# The Joy of Collecting Vintage Enicar Watches



## crazyfist

I've joined Watchuseek for a while now, but I seldom wrote meaningful stuff. Today, I decided I want to share my passion for Enicar watches and its impact on the Chinese culture, as well as a look inside the classic AR160 movement. Enicar is a brand not discussed often on these forums, but hopefully, I will spark your interest too in this little gem of horology history.









At the height of Enicar watches' success, I was yet to be born. Four years after I was born, in 1988, Enicar watch was sold to a Hong Kong company, although watches were still to be ensemble in Switzerland, the little magic that once existed was no more, and what are left of it are the nostalgic name and the ever familiar logo.

Enicar watch never made it to the moon, or to the deep seas. But in the late 60's, 70's and the early 80's, they did dominate the Chinese watch market. Enicar was imported as a Tier 4 brand, which meant it was a less expensive alternative for the Chinese to own a Swiss Made watch. In the Tier 3 were brands like Roamer and Titoni. And it was these three brands that made up the largest import watches in China, with Enicar alone importing two-hundred-thousand watches per year!

At the time, an Enicar watch costs 185 RMB (roughly $30), which is 30% more than the average Chinese monthly salary. (A Chinese domestic brand such as Shanghai and Shuangling cost half as much). It was said there were three items to own in order for a man to be eligible for marriage: a bicycle, a sewing machine, and a watch. Enicar's owner Mr. Racine (Enicar spelt backwards) is a good friend of the Chinese government and a jolly good man with a big nose. And while the Chinese government pressured him into lowering the price, he would get angry and refused to do so because it upheld the quality of his products.

AR161:








Like many of its peers at the time, Enicar was a bona-fide movement manufacture. Some of their well-known movements were AR140 - hand winding, AR160 - an improved, higher-beat version of the AR 140, AR161 -with date, AR 165 - automatic (later became the one of the base engine for Chronoswiss watches), and AR 167 - auto with day-date.

The AR160 is perhaps the most popular movement for Enicar. It encompasses all the top grade parts: top grade Nivaflex mainspring, top grade Nivarox balance spring, and top grade Incabloc shock protection system. The balance spring is made of berrylium alloy, polished steel on escapement wheel and fork. And to top it off, the movement itself is truly beautifully, the main plates are plated in gold and the bridge is decorated with mesmerizing stripes. My watchmaker once told me that the Enicar AR160 had the least failure rate during their heydays. And whenever he serviced them, he marveled at the workmanship.

AR160 Movement








AR160 beats at 21600 vph, an improvement from the 18000 vph of AR140. The movement is 26.2mm in diameter, which makes it one of the larger movements at the time, and resulted larger watch cases - typically 38mm.

















There are two so called patents for the AR160. One is Star Jewels, and the other is called Oil-Stop. The former uses a jewel as a stud for the minute wheel. As far as watchmakers can tell, it offers no specialty whatsoever; and became known as merely a marketing gimmick. The later applies a type of stearic acid to places where oil is unwanted in the movement. But it would take a certified Enicar watchmaker to know not to touch these places when servicing a watch, and reapply stearic acid when necessary. Otherwise, the Oil-Stop is a defunct feature in most of the vintage Enicar watches today.

Roamer, Titoni, Enicar, and Certina








It was said that the case finish and dial design is what made Enicar fell into the Tier 4 category rather than Tier 3. Personally, I would say that Roamer and Titoni are only slightly better. And I enjoy the larger case size, and the engraved shark on the case back. The dial design at first glance is pretty much the same as every other watch on the Chinese market at the time, but after a closer look, you would see that the lume design is a hidden surprise.

AR160 Caseback








Dial:








I am too young to pretend that I collect Enicar for the nostalgia. But my father and the people in his age around me are not. And it brings a smile to my face whenever my Enicar, the most popular watch from the heydays gets recognized. And I love the conversations that it brings out, people taking about the life back in the day, how they saved up for a Swiss watch, and what a watch was meant to them. And for those of us who weren't around in the 60's and the 70's, aren't these kind of conversations part of the reason we like collect vintage time pieces?









And let's show your Enicars if you have 'em!


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## vbomega

I don't really collect vintage watches, but I enjoy servicing vintage movements. I came across Enicar (Ocean Pearl, Star Jewels, 24 Jewels, cal 1145 if I remember correctly), and it was really well made. Finish and movement quality was impeccable.


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## bubba48

My two Enicar


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## Seele

I have only one Enicar which was my grandfather's, not too old as he bought it in the 1970s to replace a Tissot that he lost.

An interesting thing is that Enicar is still going even though the company caved in and the assets were bought to form Chronoswiss. It makes me wonder who's actually making the current ones.


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## crazyfist

Seele said:


> I have only one Enicar which was my grandfather's, not too old as he bought it in the 1970s to replace a Tissot that he lost.
> 
> An interesting thing is that Enicar is still going even though the company caved in and the assets were bought to form Chronoswiss. It makes me wonder who's actually making the current ones.


Actually, only the stock movements were sold to Gered-Rudiger Lang, who later founded Chronoswiss. The brand name and its trade mark was sold to a Hong Kong invester name Mr. Wah, CEO of Wah Ming-Hong Ltd. Watches bearing Enicar name and logo today is still operated by the Wah's family.

Presently, Enicar, along with Titoni and Roamer, are only focused in Asia market, and are still widely popular. To the old Chinese folks, these brands were the high-quality swiss watch brands that people once desired, and continues to be desired.


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## joeuk

Great info on this company,do you do your own work on these watches? if so always great to have people having a go.


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## crazyfist

I would clean the case and the dial, polish the crystal, regulate and adjust, but for full servicing, I leave it to my watchmaker here:

https://www.watchuseek.com/f2/my-watchmaker-inspiration-622318.html


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## Seele

Crazyfist,

I also understand that Roamer watches were highly prized objects of desire in mainland China for many decades, so much so the movements were replicated in Nanjing; this old thread shows some details.


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## joeuk

Wow what a guy your watchmaker is


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## crazyfist

Seele said:


> Crazyfist,
> 
> I also understand that Roamer watches were highly prized objects of desire in mainland China for many decades, so much so the movements were replicated in Nanjing; this old thread shows some details.


Wow that thread has a lot of information...

But yes, and Roamer is actually still making new ETA based watches, and I've only seen it in mainland China. It'd be a sure guess that they are also sold to a HK company. 
What's interesting is that even in the vintage market in China, sellers are still going by the price according to the old classification system, a tier 3 like Roamer would cost more than a tier 4 Enicar or Certina. I guess after all these years, some things don't change.


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## Seele

Oddly enough, at the collectors fairs here in Sydney I often find vintage Roamers, and a watch dealer in my neighbourhood is also a Roamer dealer selling the current models. There again, Australia is a strange market, for instance, nobody has ever heard of Titoni, but we're all up to our armpits in vintage Felcas.


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## vintageguy

as I recall, the Enicar Sherpa were worn by a team to the top of Mt Everest.


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## John MS

Thank you for posting such an informative and enjoyable story of Enicar and how popular the brand was in China. I enjoy an Enicar Sherpa Guide from the late 1960's that is now on a perforated Rios black leather strap.


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## TheJohnP

Still need to take this guy to my watch guy for a proper cleaning, but here's an Enicar tank dress watch with original box I picked up awhile ago that says hello.


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## Mirius

crazyfist said:


> Roamer is actually still making new ETA based watches, and I've only seen it in mainland China. It'd be a sure guess that they are also sold to a HK company.


To quote Kris



> 1994Roamer purchased by the Hong Kong based Chung Nam Company.




Though I have a vague memory that this has since changed - modern Roamers aren't really my specialist area.


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## JohnF

Thanks for this thread.  

There is a downside to Enicar: parts. I have a Sherpa Guide and a Sherpa OPS languishing for parts and need a NOS 166 movement for the Guide. Since Chronoswiss bought the stock, these are even rarer than replacement crystals that actually fit.  Search the forum for my tales of woe..

Of course, this is true for any vintage watch, but the fact that the stocks have disappeared from the market really doesn't help here. 

But I like the Sherpas too much to give up. Every once in a while something turns up. I recently found NOS hands for the 160 family that will go on the Guide, whose hands are missing the plume. The 166 inside the Guide is simply worn out (multiple problems with pinions slipping, etc). The OPS case is a disaster, with the internal bezel gearing frozen and then a tooth breaking from a previous owner forcing it.

Someday, though, they will be restored to their former glory.


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## crazyfist

TheJohnP said:


> Still need to take this guy to my watch guy for a proper cleaning, but here's an Enicar tank dress watch with original box I picked up awhile ago that says hello.
> 
> View attachment 774706


Such an elegant watch! This reminds me that out of all the watches I own, I have yet to own a tank shaped watch!

Also I have an inquiry: to me, this movement looks like an ETA, it resembles a 2750 yet it has date and the release lever for the crown appears to beheld by a screw. What's the movement model on this?


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## crazyfist

For the movement parts? Have you tried to contact Chronoswiss?

I've always wondered just how many stock movements did Chronoswiss actually purchase. The purchase was made after the quartz crisis, when Enicar's main production line was probably filled with quartz movements. Just how many AR165 and variants could be left over?


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## crazyfist

I've had numerous attempts to capture a lume shot, but failed miserably. So I just drew on the dial picture to give you an idea. Those lucky enough to own a Sherpa care to give it a shot? 








The lines are just there for reference. Only the dots light up.


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## DragonDan

Crazyfist, thank you for the photos of your watchmaker and of the love for Enicar! You might know there is a connection between these folks and my vintage watch of choice, Gallet. Of course, not many have heard of Gallet, but one of their cousins was Jules Racine based in New York in the late 30's. He was the only US importer of Gallet for many years. It was another Racine cousin that became interested in the watch business but for unknown reasons, split entirely with the Gallet connection and formed Enicar, which is Racine backwards.

That is the information as I know it. I've seen variations on that story as well. Obviously, you have put a lot more research in this than I have, I would enjoy hearing your take on that, if you know anything regarding it.









I like several of the Enicar designs, most of all the Sherpa as shown by John MS above. I've spent some time in Beijing, and have seen watchmakers work in tiny corners or doorways, but never with one's feet! Such marvelous determination!

~Daniel


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## village

A most enjoyable and informative thread...many thanks for posting. I've had the odd Enicar here and there but i don't own any at the moment.


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## crazyfist

DragonDan said:


> Crazyfist, thank you for the photos of your watchmaker and of the love for Enicar! You might know there is a connection between these folks and my vintage watch of choice, Gallet. Of course, not many have heard of Gallet, but one of their cousins was Jules Racine based in New York in the late 30's. He was the only US importer of Gallet for many years. It was another Racine cousin that became interested in the watch business but for unknown reasons, split entirely with the Gallet connection and formed Enicar, which is Racine backwards.
> 
> That is the information as I know it. I've seen variations on that story as well. Obviously, you have put a lot more research in this than I have, I would enjoy hearing your take on that, if you know anything regarding it.


Very interesting information. I did not know much about Gallet watches, but I did some research and this is what I found between the families.

The name Racine comes from an old Swiss family in the 1600s. It was believed that Jules Racine comes from the line that immigrated to the now days Quebec. I guess Jules and Ariste Racine were distant cousins. And Jules Racine is a cousin of the Gallets.

Apparently, Jules Racine was also Enicar's main distributor in the US, although Enicar was not very popular in the US, I think that was because Jules focused more on his own name brand, which housed Gallet movements.


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## TheJohnP

I wish I could tell you, but this post inspired me to take the watch in for a cleaning/servicing.
When it gets back from my watch guy, I'll open it up and let you know!


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## hns-panama

Wow. A great thread with the link to your watchmaker as an added bonus. Just when you begin to lament something in your life, reviewing those photos should be a priority!

I have a number of Enicars as well. The favorite is the Super Compressor Seapearl shown below.

There is a German watch forum with a long, long thread about them. Wonderful information but you need Google translate built in to your browser if you don't read German:

Sammelthread Enicar Uhren - UhrForum

This would be a great thing to do here.

The SC Seapearl with an Ar1124 Supertest automatic movement:
















I have read this was Enicar's first chronometer grade automatic movement. It was never certified though.


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## o.v.e

crazyfist, reading this thread was a real pleasure. When it comes to "China" and "watches" the first that jumps to our biased minds here in Europe are the numerous fakes flooding the market. It is good to learn about the passion and care for these old beauties! Enicar is among my favorite brands! A few weeks ago I bought this one:








It is a Sherpa Guide, from the mid sixties (AR 1146, the 11nn movements were predecessor of the 16n series). The watch is from Mexico, and a sparepart flew in from Australia - if You look closely You can see a missing tooth on this "24 hour minute wheel" (right hand, tooth rim):








I will pick up the watch at my watchmaker tomorrow (hopefully), and it will join these three:

























You can notice the difference on the lume-dots between the Jet and the Super Divette models. Unfortunately, they don't really glow long enough anymore to make meaningfull pictures. The Divette is like in Your sketch, the Jet's however do rather form a "cross". This Jet is one of the most beautifull watches I own, and I would not trade it for any price.


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## parrotandpitbull

I like Enicar alot. I have one an Enicar sport, pictured below. I have been looking for a black dialed one that was not an Indian re Dial for some time. Or A Harpoon model, which seem to have differing dials. Ive only seen two Harpoons in the time Ive been looking on ebay, and they went above my budget. I love the sherpa 33 pictured immediately above and have never seen one before. Why does Crazyfist refer to it as a "jet"? I also just noticed he is in China, a prime place to find an Enicar, which hasnt been messed with. Well just my two cents and hopefully a pic. P&P.


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## o.v.e

The "Sherpa Jet" is the one in the middle. However: The Sherpa date 33 is one of the most beautifull watches I own, and I would not trade it for any price.


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## crazyfist

hns-panama said:


> There is a German watch forum with a long, long thread about them. Wonderful information but you need Google translate built in to your browser if you don't read German:
> 
> Sammelthread Enicar Uhren - UhrForum


Beautiful Enicar, and thanks for the link! I have faith that this thread will also grow with many pretty Enicar pictures.


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## crazyfist

o.v.e, I cannot agree more that that is one hell of a dress watch. Such elegance with much subtlety, it reminds me of Glashutte Original's Senator Sixties model, definitely hold on and take good care of that one.


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## version4.666

Fantastic thread, good references and photographs..

