# Sticky  What's the accuracy of your Tissot(s) ?



## Johnaeus

Hi guys,

We are all passionate about timepieces and I think the most important function of a timepiece is to keep time and that as accurately as possible.

The members of this forum could compare the accuracy of their watches/movements and can benefit from each other's experience/information. And as there is always "another" watch on the wish list we'll know what are the most accurate models/movements.

We'll need to have at least 2 levels of comparison: Quartz and automatic movements (just to compare apples with apples).

It is known also that the same model/movement could have a different accuracy because of the factory initial "regulation" (whether for quartz or automatic).

I'll start the test myself (I use an Internet synchronized clock as a reference):

Model: PRC100 Chronograph
Movement: G10.211 QUARTZ CHRONOGRAPH
Accuracy: + 1s/week (I did not yet wear the watch). Not very happy with this accuracy - I expected more.

Johnaeus,

P.S. To the moderator - could we put this tread as "Sticky" (I don't know how to put it). Thanks.


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## trex

I'll play...

Model: PRC200 chronograph (3 months old)
Movement: G10.211 quartz chronograph
Accuracy: + 1 second / month.

Model: PRS516 non chronograph (1 month old)
Movement: ETA 2836-2 automatic
Accuracy: + 15 seconds / day (still hoping it gets better during break in).

Model: PR100 non chronograph (1998)
Movement: ETA 2824-2 automatic
Accuracy: - 5 seconds / day (after recent service and regulation).

I also use an Internet synchronized clock as a reference.

trex,


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## victus1

I have the Seastar 1000 Silver ETA 2824.
A very impressive +1 sec/day out of the box!


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## Rum

Model:Tissot Le Locle (51 day old)
Movement: ETA 2824-2
Accuracy: +6 seconds / day (Not happy, think about regulation)


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## Brooke_01

Rum said:


> Model:Tissot Le Locle (51 day old)
> Movement: ETA 2824-2
> Accuracy: +6 seconds / day (Not happy, think about regulation)


You do realize that + 6 seconds a day is usually obtained with a much more expensive watch.

I personally think that's great ! :-!


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## Sgian Dubh

Proof that quartz (at least older movements) aren't necessarily that much more accurate:

Model: Tissot Seastar 1000 (brand new)
Movement: ETA 2824
Accuracy: +1 second per day

Model: Omega Deville (22 years old)
Movement: Quartz 1306
Accuracy: +5 seconds per month

Model: Revue Thommen Landmark (13 years old)
Movement: Quartz (unsure of number)
Accuracy: +1 second per month

I've taken the Omega to a watchmaker and had it serviced. It's accuracy is right in line with what Omega says it should be . . .


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## Johnaeus

Actually my Tissot PRC100 Chronograph is 3 sec. fast in 13 days. Not yet worn but I consider it rather bad for a Tissot Quartz... 
Kind of frustrating

Johnaeus


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## Guest

Johnaeus said:


> Actually my Tissot PRC100 Chronograph is 3 sec. fast in 13 days. Not yet worn but I consider it rather bad for a Tissot Quartz...
> Kind of frustrating
> 
> Johnaeus


Well, if a high-end quartz movement is out of range go for a radio controlled watch: +/- 0


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## Johnaeus

stuffler said:


> Well, if a high-end quartz movement is out of range go for a radio controlled watch: +/- 0


It is not a high-end quartz movement, just... quartz. I am not aware of Tissot making high end quartz watches.

Thanks for your suggestion anyway.:-!

Johnaeus


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## TISVID

Model: PRS516 non chronograph (1 week old)
Movement: ETA 2836-2 automatic
Accuracy: + 8 to 9 seconds / day

What is typical for auto?

D


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## mrutkaus

Couple of vintage Seastar Automatics, about plus/minus 6 seconds/day, not bad IMHO.

Mike


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## robi

Tissot PRS516 chrono Valjoux 7750
2 week old
-2sec/day

regards,
robi


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## MarkJnK

Tissot PRS516 chrono Valjoux 7750
Bought used
-7sec/day (acceptable for a auto chrono)

Absolutely fantastic watch, great details, nice bracelet, awesome value for a V7750 watch.


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## Johnaeus

Curious fact in the accuracy of my Tissot PRC100 Quartz Chronograph: before wearing it, as I stated earlier in this post, it was fast about +1sec/4-5days.
I started to wear it 1 week ago and it is still less than 1 sec/week fast!Hope to get a good accuracy while wearing it. 

So the good news is that while worn it slows down.b-) 

Regards,

Johnaeus


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## robi

:-! it seems that in your case the temperature helps!!!!

(as the ordinary quartz movement are not temperature compensated... :roll

regards,
robi


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## robi

*PRS 516 Valjoux 7750 ... update*

poz dev in sec./day
DD -1.1
DU +0.8
3up +2.9
9up +0.8
12up +3.3
6up -2.7

measurement done with a digital chronograph (mudman Casio G-Shock G-9000 accurate as +1sec/month)

Not bad, isn't it?

On my hand is loosing 1.5 to 2 sec during the day (in 14 hours) - maybe mostly influenced by the 6up position....desk sitting, driving, jogging - I think the 6up position is the main influence on the daily wearing....

If the above is true (the 6up influence on daily wear rate), than this 7750 it is not very much temperature sensitive. On my hand the watch is at 31 Celsius (measured with a infrared Fluke non-contact thermometer) in the room I performed the measurement is 24 Celsius.

8 hour during the night in 12up position may compensate 1 sec from the daily wearing deviation...

maybe I can obtain a mean of -1 sec/day

not bad guys, not bad...

I own/ed 7S26 Seiko 5, eta 2836-2 Tissot Ballade, eta 2824-2 Aristo Dakar, Myota 8203 on Citizen diver, 2893-1 on Hamilton Khaki GMT...

none of this has/had so tight results.

I remember I bought the 2893-1 Hamilton because I tought it is a class or two above 282x movements... one of his position (I think 9up) was at +10sec/day away from the other five pos. It was a 100Euro work to dinamicaly echilibrate the balance wheel and another 100Euro to make a proper service. After this work it performed in 4sec. maximum deviation between the positions. But remains sensitive to temperature at a degree of -1sec/day/degreeCelsius.

From this points of views the Tissot PRS516 featuring Valjoux 7750 is the :gold accurate in my 10 years experience in autos.

thanks,
robert


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## Sgian Dubh

Having had time to let the watch settle in, it appears my accuracy has gotten a little worse, though perfectly acceptable for a non-COSC certified automatic. The Seaster now gains about four seconds per day.


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## robi

*Re: PRS 516 Valjoux 7750 ... update...chrono running*



robi said:


> poz dev in sec./day
> DD -1.1
> DU +0.8
> 3up +2.9
> 9up +0.8
> 12up +3.3
> 6up -2.7
> 
> measurement done with a digital chronograph (mudman Casio G-Shock G-9000 accurate as +1sec/month)
> 
> Not bad, isn't it?
> 
> On my hand is loosing 1.5 to 2 sec during the day (in 14 hours) - maybe mostly influenced by the 6up position....desk sitting, driving, jogging - I think the 6up position is the main influence on the daily wearing....
> ...
> thanks,
> robert


12up with cronograph running +5,7 sec/day
compaired with 12up +3,3 sec/day it is faster with a +2,2 sec

I will not continue to measure crono running in different position.

My very simple explanation is, as the power needed is higher (with the chrono functions running), the balance amplitude will be reduced and therefore the balance frequency will grow leading to a "faster" running.

How bad is it?
5,7 sec/day mean 99,9934%

Just remember back in 60's all the records, all the sport timings were measured with mechanical cronograph. 
I was swimmer. In 70-80 every swimmer in a contest had two officials that measure the performance using mechanichal chronoghraph (I realy don't know if these chronograph were even chronomether grade) (hier in romania mostly russian chronos).

What is performance? Increasing performance is the goal. If I use the same chrono to measure my performance I can tell if I am on the good road despite the "absolute performance".

And an overall of 99.9934% precision is 65 sec. deviation at 1 mil. seconds.

You know the "six sigma" quality concept? An organisation or part of an organisation that has "total quality management" implemented (General Electric, 3M, etc.) can perform at a six sigma standard deviation. 6 sigma standard deviation meaning 1 defect per 1 milion. This means that at General Electric 1 owen (or less) from 1 milion produced is defect.

My Tissot performs in 12up position at 24 Celsius with crono running at a 65/milion.
I want more? NO.
My G-Shock G-9000 Mudman is +1sec/month this means 2,19/milion but I'm lucky because that specs are ten time larger for this quartz.

I have something in my life that has to be measured with an "absolute precison" greater than 99,9934%? Absolutely NO.

But what we want is "accuracy". In the same conditions we want the same results. And "precision" is one thing (is 99,9934% in the worst case), but "accuracy" means that I will obtain the same results regarding the watch position, temperature, wearing habits.

If I have a watch that is 10 sec/day is not as precise. But if this piece is 10sec/day whatever is the position, or the temperature, this is an accurate movement.

If I have a watch with +1sec/day I'm tempted to say, OH! It is ten times more precise than the previous one! But if this +1sec/day is just a mean value of large deviations -10sec/day +10sec/day in different position and it has an +2sec/day/degreeCelsius temeprature influence is not as accurate. Maybe the +1sec/day is just a lucky position/temperature mixture when on your wrist and a good position during the night.

Remember the COSC certificates not just mean deviation but also maximum deviation between rates (flat and hanging positions, maximum deviation between mean daily rate and one of position, etc.).
12UP is not a COSC position.

For me accuracy has more value than precision. An accurate watch (mechanical and some quartz) can be "adjusted, regulated" to an degree of precision.

regards,
robi.


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## asmang

I've got a T-Touch that I'm happy with +/- 1sec. /mo. However, I don't like the following about the accuracy of other features:

1. Can't recalibrate baro pressure.  This affects both METEO and ALT functions.
2. Compass calibration really requires another compass (doesn't make much sense).


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## trex

Hey Robi, I've enjoyed your posts and hope to draw on your knowlege. I have a prs 516 that is now 3 months old. I have been waiting for it to "settle in" but it continues to be exactly +15 secs/24 hour period since new. I havn't experimented with postion (at night) and wonder if there is a postion that will usually slow the movement at night, or is each watch unique this way?


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## Brooke_01

trex said:


> Hey Robi, I've enjoyed your posts and hope to draw on your knowlege. I have a prs 516 that is now 3 months old. I have been waiting for it to "settle in" but it continues to be exactly +15 secs/24 hour period since new. I havn't experimented with postion (at night) and wonder if there is a postion that will usually slow the movement at night, or is each watch unique this way?


mine is the same, + 15 seconds a day. I'm thinking of taking it in to my AD and having them regulate it.

I'm sure that it can be set so it is more accurate than that.


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## Sgian Dubh

A gain of +15 seconds per day isn't bad for a non-COSC certified watch. Regarding accuracy, COSC certification requires the watch be accurate to -4/+6 seconds per day.

Go ahead and get the watch regulated if that'll make you happy. Otherwise, I think the movement is doing fine.

Many find that different watch positions help either slow or speed up the movement. But that's individual to each watch, so you'll need to experiment.


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## robi

*No magic position ... some recomendations...*

no magic position... every watch has his own "habits"...

Tissot prs516 valjoux 7750
DD -1.1
DU +0.8
3up +2.9
9up +0.8
12up +3.3
6up -2.7

hamilton with eta 2893-1 before and after balance wheel dynamic equilibration
6up 8.8
12up 22.4
3up 8.2
9up 12.9
dialdown 6.3
dialup 7.4

DU 3.0
DD 2.8
6up 2.6
12up 4.0
9up 5.3
3up 4.7

aristo dakar eta 2824-2

3up 1.4
6up 0.8
9up 5.4
12up 6.0 
dd 6.0
du 5.8

tissot ballade eta 2836-2

12H 1.4
12H 2.6
6H -0.5
6H 0.0
9H 2.8
9H 4.0
3H 1.1
3H 0.9
d-down 7.0
d-down 6.1
d-up 3.9
d-up 3.4

for hamilton after eq., aristo, ballade and prs516 7750 the same 6up is the slowest...
but hamilton before equilibration had DD the slowest...
I think even after a revision the same watch can have different results.

You can't compensate a +15 sec/day. 
That means you have to find a position with a -45 sec/day, that in 8 hours to slow down the watch with 15 sec. 
I do not think your movement has such a wide deviation between position. No way.

All I have done it cost - time, effort, the fact I have not wear the watch, etc. So go quicker:

My recomendation is: go to serious watchmaker, that have a instrument that measure the deviation. In minutes your will have the results. How? It turn your watch and measure all the deviation plus the balance amplitude in all positions.
From the results (usualy on paper) you and the watchmaker can figure out (and tell the watchmaker the deviation on your hand) how can regulate the watch. 
Maybe it is not posible to regulate 15sec/day from the etachron device. If I remember corecly on 2836 and 2824 it is posible to regulate a +- 4-5 sec/day at max.
But a good watchmaker can do it carefuly.
First a regulation to obtain couple of seconds per day. 
Then ask the watchmaker to repeat the measurements.
Then based on the results you can chose a proper night position.

regards,
robert.


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## trex

Thanks guys, great info. Guess I won't let the 15 sec/day bother me too much. I'll experiment with position but understand better now that at best I will likely only get a couple seconds a day closer. 

rex


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## robi

*Amazing! PRS 516 Valjoux 7750 ... after 3 weeks*



robi said:


> poz dev in sec./day
> DD -1.1
> DU +0.8
> 3up +2.9
> 9up +0.8
> 12up +3.3
> 6up -2.7
> 
> .....
> 
> On my hand is loosing 1.5 to 2 sec during the day (in 14 hours) - maybe mostly influenced by the 6up position....desk sitting, driving, jogging - I think the 6up position is the main influence on the daily wearing....
> 
> 8 hour during the night in 12up position may compensate 1 sec from the daily wearing deviation...
> 
> *maybe I can obtain a mean of -1 sec/day*
> 
> From this points of views the Tissot PRS516 featuring Valjoux 7750 is the :gold accurate in my 10 years experience in autos.
> 
> thanks,
> robert


*I've obtained even better!!!!!*

using the 12up during night, as stated above, I can say now, after 3 weeks that my Valjoux is just 2 sec. late!!!!!!

the -2sec during day remains, and the night compensate the day deviation.

have a nice weekend!

robert.


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## dandsoo

i have an Tissot PR 100 with an Eta 2824-2 and after i wear it all day and leave it at night on the desk it gains +4 seconds per day witch in my opinion is preatty good.


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## kkoenning

My Le Locle is 2 weeks old, so this is probably premature. On the winder it is -3 to -4 seconds per day. On my wrist, it is -7 to -8 seconds per day.


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## Kreuzfahrer

Model: PRC 100 Quartz Gent T22.1.581.31
Movement: F06.111 QUARTZ 3 HANDS
Accuracy: -1/1.5s per week (continuous use); though within tolerances accuracy, pretty dissatisfied with this value, hate watches running behind, thinking about taking it for adjustment.

Model (hi)story: The only difference in term of water resistance between the PRC100 and the PRC200 is the thickness of the sapphire crystal (1.8mm for PRC100). 100m water resistant watches are tested under a water pressure of 10 bars while 200m water resistant watches have to have adjusted their thickness of the crystal in order to cope with 20bars forces. Usually, 100 meters Tissot watches neither have screwed crown nor screwed case back (200m have both). As PR100 is the name of a collection launched years ago, Tissot S.A. wanted to keep this name while developing this collection. The 100 meters water resistance was kept, but with a stainless steel screwed crown and a screwed back on it in order to increase the reliability. As long as the watch is not used while diving at 200m depths in the sea, there is virtually no difference between the two models.

Pros: excellent value for the money; solid, good-looking; reliable 20mm (lug width) SS bracelet, solid clasp; nice dodecagonal (fixed) bezel
Cons: seconds arm not (always) striking exactly on the seconds markings


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## Torrid

So far my Seastar 1000 seems to be running very fast, but I just got it today, so it's not fully wound yet and I'm thinking that has something to do with it.


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## graybabs

Hi ,
Just joined and saw this thread. Had a Tissot Le Locle which lost 14secs/day, also too heavy.So sold it and bought Zeno titanium, still with eta 7750, after 2 weeks settling in lost 10 secs/day, so heart in mouth took off the back (no doubt invalidating the guarantee) and spent about 10 days tinkering with the regulator. Now since BST came in (end of March) have not touched it and it is 2 secs fast. I think this is wonderfull for an auto watch. I have also found that wearing for 15 hrs/day it gains slightly, if I wear all day and night it loses slightly. If I knew how I would post a pic of this great looking watch.
Thanks, Graham


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## Junior

I have been wearing my Seastar 1000 for the last 10 days, and over that period it has kept perfect time - it loses 2 seconds every 16 hours on the wrist, and gains 2 seconds in the next 8 hours, face up, on the stand overnight. Very impressive, particularly as I don't wear it on a regular basis. Having said that, I have 5 different watches with the ETA 2824-2 movement, and the Seastar is the ONLY one that has kept reasonable time straight out of the box! :-(


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## wbwanzer

My T-Touch (Quartz, of course) has lost 1 second in the last 30 days. That's better than my Seiko with the 8F56 movement that is supposed to be accurate to within +/- 20 sec per year. Very pleased with my T-Touch's accuracy. And it's fun to play with!


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## Torrid

After repair and regulation (replaced mainspring) I'm running +6 seconds a day, which I'm sure will slow just a bit as the spring works in.


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## rafalle

*Re: PRS 516 Valjoux 7750 ... update...chrono running*

Robi poate vorbim odata pe mesenger [email protected], doar ce mi-am luat un Seastar 1000, si am facut comanda de un PRS 516 Valjoux cu cronograf.Ce ma framinta este aceasta regularizare a ceasului, acum e inca in probe dar in 4 zile a castigat 40 de secunde, dar am de gind sa nu ma ating de el 2 luni, iulie si august ca sa vad ce se intampla. Oricum sunt la primul meu ceas automatic si am fost surprins sa vad asemenea devieri de 8-10 secunde la 24 de ore ptr automatic.Ma gandesc sa testez Valjoux inainte de al plati.Ce ma oftica la Seastar este ca nu pot intui exact pozitia minutarului, iar ca sa opresti secundarul fix la 12:00 nici vorba, si ma gandesc ca de aici erorile imense.


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## Eeeb

stuffler said:


> Well, if a high-end quartz movement is out of range go for a radio controlled watch: +/- 0


Yeh, but some of us think it's a pain to have to let your watch out at night so it can go sit in the window :-d


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## Torrid

Torrid said:


> After repair and regulation (replaced mainspring) I'm running +6 seconds a day, which I'm sure will slow just a bit as the spring works in.


Mine's settled down now to right about -0.5-+0.5 when worn daily, depending on how active I am. It'll gain about 1 to 1.5 seconds every 24 hours if left dial up. I think that qualifies as deadly accurate for an auto.


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## garyL

Hi to all the guys out there;

I did my time accuracy check for the past few days, in fact I am wondering if my TISSOT is faulty :-|...
(am using internet sync clock as a reference too...)

Model: PRS 516 Chronograph Valjoux (attached jpeg)
Movement: Automatic CHRONOGRAPH
Accuracy: VERY VERY FRUSTRATED & DISAPPOINTED. I have sync it in the morning 10am local time, till 5pm, my watch gave me the reading of +25min, 5:25pm!!! Something is wrong is it not?

Can anyone help? I ought to bring back to the dealer over the weekend to find out what happen. I have just bought this last year August 2006. I have so little faith now.

I reckoned I have been very careful wearing this as this is my first piece of automatic watch, help please...

Thanks.

garyL


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## tissot1853

My new Tissot Le Locle, ETA 2824-2, 25 jewels.

1st day -/+ 0s

6th day +4s/day


18th day +4s/day

I don't know what to expect after the break-down period of 90 days? Any ideas? 

I will be very pleased if after 90 days still running +4s/day or get better like +0.5s/day ))))))

Friend of mine has a Marcello C with the same movement, running +1s/day.


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## MIHVAG

Hello Guys , I ' M New In The Forum. I Own A Prs 516 Watch. When I Bought It It Was +20 / Day. I Had It Regulated And It's Now +4 - +7 / Day !!!! That's In The Range Of A Chronometer. Believe It Or Not The Last Few Days It's +1 - +2 Seconds A Day !!!!!!!!!!!!
From My Experience Accuracy Is Influenced By Cold Or Hot Weather ( It Runs Faster When It's Cold ) , And Whether The Watch Is Fully Wound Or Not. Anyway, I Am Very Satisfied With Its Accuracy As The Watch Cost Me Only 280 Euro... I Hope It Helps...


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## MIKEVAGIANOS

25 MINUTES IS DEFINATELY TOO MUCH. LET THE WATCH SETTLE IN FOR A COUPLE OF WEEKS, MAKE SURE IT'S FULLY WOUND AND MEASURE IT ONCE AGAIN. FROM MY EXPERIENCE ( PRS 516 - NON CHRONO- 2 YEARS OLD) , YOUR AD CAN REGULATE THE WATCH TO RUN -1 / + 8 secs / day WHICH IS PRETY ACCEPTABLE. MINE ( DEPENDIND ON TEMPERATURE) RUNS +1 - +7 / DAY.... USUALLY +4... HOPE IT HELPED...


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## garyL

Thanks guys.

I have sent it to my AD to regulate and it will take them 4 weeks or more to get back to me... I am just not convinced that my watch can go +25min within 9 hours a day, it must be wrong somewhere.

Anyway, could it be due to not winding it? The last time I wound it was few months back, after my trip back from Bali, I wound it 30rounds, as instructed in the manual... and I have been wearing it since then, without winding further.

Sorry for ignorance questions here, i am totally new in the "watch" thing, guess my questions are too boring to be entertained.

Appreciate if someone can direct some links for me to do some personal reading up for knowledge? Thanks alot.

Regards
garyL


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## Torrid

It might just be a quality issue in the factory. I had problems with the movement going extremely fast and had to send it in too.


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## mixvag

Garry,
there is defenately something wrong with the mechanism regulation, but i don't believe it will be so serious. they will regulate it, and also check if the mechanism has been affected by magnetic fields. in my opinion this is the only reason a mechanical watch can go that fast. so be careful og computer screens , speakers etc that can magnetize the watch. it's rare , but it happens...
anyway, as i said before, it's probably nothing to worry about. personaly, i wear the watch 10 hours a day so when i take it off i usually wind it about 25 rounds. i believe that if it's fully wound, it works much better. do not forget that sometimes , it's not how many hours you wear the watch but how active you are...so, give it a few rounds anyway....


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## garyL

Thanks guys... 
It will be hard to for me to avoid computers... Guess I just have to extra careful, thanks alot for enlightening.

Cheers


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## [email protected]

Seastar 660 +1 sec. a month.

Grtz, [email protected]


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## Torrid

mixvag said:


> Garry,
> there is defenately something wrong with the mechanism regulation, but i don't believe it will be so serious. they will regulate it, and also check if the mechanism has been affected by magnetic fields. in my opinion this is the only reason a mechanical watch can go that fast. so be careful og computer screens , speakers etc that can magnetize the watch. it's rare , but it happens...
> anyway, as i said before, it's probably nothing to worry about. personaly, i wear the watch 10 hours a day so when i take it off i usually wind it about 25 rounds. i believe that if it's fully wound, it works much better. do not forget that sometimes , it's not how many hours you wear the watch but how active you are...so, give it a few rounds anyway....


