# Laco Buhr - nothing but problems



## rice (Jul 16, 2010)

Snapped up one of the 55mm Laco Buhrs last year. Fantastic looking for a sub 1,000 euro watch. Very happy with it, for about 4 months until the winding mechanism stopped working. Have owned many winders over the years and was surprised by the quick failure. Still; everyone gets a lemon from time to time. 

Got the repair address in Germany and shipped it off to them via Fedex. Only insured it for $100 euro, three weeks later they ship it back, but of course neglect to note on the customs forms that it's a 'repair' job and they put the value at 500 euro. Now my customs here want the equivalent of 240 euro because they believe it's a new watch...

Ya know - it's just not worth it, I'm going to let it rot in customs and they can dispose of it... Why throw good money behind bad... If the winding mechanism fails so quickly - what's the point in spending another 1/4 of the price to try it again (on top of the $60 Fedex shipping)... If Laco can't even ship the watch properly... 

Totally disappointed with the brand. Will stick with my Panerai, Rolex and Uboats.

Not trying to be a snob, but I was a bit hesitant to buy this watch - I've found all too often that you get what you pay for. I would have gladly paid 5x more if I could have gotten a quality timepiece. Instead, indeed - I got EXACTLY what I paid for; unsound watch and bad customer service.


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## rooney (Aug 12, 2011)

I don't think you got bad customer service. Laco probably put the value on 500€ so if something happened to the watch YOU would get 500€ back. If they had only insured it for $100 and it was lost on the mail, I'm pretty sure you would have been really mad. 

I don't know where you live, but I'm pretty sure that if you get Laco to write a letter/confirmation that the watch was in for a repair, you wont have to pay the customs fee.


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## Myron (Dec 27, 2009)

What country on earth charges a 50% duty? That sounds crazy.

I have to agree with rooney, if they had underinsured it and it had been lost, you'd be bummed that you only got a fraction of the value back. I suggest you contact Laco and see if they can straighten out the customs hold up. I had a bad Oris one time and the watch got stuck in Australian customs when I returned it to the dealer (I live in the US). The dealer was happy to take charge of the situation, sent me the correct form and assisted in getting it to the right person. The watch was released with no harm or foul.

I wish you good luck, but I think you're falsely blaming Laco in this situation.

Myron


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## Uwe W. (Jan 7, 2009)

rice said:


> Will stick with my Panerai, Rolex and Uboats. Not trying to be a snob, but I was a bit hesitant to buy this watch - I've found all too often that you get what you pay for. I would have gladly paid 5x more if I could have gotten a quality timepiece. Instead, indeed - I got EXACTLY what I paid for; unsound watch and bad customer service.


Let me get this straight. The "winding" mechanism breaks, Laco fixes the watch, and now it's hung up in customs. I'll gladly take your 55 off your hands if you don't want it.

The mechanism, incidentally, is part of an outsourced part - one that comes from ETA (don't they also supply movements to Panerai and U-boat?). So the broken part is an issue with something that ETA manufactured, not Laco. As for the shipping screw up, they happen. Seems to me that your assessment of Laco was overly harsh, but good luck with your regular brands, I hear they never break.


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## kevral (May 10, 2011)

I had the exact same problem with return shipping after a warranty repair. In spite of me asking very nicely, twice, including right before shipping, they just couldn't get the customs form right.

If I hadn't been paranoid and called FedEx (after FedEx received the shipping papers but before they customs declared it on my behalf), I would have had to pay 25 % customs + 30 EUR handling fee a second time. Of course, I could have then applied to Customs for a refund, but from experience that takes roughly 2 hours of procuring and filling out paperwork and a 6 week wait (assuming all paperwork is correct the first time, if not add 2 more hours and 6 more weeks).

Luckily FedEx, having my export declaration on file, more or less took my word for it that this was the same watch being returned and declared it as "warranty repair re-import" with no additional taxes.

Incidentally, what went wrong with my special edition 45 mm sounds suspiciously like Rice's problem. And also incidentally, Laco also stuck me with paying return FedEx for what they admitted was a warranty issue, at a nice 90 EUR.


