# Starking Automatic



## mychoads

Hi,

I've had this watchin my cart on alixpress for some time and finally pulled the trigger on 11/11 for $39. I tried searching the forum for info on this watch but didn't come up with much. Does anyone here own this or have any opinions on it?








I understand it has a 28,800 9015 copy movement?


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## mythless

I don't think there is a miyota 9015 copy, yet. But, rather the clone of the eta 2824.


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## blakadder

I own it. It is a 28800 beat movement and they claim it's their own developed movement. The watch itself is more than excellent for the price. No regrets here

Sent from my Redmi Note 4 using Tapatalk


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## GraX

blakadder said:


> I own it. It is a 28800 beat movement and they claim it's their own developed movement. The watch itself is more than excellent for the price. No regrets here
> 
> Sent from my Redmi Note 4 using Tapatalk


please post some photos


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## blakadder

Here's a bad one for start


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## 1afc

blakadder said:


> I own it. It is a 28800 beat movement and they claim it's their own developed movement. The watch itself is more than excellent for the price. No regrets here
> 
> Sent from my Redmi Note 4 using Tapatalk


Yes you are right. Great for the price. 
I have the white AM0184 with the bracelet and butterfly clasp.

I haven't opened it yet but does anyone know if it can be calibrated? Doesn't look like it through the display back?


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## SinoWatchLover

Got a picture of the back of the watch? That should tell us if it is intended to be regulated.


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## mychoads

Yes, I received mine last week and regulated it. It doesn't have the fine adjustment screw like the eta movement but can be adjusted by moving the levers. I don't believe there are +/- markers, so you have to understand what you are moving and why regarding the hairspring length and beat error.


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## Chascomm

1afc said:


> I haven't opened it yet but does anyone know if it can be calibrated? Doesn't look like it through the display back?


Every mechanical watch currently in production, besides the Swatch Sistem51, can be regulated.


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## lechat

SinoWatchLover said:


> Got a picture of the back of the watch? That should tell us if it is intended to be regulated.


good idea ; the Back of the watch Please


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## blueboy85

Lucky for you. my Starking rooster watch came DOA. The watch hands and flywheel do not move at all even when handwound / shaken. Not sure what I should do - return it, ask for a replacement or a refund.


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## SinoWatchLover

If you still like the look of the watch, go for a replacement


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## 1afc

Yes you are correct. Easy regulation as per most mechanicals.
I moved it from +30 sec to +7 sec. Beat error from factory was 0.1 ms.

Regulation went from 23spd to 3spd and position error is about 6 sec.

Also hands, dial and bracelet are very good for the money.


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## blakadder

My watch is running at +2 sec out of the box. Really impressive

Sent from my Redmi Note 4 using Tapatalk


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## ohhenry1

I'm super interested in purchasing this watch, but had a couple of quick questions that I'm hoping an owner of the watch might be able to answer: (1) Does the white dial have any sunburst or texture to it, or is it just flat/plain? (2) I have small wrists, so am wondering what the lug-to-lug length is?


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## 1afc

Just plain and flat but that just makes the well finished applied markers and hands shine all the more.

Lug to lug about 44mm.


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## 1afc

Watch is now around 2 months old and the latest timing performance is shown here


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## beagles

Hi. Does someone know if the movement is a clone of 9015 or 2824?


Sent from my ONEPLUS A3003 using Tapatalk


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## beagles

beagles said:


> Hi. Does someone know if the movement is a clone of 9015 or 2824?
> 
> Sent from my ONEPLUS A3003 using Tapatalk


If its a clone it seems to be more similar to 2824 than 9015. At least what I see from the pics

Sent from my ONEPLUS A3003 using Tapatalk


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## Chascomm

beagles said:


> Hi. Does someone know if the movement is a clone of 9015 or 2824?


Do you have a photo of the movement?

The only movement that looks like a Miyota 9015 is a Miyota 9015. There are several makers of clones of the ETA 2824-2 both in Switzerland and China.

The photos that I have seen of Starking movements do _not_ resemble the 2824. For example, this one looks like a Nanning NN2813:









...and this one also has an NN28:
https://www.watchuseek.com/f72/starking-am0217-4535231.html


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## Remior

I don´t think is a Eta clone.. balance wheel is completly different... and in other possition.
Starking asures is is own movement.... even on their web... they call it 1813 caliber...

1813-?????
They have even a PDF with the drawing of it.
http://www.starkingwatch.com/upload/file/201708/1813.pdf

I think is a simple DG2813 who Starking has change escapement regulator to increasse alternances per hour...










Anyways.. I have buyed one Starking watch... Soo When I have it here I promise many photos as you want...


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## Chascomm

That one is definitely a DG; it has the DG stamp under the balance and there is a slight curve on the pallet-cock. The other ones that we've seen have been NN. The NN28 movements are (apart from minor details) the same as the previous generation of DG28/38. Perhaps DG offer a 28,800bph escapement and NN do not. I think that this faster-beating version might be the one that we have previously seen listed as DG4813.


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## Wandering Ben

Chascomm said:


> That one is definitely a DG; it has the DG stamp under the balance and there is a slight curve on the pallet-cock. The other ones that we've seen have been NN. The NN28 movements are (apart from minor details) the same as the previous generation of DG28/38. Perhaps DG offer a 28,800bph escapement and NN do not. I think that this faster-beating version might be the one that we have previously seen listed as DG4813.


Do you know any watches with Chinese high beat movements that are not 2824 clones? Recently my taste has been gravitating towards high beats (the smoother sweep is just more pleasing to look). I have ETA and two clones of it in collection. But want to know others besides the Japanese 9015 (also why is it harder to get watches with Seiko 28800 beat movements??)

Sent from snail mail


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## beagles

Chascomm said:


> Do you have a photo of the movement?
> 
> The only movement that looks like a Miyota 9015 is a Miyota 9015. There are several makers of clones of the ETA 2824-2 both in Switzerland and China.
> 
> The photos that I have seen of Starking movements do _not_ resemble the 2824. For example, this one looks like a Nanning NN2813:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ...and this one also has an NN28:
> https://www.watchuseek.com/f72/starking-am0217-4535231.html


Thanks to everybody. I ordered the Starking AM0184 from ALI. I will post some pics when arrives.

Sent from my ONEPLUS A3003 using Tapatalk


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## Remior

Mine has arrived two days ago. Really impressive watch for the money.

The movement is really 4hz and is nothing like a ETA clone... it seems to me a miyota clone (maybe a 4813 but not a DG, it has another symbol grabbed like a SK "Starking" logo maybe)


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## NuttySlack

I just got this watch today and I'm quite impressed - I don't know if it has a stainless steel case or a saphire crystal, but I like the 28,000 bph plus hacking and handwinding. The onlydownside being a slightly off-centre date window, the rest of the watch is rather beautifully finished.
















Less than £35 - you can't go wrong!


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## blakadder

It's actually 31$ right now with the bracelet

Sent from my Redmi Note 4 using Tapatalk


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## GraX

blakadder said:


> It's actually 31$ right now with the bracelet
> 
> Sent from my Redmi Note 4 using Tapatalk


WHERE? link please


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## Remior

A decent photograph...


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## HoustonReal

blakadder said:


> It's actually 31$ right now with the bracelet
> 
> Sent from my Redmi Note 4 using Tapatalk


It looks like they will be $37.70 during the AliX Anniversary Sale. Where did you find them for $31?


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## HoustonReal

Decorated Dixmont Guangzhou DG4813 (28,800 beats) drop-in replacement for DG2813. I wonder if they sell an unbranded version?


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## HoustonReal

beagles said:


> Thanks to everybody. I ordered the Starking AM0184 from ALI. I will post some pics when arrives.
> 
> Sent from my ONEPLUS A3003 using Tapatalk


I did some Googling, and they mention a similar movement in replica forums. They call it an Asian 2813 HiBeat (25J) or A2813 HiBeat. No one seems to know whether it's the same as a DG4813, but it doesn't seem to have the Dixmont crown under the balance wheel. The DG2813 is actually a 22J movement, although the 2813s are commonly called 21J, lumping them in with the Miyota 8215. The A2813 HiBeat is advertised as 25J, but this may just be some sort of shorthand for 28,800, as all the 2824-2 clones claim 25 Jewels. The trade-off in upregulating a 2813 type movement to 4Hz seems to be a loss of power reserve, which drops into the 30 hour range.

I would love to know what the power reserve is of the AM0184.


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## blakadder

Power reserve is almost inexistent on mine. Less than 10 hours.

Sent from my Redmi Note 4 using Tapatalk


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## HoustonReal

blakadder said:


> Power reserve is almost inexistent on mine. Less than 10 hours.
> 
> Sent from my Redmi Note 4 using Tapatalk


10 hours is awful! Did you fully handwind it to reach that PR time?

My Guanqin has a DG2803 (Day/Date version), and it hits in the 40-42 hour range, as advertised. For me, 30 hours is a bare minimum, and 40 hours or more is where I'm more comfortable. I don't see the point of owning a mechanical watch that can't last over a day without winding.


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## Remior

blakadder said:


> Power reserve is almost inexistent on mine. Less than 10 hours.
> 
> Sent from my Redmi Note 4 using Tapatalk


On mine power reserve is more than 30 hours... haven't checked but is for sure more than a day and half...

I have buyed another one.. a white dial one...


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## ObiWonWD40

Ordered one of these watches just over 2 weeks ago and today it arrived. Very impressed with .........s, this was my first order with them one of many to follow I think, no I know as I have already ordered another watch.

This is the one I chose: AM0184 Silver Brown Leather Strap (Sorry I can't post a link) and as of now after wearing it most of the day I am quite impressed. For just under £36 delivered in the UK it looks as if it will shape up to being a great watch!

Things I like about it are the fact that it allows hand winding, hacks and is a three handed plus date complication high beat rate movement. You just have to look at the way the second hand moves to see the smooth effect of the beat rate. As for how it will fair in the short, medium and long term? Watch this space! I don't have a timegrapher, so it is going to be run against a couple of electronic clocks that sync to the Rugby time signal for now. I will confess here to be a bit of a fan of the Chinese, in my working life I commissioned and purchased custom computer equipment for a number of clients and guess what? 99.5% of the suppliers were based in Hong Kong and Mainland China! As long as you got the specs right and checked the supplier carefully, you could get great products at the right price. My thoughts are quite simple, as long as the watch purchase is around or below £50 delivered to me in the UK, then I am usually quite happy, if it fails within the year or is DoA, if I can get my money back or a replacement then I am happy to use the parts or whatever to look at and learn. I can fix most mechanical clocks, at least the simple things and a watch works on many of the same principles, just smaller! And with most things I find the more I practice the better I get. 

I don't have a timegrapher right now, but I have the parts and the software to build one over time. As a software professional I don't use an iPhone or an Android Phone right now, you can laugh at my Windows Phone but as of now I don't care! It makes calls, sends texts and WhatsApp messages has a decent Sat Nav and I switch off most of the bits that allow people to track me, so I am happy. So same as I am with this watch and a few other Chinese Specials, for the price of a Chinese takeaway I get something that maybe lasts a bit longer!

More to follow Jim


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## sharpey

ObiWonWD40 said:


> Ordered one of these watches just over 2 weeks ago and today it arrived. Very impressed with .........s, this was my first order with them one of many to follow I think, no I know as I have already ordered another watch.
> 
> This is the one I chose: AM0184 Silver Brown Leather Strap (Sorry I can't post a link) and as of now after wearing it most of the day I am quite impressed. For just under £36 delivered in the UK it looks as if it will shape up to being a great watch!
> 
> Things I like about it are the fact that it allows hand winding, hacks and is a three handed plus date complication high beat rate movement. You just have to look at the way the second hand moves to see the smooth effect of the beat rate. As for how it will fair in the short, medium and long term? Watch this space! I don't have a timegrapher, so it is going to be run against a couple of electronic clocks that sync to the Rugby time signal for now. I will confess here to be a bit of a fan of the Chinese, in my working life I commissioned and purchased custom computer equipment for a number of clients and guess what? 99.5% of the suppliers were based in Hong Kong and Mainland China! As long as you got the specs right and checked the supplier carefully, you could get great products at the right price. My thoughts are quite simple, as long as the watch purchase is around or below £50 delivered to me in the UK, then I am usually quite happy, if it fails within the year or is DoA, if I can get my money back or a replacement then I am happy to use the parts or whatever to look at and learn. I can fix most mechanical clocks, at least the simple things and a watch works on many of the same principles, just smaller! And with most things I find the more I practice the better I get.
> 
> I don't have a timegrapher right now, but I have the parts and the software to build one over time. As a software professional I don't use an iPhone or an Android Phone right now, you can laugh at my Windows Phone but as of now I don't care! It makes calls, sends texts and WhatsApp messages has a decent Sat Nav and I switch off most of the bits that allow people to track me, so I am happy. So same as I am with this watch and a few other Chinese Specials, for the price of a Chinese takeaway I get something that maybe lasts a bit longer!
> 
> More to follow Jim


Nice, I am liking mine also... Bloody bargain for the price paid!


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## _wst

Hi,

I also bought this watch (for $38) and I thought of sharing my experience. Eventually I got 2 of them, the first one was DoA. It was really weird, the second hand moved normally but the minute&hour hands stood still. I arranged for a replacement. The new one is slightly different, it has a darker brown and longer strap, and it has an "SK" stamp under the balance wheel (the first didn't have anything there). Sadly, this one isn't perfect either, the hack doesn't work. I can live with it, I don't bother askng for yet another one.
The accuracy out of the box is +21 sec/day. The power reserve is exactly 30 hours.
Overall I'm satisfied with it, it is a good value for the money. I has a nice finish and it certainly doesn't feel cheap. On the negative side, when you buy this kind of watches you must accept that factory quality control is virtually nonexistent.

Cheers,
wst


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## mrygn

I am new at the forum and i am about to buy my first mechanical watch. i am considering to buy one of these three watches : Starking AM0184 , Guanqin GJ16034 (Seiko NH36a movement) and cadisen c1009(miyota 8215). Which one is more prefearrable in terms of build quality and movement accuracy. Thanks in advance.


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## ohhenry1

mrygn said:


> I am new at the forum and i am about to buy my first mechanical watch. i am considering to buy one of these three watches : Starking AM0184 , Guanqin GJ16034 (Seiko NH36a movement) and cadisen c1009(miyota 8215). Which one is more prefearrable in terms of build quality and movement accuracy. Thanks in advance.


If it is going to be your first mechanical watch, I would strongly advise against the Starking. It's simply too hit or miss. You could get a great one, or you could be severely frustrated with a defective one. My Cadisen C-1009 looks and works great, but I'd recommend the Guanqin since the Seiko movement in that one also has hacking (stop seconds function when setting the time), which will allow for greater accuracy and probably be more satisfying (Miyota in the Cadisen does not have that function). That Guanqin model has been very popular of late, and I haven't heard a single bad thing about it, so I think that would be your best bet.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


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## Brightling007

I'll formally introduce myself in a minute, but stumbled upon this by a google search and wanted to share some adventures I've had with these watches.

I purchased one with black dial and steel bracelet as a first, an excellent watch, since I own a Weishi Timegrapher 2000 I tested it and found out that it ran quite beautifully in all kinds of positions. Then I pulled the trigger on a white dial brown leather strap, this one had issues with what looked like gearing problems with the seconds hand, which moved around when changing the watch from several horizontal positions. So I contacted the seller, who was so friendly to send another one, but it had the same issue. I'm now guessing the black dial steel bracelet could be of a better batch and since they were on sale today I bought four of them. You could ask why so many? Well, I discovered the movement fits many other watches. What I found out from experience and the movement PDF that I'm thankful for which was posted in this thread:

1. the hands of an ETA fit
2. it has four dial pin screw positions that make it suitable for both DG2813/M8215 and ETA 2824/2836 dials, dials that have four pins actually fit with all four of them without the need to cut any of them
3. the canon length is quite short, but the Starking watches come with an extra thin spacer, also with four cut-outs to fit any kind of dial. Do watch out for thick dials for this reason, especially with thick markers.
4. the watch is about as cheap as most low beat movements in this category
5. The main spring has jewel bearings, so it has at least two more jewels as a DG2813
6. The date flip transition takes about a quarter of an hour from starting to move to actually flicking over
7. The date wheel is a bit smaller than DG2813, so beware
8. DG2813 or ETA date wheels don't fit as they're too thick, especially since the short canon.
9. the movement is 99% based upon a DG2813, but different enough to not fit the high beat parts. At least I didn't succeed to make a swap there, and made two attempts. I couldn't figure out why yet, checked all the parts under the magnifiers (Mantis and HD cams with macro lenses) I have. 

I know it's by no means economically sensible to use it for the movement, as you'd be far better off with an ETA clone movement, but this movement and especially the way the first one runs (and still does after putting it back together) was somehow appealing. And on top of that I've only started the watchmaking hobby a few months ago and needed some target practise, and what better to use than some brand new and cheap victims haha!

