# I asked Longines about an In House Movement and COSC watches. Here is the response I got.



## european.aristocrat

I asked Longines if they have any COSC watches, and I asked them if they plan to have a 100% in house movement. She didnt say yes or no to the in-house movements. I hope that it is in the works.


Thank you for your e-mail as well as for your interest in Longines watches.
Your comments on Longines in-house movements have been duly noted. As you know, Longines is a Company of The Swatch Group and all our watch movements are developed in co-operation with ETA which is also a Company of The Swatch Group.
In reply to your question regarding chronometers = COSC certified watch movements, we have to inform you that we do not carry them anymore as the calibers available in the models of our current product lines are very accurate and meet the requirements of a COSC certified movement.
Take a look at our website under Watches > Technical Information > Mechanical- and Quartz Movements - you can find the technical features of the movements used in our current product lines.
Hope this information is convenient to you, we remain on your disposal and send you our best regards,
Béatrice Donzé
E-Communication Assistant

Compagnie des Montres Longines Francillon SA 
CH-2610 Saint-Imier, Switzerland 
Phone +41 32 942 52 33 - Fax +41 32 942 52 39


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## BaCaitlin

*Re: I asked Longines about an In House Movement and COSC watches. Here is the response I g*

Good thorough response. I'm sent Omega a question last Saturday and am still waiting for a response :-(


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## Zarith

*Re: I asked Longines about an In House Movement and COSC watches. Here is the response I g*

I don't think they will answer any of your request positively.

COSC is just a label. It's expensive and Longines doesn't need it. They have already all the infrastructures to adjust correctly the movement. Since they have a direct link with ETA they can offer the best possible calibration.

An in-house movement wouldn't make much sense. The whole point of the Swatch Group is to centralize the pole of productions, independently of the separate brands. ETA makes the movements, Comadur the crystals, MOM and Rubattel focus on dial manufacturing, Universo provides the hands, and so on. In total the Swatch Group has 156 production centers, in charge of producing watches for 20 different brands. Making a movement exclusively for Longines would be too expensive and not worth it. Longines is not a luxury brand. Its target customers are not interested in paying a fortune just to get an exclusive limited edition movement.


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## brrrdn

*Re: I asked Longines about an In House Movement and COSC watches. Here is the response I g*

no need for an in house movement. wasn't the ETA movement in the quadruple retrograde watch made exclusively for longines? consider that in house :-d


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## european.aristocrat

*Re: I asked Longines about an In House Movement and COSC watches. Here is the response I g*



brrrdn said:


> no need for an in house movement. wasn't the ETA movement in the quadruple retrograde watch made exclusively for longines? consider that in house :-d


very good point. if the movement was for them only, then it technically is in-house.

to make it in house, the only difference would be to move the machines from ETA to Longines. the same people would be doing it.

i asked them out of curiosity simply because that has been a trend of manufacturers trying to impress the public.

i agree from a business point it does not make sense.


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## tbear1

*Re: I asked Longines about an In House Movement and COSC watches. Here is the response I g*



brrrdn said:


> no need for an in house movement. wasn't the ETA movement in the quadruple retrograde watch made exclusively for longines? consider that in house :-d


That is a very nice watch. I really like what Longines is offering.


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## Watch986

*Re: I asked Longines about an In House Movement and COSC watches. Here is the response I g*

One of my ALL TIME favorite watches. That is killer!


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## Redrum

*Re: I asked Longines about an In House Movement and COSC watches. Here is the response I g*

I can only say that the people at Longines are very, very helpful, and very clear and concise with their answers.
A couple of months ago i was wondering what grade of ETA2824 they used on their HydroConquest models and the reply was swift and concise:
"Elaboreé grade".
No secrets here.

Take care

RR


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## european.aristocrat

*Re: I asked Longines about an In House Movement and COSC watches. Here is the response I g*



Redrum said:


> I can only say that the people at Longines are very, very helpful, and very clear and concise with their answers.
> A couple of months ago i was wondering what grade of ETA2824 they used on their HydroConquest models and the reply was swift and concise:
> "Elaboreé grade".
> No secrets here.
> 
> Take care
> 
> RR


they answered my questions so much faster than omega.


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## Trel

*Re: I asked Longines about an In House Movement and COSC watches. Here is the response I g*

COSC is just a marketing thing.

Back when mechanical chronometers were an integral part of navigation (a chronometer still is, true, but GPS makes things a lot easier) and your average mechanical could hardly be expected to be accurate to four seconds per hour, let alone four seconds per day, then the COSC certification meant something.

Nowadays, any halfway decent mechanical can be regulated to two seconds per day. (Of all the the watches I own, none of them are COSC, and all of them are accurate to COSC spec.)


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## publandlord

*Re: I asked Longines about an In House Movement and COSC watches. Here is the response I g*



Trel said:


> Nowadays, any halfway decent mechanical can be regulated to two seconds per day.


True, but that's not what COSC specifies.


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## cuthbert

*Re: I asked Longines about an In House Movement and COSC watches. Here is the response I g*

Longines has a long history of in house movements, actually it's the brend that developed more movements ever...I've seen the list on another board and it's impressive, therefoer I must say that it's something that today I miss in Longines.