A prowd owner of Ocean pearl here.


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## Stigmata

ive posted pics up of mine in the past.. and ill put some more up.
Great inhouse movement watchmaker in its day....and great value for money.
Some are very collectible too.
I have around ten.


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## hns-panama

Indeed. There is majesty in simplicity. I do like the Sherpa Jet. It is one on my short list.


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## hns-panama

This one is coming back from the spa shortly. Cleaning, service, etc. $85. Panama labor rates are a lot lower...

It's a Seapearl Super A with an AR1290 Supertest movement. I like the contrast between the case and dial. Perfect amount of patina for the dial.


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## crazyfist

Group shot of my Ocean Pearls, left to right: Cal. AR140, AR160, and a very interesting AR161 movement.

















AR140 does not have the strips as the AR16X manual wind series. I also have an AR160 from 1975, that was one of the first AR160s to be introduced in China, which also does not have the stripes. The watch is in service (will post pics soon).









AR161:








To be more politically correct, the movement above is AR 2161, this is NOT an Enicar in-house movement. Apparently, in order to meet demands, Enicar purchased this movement from another Swiss house, therefore the bridge looks different from the AR1161. Also, note that it does not say "Star Jewels" on the dial. But Enicar did decorate the movement beautifully. One of the biggest reasons I like the Ocean Pearls is for their gold movements.


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## crazyfist

Stigmata said:


> I have around ten.


You must make us drool over them! please post pics here!


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## georges zaslavsky

Thanks for sharing


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## gtopaul

I like them too!


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## hns-panama

Back from the spa. Star Jewels automatic with a cal. 1145 movement. New Hadley Roma strap, crystal, and a hand polish of the case. I was going to sell it but now, perhaps not..


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## hns-panama

Here is a late fifties cal. AR1290 (13L) manual wind Supertest. So far, its time keeping is remarkable for such an old watch. My spa told me it only needed cleaning and lubrication. The case is worn a bit more than I like but the dial is pristine. I had the crystal polished and now I need to find a rose gold crown for it along with a better strap. The courtesy strap is just for testing on my wrist for a few days.

It is roughly 35mm in width without the crown so it is a decent size. It is also the largest caliber movement I own.

Case is a first gen. compressor. Note the little tab at the six o'clock position of the case. Turn the case back a little and it pops up. Not a screw or bayonet mount.


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## dgf67

Just picked this up and thought i'd share. it needs repair but i had to buy it when all they wanted was 5 dollars


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## hns-panama

cal. 1145?


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## Taswell

I particularly like these because of their role in the early evolution of dive watches. 
In 1958 when US Navy was testing watches for issue to their divers.
The watches they tested were:
Bulova prototype diver
Blancpain Fifty Fathoms
Rolex Oyster
Enicar Sherpa Diver 600
Enicar Seapearl 600

Any of the first three would cost well over $10000 if you can find an example from that era.

The Enicar watches are somewhat more affordable.
Some of my Enicars ...
These are from 1955-6, well before the US Navy went shopping for theirs.


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## hns-panama

FYI:

ENICAR 600 SHERPA OPS DIVERS CASE ONLY | eBay

Perhaps a few parts...



JohnF said:


> Thanks for this thread.
> 
> There is a downside to Enicar: parts. I have a Sherpa Guide and a Sherpa OPS languishing for parts and need a NOS 166 movement for the Guide. Since Chronoswiss bought the stock, these are even rarer than replacement crystals that actually fit.  Search the forum for my tales of woe..
> 
> Of course, this is true for any vintage watch, but the fact that the stocks have disappeared from the market really doesn't help here.
> 
> But I like the Sherpas too much to give up. Every once in a while something turns up. I recently found NOS hands for the 160 family that will go on the Guide, whose hands are missing the plume. The 166 inside the Guide is simply worn out (multiple problems with pinions slipping, etc). The OPS case is a disaster, with the internal bezel gearing frozen and then a tooth breaking from a previous owner forcing it.
> 
> Someday, though, they will be restored to their former glory.


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## hns-panama

Another good thread from another forum, this time on Sherpa's:

Enicar Sherpa Guide, Sherpa Jet et Graph Jet : les 24H/GMT


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## crazyfist

The caseback at the bottom marks 144, which means Cal. 1144, however it has a date, I imagine it's 145 with minor variation.


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## crazyfist

I now crave for a Sherpa. However they are really hard to come by in China. Where are you guys getting yours from?

One of my favorite Enicar article is this: 
The 70's Watch: The Enicar Sherpa Super Dive and the Chronoswiss Regulateur - Part 3 - TimeZone

It compares the Chronoswiss Cal 16X with the Enicar 16X.


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## hns-panama

crazyfist said:


> The caseback at the bottom marks 144, which means Cal. 1144, however it has a date, I imagine it's 145 with minor variation.


Most likely a 1145. The case number doesn't always reflect the caliber. I have a 144 case back and it has a 1145 in it.


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## hns-panama

Sherpas can occasionally be had on the sales forum. I bought a Divette off an eBay seller who obviously did not know what it they were looking at. Of course, the watch appeared to be a disaster so who could blame them? I bought it for the case and crown mainly. The Enicar cross hatch design. Hey, for $11.50 it was worth a shot.

See photos below to understand how far gone this watch was. I think it was in a fire. The movement shows some water damage but surprisingly, it weathered that fairly well. It is off to the watchmaker so they can try to remove the dial. The twodial feet screws are rusted...

Assuming I find the bezel parts, and that's a big assumption, the dial will need a total restoration -- $175 -- done the correct way with a new die. The dial markers cleaned up perfectly.

I will need a few odd parts for the movement though I have the same 1145 movement in another watch I could use in a pinch.

The outer case was in good shape with some wear marks you would expect on a 50 year old watch. I didn't over polish it though. Just enough to bring back the shine and get rid of some minor scratches. The bezel area had some damage with someone using a tool of some sort to pry open what they thought could pried open. It will need some professional attention but as this one is a keeper for me, I am not too worried about it. It won't be visible when I wear it.

The hands were in rough shape. I took them off the movement, and cut a small bit off of a Cape Cod Cloth. Wrapped the little piece around a toothpick and very gently cleaned the hands. Then, I used a cotton swab to finish the polishing process. (I first swiped the swab around the Cape Cod packaging to get some of the chemical cleaner on the it.) I used the dry end to buff the hands to a reasonable shine. Ready for reluming.

So, that's yet another barn find and contributes to the joys of owning Enicars 



crazyfist said:


> I now crave for a Sherpa. However they are really hard to come by in China. Where are you guys getting yours from?
> 
> One of my favorite Enicar article is this:
> The 70's Watch: The Enicar Sherpa Super Dive and the Chronoswiss Regulateur - Part 3 - TimeZone
> 
> It compares the Chronoswiss Cal 16X with the Enicar 16X.


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## crazyfist

Taswell said:


> Some of my Enicars ...
> These are from 1955-6, well before the US Navy went shopping for theirs.
> View attachment 795489


Found an cool ad for this and some other models as well:

























Notice they were once located in 681 Fifth Avenue, NY!

681 Fifth Avenue


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## Taswell

I've got four now. I've been hanging onto one waiting to find a set of correct hands for it. 
Each one is different but they all have the same wonderful Art Deco dial design.
Healthways was one of the early scuba equipment companies.
They can't have had many customers back in 1955 when they were selling the superbly salty sounding 100 Fathom watch.
Does that make twice as good as a Blancpain Fifty Fathoms??







Also a Sherpa Jet that I put together from a wreck a few months back.


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## crazyfist

Wow those indices, hands and case are really shinny now. Congrats on the find! Can you polish the case yourself? how do you do it?


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## crazyfist

A little love for ladies' Enicar:


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## hns-panama

Hi,

Thanks.

I used a Cape Cod Polishing Cloth. Google it and you'll find it. Very useful for very light polishing/brightening work.

I wanted to preserve the character of the case so I first used a 4000 grit polishing paper to take out some of the lighter scratches. Then I used the Cape Cod cloth to further polish it. I did not use a buffing wheel. All done by hand to reduce the possibility of over polishing.

The hands were a bit less work. Just very, very light polishing as I described. The key to remember is that the Cape Cod cloth is more abrasive than cotton swab. I was more concerned about damaging/bending the hands than getting a perfect finish. They are polished enough to go well with the refinished dial.

As for the dial, I found the screws that tighten the dial feet to the movement were rusted as were some other areas. Given the damage to the dial, I felt a good spray and soaking in WD40 wouldn't do any harm. The indices came out looking great so a redial was looking better and better.

I wrote Robert at International Dial and sent a picture of the dial and one that I found of the original. He said that in order to do it correctly, he would need to do a new die along with refinishing. $175. Most collectors frown on refinished dials but this watch is a keeper so I am not worried about that. Besides, it is so damaged that saving it is a better than throwing it away.

Cheers,

Hunter



crazyfist said:


> Wow those indices, hands and case are really shinny now. Congrats on the find! Can you polish
> the case yourself? how do you do it?


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## Itamaraty

I like the Enicar's a lot!
Here are mine:










Seaperal from 1956.










DDF 250.










Ultrasonic from 1958.










Super Divette that's coming from a total review and dial restoration.










Crystal 7X N.O.S!!!!

My true passion is for the Sherpa's and the Seapearl's with the EPSA case (like mine's).
I think that the Enicar's have a very good cost-benefit rate for a brand with in-house moviments.


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## ddrake

My 1970ish Ocean Pearl.


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## Marrick

Alprosa - an Enicar brand:










Enicar 412 inside:


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## hns-panama

For those of you wondering what the factory looks like today, here's a Streetview shot from Google Earth. Note the planet still on top of the building. It houses Atlantic Watches now:


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## crazyfist

Some recent acquisitions:


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## crazyfist

Continued...

I'm very happy with this acquisition, original band and all,








AR165, of course, can also be found in Chronoswiss' regulator.
























That 70's watch(es):









Great day in Beijing today


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## o.v.e

Nice catch! The almost seamless fit of the band to the watch is striking, Enicar is just good quality!


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## ramsy1971

I found this Enicar in the bottom of my drawer last night. I couldn't get it open. It's marked 2215 on the back. I wasn't able to find much info online for this one.


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## marzen

not realizing this ongoing thread about Enicar, I asked in my own thread above about the service of vintage Enicar. I have one from my dad and I want to service it. I am in US. Where should I take this watch to? Any well known watchmaker? I'd imagine, the movement, crystal and case needs to be serviced and cleaned. Any information would be greatly appreciated!


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## crazyfist

marzen said:


> not realizing this ongoing thread about Enicar, I asked in my own thread above about the service of vintage Enicar. I have one from my dad and I want to service it. I am in US. Where should I take this watch to? Any well known watchmaker? I'd imagine, the movement, crystal and case needs to be serviced and cleaned. Any information would be greatly appreciated!


Congratulations on a 167! In my view, it's really a prestigious movement.I do not live in the US therefore I cannot help you on the servicing question. But my recommendation is always take it to someone local if you can, instead of mailing it.

Also, the case and crystal can easily be cleaned DIY style. That might save you some money from a complete overhaul.

Lastly, I posted this link previously, this article would help you with a some knowledge on your watch's movement:
The 70's Watch: The Enicar Sherpa Super Dive and the Chronoswiss Regulateur - Part 1 - TimeZone


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## lsiravi

Unsure if this is the right thread for this Q. If not, mods, please move to a different forum. 

I have an (Back cover text) Enicar Incabloc Automatic Ocean Pearl handed down from my grand father. It is from at least the 70s, if not older. 

The dial was painted a drab white (chipped and cracked) and said Enicar Ultrasonic 17 Jewels. The paint came off with a touch of nail polish remover. I was able to clean the hands and the inside of the watch when I had it out. 

I was hoping for a good original paint beneath the drab white, but I was disappointed that it was plain untreated metal. The only adornment on the dial is the raised Enicar logo. The dial also has a slight indentation/dent on it. 

How/who (US West Coast) can paint the dial like the original? If not where can I buy a (reasonably priced) new dial that fits this watch? 
Case markings are 144-39-10. It has a date window at the 3'o clock position. 

Many thanks in advance.


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## o.v.e

Not good, Isiravi, You should better have asked first. There is nothing that comes at a "reasonable" price now, if You want to preserve the watch. 

1. The least You should have taken, is a picture before removing the paint. There are various specialists for this, but please expect a good "paintjob" to cost 100 USD plus. 
2. The hands and dial needs to be removed from the movement. Please have that done by an expert watchmaker, You have already ruined enough. ;-)
3. That watchmaker can also take care of properly cleaning the movement. What exactly do You mean, when You write You cleaned "the inside" of the watch with nail polish remover?
4. It might be cheaper to look on ebay for a (broken) Enicar with a similar dial. It must fit to Enicar Movement AR 1144. But only few sellers know what is inside. Try to find one with a reference number starting with 144. Older Enicar Automatics may contain AS movements, and then the dial won't fit. Even if You find one, the diameter might be different. 
5. The watch is rather 60ies then 70ies, as the 1144 was replaced by the 164 in the end of the 60ies.


----------



## lsiravi

o.v.e

I happen to know that the dial paint wasn't original, nor was the lettering the same as the original. I clearly remember my grandfather having it painted by an amateur in India, in the early 90s. The paint was some sort of enamel which had a very significant amount of trapped dust and debris on it. The enamel was also thick enough to cover the raised Enicar logo which I knew was beneath the crud. Hence the (mis)adventure. 
While I agree with your assessment, I do have a small amount of experience handling watches (again, hence the misadventure). 
After my misplaced surgery, the watch itself runs fine. So I believe that while it looks somewhat plain in appearance, it's health is good. 
Finally, agreed - likely the best possibility is a similar dial swap. I guess I will try that when I travel to India next. I happen to know that both dial painting (should one be called for, in case they are unable to find a replacement for me) and watch repairs including complete movement overhauls are comparatively much less expensive there. 

Many thanks for your suggestions
lsiravi


----------



## hns-panama

If you look earlier in the thread, you will see a Sherpa I bought on eBay. Water damage to the dial, etc.

