# New Doxa Army



## Flyingdoctor (Feb 11, 2006)

Doxa Army 42.5mm Watches of Switzerland Edition 785.00.031.20. | Watches Of Switzerland US


DOXA




www.watchesofswitzerland.com


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## Watchout63 (Mar 1, 2021)

Well you called it Doc......


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## Sotelodon (Apr 20, 2018)

Woah, I think they lost it. $4500 for a Sellita? Like why?


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## ean10775 (Nov 8, 2012)

Hmm, can’t say I’m terribly impressed, especially for the price. Except for case material, there is nothing else new here to justify a $4500 price tag. Essentially the same thing people have been saying about the carbon.


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## uperhemi (Nov 15, 2018)

...well, I am quite let down. Wish I kept my Synchron


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## CityMorgue (Jun 30, 2009)

BAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
_catches breath_
.....
AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

Doxa has huffed a wee bit too much glue.....LOL


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## antiscout (Jan 6, 2010)

Oof. 3 1/2 times the price of the synchron??? Hard pass.


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## MaBr (Jan 22, 2018)

They finally release the Army and it's a freaking ceramic watch for $4500/€4200..? AND it's limited to a 100 pieces. I will admit that it looks fantastic but what the actual... NO Doxa NO, this wasn't what anybody was asking for. Did they learn nothing from the overly expensive plastic SUB 300? If this was non limited for $2500 they would probably have sold a lot of them but now?


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## Flyingdoctor (Feb 11, 2006)

I'm not going to comment..... except. .. Black, tactical, stealthy, military look with a big ugly orange Jenny fish on the crown.... seriously....jeezus wept


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## MaBr (Jan 22, 2018)

Flyingdoctor said:


> I'm not going to comment..... except. .. Black, tactical, stealthy, military look with a big ugly orange Jenny fish on the crown.... seriously....jeezus wept


To be fair (though I don't like the fish logo) the orange on the crown looks really good with the orange hands...


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## BigBluefish (Aug 13, 2009)

I've come to love, from afar, so many offerings of Doxa's after researching that brand and its history, Really remarkable and beautiful stuff over the years. Got a Sub 200 on order. An Aquamarine 300T will be my next one, barring financial ruin. Despite what the current owners of the brand do, I like these watches, and I will have them.

But, this,_ thing_... just...no. I am really, totally at a loss to understand the thinking (or lack thereof?) behind this $4K wrist wart.


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## oystertrader (Jan 9, 2022)

$4,500? Come on, Doxa


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## NS1 (May 12, 2015)

I almost spit my coffee out laughing when I saw it has a ceramic case as I immediately knew it would be priced north of $4K. I bet they sell the full 100, but there will not be one coming to this house.


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## Erolek (Jan 8, 2013)

It's been announced in Instagram some time in March 2021. I almost forgot about it.

Greetings
Eryk


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## Semper Jeep (Jan 11, 2013)

Well, looks like WOS didn’t have a problem selling through them at that price…

Edit: Nevermind. I was looking at the wrong site. I still expect they’ll be sold out in pretty short order.


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## WatchDialOrange (Dec 30, 2011)

Only 100 being made? $4,500 I was not expecting this price?! But you do get a nice camo box.


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## Forsythjones (Jan 14, 2019)

Semper Jeep said:


> Well, looks like WOS didn’t have a problem selling through them at that price…
> 
> Edit: Nevermind. I was looking at the wrong site. I still expect they’ll be sold out in pretty short order.


Why? I’m still able to add lots of them to my cart


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## Cheverian (Sep 27, 2017)

I have a feeling that manufacturers like Doxa are going to be increasingly hamstrung by their movements and specifically by their pathetic power reserves. When you can buy a Hamilton diver for a quarter of the price with an 80 hour reserve.... Yeah, I know a Hamilton diver doesn't have Doxa cred. But all that means is a watch like this one needs to nail the design, materials, etc. Which it doesn't, in my opinion.


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## sh3l8y (Dec 27, 2020)

They’ll prob do a mass release not ceramic right? That’s how the 600T launch went.


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## dirtvictim (Mar 9, 2006)

So they got ahold of the Rolex koolaid too?


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## deepsea03 (Apr 3, 2018)

sh3l8y said:


> They’ll prob do a mass release not ceramic right? That’s how the 600T launch went.


Exactly what I was thinking


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## RG2107 (Aug 8, 2021)

Someone should tell them that they have accidentally added one zero more than they must've intended.


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## ross2187 (Sep 16, 2016)

I'm here for it, and I get - and support the price. 

It's in line with the US Divers Carbon - price wise. It's a totally new material for Doxa, it's a collab and an LE. Doxa has to be allowed to push the ball forward and they shouldn't be expected to live at the $2k price range forever for every piece. Can't please everyone.


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## NeurosciGuy15 (Jan 4, 2018)

Guessing this is a very limited WOS release with a non-limited steel version coming in a few months. Looks good though. Wouldn’t buy it at the price, but looks good.


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## pkrshang (Aug 28, 2017)

Synchron did it better.


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## CityMorgue (Jun 30, 2009)

ross2187 said:


> I'm here for it, and I get - and support the price.
> 
> It's in line with the US Divers Carbon - price wise. It's a totally new material for Doxa, it's a collab and an LE. Doxa has to be allowed to push the ball forward and they shouldn't be expected to live at the $2k price range forever for every piece. Can't please everyone.


I don't fully agree. Doxa is straight up taking advantage of their name and trying to extract significantly more money than what is warranted. The carbon is already ridiculously overpriced. There are plenty of other cases of companies offering similar materials for significantly cheaper. Not to mention, it's got a base sellita movement. Nothing exotic, or in-house. Just straight price gouging at this point. And you cannot tell me that a collab really warrants such a price tag. They were able to do a Time and Tide collab for much cheaper. And all the other collabs that they have done for watches that are less than half of what Doxa thinks these things are worth.

Don't you notice how they still have the limited carbon, the crap-graph, and even the 200T-graph still available? Those are their most expensive offerings, and they basically move none of them. And then when they do come up for sale in the secondary market, they are priced way below retail because that's what the market will bear with those things.

Now, of course Doxa can push the ball forward in their offerings. I like them experimenting with new materials and the such, but they are trying to push themselves into a market they really have no business in being in. They are a tool watch to their core, not some Tudor/Rolex luxury market they are clearly trying to force their way into.

Of course this is all subjective, but in general, more people will agree that Doxa is a bit cracked coming up with these prices.


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## CityMorgue (Jun 30, 2009)

pkrshang said:


> Synchron did it better.


That they did. And for the price of only $1k at sale, it really feels like those of us that bought it, absolutely took Synchron to the wringers. It's almost like highway robbery.


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## Erolek (Jan 8, 2013)

CityMorgue said:


> That they did. And for the price of only $1k at sale, it really feels like those of us that bought it, absolutely took Synchron to the wringers. It's almost like highway robbery.


I scratched the 'army itch' in the meantime with the Seestern. For about 160 EUR and sapphire with antireflective coating I can live with different hands and non-heritage brand.









Greeetings
Eryk


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## ross2187 (Sep 16, 2016)

CityMorgue said:


> I don't fully agree. Doxa is straight up taking advantage of their name and trying to extract significantly more money than what is warranted. The carbon is already ridiculously overpriced. There are plenty of other cases of companies offering similar materials for significantly cheaper. Not to mention, it's got a base sellita movement. Nothing exotic, or in-house. Just straight price gouging at this point. And you cannot tell me that a collab really warrants such a price tag. They were able to do a Time and Tide collab for much cheaper. And all the other collabs that they have done for watches that are less than half of what Doxa thinks these things are worth.
> 
> Don't you notice how they still have the limited carbon, the crap-graph, and even the 200T-graph still available? Those are their most expensive offerings, and they basically move none of them. And then when they do come up for sale in the secondary market, they are priced way below retail because that's what the market will bear with those things.
> 
> ...



While I don't agree with most points, I respect your different opinion. _passes a beer to a new friend_


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## mangotti (Feb 9, 2006)

Two different ways to sell a watch by two different companies :
Synchron decided to sell 500 military's at $1000 a piece which took in$500,000 in 2 days and Doxa decides to sell 100 army's at $4,500 a piece which when they all sells comes in at $450,000


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## NS1 (May 12, 2015)

pkrshang said:


> Synchron did it better.


That was my exact thought too. Glad I was able to get one.


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## Seikonut1967 (Feb 22, 2020)

Way overpriced same as the carbon. No doubt there'll be a cheaper alternative released soon. Think I'll stick to my synchron.


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## 8505davids (Jan 14, 2017)

Is it April the first??? Help-ma-Boab - $4500 and about the same in sterling after import duties/VAT etc... good to see they finally got round to a new Doxa Dartboard but seriously ... I'm willing to take the bet about them all being sold quickly. I do actually like the orange on black crown and the shade of the dial colour, but the price is a def pass for me, fancy ceramic or not (pushing the boundaries etc etc but is there really a need for anything other than steel especially when you have to pay through the nose for it? Well I suppose you pays yer money etc) - I've more than scratched my Army itch with the ti grey Maranez at 200-odd quid - its not even that attractive a dial anyway IMO. Could be that a steel unlimited version does appear at some point.

Can always rely on Doxa to give good fodder for the forum though!


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## usc1 (Jun 25, 2007)

Flyingdoctor said:


> Doxa Army 42.5mm Watches of Switzerland Edition 785.00.031.20. | Watches Of Switzerland US
> 
> 
> DOXA
> ...


Just wait until it lists on Jomashop


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## Crisker (Oct 25, 2018)

Nothing screams "shoot me" more than bright orange on an army watch. I suppose this might appeal to the GI Joe cosplay crowd, though I doubt they can afford it.


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## NS1 (May 12, 2015)

No factual basis, but my hunch is this is a one and done. 100 LE pieces and then done. I could see them debating the 500 or so of these sold by Synchron to their target audience, the homage brands satisfying the people that won't pay more than $500 for these and questioning how many they could actually sell with a steel version. That likely drove the decision to differentiate their version and go upscale on the case material and price tag.

I have a tough time seeing this as a permanent addition to the Doxa lineup in steel. With so many competitors selling the exact same niche watch, is there really enough of a market out there to sell hundreds of the Doxa Army in steel?


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## Richard C. (11 mo ago)

Sold out in 2h ☺


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## CityMorgue (Jun 30, 2009)

Richard C. said:


> Sold out in 2h ☺


Still available on Doxa's website. Let's me add it to cart.


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## ross2187 (Sep 16, 2016)

Richard C. said:


> Sold out in 2h ☺


From Analog / Shift.


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## Richard C. (11 mo ago)

It's sold out here in Austria.


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## BSwed (Jul 14, 2021)

Regarding our critique and the sold out state - I guess Doxa could say like Liberace said when reading that a critique trashed Liberace's well paid Las Vegas show - "I cried all the way to the bank".


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## mattcantwin (Aug 17, 2007)

Seikonut1967 said:


> Way overpriced same as the carbon. No doubt there'll be a cheaper alternative released soon. Think I'll stick to my synchron.
> View attachment 16594032



Me, too.


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## MaBr (Jan 22, 2018)

mattcantwin said:


> Me, too.


That looks fantastic on that strap! 👌


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## Forsythjones (Jan 14, 2019)

Richard C. said:


> Sold out in 2h


Still available from Doxa and WoS so, not really 


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## martin_blank (May 19, 2010)

Well after a long wait we finally see the Doxa Army and it and the reaction doesn’t disappoint.

I think it looks cool and would strongly consider if i didn’t already have a Doxa.


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## Ticktocker (Oct 27, 2009)

It's the epitome of an overpriced watch. Actually laughable.....


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## valerian839 (Jan 7, 2021)

I'm curious why other dive/tool watches don't use countdown bezel inserts.


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## nitron135 (Jul 6, 2017)

Hard to believe that something so obscure and in this price bracket would sell out so quickly.