Also, Longiens WAS a luxury brand, more thna Omega and Rolex, unfortunately now it's a part of Swatch, and in a large corporation priorities are given to different brands in order not to have fraticidal competition.

Personally I would have liked that Longines belonged to another group in order to allow to return to its glorious past, it's not going to work like that, I know, but still it's a little disappointing for me.

COSC is not important: my speedmaster runs within these parametersm as well as half of my russian 3133, but the story of the caliber bothers me and I would like that ETA developed some movements just for this brand like for instance a flyback chrono.


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## european.aristocrat

*Re: I asked Longines about an In House Movement and COSC watches. Here is the response I g*



cuthbert said:


> Longines has a long history of in house movements, actually it's the brend that developed more movements ever...I've seen the list on another board and it's impressive, therefoer I must say that it's something that today I miss in Longines.
> 
> Also, Longiens WAS a luxury brand, more thna Omega and Rolex, unfortunately now it's a part of Swatch, and in a large corporation priorities are given to different brands in order not to have fraticidal competition.
> 
> Personally I would have liked that Longines belonged to another group in order to allow to return to its glorious past, it's not going to work like that, I know, but still it's a little disappointing for me.
> 
> COSC is not important: my speedmaster runs within these parametersm as well as half of my russian 3133, but the story of the caliber bothers me and I would like that ETA developed some movements just for this brand like for instance a flyback chrono.


that would be nice to see some developments of further exclusive movements.
do you think that Longines would florish better under Richemont? i think they may have pushed it a little higher, or given it more freedom than Swayek.


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## CLEANS-HIGH

*Re: I asked Longines about an In House Movement and COSC watches. Here is the response I g*

I find that the watches under the swatch group to be good quality watches and Hamilton for example produces some top quality watches for the price and Longines seems to do the same and it does not make sense to have inhouse movements for Longines when the eta company is right at their disposal


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## european.aristocrat

*Re: I asked Longines about an In House Movement and COSC watches. Here is the response I g*



CLEANS-HIGH said:


> I find that the watches under the swatch group to be good quality watches and Hamilton for example produces some top quality watches for the price and Longines seems to do the same and it does not make sense to have inhouse movements for Longines when the eta company is right at their disposal


from a business standpoint you are right. eta streamlines it for swatch. i think a compromise may be more, Longines only movements from eta.


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## cuthbert

*Re: I asked Longines about an In House Movement and COSC watches. Here is the response I g*



european.aristocrat said:


> that would be nice to see some developments of further exclusive movements.
> do you think that Longines would florish better under Richemont? i think they may have pushed it a little higher, or given it more freedom than Swayek.


This can't se said for sure, the problem that I see, my austro-hungarian friend, is that Swatch is becoming too big, and with too many brands. It's inevitable that they need to sacrifice some of them in order not to have competition from within, that's totally understable from their point of view.

It's the same problme that I see for the movements, now almost all belong to Swatch: ETA, Valjoux, Lemania...basically they cretead a monopoly nad there's less choice for the customer:not long time ago you could choose a Lemania 5100, or a Valjoux 7750, or an ETA 2984, all valid movements, now not anymore.


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## cuthbert

*Re: I asked Longines about an In House Movement and COSC watches. Here is the response I g*



CLEANS-HIGH said:


> I find that the watches under the swatch group to be good quality watches and Hamilton for example produces some top quality watches for the price and Longines seems to do the same and it does not make sense to have inhouse movements for Longines when the eta company is right at their disposal


I'm not disputing the quality of the products of Swatch, the problem that I see is that it's difficult to differentiate between their offers, and the imagine of the brand is suffering: basically Swatch is like General Motors, with many cars that are different in brand only, and in the end these brands are not brands anymore but badges to put on the boot of a car.

In Fiatgroup the situation is different: all the engines are produced by FIAT powertrain, but they keep some technology for Alfa Romeo, and other for Lancia, in order to retain a certain differentation of the product, that is not obviously the same that the two brands enjoyed when they were separate enterprises with different technical solutions.

It's just a matter of what Swatch want to be from an industrial point of view.


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## Conchita Turtle

*Re: I asked Longines about an In House Movement and COSC watches. Here is the response I g*



cuthbert said:


> This can't se said for sure, the problem that I see, my austro-hungarian friend, is that Swatch is becoming too big, and with too many brands. It's inevitable that they need to sacrifice some of them in order not to have competition from within, that's totally understable from their point of view.
> 
> It's the same problme that I see for the movements, now almost all belong to Swatch: ETA, Valjoux, Lemania...basically they cretead a monopoly nad there's less choice for the customer:not long time ago you could choose a Lemania 5100, or a Valjoux 7750, or an ETA 2984, all valid movements, now not anymore.


In the Omega prize range, Richemont has JLC, PAM, IWC and Cartier, without cannibalizing each other. Why not 2 Swatch brands, offering Longines more classic watches than Omega?


