# Grovana Coral Reef Diver 300m



## JMS (Oct 1, 2006)

_EDIT: This is a first run review using the SW200. I have since inspected one of a later run and was much cleaner under. Good to see that. Its also my understanding a dealer can order with either movement._

I feel what I discovered important enough to warrant posting in Watch Reviews as well as the Divers Forum, it's my hope both threads are left there please.

I will state I actually like this watch despite this review. And I will say I find this movement more accurate and with longer power reserve than a certified 2824, 25 jewels.

#1 First picture, a very smart looking piece. Heavy, large and the exterior is of great quality.










#2 After having this for almost 4 weeks the bracelet has still not set in properly. If you look in the picture one side hangs down very nicely, the other side is binding on the lugs, making the bracelet stick out. Easily fixed, I did not play with it, it's not noticeable on the wrist.










#3 The bezel insert fell out. Here is the backing from it. They did try to attach the insert to the bezel, placing glue on the paper, then into the bezel. Unfortunately it's a waxy type material so the whole thing fell off. Cleaned the bezel, removed this paper from the insert, it has sticky stuff on it so it reapplied to the bezel with no issue. This can be noticed if the bezel is slightly above the crystal.










#4 It's a dirty build, something I did not expect. It did not come from my environment and was noticeable under a loupe immediately upon opening. Look how much goop is on the gasket. Instead of lubricating the gasket they have smeared goop over it after it was placed on the case. Not a big deal, guess I can always use the extra. The dirty build will show more in the following pictures.










#5 The reason I am writing this review. Refer back to the first picture. States 25 jewel on the dial right? This piece is sold implying it's an ETA 2824 25 jewel movement. WRONG! It's a 26 jewel movement and it's not an ETA. All right there under the Grovana name on the rotor, have a peak.










#6 Let me give you a closer look at this. Also looks like someone dug the Grovana name into the rotor with a nail.










#7 Lets look at the rest of the movement. Hmm, nope does not look like an ETA 25 jewel.










#8 Lets have a closer look. Yep, an SW 200, model number clearly there under the balance wheel.










I don't know what bothers me more. The fact I was misled by its specs of 25 jewel ETA 2824, the dial stating 25 jewel only to find its not and first seeing 26 jewels on the rotor. Maybe the dirty build. Maybe the poor build. Yes a harsh review and justly so. False advertising. With so much competition on Swiss manufacturers this is what we are getting? We don't know where parts are being sourced, that can be covered up. Blatant issues like this cannot. I always take my new pieces apart and for just reason, I have seen many things that bother me, this one I had to post as more of a heads up for all. Void my warranty? Not worried about that, never am, but don't take em apart until after some weeks giving time for initial issues to surface, I always recommend take a peak inside your pieces, sometimes you will be shocked.

This piece was purchased from an authorized dealer, I shall not name them. They are one of the largest. Being thoroughly supported by them its not their fault, have purchased many pieces from them and will continue to do so growing our relationship.

Back to the movement. It's good to see although not 100% Swiss, some viable competition to ETA. It has been more accurate in its time keeping. Myself, always watched the relatively new SW 200 movement.

There will be more on this at some point. Thanks for your time. Always be aware of what you are purchasing, where and what materials are being used, be a smart consumer in your investigating.

This has been my experience with this single piece.

James


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## stissot (Jul 13, 2007)

Are you going to keep it? 

It's a really good looking piece. It's unfortunate that the build was not clean and certainly dissapointed that the product is not as advertised. 

The thing looks wonderful, but because of the false advertising I would be sending it back. Even if the SW200 is acceptable, I just couldn't live with myself looking at the dial and "25 Jewels" knowing what's really under the hood. 

I wonder if this is just a one-off incident or if more of the "ETA 2824" models are really equipped with the SW200.


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## JMS (Oct 1, 2006)

stissot said:


> Are you going to keep it?
> 
> It's a really good looking piece. It's unfortunate that the build was not clean and certainly dissapointed that the product is not as advertised.
> 
> ...


Was discussing in the divers forum. And my point exactly, simply can't live with it myself. And we will find out, either they have one model for net retail another for brick & mortar or they made a full switch. Regardless I was not given a choice!!

James


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## jakisbck (Feb 13, 2006)

Hmmmmmmmmmm:think: thats to bad you know what started out to be a really nice looking watch but later to find that you have been mis-led. Either way let us know what happen in the end from the AD if any. 

PS I was always told that lots of companies do business in the far east and then case them up in swizty plus label them as such.

Maybe that is why there is so much secrecy in the world of horology.