My aim still is to shoehorn this movement in to a Black Bay hommage. I did already find out that the Corgeut dials the sell on .........s have the same date windowdistance and the size is fine for the font, and I wanted to pair that with a snowflake hands set, a sapphire glass Black Bay homage case, and a leather suiting strap. These watches are sold complete on Aiexpress from Corgeut and Parnis. The latter has a 24J 9015 option, and I already own one of those (yes Black Bay fan here...) and it is a superb watch, incredible finishing and that 9015 runs spot on. Then Parnis has the 21J with 8215 in it, but I dislike the 8215 for not being hackable. I did make a hands swap on that 24J Parnis, because they are stock fitted with mercedes hands. The Corgeut watches already have snowflakes, and look great, and the name appeals more to me, but from having ordered a case earlier on I noticed the finishing is not at the level of the Parnis in many ways.


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## Brightling007

Oh yes, another thing, this movement is not a DG4813, I've got stock of those and it is really not the same, although it has many similarities, such as the perlage done on the rotor. And I know there are many 4813 versions, and they used to be available in high beat a while ago, and I never owned any of those, but the Starking movement looks far better finished, the perlage on the 4813 is really horrible, and on the Starking well...less horrible. The starking also has far higher amplitude, all 4813 I have had and still have don't run over 250 degrees fully wound up. Most even barely hit the 200 degree mark, but the Starking easily tops 300 degrees. When fully wound I even saw dangerously high amplitude making me worried for damage to the pallet fork or balance wheel stone.

When there's interest for it I can post some Timegrapher screenshots and other more detailed pictures later on...


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## Brightling007

I've received the four black dial watches and they all work perfectly. So, the white dial batch is probably of a lesser quality indeed.


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## Brightling007

So, some more info gathered... All four run wihtin 5s/d straight out the box, and so far with just as excellent power reserve as my first black dial SK. For something so cheap, taken in to account it has REAL sapphire glass too (albeit thin) and REAL solid stainless steel all over, a NICE butterfly clasp, a NICE mineral display case back and a great feel and look, it absolutely is a steal! The date change on all of them is also spot on, and it moves fast too. I've shot a video as well, to judge seconds hand smoothness, I hope it works out and I'll upload it to youtube if it does and post it here later on.

Pics first...


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## Brightling007

And, here's what happens when it is flipped over in to several positions. Okay, it is not an ETA, but for the small price it cost I find it quite an amazing quality level! Look at that amplitude! If I finetune this to slightly in the + (which I prefer) it'll run absolutely spot on.


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## Brightling007

Here's the video, hope it's any bit useful as I don't think even 60fps is enough to really capture it perfectly.


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## Chascomm

Is that an extra jewel on the mainspring barrel?


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## Brightling007

Chascomm said:


> Is that an extra jewel on the mainspring barrel?


Yes, well spotted! That would be two extra stones, and quite large ones too!


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## Brightling007

I've transplanted the movement in to a Corgeut Black Bay homage I still had with defective 2813 in it. Ordered new snowflake hands (2813 don't fit, ETA do reasonably well on the Starking movement) I will keep the Starking, but will put a Shanghai 2824 clone in it, probably with different hands.

Anyway, it's all in here:
https://www.watchuseek.com/f72/corgeut-starking-merger-black-bay-homage-4740479.html#post46451181


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## Brightling007

I've had another look at what causes the issues with the white dial version, and I also had one black dial version go silent on me, which is what triggered me to further investigate. The bottom plate/frame of the movement has some bad finishing at the edge around the escape wheel from the main spring. In one movement this was still attached really thin metal, but in the others it broke off and turned in to swarf, which can block gears. It is odd, as every other part of the machining seems to be done with great care, but this bit is done pretty horribly. 

Again, the quality control is virtually non existent.


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## Brightling007

I should add that it didn't take me more than 30 minutes to take apart, clean and put back together all oiled. Off course, I've done it before a few times and trinoculars help a lot... But a good watchmaker can do the job fairly fast, and once resolved it runs good and looks reliable to my judgement.


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## Brightling007

A few more repairs done on some ETA clones and since I had some 4813 and SK donor movements I've noticed the date wheels of the three are interchangeable.

I would very much like to buy just the SK movements, Although I doubt they'll be much cheaper as a whole SK watch. 

They are so nice to upgrade 2813 watches with! But also as a project movement they are great!

1. You don't need to clip dial feet, and when a new dial is used you can firmly bolt it down with all four pins as the SK (even though the stock dial in the AM0184 comes with just two pins) has four screws in place and accommodates all four dial feet! It is therefore compatible with ETA dials and 2813 dials.
2. All you need are a set of ETA hands, these fit, with only the minute hand needing some work to firm it up, depending on tolerances. You can gently squeeze it a little to shrink the hole slightly when needed.
3. You can get away with an ETA date wheel, when needed, but many dials will have fitting date windows.
4. They've got more stones as a 2813 and when adjusted well they run very sweet, and unlike an ETA wind very effortless, and time sets faster, date flicks fast, it is high beat...

The crown stem is also pretty long in the SK watch due to the case size.

So all in all, I will probably buy a lot more of these as donor watch.


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## Ale De Alis

AM0184 case size should be 40 mm but I've seen some photos online it looks much bigger (42 or 43 i'd say). Brightling007 can you confirm the size of this watch?


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## Brightling007

It really is 40mm without crown, and 47,9mm from the top of the lugs.


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## ohhenry1

Brightling007 said:


> It really is 40mm without crown, and 47,9mm from the top of the lugs.


The watch does wear big, though, given that it's pretty much all dial. My 40mm diver watches, despite being the same in diameter as the Starking, wear much smaller, by comparison.

I have 6.25" wrists, and the Starking wears bigger on my wrist than I would like.


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## HoustonReal

*Starking* was originally establish in the early 1990's (1990-1993 depending on which company timeline you read) as Shenzhen Jieyong (Starking) Clocks and Watches Co., Ltd. (or Shenzhen Xing Huang Watches Limited).

In 2014 (or 2005) they founded the *Shenzhen Jingrui Movement Co., Ltd.* to produce tourbillon movements. They currently offer a wide range of mechanical and quartz movements, including the 25J SK Series 1813 (HiBeat A2813). The 1813 seems to be a modified 2813 design, with three extra jewels and an upregulated 28,800 movement, that decreases the power reserve from 42 hours, to about 34 hours.

*1813* Full dimension drawings

Features: 3-pin / calendar 
Dimensions: ø26mm 
Thickness: 5.18mm 
The median: 2.03mm 
Frequency: 28800 times per hour 
Gem: Diamond 25 (25 jewels)
Movement type: automatic winding / manual winding crown


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## Brightling007

I'm impressed, both with what you dug up, and the legacy this company does seem to have! Would you say this 1813 movement is for sale somewhere?


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## Ale De Alis

Looks like Starking offers a more expensive high-beat movement , too (AM0161, 150 USD)


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## Brightling007

Ale De Alis said:


> Looks like Starking offers a more expensive high-beat movement , too (AM0161, 150 USD)
> View attachment 13329803


More expensive, but 'just' 21J.. Interesting nontheless being high beat.


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## Ale De Alis

I secretly hope it's a ETA 2892 clone! :-!:-d:-d


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## HereComesTheBOOM

Awesome thread. I haven't seen this model mentioned here yet but I've been eye-baling the AM0187. But then I'm wondering if the Cadisen C1032 with a Seiko NH36A movement (50 bukcs on GB flash-sale right now) wouldn't be a saver bet. Both have very similar specs besides the movement

Thoughts anyone?

Starking AM0187:









Cadisen C1032:


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## Ale De Alis

HereComesTheBOOM said:


> Awesome thread. I haven't seen this model mentioned here yet but I've been eye-baling the AM0187. But then I'm wondering if the Cadisen C1032 with a Seiko NH36A movement (50 bukcs on GB flash-sale right now) wouldn't be a saver bet. Both have very similar specs besides the movement
> 
> Thoughts anyone?


I've just ordered the AM0184 but I think Cadisen assembles terrific watches for the price. I couldn't resist the low price (€ 32) and the high beat movement. With the C1032 you can't go wrong. It's a well known movement while Starking as a manufacturer is a newbie


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## Brightling007

NH36A is much more stable and much more constant quality as a Starking. I don't find the day indication very elegant on such a watch though...


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## Marrin

Brightling007 said:


> NH36A is much more stable and much more constant quality as a Starking. I don't find the day indication very elegant on such a watch though...


I just got a white dialed one for a review and my wife fell in love with it so I gave it to her, however after a few hours she told me it stopped.
I realized the barrel slips and unwinds. Since you have had experience dismantling these, is it possible to fix it and what kind of locking system do they use to lock the barrel from unwinding?


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## Brightling007

There is a small finger with u spring next to the balance wheel bridge, a little hidden. I'll post a picture to point out the position later on. There's a chance though it unwinds from the other end and some gears are damaged.


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## Marrin

Brightling007 said:


> There is a small finger with u spring next to the balance wheel bridge, a little hidden. I'll post a picture to point out the position later on. There's a chance though it unwinds from the other end and some gears are damaged.


Thanks I do hope it's not the gears

Sent from my SLA-L22 using Tapatalk


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## HereComesTheBOOM

Ale De Alis said:


> I've just ordered the AM0184 but I think Cadisen assembles terrific watches for the price. I couldn't resist the low price (€ 32) and the high beat movement. With the C1032 you can't go wrong. It's a well known movement while Starking as a manufacturer is a newbie





Brightling007 said:


> NH36A is much more stable and much more constant quality as a Starking. I don't find the day indication very elegant on such a watch though...


Thanks for your input gentleman. So far I've managed to resist buying anything at all though. The low prices are really tempting me, but on the other hand I know money is going to be a little tight for a while, so I'm trying to hold on to it and save up some more until I come across something I really really like.

Still hoping to find something minimalistic that really speaks to me with a black case and some lume, possibly even a solar powered radio controlled quartz instead of an automatic as I keep going back and forth between those.


----------



## Brightling007

Marrin said:


> Thanks I do hope it's not the gears


Easy to check, when the hands move fast along with the unwinding then the gears are (mostly) good, but when the hands are frozen or just shake them the gears are damaged for sure.


----------



## Ipse

For those who ordered the AM0184, is the seller just yanking our chain or what?
"Oh, I wasn't here to know if we have stock" "Will ship if we have stock"....all kind of suspicious excuses for not honoring the sale price. WTH?


----------



## Ipse

Bump...don't hide, I know you ordered it :-d

PS. Seller is the official Starking store.


----------



## Brightling007

There's more than one seller, I sure haven't had such experiences myself.


----------



## andrea__81

Has anyone else noticed this other Starking? The dial looks more interesting to me, I quite like the red fume, despite the weird date placement. Hopefully it has the same high-beat movement (there's a video embedded in the aliex*** page and looks high-beat to me).


----------



## Brightling007

I wouldn't vouch for the beat rate from that video, they may as well have used a higher frame rate to play back the video.


----------



## Untxizuria

Review says it's high beat


----------



## Sogeha

Brightling007 said:


> I wouldn't vouch for the beat rate from that video, they may as well have used a higher frame rate to play back the video.


While I think it is wise to be sceptical about Ali listing claims, even if they speed up the frame rate, the watch will still only manage the same number of beats to it's own second. So provided one counts the seconds on the watch in the video rather than timing it externally, one should be able to establish the beat rate


----------



## Brightling007

Sogeha said:


> While I think it is wise to be sceptical about Ali listing claims, even if they speed up the frame rate, the watch will still only manage the same number of beats to it's own second. So provided one counts the seconds on the watch in the video rather than timing it externally, one should be able to establish the beat rate


Given the video has enough frame rate at all to not hide any of the steps. Although this could only work in the advantage of the beat rate. A slomo replay is still desired then.


----------



## HoustonReal

Sogeha said:


> While I think it is wise to be sceptical about Ali listing claims, even if they speed up the frame rate, the watch will still only manage the same number of beats to it's own second. So provided one counts the seconds on the watch in the video rather than timing it externally, one should be able to establish the beat rate


Starking created its own movement manufacturer, Shenzhen Jingrui Movement Company, and thus produces all its movements in-house. This includes everything from tourbillons to quartz calibers. All their SK Series automatics are high beat, 28,800 bph. The SKL open heart movements run at 21,600 bph.


----------



## megapig

Hi, did anyone check if the dial is sapphire coating or whole sapphire?


----------



## JustUK

I've got 2 of the AM0184s, the first, with white dial was DOA, sounds like Brightling007 is spot-on about the variable quality control on these movements. 

The second one is a black dial which I've been wearing for about a week now. Seems to keep excellent time - early days but only been losing about 2 seconds per day so far. Put it on a NATO partly as I couldn't work out how to shorten the steel bracelet.

Has a small bit of what looks like glue residue inside the edge of the crystal at 2 o'clock, which is a little annoying.

Seller has agreed to replace the white one.


----------



## JustUK




----------



## Brightling007

megapig said:


> Hi, did anyone check if the dial is sapphire coating or whole sapphire?


I wish it had sapphire coated. It is in fact more expensive and better.

Here are the differences from what I have seen/read and experienced:

1. mineral +shatter resistant -scratches quicker +easy and cheap to produce
2. full sapphire -shatters quicker +scratch resistant +cheaper to produce as sapphire coated mineral
3. sapphire coated mineral +shatter resistant + scratch resistant - hard and expensive to produce


----------



## Ipse

Ipse said:


> Bump...don't hide, I know you ordered it :-d
> PS. Seller is the official Starking store.


Finally got a shipping notification...seeing the posts here about spotty quality I'm worried I might get a dud as I really like the watch.
Fingers crossed..will post here when it arrives.

BTW...thanks folks for taking the time to share info....no surprise that WUS is my primary source of information.


----------



## Ipse

Brightling007 said:


> I wish it had sapphire coated. It is in fact more expensive and better.
> 
> Here are the differences from what I have seen/read and experienced:
> 
> 1. mineral +shatter resistant -scratches quicker +easy and cheap to produce
> 2. full sapphire -shatters quicker +scratch resistant +cheaper to produce as sapphire coated mineral
> 3. sapphire coated mineral +shatter resistant + scratch resistant - hard and expensive to produce


Funny you should say that...I was just looking at my Burei field (sapphire) vs a new Invicta bronze (their mambo jambo Trinite flame-fusion crystal) and the Burei looks dull, it's a fingerprint magnet whereas the Invicta has beautiful coating and is both fat and clear.
So not all sapphire glass is created equal...or the desirable glass.


----------



## 1afc

@ Ipse
If those photos are realistic of real life I'd say there is definitely something wrong with the Burei crystal. 

I've not seen anything that dull apart from some politicians.

Maybe you took it outside where you live and it is still frozen.


----------



## Ipse

1afc said:


> @ Ipse
> Maybe you took it outside where you live and it is still frozen.


Too funny...ask me again in February what an ice cube with a Burei inside looks like.


----------



## ronkatct

My impulse buy (Friday order from Amazon Prime) Starking AMO 184 Gold Case wtih Brown Leather Strap arrived today. It is working -- yeah. The winding mechanism seems stiff and unrefined but for $45.00, I am pleased if it works and keeps reasonable time. It looks fantastic and certainly more than $45.00. The date window or date dial is a bit misaligned. My Black Starking with steel bracelet that I ordered earlier from Amazon for $47.00 is still finding its way from China.

No wrist shot as I cannot seem to get it right.


----------



## Ale De Alis

ronkatct said:


> My impulse buy (Friday order from Amazon Prime) Starking AMO 184 Gold Case wtih Brown Leather Strap arrived today. It is working -- yeah. The winding mechanism seems stiff and unrefined but for $45.00, I am pleased if it works and keeps reasonable time. It looks fantastic and certainly more than $45.00. The date window or date dial is a bit misaligned. My Black Starking with steel bracelet that I ordered earlier from Amazon for $47.00 is still finding its way from China.
> 
> No wrist shot as I cannot seem to get it right.


I made the same remarks about mine. Other than that, it's perfect. Now it' s running a bit fast but in two weeks I'll try to regulate it


----------



## ohhenry1

Very nice! Refreshing to see you ordered the version with the arabics at the 12 and 6 ... and in gold tone, no less! I think the Arabics version looks much better than the all indices version (which I own, and which seems to be the majority forum choice), which to my eye is a bit monotonous. Enjoy!


ronkatct said:


> My impulse buy (Friday order from Amazon Prime) Starking AMO 184 Gold Case wtih Brown Leather Strap arrived today. It is working -- yeah. The winding mechanism seems stiff and unrefined but for $45.00, I am pleased if it works and keeps reasonable time. It looks fantastic and certainly more than $45.00. The date window or date dial is a bit misaligned. My Black Starking with steel bracelet that I ordered earlier from Amazon for $47.00 is still finding its way from China.
> 
> No wrist shot as I cannot seem to get it right.
> 
> View attachment 13539259


Sent from my Pixel XL using Tapatalk


----------



## mauler8999

I checked .........s, seems the price went up to $145!!!


----------



## ronkatct

mauler8999 said:


> I checked .........s, seems the price went up to $145!!!


The black Starking AMO184 is now available from Amazon at $49.99 with $3 coupon. And it now qualifies for prime :-(. I am getting my black Starking by snail and fish/bird mail, but got my gold and leather through prime 2 day.


----------



## Brightling007

mauler8999 said:


> I checked .........s, seems the price went up to $145!!!


With the 11/11 sale coming up all prices of Chinese products will go up towards it and most discounts given then will be artificial.


----------



## ronkatct

Guess what I found on Amazon?

A Starking Rooster Automatic watch. Should I get it?