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## brainless (Jan 3, 2008)

> And also incidentally, Laco also stuck me with paying return FedEx for what they admitted was a warranty issue, at a nice 90 EUR.


That is not according with German or European consumer's rights. They have to pay for shipping to the company *and* for sending back to the customer.
I would ask them for paying the cost,

Volker ;-)


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## Uwe W. (Jan 7, 2009)

kevral said:


> Laco also stuck me with paying return FedEx for what they admitted was a warranty issue, at a nice 90 EUR.


First off, where do you live? And are you saying that Laco charged you 90 EUR just to ship your watch back?


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## kevral (May 10, 2011)

brainless said:


> That is not according with German or European consumer's rights. They have to pay for shipping to the company *and* for sending back to the customer.
> I would ask them for paying the cost,
> 
> Volker ;-)


Oh joy.
Before I sent it in return I first asked them for their FedEx number, so it could be returned on their account. If I remember the timeline correctly I did this during business hours on day 1 (after several emails back and forth the same day) and when they had not responded by close of business on day 2 I sent it myself, paying FedEx 90 EUR.

I then asked for a refund once, got ignored, asked again, got told they couldn't offer refunds and was offered a closed pilot's strap instead. This strap sells for 50 EUR, which makes it bad enough compensation as is, but as a hobbyist leatherworker it is my hobbyist's opinion that the strap is worth maybe half that when compared to for example a Fluco closed strap.

Anyway, I thought I wasn't getting anywhere at all so accepted the strap I have no use for.

As for shipping, I guess I could have used Post and saved a lot of cash - but if FedEx hadn't already had my export papers I am sure I would have had to pay taxes a second time due to Laco's improperly done customs forms.


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## Uwe W. (Jan 7, 2009)

kevral said:


> Before I sent it in return I first asked them for their FedEx number, so it could be returned on their account. If I remember the timeline correctly I did this during business hours on day 1 (after several emails back and forth the same day) and when they had not responded by close of business on day 2 I sent it myself, paying FedEx 90 EUR.


Emails "back and forth" you say, but then you claim that they hadn't responded? Yeah, I'm confused.

It's difficult to sympathise with your situation when you weren't patient enough to wait for their response in the first place - it might have been a holiday in Germany - and then you arbitrarily decided to ship the watch on your own. I doubt that Laco would have consented to paying *90* EUR to ship a watch one way, which is shockingly expensive. You still haven't mentioned where you live; I'm curious because for the life of me I can't understand why you paid so much, especially since it's more than double (almost triple) what German manufacturers charge to ship a watch to North America in two days by FedEx. No wonder they didn't want to refund that cost.

As for the Laco closed-loop strap being worth half of a paper-thin Fluco, give me a break.

Every single manufacturer's sub-forum here on WUS is filled with people who have complaints. And defective products that require warranty repair is a universal situation that EVERY SINGLE manufacture experiences. I understand how disappointing it is to have a watch not function correctly, and how much of a hassle it is to send it back for repair. I respect and appreciate when people get a little upset and want to vent their frustrations here. However, it becomes more difficult to support someone when those complaints turn into bash and rants, or they're filled with melodramatic statements like those found in this thread's OP.


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## kevral (May 10, 2011)

90 EUR is the lowest possible FedEx rate for sending a properly packaged watch from Norway to Germany. 

You can argue that it is my fault for being impatient, and I'll accept that. But I figured I should use the same shipper as I knew Laco would use to return the watch, just to ease the process with customs - which turned out to be an uncannily good bet, considering Norwegian customs would have charged me 200+ EUR in taxes if I had used any other shipping method. 

Either way this thread isn't about FedEx trying to price themselves out of the Norwegian market, but about Laco being unable to properly file a simple repair-and-return customs declaration.


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## Uwe W. (Jan 7, 2009)

kevral said:


> Either way this thread isn't about FedEx trying to price themselves out of the Norwegian market, but about Laco being unable to properly file a simple repair-and-return customs declaration.


