# Ball Trainmaster Cannonball - Still worth the money?



## Steve1762 (Apr 9, 2018)

Hi everyone, just signed up after reading *a lot* of posts from everyone, great to see such a vibrant and keen community!

I'm in the process of buying my first ever $$$$ watch and the Ball Trainmaster Cannonball has caught my eye. I was keen to hear from people who own, or have owned one, on what their experience with it is like and whether I should have any concerns about purchasing one. I've found it for £2,200 ($3,112) - would people consider that a good price for it?

It seems to have been released quite a while ago now so not sure if that is a factor I should consider with my first watch purchase!

Look forward to hearing your responses!


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## Steve1762 (Apr 9, 2018)

This is the watch if that helps!


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## WSN7 (Sep 20, 2017)

I can't tell you exactly what a good price for it would be, but if it's any consolation; that watch is beautiful and awesome.


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## terexac350 (Aug 13, 2017)

Steve1762 said:


> Hi everyone, just signed up after reading *a lot* of posts from everyone, great to see such a vibrant and keen community!
> 
> I'm in the process of buying my first ever $$$$ watch and the Ball Trainmaster Cannonball has caught my eye. I was keen to hear from people who own, or have owned one, on what their experience with it is like and whether I should have any concerns about purchasing one. I've found it for £2,200 ($3,112) - would people consider that a good price for it?
> 
> ...


In a word, NO, £2,200 for this watch is crazy. Just saw a new one for £1,200 on eBay and that's too much. Ball are a bit of an enigma, they don't even own their trademark and as others have pointed out in the past they seem to be moving to an online only sales model and it was mentioned on this forum they are losing UK dealerships, they also have a very low relative used value. If you really want one, find a cheap used one and don't pay more than £800, or for £2,200 get Good used Breitling, Omega or Tudor.

Sent from my ALP-L29 using Tapatalk


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## gossler (Mar 19, 2009)

Buying used is always cheaper. But sometimes I dont care for used, I want brand new. 

I personally like that watch a lot, but for one reason or another with my modest budget, I have gone in another direction every time I ponder on buying it. 

Ball watches are good watches, in regards to quality and finish, they are extremely well made, I rate them very high, comparable to Breitling, TAG and the likes. They offer original designe too. 

Resale is Something Im not familiar with, as I don’t flip watches. 

Ball aftermarket servicie is ok. Nothing great, but not bad at all. I have dealt with Ball Switzerland and Ball USA. 

If you like this watch, buy it! Do a good search online to find the best deal for you. 

Good luck!


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## Karkarov (Feb 22, 2016)

So a "good price" for this watch brand new in box would be 1500 USD. Even up to 2k USD I could say is "tolerable" if only barely, and you better REALLY want the watch. Over 2k USD? No dice, too much money. It is an awesome watch, wish I had one, but this is not an in-house movement, there is no flyback chrono in there, etc etc.

Used you should be looking for 900-1200 or so USD, or lower if the watch is in bad shape.


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## gossler (Mar 19, 2009)

I am really missing the My offer sales... And now regret I did not buy more watches from them last year. I have my fingers crossed hoping they will come back.


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## surfuz (Jul 2, 2017)

gossler said:


> I am really missing the My offer sales... And now regret I did not buy more watches from them last year. I have my fingers crossed hoping they will come back.


I miss it too. Bought several.. But missed out the moon phase.

Wanted the cannonball too, but bidded too low. Am ambivalent about the outcome as wanted it, but I already have too many Balls for my wrist. Gave away the Nightbreaker recently.

So let it be written. So let it be done.


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## gossler (Mar 19, 2009)

Surfuz, I have too many watches for my wrist too... Lol! The only real benefit is I never grow tired of a watch, as it takes me more than a couple of weeks to wear again the same watch. Im always excited, and looking forward to the next week so I can wear a different watch. Latly however I kind of have been cheating, and skip through some, and gravitate back to two watches, BALL, Storm chaser Pro, and Ball & BMW Chronograph. 

How do you like your Ball & BMW Chronograph?