The quote I received from IDC was $175. I would contact Robert there and send him a photo of what you would like your dial to look like. Search on Google images. It will be far better looking than what you will see from India. Though India may have some original watches still untouched by their painting crews.



lsiravi said:


> o.v.e
> 
> I happen to know that the dial paint wasn't original, nor was the lettering the same as the original. I clearly remember my grandfather having it painted by an amateur in India, in the early 90s. The paint was some sort of enamel which had a very significant amount of trapped dust and debris on it. The enamel was also thick enough to cover the raised Enicar logo which I knew was beneath the crud. Hence the (mis)adventure.
> While I agree with your assessment, I do have a small amount of experience handling watches (again, hence the misadventure).
> After my misplaced surgery, the watch itself runs fine. So I believe that while it looks somewhat plain in appearance, it's health is good.
> Finally, agreed - likely the best possibility is a similar dial swap. I guess I will try that when I travel to India next. I happen to know that both dial painting (should one be called for, in case they are unable to find a replacement for me) and watch repairs including complete movement overhauls are comparatively much less expensive there.
> 
> Many thanks for your suggestions
> lsiravi


----------



## lanang

hi guys, i recently have acquired an Enicar from a friend, could you guys please help me to ident it? could you please recommend me where to find a replacement dial which is in good condition?



























as you see here, the logo on the dial has been badly engraved, thank you guys


----------



## Eeeb

I showed JohnF this one last week when he stopped in for a visit...

























































John said he as seen this rotating disk for a subsecond done before... maybe he will see this and say where. I can't remember.


----------



## hns-panama

This exact watch was one reason for my becoming an Enicar fan. Love the creativity of the small dial.



Eeeb said:


> I showed JohnF this one last week when he stopped in for a visit...
> 
> View attachment 818338
> 
> 
> View attachment 818339
> 
> 
> View attachment 818340
> 
> 
> View attachment 818342
> 
> 
> View attachment 818344
> 
> 
> View attachment 818346
> 
> 
> View attachment 818347
> 
> 
> John said he as seen this rotating disk for a subsecond done before... maybe he will see this and say where. I can't remember.


----------



## malus65

This is really a nice thread. I'm also interested in Enicar for ages. Last year I bought two watches from a retired jeweler. One is NOS and the other was used. Every now and then I'm on the lookout for a Sherpa Jet, but it's very hard to find a nice one.
Anyway, here are mine:

The box is not original I guess, it come from the bay but I like it nevertheless

This one has a automatic caliber:


Enicar-2489 by Malus65, on Flickr


Enicar-2517 by Malus65, on Flickr


Enicar-2530 by Malus65, on Flickr

This is a Sherpa 600 D with hand wound caliber, completely NOS:


Enicar-2538 by Malus65, on Flickr


Enicar-2534 by Malus65, on Flickr

Later, I changed the second hand and the strap, it's now on a blue Tropic Sport:


IMG_0545.jpg by Malus65, on Flickr

Thanks for looking


----------



## dogen

My dear friends of enicars,
it's nice to see the interest of the enicar-watches. I have a little collection of sherpas an I would like to show them in the next weeks.
Here a small overview for the beginning :










Thanks for looking.

Cheers dogen


----------



## malus65

WOW! now that is what I call a collection:-!


----------



## Taswell

Very, very nice and they appear to be particularly fine condition too.


----------



## dogen

Let's start a little bit chronological .

The first watch I can show you is a Diver, it was in the evaluation of the US navi. The Lunette is different to the common diver. It's made in a kind of plastic.
Enicar Sherpa Diver 600 from the late 50's:



























© http://www.knirim.de


----------



## crazyfist

Let me be the first to say, welcome to our forum!!!


----------



## dogen

Hello crazyfist

specially for you next watch 

the Sherpa Super Dive. This way was used of the famous Diver Hans Hass, he was one of the real pioneers in the late 50's early 60's. 
The watch is quite big for that period 40mm.




























Cheers dogen


----------



## dogen

Some Watches of the same period of the Enicar Sherpa Super Dive, Omega SM 300m, Aquastar Benthos 500 and RLX 5513:










and the Super Dive with the Enicar Sherpa Graph:


----------



## dogen

Enicar Sherpa Graph from the early 60's with the famous ValJoux 72 and silver sub-dials:




























the Sherpa Graph with oder watches from the same period with VJ 72 (except the Speedmaster).










best dogen

(ps: I'm a collector and a do not sell any watches, so please don't ask  :X )


----------



## dogen

Sherpa Graph wit grey sub-dials:


----------



## dogen

Sherpa Super Dive black and silver version:


----------



## malus65

That is really a exceptional collection what you are showing! Since how long do you collect and where did you find such pieces?


----------



## aholst

hey, so I just purchased my first enicar (thanks to this thread!) off ebay, i'm hoping someone can help me learn more about my watch. I have not been able to find the same watch or movement online, and am not sure what the numbers on the back mean if anything.

the back says incabloc, and the numbers are 112-22-23.

also, i quickly ran into my first problem with the watch. the date came set on 3rd, so i had a lot of adjusting to do to get it on todays date. the crown only comes out one step, so the only way i to adjust the date (as far as i can tell) was to adjust the time forward 19 days. when i was halfway done, the crown screwed off into my hand. i screwed it back on but now when i try to adjust the time forward the crown simply screws back off the stem. there seems to be no way to screw it on tightly enough ( when the stem is pulled out it adjusts the time backwards, and when its pushed in it winds the watch. any thoughts how to fix this?


----------



## o.v.e

The crown of a watch is actually "glued" to the stem, that means some special stuff is applied to the winding of the stem, before the crown is screwed on. Go to a watchmaker, it will take him only few seconds to fix that!
Next, most later watches have a "quick set", You don't actually wind a full 24 h to set the date, but just go back and forth between 10 and 2, try that once it is fixed. I can not tell which movement this is (is there any number under the balance?). But the finish is typical for late Enicars. Looking at the design it could be early 80ies.


----------



## aholst

thanks o.v.e, i'll take it to a shop then try the 10-2 trick. 

i don't see any more numbers


----------



## crazyfist

I thought I'd post a Enicar Movement Reference guide, mostly the data copied from Ranftt.de, so people can identify the watches they have or will purchase.

First a little background on their caliber numbering system:

Enicar used 4 digits system at first, then later dropped the first digit for some movements, the most common of these are: 1140 and 1160, later became 140 and 160. This change in numbering had no impact on the actual movement, but could help you narrow down the date of the watch more accurately.

Although Enicar was a movement _manufacture_, in order to cut down cost and to meet demands in the late 70s and 80s, they did buy movements from other movement manufactures, notably FHF and ETA. (Some pre 70s models were also fitted with AS movements.) In the case of 3[SUP]rd[/SUP] party movements used, the caliber usually starts with a 2, ie. 2161 (FHF manual) and 2165 (ETA auto). This guide will focus on the _manufacture_ movements only.

There are two ways to ID a caliber, on the case back, or on the base plate of the movement just under the balance wheel.

The table below focus mostly on the models imported to China at the time. Sherpa, diver and chrono models were more expensive and to own and were never imported to China. L


Caliber
Manual/Auto
Jewels
Power Reserve
Feature
10XXseries, 50s to 60s, 18000 vph
 Cal. 1010
Manual
17J
42h
date
Cal. 1011
Manual
17J
42h
date
112X series, 1960s, 18000 vph
 Cal. 1120
Manual
17J
48h
　
Cal. 1121
Manual
17J
48h
date
Cal. 1124
Auto
25J
45h
　
Cal. 1125
Auto
25J
45h
date
(1)14X series, 1965-1975, 18000 vph, gold plated
　
 Cal. (1)140
Manual
17J
48h
　
Cal. (1)141
Manual
17J
48h
date
Cal. (1)143
Manual
17J
48h
day-date
Cal. (1)144
Auto
25J
45h
　
Cal. (1)145
Auto
25J
45h
date
Cal. (1)147
Auto
25J
45h
day-date
(1)16X series, 1975 to 80s, 21600 vph, gold plated
　
 Cal. (1)160
Manual
17J
46h
　
Cal. (1)161
Manual
17J
46h
date
Cal. (1)163
Manual
17J
46h
day-date
Cal. (1)164
Auto
24J
42h
　
Cal. (1)165
Auto
24J
42h
date
Cal. (1)167
Auto
24J
42h
day-date


I hope this will be of some usefulness.


----------



## o.v.e

That's an interesting overview, thanks. I had looked at Ranfft in order to identify this particular movement, but without success. Reason why I would believe it is inhouse is the Enicar-specific "pattern" on the bridges. But it is seemingly something else, and not even in Ranfft's database (under the "known" Enicar calibers). I would believe the Enicar inhouse movements are completely "known" to us.


----------



## dogen

Sherpa OPS made for military forces:



















@malus65 started with my watch-collection 10 years ago. Since 3 years a have completed the collection and since then a buy no more watches .

Best dogen


----------



## hns-panama

Taken from the other Enicar thread at UHRforum, here are the case back reference letters:


A = Automatic 
a = all-Stainless Steel 
B = Seapearl case, bayonet, 100% atm water resistant to 5 atm
C = Calendar 
CH = Chronograph 
E = Electromechanical (Landeron 4750 series Electric Movement) 
M = Brass, chrome or brass 20 micron gold plating
N = Sherpa case, 100% is water resistant to 20 atm 200 m water depth 
P = Plaque, (Plated) 20 micron 
G = Gold 
S = Sweep second (Central)
T = Rotating bezel with timing 
X = Rotating bezel 

Some additional information I've come across:


Brevet + 314962 = EPSA Super Compressor Case
Brevet + 313813 = EPSA Compressor Case


Also, in-house Supertest movements (eg. 1124, 1125, 1126) appear to be the best Enicar movements available. The AR1290 Supertests I have are not serial numbered nor are the non-Supertests I have.


----------



## dogen

Enicar Sherpa Super Divette:


----------



## Eeeb

A wonderful contribution. Thank you!

Reposting it as a separate thread with a good title will make it more useful for others searching in the future


----------



## dogen

Enicar Sherpa Aqua Graph with famous ValJoux 72:


----------



## hns-panama

Hi Eeeb,

Assuming you are referring to the caseback reference, I did so a few minutes ago.

Might I suggest including it within a separate folder for this type of information? Perhaps a "sticky" folder that only you can post to after reviewing the content? That should cut the "moderator" time way down.

Cheers,

Hunter



Eeeb said:


> A wonderful contribution. Thank you!
> 
> Reposting it as a separate thread with a good title will make it more useful for others searching in the future


----------



## dogen

Enicar Chrono with Valjoux 72 from the late 60's.


----------



## dogen

Enicar Chrono Date VJ92


----------



## dogen




----------



## dogen

Another Enicar Chrono with the famous ValJoux 72 from the late 60's.



















and the perfekt car to the watch, also from the late 60's (AR Spider Veloce 1750 BT):


----------



## dogen

Enicar was in 50's and 60's a well-known brand. Some watches of the Sherpa-line like the Super-Dive and the Sherpa Graph was in the same price category of a Rolex Submariner or a Daytona.

The story of the Manufacture d'Horlogerie Enicar S.A. started in 1914, with the watchmaker Ariste Racine responsible for the foundation of the watch factory in La Chaux-de-Fonds. The business objective was the production of lever watches with a wide palette of movements ranging from 4 to 17 lignes.

But Racine did not stay long in the Jura uplands; by the mid-twenties the firm had its headquarters in Lengnau. Here Racine specialized in sports watches under his trademark, AR, framed in a pentagon. Finished movements without cases were also exported to the New World. In around 1962, Enicar took up the production of its own automatic movements. Calibers in the 112x (11 1/2"') and 114x (11 3/4"') series were called "Rubirotor".

The "Sherpa" name given to hard-wearing sports watches has a more precise connotation. In 1956, members of a Swiss Himalayan expedition relied on Enicar timepieces, and their expectations were fully met. From then on the Enicar collection included such models as the "Sherpa Time", "Sherpa Ultradive", "Sherpa Star", "Sherpa Jet" and "Sherpa" chronographs in various executions.

In the 60's a lot pilots had Sherpa Jet Graph watches. Specially Swissair, Japan Airlines and S.A.S..










8 years ago I started to collect Enicar tool-watches, but it's very hard to find good pieces. The difficult thing is that so many "put together" watches are around. The Sherpa model are built in a modular structure and that's the reason you can find a lot of wild and very strange combinations of "put together" watches, so be very careful.










best dogen


----------



## hns-panama

Many of Enicar's more significant watches were cased by Ervin Piquerez, SA (EPSA) located in Bassecourt, Switzerland. I did a little digging and came up with some additional information. (Note: What follows is not my original research. Some was in French and in German. Any errors are probably due to my interpretation.)

Piquerez had about 200 patents from 1939 to 1979. The most famous being the Monoflex crown, Compressor and the Super Compressor cases. 

First production plant in Bassecourt enlarged a number of times and in 1946 measures 2,500 square meters where all operations were integrated. 

In 1946 EPSA rented premises in Geneva (nicknamed Le laboratoire) that employed 15 people. It was here that EPSA started a line of gold plating and housed the R&D department -- in French "de laboratoire et maquettisme style" (style and prototyping). Proposals were developed from inventions by Ervin Piquerez. Le laboratoire produced prototypes, often brassplated, as was the Heuer Monaco subjected to acceptance by Jack Heuer.

In 1959 EPSA approved plans of its new plant at Rue St.-Hubert 38 in Bassecourt. 7400 square meters. See photos below.

Specializing in steel water-resistant cases. EPSA was a member of Union de Suisse Fabricant Boites (USFB), a group capable of 260 mil. Chf in business and employing 8,600 people. EPSA produced the highest 7.3% amount making it the largest manufacturer of Swiss cases.

Growth:

Turnover in 1940 600.000 Chf
Turnover in 1951 10.000.000 Chf
Turnover in 1970 25.000.000 Chf

At the peak of its production, the factory produced over 10,000 cases daily. From what I've read, EPSA designed a rather unique production system called "Canaux" channels allowing tremendous flexibility. They could quickly shift from large batches to small lots. Small lots were less than a 1,000 pieces. The minimum order was 100 pieces (50 pieces for gold cases).

The larger lots were between 20,000 and 100,000 pieces. EPSA called it "système de production Piquerez" and the machine tools were not even bolted to the floor. (Pretty amazing and I would love to see the documentation for that.)

The water-resistant cases account for 80% of production. In 1970, the company produced 1,350,000 pieces. The average cost is about 7 Chf each.

The single largest customer is -- Enicar! The most "important" (could mean prestigious) customer is Omega. Other clients include Heuer, Baume & Mercier, Bulova, IWC and Longines from the mid-60s.