WoS still has a lot of stock. Imagine that it will come back into doxa store as well, unless it was mostly meant to be sold through WoS.


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## Flyingdoctor (Feb 11, 2006)

Will Doxa introduce a steel version for say 1300 bucks sometime down the road? 

I'd say yes. Doxa are the legitimate 'owners' of the Army look and feel. Sure Synchron beat them to the punch with the military and Maranez and Seestern have flooded the market with cheap and good quality lookalikes....... BUT...... none of them say Doxa on the dial. 

Doxa will sell a few watches based on the name on the dial and as the management are just about selling watches, I'll bet there will be a steel version with an orange Jenny fish on the crown.


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## 8505davids (Jan 14, 2017)

mangotti said:


> Two different ways to sell a watch by two different companies :
> Synchron decided to sell 500 military's at $1000 a piece which took in$500,000 in 2 days and Doxa decides to sell 100 army's at $4,500 a piece which when they all sells comes in at $450,000


Great point - but all about profit margins of course !


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## ross2187 (Sep 16, 2016)

Looks like it's now sold out at Doxa in the US. Apparently enough people liked em enough to buy em! Good for Doxa!!!


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## 8505davids (Jan 14, 2017)

Flyingdoctor said:


> Will Doxa introduce a steel version for say 1300 bucks sometime down the road?


Doubt it'd be less than the 300T price


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## NS1 (May 12, 2015)

Flyingdoctor said:


> Will Doxa introduce a steel version for say 1300 bucks sometime down the road?
> 
> I'd say yes. Doxa are the legitimate 'owners' of the Army look and feel. Sure Synchron beat them to the punch with the military and Maranez and Seestern have flooded the market with cheap and good quality lookalikes....... BUT...... none of them say Doxa on the dial.
> 
> Doxa will sell a few watches based on the name on the dial and as the management are just about selling watches, I'll bet there will be a steel version with an orange Jenny fish on the crown.


The Jenny fish on the sub crowns doesn't bother me that much, but, for some reason, it looks really out of place on the Army. An orange fish with no relationship to the brand's history on an army field watch? What the heck?


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## Moonshine Runner (Sep 29, 2016)

Richard C. said:


> It's sold out here in Austria.


No, it is not, because the watch is sold exclusively through the Watches of Switzerland stores, the watch is not offered in the Doxa online store and is therefore marked as "sold out" there.


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## Flyingdoctor (Feb 11, 2006)

Let's be honest here, Doxa don't need these to sell out instantly. I'm sure eventually they will sell out. They make 100, at least 10 will be given away to Doxa and WoS people.

It was 'designed' by a WoS chap so they will be happy to promote / sell it. Heck we even have a sales post from them on here already.

This watch wasn't aimed at the likes of us here. Just look at the comments in this thread. My email and messages blew up with people going: WTF Pete, why so expensive?

Doxa moved past the fan boy crowd with the advent of the ICE Era. They are trying to grow their business/ awareness and move upmarket. We were then, fashion is now. Time will tell how successful it will be and while the WoS distribution lasts they will definitely get many more eyes on the watch than in the past.

We were waiting for the Army but it was never our watch.


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## adg31 (Dec 28, 2010)

$4,500 


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## KostakisDE (Nov 28, 2017)

Well you know, some people just have so much money that they don't care if they throw them away. I like Doxa as a brand, I find their 300 line more approachable since the relatively recent change of hands but their 4k+ offerings are insane and nonsensical. Their carbon btw hasnt been sold out, and neither has their Chrono, which I find more appealing but also expensive at the current price range.


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## driggity (Feb 6, 2017)

Moonshine Runner said:


> No, it is not, because the watch is sold exclusively through the Watches of Switzerland stores, the watch is not offered in the Doxa online store and is therefore marked as "sold out" there.


At least in the US it was available through the Doxa website earlier today but isn’t anymore.


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## MaBr (Jan 22, 2018)

Flyingdoctor said:


> Will Doxa introduce a steel version for say 1300 bucks sometime down the road?
> 
> I'd say yes. Doxa are the legitimate 'owners' of the Army look and feel. Sure Synchron beat them to the punch with the military and Maranez and Seestern have flooded the market with cheap and good quality lookalikes....... BUT...... none of them say Doxa on the dial.
> 
> Doxa will sell a few watches based on the name on the dial and as the management are just about selling watches, I'll bet there will be a steel version with an orange Jenny fish on the crown.


No way it'll be $1300, it will be at least $2000 or even $2500 if it has the COSC movement like the ceramic version has. How could they ever defend the price of the 300T if they sold the steel Army for $700 less?


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## Ticktocker (Oct 27, 2009)

ross2187 said:


> I'm here for it, and I get - and support the price.
> 
> It's in line with the US Divers Carbon - price wise. It's a totally new material for Doxa, it's a collab and an LE. Doxa has to be allowed to push the ball forward and they shouldn't be expected to live at the $2k price range forever for every piece. Can't please everyone.


It's not the price that gets me. It's what you get for the price. If they want to come up with a $4500 watch, I support that 100%. But coming up with a watch that has nothing more than any $1500 watch has and charging $4500 is something I don't support or understand.


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## Zaboomer (Mar 24, 2019)

I kind of knew this was going to happen. Really disappointed in this. I would have immediately purchased a steel version at sub $3,000 pricing. The price of this piece is absurd and I would never purchase a watch made of a case material that can shatter. This just makes Doxa management look more foolish and outplayed by Synchron.


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## MaBr (Jan 22, 2018)

Zaboomer said:


> I kind of knew this was going to happen. Really disappointed in this. I would have immediately purchased a steel version at sub $3,000 pricing. The price of this piece is absurd and I would never purchase a watch made of a case material that can shatter. This just makes Doxa management look more foolish and outplayed by Synchron.


A $3000 steel version would also be absurd considering Synchrons $1000 price point. It's not worth a 3x premium to have Doxa on the dial.


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## sirjohnk (Sep 8, 2017)

What really interests me is that they got it down to 11.95mm thickness with the same SW200 and 300m WR.
Please Please Doxa, can you work the same magic with the 300T, 600T, etc?!!

PS: coverage from Monochrome here:








Hands-On - Doxa Army Watches of Switzerland Edition (Specs & Price)


The Doxa Army is back on active duty, with a cool, rugged black ceramic limited edition for Watches of Switzerland.




monochrome-watches.com


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## NeurosciGuy15 (Jan 4, 2018)

sirjohnk said:


> What really interests me is that they got it down to 11.95mm thickness with the same SW200 and 300m WR.
> Please Please Doxa, can you work the same magic with the 300T, 600T, etc?!!


I thought the same. Really nice side profile on this one.


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## BSwed (Jul 14, 2021)

NeurosciGuy15 said:


> I thought the same. Really nice side profile on this one.


And also I, if I remember correctly, the carbon case had to have an inner metal construction around the movement. So fairly impressive given that.
Edit: a flat crystal helps a lot though.


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## OTL (Oct 12, 2019)

They even cheap out with the PVD coating on the clasp. The price is nuts.


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## LuckyTime35 (Mar 22, 2017)

a 2k max spec'd watch for $4,500? lol no thanks


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## JorgeB (Jun 13, 2012)

I've lost all my interest in Doxa since Rick Marei left. 
Now it feels like a fashion brand and pricing is absurd. Moreover, Synchron beat Doxa at their own game like 6-8 months ago.
I'm happy with my Sharkhunter Aqualung 300 but no new doxas for me.


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## ross2187 (Sep 16, 2016)

Ticktocker said:


> It's not the price that gets me. It's what you get for the price. If they want to come up with a $4500 watch, I support that 100%. But coming up with a watch that has nothing more than any $1500 watch has and charging $4500 is something I don't support or understand.



I may be the rarity, but I see the value. This is a big step up from my 300T. Thinner 300T case made out of ceramic - which is new for Doxa, with a titanium tub for the movement, titanium caseback, and titanium crown. With a COSC movement and 300m WR. These features aren't free. 

But hey, we're all allowed our own opinions here, which makes this place great.


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## JIFB (May 7, 2017)

100 hundred items sold in a couple of hour at 4.200€... 
And some people around here find that the 'classical' Doxas are over priced... And that Joma price is the right price... And that Doxa probably don't sell much watches at the official price...
Well, here you got an answer and it makes me laugh a bit  (even though I also find that this Army model is for sure over-priced).


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## sglider (Nov 21, 2007)

Have any of you complaining about the price actually priced a ceramic cased watch from a legitimate brand? IWC (who pioneered ceramic cases) will run you around $10,000. For a Doxa it might be steep, but in the watch industry as a whole, $4500 for a ceramic case, COSC certified movement, 100 piece LE is actually pretty good.


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## ross2187 (Sep 16, 2016)

sglider said:


> Have any of you complaining about the price actually priced a ceramic cased watch from a legitimate brand? IWC (who pioneered ceramic cases) will run you around $10,000. For a Doxa it might be steep, but in the watch industry as a whole, $4500 for a ceramic case, COSC certified movement, 100 piece LE is actually pretty good.


Glad somebody finally said it _claps_


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## Flyingdoctor (Feb 11, 2006)

The fact that a big expensive, up market brand can charge $10,000 for a ceramic watch does not make it acceptable or that Doxa charge $4500 for a ceramic watch acceptable to everyone.

We could go down the rabbit hole or what something actually costs and how much is added because of the name.

People here are mostly fan boys who have literally lusted after a reasonably priced Army from Doxa. We can moan about the price and material and ugly orange Jenny fish or be a trumpeter for it but at the end of the day, very, very few of the people posting here will ever own one of these. This was not a watch aimed at us.

I expect those who are 'defending' it will buy it and be happy.

For the record. I like it, other than the crown. I like the thinness, the flat caseback, the flat crystal. The innovation of ceramic and actually I applaud the use of the camouflage case. Right thing for right watch.

I'll never own one, which is a disappointment. 



sglider said:


> Have any of you complaining about the price actually priced a ceramic cased watch from a legitimate brand? IWC (who pioneered ceramic cases) will run you around $10,000. For a Doxa it might be steep, but in the watch industry as a whole, $4500 for a ceramic case, COSC certified movement, 100 piece LE is actually pretty good.


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## Flyingdoctor (Feb 11, 2006)

Please post photos when yours arrives



ross2187 said:


> Glad somebody finally said it _claps_


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## ross2187 (Sep 16, 2016)

Flyingdoctor said:


> Please post photos when yours arrives


Bit of a watch purchasing freeze after my Rolex came in, in January.. Something about the wife wanting to get house finances in line, get ready for having kids, more investing, possibly starting a business, etc.. 

But thank you for believing in me Doc!


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## 8505davids (Jan 14, 2017)

MaBr said:


> A $3000 steel version would also be absurd considering Synchrons $1000 price point. It's not worth a 3x premium to have Doxa on the dial.


That was always Doxa's problem as soon as the Synchron and subsequent homages came out. Maybe they have been scratching their heads these months trying to come up with something different to justify a higher price and somebody suggested ceramic...so I suppose they could (and still might) issue one at 300 price and get slated for why it was so much more expensive than the homages, or go the full hog (and get slated for that of course!)

Can't blame them for trying to move upmarket (and up-profit-margin) as in the luxury goods market it seems there are always folks wanting to splash their money about and sometimes the more expensive the better, and if you don't ask that price.... But of course it hasn't worked so far and it seemed the 600 (high riding case aside) was a welcome return to sense. There is no reason why Doxa shouldn't have $4k plus watches in their range but they have got to be worth it - is that case worth $2k plus above a 300 (and I know nothing about ceramic cases , or why I would need one) - if it is for you then great.


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## gstand (Mar 10, 2021)

Nope......just nope.


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## BSwed (Jul 14, 2021)

Let's hope for a non-limited steel version priced around the 300T. I think that could work.


