# Best Value Automatic Dive Watch Under $500



## gwhibbs (Sep 16, 2010)

Any suggestions?


----------



## bedlam (Jul 1, 2009)

Easy, the Bluering


----------



## 5661nicholas (Dec 18, 2008)

The favorite of my humble collection, incredible value....................Seiko Sumo


----------



## dnslater (Feb 26, 2009)

If you do a search, this question comes up frequently. Per above, the Halios Bluering and Seiko Sumo tend to be the most common suggestions, and would be mine as well. Can't go wrong. Here are a few alternatives.

Steinhart Ocean 1
Benarus Remora (perhaps close to $500 used)
Steinhart Triton 30ATM








There are a number of other solid Boutique watches in the $500 price range with solid hacking/handwinding movements and sapphire crystals. Look at Boschett, Bernhardt, Ocean 7, Deep Blue and others. These brands all have excellent customer service.


----------



## caesarmascetti (Dec 17, 2007)

gwhibbs said:


> Any suggestions?


Value is a very subjective attribute. What one person values another may not. Perfect examples auto movement vs quartz, hacking versus nonhacking, manual winding ability on an auto versus no manual winding ability. Buying new vs used, swiss, vs asian, big name vs micro etc........ In the end buy the design that most appeals to you.


----------



## Oldboy7 (Sep 17, 2010)

Victorinox Dive Master 500 Quartz! LOL! :-d Apologies, that was PRE-coffee POST Game Night :-d I hear really good things about the Debaufre, Halios and perhaps used Victorinox Dive Master 500 Auto? :-s Best of luck in your search |>


----------



## 2BATTRANGER (Feb 7, 2010)

+1 for the BlueRing! Solid, most comfortable, best lume, great looking, unique styled watch out there! In that price range.


----------



## Crazy Cajun (Oct 19, 2006)

Orient Mako, less than $200.


----------



## Birddogone (Jul 27, 2010)

*Tissot SeaStar 1000*, if you can find one. The detail on the dial, hands and case back are uncomparable in my opinion. I paid around $350.00 brand new for mine when they first came out.

*






*


----------



## 20DYNAMITE07 (Mar 3, 2009)

Geeeze... there are TONS of watches to choose from... what makes them the best value is up to you to decide.

Vostok Amphibia
Orient Mako
Seiko 007/009
Seiko Monster
Tauchmeister T0046 (though some eliteists will disagree on the grounds that it's GermAsian) 
EDIT: Citizen EcoZilla
Most of Deep Blue's line up... Same with Boschett
Seiko Sumo
Debaufre/Steinheart Ocean 1
Halios Bluering

And on and on and on.....


----------



## 1R0NH31D3 (Jan 8, 2009)

20DYNAMITE07 said:


> Tauchmeister T0046 (though some eliteists will disagree on the grounds that it's GermAsian)


Yeah all those elitist who don't like crappy watch manufacturers who go out of their way to mislead the uninformed. Man those stuck-up elitist who try to keep people from buying garbage are sure a bunch of jerks!

With the exception of the Tacky-meister this is a pretty solid list, all of these are a good value.


----------



## 20DYNAMITE07 (Mar 3, 2009)

1R0NH31D3 said:


> Yeah all those elitist who don't like crappy watch manufacturers who go out of their way to mislead the uninformed. Man those stuck-up elitist who try to keep people from buying garbage are sure a bunch of jerks!
> 
> With the exception of the Tacky-meister this is a pretty solid list, all of these are a good value.


Well, they've got their issues to be sure... but I personally don't have a problem with that model. Sapphire Glass, Miyota 8215 movement, 1000m case (I know...says them. But Deep Blue uses the same case and also makes the 1000m claim - so I give it more creedence) and good looks (1 of Tauchmesiter's 2 good looking watches - they have a submariner GMT that looks nice... the rest aren't so hot IMO). All that for $150 is a pretty good deal. You just have to hope you don't need any customer service ;-).

As far as a German company building a watch with Asian components (and in most cases building most of their products in Asia) that doesn't really bug me like it does others - but that's just me. :-!


----------



## Kent108 (Jan 17, 2007)

"Crappy"?

Well, a while back one of the guys here put a Tauchmeister (Deporte is the same watch, just branded differently on the dial) through a pretty impressive torture test and it survived with flying colors:

https://www.watchuseek.com/f74/deporte-torture-test-144541.html

The watch was baked, microwaved, run through a dishwasher, frozen, etc. No problems whatsoever.

IMO, that's impressive, and none of the watches listed in your signature would do any better. Some might not do as well.

I have no experience with the brand, and it probably wouldn't get my vote for best value. But I think it deserves a spot in the contest.



1R0NH31D3 said:


> Yeah all those elitist who don't like crappy watch manufacturers who go out of their way to mislead the uninformed. Man those stuck-up elitist who try to keep people from buying garbage are sure a bunch of jerks!
> 
> With the exception of the Tacky-meister this is a pretty solid list, all of these are a good value.


----------



## 1R0NH31D3 (Jan 8, 2009)

If an actual real life friend had a couple hundred dollars to spend on one watch would you recommend that he get a Tauchmeister?


