# How to clean old dial ?



## bricem13 (Apr 6, 2010)

Hello all


I got an old seiko 6309-7049 whci has some patina on dial as well lume is turning to be grey. I like that because it is how it should look. But anyway I'll will service the movement in the upcoming weeks so I'll disassemble the dial and was wondering what I could use for cleaning it ? I don't want the patina off but want to be sure it is clean.

Is rodico a good option ? won't it get lume off?

Best regards,
Brice


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## Outta Time (Feb 9, 2010)

If there is a way to clean old dials without damaging them, I would sure like to hear about it. The safest way is just a little water on a lint free cloth and dab. Alcohol, soap, or cleaners of any kind can and will strip numerals, logos, and laquer instantly. I recently had rodico strip a brand new date disc when all I was trying to do was remove a fingerprint and some dust. Lume becomes brittle with age and will flake off with little effort. There is no way of knowing what laquer was used on the dial or what the composition of the paint or pigments were, so it's trial and error. The only dials I have cleaned with any success are (cracked) enamel dials from old pocket watches. I have also yet to see a really good dial resto. I have had limited success with stripping the dial and repainting. I have also had limited success using Pledge (furniture polish) and a very, very soft brush.


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## Beau8 (May 24, 2008)

Some have used copper wire brush to remove dirt and debris from the back of the dial and Rodico to clean the dial. However, caution should definitely be used on either the dial face or the back~Cheers!


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## Henry Hatem (Sep 28, 2006)

Each dial presents its own issues and techniques. First - DO NO DAMAGE!

If you are looking to make it new - make it new with a refinished dial
If you are looking to clean it up - clean it up with a dial brush or other very very soft CLEAN CLEAN brush to remove extraneous detritus.
If you want to clean it - recognize what is on the dial - decals, ink, lume - all pose their own issues. a short blast of clean air may be the solution.
Next would be to "think" of rodico or similar product to pull up stubborn detritus and possibly some embedded dirt. But it can also pull lume or poor ink.

If all those fail - now think liquids..... but what is the dial made of and what is on it? decals... ink... paper...
some dials can with stand a soft brush and water but make sure you kow what the dial is composed of. 

Old porcelain dials - you can possibly get more aggressive but it is all a risk. AND you must determine your risk! what happens if it gets destroyed...
once you determine the risk you can escalate cleaning techniques the list goes on but this is where it starts.

Start slow and increase aggressiveness till the sesired effect is achieved. DON'T OVER DO IT!

All the best, Henry




bricem13 said:


> Hello all
> 
> I got an old seiko 6309-7049 whci has some patina on dial as well lume is turning to be grey. I like that because it is how it should look. But anyway I'll will service the movement in the upcoming weeks so I'll disassemble the dial and was wondering what I could use for cleaning it ? I don't want the patina off but want to be sure it is clean.
> 
> ...


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## TheManWhoFalls (Sep 13, 2013)

Commandeering this thread. Didn't want to make a new one.









Vintage Semca. AS1220/1221. I date it to around the 50's? Dial has a rough surface. I originally thought the black stuff was simply dirt. Regrettably I brought some tweezers to the dial and it appears the black stuff does not simply flake off: it takes some white with it. The area around 6 o'clock is lighter and shinier because of this. I'm considering a few different solutions:
-warm water
-water + vinegar
-rubbing alcohol
-saliva (another thread advised this)
-lighter fluid

In your opinion, does it look ok as is? I don't want to do any more damage than I've already done. I will be reluming the dial and hands.


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## Somewhere else (Feb 17, 2006)

TheManWhoFalls said:


> Commandeering this thread. Didn't want to make a new one.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Be very careful not to destroy the dial. Water and Vinegar works somewhat on cleaning up gold plating, such as hands. But keep in mind that Vinegar is acetic acid and must be diluted with water otherwise it could take your whole dial away. And here's something else to keep in mind, don't try cleaning with just any water. Tap water has fluoride and other chemicals in it. Use distilled water , such as is used in irons.

Here is where I give my lecture on what dials are made of, at least on the printing side: Until into the 1960s and then, in many cases to this day, the dial is printed in a sandwich of a cellulose acetate lacquer right on the metal, then a oil based ink on top of that, with another cellulose acetate layer on top of that. Of course there were thousands of variations of this and as many chemical formulations of this as you want.

So because of the chemistry of the lacquer on vintage watch dials, you do not try cleaning with rubbing alcohol (isopropyl alcohol) which is a disinfectant and also a powerful household cleaner. One of the things housewives know is that it will get hairspray (I come from a generation when women used to use hairspray) off of mirrors, but you should never use it to try to take hairspray off of furniture because it will take the lacquer with it. Isopropyl alcohol (rubbing alcohol) _dissolves_ cellulose acetate which is what many hairsprays are made of and hey....what the dial of your vintage watch is lacquered with.

The same goes for lighter fluid, which is naptha. Naphtha is also used to thin or dissolve cellulose acetate. Never let it near a watch dial.

Saliva is mildly acidic. Just don't get in the habit of licking your watch dials.

Basically cleaning a watch dial--and I don't recommend you even try--involve removing some or all of the top layer of discolored layer of cellulose acetate lacquer that protects the ink on the dial. Some people do it. Some people actually succeed at it. But the other 99% of humanity make a mess of their dial.

I recommend carefully cleaning it with distilled water only using cotton Q tips. Otherwise, you may run into problems.


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## geronimo95 (Sep 5, 2013)

my wife is a jeweller and she has a very simple cleaner consisting of a dip basket into a virbrating container - a real cheapo version of a proper jewelry cleaner. I've been using it to clean dials in a warm solution of distilled water and dish soap - the kind you use to wash your dinner dishes (scent free of course). leave it in there for a few hours buzzing and then rinse in water and pat them dry. a hair dryer on low can be used to dry the dials quickly if corrosion is a concern.

so far no paint or patina loss on any of the dials ive cleaned. Just dirt coming off very very gradually. the process is so slow so its very controllable.


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## Somewhere else (Feb 17, 2006)

geronimo95 said:


> my wife is a jeweller and she has a very simple cleaner consisting of a dip basket into a virbrating container - a real cheapo version of a proper jewelry cleaner. I've been using it to clean dials in a warm solution of distilled water and dish soap - the kind you use to wash your dinner dishes (scent free of course). leave it in there for a few hours buzzing and then rinse in water and pat them dry. a hair dryer on low can be used to dry the dials quickly if corrosion is a concern.
> 
> so far no paint or patina loss on any of the dials ive cleaned. Just dirt coming off very very gradually. the process is so slow so its very controllable.


So far you've been lucky. The first thing that we learned in watchmaking school all those many years ago was "never put a watch dial in an ultrasonic cleaner". Not even with soap and water. The vibration from the medium will shake off the not just the dirt, but the ink also. I've seen it happen.


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## Brauer (Feb 19, 2015)

Ive cleaned some dials,and the best result BY FAR is with baby-oil and a soft cotton cloth


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## Outta Time (Feb 9, 2010)

I'd like to add an update to this, if I may.
I have had some very good results sending dials to International Dial Co.


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## bsshog40 (Apr 7, 2015)

I have been using a Rodico. It won't remove stains but it does clean dials to a certain extent. I've rubbed it across the numbers, letters and lumes and have not had any issues. It's not for severely damaged dials though as its more for some dirt and smudges.


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