# Baselworld 2017: Avigation Big Eye



## NunoGMR (Oct 8, 2013)

There were plenty of novelties from Longines this year: the Heritage flagship, the VHP, the heritage 1945, a full new line of chronometers (Record). But I have seen more new stuff on instagram that hasn't got all the press-release promotion. This one was shown by instagram user @tidssonen, I know nothing more about it maybe someone can provide details on price, reference. This one looks amazing:


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## junta (Oct 7, 2016)

Im not sure what what to think about the different hands for the subdials.


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## dantan (Dec 16, 2014)

This one is very cool!

I, too, would like to know more!


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## heb (Feb 24, 2006)

I love the looks of it but the 3 minute incremented "big eye" will prove to be a confusing pita. Too bad.

heb


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## seisnofe (Feb 1, 2011)

nice watch, more information? size, price...


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## marker2037 (Nov 19, 2015)

Hmm, hadn't seen this one anywhere prior to this. Looks pretty good right there. I'd like to see more pics and coverage to get a better idea about it.


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## Dale Vito (Apr 6, 2006)

It's ref. L2.816.4.53.2 (.4 for XL strap), powered by cal. 688, set for release in the third quarter of 2017, 41mm.
Price in EUR is 2.550 (incl. VAT).


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## Dale Vito (Apr 6, 2006)

Here's another one; Heritage Chronograph 1940, L2.814.4.76.0 (.3 for XL strap), 41mm, powered by caliber L705.2. Third quarter 2017, EUR 2900 incl. VAT.


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## seisnofe (Feb 1, 2011)

I like both, thanks for the pictures


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## NunoGMR (Oct 8, 2013)

Thank you Sir. Oh I notice the lack of date window on these new models. And the size of the avigation chrono at 41mm


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## Dale Vito (Apr 6, 2006)

seisnofe said:


> I like both, thanks for the pictures





NunoGMR said:


> Thank you Sir. Oh I notice the lack of date window on these new models. And the size of the avigation chrono at 41mm


my pleasure


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## dantan (Dec 16, 2014)

Longines is on fire! I like!


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## marker2037 (Nov 19, 2015)

Whoa whoa whoaaaaaa, that Heritage Chrono 1940!!!


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## publandlord (Aug 15, 2006)

marker2037 said:


> Whoa whoa whoaaaaaa, that Heritage Chrono 1940!!!


Well now.

This watch fixes the many, many faults that people bleat and cry about when it comes to Longines.

- Its movement is likely the column-wheel 7753, as the running seconds is at '9', not the modular 2894, aka the Devil's Own Movement
- There is no lume
- There is no date, thus stopping the watch from being "destroyed"
- There are no nibbled numbers
- The case is well sized for the movement
- The hands are the right length

It's basically the same sort of watch as the Stowa chrono. But will the complainers buy it? Will they hell. And what is the reason for their fresh pain? It says "AUTOMATIC" on the dial


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## marker2037 (Nov 19, 2015)

I can't wait to see more pics of both of these. That one pic of the 1940 is the only evidence on the web that this watch even exists. I'm guessing that Longines wanted to keep these two under wraps until a later time and didn't want them covered by the blogs for some reason. Who knows. I just know I want it and the 1945. I'd take the big eye too tbh.


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## slique (Feb 26, 2016)

Beautiful pieces both!


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## dinexus (Nov 18, 2012)

publandlord said:


> Well now.
> 
> - Its movement is likely the column-wheel 7753, as the running seconds is at '9', not the modular 2894, aka the Devil's Own Movement
> - There is no lume


Correct, column wheel, but I believe the hands and numerals are luminous.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## vintageseamaster1950s (Nov 2, 2013)

i like the big eye indeed!


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## cuthbert (Dec 6, 2009)

junta said:


> Im not sure what what to think about the different hands for the subdials.


 That's normal for most chronographs.


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## madhatter77 (May 20, 2013)

junta said:


> Im not sure what what to think about the different hands for the subdials.


This is similar to some other watches like Heuer 1550sg. It is for easier distinguishing the chronograph's and running seconds hands. Speedmaster racing paints chronographs hands in orange and the rest in white. I think it's legitimate, and have no problem with it visualy.