----------



## Kent108 (Jan 17, 2007)

Nope. BUT, if he said he wanted to get one, I wouldn't tell him he was crazy for doing so ...



1R0NH31D3 said:


> If an actual real life friend had a couple hundred dollars to spend on one watch would you recommend that he get a Tauchmeister?


----------



## caesarmascetti (Dec 17, 2007)

1R0NH31D3 said:


> If an actual real life friend had a couple hundred dollars to spend on one watch would you recommend that he get a Tauchmeister?


I'd recommend a Seiko DIver


----------



## Ticktocker (Oct 27, 2009)

20DYNAMITE07 said:


> Well, they've got their issues to be sure... but I personally don't have a problem with that model. Sapphire Glass, Miyota 8215 movement, 1000m case (I know...says them. But Deep Blue uses the same case and also makes the 1000m claim - so I give it more creedence) and good looks (1 of Tauchmesiter's 2 good looking watches - they have a submariner GMT that looks nice... the rest aren't so hot IMO). All that for $150 is a pretty good deal. You just have to hope you don't need any customer service ;-).
> 
> As far as a German company building a watch with Asian components (and in most cases building most of their products in Asia) that doesn't really bug me like it does others - but that's just me. :-!


It really depends on what you are requiring in a dive watch. Are you going to dive? I don't like 98% of Invicta watches but their 40mm Pro Diver with the Miyota auto is a great watch for the low price.

That Tauch sure looks a lot like my Momentum. They have incredible lume, long lasting batteries and are about $175. I was lucky enough to be the only bidder on this one and got it for $75 on ebay.


----------



## 20DYNAMITE07 (Mar 3, 2009)

1R0NH31D3 said:


> If an actual real life friend had a couple hundred dollars to spend on one watch would you recommend that he get a Tauchmeister?


If I had a buddy that said, "I wanna chunky automatic diver and I only want to spend $150" I would at least mention it to him. Personally, I'd try to talk him into an Orient Mako or a Seiko 007... Or if he were willing to go Quartz, I would tell him about the Deep Blue for customer service reasons. But some people like big hunks of metal, and that might fit the bill.

Ignore the name on the dial for a second... the case, movement, glass, and looks all add up to a nice package. It really is a pretty nice watch for $150.


----------



## nam6869usmc1 (Nov 12, 2008)

Deep Blue has a group under $500 right now over on Shopnbc,, you can go ETA or Miyota, *Sapphire all*, (T100 Trit Tubes or reg Lume).


----------



## 1R0NH31D3 (Jan 8, 2009)

I can see where your coming from for sure. And I do agree with some of what your saying and value your opinion. But. I'm still not convinced. I think they are crap and I'm recommending to gwhibbs that out of every watch mentioned in this thread the Tauch would be my last choice, based of the watches I have experience with. Everything else mentioned in this thread is a better choice. 



20DYNAMITE07 said:


> If I had a buddy that said, "I wanna chunky automatic diver and I only want to spend $150" I would at least mention it to him. Personally, I'd try to talk him into an Orient Mako or a Seiko 007... Or if he were willing to go Quartz, I would tell him about the Deep Blue for customer service reasons. But some people like big hunks of metal, and that might fit the bill.
> 
> Ignore the name on the dial for a second... the case, movement, glass, and looks all add up to a nice package. It really is a pretty nice watch for $150.


----------



## 20DYNAMITE07 (Mar 3, 2009)

1R0NH31D3 said:


> I can see where your coming from for sure. And I do agree with some of what your saying and value your opinion. But. I'm still not convinced. I think they are crap and I'm recommending to gwhibbs that out of every watch mentioned in this thread the Tauch would be my last choice, based of the watches I have experience with. Everything else mentioned in this thread is a better choice.


Fair enough ;-)


----------



## Elkabong (Jan 5, 2011)

I really enjoy the Artego Diver (first version) I purchased from this site from another member. Nice heft, built like a tank and good timekeeper with the Miyota movement.


----------



## Todd5851 (Dec 12, 2006)

My choice would have to be the Seiko SKX007. It is the best $160 I have ever spent. I don't know of any sub $500 watch that exeeds the Seiko's looks, quality, and performance. By the way, mine is accurate to within 2 secs/day to boot.:-!


----------



## surfguy (Aug 8, 2006)

IMHO this category is won by Seiko SKX series at $200!


----------



## jason_recliner (Feb 2, 2009)

All round best value? Monster

But if you want to step up a notch, you can really see (and feel) where the extra $$$ go in a Sumo. I had the Sumo on yesteday and HOLY COW IT'S A GREAT WATCH!


----------



## dnslater (Feb 26, 2009)

surfguy said:


> IMHO this category is won by Seiko SKX series at $200!


I loved my SKX007 and really love my Monster, but you get some serious value upgrades by spending $500, such as sapphire, handwinding, hacking and a more accurate movement. It is rare for a 7s26 to be near COSC out of the box. Sumo is in a different league than the 007.


----------



## azpops (Jul 10, 2010)

Deleted...

