. Ironically, I have six Seikos with hardlex, including my SBDX001 from 2003, which I've worn to do everything from stacking firewood to snorkeling to weed-eating and mowing the lawn. Not a scratch on the crystal.
> 
> The two I've scratched are a circa 2000 Citizen Promaster World Timer and a current generation OWC Snowflake (not my scratch, actually, and it's a pinhole divot - but it's there). Neither bother me in the slightest, but I USE my watches.


Here is "KEY WEST 'Rough Duty'"





Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## 77deluxe (Jun 17, 2007)

THIS is exactly why I prefer acrylic crystals.


----------



## TheMeasure (Jul 8, 2013)

I cringed the entire time. It was painful watching the abuse your KW went through. Please no more...?



STEELINOX said:


> Here is "KEY WEST 'Rough Duty'"


IG: th3measure


----------



## STEELINOX (Mar 20, 2006)

Ever see someone wearing a fine timepiece operate a sawzall? (lol)


TheMeasure said:


> I cringed the entire time. It was painful watching the abuse your KW went through. Please no more...藍
> 
> IG: th3measure


----------



## Matthew Janicki (Dec 19, 2009)

This was hilarious 

Wysłane z iPhone za pomocą Tapatalk


----------



## Arthur (Feb 11, 2006)

I have never scratches a sapphire crystal, and I wear my watches in some pretty rough conditions. I have used a sawzall, chain saw, weedeater, power washer, Air impact wrench, tractor, zero turn and other motorized and vibrating equipment. I have scratched the heck out of acrylic crystals. In fact years ago, my only watch was a Rolex 1680. I wore it on the farm every day. It was greasy nasty and the crystal was so scratched that you could hardly see the hands!! I took it to a local Rolex dealer for service and he was just astounded. He wanted to know what in the world I was doing to the watch? Just wearing it every day at the office I told him. Where the hell is your office he asked? Well, I told him it varies, could be the cab of a combine, on a tractor, changing a tire, never know where from day to day. Serviced, crystal changed and it looked like new. He told me I need a pocket watch, I was too hard on wrist watches. I was a happy camper when the first sapphire crystals came along, although I love my old acrylic crystal watches, I don't abuse them anymore. 

The only thing I am careful about is when working in close quarters using wrenches, changing blades on my mowers, etc. a hard impact on solid steel will scratch or crack even the hardest crystals. Best to put your watch in your pocket when this sort of work is being done. Better safe than sorry. Under normal conditions, it would have to be a freak blow to scratch or shatter a sapphire crystal.


----------



## Arthur (Feb 11, 2006)

I have never scratched a sapphire crystal, and I wear my watches in some pretty rough conditions. I have used a sawzall, chain saw, weedeater, power washer, Air impact wrench, tractor, zero turn and other motorized and vibrating equipment. I have seen sapphire chip along the edge of a flat crystal that has a sharper edge, like a Rolex 16610 for instance, but never a domed crystal. 

I have scratched the heck out of acrylic crystals. In fact years ago, my only watch was a Rolex 1680. I wore it on the farm every day. It was greasy, nasty and the crystal was so scratched that you could hardly see the hands!! I took it to a local Rolex dealer for service and he was just astounded. He wanted to know what in the world I was doing to the watch? Just wearing it every day at the office I told him. Where the hell is your office he asked? Well, I told him it varies, could be the cab of a combine, on a tractor, changing a tire, never know where from day to day. Serviced, crystal changed and it looked like new. He told me I needed a pocket watch, I was too hard on wrist watches. I was a happy camper when the first sapphire crystals came along, although I love my old acrylic crystal watches, I don't abuse them anymore. 

The only thing I am careful about is when working in close quarters using wrenches, changing blades on my mowers, etc. a hard impact on solid steel will scratch or crack even the hardest crystals. Best to put your watch in your pocket when this sort of work is being done. Better safe than sorry. Under normal conditions, it would have to be a freak blow to scratch or shatter a sapphire crystal.


----------



## Chromejob (Jun 18, 2010)

STEELINOX said:


> Here is "KEY WEST 'Rough Duty'"


A-ha, I was looking for a new way to fold fitted sheets. Look out, Marie Kondo, here's Steelinox...!


----------



## powerband (Oct 17, 2008)

STEELINOX said:


> Here is "KEY WEST 'Rough Duty'"
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Oh Jeez... that's what's G-shock is for.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## rudarb2990 (May 29, 2016)

I have never scratched a sapphire crystal. Fair point where MKII crystals do have a slight dome to them, rather than resting flush. I would honestly prefer to see more MKII's with acrylic crystals-I think it would add more of that vintage feel to them.


----------