Really? I was under the impression that this thread was about blowing isolated incidents out of proportion.

If Laco is so inept at dealing with the intricacies of shipping watches all over the world, as you suggested, you would think that this forum would be rife with 'customs' complaints. I can only speak from my own experience; of all the watches that Laco has shipped me (I'm in Canada), there hasn't been one issue with how it was processed through customs. I guess I must have been really lucky then. Of course I can only imagine the numerous pitfalls associated with keeping abreast of the customs requirements of the one hundred or so countries that Laco must ship to. And when something does get hung up at a border, at least we can all safely assume that the fault will most certainly be Laco's. Just like the excellent customs agents and FedEx employees in Norway (and Singapore), I assume that their Canadian equivalents are incapable of mistakes that would result in unnecessary costs or delays in a parcel's delivery.

When a watch manufacturer screws something up - and they all do on occasion - I prefer to judge them by how they fix their mistakes and not that they made one in the first place. Of course in your case we'll never know how things would have been handled since you couldn't wait a few days to find out how Laco wanted to process your particular warranty issue. Had the normal warranty procedure been followed, perhaps your watch would have been handled differently from beginning to end and the mistake in the shipping paperwork would have been avoided. Unfortunately, we'll never know the full story regarding the circumstances behind your particular complaint as it's highly unlikely that Laco will post anything here in their defence.

Forums are often very similar to kangaroo courts; manufacturers are accused of all sorts of things before being summarily found guilty by their accusers. I understand that buyers can momentarily get caught up in the frustration of dealing with a broken watch, but I'm equally frustrated when those buyers turn that frustration into an unfounded and undeserved bashing of a manufacturer. If the disproportionate number of complaints that you find in watch forums represented an absolute truth about the state of watch manufacturing today, you can believe that there wouldn't be one single watch company left in business.


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## kevral (May 10, 2011)

Now you're just being ridiculous.

I'll make this as simple as I can:
Laco shipped me the same watch twice.

1. The new watch: declared full value

2. The same watch, after repairs: declared full value

The customs paperwork was, in other words, IDENTICAL both times.

How do you suppose that Customs would know that this was a warranty return when Laco filled out the paperwork as if the watch was new?

And for the record - Laco told me to send the watch back; I said I would FedEx it to them; they confirmed the address; I asked for their FedEx number - in that order. But I guess you aren't likely to believe a single word a non-fanboi says without seeing the full email record?


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## Uwe W. (Jan 7, 2009)

I was wondering how long it would take before this thread degenerated into a predictable 'fanboy' accusation. 

I fully believe you. No email records are required. Laco made a mistake and you paid for it. Shame on them. And shame on me for questioning the details of your convoluted posts and for suggesting that you might have had any role in this screw-up.


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## kevral (May 10, 2011)

I just realized this is much like arguing with the doorman at the nightclub: it really doesn't matter whether I am right, and there is no upside for me either way. 
So I am going to keep quiet and go away before I am made to.


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## Uwe W. (Jan 7, 2009)

kevral said:


> I just realized this is much like arguing with the doorman at the nightclub: it really doesn't matter whether I am right, and there is no upside for me either way. So I am going to keep quiet and go away before I am made to.


Funny, here I was thinking that you were the doorman...

I admitted that you were right, so you have me at a loss. What "upside" were you looking for? I think anyone reading this tread will understand that you're dissatisfied with Laco for their handling of your warranty repair.

And please don't pull that "oppressive moderator" card on me. It's insulting. I don't have a history of arbitrarily silencing contentious opinions in this forum, so as long as you remain civil - something that this thread has been so far - there isn't any threat of you being silenced.


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## rice (Jul 16, 2010)

interesting read...

i suppose u may think i'm blowing it out of proportion. maybe i am. (shrug), i'm not really an anal guy - just average watch buyer who wants value for the cash... when i buy a product like the Laco B-Uhr I expect it to last longer than 4 months. One board-member advised the mechanism isn't made by Laco, so don't blame them.. Really? (surprised) who else would I hold responsible?