Pops


----------



## nakedjohnny (Nov 21, 2009)

if you can find a used on how about victorinox dive master 500m. If you really wanted a swiss movement. ETA 2892.A2 is regarded as 'nicer' than 2824 by many.

If you wanted one with 7S movement or ETA 2824 there are so many options I wouldn't know where to start.

Sumo is certainly a step up, more comparable to VDM500.


----------



## oiram (May 25, 2010)

*Seiko Sumo and Orient Revolver*


----------



## tyclu (Jan 1, 2008)

lotta love for Seikos. and rightfully so. FYI... Ocean7 has a sale on the LM-3 right now -- chunky 1000m diver, auto, sapphire, bracelet, etc...


----------



## toph (Oct 12, 2008)

another for the bluering, an absolute cracker for the price. i would have paid double and woudln't be dissapointed.
cheers


----------



## chronomeister (Sep 14, 2008)

As much as I love micro brew manufacturers have to say hands down on the mid-high end a Seiko SUMO and on the low end a 007 ....or my mod'd 7S26's or Monsters......they run and run and run....:-!:roll:

Note- Sumo pic borrowed....


----------



## markrlondon (Mar 7, 2007)

Ticktocker said:


> That Tauch sure looks a lot like my Momentum. They have incredible lume, long lasting batteries and are about $175. I was lucky enough to be the only bidder on this one and got it for $75 on ebay.


These watches are also sold under the Divex, Apeks (see http://www.apeks.co.uk/products/pro... 500 Metre Dive Watch&Category=Diving Watches ), and Aqualung brands, amongst others.


----------



## Maffy (Aug 19, 2008)

gwhibbs said:


> Any suggestions?


Seiko SKX series, Samurai or Sumo
Citizen JP2000 or ecozilla

;-)


----------



## TACSTS (May 11, 2008)

I'd say just about any Seiko Diver under $500 is going to be a great value. You've got several to choose from too - 007 (and blue and orange and yellow dialed variants), Monster (black or orange), Sumo (black, blue or orange), and Samurai's if you can find them still. 

If it were my $500 - I'd post a WTB for a Marathon SAR or GSAR. Two of my favorite watches. A little above the $500 pricepoint new, but lots show up used in that range. I got each of mine for ~$400 if I remember correctly.


----------



## drummerdan (Feb 17, 2006)

I know it's been said many times before, but the Sumo IS a great watch. And, only slightly over your budget but worth it!


----------



## orientwatchusa (Jan 24, 2010)

Well obviously I'm a little biased, but there are a lot of options for a great diver if you're on a budget. Orient has some great divers, like the popular Mako and Mako XL.


----------



## jlh2600 (Mar 17, 2006)

*What?!*



Kent108 said:


> The watch was baked, *microwaved*, run through a dishwasher, frozen, etc. No problems whatsoever.


With my hectic schedule, I don't always _have_ time to remove my hands from microwave ovens before pressing start. Finally- a diver built to endure the rigors of the modern professional on the go.


















...but was it also _dropped on the ground_?! If so, that one. If no, something in a $500 plastic watch.


----------



## watarski (Mar 12, 2006)

*Re: What?!*

While I agree with the Seiko comments, I have a hard time fully recommending any in this category. I myself am trying to find a good "toolish" (overused term, I know) diver. For me, the exclusion of a sapphire crystal on the Seiko's is ridiculous. These crystals don't cost that much, and the hardlex is too easy to scratch for me. That and the polished case finish...

However, I've been toying with the idea of having one of my Seiko's blasted and a crystal installed and calling it a day.


----------



## mav66 (Sep 1, 2008)

No contest. Best dive watch for under 500 = SUMO


----------



## Brandon -B- (Oct 21, 2009)

Birddogone said:


> *Tissot SeaStar 1000*, if you can find one. The detail on the dial, hands and case back are uncomparable in my opinion. I paid around $350.00 brand new for mine when they first came out.


Obviously this is going to be a subjective topic but I 100% agree with this. The detail on this watch is unmatched In this price range. The hands, the silver applied markers, the black bezel with raised silver numbers, the domed sapphire crystal, see through caseback polished/ brushed case. Not to mention the classic look. Mine is running incredibly accurately for over a year. I get tons of compliments on it from strangers. Really it's probably a great value anywhere under $1000. I know you can still find them Grey Market however you feel about that.


Emailing: seastarpocket by BrandonB00, on Flickr

photo.JPG by BrandonB00, on Flickr

photo.JPG by BrandonB00, on Flickr


----------



## nam6869usmc1 (Nov 12, 2008)

*Re: What?!*



watarski said:


> While I agree with the Seiko comments, I have a hard time fully recommending any in this category. I myself am trying to find a good "toolish" (overused term, I know) diver. For me, the exclusion of a sapphire crystal on the Seiko's is ridiculous. These crystals don't cost that much, and the hardlex is too easy to scratch for me. That and the polished case finish...
> 
> However, I've been toying with the idea of having one of my Seiko's blasted and a crystal installed and calling it a day.


