# New 50k + purchase policy?



## greentimgreen

I've just been reading this post and don't know what to make of it. Can't be a sensible business move for Lange, can it?


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http://instagr.am/p/CMOaJTSLeTD/

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## Brey17

Seems like a bold strategy.


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## kritameth

Welp, it looks like the Datograph just became another watch I'll never get to enjoy in this lifetime.


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## Ginseng108

What does the post say?


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## DadLife

Ginseng108 said:


> What does the post say?


...it's in English, man...but here, I've got your back.

"Come April 1st, any Lange 50k and above is now by application only. What this means is anyone who wishes to purchase a Datograph, Zeitwerk or an 1815 Chrono is going to have had purchased two Langes before they are eligible to "apply" and then wait a minimum of 6 months."


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## jkpa

Ugh. Not anywhere near my wheel house but this limiting of supply and access is getting so old. It's a watch FFS


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## weisscomposer

Well. I guess as someone highly unlikely ever to be in a position wherein they can spend $50K on a watch, I'll just keep my opinion to myself.


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## Bird-Dog

Engineering exclusivity... as if the $50K+ price-tag wasn't enough!


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## scuttle

jkpa said:


> Ugh. Not anywhere near my wheel house but this limiting of supply and access is getting so old.


You mean *auld. *Think about it... Lange... auld...


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## jkpa

^ 😂


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## Yugi

They are trying to build the hype and demand. We will have to wait and see if that strategy works or backfire.


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## justcruisin

I’m lucky that my wrists can do max 40mm, and 38mm is the sweet spot. All the > 50k watches outside of the PT Lange 1 are 40mm+.


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## SLWoodster

Believable. Likely the result of a flood of Odysseus requests from people looking to buy "investment pieces".


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## scuttle

SLWoodster said:


> Believable. Likely the result of a flood of Odysseus requests from people looking to buy "investment pieces".


I was going to say that I was honestly glad for them. Then I remembered they're part of Richemont...


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## drhr

These are the times I thank my lucky stars I really am not a fan of those particular Lange models and would not spend the money no matter the prices . . .


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## Johnjr




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## rand777

This just means I would only ever consider buying a pre-owned one after April 1st.


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## Zhanming057

I don't like this when Rolex does it, and I don't like it when Lange does it. If people have the money, let them buy whatever they want, raise prices accordingly, or do a normal waitlist.


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## longtimelurker

scuttle said:


> I was going to say that I was honestly glad for them. Then I remembered they're part of Richemont...


Elaborate, please. Something about richemont you don't like?


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## fruxzak

I copy pasted the text below so you can read it properly without clicking into Instagram:

_UPDATE 2: I had a very respectful call with @wilhelmgeorgschmid who informed me that the purpose of this policy is to limit having extra stock lying around at ADs when there is demand elsewhere. It is more difficult for Lange to see what's in stock outside their own network and this ensures when a Dato or Zeitwerk for example are wanted it can be sourced to an enthusiast as production on some of these models are currently delayed.

The process for AD clients entails applying for the piece of their choice, getting approved( determined by Lange) and then wait a minimum of 6 months for it to arrive.

While I personally dislike this policy and think it's bad and short sighted, I do appreciate Mr. Schmid taking the time to call and and discuss the matter.~~~~

Come April 1st, any Lange 50k and above is now by application only. What this means is anyone who wishes to purchase a Datograph, Zeitwerk or an 1815 Chrono is going to have had purchased two Langes before they are eligible to "apply" and then wait a minimum of 6 months.

People work for their money. Choosing to spend their hard earned cash on an obsolete object out of passion is something that has to be valued and appreciated, not taken advantage of to create faux hype and imaginary demand. I understand when a particularly difficult to make or in-demand watch is prioritized for established clients but we all know where the real demand lies.

Lange is not Patek, Vacheron or AP. while their watches are incredible, they simply lack the brand equity, history and storytelling that is only acquired through a long, storied existence which, imo, entitles you to a degree of exclusivity-But even the Trinity haven't gone this far.