----------



## watchcrank_tx

ronkatct said:


> Guess what I found on Amazon?
> 
> A Starking Rooster Automatic watch. Should I get it?
> 
> View attachment 13543277


Link please. 

Edit: Never mind, found it:

"STARKING Men Rooster Cock Self Winding Automatic Sapphire AM0242 Black Leather Waterproof Wrist Watch"

I'd likely never wear it, but still my mouse finger itches when I contemplate the words "Buy it now." If I were certain it had the 4Hz movement I'm so curious about, I might not be able to resist.

Edit again: Ali (where it's $8 or $9 more) says it's the 28800 HIGH BEATS MOVEMENT, so yeah, I may have to buy this.


----------



## Chascomm

I'd be curious to see some natural lighting photos of this watch. The listing shows some heavily processed wrist shots that give some sense of the textures. Looks promising.


----------



## watchcrank_tx

Chascomm said:


> I'd be curious to see some natural lighting photos of this watch. The listing shows some heavily processed wrist shots that give some sense of the textures. Looks promising.


*"Only 5 left in stock - order soon."*

Would five of y'all do the decent thing and remove temptation from my mind? :-d


----------



## watchcrank_tx

It's a Chopard clone. I should have guessed. Oh well.

Not sure who contributed the correlation, but hat tip to the folk in the "A comprehensive list of Ali Express homages" thread for that info.

I know many don't have the same distaste for clones that I do, but isn't there something wrong when a Chinese company has to copy their Year of the Rooster watch from a foreign design?


----------



## Brightling007

The Chinese have an excellent style of their own, they probably just don't trust it enough to be the style that will sell well internationally.

They know for a fact European designs do...


----------



## Chascomm

watchcrank said:


> It's a Chopard clone.


Yep :-(


----------



## ronkatct

I want a year of the chicken watch. I bought. Only 4 left.:-d


----------



## ronkatct

My Starking Chicken watch arrived. No date. Which is good. The date on my other Starking seems to jump around. Maybe I shook it when the date was changing. Not going to bother returning a $44 watch as long as it works.


----------



## Chascomm

I'm curious to see how this looks out of the plastic and on the wrist. Does the dial have much texture or is it just a flat print.


----------



## ronkatct

I haven't used it or wound it yet. I shook it and it ran. I will play with it this weekend. I will use my new Orient Howard this weekend so the Chicken watch will have to wait. It is suppose to come out once a year during the lunar New Year;-). That is the purpose of a lunar year watch -- actually once every 12 years, during the year of the mighty chicken.


----------



## ronkatct

The Roster Starking was wound up and the time was set. There is not date complication and no second hacking. Given the lack on hour indices, one has to guess the second and time. It is not the most accurate way to tell the time but more of a fashion statement. It is useful about once a year. I will see roughly how accurate it is tomorrow and how long it runs before the power reserve dies and then store it away until the lunar new year. Then it might come out to play.


----------



## watchcrank_tx

ronkatct said:


> There is not date complication and no second hacking.


Whoa, does the Starking 4 Hz / 8 bps / 28,000 bph movement not hack, or is this movement not the 8 bps movement, or is it 8 bps but a non-hacking version while others do hack? I ask because I don't have any Starkings, but I'd not noticed any mention in other threads that Starking's 8 bps movement _didn't_ hack. I admit I'd not read deeply about this movement, having assumed that as an evolution of the Chinese 8215 evolutions it preserved the hacking that the Chinese developments introduced.


----------



## Ipse

My AM1084 does hack...however, I can't open the frikkin caseback to regulate it! So damn tight as if it was 10000m water resistant.
I even tried to freeze the case hoping that somehow the metals will have different contraction coefficients.
I DO have a Bergeron tool, not using a hammer BTW 
Suggestions?


----------



## Ale De Alis

Ipse said:


> My AM1084 does hack...however, I can't open the frikkin caseback to regulate it! So damn tight as if it was 10000m water resistant.
> I even tried to freeze the case hoping that somehow the metals will have different contraction coefficients.
> I DO have a Bergeron tool, not using a hammer BTW
> Suggestions?


Sooner rather than later, I'll have to accomplish this feat, too. With these you should be alright:


----------



## Brightling007

All my Starkings opened just fine, using a three pin case opener wrench (such as the above). And the movements of these all hacked. I've also never had keyless work trouble, not even after having removed the stem several times. That can't be said about the DG3804, which is a fine movement, but the keyless work (especially the hacking lever) is very weak.


----------



## ronkatct

My Starking am0184 gold with date complication has second hacking, and it is supposedly a 28800 beats/hr watch. I have no idea about the beat rate of the Starking Rooster except that there are no hour markers, no date complications, and no second hacking.

It is a show watch rather than functional.


----------



## Brightling007

Put it against your ear and you'll very clearly hear the beat rate difference. The 28800 really sounds MUCH more hasty as a 21600...


----------



## ronkatct

It died when I checked it at about 5:00. I am not sure if I fully wound the watch as I did not want to break the spring or any part. Who knows if the declutch mechanism works. So the power reserve is under 18 hours. 

I checked the sounds of the 28800 watches I have (Rolex, Tissot with 2824-2, and the other Starking) and the 21600 watches (Seiko, Orients, and Tissot with Powermatic 80) and Star Rooster is a 28800. 

We can call this watch Star Rooster 28800.

The face is just painted on flat and not enameled or anything fancy smancy. It is too much to expect for $40.


----------



## ronkatct

double post


----------



## Brightling007

You should not wait the ten seconds to post again, but hit the back button and refresh the page, trust me, your postings will not be lost..

18 hours isn't much, the AM0184 watches I have reach well over 30 hours... You probably didn't wind it far enough then.


----------



## Ipse

Ale De Alis said:


> Sooner rather than later, I'll have to accomplish this feat, too. With these you should be alright:
> 
> View attachment 13555959
> 
> 
> View attachment 13555961


As I mentioned, I have the Bergeron tool, but I admit, I didn't take the bracelet off to put it in a vice. Maybe I should just leave it...I won't be wearing it long enough to have to adjust time &#55357;&#56834;


----------



## Dejekt

I pulled the trigger on the blue version of the one listed as tm0271 transparent. High-beat and thought it looked interesting. Only hardlex though.


----------



## ronkatct

Update of my Gold Starking. It stopped, as I did not use it on Saturday. I did shake it a bit on Friday and Saturday. It is a pain to adjust as the date adjustment is difficult to click from the crown. Sometimes the date mechanism is engaged instead of the wind in the complete pushed down position, and sometimes, it is not. Anyway, I finally reset everything and will see how accurate it is next week. I think I not use the Starking this week.


----------



## Dejekt

https://www..........s.com/item/STA...3d8f957&transAbTest=ae803_5&priceBeautifyAB=0


----------



## emily46758

OH, yes, starking watch , one of my friend had one and its totally shinny. i want to buy too,, but considering AM0184 Im thinking about the new arrived one , they told its am0269 which is similar to NOMOS... someone have more suggetion ?
View attachment 13563549


----------



## emily46758

they told me its not AM0184. your design should be am0194


----------



## JustUK

Dejekt said:


> I pulled the trigger on the blue version of the one listed as tm0271 transparent. High-beat and thought it looked interesting. Only hardlex though.


I've just done the same on a TM0915 with dark blue face, date at 6 o'clock, high beat movement, black leather strap. Hoping it comes through with sapphire as although the listing says hardlex, it also says "Movement: Quartz". Also the pics of the movement show a case back that clearly has the word "sapphire" engraved on it.

I'll post some pics etc when it arrives.

What is it with these listings - could do a better job myself - I have a lot of respect for these manufacturers but when you see some of the spelling and listing errors it's quite sad.


----------



## JustUK

Dejekt said:


> I pulled the trigger on the blue version of the one listed as tm0271 transparent. High-beat and thought it looked interesting. Only hardlex though.


I've just done the same on a TM0915 with dark blue face, date at 6 o'clock, high beat movement, black leather strap. Hoping it comes through with sapphire as although the listing says hardlex, it also says "Movement: Quartz". Also the pics of the movement show a case back that clearly has the word "sapphire" engraved on it.

I'll post some pics etc when it arrives.

What is it with these listings - could do a better job myself - I have a lot of respect for these manufacturers but when you see some of the spelling and listing errors it's quite sad.


----------



## Brightling007

JustUK said:


> I've just done the same on a TM0915 with dark blue face, date at 6 o'clock, high beat movement, black leather strap. Hoping it comes through with sapphire as although the listing says hardlex, it also says "Movement: Quartz". Also the pics of the movement show a case back that clearly has the word "sapphire" engraved on it.
> 
> I'll post some pics etc when it arrives.
> 
> What is it with these listings - could do a better job myself - I have a lot of respect for these manufacturers but when you see some of the spelling and listing errors it's quite sad.


You can get yourself this:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/High-Accur...h=item4895823bec:g:i4AAAOSwal5YM7Qu:rk:3:pf:0

And it'll tell you the difference between mineral and sapphire in a heartbeat.


----------



## ohhenry1

emily46758 said:


> OH, yes, starking watch , one of my friend had one and its totally shinny. i want to buy too,, but considering AM0184 Im thinking about the new arrived one , they told its am0269 which is similar to NOMOS... someone have more suggetion ?
> View attachment 13563549
> View attachment 13563553
> View attachment 13563551


I'd avoid that model. It looks nice, but it has a fake power reserve indicator (the top dial). If you're in love with that design, then I'd get the Guanqin (or even Cadisen, though I don't know as much about it) version of the homage on GearBest, which sells for around $50 USD. Guanqin's Nomos Lambda homage has several reviews on YouTube, and they're all positive. The Guanqin won't have a high beat movement, but I'd gladly give up high beat in exchange for a true power reserve dial.


----------



## Brightling007

I have a Guanqin watch, a Longines Master Collection year calendar homage, and it has an alloy case. I wasn't too pleased with the finishing and would trust the Starking to be much better in that respect. It definitely sucks that it has no power reserve indication though. I would say if they went the extra mile and made it just the way it is with sapphire and PR indicator for double the price they would have actually climbed up the ladder and probably made more profits.


----------



## ohhenry1

Thanks for sharing your experience with Guanqin. I would point out, though, that this particular Guanqin (the Nomos Lambda homage) has been reviewed extensively by several different and clearly legit YouTubers, and is a known quantity. All reviews have been positive. I don't doubt that other Guanqin have alloy cases, but given the above, I'd be shocked if this model did (and if it had poor finishing).


Brightling007 said:


> I have a Guanqin watch, a Longines Master Collection year calendar homage, and it has an alloy case. I wasn't too pleased with the finishing and would trust the Starking to be much better in that respect. It definitely sucks that it has no power reserve indication though. I would say if they went the extra mile and made it just the way it is with sapphire and PR indicator for double the price they would have actually climbed up the ladder and probably made more profits.


Sent from my Pixel XL using Tapatalk


----------



## HoustonReal

Brightling007 said:


> I have a Guanqin watch, a Longines Master Collection year calendar homage, and it has an alloy case. I wasn't too pleased with the finishing and would trust the Starking to be much better in that respect. It definitely sucks that it has no power reserve indication though. I would say if they went the extra mile and made it just the way it is with sapphire and PR indicator for double the price they would have actually climbed up the ladder and probably made more profits.


I would be very surprised if your Guanqin GQ20022 actually has an alloy case. All the listings and YouTube reviews indicate a polished 316L stainless case. How did you determine it was alloy? Every Guanqin automatic I've ever seen has been stainless.

Sent from my moto g(6) using Tapatalk


----------



## Brightling007

HoustonReal said:


> I would be very surprised if your Guanqin GQ20022 actually has an alloy case. All the listings and YouTube reviews indicate a polished 316L stainless case. How did you determine it was alloy? Every Guanqin automatic I've ever seen has been stainless.
> 
> Sent from my moto g(6) using Tapatalk


Well, I did not (yet) chop a piece off, but as far as I can remember it was completely not magnetic, and the looks... But it's by no means a 100% scientifically proven or guaranteed fact. I shall have another look at it for sure, it is not a watch I wear a lot.


----------



## Brightling007

Here's my Guanqin... I have to say when a watch is glossy like that at all sides it is always hard to say if it is steel or alloy, it might be a really great polishing job, or just a layer of chrome. I shall open it up soon to check the insides, usually the colour there says it all. Or I can at least grind of a little sample.


----------



## HoustonReal

Brightling007 said:


> Well, I did not (yet) chop a piece off, but as far as I can remember it was completely not magnetic, and the looks... But it's by no means a 100% scientifically proven or guaranteed fact. I shall have another look at it for sure, it is not a watch I wear a lot.


Ideally, both 304 and 316L stainless steel are austenitic, or non-magnetic. Mistakes in production can sometimes lead to slight magnetism, but 316L is more difficult to accidentally magnetize.

https://greenwoodmagnetics.com/resource/what-is-the-difference-between-304-and-316-stainless-steel/

The case back also reads "ALL STAINLESS". Then again, it says "Swiss Made", as well.


----------



## ohhenry1

HoustonReal said:


> Ideally, both 304 and 316L stainless steel are austenitic, or non-magnetic. Mistakes in production can sometimes lead to slight magnetism, but 316L is more difficult to accidentally magnetize.
> 
> https://greenwoodmagnetics.com/resource/what-is-the-difference-between-304-and-316-stainless-steel/
> 
> The case back also reads "ALL STAINLESS". Then again, it says "Swiss Made", as well.


On the subject of stainless steel and Starkings, what do you believe the Starking Piaget Polo S chronograph homage to be made of? All stainless? Or stainless back with alloy case?


----------



## Brightling007

I know, yet by far most 316L steel samples I have are slightly magnetic, just enough to feel it when help up against a small neodymium bar magnet. I've just had a look inside the Guanqin, there is not much suspicious about it to the naked eye, and it could even be a two part casing, with a bush pressed in to it.

Only one way to tell by means I have at hand is to drill in to a lug hole and investigate some shavings under my microscope.

I may have been wrong about the material after all, and if that is the truth it is quite a nicely polished casing.

Mine looks a bit different from that at the back, says only "st.steel"...


----------



## HoustonReal

ohhenry1 said:


> On the subject of stainless steel and Starkings, what do you believe the Starking Piaget Polo S chronograph homage to be made of? All stainless? Or stainless back with alloy case?


The back of mine says "All Stainless Steel", and I have no reason to doubt it. The bracelet has folded links, but it seems better than most other similarly constructed bracelets I've owned.

Mine is blue, and the color is very subdued compared to the listing pictures. In low light it almost looks gray, and in sunlight the blue is muted, like a "Blue Jean" color. The quartz chronograph movement works, but often requires manual realignment after use. This is an in-house movement, so its overall quality and longevity is an unknown.

For the $20 I paid, it's not a bad watch, but don't expect Seiko-like reliability.


----------



## HoustonReal

Brightling007 said:


> I know, yet by far most 316L steel samples I have are slightly magnetic, just enough to feel it when help up against a small neodymium bar magnet. I've just had a look inside the Guanqin, there is not much suspicious about it to the naked eye, and it could even be a two part casing, with a bush pressed in to it.
> 
> Only one way to tell by means I have at hand is to drill in to a lug hole and investigate some shavings under my microscope.
> 
> I may have been wrong about the material after all, and if that is the truth it is quite a nicely polished casing.
> 
> Mine looks a bit different from that at the back, says only "st.steel"...
> View attachment 13569241
> View attachment 13569243


BTW - Gearbest now has this model for *$31.75* ($43.75 w/additional $12 discount in cart)


----------



## watchcrank_tx

HoustonReal said:


> The case back also reads "ALL STAINLESS". Then again, it says "Swiss Made", as well.


Yikes. I'm no fan of most clones, but as is often pointed out, they are legal. This isn't. Whatever domestic laws China may have about selling products with false information engraved on them, exporting a product with a false designation of origin is in violation of most (likely all) current trade treaties. Further (and admitting I am not a lawyer), I believe that importing an item with a false country of origin has been illegal in the United States since the Smoot-Hawley Tariff Act of 1930, not to mention that deceptive labeling is illegal under consumer protection laws. I suspect similar laws exist in most other countries.


----------



## ronkatct

Sterling has some new automatics with third hand complication that look very nice on Amazon. Prices are from $45 to $75 depending on strap or mesh and date complications.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07HH452DG?th=1


----------



## Ipse

HoustonReal said:


> BTW - Gearbest now has this model for *$31.75* ($43.75 w/additional $12 discount in cart)


I succumbed to this one..32 bucks!
Worried though that I will lose my mind if it needs setting after a week in the drawer....so many hands... ;-)


----------



## ronkatct

My new Black Sterling AM 0184. Looks much better than its price class. It actually looks good and much better than it cost. The bracelet is NOT FOLDED. The date dial for this watch is small but properly aligned, unlike my gold Sterling (which also has issues in getting the crown to the date change position).

I am impressed with the initial quality. Almost everything is spot on. One hour index is off, but that is minor for its price. Now if reliable, reasonably accurate with decent power reserve, it is a good buy.


----------



## ronkatct

My new Black Sterling gained 8 seconds in the approximately 16 hours since I set it up to the atomic clock. So out of the box, the accuracy seems to be about 12spd. It was on wrist or on power winder. This is decent performance. This is impressive for a $46 watch. I might get a white, but people have reported qc problems with white in a previous batches. The white with 12 and 6 arabic numerals has 2 day shipping. But I wouuld prefer white with no numerals just to have something different.