Agree concerning the lack of Sapphire, I destroyed two seiko Kenetics crystals just by wearing them daily, but I'm very hard on them all. I think the Sumo is one of the best looking & soild piece's out there and to upgrade to Sapphire would make it very hard to "Beat"... I've read quite a few post where peeps upgrade Sumo to Sapphire & think it made a big difference.


----------



## ramblin_wreck08 (Jan 26, 2010)

*Re: What?!*



watarski said:


> While I agree with the Seiko comments, I have a hard time fully recommending any in this category. I myself am trying to find a good "toolish" (overused term, I know) diver. For me, the exclusion of a sapphire crystal on the Seiko's is ridiculous. These crystals don't cost that much, and the hardlex is too easy to scratch for me. That and the polished case finish...
> 
> However, I've been toying with the idea of having one of my Seiko's blasted and a crystal installed and calling it a day.


You could argue that hardlex is better for diving since it's more resistant to shattering. It all depends on what you want to do with the watch. Seiko designed it for diving, hence the hardlex. Doesn't bother me a bit, but YMMV. In any event, you could always get a sapphire crystal installed if the hardlex bothers you. I don't think it should affect your decision either way.

With regard to the polished parts of the case, I got mine brushed. Highly scratch resistant. Love it.


----------



## watarski (Mar 12, 2006)

*Re: What?!*

Josh - i agree with your points, I'm just anal about the scratches is all. Where did you get your case brushed?


----------



## ramblin_wreck08 (Jan 26, 2010)

*Re: What?!*



watarski said:


> Josh - i agree with your points, I'm just anal about the scratches is all. Where did you get your case brushed?


Got it brushed by Noah Fuller. Very pleased.


----------



## Toronto Pete (Jan 2, 2010)

*Re: What?!*

A lot of love for the Sumo here.

But every time I see their choice of 12:00 marker I have to suppress a snort of laughter. Oh, Seiko, you jokers.


----------



## bedlam (Jul 1, 2009)

*Re: What?!*

Ok, I understand now. So if I spend more than the OP designated and I have the case finish improved and I get the crystal improved by having sapphire installed and I do something about the undersized bracelet and crappy clasp...then the SUMO!!!! is the best watch for a lot more money, time and effort than the other suggestions required!

I'm thinking we should call this condition MySUMOpia

:-d


----------



## jason_recliner (Feb 2, 2009)

*Re: What?!*



bedlam said:


> Ok, I understand now. So if I spend more than the OP designated and I have the case finish improved and I get the crystal improved by having sapphire installed and I do something about the undersized bracelet and crappy clasp...then the SUMO!!!! is the best watch for a lot more money, time and effort than the other suggestions required!


You're way off here.

It is impossible to improve the finish of the case without access to state of the art machine tools. It is as good as it gets for a dive watch, and is way beyond anything else under $1000. You can have it brushed, or brush it yourself, if that is your thing. But you would ruin the perfectly honed edges, amazingly consistent brushing, and deep polish.

If you prefer a sapphire you can have one fitted, I think it runs to around $50 bucks.

The bracelet isn't the best, but it isn't bad. It just pales compared to the rest of the watch. It certainly isn't "undersized", unless maybe you have a 12 inch wrist.

The clasp isn't great (never hurt Rolex!), but you can replace it with that from the MM300, which is one of the best. Budget around $80. You can also fit the MM300 strap which looks sensational - mine was under $25.

So, in case you're still having trouble keeping up...

Used (minty) Sumo = $400
Crystal = $50
MM300 clasp = $80
MM300 strap = $25

Total = $555.

Slightly over the OP's budget but nothing else comes close to touching this one.


----------



## midshipman01 (Dec 29, 2008)

*Re: What?!*

I'd also suggest going with yobokies' Anvil with fitted Sumo endlinks. That awesome, hefty bracelet takes the Sumo to a whole new place in terms of looks and feel for less than $100, and fixes the clasp issue in the process.


----------



## jlh2600 (Mar 17, 2006)

*Re: What?!*

Brandon B. & BIrd dog, tell me more about that tissot? Specifically the bezel action & how it feels on the wrist- because that caseback shape does not look especially comfortable. anything in the way of lume?


----------



## ref3525 (Sep 4, 2009)

*Artego 300 :-d*


----------



## bedlam (Jul 1, 2009)

*Re: What?!*



jason_recliner said:


> You're way off here.
> 
> So, in case you're still having trouble keeping up...
> 
> ...


So, if I go over the OP budget and change all the things you listed then its the SUMO!!! all the way!

Thanks for making my point ;-)


----------



## ramblin_wreck08 (Jan 26, 2010)

*Re: What?!*



jason_recliner said:


> You're way off here.
> 
> It is impossible to improve the finish of the case without access to state of the art machine tools. It is as good as it gets for a dive watch, and is way beyond anything else under $1000. You can have it brushed, or brush it yourself, if that is your thing. But you would ruin the perfectly honed edges, amazingly consistent brushing, and deep polish.
> 
> ...


Just for clarification, the comment on brushing the case was aimed only at watarski's post regarding a tool watch. I don't know how many include the Sumo in that category, but I am not one of them. I was specifically referring to a way to make the SKX007 more "toolish" by making it more scratch resistant. And that was only due to his comment about how easily the polished finish gets scratched.