EPSA merged in 1984 with The Générale SA, under the name of Piquerez-Bourquard SA. Then in 1994, Nouvelle Piquerez SA. The company was merged into Samsung group in the same year until 1999 before being purchased by Valentini SA, which failed in 2003.

Photos follow with the last being a current Google Earth shot of the larger, 1959 factory:


----------



## dogen

Here some pictures of the manufacture of Enicar from 1924:










The Enicar-Fabric in the 50's:










The Enicar-Building today in Lengnau, still there even the symbol is there, the saturn (the rings are missing).










(picture is from stefan).

And a little bit more information of the compressor case:

SCUBAWATCH.ORG EPSA SUPER-COMPRESSOR FAQ

best dogen


----------



## dogen

It's sunday and I have time .

I like to show you a super rare piece. I'ts the Holly Grail of enicar or the unicorn, nobody has saw it but everybody heard about it.

This is a page of a catalog where the watch is described, the *Enicar Sherpa Super Graph* :










The Enicar Super Graph has a ValJoux 72 and was waterproof to 50m. I get my example from a italian collector:

*Here it is*:




























Sherpa Graph and Super Graph:










Best Dogen


----------



## dogen

Now we have the Super Graph, the Aqua Graph and missing its the Jet Graph, the watch was used by airlines and was a GMT way with a ValJoux 72 with one more complication.














































Best Dogen


----------



## dogen

Enicar Alarm clock:




























Best Dogen


----------



## dogen

Sherpa Super Divette:










best dogen


----------



## DragonDan

Wonderful! I've not heard of a Valjoux 72 with a GMT complication. That is extraordinary


----------



## dogen

Here the hole Valjoux 72 Family of Chronograph Movements.

71 Large 15 Ligne version of Valjoux 72 (13 Ligne or just under)
72 Basic 'Plain Jane' Valjoux 72.
721 "Seafarer" Tides complication in 9 o'clock sub-dial...
722 Rolex variant with Breguet Overcoil & MicroStella Balance
72c/723 Tri-Date non-moonphase v.72
724 GMT complication
725 I've never seen a movement marked 725, probably skipped.
726 Improved v.72 movement.
727 Rolex version of 726 with Bruget Overcoil & MicroStella*
728 1 Register/Center Pinion Chrono Minute hand varitant.
729 GMT, probably v.726 with GMT complicaton added.
730 Another Triple-Date model, perhaps DDM v.726?

The GMT function is actually nothing special, Heuer use the 724, but I think enicar did the complication them self.

Back to the smaller versions: The Sherpa Jet:





































best dogen


----------



## dogen

Enicars "Manhattan" Meteor:


----------



## Judylynn

I inherited a ladies Enicar watch and know nothing about them. It is on a necklace. The watch is encased in a ball with a swivel at the top that opens and closes have the ball to reveal the watchface. It ways ultrasonic, enicar, 17 jewels and swiss on the watchface and PlaqueL on the metal swivel with a mark that I can't read. I don't know how to set it, wind it or know if it's worth fixing. Any ideas?


----------



## dogen

The big brother of the Divettes 40mm (without crown) the Enicar Sherpa Super Jet, its a GMT-Watch with manufactured automatic-calibre:










here next to a UG Polerouter:










best dōgen


----------



## Eeeb

Judylynn said:


> I inherited a ladies Enicar watch and know nothing about them. It is on a necklace. The watch is encased in a ball with a swivel at the top that opens and closes have the ball to reveal the watchface. It ways ultrasonic, enicar, 17 jewels and swiss on the watchface and PlaqueL on the metal swivel with a mark that I can't read. I don't know how to set it, wind it or know if it's worth fixing. Any ideas?


Pics would help but generally vintage watches which are not treated as jewelry don't have high value. Often the restoration/maintenance costs as much as the watch. But heirlooms are already owned and are usually well worth restoring since they represent a personal link with your history.


----------



## dogen

Enicar Sherpa Super Dive (40mm).










best dōgen


----------



## trim

Mirius said:


> To quote Kris
> 
> 
> 1994Roamer purchased by the Hong Kong based Chung Nam Company.


Actually it is a little more now complicated, as the current company is a 50/50 swiss/chinese joint venture company - and is still located in Solothurn Switzerland (within walking distance of the original factory) - since the original bankruptcy it has always been in Solothurn, even through the changes in ownership. They are now selling in europe and many former markets.

Not trying to derail a great Enicar thread, love them too - but was very pleased to see the Chinese Roamer info here.

BTW - as for the quality of movements, after the mid 60s Enicar really lost that race vs Roamer and Certina (not biased, really ;-)).

Actually when the cultural revolution hit, Roamer almost went under - I don't know about Enicar but I guess it would have been a similarly traumatic time for them. It was only the change in Sri-Lanka government import policies that saved Roamer that time. I have the dates somewhere - but not at hand..

Nice thread OP.


----------



## dogen

Enicar Sherpa Star Diver (43mm!!):





































Compare to other divers like Aquastar Benthos 500 and Doxa Sharkhunter









best dogen

ps: to trim, enicar movements were one of the best in that time, that's the reason why you can find them in our days in the chronoswiss watches!!!! here more information : http://people.timezone.com/library/tmachine/tmachine631686142335259750 or here http://www.watchandclockforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=16&t=4941


----------



## dogen

The rare Enicar Sherpa Ultra Dive :





































best dogen


----------



## sjgarner

Was wondering if you could help me out with this Enicar I bought. I cant find anything about it. Thanks!


----------



## Eeeb

sjgarner said:


> Was wondering if you could help me out with this Enicar I bought. I cant find anything about it. Thanks!


LCD display on Swiss watch like this indicates late 70's to middle 80's.


----------



## dogen

Enicar Sherpa Mantagraph, the special thing is, inside is a Seiko caliber:



















best dogen


----------



## lanang

Dear Dogen, watching your incredible collections of well preserved Enicar Sherpas is a sanity disaster to my mind for I keep drooling and talking to myself everyday. My conscious is now falling apart. I need professional help.  excuse me, gotta get my medication....


----------



## o.v.e

lanang said:


> Dear Dogen, watching your incredible collections of well preserved Enicar Sherpas is a sanity disaster to my mind for I keep drooling and talking to myself everyday. My conscious is now falling apart. I need professional help.  excuse me, gotta get my medication....


Unfortunately, there is no remedy. To build such a collection from scratch will now be impossible. That guy simply started way earlier than we did :rodekaart, sometimes I think he has bought the whole market :think: ... but at least he shares the pictures... :-!

Plus he is very helpfull with information!


----------



## dogen

This is the most frequent Super Dive:





































best dogen


----------



## crazyfist

I have a very entry level question to the diver model owners: Are the crown(s) screw-down? I couldn't find any information on it. I happened upon a Sherpa on the web that has a manual winding movement, which I have not seen in these pictures. I would imagine a manual winding diver does not have a screw-down crown or crowns. Thanks.


----------



## dogen

No, there have no screw-down crowns, only the the star diver has a screw-down crown. At that time the Omegas for 300m had also no screw-down crown.










best dogen


----------



## dogen

Enicar Sherpa Super Dive




























best dogen

ps: the strap is made from recycling material (old handbag), political correct .


----------



## Stigmata

Great collection Dogen
I have a few Enicar watches... 3 Sherpa Guides.. ill probably flick one of those soon.1 Super Dive 33 and around 10 of the dress watches.Ultrasonics, Sea Pearls Ocean Pearls,Star Jewels.

Great watches!!!.. and its great to know they have a cult following


----------



## dogen

Enicar Sherpa Super Jet:




























best dogen


----------



## dogen

Sherpa Enicar Guide:


----------



## Eeeb

"The hits just keep on comming!" 

Do you actually have these watches currently in your collection?


----------



## dogen

yes there all still in my collection, nothing is missing 

Sherpa Enicar Guide:






































best dogen


----------



## Harry Keogh

I thought I'd join in this thread as I have an Enicar in my collection. Mostly I collect modern watches but this watch came from my great uncle when he died. I had the crystal replaced and the movement serviced. I gather from my research that the movement is a 1012. If anyone could tell me anything else about the watch, year of production, quality etc, I'd really appreciate it. My great uncle was a competitive cyclist and would have probably bought the watch during the 1960s when he cycled a lot in Europe - unless the watches were easily available in the north of England then.


----------



## scoobydoo59

I am an enicar enthusiast, first aquired was my sherpa graph world timer when I was 15yr old, I am now 56 and have many enicars including the jetgraph,
great thread, interesting, I will post some pics soon, I also have original paperwork from enicar factory back in 1986 when I sent 2 of my watches from U.K. to Switzweland for overhauls, Just before the factory closed I believe. Dave Scoobydo59


----------



## dogen

Welcome scoobydoo 

that's great I hope you start soon .

Best Dogen


----------



## Aero 1

The more I learn about this brand the more I am minded to try and acquire a couple of examples. Well made and well finished movements that seem to have withstood the test of time.


----------



## hns-panama

The 1010/1012 calibers are basically bulletproof. Very high quality for their time and even now. I'm pretty sure Enicar made a chrono version of the 1010 but I do not know about if the 1012 version was given the same treatment. 

Very nice example!


----------



## dogen

So this ist my last one. A good moment to make place for others.

Enicar Mantagraph with the Seiko calibre and the original strap! :




























Best Dogen


----------



## Eeeb

I shall miss seeing your seemingly inexhaustible supply of wonderful Enicars! Thanks!!!


----------



## Sunday Rider

So glad to find this thread dedicated to this wonderful watch. 

Thanks to Dogen for posting those museum quality pieces. I drool every time I see them.

Here is my daily wearer. It was a "rescue" and keeps great time. The face gives it character.


----------



## futuregopher

thank you OP for the very interesting history and background...I was never really into watches until I bought my first timex weekender 2 months ago. I'm chinese and when I was in China this past september, I remember my oldest cousin telling me about our grandpa's enicar. It was ~$100RMB back when my grandpa got it in his early 20's with his first 2 months salary. Very cool to hear about enicar. thank you and good luck to all


----------



## locolockman

This watch was a garage sale find for the person I bought it from. He found it in a drawer marked everything 50 cents. I paid him a lot more than that but still not much. Had it serviced and a light polish. Here it is, i really like the look and the quality seems great. I now have another brand to collect. Great thread.


----------



## locolockman

China, like everything else. Quartz killed so many good watchmakers. Enicar in house movements were very good and the 1145-1147 were rock solid. Too bad.


----------



## purplebubbles

Can anyone tell me about this watch. It's an Enicar gold plated watch with coral beads. Looking for an estimated value and year of make and any other information about it. I love it and would like to know it's history.


----------



## Eeeb

Ladies watches such as this have a jewelry value that exceeds their watch value. This is not our area of expertise! We don't do valuations anyway (check the posts at the top of the forum, especially in the Links and Articles subforum for useful information on this).

Nice looking bracelet! The watch itself could be from the 40s to present -- beauty is timeless


----------



## Stigmata

I have a few Enicars including 2 Sherpa Guides (Had 3 but just sold one) and a Super Dive.
I really love the Enicar Sherpa series as they are a real masculine watch. Hefty, funky and meaty.
Theyre watches that echo an era of Hendrix and the Stones.
Wearers were not middle aged accountants they were adventureres climbing mountains, flying planes , diving into oceans or in some military somewhere.
Probably driving an E type Jag.
They are a vintage watch that is the right size for today but they have character. Theyre not some sterile dial with generic movement watch of today.

Sure there are more expensive watches than my Enicar Sherpa but few have the character and unique funk these have.The Guides/Jets /Super Jets came out in so many different versions of colour combinations (and movements Sherpa 33 with the 125 ... 145s and 165s later on that Chronoswiss adopted from orphanage)it makes it difficult to stop at owning one. 

They belong to the golden age of watchmaking

Mad dogs and Enicar Sherpas .


----------



## JohnF

Stigmata said:


> I have a few Enicars including 2 Sherpa Guides (Had 3 but just sold one) and a Super Dive.
> I really love the Enicar Sherpa series as they are a real masculine watch. Hefty, funky and meaty.
> Theyre watches that echo an era of Hendrix and the Stones.
> Wearers were not middle aged accountants they were adventureres climbing mountains, flying planes , diving into oceans or in some military somewhere.
> Probably driving an E type Jag.
> They are a vintage watch that is the right size for today but they have character. Theyre not some sterile dial with generic movement watch of today.
> 
> Sure there are more expensive watches than my Enicar Sherpa but few have the character and unique funk these have.The Guides/Jets /Super Jets came out in so many different versions of colour combinations (and movements Sherpa 33 with the 125 ... 145s and 165s later on that Chronoswiss adopted from orphanage)it makes it difficult to stop at owning one.
> 
> They belong to the golden age of watchmaking
> 
> Mad dogs and Enicar Sherpas .


Amen, especially that last sentence...


----------



## Leroy Kaman

*Sv: The Joy of Collecting Vintage Enicar Watches*

New acquisition:


----------



## o.v.e

*Re: Sv: The Joy of Collecting Vintage Enicar Watches*

Nice! I hardly wear mine - it is just too big. But the Jet is among my favorites, probably the one I would keep, if I were only allowed to pick a single watch.


----------



## Stigmata

*Re: Sv: The Joy of Collecting Vintage Enicar Watches*

That one is similar to one of mine.

They look much nicer in the flesh


----------



## Taswell

*Re: Sv: The Joy of Collecting Vintage Enicar Watches*

Back from a long visit to my watchmaker.
This Sherpa Jet was a wreck when I picked it up but looks and works great now.


----------



## Stigmata

*Re: Sv: The Joy of Collecting Vintage Enicar Watches*

Very nice Taswell.

Thats a very nice watch.
How is running?


----------



## Leroy Kaman

*Re: Sv: The Joy of Collecting Vintage Enicar Watches*

Taswell (and any others who have had their Sherpas serviced/cleaned), is it possible to polish some of the scratches on the plexi glass? Do you do it yourselves, or have your watchmaker do it?


----------



## locolockman

I had a local jeweler do it. They did a great job.


----------



## Taswell

*Re: Sv: The Joy of Collecting Vintage Enicar Watches*

The Jet has had a full overhaul so it's running just fine.
I found a NOS case with crystal so this one didn't need any polishing but I use Polywatch on others myself.