Love and appreciation of Lange was all it took to be a member of Langenation - a community of loyal enthusiast and collectors who came together under the welcoming smiles of Gunther Blümlein, Walter Lange and the unbelievably dedicated and passionate old guard at Lange. _


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## greentimgreen

fruxzak said:


> I copy pasted the text below so you can read it properly without clicking into Instagram:
> 
> _UPDATE 2: I had a very respectful call with @wilhelmgeorgschmid who informed me that the purpose of this policy is to limit having extra stock lying around at ADs when there is demand elsewhere. It is more difficult for Lange to see what's in stock outside their own network and this ensures when a Dato or Zeitwerk for example are wanted it can be sourced to an enthusiast as production on some of these models are currently delayed.
> 
> The process for AD clients entails applying for the piece of their choice, getting approved( determined by Lange) and then wait a minimum of 6 months for it to arrive.
> 
> While I personally dislike this policy and think it's bad and short sighted, I do appreciate Mr. Schmid taking the time to call and and discuss the matter.~~~~
> 
> Come April 1st, any Lange 50k and above is now by application only. What this means is anyone who wishes to purchase a Datograph, Zeitwerk or an 1815 Chrono is going to have had purchased two Langes before they are eligible to "apply" and then wait a minimum of 6 months.
> 
> People work for their money. Choosing to spend their hard earned cash on an obsolete object out of passion is something that has to be valued and appreciated, not taken advantage of to create faux hype and imaginary demand. I understand when a particularly difficult to make or in-demand watch is prioritized for established clients but we all know where the real demand lies.
> 
> Lange is not Patek, Vacheron or AP. while their watches are incredible, they simply lack the brand equity, history and storytelling that is only acquired through a long, storied existence which, imo, entitles you to a degree of exclusivity-But even the Trinity haven't gone this far.
> 
> Love and appreciation of Lange was all it took to be a member of Langenation - a community of loyal enthusiast and collectors who came together under the welcoming smiles of Gunther Blümlein, Walter Lange and the unbelievably dedicated and passionate old guard at Lange. _


Thank you. I should have done this in the original post, apologies

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## longtimelurker

So this is basically a rolling pre-order system (temporary?) with a loyalty gate? 
If that's the case, I only really have a problem with the loyalty gate part. Sure, give preference to returning customers, but the "entry fee" model seems too snobbish and presumptuous for me. Bit at least the bar is clear and defined, unlike the rolex secret society games.


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## Edftwin35

jkpa said:


> Ugh. Not anywhere near my wheel house but this limiting of supply and access is getting so old. It's a watch FFS


Couldn't agree enough.


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## CRW161

Luckily, I've yet to see an ALS watch that I would choose to buy @ $10k, let alone $50k, so I expect to remain unaffected.


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## Cincy2

Pre-owned prices will now move upward quickly. I feared this would happen.

Cincy


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## cheu_f50

Generally in support of business approaches like that. A 50k Lange is something very special in most context, I'd rather see A. Lange allocating them to their most loyal fans instead of letting luck decide who gets one and who doesn't by showing up at the right AD at the right time.


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## scuttle

longtimelurker said:


> Elaborate, please. Something about richemont you don't like?


This is just the one example









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...Richmont are the company who give tasteless pandering to noveau riche social climbers a bad name.

And they're notorious for cutting costs on quality control and customer service when they take brands over...









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A few months ago I noticed my JLC Reverso Grande Date was randomly stopping. I sent it in to JLC service center in Texas. After about six weeks and $1000, they returned my serviced watch. After having it for about a week, I noticed it was running 15 seconds fast per day. I contacted JLC and they...




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## EekTheCat

There had better not be a knock-on effect and a sudden run to Glashutte Original (or Dornblueth and sohne for that matter). I've been saving for a PanoLuna all lockdown gawdammit! 😅


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## imaCoolRobot

Hell hath no fury like a rich person temporarily inconvenienced.


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## Pongster

scuttle said:


> You mean *auld. *Think about it... Lange... auld...


sign of the times


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## Pongster

Since the Datograph am looking for (YG) is no longer in current line up, then i shouldnt by affected by this.


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## WatchEater666

This is really silly. I personally hate the dumb games some brands play and it was a big reason I went Lange. No ******** with a straightforward process.

It’s insulting towards customers IMO. If we are buying watches worth 5 figures we probably aren’t too stupid.