I really liked the watch but I think the only reason I had trouble with it was that it just didn't have as high of magnetic resistance because of the sapphire back.


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## carlhaluss

Brooke_01 said:


> You do realize that + 6 seconds a day is usually obtained with a much more expensive watch.
> 
> I personally think that's great ! :-!


I agree. I just bought a Le Locle Automatic today, it ended up costing $565.00 cad incl. tax after discount. I had been looking at at $2700.00 Baume & Mercier watch when I saw this Tissot. I was absolutely blown away by the quality and attention to detail of the Tissot for one quarter of the price! I do admit the Baume & Mercier is a gorgeous watch, maybe sometime later, but the Tissot is incredible value.
Cheers,
Carl


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## Frenchymanny

Hi there,

On US Gov time, my new PRC200 is -1 sec in 9 days (quatz)

Manny


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## I Like Watches

I have two Tissot watches:
Tissot T-Touch Titanium Touch-Screen Watch Model Number: T33778851
Tissot T-Race Nicky Hayden (2006) Limited to 4999 pieces worldwide Model Number: T90487682
This might sound really, really stupid but I never really noticed how "accurate" my watches were. As far as I know they're accurate. Heck... for the price I paid for these watches, THEY'D BETTER BE ACCURATE!!


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## rafalle

Seastar 1000.
+10 to +14 seconds at every 24 hour.
From the first day.
After the 8 months...same.
Tested in hot summer, +40, and winter -15.
Maybe at -25 it is starting to be more precise.
Eventually during hot summer I put the watch , over night, in cold water.
It is no pleasure to adjust my watch every 10 days.


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## Riker

My newish PRC200 has not lost or gained any time in 7 days. I'm impressed :-!


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## stanislav

I have a new Tissot Seastar II for 8 days and it gains 9 sec/day. I do not take it off, but I tried to leave it Dup during night - no change. I know it needs some time to settle, I do not mind setting my watch cause I like to get busy with it from time to time anyway but I would prefer smaller deviation.
I have a Citizen Marinaut Chrono Eco-Drive and in 8 months it is spot-on, never moved a sec - +/-0, amazing


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## Tomswissfan

Hello I'll play along too,

Tissot PR50 Automatic
ETA 2824-2 Movement
4 months old
+35 sec/week (+5 sec/day)

Not too shabby for a $200 watch :-d !!!

Just got a Chase-Durer costing $1000 and it is a few sec faster per day :think:


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## dienstuhr

Tissot Chrono Janeiro
Valjoux 7765 chronograph COSC
COSC cert dated 1997, service history unknown.
-3s in 24 hours :-!

Cheers

d.


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## sluglug

I got my watch in January but just started wearing it 3 days ago and decided to keep track of the accuracy. I don't know if it was just made prior to receiving it but my AD said they were waiting to get it from switzerland. got a sick deal for $299.00 shipped.

model: Le Locle
movement: eta 2824-2
accuracy: +1 sec within 3 days and extremely pleased so far.


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## Wee scottie

I bought a PR50 automatic, delivered Tuesday10 April. Currently running 12 seconds fast per day. I've read new automatics take 90 days to 'run in'. Can anyone tell me if their Tissot's timekeeping varied much from delivery date to three months old?


----------



## strongmace

Wee scottie said:


> I bought a PR50 automatic, delivered Tuesday10 April. Currently running 12 seconds fast per day. I've read new automatics take 90 days to 'run in'. Can anyone tell me if their Tissot's timekeeping varied much from delivery date to three months old?


+7 seconds per day out of the box (November 2007). Still the same now.


----------



## turbinator

*Check it with my accuracy spreadsheet...free*

Hello all -

I'm a fairly recent member to WUS and wanted to let everyone know about an accuracy trending spreadsheet I wrote a few years ago and finally posted on the web with the help of another WIS.

It automatically graphs the results in units of "sec/day" and also lets you know the error in minutes + seconds per month. It is very easy to use, even if you arn't very experienced with excel.

You can click on the link, do a "save as" and you're ready to go. It has a very good "instructions" page you should read first. My email address is shown in the "data" page, so you may email me if you have any questions.

http://webpages.charter.net/carys/Wa...uracyTrend.xls

Turbinator


----------



## Wee scottie

Wee scottie said:


> I bought a PR50 automatic, delivered Tuesday10 April. Currently running 12 seconds fast per day. I've read new automatics take 90 days to 'run in'. Can anyone tell me if their Tissot's timekeeping varied much from delivery date to three months old?


Update 29 April: my PR50 kept running faster, and as of yesterday was averaging 27 seconds PD. I emailed the AD I bought it from to ask about regulating it, and he kindly asked me to return the watch for another movement. (Apparently, Tissot UK take 2 - 3 weeks to turnaround service jobs and the AD said, as it was a recent purchase, he would replace and send the watch back to Tissot himself. Naturally, I'm very pleased with this level of service and am more than grateful to the dealer |>)


----------



## [email protected]

PR50 titanium gains about 4 seconds per month.


----------



## crashaholic

Out of the box:

Model: PRC200 chronograph (6 months old)
Movement: G10.211 quartz chronograph
Accuracy: +/- 0 second / month.

My Gauge has been comparing with a Casio PAW1300 which gets it's nightly time sync.


----------



## Drbalance

*Just synced over the 30 days. Watches listed in cronological order of purchase: *

*TISSOT Ballade (2002)*
Auto 
+ 6sec/day (24 Hours)

*TISSOT Quickster* (Brown Leather Strap Version) *(2003)*
Quartz
+ 5-6 sec/mth

*TISSOT T-Lord (2004)*
Quartz
+ 5-6 sec/mth

*TISSOT Seastar 660 (2005)*
Quartz
+ 1 sec/mth (just regulated under warranty -was loosing 3 min/week

*TISSOT T-Touch* (Nascar Special Edition) *(2008)*
Quartz
+ 1sec/mth

I'm pretty happy with the results. I have a special place in my heart for every single one of these watches. I love em' all!!


----------



## Barnaby

Tissot Le Locle Chronograph Valjoux 7750 (a bit over four years old and serviced six months ago). This runs at about -3 sec/day. It's a beautiful watch. Before the service, however, it ran at about -15 sec/day.


----------



## Beyond 'The Box'

Tissot SeaStar 1000 running +3/day.
ETA 2824-2

very happy with it.


----------



## slb

My T-Touch Expert has been on me one month, and no +- yet.
Good sign


----------



## dp60

My old PR100 quartz started off perfect +/- 0 /day. After 10 years, it started to gain +/- 1 second / day. After 15 years it returned to perfection. The seal are wearing out and I cannot locate replacement seals for the crown. Perhaps I'll just sell it on eBay and hope for best. One time I was in Belize, and an old Catholic priest complimented my Tissot. He said that in seminary he studied watch repair for fun and he loved Tissot so much that he was tempted to abondon his vows to pursue watchmaking.


----------



## Bearcat

I have the Seastar 1000 Silver ETA 2824.
A very impressive +1 sec/day out of the box!

Me, too....


----------



## Aviography

T-Touch Expert purchased 2 weeks ago, gained almost 1 second in 1.5 weeks.


----------



## canipus

Wearing a very old ultra slim gold plated case, stainless back, 6 jeweled Tissot quartz (around 28yrs) purchased from the watch counter at Zurich airport for around $100 in present day money value. Gains around 2 secs per month with on my wrist 16 hours at 24deg C / off my wrist 8 hours in each 24 hours cycle. The accuracy has never changed in spite of 6 battery changes/service intervals, a new saphire crystal glass, a replacement contact due to battery leakage from a Renata silver oxide button cell. (a very small amount of the alkaline sodium hydroxide had leaked past the nylon gasket crimp from the button cell), and a heavily knocked about case.


----------



## seob

New Le Locle Gent 2824 -2

Runs about -1 to -2 sec a day so far.


----------



## slb

After about 8 weeks, I've lost 2-minutes. (slow)
Should I be concerned?
T-Touch Expert
Can't imagine it needs a new battery


----------



## Torrid

slb said:


> After about 8 weeks, I've lost 2-minutes. (slow)
> Should I be concerned?
> T-Touch Expert
> Can't imagine it needs a new battery


Quartz shouldn't be off by that much. I'm pretty sure the most it should be off by that point would be 30 seconds.


----------



## Eeeb

slb said:


> After about 8 weeks, I've lost 2-minutes. (slow)
> Should I be concerned?
> T-Touch Expert
> Can't imagine it needs a new battery


Torrid is correct. But I often find "new" watches have the same batteries in them when they are sold as when they were made. That can add a year to the age of the battery... A battery swap is a lot easier to try as a solution... If that does not work, then go after warranty issues.


----------



## micuthegreat

My PRC200 is about +2sec max deviation a month, and it get used everyday, even during tennis matches, showers, sleep etc. I'm suprised how its able to maintain such accuracy over a month.


----------



## KillerKowalczyk

Tissot Seastar 1000 (Blue)
2 years old
+3 seconds/day


----------



## mradjstmnt

my le locle runs extremely accurrate and is a great watch for the money


----------



## Rono

I have a Tissot Seastar circa 1987, and because I'm an accuracy freak, had it regulated because it was gaining about 30 seconds per month. It now loses 8 seconds per month, but I think concern about accuracy amounts to an illness which I am attempting to overcome. I do, however, try to keep all my watches within a couple of seconds of my radio controlled clock. I expect members of this forum are aware that the performance of watches (especially quartz controlled) depends on temperature constants, and indeed the Seiko Perpetual, which I have, is designed to be within 20 seconds per year, only if worn on the wrist (body temperature regulated) and can gain as much as 2 seconds per week, when not worn. In short absolute accuracy will always be a losing battle!


----------



## GMT-II

Tissot T-lord automatic chronograph 7750 movement
+6 seconds for a day! :-(

Shall I service it?


----------



## Torrid

GMT-II said:


> Tissot T-lord automatic chronograph 7750 movement
> +6 seconds for a day! :-(
> 
> Shall I service it?


That is great for a mechanical.


----------



## mitchb

I'm pretty lucky with all my Valjoux movements from Accutron to Tissot my valjoux are within 2 second per day and I'm not complaining. My Gevrils are variant from to 5 seconds + per day and my regular Tissots are all around =5 seconds per day give or take a few seconds either way. I know the accuracy can be exact but it requires the patience of going to a watch maker and having the watch adjusted ever so slightly and sometimes you can be dead on with one visit, sometimes three and sometimes a watch just doesn't jive with you and it never kicks in exactly. Like a pet that won't house train sometimes the watch requires just to be left alone and accidents are bound to happen. I notice alot of the regular auto Tissots range 10+ 5- and that is supposed to be within spec. I've lost interest in exact precision in a 24 hour period. I'm not precise to 10 seconds a day. some days I'm off a half day. Sometimes I look at my day date watches to see what day it is and I'm fully automatic.A good watch feels right even if it requires an adjustment once in a while.


----------



## isap63

Can someone help me to understand on how to measure the accuracy of a watch ? And what is the accuracy scale ? How many sec's loss or gain is considered to be best ?


----------



## dremka

3 yrs old PR50 quartz
+ca 1 s per 6 months with regular wearing (12h on wrist on average). Excellent model  I'm very satisfied with it.


----------



## Chibitul Smecher

dremka said:


> 3 yrs old PR50 quartz
> +ca 1 s per 6 months with regular wearing (12h on wrist on average). Excellent model  I'm very satisfied with it.


wow, this is great.


----------



## Chibitul Smecher

3 weeks old PRC200 chrono, seems to run about +1.5s per week.


----------



## swift

hi, im new here... have my only tissot pr 516 for 3 years its running +5 sec. per day very satisfied even its not cosc :-!










thanks for viewing


----------



## bbuyer

I got my LeLocle with power reserved (T006.424.16.053.00) 3 days ago and it gained 3s/day so far. But little bit confused because at the back it says 21 jewels and on their brochure It says their 25 jewels. Does it because of the movement the watch used? Do anybody on these forul has the same experience? What's the best movement for this kind of watch model.


----------



## fluppyboy

Tissot PRC200 chrono, 2 years old
+1 to +2 sec/month

Tissot Le Locle (T41142333)
-2 to -3 sec/day out of the box (picked it up yesterday)

Will post here again in three months, once the Le Locle has settled down.


.


----------



## ipswitch

I'm wearing Tissot PRS516 auto non-chrono, i synchronized it with the watches on top and 
it runs -1 sec. not -1 sec per day but just 1 second, not more not less and it's a few days now. is this normal because i read different from previous threads


----------



## ipswitch

okay, now its +10 late for this month


----------



## ipswitch

ipswitch said:


> okay, now its +10 late for this month


 confirmed. -2 seconds every day. at night before sleep, face down. tomorrow's night, face up:-!


----------



## fluppyboy

fluppyboy said:


> Tissot PRC200 chrono, 2 years old
> +1 to +2 sec/month
> 
> Tissot Le Locle (T41142333)
> -2 to -3 sec/day out of the box (picked it up yesterday)
> 
> Will post here again in three months, once the Le Locle has settled down.


Update:

Tissot PRC 200 chrono
+0.5 sec/month or less (not worn at the moment)

Tissot Le Locle (T41142333)
-2 sec/day when worn 24/7 (well, I do take it off for showers, etc. ), about -5 sec/day when taken off at night - I haven't experimented yet with resting it in different positions overnight.

.


----------



## mikesh

bbuyer said:


> I got my LeLocle with power reserved (T006.424.16.053.00) 3 days ago and it gained 3s/day so far. But little bit confused because at the back it says 21 jewels and on their brochure It says their 25 jewels. Does it because of the movement the watch used? Do anybody on these forul has the same experience? What's the best movement for this kind of watch model.


Le Locle Power Reserve = caliber ETA 2897 (21 jewells) - there´s mistake about 25 jewells in brochure and also wrong photo of backside of these watches 
Le Locle = caliber ETA 2824-2 (25 jewells)

My watches
Model:Tissot Le Locle Power Reserve (1 moth old, worn 24/7)
Movement: ETA 2897
Accuracy: +2.5 seconds / day


----------



## Rigel

My Tissot PRS516 Auto/Chrono is dead accurate. Now five months old and was dead accurate out of the box, and it still is. 

Some days I see it goes a second off, but next day it is right on the spot. I check it regularly with my Suunto X10 with GPS.


----------



## tissot_pt

Hello all,

How do you guys test your Tissots?

Thanks,


----------



## Rigel

Comparing with :

1. Suunto X10 and Garmin eTrex VistaHCx.
2. www.time.gov


----------



## tissot_pt

Well... Thanks but I am not from USA, I am from Portugal...

Any other way?

May be this could do: http://wwp.greenwichmeantime.com/time-zone/europe/european-union/portugal/time.htm

Thanks,


----------



## fluppyboy

fluppyboy said:


> Update:
> 
> Tissot PRC 200 chrono
> +0.5 sec/month or less (not worn at the moment)
> 
> Tissot Le Locle (T41142333)
> -2 sec/day when worn 24/7 (well, I do take it off for showers, etc. ), about -5 sec/day when taken off at night - I haven't experimented yet with resting it in different positions overnight.
> 
> .


Update: I have not been wearing my Le Locle for a couple of weeks (wearing a new watch, oops ), and when fully wound every morning and rested dial down, the Le Locle gains about +0.5 to +1 sec/day.


----------



## GearSlammer

ive had my prs 516 for about a month, so i figured id check its accuracy. so far, its gaining roughly 15 seconds a day. 
doesnt seem very good. i checked it four days in a row, every morning, and it consistantly gained about 15 seconds. 
needless to say im a little disappointed. i might give it some time before i call the dealer.


----------



## modyblu

I haven't checked the accuracy of my Tissot for sometime. It stopped on me and it being nearly 10 years old needs service. It was very accurate. I'm talking of a great 2824 movement of course.


----------



## 7tenz

I just recieved my Tissot chrono 7750 last monday. I set it to an atomic radio controlled clock in the afternoon. Here one week later, early evening, it's running 6 seconds fast. Last nite, sunday, it was only 4 seconds. I am too rough on watches to wear it at work, so I left it home today and the weather is colder today.

Also the small sweep second hand is hard to get an exact reading. I'll be sure to do an update if and when it changes after a few months break-in. From what I've gathered from online forums and my own experience, it's like a crap shoot as to predicting what it will be like then.

But so far, am I wrong for being happy with it?

BTW I paid $585. Couldn't pass it up.


----------



## ndlow

Adding to the data:

My PR50 chrono (quartz)(approx 2 years old)
-3 sec (5 months)
very pleased as its the most accurate piece in my collection, of course the mechanicals don't stand a chance.


----------



## 7tenz

My 7750vj is 4 weeks old now, running about 22 sec fast. I'll try to keep it going.


----------



## GearSlammer

7tenz said:


> My 7750vj is 4 weeks old now, running about 22 sec fast. I'll try to keep it going.


wow, thought mine was bad.
i called my ad, and she told me she has a demagnetizer that might help, but i doubt it. 
last i checked, it was about 10 sec. fast, down from 13.


----------



## 7tenz

GearSlammer said:


> wow, thought mine was bad.
> i called my ad, and she told me she has a demagnetizer that might help, but i doubt it.
> last i checked, it was about 10 sec. fast, down from 13.


I meant that it gained 22 seconds over the entire 4 weeks. Less than a second a day is pretty good I think.


----------



## LUW

Less then a second a day is outstanding!


----------



## 7tenz

I have some quartz watches that don't do near as good. I have an Accutron Diver vx something and a Hamilton Khaki with eta automatic movements too. Both were +5/ day new. The Hamilton still is the same and the Accutron loses 5 a day, change of 10 seconds. I want to wait and see what eventually happens with the Tissot after it breaks in, however long that takes.


----------



## Guest

Bought new 3 months ago Tissot Classic Dream, checked against my radio controlled clock. In sync after 2 months unadjusted .|>


----------



## watchinu

Well, I couldn't tell you neither one of my Tissot have second hands.


----------



## Improbable Joe

My PRC200 Auto Chrono is running... about 15 seconds fast per day. Is that bad?


----------



## aban01

*Re: PRS 516 Valjoux 7750 ... update...chrono running*

my 516 non chrono
+15 sec/day when I bought it
now after 1 year it become +8 sec/day


----------



## GearSlammer

got mine de-magnetized yesterday. doesnt seem to have helped. still running 13 sec. fast.
might get it regulated.


----------



## Moosie

7tenz said:


> I have some quartz watches that don't do near as good. I have an Accutron Diver vx something and a Hamilton Khaki with eta automatic movements too. Both were +5/ day new. The Hamilton still is the same and the Accutron loses 5 a day, change of 10 seconds. I want to wait and see what eventually happens with the Tissot after it breaks in, however long that takes.


I'm curious what is the current accuracy of your Tissot?


----------



## dremka

I've got - let's say - an 'interesting' dilemma - Tissot Le Locle +3 s after 48h, but bought with some scratches invisible on a wrist (they're close to the crown). Unfortunately I noticed them at home. Replace the watch (the new one can be less accurate of course) or only ask for the price compensation - that is a question .


----------



## kgeez

Hello there!

I purchased Tissot PRC200 automatic.
It is 2 sec/ day after regulation. More than happy, I am 

Gabor


----------



## markbud

My PRC100 loses 2 min a week.



Johnaeus said:


> Hi guys,
> 
> We are all passionate about timepieces and I think the most important function of a timepiece is to keep time and that as accurately as possible.
> 
> The members of this forum could compare the accuracy of their watches/movements and can benefit from each other's experience/information. And as there is always "another" watch on the wish list we'll know what are the most accurate models/movements.
> 
> We'll need to have at least 2 levels of comparison: Quartz and automatic movements (just to compare apples with apples).
> 
> It is known also that the same model/movement could have a different accuracy because of the factory initial "regulation" (whether for quartz or automatic).
> 
> I'll start the test myself (I use an Internet synchronized clock as a reference):
> 
> Model: PRC100 Chronograph
> Movement: G10.211 QUARTZ CHRONOGRAPH
> Accuracy: + 1s/week (I did not yet wear the watch). Not very happy with this accuracy - I expected more.
> 
> Johnaeus,
> 
> P.S. To the moderator - could we put this tread as "Sticky" (I don't know how to put it). Thanks.


----------



## nmbcatega2

Hi there i have a 1980"s tissot model equiped with eta 2892-2 movment, wich it seems like after every regulation beat i have made to it, it start"s to loose his accuracy hard, i don"t konw what is the problem with it!
I have made adjustment"s to it to +1 sec/day and after a few days it start"S to loose his accuracyo|!


----------



## JorgeT

I might be lucky, since I can "eye" measure my PRS516 auto chrono to being one of my most accurate and quite better at holding power reserve than other autos. No more than 1 min/month from atomic controlled Casio's, no noticeable different on winder or at hand. Comparing to a seiko, a swatch auto, an Oakley kinetic, a couple of Fossils and a Prometheus CR1. The CR1 and the Tissot are almost dead on with each other, but the CR1 holds less power reserve. On winder, Swatch is +20 sec. in a few days, Fossil a few mins in a week, Oakley (being quartz) being pretty close to Casio's. At least in my case, very very accurate, no adjustment or service yet (have had it for 5 months).


----------



## kanmoloko

I just got PRC200 chrono quatz. It runs 1 second faster after 5 days. Is it normal?


----------



## boeing767

*What's the accuracy of your Tissot(s) ? PRC 200*

Model: Tissot PRC200 (3,5 years old)
Movement: Quartz Chronograph
Accuracy: + 0 / 1 second a day

But after 3,5 years the movement did brokedown. I sended the watch to Swiss for repair. After an replacement of the movement it became clear to me that the accuracy became less good.

Accuracy: + 1 / 3 seconds a day (still an original Tissot movement)


----------



## BigSTing

I recently purchased the prc200 automatic chronograph. It keeps unbelievably accurate time right out of the box. I'm assuming I'll have to recalibrate the time every month or so. Anyone looking to buy this watch should disregard any of the skepticism on this forum. Not to mention, its a beautiful watch.


----------



## ferchote

Tissot SeaStar 1000, running +3/day (Blue Dial).
Great!!!


----------



## nmbcatega2

I have a tissot txl automatic 2009 model, eta 2824-2 elaborated, first it had an +15s/day, then after a week or so it had an + 3s/day, and in the past week or so it rised up again to +12s/day graduate, the watch is in my posesion for abou a month!
Prety heratic no? i dont"know whay!


----------



## ade_barnett

*Re: PRS 516 Valjoux 7750 ... update...chrono running*

I got Tissot automatic for 21st birthday back in the early 70s. It served me well until I had serious motorcycle accident some years later. If I took the watch off at night it would loose about 6secs a day. It was about 2secs a day if I wore it all the time.

I have now bought a PRC200 automatic expecting similar reliability if not better working on the basis that technology if nothing else has improved with time. I am disappointed as it gains 10secs a day. I find this disappointing.


----------



## cance

tissot prc200 chronograph
eta g10.211 
and now you can not believe me because it has been 20 days and it is still exactly same where i looked (atomic watch)..
i think that i am a bit lucky 
i have a seiko military watch using 7s26 it is +21s/day.. do you have idea how i can decrease it?


----------



## kgeez

Improbable Joe said:


> My PRC200 Auto Chrono is running... about 15 seconds fast per day. Is that bad?


