# My new vintage zenith calibre 126



## ngdesign (Nov 28, 2009)

Hi all, i am new here.
Like most of you, one of my favorite brand is Zenith. I have never owned a vintage wristwatch tho and this is my first.
I have been trying find some extra details about this watch, as far as i know it's a calibre 126-5-6 (i looked up the website Dan provided) but only found picture of calibre 126 (mine has a extra wheel on top)

http://www.ranfft.de/cgi-bin/bidfun-db.cgi?00&ranfft&0&2uswk&Zenith_126_3

The condition seems to be pretty clean.
I haven't been able to open the back myself yet as i don't know what tool to use (and obviously too scared to scratch it too haha)
Can any one help me out and provide me with a little more details of this judging from the pictures (authenticity of movement, hands & dial)
Would love to hear some expert judgements from you guys!
Thank you


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## Hartmut Richter (Feb 13, 2006)

Congratulations! A nice, clean Zenith from the early fifties (going by movement serial number). The Cal. 126 is the base version, the 126-5 has an indirectly driven central seconds hand, the Cal. 126-6 has Incabloc shockproofing and in case you hadn't guessed, the 126-5-6 has both. On the whole, everything seems to fit - case (with serial number), movement (with serial number), style of hands, and dial - I don't think you need worry about authenticity.

Hartmut Richter


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## ngdesign (Nov 28, 2009)

Hartmut Richter said:


> Congratulations! A nice, clean Zenith from the early fifties (going by movement serial number). The Cal. 126 is the base version, the 126-5 has an indirectly driven central seconds hand, the Cal. 126-6 has Incabloc shockproofing and in case you hadn't guessed, the 126-5-6 has both. On the whole, everything seems to fit - case (with serial number), movement (with serial number), style of hands, and dial - I don't think you need worry about authenticity.
> 
> Hartmut Richter


Thank you Mr Richter
Always nice to learn some extras and a confirmation from an expert. 
Yes, i am indeed very please with this watch, i have a lot of love for classic clean face wristwatches. ;-)


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## Tony C. (Dec 9, 2006)

Very nice indeed! I happen to really like the 3-6-9-12 Arabic dials, and yours looks quite good. Harmut has given you his expert opinion, so I have nothing to add other than to agree that it appears to be correct and genuine.

Thanks for posting!

Regards,

Tony C.


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## D N Ravenna (Apr 30, 2005)

Indeed, you have a nice watch! I have always liked the indirect seconds hands on watches, not sure exactly why. My first was a Hamilton 4992B pocketwatch. It is a very nice one. Then was my Universal wristwatch. One day I may have a Zenith!

Thanks for sharing,

Dan

Ps - Sorry for the pic quality. I took these back when no one had digi-cams and used scanners! |>


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## Hartmut Richter (Feb 13, 2006)

Very unusual - a pocket watch with central seconds hands (leaving aside those awful modern contraptions with small, manual wrist watch calibres which even include a date). The Universal Geneve has a Cal. 267, in case you didn't know:

http://www.ranfft.de/cgi-bin/bidfun-db.cgi?00&ranfft&0&2uswk&Universal_267

...and for anyone out there wondering, they have some details on the Hamilton 4992B as well:

http://www.ranfft.de/cgi-bin/bidfun-db.cgi?00&ranfft&0&2uswk&Hamilton_4992B

Hartmut Richter


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## ngdesign (Nov 28, 2009)

D N Ravenna said:


> Indeed, you have a nice watch! I have always liked the indirect seconds hands on watches, not sure exactly why. My first was a Hamilton 4992B pocketwatch. It is a very nice one. Then was my Universal wristwatch. One day I may have a Zenith!
> 
> Thanks for sharing,
> 
> ...


I like universal too, but never got the chance to own one of their famous chronographs yet. Maybe next year...


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## Jensop (Nov 7, 2009)

Hi,
I have been wearing my 126 this sunday! Yours is very nice and tidy!:-!