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## madhatter77 (May 20, 2013)

Dale Vito said:


> View attachment 11350010
> 
> 
> It's ref. L2.816.4.53.2 (.4 for XL strap), powered by cal. 688, set for release in the third quarter of 2017, 41mm.
> Price in EUR is 2.550 (incl. VAT).


Wow, a modern Longines without a date!? Did pigs start to fly?! )

I like it. And I have nothing against dates per se.


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## Funan (Feb 12, 2017)

I really like the lack of date. The dial already has so much going on.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


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## lmmo (Dec 28, 2014)

Covered by SJX.

Introducing the Longines Avigation BigEye Chronograph Pilot's Chronograph | Watches By SJX


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## scorpius73 (Mar 25, 2008)

I also found this on the Longines website. I am really interested in this watch. https://www.longines.com/novelties/the-longines-avigation-big-eye


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## walter (Feb 26, 2006)

inspriation a-la LeCoultre


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## GregoryD (Jan 31, 2009)

I like this, but it does look awfully thick. I feel like for a watch in this style with only 30m WR, the case should be slimmer and more elegant.


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## Gepetto82 (Dec 21, 2016)

That's a handsome watch! As far as I can tell, nobody can get it yet


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## bwgrayson1980 (Mar 19, 2017)

I went ahead and pre-ordered it last week. Was told it would be in sometime in November.


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## tacotom (Jan 6, 2015)

I want to love it, but something holds me back from embracing it. Not sure about why. 


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## jason042779 (Oct 30, 2014)

These Longines novelties are cool, but they seem to disappear quickly. Is the Heritage Column Wheel Chrono discontinued? The 1973 Chrono? Will this happen to this model too?


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## cuthbert (Dec 6, 2009)

jason042779 said:


> These Longines novelties are cool, but they seem to disappear quickly. Is the Heritage Column Wheel Chrono discontinued? The 1973 Chrono? Will this happen to this model too?


In short, the Heritage series started 10 years ago approximately, each year Longines proposes a reissue of an historical model that is produced in numbered edition for just one year, then it's discontinued.

The only exception was the Legend Diver that has remained in production due to the strong request from the customers.

So far I have seen in this series the Istituto Idrografico Regia Marina (I think 2008), the W.W.W., the Silver Arrow, the LLD, the 1954 chrono, the Heritage chronograph diver and simple diver, the Avigation, the Conquest 1954, Conquest 1958, the COSD and now this one.


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## cuthbert (Dec 6, 2009)

double post sorry!


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## billybob1 (May 15, 2010)

like it


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## billybob1 (May 15, 2010)

whoa thats nice!


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## billybob1 (May 15, 2010)

cool


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## Dale Vito (Apr 6, 2006)

' had the chance to fiddle with it today;


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## workahol (May 11, 2013)

Awesome photo. Looking forward to hearing your first-hand impressions!

- Matt


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## Dale Vito (Apr 6, 2006)

workahol said:


> Awesome photo. Looking forward to hearing your first-hand impressions!
> 
> - Matt


Thanks Matt.

It's not mine and as such I haven't really worn it. It's beautiful though! Love the look, the case finish and the instrumental yet just-a-bit-weird dial. No-date is really cool. I dig the price too.

Only criticism I can come up with at this point is that perhaps it could be a bit less bulky? Could be me - I've been wearing mostly 1940's - 1970's dress watches lately.


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## cuthbert (Dec 6, 2009)

Dale Vito said:


> ' had the chance to fiddle with it today;
> 
> View attachment 12628401


Handsome watch but...how big is it? In particular thickness, lug to lug and lug size.


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## Dale Vito (Apr 6, 2006)

cuthbert said:


> Handsome watch but...how big is it? In particular thickness, lug to lug and lug size.


I'll try and answer these questions tomorrow.

from mobile device


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## Dale Vito (Apr 6, 2006)

Dale Vito said:


> I'll try and answer these questions tomorrow.
> 
> from mobile device


here we go;

height; +/- 14.8mm
lug2lug; +/- 49mm


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## Unce_Turbo_997 (Oct 18, 2010)

When will AD's have this?