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## surfuz (Jul 2, 2017)

gossler said:


> Surfuz, I have too many watches for my wrist too... Lol! The only real benefit is I never grow tired of a watch, as it takes me more than a couple of weeks to wear again the same watch. Im always excited, and looking forward to the next week so I can wear a different watch. Latly however I kind of have been cheating, and skip through some, and gravitate back to two watches, BALL, Storm chaser Pro, and Ball & BMW Chronograph.
> 
> How do you like your Ball & BMW Chronograph?


Hehe.. Aren't we all 

I don't have the BMW. Have been lazy recently, only wearing those with bracelet or deployant clasp.

Recent wears are 60 Seconds, Aerogmt 2 and Airborne 2. Storm Chaser Glow still untouched.

Am hoping they launch a Trainmaster next. Too many sports models in preorders. Looking out for a moonphase or worldtime, hopefully with new in house movement and higher power reserve.

Am expecting Challenger M, mine is the grey dial #1 

So let it be written. So let it be done.


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## surfuz (Jul 2, 2017)

Btw, in response to the OP, if thi is first watch u want to spend serious $ on, and u want it new, then go for it!

It's really nice. I don't have this model, but something similar in the 60 seconds. 

So let it be written. So let it be done.


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## terexac350 (Aug 13, 2017)

If you decide to buy this watch make sure it's for keeps because if you try to sell it privately you will struggle to get anywhere near what you think it's worth and as 99.99% of the UK will never have heard of Ball probably no jeweller will take it in part-ex for something else either. So think hard before you spend $3,100 on a Ball watch. 

Sent from my ALP-L29 using Tapatalk


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## lovedeep (Jul 24, 2017)

I personally think cannonball is beautiful. But, you might want to consider it buying from a WUS member (they do come up occasionally) and save about 50-60% of your money.


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## timefleas (Oct 10, 2008)

terexac350 said:


> In a word, NO, £2,200 for this watch is crazy. Just saw a new one for £1,200 on eBay and that's too much. Ball are a bit of an enigma, they don't even own their trademark and as others have pointed out in the past they seem to be moving to an online only sales model and it was mentioned on this forum they are losing UK dealerships, they also have a very low relative used value. If you really want one, find a cheap used one and don't pay more than £800, or for £2,200 get Good used Breitling, Omega or Tudor.
> 
> Sent from my ALP-L29 using Tapatalk


Both wrong information, and poor advice. First, this is a Ball sponsored forum, and as stated in the guidelines, prices are not subject to discussion though recently they have been lax in monitoring this. The Cannonball is one of Ball's best long term seller's and is certainly worth much more than suggested above, though I would not pay the retail suggested by the OP. Nor would I consider chrono watches in the same retail price bracket by Breitling, Omega or a Tudor as better alternatives to the Cannonball--to match Cannonball's quality, you would have to pay significantly more for a watch from one of those brands--in terms of actual bang for the buck it is one of the best there is at that price level--the Cannonball is one classy watch, and matches up well against many similarly equipped watches by many manufacturers. Ball is sold worldwide, and what happens in one country does not necessarily reflect entirely on the product, and its sales, as a whole.


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## terexac350 (Aug 13, 2017)

timefleas said:


> Both wrong information, and poor advice. First, this is a Ball sponsored forum, and as stated in the guidelines, prices are not subject to discussion though recently they have been lax in monitoring this. The Cannonball is one of Ball's best long term seller's and is certainly worth much more than suggested above, though I would not pay the retail suggested by the OP. Nor would I consider chrono watches in the same retail price bracket by Breitling, Omega or a Tudor as better alternatives to the Cannonball--to match Cannonball's quality, you would have to pay significantly more for a watch from one of those brands--in terms of actual bang for the buck it is one of the best there is at that price level--the Cannonball is one classy watch, and matches up well against many similarly equipped watches by many manufacturers. Ball is sold worldwide, and what happens in one country does not necessarily reflect entirely on the product, and its sales, as a whole.


You appear to believe that you are some kind of Ball guru, this is not a Ball sponsored forum, it's a dealer sponsored forum and as such not balanced, as seen when a long thread revealing the ball organisation was removed, you have no idea what amount of watches ball sells, the Chinese owners don't reveal sales figures but the cheap quartz "railroader" that is selling in the Chinese market may well be their best seller based on population. Just by monitoring the web it's easy to get a value level, a new one on eBay is "$1,699 or best offer" and all the ones priced higher are perpetually for sale used ones for considerably less . And bang for buck at over $3,000 it's a valjoux movement with a Ball engraved rotor nothing more they don't modify anything regardless of what they say, I opened a spacemaster a long time ago and just a standard ETA cosc inside and a ball engraved rotor. Better than a speedmaster I don't think so.