----------



## Stigmata

*Re: Sv: The Joy of Collecting Vintage Enicar Watches*

If its crystal crazying you mean its impossible to get off.
If theyre scratches they come off easily as the crystal is very thick.


----------



## Leroy Kaman

*Re: Sv: The Joy of Collecting Vintage Enicar Watches*

Thanks for the replies. They are just scratches, no crazing. I'll ask my watch repair guy if he can do it, or else I might just try polywatch.


----------



## Marrick

*Re: Sv: The Joy of Collecting Vintage Enicar Watches*



Leroy Kaman said:


> Thanks for the replies. They are just scratches, no crazing. I'll ask my watch repair guy if he can do it, or else I might just try polywatch.


Have a look at https://www.watchuseek.com/f11/how-diy-cheap-crystal-repair-scratch-removal-tutorial-420568.html

b-)


----------



## Leroy Kaman

*Re: Sv: The Joy of Collecting Vintage Enicar Watches*



Marrick said:


> Have a look at https://www.watchuseek.com/f11/how-diy-cheap-crystal-repair-scratch-removal-tutorial-420568.html
> 
> b-)


Thanks a lot! That looks very doable. The only thing that worries me is that I have no idea about how to get the crystal off, and I would really prefer that to avoid any residue between the bezel and the plexi.


----------



## Marrick

*Re: Sv: The Joy of Collecting Vintage Enicar Watches*

You need a special tool. Unless you're going to do it a lot, it might be cheaper just to ask a watchmaker to do it for you or to fit a new crystal on your watch.


----------



## Emre

*Re: Sv: The Joy of Collecting Vintage Enicar Watches*

It was also my first trial with polywatch scratch remover, the results were astonishing. Applied some 4-5 teardrops on the crystal, distributed it on the whole surface with a piece of cotton cloth, waited a bit - like 2 min, then make some circles cw and ccw with pressure, repeat if necessary. Its joyful with the self sufficient feeling within this hobby, me happy, and would recommend it,the results:

*before:*










*
after:*


----------



## Nedwards

*Re: Sv: The Joy of Collecting Vintage Enicar Watches*










My Ocean Pearl.


----------



## hns-panama

*Re: Sv: The Joy of Collecting Vintage Enicar Watches*

New band on the Supertest Seapearl. It's a cal. 1290. Tried a burgundy colored band to see how I would like it with the rose gold case. So far, I do.


----------



## hns-panama

*Re: Sv: The Joy of Collecting Vintage Enicar Watches*

I had a good AR1145 movement on hand and bought a NOS gold plated case with dial, crown, and hands. Black Hadley-Roma band as the markers are gold with black stripes. I liked the red dot on the second hand. Now I am very tempted to get a black band with red stitching just to see how it would look. Watch keeps great time. The 1145 is a real gem!


----------



## Patrick_Ethan

*Great brand* I've admired for some time. Due to the excellent dial, case & feature design, plus the price-accessibility, this was among the very first vintage brands I found interesting. My sole example below. Am looking forward to someday having a Sherpa compressor of some sort, but pricy, and not IMHO a daily wearer.


----------



## merl

My first vintage:
Enicar Sherpa 600 date, really love the blue sunburst dial and the seconds hand color
View attachment 967578


The inside (sellers pic)
View attachment 967579


The watch came with a Nos racing strap which immediately cracked so it's now on a new strap.
View attachment 967580


View attachment 967581


----------



## hns-panama

An older Seapearl Super A Supertest with a burgundy strap. Cal. 1290 movement.

View attachment 992361


----------



## junkman

*my first enicar*


----------



## Formula1980

That is one gorgeous Star Diver! I had a Super Dive and sold it years ago...kick myself for doing that. Enicar made some really nice compressors.

Looks great sandwiched between the Aquastar and the Doxa!


----------



## crazyfist

*Re: my first enicar*

My first Enicar of 2013, and first one purchased in the US. Very pleased with it.

View attachment 1009097


----------



## ochapiteau

*a moonphase enicar*

Hi everybody,
I just bought an enicar watch with calendar and moonphase :
https://plus.google.com/photos/104157863200543841247/albums/5859367116713508689
I like it ;-)
It's written dive service, working very well
Any idea of the year and mecanism ?
Olivier
Ps:sorry for the link, did not find how to upload on the gallery


----------



## Hartmut Richter

*Re: a moonphase enicar*

Welcome to the forum. That's a nice looking watch. A movement picture might help but, since it's automatic, the most likely options are the Adolf Schild Cal. AS 1402 or the Felsa Cal. 693. On the basis of the exact pusher positions, I'd go for the Felsa movement:

bidfun-db Archiv: Uhrwerke: Felsa 693 Bidynator

Hartmut Richter


----------



## Stigmata

I have that exact watch its an ETA movement and probably late seventies or early eighties.

The Sherpa is my daily watch... and i have three of them 2 Guides and a Super Dive.


----------



## Tnbender

Hey, I've just picked up a enicar sherpa diver 600 automatic. It's run great for two days now. Back marked 100/216 BaANXS. Brevet 314962.
anyone tell me the date range, and how I can get a replacment bezel! I've ordered a new plexiglass and an Enicar strap. Thanks for any help! NealderbenATyahoo.com


----------



## hns-panama

Nice Sherpa project...

Bezel is basically unobtainium. You will have to find someone to make one. Won't be cheap either.

Or, you have them put on a smooth bezel until you find a new or donor watch.

Otherwise, make sure you get the movement serviced by a good watchmaker who knows what a Super Compressor case is.


----------



## JohnF

Yep, finding a new bezel is basically almost impossible. My Enicar Sherpa Guide bezel is battered and faded, but irreplaceable.


----------



## nicola1960

Questa è la mia ricerca.
This is my search.;-)

Gli orologi Enicar: la storia


----------



## crazyfist

nicola1960 said:


> Questa è la mia ricerca.
> This is my search.;-)
> 
> Gli orologi Enicar: la storia


Wonderful pictures of the ad! Thanks to your research, I was able to date three of my watches to the exact year:








1954















1954















1967








Group shot:


----------



## skywatch

crazyfist said:


> 1967
> View attachment 1039015


I have that same model of Sherpa Star, which I gave to my wife as it looked a bit bright on my wrist.


----------



## nicola1960

crazyfist said:


> Wonderful pictures of the ad! Thanks to your research, I was able to date three of my watches to the exact year...


Grazie a te.;-)
Thank you.


----------



## PerV

Hello guys! First of all, I love this thread! Awesome. |>

And please forgive me If this is not the right place to ask, but it seems that all the enicar experts are here hehe :-d

Can you please help me identify this Enicar Quartz watch? It was a present, but I don´t know about the year, model, etc.

(The back: "Enicar Crystal Quartz401-0373-606 STAINLESS STEEL WATER RESISTANT).

Thanks in advance!


----------



## greger

Sadly it stopped going not that long ago... My local watch maker wants 2400 SEK (€275/$360) to fix it and I bought for a third of that, so I don't know.


----------



## merl

greger said:


> Sadly it stopped going not that long ago... My local watch maker wants 2400 SEK (€275/$360) to fix it and I bought for a third of that, so I don't know.


Well, the watch looks nice. :thumbup:
My enicar is at a local watchmaker atm because it stops daily at around 9:50.
He is going to fix it for €115.
Since I didn't know the servicehistory if the watch I'm sering it as a service+ 
Anyway, it is up to you if the watch means enough for you to pay that amount to fix it.
Maybe you can try to find an enicar watch with the same movement on the bay and let the watchmaker replace the faulty one.


----------



## WatchFred

Dogen has set a quality standard for vintage Enicars that is totally impossible to reach, have been searching for a nice and affordable SherpaGRAPH for a very long time - but either they were beat up or just too expensive for my tastes - until I finally grabbed this one. love it.


----------



## hns-panama

Woof!



WatchFred said:


> Dogen has set a quality standard for vintage Enicars that is totally impossible to reach, have been searching for a nice and affordable SherpaGRAPH for a very long time - but either they were beat up or just too expensive for my tastes - until I finally grabbed this one. love it.


----------



## hns-panama

Nice looking.

It would help to see the movement though.



PerV said:


> Hello guys! First of all, I love this thread! Awesome. |>
> 
> And please forgive me If this is not the right place to ask, but it seems that all the enicar experts are here hehe :-d
> 
> Can you please help me identify this Enicar Quartz watch? It was a present, but I don´t know about the year, model, etc.
> 
> (The back: "Enicar Crystal Quartz401-0373-606 STAINLESS STEEL WATER RESISTANT).
> 
> Thanks in advance!


----------



## RainMan 777

WatchFred said:


> Dogen has set a quality standard for vintage Enicars that is totally impossible to reach, have been searching for a nice and affordable SherpaGRAPH for a very long time - but either they were beat up or just too expensive for my tastes - until I finally grabbed this one. love it.


The watch looks great and it is one of the better looking vintage watches. You stated affordable? Do they sell up ward of $2000?
that is a bit too much, any recommendations?
Thanks


----------



## bert094

Hi,this is my first post, so please be kind. I bought an Enicar Sherpa Divette 33 in 1966 in Berlin. Abused over the years - mostly by me - diving and generally. Also by "watchmakers" long story. I have recently become interested in military watches and my old Diving watch and would like to "restore" it, maybe not to dive status but at least as a watch. My problem is I don't know what the structure should be and therefore what parts may be missing/broken. I have removed the back, the movement ( AR 1145 ) seems fine and is ticking. The last "watchmaker" (he lives in Sussex) returned it after 3 months with a loose fitting plastic chrystal and movement and a badly painted over face. I ask that maybe one of the experts might help with a diagram or description of how the watch was originally constructed. Many thanks.


----------



## Zilladon

dogen said:


> Enicar Sherpa Mantagraph, the special thing is, inside is a Seiko caliber:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> best dogen


Wow!! Everything about this is gorgeous! Great idea to match this one up with the stingray strap. How is it that all of your Enicars look practically brand new?

- Patti


----------



## thebryman

Hello there, fellow collectors- new guy here...I've always been something of a watch aficionado, however have never encountered the... 'wonderful'... world of... "vintage"... watches sold on E-Bay until very recently (I know, I know).

Anyways, to the point: I just won this Enicar for under $40, but to be really honest with you all it seems to be in just a bit TOO good of condition for a "vintage" Enicar (advertised as being produced between the 40's and early 70's; this thing looks like a frankenwatch thrown together from an older face/dial with modern back and bezel...).

I want the _brutal _truth from those of you in here whom are far more knowledgeable about this company than I am- did I just waste my money?

(Ex: the backing doesn't even state anything regarding the watch [17 jewel/Enicar/etc] but simply tells you that the back is base metal and the thing is "Dustproof"...)

*PICS:
*




















Thanks in advance to any of you that bother to enlighten me,

BB


----------



## crazyfist

Sorry to break it to you but this is definitely a franken. I know this seller, from India right? I actually wanted to write some thing here to warn people about this particular franken Enicar. But never got the time...sorry...

Referring to my original post, Star Jewels indicates Enicar in-house movement. The movement you have in your watch is FHF 69. A very commonly used 3rd party movement in the 70s. And this particular movement can be had for less than $5 on eBay, somehow loads of them came from India. Here's one I purchased not long ago and just received in running condition:

Genuine Vintage Swiss Wrist Watch Movement 17JEWELS Winding Ref St 96 Swiss Made | eBay

Also refer to my original post regarding the caseback for Star Jewels.

The brutal truth? I think you over paid 30 bucks for that watch...

But we live and learn. Next time, please post here first with your question, then make the purchase. We'd be more than happy to help.


----------



## crazyfist

In all fairness Enicar did use FHF movements in their watches in the 70s and 80s. I have one, and this is what it looks like:

"Enicar" engraved on the bridge








Caseback with the number 2161. the number 2 is very important here, as it separates from the in house cal. 161. They all belong in the 16x series because they share the same hz.








And most importantly, removal of the words "star jewels" from the dial.


----------



## thebryman

crazyfist said:


> The brutal truth? I think you over paid 30 bucks for that watch...


Bah, lesson learned...glad I found/registered to this forum for future purchase inquiries (WatchRecon doesn't seem to have much in way of Enicar to compare ATM).

Guess at least I've got a nice Father's Day gift for the old man- he'd never know the difference :think: ...I hope...


----------



## Saufi Subri

hello guys. been reading WUS a long time but finally joined today thanks for this thread.
I thought i might seek an opinion from you guys the expert. saw this on ebay <meta name="keywords" content="rare VINTAGE ENICAR AUTOMATIC SWISS MENS DAY/.
is it worth it to make the plunge? thanks in advance


----------



## crazyfist

Hi and welcome! Good to see that this thread is breeding Enicar fans! 

The watch you are interested in states that the dial is original, but that is certainly false. If you look carefully for the hour markers, you will find...there isn't any. I believe the hour markers were indices that were removed during the repaint. Also for in house Enicar movement, there is usually "Swiss made" printed on the bottom of the dial. The case back is also polished to the point where all texts are gone. 

Other than that, the movement seems to be in ok condition. AR 167 is what chronoswiss use as base movement. If it works as it should, and you are okay with non original dial, then it's not too bad for the price at this point.


----------



## Saufi Subri

Thank you so much for the reply. I had my doubts with the dial. I have no problem with repainted dials if the price is good. so long as the case and movement are original. there is another im eyeing if you would be so kind to comment on it
http://www.ebay.com.my/itm/31067672...AX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649#ht_2587wt_758
i am really looking forward to owning a vintage enicar. the likes of which mr dogen shows is just too out of my price range haha


----------



## crazyfist

This one looks alright. Should be all original. It's an ETA movement, probably one from the 27XX automatic series. Not as desirable as an in-house Enicar movement, but I have no doubt the quality is up to par. And the price is more than reasonable. 