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## Dale Vito (Apr 6, 2006)

Unce_Turbo_997 said:


> When will AD's have this?


Should be in now / soon, depending on whether (and when) they've ordered it? The dealer I'm affiliated with obviously has it in stock


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## cuthbert (Dec 6, 2009)

Dale Vito said:


> here we go;
> 
> height; +/- 14.8mm
> lug2lug; +/- 49mm
> ...


Diameter 41 mm confirmed? lug width 20mm?

In this case I might be needing to see the watch in person...and starting to save money, I always wanted a column wheel Longines but all the watches they had produced so far with this movement were way too big.


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## madhatter77 (May 20, 2013)

cuthbert said:


> Handsome watch but...how big is it? In particular thickness, lug to lug and lug size.


It has a valjoux 7753 based movement: those usually make thicker watches. I wouldn't mind if they made a handwinding version  
A little offtopic - are there any handwound chronograph movements available today (apart from the modified 7750)?


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## madhatter77 (May 20, 2013)

walter said:


> inspriation a-la LeCoultre
> View attachment 12472881


It's a common dial layout for the military chronographs. The third type would be the "bund" (zenith cp-2, leonidas, heuer 1550sg, breitling ...).
Type xx from breguet has similar 30 minute counter to this and longines's but with a twist: for added legibility they printed only every second minute marker and a larger marker for every sixth minute.
This and Longines' tends to be a little crowded compared to breguet's solution.


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## madhatter77 (May 20, 2013)

Dale Vito said:


> here we go;
> 
> height; +/- 14.8mm
> lug2lug; +/- 49mm
> ...


It probably doesn't appear as thick as it sounds because a part of that thicknes is the glass. The LLD is 13 mm thich if i remember correctly and it certainly dorsn't appear thick at all.

I'd really like to go see it in metal


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## cuthbert (Dec 6, 2009)

Double post sorry!


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## cuthbert (Dec 6, 2009)

madhatter77 said:


> It has a valjoux 7753 based movement: those usually make thicker watches. I wouldn't mind if they made a handwinding version
> A little offtopic - are there any handwound chronograph movements available today (apart from the modified 7750)?


yes if the number is correct that would be the thinnest 775X watch I've ever heard about.

For the handwound movements, the Chinese Seagull ST19 is available, you can still find some stock Russian Poljot 3133 (at relatively high prices) and I think the manual version of the 7750, the 7760, is still available. I have an Hanhart with that movement but it doesn't get thinner than 13.70mm.

Zenith until recently sold an handwound version of the Primero too.



madhatter77 said:


> It's a common dial layout for the military chronographs. The third type would be the "bund" (zenith cp-2, leonidas, heuer 1550sg, breitling ...).
> Type xx from breguet has similar 30 minute counter to this and longines's but with a twist: for added legibility they printed only every second minute marker and a larger marker for every sixth minute.
> This and Longines' tends to be a little crowded compared to breguet's solution.


Yes the Benrus Sky Chief (another chronograph of that era) had the longer minute markers after each 3 minutes:










That is because as a part of VFR training pilots are trained to learn how to perform "standard turns", that means at a certain bank they should turn 360 degrees in a certain time, today it's 2 minutes or 120 seconds, at that time I suspect it was three minutes or 180 seconds, so the rate was two degrees per second.

Longines' solution is definitely more visible for the pilot in comparison to more standard dials like the Benrus.



Dale Vito said:


> here we go;
> 
> height; +/- 14.8mm
> lug2lug; +/- 49mm
> ...


Can we see a picture of the profile and caseback please? Very interested, the watch looks for me.


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## madhatter77 (May 20, 2013)

cuthbert said:


> yes if the number is correct that would be the thinnest 775X watch I've ever heard about.
> 
> For the handwound movements, the Chinese Seagull ST19 is available, you can still find some stock Russian Poljot 3133 (at relatively high prices) and I think the manual version of the 7750, the 7760, is still available. I have an Hanhart with that movement but it doesn't get thinner than 13.70mm.
> 
> ...


I forgot the Zenith. But they are both (at least the 77xx, not sure about zenith) modified automatics.