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## autowatch

*Re: I asked Longines about an In House Movement and COSC watches. Here is the response I g*

Could we consider "in house" movement one which has been produced by ETA, is "top" caliber and modified by Longines? What is the "house" here? Is it Swatch or Longines? Now, if it is Swatch then ETA is part of the "house", so it is ''in house"... Well, I don't know this. What I know is, that I got my Longines Spirit auto 3 days ago which is equipped with L619 (modified ETA 2892-2) and it is giving me +1spd, tested in 3 positions. Remember, this watch has serial# around 33 mil, i.e. that is probably 3 years old, and it was not used before I bought it. I don't know do we need COSC here...


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## anirudhkitt

*Re: I asked Longines about an In House Movement and COSC watches. Here is the response I g*



cuthbert said:


> I'm not disputing the quality of the products of Swatch, the problem that I see is that it's difficult to differentiate between their offers, and the imagine of the brand is suffering: basically Swatch is like General Motors, with many cars that are different in brand only, and in the end these brands are not brands anymore but badges to put on the boot of a car.
> 
> In Fiatgroup the situation is different: all the engines are produced by FIAT powertrain, but they keep some technology for Alfa Romeo, and other for Lancia, in order to retain a certain differentation of the product, that is not obviously the same that the two brands enjoyed when they were separate enterprises with different technical solutions.
> 
> It's just a matter of what Swatch want to be from an industrial point of view.


Old thread but could not help but give this post a |>|>|> . Perfect analogy!!!
But i seriously think that under richemont group brands have more freedom.
i dont know if it is fair to compare this but under them panerai have developed their own caliber. (i am not a fan but just saying).

On the other hand longines (which i believe is a much more capable company) with a great horological tradition is reserved to be modifying ebauches from eta and reserved to being placed below OMEGA though i am sure that they are capable of much more.


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## cuthbert

*Re: I asked Longines about an In House Movement and COSC watches. Here is the response I g*



Conchita Turtle said:


> In the Omega prize range, Richemont has JLC, PAM, IWC and Cartier, without cannibalizing each other. Why not 2 Swatch brands, offering Longines more classic watches than Omega?


That's a different strategy: Cartier for me is not a real watchmaker, but a luxury brand that also sells (not produce) watches, IWC and JLC are niche brands, nothing as popular as Rolex, Longines at its golden age and Omega, evidently the Richemont marketing strategists thought that in their market there's enough room for all of them... Omega and Longines are brands that always made big numbers, and I think they would kill each other.

Of course, it would be better to have more groups, not just a luxury one (Richemont) and a true watch compnay like Swatch, but alas it's called "consolidation of the swiss watch industry".


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## cuthbert

*Re: I asked Longines about an In House Movement and COSC watches. Here is the response I g*



autowatch said:


> Could we consider "in house" movement one which has been produced by ETA, is "top" caliber and modified by Longines? What is the "house" here? Is it Swatch or Longines? Now, if it is Swatch then ETA is part of the "house", so it is ''in house"... Well, I don't know this. What I know is, that I got my Longines Spirit auto 3 days ago which is equipped with L619 (modified ETA 2892-2) and it is giving me +1spd, tested in 3 positions. Remember, this watch has serial# around 33 mil, i.e. that is probably 3 years old, and it was not used before I bought it. I don't know do we need COSC here...


Well I don't think that Longines modifies the calibers, I think that ETA already supply them with all the decorations that transforms the generic 2892-2 into the L619....and there's nothing wrong with that IMO!

I recently received my vintage Longines military chrono, an interesting piece, and I found out that even in the 70s the brand purchased the calibers from other companies (in this case Valjoux) and they didn't even modify them...my 7750 is plain, not Longines logo on the rotor, no special marks etc...I even suppose that they bought the watches from Heuer and sold them under the Longines brand because they didn't have a watch with these specifications in catalogue....you can see it here:

https://www.watchuseek.com/showthread.php?t=366781

Ironically, my second choice was a Spirit, a beautiful and underrated watch, surely for me ETA is not the Evil Empire and Hayek is not the Prince of Darkness, the only thing that I would like is to see more attention for the brand and hope that they can receive particular calibers that make them different from the competitors.


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## Vlciudoli

My LLD runs at -2 per day, even better if I place it crown down at night.

Who needs COSC?


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## AngusBC3

Depends which way you look at this, Swatch manufacture all their own movements, doesn't that count as in house for each brand?
It doesn't matter to me if its in house, but the quality of movement does matter.
I purchased this Hydro Conquest Automatic in February and the time keeping is excellent, set it against my iPhone and it lost 23 seconds in 3 months from 1st April to 1st July.
i contacted Longines to ask the date of manufacture, they replied the next day saying 26th November 2016. Impressive customer interaction.


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## heb

I think their column wheel chronograph movement is also exclusive to the brand.

heb


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## closeset

*Re: I asked Longines about an In House Movement and COSC watches. Here is the response I g*

I also love this one. Good point.



brrrdn said:


> no need for an in house movement. wasn't the ETA movement in the quadruple retrograde watch made exclusively for longines? consider that in house :-d


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## VicLeChic

Longines had an in-house movement L 878.4 in their pocket watch 180th anniversary two years ago. Other than that I'm not aware of any other movement not coming from ETA.


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