Saufi Subri said:


> Thank you so much for the reply. I had my doubts with the dial. I have no problem with repainted dials if the price is good. so long as the case and movement are original. there is another im eyeing if you would be so kind to comment on it
> http://www.ebay.com.my/itm/31067672...AX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649#ht_2587wt_758
> i am really looking forward to owning a vintage enicar. the likes of which mr dogen shows is just too out of my price range haha


----------



## Saufi Subri

thanks again sir for ur kindness. i will start looking around more for enicar.. esp with inhouse movement


----------



## MMMD

Taswell said:


> I particularly like these because of their role in the early evolution of dive watches.
> In 1958 when US Navy was testing watches for issue to their divers.
> The watches they tested were:
> Bulova prototype diver
> Blancpain Fifty Fathoms
> Rolex Oyster
> Enicar Sherpa Diver 600
> Enicar Seapearl 600
> 
> Any of the first three would cost well over $10000 if you can find an example from that era.
> 
> The Enicar watches are somewhat more affordable.
> Some of my Enicars ...
> These are from 1955-6, well before the US Navy went shopping for theirs.
> View attachment 795489


Beautiful collection (and a fantastic thread, by the way|>)! Here are my two:









The Healthways 100 (1955) has taken a beating, but the Seapearl 600 (1957-58?)is a real beauty. Both have watertight EPSA bayonet cases with the AR 1010 inside:









My Seapearl 600 is later than 1956 (maybe 1957-58? I haven't wrestled the back off of it yet to check the EPSA date inside), as it has the word "Sherpas" on the case back, referring to the Swiss Everest expedition of 1956.









Interesting side note: the leader of the Swiss Everest expedition describes the Enicar watches that his group used as "Enicar ​*automatic* wrist-watches, some of them fitted with a thermometer." Presumably "automatic" is an error (?), as it is commonly held that the climbers wore manual-wind Seapearl 600's. You can read his account here (Enicar mentioned on p. 35): ​Full text of "The Everest Lhotse Adventure"

Back to diving... The report entitled "Miscellaneous Comments on Several Submersible Wrist Watches," released by the U.S. Navy Experimental Diving Unit in May 1959, is interesting reading and is available here: Miscellaneous Comments on Several Submersible Wrist Watches. .

The really juicy stuff, however, is the earlier report entitled "Comparative Evaluation of Three Commercially Available Swiss-Made Submersible Wrist Watches," released by the same group in July 1958.









Here's the abstract:








In July 1958, the U.S. Navy Experimental Diving Unit recommended that the Bureau of Ships *delete* the Rolex Submariner 6538 from the list of watches approved for interim purchase (while the Bulova Submersible was being developed for the Navy), and that they *add* the Enicar Seapearl 600 to that list. As I said, juicy stuff.

The Bureau of Ships followed this recommendation as regards the Enicar, _but did not delete the Rolex 6538, _much to the delight, I'm sure of any old Navy diver or his kin who still owns one. 

The abstract is available here: Comparative Evaluation of Three Commercially Available Swiss-Made Submersible Wrist Watches, . If you want a copy of the actual report, the DTIC will direct you to the National Technical Information Service: NTIS - National Technical Information Service . Hope this inspires you, as it has me, to wear your Seapearl 600 with even more pride.


----------



## JimInOz

I just had to bump this thread so I don't lose it.

In 1965 we transited through Singapore and I bought an Enicar (Ultrasonic?) in Change Alley while all of the other guys were buying Citizens and Seikos.

It was extremely thin, gold filled case, had gold stick hands and marker on a white dial that went right to the edge of a really thin bezel so it looked a lot larger than contemporaries.

It was last seen on the wrist of a girlfriend just before I departed on another voyage, unfortunately I never saw her again, such is life.

Anyway, I saw another recently and on an impulse, decided to add it to my collection of Omegas, just for old times sake.

Any comments or advice on my purchase is welcomed, auction details are here

Superb Vintage Enicar Ultrasonic Gold P 23 Jewels Wrist Watch Drivers | eBay

Cheers

Jim


----------



## everestx

Received this a couple days ago and having a hard time getting it off my wrist


----------



## merl

everestx said:


> Received this a couple days ago and having a hard time getting it off my wrist
> 
> View attachment 1127187


it's a beauty! congrats


----------



## Shum

I got two Enicars but they both have the wrong case backs.















One is a Sherpa with a 160 movement but with a Ultrasonic Sherpa 600 back (to small so just pushed in).















The other is a Star Jewles with what I beleave is a 161 movement but the caseback is an Ocean pearl 140 back (so stuck I can't get it off).

It's so sad I just want to cry...


----------



## fatehbajwa

Wearing this today...


----------



## Stigmata

i have another 2 Sherpa Guides coming in. One is as mint as youre ever going to find. Outer bezel is almost unmarked. Back is unpolished crystal no crazing.Complete with the cross hatch design signed crowns and not the plain signed.Dial inner bezel all excellent.
The other exactly the same watch. But not as in mint condition still very good. 
Boosts my collection to 4 Sherpa Guides and one Super Dive.Plus Ultrasonics . Sea Pearls Star Jewels and Ocean Pearl models of all kinds.
Im not looking at adding any more of the dress watches and will continue to focus on the Sherpa series with a Super Jet being the ultimate for me.


----------



## Stigmata

i have the 19 jewel version of exactly the same watch. i dont really ever wear it but i like it

ultrasonic slim gold on white


----------



## crazyfist

JimInOz said:


> I just had to bump this thread so I don't lose it.
> 
> In 1965 we transited through Singapore and I bought an Enicar (Ultrasonic?) in Change Alley while all of the other guys were buying Citizens and Seikos.
> 
> It was extremely thin, gold filled case, had gold stick hands and marker on a white dial that went right to the edge of a really thin bezel so it looked a lot larger than contemporaries.
> 
> It was last seen on the wrist of a girlfriend just before I departed on another voyage, unfortunately I never saw her again, such is life.
> 
> Anyway, I saw another recently and on an impulse, decided to add it to my collection of Omegas, just for old times sake.
> 
> Any comments or advice on my purchase is welcomed, auction details are here
> 
> Superb Vintage Enicar Ultrasonic Gold P 23 Jewels Wrist Watch Drivers | eBay
> 
> Cheers
> 
> Jim


Jim, I happen to have the 25J version of this watch. The movement is a variation of the Cal. AR-1010, I also have the 17J version, quite a few of them, actually. So now I gathered there are at least 4 versions of this movement, the 17J, 19J, 23J, and 25J...wouldn't be suprised if there's a 21J as well.

I think the 1010 is perhaps the most robust Enicar manual movement next to the AR 160 (although I've seen many AR 160s with lose central wheel). I'm not a seasoned watchmaker, only a hobbyist, but I've always managed to service the 1010s with no issues at all.

Let us know when you receive the watch and make sure to post some pics here!


----------



## crazyfist

I gotta say I've found some Enicar Sherpa Graphs on my ebay watch list and they eventually ended up here in this thread! I'm so jealous!!!


----------



## L.O.E

Hi guys,

I just acquired an Enicar Seapearl 600. It is very rare, in fact, so rare that I haven't managed to find another during my search. It's an automatic and has a regular plain dial.


----------



## crazyfist

Absolutely beautiful seapearl, and in particularly fine condition! I find these classy dials more attractive than other vintage divers. The Seapearls EPSA compressor cased watches are underrated, imo. Your watch looks awful similar to this one:









And here's my EPSA Seapearl:


----------



## L.O.E

It's a nice watch you have there. I wonder how you managed to open the case back. I am currently looking to get a new crystal for the watch. Do you have any idea where I should attempt? Is a used one the only option? Thanks.


----------



## crazyfist

Your local watchmaker would be the best source for crystal replacement. If you have a case back opener, be very careful when opening this. Notice there a small circle engraved on the 2 o'clock position on the case back, you only need to turn the case back 1/8th of a way, when the circle is aligned with the crown, the caseback'd fall out. I'd recommend using a rubber ball case back opener rather then a metal one.


----------



## L.O.E

Thanks for your prompt reply. I have a couple of metal openers, but I don't think I'll try either. It looks like it's time to order a rubber ball opener now. Thanks again.


----------



## 104RS

Wow, the posts of dogen have really blown me away. I'm completely amazed by his stunning collection.
This is the best collection I have ever seen, simply fantastic! Hopefully you will share some more pictures with us in the near future!


----------



## gr8sw

will add to this great thread, and many thanks to dogen for showing his great Enicar collection! :-!

a recent arrival from the original owner in the Netherlands who wore it around the world in the offshore industry... sadly realized it's missing its outer metal bezel ring (now on the impossible hunt... anyone got a spare?) but I'm still loving it nonetheless!


----------



## Tick Talk

From a recent visit to La Chaux-de-Fonds:


----------



## L.O.E

_*Re*_: Interesting side notes.

I think the Seapearl 600 Automatic version has a plain dial. Please see the pictures of my Enicar below.

















I also think the plain dial rather makes more sense as being used in Swiss expedition in 1956. The controversial (as we speak in this thread here) Rolex Oyster that claimed first watch on Everest definitely looks similar (see picture attached below, according to my search though). Wouldn't it make less sense to use a diver-style watch as a mountain expedition time-piece?









Have a good day!



MMMD said:


> Beautiful collection (and a fantastic thread, by the way|>)! Here are my two:
> 
> View attachment 1114636
> 
> 
> The Healthways 100 (1955) has taken a beating, but the Seapearl 600 (1957-58?)is a real beauty. Both have watertight EPSA bayonet cases with the AR 1010 inside:
> 
> View attachment 1114638
> 
> 
> My Seapearl 600 is later than 1956 (maybe 1957-58? I haven't wrestled the back off of it yet to check the EPSA date inside), as it has the word "Sherpas" on the case back, referring to the Swiss Everest expedition of 1956.
> 
> View attachment 1114660
> 
> 
> Interesting side note: the leader of the Swiss Everest expedition describes the Enicar watches that his group used as "Enicar ​*automatic* wrist-watches, some of them fitted with a thermometer." Presumably "automatic" is an error (?), as it is commonly held that the climbers wore manual-wind Seapearl 600's. You can read his account here (Enicar mentioned on p. 35): ​Full text of "The Everest Lhotse Adventure"
> 
> Back to diving... The report entitled "Miscellaneous Comments on Several Submersible Wrist Watches," released by the U.S. Navy Experimental Diving Unit in May 1959, is interesting reading and is available here: Miscellaneous Comments on Several Submersible Wrist Watches. .
> 
> The really juicy stuff, however, is the earlier report entitled "Comparative Evaluation of Three Commercially Available Swiss-Made Submersible Wrist Watches," released by the same group in July 1958.
> 
> View attachment 1114642
> 
> 
> Here's the abstract:
> 
> View attachment 1114643
> 
> In July 1958, the U.S. Navy Experimental Diving Unit recommended that the Bureau of Ships *delete* the Rolex Submariner 6538 from the list of watches approved for interim purchase (while the Bulova Submersible was being developed for the Navy), and that they *add* the Enicar Seapearl 600 to that list. As I said, juicy stuff.
> 
> The Bureau of Ships followed this recommendation as regards the Enicar, _but did not delete the Rolex 6538, _much to the delight, I'm sure of any old Navy diver or his kin who still owns one.
> 
> The abstract is available here: Comparative Evaluation of Three Commercially Available Swiss-Made Submersible Wrist Watches, . If you want a copy of the actual report, the DTIC will direct you to the National Technical Information Service: NTIS - National Technical Information Service . Hope this inspires you, as it has me, to wear your Seapearl 600 with even more pride.
> 
> View attachment 1114654


----------



## MMMD

L.O.E said:


> _*Re*_: Interesting side notes.
> 
> I think the Seapearl 600 Automatic version has a plain dial. Please see the pictures of my Enicar below.
> 
> View attachment 1140863
> 
> 
> View attachment 1140865
> 
> 
> I also think the plain dial rather makes more sense as being used in Swiss expedition in 1956. The controversial (as we speak in this thread here) Rolex Oyster that claimed first watch on Everest definitely looks similar (see picture attached below, according to my search though). Wouldn't it make less sense to use a diver-style watch as a mountain expedition time-piece?
> 
> View attachment 1140870
> 
> 
> Have a good day!


I think a diver style watch like this would be fine on a mountain in terms of weatherproofing and visibility... I might want something with good lume and a non-reflective dial in the ice and snow. It's the manual winding part that bothers me... numb fingers, thick gloves or mittens... I'd definitely want a self-winder in that situation.


----------



## Stigmata

I forgot how to get a photo up...

hmmmmm








The haze above the Enicar sign is a reflection.
Its very clean back and front.


----------



## Stigmata

My 3 guides. 
The two on the outside are in great conditon . The one on the left has fine crazing going on in the crystal. The middle i wear most days.All run very well. Two on left have been serviced recently by me. The one on the right didnt need it. All original completely except middle i have a short bracelet for it so use a Zulu .
Ill put up a few others when i get my photograpgy happening . Including a jump hour.Ultrasonics Seapearls Ocean Pearls Star Jewels and a Super Dive.Oh and one Indian redial i thought was very cheap out of curiosity. Has an AR 165 in it.


----------



## JohnF

Mine is in repair, needs a new mainsprung and some tweaking. It's my daily wear...


----------



## Stigmata

jump hour, usnusual from the unusual 70s.


----------



## MMMD

Stigmata said:


> View attachment 1149565
> jump hour, usnusual from the unusual 70s.


Nice. On that note... wearing the groovy Saturn-Matic today:


----------



## hns-panama

Very excited to acquire a grail. This little lot was bought with the help of a friend in California. I am one very happy camper. Even more so when the Seapearl arrives.


----------



## o.v.e




----------



## crazyfist

WOW! Is this one of the cases here the seller had no idea whats at stake? You are very lucky my friend, and I'm so jealous.



hns-panama said:


> Very excited to acquire a grail. This little lot was bought with the help of a friend in California. I am one very happy camper. Even more so when the Seapearl arrives.
> 
> View attachment 1154405


----------



## Stigmata

o.v.e said:


>


Exactly gorgeous


----------



## hns-panama

Yep.... 

It was a find, but through education of the brand, with the help of folks here, I knew what to look for and what the potential was. 

Thanks.


----------



## hns-panama

Questions for the Sherpa Jet owners:

Dial diameter? (Same as a standard 1145 movement dial?)

Is the dial flat, pie pan or just curved?

Suggestions for acquiring the 24 hand? It has a 2mm hole.

Thanks.


----------



## Kings and Aces

Little blue today!


----------



## o.v.e

hns-panama said:


> Questions for the Sherpa Jet owners:
> 
> Dial diameter? (Same as a standard 1145 movement dial?)
> 
> Is the dial flat, pie pan or just curved?
> 
> Suggestions for acquiring the 24 hand? It has a 2mm hole.
> 
> Thanks.