Interesting explanation of the Benrus's markers on the 30 min counter. 
I have seen it explained in numerous places as simple long distance call timer (something as a warning because supposedly the prices for LD calls were apparently increasing in three minute increments).


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## cuthbert (Dec 6, 2009)

madhatter77 said:


> Interesting explanation of the Benrus's markers on the 30 min counter.
> I have seen it explained in numerous places as simple long distance call timer (something as a warning because supposedly the prices for LD calls were apparently increasing in three minute increments).


Yes the Zenith like the 7760 is an auto movement with the self winding mechanism removed, I don't know if it's still in production.

I am a small private pilot, that's the reason why I know that, today the turning rate is 120 seconds per 360 degrees and you are taught to keep constant altitude and speed during the turning, it's very important because when you are navigating VFR you just have the compass, the chronograph on the board, your map, the ruler therefore you have to learn to be precise in what you are doing.

Pilots in that ear before the invention of the VOR had to rely on that not to get lost (and in the Pacific theatre the US casualities for "lost pilots" were higher than for combat, as the ocean is flat with few reference points for visual navigation) and that is the reason why pilots preferred wrist chronographs: in case of damage for enemy fire or any other reasons the chrono was a backup. I am sure that Pappy Boyington had a Longines for instance, as it was the top pilot brand at the time.

Evidently with a 30s cargo the turning rate had to be lower, but yes that's the reason why you have one notch each three minutes.

P.S. Errata corrige, the Skychief has one notch every four minutes, the old Soviet Strela on the other side is like the Longines:










As well as this late 40s Lemania CH27:










So I would say it was a standard feature of the "aviator" chronographs of this era, along with the tachy scale (useful to measure ground speed given that you find milestones each km) and telemetric scale (to measure how far you are from a storm).


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## madhatter77 (May 20, 2013)

cuthbert said:


> Yes the Zenith like the 7760 is an auto movement with the self winding mechanism removed, I don't know if it's still in production.
> 
> I am a small private pilot, that's the reason why I know that, today the turning rate is 120 seconds per 360 degrees and you are taught to keep constant altitude and speed during the turning, it's very important because when you are navigating VFR you just have the compass, the chronograph on the board, your map, the ruler therefore you have to learn to be precise in what you are doing.
> 
> ...


Thanks!! Very informative!


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## walter (Feb 26, 2006)

madhatter77 said:


> It's a common dial layout for the military chronographs. The third type would be the "bund" (zenith cp-2, leonidas, heuer 1550sg, breitling ...).
> Type xx from breguet has similar 30 minute counter to this and longines's but with a twist: for added legibility they printed only every second minute marker and a larger marker for every sixth minute.
> This and Longines' tends to be a little crowded compared to breguet's solution.


while breuget xx does indeed have a similar minute register with a larger size, but neither the zenith nor the heuer/leonidas bund feature that characteristic.


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## cuthbert (Dec 6, 2009)

walter said:


> while breuget xx does indeed have a similar minute register with a larger size, but neither the zenith nor the heuer/leonidas bund feature that characteristic.
> 
> View attachment 12680033
> 
> ...


True, but the cronometri CP-1 and CP02 of the Italian Air Force were later designs (late 50s/early 60s), and the Heuer/Leonidas was also issued to Italian ground forces (recon units). The Breguet is even more interesting as it has the minute marks and the hand for the subdial painted with radium, very rare so it had an important meaning and the indexes had to be seen in dark environment, I would rule out phone calls for that.

Definitely a standard turn with a jet doesn't take 3 or 4 minutes...

However I am looking for that Longines but it didn't reach the ADs yet. A pity.


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## rfortson (Feb 18, 2012)

Dale Vito said:


> View attachment 11350034
> 
> 
> Here's another one; Heritage Chronograph 1940, L2.814.4.76.0 (.3 for XL strap), 41mm, powered by caliber L705.2. Third quarter 2017, EUR 2900 incl. VAT.


I love this one, and no-date is a plus in my book. Is the L705.2 another column wheel?

Sent from my SM-P580 using Tapatalk


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## rfortson (Feb 18, 2012)

dinexus said:


> Correct, column wheel, but I believe the hands and numerals are luminous.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Also, it's a 7750 derivative. The 7753 (I believe) is the triple date moon phase version.