Dear,

I had the same accuracy with my automatic prc 200, but after regulation is became much better: 2-3 sec/day.
Br

Gabor


----------



## devilmoon

I've had my Le Locle (ETA 2824-2) for about 3 weeks now. When worn for about 10 hours a day, it holds steady at +5/day. After experimenting with different resting positions, I find that it maintains the same time overnight by laying it on its side, crown up. This is my first auto and it is a phenomenal movement for the price. And I have these very same forums for helping me find this brand too!


----------



## aesmith

Tissot "Desire" Quartz model T52.1.481.31 runs at around -10 sec per month.

I find that disappointing, but that's better than Tissot will guarantee (their tolerance is -0.5 / +0.7 sec per day == -15 to +21 seconds per month). It kind of turns me off quartz, especially higher priced watches. I would quite like a PR50 Titanium. However it would really suck if I splashed out on that and found it ran 15 sec per month slow, but of course that's within their published tolerances so I'd have no come back under guarantee even if it was brand new.

How do you guys get your super accurate Quartz Tissots? Is it just the luck of the draw, like my £12.95 Lorus "emergency watch" that runs within 1 or 2 sec per month.

Tony S


----------



## d52vnv

I'm loosing about 3 sec per day on my lovely Le Locle. I wear it all the time 18 hrs a day. I've had this watch for a little over a month.


----------



## Ausman600

*Re: PRS 516 Valjoux 7750 ... update...chrono running*

My 1 week old Tissot Visodate currently gains 15 sec a day.


----------



## jrantasa

*Re: PRS 516 Valjoux 7750 ... update...chrono running*



Ausman600 said:


> My 1 week old Tissot Visodate currently gains 15 sec a day.


My Visodate is gaining about 19 seconds in 24 hours. That is not great at all but IMO acceptable. After some wrist time and breaking in I will probably have it regulated.


----------



## nmbcatega2

I"ve got it now, my tissot txl t-trend txl automatic, mechanism eta 2824-2 elaborated after regulation, for two day"s now it has gained 1s only!
I"M VERY HAPPY WITH THIS!!


----------



## ferchote

+1, tissot seastar 1000 at +3 sec/day, very good!!!


----------



## fluppyboy

Lately, my Le Locle is averaging -1.6 seconds per day, or a little less.


----------



## frank12067

I'll join you guys in saying I love my new Le Locle Roman Numeral Black with the ETA 2824-2. Had it for 3 days, worn 16 hours a day, every day (except when I exercise). Gains +1 second a day over my "quartz-radio controlled, recalibrated every night" G-Shock Casio. It may get worse, but I was expecting much worse since the mechanical movements acceptable tolerances are actually much looser. Plus it looks so good on my wrist.


----------



## bolond

I recently purchased the Tissot 'desire' t52.1.421.13 while I like the watch overall, it gained about 6-7 seconds in the first month of using it, which is somewhat less accurate than I would have expected, my previous Swiss watch (a 'Nobel') used to gain about a second per week.

What is generally considered decent/good/great accuracy for a Swiss quartz?


----------



## waylifetruth

I have a PRS-516 auto with ETA2836-2. 4 years old (2007) I'm getting -15 seconds per day with it. Not all that great, but at least its predictable. 
Its been to heck and back though, and held up very nicely. Its THE watch that addicted me to mechanical watches! It has at _least_ 350,000 scratches in it but the sapphire is still looking brand new.


----------



## explorador

Hi everybody!

This prc 200 ,t0140.430A, 2836-2 mvmt. is 36 hours old.

+34sec / 36 hours.

This movement can do much better than this, so I"ll keep on WATCHing.

I bought it as a present for my dad, and will wear it until I see him in 3 months, so its more personal.

Greetings from Switzerland.


----------



## fshizl

*Re: PRS 516 Valjoux 7750 ... update...chrono running*

PRS 516 Valjoux

I use NIST.GOV to set the watch, today I let it sit for the entire day and I just checked and it seems to be 5-6 seconds faster than the website. Is this normal for a brand new watch? My jewelry store told me that if I had any problems they could work on the watch themselves and fix it....

so

Tissot PRS 516 Chrono Auto (valjoux)
Movement: Valjoux 7750
Accuracy: +5-6 Seconds/Day


----------



## Roamer

Tissot are amazing, in my (limited) experience. The other week I bought my first one ever - a Le Locle. First thing I did was a four-position static test. It averaged + 9 sec/day. Not bad, but on actually wearing it for a week, it improved dramatically between +0 and +1.5 secs/day, and this is one of the least expensive autos out there. ETA 2824-2s are truly great movements.

In fact, I was so impressed with my new Tissot, I bought my mother a ladies version of the Le Locle to test. After day two I'm not even going to bother testing it further. She can just go a head and wear it - it's keeping PERFECT time already! This one has the ETA 2671.

Nice... especially as the last watch I bought her was 40 years ago (a Citizen Cosmostar) and that one kept perfect time for 30+ years - and still does (and it's never been serviced!). Likewise, the ladies Seiko I bought for my kid sister (except she does have it serviced).


----------



## Roamer

Roamer said:


> Tissot are amazing, in my (limited) experience. The other week I bought my first one ever - a Le Locle. First thing I did was a four-position static test. It averaged + 9 sec/day. Not bad, but on actually wearing it for a week, it improved dramatically between +0 and +1.5 secs/day, and this is one of the least expensive autos out there. ETA 2824-2s are truly great movements.


Update on the new Le Locle. It just got better. It's now keeping time so well - I can't see any deviation form GMT. |>


----------



## cali99

*Re: PRS 516 Valjoux 7750 ... update...chrono running*

Tissot Le Locle, 2 weeks old, -2 seconds/day


----------



## Roamer

My Le Locle, just 1 month old, has been running a regular + 2 secs/day. Quite amazing for budget-range watch. On the other hand my vintage manual-wind Roamer Vanguard (acquired yesterday on eBay for £25) has been running at 0.0 secs deviation for the last 30 hrs. Go figure..

P.S. The seller lives just 2 miles away, so brought it direct to my house a couple of hours later! How's that for service?


----------



## motrix

Bought a Tissot PRS 516, a 2836-2 caliber, just a week ago.

Has run fast 7 sec/day in a 4 day test, right out of the box.

Seems pretty good to me, and I think this can be improved with some fine tuning !

I´ll wait it runs for some time before opening it.


----------



## Rider

Tissot Le Locle, ETA 2824-2
5 seconds a day
Seems like excellent time for a sub $500 automatic.


----------



## explorador

Update to my previous post from may 21st about this prc 200






.

The next day I sent it to Tissot. Now I wear it nonstop since jun 15th. +21 sec in 6 weeks or +0.45 sec/day, constantly.

I knew this caliber could do better. I could not expect any better precision for chf 600!!

Hope my dad can share my fanatism about precise mechanical timepieces, when he gets it as a birthday present in 3 weeks. But I don't think he will.


----------



## Karmalu

Tissot Visodate, first day out of the box is running at +10 sec/day. Is there any type of "break in" period during which the accuracy will fluctuate? From what I've read on here, 10+ per day is pretty good for an automatic.


----------



## THE BLOT

PRS 516 DAY-DATE / Eta 2836 / Brand New / 1 year old: +5 sec/die
PRS 516 CHRONO / Valjoux 7750 / Brand New / 6 months old: +1 sec/die
It seems to me excellent!!!


----------



## JwY

Karmalu said:


> Tissot Visodate, first day out of the box is running at +10 sec/day. Is there any type of "break in" period during which the accuracy will fluctuate? From what I've read on here, 10+ per day is pretty good for an automatic.


There's a lot of mixed feelings about a break in period. Some people say that it took them a few months, others have had the time improve after a week, while others had no change at all and don't believe in it.


----------



## Seamaster73

Karmalu said:


> Tissot Visodate, first day out of the box is running at +10 sec/day. Is there any type of "break in" period during which the accuracy will fluctuate? From what I've read on here, 10+ per day is pretty good for an automatic.


I've never believed in this "break-in business" (except on the older pre-B 7S26 movements, which did seem to settle down after a while).

+10/day for your Visodate is excellent. Mine runs +20/day.


----------



## kirkh666

Hi

New to this forum and this is actually my first post! I bought the PRC200 automatic chrono with the new ETA c0.1 movement, the one everyone is unsure about. Well, I am happy to report that after 4 days of owning this beautiful watch, it only gains +6 sec/day, and the power reserve is exactly as tissot says...Im very satisfied with the accuracy


----------



## LiveOnGMT

ETA E48.311 T-Touch II Titanium Less than +1 sec per month. (Based on GPS signal)
G10.211 PRC 200 Quartz Chrono +1-2 sec per month.

Additional info on the T-Touch II.....the compass and altimeter in this watch are unbelievably accurate.


----------



## lazzar23

*Re: PRS 516 Valjoux 7750 ... update...chrono running*

What this model?


----------



## Roamer

Roamer said:


> My Le Locle, just 1 month old, has been running a regular + 2 secs/day. Quite amazing for budget-range watch...


This is definitely my last comment on the Le Locle's timing. So much for those earlier static tests, now it's 3 months old and run in properly I just wore it in Spain for two weeks solid. It kept an average +0.5 secs/day. Is that amazing or what? Must have been the heat..


----------



## rMv

Tissot PRC 200 Chrono Quartz.
I own it for one week and still no seconds lost. Amazing.


----------



## Jeffy-pie

My new searstar 1000 was off by +30 secs/day on my wrist the first day I wore it all day, and +25 secs sitting faceup on my desk. I just sent it in for a warranty adjustment(and also to have the faulty bezel replaced). I am wondering about this whole "break-in" period for watches. I just have trouble imagining that they really do need breaking in. I mean, the whole idea of breaking in something means that there's parts that are going to mesh together and wear down a little, as if to say the watch maker purposely leaves some of the meshing teeth or jewels roughened or unfinished in some other way, to be smoothed down over a period of use.. Much like automobile engines USED to require a break-in period to smooth down the purposely crosshatched cylinder bores(some still do). That logic doesnt make sense to me in a fine little mechanical movement in a watch which is very lightly lubed and where the presence of metal particulates left over from "breaking in" are most undesireable. 

I guess my question would be: is there actual documentation to support the idea that watches indeed need break in? I'm fairly new to Horology but my left hemisphere is saying no to this idea.


----------



## JwY

Jeffy-pie said:


> My new searstar 1000 was off by +30 secs/day on my wrist the first day I wore it all day, and +25 secs sitting faceup on my desk. I just sent it in for a warranty adjustment(and also to have the faulty bezel replaced). I am wondering about this whole "break-in" period for watches. I just have trouble imagining that they really do need breaking in. I mean, the whole idea of breaking in something means that there's parts that are going to mesh together and wear down a little, as if to say the watch maker purposely leaves some of the meshing teeth or jewels roughened or unfinished in some other way, to be smoothed down over a period of use.. Much like automobile engines USED to require a break-in period to smooth down the purposely crosshatched cylinder bores(some still do). That logic doesnt make sense to me in a fine little mechanical movement in a watch which is very lightly lubed and where the presence of metal particulates left over from "breaking in" are most undesireable.
> 
> I guess my question would be: is there actual documentation to support the idea that watches indeed need break in? I'm fairly new to Horology but my left hemisphere is saying no to this idea.


It's still very controversial here. There are tons of threads debating whether it happens or not. There are some that claim they experienced it, however, some also said they had no changes whatsoever. Breaking in may also be the distribution of oils. For some watches, they may have already ran the movement for a while if they were regulating it or getting it certified for COSC. So really, you're not going to get a clear answer.


----------



## Jeffy-pie

JwY said:


> It's still very controversial here. There are tons of threads debating whether it happens or not. There are some that claim they experienced it, however, some also said they had no changes whatsoever. Breaking in may also be the distribution of oils. For some watches, they may have already ran the movement for a while if they were regulating it or getting it certified for COSC. So really, you're not going to get a clear answer.


Ya, I am seeing a fair bit of anecdotal claims that their watch became more accurate over time but also a lot that seem to get worse as they age, which makes a lot more sense to me. It seems to me that any watch's timing will alter over time with little jolts and bumps and whatnot, and wear too I guess;
Sometimes in favour of being closer to perfect time, and sometimes farther away. In the case of my new seastar, I really want to get it as close to zero as possible and go from there.


----------



## AWATCHNUT

PRC 100 Titanium Quartz Chrono 2 seconds/week.Absolutely love the watch.Champagne dial and faceted bezel has a different look.I own Movado series 800,Ebel Classic and Sport wave,Raymond Weil(dont laugh) and a few Seiko's,The watch is among the lightest I own and is a pleasure to wear.It also is not a recognizable
luxury brand which is important for me as I dont want to show off in front of office associates/employees I understand the movement is a plastic inexpensive ETA calibre Would someone kindly give me the #.and accuracy.THANKS


----------



## tibimail

... the same PRS516 automatic (non chrono)
Accuracy:  + 15 sec / day
(It will be better ONLY after service !!! )


----------



## fumi40

Tissot V8

G10.211 QUARTZ

+/- 1 sec in 3 months (which is the longest I can go without stopping to change the date)

I've worn it every day for 3 years and it's spot on every month.

I guess I was lucky..


----------



## Jeffy-pie

fumi40 said:


> Tissot V8
> 
> G10.211 QUARTZ
> 
> +/- 1 sec in 3 months (which is the longest I can go without stopping to change the date)
> 
> I've worn it every day for 3 years and it's spot on every month.
> 
> I guess I was lucky..


Yeah, my PRC200 with the same movement is that accurate. It takes so long to go out even one second that it's basically impossible to notice.. Quartz watches are awesome that way. No complaints at all, especially the price I stole it for at costco here in Canada- many in this forum would cry if they knew  especially those poor Europeans


----------



## Jeffy-pie

*Re: PRS 516 Valjoux 7750 ... update...chrono running*



lazzar23 said:


> What this model?
> View attachment 516228


 I'd like to know too.. That's a really nice and unique one


----------



## Gladwin

Model: Tissot Seastar 1000 (3 years old)
Movement: ETA 2824
Accuracy: + 5 minutes / 2 weeks.


----------



## Lowengen

I got a Tissot Visodate (ETA 2836 - 2) a few days ago, and it has about +24secs/day.
Is there something wrong or is it just normal?


----------



## Jeffy-pie

Lowengen said:


> I got a Tissot Visodate (ETA 2836 - 2) a few days ago, and it has about +24secs/day.
> Is there something wrong or is it just normal?


I wouldnt be happy with that. Tissot will probably regulate it under warranty for you. They did mine, a late model seastar non-chrono. Turns out it actually did have a defective part in the movement so they fixed it and regulated it and it's now better than I had hoped at exactly +10 secs in 5 days. awesome.


----------



## JwY

Jeffy-pie said:


> I wouldnt be happy with that. Tissot will probably regulate it under warranty for you. They did mine, a late model seastar non-chrono. Turns out it actually did have a defective part in the movement so they fixed it and regulated it and it's now better than I had hoped at exactly +10 secs in 5 days. awesome.


That's really sweet. How do you love it now?


----------



## Jeffy-pie

JwY said:


> That's really sweet. How do you love it now?


Very happy.. I knew it was a good watch. I still cant believe Tissot doesn't take the time to check the timing on their automatics before they leave the factory though.

My girlfriend's christmas present just arrived at the dealer, a nice little Tissot Lady Heart in polished stainless and mother of pearl wth little diamonds. Let's hope it's within a reasonable tolerance. I'm picking it up tomorrow.


----------



## JwY

Jeffy-pie said:


> Very happy.. I knew it was a good watch. I still cant believe Tissot doesn't take the time to check the timing on their automatics before they leave the factory though.
> 
> My girlfriend's christmas present just arrived at the dealer, a nice little Tissot Lady Heart in polished stainless and mother of pearl wth little diamonds. Let's hope it's within a reasonable tolerance. I'm picking it up tomorrow.


Yeah, I still think they mass produce their movements and just drop them in the cases. Did they address your bezel paint?

Sounds like a very nice gift. Hope she likes it.


----------



## Jeffy-pie

JwY said:


> Yeah, I still think they mass produce their movements and just drop them in the cases. Did they address your bezel paint?
> 
> Sounds like a very nice gift. Hope she likes it.


Yes they did address it, and the official word from Swatch Canada, which apparently came down from Tissot itself is that they designed it that way and that it's not what they consider to be a "defect". I wrote about that here : https://www.watchuseek.com/f62/my-new-seastar-1000-t066-407-11-057-00-a-582784-3.html

Her lady heart is gorgeous.. and runs nice, looks like about 3 or 4 seconds fast per day.


----------



## Jeffy-pie

13 days, 3 hours and it's now exactly 13.5 seconds fast. Super awesome good times 

It was up to 20 secs but I've discovered that if I store it overnight in a certain position it loses a tiny bit. Couldn't be happier.


----------



## Minichado

_PR50 Titanium_
Read this thread, decided to measure.

Looks like I'm *losing *around 12s/day. I think I usually adjust it once every 2 weeks. Hasn't been regulated in 5 years 

Fine by me, considering the abuse this thing takes!


----------



## countb20

Purchased a PR100 3 weeks ago. For the first two weeks I had an inaccuracy of like -10 seconds so I had to re-adjust quite often. But strangely after another adjustment about a week ago it hasn't lost a single second nor gained one. Very pleased with this watch if it's going to be like that from now on


----------



## KG4DFC

Purchased a Tissot Visodate on 24 December 2011. Movement ETA 2836-2. After 30Hrs it's @ - 3 seconds. Very satisfied with performance and looks of this watch.


----------



## countb20

got me the visodate yesterday, after 28 hours it gained like 8 seconds, wish I could tell her to slow down abit but 8 seconds is fine with me. beautiful watch nonetheless.


----------



## mikeynd

I've been watching my Tissot t-touch expert,since the first week in January,and it started off really well,but for some reason the gap got a bit larger.Now for the almost a year it is 44 seconds fast.I don't think that is bad at all,which comes to less than 4 seconds a month.I didn't think a month or few weeks is a really the best way to check over all accuracy so i did stick it out for the year.


----------



## Minichado

New Couturier seems to be losing 1s a day. I seem to be using the chrono every day at work for some time and motion studies, but I don't think this should affect it because it is quartz, not automatic.

Very happy with this!!!


----------



## colindaz

i have a Tissot Le Locle T41.5.413.12 with arabic numbers I love it 
it gains 12 secs a day


----------



## mansourk

Got my Le Locle on 23 Dec 2011, gains +3 sec in 24 hours.


----------



## JuliusB

Hello guys i have tissot visodate and my day change is at 12:59:30 and sometimes it is 12:59:35 is it normal?


----------



## Jeffy-pie

Jeffy-pie said:


> 13 days, 3 hours and it's now exactly 13.5 seconds fast. Super awesome good times
> 
> It was up to 20 secs but I've discovered that if I store it overnight in a certain position it loses a tiny bit. Couldn't be happier.
> 
> View attachment 574070


Just an update.. All of a sudden, last week sometime, my watch started losing 30 secs/day.. what the #$%@ .. I guess I'm gonna have to send it all the way back to Toronto yet again. I love the way this watch looks and feels, especially considering the price but sheesh, I'm starting to become concerned with the quality of the movement. It came from the jewelry store 30 secs fast, had to say goodbye to it for 6 weeks after wearing it for 3 days, now 3.5 months later it's already going back for another adjustment. In fact, because they admitted the reason it was so fast to begin with was a defective part in the movement, and now it being just as bad, I'm going to tell them I want a new movement, then regulated before they send it back..This is crazy.. I didn't spend almost a grand on a watch to have it screw up so much.

Oh, and new seals and pressure tested. And then hopefully be done with it till.. what, 5 years for maintainance?


----------



## nmbcatega2

My Tissot T Lord Chronograph after service it gains 4s/day, and it has been so ...until now and it has the same rate 4s/day, i"m very pleased!


----------



## lwendt33

I have a Seastar 1000 Automatic I just got and it was +8 secs the first day. Should I be concerned? I've read some at very accurate and it looks like other people's are fast or slow. I'd expect a few seconds a day but +8 for the first day is a lot.


----------



## blakey

I have got myself a Tissot Le Locle T41.1.423.53 just a month ago for casual usage. However, I am getting +1 secs/hr, i.e. +24s/day.

I considered that pretty bad for a ETA 2824-2 movement. I will probably have it sent for regulation soon.


----------



## AsAnAtheist

@blakey

Sounds like maybe you got old stock and are in need for servicing.

Anyways after playing with positions I've gotten my Le Locle to be somewhere around .5 seconds a day. So far that's two days straight.


----------



## The Naf

playing with positions? You mean storing it a certain way when not in use to counteract the drift from when your wearing it? If so do tell us what your doing coz that is faaantastic. Mines +10/s per day which is within manufacturers specifications I believe...Only 2 weeks old though so *may *improve


----------



## Lowengen

I've got a Tissot Visodate somewhere in November 2011... At that time, for the first few weeks, it was running at +22secs/day (approx +1sec/hour)..
After around 3 - 4 weeks, it became +17secs/day...
Last week, sent my watch to Swatch Group under warranty (coz i thought there waz a movement problem as my watch stopped moving, but it is not) and they tweaked with the small "+/-"... Now, it is running at +9secs/day... Good enough for me... though, would love it more if it could go less...


----------



## AsAnAtheist

The Naf said:


> playing with positions? You mean storing it a certain way when not in use to counteract the drift from when your wearing it? If so do tell us what your doing coz that is faaantastic. Mines +10/s per day which is within manufacturers specifications I believe...Only 2 weeks old though so *may *improve


Playing with positions is fairly common here in WUS.
It means storing it in certain ways to counteract drift. All automatics have certain accuracy depending on accuracy. I just play with those positions, dial up dial down crown up crown down, etc..

Anyways reporting my newest Tissot Visodate, playing with the position (crown up).
1s/day~ maybe less. Checked and synced with time.gov I am quite pleased with the performance these Tissot, now I wonder if buying from an AD is making any difference! I am now going to run a week long test to see how much time deviates.


----------



## DesertGoon

*T-Race with ETA G10.211 movement*

my t-race watch which i purchased from amazon a few weeks ago is slow by a few seconds in a day. :-s i have the impression that a quartz movement is more accurate than a conventional mechanical movement but seems not the case. :think:


----------



## masbret

*Re: T-Race with ETA G10.211 movement*

My PRS516 automatic gains about 4 seconds per day.


----------



## LegendaryNBK

My PRS200 quartz is running 5sec slow per day for 5 days straight. Is this within Tissot standards for their quartz models or should I send it back(its covered under warranty)?


----------



## wovivi01

I set my Tissot Sea Touch 60 days ago, and it is still spit on. I think that's pretty incredible, I am very pleased with that. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## didil

My Le Locle about 1 yo. gains 4 secs/day^^ very nice


----------



## AsAnAtheist

Just checked my Visodate's time. I haven't synced it in approximately 1 month.

Accuracy per day, I am unsure as it varies.
However when compared to the time.gov clock: Approximately .4-5. secs fast.
That's .4 deviation from 1 month back when I synced it...


----------



## evanPGH

I have a Couturier quartz chrono (ETA G10) that I've had for exactly one month and it's lost just over a second in that time. Needless to say, I'm pretty impressed.


----------



## spenone

My fairly new PRS 516 automatic gains 10 seconds per day at the moment.

I also have a 10 year old gold Carson quartz which gains less than 1 second per week.

Both within tolerances I guess.


----------



## dctex99

Both of my Tissot's with Valjoux 7750's are time gainers; one gains 30 seconds a day; the other about 10 seconds a day!!


----------



## MrGone

My Lelocle Chrono is running about +1 to +2 / day.