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## TallWatch (Oct 10, 2013)

sglider said:


> Have any of you complaining about the price actually priced a ceramic cased watch from a legitimate brand? IWC (who pioneered ceramic cases) will run you around $10,000. For a Doxa it might be steep, but in the watch industry as a whole, $4500 for a ceramic case, COSC certified movement, 100 piece LE is actually pretty good.


Apart from the limited nrs, Rado does a whole bunch of ceramic watches starting at € 2000 - 2500 . COSC is about the minimum standard today i would say and all major movement brands can give you that. 38 hrs PR is weak though. So Doxa/WOS is overpricing this one especially given the number of fans waiting for this model. 100 LE in pricy carbon is okay, that risk is on WOS, but for Rick`s sake, run a steel version at 2500,- and sell a LOT of watches.


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## kpaxsg (Feb 11, 2006)

Price is what you pay, value is what you get. FOMO helps DOXA for this issue. Flipper perhaps kept out of the game with this price but I may be wrong...glad I got my M.A.D Red...massena geometer, Ming Gilt, Kurono Chrono 2...


Still available for this Doxa Army I believe....





Doxa Army 42.5mm Watches of Switzerland Edition 785.00.031.20. | Watches Of Switzerland US


DOXA




www.watchesofswitzerland.com


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## TallWatch (Oct 10, 2013)

kpaxsg said:


> Price is what you pay, value is what you get. FOMO helps DOXA for this issue. Flipper perhaps kept out of the game with this price but I may be wrong...glad I got my M.A.D Red...massena geometer, Ming Gilt, Kurono Chrono 2...
> 
> 
> COOL line-up you have !


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## OTL (Oct 12, 2019)

sglider said:


> Have any of you complaining about the price actually priced a ceramic cased watch from a legitimate brand? IWC (who pioneered ceramic cases) will run you around $10,000. For a Doxa it might be steep, but in the watch industry as a whole, $4500 for a ceramic case, COSC certified movement, 100 piece LE is actually pretty good.


Yep. You can get Tudor, Zenith ect. fully ceramic watches with in-house COSC movements for this kind of money. This watch is overpriced, there is no debate to be had about it.


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## O . (May 13, 2020)

I really like this watch, and love the use of ceramic, but there's no way I can justify $4500 for a Sellita SW200-1, even COSC grade. This is entering into the laughable pricing territory of B&R. Not a good look for Doxa. 

These are still available on the WOS site.


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## martin_blank (May 19, 2010)

Where are these ceramic Zenith watches for 4K? 

Complaining about watch prices is so 2010...


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## sglider (Nov 21, 2007)

OTL said:


> Yep. You can get Tudor, Zenith ect. fully ceramic watches with in-house COSC movements for this kind of money. This watch is overpriced, there is no debate to be had about it.


The black bay ceramic is a few hundred more, Zenith's ceramic models are a couple thousand more. I'm frankly shocked the BB ceramic sells for that little tbh. I'm also pretty sure that Doxa doesn't have Tudor's resources, so development costs and the per unit cost of those ceramic cases is probably a lot higher for Doxa than it is for Tudor. And those Rado's are a little cheaper, but their ceramic models carry at least a thousand dollar premium over similar steel models. All of that to say ceramic cases cost more. Which is one of the reasons this watch costs more.


----------



## MaximillionBuxx (Dec 31, 2016)

Horrible looking dial and the case shatters when dropped. No thank you.

Edit: I see it has already sold out on Doxa's website at least. Expect it in steel soon.


----------



## MarkinKC (Dec 10, 2017)

Flyingdoctor said:


> Doxa Army 42.5mm Watches of Switzerland Edition 785.00.031.20. | Watches Of Switzerland US
> 
> 
> DOXA
> ...


They're thinking, "Maybe we should be more like Invicta!"


----------



## MaximillionBuxx (Dec 31, 2016)

JorgeB said:


> I've lost all my interest in Doxa since Rick Marei left.
> Now it feels like a fashion brand and pricing is absurd. Moreover, Synchron beat Doxa at their own game like 6-8 months ago.
> I'm happy with my Sharkhunter Aqualung 300 but no new doxas for me.


I'm torn. Seems less like a forum watch more like a fashion watch. I think all the grassroots forum stuff during the Marei era started hurting the brand after a time.


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## Ticktocker (Oct 27, 2009)

Forget that it’s a Doxa. Maybe someone can explain why a watch, a MILITARY watch to boot, that can easily shatter would be a watch anyone would want to pay more than a few hundred bucks much less $4500. 
My grandmother’s ceramic vase broke because I looked at it cross eyed.


----------



## sglider (Nov 21, 2007)

Ticktocker said:


> Forget that it’s a Doxa. Maybe someone can explain why a watch, a MILITARY watch to boot, that can easily shatter would be a watch anyone would want to pay more than a few hundred bucks much less $4500.
> My grandmother’s ceramic vase broke because I looked at it cross eyed.


Not the same ceramics. The ceramics used in watches probably have more in common with the tiles on a space shuttle than your grandmother’s vase. Super hard, darn near scratch proof, super light.









Ceramic Watches | Watch Education | Govberg Watches


Govberg: Luxury Watches Including Rolex, Omega and Patek Philippe




www.govbergwatches.com


----------



## Flyingdoctor (Feb 11, 2006)

You have to remember that it was the grassroots forum stuff that built the brand back from basically nothing. Did it hurt in the end, not if you wanted the Doxa SUB to remain a niche market watch? However, the grassroots gave the Jenny owners back a fully functioning and profitable brand. They decided to expand the horizons and move towards a more easily accessible and fashion centric profile. The Marei era had to end one way or another. It was always on the cards.

People like me sometimes get a bit miffed at the direction Doxa is going. Hopefully I get a bit if a pass because I am now probably the professor emeritus  of all things Doxa history so I think I can justify some of my criticism.

My beef is with the use of the Jenny fish and it being bastardised as the Doxa fish. Classing the C-graph and 200 as SUBs. News flash, even though the 200 has some Doxa DNA in it, it was never called a SUB and the lack of acknowledgement for what Rick Marei achieved and even worse what Clive Cussler did. But, hey, if that is all the grief Doxa get, they will be happy  

Rick Marei is now doing very nicely thank you reviving Aquastar. I can guarantee when this piece of dive watch history is reissued, it won't be ceramic and it won't cost $4500  










The new ceramic Doxa Army (and I'm convinced there will be more) has a bit of a back story which kinda justifies why it was a special edition and ceramic and high price. The expression "luxury Swiss watch brand" was mentioned at one time. More as an aspiration rather than a fact but I can understand where it is coming from. Think big or go home.

I really want the brand to succeed. I love Doxa, always will. I hope they throw some of old timer grassroots guys a bit of a bone every once in a while. 




MaximillionBuxx said:


> I'm torn. Seems less like a forum watch more like a fashion watch. I think all the grassroots forum stuff during the Marei era started hurting the brand after a time.


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## OTL (Oct 12, 2019)

martin_blank said:


> Where are these ceramic Zenith watches for 4K?
> 
> Complaining about watch prices is so 2010...


Who said they can be bought for 4K? Please let me know where.


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## MaximillionBuxx (Dec 31, 2016)

Flyingdoctor said:


> You have to remember that it was the grassroots forum stuff that built the brand back from basically nothing. Did it hurt in the end, not if you wanted the Doxa SUB to remain a niche market watch? However, the grassroots gave the Jenny owners back a fully functioning and profitable brand. They decided to expand the horizons and move towards a more easily accessible and fashion centric profile. The Marei era had to end one way or another. It was always on the cards.
> 
> People like me sometimes get a bit miffed at the direction Doxa is going. Hopefully I get a bit if a pass because I am now probably the professor emeritus  of all things Doxa history so I think I can justify some of my criticism.
> 
> ...


Yeah. I totally get your point. I was there from 2008ish forward, but not when the brand got rolling again in 2001. I would feel the same as you. And thank you for reviving Doxa as well, btw.

Here is my point, however. I think what hurt the brand, or at least what I saw, was lots of online infighting between people who had no ownership of the intellectual property who felt the Jenny family owed them something for hyping Doxa or helping arrange to online forum sales. For instance, I remember one guy who had some sort of agency/employment dispute that would secretly email you not to purchase the brand and would make all kinds of outrageous claims about Doxa if you said something nice online. And maybe the Jenny family did owe everyone something more, but all of the online airing of greivances made the brand look like amateur hour.

I truly appreciate Rick Marei (I saw his name come up on another dead trademark watch filing recently, lol) and everyone who got the brand rolling again, but I'd like to see prices rise and brand recognition to also increase to offset the depreciation associated with the watches I own. The only way I see this happening is the company putting some distance in from the people who helped revive it. At the same time, I'd like to see a few changes from their current direction as well, but I'm not in the biz of selling watches. 

Does that make sense?


----------



## NeurosciGuy15 (Jan 4, 2018)

Flyingdoctor said:


> People like me sometimes get a bit miffed at the direction Doxa is going. Hopefully I get a bit if a pass because I am now probably the professor emeritus  of all things Doxa history so I think I can justify some of my criticism.
> 
> My beef is with the use of the Jenny fish and it being bastardised as the Doxa fish. Classing the C-graph and 200 as SUBs. News flash, even though the 200 has some Doxa DNA in it, it was never called a SUB and the lack of acknowledgement for what Rick Marei achieved and even worse what Clive Cussler did. But, hey, if that is all the grief Doxa get, they will be happy
> 
> ...


A Benthos 500 would be a super cool reissue. Can’t imagine it would be cheap…not too many totalizer movements with a fly back out there. Although in this situation a watch with a movement like that would be interesting enough to warrant the price.

Re: Sub 200. I get the annoyance with the name. I really do. It’s a bit sacrilegious. But I also do totally understand why they’d want a consistent identity across the full spectrum of their watches.


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## charger02 (Apr 28, 2011)

Ticktocker said:


> Forget that it’s a Doxa. Maybe someone can explain why a watch, a MILITARY watch to boot, that can easily shatter would be a watch anyone would want to pay more than a few hundred bucks much less $4500.
> My grandmother’s ceramic vase broke because I looked at it cross eyed.



Finally, an area I can comment on based on life experience. This is a trinket. A timepiece based on history. It's not really a military time piece. Sure you can wear it in a combat zone, including heavily defended bases with coffee shops, but automatic watches are just not that durable. I have seen people wear Omegas and Rolex and I would trust my Suunto/G Shock/Garmin to work after I dropped it in the shower or banged it against a bunker or armored vehicle. 

The reality is that if you can afford it and want to wear it so be it. Is it really a military watch? Sure. I guess. It tells time. But will it stand up to the rigors of hard use? I guess that depends on how hard your job is. 

I find it funny, that people always talk about a "military" watch, especially when discussing divers, but I would really like to know if deep-sea welders use automatic watches.


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## riff raff (Dec 28, 2015)

Flyingdoctor said:


> I'm not going to comment..... except. .. Black, tactical, stealthy, military look with a big ugly orange Jenny fish on the crown.... seriously....jeezus wept


Well, you nailed the issues with this eyesore. I think this watch may have been the real reason for *****' outburst at the temple. (he actually liked most money changers)


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## Flyingdoctor (Feb 11, 2006)

MaximillionBuxx said:


> the biz of selling watches.


You hit the nail on the head with that. Doxa is no longer in the business of reviving the brand AND selling watches it is now purely about selling watches.

Other than an Aubry angular case with the crown at 3 o'clock, Doxa pretty much has exhausted its historical designs. Also, its association with diving is in the past. The ICE era is about tie ins with watch distributers and bloggers. I fully expect to see the Scunthorpe Farmers Weekly edition of the crap graph  

Dive watches have also pretty much lost their association with diving. 50 Years ago the new 600T would have been worn as a dive watch. Who would care about the galactic caseback height. It would mesh into a wetsuit and the watch would function perfectly for the job it was designed to do. That rarely happens now. We will never know but what percentage of new 600T owners have dived with the watch? Not too many I'll bet. Nowadays it is about wearing a nice watch which is why not making a subtle change to the design to flatten the caseback and reduce the height was a bad mistake in my mind. It has to be about wearability, not just looks.