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## BHP940

I guess my choice in the previous thread about what to buy if you could only have one watch and cost was no object is void.😩🤣


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## rand777

BHP940 said:


> I guess my choice in the previous thread about what to buy if you could only have one watch and cost was no object is void.😩🤣


I feel the same way. I was thinking of a DatoGraph as a next watch but they are on my banned list for buying anything new from now on


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## espresso&watches

EekTheCat said:


> There had better not be a knock-on effect and a sudden run to Glashutte Original (or Dornblueth and sohne for that matter). I've been saving for a PanoLuna all lockdown gawdammit! 😅


I don't see that happening, especially since this only affects Lange watches over $50k - they're not exactly fighting for the same market. (I own a GO Pano, btw - great watch!)


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## yellowfury

I think it’s a huge mistake but I’m not their target customer. We’ll see how this pans out but I hope it fails so other brands don’t follow suit.


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## sieglo

Good thing I just purchased my grail 1815 Chrono a couple weeks ago.


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## GrouchoM

I wonder if some wealthier people (and traders) will buy the a few Saxonias out other "lesser" models to earn their right to buy upper end ALSs and then sell the Saxs, thus flooding the market with Saxs at great prices.


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## weisscomposer

GrouchoM said:


> ... and then sell the Saxs, thus flooding the market with Saxs at great prices...


Replace "Saxs" with "Lange 1s" and you'll have my full support.

But alas, based on he recent price trends, I think this is probably wishful thinking.


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## AnonPi

GrouchoM said:


> I wonder if some wealthier people (and traders) will buy the a few Saxonias out other "lesser" models to earn their right to buy upper end ALSs and then sell the Saxs, thus flooding the market with Saxs at great prices.


Well, apparently, buying the "lesser" models doesn't earn you any right to buy anything as you still have to be "approved". One has to wonder a) if ALS is violating any laws in any jurisdictions and b) who exactly is it they don't want wearing their watches that ALS have instituted an arbitrary "approval" process that will prevent them from obtaining ALS watches?


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## fish70

WatchEater666 said:


> If we are buying watches worth 5 figures we probably aren't too stupid.


Hmmmm....


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## mlcor

AnonPi said:


> Well, apparently, buying the "lesser" models doesn't earn you any right to buy anything as you still have to be "approved". One has to wonder a) if ALS is violating any laws in any jurisdictions and b) who exactly is it they don't want wearing their watches that ALS have instituted an arbitrary "approval" process that will prevent them from obtaining ALS watches?


I think it depends upon your relationship with the AD--it seems unlikely to me that they would refuse to approve someone recommended by the AD. I've bought three from my AD (traded one back), the most expensive of which was "only" a Saxonia Annual Calendar, and I was approved. Although I decided to pass on it.


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## DatoG

WatchEater666 said:


> This is really silly. I personally hate the dumb games some brands play and it was a big reason I went Lange. No ****** with a straightforward process.
> 
> It's insulting towards customers IMO. If we are buying watches worth 5 figures we probably aren't too stupid.


Lol... these watches are closer to 6 figures than 5!!! And agree we probably are not too stupid...

As we all know it's all about market perception of value... you can raise msrp all you want but if most prospective buyers perceive the market price is lower, than it won't sell at msrp.

No one knows...so this is one way to find out as buyers of $50k watches are more than likely not impacted negatively due to covid.

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## cruzmisl

Bird-Dog said:


> Engineering exclusivity... as if the $50K+ price-tag wasn't enough!


You forgot the cost of the other two watches.......

What a great way to limit their market and overall appeal. Business must be good to take such a stance. They want to be certain a commoner like myself never owns one of their watches.

I hate these exclusionary practices.

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## chatty1

I just emailed with my local Lange AD. I have not purchased any new Lange's from them, but have purchased pre-owned (Saxonia Dual Time / 1815 Annual Calendar). Doesn't seem like there'd be any issue if I wanted to purchase a new Lange >$50k from them. There's another thread that discusses the new distribution policy which seems more accurate. Basically it says, ADs can carry inventory of 1815, Saxonia and Lange 1 and whoever walks into the store can buy. But ADs can't carry inventory of Datographs / Zeitwerks etc. you'd need to order it. And it doesn't sound necessary to have had a prior Lange purchase history. the limited editions or Odysseus, that looks like you need Lange purchase history to be able to get.
The reasoning on the Datograph/Zeiwerk being "pre-sale" doesn't seem so crazy to me. They don't want those pieces just sitting in inventory at an AD when there may be demand for that piece elsewhere in the network.