Jens


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## Gombrich (Sep 29, 2008)

Nice clean example that. Very nice. :-!

Dave


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## ngdesign (Nov 28, 2009)

Jensop said:


> Hi,
> I have been wearing my 126 this sunday! Yours is very nice and tidy!:-!
> 
> Jens


Thanks Jens
wow, is that a glass back? NICE:-!


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## D N Ravenna (Apr 30, 2005)

Hartmut Richter said:


> Very unusual - a pocket watch with central seconds hands (leaving aside those awful modern contraptions with small, manual wrist watch calibres which even include a date). The Universal Geneve has a Cal. 267, in case you didn't know:
> 
> http://www.ranfft.de/cgi-bin/bidfun-db.cgi?00&ranfft&0&2uswk&Universal_267
> 
> ...


Thanks Hartmut!
Not to hijack the thread, but the 4992B pocketwatch was used during WWII in command situations. It was normally in a box protected by 4 springs as it had no incabloc. I imagine the large second hand made it easy to synchronize other watches. It makes a fine pocketwatch if one can learn to read 24 hrs as opposed to 12!

Cheers!

Dan


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## Jensop (Nov 7, 2009)

Well, it's a Sporto b-), so for extra protection I guess, it has an plexi cover inside the steel case back...

I am not sure how common this feature is, but I like it.

Jens


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## D N Ravenna (Apr 30, 2005)

Jensop said:


> Well, it's a Sporto b-), so for extra protection I guess, it has an plexi cover inside the steel case back...
> 
> I am not sure how common this feature is, but I like it.
> 
> Jens


Really? I have never heard of that! I know that some folks would purchase two "fronts" for their pocket watches to show both sides, but I have not heard of this.

I would say this is quite rare. Do you have a larger picture showing the entire back? I am wondering how they affixed the plexi cover. I would love to do the same with some of my vintage watches.

Thanks for sharing that tidbit!

Dan


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## ngdesign (Nov 28, 2009)

D N Ravenna said:


> Indeed, you have a nice watch! I have always liked the indirect seconds hands on watches, not sure exactly why. My first was a Hamilton 4992B pocketwatch. It is a very nice one. Then was my Universal wristwatch. One day I may have a Zenith!
> 
> Thanks for sharing,
> 
> ...





ngdesign said:


> I like universal too, but never got the chance to own one of their famous chronographs yet. Maybe next year...


Well, guess my 2010 came early this year :-d
(i am such a junkie)


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## Hartmut Richter (Feb 13, 2006)

Good heavens! - another Universal Geneve and another indirect central seconds hand! Cal. 139 (or 138SS) with bumper winding as well:

http://www.ranfft.de/cgi-bin/bidfun-db.cgi?00&ranfft&0&2uswk&Universal_139

Nice watch - very clean, very interesting, very collectible!

Hartmut Richter


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## Gombrich (Sep 29, 2008)

ngdesign said:


> Well, guess my 2010 came early this year :-d
> (i am such a junkie)


That's beautiful. I'm sure I'm not alone in thinking that's at least as nice as a Patek Calatrava and (I imagine) a lot less expensive.

Up to now my favourite Universals were the Polerouters but I think you have just changed my mind.

Dave


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## ngdesign (Nov 28, 2009)

Thanks guys
I am in love with this watch too! :-!
Just been on my magnifying glass for about an hours exploring every bit and listening the ticks.
It's a little quieter than my zenith 126-5-6.

126 current test result:
1. currently only running around +1 minutes in 24 hours
(guess i don't need to get it service yet)
2. Still testing the power reserve
(12 hours just passed, still ticking happily away)


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## D N Ravenna (Apr 30, 2005)

Very nice ngdesign! 

Not to slam Patek, but when you go back to the watches of the pre-60s, mybe even pre-50s, I do not think there is much difference. A Waltham 21-jewel pocket watch, size 18 with the gold dasmasceening (sp?) has more character in it than a handful of Calatravas made recently. The UG is another fine example. Same with our Zenith Chronometre.