----------



## sithlordtobe

Just received my Le Locle three days ago, and it's been +15/6 a day. I hope once it "settles" like a lot of people have been saying, it will be less of a gain.


----------



## Bogdan Mihai

i set my t-race about 2 days ago with an online time site, and sice, i can't really tell if it gained or loss one second!
i'm very surprised


----------



## ScottShanks

Just received my T-Classic Automatics III yesterday (ETA 2836-2). It gained about 3 seconds in one day.


----------



## jeremy_m

Hi friends, I need your advice please! I've read the entire thread and others on these forums, and am really happy to find such helpful folks.

Tissot PRC 200 Automatic Chronograph: T014.427.11.081.00 (grey dial)
+35 seconds / day (measured over the course of the week)
One week old, worn 12+ hrs / day
Have not played with positions
Purchased from AD in India, where it's hot and humid, and my wrist is often hot and sweaty.
AD the watch 32 times at time of purchase one week ago, and have not wound since, but have been wearing it 12+hrs/day since that time.

I'm OK with the watch gaining time, but I want to your opinion -- should I deal with this? The AD has a certified watch repair center, but I'm hesitant to have them mess with it -- I don't know if they would do a repair in house or send it back to Swatch (wherever "back" is in this case). I also don't want to be without the watch for too long.

It's my first automatic, I'm completely in love with the watch, and I'm certainly willing to wait and see how it breaks in. I'll also try playing with positions as many others have suggested. But is this +35s/day so out of range that it's clear it needs to be regulated/serviced/checked for faulty mechanism(s)?

Thanks for opinions, and what a wonderful community here.
Cheers,
Jeremy

PS. how do I determine what movement my watch has? No documentation that came with the watch seems to say. Included are pics of front and back. There is no "xx Jewels" marking, only "888".


----------



## Bosatsu

+35 sec/day seems excessive to me - from what I understand about these watches. Two things I can think of:

1) Make sure it's not used/returned/repaired. Should be fine if it's from an AD. But sometimes it hard to say... I was in Jodhpur earlier this year and went to an AD of Ray Ban Sunglasses... Some were real, some were fakes... Just something to be careful of. Also, prices were terribly high. Higher than I can get in USA.

2) I think its not the humidity itself that causes a problem, its rapid _changes_ in humidity and temperature that causes problems. Can a more senior member of this forum validate? I'm only going off of what my instructions from Tissot say.

I have a 2009 Heritage Gold and the ETA 7753 movement has been wonderful. I'm currently -3 seconds, but that is constant from a few days ago, so now it seems to be staying steady at +-0 sec/day.


----------



## jeremy_m

Bosatsu said:


> +35 sec/day seems excessive to me - from what I understand about these watches. Two things I can think of:
> 
> 1) Make sure it's not used/returned/repaired. Should be fine if it's from an AD. But sometimes it hard to say... I was in Jodhpur earlier this year and went to an AD of Ray Ban Sunglasses... Some were real, some were fakes... Just something to be careful of. Also, prices were terribly high. Higher than I can get in USA.
> 
> 2) I think its not the humidity itself that causes a problem, its rapid _changes_ in humidity and temperature that causes problems. Can a more senior member of this forum validate? I'm only going off of what my instructions from Tissot say.
> 
> I have a 2009 Heritage Gold and the ETA 7753 movement has been wonderful. I'm currently -3 seconds, but that is constant from a few days ago, so now it seems to be staying steady at +-0 sec/day.


Thanks for your reply Bosatsu,

I had it regulated two days ago, and now it's holding steady at +4s/day, so I'm quite pleased. C. T. Pundole & Sons is the AD here in Pune, India, and their watch repair center on the second floor is excellent. They had the watch regulated in 10 minutes and back on my wrist. If anyone is considering a purchase in India and they come through Pune, I can highly recommend their service. I was a demanding customer from the get-go, and Mr. Master, the manager at their flagship M.G. Road store was superb. Their service center was impressive, fast, and high quality. (I'm not affiliated in any way, just a very satisfied customer.) I was hesitant about purchasing in India, but their pricing was comparable to US prices and their service, I dare say, was much better than I could have hoped for in the US.

The humidity question is quite interesting -- I bet you are correct about the changes in humidity. I move Mumbai-Pune quite often, and that entails a vast change in humidity. I'll have to keep track to see if things change when I make that move. I've got a few days of track record in low-humidity Pune now, and I'll be headed back to Mumbai tomorrow, so I'll see if I can discern a change.

I'm quite confident this was a new, never before worn or returned or repaired piece. HOWEVER, I think it likely that the rather rare grey dial might have been sitting on the shelf for quite a while -- it's not standard fare in the least. And I know it was not wound when I had them pull it from the back. I read in earlier pages in this or another thread (I've read too many to remember exactly where), that some senior contributors felt like Tissot was plopping movements into watches sometimes without even regulating afterwards, and that every once in a while you get a watch that just wasn't properly regulated in the factory. I have a feeling that this might have been the case with mine. Regardless, I'm so happy I went back in -- it was so easy and painless and such a nice result (so far at least!).

Cheers,
Jeremy


----------



## rotarygov

Hi All,

I have been a lurker here for a while and this is my first post since registering. I had a Tissot bought as a gift about 30 years ago – a mechanical 9ct gold Seastar 7. I wore it as my everyday watch for all that time. For some stupid reason I sold it last year and have regretted it ever since, and took to wearing my dad’s presentation watch (a 9ct gold mechanical Rotary Maximus) which he had presented for 30 years service from 1932 onwards.

I also have an Omega Geneve Automatic which I inherited some while ago. Knowing that I regretted selling my Tissot my wife offered to buy me a new Tissot whilst we were away in Plymouth earlier this year. I couldn’t make my mind up between 2 watches so ended up buying both (she bought one as a gift, I bought the other) – a Tissot Ballade III quartz with stainless steel bracelet and a Tissot PR100 quartz with duo-tone bracelet.

I love them both and wear the Ballade III as my day watch (my purchase) and the PR100 as my “going out” watch (my wife’s gift). As for timekeeping:-

Tissot Ballade III gains approx 1 second per week over 12 weeks;
Tissot PR100 gains approx ½ second per week over the same period.
Both have the same quartz calibre ETA F06.111 

By comparison, the Omega Geneve automatic gains approx 8 seconds per week over the same period.


----------



## Savione

My Visodate was running about +30s/day few weeks after purchase. After regulation it is now +7s/week. I am really happy with it.


----------



## lhoff

So far so good. My Heritage PR516 GL is only a couple of days old, but I adjusted it yesterday morning to the time on my computer, which a program called Chronos checks and corrects every 5 minutes to atomic time clocks. Just checked it a few minutes before 12:00 noon and it was about 7 seconds fast. I'll see how it does over the next few days, but if it stays pretty well the same, I'm quite happy.
Larry


----------



## Robocaspar

Um.. you mean 7 seconds fast.. right


----------



## lhoff

Robocaspar said:


> Um.. you mean 7 seconds fast.. right


Yes, seconds. Just edited my post.
Thank you!


----------



## Robocaspar

My Couturier Auto Chrono with ETA C01.211 has been running at -5s per day for about a week. Resting position 12up.


----------



## Will3020

victus1 said:


> I have the Seastar 1000 Silver ETA 2824.
> A very impressive +1 sec/day out of the box!


Ditto, for me too.


----------



## lhoff

lhoff said:


> So far so good. My Heritage PR516 GL is only a couple of days old, but I adjusted it yesterday morning to the time on my computer, which a program called Chronos checks and corrects every 5 minutes to atomic time clocks. Just checked it a few minutes before 12:00 noon and it was about 7 seconds fast. I'll see how it does over the next few days, but if it stays pretty well the same, I'm quite happy.
> Larry


This is an update. I've been checking the same way I did 2 weeks ago for the last four days. It has been quite consistent at 4 seconds fast per day. This includes at least one full day when I wore my Seiko Premiere Kinetic Perpetual instead. 
At some point I'll set the watch again and check it for a few days. If it continues to be this accurate, I'll be very pleased. 
I'm very happy with this watch in every respect. 
Larry
PS, the caliber is 2836-2.


----------



## watching the clock

Savione said:


> My Visodate was running about +30s/day few weeks after purchase. After regulation it is now +7s/week. I am really happy with it.


My Tissot gaining 2 seconds per day, very happy with the watch, even though I don't wear it every day. always ensure that it is powered up.


----------



## Lemper

Jeffy-pie said:


> 13 days, 3 hours and it's now exactly 13.5 seconds fast. Super awesome good times
> 
> It was up to 20 secs but I've discovered that if I store it overnight in a certain position it loses a tiny bit. Couldn't be happier.
> 
> View attachment 574070


Looks great man!


----------



## seab3

Tissot T-One 2834-2

+10 Seconds a day measured against an atomic synced clock.

+9.5 Seconds a day face up measured with the Kello app


----------



## Will3020

1 to 3 +/- but quite a reliable piece


----------



## CrossingX

hi there peeps..
bought a tissot couturier *T035.407.16.051.01* a week ago with 2834-2 as its movement.. been measuring its accuracy with http://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/http://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/ and found out it consistently adds 8 secs per 24 hours.. 
is the movement alrite may i ask??


----------



## bonzo

My Visodate is -1.5 per day


----------



## Drumr78

Prs 516 bought in December. Will run +10sec if not worn and sitting face up. When I wear it, which is almost every day it's averaging +2sec per day. I'm extremely happy with the accuracy considering the price. I just hope that when I get my omega PO that it keeps at least that per day.


----------



## D HEINZ

I love my Tissot!
Model: PRS330 Sport Chronograph
Movement: ETA G10.211/ quartz
Accuracy: It has gained 1 sec in the three months i have owned it. Absolutely impressed.


----------



## CrossingX

CrossingX said:


> hi there peeps..
> bought a tissot couturier *T035.407.16.051.01* a week ago with 2834-2 as its movement.. been measuring its accuracy with http://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/http://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/ and found out it consistently adds 8 secs per 24 hours..
> is the movement alrite may i ask??


after roughly a month, i believe my watch has finally "settled" down. It has been running consistently +5secs/24 hours. Good enough for me..


----------



## adixsj05

Have a Tissot Seastar 2824-2 and just recently measured it against my Hamilton Scuba Chrono for a week.

Hamilton Scuba Chrono not off enough to count 
Tissot Seastar 100 +6 seconds a day and have had it for about a month! Very Pleased with it


----------



## CrossingX

CrossingX said:


> after roughly a month, i believe my watch has finally "settled" down. It has been running consistently +5secs/24 hours. Good enough for me..


after another month and its running -3secs/24hours.. is this normal may i ask?? its going from fast to slow.. please advise..


----------



## alx007

Tissot Le Locle w/ Power Reserve. 2897 movement. 

Synced 24h ago with an atomic clock. +10 sec. That works for me.


----------



## mrk

My first watch in 11 years was the PRC 200 chrono (not the updated version) and that seems to neither gain or lose any time at all for a couple of months.

I last adjusted it with the radio controlled clock I have when DST changed over last and it's still accurate to the second.

I've had a Seiko 5 and Orient Mako as well and they've not been as accurate over such time next to the Tissot. Looking forward to getting the new Tony Parker limited edition next month to add to the collection


----------



## Arctic_Ace

I bought one week ago Tissot PRC 200 quartz chronograph and it has not lose or gain any seconds so it's perfectly accurate.


----------



## Jeffy-pie

My 2011 seastar 1000 is running great at +9 secs after setting it 2 weeks ago. Pretty good I'd say


----------



## gdest

Tissot prs516 has 2836-2 movement as listed on Tissot official site. 
How do I know if it's standard, elaborated or maybe even top. It's not expensive watch so I presume it has standard movement. But how could I know? 

Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## dwaldmann

I Purchased my T068.427.16.011.00 on 31 May this year.









After a few weeks for break in I found it to be running generally 3-5 seconds fast per day (normal day wear and leaving it crown down while sleeping). Then I didn't check for 2 weeks and found it had only gained 8 seconds the entire period.

However, last week it started running about 10 minutes fast per day. I was in Las Vegas at the time and assumed that I must have somehow got it magnetized. Unfortunately I live in the boondocks so there are no watch repair shops anywhere near by and certainly not an authorized Tissot shop. I did talk to a relatively near antique clock maker and he thought it would be very unusual for a modern watch to become magnetized because of the shielding they do now, and that because of that it would have to be taken apart to demagnetize it if that were indeed the problem. He suspects it's a tangled hair spring.

So I called Tissot and they told me they want me to do a test first. Hand wind 60 revolutions, then wear it for two days, recording when it's put on and taken off. It's already gained almost 3 minutes from this morning so I don't think it was underwound. Guess we'll see what happens.


----------



## MrCCartel

Tissot Seastar 1000 Auto Chrono (NEW 24 Hours Old)
ETA C01.211
+5.5 Seconds in 24 hours against Nist.gov


----------



## mgr

I seem to loose 6 seconds per day Powermatic 80 (ETA C07.111). I've tried simple regulation techniques (positioning overnight) but they appear to have no effect. I appreciate however that my loss is within acceptable limits (+/-10 non-COSC) and Tissot manufacturing specs (-10/+30) but wouldn't mind trying to counter the loss to maintain accuracy.

Any tips?










I hope mine varies like this as will average out to be closer to actual time


CrossingX said:


> after roughly a month, i believe my watch has finally "settled" down. It has been running consistently +5secs/24 hours. Good enough for me..


 


CrossingX said:


> after another month and its running -3secs/24hours.. is this normal may i ask?? its going from fast to slow.. please advise..


----------



## jackhammer

my PRS516 auto/non-chrono has been ranging 13 to 14sec per day. it's only 8-days old.

funny thing i noticed though... just an hour after syncing it has already gained about 6secs., strange?!? i noticed this just now while it was resting in the display box.

i'm really new at this so i might be missing something. what i normally do everyday since i bought it is at 8:59am i pull the crown to position II and note the gain or loss. i then adjust it to 9am, then wait for the time and sync. now, would that 60sec. worth of time it is stopped has something to do with the sharp gain in secs.?

i'll get back to this thread tomorrow to see if the gain still checks out at 13 to 14sec.

cheers!!


----------



## jackhammer

^
weird!! after being consistent to 13-14sec/day fast, my PRS516 is now roughly 24sec fast?!? is this normal?


----------



## jackhammer

ok... so it's back to 14sec fast. what gives? hmmm...


----------



## Shaunie_007

My tissot Bridgeport auto chrono gains about 1 sec per day. I almost never have to reset the time. I also have the Janeiro on the way which is COSC certified, and will report back with it's timing!


----------



## lonewolf9

My Tissot Visodate Heritage runs about +15 sec per day on the winder. I thought this was excessive but sounds like there are many others.


----------



## Ollek

Hi all, first post here from a watch newbie. Until now I have been wearing my dad's old Seiko that he bought in the early months of the 1980s, before I was even born. Seems I have a problem with my new PRC 200 Quartz. I bought it from an AD on Monday and it's just not keeping time. I synched last night at 9 pm and now (3:50 pm my time) it has lost 10 seconds! Surely this is no way a quartz watch should be acting but is there any reasonable explanation for this or am I simply dealing with a flawed individual? I will be taking it back to the AD on Monday at the latest but any feedback would be appreciated. Needless to say I'm not very impressed.


----------



## fluppyboy

Ollek said:


> Hi all, first post here from a watch newbie. Until now I have been wearing my dad's old Seiko that he bought in the early months of the 1980s, before I was even born. Seems I have a problem with my new PRC 200 Quartz. I bought it from an AD on Monday and it's just not keeping time. I synched last night at 9 pm and now (3:50 pm my time) it has lost 10 seconds! Surely this is no way a quartz watch should be acting but is there any reasonable explanation for this or am I simply dealing with a flawed individual? I will be taking it back to the AD on Monday at the latest but any feedback would be appreciated. Needless to say I'm not very impressed.


Nope, that is not right. No time to panic just yet though, that is what warranty is for. I suspect it's either a dud watch or the battery is about to die (although that should still not slow a watch down... but strange things do happen from time to time). Go back to the shop, and they will take care of it for you.


----------



## dwaldmann

dwaldmann said:


> I Purchased my T068.427.16.011.00 on 31 May this year.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> After a few weeks for break in I found it to be running generally 3-5 seconds fast per day (normal day wear and leaving it crown down while sleeping). Then I didn't check for 2 weeks and found it had only gained 8 seconds the entire period.
> 
> However, last week it started running about 10 minutes fast per day. I was in Las Vegas at the time and assumed that I must have somehow got it magnetized. Unfortunately I live in the boondocks so there are no watch repair shops anywhere near by and certainly not an authorized Tissot shop. I did talk to a relatively near antique clock maker and he thought it would be very unusual for a modern watch to become magnetized because of the shielding they do now, and that because of that it would have to be taken apart to demagnetize it if that were indeed the problem. He suspects it's a tangled hair spring.
> 
> So I called Tissot and they told me they want me to do a test first. Hand wind 60 revolutions, then wear it for two days, recording when it's put on and taken off. It's already gained almost 3 minutes from this morning so I don't think it was underwound. Guess we'll see what happens.


So I sent it off to Tissot USA. Took them 2 months to fix it because apparently they replace the hands when they take a watch apart and they were on back order.

Been keeping good time since, with one major issue.

6 times in the last month since I got it back it has stopped in the night (since I got it back I have worn it all day every day). My wearing habits have been virtually the same, in fact if anything I've been tending to wear it for 2-4 hours a day longer since I got it back. Never once in the first two months I had it did it stop in the night. This morning when I got up it had only run 5 hours after I took it off. Before I sent it back the first time I would occasionally wear one of my other watches for a day and the Tissot never stopped even being unworn for 30+ hours.

So I guess it's back to the repair center again. Not nearly as impressed now as I was earlier on...


----------



## BrunoGeuth

I recently had my Tissot automatic B991 from 1988 serviced and regulated and now it is extremely accurate, around 0 to 1 second a day! Verry satisfied...

I hope they can do the same thing to my Tissot PR50 Automatic because that one loses 10 seconds a day.

I will keep you updated once done.

Bruno in Belgium


----------



## jackhammer

my auto/non-chrono prs5216 is now a month and 3 days old today. at first the timing was erratic (+14s per day... one time it jumped to +24s!!)... but for the past 20 or so days it has been consistent in keeping +7 to +8s everyday against National Institute of Standards and Technology. i keep it upright in the original tissot box at night when i sleep... and i wear it most of the time when at work and even at home to keep it well-wound.

let's see if that's how it's gonna be for the months to come.

cheers!!


----------



## Ollek

Ollek said:


> Hi all, first post here from a watch newbie. Until now I have been wearing my dad's old Seiko that he bought in the early months of the 1980s, before I was even born. Seems I have a problem with my new PRC 200 Quartz. I bought it from an AD on Monday and it's just not keeping time. I synched last night at 9 pm and now (3:50 pm my time) it has lost 10 seconds! Surely this is no way a quartz watch should be acting but is there any reasonable explanation for this or am I simply dealing with a flawed individual? I will be taking it back to the AD on Monday at the latest but any feedback would be appreciated. Needless to say I'm not very impressed.


I did take the watch back to the AD I bought it from. It was in service for about two weeks and I got it back 11 days ago. Since then it has been keeping perfect time.

Happy with the end result but unfortunately this rocky start to our relationship hasn't been forgotten and there is still a feeling of annoyance when I look at the watch. I think that's slowly starting to fade though. I deliberated on the watch for a long time so I hope this didn't ruin it for me.


----------



## cciewannabe

2 Weeks ago I purchased a new PRC 200, black face with yellow chrono's at Macy's and I noticed it is running slow. I set it 4 days ago and now it is running about 4 minutes behind. Could it be the watch was sittng there for a few years and now the battery is going bad? I can return it for my money back, but definitely not for an exchange, since this model no longer shows up on their inventory.
Thanks in advance.


----------



## Luis_Leite

Model: V8 (chronograph,1 month old)
Movement: G10.211 quartz chronograph
Accuracy: + 1 second / month.


----------



## LukaszTissot

Model: Tissot Le Locle Automatic (T006.428.11.038.00)
Movement: 2825-2
Accuracy: + 5 second / day


----------



## DaveyNY

Hey guys wanted to ask a question on this.

i bought a Tissot Automatic III 2 weeks ago. I started timing it over the weekend and see it is running +24 Seconds/day while on my nightstand.


I am considering opening it up to adjust the regulator and when I looked at the back I see that it is already NOT dead center but 2 clicks in the "minus." There is nothing to indicate the watch is a refurb or used. I got everything with plastic o it etc.. (from Jomashop which has a solid reputation)

My questions are:

1. Do watches get fine tuned/regulated before they leave via the regulator and so it is normal to have an automatic watch not leaving "dead center" on regulator?

2. How do i remove the back on this to regulate it myself?

Thanks all


----------



## Ozzy7

I bought my V8 3 weeks ago and it is still bang on!


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## BadBlue

My new PRC 200 Powermatic 80 is running -3 seconds per day. So far for the first week it was -21 seconds over 7 days.


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## jar

I recently got one of the new Tradition Perpetual (at least until 2100) Calendar watches and so far I cannot tell if it is gaining or losing any time at all when referenced against time.is.


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## jar

jar said:


> I recently got one of the new Tradition Perpetual (at least until 2100) Calendar watches and so far I cannot tell if it is gaining or losing any time at all when referenced against time.is.


Coming up on two weeks now and I still cannot tell if this watch is gaining or losing any time.

Gotta admit I'm pretty impressed.


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## jeeper3b

I have a prs 200 quartz eta G10 211 movement , couldn't be happier , it's been four months since I replaced the battery and set it and it has lost 6 seconds , I think that's pretty good accuracy at this price point , excellent quality in my opinion


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## Leonid Shmyhol

Not happy with +1'' a week? How about +10'' a day? T-Trend Tissot Couturier Automatic, bought it last week. Should I return it to the dealer to get it calibrated? What do you think?


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## Leonid Shmyhol

So +10'' a day for T-Trend Tissot Couturier Automatic is normal? Bought it last week.


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## fluppyboy

Leonid Shmyhol said:


> So +10'' a day for T-Trend Tissot Couturier Automatic is normal? Bought it last week.


Yes. It's an automatic watch. A consistent +10 seconds per day is good. Enjoy your new watch!


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## BadBlue

Leonid Shmyhol said:


> So +10'' a day for T-Trend Tissot Couturier Automatic is normal? Bought it last week.


Yes. Most likely It will slow over time. One week in is too early to tell what's what. Leave it vertical over night crown-up and see how much it loses over night.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## BadBlue

BadBlue said:


> My new PRC 200 Powermatic 80 is running -3 seconds per day. So far for the first week it was -21 seconds over 7 days.


Still about -4 secs per day when worn and not doing any hand winding of watch. If you leave it face up for a few days after a manual wind it will gain most lost time back. 21 days since last time set and I t's -3 seconds overall in those 21 days.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## achilles01

I have a Tissot Expert Touch watch (T013420.A). For the last 15 days, the watch is being off by less than a second (last synchronized with time.gov). I wear it all the time during work and outdoor activities.


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## GaryPham

My couturier automatic chronograph is +/-1sec a day if worn on my wrist for 16 hours and laying face down overnight for 8 hours


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## Levvy

Tissot Visodate...
4 days old with average +9 seconds per day


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## Tseg

My Visodate is not even week old and the first day was >20 spd fast, by the 2nd day was in the mid-teens fast. I then have been busy traveling so just got around to checking it out again... between 6 pm last night and 6 pm tonight (day 4) it gained just 2 seconds. I hope it holds right there!