----------



## Ale De Alis

ronkatct said:


> My new Black Sterling gained 8 seconds in the approximately 16 hours since I set it up to the atomic clock. So out of the box, the accuracy seems to be about 12spd. It was on wrist or on power winder. This is decent performance. This is impressive for a $46 watch. I might get a white, but people have reported qc problems with white in a previous batches. The white with 12 and 6 arabic numerals has 2 day shipping. But I wouuld prefer white with no numerals just to have something different.


I have an AM0184 with no numerals on the dial. I like yours better! :-!
Mine was +12/15 spd, too. Three days ago dropped to - 2/3 spd without any regulation. Let's hope it keeps going on like this.


----------



## ronkatct

^ I want a white starking am0184 without arabic numerals, as i have a black with .


----------



## Le_Zouave

ronkatct said:


> ^ I want a white starking am0184 without arabic numerals, as i have a black with .


Starking AM0184 is without arabic numerals.
Starking AM0194 is with arabic numerals.
Luckily for you, AM0184 exist in white, while AM0194 also exist in white but with golden inlay (but you don't want AM0194 in white anyway).
Aliexpress opened pre-order for 11/11 but AM0184 is not as low as the previous promotion.


----------



## bklake

Le_Zouave said:


> Starking AM0184 is without arabic numerals.
> Starking AM0194 is with arabic numerals.
> Luckily for you, AM0184 exist in white, while AM0194 also exist in white but with golden inlay (but you don't want AM0194 in white anyway).
> Aliexpress opened pre-order for 11/11 but AM0184 is not as low as the previous promotion.


Amazon lists the one with numerals as AM0184 but the 0194 is buried in the color selection menu. Aliexpress has it as AM0194. Amazon has these is stock for just a few dollars more and you can have it in 2 days.


----------



## ronkatct

Le_Zouave said:


> Starking AM0184 is without arabic numerals.
> Starking AM0194 is with arabic numerals.
> Luckily for you, AM0184 exist in white, while AM0194 also exist in white but with golden inlay (but you don't want AM0194 in white anyway).
> .........s opened pre-order for 11/11 but AM0184 is not as low as the previous promotion.


Ordered this instead with 2 day shipping and at $42 after coupon.:-d


----------



## ronkatct

Latest Starking arrived.


----------



## ohhenry1

Starking has just released it's high-beat Submariner homage!

Link: TUKF

Color options are quite limited right now (green, and then blue/gold two-tone), and I wouldn't advise buying at that price (too high, even at the 11/11 Pre-Order price of $102.60), but it's an encouraging development. This would be a good one to consider when the price eventually falls.


----------



## Ale De Alis

ohhenry1 said:


> Starking has just released it's high-beat Submariner homage!
> 
> Link: TUKF
> 
> Color options are quite limited right now (green, and then blue/gold two-tone), and I wouldn't advise buying at that price (too high, even at the 11/11 Pre-Order price of $102.60), but it's an encouraging development. This would be a good one to consider when the price eventually falls.


Yep, still too expensive to compete with Loreo and Parnis.


----------



## HoustonReal

ohhenry1 said:


> Starking has just released it's high-beat Submariner homage!
> 
> Link: TUKF
> 
> Color options are quite limited right now (green, and then blue/gold two-tone), and I wouldn't advise buying at that price (too high, even at the 11/11 Pre-Order price of $102.60), but it's an encouraging development. This would be a good one to consider when the price eventually falls.
> 
> View attachment 13583627


Only 10OM WR? While the Starking may have a 28,800 movement, the Invicta Pro Divers are much better watches. I would rather have an NH35A in that price range, and 200M WR is a bare minimum for $100+.


----------



## Brightling007

ohhenry1 said:


> Starking has just released it's high-beat Submariner homage!
> 
> Link: TUKF
> 
> Color options are quite limited right now (green, and then blue/gold two-tone), and I wouldn't advise buying at that price (too high, even at the 11/11 Pre-Order price of $102.60), but it's an encouraging development. This would be a good one to consider when the price eventually falls.
> 
> View attachment 13583627


It wasn't just released, it already existed when I purchased my first am0184, but I found it too expensive, no solid end links and dubious pictures showing many inconsistencies, even one or two with Rolex engraved in the rehaut.


----------



## ronkatct

Swapped out the light brown strap of the Black Beauty Sterling for a dark brown strap I had. Should i use light brown or dark brown strap?

View attachment 13584255


View attachment 13584256


:think:


----------



## ronkatct

Image missing


----------



## watchcrank_tx

HoustonReal said:


> Only 10OM WR? While the Starking may have a 28,800 movement, the Invicta Pro Divers are much better watches. I would rather have an NH35A in that price range, and 200M WR is a bare minimum for $100+.


Indeed, it's sort of bizarre to see Starking enter a market where they are not a value player. The Invicta is clearly the leader here except for those who can't abide a 3Hz, 6bps movement.



Brightling007 said:


> It wasn't just released, it already existed when I purchased my first am0184, but I found it too expensive, no solid end links and dubious pictures showing many inconsistencies, even one or two with Rolex engraved in the rehaut.


I saw that too. I'd like to think that was just sloppy photoshopping of a stolen photograph rather than photoshopping their brand name onto a conterfeit from the same factory. I find subs about as interesting as beige paint though, so I've never paid much attention to how to authenticate one. Perhaps someone who knows Rolex subs well can say whether that's a real Rolex or a fake one.

Additionally, the other non-render (I think) sales photos I've found of this watch, not only the Rolex wrist shot, are clearly photoshopped between color variations. I guess if you've saved money on designers by lifting someone else's design, you might as well save on photographers too. :roll:


----------



## Ale De Alis

ronkatct said:


> My new Black Sterling AM 0184. Looks much better than its price class. It actually looks good and much better than it cost. The bracelet is NOT FOLDED. The date dial for this watch is small but properly aligned, unlike my gold Sterling (which also has issues in getting the crown to the date change position).
> 
> I am impressed with the initial quality. Almost everything is spot on. One hour index is off, but that is minor for its price. Now if reliable, reasonably accurate with decent power reserve, it is a good buy.
> 
> View attachment 13573403


Ronkatct, the lug width of your new Starking is 19 or 20 mm?


----------



## Ale De Alis

double post


----------



## Ale De Alis

triple post


----------



## ronkatct

Lug width of new Black Beauty Starking is 20mm.

Should I use new dark brown strap or original light brown strap? Original images somehow got lost.


----------



## Ale De Alis

Go with the light brown strap.
I didn't mean the black watch, I meant this one ;-)


----------



## ronkatct

Ah, the other black beauty. Also 20mm. All the starkings are 20mm i think. I wore black beauty with dark brown strap to work today. I might wear the other black beauty Starking to work tomorrow, or blue Orient howard,. We shall see.


----------



## Dejekt

So here are the pics I promised of the starking highbeat I ordered. Crystal is mineral (they're saying hardlex, but I thought that was proprietary?), case is a zinc alloy as opposed to SS. Second hand does operate pretty smoothly, and while I don't think the watch is ugly I don't think it looks quite as good as the pictures on ali. Leather band looks nice and matches well, but to me it is a bit stiff and thin, will see how it feels once broken in and I will report back on the accuracy once I have timed it for a few days. The rotor is pretty loud when you flick your wrist which doesn't bother me that much and it is overall pretty light, which I assume is attributable to the use of Zinc. For 45$ I don't hold the zinc or mineral crystal against the watch as I knew what I was ordering going in and I still think it is a great deal for a high beat movement assuming it holds up.


----------



## Dejekt

Yeah I think maybe some QC issues. I wound it up some before putting it on and multiple times have noticed it completely stopping. If I shake it, it will restart (sometimes requires a fairly forceful shake of my wrist). I tried giving it a small wind once when it stopped too and it didn't start back until I shook it again so I don't think it is an issue with being unwound since when it does restart it keeps going. Contacted the seller.

Also no hacking seconds on this model, despite it being high-beat. Even if you set time backwards it doesn't stop like I've seen on russian watches.


----------



## ronkatct

Changed back Starking Back Beauty to its original Strap and may use it today. It is a bit fast after a week of non use in winder.


----------



## Brightling007

I've received a TM0915 yesterday, but the case is alloy and it has a solid pressfit caseback, mineral glass, bit disappointed. So I transplanted the internals in to an AM0184 that I stripped for the movement. I like it a lot now, and ot is a bit more unique.






before...






after...


----------



## Cestusrex

Doctor, the transplant was a success! I like it.


----------



## Brightling007

Cestusrex said:


> Doctor, the transplant was a success! I like it.


Thanks! At first I though should I even do it, then I though ah what the heck and when it was finished I started liking it more an more!


----------



## ronkatct

My Black Starking with metal bracelet does not autowind effectively:roll:, so I requested a return through Amazon. Starking offered to send me a replacement watch, which I accepted:-d. Replacement arrived today and replacement whirls easily when shaken. Still not sure of accuracy yet but autowind works.

So Starking watches are not that reliable with 2 watches being borderline. I did not bother to return one, but getting the crown to be on the date changing position is tricky for the gold Starking. My Black Beauty with leather strap works well:-!.

I now have 2 Starking Black metal bracelet watches. I can wear one on each hand.:-!


----------



## ronkatct

I have to report that the Starking above no longer moves with hard hand windmill movements nor with hand winding. The KING has gone back to the STAR :-(.

But the replacement seems to be working well. I have would it up and set up the time and date. I will roughly estimate accuracy tonight when I go home and may use a timegrapher when I get one on Thursday. I may resize the bracelet (or not). I need to resize several Winner watch bracelets as well.


----------



## Brightling007

ronkatct said:


> I have to report that the Starking above no longer moves with hard hand windmill movements nor with hand winding. The KING has gone back to the STAR :-(.
> 
> But the replacement seems to be working well. I have would it up and set up the time and date. I will roughly estimate accuracy tonight when I go home and may use a timegrapher when I get one on Thursday. I may resize the bracelet (or not). I need to resize several Winner watch bracelets as well.


It'll be main spring barrel related probably. if you can get it ticking over by helping the third wheel, the it's probably the main spring that can't move due to finishing issues. you may be able to free it up by giving the bottom (escape) wheel a little push.

Bit of a shame it is only something so trivial to make a whole watch useless...


----------



## ronkatct

Brightling007 said:


> It'll be main spring barrel related probably. if you can get it ticking over by helping the third wheel, the it's probably the main spring that can't move due to finishing issues. you may be able to free it up by giving the bottom (escape) wheel a little push.
> 
> Bit of a shame it is only something so trivial to make a whole watch useless...


How do I do that? I ordered some inexpensive watch opening tools and other stuff from Amazon and the orders will arrive tomorrow and Thursday. My diamond tester arrived today and the Starking has sapphire crystal.


----------



## ronkatct

double post


----------



## Dejekt

The replacement arrived today for my TM0271. This one will not run at all, and the crystal on the caseback fell out in the box.


----------



## GreenNeedle

Hello guys. I was just wondering if anyone knew what size the dial on this watch is. Thinking about buying it for a mod.


----------



## Brightling007

GreenNeedle said:


> Hello guys. I was just wondering if anyone knew what size the dial on this watch is. Thinking about buying it for a mod.


This is the AM0184 dial...








The TM 0915 is about 3-4mm larger...


----------



## GreenNeedle

Brightling007 said:


> This is the AM0184 dial...
> View attachment 13678909
> 
> 
> The TM 0915 is about 3-4mm larger...


Yeah it was the 184 I was looking at. Didn't think it was going to be that big. kinda limits options for modding.

Many thanks for measuring though. Will have to have a think


----------



## GreenNeedle

Brightling007 said:


> This is the AM0184 dial...
> View attachment 13678909
> 
> 
> The TM 0915 is about 3-4mm larger...


Yeah it was the 184 I was looking at. Didn't think it was going to be that big. kinda limits options for modding.

Many thanks for measuring though. Will have to have a think


----------



## Brightling007

I think it will accept a smaller dial, will measure what the minimal needs are ok?


----------



## CalinFlorin

I bought 3 days ago a Starking AM0182 it runs +10s per day but this sound and fact that it stops when you shake it like that worries me...
I regret now that I haven.t bought a nakzen with miyota 9015 or 8215. I dont think that my watch will last long 

https://streamable.com/cbdlw
strange sound like a fallen part and it stop for 1 second part and it stop for 1 second..

Please give me some advices. Thanks


----------



## GreenNeedle

Brightling007 said:


> I think it will accept a smaller dial, will measure what the minimal needs are ok?


That would be good. If I can fit a smaller dial and the chapter ring still covers the edges that might work


----------



## Brightling007

Unfortunately a lot of them have this issue, I have a remedy for it (if it has the same cause) but it requires removing the main bridge of the movement. It is the placing back that odds the hard part, where five axles need to be aligned.


----------



## GreenNeedle

CalinFlorin said:


> I regret now that I haven.t bought a nakzen with miyota 9015 or 8215. I dont think that my watch will last long


There is a Nakzen on the forbidden site that says it has an NH35 movement in it. From the picture of the movement though I am not overly convinced it really is an NH35. Unless Seiko have started stamping their rotor instead of etching. Looks very poorly done to me.


----------



## Brightling007

GreenNeedle said:


> That would be good. If I can fit a smaller dial and the chapter ring still covers the edges that might work


The minimal size is still 34.50mm


----------



## GreenNeedle

Brightling007 said:


> The minimal size is still 34.50mm


Might need to find a Plain steel Parnis chapter ring of similar size then. Not getting my hopes up. They all seem to be the dodgy flat chapter rings like the new Seiko big watches.


----------



## Chascomm

GreenNeedle said:


> There is a Nakzen on the forbidden site that says it has an NH35 movement in it. From the picture of the movement though I am not overly convinced it really is an NH35. Unless Seiko have started stamping their rotor instead of etching. Looks very poorly done to me.


A Chinese assembler stamping 'Seiko' onto a Chinese movement? First time I've heard of such a thing, and I doubt if it would be worth the effort. On the other hand I've seen many instances of a watches powered by unsigned Chinese movements where the seller _claims_ a Japanese movement. Croton often used to be sold with 'Japan 8215 movement' (Sea-Gull ST16) or 'Japan 8205 movement' (Dixmont DG28), but they never actually put counterfeit signatures on the movement. I think that if it says Seiko, then that is what it is.


----------



## Brightling007

An Nzh35 isn't really a Seiko, it is Hattori, and that is the manufacturer of Seiko movements, so it is not all wrong, but there is a difference. If it says 7S6 or 4R35 then it is Seiko. In essence these are the same, just not the rotor, there is no Seiko watch with NH35 inscription on the rotor.

The Chinese do make these movements too, don't know where, but I have several with sterile finishing that are definitely not Japan made.


----------



## Brightling007

An NH35 isn't really a Seiko, it is Hattori, and that is the manufacturer of Seiko movements, so it is not all wrong, but there is a difference. If it says 7S6 or 4R35 then it is Seiko. In essence these are the same, just not the rotor, there is no Seiko watch with NH35 inscription on the rotor.

The Chinese do make these movements too, don't know where, but I have several with sterile finishing that are definitely not Japan made.


----------



## Chascomm

Brightling007 said:


> An Nzh35 isn't really a Seiko, it is Hattori, and that is the manufacturer of Seiko movements, so it is not all wrong, but there is a difference. If it says 7S6 or 4R35 then it is Seiko. In essence these are the same, just not the rotor, there is no Seiko watch with NH35 inscription on the rotor.
> 
> The Chinese do make these movements too, don't know where, but I have several with sterile finishing that are definitely not Japan made.


That would be Jing He Industrial Company. For movements that look like the older Seiko 7s26 or 70xx series, look at the Hangzhou 2-series. Some years ago there were Orient style movements showing up in several brands which were probably sourced from Shanghai Golden Time Co, but I'm not sure if they are still being made. But on none of these have I ever seen false manufacturer's marks.


----------



## GreenNeedle

Brightling007 said:


> An NH35 isn't really a Seiko, it is Hattori, and that is the manufacturer of Seiko movements, so it is not all wrong, but there is a difference. If it says 7S6 or 4R35 then it is Seiko. In essence these are the same, just not the rotor, there is no Seiko watch with NH35 inscription on the rotor.
> 
> The Chinese do make these movements too, don't know where, but I have several with sterile finishing that are definitely not Japan made.


I'm not saying it was stamped Seiko, although I didn't check there. I assume it said SII. It was more the way it was stamped very crudely rather than being tidily etched.








IMO If I was looking at the Nakzens with Japanese movements then rather than buying one for £55 with an NH35 movement that can be bought on its own for £25 I would rather go for the £75 ones that have a Miyota 9015 movement in them. For that price you are basically buying the movement and getting the rest for free as the movement is not much less on its own. A hi-beat movement as well.


----------



## Chascomm

GreenNeedle said:


> I'm not saying it was stamped Seiko, although I didn't check there. I assume it said SII. It was more the way it was stamped very crudely rather than being tidily etched...


I just did a quick Google to get an impression of the level of finish on NH35 movements as supplied to various brands, and its cosmetic standard of finish appears to be below the average for Chinese movements, certainly cruder than the Jing He JHB series movements that are the clone of the NH35. I'd say that if it looks rough, then it's the Japanese original.