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## JMS (Oct 1, 2006)

Received a full credit on the piece. Still find it disturbing that the European seller still is claiming its an ETA on his web sites and elsewhere. No answer from anyone regarding why or when, as stated before, caught with pants down


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## swzarsa (Jan 3, 2008)

Hello Jim,
I've just won an an Ebay auction on this timepiece. The seller avers that it is a 2824 movement inside which remains to be seen. Thanks so much for your post!

regards,
rich


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## obie (Feb 9, 2006)

Hey Jim, aside from the mislabeling and the bezel and trashed movement, do you think that the sw200 will run for the long term if they are clean instead of what you had? I ask this because My new polluce is a 21 jewel sw200. it keeps great time. I'm just wondering about it over the long term use.


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## workaholic_ro (Dec 3, 2007)

JMS said:


> #6 Let me give you a closer look at this. Also looks like someone dug the Grovana name into the rotor with a nail.


Not quite a nail but very much alike the typical job of a ((very)) (cheap) stepper driven CNC engraver. Rare in the watch industry, it brings more value to the work :-d


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## jems (Jan 13, 2008)

Jim,
I just stumbled upon your review, Great job. You do have me a little upset though. Although, NOT your fault. I have purchased Four (4) of these watches from I think, the same seller you have on the bay. All very beautiful watches. Although, the last two which I purchased do have a little prblm. That is, the crowns on both of them, don't seem to spring out when unscrewed/unlocked. The first two, I purchased readily pop out when unlocked. When_ I emailed the seller/distributor in Germany, He told me, that it is normal w/some of them. Yeah right! Well, I hope it is not because of a mvmnt. swap. It is unbelievable that a distributor would be doing this & not informing the buyers. I guess I will have to open up the back of my four Grovanas & inspect them now. I didn't want to do that & risk having them leak if I happen to get them wet some how. When I get the courage up to open the backs of my watches up, I will get back to you. That is if I don't have a coronary over a heart swap in my watches._
_Thanks again for the well done & informative review! _
_Joe_


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## swzarsa (Jan 3, 2008)

Steve,
I recently asked a vendor (based in Germany) if they will guaranty that the movement on an auction item was an ETA 2824-2. The reply was "no. could be sw200." I followed up my question with, "Why does your advertising not reflect that possibility?" No, reply so far..

Aloha,
Rich


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## jems (Jan 13, 2008)

Jim,
I finally opened up two of my Grovanas, fully expecting to see the same thing you have so nicely photographed. To my surprise & relief, It appears I have the 25 Jewel ETA Mvmnt's. in these two. Exactly as pictured here https://www.watchuseek.com/showthread.php?t=55349, in a Dec. '06 Review by OldeCrow. Why the crowns on them seem to stick & not pop out, I just don't know. Both are otherwise, working just fine.
Thanks again for your review. I will certainly keep it in mind should I decide on future Grovana purchase.:thanks


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## tpdtom (Dec 27, 2007)

Just as an aside to this thread, which I hope is on topic, I recently purchased a Debaufre Ocean I. I'm extremely happy with the watch, and with the piece keeping good time (a little fast but it's new) I haven't had reason to have it opened. I have heard that Grovana makes these watches for Steinhart/Debaufre, but I can't confirm that. Now here is the interesting part.

In addition to the Ocean I, which is advertised as having an ETA 2824-2 movement, the company offered another limited edition this year called the Ocean Classic. This limited edition of only 50 watches used, guess what ? An SW 200 movement ! Otherwise, the watch was touted as having a classic dial with larger markers. Same diameter, weight, and even the same 275 individual pieces !

In closing, I only want to point out that if it's true that Grovana manufactures the homage watches for Steinhart/Debaufre then it stands to reason how an SW 200 could end up in a Grovana timepiece which supposedly holds an ETA 2824-2. Makes me wonder what's in mine :-s, but I don't have the expertise to open the back, plus I was planning to wear this watch on an overseas trip which might include some snorkeling, so maybe I'm better off to leave well enough alone...Tom


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## Watchstuff2 (Jun 23, 2007)

Glad you are enjoying the Debaufre! And yes, Grovana does make these for Debaufre, and yes, the Ocean Classic does have the Sellita movement....they also use the Sellita in their Triton model. They still use the ETA 2824 in some of their other models, but I assume they will change over to the Sellita on other models eventually...


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## luxury-swiss-watches (Feb 27, 2008)

We import the Grovana divers into the US, this caught me by complete surprise when someone questioned whether our watches "really" have ETA movements inside.

I called Switzerland this morning and learned that the dealer can request the Sellita movement instead of ETA, but only a very few are doing so. My guess is the high capacity dealers are doing this to speed up delivery due to the short supply of ETA.