Sent from my SM-P580 using Tapatalk


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## rfortson (Feb 18, 2012)

GregoryD said:


> I like this, but it does look awfully thick. I feel like for a watch in this style with only 30m WR, the case should be slimmer and more elegant.


I agree with you, but Longines has several like that. I've just learned to ignore it.

Sent from my SM-P580 using Tapatalk


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## rfortson (Feb 18, 2012)

cuthbert said:


> yes if the number is correct that would be the thinnest 775X watch I've ever heard about.
> 
> For the handwound movements, the Chinese Seagull ST19 is available, you can still find some stock Russian Poljot 3133 (at relatively high prices) and I think the manual version of the 7750, the 7760, is still available. I have an Hanhart with that movement but it doesn't get thinner than 13.70mm.
> 
> ...


Since this is an aviation watch, your explanation for 3 minute marks makes sense. Another reason for those marks is that long distance phone calls were measured/charged in 3 minute increments.

Sent from my SM-P580 using Tapatalk


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## cuthbert (Dec 6, 2009)

rfortson said:


> I agree with you, but Longines has several like that. I've just learned to ignore it.
> 
> Sent from my SM-P580 using Tapatalk


Actually according to the measurements given in this thread, it appears this is the slimmest 775X derivative watch ever as it's under 15 mm. I am curious to see in real life, I assume it looks chunky due to the small diameter. That is the reason why I want to see it in real life as

Mentioning pilots' watches the Hawkinge looks even more chunky, and it's not even a chrono:












rfortson said:


> Since this is an aviation watch, your explanation for 3 minute marks makes sense. Another reason for those marks is that long distance phone calls were measured/charged in 3 minute increments.
> 
> Sent from my SM-P580 using Tapatalk


In the 30s when you were on a plane you couldn't make phone calls, and besides that some watches like the Benrus have marks every 4 minutes, while different planes have different standard turning rates (the biggest the slower to turn) I seriously phone fares changed too.


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## rfortson (Feb 18, 2012)

cuthbert said:


> Actually according to the measurements given in this thread, it appears this is the slimmest 775X derivative watch ever as it's under 15 mm. I am curious to see in real life, I assume it looks chunky due to the small diameter. That is the reason why I want to see it in real life as
> 
> Mentioning pilots' watches the Hawkinge looks even more chunky, and it's not even a chrono:
> 
> ...


Yeah hard to make a phone call on a plane back then. But many other chronographs ("dressy" types) had the 3 minute marks as well. The three minute phone charge increment was standard at least in the US for years, so I'm inclined to believe the use for timing phone calls. Three minutes seems to be a handy increment for a lot of different things.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G930A using Tapatalk


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## cuthbert (Dec 6, 2009)

rfortson said:


> Yeah hard to make a phone call on a plane back then. But many other chronographs ("dressy" types) had the 3 minute marks as well. The three minute phone charge increment was standard at least in the US for years, so I'm inclined to believe the use for timing phone calls. Three minutes seems to be a handy increment for a lot of different things.
> 
> Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G930A using Tapatalk


Again, these watches were sold worldwide, and the only "American" brand is Benrus...that has a special after FOUR minutes, not three.

Sorry, IMO this theory doesn't hold water.


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## rfortson (Feb 18, 2012)

cuthbert said:


> Again, these watches were sold worldwide, and the only "American" brand is Benrus...that has a special after FOUR minutes, not three.
> 
> Sorry, IMO this theory doesn't hold water.


Well we'll just have to agree to disagree. 

That's what's fun about this hobby.

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## mebiuspower (Sep 24, 2009)

REALLY like this.


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## cuthbert (Dec 6, 2009)

mebiuspower said:


> REALLY like this.


You bought it? Where di you find it? Are the hands white or steel?

It definitely looks an handsome design.


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## mebiuspower (Sep 24, 2009)

cuthbert said:


> You bought it? Where di you find it? Are the hands white or steel?
> 
> It definitely looks an handsome design.


No, just tried it on at the airport duty free. Hands are white as seen in the photo.


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