Two weeks later and the watch is still in customs. Laco seems to have failed to send the correct paperwork to Fedex. Yes they have 'repair' on one form, but FedEx is saying that it's not correct. I have no idea - a simple human that is not familiar with this stuff. I would expect Laco to have gotten their paperwork right. Laco seems to have decided to bow out of the issue altogether with no response to my last email requesting help.

Faced with a $240 bill from Customs (Philippines)... I've already paid this once (when I bought it), if I pay it again I'm up to $480 (plus the $60 I spent to ship it to them for repairs) - $540.... The watch was only $1k... and it broke within 4 months, do I really want to spend the cash to get it back? Will it break again? 

I'm very picky with my watches, they are an object of precision and beauty, it's rarely a matter of money - wearing an oversized piece of crap wouldn't make me feel great. Even if I pay the fees (and I probably will) I doubt I'll be wearing this watch again, Laco has certainly lost it's allure - the shipping problem of course was only the icing on the cake - the real issue is that their watch only stood up to 4 months of use. Go figure. It's a difficult thing to pull off; wearing a 55mm watch, you can really only do it if you're proud of it, confident in it - but knowing it's a cereal-toy.... (sigh)

Like I said, I would have gladly (GLADLY) paid 6x the price if Laco would have only given me a watch that would last a lifetime, and some professional international customer service to back it up. The 55mm is such a conversation piece, I can imagine everytime I'm talking about it - in the back of my mind I'm thinking 'yeah, piece or refurbished crapola'

The new Uboat 53mm is looking pretty nice, so is the updated version of the sea dweller (deep sea?)... Still not sure why most guys like to slag off U-Boat, it's a nice (aesthetic) looking watch, and feels pretty solid on the wrist. Not sure of the mechanism, but surely couldn't be much worse than rolex?


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## Janne (Apr 16, 2007)

you get that the problem is coming from an outsourced component?
Laco just puts them in the case! They have absolutely no influence over the assembly, quality etc of the movement!

We should all be grateful that Laco ( and others that use ETA) are dealing with warranty issues with the ETA made and supplied movements!

And why are you tossing fuel on the fire by stating that your U-boat has maybe a better movement that Rolex? You do not even know which movements is in the U-boat!!!!!!!
Are you here on WUS to create fights, or to enjoy yourself?


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## Uwe W. (Jan 7, 2009)

rice said:


> Like I said, I would have gladly (GLADLY) paid 6x the price if Laco would have only given me a watch that would last a lifetime, and some professional international customer service to back it up. The 55mm is such a conversation piece, I can imagine everytime I'm talking about it - in the back of my mind I'm thinking 'yeah, piece or refurbished crapola'


You certainly apply a very unrealistic set of standards to your purchases. I find it absolutely incredulous that anyone would state that a watch should last a lifetime or it's "crapola". Every single watch manufacturer on this planet has watches returned to them for warranty repairs. Watches are mechanical devices - and as such - they are subject to mechanical failures. Based on your comments, I assume that you expect a car should last a lifetime too?

I don't know what your experience with watches is, but eventually you will come to realise that it doesn't matter which brand or model you buy, there will always be a risk it breaking. You're obviously bitter by your experience with Laco, which is a shame. Maybe after some time has passed and you 'cool down' a little, you'll realise that you could have worded your comments here a little more carefully. Because at the moment, the extremity of your statements sound absurd given the relatively common nature of your experiences. As I stated before, I wish you good luck with your future watch purchases; I hope for your sake that they all last you a lifetime.


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## forestone (Aug 14, 2011)

rice said:


> interesting read...
> 
> i suppose u may think i'm blowing it out of proportion. maybe i am. (shrug), i'm not really an anal guy - just average watch buyer who wants value for the cash... when i buy a product like the Laco B-Uhr I expect it to last longer than 4 months. One board-member advised the mechanism isn't made by Laco, so don't blame them.. Really? (surprised) who else would I hold responsible?
> 
> ...


Pm sent!