This is the only watch with me on my travels so have been wearing 24/7 including sleeping with it on. Been using time.gov as my time source.


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## engin_ba

Couturier Auto Chrono
C01.211
+/-1sec a day out of the box. I wear it all the time.


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## AmeyaJoe

Tissot PRS 516 Automatic.
It is currently running +16 seconds per 24 hours.
Bought brand new, only 3 days old.
Hoping it will settle down to 3-4 seconds per 24 hrs after a break-in period of 2 to 4 weeks.


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## soulzero

Just got a new PRC200, but the thing is. My date will start changing at 23.00 BUT will have stopped at 1.05 instead of midnight.
Its like the watch is running a different timezone (GMT +2 instead of my GMT+1)

Is this a normal thing?


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## kebosatu

Hi Guys, how do you keep your automatic watch at night to get this kind of accuracy? 

Are you using winder when you are not using your watch?

I'm new here btw, soon to be a proud owner of Tissot watch. But kinda worry about the seconds hand is not aligning properly as reported by most Tissot owner.... Nice to meet everyone here. 

-kebo


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## thorell

I've got my PRS516 auto for three weeks now. Using Twixt for iPhone, I recorded the watch to be 5sec/day fast the first week, 1,7sec/day fast the second week. This last week, it has only gained 8,5sec in 9 days, witch means 0,7 seconds in average. 

I must say that I'm really impressed by this result.


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## thorell

I'd just want to share this picture. My PRS516 is spot on after 20 days of wearing. I think that's amazing!


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## grumpyoldman

quite a long thread....my tissot T Race with the good old 7550 movement came with about +12 sec a day out of the box in 2008, kept this for about 2 years, with very little variation ,not more than 2 sec a day. Then I left it on while chopping a tree down with my axe...... it went to +3 sec a day and stayed there for a couple of years. Lately I noticed it was a bit slow, so now, after nearly 6 years (without a service or adjustment) it is down to -9 sec a day. What really impresses me is that the variation was always very very low, never more than 2-3 sec a day. It is easy to adjust a 80 euro Seiko to run to several sec a day, but it will vary by +/- 10-15 sec in the range of a week or a month. So if you like to adjust your watch you could keep the tissot to within +/- about 2 sec a day easily, very happy with this, and also very satisfied how it kept its precision over the years. In this regard it is on par with my up market Seiko flightmaster, that cost 5 times more.....JL


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## grumpyoldman

totally normal....afaik also not recommended to adjust the data around the time it changes


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## Nasir Askar

Mine Tissot Antimagnitique though 65 years old but keeps good time.. Was initially gaining a couple of minutes but after adjustments it's now losing a couple of seconds a day


----------



## rfortson

Just picked up this Heritage Navigator the other day and after two days it's lost 2 seconds. Needless to say I'm happy.

What's a post without a picture?










Update. After a week of being worn about half the time and the rest either sitting in the box or on a winder, it's 6 seconds behind. 

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I337 using Tapatalk


----------



## rfortson

rfortson said:


> Just picked up this Heritage Navigator the other day and after two days it's lost 2 seconds. Needless to say I'm happy.
> 
> What's a post without a picture?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Update. After a week of being worn about half the time and the rest either sitting in the box or on a winder, it's 6 seconds behind.
> 
> Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I337 using Tapatalk


I had to set it after two weeks. It lost 15 seconds.  I'm happy.


----------



## thorell

I have a question. About a month ago I was very impressed with the accuracy of my Tissot PRS516. It gained about 0.5 seconds a day. Now it's gaining 10 seconds a day. 

I got the watch on the 11th of May. I haven't dropped it or something like that. 

Any idea what happened?


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## xXxVladxXx

How many minutes does It run fast? If Its over 2 mins there might be a problem. I have a prs 516 and over the course of about 5 days It only gains over a min and a half.


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## thorell

xXxVladxXx said:


> How many minutes does It run fast? If Its over 2 mins there might be a problem. I have a prs 516 and over the course of about 5 days It only gains over a min and a half.


It gains about one minute per week. So it's not a big issue.


----------



## Sweeper71

Hi, my PRS-516 2836 auto runs at +6/24h, very satisfied.


----------



## pantagruel

My lovely Visodate gains about 20-25 seconds a day. Not thrilled about it, but I could live with it.


----------



## Peter Lovetime

I own now my Tissot T-Touch Trekking Black around 4 Years and i am very satisfied with here from the first Day on.

For Exemple the Time differe only a Second in a Month, its really very great and a real Pleasure! 
The best Watch i ever had and i take my T-Touch 24 Hours every Day.

Please, excuse my german English...


----------



## KnuckleheadFlow

I lucked out with my PRS516 Auto Chrono (T044.614.21.051.00). When I first got it at the beginning of August I was checking it's accuracy daily and it was consistently losing about a second a day. It's my first mechanical watch and having read up, I was expecting a lot more, given the 7750's range for the elaboré grade. I don't bother reseting it anymore to be honest. I think I last set it about two weeks ago and it is currently about 11.5 seconds slow.


----------



## Dan_957

Got this powermatic 80 chrono (movement ETA C07.111) about two and a half weeks ago. It has been running at a consistent +6 sec a day (on the edges of spec, but highly stable). Its usual rest position is dial up, and I wear it quite often (have yet to deplete the power reserve on this thing).


----------



## newtonheath

My powermatic 80 runs at + 8 secs a day I'm a bit dissappointed with that but can live with it

my Prs516 also runs fast 7 seconds a day

my t touch runs very accurately but of course it's a quartz

not checked my dress watch moonphase the battery has run out I'll have to get round to changing it.


----------



## Dan_957

Dan_957 said:


> Got this powermatic 80 chrono (movement ETA C07.111) about two and a half weeks ago. It has been running at a consistent +6 sec a day (on the edges of spec, but highly stable). Its usual rest position is dial up, and I wear it quite often (have yet to deplete the power reserve on this thing).


Update,... with roughly two months of regular use it seems my daily average has improved (break in period, I guess?) to a consistent +3.5 sec a day. This measurement was over the last 10 days, having synced with USNO time. The watch was exposed to a variety of temp extremes in wearing, and was usually at rest dial up in an ambient temperature of between 65-68 fahrenheit, yet I observed very little variation between daily rate (+/- <1) regardless of wear or temp exposure.


----------



## scax

My two Tissots worth.....

Bought a new Couturier quartz a month ago and it has gained less than a second in its first month with me. Nice.

Then bought a Le Locle 2824-2 movement watch in yellow pvd gold with white face automatic from an AD in England. Here's my tale of the first 8 days. Non-COSC. 

Day 1 gained 5.5 seconds. Listened to movement and it seemed a bit rough sounding and uneven and louder than expected but still only audible when held to the ear.
Day 2 gained 6.5 seconds, but part of day 2 spent timing various positions for an hour each with interesting results. Still sounds rough and loud.
Day 3 gained 6.25 seconds. Still rough and loud. Kind of like as if one of the pallet stones is tapping smoother than the other one.
Day 4 gained 0.75 seconds. No notes on sound as by then I thought that it wouldn't change anyway.
Day 5 gained 1.35 seconds. Still no notes on sound.
Day 6 gained 1.0 seconds. Noted movement was surprisingly quieter and smoother sounding... gone was the feeling that one pallet stone was hitting louder than the other one. Seems the watch found its proper beat and rhythm. I don't expect it to sound much different going forward now.
Day 7 gained 0.1 seconds.
Day 8 gained 0.5 seconds.
Interesting watch to study as it breaks in. I read elsewhere that 2824-2 movements get a bit slower in the first few days or so then lock in. So, no surprises here other than better than expected accuracy and the settling of the sound which the movement makes to my ear.


----------



## scax

Follow on to my new Le Locle auto: Set it to time.gov over 80 hours ago and it is presently about 1/2 second slow from when set. I noticed it loses at a rate of about 3 seconds per day in 6up position and gains about 4 seconds a day in crown up position. So, when I take it off at night, it can be "adjusted" by how it is stored a bit, if desired.

While this Le Locle is very good, it doesn't hold a candle to my most accurate auto which I bought used. That 1990 Breitling Chronomat was bought in 2007 and had been serviced by Breitling in Connecticut, USA the year before. It gained reliably at a rate of 3 seconds per month regardless of what I did with it at night. Just goes to show what a well adjusted Valjoux 7750 movement can do. It gained a total of 18 seconds in 6 months continuous use with no effort whatsoever other than daily wear.


----------



## CorruptCommie

I've had a PRC200 Auto (C01.211 movement) for a little over 3 weeks now. Started out about +20sec/24hours, now it is around +12sec/24hours. Stored face up at night.


----------



## scax

Latest update on my new Le Locle.... set it to time.gov at 1:15am the 11th of January. It is now 1:30am on the 18th, seven days later. Comparing with time.gov, it is under 1/2 second slow. I noticed it was as high as 3 and 1/2 seconds fast during the week, but that was as off as it got. I may have spoken too soon about not being able to hold a candle to my Breitling Chronomat. Very interesting Le Locle, bought new from an AD in England on a pre-Christmas sale for £248 in yellow pvd gold. Received on January 3rd and running ever since. I say, not too bad for a non-COSC 2824-2 movement ;-)


----------



## Dan_957

Update on my Luxury Automatic COSC - 
After reading what others have done to compensate for daily +/- by altering rest position I decided to try this. Between 1/19/15 and 1/27/15 my daily average was essentially zero - using rest position 12 up to lose time and positions 6 up and dial to ceiling to gain time. I checked the watch twice a day, altering rest position as needed, but did not wear it at all. 

I've now tried again, but this time with wearing the watch. Between 2/5/15 and 2/10/15 my daily average is +1.2 seconds (as it currently sits at +6 seconds five days after setting it). Must say, I'm pretty satisfied with these contrived results.


----------



## Thethirdrowe

I've had a PRC 200 Powermatic 80 for about a week now, and it's -4 seconds/day. I haven't really taken it off, so it sits 6 o-clock up most of the time, and I'm unsure what it's doing when I sleep.


----------



## BruceE

My Luxury Automatic COSC averages about +3secs per day. I used the retest chart to leave it face down when I'm not wearing it.


----------



## Thethirdrowe

After regulating the Powermatic 80 movement, my PRC 200 is sitting pretty at +1.2. Regulating it was definitely easier said than done.


----------



## achilles01

My early impression about my Tissot T Touch expert model was that it was losing about 2s every month. Now after 14 months since its purchase, my monthly log has confirmed a total of -39s discrepancy over atomic standard time since last calibration in 14 Apr 2014. That is a rate of loss of 2.6s per month, quite consistently. I am not too happy with it noting +/- 1s accuracy reported in the forums for the same model, but can live with it for sure.


----------



## Deli

All this time spent in excel spreadsheets and timing a few seconds here and there, guys. Are you serious ? :think:


----------



## Tom vanDal

My new Tissot Vintage Automatic Powermatic (Caliber C07.111) runs spot on (+/- 0 seconds) since 5 days.
I'm really impressed considering it's no Chronometer. 

During the day it's on my wrist, in the evening and for the night I put it on a Winder configured for 650 rotations/day bi-directional.


----------



## nello

Tom vanDal said:


> My new Tissot Vintage Automatic Powermatic (Caliber C07.111) runs spot on (+/- 0 seconds) since 5 days.
> I'm really impressed considering it's no Chronometer.
> 
> During the day it's on my wrist, in the evening and for the night I put it on a Winder configured for 650 rotations/day bi-directional.


I am curious why u put it on a winder at night if you wear it daily?
If you feel inclined, I would like to see some accuracy numbers being worn. Only worn.
:curious:


----------



## Tom vanDal

nello said:


> I am curious why u put it on a winder at night if you wear it daily?
> If you feel inclined, I would like to see some accuracy numbers being worn. Only worn.
> :curious:


Sometimes I wear a SEIKO, therefore I have a Winder. I will disable the winder for the Tissot and update you in a few days.

Why shouldn't I put it on a winder if it runs spot on with this approach? Isn't that the goal? ..to keep the watch accurate. 
Thats why I shared my experience with this caliber.


----------



## nello

Tom vanDal said:


> Sometimes I wear a SEIKO, therefore I have a Winder. I will disable the winder for the Tissot and update you in a few days.
> 
> Why shouldn't I put it on a winder if it runs spot on with this approach? Isn't that the goal? ..to keep the watch accurate.
> Thats why I shared my experience with this caliber.


If it is spot on, I would not change a thing. I am curious. I read a few articles in time zone that spoke of over winding an automatic. Autos have overwind protection, but this author explained the wear and tear this places on those parts. He also explained a way of tilting a winder back with a wedge(some winders are already tilted) to obtain a sweet spot. This sweet spot takes advantage of the tension built up in the spring. The tilt while winding allows this tension to overcome the gravitational force on the rotor. Effectively, the rotor stops rotating and thus the winding stops, all before the full power reserve is reached. 
I will look for the articles again.
Got it.
http://people.timezone.com/msandler/Articles/ArnsteinWinder/Winder2.html


----------



## Tom vanDal

nello said:


> If it is spot on, I would not change a thing. I am curious. I read a few articles in time zone that spoke of over winding an automatic. Autos have overwind protection, but this author explained the wear and tear this places on those parts. He also explained a way of tilting a winder back with a wedge(some winders are already tilted) to obtain a sweet spot. This sweet spot takes advantage of the tension built up in the spring. The tilt while winding allows this tension to overcome the gravitational force on the rotor. Effectively, the rotor stops rotating and thus the winding stops, all before the full power reserve is reached.
> I will look for the articles again.
> Got it.
> Watches and Winders: It's Not Only About Turns per Day


Very Interesting, thanks for sharing.
I disabled the winding over night for my Tissot and it's still within 1sec accuarcy. I'll keep it like this for some more days and will give you a feedback.


----------



## nello

Sweet. I would be very happy with that.
My job does not allow me to wear my watches for entire days. I am a mechanic. I only wear one for short periods of time throughout the week. All day Wednesday and all day Sunday are the only two 16 hour stretches of wear. I need to buy a winder. Curious how well my Tissot Luxury Powermatic 80 will fare.


----------



## mtshsi

Tom vanDal said:


> My new Tissot Vintage Automatic Powermatic (Caliber C07.111) runs spot on (+/- 0 seconds) since 5 days.
> I'm really impressed considering it's no Chronometer.
> 
> During the day it's on my wrist, in the evening and for the night I put it on a Winder configured for 650 rotations/day bi-directional.


That's good to know -- my Powermatic 80 runs just a little slow -- averages about -5 seconds per day, but varies a little depending on how I wear it, whether I've got it around magnets a lot, etc... So putting it on a winder at night could make up for that?


----------



## nello

mtshsi said:


> That's good to know -- my Powermatic 80 runs just a little slow -- averages about -5 seconds per day, but varies a little depending on how I wear it, whether I've got it around magnets a lot, etc... So putting it on a winder at night could make up for that?


I would try different rest positions when you take it off. Face down, face up,crown down, crown up. Check each position in a 24hr period. Ie: wear like you normally would and try a different rest position every night. Check accuracy in morning. Let us know how it goes.

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## Dan_957

I put on my powermatic 80 chronometer after winding and setting it from dead reserve on Monday morning (set to USNO time). It's now Friday morning, and I have only taken it off to shower (so it's had about 23 and half hours a day of wear, per day) and it has gained 2 seconds. Environment temps have ranged from mid to upper 70's in doors to lower to mid 90's in the sun (so whatever that equals to wrist temps), and my activities have been mostly light exercise. 

I know watches are usually more accurate if you don't take them off but I'm actually happily surprised here, I honestly did not expect a +2 seconds over roughly 100 hours.


----------



## RollingStone

Hi, was hoping someone could provide some advice on this.
I recently purchased an automatic Tissot and what I've noticed is that after one week it is 3-4 minutes ahead of my mobile phone's time! So I've tried this three times already - at the beginning of the week I sync the times and then just watch. And every time it's the same, at the end my watch is closer to 4 minutes in front!
I've been reading about this, some articles mentioning "breaking in" periods, but none of them mention such extreme differences. It doesn't feel normal to me that I need to be readjusting the time every week.
It's not a super expensive watch, but it's not cheap either ($1200) so for that money I'd expect it to, well..function properly.
Do you think it's time to take it back to the store for them to look at it?


----------



## nello

RollingStone said:


> Hi, was hoping someone could provide some advice on this.
> I recently purchased an automatic Tissot and what I've noticed is that after one week it is 3-4 minutes ahead of my mobile phone's time! So I've tried this three times already - at the beginning of the week I sync the times and then just watch. And every time it's the same, at the end my watch is closer to 4 minutes in front!
> I've been reading about this, some articles mentioning "breaking in" periods, but none of them mention such extreme differences. It doesn't feel normal to me that I need to be readjusting the time every week.
> It's not a super expensive watch, but it's not cheap either ($1200) so for that money I'd expect it to, well..function properly.
> Do you think it's time to take it back to the store for them to look at it?


I would say its time to take it back. That is way off. Even during break in, I would expect no more than 10 sec/day. I would insist on it being regulated or replaced. Just my opinion. Not an expert. I have never had a cheap Chinese auto off that much.
I hope it works out. Keep us updated.


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## BruceE

nello said:


> I would say its time to take it back. That is way off. Even during break in, I would expect no more than 10 sec/day. I would insist on it being regulated or replaced. Just my opinion. Not an expert. I have never had a cheap Chinese auto off that much.
> I hope it works out. Keep us updated.


The Tissot instruction manual states that for non-COSC watches, the average accuracy is -10/+30 secs per day. So this watch may be on the very outside of being in spec.


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## Dan_957

Yeah, if you believe your Tissot is gaining minutes a day it absolutely needs to be looked at. A decent watch shop will be able to put this on a timing machine and give you a specific value for its error. They will then probably suggest you send it to either the manufacturer's service center or to an independent watch maker for inspection/ service. Good luck!


----------



## .isx

thorell said:


> I'd just want to share this picture. My PRS516 is spot on after 20 days of wearing. I think that's amazing!


how do you measure this?


----------



## applejosh

My PR100 runs about 6-8 seconds fast per day. Not too bad for a lower end, non-COSC watch.


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## Peter Kelly

I have a Tissot Powermatic 80 COSC and the accuracy (or lack of it) is driving me bonkers.

When I first received the watch it was running a little fast during the day when worn and a little slow at night when on the bedside table. All just within tolerance. However, every now and then the time would leap forward, sometimes by more than 10 seconds within a few hours.

As a consequence I returned it to Tissot for repair and, as they must have determined it was not to spec they sent it to Switzerland for calibration. At least that's what they told me. I understood the repair facility in the UK is in Southampton, but apparently they don't do anything if the watch needs opening, which leaves me at a loss as to exactly what they can do!

Anyway, I got the watch back and the first thing I had to do was reset it, as it was 17 seconds slow. It then performed very well with the timing being very good, only gaining about a second a day. Unfortunately, very soon the odd behaviour started again, but this time I discovered exactly when it went awry. I had checked the watch at one point and then, by pure fluke, glanced at it again no more than 15 minutes later and it had gained 16 seconds! the only thing I had done in that period was to scratch the dog!

Tissot told me that I should be able to do that without any adverse effects, but as that was clearly not the case I returned it again. This time they tell me it was fine and sent it back to me, although when opened it was 7 seconds slow.
Ludicrously, I am going to have to arrange a real time video of me scratching the dog to demonstrate the problem. Until then I'm stuck with a faulty watch that Tissot deny.


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## nello

Peter Kelly said:


> I have a Tissot Powermatic 80 COSC and the accuracy (or lack of it) is driving me bonkers.
> 
> When I first received the watch it was running a little fast during the day when worn and a little slow at night when on the bedside table. All just within tolerance. However, every now and then the time would leap forward, sometimes by more than 10 seconds within a few hours.
> 
> As a consequence I returned it to Tissot for repair and, as they must have determined it was not to spec they sent it to Switzerland for calibration. At least that's what they told me. I understood the repair facility in the UK is in Southampton, but apparently they don't do anything if the watch needs opening, which leaves me at a loss as to exactly what they can do!
> 
> Anyway, I got the watch back and the first thing I had to do was reset it, as it was 17 seconds slow. It then performed very well with the timing being very good, only gaining about a second a day. Unfortunately, very soon the odd behaviour started again, but this time I discovered exactly when it went awry. I had checked the watch at one point and then, by pure fluke, glanced at it again no more than 15 minutes later and it had gained 16 seconds! the only thing I had done in that period was to scratch the dog!
> 
> Tissot told me that I should be able to do that without any adverse effects, but as that was clearly not the case I returned it again. This time they tell me it was fine and sent it back to me, although when opened it was 7 seconds slow.
> Ludicrously, I am going to have to arrange a real time video of me scratching the dog to demonstrate the problem. Until then I'm stuck with a faulty watch that Tissot deny.


Update?


----------



## Daveb1st

First post!

Prs 516 non crono
Eta 2836-2
New out of the box and off wrist +20 s/day
Now 4 weeks old and on wrist 24/7 a steady +12 s/day. Noticed a disproportionate amount of gain is over night. 

Happy with this. Have a sat clock in bedroom so once a day pull crown for 12 sec!


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## nello

Daveb1st said:


> First post!
> 
> Prs 516 non crono
> Eta 2836-2
> New out of the box and off wrist +20 s/day
> Now 4 weeks old and on wrist 24/7 a steady +12 s/day. Noticed a disproportionate amount of gain is over night.
> 
> Happy with this. Have a sat clock in bedroom so once a day pull crown for 12 sec!


Have you tried positioning the watch differently at night?
Or, do you sleep with it on the wrist?

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Lundavra

I have been very disappointed with my Tissot T065430.

A couple of years ago the battery on my Seiko watch needed changing and I found that I would have to send away to be replaced.

It got me thinking about going back to a self-winding mechanical watch. I bought the Tissot T065430A and was surprised about its poor accuracy and even more surprised to find that the specification was only 30 seconds a day. It went over this so I sent it back under warranty, it was slightly better when returned but has stayed about the same so I have to adjust every few days.

I had cheap wind up watches many years ago that were more accurate than this, I thought mistakenly that Tissot was a reasonably good maker.

I am close to the point of just putting the Tissot in the drawer and going back to my old Seiko watch.

Why is this forum so slow when typing the post though seems OK now. I typed most of the above offline and pasted into the forum.


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## Lundavra

I have given up on the Tissot watch, I got my Seiko out of the drawer where it had been lying untouched for a couple of years. It was less than two minutes out, the Tissot would be as bad within a few days. Just put the Tissot down as an expensive mistake.


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## nello

Lundavra said:


> I have given up on the Tissot watch, I got my Seiko out of the drawer where it had been lying untouched for a couple of years. It was less than two minutes out, the Tissot would be as bad within a few days. Just put the Tissot down as an expensive mistake.


How old is the Tissot? If 3-5 years old, it may need a service. If newer, it may just need regulation. It may be magnetized. 
I am assuming the Tissot is an auto. I don't know that model number.
Just re-read your post. Yes, an auto. Who did you return it to? The dealer you bought it from. They might suck. I would not give up that easily. I would still try having it regulated. Someone else. Not who you returned it to. I don't know how to date a Tissot. It could have been sitting in a display case for 3 years. Still "new", but dried out.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Lundavra

nello said:


> How old is the Tissot? If 3-5 years old, it may need a service. If newer, it may just need regulation. It may be magnetized.
> I am assuming the Tissot is an auto. I don't know that model number.
> Just re-read your post. Yes, an auto. Who did you return it to? The dealer you bought it from. They might suck. I would not give up that easily. I would still try having it regulated. Someone else. Not who you returned it to. I don't know how to date a Tissot. It could have been sitting in a display case for 3 years. Still "new", but dried out.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Reply attached.