----------



## Fullers1845 (Nov 23, 2008)

No disagreement with the Seiko recommendations. I'll throw in the Debaufre Ocean 1 (or one of the newer Steinhart Ocean watches with the improved bezel and caseback) into the mix:


----------



## Birddogone (Jul 27, 2010)

*Re: What?!*

jlh, The bezel is a 60 click and is tight with no play. The SeaStar 1000 came with a rubber strap w/ a stainless deployment, there were some complaints about how the deployment stuck into your wrist. It did not bother me, but I prefer the sail cloth strap instead. The case back is as comfortable for me as any other watch, no problems. I don't mean to beat a horse that is still kick'n, but for a Swiss watch with a Swiss ETA automatic movement (gains one second per day) nothing IMHO comes close to this watch. The Deep Blue Master 2000 does, but is almost twice the original price of the Tissot.
Hope this helps,
Rod



jlh2600 said:


> Brandon B. & BIrd dog, tell me more about that tissot? Specifically the bezel action & how it feels on the wrist- because that caseback shape does not look especially comfortable. anything in the way of lume?


----------



## MacDaddy (Jun 21, 2007)

*Re: What?!*

Another vote for the Seiko skx series:-!


----------



## jason_recliner (Feb 2, 2009)

*Re: What?!*



bedlam said:


> So, if I go over the OP budget and change all the things you listed then its the SUMO!!! all the way!
> 
> Thanks for making my point ;-)


I'm not sure what your particular gripe is with the Sumo, or if you're being intentionally beligerent here...

The used watch is $400 (I've seen them for less). You don't need to spend a cent more on it. If you were so inclined, you could could pick up any of the above items, or all of them, but then you would be $55 (11%) over OP's budget.

It's watches, not rocket science.

Ramblin, I understood you were talking about something else, but your point was picked up upon and misunderstood to imply that the Sumo needs refinishing.


----------



## bedlam (Jul 1, 2009)

*Re: What?!*



jason_recliner said:


> I'm not sure what your particular gripe is with the Sumo, or if you're being intentionally beligerent here...


Not agreeing with you isn't belligerence. And probably the only way we can settle this is for me to buy a SUMO!!! and see for myself. The pursuit of objective data to establish the truth in a scientific manner is the best reason I can think of to buy another watch ;-)


----------



## slivver71 (Sep 15, 2006)

seiko sumo...bluering...precista prs14/18a...mkii (a used blackwater or stingray!)...all great watches! i've owned all 4 at some point and have 3 of them presently :-!!!!


----------



## Raza (Jul 21, 2010)

I know everyone says Sumo. I really like the Bluering and passed on a scratch and dent model with a deep nick in it (still kicking myself) and would love to add one to my collection one day (but it has to be the right one; silver dial).

I'm going to go ahead and also recommend a Seiko, but not the Sumo. The Spork/Kamikaze. The Seiko SRP043K1/2. I have a K2 myself and love it. I bought the K2 over the K1 fro two reasons. 1, the K2 is cheaper. 2, the K2 comes on rubber and the K1 comes on a bracelet; I planned on replacing the strap either way, so why pay extra for a naked steel bracelet that I don't care for in the first place?










Got the strap from Bradystraps for $30. Total cost was $300, including shipping from Longislandwatch.com and the strap and shipping from Bradystraps.com. It doesn't hack or handwind, but it's my cheapest watch and it's also one of my favorites. Not my favorite, but it gets a lot of wrist time. It can be dressed down for work or dressed up for a night at the bar.

I should say that this is my first Seiko since I had two fail on me and a third get relegated to the drawer of forgotten things. It totally opened me back up to the brand.

I say get this. Save $200. Go to a nice steakhouse. And I do mean nice.


----------



## biker (Apr 7, 2009)

To the OP, if your mind has not been made up yet, I'm chiming in for the Sumo as well - along with all the points already put forward by the others, I would just like to add that it has simply one of the sharpest precision cut steel cases I have ever seen. As you look, feel and marvel at it, you catch yourself realising 'heh, and this is just the lugs. There is so much more.'

The Blue Ring has some vocal and ardent supporters, but I see no reason why this should descend into Sumo v Blue Ring type of argument. When someone chimes in with their views, it still surprises me that some people seem to think that those views somehow diminishes their collection and start going on the defensive. It doesn't. And in the end, we all buy what we like.


----------



## Rhino-Ranch (Oct 19, 2008)

*Chronomeister*,
We need close ups of what's in your case below.
*Rhino*



chronomeister said:


> As much as I love micro brew manufacturers have to say hands down on the mid-high end a Seiko SUMO and on the low end a 007 ....or my mod'd 7S26's or Monsters......they run and run and run....:-!:roll:
> 
> Note- Sumo pic borrowed....