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## Janne (Apr 16, 2007)

3 years ago, I bought a JLC Reverso Day Moon. Around USD 9000 or so. 2 years later the Silver plated dial started to lose the Silver. 
I had it sent to Switzerland. The problem was a leaking crystal. 

I still love the watch, and JLC's products!

Everything can develop a fault.


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## rice (Jul 16, 2010)

Hey,

Wasn't trying to troll on the board, and I'm not overly bitter either. You're right maybe I do place too high of expectations on my watches. I'm still sort of new to the watch game. I have two rolex and one panerai - so i'm not much of a collector - and i've only had them for ten years. All mechanical devices will fail - I just thought 4 months was a bit quick. I have no experience with Laco, I thought when you put your brand on something you sanctioned it. BMW's don't make every single part in their car, however they brand it and stand by it. Laco did the same, they repaired the watch with no fuss what-so-ever. The issue that came up was a customer service one - the misunderstanding or misidentification of the papers FedEx needed. The smaller issue being - do I end up paying over half what the watch costs just to get it back again - or donate it to customs (throw good money behind bad).

As someone new to the Laco brand I couldn't help but do some math - mechanical failure within 4 months, customer service foul up - so I made my post 'nothing but trouble' because of course in my opinion that's true. I've had nothing but trouble with this watch.  I wasn't saying Laco sucks, I wasn't saying that all their watches are crap, I was conveying my experience. Sorry if it came across as harsh. It was a beautiful piece, and lots of good conversations about it. 

I also don't believe I said U-Boat had better timekeeping ability than Rolex... I LOVE Rolex, mine are tanks and they get daily use. However I think anyone who owns one will agree they are not the most accurate time-piece. If I leave mine alone for 6 months I pretty much know I've lost 5-10 min... My friends and I joke about Rolex giving you the 'approximate time'... Instead I was questioning why it seems (on this and other boards) that U-Boat doesn't seem to get much respect? I'm very close to picking up the 53mm and I guess I was just fishing for some quick input about it. There aren't that many 53mm+ watches out there at the moment. 

On a slightly less flattering note (and I'm sure i'll get beat up for this) - the Buhr is a BIG frigging watch, it DOES attract notice, I can honestly say that I'm shallow enough to wish it cost more - when you're wearing a watch that big it's making a bold statement. Peers will either think: 1. it's vintage 2. it's valuable - when in fact it's neither vintage or valuable, it's just big, I sometimes feel embarrassed to talk about it as i 'feel' like it's just two steps up from a G-shock - ha. There are swiss army watches that cost as much - doh!. I didn't buy a vintage one cause i knew it wouldn't stand up to my lifestyle. Up until now I assumed that if a manufacturer came out with a 6k+ watch it would be better made (better parts) than a sub 1k watch.. However after reading Janne's post about the JLC - who knows. There aren't many accessories guys can wear to tell a bit about themselves. So I totally understand why some friends like all gold Daytona's and such.. I mean, I LOVE the style of the watch and would been very glad to have a version that was higher quality even if it were higher price. Nothing feels quite as bad as watching your new watch stop working...

Peace.


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## Janne (Apr 16, 2007)

Most ETA movements are bought by watch companies like Laco ( and tons of others) "as they are", with zero modifications. They come in different grades.

ETA can do some modifications at a price. IWC movements come to my mind here.

If you Rolex is Chronometer grade ( "Certified Chronometer" on the Dial), it should not lose/gain much time, -4 /+6 secs a day. 

I think you should be able to solve your situation by emailng Laco, explaining, and they should send you an email that explains the fault they made you can show FedEx. It is their duty to help you!



Good luck!


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## rice (Jul 16, 2010)

Janne said:


> Most ETA movements are bought by watch companies like Laco ( and tons of others) "as they are", with zero modifications. They come in different grades.
> If you Rolex is Chronometer grade ( "Certified Chronometer" on the Dial), it should not lose/gain much time, -4 /+6 secs a day.


so that's -3 min a month.. sounds about right.


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## Janne (Apr 16, 2007)

You will not get much better than that. Most people adjust the watch maybe once a week, at a set day. 