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## gossler (Mar 19, 2009)

to me, Its not all abut the movement...While it is important, I value the overall design of the watch much higher than the movement, history, and popularity. The BALL Cannonball Chronograph is a beautiful watch, with a good movement inside.

While I agree that prices on Ebay are a good reference, they do not dictate the price of any watch.



terexac350 said:


> You appear to believe that you are some kind of Ball guru, this is not a Ball sponsored forum, it's a dealer sponsored forum and as such not balanced, as seen when a long thread revealing the ball organisation was removed, you have no idea what amount of watches ball sells, the Chinese owners don't reveal sales figures but the cheap quartz "railroader" that is selling in the Chinese market may well be their best seller based on population. Just by monitoring the web it's easy to get a value level, a new one on eBay is "$1,699 or best offer" and all the ones priced higher are perpetually for sale used ones for considerably less . And bang for buck at over $3,000 it's a valjoux movement with a Ball engraved rotor nothing more they don't modify anything regardless of what they say, I opened a spacemaster a long time ago and just a standard ETA cosc inside and a ball engraved rotor. Better than a speedmaster I don't think so.
> 
> Sent from my ALP-L29 using Tapatalk


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## terexac350 (Aug 13, 2017)

gossler said:


> to me, Its not all abut the movement...While it is important, I value the overall design of the watch much higher than the movement, history, and popularity. The BALL Cannonball Chronograph is a beautiful watch, with a good movement inside.
> 
> While I agree that prices on Ebay are a good reference, they do not dictate the price of any watch.


My original post was to stop the OP paying way over the odds for a watch that could be purchased new for almost half of the price he had been quoted, I don't appreciate some self appointed retail expert to tell me I have given him the wrong advice as the previous poster did.

Sent from my ALP-L29 using Tapatalk


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## gossler (Mar 19, 2009)

I understand your point, perhaps you came a little to strongly. All we can do here is, give our best opinion, and recommend people what to do. At the end of the day, they choose what ever path they prefer.

I personally rarely buy from ADs as I usually find way better deals elsewhere. Be that Ebay, Jomashop, Ball My Offer, etc.

Another thing to consider is import duties, EU has 19% VAT.. so $1700 US + shipping+ 19% Vat, might not be as attractive as 2,200 out the door in town.


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## bracky72 (Jun 30, 2013)

That price is way to high. People were buying this same watch for less then half that new. To pay over double what’s its worth would be flat out ignorant.


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## john.6 (May 28, 2014)

gossler said:


> I understand your point, perhaps you came a little to strongly. All we can do here is, give our best opinion, and recommend people what to do. At the end of the day, they choose what ever path they prefer.
> 
> I personally rarely buy from ADs as I usually find way better deals elsewhere. Be that Ebay, Jomashop, Ball My Offer, etc.
> 
> Another thing to consider is import duties, EU has 19% VAT.. so $1700 US + shipping+ 19% Vat, might not be as attractive as 2,200 out the door in town.


The 2,200 out of the door was in UK Pounds, multiply that by 1.42 to get $3,100 and vat is only usually caught on DHL or UPS shipments so a big difference


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## timefleas (Oct 10, 2008)

terexac350 said:


> You appear to believe that you are some kind of Ball guru, this is not a Ball sponsored forum, it's a dealer sponsored forum and as such not balanced, as seen when a long thread revealing the ball organisation was removed, you have no idea what amount of watches ball sells, the Chinese owners don't reveal sales figures but the cheap quartz "railroader" that is selling in the Chinese market may well be their best seller based on population. Just by monitoring the web it's easy to get a value level, a new one on eBay is "$1,699 or best offer" and all the ones priced higher are perpetually for sale used ones for considerably less . And bang for buck at over $3,000 it's a valjoux movement with a Ball engraved rotor nothing more they don't modify anything regardless of what they say, I opened a spacemaster a long time ago and just a standard ETA cosc inside and a ball engraved rotor. Better than a speedmaster I don't think so.
> 
> Sent from my ALP-L29 using Tapatalk


I stand corrected--you are quite right that it is through the good graces of Rob Caplan and his brother, in association with Topper Jewelers, that we are lucky enough to have a sponsored forum dedicated to Ball watches. In the past this support has resulted in many excellent reviews on new watches by Rob, in various contests sponsored and supported by Topper, and often in direct links to some of the main players in the Ball organization, such as Mr. Jeff Hess.