ALL of ours will be ETA movements unless otherwise stated in our advertising. Switzerland also confirmed that none of our shipments would have had the Sellita, they don't put them in unless requested.

I am going to get one on my next shipment so we can bench-test it ... I will post the results. The main thing we are looking for is how it keeps time in various positions (the 2824 is flawless, regardless of the position) and how well it can be tuned.

Thomas
Luxury-Swiss-Watches


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## JMS (Oct 1, 2006)

Live and learn. Been off for a while, few rounds of chemo but hell I will live long and prosper as our favorite vulcan stated I believe.

You get what you pay for, if something seems too good to be true then usually it is.

I do miss the piece. I was told there are pieces made for ebay and pieces made for other markets, or perhaps as one dealer above mentioned movements by request. For Grovana you may want to check out Roy at RLT Watches too vs. ebay, a nice dealer and just a better overall feeling in transactions, I have dealt with him upstanding gent. Again not to slight that fleabay dealer I did have a follow up transaction with him of $800 was not his fault either but seems to still support the lower end Grovana built with the SW200 movements which I did not find to be clean builds. To name names we know there is only one fleabayr that has these, Holger and the 2 ebay sites he runs, a good guy but maybe not for Grovana, flame me if you wish but despite this Grovana ebay problem he is fine.


regards,


James


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## luxury-swiss-watches (Feb 27, 2008)

We just got the new watches (with the SW-200s in them) back from my Rolex jeweler. We checked them in a number of running positions on a piece of equipment that reads the frequency the watch vibrates at ... a mark of a good movement is its ability to keep the same time in many positions (that is, if it runs 5 sec fast flat on a table, it should run 5 sec fast in every other position). The 26 jewel SW-200s we tested are able to do that. This makes the watch "tunable" so you can get it running with decent accuracy.

I also learned that Selita was a sub-contractor for ETA manufacturing the 2824; and that the SW-200 IS EXACTLY the same specs as the 2824, with an additional jewel.

As for the "dirty" build, make sure you buy from an authorized dealer and get SIGNED papers; otherwise the warranty is not valid.


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## jhamlin38 (Feb 10, 2007)

Great news. There's a brand new company that knocked off this watch, and are widely available at a price that will ensure perfection. Try 'em. They're called Rolex.


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## Nalu (Feb 14, 2006)

jhamlin38 said:


> Great news. There's a brand new company that knocked off this watch, and are widely available at a price that will ensure perfection. Try 'em. They're called Rolex.


I did. Traded the LV and kept the Grovana (from Roy Taylor at RLT Watches - I concur with James' statements):










I've had excellent results from my watches with SW-200s (about 4 - that I know of). No problems to date and no complaints from me about Sellita.


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## Tragic (Feb 11, 2006)

jhamlin38 said:


> Great news. There's a brand new company that knocked off this watch, and are widely available at a price that will ensure perfection. Try 'em. They're called Rolex.


Well said. :-!


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## swzarsa (Jan 3, 2008)

Aloha Jim,
That fleabayer you mentioned has a bad habit of "banning" individuals from his site who questions his selling philosophy, i.e., insisting that he states for a fact that his Grovanas had SW-200 movements.. I must admit, I'm proud to have gotten under his skin and got banned myself...nice watches though.
rich


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## panerai7 (Mar 11, 2008)

I cancelled my purchase because the item wasn't as described. Now i looked, he changed a lot of his ads to eta or sellita right in the description.

Shouldn't there be some sort of way to tell without opening the caseback?


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## KTM650M (Mar 22, 2006)

*Grovana Coral Reef - bit of a joke*

I was not aware of the movement "switch" and it is great that some people point out these small issues on the Internet and in this Forum.
It is also worth pointing out that some real Grovana Corel Reef have forgot to place logo on crown and strap. These are NOT "fakes" it is just the way that Grovana works with the Chinese.
Despite such a low price for a "claimed" Swiss automatic you will find that 90% of Grovana - Revue-Thommen included - components are made in China.
Hence, as pointed out on original topic - the ring for the bezel comes off, more annoying > the dot on the bezel comes off (try to find it and glue it back when it happens :think - the crown has far too much play with real low quality finish and, recently pointed out to me, the case is real cheap and cheerful with poor finish. :rodekaart
I have found a site with trade prices for Grovana and Revue-Thommen on the Internet and the Corel Reef or model 1571 so cleverly name by Grovana :-d - costs CHF 189.05 :-(
For such a low cost price we cannot expect a good quality watch after all.:roll: but worth the £115 or $199 price tag offered by some.


