# Does anyone think the Tarnan Oceanographer might be inspired by the Kingston?



## orian (Feb 10, 2010)

Does anyone think the Tarnan Oceanographer might be inspired by the Kingston?

http://oceanictime.blogspot.com/2011/02/tarnan-oceanographer-intro.html

It looks similar to the very early Rolex Subs, and I was wondering if its designers had been inspired by the development of the Kingston. 

No one can know, of course, but it's interesting to speculate.


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## cpotters (Jan 29, 2009)

Looks like that's a distinct possibility!


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## sunster (Apr 17, 2007)

More likely inspired by the success and demand for the Kingston


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## clouser (Apr 22, 2008)

sunster said:


> More likely inspired by the success and demand for the Kingston


No kidding. However, I'm amazed at how little attention to detail is being paid on all these vintage Rolex inspired watches that are popping up. It's like the owners/designers saw the demand for the Kingston then said "Here, let me throw something together that just looks similar and start selling it as soon as possible while interest is still up."


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## sunster (Apr 17, 2007)

I think to be fair to Tarnan, at least they've put additional effort into making a bracelet for the Oceanographer as opposed to just giving it with a nato


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## Izzy (Mar 26, 2008)

I liked the Tarnan, my name is down for one. Looking forward to it. It is very likely that the success of the Kingston had inspired its inception. I always wanted a big crown with a 3 6 9 dial with a domed crystal and it fits the bill.


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## sunster (Apr 17, 2007)

Izzy said:


> I liked the Tarnan, my name is down for one. Looking forward to it. It is very likely that the success of the Kingston had inspired its inception. I always wanted a big crown with a 3 6 9 dial with a domed crystal and it fits the bill.


When is it due? Be interested to hear your thoughts on it


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## Dragoon (Feb 17, 2006)

Looks good but it would be nice to see some real pictures of a prototype from various viewpoints prior to plunking down for a deposit. Not cheap, either. 

I like it but there are a lot of unknowns with that one. Should be fun to see some pics of real world watch.

I think it will be a nice piece to have in ones collection. 

I sort of thought the Kingston might have this effect when we discussed this a while ago.

And I also wonder why companies like Rolex and Omega dont get their heads out of the sand and re-release some of the wonderful vintage designs? I understand they sell all the watches they make. 

I guess it is good for the small guys and just a nuisance for the Big Brands.


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## Dragoon (Feb 17, 2006)

Well, they state May 2011 it will be available.



sunster said:


> When is it due? Be interested to hear your thoughts on it


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## Izzy (Mar 26, 2008)

Yep, May 2011. Will post pictures when I get it.


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## Arthur (Feb 11, 2006)

i took a look at it and it's definitely nice. The only thing I would change is the crown. it's not very attractive to me .I would put something resembling the rolex 8mm Brevet, or something similar to the Kingston.


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## Izzy (Mar 26, 2008)

I agree Arthur, that is the only thing I was hoping they would change. The crown design was were they compromised. It is 7.5mm, that was the largest they could have it without it touching the bezel. Apart from that it is going to be a very good looking watch. It is a homage based on the 6200, a very rare submariner:


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## Arthur (Feb 11, 2006)

Izzy,
If they tapered the back of the crown ,like the Rolex crown it would clear the bezel easily. As you can see from the side view photo, the crown on the 6200 comes over the bezel by a bunch, but because it's tapered, it works fine. If they did a better crown, this watch would be a definite for me, but I don't like the crown.


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## Izzy (Mar 26, 2008)

I hear you my friend, you are preaching to the converted. I have been going back and forth with this with the designer....


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## eganwh (Jan 15, 2009)

Izzy, I read your exchange with Franck concerning the crown. Sounds like he has "settled" on 7.5mm OD. Are you concerned at all with (what appears to be) the much larger diameter of the Oceanographer as compared to the Rolex 6200 with respect to the crown size? With a planned watch Ø of 42.0 mm (crown excluded) I suspect the 7.5mm crown will have much less visual weight than the big crown on the original 6200, thus defeating an important aesthetic of the homage.