----------



## Bolaberlim (Jul 30, 2009)

Kent108 said:


> "Crappy"?
> 
> Well, a while back one of the guys here put a Tauchmeister (Deporte is the same watch, just branded differently on the dial) through a pretty impressive torture test and it survived with flying colors:
> 
> ...


it's hard to do better if the only requirement is survival :-d but I agree that those watches are a good deal. I also vote for the citizen's Ecozilla and aqualand, seiko monster for low budget, and Prometheus Ocean Diver right on the $500 limit...ish. The prometheus is an underrated watch, it delivers a lot for a very good price and dresses up or down. Can't go wrong with that one!


----------



## A MattR of Time (Feb 22, 2006)

*Re: What?!*



watarski said:


> While I agree with the Seiko comments, I have a hard time fully recommending any in this category. I myself am trying to find a good "toolish" (overused term, I know) diver. For me, the exclusion of a sapphire crystal on the Seiko's is ridiculous. These crystals don't cost that much, and the hardlex is too easy to scratch for me. That and the polished case finish...
> 
> However, I've been toying with the idea of having one of my Seiko's blasted and a crystal installed and calling it a day.


Well, a real WORKING diver, or a toolish diver to use your lingo, benefits from a hardlex crystal because it is much more shatterproof than sapphire. And if you are using your diver as Seiko inteneded - below the surface of the ocean in and around rocks and coral reefs, etc, and you smack your watch up against said formations, you would much rather have your crystal scratch than shatter, thereby flooding your watch.

Now, if you are more concerned with desk diving........

For under $300, I give you this combo, and my example runs at -2 sec/day out of the box:


----------



## Rhino-Ranch (Oct 19, 2008)

Hello All,
You guys forgot to mention.

*Halios Holotype *
*Boschett Cave Dweller / Reef Ranger*
*Artego*

*O7 G-1 quartz chrono (under $350)*
*07 G-1 swiss auto 2893-2 GMT (slightly over $500) includes bracelet + sapphire !*
*







*

*







*

**http://www.ocean7watchco.com/cs2/images/detailed/O7_G-2_2_tone_dial_wsm_3786.jpg


----------



## jason_recliner (Feb 2, 2009)

*Re: What?!*



bedlam said:


> Not agreeing with you isn't belligerence.


I was more how I perceived you were misunderstanding what was being said about the watch.. Anyway, it's all gotten way too labourious and tedious.... m OP, get a Sumo, get a Bluering, get a Precista, and then tell us which one is best!



bedlam said:


> And probably the only way we can settle this is for me to buy a SUMO!!! and see for myself. The pursuit of objective data to establish the truth in a scientific manner is the best reason I can think of to buy another watch ;-)


I gotta confess the level of enthusiasm for the Bluering has definitely made me curious! Too bad I'm not buying any watches this year.


----------



## Birddogone (Jul 27, 2010)

Where the hell is *gwhibbs* ? 65 responses and not a word from him???? :-d


----------



## bedlam (Jul 1, 2009)

jason_recliner said:


> I gotta confess the level of enthusiasm for the Bluering has definitely made me curious! Too bad I'm not buying any watches this year.


And you are still reading these boards? Damn, that's like sending yourself to purgatory ;-)


----------



## bedlam (Jul 1, 2009)

Do you have any data on the hardlex? I have asked at times for some evidence of their being benefits of it over sapphire and nobody had been able to point me to anything substantive.


----------



## A MattR of Time (Feb 22, 2006)

bedlam said:


> Do you have any data on the hardlex? I have asked at times for some evidence of their being benefits of it over sapphire and nobody had been able to point me to anything substantive.


SCWF Mirror : Hardlex compared to sapphire glass? (user, 2007-01-15, message 1168892883)

https://www.watchuseek.com/f281/settling-great-crystal-debate-sapphire-vs-hardlex-140805.html


----------



## bedlam (Jul 1, 2009)

A MattR of Time said:


> SCWF Mirror : Hardlex compared to sapphire glass? (user, 2007-01-15, message 1168892883)
> 
> https://www.watchuseek.com/f281/settling-great-crystal-debate-sapphire-vs-hardlex-140805.html


I have seen those discussions...there is no evidence of hardlex/sapphlex being superior to sapphire being presented in them.


----------



## A MattR of Time (Feb 22, 2006)

bedlam said:


> I have seen those discussions...there is no evidence of hardlex/sapphlex being superior to sapphire being presented in them.


From Seiko's Ikuo Tokunaga himself:

http://www.thewatchsite.com/index.php?topic=273.0



> Authored by *Tokunaga*
> Question:
> 
> I understand that Hardlex is used in the Marinemaster due to its shatter resistance. My question is why doesn't Seiko use an acrylic crystal in this case? Acrylic crystals are shatter resistant and unlike Hardlex can be buffed if scratched. Could a Sapphlex crystal be used in this application?
> ...


----------



## rs518 (Feb 11, 2011)

First time poster. I've worn Casio G-Shocks my whole life except for a brief period where I wore an Omega Aqua Terra SeaMaster Quartz (sold) & a Xetum Stinson (also sold it). I've read this thread 2x and now I'm in the market for a Diver around/under $700. At this time my options include: Halios BlueRing (if I can find one), Ocean7 G-1 Automatic, Helson Shark Diver 2000 M, Boschett Reef Ranger Limited Edition. I'm open to other suggestions as well. Any thoughts/comments/suggestions on my list so far?