If you read the movement description the various manufacturers give us, you will get the idea that very few use ETA, or that they are heavily modified. This is not so. Usually the only modification ( not really one) is the watch-assemblers name on the rotor.

Carmanufacturers of today install standard components too. The housing may be unique, but the inside is stock. Cheaper that way.

I believe your U-boat has an ETA movement, but I am niot sure which grade.
You say you have owned some watches for 10 years - time for service!!!


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## avatar1 (Sep 15, 2008)

rice said:


> so that's -3 min a month.. sounds about right.


Yes it does. Welcome to the real world.


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## Janne (Apr 16, 2007)

avatar1 said:


> Yes it does. Welcome to the real world.


The real mechanical world!!!


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## Gabriel A. Zorrilla (Nov 30, 2010)

Myron said:


> What country on earth charges a 50% duty? That sounds crazy.


Argentina is one of those and in a good day. *rolls eyes*


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## Janne (Apr 16, 2007)

Gabriel A. Zorrilla said:


> Argentina is one of those and in a good day. *rolls eyes*


Sounds like a good country to assemble watches for in-country use!


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## forestone (Aug 14, 2011)

Robert156 said:


> I don't think you got bad customer service. Laco probably put the value on 500€ so if something happened to the watch YOU would get 500€ back. If they had only insured it for $100 and it was lost on the mail, I'm pretty sure you would have been really mad.
> 
> I don't know where you live, but I'm pretty sure that if you get Laco to write a letter/confirmation that the watch was in for a repair, you wont have to pay the customs fee.
> 
> ...


Im from the Philippines. I had a watched repaired in the u.s. I send the head only. I was still taxed by the customs here when the watch was returned.

Different government has diff poloicies.


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## Myron (Dec 27, 2009)

Gabriel A. Zorrilla said:


> Argentina is one of those and in a good day. *rolls eyes*


Apparently, the OP is from the Phillipines, so he can apparently empathize. I admit I had no idea there were such outrageous duties in some countries.

Myron


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## Janne (Apr 16, 2007)

The shipping must be quite substantial if you send from the Phillipines to Germany?


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## skindiver2005 (Mar 10, 2006)

*I really dont get it*

I have to start with this, I am not affiliated with Laco and to be honest, I am not the pilot watch guy either, having said that. I think people like you spoil this hobby and with comments like those, they cause major harm to companies that are trying harder than others by commiting to a great forum like this. Let me explain:Any mechanical watch can break down within a few days, weeks or months, disregarding its origin, price or brand name, bearing in mind that according to statistics, the owners play a tremendous role in breaking their watches. Watches were worn for a century in a pocket on a very safe place near the body, while workers never owned a watch or if, then they would wear it on very special occasions only, now we wear watches on our wrist and hit them at least once a week against the desk, door or whatsoever, but the technology is still the same, so expect a movement issue with any mechanical watch any time when you buy one, or just go with a cheap digital watch, they last forever, or until the battery dies.Laco does not manufacture the movement and if anybody is to blame, then it is the manufacturer of the movement for manufacturing it , the owner for abusing it, but definitely not lacoWhat really is annoying , bashing Laco for their service and blaming them for customs issues, NOW listen, it is your country's customs authorities who wanted to charge you taxes twice for the same goods, and it is your responsibility once you decide to import goods from outside the country to exactly obtain information on how to deal with customs. You must have proof that the watch has entered the country once and you must provide your customs those documents to support your claims. This is not Lacos mess up, it is yours !, so buy local for 3X the price or take the plunge.Finally, I have nothing against you pal, and I am not here to preach, but the truth must be said.


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## Janne (Apr 16, 2007)

*Re: I really dont get it*

You made a valid stateent, Skindiver! It is our responsibility to know the Laws and Rules....

Just a note: When the World made the transition between Pocket watches and Wrist watches, I would imagine they were having a lot of problems with damaged movements ( balance wheel shaft) due to excessive shock. So the Shock protection ( Incabloc) was invented in the early 1930's (1934).