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## Molle (Mar 30, 2006)

Pic's by Jocke: www.timetotalk.se: Några snabba fick det bli>>>>>>>>


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## Dragoon (Feb 17, 2006)

NT

Link: OceanicTime: TÄRNAN Oceanographer (intro)


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## sunster (Apr 17, 2007)

Looks very nice indeed


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## Dragoon (Feb 17, 2006)

Wow! That one looks amazing! Good job, Tarnan!


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## Yao (Dec 12, 2006)

They choose the easier to work with gold tone paint for the dial rather than a dual-tone plating that we did on the Kingston.


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## Yao (Dec 12, 2006)

clouser said:


> No kidding. However, I'm amazed at how little attention to detail is being paid on all these vintage Rolex inspired watches that are popping up. It's like the owners/designers saw the demand for the Kingston then said "Here, let me throw something together that just looks similar and start selling it as soon as possible while interest is still up."


Unfortunately I do think that this is the case as well. But at least they went to the length to do their own homework and design work.


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## Yao (Dec 12, 2006)

Well this is probably just a good time as any to note that the non-LE version of the Kingston will have a 3-6-9 date dial as an option. I don't know if a glossy gilt dial will be an option though. I am currently envisioning a matte dial in black, of course.


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## Dragoon (Feb 17, 2006)

If there was any way possible to get a gilt dial 3-6-9 that would be incredible. I understand there could be an upcharge for the additional effort, but, I would definitely encourage and choose that option as I think a lot of others would.

Gotta agree that your gilt dial on the Kingston is without doubt the classiest homage dial out there I have seen. It is spectacular in person.



Yao said:


> Well this is probably just a good time as any to note that the non-LE version of the Kingston will have a 3-6-9 date dial as an option. I don't know if a glossy gilt dial will be an option though. I am currently envisioning a matte dial in black, of course.


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## jimhalinda (Apr 19, 2011)

Hmm, that could make people hungry for a gilt-dial version of the Vantage!


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## Thieuster (Jan 22, 2009)

Yes! hadn't thought about that. I would certainly be interested swapping my Vantage's dial for a gilt-version! Perhaps it's possible to order more gilt dials for Vantage owners wanting to swap the dial?

Menno


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## simonsev (Jun 11, 2007)

jimhalinda said:


> Hmm, that could make people hungry for a gilt-dial version of the Vantage!


Now that would be a fantastic piece, love my Vantage and chance to have a gilt dial would make it even better..!


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## Arthur (Feb 11, 2006)

Yao said:


> They choose the easier to work with gold tone paint for the dial rather than a dual-tone plating that we did on the Kingston.


It'a a right nice looking watch, but as they say out here in the sticks, "It ain't no Kingston"!!!

As I said before, I really think the crown is a turnoff, at least for me. Another aspect of the crown, since the watch is a 42mm, the crown proportions are much more like a Submariner 6536 or or later models rather than the "big crown" 6538 amd 5510.

just my dos centavos

Arthur


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## oca_9i (Sep 9, 2009)

But for the price of a Tarnan, you can almost get 2 Davosa Ternos...It's really a hard choice beside the Kingston!


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## Arthur (Feb 11, 2006)

You might be right, however to me the Davosa is pretty much a homage (I'm being polite here!!) of the modern Sub 16610, not the older vintage 6538/6536 models. Unfortunately, the 16610 is probably the most copied watch in the world. There are lots and lots of watches similar to the Davosa out there. Now it seems like there are a lot of folks trying to recreate their version of the Rolex big crown models. Of all of these, the Kingston is head and shoulders above any that I've seen thus far.
Just my dos centavos
Arthur


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## JDS (Ohio) (Mar 1, 2007)

Yao said:


> Well this is probably just a good time as any to note that the non-LE version of the Kingston will have a 3-6-9 date dial as an option. I don't know if a glossy gilt dial will be an option though. I am currently envisioning a matte dial in black, of course.


Of course you knew the magic words to make me start saving for another one, didn't you?o|


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## JDS (Ohio) (Mar 1, 2007)

Dragoon said:


> Gotta agree that your gilt dial on the Kingston is without doubt the classiest homage dial out there I have seen. It is spectacular in person.


Got that straight! It's also pretty hard to photograph: at some angles the gilt disappears, at some others the LUME disappears, and all you see is the gilt outlines and minute marks. Maddening sometimes, but cool nonetheless. I don't imagine you'd get those same effects with paint.