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## Tamris02

Surely the idea is to have a watch that is accurate. I am going back to the 70's when I had automatic watches, they barely lost/gained time. I personally would be horrified to have spent 1000's of £'s for the watch to gain/lose time.


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## nello

Lundavra said:


> Reply attached.


That is unfortunate. I only have one ETA based Tissot, but a few hamiltons and a vsa. All 2824 have been great. Less than 5sec./day. My current Tissot has the powermatic 80. It has been exceptional. I have had several seikos with different movements. I have had good luck with nh35 that a lot of people complain about. My SKX009 has been great lately. Non hacking so it is hard to time exactly. When I first got it, it was about 10 sec a day fast if I remember right. It has settled to about 6sec/day if left dial up at night.
You may have gotten a bad movement. Or, like I said before, poor service. I would expect better from a Swatch group company. They may have seen that it was within spec and did not adjust it. It could have gotten shocked during shipping. It could have had any number of things happen. 
I would still try to have it regulated locally or sell it vs. leaving an auto sitting in a drawer.
Sorry to hear your bad luck.

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## Pullbuoy

Tissot automatics 3 brand new. It took a day or two to bed-in but has been a solid +6 sec per day since. It has an ETA automatic movement (28XX?) which is not COSC certified, so I'm pretty pleased with this level of performance. If I'd wanted uber-accuracy, I'd have spent more or got a quartz version. 

Plus it looks great and wears well. Your watch really only needs to appeal to one person - you!


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## WatchNinja2

I know this is probably really irrelevant, but i had a really bad experience with my first expensive watch (at least it was expensive to me) and it was a Tissot.
I had an automatic PRS 315 about 5 years ago and it was top notch in look and feel. Rarely took it off. However after 3 years it started loosing time. took it repeatedly to the dealer to get fixed but since you couldnt tell for about 2 weeks if it was loosing time or not I wouldnt go back for a while as i just ajusted it. By the end i had to fiddle with the thing so often the pin kept coming out. After 6 years i gave up with the thing and abandoned it in a drawer. Now im with a cheapo automatic watch till i can save up for the next one.


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## nello

The three year point was the time to take it to a dealer for service. You did. I think you just got shatty service.
A good watchmaker is hard to find.


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## freakfingers12

I have two with same movement in them, one the Tissot Automatics III and the other the Tissot Visodate. The former, albeit having the most basic and undecorated ETA 2836-2 is running about +6sec a day. The latter, with gold plated rotor and vintage logo is running about +30sec a day. I'm thinking of sending the Visodate for warranty but reluctant as I've heard not so good comments about their service. Is it true? 
Although both are using the same movement, I do realise that the automatics III has a noisier rotor than the Visodate.


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## Time In

...I only own 1 Tissot--T Race Chrono/Auto Valjoux 7750. Always has been accurate and satisfied on single or multi-day use. I'm not a WIS so I can't provide you +/- seconds....... (I can control my OCD on that one !!)........
View attachment 10794082
View attachment 10794106


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## Christopher_Jefferson

I have a powermatic 80 chronometre luxury and it is fast by 2 seconds per day. Id say Rolex eat your heart out. Course it ain't a Rolex.....


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## KurtMan

Couturier C01.211 running -4sec/day currently.


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## VictorRH

T-Lord (Valjoux 7750), + 6 sec/day


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## Horologic

My new Visodate is running +6 seconds per day.


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## VadimMkin

Tissot LeLocle Chronometer: +2 to +4 per day out of the box on old stock model with stiff crown problem, now waiting on completion of servicing and expecting it to go closer to +1 to -1 (based on anecdotal evidence from owners of the same model).
My T-Lord Auto Chronograph with Valjoux 7753 is about +5 seconds per day (also, I put it on timing machine, and in position "crown up" it is +9 spd, crown down is +3 spd, the other positions are around +5 spd)


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## kdsdada0308

I have a Tissot Couturier Small Seconds that runs +3 seconds a day. Pretty darn good in my book.


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## cariduro24

Here are some numbers for my Tissot Powermatic 80. This sample is not to big but I'll report back in a week or so. See below.









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## dwaldmann

Never heard of WatchCheck before. Too bad it's Android Only. But then again, just yesterday I received my free-for-a-year Android phone from our local telco. Installed the app and will try it out!


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## VadimMkin

My Tissot chronometer just came back from service; the Tissot sales rep told me that the service was in Miami where they have a specialist in chronometer movements. The results for a couple of positions are just plain amazing while the rest is as expected. Enjoy the


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## dwaldmann

Very impressed, after 1 week, -1.5 seconds per day. Haven't tried any other position.


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## dwaldmann

After total of 3 weeks, even more impressed:
1. Horizontal, Face up*, -1.4 sec/day
2. Vertical, 3:00 up*, -2.5 sec/day
3. Vertical, 9:00 up*, +.3 sec/day

Based on this relatively small sample so far, by overnighting in position 3 except:
Once a week in position 1
Plus one extra day once a month in position 1

Accuracy should be within 1 second at end of DST, and not more than +/- 3 seconds or so over the entire course. 

We shall see...



*night position, worn approximately 16 hours/day.


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## monax

Around 4 months since I rebuilt my antimagnetique (the 40mm one I posted in the vintage thread), it's been about +/- 2 seconds a day. Among other things I poised the balance and made some adjustments to the hairspring. Face up at night; nothing fancy.


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## mwillems

Black Visodate, one year old. On my wrist 24h/day. And it is ridiculously accurate. 17 days so far since I put it on again: it is still within one second of actual time. 1 second or less in 17 days, that's absurdly accurate.


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## dwaldmann

I am just more and more impressed. I mostly wear it around 15-16 hours a day, and once or maybe twice a week I don't put it on.


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## BadBlue

+10 sec per day










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## BruceE

About half-way through a monthly rotation. Le Locle Powermatic-80


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## dwaldmann

BruceE said:


> About half-way through a monthly rotation. Le Locle Powermatic-80


Bruce, what app is that?


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## BruceE

dwaldmann said:


> Bruce, what app is that?


It's called "Watch Tracker". I have an iPhone.


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## dwaldmann

Thanks Bruce!

The one I've been using is only for Android, and I've been using it on a free phone that I don't generally have on me.


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## Dan3612

I use Watch Tracker too, great app!


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## klv12gcn

Horologic said:


> My new Visodate is running +6 seconds per day.


That's amazing!
I also own a Visodate for nearly one month now. And its deviation is about +13 s/day


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## Kyle Jordan

Yeah it's slightly different. Here's a photo of the back of my watch (exact same but with white dial)


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## Kyle Jordan

Yeah it's slightly different. Here's a photo of the back of my watch (exact same but with white dial)
View attachment 13240269


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## OmegaRed

My new Visodate runs +8 - 10 seconds per day. Very impressed!


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## DrDarrow

I have a Tissot Automatics III that runs a pretty consistent 27-30+ spd. Really need to have it looked at before it's out of warranty.


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## Mr.Jones82

My Seastar is the most accurate watch I own. It runs -2 to -3 a day. It does not seem to gain or lose any time on my wrist.
I just bought a Couturier day-date this week. I wore it the past couple of days, and it gained about 4 or 5 seconds a day. 
I love my Couturier. Pictures do not do it justice. I do not think there are many fans out there, but when I saw it in person, I fell in love. The only thing that rivals it in case finish for the price would be my Sumo. I really like the beefy bracelet it comes on, too. It seems to be keeping great time thus far, but we will see.


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## Valon

My Tissot Le Locle which i have owned for a 1year and 2 months now runs at +4 or -4/5 seconds a day depending on what position i left the watch when i go to sleep, so far i'm quite satisfied.


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## DrDarrow

Just sent my Automatics III in for service for running too fast. Was fuzzy on the buy date, but knew I was getting close to the 2yr warranty expiring. Turns out I got it in with just 4 days to spare. Phew!


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## ronkatct

My Tissot T-Classic Titanium Powermatic 80 seems to lose about 3 to 4 s/day. That is close enough for me and is my second most accurate automatic.


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## BundyBear

I know this is cheating as it's a quartz. My very first Tissot & Swiss watch, a PR200 from 1996. A sentimental piece for me and a daily wearer for many years until newer watches came along. Even then, I would still take this out and give it some wrist time. Accuracy on this has been spot on and I can't recall when was the last time I had to adjust the time. Even if I had to (maybe once a year?), it was only a few seconds fast.


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## munizfire

Tissot PowerMatic 80 Jungfraubahn Edition:

Just downloaded the ToolWatch app last week, these measurements were taking with said app. Does anyone have any other favorite method or software to measure the accuracy of their watches? I'm fairly confident the watch has started keeping better time lately (I bought it August), because I remember it losing more than 10 secs in a day earlier on (Dial up).

All values are in SPD
3 up: -1.9
6 up: +2.1 
9 up: -6.2
12 up: -9.1
Dial up: -4
Dial down: -2.2


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## asimzb

I have a 2 years old, Tissot Couturier quatrz.

ETA-G10 211

I set the time almost 2 years ago, it's only lost 6 seconds in 2 years. very satisfied. 

and my new Orient Bambino accuracy is 7+ to 16+ per day.


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## TedG954

During my last 9 days in Great Britain, my watch has been perfect. Must have been made on a good day.


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## TedG954

BTW....it's a T-Sport Chonograph.


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## juventus

Dial up or down , winding crown up or down +1 sec for 3 days in all positions. 
More than happy with this accuracy.


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## microkorgi

I had a V8 auto chrono a while back, and the way I wore it gave me a net cancellation while at work 
I sent it in for warranty repairs when I noticed one of the lug holes was wearing down almost immediately, and they decided the movement wasn't up to par. After rebuilding, it would run 4-5 sec/day fast. Irked me to no end, but it helped knowing it was brand new inside. You can't win 'em all. 
But it was a fantastic watch, and I really miss it.


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## ktoo

seastar powermatic 80 T120.407.17.051.00: +.5 sec day 1 (overnight glass up), -.5 sec day 2 (overnight crown up), -.5 sec day 3 (overnight crown up) edit: settling in now at +5/24


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## Dryfly

I own a Tissot Chemin Des Tourelles COSC certified chronometer. It gains around 20-25 seconds per day. Ridiculous piece of $1200 garbage. Cannot even be regulated by anyone but the factory, as you need to do it with a laser.

Will never own another Tissot. Was told that if I wanted to send it in to be fixed, I should not expect to see it back for 4-6 months. Again ridiculous.

Would never recommend Tissot to anyone.


----------



## Dryfly

I own a Tissot Chemin Des Tourelles COSC certified chronometer. It gains around 20-25 seconds per day. Ridiculous piece of $1200 garbage. Cannot even be regulated by anyone but the factory, as you need to do it with a laser.

Will never own another Tissot. Was told that if I wanted to send it in to be fixed, I should not expect to see it back for 4-6 months. Again ridiculous.

Would never recommend Tissot to anyone.


----------



## BrunoGeuth

I have 2 1990's vintage Tissot watches a PR50 Automatic and a B991 Automatic and in the last 4 weeks they gained/lost 0 (ZERO!) spd! Both were serviced in 2014.


----------



## SeikHoe

About one month old, *ran -2 per day at first*, *now running +1/-1 with off wrist rest vertical XII o'clock down.
Le Locle steel and rose gold, Powermatic 80 (which ran 90hrs 25min on a full wind)*


----------



## vietnam92

GearSlammer said:


> ive had my prs 516 for about a month, so i figured id check its accuracy. so far, its gaining roughly 15 seconds a day.
> doesnt seem very good. i checked it four days in a row, every morning, and it consistantly gained about 15 seconds.
> needless to say im a little disappointed. i might give it some time before i call the dealer.


how about your watch now, bro?


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## joaot

My T-Complication Chronometer.
Watch fully wound I got the following results:










After about 24 hours:


----------



## vietnam92

joaot said:


> My T-Complication Chronometer.
> Watch fully wound I got the following results:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> After about 24 hours:


What app, bro?


----------



## joaot

vietnam92 said:


> What app, bro?


I am using an Weishi 1900.


----------



## andreisavescu

Tissot Couturier Powermatic 80, I own it for 1 week now. Automatic 2824-2 PR80 movement.
+3.31sec / day average, worn everyday. During nights, it stays in different positions so far.


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## funkmon

andreisavescu said:


> Tissot Couturier Powermatic 80, I own it for 1 week now. Automatic 2824-2 PR80 movement.
> +3.31sec / day average, worn everyday. During nights, it stays in different positions so far.


I'm getting similar. I got it on the 17th and I'm getting +1.3 seconds per day, worn 6 times. This thing has really turned me into a powermatic guy. We're getting a lot of really good numbers on the powermatic movements here.


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## percysmith

Wish mine look more like yours. Pretty inconsistent performance here.
Worse, this was after regulation by the same watchmaker who regulated my 2893-2 into <+/-1spd and my Miyota 9015 into <+/-1.3spd.


----------



## funkmon

percysmith said:


> Wish mine look more like yours. Pretty inconsistent performance here.
> Worse, this was after regulation by the same watchmaker who regulated my 2893-2 into <+/-1spd and my Miyota 9015 into <+/-1.3spd.
> 
> View attachment 15425740
> View attachment 15425742


D:


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## percysmith

funkmon said:


> D:
> View attachment 15440044


How do I draw a super envious face?

Mine at least is getting consistent this week.+10s Monday,+11s Tuesday.
Which model is yours and is yours a silicium or chronometer movement or something?


----------



## funkmon

percysmith said:


> How do I draw a super envious face?
> 
> Mine at least is getting consistent this week.+10s Monday,+11s Tuesday.
> Which model is yours and is yours a silicium or chronometer movement or something?


It's just a normal powermatic. Not COSC or silicium. I don't remember the model name but this is the watch. Cost me like $300 or something.


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## percysmith

https://www.jomashop.com/tissot-watch-t035-407-16-051-03.html



movement*s* - so you have one more?


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## percysmith

I think I worked out what I am doing wrong
I may have overwound my Tissot Powermatic 80 and affected the minutes and seconds hands

I know in theory the watch can't overwound https://www.tissotwatches.com/assets/usermanuals/157-en.pdf
However when I gave my watch a hand winding when it really doesn't need it, I can see the extra power being released to the weight, making it turn. Just for clarity, I am holding my watch in my hand while I am hand winding it, so the weight turning is not because I am shaking it.

I have a theory that the overwinding is moving the minutes and seconds hands, so I am seeing bad performance in Watchcheck even though my watchmaker's timegrapher and my own app Timegrapher shows a perfectly acceptable <10 spd performance for the watch

Since I am not wearing the Tissot this week, I have given the watch a carefully monitored "diet" of 8 revolutions of the crown per day in its case (I moved up to 10 revolutions, it stopped last night).
Performance is back down to +8spd. If it keeps up this performance I'll stop tweaking.

Has anyone else observed overwinding will affect the minutes and seconds hands?


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## Dracer




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## CSG

I haven't tested my 1962 Seamaster but it's probably within 6-7 seconds a day based on my casual observation. Same with my 1960 Constellation. Have them serviced and regulated now and then and they are great performers.


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## percysmith

CSG said:


> I haven't tested my 1962 Seamaster but it's probably within 6-7 seconds a day based on my casual observation. Same with my 1960 Constellation. Have them serviced and regulated now and then and they are great performers.


1962 Seamaster is an Omega?


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## Tineen

My Tissot Seastar 1000 Powermatic is currently +2 secs per day when worn. I've also measured the Powermatic when off the wrist with a full wind and manages just a shade over 81 hours.


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## gvlozada

Tissot Heritage 1973 Limited Edition (Valjoux 7753), +8.2 seconds variation per day.









Sent from my Redmi 5 Plus using Tapatalk


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## gvlozada

Tissot PRS 516 T91.1.487.81 carbon dial, discontinued 2010 model bought brand new and heavily discounted from an AD, it was his last remaining unit, +2.3 seconds per day (Valjoux 7750 movement). variation









Sent from my Redmi 5 Plus using Tapatalk


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## Dirty Red

For Christmas I purchased a Heritage Petite Seconde with the Unitas 6498 hand wound movement. It has been running at about 2 seconds per day. I did not expect that from a $500 watch with an old tractor engine. 

The wife heard me winding it from across the room and asked what the heck that noise was. The TV was on and the bread machine was beating away and she still heard it.

This is such a neat watch and deserves a write up with photos but there are several good YouTube videos out there.


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## kalm71908

Veloci-T auto chronograph is +7 seconds a day


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## dnordin

Seastar 1000 Powermatic 80 -2 sec/day


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## oscmsw

Tissot PR100 Chronometer +or- 2 spd. My $120.00 beauty.


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## jss78

I need to share this because it's so ridiculous...

A few months old Automatics III with an ETA 2836-2. Over a one-week period of variable wear it's deviated +1 second, that is, about +0.14 seconds/day.

(The individual days vary quite a lot, so it's a case of being lucky, but I'll take it!)


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## oscmsw

PR100 +/-1


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## gear1box

Dryfly said:


> I own a Tissot Chemin Des Tourelles COSC certified chronometer. It gains around 20-25 seconds per day. Ridiculous piece of $1200 garbage. Cannot even be regulated by anyone but the factory, as you need to do it with a laser.
> 
> Will never own another Tissot. Was told that if I wanted to send it in to be fixed, I should not expect to see it back for 4-6 months. Again ridiculous.
> 
> Would never recommend Tissot to anyone.


Dry --

i own the same watch -- bought gray market from Jay-shop two years ago -- and i was getting consistent -10+ s/d accuracy, which is clearly not within COSC. i waited four or five months to see if it might "settle in" but no joy. Since it was gray market, Jay-shop was to handle claims but, ah, guess what? As you say, they cannot regulate the Powermatic's free-sprung balance wheel.

On a lark i wrote SwatchUSA, explaining that it was gray market/Jay-shop, but could they regulate it if i paid for the service? They said "it's a chronometer so send it in" which i did. They even sent a shipping label. Four weeks later it arrived home NO CHARGE, not even for shipping.

She is running within a 1 s/d now and, with a new crocodile strap from ZicZac, is my favorite dress watch by far.

-- gary ray


----------



## percysmith

gear1box said:


> Dry --
> 
> i own the same watch -- bought gray market from Jay-shop two years ago -- and i was getting consistent -10+ s/d accuracy, which is clearly not within COSC. i waited four or five months to see if it might "settle in" but no joy. Since it was gray market, Jay-shop was to handle claims but, ah, guess what? As you say, they cannot regulate the Powermatic's free-sprung balance wheel.
> 
> On a lark i wrote SwatchUSA, explaining that it was gray market/Jay-shop, but could they regulate it if i paid for the service? They said "it's a chronometer so send it in" which i did. They even sent a shipping label. Four weeks later it arrived home NO CHARGE, not even for shipping.
> 
> She is running within a 1 s/d now and, with a new crocodile strap from ZicZac, is my favorite dress watch by far.
> 
> -- gary ray


That's a better outcome than what Swatch HK was able to do for me; but then again, it will be pointed out to me that I prejudiced myself by attempting a regulation with an independent watchmaker first.


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## gear1box

Percy --

This first SwatchUSA interaction on regulating my Chemin COSC -- extremely beneficial from my perspective -- initiated a series of transactions: i've sent two of my watches in to them, including a 7750 "full" service of a Tissot Bridgeport Chrono ($290, which is extremely reasonable for 7750 chrono overhaul). In the process, i had some conversations about the Powermatic's design.

Elsewhere i've commented on my findings; see link below.









Standard vs. Silicon blanace spring (SeaStar)


I'm seriously considering a SeaStar 1000 automatic. I've never owned a nice watch before, but I love the romance of mechanical movement and love the look/style of the SeaStar. I'm wondering if the Silicon balance spring is really worth the extra C$150 (seems steep for a different spring and 2...




www.watchuseek.com





The bottomline -- which i am sure that your independent watchmaker confirms -- is that the movement is simply not designed to be maintained, and _specifically regulation adjusted with just a jeweler's screwdriver accompanied by a light touch_. The free-sprung balance weights are (like Rolex btw) the source of regulation but if the poise is compromised (or wear on the ratchet teeth, etc) the answer is to replace the regulation module as a whole. In that model making key parts of plastic is efficient since the design-life need not be the life of the watch, just the gap between service intervals.

My purchase-life expectations may not be yours but i bought this watch with a ten-year horizon: i figure that in that time i may get tired of it, the rose gold PVD finish will wear and may be showing base metal, or my needs may change. So that means i will have one $190 SwatchUSA overhaul at five years. As long as it keeps COSC time when it comes back to me that seems fair. Who knows? In a decade i may wish to keep wearing it so that's another overhaul then. i will surely be getting a new regulation module at that point . . .

Many watch fans complain about this designed-in obsolescence engineering approach but i am happy with it. "No" you cannot get it serviced locally, but i am more than happy with SwatchUSA's service and prices; i even get a two-year factory warrantee from them (which my gray-market Jay-shop piece never had when new). i also know that they will use the correct gaskets, not ones that "fit". i like the 80 hrs; the accuracy seems stunning; the selection and features are competitive and the prices are reasonable. No wonder four of my five watches are Swatch brands (i.e., three Tissots and a Rado).

-- gary ray


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## percysmith

gear1box said:


> The bottomline -- which i am sure that your independent watchmaker confirms -- is that the movement is simply not designed to be maintained, and _specifically regulation adjusted with just a jeweler's screwdriver accompanied by a light touch_. The free-sprung balance weights are (like Rolex btw) the source of regulation but if the poise is compromised (or wear on the ratchet teeth, etc) the answer is to replace the regulation module as a whole. In that model making key parts of plastic is efficient since the design-life need not be the life of the watch, just the gap between service intervals.


It was put to me whether my problem was a poise problem Questions about ETA C07 (Powermatic 80, H-10, etc.) , but I should have started with a regulation problem and my (first) watchmaker started out by attempting to adjust the weights Questions about ETA C07 (Powermatic 80, H-10, etc.)


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## percysmith

gear1box said:


> The bottomline -- which i am sure that your independent watchmaker confirms -- is that the movement is simply not designed to be maintained,


I saw a video where a Powermatic 80 was successfully repaired for major drop damage, but the watchmaker didn't show post-repair timekeeping Repair a Tissot watch which falling from high altitude destoryed.


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## gear1box

Percy --

I am not a watchmaker so feel a bit out of my depth addressing the question . . . but i have spent a too-long career as an intimate observer of high technology industries and how new technologies are mapped into production processes. So evaluate my views accordingly.

i feel like i was a bit imprecise when i said ". . . . not designed to be maintained . . ."; i should have added ". . . _by a local independent watchmaker"._ "Yes" Powermatic movements -- unlike, say, System 51 movements -- can be rebuilt and maintained by, for example, service overhauls as typically understood. The difference is that, with the easily (and cheaply, one hopes) regulating module design strategy time-consuming and expensive steps like poise balancing no longer make much sense; this is particularly so for Powermatic movements (like mine) with the plastic parts. I was directly told that "yes you can regulate Powermatics with the 'shop tool' but much beyond that and it just makes sense to replace the [regulation] module . . ."

