# Fake Oris Big Crown Pointers Serial 26-58574



## humphrj

Is there a way of outing these sellers, or finding out where the source is?

I'm not going to say this is always going to be these numbers but the number engraved on mine are '26-58574' and '7543'.
I think 7543 refers to the model and movement. 
And 26-58574 is the individual serial number that should be different on each watch.

If look closely at sellers photos and can see that the serial number is 26-58574 then it is a fake. The fakers don't seem to change the serial number.

Just how many of these are out there. I've been looking on the 'bay' and just over the last week I have seen loads of fake Oris Big Crown Pointers. Here's mine.






























Needless to say, I didn't know it was fake before I bought it. o|
But being the watch nerd I am (not nearly nerdy enough), I decided to look into this. I think I'm only scratching the surface.
Found these threads... Hope it's okay to post other thread links for the benefit of all.

This 1st link shows a letter from Oris debunking this serial number as fake - https://www.watchuseek.com/f63/fake-oris-sold-ebay-antiquesghaith-932985.html
https://www.watchuseek.com/f239/1st-comparison-ball-fireman-2-oris-pointer-date-293336.html
ETA 2824. Something odd/unusual about this movement.

So. I'm not an expert but here is what (I think) I have found out.
An extremely high proportion of advertised Oris Big Crown Pointers are fake. 30% or more at the time of looking
The key areas seem to be:
- Poorly applied lume on the hands (sometimes running over the front of the hands) look at my hour hand.
- Inconsistent movements being used. Mine is a legit but old ETA 7543. The screws and indents that the screws go in to are hacked about and completely inconsistent with the condition of the case and crystal. Also I believe that the High Mech movement regulator should have a screw to regulate it, not just the usual pushing the arm back and forth to plus and minus.
- Most obvious is the lettering on the case back. I believe it should have a deep engraving and not just be surface laser etched. The etching is inconsistant in the way it is sometimes closer and then migrates to further away from the display back crystal.

I encourage anyone to correct me on any points and to seek out these listings and look for the serial number.

If I get any major errors in the above post pointed out to me, I will amend as applicable. Plus if any moderators think I'm overstepping the mark in any way let me know. Thanks


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## humphrj

These photos showhow it should look.


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## humphrj

Any other Oris Big Crown Pointer owners out there?


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## JonS1967

Sorry to learn of your troubles. It's incredible to me that people go to such extreme lengths to counterfeit watches; especially a watch that many non WIS would even recognize.

I bought mine from forum sponsor Topper Jewelers (phenomenon experience by the way). Just posted this pic earlier today in the "Lets see your Oris today!!" Thread.









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## Chris Hohne

Don't have to worry about fakes when you buy from an AD like Toppers.

Chris Hohne


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## humphrj

I completely agree. Or at the very least ensure there is paperwork and original sales receipt. Then perhaps contact Oris to confirm the model, movement etc all matches the serial number. 
I've been burnt and accept that but if any potential buyers see this before making a purchase then it will be worth it.

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## Wildmans85

Wow, thanks for the info, I've been looking at getting a Big Crown with the black face for quite a while now, just checked all the photos of the watches I was interested and guess what?! All fakes! Absolutely unreal.


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## JonS1967

I hadn't really considered the possibility of ending up with a fake when I purchased mine because I knew I wanted a new watch. But I still can't come to grips with the idea that there are so many fakes out there. Very upsetting.


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## Whiskeydevil

sorry to hear about that.


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## humphrj

I got this reply to an email I sent to Oris UK a while back and thought it might be worth posting it up here.

_Dear Jason,
Thank you for your email and consideration.
I have been aware of this for quite some time and so far have been unable to find the "root" of this supply.

I totally agree this kind of thing does a brand no favours what so ever. This is indeed quite a frustrating situation!

I have checked eBay today and there are a "vast" number of watches described as "vintage" that bear no resemblance to anything Oris have ever made!

eBay, sadly are of no assistance against this type of trading.

I have made a couple of discoveries with these actual watches.
The Official Oris serial numbers are unique and are always different on all of our watches, on the fakes that we have seen at our aftersales (because they break down very quickly!) these "serial numbers" have all been the same number.
The seller appears to make no effort to hide this number.
Visually, as we know they are quite authentic So far, I have tracked them to India and the far east. This is now in the hands of our Indian team, as well as our legal team.