----------



## chronomeister (Sep 14, 2008)

Rhino-Ranch said:


> *Chronomeister*,
> We need close ups of what's in your case below.
> *Rhino*


Rhino:

Some coming up! New post.......:-!


----------



## 20DYNAMITE07 (Mar 3, 2009)

rs518 said:


> First time poster. I've worn Casio G-Shocks my whole life except for a brief period where I wore an Omega Aqua Terra SeaMaster Quartz (sold) & a Xetum Stinson (also sold it). I've read this thread 2x and now I'm in the market for a Diver around/under $700. At this time my options include: Halios BlueRing (if I can find one), Ocean7 G-1 Automatic, Helson Shark Diver 2000 M, Boschett Reef Ranger Limited Edition. I'm open to other suggestions as well. Any thoughts/comments/suggestions on my list so far?


That's a really strong list!

Just an FYI for you and for anyone else on the market... some dude (not me) has a Bernhardt Sea Shark for sale in the classifieds for $165. 200m resistance, Sapphire glass, Miyota automatic movement, and great looks. RS 518, it might be small for your taste since your list contains some real bigguns. But it's a great watch.


----------



## chronomeister (Sep 14, 2008)

Rhino:

here's few pic's of my Seiko Mods....big fun to do but now I have quite a few and SOOOOO many extra parts left......

Enjoy,
Greg

PS! Another post with more pic's next....


----------



## chronomeister (Sep 14, 2008)

:-!MORE.......

In my experience these cost approx. $250-300. or more if you change the crystal to a sapphire one.......and I don't do the mods myself have Jack at IWW execute the design......he's KILLER!


----------



## nam6869usmc1 (Nov 12, 2008)

Seiko Prospex Marine Master Professional Spring Drive Movement Men's Watch # SBDB001. Dial color: Black. Band: Titanium. Case: Titanium. Glass:* Sapphire crystal (non-reflective coating).*
Seiko Prospex Marine Master Kinetic Men's Watch # SBDD001. Dial color: Black. Band: Rubber. Case: Titanium (hard-coated black). Glass: *Sapphire crystal (non-reflective coating).*


Seiko PROSPEX Marine Master Professional 1000m SBBN013 Japanese price of 210000 Yen, Equivalent to US $2490 Japanese made Quartz movement Lumibright Anti Magnetic Date display *Sapphire Glass*
In case of diver's watch which are required so many characteristics totally, such as resistance to pressure, water resistance, shock resistance, wear resistance, heat resistance, and durability etc., we usually use "High- quality HARDLEX" glass having the most excellent "*cost performance"* and sometimes use *sapphire glass* as a glass of some PROSPEX diver's watches.
*Ikuo Tokunaga*
It seems they upgrade to Sapphire for their High end Seiko's....


----------



## A MattR of Time (Feb 22, 2006)

nam6869usmc said:


> Seiko Prospex Marine Master Professional Spring Drive Movement Men's Watch # SBDB001. Dial color: Black. Band: Titanium. Case: Titanium. Glass:* Sapphire crystal (non-reflective coating).*
> Seiko Prospex Marine Master Kinetic Men's Watch # SBDD001. Dial color: Black. Band: Rubber. Case: Titanium (hard-coated black). Glass: *Sapphire crystal (non-reflective coating).*
> 
> 
> ...


and quite honestly, those high end Seiko's are more likely to see desk diving at the country club more than actual diving. Now, a working man's diver, OTOH, will more likely see water, and coral, and rocks.....


----------



## jmerino7 (Jan 11, 2011)

I like my new Seiko SKZ325K1.







Thanks.


----------



## nam6869usmc1 (Nov 12, 2008)

A MattR of Time said:


> and quite honestly, those high end Seiko's are more likely to see desk diving at the country club more than actual diving. Now, a working man's diver, OTOH, will more likely see water, and coral, and rocks.....


So when Marathon MilSpec Sar, Gsar, Tsar was designed they should of selected Hardex/Mineral just asking,,,,,,,,,,,,,,not designed as desk Divers.


----------



## jason_recliner (Feb 2, 2009)

nam6869usmc said:


> So when Marathon MilSpec Sar, Gsar, Tsar was designed they should of selected Hardex/Mineral just asking,,,,,,,,,,,,,,not designed as desk Divers.


The MM300 is an oldish design now, being released around 2000. Thick sapphise is suitably shatter resistant, although not as shatter reisitant as anm equivalent mineral crystal (but resistant enough for a watch application). My understanding is that thick, domed, high quality (meaning microscopic fault free) sapphires back when this watch was being designed were very expensive, and would have added a disproportionate amount to the watch's $1,200 cost. To keep costs down a thick domed borosilicate crystal was used. Note that the SAR you reference has a flat crystal, which is cheaper to manufacture than domed. Some might argue that a domed hardlex is preferable for diving than a flat sapphire? I don't know, I'm not a diver, but it is cool being able to see the dial of my MM300 at quite oblique angles in the pool at my gym 

10 years later, thick sapphires are relatively affordable, even domed ones (the 5 mm thick domed internal AR aftermarket sappiire on my 007 was only $90 or so), and the MM300 is a $2,500+ watch, so the lack of sapphire seems like a surprising oversight. I have no doubt the MM300 replacement will have sapphire, based on recent Propspex offerings.