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## KTM650M (Mar 22, 2006)

luxury-swiss-watches said:


> We just got the new watches (with the SW-200s in them) back from my Rolex jeweler. We checked them in a number of running positions on a piece of equipment that reads the frequency the watch vibrates at ... a mark of a good movement is its ability to keep the same time in many positions (that is, if it runs 5 sec fast flat on a table, it should run 5 sec fast in every other position). The 26 jewel SW-200s we tested are able to do that. This makes the watch "tunable" so you can get it running with decent accuracy.
> 
> I also learned that Selita was a sub-contractor for ETA manufacturing the 2824; and that the SW-200 IS EXACTLY the same specs as the 2824, with an additional jewel.
> 
> As for the "dirty" build, make sure you buy from an authorized dealer and get SIGNED papers; otherwise the warranty is not valid.


In all fairness, what you wrote, is not rocket science. With hundreds of models and brands using the ETA2824 on their watches and millions of this particular movement made; one would say that it is fairly reliable, after all.
One should be more concerned about the general poor finish of such a watch.

Sellita was taken to court by ETA - hence I don't think they are the best of mates (I could be wrong - "some" will sleep with anyone just to make money).

This particular model is sold all over the place and prices on Grovana and Revue-Thommen watches can be apart as much as 100% from one dealer to the other. What "dirty" build has to do with warranty; I am not really sure. All models 1571 sold - even at $199 - come with warranty booklet.


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## JMS (Oct 1, 2006)

panerai7 said:


> I cancelled my purchase because the item wasn't as described. Now i looked, he changed a lot of his ads to eta or sellita right in the description.
> 
> Shouldn't there be some sort of way to tell without opening the caseback?


yep, 10 chance to 1 when unscrewed the crowns don't pop out as nicely as the ETA, in my experience


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## cessnapilotdr (Dec 11, 2008)

*i need an advice..*

hi you..
i am decided to buy a new grovana diver watch ,maybe a revue thommen.
but after reading your message i 'm afraid of getting that brand.
how should we understand it's fake or real ?ETA or Sellita?
does it have a way?
thanks in advance for your kind reply...



JMS said:


> I feel what I discovered important enough to warrant posting in Watch Reviews as well as the Divers Forum, it's my hope both threads are left there please.
> 
> I will state I actually like this watch despite this review. And I will say I find this movement more accurate and with longer power reserve than a certified 2824, 25 jewels.
> 
> ...


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## Guest (Dec 11, 2008)

*Re: i need an advice..*

The SW 200 is a clone of the ETA 2824-2. You may use our search function to get more information. Just type "Sellita" or "SW 200". Good luck hunting


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## Bull Winkle (Dec 14, 2008)

I bought a Triton with the sw200 movement. Before I did I researched on several forums as too the movement. What I found, after really reading was that it was an accurate movement. Getting the watch from the mfg, with a 2 year warranty help calm my apprehension. I've had the Triton for about a month and it keeps good time about 5 or 6 seconds a day. I also bought an Ocean 1 with the 2824 and had a friend who is a better watch geek than i am inspect it, both visually outside and also the movement, and it is indeed a 2824. I like to know what I'm getting and Debaufre seems to sell you what they say they are selling.


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## Beyond 'The Box' (Jan 11, 2008)

Nice lookin' watch, minus the cyclops and mercedes hour hand, though very typical for a rolex imitation.


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## JDT (Dec 20, 2008)

Oh geeze. I just ordered a Debaufre Ocean-1 blue/blue today and now I find out that it's made in China? I haven't even gotten the thing yet. Please tell me that I haven't just paid $480 for a $200 watch.


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## swzarsa (Jan 3, 2008)

I have several Grovanas with movements ranging from the CL-888's and to the ETA 2824 and a more recent SW-200 and nothing bad to say about either the movement or the aesthetics of the watches themselves (except for that darn button on the diver falling off). The 2-year warranty and "surety" that the movement was exactly what they said it was are definitely peace of mind essentials. I would avoid the "either or" seller. I prefer my dealers "upfront" with their wares.


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## swzarsa (Jan 3, 2008)

I feel your pain! I just pulled the trigger on a TT Debaufre Ocean-1 today as well..however, dealer (from Australia) avers that his watches are "Swiss Made" and does not contain Chinese assembled movements...we'll see..


