# Pls help on 1st Panerai (PAM 104, PAM 164 or PAM 312)



## cielomeib (Aug 31, 2012)

Hi all! Thinking of getting my husband a Panerai for his birthday. Was hoping any of you could help me figure out which PAM to get him. As of the moment, his everyday watch is a rolex submariner. He is about 5'8" in height and is medium built. Would a 44mm suit him or should I get a smaller case diameter watch? Would like to get a PAM that can be worn casually and also under a suit. Budget would be not higher than €6000. As of the moment, I am
looking at PAM 104, PAM 164 & PAM 312. Hope to hear from you guys. Any advice will be greatly appreciated.


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## Ozy (Aug 10, 2009)

PAM 312!

Let me know if you need another husband, my birthday is in March


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## Matty01 (Sep 6, 2011)

312 is a ripper, as is the 176 ... 44mm pam dontwear that big, 40mm to small for me amd i have 7.5inch wrists


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## jamoss75 (Jan 1, 2009)

Go for the PAM00312.
In house movement and wears well on smaller wrists (like mine).


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## enzo panuccio (Jul 14, 2009)

hi cielomieb,

out of the one's you have shortlisted I would definitely say the 312. Stunning brushed finish 1950 case and excellent value (in Panerai terms i.e.).
it has less going on than the other two but more of the important features.
and remember less is more with Panerai purists.

_PAM312_








another one to consider, if you're looking for a Bettarini case Pam that sits a little closer to the wrist which helps it fit under shirt cuffs, is the Pam 000.
it's the entry level Pam but don't let that deter you because it's a wonderfully authentic and stunning Pam in it's own right!
good luck, and I hope this helps.
but I'm sure he will love whatever you decide on!

roger


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## cielomeib (Aug 31, 2012)

Thank you for your response, Roger and jamoss75! The PAM 312 looks amazing on both of you! I appreciate you attaching those pics - makes me lean even more on PAM 312.

@Roger: Checked the PAM 000, it is a beauty, but my husband likes a date on his watch, so yeah, I guess I'll have to pass on that one. 

Emailed some ADs in Amsterdam and one of them just responded. He said the price of PAM 312 is €5900. He can't give me any discounts but he can give me an extra strap for free (this is aside from the black croco and rubber straps that are included in the watch). And since I am not from EU, he said I could get a full 19% tax refund at the airport. What do you guys think of that?


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## Moker (Aug 17, 2007)

Hi cielomeib,

I purchased my 312 in Amsterdam 3 weeks ago.
There are two dealers: Reuter, who does not give any discount and Gassan Diamonds. The last one gave a discount upon asking.
In addition, there is indeed a possibibility for VAT return at the Aiprot, but since I am from The Netherlands don't have a clue on how this works.

Cheers,
Ronald


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## Matty01 (Sep 6, 2011)

Youll save the local tax, but most likely have toay us import taxes


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## Nishant (Apr 7, 2011)

Of the ones u mentioned, get him a 312 ! 
Sweet timepiece ..


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## enzo panuccio (Jul 14, 2009)

hard to comment on the overseas deal cielomeib although on all accounts with a 19% vat refund it sounds good.
watch out for what Matty01 said though. I don't know if you could take it out of the box and your husband wear it on his wrist while placing the box in your carry on luggage to save import taxes the other end.
Matty was assuming you're from Australia? Don't know if that's the case?

On the dealer strap offer, confirm what strap he is offering. Some aftermarket straps are quite cheap (price and quality) whilst the OEM Pam straps are "all dear." 
Push the dealer for an OEM Jules Verne strap, or an Assolutamente strap. 
They are both top shelf Panerai straps, will suit any Pam very much and cost a fair bit approx. ~ US$450

roger

OEM Jules Verne and ********************OEM Assolutamente straps.


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## cielomeib (Aug 31, 2012)

@Moker: Hello, Ronald! Thanks for the info! May I know how much discount they gave you for your PAM 312? Im smiling from ear to ear now.  Hope to hear from you again.

@Matty01: Thanks for reminding me about customs tax. Im actually from the Philippines. Still have to check on how much they charge for bringing in time pieces like Panerai here. Hopefully, not as high as what US customs charges. 