----------



## Brightling007

That's my experience too, the Hattori movement is finished well where it matters most, but everything where it is just cosmetic or of a lesser functional need the material and finishing are only so so. The sterile ones I have (supposedly Chinese) are a bit better and generally show even a tad more precision on the Timegrapher.


----------



## CalinFlorin

Does anyone have any idea how long will a 25 jewel high beat starking will last ?


----------



## ronkatct

ronkatct said:


> I have to report that the Starking above no longer moves with hard hand windmill movements nor with hand winding. The KING has gone back to the STAR :-(.
> 
> But the replacement seems to be working well. I have would it up and set up the time and date. I will roughly estimate accuracy tonight when I go home and may use a timegrapher when I get one on Thursday. I may resize the bracelet (or not). I need to resize several Winner watch bracelets as well.


Sad to say that the replacement AM0184 Black Starking also failed. But I got a full refund so I am happy. I also got 2 free watches that I will take apart to play. And I have 2 dececnt bracelets to swap for my Winner watches :-d.


----------



## johnmichael

Hey GreenNeedle, you are so right in paying a bit more for the Nazken since you do indeed essentially buy the 9015 and get the rest of the watch for free! My sentiment exactly when I purchased one for $85 USD.


----------



## CalinFlorin

he watch arrived and when you shake them the second hand stops for 1 second.

https://streamable.com/9epgl look this video

On another morning I found the watch stopped completely after I worned it the whole day and even handwind the crown.
The movement is low quality !
The back glass is Hardlex, not Sapphire, only the dial is Sapphire.
The seller didn't want to give me some of the money back ! He gave me a coupon of 30$ to buy from his store, what a joke after I thrown 70 usd, he wants to make me buy another piece of .... !
So I paid 72 $ for a crap that stops, that stutter during moving the hand and that keeps not the time !

Do not buy from this seller, because he doesn't care if you get a faulty product.
SELLER NAME: *LM WATCH STORE*
https://lmwatch.aliexpress.com/store/2901094?spm=a2g0s.9042311.0.0.7c414c4dunroVw


----------



## Brightling007

That is sad to hear, but not surprising. I'd say if you are not capable of repairing movements, or don't feel like it is useful to invest any time in then stay away from Starking.

The movement is actually for most pretty well finished and pretty high quality, just the gear on the seconds hand pinion is not.

I have bought more than ten watches through the past with this 28800 movement and at least half of them had issues, but I have managed to use them all after a good service, even the seconds hand freeze issue is possible to resolve, although not in the most professional way, but when the movement is taken apart a small amount of grease can be applied to the shaft to stabilize the moving.


----------



## johnmichael

Are there any inexpensive ($50+/_) Chinese watches w/high beat movements (made by whom?) that are worth buying. A few weeks ago, I had an opportunity to buy a Nakzen w/9015 for around $85 which is without saying a good deal. It is just the sub $60-$70 range that I am wondering about. Too bad about the Starking since it is their own movement. Unfortunately, I heard/read more negative than positive about it (see Brightling007 above).


----------



## Brightling007

Anything under $100 with high beat movement is exceptional, but under $50 is just plain bonkers. I've talked to several Chinese sellers about buying movements and they were all shocked about the SK deal, but it goes without saying this low price is 'justified' as with many other Chinese products the quality control is not great. Apparently you don't need to provide high quality to be successful, the world wide market apparently offers an endless supply of unsuspecting customers.


----------



## sh333

I have just ended a two month runaround in a formal dispute with the STARKING official store on Aliexpress. Long story, but I would highly recommend avoiding that business at all costs going forward. 

In a nutshell, they never shipped the watch. when i inquired as to why, they claimed it was because of strike action with Canada post (CP is still not on strike despite discussion of possible strike action at some point). This is total BS as i have gotten numerous other Ali packages during the same time frame. When pressed they then tried to get me to pay more for shipping despite there being no framework in place for me to pay more (not that i would have). Finally, when i gave up, they would not refund me until i went thru the formal dispute process with Ali.

Their customer service is a joke at best and given some of the recent complaints in terms of quality, i am going to avoid ordering any more Starking items going forward out of principle. YMMV.


----------



## John_Schoen

I received my AM184 that I ordered on 11/11 yesterday. It has no issues and was well regulated, my timegrapher measured a beat error of 0 to .1 milliseconds and +4 seconds/day accuracy. In the real world that translated to running spot on 24 hours later. Incredible value for the 37 Euros that I paid for it.


----------



## Brightling007

John_Schoen said:


> I received my AM184 that I ordered on 11/11 yesterday. It has no issues and was well regulated, my timegrapher measured a beat error of 0 to .1 milliseconds and +4 seconds/day accuracy. In the real world that translated to running spot on 24 hours later. Incredible value for the 37 Euros that I paid for it.


I've had a few run like that too, and still do, you're lucky!


----------



## HoustonReal

I received a Starking AM0242 Rooster watch from Amazon on Friday. It came DOA, and all attempts to resuscitate it failed. It goes back today!


----------



## johnmichael

I question this pricing but here it is: https://ronano-stores.myshopify.com...0dKj0tSa_sYS0ElCZ5tDoEqx0FR4tyFoaAgsXEALw_wcB


----------



## HoustonReal

johnmichael said:


> I question this pricing but here it is: https://ronano-stores.myshopify.com...0dKj0tSa_sYS0ElCZ5tDoEqx0FR4tyFoaAgsXEALw_wcB


I thought this might be the inflated shipping and handling scam, but it was free shipping. The prices are way too low. They have the Cadisen with the Miyota 9015 for $45, and the Gladster Tracer (Miyota 8215) for around $23. Those are way under the movement prices. The Cadisen C1030 is $25. It seems like it must be a scam.


----------



## ronkatct

I should check my Rooster Starking. Two of my Starkings died and one has problems. The one without date works well. My rooster worked when I tested it months ago. Three out of four with problems isn't good reliability odds. Only worse was Vostok - 1 out of 1 failed - the crown came off and I returned for full refund and have not reordered.


----------



## ronkatct

Yeah! King Rooster is working. I tried to wind it up and see how long it runs.

Edited to add. How long it runs in terms of power reserve and not how long it lasts till Rooster dies. I will use King Rooster once a year so it will last forever.


----------



## Brightling007

I think they're getting sloppy, as the odd seem to degrade. My last order were so basically doa, flawed at least.

It's not the first time in history the Chinese produced a cheap high beater with issues...


----------



## ronkatct

Too bad that the QC is the letdown for Starking. Starking watches are nice otherwise. They must be losing money on returns or refunds. I got 2 free black Strarkings that i did not have to return and a full refund. My gold Starking works but the wind to date set crown position is tricky. The black beauty, non-date small hand, and non date King Rooster are fine. I will stick to Winner/Forsining watches or Miyota/Nh35-36 movements. I have not had a problem with a Tongji movement except inefficient rotor. Winner/Forsining watches have horrible bracelets and straps but look great and cost a sunflower seed.


----------



## HoustonReal

johnmichael said:


> I question this pricing but here it is: https://ronano-stores.myshopify.com...0dKj0tSa_sYS0ElCZ5tDoEqx0FR4tyFoaAgsXEALw_wcB


And it's now defunct! The scam is over, and the store has disappeared.


----------



## GreenNeedle

Mine arrived today. White face brown leather strap. Worn it since it arrived and first 12 hours it is +1s. So far looking very good.


----------



## Brightling007

Usually when they start that well, they stay that well. Thanks for reporting, it's good to know they have a chance of coursing towards a reliable product.


----------



## ronkatct

ronkatct said:


> Yeah! King Rooster is working. I tried to wind it up and see how long it runs.
> 
> Edited to add. How long it runs in terms of power reserve and not how long it lasts till Rooster dies. I will use King Rooster once a year so it will last forever.


King Rooster seems to have a power reserve of about 30 hours. I am not sure if I fully would the watch. It will go back into storage awaiting the Lunar New Year.


----------



## GreenNeedle

Brightling007 said:


> Usually when they start that well, they stay that well. Thanks for reporting, it's good to know they have a chance of coursing towards a reliable product.


Just to pick your brain a little seeing as you've explored modding options. I did buy it in the hope of modding it a bit although I'll wait for a week or so and make sure it keeps working first 

When you say 2824 dials fit, does the date line up in the window of a 2824 dial when fitted? Or are we talking plain 2824 dials and just fit it over ignoring the date wheel. And you say that ETA hands fit with some minor pinching necessary sometimes on the minute hand? Is it a definite no-no for fitting a miyota 82?? dial?

There are some sterile dials around in a similar size between 34.5 and 35.5 so just checking out what will fit really.


----------



## HoustonReal

GreenNeedle said:


> Just to pick your brain a little seeing as you've explored modding options. I did buy it in the hope of modding it a bit although I'll wait for a week or so and make sure it keeps working first
> 
> When you say 2824 dials fit, does the date line up in the window of a 2824 dial when fitted? Or are we talking plain 2824 dials and just fit it over ignoring the date wheel. And you say that ETA hands fit with some minor pinching necessary sometimes on the minute hand? Is it a definite no-no for fitting a miyota 82?? dial?
> 
> There are some sterile dials around in a similar size between 34.5 and 35.5 so just checking out what will fit really.


The *SK Series* hand sizes are *1.52/0.90/0.25*

*http://www.starkingwatch.com/upload/file/201708/1813.pdf*


----------



## GreenNeedle

HoustonReal said:


> The *SK Series* hand sizes are *1.52/0.90/0.25*
> 
> *http://www.starkingwatch.com/upload/file/201708/1813.pdf*
> 
> View attachment 13715421


Many thanks for that. It is a useful doc, I have the .pdf version already with the ETA ones at the end on my HD at the moment. Just need clarification on the date window now, although I don't mind covering the date up if a non date dial takes my fancy.

To update on the watch after 24 hours. Timekeeping is good. First 24 hours with 8 hours off the wrist and left face up overnight was +4s............then I thought I would handwind it and noticed a strange thing. When the seconds hand is inbetween 5 and 20 the seconds hand jumps forward in quartz-like movements while you wind, then sweeps while you reposition your grip then jumps forward again while you wind. Doesn't happen when the seconds hand is away from the crown area. Very strange  Was still +4s after I wound. Maybe it holds the seconds and then it release all the "sweeps" it missed!!! Don't like the idea of that. Seems that might cause stress problem inside so I won;t hand-wind it anymore just in case.

So I've reset the time now to my EcoDrive and will check the +/- again tomorrow.


----------



## GreenNeedle

Just to update. I won't keep updating on the timekeeping, just if it stops working 

The watch seems to be a steady +4s per day. I can;t see much point in checking it in all the different "resting" positions. I always out of habit put my watches face up and 4s is pretty darned good. Beats the accuracy of my 7S26B's +15s and my Technos Goldshield "60s" Franken watch. The Franken is actually quite good with a Fontainemelon movement in it averaging about 10s per day.

Time will tell (no pun intended) if this lasts the decade+ of the Seiko and the ??? years of the Franken but so far so good. Maybe I just get lucky with watches?


----------



## Ale De Alis

If my am0194 rests (12h) crown up, the watch is about -10. If it rests (12h) dial up, it's about +10. To achieve great accuracy I should change its position once a day! :-d


----------



## ronkatct

Just wear your Starking and move your arm all around and you will wind your Starking and ensure its accuracy.


----------



## watchcrank_tx

Ale De Alis said:


> If my am0194 rests (12h) crown up, the watch is about -10. If it rests (12h) dial up, it's about +10. To achieve great accuracy I should change its position once a day! :-d


Time it in all positions, then wear it and figure out how your wear pattern combines to make it run. Then find the best position to rest it overnight to add or subtract time by which the watch drifted during the day. Whether intentional or not, that's the way that most of the truthful tales of extreme mechanical accuracy we see reported on this website are achieved. (Most, I suspect, are instead exaggerations, rose-tinted mis-remembrances, or outright fibs, though a very, very few probably are simply preternaturally accurate watches.)

The above technique assumes you wear the same watch multiple days in a row, which far from everyone on this site does, of course. b-)


----------



## GreenNeedle

watchcrank said:


> Time it in all positions, then wear it and figure out how your wear pattern combines to make it run. Then find the best position to rest it overnight to add or subtract time by which the watch drifted during the day. Whether intentional or not, that's the way that most of the truthful tales of extreme mechanical accuracy we see reported on this website are achieved. (Most, I suspect, are instead exaggerations, rose-tinted mis-remembrances, or outright fibs, though a very, very few probably are simply preternaturally accurate watches.)
> 
> The above technique assumes you wear the same watch multiple days in a row, which far from everyone on this site does, of course. b-)


I'll try it in the "crown up" position for the next few days (nights) and see if the EcoDrive catches up with the Starking.


----------



## Ale De Alis

This morning I was setting the time and my AM0194's heart stopped for about 10 min. :roll:
It raised from the dead all by itself :-!
Not exactly the most reliable movement :-d:-d


----------



## Brightling007

Ale De Alis said:


> This morning I was setting the time and my AM0194's heart stopped for about 10 min. :roll:
> It raised from the dead all by itself :-!
> Not exactly the most reliable movement :-d:-d


Could be poor beat error adjustment, or swarf/dust/poor finishing somewhere. When the beat error is off, the movement can be 100% healthy and still won't start. This is like a pendulum clock not standing straight.


----------



## ronkatct

Both my black Starking AM0184 watches stopped and never restarted. Could they both suffer from beat error movement issues? I received full refund and 2 free watches as well, so I can take them apart and play. I bought some cheap tools to do so, but I am having problems removing bracelets. Not removing the clasp doesn't help o|.


----------



## Brightling007

ronkatct said:


> Both my black Starking AM0184 watches stopped and never restarted. Could they both suffer from beat error movement issues? I received full refund and 2 free watches as well, so I can take them apart and play. I bought some cheap tools to do so, but I am having problems removing bracelets. Not removing the clasp doesn't help o|.


It's possible, but if you don't have the equipment you'd best leave it alone. Your best bet would be to drop it off at a watchmaker, but the usual ones charge more for just opening and closing the caseback as what the whole watch costs. It's a shame, but I guess that's the down side of such an incredible deal.


----------



## ronkatct

Brightling007 said:


> It's possible, but if you don't have the equipment you'd best leave it alone. Your best bet would be to drop it off at a watchmaker, but the usual ones charge more for just opening and closing the caseback as what the whole watch costs. It's a shame, but I guess that's the down side of such an incredible deal.


I will wait until summer when the weather is warmer to see if the warmer weather might get the lubricant viscous enough for the watches to get going. I can open the back and move the balance wheels to see if the watches start back up. What have I got to lose except time from dead watches :roll:? They are 2 free watches at this time and I can salvage 2 very nice bracelets.

I have so far salvaged 1 so-called "leather" strap from my defective Benyar (which I got replaced for $1, and the replacement seems to be working fine with decent accuracy). I will leave a very nice thank you and positive review in a few days assuming the replacement Benyar works well.


----------



## Brightling007

ronkatct said:


> I will wait until summer when the weather is warmer to see if the warmer weather might get the lubricant viscous enough for the watches to get going. I can open the back and move the balance wheels to see if the watches start back up. What have I got to lose except time from dead watches :roll:? They are 2 free watches at this time and I can salvage 2 very nice bracelets.
> 
> I have so far salvaged 1 so-called "leather" strap from my defective Benyar (which I got replaced for $1, and the replacement seems to be working fine with decent accuracy). I will leave a very nice thank you and positive review in a few days assuming the replacement Benyar works well.


It's not so hard, even in wintertime to generate summer temperatures for something as small as a watch.

If you open it, chances are greater of getting it going by fettling with the main spring, as moving the balance wheel. Just as it is more useful to move a bicycle wheel by moving the pedals as it is to try turn the wheel, if the chain is blocked by a wooden stick. If there is dust inside, or swarf, or whatever kind of poor finishing blocking the gears, amping up the main spring power could free the blockage.

This in fact, was in most cases the reason why the SK movement stopped, a blocked main spring exit wheel...


----------



## John_Schoen

I was interested in the AM0261 diver because the original listing said it had a high beat movement. The listing has changed, they call it a Japan movement now and mention a Miyota and later in the ad an NH35A. When I asked what it really is I was told that it is an NH35. You can get Invicta divers for far less, so I think this Starking is overpriced.


----------



## Brightling007

John_Schoen said:


> I was interested in the AM0261 diver because the original listing said it had a high beat movement. The listing has changed, they call it a Japan movement now and mention a Miyota and later in the ad an NH35A. When I asked what it really is I was told that it is an NH35. You can get Invicta divers for far less, so I think this Starking is overpriced.


Yes, there have been many discussions about this one, there is literally not a single picture showing the same watch, let alone the watch that you'll be getting IRL, the NH35 has a pretty large date font, but the photoshopped pics show a really small font. I wouldn't even trust the advert enough to buy it, no matter how nice it could be IRL. There's even genuine Rolex pictures in there, photoshopped, but the engraving in the rehaut still remains.

I think there may have been a version with their own 28800vph movement, which has been proven highly unreliable. They probably changed to an NH35 now, which on itself is not a bad thing in terms of reliability. But as you say, a lot better can be had a lot cheaper.