I love Zenith, but I love watches as well. Keep your eyes open and you'll have a fun time!

Dan


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## ngdesign (Nov 28, 2009)

ngdesign said:


> Thanks guys
> I am in love with this watch too! :-!
> Just been on my magnifying glass for about an hours exploring every bit and listening the ticks.
> It's a little quieter than my zenith 126-5-6.
> ...


The 126 only managed to run a little over 21 hours 30 minutes ... a little disappointing. 
you guys reckon i should take it for a service? how much would it usually cost?


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## Hartmut Richter (Feb 13, 2006)

ngdesign said:


> The 126 only managed to run a little over 21 hours 30 minutes ... a little disappointing.
> you guys reckon i should take it for a service? how much would it usually cost?


Yes, that sounds a little too little! Either there's something wrong with the mainspring or the system is a little gummed up and offering too much resistance at low power. How much will a servie cost?! Depends who does it!:-d If you give it to Zenith, they will hand it back ain pristine condition and charge accordingly. Your local watchmaker will take less out of your wallte but can only rely on the parts that are there. If anything still just serves the part but might be better replaced, the watch won't run as well when it's finished. Take your pick.

@ ngdesign: forget about the mean daily rate (yours is ca. +1 minute/24 hours). Concentrate more on the consistency in daily rate. If the watch is gaining a minute per day - too much for my tastes! - but doing so every day, everything is well. It would then just need to be adjusted. Even a fifties watch, especially a Zenith, should manage to keep within ±15 seconds of that mean value. If the deviations around it are greater, something is wrong and the watch needs servicing.

Hartmut Richter


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## ngdesign (Nov 28, 2009)

Hartmut Richter said:


> Yes, that sounds a little too little! Either there's something wrong with the mainspring or the system is a little gummed up and offering too much resistance at low power. How much will a servie cost?! Depends who does it!:-d If you give it to Zenith, they will hand it back ain pristine condition and charge accordingly. Your local watchmaker will take less out of your wallte but can only rely on the parts that are there. If anything still just serves the part but might be better replaced, the watch won't run as well when it's finished. Take your pick.
> 
> @ ngdesign: forget about the mean daily rate (yours is ca. +1 minute/24 hours). Concentrate more on the consistency in daily rate. If the watch is gaining a minute per day - too much for my tastes! - but doing so every day, everything is well. It would then just need to be adjusted. Even a fifties watch, especially a Zenith, should manage to keep within ±15 seconds of that mean value. If the deviations around it are greater, something is wrong and the watch needs servicing.
> 
> Hartmut Richter


o| i knew i got myself into an expensive hobby, but didn't know i am getting hit soon.

I found some older post from jj69 about the repair cost of his rainbow chronograph... costed more than my watch :-x

I have been researching and found some listed service center from the The British Horological Institute, guess qualified makers is safer for my first vintage. Or i might even wait a little longer, save it up and have zenith do the check up. :-!


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## Hartmut Richter (Feb 13, 2006)

ngdesign said:


> o| i knew i got myself into an expensive hobby, but didn't know i am getting hit soon.
> 
> I found some older post from jj69 about the repair cost of his rainbow chronograph... costed more than my watch :-x
> 
> I have been researching and found some listed service center from the The British Horological Institute, guess qualified makers is safer for my first vintage. Or i might even wait a little longer, save it up and have zenith do the check up. :-!


Don't panic yet! Note down what the watch is reading (i.e. time it against an atomic clock). Say it's +30 secs. Do it again tomorrow at nearly the same time of day. Say it's +1:30. That's a daily rate of +1 minute. Do that again and again for a week or two. If the daily rate is nearly the same every day, you just need to get the watch adjusted. If it deviates wildly, THEN you need to have the watch serviced.

Hartmut Richter


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## ngdesign (Nov 28, 2009)

:thanks, i'll start right now! can't wait for the week result.


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## D N Ravenna (Apr 30, 2005)

A local, certified watch maker may be all you need. Mainsprings can be purchased in generic form and work quite well. That and a cleaning may be all you need!