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## Junior (Feb 8, 2006)

I have a Grovana Coral Reef 2 that has the same 'problems' (or should I say, Characteristics?) as descibed in the review - the bracelet doesn't sit flat at one of the lugs, and the crown doesn't pop out when unscrewed. Apart from the fact that when I occasionally hand wind it to start it up I change the date by mistake, this isn't a big deal! The bracelet itself is slightly sharp on the eges of the links, but I can fix this if necessary. However, it is robust, good looking, priced very attractively, and the movement works like a dream, gaining 1 second in a WEEK the last time it was worn regularly (at the moment, it is exact to the atomic time signals after two days), so as far as I'm concerned, it is as close to the ideal daily wear watch as you are likely to get. Well done to Grovana for producing such a good quality automatic watch at a reasonable price. :-!


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## Beyond 'The Box' (Jan 11, 2008)

Junior said:


> I have a Grovana Coral Reef 2 that has the same 'problems' (or should I say, Characteristics?) as descibed in the review - the bracelet doesn't sit flat at one of the lugs, and the crown doesn't pop out when unscrewed. Apart from the fact that when I occasionally hand wind it to start it up I change the date by mistake, this isn't a big deal! The bracelet itself is slightly sharp on the eges of the links, but I can fix this if necessary. However, it is robust, good looking, priced very attractively, and the movement works like a dream, gaining 1 second in a WEEK the last time it was worn regularly (at the moment, it is exact to the atomic time signals after two days), so as far as I'm concerned, it is as close to the ideal daily wear watch as you are likely to get. Well done to Grovana for producing such a good quality automatic watch at a reasonable price. :-!


Great addition here Junior, and awesome watch man! :-!


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## por44 (Dec 21, 2007)

Regarding the SW-200; I've had several in Grovanas and Chase Durers over the last several years - their timed performance was on par if not better than some of their ETA 2824 1st cousins. 

Competition can be a very good thing. I think this is one of those cases.


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## KTM650M (Mar 22, 2006)

Just to let everyone know - mine have become a piece of junk.

Bought first one in 2007 and the GMT in 2008.

Found out that the 2007 model does not have a ETA movement but a Claro one.
Comparing pictures with other sites also find out that the GMT does not have logo on Crown.

Both watches have "lost" the dot at 12 as this is just glued in. The bezel on the 2007 model does not rotate any more and the crown is wobbly all over the place.

Worth mentioning that I sent the watch to Grovana in 2009 for repair under warranty.

The dial on the GMT is also moving when you pull out the crown.

Fair to say that they were good value for money at that time but they are really low quality products.


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## Zeke (Oct 4, 2007)

My three-year-old Debaufre Ocean 1 Classic did lose the lume dot -- bezel replaced for free -- but, aside from that, I've worn the Hell out of this thing, daily, with no issues.

Case says "2824-2."

I can't complain.


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## chefluigi (Mar 15, 2011)

I have a Grovana with the green bezel and,Love it, just sold my Rolex and pocketed a few thousand dollars, I,m wearing my Breitling diamond bezel chrono for dress and timing parking meters in downtown Philadelphia,I also have a Accutron Vx-200 Chronograph that was far better quality than the Rollie, In todays market Rolex no longer has a quantum leap in quality or inovation; lots of other watches are as nice if not better. I think all high end watches are worth about one thousand dollars unless theres gold or diamonds. The rest is in the name. I 'm finding the nicer the watch is every-day joes don't even know what they are so your not impressing anyone. all they know is Rolex. All of my lawyers are wearing Cartier pasha's or tanks,all of my doctors are wearing Seiko's. My advice is trust in your Breitling with diamonds; the valjoux7750 is better than the Rolex Daytona and has the date is 5 grand cheaper and with the 18 krt accents and diamonds I never get Blinged down by any piece thanks for having my opinion , ps theres so many fake rolex's, one more thing ,the only thing worst than getting you arm ripped off by a shark is getting the arm with the rollie riped off.


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## chefluigi (Mar 15, 2011)

I love my grovana coral reef, sold my Rolex,it's too expensive to dive with ,and i wear My Breitling chrono for dress, thier saying it's a copy of the Rolex ; thats crap all watches are round more or less and for diving you need a bezel. Theres really only so many ways you can go with design. most of the rolexes you see are fake anyway. you might as well say all cars are a copy of the model T, so what. As far as real quality goes Omega speedmaster was the only watch that survived astronaut testing and went to the moon, Omega missed the boat ,they should have slaped a diving bezel on it and made it waterproof to 1000 feet and added a saphire glass and reserved the plastic crystal for people who were actually going into space. but back to the Grovana ,this summer i'm going to start my own test. ( the South Philly test) wear i take the coral reef diving, fishing ,fighting in seashore bars,and motorcycling, i think that will be more grueling than the moon test, I'll let you know how it does


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