But since the world has moved on, why not Doxa? If the Scunthorpe Farmers Weekly limited edition will sell watches then why not. Heck, I'll bet Jan Edocs would give his right nut to have Justin Beeber wear a Doxa SUB and mention it to his fans. Walca couldn't make them fast enough. Diving, who cares, croon out another tune and flash that Doxa, Justin  

And that leads me to the Ceramic Army. .........we honour our history with the Swiss Army’s elite divers unit by reissuing.......... I thought that was a nice touch. And it makes sense to me to establish that connection with history because other than something like Mission 31, there isn't anything else that even vaguely interests anyone in the diving world. I was lucky enough to become friends with Dr Don Walsh who wore an Aquastar on the Trieste during the deepest dive ever back in 1960 and Marc Jasinski who designed the Deepstar Decompression bezel when I was writing the Aquastar book. I became friends with Dirk Cussler and Ralph Wilbanks and was lucky enough to be able to give Clive Cussler one of my signed books instead of it being the other way round  Absolutely wonderful and kind people and people who are a big part of diving and dive watch history.

The ceramic Army is a part of that history, unfortunately the limited quantity and price mean that very few people will ever get to experience it. But, that's the way the world turns.


----------



## Flyingdoctor (Feb 11, 2006)

Watch this space... well not THIS space. You may be surprised 



NeurosciGuy15 said:


> A Benthos 500 would be a super cool reissue. Can’t imagine it would be cheap…not too many totalizer movements with a fly back out there. Although in this situation a watch with a movement like that would be interesting enough to warrant the price.
> 
> Re: Sub 200. I get the annoyance with the name. I really do. It’s a bit sacrilegious. But I also do totally understand why they’d want a consistent identity across the full spectrum of their watches.


----------



## Flyingdoctor (Feb 11, 2006)

This I do know something about as I started in the offshore industry in Aberdeen back in 1984 and knew a bunch of saturation and inspection divers there and inspection divers when I ran subsea pipeline inspection jobs in the middle east, which is where I first saw a Doxa SUB on the wrist of a diver I was pulling on deck...blah, blah, blah

Yep Rolex SUBs were the soup du jour for most of the divers I knew then. Nowadays probably not.



charger02 said:


> Finally, an area I can comment on based on life experience. This is a trinket. A timepiece based on history. It's not really a military time piece. Sure you can wear it in a combat zone, including heavily defended bases with coffee shops, but automatic watches are just not that durable. I have seen people wear Omegas and Rolex and I would trust my Suunto/G Shock/Garmin to work after I dropped it in the shower or banged it against a bunker or armored vehicle.
> 
> The reality is that if you can afford it and want to wear it so be it. Is it really a military watch? Sure. I guess. It tells time. But will it stand up to the rigors of hard use? I guess that depends on how hard your job is.
> 
> I find it funny, that people always talk about a "military" watch, especially when discussing divers, but I would really like to know if deep-sea welders use automatic watches.


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## Dark Overlord (Jul 18, 2016)

defining a mark up as the added percentage of the original price paid.

Omega SMPc $5100, ceramic $8100. Planet Ocean $6500, ceramic $10200 60% mark-up approx
Tudor BB $3575 ceramic $4825 26% mark up approx
IWC big pilot $8650 ceramic $10300 21% mark up
Doxa 300sub $2450 Army ceramic $4500 83% mark up

this is the reason for the general ire attached to the release at this price. by percentage for the market Doxa plays in they are charging you 83% of the original product on top of the original price. I used the 300sub because of the COSC movement, that's only fair. If you gauge it against the 300t its a 143% mark up. 

I personally never loved the army design like I do the Sub design. But I can always be persuaded as a watch guy to consider a purchase. not here


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## NeurosciGuy15 (Jan 4, 2018)

Flyingdoctor said:


> Watch this space... well not THIS space. You may be surprised


A certain other space I presume. Haha I’ll keep a very interested eye out.


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## redhed18 (Mar 23, 2013)

MaximillionBuxx said:


> I truly appreciate Rick Marei (I saw his name come up on another dead trademark watch filing recently, lol)


I think at this point that Rick could & should start his own "Marei" brand... the man has enough skin in the game.


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## MaximillionBuxx (Dec 31, 2016)

I've never dived with any of mine. I go back to the Caribbean quarterly and I always wear my 1500T. The majority of my time is spent in the ocean swimming. I rinse it off, but occasionally I'll find a little salt under the clasp or whatnot. I love it when that happens and is why I'll never sell the huge ill balanced piece that it is. 

I doubt I'll ever dive, but I'm already planning on wearing it on some more low-level mountaineering stuff this summer and up Kilimanjaro in March or June next year. It all gives me a romantic feeling, you know? Doxa is about adventure of any kind to me.

With all that said, if Bieber or Travis Scott or whomever suddenly elevates the status of the brand, I'd be delighted even though my next Doxa will surely be a vintage of some kind.


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## jskane (Mar 18, 2020)

OTL said:


> Yep. You can get Tudor, Zenith ect. fully ceramic watches with in-house COSC movements for this kind of money. This watch is overpriced, there is no debate to be had about it.


Tudor maybe - no way Zenith ... so what's the "etc", then?


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## Dark Overlord (Jul 18, 2016)

jskane said:


> Tudor maybe - no way Zenith ... so what's the "etc", then?


rado $3500 
not a lot of ceramic out there to be fair. makes the black bay quite a deal


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## 19thnervousbreakdown (Dec 1, 2021)

It’s some way sad.. that’s what I can say about it. Looked forward to it, but not in this way. I didn’t want a ceramic sub 300 with a Army design and a orange printed crown. I wanted a beefier SUB Case, non limited, someway cheap (we) so I could bash it around and see some marks on the coating… that’s what I wanted! But maybe this is similar to the 600T and it will come as a non LE Version. fairly affordable then without this special ceramic material but in good old fashioned steel.

In the meantime I am well set with my Aquastars and my SUB300 concerning the Dive Tool Watch part of my collection.

This release will directly move into the drawer to the 600T titanium and the 200 T graph in gold. (At least in my head). That’s not what Doxa stands for.
And I bet when they release a non LE version in steel they will make more money of it than with this LE Edition.

Just my 2 cents….


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## jskane (Mar 18, 2020)

Dark Overlord said:


> rado $3500
> not a lot of ceramic out there to be fair. makes the black bay quite a deal


Agree about the Black Bay but point being, ceramic is generally pricy across the board - even with the manufacturing clout of the Swatch Group. I mean, $3500.00 for a Rado?

I'm just not on the totally negative bandwagon here - at least not until I hear James Lamdin's take (he's the Doxa freak at Analog Shift and that's where Watches of Switzerland enters the picture). And I say not in the negative camp because. like, why? What's the big f'ing deal? So Doxa makes another pricey LE that practically _EVERYBODY_ predicted ... omg.


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## ross2187 (Sep 16, 2016)

MaximillionBuxx said:


> Yeah. I totally get your point. I was there from 2008ish forward, but not when the brand got rolling again in 2001. I would feel the same as you. And thank you for reviving Doxa as well, btw.
> 
> Here is my point, however. I think what hurt the brand, or at least what I saw, was lots of online infighting between people who had no ownership of the intellectual property who felt the Jenny family owed them something for hyping Doxa or helping arrange to online forum sales. For instance, I remember one guy who had some sort of agency/employment dispute that would secretly email you not to purchase the brand and would make all kinds of outrageous claims about Doxa if you said something nice online. And maybe the Jenny family did owe everyone something more, but all of the online airing of greivances made the brand look like amateur hour.
> 
> ...





jskane said:


> Agree about the Black Bay but point being, ceramic is generally pricy across the board - even with the manufacturing clout of the Swatch Group. I mean, $3500.00 for a Rado?
> 
> I'm just not on the totally negative bandwagon here - at least not until I hear James Lamdin's take (he's the Doxa freak at Analog Shift and that's where Watches of Switzerland enters the picture). And I say not in the negative camp because. like, why? What's the big f'ing deal? So Doxa makes another pricey LE that practically _EVERYBODY_ predicted ... omg.



The endless hate and complaining has to stop. The gatekeeping of the Marei era, by… the few.. is just absolutely exhausting and nauseating. He did his job (of which we thank him and recognize his contributions - GREATLY) , he’s gone and its a new day. Lets move on. The constant gate keeping of it, and slamming, shaming, and slagging the current owners does absolutely no favors for new fans, it only turns them off and away.

Grow up kids, it’s only watches. Lets just be excited Doxa even exists today.


----------



## kpaxsg (Feb 11, 2006)

Discussion aside. I stumbled on the link for similar looking rubber strap if you guys are interested:


https://shopee.sg/product/272879973/5352911843?smtt=0.16160460-1651112119.9


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## drmdwebb (Apr 17, 2020)

So disappointed. I was looking forward to this! I nearly choked when I saw the price. I’ve been waiting, but I’ll be looking to pick up a Synchron secondhand now.

I quite like it though. I wonder if they’ll be selling at >1000 off the RPP soon like the carbon is.


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## MaximillionBuxx (Dec 31, 2016)

ross2187 said:


> The endless hate and complaining hasto stop. The gatekeeping of the Marei era, by… the few.. is just absolutely exhausting and nauseating. He did his job (of which we thank him and recognize his contributions - GREATLY) , he’s gone and its a new day. Lets move on. The constant gate keeping of it, and slamming, shaming, and slagging the current owners does absolutely no favors for new fans, it only turns them off and away.
> 
> Grow up kids, it’s only watches. Lets just be excited Doxa even exists today.


I've been looking into buying some dead trademarks & you'd be surprised about how the Swiss ignore the world in terms of protecting their intellectual proprety and yet endlessly make it difficult to accomplish manufacturing there. I see how Marei got cut off from the company & am shocked he got as far as he did with a Swiss Made label.


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## Ketchup time (Apr 23, 2015)

First off, love DOXA and I truly hope that they are successful and continue to bring us our quirky loved divers.
But, I miss the days of the DOXA Sub embracing their roots as a DIVE watch. 
















Continuing and building relationships with the Cousteau’s and Cussler, as well as;
Project Aware
Poseidon 
TUSA
Mission 31
Spirotechnique
Ocean Futures Society
NUMA
Seahunters
RA Navy
Aqualung 

Why can’t we still have that? Isn’t that more impressive then some obscure online watch retailer LE? Why can’t the ICE era recognize and mention this on their site? 
”You’re call to adventure”
Great tag line, you have a legitimate history, use it, capitalize on it.
You’ve got the watch line up, now focus on producing an amazing tapered beads of rice bracelet. 
And for us watch nerds, give us a Cussler edition Sub.


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## Flyingdoctor (Feb 11, 2006)

While I do agree with your overall sentiments. I think you are using just a little hyperbole with your claims of hate, exhausting and nauseating

If the stuff that is posted really is so absolutely exhausting and nauseating to you then just block the posters. Everything will be a lot more sweetness and light. One of the individuals here has made it a career to go to the Aquastar forum and moan, groan, complain and generally just be annoying. It is definitely tiresome. Many people blocked him. Easy.

You seem to be a somewhat positive individual with your clap, clap and well done Doxa, love the price and watch etc, etc. That's great, it will balance things nicely and assuming I am one of "the few" gatekeeping the Marei era (not actually quite sure exactly what that means), I appreciate you acknowledging his contribution......It's just a pity the ..... see what I almost did there .... almost 

And as for this..... _it’s only watches. Lets just be excited Doxa even exists today....... _absolutely spot on. Couldn't agree more.



ross2187 said:


> The endless hate and complaining has to to stop. The gatekeeping of the Marei era,by… the few.. is just absolutely exhausting and nauseating. He did his job (of which we thank him and recognize his contributions - GREATLY) , he’s gone and its a new day. Lets move on. The constant gate keeping of it, and slamming and shaming the current owners does absolutely no favors for new fans, it only turns them off and away.
> 
> Grow up kids, it’s only watches. Lets just be excited Doxa even exists today.