I assure you we will do our utmost to put an end to this as soon as we can.
I am sure you know that these things are often a bit of an epidemic.
We have started to work with some "watch bloggers" and I think this may be a good way to send out this alarm.

Once again I thank you for taking the time to write in and bring this to our attention

Best Regards

Mr Paul Thurlow
UK Sales and Marketing Manager
Oris UK Ltd
Enterprise House
Delta Way
Egham
Surrey
_TW20 8RX


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## humphrj

Bump.

Just because there are still lots of these around on ebay and I don't want any fellow watch enthusiasts to get burnt.


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## tubelogic

humphrj said:


> Bump.
> 
> Just because there are still lots of these around on ebay and I don't want any fellow watch enthusiasts to get burnt.


So I apparently got one one of these and would never have known if I didn't send it to Oris for a repair. Overall I am amazed by the fit and finish. So much in fact that I took it to a local watch repair shop first who said I would have to send it to Oris because only they can supply parts. (He didn't even know it was a fake!) The counterfeit part was only found after sending it to Oris in Mass, USA...

It is really unfortunate that anyone would go through this much effort to make such a beautiful watch, only to make a fake. I had bought this watch as a replacement for a genuine Oris I had (that was stolen) and honestly the counterfeit once felt and acted as nice if not nicer than the one I had originally. I have put out a call to both eBay and PayPal and we will see what happens, but I bought mine almost a year ago so I don't think I will have much luck. Apparently the service center has "seen more than a few" of these so this is a real problem.

Good luck out there guys, there are jerks everywhere. Watch out for the seller "Golden.watches" out of Canada.


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## Buddy2

Is this another fake. Saw this on ebay.


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## willykatie

I wonder if there are other Oris models that are fake apart from Big Crown. 

These people are getting clever and they do look pretty good for fake and to most people they probably believe that they're genuine product. 

They should come up and make an actual brand rather than making fake 


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## nigelw

Looks genuine - I remember this model - late 90's and seemed quite short lived, flat sapphire glass and I think also added a screw down crown.


Buddy2 said:


> Is this another fake. Saw this on ebay.


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## Buddy2

Thanks. Do you know of a resource where they have the big pointer series throug the years?


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## Pez83

Buddy2 said:


> Thanks. Do you know of a resource where they have the big pointer series throug the years?


I often thought that myself. I have a few catalogues from 95 to early 2000s that show some good models.


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## TheWatchmaker

PM SENT


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## W.G. Pagel

This one appears to be fake as well form a seller with 100% feedback?
Pictures show the same S/N as the OP's of 26-58574:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Oris-Automatic-Date-Rose-and-S-Steel-Big-Crown-/122733229605?hash=item1c93787625:g:nb4AAOSwTPFZ0Dpd


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## humphrj

You're right. Indeed it is a fake. These are so good and detailed that I'm not surprised and the seller may not know. The standouts are the small lume dots on the dial - the overly green lume on the hands, the caseback engraving has been lazer etched not deep engraved and of course the Serial number which Oris have confirmed in a letter earlier in this post as being incorrect.



W.G. Pagel said:


> This one appears to be fake as well form a seller with 100% feedback?
> Pictures show the same S/N as the OP's of 26-58574:
> 
> http://www.ebay.com/itm/Oris-Automatic-Date-Rose-and-S-Steel-Big-Crown-/122733229605?hash=item1c93787625:g:nb4AAOSwTPFZ0Dpd


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## nigelw

I also think that only watches that are gold plated fully have gold coloured crowns, The bi coloured (gold bezel) normally seem to have steel crowns when genuine.

The paint on fake red rotors seems to be a bit tatty often - this one does not look too bad actually but shows signs of unevenness near the Mech printing.

Nigel.



humphrj said:


> You're right. Indeed it is a fake. These are so good and detailed that I'm not surprised and the seller may not know. The standouts are the small lume dots on the dial - the overly green lume on the hands, the caseback engraving has been lazer etched not deep engraved and of course the Serial number which Oris have confirmed in a letter earlier in this post as being incorrect.


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## TigerUK

why do the fakers bother with these. I would have thought Oris at it's price point it wont be worthwhile for fakers to bother. They should spend their resources on making submariners. The thing sells like hot cakes and the design doesn't change for some 10 years.


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## humphrj

TigerUK said:


> why do the fakers bother with these. I would have thought Oris at it's price point it wont be worthwhile for fakers to bother. They should spend their resources on making submariners. The thing sells like hot cakes and the design doesn't change for some 10 years.