However, regarding the actual point of the thread, you mix heresy with known facts, old with new, MSRP with gray market retail, Ebay with Ball Online auctions, conjecture in lieu of evidence, etc., and by doing so, you missed most if not all of the main points. To make it simple, we were discussing buying a new Cannonball, and as I mentioned, I would not buy it at its MSRP as it can be had significantly lower, even through ADs, but it is still a very worthwhile purchase, but also where a new Cannonball will NOT cost anywhere close to a NEW Speedmaster--even at full MSRP. Finally, I won't dignify your remarks against my person or character, as that too is against the forum guidelines--"ad hominem" arguments are just about never really unnecessary (anywhere) and simply serve to undermine the veracity and integrity of the discussion.


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## john.6 (May 28, 2014)

timefleas said:


> I stand corrected--you are quite right that it is through the good graces of Rob Caplan and his brother, in association with Topper Jewelers, that we are lucky enough to have a sponsored forum dedicated to Ball watches. In the past this support has resulted in many excellent reviews on new watches by Rob, in various contests sponsored and supported by Topper, and often in direct links to some of the main players in the Ball organization, such as Mr. Jeff Hess.
> 
> However, regarding the actual point of the thread, you mix heresy with known facts, old with new, MSRP with gray market retail, Ebay with Ball Online auctions, conjecture in lieu of evidence, etc., and by doing so, you missed most if not all of the main points. To make it simple, we were discussing buying a new Cannonball, and as I mentioned, I would not buy it at its MSRP as it can be had significantly lower, even through ADs, but it is still a very worthwhile purchase, but also where a new Cannonball will NOT cost anywhere close to a NEW Speedmaster--even at full MSRP. Finally, I won't dignify your remarks against my person or character, as that too is against the forum guidelines--"ad hominem" arguments are just about never really unnecessary (anywhere) and simply serve to undermine the veracity and integrity of the discussion.


Lets not let the facts get in the way:

Both below are official AD

Only £190 difference so not much at all, of course the Ball MSRP is a massive fairy tale (but the OP obviously didn't know this and could have spent much more money than was necessary) , and if desired the future resale of the speedmaster will be much much easier with a much much higher return.

https://www.goldsmiths.co.uk/Omega-Speedmaster-Racing-Mens-40mm-Automatic-Co+Axial-Watch/p/17331060/

https://www.jurawatches.co.uk/colle...ompany-cannonball-watch-cm1052d-l3j-wh-bl-130

If the OP is following this thread, do a little bit of research before you part with your money and if you still want the Cannonball then goodluck.


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## Steve1762 (Apr 9, 2018)

Thank you to everyone for your comments and advice - it's been really useful to hear everyone's opinions on this.

Whilst I wasn't buying the watch for it's potential resell value (it's a wedding gift from my partner to me), after hearing some of the advice I decided that the Ball Trainmaster probably wasn't worth the amount it's being sold at.

I then stumbled across a Baume et Mercier Capeland Flyback which I absolutely loved the face of but unfortunately they were discontinued and I could not find a seller in the UK. The price was also rather high so without being able to see it I decided against purchasing it from abroad. The very next day I found a ridiculously similar Sekonda quartz for about £3,000 cheaper (£40!)... so I purchased that as a 'everyday/occasions where it might get broken' watch and whilst it isn't as nice as the Flyback, it's not bad for the price!

After a lot more research I finally decided on a watch, the Longine Master Collection Moon Phase (L2.673.4.78.3). I think it's got a great face and the blue hands look great. Only downside is the date hand is a bit distracting but no doubt will get used to it!

Images of the watches mentioned.

Baume et Mercier Capeland Flyback








Sekonda








Longine Master Collection Moon Phase


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## indejaus (May 4, 2011)

buy one. you won't regret it. 

my personal experience is that i love the watch so much that i had version series I in black dial, which i will sell, and have purchased series II in grey dial, so see how much i love this watch. regards.


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