The example you cite of major drop damage -- which usually means balance staff damage -- would likely mean a module replacement as well as other repairs. Could the damage be repaired in-place? I don't know but the more relevant question is: what is the cost of doing so compared to module replacement? ETA knows its movements and the repairs that are experienced. My strong suspicion that field knowledge informed this architecture.

-- gary ray


----------



## Narcoleptic Flarp

Just tested my Heritage 1948, and it has lost about 2 seconds in 24 hours. Really pleased with the accuracy!


----------



## ronkatct

My new Tissot Seastar 100 with regular Powermatic 80 is ugly on the timegrapher but runs about + 1s/day on wrist. It seems to be more accurate on wrist that my COSC BB 58.


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## gear1box

ronkatct said:


> My new Tissot Seastar 100 with regular Powermatic 80 is ugly on the timegrapher but runs about + 1s/day on wrist. It seems to be more accurate on wrist that my COSC BB 58.
> 
> View attachment 16439942


Ron, Ron . . . .

I guess that you didn't get the memo: Powermatic/C07's are so quiet -- it is one of the sources of energy loss that ETA's re-design minimized -- that they do not register well on our "hobby" $150 timegraphers. This is particularly true for the polymer escapement C07.111 which your Seastar -- like mine! -- has. In particular the beat error is all over the place since the "tok" side is noticeably quieter than the "tic".

Of course it hardly matters because you probably do not wish to mess with the weights on the balance wheel to regulate it. Please do not, and ignore the Youtube videos that claim you can: you will only screw up the poise on your balance wheel and, possibly, damage the staff or its bearings.

It is a great -- and rugged -- watch; just enjoy it. In five to seven years send it to SwatchUSA with $180 and get it back for another five to seven years, two of which will be covered by a new watch warranty. A massive consumer benefit of Tissot ownership is access to SwatchUSA service (i've dealt with them three times on other watches) at reasonable prices; take advantage of it.

Am i a satisfied owner? Yupper.

-- gary ray


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## ronkatct

gear1box said:


> Ron, Ron . . . .
> 
> I guess that you didn't get the memo: Powermatic/C07's are so quiet -- it is one of the sources of energy loss that ETA's re-design minimized -- that they do not register well on our "hobby" $150 timegraphers. This is particularly true for the polymer escapement C07.111 which your Seastar -- like mine! -- has. In particular the beat error is all over the place since the "tok" side is noticeably quieter than the "tic".
> 
> Of course it hardly matters because you probably do not wish to mess with the weights on the balance wheel to regulate it. Please do not, and ignore the Youtube videos that claim you can: you will only screw up the poise on your balance wheel and, possibly, damage the staff or its bearings.
> 
> It is a great -- and rugged -- watch; just enjoy it. In five to seven years send it to SwatchUSA with $180 and get it back for another five to seven years, two of which will be covered by a new watch warranty. A massive consumer benefit of Tissot ownership is access to SwatchUSA service (i've dealt with them three times on other watches) at reasonable prices; take advantage of it.
> 
> Am i a satisfied owner? Yupper.
> 
> -- gary ray


My Mido Ocean Star, also with Powermatic 80, has 2 almost straight lines with a small beat error, but looks as pretty as the design. Not sure which Powermatic is used in the Mido.


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## gear1box

ronkatct said:


> My Mido Ocean Star, also with Powermatic 80, has 2 almost straight lines with a small beat error, but looks as pretty as the design. Not sure which Powermatic is used in the Mido.


Ron --

Per ABlogToWatch's review, your Ocean Star has a C07.611, 25 jewel, movement. That is two more jewels than the C07.111 and . . . the two "extra" jewels are on the ratchet lever. Which is to say that your movement does NOT have the polymer escapement and is louder because of it. To be sure, it is still almost certainly quieter than a 2824 due to the energy engineering i referenced but it isn't like the polymer models in terms of the timegrapher.

It still however has the free-sprung balance wheel, which confers some advantage but means that the movement effectively cannot easily be regulated by anyone short of a Swatch facility. Ignore Youtube claims to the contrary, unless you want to induce poise problems or are incredibly good / lucky balancing an in-place wheel . . . .

-- gary ray


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## percysmith

gear1box said:


> It still however has the free-sprung balance wheel, which confers some advantage but means that the movement effectively cannot easily be regulated by anyone short of a Swatch facility. *Ignore Youtube claims to the contrary,* unless you want to induce poise problems or are incredibly good / lucky balancing an in-place wheel . . . .


I know what your mean - I've seen one 




But then it completely floored my usual watchmaker as you described. Another watchmaker suggested another difficulty is Powermatic 80 has only two weights as opposed to four on Rolex, Omega.

@Archer asserts my watchmaker is incompetent Questions about ETA C07 (Powermatic 80, H-10, etc.) . For info, my watchmaker successfully regulating my Calibre 8500 on Omega AT, so it doesn't appear to be an issue he's not up to regulating freesprung movements.

I don't know what is the real issue why regulating Powermatic 80 is so hard and I beg rest:
i. Don't regulate one of these movements unless you absolutely have to
ii. If you do, and your watchmaker couldn't get it to work - or, if you can take it to Swatch and they can't resolve the issue, there's always the option of trashing the Powermatic and putting in a $150 ETA 2824 in its place.

I have not seen another Powermatic watch I wish to acquire - I'm getting more picky about lume, so my recent acquisitions have been with Seiko at this price range.

Of course you cannot do that to special Powermatic movements like the GMT in the Mido Ocean Star GMT Ocean Star GMT


----------



## gear1box

Sir --



percysmith said:


> I know what your mean - I've seen one
> 
> 
> 
> 
> But then it completely floored my usual watchmaker as you described. Another watchmaker suggested another difficulty is Powermatic 80 has only two weights as opposed to four on Rolex, Omega.
> 
> @Archer asserts my watchmaker is incompetent Questions about ETA C07 (Powermatic 80, H-10, etc.) . For info, my watchmaker successfully regulating my Calibre 8500 on Omega AT, so it doesn't appear to be an issue he's not up to regulating freesprung movements.
> 
> I don't know what is the real issue why regulating Powermatic 80 is so hard and I beg rest:
> i. Don't regulate one of these movements unless you absolutely have to
> ii. If you do, and your watchmaker couldn't get it to work - or, if you can take it to Swatch and they can't resolve the issue, there's always the option of trashing the Powermatic and putting in a $150 ETA 2824 in its place.
> 
> I have not seen another Powermatic watch I wish to acquire - I'm getting more picky about lume, so my recent acquisitions have been with Seiko at this price range.
> 
> Of course you cannot do that to special Powermatic movements like the GMT in the Mido Ocean Star GMT Ocean Star GMT


Sir --

Let speak to points that you raise:

Firstly, with respect to regulation function and general design issues of the C07 free sprung balance per se, i would say that i do not share with many their general hostility towards the design. It can be regulated, just not trivially by many of us; indeed it is designed for service-center maintenance which -- for many SwatchUSA lines -- is really quite reasonably priced. Many advanced technology products, such as automobiles, are no longer designed to be user serviced; we do not think the less of them. I also do not share your second watchmaker's view that having only one degree of balance wheel balancing is necessarily a problem. The wheel is surely balanced in the orthogonal dimension by laser mass removal in production. Having been done, the need for hands on in-service adjustment of that dimension is probably very tiny. Finally, the great 20th century horologist -- he literally "wrote the book . . ." -- George Daniels was a huge fan of free sprung movements and carefully documents his reasons. 

Swatch makes a tool, which they make available only to their registered account holders, that supports the balance wheel for regulation. _*IF *_one had that tool, i agree with you: regulation would not be harder than what watchmakers' routinely do for many high end watches like Rolex. Easier, actually, since there is one fewer degree of freedom to maintain on the wheel. Frankly, for a number of reasons Swatch would be well advised to make that tool widely available.

But yes, i like the C07 design for its general robustness -- not having the speed adjustment lever helps -- and the 80hr reserve; for me a pretty big advantage. So much so that i am seriously considering swapping 2824 form-factor movements for C07s in my two very nice Chinese homage watches. Hah! Sea-Gull now makes a C07 clone movement with one major feature change . . . wait for it . . . it lacks the free-sprung wheel and can be field regulated. Maybe i will go that way with one of the watches.

-- gary ray


----------



## percysmith

gear1box said:


> I also do not share your second watchmaker's view that having only one degree of balance wheel balancing is necessarily a problem. The wheel is surely balanced in the orthogonal dimension by laser mass removal in production. Having been done, the need for hands on in-service adjustment of that dimension is probably very tiny.


Hang on. Are you suggesting a if watch regulated properly at the factory, there is no further need for future regulation notwithstanding:

change in climate/humidity at wearer's location; and
wear over time?



gear1box said:


> Swatch makes a tool, which they make available only to their registered account holders, that supports the balance wheel for regulation. _*IF *_one had that tool, i agree with you: regulation would not be harder than what watchmakers' routinely do for many high end watches like Rolex. Easier, actually, since there is one fewer degree of freedom to maintain on the wheel. Frankly, for a number of reasons Swatch would be well advised to make that tool widely available.


My watchmaker was able to procure a tool to regulate the 8500; he was not able to for the Powermatic 80.


----------



## gear1box

percysmith said:


> Hang on. Are you suggesting a if watch regulated properly at the factory, there is no further need for future regulation notwithstanding:
> 
> change in climate/humidity at wearer's location; and
> wear over time?
> 
> 
> 
> My watchmaker was able to procure a tool to regulate the 8500; he was not able to for the Powermatic 80.


No Percy, i did not mean to say, or imply, that that _regulation _would not be required: indeed it does for sure for wear if nothing else and we've been discussing how to do it. No, my intent was to convey this idea that the there was no need to have field adjustable the poise balance of the wheel in the dimension orthogonal to the axis on which the Powermatic weights are located, _if_ that dimension is sufficiently accurately balanced when made. To be sure there will be some poise effects of moving the weights out, but they are probably minor within the context of other errors.

This is based on my exchange with a SwatchUSA technician about a Seastar i sent in for regulation a year or two back. From an engineering point-of-view this all has to be seen within the "regulation module" approach of the ETA design: one of the major "hidden" differences with the 2824 is that the wheel/spring/lever/rachet is designed to be replaced in total as a module if anything other than a minor tweak is needed. Within that context having field technicians chasing down second-order balance wheel poise effects makes no sense. Thus there is no way to adjust the balance wheel's rotational mass orthogonal to the weight screws: if the screws won't address the problem -- sometimes they won't, particularly with severe drop damage -- replace the whole module.

Most watch enthusiasts' recoil, i think, from this kind of design/field maintenance trade-off but in my field (defense) we make it all the time. We watch people would like to think that with proper maintenance our watches with their original parts will last forever; the other approach is that the purpose of them is to deliver a stream of services at the lowest cost. This trade-off that yields the disposable Powermatic regulation module is a reflection of the latter's philosophy. 

It is kind of ridiculous for most of us to think of mechanical watches as time-keeping devices, so i guess their stream of services is more, well, subtle and whatever the customer wishes it to be. For me, paying Swatch $180 every five to seven years -- with no other service options -- isn't out of line and i'm happy to do it. Yet I cannot disagree with someone that says, for them, this swap-out-for-repair approach is odious. BUT i need to note that the 2824 balance wheel itself has no adjustments at all, so severe damage with it probably couldn't be accommodated either.

-- gary ray


----------



## Archer

gear1box said:


> Swatch makes a tool, which they make available only to their registered account holders, that supports the balance wheel for regulation. _*IF *_one had that tool, i agree with you: regulation would not be harder than what watchmakers' routinely do for many high end watches like Rolex. Easier, actually, since there is one fewer degree of freedom to maintain on the wheel. Frankly, for a number of reasons Swatch would be well advised to make that tool widely available.


You do not absolutely need this tool, as the balance can be removed from the watch and supported outside the movement while the screws are being turned. It's more work though, so if that happens will partly depend on how motivated your watchmaker is (that may also depend on what you are willing to pay them).



gear1box said:


> No, my intent was to convey this idea that the there was no need to have field adjustable the poise balance of the wheel in the dimension orthogonal to the axis on which the Powermatic weights are located, _if_ that dimension is sufficiently accurately balanced when made.


True - but that's a big if...



gear1box said:


> Thus there is no way to adjust the balance wheel's rotational mass orthogonal to the weight screws:





gear1box said:


> BUT i need to note that the 2824 balance wheel itself has no adjustments at all,


Smooth balance wheels with no built in adjustments (no weights or screws) can and are adjusted for poise regularly. This is done via the removal of material from the underside of the balance. Again the willingness of the watchmaker to take such steps may depend on their abilities and what they are charging.



Often the choices here will be driven by the access the watchmaker has to new parts, and the prices of those parts. 

Cheers, Al


----------



## gear1box

Archer said:


> You do not absolutely need this tool, as the balance can be removed from the watch and supported outside the movement while the screws are being turned. It's more work though, so if that happens will partly depend on how motivated your watchmaker is (that may also depend on what you are willing to pay them).
> 
> 
> 
> True - but that's a big if...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Smooth balance wheels with no built in adjustments (no weights or screws) can and are adjusted for poise regularly. This is done via the removal of material from the underside of the balance. Again the willingness of the watchmaker to take such steps may depend on their abilities and what they are charging.
> 
> 
> 
> Often the choices here will be driven by the access the watchmaker has to new parts, and the prices of those parts.
> 
> Cheers, Al


Al --

Thank you and we are fully in agreement. Sure, removing the balance wheel opens the envelope of what can be done if you wish to do so. And yes, directly removing weight is how one does it on the 2824 and you can use the same files and ruby jaws for the C07's balance wheel if one wishes to do so.

ETA was/is trying to minimize that type of field work which, in their regulation-module replacement model, is not needed. _*But *_-- and you say the critical point -- it all depends on the availability of parts & their prices too. 

i am only saying that, as a consumer, i do not reject the evolution of design in a direction that mandates module-level replacement as a repair model vs those kinds of steps, per se. To me it depends on whether i get benefits from the change as well as cost to me in service. i am sufficiently happy with the balance of benefits of the C07/Powermatic approach that i'm willing to buy more such watches but completely understand that my tastes may not be shared.

Let me close by making an economic observation (sorry; it's my profession): the price of respectable quality Chinese 2824s is getting so low (Sea-Gulls are well under $100 delivered) that anything past simple regulation and maybe beat adjustment can hardly be economically justified. For a variety of precision manufacturing technology reasons, i am reasonably sure that 2824 movement production can sustain these prices long-term at very high quality levels. 

Moreover -- and i think that this is a potentially a profound change -- the 2824 movement form-factor/envelope seems to be evolving as the _lingua franca _of Chinese watches. This might change the face of watch ownership in important ways: you would at both purchase and in-use have a choice of attributes you might wish out of a movement; wouldn't that might be nice? Put another way: _the movement's attributes would no longer be tied to the case in which it is housed._ We could do that now but the "Franken watch" implication is that the result can never be easily maintained. If movement swaps are the standard maintenance action, who cares?

-- gary ray


----------



## Archer

gear1box said:


> i am only saying that, as a consumer, i do not reject the evolution of design in a direction that mandates module-level replacement as a repair model vs those kinds of steps, per se.


I understood your point. Just clarifying that these things can be done and _are_ done daily by watchmakers all over the world.

I think the module level thing is far more prominent in brand service centers than with watchmakers working on their own. In a brand service center you are under extreme time pressures and output expectations, and for someone like me, who works alone, I don't have those pressures. I would rather do less parts replacing, and more actual repairs.

These policies dumb down the profession significantly, and some of these modular approaches have been failures in the past and lead to watches that are difficult if not impossible to repair now. I can understand you likely don't have a long term view on these watches now, but that is what leads brands to be able to get away with this sort of thing...it's not good for watchmaking or collecting in the long run...

Cheers, Al


----------



## percysmith

Let me try and summarise, from a perspective as a lay consumer:

1. Powermatic movements _can _be regulated, but might entail far more work than ETA 2824 (where the watchmaker can regulate merely by adjusting screws) or even current Omega/Rolex freesprung movements (where the watchmaker can regulate weights on the balance with the use of a tool). On Powermatic, if direct adjustment of the weights does not lead to the required result in rate, the watchmaker may need to remove the balance wheel from the movement for further adjustment, or even remove material from the balance to correct poise error introduced, if any.

2. In practice, Swatch has made the regulation module disposable.

3. (As a sort of saving grace) For third party watchmakers, it may be economical to suggest to customers to replace the whole movement with a ETA 2824-2 or equivalent (as I have done) or a Chinese 2824.


----------



## rekmeyata

Two years ago I purchased a Tissot PR100 Powermatic 80 and the accura cy is not good, it loses 5 minutes a month, my first Tissot was a 1972 Seastar that watch gained 30 seconds a month, but that was before Swatch took over and ruined the Tissot brand image. 

My problems developed shortly after I got it, it ran for 3 months gaining about 5 minutes a month, then it stopped running, so I sent it back of course. When I got it back it was running 5 minutes slow a month, I called Swatch and they said to send it back, when I got it back it was still running 5 minutes slow, called them and sent it back again, received it doing the same thing, called and sent it back, received it and it was doing the same! This went on for total of 4 times, on the 5th time they said they would replace the watch, so I sent it back and they did NOT replace the watch, simply sent it back saying it was running within factory specs, which is 10 seconds a day which equals to 5 minutes a month, so technically they are correct, however they could have fine-tuned the timing on the watch when they got it the first time, a watch repair guy can easily do that, but Swatch wouldn't even try. Why, if the watch was running within factory specs did, they put me through the hassle of sending it back to them 5 times?! It would have been less hassle for me and less expense on their end had they simply adjusted the watch a tad to make it run more accurately.

I have a $150 Seiko 5 diver automatic that runs about a minute fast a month, I also have a 1963 Omega that runs 15 seconds fast a month! Yet Swatch can't get the accuracy to even match a cheap Seiko??? I should have spent that money and got another more expensive Seiko!

Some of you probably think that 5 minutes is no big deal, but all my automatic watches I've ever had never gained or lost more than a minute from the factory, so I'm accustomed to that sort of accuracy, and I expect that kind of accuracy from a watch. Of course, maybe it's just that the old school watches simply were made better, and the watch maker that put it together took the time to make sure it was running accurately before releasing it for sale?

I've heard other complaints about the Swatch organization as well as on other forums, they simply have cheapened vintage marque brands to cut costs and to make a larger profit for shareholders. I was going to buy another Omega, but not now, I'm not taking a gamble like that, I just get a Grand Seiko and forget buying any Swatch brand company.


----------



## percysmith

rekmeyata said:


> Two years ago I purchased a Tissot PR100 Powermatic 80 and the accura cy is not good, it loses 5 minutes a month, my first Tissot was a 1972 Seastar that watch gained 30 seconds a month, but that was before Swatch took over and ruined the Tissot brand image.


That was the Tissot I had. 



rekmeyata said:


> they did NOT replace the watch, simply sent it back saying it was running within factory specs, which is 10 seconds a day which equals to 5 minutes a month, so technically they are correct,


They are correct.



rekmeyata said:


> \however they could have fine-tuned the timing on the watch when they got it the first time, a watch repair guy can easily do that, but Swatch wouldn't even try.


Probably yours required more than a minor tweak i.e. they need to consider replacing the whole regulation module. But since yours is within spec, they refused. See upthread:



gear1box said:


> This is based on my exchange with a SwatchUSA technician about a Seastar i sent in for regulation a year or two back. From an engineering point-of-view this all has to be seen within the "regulation module" approach of the ETA design: one of the major "hidden" differences with the 2824 is that the wheel/spring/lever/rachet is designed to be replaced in total as a module if anything other than a minor tweak is needed. Within that context having field technicians chasing down second-order balance wheel poise effects makes no sense. Thus there is no way to adjust the balance wheel's rotational mass orthogonal to the weight screws: if the screws won't address the problem -- sometimes they won't, particularly with severe drop damage -- replace the whole module.
> 
> Most watch enthusiasts' recoil, i think, from this kind of design/field maintenance trade-off but in my field (defense) we make it all the time. We watch people would like to think that with proper maintenance our watches with their original parts will last forever; the other approach is that the purpose of them is to deliver a stream of services at the lowest cost. This trade-off that yields the disposable Powermatic regulation module is a reflection of the latter's philosophy.





gear1box said:


> I've heard other complaints about the Swatch organization as well as on other forums, they simply have cheapened vintage marque brands to cut costs and to make a larger profit for shareholders. I was going to buy another Omega, but not now, I'm not taking a gamble like that, I just get a Grand Seiko and forget buying any Swatch brand company.


I don't follow how Swatch's actions in Tissot (and other Swatch "vintage" brands at its level such as Hamilton and Mido) has anything to do with what it does at the Omega level.

I have both Omega and Grand Seiko now. Although I slightly prefer the GS looks, it's certainly harder to service as a Hong Kong user - Seiko sends a lot of repairs back to Japan, plus, independent watchmakers can't touch the zaratsu polishing or perform any Spring Drive maintenance/overhaul when the time comes. Both Swatch and/or independent watchmaker can do work on Omega.


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## rekmeyata

Are you saying that I can't remove the back of the watch myself and regulate the time with a small lever they use to put in watches to do that?


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## percysmith

rekmeyata said:


> Are you saying that I can't remove the back of the watch myself and regulate the time with a small lever they use to put in watches to do that?





gear1box said:


> The bottomline -- which i am sure that your independent watchmaker confirms -- is that the movement is simply not designed to be maintained, and _specifically regulation adjusted with just a jeweler's screwdriver accompanied by a light touch_. The free-sprung balance weights are (like Rolex btw) the source of regulation but if the poise is compromised (or wear on the ratchet teeth, etc) the answer is to replace the regulation module as a whole. In that model making key parts of plastic is efficient since the design-life need not be the life of the watch, just the gap between service intervals.


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## rekmeyata

Wow, if I had known that I would have never bought that Tissot PR100. My watch has a view back, as I think all PR100's do, I don't see any plastic but it could be hidden, but I don't see a way of fine tuning it either, which I thought could be hidden from direct view without taking the back off, but I think like you said there is no way to fine tune it. That sucks. I doubt I will ever service this watch then, when it breaks just toss it. I've had that $150 Seiko 5 divers watch for 15 or so years and it's never gone in for service and it runs fine, nor will it go into service since the service would cost more than the watch is worth.

Does Seiko build their watches the same way with that weird regulation module? I assume that all Swatch auto watches have that same sort of regulation module?


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## percysmith

rekmeyata said:


> Does Seiko build their watches the same way with that weird regulation module?


No



rekmeyata said:


> I assume that all Swatch auto watches have that same sort of regulation module?


Swissmatic and Powermatic movements. If you go further upmarket such as Longines or Omega, or even Tissots with Valjoux based movements, there should not be any regulation module.


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## gear1box

rekmeyata said:


> Wow, if I had known that I would have never bought that Tissot PR100. My watch has a view back, as I think all PR100's do, I don't see any plastic but it could be hidden, but I don't see a way of fine tuning it either, which I thought could be hidden from direct view without taking the back off, but I think like you said there is no way to fine tune it.