----------



## GreenNeedle

I have always been quite sceptical in the whole crown up, dial up making any difference so I was ready to say no difference to be honest however......

reset the watch to match my EcoDrive 4 days ago and every night it has been left crown up. After 4 days the watch is +1s. Total 1s!!!

Seems that the end of the day it is 4s fast and then in the morning it has countered almost all of that.

So, surprisingly to me this seems to actually work and for £36 (or whatever it actually cost, something like that) I have a watch that (at the moment fingers crossed) will be within 2s of accurate per week so long as it is left crown up at rest.

I should add I have worn this every day since I got it. No winders or anything like that, just worn.

So far great value although as seen above it could stop at any time 

This is the AM0184 I think. the one with the markers rather than any numbers.


----------



## Brightling007

I have a timegrapher, the ultimate piece of equipment to remove such scepticism, although not all watches show the same behavior. It depends on the model,make and condition of the movement. On a Grand Seiko for instance position changes are barely noticeable.


----------



## ronkatct

I am not sure what the allure is with the Starking 28800 bpm movement. My experience is .5 problem rate. I rather have an nh36 or Miyota 8015. Even the Tongji non-efficient autowinder movement is more reliable.

In a timegrapher, some movements are accurate in all positions while others are accurate in certain positions. Others can be "manually regulated" by adjusting the position to gain or lose time.


----------



## Brightling007

Some specimen of the SK run fantastic, I guess that's the allure, the potential is definitely there. The other allure is high beat movements are a little more accurate, when healthy off course, and having one in the nh35 price range, yeah, that's very appealing to some of us. Also, no matter what was wrong with those that I had (at least 15 by now) I've always managed to get them to run reliably in the end.

So, yeah, I agree with you if you just want a solid reliable timepiece it is not the greatest choice right now, but to those who are capable of doing repairs, or to those that don't mind to take a gamble, it can be an interesting purchase nonetheless.


----------



## ronkatct

Many of my 21600 bpm watches are within 10spd or less in the time grapher. And they are also equally accurate in the power winder. The gold Starking AM0184 that works (but has a slight crown stem misalignment) runs about +30spd if I remember correctly; I need to time graph it. The 3HZ (21600bps) watches can be as accurate as the 4 HZ (28800 bpm) watches in real world time keeping. 

Buy Starking from Amazon so that buyer gets good protection and warranty. I got 2 free watches to play.


----------



## Brightling007

It all comes down to the inherent quality of the parts too off course, but 28800 is definitely more accurate down to all sorts of wear patterns not a mystery why big name companies like Rolex and ETA go fully for it. For sports watches it is definitely the preferred beat rate. Off course this does not need to apply to the SK, but the first black dial AM0184 I've had run spot on, no matter which direction they're tested in.

Going by the reports and my own experiences it however looks like they're getting more and more sloppy.


----------



## watchcrank_tx

GreenNeedle said:


> I have always been quite sceptical in the whole crown up, dial up making any difference so I was ready to say no difference to be honest however......
> 
> reset the watch to match my EcoDrive 4 days ago and every night it has been left crown up. After 4 days the watch is +1s. Total 1s!!!
> 
> Seems that the end of the day it is 4s fast and then in the morning it has countered almost all of that.


Glad it worked for you. It's a cheap (free) way to get acceptable accuracy out of all but the worst movements, so long as they are regulated such that they have some positions which will gain time and some which will lose. At most that takes a little fiddling with the regulator and a lot of timing tests.


----------



## GreenNeedle

Just a quick one 

The testing was going so well. The watch was keeping within a second or so a day (left crown up at night) and then it was New year's day...........and you can probably guess the next part. Dazy head in the morning and the only non deployant or bracelet watch I have and as I entered the kitchen I dropped it, it hit the tiles and now it is running about 2 mins fast a day (working off about 5 secs per hour.)

As it isn't 5 secs per minute I am assuming that the regulator has slipped on the impact rather than a Seiko-like hairspring problem. So it is now sat off my wrist waiting for it to wind down so I can have a good look at the hairspring before trying to re-regulate it 

On the off chance someone might know on this movement, seeing as there are no +/- markings.......is + left and - right (meaning moving the lever right for the non existent pointer to move left etc.) or other way round.

Sods law. I bought a new dial and new ETA hands on New years eve (from the far east.) Was going so well. lol

And if I get it within a few seconds again it is going on a deployant  Don't like traditional buckle straps.


----------



## GreenNeedle

Brightling007 said:


> This is the AM0184 dial...
> View attachment 13678909
> 
> 
> The TM 0915 is about 3-4mm larger...


Hello, can I ask how you got the dial out from the case? Is it a front loader? And how did you open the front? Is it unscrew or push fit or??? Any advice would be helpful and deeply appreciated.


----------



## Brightling007

GreenNeedle said:


> Hello, can I ask how you got the dial out from the case? Is it a front loader? And how did you open the front? Is it unscrew or push fit or??? Any advice would be helpful and deeply appreciated.


Sure, this works best:
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/Cym...e8-47e4-9779-10cb6e1c87a3&transAbTest=ae803_5

To remove the front bezel together with the glass. On the 0915 it is not a separate part though, even though it looks the same, the only thing that can be removed is the glass. There I have used compressed air on the crown tube. The 0184 though has a snap fit front bezel.

The first ones though, when I didn't have the tool yet, I used a French opinel knife and a bench vice, this provides a high force yet controlled manner of prying in between the two parts.


----------



## GreenNeedle

Brightling007 said:


> Sure, this works best:
> https://www.aliexpress.com/item/Cym...e8-47e4-9779-10cb6e1c87a3&transAbTest=ae803_5
> 
> To remove the front bezel together with the glass. On the 0915 it is not a separate part though, even though it looks the same, the only thing that can be removed is the glass. There I have used compressed air on the crown tube. The 0184 though has a snap fit front bezel.
> 
> The first ones though, when I didn't have the tool yet, I used a French opinel knife and a bench vice, this provides a high force yet controlled manner of prying in between the two parts.


Many thanks. Following your advice (OK not so much) I was too eager to change it to buy the item from Ali or even a UK source. So i used a stanley blade to run round the bezel, which gave me a gap, then I used a knife out of my cheapo watch repair kit that should be used for trying to get push fit backs off and then started working on it.

"Brushed" the whole case and bezel with some P800 wet/dry as the polished look wouldn't go with the almost Sinn look I am going for. Rodico to remove all the metal "dust" Then the new dial and hands added. then used 2 pieces of maple and a 6" clamp to press the bezel back in.

Looks amazing. Will follow with pictures when I can find my camera.

And the watch is back to +3-4s per day at the moment, almost cancelled out at night crown up. That is if I take it off at midnight. I have a habit of staying up for too long and then the "crown up" only gets a few hours.


----------



## ronkatct

Wearing black beauty today. Changed out the light brown strap for a Black strap, giving the all black sleek look.


----------



## Tiemen

Hello all,

First of all I will introduced myself.
I’m Tiemen and I’m living in the Netherlands.
In the past I had nothing with watches, but about a year ago something change 

A couple months ago I search on Alieexpress and after reading a lot of comments (and watching on YouTube) I decided too buy a cheap watch (I’m a student Theology, so I don’t have a big wallet  and it’s a Starking AM0184.

The first one was a DOA, and after a short conversation with the seller I get new one.
This one was oke. 

I downloaded the app Toolwatch, because I wanna know the accuracy of the watch.
This are the measurements from one week:
Sunday	+15	(wearing the watch for 15 hours)
Monday	+17	(wearing the watch for 15 hours)
Thursday +19	(wearing the watch for 16.15 hours)
Wednesday	+18	(wearing the watch for 16.5 hours)
Thursday	+16	(wearing the watch for 16.75 hours)
Friday +20	(wearing the watch for 14.75 hours)
Saturday +18	(wearing the watch for 12.75 hours)

Power reserve is 34 hours, not a bad score I think.

I wanna try too make the slower the watch, so I will order some tools.
I never work on a watch, but I’ve two watches. 
The DOA watch is a testwatch  

How can I slower the watch? 
Some watches have a + and -, but not this one.
When I have a good understanding from how it’s work, the spiral on the balanswheel must become longer too make the watch slower. 
So, the both ‘levers’ from the compass (?) move towards each other will make the watch run slower, move from each other will make the watch run faster.
Is this correct?

(excuses for my bad English)


----------



## MS_original

Hey guys, does anyone know what movement is in the Starting automatic AMO184? Someone told me it's a seagull movement buy I haven't been able to find out anything on aliexpress


----------



## MS_original

I have seen mine be about +12s after the first day and +12 to +15 after that for days two and three. What's everyone else seeing?


----------



## Tiemen

MS_original said:


> I have seen mine be about +12s after the first day and +12 to +15 after that for days two and three. What's everyone else seeing?


See the post above for mine Starking

Staking say's they have their own movements, but i'm not sure aboutt that


----------



## Brightling007

Tiemen said:


> Hello all,
> 
> First of all I will introduced myself.
> I'm Tiemen and I'm living in the Netherlands.
> In the past I had nothing with watches, but about a year ago something change
> 
> A couple months ago I search on Alieexpress and after reading a lot of comments (and watching on YouTube) I decided too buy a cheap watch (I'm a student Theology, so I don't have a big wallet  and it's a Starking AM0184.
> 
> The first one was a DOA, and after a short conversation with the seller I get new one.
> This one was oke.
> 
> I downloaded the app Toolwatch, because I wanna know the accuracy of the watch.
> This are the measurements from one week:
> Sunday	+15	(wearing the watch for 15 hours)
> Monday	+17	(wearing the watch for 15 hours)
> Thursday +19	(wearing the watch for 16.15 hours)
> Wednesday	+18	(wearing the watch for 16.5 hours)
> Thursday	+16	(wearing the watch for 16.75 hours)
> Friday +20	(wearing the watch for 14.75 hours)
> Saturday +18	(wearing the watch for 12.75 hours)
> 
> Power reserve is 34 hours, not a bad score I think.
> 
> I wanna try too make the slower the watch, so I will order some tools.
> I never work on a watch, but I've two watches.
> The DOA watch is a testwatch
> 
> How can I slower the watch?
> Some watches have a + and -, but not this one.
> When I have a good understanding from how it's work, the spiral on the balanswheel must become longer too make the watch slower.
> So, the both 'levers' from the compass (?) move towards each other will make the watch run slower, move from each other will make the watch run faster.
> Is this correct?
> 
> (excuses for my bad English)


If you don't have means to check the beat error then better not touch it. This is not a seiko, on which the speed is easily set separately from the beat error. On the starking you can barely set the levers separately.

I'm in Hilversum, so if you need help/instructions, just let me know...


----------



## Brightling007

Tiemen said:


> See the post above for mine Starking
> 
> Staking say's they have their own movements, but i'm not sure aboutt that


It is in basis a Miyota 8000 series, but then the chinese copied that with hack function and called it 2813, and SK copied that and changed the escapement to have a high beat rate at 28800bph, and it is cast with SK logo under the balance. So yeah, they produce their own movement, but the basic design is not theirs.


----------



## MS_original

Brightling007 said:


> Tiemen said:
> 
> 
> 
> See the post above for mine Starking
> 
> Staking say's they have their own movements, but i'm not sure aboutt that
> 
> 
> 
> It is in basis a Miyota 8000 series, but then the chinese copied that with hack function and called it 2813, and SK copied that and changed the escapement to have a high beat rate at 28800bph, and it is cast with SK logo under the balance. So yeah, they produce their own movement, but the basic design is not theirs.
Click to expand...

Thanks! Any info on the long-term reliability/durability of this movement?


----------



## HoustonReal

Brightling007 said:


> It is in basis a Miyota 8000 series, but then the chinese copied that with hack function and called it 2813, and SK copied that and changed the escapement to have a high beat rate at 28800bph, and it is cast with SK logo under the balance. So yeah, they produce their own movement, but the basic design is not theirs.


Just to be fair, legacy Beijing Watch Factory movements (SB11, SB12, B16ZR) are also based on the Dixmont Guanzhou/Nanning 2813 design. The Sea-Gull ST16 and ST17 are similarly based on the Miyota 82xx architecture, but substitute a Seiko-style autowinding module.


----------



## JustUK

I have 4 watches with this movement, and can confirm the 50% reliability claim.

They are as follows:

TM0915 - Blue dial, cheap alloy case, not sapphire, reliable to +10s/day
AM0184 - Black dial - A bit of glue residue under crystal, sapphire, reliable to -4.7s/day
AM0184 - Silver dial - Clean watch and strap but - Dead on arrival 
AM0239 - Rose gold with cream dial and sapphire- lovely looking watch but stuttering seconds hand and +30s/day in limited testing.

All in all no more Starkings for me until they fix the QC issues.


----------



## Brightling007

Yeah, it's weird, as the movements do generally look to be finished better than the average 2813, but just have this little flaw now and then of the poorly finished seconds pinion gear, and some movements are quitting due to swarf/roughness of some edges here and there on the plates or gears. 

Mostly, when one comes DOA, and you open it and push the first or second gear it will run and keep running. Or worst case you remove the balance and pallet fork and let the whole gear train run freely for a few good runs, then it'll run smoothly and keeps running just fine. A little whiff of aird duster through it to remove any possible debris or swarf... 

I've not had one that would just never run again, and once I got them running they kept running, not a single one failed again after a while, and I've bought more than ten, of which some became gifts, some used for the movement to make a build, some still in the original state. 

As for the stutter, if you remove the seconds hand, and the upper bridge of the movement, then pull out the seconds pinion, apply a tiny blob of grease on the shaft and push it back, making sure the gear is remaining dry. Then the stutter will disappear, sacrificing just a bit of amplitude. These are very strong runners though, and where I needed to do this the movements still were in the 270-280 degrees amplitude range. The grease just makes sure the seconds hand will be stabilized. This results in a very smooth running seconds hand. I'm using a synthetic grease for this, so it will not run dry over short time.


----------



## JustUK

Brightling007 said:


> Yeah, it's weird, as the movements do generally look to be finished better than the average 2813, but just have this little flaw now and then of the poorly finished seconds pinion gear, and some movements are quitting due to swarf/roughness of some edges here and there on the plates or gears.
> 
> Mostly, when one comes DOA, and you open it and push the first or second gear it will run and keep running. Or worst case you remove the balance and pallet fork and let the whole gear train run freely for a few good runs, then it'll run smoothly and keeps running just fine. A little whiff of aird duster through it to remove any possible debris or swarf...
> 
> I've not had one that would just never run again, and once I got them running they kept running, not a single one failed again after a while, and I've bought more than ten, of which some became gifts, some used for the movement to make a build, some still in the original state.
> 
> As for the stutter, if you remove the seconds hand, and the upper bridge of the movement, then pull out the seconds pinion, apply a tiny blob of grease on the shaft and push it back, making sure the gear is remaining dry. Then the stutter will disappear, sacrificing just a bit of amplitude. These are very strong runners though, and where I needed to do this the movements still were in the 270-280 degrees amplitude range. The grease just makes sure the seconds hand will be stabilized. This results in a very smooth running seconds hand. I'm using a synthetic grease for this, so it will not run dry over short time.


Thanks for the tips - motivating me to give them a try at some point rather than consign two watches to the bin!


----------



## JustUK

Dup


----------



## JustUK

Got this back on wrist and worn it during my normal routine for 10 days.









Brushed lugs match brushed metalwork on one of my MKS straps as a bonus.









Great timekeeping results as you can see below, and more motivation to get my other Starkings revived.


----------



## Brightling007

I've giften one to my uncle, and even though it ran, and his greatest pet pieve was the spinning noisy rotor from time to time, I've retrofitted it with a 2836-2. The hands fitted right on, the date ligned up right away. I must say, it felt like an upgrade, even though it cost almost double the value of the watch.


----------



## JustUK

Brightling007 said:


> I've giften one to my uncle, and even though it ran, and his greatest pet pieve was the spinning noisy rotor from time to time, I've retrofitted it with a 2836-2. The hands fitted right on, the date ligned up right away. I must say, it felt like an upgrade, even though it cost almost double the value of the watch.


Agree sounds like a great upgrade - proper Frankenwatch, or is it perhaps more like reverse engineering? Case and sapphire seem pretty robust so will be interesting to see how long his lasts.


----------



## HoustonReal

Brightling007 said:


> Mostly, when one comes DOA, and you open it and push the first or second gear it will run and keep running. Or worst case you remove the balance and pallet fork and let the whole gear train run freely for a few good runs, then it'll run smoothly and keeps running just fine. A little whiff of aird duster through it to remove any possible debris or swarf...


My Starking Rooster watch (AM0242) came DOA. Since my expertise is limited to battery changes, I certainly didn't want to blow my chance for a full refund by taking the back off. The watch was very attractive, but completely non-functional.

You would think Starking would check if these watches run after being assembled, as basic QC. It sounds like they should keep working if they ever ran? The Starking was my only DOA watch, other than a few NOS quartz watches that needed new batteries.


----------



## ronkatct

HoustonReal said:


> My Starking Rooster watch (AM0242) came DOA. Since my expertise is limited to battery changes, I certainly didn't want to blow my chance for a full refund by taking the back off. The watch was very attractive, but completely non-functional.
> 
> You would think Starking would check if these watches run after being assembled, as basic QC. It sounds like they should keep working if they ever ran? The Starking was my only DOA watch, other than a few NOS quartz watches that needed new batteries.
> 
> View attachment 14123897
> View attachment 14123895


Your Rooster watch looks exactly like my Rooster watch. Mine works, at least I hope it still works. I haven't had an opportunity to use it. It is a once in a rooster watch.