To me, the lack of sapphire in MM300 (or Sumo) is not a bad thing. I have had good luck with Hardlex so far, and I like the fact it is different to sapphire. Although I appreciate the scratch resistance of sapphire, I wouldn't want to replace the crystals on my vintage pieces with it, because it is not true to the era (and would detract from the individal character of the watches IMO). So, while it is possible to replace the mineral crystals on most Seiko divers with sapphire, it is not something I see as desirable, personally.


----------



## bedlam (Jul 1, 2009)

A MattR of Time said:


> From Seiko's Ikuo Tokunaga himself


Thanks for the info.

Mr Tokunaga says there is a cost benefit to Seiko of Hardlex and indicates that sapphire is used in the high end Prospex watches. The indication is that if the issue isn't about saving pennies Ikuo would go for sapphire in his best dive watches. As do I.


----------



## A MattR of Time (Feb 22, 2006)

Agreed there is definitely a cost benefit to the Mfr.


----------



## streetracer101 (Dec 18, 2008)

I have to throw my vote in for the Tissot Seastar 1000 as well. For under $350 used, you can get a hackable 2824 movement, domed sapphire crystal and beautiful fit/finish. I just received one in a trade and probably will be looking for others in different colors because they are such a great watches. Plus, they work really well for those of us with smaller wrists.


----------



## Rhino-Ranch (Oct 19, 2008)

Greg,
Very cool ! Great work. 007 Monster ! Thanks for the extra pics.
Jim



chronomeister said:


> :-!MORE.......
> 
> In my experience these cost approx. $250-300. or more if you change the crystal to a sapphire one.......and I don't do the mods myself have Jack at IWW execute the design......he's KILLER!


----------



## Rhino-Ranch (Oct 19, 2008)

Tissot has a tastey bezel, quirky hour hand, and is lacking in the lume department. I am sort of undecided. Question: at 44 mm how is it that you find it suitable for small wrists ? [not that it matters 'cause I'm healthy 7.5]. Also, Google located reputable AD w/ New Tissot Seastar under $450.



streetracer101 said:


> I have to throw my vote in for the Tissot Seastar 1000 as well. For under $350 used, you can get a hackable 2824 movement, domed sapphire crystal and beautiful fit/finish. I just received one in a trade and probably will be looking for others in different colors because they are such a great watches. Plus, they work really well for those of us with smaller wrists.


----------



## Raza (Jul 21, 2010)

The Seastar is a pretty sweet looking watch.


----------



## rs518 (Feb 11, 2011)

Rhino-Ranch said:


> Tissot has a tastey bezel, quirky hour hand, and is lacking in the lume department. I am sort of undecided. Question: at 44 mm how is it that you find it suitable for small wrists ? [not that it matters 'cause I'm healthy 7.5]. Also, Google located reputable AD w/ New Tissot Seastar under $450.


Could you PM me the link? I'm very interested and I've been looking for a brand new one for a long time!


----------



## Matusalem_1324 (Mar 13, 2011)

_Tissot has a tastey bezel, quirky hour hand, and is lacking in the lume department. I am sort of undecided. Question: at 44 mm how is it that you find it suitable for small wrists ? [not that it matters 'cause I'm healthy 7.5]. Also, Google located reputable AD w/ New Tissot Seastar under $450_.

Hi, I am really new to this forum. I am trying to start a collection of quality watches but am still at university so dont have the cash to chase the super expensive watches. I am really keen on this watch, esp if under $450, can you please provide the AD who has the Seastar. Also if anyone knows of where I could get a good price on a Seiko Sumo please let me know, I love both of these watches but struggling to find them on the market, am a rookie at this so prob not looking in the right place. Any help would be great thanks....


----------



## persco (Nov 25, 2009)

Matusalem_1324 said:


> _Tissot has a tastey bezel, quirky hour hand, and is lacking in the lume department. I am sort of undecided. Question: at 44 mm how is it that you find it suitable for small wrists ? [not that it matters 'cause I'm healthy 7.5]. Also, Google located reputable AD w/ New Tissot Seastar under $450_.
> 
> Hi, I am really new to this forum. I am trying to start a collection of quality watches but am still at university so dont have the cash to chase the super expensive watches. I am really keen on this watch, esp if under $450, can you please provide the AD who has the Seastar. Also if anyone knows of where I could get a good price on a Seiko Sumo please let me know, I love both of these watches but struggling to find them on the market, am a rookie at this so prob not looking in the right place. Any help would be great thanks....


Some places for the Sumo:

SBDC001 SBDC003 SBDC005 AUTOMATIC 200M DIVER

Seiko 6R15 Automatic SUMO

SeiyaJapan | Grand Seiko | G-Shock | Seiko Spirit | Prospex | Marinemaster | Citizen | SEIKO Prospex 200M Diver 6R15 Automatic SBDC001


----------