That said, I might want a NON-gilt dial option for my second Kingston fix. That's the worst part of ordering a Mark II, making that final decision as you hit the order button. Give me options, so my wife can laugh at me as I tear my hair out deciding.o|


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## Dragoon (Feb 17, 2006)

Well, taking pics and watches is sort of a double edged sword. Sometimes macro settings can make a minor cosmetic mark appear a giant blemish and other times special lighting, lenses, filters, and photoshop can make a regular watch look like a designer piece which may or may not be the case.

But, definitely, some watches are more difficult than others to capture.



















I cannot imagine NOT getting a gilt dial option for a Kingston unless you already have a gilt dial version. I have not seen this method of producing a gilt dial in a piece in this price range (fancy way of saying I have never seen a gilt dial like this ).



JDS (Ohio) said:


> Got that straight! It's also pretty hard to photograph: at some angles the gilt disappears, at some others the LUME disappears, and all you see is the gilt outlines and minute marks. Maddening sometimes, but cool nonetheless. I don't imagine you'd get those same effects with paint.
> 
> That said, I might want a NON-gilt dial option for my second Kingston fix. That's the worst part of ordering a Mark II, making that final decision as you hit the order button. Give me options, so my wife can laugh at me as I tear my hair out deciding.o|


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## JDS (Ohio) (Mar 1, 2007)

Well, fortunately I already have a gilt dial Kingston already in hand. I would love a 3-6-9 dial version, but wonder if TWO gilt dial Kingstons might cannibalize each other's wrist time. But not to worry, Bill always gives us choices. Maybe a 3-6-9 gilt, with C-3 super luminova?

Unfortunately, on the other hand, my photography isn't reliably up to capturing these gilt dials, whether straight Sub layout or the 3-6-9 MilSub. b-)


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## Dragoon (Feb 17, 2006)

That macro shot close up on the wrist looks pretty good to me!

Yes, two Kingstons in one household is pure decadence!


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## Izzy (Mar 26, 2008)

The Oceanographer is an awesome watch and a real beast! Beautiful 3-6-9 dial configuration and the details of the crown and the caseback are very nice touches. I replaced the steel bracelet with a military strap which set off the C3 lume perfectly. It is currently my summer watch together with my MKII Milsub. Just wish my Kingston could join them.


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## Dragoon (Feb 17, 2006)

Izzy,

That Tarnan Oceanographer is way cool! Thanks for the cool pics!


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## bin31z (Jan 5, 2011)

Umm what? Inspired by the Kingston? How can a watch be inspired by a homage?


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## Dragoon (Feb 17, 2006)

Well, one way to look at this is that the Kingston has generated a great deal of interest and demand in its short existence. The ability to obtain a modern interpretation of an unobtainable grail piece such as the Rolex Big Crown model 6538 (or whateva the model #) perhaps has generated or ignited a recent trend in the smaller boutique watchmakers bringing back models that have not been seen for 40-50 years or more.

On top of that , these homage pieces have the modern improvements and materials available to make the modern interpretations quite servicable wihtout worrying about harming or destroying a $60,000 collectors piece. That is, if you can or could afford an original.

So, I believe what the OP may have been asking is: Did the creation of the Kingston and the astounding reception upon its delivery promote some smaller manufactures to re-create some of the more obscure but highly collectible Rolex grail watches. The Ternan O shares with the Kingston the early Rolex design as the Ternan is a homage to the Rolex from the late 50's, I believe...forget the model #.

So, that may be how a homage can influence the creation of another homage if my explanation makes any sense. Then again, Ternan may have had this piece in the works for a few years, dont know.

Back when Bill was working on production of the kingstons many of us discussed this very issue of other manufactures creating similar homages based of the buzz the Kingston was creating. Go back thru the Kingston threads and you can read it in black and white. I think what the OP may have in mind is that the buzz of Kingston and immense appeal of the design from customers may have encouraged other boutique brands to explore this area of design, if they were not already.

Nice to see the Ternan is based on a different Rolex model. It really is gorgeous.