And of course you care,as this is the best WWwatchforum !!


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## Renisin (Jan 29, 2011)

*Re: I really dont get it*

I often come on this site because of my interest in Flieger watches and Laco makes as close to the original as you are going to get,they sell some very nice pieces. I don't like to get caught up in an arguement where I don't have a dog in the fight, so to speak but when I read what SKINDIVER2005 wrote I had to put forth my 2cents!!!!

If I buy a Ford product and the brakes or some other part of the car malfunctions do I go to the company that Ford outsoursed to or do I go to ford? Its called economics 101, the company that puts their name on and sells the finished product is the one who should be held responsible!!! Further more Laco should have given instruction on how to return the watch in a timely manner.

Lastly, while it is true that anything can go wrong with anygiven watch,the better watches last longer than cheap watches. A mechanical watch with proper care will last far longer than a quartz watch,that is a fact!!!!!!!!

The OP has every right to voice his concerns here on this forum,where did you want him to do it? on some other site? Laco as well as anyother company has an obligation to the people that buy their watches,thats if they want to stay in business. This forum is great for keeping honest people honest,right?

Ren


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## Janne (Apr 16, 2007)

*Re: I really dont get it*

But surely you are not blaming Ford if the Bosch made part fails?
Laco fixed the problem, so I do not see your point? The issue is the Duty/taxation thing.


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## skindiver2005 (Mar 10, 2006)

*Re: I really dont get it*



Renisin said:


> I often come on this site because of my interest in Flieger watches and Laco makes as close to the original as you are going to get,they sell some very nice pieces. I don't like to get caught up in an arguement where I don't have a dog in the fight, so to speak but when I read what SKINDIVER2005 wrote I had to put forth my 2cents!!!! If I buy a Ford product and the brakes or some other part of the car malfunctions do I go to the company that Ford outsoursed to or do I go to ford? Its called economics 101, the company that puts their name on and sells the finished product is the one who should be held responsible!!! Further more Laco should have given instruction on how to return the watch in a timely manner.Lastly, while it is true that anything can go wrong with anygiven watch,the better watches last longer than cheap watches. A mechanical watch with proper care will last far longer than a quartz watch,that is a fact!!!!!!!!The OP has every right to voice his concerns here on this forum,where did you want him to do it? on some other site? Laco as well as anyother company has an obligation to the people that buy their watches,thats if they want to stay in business. This forum is great for keeping honest people honest,right?Ren


I might know a less than you do about watches. I am not here for troublemaking, I am a frequent reader but less of a poster, but I couldnt hold back on this. 1. Yes, you can seak repair from Ford for a defective Bosch part that broke in the Ford, but you cannot blame them for the defect in the bosch part, you can only blame them for choosing a bosch part. And after Ford has replaced the part and repaired the car, you cant blame them any longer.2. Yes, anyone can voice his or her concerns, but not by blaming problems of their country's tax laws on the manufacturer of the watch.I hope that all issues with the watch and taxes get fixed soonskindiver2005


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## Uwe W. (Jan 7, 2009)

*Re: I really dont get it*

Debate and conflicting opinions are a reality of forum life. However, as per WUS rules, I'm asking that everyone remain respectful and polite when presenting their viewpoints. I'm not singling out anyone, so there's no reason to start a 'he said, she said' argument. There is no place here for name calling; I've had to clean up a few of the posts here and will close this tread if the tone of the posts continues to degenerate.


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## Renisin (Jan 29, 2011)

*Re: I really dont get it*

Dear Janne,

You are learned about many things and watches being one of them, but skindiver said alot of .... that hit me wrong! I think that if Ford put out a product that had constant complaints,it would be forced to look for an alternate source. I am not saying that Laco is putting out a poor product! What I am saying is that ultimately Laco is responsible for the products they put out.

I made many points,one being that this is exactly the right place to air a concern.