If your watchmaker is good, he/she will let you know if other parts are needed and then you can use Zenith. You could ask them to make sure they do that.

Please keep us posted!

Dan


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## ngdesign (Nov 28, 2009)

D N Ravenna said:


> A local, certified watch maker may be all you need. Mainsprings can be purchased in generic form and work quite well. That and a cleaning may be all you need!
> 
> If your watchmaker is good, he/she will let you know if other parts are needed and then you can use Zenith. You could ask them to make sure they do that.
> 
> ...


Will surely do! thank you!


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## ngdesign (Nov 28, 2009)

Hartmut Richter said:


> Yes, that sounds a little too little! Either there's something wrong with the mainspring or the system is a little gummed up and offering too much resistance at low power. How much will a servie cost?! Depends who does it!:-d If you give it to Zenith, they will hand it back ain pristine condition and charge accordingly. Your local watchmaker will take less out of your wallte but can only rely on the parts that are there. If anything still just serves the part but might be better replaced, the watch won't run as well when it's finished. Take your pick.
> 
> @ ngdesign: forget about the mean daily rate (yours is ca. +1 minute/24 hours). Concentrate more on the consistency in daily rate. If the watch is gaining a minute per day - too much for my tastes! - but doing so every day, everything is well. It would then just need to be adjusted. Even a fifties watch, especially a Zenith, should manage to keep within ±15 seconds of that mean value. If the deviations around it are greater, something is wrong and the watch needs servicing.
> 
> Hartmut Richter


I started to retime my 126 again this week like you taught me.
3rd day has passed, here is the current result.
Day 1: +7 sec
Day 2: +7 sec (same as the 1st day, only +7 on top of the first 7)
Day 3: +7 sec (again)

Seems to be quite stable :-!


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## D N Ravenna (Apr 30, 2005)

ngdesign said:


> I started to retime my 126 again this week like you taught me.
> 3rd day has passed, here is the current result.
> Day 1: +7 sec
> Day 2: +7 sec (same as the 1st day, only +7 on top of the first 7)
> ...


That is pretty good. It is possible that you do not need any cleaning and lubrication?

Dan


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## Hartmut Richter (Feb 13, 2006)

D N Ravenna said:


> That is pretty good. It is possible that you do not need any cleaning and lubrication?
> 
> Dan


So, you have:

- daily rates of +7 and +7 seconds/24h (i.e. the watch gains 7 seconds every 24h)

- a mean daily rate so far of +7secs/24h ([7+7]/2) - not much info to go on but looks stable

- deviations from the mean daily rate of 0 and 0 secs (all rates are 7secs/day)

- therefore also a mean deviation and a maximum deviation of zero and

- ...a maximum difference in daily rates of zero!

Although the information is so far rather scarce, these are the sort of rates that most wrist watches (including the big "R") dream of. If your watch keeps this up, it would beat most of the stuff on the market - new *and* vintage!

Hartmut Richter


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## TSWatches (Dec 13, 2009)

Nice watch, zenith also gave this watch a new touch in the collection. Watch this one:


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## ngdesign (Nov 28, 2009)

Hartmut Richter said:


> So, you have:
> 
> - daily rates of +7 and +7 seconds/24h (i.e. the watch gains 7 seconds every 24h)
> 
> ...


Day 4: still keeping up the +7/24h :-!

Disappointingly (<- is this even a word or i am making this up :think:?)
The Universal needs a repair or service for sure, it just keeps stopping every few hours and won't allow me to timed it.
Well... at least my 126 is still ticking happily away like a soldier!



TSWatches said:


> Nice watch, zenith also gave this watch a new touch in the collection. Watch this one:


Thanks TSWatches. It's indeed a nice watch, happiest purchase this year so far.


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## Mowgli (Oct 1, 2009)

Both of your zenith's are gorgeus !


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## D N Ravenna (Apr 30, 2005)

Sorry to hear about your UG! But do save up and get it cleaned and lubed. It is also a very nice looking watch!