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## chatty1

I just emailed with my local Lange AD. I have not purchased any new Lange's from them, but have purchased pre-owned (Saxonia Dual Time / 1815 Annual Calendar). Doesn't seem like there'd be any issue if I wanted to purchase a new Lange >$50k from them. There's another thread that discusses the new distribution policy which seems more accurate. Basically it says, ADs can carry inventory of 1815, Saxonia and Lange 1 and whoever walks into the store can buy. But ADs can't carry inventory of Datographs / Zeitwerks etc. you'd need to order it. And it doesn't sound necessary to have had a prior Lange purchase history. the limited editions or Odysseus, that looks like you need Lange purchase history to be able to get.
The reasoning on the Datograph/Zeiwerk being "pre-sale" doesn't seem so crazy to me. They don't want those pieces just sitting in inventory at an AD when there may be demand for that piece elsewhere in the network.


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## weisscomposer

chatty1 said:


> There's another thread that discusses the new distribution policy which seems more accurate.


Yes, this amazing post from CFR has so much fantastic information, and is from a well-respected member of the Lange community. I don't know why this thread managed to gain so much traction whereas the other didn't. Perhaps a moderator can merge them...


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## CFR

I visited the NYC Lange boutique in person yesterday. Confirmed that anyone can walk in off the street and buy an 1815 Chronograph or a Zeitwerk if they have it in stock, and if not they'll order one. As I wrote in my other post, Lange just wants your name to make sure the same person isn't ordering the same watch from multiple dealers. They never heard of any "$50K prior purchase" requirement for any of these watches.


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## DatoG

CFR said:


> I visited the NYC Lange boutique in person yesterday. Confirmed that anyone can walk in off the street and buy an 1815 Chronograph or a Zeitwerk if they have it in stock, and if not they'll order one. As I wrote in my other post, Lange just wants your name to make sure the same person isn't ordering the same watch from multiple dealers. They never heard of any "$50K prior purchase" requirement for any of these watches.


Right ....no purchase history needed except for the SS and perhaps WG Odysseus

The purchase history mainly needs to be from boutique as boutique are also the only ones getting them as well.

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## CFR

DatoG said:


> Right ....no purchase history needed except for the SS and perhaps WG Odysseus
> 
> The purchase history mainly needs to be from boutique as boutique are also the only ones getting them as well.


No purchase history is needed for the WG Odysseus Datomatic, but just like with any other watch where demand presently exceeds supply, a new client would likely wait longer than a loyal client.

Nobody can predict if a prior purchase history will be needed in the future for the SS Odysseus Datomatic, once demand eventually is satisfied among those who do have prior purchase histories. As we know, the SS Odysseus Datomatic is a standard-production model. It' is not a numbered limited edition. Time will tell if eventually anyone can walk in off the street and buy an SS Odysseus Datomatic from a boutique or an AD in the same way that right now people can walk in and buy (or order) any other standard-production Lange, including a Datograph Up/Down or Zeitwerk, without a prior purchase history.


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## qyburn

Selling only to customers with purchase history sounds like preferential treatment for flippers and grey dealers.


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## CFR

qyburn said:


> Selling only to customers with purchase history sounds like preferential treatment for flippers and grey dealers.


I'm not seeing that connection. If you flip an "application piece" such as a steel Odysseus, Lange will not sell you another application piece. And for years, Lange has actively closed ADs who are caught selling unworn pieces to the grey market. 20 years ago, Lange tolerated grey-market sales much more, and there was a very active worldwide grey market in unworn Langes with full warranties and often with open papers. No more. Those days went away a long time ago.


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## AnonPi

CFR said:


> I visited the NYC Lange boutique in person yesterday. Confirmed that anyone can walk in off the street and buy an 1815 Chronograph or a Zeitwerk if they have it in stock, and if not they'll order one. As I wrote in my other post, Lange just wants your name to make sure the same person isn't ordering the same watch from multiple dealers. They never heard of any "$50K prior purchase" requirement for any of these watches.


Yes, the original report here, which was inaccurate, was a bit alarming. But the actual policy that we now know seems entirely reasonable, including limiting the sale of "special" watches (LEs and SS Odysseus, as I understand it) to customers with purchase history. The "application" process, for those watches where it's required, as explained seems pretty innocuous too, and a good move by ALS.


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