I think the dial diameter is like the movement. It is flat. The bigger diameter of the Super Jet is only due to the 24h-ring. But I can't compare them right now. The 24h hand is difficult to source, I guess You will have to find a scrap watch. Unfortunately the checkered style hand is often damaged and can not easily be repainted.


----------



## Stigmata

yes.. best way to do it panama is look around for a busted guide with aa 24 hour hand and buy it.. 
then sell the rest off as a donor watch...


----------



## hns-panama

Thanks. Will be interested in the diameter of the Jet. Not the Super Jet. I have the 1146 movement and not a 166.

I've seen several versions of the 24 hour hand. One is a stick and the other is the checkered thick one.


----------



## hns-panama

That's probably what I will have to do at some point. Thanks.


----------



## Stigmata

Most guides are 146 movements not 126 or 166.

146 have the red date... 126 and 146 use a black date.

Good chance yours is similar to the chequered pointer


----------



## locolockman

For anyone interested. [Moderator delete... please read the forum rules.]


----------



## hns-panama

Well, the Seapearl arrived and it runs too. Have not removed the case back since I am headed out of town for the weekend but one thing I will need is a tension/reflector ring for the crystal. Does anyone know of a possible replacement? Perhaps from another Seapearl? I can get the crystal so that's not a problem.

The case back number 100/61-10aSN.

Wound it and it fired right up. Keeping perfect time so far.

Other than the reflector ring, the case has some terrific patina in the form of some dings, which I trust have a good dive story behind them. I think I will only do a bit of cleaning with the Cape Cod Cloth. The dial is in great overall shape and is in need of reluming. Same with those terrific hands.

Overall, quite pleased.


----------



## MMMD

hns-panama said:


> Other than the reflector ring, the case has some terrific patina in the form of some dings, which I trust have a good dive story behind them. I think I will only do a bit of cleaning with the Cape Cod Cloth. The dial is in great overall shape and is in need of reluming. Same with those terrific hands.


Beautiful. Just my opinion, but I would urge you not to relume this little piece of history - I think it looks great as is. 
I've recently expanded my little collection of Seapearl 600's and will post some photos soon. Thanks for sharing yours.


----------



## hns-panama

Thanks. I waver about the reluming. It does "speak" doesn't it? What sea stories it could tell...

Now searching for a strap. Thinking black shark. 17mm width.

Looking forward to seeing your photo!



MMMD said:


> Beautiful. Just my opinion, but I would urge you not to relume this little piece of history - I think it looks great as is.
> I've recently expanded my little collection of Seapearl 600's and will post some photos soon. Thanks for sharing yours.


----------



## crazyfist

Fantastic catch! I agree with MMMD that relume is not necessary. I happen to think it's in superb shape given it's history. Could I trouble you for a shot for the caseback and the movement when you can get to it? Muchas gracias!


----------



## John Kirby

I just bought my first Enicar and I kinda rushed into and bought from the Indian dealer that pretty much everyone says is a scammer. Not sure if my is a redial because of the planet without the rings.

Any opinions?


----------



## hns-panama

Thanks Crazyfist. Will do when I get back to the city.

Edited: Added photo. The back is almost pristine. So I did not attempt to open. Figure a cal. 1010 in it though. Fairly common but very robust. Mine has a 38 hour reserve and accurate within 1 minute a day. Not bad for an oldie.


----------



## Stigmata

definitely a redial..tricked up hands... but if it works ok its fine... 

if u didnt pay too much... and like it.. no worries..

but its not original


----------



## everestx

New arrival


----------



## hns-panama

Yep. Redial.

Now I see one seller, probably the same one, recasing them in cheap base metal junk. Verry rare. Not.

These guys can ruin the legacy of Enicar.

Just my 2 cents.


----------



## MMMD

I've expanded the Seapearl 600 collection a bit: 
















Two fancy-lug Seapearls have been added to the fleet. Both of these have "Seapearl 600" in silver lettering within a black rectangle. The one in the middle of the top row has an EPSA case dated 9-57. It needs a service... runs but doesn't set. On the watch at top left, "Sherpas" is added above "Seapearl 600." That one has had a little polish on the backside but is otherwise in good shape.

So at least four variants of these early divers.

The backs demonstrate varying levels of abuse... and what a nylon strap can do to stainless steel. :-(


----------



## MMMD

One of the dangers of searching for Enicars on eBay is that you never know when something unexpected and irresistible is going to pop up. Maybe something you've never seen before... maybe something you didn't even know existed. Not the Sherpa Diver I was looking for, but I'm a sucker for 50's pink gold chronometers in outstanding condition. 

























Ooh, a dust cover:









The AR 1034 is a modified Adolph Schild movement (AS 1361N) that was also used by Ebel, Rado and Zodiac to produce some certified chronometers. I didn't know that Enicar had done the same until I found this; the Enicar movement is more beautiful than any of the others. (The AS 1361N was also used in some Blancpain Fifty Fathoms of the 50's.)

















Here it is next to some yellow-gold competition. I think it stands up pretty well.  It's 34 mm across, 41 mm lug-to-lug, almost identical in size and quite similar in shape to the Seamaster seen below.


----------



## L.O.E

Hi,

I have a Seapearl 600 Automatic (shown on previous pages) that is in need of a new crystal. The case number is 100/120BaANS. Could you let me know where I can get the Enicar crystal, probably in form of new old stock? I don't want to just get a generic one for this peace of legendary.

Thanks.



hns-panama said:


> Well, the Seapearl arrived and it runs too. Have not removed the case back since I am headed out of town for the weekend but one thing I will need is a tension/reflector ring for the crystal. Does anyone know of a possible replacement? Perhaps from another Seapearl? I can get the crystal so that's not a problem.
> 
> The case back number 100/61-10aSN.
> 
> Wound it and it fired right up. Keeping perfect time so far.
> 
> Other than the reflector ring, the case has some terrific patina in the form of some dings, which I trust have a good dive story behind them. I think I will only do a bit of cleaning with the Cape Cod Cloth. The dial is in great overall shape and is in need of reluming. Same with those terrific hands.
> 
> Overall, quite pleased.
> 
> View attachment 1161193


----------



## hns-panama

Hi,

Suggest contacting richie-rich42 on eBay. I bought a few crystals from him. He may have a source for you. 

As for originals, good luck on that. A GS is probably better anyway.

Whatever you do, don't lose the tension ring...



L.O.E said:


> Hi,
> 
> I have a Seapearl 600 Automatic (shown on previous pages) that is in need of a new crystal. The case number is 100/120BaANS. Could you let me know where I can get the Enicar crystal, probably in form of new old stock? I don't want to just get a generic one for this peace of legendary.
> 
> Thanks.


----------



## L.O.E

Hi,

Thanks for the advice. I will be in touch with him and get a gs. Maybe it sounds stupid, but is it possible to reuse the tension ring that is in the watch?

Thanks.



hns-panama said:


> Hi,
> 
> Suggest contacting richie-rich42 on eBay. I bought a few crystals from him. He may have a source for you.
> 
> As for originals, good luck on that. A GS is probably better anyway.
> 
> Whatever you do, don't lose the tension ring...


----------



## hns-panama

Indeed. The ring can and should be reused. Be very clear about that with whomever you have service it.

I'm now looking for one for the 600.



L.O.E said:


> Hi,
> 
> Thanks for the advice. I will be in touch with him and get a gs. Maybe it sounds stupid, but is it possible to reuse the tension ring that is in the watch?
> 
> Thanks.


----------



## radger

hns-panama said:


> Indeed. The ring can and should be reused. Be very clear about that with whomever you have service it.
> 
> I'm now looking for one for the 600.


These crystals are called armed acrylics and come complete with fitted tension ring in chrome or gold,
The tension ring would not be removed and re-used. The 'armed acrylic' crystals are readily available from
watch material suppliers in all sizes and increase in size in 10th mm increments, a tool is required to compress
the crystals for insertion.


----------



## hns-panama

You are correct that armed crystals have the ring pre-installed. However, I have found the rings to be smaller in width than what came from the Enicar factory. Hence, the need to be very clear about not ruining the ring when removing the crystal and reusing it in the replacement...

In my case, the Seapearl doesn't have the reflector ring and the replacement GS crystal doesn't include it...



radger said:


> These crystals are called armed acrylics and come complete with fitted tension ring in chrome or gold,
> The tension ring would not be removed and re-used. The 'armed acrylic' crystals are readily available from
> watch material suppliers in all sizes and increase in size in 10th mm increments, a tool is required to compress
> the crystals for insertion.


----------



## everestx

New arrival - thought I'd better snag this before MMMD added it to his collection!


----------



## radger

hns-panama said:


> You are correct that armed crystals have the ring pre-installed. However, I have found the rings to be smaller in width than what came from the Enicar factory. Hence, the need to be very clear about not ruining the ring when removing the crystal and reusing it in the replacement...


Do you mean
That you have to buy an armed acrylic which is pre fitted with its tension ring.
Then you have to remove this criticaly sized and fitted tension ring.
Then you take the scavenged ring from the used crystal and fit it to the new crystal for
which it was never meant or made for?

Or are you buying a standard acrylic and somehow fitting the used tension ring to this?

How are you machining the criticaly sized groove for the tension ring to the rim of your
new crystal?

If you are fitting used tension rings to crystals for which it was never meant then how can
you be sure that the tension ring is doing its job?

Armed acrylics can also be bought with extra wide tension rings......
http://www.agthomas.co.uk/watch_glasses.htm


----------



## 104RS

Can anyone tell me if this is the correct movement for the watch? 
I'm not completely sure about it since I owned another, specifically smaller Enicar watch with seemingly the same movement as this has in it.
It seems to be pretty small in comparison to the case of the watch.


----------



## crazyfist

I'm pretty sure that's the correct movement. Caliber AR -141. In fact you should find either 140-xx-xxx or 141-xx-xxx inscribed on the case back. (if this was made after 1975, then you should find 161 variants.) As for the size might seem smaller, it could be that the movement holder ring is not original. But I think everthing is original here. GREAT looking piece. Wish I have one. Enjoy it.


----------



## 104RS

crazyfist said:


> I'm pretty sure that's the correct movement. Caliber AR -141. In fact you should find either 140-xx-xxx or 141-xx-xxx inscribed on the case back. (if this was made after 1975, then you should find 161 variants.) As for the size might seem smaller, it could be that the movement holder ring is not original. But I think everthing is original here. GREAT looking piece. Wish I have one. Enjoy it.


Thank you for your response, crazyfist!
It seems to me like it's the same movement as this watc (which was a 25$ running Enicar), what do you think?
The Enicar Diver is only about 36mm, could that be correct?


----------



## John Kirby

My first Enicar came in the mail today.

Though it's missing the rings of Saturn and is most likely a redial, I'm in love with it. Maybe more so than my Omega.


----------



## Zilladon

Here's my second (of 2) Enicars; it probably won't be my last! 

=Patti


----------



## merl

Zilladon said:


> Here's my second (of 2) Enicars; it probably won't be my last!
> 
> =Patti
> 
> View attachment 1172731


nice catch Patti!


----------



## crazyfist

104RS,

I just realized that the movement is AR-160 series of manual winding watches. The way to spot this is the crown release lever is a "push button" rather than a screw. Thus dating the watch in the 70s. The 36mm size seems right for a 70s watch. As for your new acquisition, the movement does look somewhat corroded, could be that they either originated from a southeast asian country, or have been tested under water. Would like to see the dial side to make further analysis.


----------



## 104RS

crazyfist said:


> 104RS,
> 
> I just realized that the movement is AR-160 series of manual winding watches. The way to spot this is the crown release lever is a "push button" rather than a screw. Thus dating the watch in the 70s. The 36mm size seems right for a 70s watch. As for your new acquisition, the movement does look somewhat corroded, could be that they either originated from a southeast asian country, or have been tested under water. Would like to see the dial side to make further analysis.


Thanks again. The last picture I posted (post #254) is a different movement than in the Sherpa Diver! This is a picture of another Enicar I owned some time ago.
I just tried to find out the differences and so on. 
To which of my posts were you referring in your last post? # 252 or #254? Only post #252 is a picture of the movement in the watch I´m actually on about.

I actually only bought the watch after your post regarding it´s originality, it still has to arrive on my doorsteps.
When it arrives I will definately make some more pictures and would love to hear your opinion about it!


----------



## Zilladon

merl said:


> nice catch Patti!


Thanks merl; I like it because I haven't seen too many others with the same dial (among other reasons as well!)


----------



## hns-panama

That's why I have a watchmaker do it. I just make certain he knows that the tension ring is not disposable. It may need to be reused just in case.

Yes, he knows this. However, I remind him just in case. In my line of work, we measure twice and cut once. He knows that too and smiles.



radger said:


> Do you mean
> That you have to buy an armed acrylic which is pre fitted with its tension ring.
> Then you have to remove this criticaly sized and fitted tension ring.
> Then you take the scavenged ring from the used crystal and fit it to the new crystal for
> which it was never meant or made for?
> 
> Or are you buying a standard acrylic and somehow fitting the used tension ring to this?
> 
> How are you machining the criticaly sized groove for the tension ring to the rim of your
> new crystal?
> 
> If you are fitting used tension rings to crystals for which it was never meant then how can
> you be sure that the tension ring is doing its job?
> 
> Armed acrylics can also be bought with extra wide tension rings......
> Watch Glasses


----------



## radger

hns-panama said:


> That's why I have a watchmaker do it. I just make certain he knows that the tension ring is not disposable.


Oh well, I can only give advice based on standard practice.
If you are instructing your watchmaker to re-use the old tension ring then I'll bet he gives no guarantee as to the
effectiveness of the waterproofing, armed acrylics are supposedly waterproof after all.


----------



## merl

Zilladon said:


> Thanks merl; I like it because I haven't seen too many others with the same dial (among other reasons as well!)


It's a great dial and you were lucky to find a watch that matches your shell!


----------



## Sunday Rider

Zilladon said:


> Here's my second (of 2) Enicars; it probably won't be my last!
> 
> =Patti
> 
> View attachment 1172731
> 
> View attachment 1173221


Very nice watch. You are right, I am sure it won't be your last. You have caught the "disease". Happy Enicar collecting.


----------



## crazyfist

There seems to be a lot of questions regarding Enicar Star Jewel models out of India lately. While some redials are great, it's really a matter of personal preference, but sometimes, we see completely franken watches that are just wrong. This thread has really identified the tell signs but I guess this is a long thread now and people can't really read every post. So here's an updated Enicar Star Jewels collecting 101, plus, it's a chance to show off my humble collection.