I know John. I've even seen fake skx007 on eBay. Along with the redialed 6309 and 7002 divers eBay is such a minefield now. It must be a lot harder for new people coming in to this hobby, when even 'affordables' might be fake.

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## humphrj

It does make one wonder when the end price is quite so low, how a profit can be turned out of an entry level faked watch. This is why fakes are so abhorrent for me. Not necessarily abhorrence at the end product (although some are very bad) , but abhorrence for the way some of the conditions, treatment and poor wages some of the makers of this stuff must surely be under.
Fakery of all sorts supports crime and depravity. 

Don't buy fakes people.- please.

Rant over



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## Poydras12

tubelogic said:


> So I apparently got one one of these and would never have known if I didn't send it to Oris for a repair. Overall I am amazed by the fit and finish. So much in fact that I took it to a local watch repair shop first who said I would have to send it to Oris because only they can supply parts. (He didn't even know it was a fake!) The counterfeit part was only found after sending it to Oris in Mass, USA...
> 
> It is really unfortunate that anyone would go through this much effort to make such a beautiful watch, only to make a fake. I had bought this watch as a replacement for a genuine Oris I had (that was stolen) and honestly the counterfeit once felt and acted as nice if not nicer than the one I had originally. I have put out a call to both eBay and PayPal and we will see what happens, but I bought mine almost a year ago so I don't think I will have much luck. Apparently the service center has "seen more than a few" of these so this is a real problem.
> 
> Good luck out there guys, there are jerks everywhere. Watch out for the seller "Golden.watches" out of Canada.


tubelogic, I find your experience particularly troubling, because as I have mentioned in another post, the dead giveaway for me is the feel, meaning the fit and finish. The few fakes I have held in my hand felt cheap. I went to Hong Kong last year and actually went into what I can only describe as a mall, that sold almost nothing but fakes, fake everything, not just watches. I had hesitancy to even go to the place because I hate that fakes even exist, but my curiosity won out and I went. Bought nothing, but the experience of seeing just how many things are faked was both shocking and sad. As for watches, every brand I have ever heard of was there, even Casios. After that experience, I will never buy a watch on Ebay.


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## Buddy2

Another fake Oris Big Crown pointer on ebay.

This time a different serial number, and not even properly etched.

Oris Pointer Automatic 25 Jewels Big Crown Swiss Made Excellent Condition Watch | eBay


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## humphrj

Buddy2 said:


> Another fake Oris Big Crown pointer on ebay.
> 
> This time a different serial number, and not even properly etched.
> 
> Oris Pointer Automatic 25 Jewels Big Crown Swiss Made Excellent Condition Watch | eBay


I've reported this seller to eBay before and they're still chucking out the same crap. I mean, how is it possible for a seller to have that many duplicates on sale or sold recently. I'm no expert on Fortis or Rado but I'll bet they're all fakes too.

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## Buddy2

humphrj said:


> I've reported this seller to eBay before and they're still chucking out the same crap. I mean, how is it possible for a seller to have that many duplicates on sale or sold recently. I'm no expert on Fortis or Rado but I'll bet they're all fakes too.
> 
> Sent from my ONEPLUS A3003 using Tapatalk


It does make you wonder how much these sellers are worth to ebay for them to ignore the fradulent activity. I have flagged fakes before and the auctions were still not taken down.


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## jmwilliamson2

Yikes. This makes me very nervous, as I purchased a Big Crown secondhand. I can't imagine that mine is fake, as it had appropriate documents and seems to be very high quality. I may not do it again after reading this. A few extra bucks to an AD to ensure I'm not out several hundred to a fraudster may be worth it. 


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## Beagleybear

Hi! Is this Oris a fake one? Thanks in advance for the guidance!









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## humphrj

Beagleybear said:


> Hi! Is this Oris a fake one? Thanks in advance for the guidance!
> 
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> 
> 
> Sent from my ASUS_X008D using Tapatalk


Movement looks legit. Not familiar with that model. I'd say the case is too complicated to reproduce cheaply but who knows these days.

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## Briankitchens

I'm new to forum and hopeople someone can help me...someone offering to sell oris model 7569 serial number 26-19524.posting pics fm to help. Thank you for any help.


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## Briankitchens

Real?


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## Chris Hohne

Let's get off the "is this fake" tangent.


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