@Nishant: yeah, the PAM 312 seems good for the price and what the watch has to offer (looks & functions), I guess. Though Im still open to other suggestions.  Although, as what I've said to Mr. Roger here, a date on a watch is an important function I cannot disregard.


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## cielomeib (Aug 31, 2012)

@enzo panuccio: Hello again, Roger! Wow, those are good looking straps! Thanks for the photos and for responding again. I sure am taking down notes. I'm not a watch person and so information such as what you are sharing with me is truly helpful. Yeah, I'd better email that AD again regarding the free strap. Will try to check on the email add of Gassan Diamonds to inquire about the availability of PAM 312. Hopefully, I'll be as lucky as Ronald and get some discounts.


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## enzo panuccio (Jul 14, 2009)

cielomeib said:


> yeah, the PAM 312 seems good for the price and what the watch has to offer (looks & functions), I guess. Though Im still open to other suggestions.  .....a date on a watch is an important function I cannot disregard.


the Pam 243 is a stunning watch from the Submersible series! (discontinued last year but still available at some dealers)


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## cielomeib (Aug 31, 2012)

I agree with you, Roger. PAM 243 is a stunner! Will ask the AD on that, too. Hopefully, it's still in my price range.


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## Synequano (May 2, 2012)

As an alternative,check out the 351,the somewhat different version of 312,it has titanium case,brown dial and gold hands










The retail is 6300 euros,you might get it to 6000ish usd if the AD give a better discount
The other reason why I am recommending this piece is the fact that your husband has rolex sub that (usually) has black dial
As for how the tax refund works,you ask for VAT papers from the store,in the airport you go to customs (for watch,you go after the immigration) to get the VAT paper stamped and collect the refund (no stamp no refund)
As for carrying it to your country,I don't know how it usually works,I had no problem when I brought 3 pams + boxes to Indonesia in April (well,practically it's smuggling,because the luxury tax in my country is around 70-80% and nobody's actually declare luxury items bought abroad..)


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## Moker (Aug 17, 2007)

cielomeib said:


> @Moker: Hello, Ronald! Thanks for the info! May I know how much discount they gave you for your PAM 312? Im smiling from ear to ear now.  Hope to hear from you again.


PM sent


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## RTea (Jun 3, 2010)

312 all the way! I have the 104 but only because the 312 is out of my price range . It's still fantastic but if your budget allows the 312,there's no doubt its the superior watch!


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## cielomeib (Aug 31, 2012)

You have no idea how much I appreciate your responses. Last concern, is the case of PAM 312 made of titanium? Does it get scratched easily?


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## cielomeib (Aug 31, 2012)

@synequano: thank you for posting a pic of PAM 351. It's gorgeous! Does it have the same case finish as PAM 313? Is it prone to scratches?


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## Synequano (May 2, 2012)

351 has the same case shape as 312,brushed lower part and polished bezel,i scratched mine on the brushed part,but I was able to polish the scratch using ink eraser


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## sager (Dec 16, 2011)

Another vote for the 312.

And what an awesome wife you are!! He is going to to love it!


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## Watch_guy (Jun 26, 2008)

cielomeib said:


> Hi all! Thinking of getting my husband a Panerai for his birthday. Was hoping any of you could help me figure out which PAM to get him. As of the moment, his everyday watch is a rolex submariner. He is about 5'8" in height and is medium built. Would a 44mm suit him or should I get a smaller case diameter watch? Would like to get a PAM that can be worn casually and also under a suit. Budget would be not higher than €6000. As of the moment, I am
> looking at PAM 104, PAM 164 & PAM 312. Hope to hear from you guys. Any advice will be greatly appreciated.


I agree with most that the 312 is great, but....it certainly does not fit well under cuffs. The 312 sits very high on the wrist, and especially someone with a smaller wrist, it may be a bit much with suits.


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## RTea (Jun 3, 2010)

cielomeib said:


> You have no idea how much I appreciate your responses. Last concern, is the case of PAM 312 made of titanium? Does it get scratched easily?


Nope the 312 is stainless steel, easy to touch up if it gets scratched. It can be a DIY job or any competent jeweler can. I like to leave the love marks on my watches though.


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