And certainly MK II is not alone in creating Rolex homages to bygone Rolex designs or Omega designs, for that matter, which have been all but abandoned by their manufacturer. O7 created the LM-7 in homage to the Ploprof. Helson created the SkinDiver and the Sharkmaster (in homage to the Omega 1000, I think that is the correct model designation). And, all the BP 50 Fathoms homage pieces such as the MK II Stingray, Timefactors PRS-50, O7 LM-5, and a whole boatload of Rolex submariner homages, many of which are quite servicable just to name a few.

I guess Rolex and Omega have such outstanding business success in the last 20 years or longer that the older designs are of little interest to them anymore. Occasionally you see tribute pieces such as the re-intro of the Ploprof and such but it is more of second thought or tribute than a planned reintro of older model line ups.



bin31z said:


> Umm what? Inspired by the Kingston? How can a watch be inspired by a homage?


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## cpotters (Jan 29, 2009)

Dragoon said:


> Well, one way to look at this is that the Kingston has generated a great deal of interest and demand in its short existence. The ability to obtain a modern interpretation of an unobtainable grail piece such.............and certainly MK II is not alone in creating Rolex homages to bygone Rolex designs or Omega designs, for that matter, which have been all but abandoned by their manufacturer..................I guess Rolex and Omega have such outstanding business success in the last 20 years or longer that the older designs are of little interest to them anymore. Occasionally you see tribute pieces such as the re-intro of the Ploprof and such but it is more of second thought or tribute than a planned reintro of older model line ups.


An excellent post - its worth reflecting that this genre of watch (the classic reinterpretations of the stainless tool watch from the 50s and 60s) is becoming more popular - generically - as a reaction to a broader watch market which has delivered designs that are much bigger, much flashier and often more complicated.

Rather than think of these "improved classics" as copies piggy-backing on the glory of another's design, think of them as having the same appeal as the reintroduced Mini Cooper, VW Beetle, or the BMW "1" series: exhibiting the spirit of the past with modern updates that appeal to today's consumer. Are they for everybody? Not really, but nothing should be "for everybody". So long as these watches - regardless of maker - are well crafted timepieces made with first rate materials and finished to the highest standard, then the wearing of one requires no explanation


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## Izzy (Mar 26, 2008)

I agree, Dragoon's post is spot on. This hobby of ours is 1st and foremost a "passion" and within this passion there are different types. You have your vintage lovers, movement aficionados and you have the ones that love anything new. Within this you have watch fans who align themselves to particular brands and it is like supporting your local football team, which at times I find funny in reading posts whenever certain brands are discussed in a defensive manner. For me, I am interested in all watches but I have particular fondness for vintage Rolexes. The watches they made between the 50's and to the mid-80's were in my mind its golden period. Some of these watches are rare, because of the short run in the particular dial configurations and also because they had more than one external dial maker. The prices of these watches are so high now and it is prohibitive for most to buy. But it is not just Rolex who made fantastic watches during this period. If you ask Patek Philippe collectors and to name their favorite watches they would mostly come from the 50's and 60's, their perpetual calendars and chronographs from this period are absolutely stunning. Same goes for Vacheron Constantin, Universal, Heuer (pre-TAG), Brietling, Omega to name but a few. This is where the Kingston and the Oceanographer come in, they were built by people with a passion for a classic watch. 
To Charlie's point, VW's new beetle looks like its going to be a winner a much better interpretation than the last one!


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## sunster (Apr 17, 2007)

The first real life pics of this watch I've seen...looks great...please post some pics on the bracelet too some time


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## arnold716 (May 29, 2011)

hi 
don't want to canibalize the mkii forum, but here's some pics of the tarnan oceanographer and the bracelet, very very good work from taernan


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## NaecoSea (May 10, 2009)

Two points:


1) I would definitely want a 3 6 9 Kingston Date Dial

2) If it were gilt in silver instead of gold it would be my perfect watch! (Yes I know it's not historically accurate)

I did manage to get a 3, 6, 9 HRV LRRP which I love but there's something about the slightly smaller size of the 369 numbers to the rest of the dial that throws it off just a tad enough (given I'm extremely picky so it's probably just my anal retention). I know literally nothing about the logistics and practicality of enlarging those numbers on future editions so I would chalk up the size choice to my own ignorance.

Still I can't wait for what Bill can come up with for the Non-LE!!!! :-!


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