----------



## vkalia (Oct 26, 2014)

The whole "$4500-Sellita" doesnt make sense to me. I am not buying a movement - I am buying a watch. The case matters - and ceramic cases are expensive. And so does brand/history (that's why we lap re-issues and stuff). Given all fo that, $4500 for a carbon case isnt bad at all. Not a steal but not a rip-off either.

The issue is more that we enthusiasts dont see Doxa as a maker of $4500 watches. I know i dont. If they release this in steel (preferably not PVD) for $2k or so, i will likely get one. I like the look of the Army - never been interested in the homage releases by Synchron and others, but the OG would be nice.


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## BobMartian (Sep 23, 2011)

It’s nice to see something original with modern features. Not just another exact copy of a watch released 50 years ago. That is essentially a replica with different branding.

Doxa should release these in different color cases. MoonSwatch style.


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## Dark Overlord (Jul 18, 2016)

jskane said:


> Agree about the Black Bay but point being, ceramic is generally pricy across the board - even with the manufacturing clout of the Swatch Group. I mean, $3500.00 for a Rado?
> 
> I'm just not on the totally negative bandwagon here - at least not until I hear James Lamdin's take (he's the Doxa freak at Analog Shift and that's where Watches of Switzerland enters the picture). And I say not in the negative camp because. like, why? What's the big f'ing deal? So Doxa makes another pricey LE that practically _EVERYBODY_ predicted ... omg.


I'm not negative on this either. Just analytical. 

the reason I, think, for the the types of negative responses most have had, I believe comes down to price ratios.

Sure many would've hoped that this came in around $2k or less but I also think many would accepted a $2500-2750 price range in ceramic. Anything under 3k would've at least been inline with other manufacturers and kept Doxa in the same market range. Higher priced than many bit still entry level luxury.

the Tudor out spec'ing the Doxa for less will make many think esp if this wasn't limited. Similar to how many pan Hublot for being way more expensive than cheaper watches that out spec them. Not something collectors embrace as a rule of thumb.


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## Monkeynuts (Dec 23, 2012)

It’s a great release but for me the military is been overdone now


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## 8505davids (Jan 14, 2017)

Flyingdoctor said:


> Rick Marei is now doing very nicely thank you reviving Aquastar. I can guarantee when this piece of dive watch history is reissued, it won't be ceramic and it won't cost $4500
> 
> View attachment 16594982


Please ensure he makes it too big for my skinny wrist and not for a couple of years - I'm in the bad books with my better half as it is

As an aside the Doc is quite right - this watch isn't meant for the average Doxa fan - there are only 100 so its a real niche target with case and especially price, and as that its interesting to see it made. Likely a more everyman steel version will appear aimed at the bulk of Doxa buyers. Its not one for me either way - I'd sooner have another, more attractive, 300.


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## TallWatch (Oct 10, 2013)

Flyingdoctor said:


> with the Swiss Army’s elite divers unit by reissuing..........


A unit as needless as a ceramic dive watch , no country will invade Switzerland by sea...... so a perfect match


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## adg31 (Dec 28, 2010)

TallWatch said:


> A unit as needless as a ceramic dive watch , no country will invade Switzerland by sea...... so a perfect match


They have got some quite deep lakes though 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## TallWatch (Oct 10, 2013)

adg31 said:


> They have got some quite deep lakes though
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Maybe they could start a coast guard then for those lakes ...


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## daglesj (Jan 5, 2020)

BobMartian said:


> It’s nice to see something original with modern features. Not just another exact copy of a watch released 50 years ago. That is essentially a replica with different branding.


Eh? Not sure if being sarcastic...  🤣


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## hooperman42 (May 12, 2006)

Hideous


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## OTL (Oct 12, 2019)

jskane said:


> Tudor maybe - no way Zenith ... so what's the "etc", then?


The Zenith Defy Skeleton ceramic can be purchased new on the grey market for a bit over $5000. It shouldn't be too hard to get a 25% discount at most AD's either, so that would keep them in the same ballpark.

As also previously mentioned there is Rado. And Bell & Ross, and several micro brands...


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## Snulle (Apr 15, 2011)

So the Army finally came out, and it sold out fast. I would like a Doxa Army, even though I already have the Synchron Military. I have no experience with ceramic cases so I have no personal opinion about that but this version was too expensive for me anyway. When I first saw the images I thought it looked a bit strange, mostly colour wise, and the size of the font and Army "logo"... The beige/teal in the center seemed off somehow, perhaps it's just because it's brand new and does not have the patina of a vintage dial but it looks dirty somehow, I think it should have a bit more yellow tint. The hands are also a bit too bright orange than I assume they should be and the markers and numbers should be toned down, perhaps it's the pics but to me the bezel is too bright and kind of "takes over" somehow. I dinät know if I dare to say it but my first impression of it was that it looked sort of "toyish"... You'd assume that Doxa would get the colours right on a reissue of their own watch  Perhaps I'm just gotten used to the Synchron Military, the beige on the dial is a bit brighter but the hands and bezel look more like the Vintage Army. I found some in-hand comparison images on an other forum that shows the vintage Army, the new Army and the Synchron and it shows the colour difference, especially on the hands and bezel. I have to say that I do like the thickness, or perhaps I should say the slimness, of the reissue. A steel version release seems logical, now they have the dial and hands, but the question is if they would make a new slimmer steel case for it... Could the 300 case fit? If there will be a steel version in PVD and it's not another limited edition my guess is that it will be priced as the 300 (since it's a COSC).


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## Flyingdoctor (Feb 11, 2006)

Nevermind an Army with that case. Make one in steel as a Cussler edition and I personally will shake Edocs' hand and tell him he is my hero.



Snulle said:


> So the Army finally came out, and it sold out fast. I would like a Doxa Army, even though I already have the Synchron Military. I have no experience with ceramic cases so I have no personal opinion about that but this version was too expensive for me anyway. When I first saw the images I thought it looked a bit strange, mostly colour wise, and the size of the font and Army "logo"... The beige/teal in the center seemed off somehow, perhaps it's just because it's brand new and does not have the patina of a vintage dial but it looks dirty somehow, I think it should have a bit more yellow tint. The hands are also a bit too bright orange than I assume they should be and the markers and numbers should be toned down, perhaps it's the pics but to me the bezel is too bright and kind of "takes over" somehow. I dinät know if I dare to say it but my first impression of it was that it looked sort of "toyish"... You'd assume that Doxa would get the colours right on a reissue of their own watch  Perhaps I'm just gotten used to the Synchron Military, the beige on the dial is a bit brighter but the hands and bezel look more like the Vintage Army. I found some in-hand comparison images on an other forum that shows the vintage Army, the new Army and the Synchron and it shows the colour difference, especially on the hands and bezel. I have to say that I do like the thickness, or perhaps I should say the slimness, of the reissue. A steel version release seems logical, now they have the dial and hands, but the question is if they would make a new slimmer steel case for it... Could the 300 case fit? If there will be a steel version in PVD and it's not another limited edition my guess is that it will be priced as the 300 (since it's a COSC).
> 
> View attachment 16596768
> 
> ...


----------



## Seikonut1967 (Feb 22, 2020)

Flyingdoctor said:


> Nevermind an Army with that case. Make one in steel as a Cussler edition and I personally will shake Edocs' hand and tell him he is my hero.


Cussler edition is way overdue. Clive did helluva lot for the brand without wanting any credit, kudos, recognition or whatever you want to call it. Least that could be done is give him a little credit by way of an iteration in his honour. 
Sadly it seems that they would sooner do collaborations with companies or brands that like to blow smoke up their posterior.


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## daglesj (Jan 5, 2020)

As I said elsewhere, I just can't get over that awful font on the dial. Screams playschool rather than warfare.


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## jskane (Mar 18, 2020)

OTL said:


> The Zenith Defy Skeleton ceramic can be purchased new on the grey market for a bit over $5000. It shouldn't be too hard to get a 25% discount at most AD's either, so that would keep them in the same ballpark.
> 
> As also previously mentioned there is Rado. And Bell & Ross, and several micro brands...


Good lord: grey market vs. retail - guessing at discounts - give it a rest.

$4500.00 for a 100 round LE from a company that retails its carbon watches just under that price point collabed with Watches of Switzerland is just simply not out of line ... or even surprising.

You can not like it - but you can't ignore the business trajectory as to how they got there.


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## Oris1977 (Mar 14, 2020)

Well…Based on what I’ve read so far in this thread, I’m going to be “that guy.” Lol. Through fate, I bought one.

I was reading about the release last night and thought “that’s a cool watch that would fit well into my collection but it’s a bit pricey for what it is.” I kind of forgot about it seeing that it was limited to only 100 pieces (so what are the chances of even getting one) and I don’t really want to spend that kind of money right now.

This morning my sales rep at my AD called and said she will have one Friday and it’s mine if I want it. I never reached out about it or anything so I figured it was just meant to be. I paid for it and it’s supposed to be here tomorrow or Saturday.


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## mpredden (Nov 29, 2017)

daglesj said:


> As I said elsewhere, I just can't get over that awful font on the dial. Screams playschool rather than warfare.





daglesj said:


> As I said elsewhere, I just can't get over that awful font on the dial. Screams playschool rather than warfare.
> [/QU
> 
> 
> ...


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## Flyingdoctor (Feb 11, 2006)

Well done, Sir. Utmost respect for you. Everyone here has been "far too expensive" or "great price" but not buying it. You one up us all because you will have a pretty cool piece of Doxa history.



Oris1977 said:


> Well…Based on what I’ve read so far in this thread, I’m going to be “that guy.” Lol. Through fate, I bought one.
> 
> I was reading about the release last night and thought “that’s a cool watch that would fit well into my collect but it’s a bit pricey for what it is.” I kind of forgot about it seeing that it was limited to only 100 pieces (so what are the chances of even getting one) and I don’t really want to spend that kind of money right now.
> 
> This morning my sales rep at my AD called and said she will have one Friday and it’s mine if I want it. I never reached out about it or anything so I figured it was just meant to be. I paid for it and it’s supposed to be here tomorrow or Saturday.


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## 19thnervousbreakdown (Dec 1, 2021)

I would like to see a comparison to a ICE ERA Sub 300, just to get a feel how the steel version will wear 😊


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## Ketchup time (Apr 23, 2015)

Oris1977 said:


> Well…Based on what I’ve read so far in this thread, I’m going to be “that guy.” Lol. Through fate, I bought one.
> 
> I was reading about the release last night and thought “that’s a cool watch that would fit well into my collect but it’s a bit pricey for what it is.” I kind of forgot about it seeing that it was limited to only 100 pieces (so what are the chances of even getting one) and I don’t really want to spend that kind of money right now.
> 
> This morning my sales rep at my AD called and said she will have one Friday and it’s mine if I want it. I never reached out about it or anything so I figured it was just meant to be. I paid for it and it’s supposed to be here tomorrow or Saturday.


Congrats! Can’t wait to see some wrist shots once you get it!


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## 8505davids (Jan 14, 2017)

I suppose retail and bloggers are the future - likely the last two releases (600 and Army) will set the tone for future issues. A LE in partnership with a retailer/blogger followed by the everyman version. I don't have any real issue with that if it helps interesting new Doxas appear every now and again - the dual branded diving related dials were nice though...


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## xian (Feb 3, 2021)

8505davids said:


> I suppose retail and bloggers are the future - likely the last two releases (600 and Army) will set the tone for future issues. A LE in partnership with a retailer/blogger followed by the everyman version. I don't have any real issue with that if it helps interesting new Doxas appear every now and again - the dual branded diving related dials were nice though...