A few thoughts:

You cannot easily see the polymer escapement wheel and lever through the back.
i have two Tissot powermatics and am reasonably happy with them; they both keep time under COSC and i like the 80hr PR.
However, i had to pay SwatchUSA $90 to regulate my Seastar to that level; it was about like yours -- losing roughly 10 s/d -- so within spec, but they regulated it well enough.
i plan to spend the $180 for a full SwatchUSA service on both watches at year six or seven. 
If the movements really bug you, they have a 2824 form-factor so a movement swap is very easy. I have had good luck with H&K's PT5000s in my Chinese watches and they are cheaper than Sellita's or ETAs.
In my experience the Powermatics are more resistant to magnetism that PT5000s however.
Good luck.

-- gary ray


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## rekmeyata

percysmith said:


> No
> 
> 
> 
> Swissmatic and Powermatic movements. If you go further upmarket such as Longines or Omega, or even Tissots with Valjoux based movements, there should not be any regulation module.


Here is an image of a 2021 Omega SpeedMaster Moonwatch Professional, I don't see a way of adjusting the accuracy but I'm not a pro watch maker maybe there is:









And this is a 2021 Constellation:










This is a Longines Master, it's a bit different looking, I can't tell on this either, this watch has 1 sub dial:








There was one pic of a Longines and they had what I know is a way of adjusting with a lever, it had 3 sub dials on it but they still called it a Master Collection.


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## percysmith

8900: I’m guessing it’s like my 8500 - your watchmaker will need a tool to adjust the weights on the balance wheel. My watchmaker didn’t have the tool to adjust Omega weights, he ordered one in for US$100 which I reimbursed him for, he did a decent enough job with the 8500 (as in he didn’t wipe out positional variation in my 2nd hand movement but otherwise made the 8500 relatively stable in rate (about +2-3 spd in every position but dial up).

3861: also weights

__
https://www.reddit.com/r/OmegaWatches/comments/tw3118

Longines: I see screws on the wheel, so I’m not sure if a watchmaker is supposed to used a jewellers screwdriver directly on those or is some tool similar to Omega supposed to be used.


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## rekmeyata

percysmith said:


> 8900: I’m guessing it’s like my 8500 - your watchmaker will need a tool to adjust the weights on the balance wheel. My watchmaker didn’t have the tool to adjust Omega weights, he ordered one in for US$100 which I reimbursed him for, he did a decent enough job with the 8500 (as in he didn’t wipe out positional variation in my 2nd hand movement but otherwise made the 8500 relatively stable in rate (about +2-3 spd in every position but dial up).
> 
> 3861: also weights
> 
> __
> https://www.reddit.com/r/OmegaWatches/comments/tw3118
> 
> Longines: I see screws on the wheel, so I’m not sure if a watchmaker is supposed to used a jewellers screwdriver directly on those or is some tool similar to Omega supposed to be used.


I didn't take the watch to a watchmaker, I sent it back to Tissot/Swatch all those times, I would think, and hope, they would have the proper tools.


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## sal4

I am very pleased with the accuracy of my Tissot Seastar 2000 Professional (T120.607.11.041.00). It is running about +0.5 SPD. 











Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


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## matlt

I bought a seastar 1000, powermatic 80 with the cheap plastic escapement co7.111 in it a couple weeks ago. The first couple days, it was about +3spd. The past couple days it’s settled down to something far less, and is less than 1 second per day. It’s been consistent enough that I can’t measure a change by eye. Worn for about 22 hours each day, so no positional variance to speak of. Continuing to monitor.


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## rekmeyata

matlt said:


> I bought a seastar 1000, powermatic 80 with the cheap plastic escapement co7.111 in it a couple weeks ago. The first couple days, it was about +3spd. The past couple days it’s settled down to something far less, and is less than 1 second per day. It’s been consistent enough that I can’t measure a change by eye. Worn for about 22 hours each day, so no positional variance to speak of. Continuing to monitor.


Plastic escapement? Is there a way you can take a picture of the escapement plastic part? I looked all over mine from the view back and I couldn't see anything made of plastic inside, but maybe I don't know what I'm looking for or at? thanks!


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## percysmith

rekmeyata said:


> Plastic escapement? Is there a way you can take a picture of the escapement plastic part? I looked all over mine from the view back and I couldn't see anything made of plastic inside, but maybe I don't know what I'm looking for or at? thanks!











Questions about ETA C07 (Powermatic 80, H-10, etc.)


I've seen a lot of talk about these new movements and there seems to be a lot of opinion going around. I'm not wanting to make this a rant thread. I'm just hoping to get some facts from experts to hopefully make us more educated and help us draw our own conclusions about these things. I also...




www.watchuseek.com


----------



## matlt

percysmith said:


> Questions about ETA C07 (Powermatic 80, H-10, etc.)
> 
> 
> I've seen a lot of talk about these new movements and there seems to be a lot of opinion going around. I'm not wanting to make this a rant thread. I'm just hoping to get some facts from experts to hopefully make us more educated and help us draw our own conclusions about these things. I also...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.watchuseek.com


Plastic is probably the wrong word. The escapement is some kind of synthetic material. 23 jewels vs 25 with a standard pallet fork. Under casual observation, I cant really tell the difference from my 2825-2 tissot. Hard to find exact details but I believe the pallet, escape wheel, and balance wheel are all made of this material, and are designed to be replaced as a complete module


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## rekmeyata

percysmith said:


> Questions about ETA C07 (Powermatic 80, H-10, etc.)
> 
> 
> I've seen a lot of talk about these new movements and there seems to be a lot of opinion going around. I'm not wanting to make this a rant thread. I'm just hoping to get some facts from experts to hopefully make us more educated and help us draw our own conclusions about these things. I also...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.watchuseek.com


I see the plastic


matlt said:


> Plastic is probably the wrong word. The escapement is some kind of synthetic material. 23 jewels vs 25 with a standard pallet fork. Under casual observation, I cant really tell the difference from my 2825-2 tissot. Hard to find exact details but I believe the pallet, escape wheel, and balance wheel are all made of this material, and are designed to be replaced as a complete module


Synthetic is just a fancy name for plastic, both are made out of similar materials, all of those types of materials can easily and cheaply be made by a 3D printer, then they probably take the original part made by the 3D printer and just stamp out thousands of those plastic parts for a penny each. 

My watch says it's a 23 jewel movement, so I took a magnifying glass to look at the movement parts through the back view, I could not find anything remotely plastic on the backside; all I see is parts made of steel or brass in color and shine, the only part that is a gray/black color is the rotor, I assume that has to be steel for the necessity of needing some weight to it so it can spin easily.


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## rekmeyata

I can't read the movement number even with a magnifier due to its location right above the balance wheel but too close to the edge of the case and covered by the steel part of the back. I did see a number that said V8 AU02. 

I have found a couple of websites, they both said there is a polymer escape and balance wheel, the reason for it, along with a nivachron hairspring, are said to be anti-magnetic to a factor of 10-20, and improves timekeeping accuracy no matter the temperature. While I can't see the plastic in mine, it probably does according to websites. My old Seastar from 1972 said anti magnetic, but it didn't have any plastic parts, and I don'tt know if nivachron was being used back then by Tissot, but I never had any issues with magnetic fields or cold or hot temps screwing with the time keeping.

I do know that one of the watches shown on the internet had the word SWISS where my V8 AU02 number is, not sure what the significance of that means if anything.


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## matlt

There are multiple variants of the powermatic 80. At a minimum, there’s the variant with the synthetic escapement in my seastar. This is a c07.111, 23 jewels. Another variant with a sililcium hair spring that I believe all have a standard metal and jeweled escapement. I imagine there's another version with a standard metal hair spring, and jeweled escapement. Then there are cosc certified versions


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## rekmeyata

matlt said:


> There are multiple variants of the powermatic 80. At a minimum, there’s the variant with the synthetic escapement in my seastar. This is a c07.111, 23 jewels. Another variant with a sililcium hair spring that I believe all have a standard metal and jeweled escapement. I imagine there's another version with a standard metal hair spring, and jeweled escapement. Then there are cosc certified versions


One of the sites I read said that the polymer parts are not serviceable or replaceable?! Thus, if they go bad the watch is junk...except if you send the watch to Tissot to be fixed and they can't fix it, they will put you on their watch replacement exchange for around $240 (today's dollars) or so for the same type of watch. That is why I probably won't ever service the watch like I did with the old 72 Seastar that I only serviced twice since 72. I wouldn't think there would be a lot of wear stress on those plastic parts, but it still is a source of concern in my mind.


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## matlt

Tissot will service them. Depending on necessity, I imagine only the escapement can be replaced easily. Afaik, with these low grade 2824's, it's more economical to just swap the whole movement


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## gear1box

rekmeyata said:


> One of the sites I read said that the polymer parts are not serviceable or replaceable?!


At least for Tissots in the US, this is mis-leading. I have two Powermatic 80s (Seastar 1000 and Chemin COSC) and have dealt with SwatchUSA regarding my Seastar. In the process of that service i asked the watchmaker about this issue. The short story is that the Powermatic is designed with a "regulating module" that is removed and replaced when there is an issue with the balance wheel, pivots, hairspring or escapement parts. Essentially if you send your Tissot in for a $190 "full service" every five years (or whenever) they will swap this module out if/when the parts are worn.

Honestly i cannot complain about that; the price for a full service is extraordinarily reasonable these days i would say and swapping out the module is fine with me. You may feel differently.

-- gary ray


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## percysmith

matlt said:


> There are multiple variants of the powermatic 80. At a minimum, there’s the variant with the synthetic escapement in my seastar. This is a c07.111, 23 jewels. Another variant with a sililcium hair spring that I believe all have a standard metal and jeweled escapement. I imagine there's another version with a standard metal hair spring, and jeweled escapement. Then there are cosc certified versions


Rekmeyata said Powermatic 80, which was my original Tissot until I replaced the movement with 2824-2 and subsequently sold it. I remember there was a Chronometer version of that, but cannot remember a silicium version.



rekmeyata said:


> Two years ago I purchased a Tissot PR100 Powermatic 80 and the accura cy is not good, it loses 5 minutes a month, my first Tissot was a 1972 Seastar that watch gained 30 seconds a month, but that was before Swatch took over and ruined the Tissot brand image.


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## rekmeyata

gear1box said:


> At least for Tissots in the US, this is mis-leading. I have two Powermatic 80s (Seastar 1000 and Chemin COSC) and have dealt with SwatchUSA regarding my Seastar. In the process of that service i asked the watchmaker about this issue. The short story is that the Powermatic is designed with a "regulating module" that is removed and replaced when there is an issue with the balance wheel, pivots, hairspring or escapement parts. Essentially if you send your Tissot in for a $190 "full service" every five years (or whenever) they will swap this module out if/when the parts are worn.
> 
> Honestly i cannot complain about that; the price for a full service is extraordinarily reasonable these days i would say and swapping out the module is fine with me. You may feel differently.
> 
> -- gary ray


Now that I own the watch, replacing the module is going to have to fine with me, but I don't plan on servicing it. My brother had his watch serviced and they screwed it up, kept taking it back and they would screw it up some more, then they claimed they didn't screw it up; I've known others that had the same issue. So, when it stops someday then I will send it in. At least the price of $190 isn't as bad as Rolex at between $800 to $1,200! The more expensive the watch the more the service cost which I think is a scam since it doesn't take that much more or any more effort or knowledge to service a Tissot as a Rolex; but if you can afford a Rolex or better then you can afford the price of the service.


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## percysmith

I wonder if the new Valjoux 7750 is also regulation module In-Depth - How Tissot Has Drastically Improved the Valjoux 7750?


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## matlt

rekmeyata said:


> Now that I own the watch, replacing the module is going to have to fine with me, but I don't plan on servicing it. My brother had his watch serviced and they screwed it up, kept taking it back and they would screw it up some more, then they claimed they didn't screw it up; I've known others that had the same issue. So, when it stops someday then I will send it in. At least the price of $190 isn't as bad as Rolex at between $800 to $1,200! The more expensive the watch the more the service cost which I think is a scam since it doesn't take that much more or any more effort or knowledge to service a Tissot as a Rolex; but if you can afford a Rolex or better then you can afford the price of the service.


It certainly takes more effort. And takes at least some extra knowledge. This goes with any luxury goods. If you aren't demanding and in return experiencing a higher level and quality of service when you send in an Omega than you would when sending in a Tissot, you should be complaining about it to the service centers.

The same applies to cars. You should be expecting considerably better attention to detail, ability, and knowledge from a Porsche mechanic than from a VW mechanic.


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## percysmith

matlt said:


> It certainly takes more effort. And takes at least some extra knowledge. This goes with any luxury goods. If you aren't demanding and in return experiencing a higher level and quality of service when you send in an Omega than you would when sending in a Tissot, you should be complaining about it to the service centers.
> 
> The same applies to cars. You should be expecting considerably better attention to detail, ability, and knowledge from a Porsche mechanic than from a VW mechanic.


The more apropos analogy is iPhone 6/6S to iPhone 13. The former can be argurably third party serviced, the latter virtually impossible.


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## gear1box

percysmith said:


> I wonder if the new Valjoux 7750 is also regulation module In-Depth - How Tissot Has Drastically Improved the Valjoux 7750?


Percy --

From both the photo and the discussion the new 7750/A05 does seem to have the same technology balance wheel (i.e., free sprung balance wheel with no regulator and only one axis of balance weight adjustment). That doesn't necessarily mean they have gone to the a regulator module architecture however.

The great 20th century watchsmith George Daniels argued strongly in his treatise on movements for the theoretical advantages of free sprung designs -- and certainly Rolex agrees -- but i cannot say that, after three years of Powermatic ownership, that the design has compelling consumer benefits. My two Powermatics run well enough, particularly the COSC variant. 

Still the COSC Powermatic doesn't exceed the time keeping out-of-the-box accuracy on-wrist of some of my two PT5000 Chinese-sourced 2824 clones. Yes they do not have 80hr PR, and i will concede that they are likely not as anti-magnetic i suppose. Hah! For those Chinese movements -- available for $75 from eBay -- i suppose that a movement swap is the overhaul strategy, probably for even less than $190 (but shipped back to Hong Kong).

-- gary ray


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## percysmith

gear1box said:


> The great 20th century watchsmith George Daniels argued strongly in his treatise on movements for the theoretical advantages of free sprung designs -- and certainly Rolex agrees -- but i cannot say that, after three years of Powermatic ownership, that the design has compelling consumer benefits. My two Powermatics run well enough, particularly the COSC variant.
> 
> Still the COSC Powermatic doesn't exceed the time keeping out-of-the-box accuracy on-wrist of some of my two PT5000 Chinese-sourced 2824 clones. Yes they do not have 80hr PR, and i will concede that they are likely not as anti-magnetic i suppose. Hah! For those Chinese movements -- available for $75 from eBay -- i suppose that a movement swap is the overhaul strategy, probably for even less than $190 (but shipped back to Hong Kong).


A more extreme example - a second hand 8500 I have, which I acquired about two years old, is outperformed by a ETA 2893-2 Elabore I acquired new.

Both watches were regulated on receipt.
The 8500 can do no better than -2 to +4 spd
The 2893 is keeping -1 to +1 spd.


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## aribus

I received a PRX for Father’s Day and it’s -4 a day.


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## froze93309

aribus said:


> I received a PRX for Father’s Day and it’s -4 a day.


 Not sure what the hell Tissot/Swatch is doing to the Tissot brand, but this isn't good. Now you're going to have to deal with the warranty department as I had to, and it was a pain, it took them 6 tries to finally get it somewhat accurate, at least it's within their guaranteed time keeping window now, but it took sending it to them 6 freaking times to bring it to -2 a month, which is better than what the time keeping window guarantee is. My Tissot is the PR100 Powermatic 80. I thought mine was perhaps a fluke, but now after reading your report it may not be a fluke. Even my $250 Seiko keeps better time than my Tissot! As far as I'm concerned, I doubt I will ever buy another Swatch branded watch; no wonder a local jewelry store in town no longer carries Tissot or Hamilton.


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## percysmith

aribus said:


> I received a PRX for Father’s Day and it’s -4 a day.





froze93309 said:


> Not sure what the hell Tissot/Swatch is doing to the Tissot brand, but this isn't good. Now you're going to have to deal with the warranty department as I had to, and it was a pain, it took them 6 tries to finally get it somewhat accurate, at least it's within their guaranteed time keeping window now, but it took sending it to them 6 freaking times to bring it to -2 a month, which is better than what the time keeping window guarantee is. My Tissot is the PR100 Powermatic 80. I thought mine was perhaps a fluke, but now after reading your report it may not be a fluke. Even my $250 Seiko keeps better time than my Tissot! As far as I'm concerned, I doubt I will ever buy another Swatch branded watch; no wonder a local jewelry store in town no longer carries Tissot or Hamilton.


I'm going to assume aribus meant he has a PRX Powermatic 80 or Valjoux 7750 that's running -4 seconds a day. @aribus please correct me if incorrect.

In that case what warranty claim does airbus have? Argurably, that's COSC. If aribus has the Powermatic 80 version, the only downside is aribus cannot regulate it himself (e.g., to positive variance).

And people were already saying my -3 to +3 spd on my new Seiko 5 GMT was already a pretty good outcome









Seiko 5 gmt (ssk)


What's everyone's 4R34 running like? Really wanna pull the trigger, but have seen a few horror stories, and the stated tolerances are preeeeeeeeeeetty wide on this one. -3 to +3spd so far. Average SPD anyway. 4R34 this week: 4R36 in my SPRD67:




www.watchuseek.com


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## froze93309

percysmith said:


> I'm going to assume aribus meant he has a PRX Powermatic 80 or Valjoux 7750 that's running -4 seconds a day. @aribus please correct me if incorrect.
> 
> In that case what warranty claim does airbus have? Argurably, that's COSC. If aribus has the Powermatic 80 version, the only downside is aribus cannot regulate it himself (e.g., to positive variance).
> 
> And people were already saying my -3 to +3 spd on my new Seiko 5 GMT was already a pretty good outcome
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Seiko 5 gmt (ssk)
> 
> 
> What's everyone's 4R34 running like? Really wanna pull the trigger, but have seen a few horror stories, and the stated tolerances are preeeeeeeeeeetty wide on this one. -3 to +3spd so far. Average SPD anyway. 4R34 this week: 4R36 in my SPRD67:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.watchuseek.com


If you're correct and he meant 4 seconds a day, that's about where mine is now after 6 attempts to get to run half way decent. My old 1972 Tissot Seastar ran between 20 and 30 seconds a MONTH, on the fast side. I wish that old one could have been repaired, that sucked.


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## percysmith

froze93309 said:


> If you're correct and he meant 4 seconds a day, that's about where mine is now after 6 attempts to get to run half way decent.


I couldn't get a satisfactory repair to my Powermatic. I eventually replaced the movement with a ETA 2824 Questions about ETA C07 (Powermatic 80, H-10, etc.)



froze93309 said:


> My old 1972 Tissot Seastar ran between 20 and 30 seconds a MONTH, on the fast side. I wish that old one could have been repaired, that sucked.


My Powermatic 80 is also a replacement for a P653 that Swatch HK refused to service.


----------



## froze93309

percysmith said:


> I couldn't get a satisfactory repair to my Powermatic. I eventually replaced the movement with a ETA 2824 Questions about ETA C07 (Powermatic 80, H-10, etc.)
> 
> 
> 
> My Powermatic 80 is also a replacement for a P653 that Swatch HK refused to service.


Gees, that's crazy you had to replace the movement with a Calvin Klien movement of all things. I had the old Seastar looked at by 2 different watchmakers, and neither said they could fix it, one where I live, and one who was in Chicago, the Chicago guy said to send it to Tissot, if they can't fix it, they would replace it. Neither of those two watchmakers ever said anything about replacing the old movement with something newer. I did ask both of them if a newer Tissot movement could be substituted into my old watch, and they both said no.

I really don't want to replace the Tissot movement with a Calvin Klien movement, but I can certainly understand the frustration that would lead a person to do that!

After reading your site you gave, maybe, I'll repeat that, MAYBE, someday I'll find a watchmaker when I get it serviced who understands how to adjust it, and then just tell him to take his time and get it exact as possible. But right now, I'm not going to bother with it. My thoughts on this watch right now is that it's a piece of junk, so why spend $150 or more to have it even serviced? So I may never get it serviced the rest of my life or it, whichever comes first.

Needless to say, I wish Tissot never sold out to Swatch, Swatch has ruined a fabled brand of watches. In the future, I will never buy another Swatch company brand of watch.


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## percysmith

I’m not sure the 1972 Tissot Seastar can be replaced by any current movement as a drop-in.

I just know the Powermatic 80 can be replaced by an ETA 2824 (and now that I know more, this means it can be replaced by a SW200 or a PT5000).

Buying a Calvin Klein was a beginner’s cheap way of sourcing a ETA 2824.


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## gear1box

percysmith said:


> I’m not sure the 1972 Tissot Seastar can be replaced by any current movement as a drop-in.
> 
> I just know the Powermatic 80 can be replaced by an ETA 2824 (and now that I know more, this means it can be replaced by a SW200 or a PT5000).
> 
> Buying a Calvin Klein was a beginner’s cheap way of sourcing a ETA 2824.


One of the beneficial trends of the, shall i say, "consumer grade" mechanical watch market (say < $2k) is the emergence of the ETA 2824 "form factor" as a reasonably broad-based market standard. I suppose starting Sellita and the 2824 clone movements (which is asserted to have at least a half dozen scale production players) but now encompassing movements like Powermatic/C07s, a remarkably broad family of watch cases all use what are close to "drop-in" replacement movements. I've found, for example, that the Hong Kong PT5000 or the Sea-Gull ST2130 movements are quality movements -- i can attest that they work well in my personal watches -- and can be had at prices under $70. Dropped into any of the 2824-compatible cases (in theory at least) should work well but i have not seen it reported that it works in practice. 

Now . . . that doesn't mean that the swapping one of those movements for, say, a Powermatic/C07 is without consequences even if the swap goes smoothly. Obviously you would not get the 80 PR; i'd expect that they wouldn't be as anti-magnetic too. On the other hand, praise be!, these movements can be consumer regulated (which the Powermatic cannot). Accuracy seems competitive. Swatch USA charges $180 plus shipping to overhaul a Tissot Powermatic; depending on your local watchmaker you might be able to replace the movement for less.

I do not have experience doing so and thus cannot make a recommendation. However i am saying that the rise of the 2824 form-factor has potentially large consumer implications.

-- gary


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## aribus

percysmith said:


> I'm going to assume aribus meant he has a PRX Powermatic 80 or Valjoux 7750 that's running -4 seconds a day. @aribus please correct me if incorrect.
> 
> In that case what warranty claim does airbus have? Argurably, that's COSC. If aribus has the Powermatic 80 version, the only downside is aribus cannot regulate it himself (e.g., to positive variance).
> 
> And people were already saying my -3 to +3 spd on my new Seiko 5 GMT was already a pretty good outcome
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Seiko 5 gmt (ssk)
> 
> 
> What's everyone's 4R34 running like? Really wanna pull the trigger, but have seen a few horror stories, and the stated tolerances are preeeeeeeeeeetty wide on this one. -3 to +3spd so far. Average SPD anyway. 4R34 this week: 4R36 in my SPRD67:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.watchuseek.com


You are correct. I have a PRX automatic with a Powermatic 80 that loses 4 seconds a day, which in my mind is not bad. There’s no COSC certification with this watch, yet it’s within COSC standards as I understand it. I’d prefer that it run fast so that I can hack it for a moment and let time catch up, but as it is I have no complaints.

I have a Hamilton Intra-matic and a Tissot Visodate that keeps less accurate time, so I’m not complaining. If I wanted superb accuracy, I’d wear one of my multiband G-Shocks.


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