Ren


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## Uwe W. (Jan 7, 2009)

*Re: I really dont get it*



Renisin said:


> You are learned about many things and watches being one of them, but skindiver said alot of .... that hit me wrong! I think that if Ford put out a product that had constant complaints,it would be forced to look for an alternate source. I am not saying that Laco is putting out a poor product! What I am saying is that ultimately Laco is responsible for the products they put out.
> 
> I made many points,one being that this is exactly the right place to air a concern.
> 
> Ren


There are two major problems with your statement:

1. Laco has NOT had "constant complaints" with respect to the ETA movements used in their watches. In fact, if you were to do a quick search of this forum you'd find that they receive very few complaints in general. So there isn't any reason for Laco to find an alternate source.

2. You're right that Laco is ultimately responsible for their product. The fact that they warrant it against defects is proof that they do accept that responsibility. The watch had a problem with the movement, and Laco repaired it, so I don't see why this is a point of discussion.

What irked many of us with the OP's post was the absoluteness of his complaints; his suggestion that because his Laco broke, all Laco watches are an inferior product. Those of us experienced in watch buying know that any manufacturer, regardless of their price point, can produce a watch that develops a fault. This has nothing to do with longevity, quality or durability. Every single watch built has the potential to suffer from a mechanical fault; singling out one particular watch manufacturer as the exclusive source of this reality suggests inexperience on the part of the complainant.


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## KUNISMAN (Apr 30, 2011)

*Re: I really dont get it*

I´m probably alone here, but i think this thread has served its purpose. No one is any longer discussing an important matter as i think we all agree that Laco as done its duty as a reliable manufacture and the real problem ocurred due to miscommunication and excessive tax laws.


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## rice (Jul 16, 2010)

a few points:

- The only thing I was 'blaming' Laco for was that the watch malfunctioned so quickly - that's not opinion or conjecture, that's fact.
- I did not blame them for Philippines tax regulations (scams), however I would have thought they would have filed the correct 'repaired items' forms with customs. Fedex is saying they did not get these forms from Laco... Is it Fedex or Laco - no idea.

My issue (my debate) was 'do i want to spend 60% of the value of the watch to get it back, even though it broke the first time within 4 months'. i suppose i was hoping for some feedback along the lines of '.... happens but it's a fab watch GET IT BACK' or 'it's a low-end watch, take a look at this instead' - I honestly had no idea it would turn into many guys jumping on my arse about if i have the right to complain about a watch malfunctioning so quickly... This is a forum about Laco products, I think we have a right to talk about the good and bad. Since when can we NOT talk about our experiences?

Contrary to one poster's thoughts; I don't sideline as a sumo wrestler while wearing my Laco, nor do I do anything more taxing to it than the occasional shag, and lifting of that arm to sip my gin. I'm a 40-something professional and I hardly abuse my watches.

I've said before that Laco handled the repair perfectly, gave me the address, let me ship it in MONTHS and months later, and repairs were made withing a few weeks. I'm not ganging up on Laco, was disappointed it stopped working. I guess I happened to win the lottery as no-one else has come forward to complain about their Laco Buhr (so it goes). The title of my post was 'LACO BUHR - NOTHING BUT PROBLEMS' - it wasn't 'Laco sucks'... so no need to defend the brand.

Anyway - just to add closure to this post: I made the decision to NOT get the watch back. The Fedex lady called me early this week and told me they don't handle COD I'd have to go make a payment at a certain payment center - whatever, I hung up at that point. 

Then 20 min ago my doorbell rang and there was a subsidiary of Fedex sitting there with the watch.. I ended up paying full customs price for it yet again - mainly just so I can see if the thing breaks - lol. 

One interesting note: I shipped it in a hurry (before flying out to Thailand to get to hospital) and wrapped it in bubble-wrap and stuck it in an oversized cardboard sunglasses box... I figured it would 'probably' make the trip, and to be honest if it didn't I wasn't too concerned... I would have imagined they would have shipped it repaired back to me in something more standard, substantial or safe. NOPE - same bubble-wrap and sunglasses box - lol. Got to love it.

Here's hoping the watch will do me right this time. It is a beautiful watch, and I'm grateful Laco decided to produce it.

Peace.


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