Agreed, I’ve been holding off on a 300T Pro because I’m a sucker for double-signed dials. Missed out on a Poseidon and am still bummed about it


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## boatswain (Sep 4, 2014)

I like the proportions of the Army case and it would be great to see it in steel. 

Though I would prefer the traditional dials and hands in that case over the Army set. 

That would be stiff competition for the 300T though so I don’t if it will ever happen.


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## Rbq (Mar 26, 2018)

Interesting conversation here. I bought the watch before I saw this sub-forum, and didn’t realize how many passionate fans the brand has. I’ve always been interested in getting one, but there was always something else to get. When I saw this, I thought why not (I had a different watch in mind - oh well, next time). Ordered Wednesday and arrived Thursday!

Never had a ceramic watch before, though my wife has a J12, so already had some idea of what to expect. That said, I was still pleasantly surprised when I first handled it. It kinda looks and feels like titanium, but with more heft.

Some real world photos:










Dial is pretty much identical to the original: DOXA Army



















Haven’t sized it yet, but it feels good on the wrist. I don’t typically wear watches larger than 40mm in diameter, but I now get it when they say Doxas wear differently because of the short lug-to-lug. It probably also helps that it’s relatively thin at around 12mm. My only gripe is I wish they color-matched the date wheel.

Overall quite happy and very impressed with my first Doxa. I do hope they make a stainless steel one for the fans.


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## martin_blank (May 19, 2010)

Looks great! Congrats on a pretty epic pick up. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Contaygious (May 9, 2014)

It sold out and ceramic is expensive I think y'all forget. So basically haters don't matter lol. I think it looks amazing but already have the carbon and missed the sale. I would love more ceramic from doxa! I have a ceramic octo.


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## ross2187 (Sep 16, 2016)

Contaygious said:


> It sold out and ceramic is expensive I think y'all forget. So basically haters don't matter lol. I think it looks amazing but already have the carbon and missed the sale. I would love more ceramic from doxa! I have a ceramic octo.


Still available at WoS.


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## lab-guy (Jan 6, 2016)

If there's a SS version around the 300T range later, I'll guarantee I'm in, but this didn't do it for me.


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## Flyingdoctor (Feb 11, 2006)

Makes you wonder if they would have been better to made 200 and sell them at $2250




ross2187 said:


> Still available at WoS.


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## NeurosciGuy15 (Jan 4, 2018)

Hands-On: The Mysterious Vintage Doxa Army Resurfaces As A Modern Ceramic Watch


And a 54-year-old mystery surrounding the blacked-out Doxa diver is finally solved.




www.hodinkee.com





Cool article about the Army. A few highlights:

1. Jan Edocs and Doxa worked with the Swiss government to figure out if the Army was ever actually purchased and issued to the military. It was, and was issued to divers and medics according to a retired Swiss commando quoted in the article (check out the article for his super cool issued 300T as well).

2. The original Army’s case was not PVD coated. It was oil dipped, and the oil was then heated, turning it black. Hence why so many are just steel nowadays, it was not a particularly rugged treatment.


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## drunken-gmt-master (Mar 29, 2018)

charger02 said:


> . . .
> 
> I find it funny, that people always talk about a "military" watch, especially when discussing divers, but I would really like to know if deep-sea welders use automatic watches.


Based on this Benjamin Lowry article on Hodinkee, probably not.


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## bobs.divers (Nov 16, 2020)

FedEx just dropped by 😃 and …
it’s a keeper!
Feels very solid and has a nice heft to it. The dial has a very unique aesthetic that made me stay on the fence before (even when the Synchron came out) now in real life I am glad I pulled the trigger (according to Stephanie from Doxa, it was the very last one they had allocated to them).

This piece belongs on the camo nato strap, I don’t see myself wearing it on the rubber (kinda too plain).
Below pictures


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## Ketchup time (Apr 23, 2015)

Rbq said:


> Interesting conversation here. I bought the watch before I saw this sub-forum, and didn’t realize how many passionate fans the brand has. I’ve always been interested in getting one, but there was always something else to get. When I saw this, I thought why not (I had a different watch in mind - oh well, next time). Ordered Wednesday and arrived Thursday!
> 
> Never had a ceramic watch before, though my wife has a J12, so already had some idea of what to expect. That said, I was still pleasantly surprised when I first handled it. It kinda looks and feels like titanium, but with more heft.
> 
> ...


Congrats on your first DOXA!


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## drunken-gmt-master (Mar 29, 2018)

ross2187 said:


> Still available at WoS.


Strange, they were sold out yesterday. Guessing there were some canceled orders.


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## Ketchup time (Apr 23, 2015)

bobs.divers said:


> View attachment 16598724
> 
> View attachment 16598725
> 
> ...


I agree. I think this one belongs on a NATO or MN strap. Congrats on your Army.


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## bobs.divers (Nov 16, 2020)

Ketchup time said:


> I agree. I think this one belongs on a NATO or MN strap. Congrats on your Army.


Thanks bud, really digging it 👍🏾


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## valerian839 (Jan 7, 2021)

drunken-gmt-master said:


> Strange, they were sold out yesterday. Guessing there were some canceled orders.


sold out on the DOXA website? Or sold out on Watches of Switzerland's website?


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## drunken-gmt-master (Mar 29, 2018)

valerian839 said:


> drunken-gmt-master said:
> 
> 
> > Strange, they were sold out yesterday. Guessing there were some canceled orders.
> ...


On both sites, but I hadn't checked the WoS site again until seeing ross2187's post. That's why I'm thinking some people must have canceled their orders.


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## ean10775 (Nov 8, 2012)

I initially posted that I was put off by the price and that there wasn’t much new here, but in looking at the watch again, I’ve revised my take on it a bit. I still think it is expensive, but that is less about the watch itself and more about the straps and other things that come with that that really makes it seems like Doxa didn’t put much thought into it. Using the same rubber strap as the carbon doesn’t suit the military aspect of the watch in my opinion, and the camo strap doesn’t look like an especially high quality one. I also agree with what has been said earlier about the orange Jenny fish. I don’t mind it on the other watches, but this would have looked better with the same type of crown that was used on the Sub 300 LEs.


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## Flyingdoctor (Feb 11, 2006)

Sorry, not buying the story on his watch. No way that SUB 300T was issued to him like that in 1969. It has a non standard crown and the bezel is from the Aubry period that didn't start until around 1978. Maybe he did get it in 1969 but it has been serviced / modified since then. Of course calling out a retired paratrooper is probably not a good thing  

As for the oil coating which is heated etc, etc. I'd really like to see more info on that because again, I'm pretty skeptical on that too.



NeurosciGuy15 said:


> Hands-On: The Mysterious Vintage Doxa Army Resurfaces As A Modern Ceramic Watch
> 
> 
> And a 54-year-old mystery surrounding the blacked-out Doxa diver is finally solved.
> ...


----------



## Flyingdoctor (Feb 11, 2006)

Hadn't realized it was a cut to size strap. Probably a nice black leather strap or black Nato would be a better look. The camo effect works great on the case, not so much on the strap. Just love the thin low profile of the watch. Health to enjoy it



bobs.divers said:


> View attachment 16598724
> 
> View attachment 16598725
> 
> ...


----------



## bobs.divers (Nov 16, 2020)

Flyingdoctor said:


> Hadn't realized it was a cut to size strap. Probably a nice black leather strap or black Nato would be a better look. The camo effect works great on the case, not so much on the strap. Just love the thin low profile of the watch. Health to enjoy it


thank you very much Doc! indeed, the low profile of the watch makes it very wearable, I wanna say it wears a tad bit better than the 300. Maybe is due to the slight difference in weight. Below some comparison images:


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## Flyingdoctor (Feb 11, 2006)

I initially thought it was based off the SUB 300 but with a flat crystal but it could also be the 2005 SUB 600T. Whichever they based it on it was definitely the right move. It should totally disappear on the wrist and wear like a dream on the right strap.



bobs.divers said:


> thank you very much Doc! indeed, the low profile of the watch makes it very wearable, I wanna say it wears a tad bit better than the 300. Maybe is due to the slight difference in weight.


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## charger02 (Apr 28, 2011)

Flyingdoctor said:


> Sorry, not buying the story on his watch. No way that SUB 300T was issued to him like that in 1969. It has a non standard crown and the bezel is from the Aubry period that didn't start until around 1978. Maybe he did get it in 1969 but it has been serviced / modified since then. Of course calling out a retired paratrooper is probably not a good thing
> 
> As for the oil coating which is heated etc, etc. I'd really like to see more info on that because again, I'm pretty skeptical on that too.



Doc, horology aside, there are some details with the story that would lead me to believe that elements are not factual. Perhaps "mis-remembered" is a better term.


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## Flyingdoctor (Feb 11, 2006)

Thanks. Yea, I'm a natural born skeptic when things happen to be discovered with no proof. This is what happens when you heat up oil to burn it on as a coating.










Here are facts about baked oil

Oxidizing (burning) vegetable oil in the presence of iron at a temperature typically well above 300° F but below its flash point will result in a greasy golden brown residue which is a long chain organic molecule (organic polymer ). Anyone who has inadvertently left cooking oil too long in a hot frying pan will be familiar with this residue as it is exactly the same thing.

*Baked oil has no track record in the field*

To date we know of no extended exterior field trial of this type of finish.
There is no standard for the application of baked oil finish in any industry. Nor is it used commercially in any other industry or any other product.
There are other safer proven options to accomplish the same result.
Cannot be touched up in the field.
No track record of rust protection

Lets say it wasn't vegetable oil but real out of the ground oil. Doesn't really matter actually. Still a long chain hydrocarbon. I'd so love to see the process they used to make it to the coating that was on the original Army. 

As for the paratrooper guy. Yep got a watch in 1969 with a bezel that wasn't produced until at least 1978 and a non standard crown. Wore it every day for over 50 years without servicing and without a mark on a coated bezel or seemingly no scratches on a mineral glass crystal. Kinda pushes the boundaries of mis-remembered  

But, hey, as we all know, why let facts get in the way of a good story.

The watch is / will become a classic piece of Doxa history, it doesn't need a "good" story. It stands on its own. 




charger02 said:


> Doc, horology aside, there are some details with the story that would lead me to believe that elements are not factual. Perhaps "mis-remembered" is a better term.


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## TallWatch (Oct 10, 2013)

Rbq said:


> Interesting conversation here.
> 
> Overall quite happy and very impressed with my first Doxa. I do hope they make a stainless steel one for the fans.


Congrats !!! It is a good looking watch, and being in The Happy Place is all what matters


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## TallWatch (Oct 10, 2013)

Maybe he remembers this ( in error ) from a similair treatment like Parkerizing as was done with the Benrus cases , or gun blacking, were after the chemical proces the surface metal is treated/polished with gun oil, or similair light oil, but definitely not heated. 

But i won`t hold it against him 



Flyingdoctor said:


> Thanks. Yea, I'm a natural born skeptic when things happen to be discovered with no proof. This is what happens when you heat up oil to burn it on as a coating.
> 
> Here are facts about baked oil
> 
> The watch is / will become a classic piece of Doxa history, it doesn't need a "good" story. It stands on its own.


----------



## Kirkawall (Mar 28, 2015)

bobs.divers said:


> View attachment 16598724
> 
> View attachment 16598725
> 
> ...


Congrats! Unique take on the Military for sure and glad you're loving it -- have been interested in this for a long time and while I didn't expect this version I'd definitely look into the expected SS spinoff. 

Thanks for the pix and owner insights and wear it in excellent health,

k


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## bobs.divers (Nov 16, 2020)

Kirkawall said:


> Congrats! Unique take on the Military for sure and glad you're loving it -- have been interested in this for a long time and while I didn't expect this version I'd definitely look into the expected SS spinoff.
> 
> Thanks for the pix and owner insights and wear it in excellent health,
> 
> k


thank you very much 🙏


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## WatchDialOrange (Dec 30, 2011)

bobs.divers said:


> View attachment 16598724
> 
> View attachment 16598725
> 
> ...