----------



## vintorez

Hi guys, I just discovered the Starking AM0184 last night and saw a bunch of rave reviews about it. My question: how has it fared for you long term? Is it still going strong?


----------



## ronkatct

vintorez said:


> Hi guys, I just discovered the Starking AM0184 last night and saw a bunch of rave reviews about it. My question: how has it fared for you long term? Is it still going strong?


I ordered a black Starking AM0184 from Amazon that failed. The replacement also failed, so I got a full refund. I now have 2 non functioning Starking free. I figure I am way ahead of the game and will try to get it to work someday. Nice bracelets with the watches.


----------



## vintorez

ronkatct said:


> I ordered a black Starking AM0184 from Amazon that failed. The replacement also failed, so I got a full refund. I now have 2 non functioning Starking free. I figure I am way ahead of the game and will try to get it to work someday. Nice bracelets with the watches.


Did they fail after a while or were already DOA out of the box?

The specs for the price seem too good to be true, so I'm wary that the movement is made out of sawdust or something.


----------



## Brightling007

The movements are no worse than any DG2813, only poorly QC'd, which means some machining swarf can still be present, or some parts have sharp edges, most commonly all it needs is a good run in, so if you open it and push the second or third wheel a little it'll start running, and usually keep running.


----------



## HoustonReal

ronkatct said:


> I ordered a black Starking AM0184 from Amazon that failed. The replacement also failed, so I got a full refund. I now have 2 non functioning Starking free. I figure I am way ahead of the game and will try to get it to work someday. Nice bracelets with the watches.


Amazon made me send my Rooster watch back. If I could have kept it, and received a full refund, I would have tried to open it up and fix it.


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## HoustonReal

Brightling007 said:


> The movements are no worse than any DG2813, only poorly QC'd, which means some machining swarf can still be present, or some parts have sharp edges, most commonly all it needs is a good run in, so if you open it and push the second or third wheel a little it'll start running, and usually keep running.


I agree that the movements use the same design, but the 50% failure rate WUS members have seen, far exceeds anything you typically see with a Dixmont powered watch. Starking has some issues with their manufacturing, since even poor QC doesn't explain such a high failure rate.


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## ronkatct

The fact that no questions were asked when I complained suggest that this is a known problem. Both watches worked for a while and then died. I will try to open it up and fix it as suggested by Brightling. I did open one watch but could not get it to work. I had a problem with the Beymer watch as well but the qc there is way above the qc of Starking.


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## vintorez

A watchmaker reviews the AM0184:


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## diynor_77

Hi All - new member joining to the forum.

I have 2 units of the movement, AM0184 and AM0187 - both are working more consistently than any of my Seiko 7s26/NH35 - however, I am surprised with this cause I have fully disassembled, cleaned and oiled them both and I have a negative impression of what I have observed.

They are not a quality built - that includes very soft materials, excessive assembly tolerances, poor design features, inadequate/non-existent oiling,dirty assembly environment and poor/dirty assembly practices (fingerprints and dirt all over the parts).

I can give you more explainations if any of you have any wonder. Just ask.


----------



## Brightling007

diynor_77 said:


> Hi All - new member joining to the forum.
> 
> I have 2 units of the movement, AM0184 and AM0187 - both are working more consistently than any of my Seiko 7s26/NH35 - however, I am surprised with this cause I have fully disassembled, cleaned and oiled them both and I have a negative impression of what I have observed.
> 
> They are not a quality built - that includes very soft materials, excessive assembly tolerances, poor design features, inadequate/non-existent oiling,dirty assembly environment and poor/dirty assembly practices (fingerprints and dirt all over the parts).
> 
> I can give you more explainations if any of you have any wonder. Just ask.


Mine too, produce a flat line on my Timegrapher and not much positional variation, plus a super high amplitude. I know an NH35 has a 53 degree lift angle, so the TG is set to that value properly, still the amplitude does rarely reach beyond 270 degrees on these units. Obviously that's drag, and the looseness on the SK1813 may actually contribute to a higher amplitude, but it doesn't explain the unexpectedly high accuracy.

Finishing and material wise they are indeed not too impressive, but neither is the average 2813. I've seen 2813 far worse tbh.


----------



## diynor_77

I agree with you but starting to discuss about high amplitudes and SHORT TERM excellent performance is going to deviate the focus from the message I was trying to convey.

My point was intended to give an answer to the guys Wondering about reliability and duration. Plus, it is not too hard to beat a DG2813 in any feature - and winning that comparison does not make you any good.

Back to the point, the answer is clearly that the issues I have listed in my original post would make you lucky if your SK1813 continues working beyond 1 year.

There is a lot of discussion about of lack of QC - which I agree, I don't think they have any QC system in place - but the real issue here to my view is the purpose of their product and fabrication method design: there is no intention to make these watches to last far beyond 1 year. My impression is that they have missed the target and instead of having a population failing before the year in the range of 10%, they have a failure rate of 50% - apparently.

My view to this is, if you are on the market with the intention to:
A) buy a mechanical beater with a decent look just for a few bucks - cheaper than a Seiko plus with better strap and glass - but with comparable reliability (min. To last you 5years without requiring a service), then you are much better off buying Chinese watch equipped with a SII or a miyota.
B) buy a fashion watch or a novelty watch for a few bucks, able to keep decent time regardless positional variance and so on -then you are much better off by buying a Chinese watch equipped with a Japanese quartz movement , again SII or Miyota - they will last you the duration of the battery and if you are so fond of it, you can always put a new battery to keep it going.

Starking watches are a contradiction - they are clearly falling closer to the case B than A, but they are not able - by design- to deliver a minimum of reliability to last even 1year --- a person who buys a mechanical watch expects a minimum life expectancy for it of 5years and if you are willing to service it, it is also expected to last you potentially a lifetime.

I guess with this message I am not leaving much to wonder for anybody falling closer to A or B in their expectations from their purchase.


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## Brightling007

I have bought more than 10 SK watches, most are over a year old by now and still run great. Some came dead on arrival and simply needed a nudge to get them going. I've got several DG2813 that are over 10 years old and never got a service, heck, probably didn't even get any lube from the factory. So, sure, not sophisticated, poor QC, still nothing that indicates them not being able to live past a year.

It were actually several miyota that let me down the past summer season. Not that they completely cut out running, and I must say the escapement is much better than any 2813 or 1813, but the date change wheel is made of candlewax in those. Then added the lack of hacking and in the case of a 7S26 also lack of hand winding. Add the extremely noisy rotor to the Miyota... All I can say if you want something good, go for a good ETA clone rather than all these asian options and you will be truely happy, and your watchmaker as well, as any bridge, spring, drum, whatever is available and service is never a mystery.


----------



## diynor_77

I don't get your persistence to defend the "virtues" of starking movements - to me they are just a piece of junk - mainly because they have been designed, fabricated and assembled to be simply that: junk.

A mechanical watch doesn't tend to magically break when is most of the time sitting in a box or forgotten in a drawer - I pointing this to clarify my view of your statement of owning way more than 10 watches (10sk, several DG, plenty of miyota, etc..) - and intend to use this as a prove of Starking reliability.

Seiko 7xxx and miyota 8xxx series reliability in question --- to this I would point that they have been around since the seventies and there are still plenty of early units in working condition and those that are considered dead units are frequently brought back to life just by servicing them. Also, when it comes to reliability - simplicity is a positive feature.

Starking additional functionalities, hacking and hand-winding, they are both designed to let you down in short time and I believe why a percentage of the units arrive DOA - I am gonna elaborate this. 

SK hacking: just a folded piece of thin copper alloy sheet squeezed into the gears. Problem is that is constantly held in tension against the winding stem to be deactivated or it touches the balance wheel hence "hacking". This design is made for early wear and failure resulting in a dead movement by "constant hack" - everytime you operate the crown in the 0 (winding) and 1 (date) positions you are wearing it the thin copper sheet - when you transition between 2, 1 and 0 positions and viceversa you a badly wearing it out --- generated metal particles from stem and hacking lever have no other place to go than become a grinding paste in the rest of the movement - helping to reduce movement life. ----- in my 2 starkings I decided not to install the "hacking lever" back when I serviced them to gain movement life.

Winding functionalities: Starking forgot to fully copy miyota on this and avoided to install the additional low friction thin brass washer in the intermediate sliding pinion - the only reason miyota has the washer there is to reduce wear of the pinion and plate/ contact points, hence the only reason Starking does not have it (and does not Grease the contact points either) is to guarantee a high friction and wear point.

And to conclude: the only reason I pointed miyota and Seiko movements as a better option than Starking or DG movements is because you can have them for only 20% average additional cost over a Starking unit (Starking ranges from 30 to 50USD and Seiko/miyota prices start around 45USD - ref for both to AliExpress) and they are both a properly engineered, proven designs with unquestionable reliability.

ETA clone as an alternative - yes you are right on what you say, but prices are in the x3.5 multiplier as a minimum in comparison with Starking. This wasn't a fair comparison and it is biased to keep the balance cost-vs-risk in favour of Starking.


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## ronkatct

I took the back off one of my non-functioning Starking AM0184 and tried to nudge the balance wheel to get the movement going. I tried to nudge the escapement gear as well. No idea whether there is a clutch of some sort, but now when I wind the starking, the second hand turns rapidly. The balance wheel and escapement no longer seems to be connected to the movement train. Any ideas what I did wrong? As I have 2 Starkings and a full refund, I have nothing to lose if I totally damage the watches.

The qc on the Starking is worse than the tongji watches. I actually like my Winner, Tevise, and Fngeen watches with tongji movements.


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## ronkatct

double post


----------



## Brightling007

diynor_77 said:


> I don't get your persistence to defend the "virtues" of starking movements - to me they are just a piece of junk - mainly because they have been designed, fabricated and assembled to be simply that: junk.
> 
> A mechanical watch doesn't tend to magically break when is most of the time sitting in a box or forgotten in a drawer - I pointing this to clarify my view of your statement of owning way more than 10 watches (10sk, several DG, plenty of miyota, etc..) - and intend to use this as a prove of Starking reliability.
> 
> Seiko 7xxx and miyota 8xxx series reliability in question --- to this I would point that they have been around since the seventies and there are still plenty of early units in working condition and those that are considered dead units are frequently brought back to life just by servicing them. Also, when it comes to reliability - simplicity is a positive feature.
> 
> Starking additional functionalities, hacking and hand-winding, they are both designed to let you down in short time and I believe why a percentage of the units arrive DOA - I am gonna elaborate this.
> 
> SK hacking: just a folded piece of thin copper alloy sheet squeezed into the gears. Problem is that is constantly held in tension against the winding stem to be deactivated or it touches the balance wheel hence "hacking". This design is made for early wear and failure resulting in a dead movement by "constant hack" - everytime you operate the crown in the 0 (winding) and 1 (date) positions you are wearing it the thin copper sheet - when you transition between 2, 1 and 0 positions and viceversa you a badly wearing it out --- generated metal particles from stem and hacking lever have no other place to go than become a grinding paste in the rest of the movement - helping to reduce movement life. ----- in my 2 starkings I decided not to install the "hacking lever" back when I serviced them to gain movement life.
> 
> Winding functionalities: Starking forgot to fully copy miyota on this and avoided to install the additional low friction thin brass washer in the intermediate sliding pinion - the only reason miyota has the washer there is to reduce wear of the pinion and plate/ contact points, hence the only reason Starking does not have it (and does not Grease the contact points either) is to guarantee a high friction and wear point.
> 
> And to conclude: the only reason I pointed miyota and Seiko movements as a better option than Starking or DG movements is because you can have them for only 20% average additional cost over a Starking unit (Starking ranges from 30 to 50USD and Seiko/miyota prices start around 45USD - ref for both to AliExpress) and they are both a properly engineered, proven designs with unquestionable reliability.
> 
> ETA clone as an alternative - yes you are right on what you say, but prices are in the x3.5 multiplier as a minimum in comparison with Starking. This wasn't a fair comparison and it is biased to keep the balance cost-vs-risk in favour of Starking.


Most of my SK watches I gifted to people that don't own more than two or three watches, people within my family. Most of those units are worn daily. This may aid in not wearing out the hacking leaver and winding function. As for the quality, it is definitely not junk, but it isn't great either. As I said before it is basically on par with a DG. Then I also did service the odd SK, when I decided to use the movement for a build, and lubricated the necessary points. This I did just for the fun and sake of learning to service movements when I wasn't yet very good at it and didn't want to ruin an expensive unit.

As for Seiko, no question about it, they are reliable, perhaps one of the most reliable movements ever made. Miyota may be reliable, but there are certainly issues with some parts, that I've come across twice in my own collection of barely worn watches.

Then ETA clones, the low beat versions are available for just over 20 dollars and are already better than the SK, and DG, and have good power reserve, run very accurate, wind both directions. The 2836-2 found as the Seagull ST2100 I recently bought for 53 euro a piece, which is relatively expensive when compared to these bottom of the line units, but a more than double raise in quality and having all the nice features. And sure they also could do with a little lube here and there that they did not get from the factory, but the basic quality is really incredible at that price point.

So yeah, we are discussing the cheapest of the cheapest, off course there will be compromises made. I am however tasting the pudding and liking it enough to not just be calling it junk.


----------



## Brightling007

ronkatct said:


> I took the back off one of my non-functioning Starking AM0184 and tried to nudge the balance wheel to get the movement going. I tried to nudge the escapement gear as well. No idea whether there is a clutch of some sort, but now when I wind the starking, the second hand turns rapidly. The balance wheel and escapement no longer seems to be connected to the movement train. Any ideas what I did wrong? As I have 2 Starkings and a full refund, I have nothing to lose if I totally damage the watches.
> 
> The qc on the Starking is worse than the tongji watches. I actually like my Winner, Tevise, and Fngeen watches with tongji movements.


The balance wheel is nearly never the culprit. When trying to determine where there is a gear not turning you can start at the balance wheel off course and work back from there to the main spring. This is perhaps already watchmakers territory, as it is very delicate and a shaft pin breaks easily. I do this under very heavy 3d magnification, so when there is a reason for it not turning the chances are great of seeing where the culprit lies.

When we look at the movement with the rotor up, the energy of the main spring is stored via the top gear. (I'm not ggoing to describe the winding methods here) The bottom gear is the releasing end. This passes it's energy to another gear almost at the center of the movement all the way on the bottom (no3) This is driving no2, that drives no1 which drives the escape wheel.

No1 can be seen through the hole in the top plate near the balance wheel, right above the escape wheel, no2 is a little more to the center of the movement and sticks from under the bridge, and overlaps slightly with the balance wheel. Usually that needs a little nudge to get the movement going, so it appears there are some rough edges there that cause a blockage. Giving it a nudge though, means you are risking hitting the balance wheel, and must be done with preferraby a plastic stick or pegwood. You must grip it in to the teeth, so any damage there also will cause it to block. Also never push down on any of the gears as it will likely snap the shaft end pin.

Good luck!

And as for Tongji, they make a very decent 2836-2 clone as well, very affordable.


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## diynor_77

ronkatct said:


> I took the back off one of my non-functioning Starking AM0184 and tried to nudge the balance wheel to get the movement going. I tried to nudge the escapement gear as well. No idea whether there is a clutch of some sort, but now when I wind the starking, the second hand turns rapidly. The balance wheel and escapement no longer seems to be connected to the movement train. Any ideas what I did wrong? As I have 2 Starkings and a full refund, I have nothing to lose if I totally damage the watches.
> 
> The qc on the Starking is worse than the tongji watches. I actually like my Winner, Tevise, and Fngeen watches with tongji movements.


I believe you have damaged either the "escapement wheel" pivots or the "pallets" pivots and now they are sitting partially on place but out of alignment (no connection to the other parts of the movement) - that leaves all the "time regulating components" disconnected from the main spring with the effect of:
- the balance wheel sees no action/movement.
- the pallets don't move.
- the escapement wheel don't move ( if it does move, means that is on place and you have only damaged the pallets).
- any tension applied to the mainspring gets immediately released fully ( with the observation of the seconds hand following that energy release and no movement on the balance wheel).

Now you are left with a beautifully crafted and nice case and bracelet, rendered useless, and a movement only useful for spares.

I would definitely use it as a learning/practising ground as recommended by Britling - since you already have it and have nothing to lose.

The advice of "giving a nudge to the gears" considering the complementary information given along it, made it a poor one - sorry to say.

There is a blog ( in German but Google translate it if you need to do it) with an evaluation of the SK watches, movements and its parts - follow this link:

https://watch-movements.eu/blog/en/2019/02/23/starking_jingrui_sk_1813-s-2/

If you attempt to extract the movement from the case to fully disassemble it : AM0184 is a front loading case, meaning that you need :
- remove the exhibition bottom lid in order to access the stem-crown release pusher.
- remove the top glass-besel (only pressure snapped into the case) in order to get the movement-dial out of the case.

Note that this action most likely leave you with a case with ugly and noticeable indentations - specially if you haven't done it before and don't have the right tools for it.

Hope is of help.