Cheers,

Dan


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## ngdesign (Nov 28, 2009)

D N Ravenna said:


> Sorry to hear about your UG! But do save up and get it cleaned and lubed. It is also a very nice looking watch!
> 
> Cheers,
> 
> Dan


Thanks. Will surely do that next year!


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## Tony C. (Dec 9, 2006)

D N Ravenna said:


> I would say this is quite rare.


Actually, while not a common practice at all, it was typical of the Sportos of a certain period. I have one with the same plexi cover, and have seen quite a few others.

Regards,

Tony C.


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## D N Ravenna (Apr 30, 2005)

Tony C. said:


> Actually, while not a common practice at all, it was typical of the Sportos of a certain period. I have one with the same plexi cover, and have seen quite a few others.
> 
> Regards,
> 
> Tony C.


That's interesting. Thanks for sharing this information!

Dan


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## ngdesign (Nov 28, 2009)

word back from a service center
The universal service charge will cost me $910 ><

Observations: Case screws rusted & Broken.. nothing else


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## D N Ravenna (Apr 30, 2005)

ngdesign said:


> word back from a service center
> The universal service charge will cost me $910 ><
> 
> Observations: Case screws rusted & Broken.. nothing else


Darn generous charge if you ask me!

Dan


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## ngdesign (Nov 28, 2009)

D N Ravenna said:


> Darn generous charge if you ask me!
> 
> Dan


generous as in "cheap"?

rust?


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## D N Ravenna (Apr 30, 2005)

Sorry, my post was meant to be sarcastic.

While I am unable to keep my finger on the pulse of things such as repairs, $910 seems to be rather high. Of course, I do not know all the repairs they quoted.

As for rust, I don't think I saw any?

Keep us posted,

Dan


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## ngdesign (Nov 28, 2009)

D N Ravenna said:


> Sorry, my post was meant to be sarcastic.
> 
> While I am unable to keep my finger on the pulse of things such as repairs, $910 seems to be rather high. Of course, I do not know all the repairs they quoted.
> 
> ...


Hehe, i thought so .. you did got me with that.. 
Well, guess you didn't know how powerful your words are to me :-d

Yea, i can't see any rust on any nails either, guess they just made it up trying to charge me a fortune. I am going to pick it up tuesday and have another quote from other watchmakers.


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## D N Ravenna (Apr 30, 2005)

ngdesign said:


> Hehe, i thought so .. you did got me with that..
> Well, guess you didn't know how powerful your words are to me :-d
> 
> Yea, i can't see any rust on any nails either, guess they just made it up trying to charge me a fortune. I am going to pick it up tuesday and have another quote from other watchmakers.


Part of my problem is the cobbling together of bits and pieces of unrelated data. You see, overhauling most Rolex's will run you less than that; perhaps not by much, but still less. And a Rolex overhaul can be pretty extensive.

Those suckers will replace your hands unless you tell them not to. Crowns, etc.

So almost by definition, other rehabs should be less. It also shows up in the parts. A Rolex rehab will include a Rolex mainspring and perhaps a Rolex crystal, both pretty rediculously priced IMO. A vintage UN or vintage Zenith will take appropriate vintage parts at a very substantial discount. They are generic. Then again, the original mainspring or crystal are not marked.

My most extensive rehab was on a Hamilton 992B pocket watch. Before it was all said and over, I had a display case, several gold screws for poising the balance, a new mainspring, a new hairspring, hands, and new crystals I had made special for the display case. Even with inflation, I doubt that those parts would exceed $300, and I would guess $200 would be better given that display cases are not that common any more as are the hairsprings.

Outside of that, the time required to clean and lubricate the watch are pretty standard.

Oh well, I was cryptic in my last response and now you have more. See what I mean about drawing together bits and pieces to make a response? :-d

Cheers,

Dan


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## Beau8 (May 24, 2008)

Congrats~Looks fantastic! ;-)


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