Looks great on your wrist Congrats again and enjoy!!


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## bobs.divers (Nov 16, 2020)

WatchDialOrange said:


> Looks great on your wrist Congrats again and enjoy!!


Thank you very much! 🙏🏾


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## ACG (Jan 26, 2007)

Looks great. congrats

I’d love one but not sure I could get to that price without buying either the 300 carbon or the Tudor BB ceramic first and saving some cash 

Won’t stop me lusting after this one on instagram though


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## Calibra (Mar 17, 2021)

I bought one and here are my first impressions after 5 days and some pics (I don’t consider myself a Jenny hater or supporter, I just like vintage and vintage-inspired Doxas, and own a 1967 Sub 300 “No-T Slim Case” version). The below is just my honest opinion, trying to be as objective as possible.

*Pros:*

*Ceramic*. It’s of excellent quality and feel. I’ve long been against owning black case watches thinking they evoke a toy watch or cheap PVD aesthetic. However, after educating myself on tactical black-cased watches and the importance of absorbing light, I decided to explore current market offerings. PVD chips, carbon’s finishing is not for everyone (definitely not for me), and DLC can have a sheen that to me goes against the light-absorbing intent of tactical watches. On the other hand, ceramic doesn’t scratch easily, its matte and solid-colored finishing has a very rugged and uniform appeal, and while it can crack, I’m not going to be parachuting off planes or doing close quarter combat, so the material’s brittleness does not bother me. While I don’t disagree with folks who want a stainless steel version, I don’t mind this material choice at all, as I think both the market and my collection are saturated with steel offerings, and realistically those wouldn’t be worn in tactical or covert scenarios, so having a light-absorbing watch makes more sense to me, and it will be a piece without competition in my collection.
*Case thickness and weight*. It’s extremely wearable, noticeably slimmer and lighter than any Doxa Sub 300/300T I know of, with the exception of my ‘67 No-T slim version. This slim profile also makes it a potential strap monster (see pics).
*Overall design*. Aside from the three design aspects I listed in the Cons below, I think they nailed the rest of the watch (e.g, dial design and use of negative spaces, razor sharp sawtooth bezel, slightly raised bezel markings especially at 12). It’s unapologetically utilitarian, unlike other ceramic offerings like Omega’s and Tudor’s, which to me are gimmicky in that they’re not very legible and thus not believable as tactical watches. Not for me. I prefer the committed ceramic designs from IWC, Bell & Ross, and … Doxa.
*Cons:*

*Orange Jenny fish crown logo*. I hate it, no way around it. But can I get used to it? Yes. If anything, it helps match the hands with something else on the watch.
*Date window not color matched to dial*. Would’ve been nice to have an off-white background here, but not a dealbreaker. The Synchron Military (which I also own), is also pure white.
*Supplied straps*. I think pairing such a vintage reissue with a modern rubber strap was lazy and not tasteful (feels to me like an 80’s Porsche 911 with 2020 Porsche 911 wheels), and the nato looks like it belongs in a toy store next to the GI Joe’s. That camo pattern makes the whole package almost look like an intentional joke. Needless to say, both straps will stay in their box as I am having a lot of fun with alternate straps (see pics). Given its dimensions and colors, this watch is a strap monster for me. That said, I’d love for Doxa to offer OEM 16mm buckles in matching material.
*Neutral:*

*Price.* I’m not an expert on manufacturing costs for ceramic watches, and while I know they’re expensive, I agree that the movement does not justify the cost. However, every limited edition release or collab (regardless of case material) has a mark-up backed up by low supply, across ALL brands, not just Doxa. I am in the camp of enjoying the design consensus that watch manufacturers and industry experts can arrive at with their collabs, as I find that they often bring out the best in each other by pooling their expertise, which results in watches that often nail design to my taste (e.g., Hodinkee, Worn & Wound, Revolution, and now WOS). I own LE watch collabs from all of these places, and like them much more than the standard catalog offerings of their respective brand partners. To me, it justifies the price, and the LE aspect helps me not lose too much if I decide to sell one day, since tastes change. While some people may criticize this as hype culture, I just typically like the design influence that folks like Wei Koh and Ben Clymer bring in their watch collabs. And while Doxa is getting some hate for this launch and their low supply right now, look at Rolex and their perpetual manipulation of supply (I worked in luxury automotive manufacturing for most of my career and don’t buy their reasons for low production numbers for a second). To me, that’s far worse.
Side by side: 2022 Doxa Army and 1967 Doxa Sub 300 “No-T Slim Case”









With WWII canvas:









With distressed nato:









With black leather:









With tumbled black leather:









With distressed ballistic canvas:









With distressed nato:









With Tropic black rubber:









With black parachute strap:


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## Flyingdoctor (Feb 11, 2006)

Excellent write up and great photos. Man, the watch looks like it was born for that WWII canvas. 

I was trying to figure what case they modelled it on. Crown cut out is too sloped to be the vintage 300. Maybe the Marei era SUB 600T or possibly the 1000T, but the caseback profile is definitely closer to the vintage 300. I think they took the best of several cases and knocked it out of the part.

Health to enjoy it.



Calibra said:


> I bought one and here are my first impressions after 5 days and some pics (I don’t consider myself a Jenny hater or supporter, I just like vintage and vintage-inspired Doxas, and own a 1967 Sub 300 “No-T Slim Case” version). The below is just my honest opinion, trying to be as objective as possible.
> 
> *Pros:*
> 
> ...


----------



## Calibra (Mar 17, 2021)

Flyingdoctor said:


> Excellent write up and great photos. Man, the watch looks like it was born for that WWII canvas.
> 
> I was trying to figure what case they modelled it on. Crown cut out is too sloped to be the vintage 300. Maybe the Marei era SUB 600T or possibly the 1000T, but the caseback profile is definitely closer to the vintage 300. I think they took the best of several cases and knocked it out of the part.
> 
> Health to enjoy it.


Thank you! I agree about the straps, I’m really enjoying it on the canvas straps the most, just want to find a black buckle for it.

As for the type of case and crown cutout this is likely based on, there is some impressive research by Dr. Peter McClean Millar: SYNCHRON MILITARY. According to his research (paraphrasing), the “production” Doxa Army watches used first generation (pre-Synchron) Sub 300T cases (despite the Doxa Army being produced in the Synchron era). These earlier cases were thinner and had crown cutouts, unlike the chunkier and symmetrical Synchron cases.

Another interesting finding from Dr. Millar is that the original Doxa Army is believed to have been shipped on a Tropic rubber strap, which would’ve been nice to do in the re-issue (though Tropic is owned by Synchron, so that using Tropic would’ve been highly unlikely).


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## Snulle (Apr 15, 2011)

Calibra said:


> Thank you! I agree about the straps, I’m really enjoying it on the canvas straps the most, just want to find a black buckle for it.
> 
> As for the type of case and crown cutout this is likely based on, there is some impressive research by Dr. Peter McClean Millar: SYNCHRON MILITARY. According to his research (paraphrasing), the “production” Doxa Army watches used first generation (pre-Synchron) Sub 300T cases (despite the Doxa Army being produced in the Synchron era). These earlier cases were thinner and had crown cutouts, unlike the chunkier and symmetrical Synchron cases.
> 
> Another interesting finding from Dr. Millar is that the original Doxa Army is believed to have been shipped on a Tropic rubber strap, which would’ve been nice to do in the re-issue (though Tropic is owned by Synchron, so that using Tropic would’ve been highly unlikely).


Fun fact: Flyingdoctor actually is Dr Peter Millar


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## Calibra (Mar 17, 2021)

Snulle said:


> Fun fact: Flyingdoctor actually is Dr Peter Millar


Haha I had no idea! Well thanks for letting me know.


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## NeurosciGuy15 (Jan 4, 2018)

Calibra said:


> Another interesting finding from Dr. Millar is that the original Doxa Army is believed to have been shipped on a Tropic rubber strap, which would’ve been nice to do in the re-issue (though Tropic is owned by Synchron, so that using Tropic would’ve been highly unlikely).


Couldn’t call it a tropic, of course, but I’m sure they could release a tropic style strap with Doxa branding. Plenty of companies have their own version of a tropic. In fact, that would be pretty funny after Synchron released the Military. Maybe Doxa should call it the equatorial strap.


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## ean10775 (Nov 8, 2012)

I love the look on the black Tropic. Calibra’s comments on the strap choices for this watch being lazy and cheap echoes my own feelings. If the original was issued on a Tropic Doxa should have come up with its own version along with a custom buckle. That would have shown more pride in the release and looked better to boot.


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## MichaelKG (Apr 18, 2013)

Cheverian said:


> I have a feeling that manufacturers like Doxa are going to be increasingly hamstrung by their movements and specifically by their pathetic power reserves. When you can buy a Hamilton diver for a quarter of the price with an 80 hour reserve.... Yeah, I know a Hamilton diver doesn't have Doxa cred. But all that means is a watch like this one needs to nail the design, materials, etc. Which it doesn't, in my opinion.


Since when has the power reserve thing become the benchmark in comparing watches. Who cares that the Hamilton has an 80 hour reserve. 

Most people on here constantly switch between watches or wear them all the time so that won't be even noticeable.


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## Cheverian (Sep 27, 2017)

MichaelKG said:


> Since when has the power reserve thing become the benchmark in comparing watches. Who cares that the Hamilton has an 80 hour reserve.
> 
> Most people on here constantly switch between watches or wear them all the time so that won't be even noticeable.


People care about different things obviously, but it's hard to argue power reserves don't matter when luxury companies from Rolex to Omega to JLC have been coming out with new movements with longer life and advertising it as an advance.


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## Flyingdoctor (Feb 11, 2006)

I get the whole thing about power reserve as a big advance and it being a great marketing thingy......but... I don't know about everyone else, but I tend to wear one watch for several days on average about 10 hours a day so that means it sits not moving for 14 hours then I put it on again. In that situation as long as it has a power reserve of say 20 hours then I don't need to even worry about having to wind it when I put it on because it has stopped.

An 80 hour power reserve would be of no use unless I leave it sitting for 3 days and don't want to wind it and set it again. I'm also pretty weird because I like picking up a watch to wear and setting it and winding it. Something soothing about starting it up.





Cheverian said:


> People care about different things obviously, but it's hard to argue power reserves don't matter when luxury companies from Rolex to Omega to JLC have been coming out with new movements with longer life and advertising it as an advance.


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## Cheverian (Sep 27, 2017)

Flyingdoctor said:


> I get the whole thing about power reserve as a big advance and it being a great marketing thingy......but... I don't know about everyone else, but I tend to wear one watch for several days on average about 10 hours a day so that means it sits not moving for 14 hours then I put it on again. In that situation as long as it has a power reserve of say 20 hours then I don't need to even worry about having to wind it when I put it on because it has stopped.
> 
> An 80 hour power reserve would be of no use unless I leave it sitting for 3 days and don't want to wind it and set it again. I'm also pretty weird because I like picking up a watch to wear and setting it and winding it. Something soothing about starting it up.


I definitely hear you. People also own automatic winders which render the whole issue moot for them. I don't use winders, and I wear a different watch every day so I can't help but notice which of mine are Energizer Bunnies.

I'm personally more interested in the accuracy of a movement than other considerations, and I find the ETA in my Doxa (purchased new last year) to be unremarkable in that regard.

The one thing I notice more than anything is what a rough winder the ETA is compared, for instance, to the old 2500 in my 2000s era Planet Ocean. 

But I own a Doxa because of its history and how it looks, not because of what's under the hood.


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## Oris1977 (Mar 14, 2020)

Ketchup time said:


> Congrats! Can’t wait to see some wrist shots once you get it!


