# Best Spring Bars for NATO



## 66Cooper (Jun 20, 2008)

As the clock ticks down on my Kingstons arrival, I have been wondering this. I will be rocking the K on a Bond strap from time to time and was wondering what the absolute best (tightest fitting) shoulderless bars would be given that this watch has drilled lugs. Other then my Pam, none of my other watches have drilled lugs so I havent really looked into this.
I have more my fare share of NATO and the lot and have never liked the look with shouldered bars. I want something that looks like the Tudor Snowflakes fixed bars. Something very sturdy and solid looking with no (well, as little as possible) wiggle room. Anyone have any suggestions? Will the Kingston ship with such bars?

Thanks all!


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## hooyah22 (Sep 27, 2009)

My Kingston will be wearing Marathon SAR spring bars more than likely. Incredibly strong and tight fitting, I highly recommend them


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## 66Cooper (Jun 20, 2008)

I will have a look. Thanks! 

Sadly I lost a very nice watch on a Omega shark mesh band over the summer in a lake. The spring bars were sure to blame. I will not have that happen ever again.

After posting, I came across the Project X website. They do those one-off Rolex with no crown guards and DLC coatings. Anyway, they offer an alternative to solid bars with what must be a tight fitting tube over a (hopefully) tight fitting spring bar. At least it better be for the 100GBP they charge for them!!!


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## 66Cooper (Jun 20, 2008)

Oh, and where does one find them


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## citizenfox (Jul 21, 2010)

66Cooper said:


> I will have a look. Thanks!
> 
> Sadly I lost a very nice watch on a Omega shark mesh band over the summer in a lake. The spring bars were sure to blame. I will not have that happen ever again.
> 
> After posting, I came across the Project X website. They do those one-off Rolex with no crown guards and DLC coatings. Anyway, they offer an alternative to solid bars with what must be a tight fitting tube over a (hopefully) tight fitting spring bar. At least it better be for the 100GBP they charge for them!!!


OK -I went on the website and see them. Here's the question - says the process "is reversible and is service we offer". Wondering how hard they are to install and reverse at home. I'm going to ask and see what kind of answer I get. I'll report back.


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## 66Cooper (Jun 20, 2008)

Well, the new Rolex Sub does not have drilled lugs so I am kind of thinking these might just be very beefy, very tight fitting shoulderless bars. If you had drilled lugs, I'd imagine these would be easier to remove on a drilled lug watch. Interested to see what they say though.


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## Chazmania006 (Jan 5, 2010)

As a side note, I too wanted a more secure bar solution for non drilled lugs, but I also wanted it to be easily reversible.

I purchased the Ofrei FB-7891 - "Double shoulder on one end and single on the other" - and fit them to my 20mm non drilled lugged Marcello C Nettuno 3. The tube is length 19.65mm, so it is very tight fitting (I did have to remove some from the spring ends in order to fit them into the lugs).

I figure this gives me a more permanent psuedo-fixed bar solution for the most secure wearing of a NATO strap.

In the event that I want to go back to a bracelet, I'll just snip those bars out and go back to the stock spring bars (you can bet I'll be masking off the case so I don't scratch it). However it's been 4 months so far and I've been enjoying NATO wear so much that going back to the bracelet hasn't crossed my mind.


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## 66Cooper (Jun 20, 2008)

Post some pix if you have them. Sounds cool.


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## tmoris (Dec 8, 2009)

please excuse my newbie question, but whats wrong with "normal" spring bars? Im wearing my steinhart vintage red and traser supersport on a rhino and bond straps and i never even thought about using anything else than the default spring bars that were on the watches when i purchased them. :-s


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## Chromejob (Jun 18, 2010)

tmoris said:


> please excuse my newbie question, but whats wrong with "normal" spring bars? Im wearing my steinhart vintage red and traser supersport on a rhino and bond straps and i never even thought about using anything else than the default spring bars that were on the watches when i purchased them. :-s


Normal bars, 1.2mm or 1.5mm, maybe be too thin to withstand the kind of dynamic force that a nylon band exerts. If the pins are smaller than the lug holes, they can "wiggle" and enlarge the holes ... so some say. Likewise, it's said that double-shoulder bars can be caught by the strap and pop off.

I have a bunch o' 2mm "fat boy" bars from Panatime and like them. Tough li'l buggers. And they can be removed (gently) with thumbnail so you don't have to reave your band through the gap (which can tear up the holes). I swear by them.


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## 66Cooper (Jun 20, 2008)

Very well said. NATOs are amazingly strong have a great safety feature should one of the spring bars let go but i really dont want to happen again. Its nothing but high-end spring bars for my watches


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## eganwh (Jan 15, 2009)

SAR shoulderless fat spring bars are here at countycomm.com:

SPRING BARS FOR SAR WATCHES


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## enkidu (Mar 26, 2010)

eganwh said:


> SAR shoulderless fat spring bars are here at countrycomm.com:
> 
> SPRING BARS FOR SAR WATCHES


I can recommend the countycomm spring bars. I have them on my Blackwater and they are very tight fitting and very secure.


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## tmoris (Dec 8, 2009)

Chromejob said:


> Normal bars, 1.2mm or 1.5mm, maybe be too thin to withstand the kind of dynamic force that a nylon band exerts. If the pins are smaller than the lug holes, they can "wiggle" and enlarge the holes ... so some say. Likewise, it's said that double-shoulder bars can be caught by the strap and pop off.
> 
> I have a bunch o' 2mm "fat boy" bars from Panatime and like them. Tough li'l buggers. And they can be removed (gently) with thumbnail so you don't have to reave your band through the gap (which can tear up the holes). I swear by them.


i see. and how exactly do you remove them? i understand there is no space to push one side into the other, because it is solid on its whole length..?