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## diynor_77

Brightling007; said:


> Most of my SK watches I gifted to people that don't own more than two or three watches, people within my family. Most of those units are worn daily. This may aid in not wearing out the hacking leaver and winding function. As for the quality, it is definitely not junk, but it isn't great either. As I said before it is basically on par with a DG. Then I also did service the odd SK, when I decided to use the movement for a build, and lubricated the necessary points. This I did just for the fun and sake of learning to service movements when I wasn't yet very good at it and didn't want to ruin an expensive unit.
> 
> As for Seiko, no question about it, they are reliable, perhaps one of the most reliable movements ever made. Miyota may be reliable, but there are certainly issues with some parts, that I've come across twice in my own collection of barely worn watches.
> 
> Then ETA clones, the low beat versions are available for just over 20 dollars and are already better than the SK, and DG, and have good power reserve, run very accurate, wind both directions. The 2836-2 found as the Seagull ST2100 I recently bought for 53 euro a piece, which is relatively expensive when compared to these bottom of the line units, but a more than double raise in quality and having all the nice features. And sure they also could do with a little lube here and there that they did not get from the factory, but the basic quality is really incredible at that price point.
> 
> So yeah, we are discussing the cheapest of the cheapest, off course there will be compromises made. I am however tasting the pudding and liking it enough to not just be calling it junk.


This post thread is devoted to Starking watches - don't get surprised if we are comparing them with watches in their price range - and what the other manufacturers offer at a similar price. Other comparisons are out of place, to my view.

Just a note to clarify my previous post and yours: when I spoke of prices at AliExpress, both for Starking and other Chinese sellers, I am referring to "complete watches with all their parts, delivered in your mailbox". When you speak of the same, you are referring to prices of the movement only.

Again, this could be misleading and irrelevant to most watch enthusiast ( since they are not watchmakers or have the patience/time/tools to learn the required skills to replace a movement - or to repair/intervene into the mechanics of a purchased watch received DOA, without ruining it further).


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## ronkatct

So it looks like one of my Black Starking AM0184 is toast. I have one more freebie Starking to fix or destroy.


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## ObiWonWD40

I think that the Starking AM0184 I bought in April 2018 for £34.20 delivered was a reasonable purchase. I rarely wear that type of dress watch, roughly once or twice a month maybe, so for the money I paid, it does not owe me anything. If/When it finally gives up the ghost, I will take it apart as a learning experience. Having had a year of use out of it I reckon I am into bonus time now anyway. :-!

What I will say is that as an experiment it was worth the effort for me, YMMV! I won't replace it with another one though, if I need a mechanical dress watch in the future then I plan on getting a watch with a Miyota 9015 movement. I have mixed feelings about that to, for a number of reasons. I am not enamoured by the Miyota 8215 movement, I bought a very cheap Ochstin watch GA021A, with that movement, the well known Longines Conquest Homage in Rose Goldish finish and that has been great, but the Cadisen with the same movement has been a dog's breakfast, with the Date Problem, the rapid advance just does not work correctly! I hope the 9015 will be better if I buy one, but with either Faux Jewels, Diamonds on the dial or the De Feels name, that is not in the immediate future. As it is a watch that gets worn in the evening typically, a watch with no Lume which is another alternative is a non-starter too!

My feeling is that the Starking watches are a bit of a lottery. I was lucky as I got a good one, it has run well from day one and keeps time as well as my NH3** watches and the Miyotas I have. From a totally non scientific impression, mine seems to keep better time than the Miyotas, I put the Starking and the Ochstin in the Winder, both set to the same time for five days and the Starking kept better time. Which proves absolutely nothing but amused me at the time :roll:

There are some places in the World you go where wearing a decent watch gets you made a target, if you need to visit a place like that then a Starking is probably a great choice. At the worst case it will be dead right twice a day! A Non WIS will think you are wearing a decent watch and if it gets lost, stolen or stops you are not out a load of money! For me it has been a no-brainer, and I get to play with it if it stops!

Very best regards,
Jim

PS My advice, if you want a cheap watch that does not look too shabby, keeps great time and costs less than half what you pay for the Starking, get a Nakzen Pagoda! Seiko movement, no date wheel issues, quartz accuracy and totally grab and go. Not to say I have fallen out of love with Automatics, just very cheap ones!


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## Brightling007

It may have been poor advice in hindsight, but when I say give the gears a nudge, I expected someone would know it is a watch movement and super duper vulnerable, so you would take magnification, a clean tool, watch a youtube vid or two before you start, just like me. Slightly over a year ago I never ever even opened up a watch casseback...just goes to say.... it's mainly the man behind the wheel...

As for the swap for an ST2100, it is something I literally did in one, and it turned out not too shabby at all, so is it worth it when you know the price of the SK? Off course not, but when you would never have seen an SK in your life, it is a really nice watch with that movement and my uncle completely fell in love with it, so it's all so relative...

Very fair points Obi, and it is true, the first batch of four black SK all ran, all had well over 300 degrees amplitude, were stable upon position variations and showed an almost completely flat line on the Timegrapher. When they run, they run much better than you would expect them to knowing it is some kind of DG clone in there.


----------



## HoustonReal

Brightling007 said:


> When they run, they run much better than you would expect them to knowing it is some kind of DG clone in there.


The design is usually more reliable than the Starking variants, but most of the others haven't been modified to run at 28,800 bph. Before I really started studying Chinese watch movements, I had no idea that most of the recent Beijing Watch Factory calibers were based on the same design as the DG/NN28xx series of movements. Carnival uses undecorated Beijing SB11 movements in many of their watches. If you really look at Beijing SB12 and B16ZR movements, you'll see that they are just nicely decorated, higher jeweled versions of the same design. Beijing Watch Factory had a pretty good reputation for quality products before its recent acquisition, but not to hear Fiyta tell it. Fiyta claims they want to improve Beijing's in-house movements, but they seem hell bent on converting over to the Miyota 8 series.


----------



## Casertano69

https://www.baselworld.com/zh/brands/132098/starking-watches


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## Casertano69

What a movement uses this Starking?...it's nice

https://www.zipy.it/p/ali/starking-...ristwatch-watch-laikrodis-tm0901/32795545946/


----------



## Chascomm

Casertano69 said:


> What a movement uses this Starking?...it's nice
> 
> https://www.zipy.it/p/ali/starking-...ristwatch-watch-laikrodis-tm0901/32795545946/


It's a Starking movement.


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## Casertano69

Chascomm said:


> It's a Starking movement.


Ah,Starking does its movements in-house?


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## Casertano69

Chascomm said:


> It's a Starking movement.


Ah,Starking does its movements in-house?


----------



## Monkey_like_watch

Casertano69 said:


> Ah,Starking does its movements in-house?


https://www.baselworld.com/en/brands/132098/starking-watches?categoryId=9


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## AlbertanLiam

*Starking*

Curious if Starking watches are any good? They have a decent looking movement, sapphire glass and bracelet. If anyone has owned one or currently owns one can you please let me know on the quality thanks.


----------



## watchcrank_tx

*Re: Starking*



HoustonReal said:


> I agree that the movements use the same design, but the 50% failure rate WUS members have seen, far exceeds anything you typically see with a Dixmont powered watch. Starking has some issues with their manufacturing, since even poor QC doesn't explain such a high failure rate.


In the past, there has been speculation that the ultra-cheap and spectacularly unreliable Tonjis we see today in $10-15 watches use rejected parts that were a byproduct of the vast supply of Tongji production over the decades in Chinese industry. Aside from the escapement being altered to raise the beatrate, could there be something similar going on with Starking's movements and the vast contemporary supply of 8215-family clones in production in China, which no doubt produce mountains of rejected parts too? Note, I'm not making an allegation, just speculating if that might be the cause of the Starking disaster.



AlbertanLiam said:


> Curious if Starking watches are any good? They have a decent looking movement, sapphire glass and bracelet. If anyone has owned one or currently owns one can you please let me know on the quality thanks.


I do not own one, but that is because reading owner reports on this forum has convinced me their quality is abysmal and they sell some of the least reliable products on the market today. Which is a shame, because I love the idea of a cheap 4 Hz movement like they've made from the basic 8215 design.


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## diynor_77

Guys,

Don't waste your money and time on starling watches - absolute garbage.

For the price difference (in some instances diff.is less than 10usd), any Chinese watch equipped with Seiko NH3x or miyota 8xxx is to be chosen without giving a second thought to starling.

See my previous posts where I give explanations.

Best regards


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## Brightling007

Ok guys n gals, check this out!!


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## Brightling007

diynor_77 said:


> Guys,
> 
> Don't waste your money and time on starling watches - absolute garbage.
> 
> For the price difference (in some instances diff.is less than 10usd), any Chinese watch equipped with Seiko NH3x or miyota 8xxx is to be chosen without giving a second thought to starling.
> 
> See my previous posts where I give explanations.
> 
> Best regards


I've had more issues with Miyota actually... And I've had two nh35 let me down in the san martin Tiger Sharks.... And I was not the only one here on the forum...


----------



## watchcrank_tx

Brightling007 said:


> Ok guys n gals, check this out!!


Was just coming here to post that and saw I was beaten to it. |>b-)


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## Brightling007

It proves what I mentioned earlier, the movement is not inherently bad, but there are quality issues... But let's be honest, the case and bracelet and crystal alone are already worth the 50 bucks, so for those that like the style, and can have the movement replaced, there's no need to steer clear of it really.


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## Alex_London

Has anyone tried to swap a Miyota 8215 with the Starking auto movement? I have a couple of Chinese specials that would be immeasurably improved if they were h/hw and 28.8vph!


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## Brightling007

Alex_London said:


> Has anyone tried to swap a Miyota 8215 with the Starking auto movement? I have a couple of Chinese specials that would be immeasurably improved if they were h/hw and 28.8vph!


Not worth it.
A. The movement isn't that great.
B. You need new hands 
C. Just buy a Tianjin ETA clone of a 2836 and be done with something that has a lot more positive than negative sides...

Edit: Oh I should add, yes it has been done... By me...


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## Alex_London

Many thanks! 

I was hoping that the hands etc would be a direct swap, back to the drawing board.

I would swap in a Seagull ETA clone but isn't the stem height rather different from an 8215?

Cheers


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## Alex_London

Many thanks! 

I was hoping that the hands etc would be a direct swap, back to the drawing board.

I would swap in a Seagull ETA clone but isn't the stem height rather different from an 8215?

Cheers


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## Brightling007

Seagull ST2130 is 2824, which is flatter at the front end, so diffferent stem height. The ST2100 is what you need for identical stem height... That's a 2836 clone.


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## sinner777

Hi.

I have AM0184, about a year and a half old. It is older series, there are some differences on crown (no engraving but shallow laser etched and colour filled logo) and caseback is different.

So far,watch is running. It is not running accurately (it's around 15 seconds slow per day) and time and date setting can be wonky but case and bracelet design are way above the price..

I know it is cheap watch and movement will probably fail at one moment. But I have just accepted it like that.

Case and crystal are still in good condition,with usual swirls from day wear.

So... As I could read from the whole thread - movement can be replaced ? I have seen YouTube Miyota movement swap video but also read about 2836-2 swap?

I have an experienced watchmaker for a friend so I am thinking about that option in case of movement disaster.

Case and bracelet are just too god to toss in a bin...


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## Arh061

AlbertanLiam said:


> *Starking*
> 
> Curious if Starking watches are any good? They have a decent looking movement, sapphire glass and bracelet. If anyone has owned one or currently owns one can you please let me know on the quality thanks.


Absolute garbage, don't waste your money. Looks nice, but that's about it. I bought one that stopped after less than a week. I got a replacement (thanks Starking) but this one came faulty, when shaken to wind the watch, the minute hand jumps all over the place. Timekeeping is crap too, will easily loose or gain 15 minutes in the first hour, then it just runs 15 minutes behind/or ahead. Power reserve is about 20 hours.
Long story short, it's just a piece of crap.


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## Brightling007

Is it the Miyota movement you got in it? I saw they ditched their in house movement for the Miyota 8xxx series.

I had some dead on arrival too, only the first ones I ordered a long time ago still run. The later batches were almost all very problematic.

But now with the Miyota it should be fairly reliable, albeit still being far from my favorite movement.


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## HoustonReal

Starking now sells a very similar watch for $10-$15 more, with an actual Miyota 8215. The only real difference being the date window moves from 3H to 4.5H on the AM0171.

Starking still sells the AM0184, with their in-house SK1813 movement. It has not been discontinued or replaced.

















FYI - Starking SK movements are not Miyota 8215 clones. They copy the design of the DG2813, NN2813 and Beijing SB11. This design used the Miyota 8 series basic architecture, but added hacking. Starking has their own movement factory in Shenzhen. _Shenzhen Jingrui Movement Company_ Limited was established in 2014 to manufacture tourbillon movements.

The trade-off to raise the beat rate of these SK series movements may lead to their unreliability. Dixmont originally produced their DG4813 to run at 28,800, but slowed it down to 21.600 in later versions.






1813-星皇表官网


机芯图纸下载 1813.pdf




www.starkingwatch.com


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## Brightling007

Good info, I can confirm all of that, the 4813 I have bought were all 21600, bought in 2017/2018.

The SK1813 is probably better off with 21600bph, although it might as well not be reliable. The issues, as far as I have investigated, have to do with the seconds pinion gear having tons of play quite often. Often enough to seize it up completely. Many have a stop and go seconds hand because of this, when you shake it. I have had a few that are issue free till date, and in total have seen about 10 over a period of time. The later specimen were rather worse than improved upon.


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## ahoken50

I just wonder how to open tm0915. I tried by removing the bezel part. Impossible. Is this a model you need to remove glass only? The solution to remove the glass what it is? Compressed air?

Thanks



Brightling007 said:


> Sure, this works best:
> https://www.aliexpress.com/item/Cym...e8-47e4-9779-10cb6e1c87a3&transAbTest=ae803_5
> 
> To remove the front bezel together with the glass. On the 0915 it is not a separate part though, even though it looks the same, the only thing that can be removed is the glass. There I have used compressed air on the crown tube. The 0184 though has a snap fit front bezel.
> 
> The first ones though, when I didn't have the tool yet, I used a French opinel knife and a bench vice, this provides a high force yet controlled manner of prying in between the two parts.


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## Schick

I bought myself and my wife new Starking watches. She loves hers, and I love mine. My watch is the following with the orangish hands and indices:








87.31US $ 14% OFF|Starking Men Watch Automatic Mechanical Watches Role Date Week Luxury Brand Japan Miyota Movt Wrist Watch Clock Sapphire Crystal - Mechanical Wristwatches - AliExpress


Smarter Shopping, Better Living! Aliexpress.com




www.aliexpress.com





Our watches run great and look really great as well. I am unsure why Starking gets such a bad reputation here. I will definitely purchase another Starking watch. Perhaps my tastes are too budget minded for most folks out there. A nice watch, with a sapphire crystal, and a budget Miyota is fine for me.


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## HoustonReal

Schick said:


> I bought myself and my wife new Starking watches. She loves hers, and I love mine. My watch is the following with the orangish hands and indices:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 87.31US $ 14% OFF|Starking Men Watch Automatic Mechanical Watches Role Date Week Luxury Brand Japan Miyota Movt Wrist Watch Clock Sapphire Crystal - Mechanical Wristwatches - AliExpress
> 
> 
> Smarter Shopping, Better Living! Aliexpress.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.aliexpress.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Our watches run great and look really great as well. I am unsure why Starking gets such a bad reputation here. I will definitely purchase another Starking watch. Perhaps my tastes are too budget minded for most folks out there. A nice watch, with a sapphire crystal, and a budget Miyota is fine for me.


A Starking with a Japanese movement is a different fish. The criticism has focused on Starking's, in-house, 2813 clones. The company may have improved it's QC in recent months, but their 28,800 bph, SK series movements, had high failure rates. A real Miyota 82xx caliber is normally bulletproof, except for a bit of second hand stutter, and loud winding noises.


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## GreenNeedle

Just to update on mine. IT stopped working a few weeks ago so I got 2 year's out of it. I adjusted it very slightly and it was running to +/-10s a day so pretty good for the money. I haven't had the time to open it up and have a look but the winder suggests it is fully wound up so something in there snagging or perhaps the balance wheel spring has done the Seiko 7S25 trick of getting caught. lol. I will have a look at it at some point.


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## GreenNeedle

Just another update. I had a close inspection of the balance wheel and spring and nothing was caught. I wasn't going to spend too much time messing about with the starking movement so I just bought a cheap ETA clone off ebay.....

....now, I had fitted aftermarket dial and face to the starking which were for ETA 2824 and fitted perfectly. The dial feet fit in indentations at the edge of the starking movement rather than holes and then a screw clamps against the foot from the side rather than clamping through the movement into a hole.

This cheap ETA clone which arrived today has holes and they are not in the same place as the feet (I can't remember if this was a 4ft dial that I snipped and filed 2 off.)

Hey ho, all feet have been filed off and the dial spacer glued to the back of the dial and then the dial glued to the movement with crystal cement. So will pop of easy enough if needed.

Will post up the piccies I promised 2 years ago once I've finished. A proper Franken-franken version now. lol. Starking case and crown, Aftermarket dial and hands, ETA clone movement and stem.

EDIT-Scratch that. This "ETA clone" movement doesn't let the hands fit either. lol. gotta love ebay.


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