I picked mine up today. Absolutely love the watch! It wears great. I really like the clasp and it’s adjustability. Superb lume! I’m also very impressed with how smooth the second hand is. Sorry for the bad pics


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## NeurosciGuy15 (Jan 4, 2018)

Oris1977 said:


> I picked mine up today. Absolutely love the watch! It wears great. I really like the clasp and it’s adjustability. Superb lume! I’m also very impressed with how smooth the second hand is. Sorry for the bad pics
> View attachment 16613839
> View attachment 16613843
> 
> View attachment 16613842


I think you picked the absolute worst time (well, along with 10:20) to photograph a Doxa hahaha. Looks great though! Really like the matte black of the ceramic.


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## Oris1977 (Mar 14, 2020)

NeurosciGuy15 said:


> I think you picked the absolute worst time (well, along with 10:20) to photograph a Doxa hahaha. Looks great though! Really like the matte black of the ceramic.


 It took me a second, but I see what your saying. Hahaha. Are we sure it’s a Doxa!?


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## Rbq (Mar 26, 2018)

New strap just arrived! Wolbrook desert tropic with black PVD hardware. Really happy with this combo


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## 19thnervousbreakdown (Dec 1, 2021)

Rbq said:


> New strap just arrived! Wolbrook desert tropic with black PVD hardware. Really happy with this combo


this looks fantastic! The Doxa Rubber doesn’t match watch at all IMOH .. this looks great!


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## Rbq (Mar 26, 2018)

19thnervousbreakdown said:


> this looks fantastic! The Doxa Rubber doesn’t match watch at all IMOH .. this looks great!


I think it really brings out the dial!


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## Calibra (Mar 17, 2021)

Rbq said:


> New strap just arrived! Wolbrook desert tropic with black PVD hardware. Really happy with this combo


I bought the same strap, thanks for the tip! I also bought two single-pass natos, one in black leather and the other in black nylon. I don’t know how I feel about them though, being used to to double-pass natos, these feel “flimsy” to me. Thoughts?


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## 19thnervousbreakdown (Dec 1, 2021)

Calibra said:


> I bought the same strap, thanks for the tip! I also bought two single-pass natos, one in black leather and the other in black nylon. I don’t know how I feel about them though, being used to to double-pass natos, these feel “flimsy” to me. Thoughts?
> View attachment 16637556
> 
> View attachment 16637555
> ...


I would go with the tropic or an ISOFRANE (black or green). 

On the NATO side, I think the ribbed CWC single Pass Natos would look killer on it! Or a grey UTE Nato from the H Shop.


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## Calibra (Mar 17, 2021)

19thnervousbreakdown said:


> I would go with the tropic or an ISOFRANE (black or green).
> 
> On the NATO side, I think the ribbed CWC single Pass Natos would look killer on it! Or a grey UTE Nato from the H Shop.


Thanks! I didn’t know one could buy CWC straps! Love the ribbed ones, gonna look into it! I do own one UTE nato from the H Shop, but wasn’t a fan of the quality, I found them a bit stiff and they crease a lot when folded, kind of reminds me of folded cardboard.

I did get lucky with straps from Nato G10, I got this braided perlon nato with pvd hardware and actually love it. It’s not too thick so it doesn’t add much height, and the website states the thickness of each strap, I bought a few more. Gonna also give Barton Watch Bands a shot, their cordura and canvas straps look promising.

Here’s the Nato G10 braided perlon:


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## DCWatchCollector (Aug 26, 2018)

Calibra said:


> I bought the same strap, thanks for the tip! I also bought two single-pass natos, one in black leather and the other in black nylon. I don’t know how I feel about them though, being used to to double-pass natos, these feel “flimsy” to me. Thoughts?
> View attachment 16637556
> 
> View attachment 16637555
> ...


Looks great! So well done.


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## 19thnervousbreakdown (Dec 1, 2021)

Calibra said:


> I did get lucky with straps from Nato G10, I got this braided perlon nato with pvd hardware and actually love it.


so then maybe the single pass ribbed Natos are the ones for you. These look so tactical and a brown or grey one would fit the Doxa so good! Great watch! At first I was a little bit critical about it but the more I see it the more I am keen to see the Non LE edition!


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## jaymond.jedrie (7 mo ago)

Did they learn nothing from the overly expensive plastic SUB 300? If this was non limited for $2500 they would probably have sold a lot of them but now?




Speed Test​


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## Ryeguy (Jun 24, 2009)

jaymond.jedrie said:


> Did they learn nothing from the overly expensive plastic SUB 300? If this was non limited for $2500 they would probably have sold a lot of them but now?
> Speed Test​


Well, it has been sold out for a while now, so I think Doxa would chalk this release up as a success. 

I think the challenge is Doxa’s definition of a successful release (selling out a small batch LE) is different than yours (less expensive larger number release). 

I’m happy with my Synchron version. I’d encourage you to look for one of those if you like the Doxa Army look, but prefer stainless construction and a more wallet friendly price.


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## JIFB (May 7, 2017)

jaymond.jedrie said:


> Did they learn nothing from the overly expensive plastic SUB 300? If this was non limited for $2500 they would probably have sold a lot of them but now?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


... and by the way, the Sub 300 is not plastic but carbon...


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## Flyingdoctor (Feb 11, 2006)

Actually no. It is more plastic than carbon..........

You can read about it in my Doxa ICE book. Free download here.....

doxaice.pdf (doxa300t.com)



JIFB said:


> ... and by the way, the Sub 300 is not plastic but carbon...


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## JIFB (May 7, 2017)

Flyingdoctor said:


> Actually no. It is more plastic than carbon..........
> 
> You can read about it in my Doxa ICE book. Free download here.....
> 
> doxaice.pdf (doxa300t.com)


Yep, I know the point Doc  .
But that doesn't mean that forged carbon is plastic. 
I think that we all can/should agree that the plastic term has a negative connotation that is very unfair.


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## Flyingdoctor (Feb 11, 2006)

Yes, it also doesn't mean that forged carbon is carbon.

I don't see the term plastic as being negative at all. Unfortunately, there is so much "emperor's new clothes syndrome" with watches.

People try to make out something like forged carbon is absolutely fantastic and charge accordingly. Bottom line, it is flakes of carbon in a plastic binder. Does it have good mechanical properties and corrosion resistance? Yes, so does a Pepsi bottle. It's about truth in presentation. Something like this would go a long way to help educate the buyers and also the %$#*& reviewers who just regurgitate the %$#& that Doxa feed them without even sense checking it.

_We use forged carbon because of its lightness, toughness and corrosion resistance. It is manufactured using a high temperature process where carbon fiber pieces are incorporated into a plastic resin binder. The resulting isotropic structure has better thermal and vibration damping properties compared to steel. Using it allows us to incorporate an innovative titanium substructure to hold the movement which contributes to the overall rigidity of the watch. blah, blah, blah_

But in fairness, the prize for the emperor's new clothes has to go to Rolex. Doxa don't even come close. Just hang out in the Rolex forums  




JIFB said:


> Yep, I know the point Doc  .
> But that doesn't mean that forged carbon is plastic.
> I think that we all can/should agree that the plastic term has a negative connotation that is very unfair.


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## JIFB (May 7, 2017)

Forged carbon is forged carbon, nor plastic, nor 'classical' carbon. We can agree on this.


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## nitron135 (Jul 6, 2017)

Saying that forged carbon is plastic with chopped bits of carbon fiber is just descriptive. That’s how it’s made and that’s what it is.


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## Monkeynuts (Dec 23, 2012)

Its a strange forum at the moment , a lot of times I’ve wanted to post but can’t be bothered with it but it seems to be a forum of reps or homages whatever you want to call them I couldn’t give a monkeys tbh


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## Monkeynuts (Dec 23, 2012)

So if it is plastic which people who don’t own it claim , what’s the best plastic watch?


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## berserkkw (Jan 29, 2013)

After handling the Doxa 300 No-T (we finally got an AD here in Kuwait), I'd never be able to handle that watch.. playing with the bezel and touching the case sides leaves a whole lot of smudges, by the end of a week, I'm certain I'd have hairline scratches all over the polished parts... 

Realizing that, I wish I had the opportunity to have gotten this Doxa at retail.. I guess the next best thing is the Carbon models, but even then, the edges feel great new, but I'm sure they'd dull down after a year or so of wear..


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## drmdwebb (Apr 17, 2020)

Monkeynuts said:


> So if it is plastic which people who don’t own it claim , what’s the best plastic watch?
> View attachment 16718430


I have the one on the left, and looking for one like that on the right!


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## nitron135 (Jul 6, 2017)

Monkeynuts said:


> So if it is plastic which people who don’t own it claim , what’s the best plastic watch?
> View attachment 16718430


One on the right is almost certainly a better value..


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## JIFB (May 7, 2017)

It appears that Fratello's missed the 300C in the review of the best plastic watches of the year Best Plastic Watches Of 2022: Swatch, Timex, Ulysee Nardin, And More (fratellowatches.com).
Or maybe is it because forged carbon is not plastic??? Who knows!


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## JIFB (May 7, 2017)

Monkeynuts said:


> So if it is plastic which people who don’t own it claim , what’s the best plastic watch?
> View attachment 16718430


Nice pair. I would certainly go for both of them.
Have a little preference for the one on the left.


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## Flyingdoctor (Feb 11, 2006)

Well, you obviously don't.

Don't bother replying with a snarky comment that you will later delete like the last time. I just blocked you, so I won't see it. Goodbye



JIFB said:


> Or maybe is it because forged carbon is not plastic??? Who knows!


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## Flyingdoctor (Feb 11, 2006)

At the end of the day, it doesn't matter what a watch is made out of or what other people think of it or call it. People buy them based on their own personal preferences. Both the Carbon and Ceramic SUBs are great looking watches, in my opinion. I'd have bought both if they hadn't been so expensive.

And as to the question which is best. You need to define best. Best at being run over by a truck or beaten with a hammer and keep on working? It sure ain't the Carbon or castor oil Speedy. It's probably this:









And before people get all bent out of shape about the castor oil comment about the Speedy. At least Swatch are open and honest about their watch

"Strong yet soft to the touch, BIOCERAMIC is a hybrid composition of ceramic and biosourced plastic that is sourced from castor-plant oil."


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## JIFB (May 7, 2017)

Flyingdoctor said:


> Well, you obviously don't.
> 
> Don't bother replying with a snarky comment that you will later delete like the last time. I just blocked you, so I won't see it. Goodbye


No snarky comment.
My comment was 'in general' and not specifically address to you or anyone else.


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## Monkeynuts (Dec 23, 2012)

What a sad brand forum this has been turned into


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## Ryeguy (Jun 24, 2009)

Monkeynuts said:


> What a sad brand forum this has been turned into


So true. 

I can't help but wonder if that JomaShop sale had actually gone through if it wouldn't have pumped up the activity here with some new Doxa fans.


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## Rbq (Mar 26, 2018)

Took the army out today. Met some stingrays and friendly sharks. Have to say the Wolbrook tropic is the best strap for this, just so comfortable.


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## rhaykal (Feb 10, 2014)

Rbq said:


> Took the army out today. Met some stingrays and friendly sharks. Have to say the Wolbrook tropic is the best strap for this, just so comfortable.


Damn Dude!!!!! That Army looks stellar on that tropic. Unfortunately I could not spring for the Army when it dropped, although I do have both Synchron Militarys. Making me want to add that same color tropic to my dlc synchron!


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## Rbq (Mar 26, 2018)

rhaykal said:


> Damn Dude!!!!! That Army looks stellar on that tropic. Unfortunately I could not spring for the Army when it dropped, although I do have both Synchron Militarys. Making me want to add that same color tropic to my dlc synchron!


Do it! It’s just perfect for it. And not just because of the color, the rubber is really very comfortable, and performs extremely well in and out of water! Never had to remove it to wipe away sweat (am in a hot and humid place right now), like I probably would if wearing a bracelet. Am not affiliated with Wolbrook in any way


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