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## Chazmania006 (Jan 5, 2010)

Chromejob said:


> ...Likewise, it's said that double-shoulder bars can be caught by the strap and pop off.


This is exactly what happened to me. A couple years ago I was at a concert wearing my N3 on a NATO strap with the stock double-shoulder spring bars. I made my way too far into the floor/pit area and by the end of the show my watch was dangling from my wrist, connected to the NATO on only one side.

I was relieved that my watch wasn't removed completely and stomped on by moshers, but I was disappointed that lost that spring bar. I tried tugging on the strap at various angles, and I was able to recreate what happened at the show. Under the right pressure and at the right angle, nylon can stretch and grab hold of the flange/shoulder, pulling it out of the lug hole.

My "psuedo-fixed" spring bar solution:
http://i994.photobucket.com/albums/af70/chazmania006/1300471915.jpg
http://i994.photobucket.com/albums/af70/chazmania006/1300471962.jpg
http://i994.photobucket.com/albums/af70/chazmania006/1300471993.jpg

(and yes, I was kind of asking for it by wearing my watch into a mosh pit, but I'm older and wiser now  )

On my wrist as I type this, my Milsub GMT on a Maratac NATO, using the same Panatime 2mm 'fat boys' that Chromejob referred to:
http://i994.photobucket.com/albums/af70/chazmania006/1300473563.jpg
Of course the Milsub has drilled lugs, so changing them out is a piece of cake. But I imagine they still would be good on a no-hole lugged watch because there are fewer raised ridges for the nylon strap to catch on.

Like I mentioned in my earlier post, if I ever want to remove the bars from my N3, I will just mask off the case and snip them out with wire cutters.


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## eganwh (Jan 15, 2009)

I believe Bill is shipping these with the Kingstons.


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## 66Cooper (Jun 20, 2008)

Thats good to know if he is. This will be my first drilled lug watch in many years. I want to take full aevantage of that fact.


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## Chromejob (Jun 18, 2010)

tmoris said:


> i see. and how exactly do you remove them? i understand there is no space to push one side into the other, because it is solid on its whole length..?


It's not solid end to end. It still has sprung tips, but there are no shoulders for catching with a spring bar tool. Just gently push the spring bar down to one lug and the opposite tip should come free.

BTW, the NATO style doesn't offer any more "loss prevention" other than preventing a watch from sliding off the strap ... the second strap stops it from sliding the main strap. You can still lose a watch if both spring bars fail.


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## enkidu (Mar 26, 2010)

Chromejob said:


> It's not solid end to end. It still has sprung tips, but there are no shoulders for catching with a spring bar tool. Just gently push the spring bar down to one lug and the opposite tip should come free.
> 
> BTW, the NATO style doesn't offer any more "loss prevention" other than preventing a watch from sliding off the strap ... the second strap stops it from sliding the main strap. You can still lose a watch if both spring bars fail.


I disagree with that last statement. With a traditional two piece strap or bracelet you can lose your watch if ANY ONE of the following fail: cut strap, top spring bar releases/breaks, bottom spring bar releases/breaks, the strap unbuckles itself, or the buckle fails. With a NATO style strap, you can lose you watch only if your strap is cut, BOTH your spring bars fail during the same period, your strap unbuckles itself or the buckle fails.

I won't go through the full failure analysis with detection/correction/recovery scenarios, but it should be pretty clear that a NATO style strap provides more loss prevention. Imagine that your top spring bar has a stress fracture and is about to fail. On a bracelet or two piece strap, as soon as that spring bar fails your watch is falling off your wrist. On a NATO strap, your watch will start dangling by one spring bar but will NOT fall off your wrist.

I've popped single spring bars several times on my Polar playing rough contact sports; after I switched to a NATO it never once fell off my wrist. The first time, I had to comb the grass to find it.


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## tmoris (Dec 8, 2009)

thank you both Chromejob and enkidu for the insights! :-!


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## Chromejob (Jun 18, 2010)

Chromejob said:


> ... BTW, the NATO style doesn't offer any more "loss prevention"[1] other than preventing a watch from sliding off the strap ... the second strap stops it from sliding the main strap. You can still lose a watch if both spring bars fail.





enkidu said:


> I disagree with that last statement. With a traditional two piece strap or bracelet you can lose your watch if ANY ONE of the following fail: cut strap, top spring bar releases/breaks, bottom spring bar releases/breaks, the strap unbuckles itself, or the buckle fails. With a NATO style strap, you can lose you watch only if your strap is cut, BOTH your spring bars fail during the same period, your strap unbuckles itself or the buckle fails.
> 
> I won't go through the full failure analysis with detection/correction/recovery scenarios, but it should be pretty clear that a NATO style strap provides more loss prevention....


[1]Sorry, I should've clarified, as I usually do, that a NATO provides *just a little more loss prevention than a conventional one-piece nylon ("RAF-style") strap. *NOT two-piece straps. With a single-piece nylon strap, your watch can slide off, while the second shorter piece of the NATO halts this. Yes, a single spring bar failure on a two-piece strap, bracelet, or leather band will allow the watch to drop ... hence the reason to use good quality bars.

I specify this for those who claim that a NATO is more secure than a one-piece RAF style nylon band.


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## 66Cooper (Jun 20, 2008)

Exactly, just more protection then a 2 piece strap. NATOs have the added bonus of holding the watch head in place on the strap.


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## enkidu (Mar 26, 2010)

Chromejob said:


> I specify this for those who claim that a NATO is more secure than a one-piece RAF style nylon band.


Ah yes, that makes complete sense. Thanks so much for the clarification!


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