First of all, what's Star Jewels? Here are some pics I grabbed from the German forum, this is a stud where the minute wheel goes on:







And next one is found in automatic star jewels only:








So basically, Star Jewels = In-house Enicar movement. Which is really what's great about Enicars in the first place, and the manual winding versions are extremely affordable.

The Star Jewels started to appear on dials in the 1960s with the introduction of AR-140 movements. Later it can be found on AR-160 movements as well. So if you found an Enicar to your liking, and it says Star Jewels on the dial, first, you need to ID the movement. Here's a shot of both movements:









The AR-160 on the right is shinier than AR-140 (left) in this pic but that's not true for all AR-160s. When putting them side by side, there are actually several things one can tell that are different between the two, I've circled the easiest sign to differentiate the two, and that is the crown release system. AR-140 is screw in and AR-160 is push button. Of course, the movement is also marked under the balance, circled below:









Once you've identified the movement, match it with the number found on the caseback, seen below:









If it's a match, viola! You are good to purchase. If the caseback is different, then it's a franken. The same rules applies to the Automatic winding versions.

As for dials and redials, Enicar made many rather sober looking dials for Star Jewels, and just so happens it's what I prefer. And not to bad-mouth Indian redials, they are actually rather interestingly done. But I'd like people to also check out some Chinese sellers, AFAIK, most sellers offer genuine Enicar. All my Star Jewels are from China. Here's my humble collection:

















Here they are strapped:








That's all folks. I hope I had been helpful.


----------



## Sunday Rider

Thanks Crazyfist for that very informative post. Always wondered about the name Star Jewels. Have to admit though of all the Enicars that I love, [ the Star Jewel line is not my favourite .] Edit: this is wrong, as I like the last 3 pictures from Crazyfist and didn't realize they are Star Jewels. My apologies Crazyfist, I should have been reading more thoroughly.


----------



## Marrick

Sunday Rider said:


> Thanks Crazyfist for that very informative post.


+1 :-!


----------



## crazyfist

I'm glad to contribute, Sunday Rider and Marrick.

However, I think I've misused the term "Star Jewels Models" in my previous post and I should perhaps clarify. Star Jewels is not part of a model line. In this particular case, the term is basically a "technical breakthrough" that they put on the dial to advertise the watch. Much like dials with the words "incabloc", "Rotomatic" (or whatever -matic companies come up with), "Super shock", "Anti-magnetic", even "Ultrasonic", etc. These texts do not necessarily translate into what the model is named, but only a brief description of the movement's function or uniqueness. For example, Enicar Sherpa dive watches are also Star Jewels powered. Thanks to Dogan's awesome pictures (totally drool worthy), here we see a Star Jewels (engraved on the rotor) movement in a Sherpa Divette:

















I think only the pre 1960s Enicars were not star jewels. Later in the 80s they went with ETA and FHF. Hope that cleared something up.


----------



## CelsoVasco

Please someone help me identify this clock


----------



## 104RS

crazyfist said:


> I'm glad to contribute, Sunday Rider and Marrick.
> 
> However, I think I've misused the term "Star Jewels Models" in my previous post and I should perhaps clarify. Star Jewels is not part of a model line. In this particular case, the term is basically a "technical breakthrough" that they put on the dial to advertise the watch. Much like dials with the words "incabloc", "Rotomatic" (or whatever -matic companies come up with), "Super shock", "Anti-magnetic", even "Ultrasonic", etc. These texts do not necessarily translate into what the model is named, but only a brief description of the movement's function or uniqueness. For example, Enicar Sherpa dive watches are also Star Jewels powered. Thanks to Dogan's awesome pictures (totally drool worthy), here we see a Star Jewels (engraved on the rotor) movement in a Sherpa Divette:
> 
> View attachment 1176128
> 
> 
> View attachment 1176129
> 
> 
> I think only the pre 1960s Enicars were not star jewels. Later in the 80s they went with ETA and FHF. Hope that cleared something up.


This is one stunning piece. Is it yours, crazyfist? I absolutely love it.


----------



## 104RS

CelsoVasco said:


> View attachment 1176311
> Please someone help me identify this clock


At least take some pictures of the case and the movement. The dial says Star Jewels so it´s probably equipped with a 140 movement, the case will help you tell what´s inside.


----------



## crazyfist

104RS,

Absolutely NOT MY WATCH. I freaking wish! Haha

It's part of Enicar collector extraordinair Dogan's watch,who posted this watch on page 9 of this monstrous thread, alone with the rest of his collection. Go check it out.


----------



## Sunday Rider

Thanks Crazyfist for even greater clarity on the Star Jewels term. That is a beautiful watch and for sure I wouldn't have thought the Star Jewels would be in the movement. The problem with Enicar is each model I see that I haven't seen before, I want to add to the collection......So glad I happened upon this forum.


----------



## 104RS

crazyfist said:


> 104RS,
> 
> Absolutely NOT MY WATCH. I freaking wish! Haha
> 
> It's part of Enicar collector extraordinair Dogan's watch,who posted this watch on page 9 of this monstrous thread, alone with the rest of his collection. Go check it out.


That Super Divette is a very unique piece, like a few other Enicar pieces I have never seen it before.
I already checked out Dogen's collection, I was absolutely blown away by his stunning collection. Simply amazing. All appear to be brand spanking new.
His collection is part of the reason why I fell in love with Enicar ;-)


----------



## 104RS

Crazyfist, as promised here are the pictures of the Sherpa 300 Diver we already spoke about.
The case says Sherpa 300, and according to the back there's 160 movement inside (160-58-02).








View attachment 1177588

View attachment 1177589

View attachment 1177590


----------



## primabaleron

Greetings from Poland


----------



## primabaleron

One more


----------



## primabaleron

And...


----------



## DeKnight2004

Can anyone ID this watch for me? It has a pretty good pricetag on it $45. I usually go with Soviets, so if worth it; this will be my first Swiss.


----------



## hns-panama

Picture of back would be helpful...

If the case is large, then we are probably looking at a cal. 1292 movement.



DeKnight2004 said:


> Can anyone ID this watch for me? It has a pretty good pricetag on it $45. I usually go with Soviets, so if worth it; this will be my first Swiss.
> 
> View attachment 1182191


----------



## DeKnight2004

It just so happens I do have a pic of the back. I'll post one of the movement as well. I thank you so much for your assistance. Where can I learn more about movements?


----------



## crazyfist

bidfun-db Archive: Watch Movements: Enicar 1292

Good quality IMO. 17j and incabloc.

Maybe it's your picture, but in the center there should be a jewel...



DeKnight2004 said:


> It just so happens I do have a pic of the back. I'll post one of the movement as well. I thank you so much for your assistance. Where can I learn more about movements?
> 
> View attachment 1182944
> View attachment 1182945


----------



## hns-panama

First, thought I would say thanks to Crazyfist for starting this thread. The link to his watchmaker in China is rather epic and worth looking at.

Recently, I acquired a Seapearl 600. Dial and case have stories to tell so all I am doing is wearing it. A great conversation piece.

I just received a spare 1010 movement with a rather special dial. The hands are spares for the 600. While the 600 dial is fine for daily wear, this one is a bit to far gone and I may have to commit to a restoration.

The 1010 movement is like a John Deere tractor motor. It just runs while taking a beating. Quite a statement for the company. I found a blog post about servicing the movement that I thought would be good for the thread:

DC's Watches: Enicar AF1010(B) Restoration

As for my recent addition, I can only add that all real dive watches should use fathoms instead feet


----------



## Rybeam

I have been unable to find another Enicar like this one. It is 25 jewel, no date indicator, Ultrasonic, Incubloc. Any and all info welcome. I love not trolling for info to sell. T






hanks All


----------



## hns-panama

Need to see the case back and movement too, if possible.



Rybeam said:


> I have been unable to find another Enicar like this one. It is 25 jewel, no date indicator, Ultrasonic, Incubloc. Any and all info welcome. I love not trolling for info to sell. T
> View attachment 1186227
> hanks All


----------



## crazyfist

hsn-panama, I had learned so much from you and anyone else who contributed valuable information to this thread. I had many times relied on the information here, especially the pictures, as a reference for making a purchase. And I hope the collective information here can contribute the continous popularity of Enicar.

I love the Seapearl 600 model, and am envious of anyone who has one...or several. As these generally cost somewhat expensive per my vintage buying habit, I came across great alternatives. The Super Seapearl models are also EPSA Super Compressor cased, hence the "super" on the dial and on the movement. They are the same size, and uses the same bullet proof AR-1010 movement, and only cost a fraction of the Seapearl 600. I call these Poor Man's Seapearls.

My poor man's Seapearl:







On this model the lugs are also similar to the Seapearl 600.








And of course, the classic Enicar EPSA Super Compressor case.

Poor Man's seapearls:








I now have three poor man's seapearls in two different case shapes. I believe the one on the right has the same case as some Seapearl 600 models.









All three of these came from China for $50 a pop. I think that's a fair price for Super Compressors with in house movement. And before anyone makes a purchase, make sure the case is EPSA, there are some redials out there that puts the "seapearl" on the dial, but with generic screw down case.

Recently, I've neglected to BIN on this beautiful piece:
Vintage Swiss Enicar Super Seapearl 17 Jewels Manual Men's Watch | eBay

Anyone purchase it? You must post pictures of it here if you are reading this!



hns-panama said:


> First, thought I would say thanks to Crazyfist for starting this thread. The link to his watchmaker in China is rather epic and worth looking at.
> 
> Recently, I acquired a Seapearl 600. Dial and case have stories to tell so all I am doing is wearing it. A great conversation piece.
> 
> I just received a spare 1010 movement with a rather special dial. The hands are spares for the 600. While the 600 dial is fine for daily wear, this one is a bit to far gone and I may have to commit to a restoration.
> 
> The 1010 movement is like a John Deere tractor motor. It just runs while taking a beating. Quite a statement for the company. I found a blog post about servicing the movement that I thought would be good for the thread:
> 
> DC's Watches: Enicar AF1010(B) Restoration
> 
> As for my recent addition, I can only add that all real dive watches should use fathoms instead feet


----------



## kazrich

Hello from Southampton ( UK ) . I'm new to the forum and to this great thread. Lots of interesting contributions, information and images !
Not sure if all readers are aware that in 1967 Enicar sponsored Jim Clark ( in my humble opinion the greatest racing driver of all time ).
I keep a couple of period watches associated with ' Gentleman Jim ' and recently acquired the Enicar.
This is the Enicar high tech, money no object advert promoting Jim Clark at the 67 Singapore Grand Prix :-d:-d







Some believe that the watch shown here is a Breitling Top Time, but the triple registers on that model are far too small. I think this watch is the Enicar Sherpa Graph.

I have enlarged the image before too much distortion kicked in and compared it life size on the computer monitor against my own Sherpa.



My initial impression was that the Shepa's lugs were slightly fatter - but when the watch is angled as per the photo they are exactly the same.
The triple register dials are the same size and proportion
The depth of the crystal looks the same
The case immediately beneath the crystal is also slightly beveled as you can just see in the picture

It's impossible to be certain from the quality of the enlargement, but I am pretty sure it's either a Sherpa Graph 300 or an Aqua Graph which looks very similar.

They were both top end Enicar's and featured the same gold plated Valjoux 72 engine as used in the Rolex Daytona.

Anyhow here's mine

Richard


----------



## crazyfist

Wow you must be a huge fan, even got the similar strap to go with it. Theres a good chance he's wearing the same one you have. He's sponsored by Enicar afterall, and Sherpa Graph is their premium model. But there's also an off chance that he's wearing one of mine:

:-d

Edit: upon closer inspection, I'm pretty sure those lugs are Sherpa Graph lugs. And I'm extremely envious.


----------



## John Kirby

Any info on this watch?

Only two photos sadly and no movement photo.... I'm interested in getting it.


----------



## kazrich

crazyfist said:


> Wow you must be a huge fan, even got the similar strap to go with it. Theres a good chance he's wearing the same one you have. He's sponsored by Enicar afterall, and Sherpa Graph is their premium model. But there's also an off chance that he's wearing one of mine:
> 
> :-d
> 
> Edit: upon closer inspection, I'm pretty sure those lugs are Sherpa Graph lugs. And I'm extremely envious.


Well crazyfist Iv'e just noticed that your watch has a 500 register on the tachymetre - most seem to have 300 and I have seen them with 1000. Some don't even print the word tachymetre. This makes buying a Sherpa Graph a bit of a minefield.
Firstly I thought some of the watches for sale were wrong, made up from bits or tampered with. I soon realized that the finished detailing on this model vary considerably. 
Dial. Mine is black, but I have seen them white, silver, champagne and mid grey. Why do they call them Panda dials ( I never saw a panda with a black face and white eyes )
Minute Hands. Some have 'baton' hands with yellow or orange lume tips. Others have parallel hands with partial lume.
Second Hands. Mine is like fine wire with a red circular tip. Others have solid bright orange or red hands
Tachymetre background. Some look charcoal / black, others are mid grey, others are white and don't say tachymetre.
Registers.Some look silver but I am pretty sure mine is light cream ?
Just to add to the confusion you have the Enicar Aqua Graph. Initially they look like a Sherpa Graph with a rotating outer bezel, but ------ Some don't have a bezel ? This makes them look like a Sherpa Graph.
Is this a Sherpa made for deep sea diving 
Engine. They all seem to use the Valjoux 72 movement ------- I think :roll:
Enicar must have realized that they had a design icon and changed or ' updated ' it to sustain interest in it's long production run. 
I would be interested to know if this was the case or could you have one made to order ?
If in 1967 I went to my local Enicar dealer and specified a ' quiet ' Sherpa Graph for work in a kind of mono tone finish and without the word tachymetre, would they have made this beauty ? ( a real one , not photo shopped )


----------



## crazyfist

Hey Kazrich,

Actually I don't have a Sherpa graph of any kind. Most Sherpa graphs, or Sherpa models are EPSA super Compressor cased. The ones I have are standard issues screw down case backs. The cases are probably made by Enicar. Not all Enicar chronographs are Sherpas, and some don't have tachometers at all. In my experience most chronographs are authentic, it's the sherpa guides you have to watch out for. Here we see some old ads of my chronos, and as you can see, they are not given a model name, simply Enicar Chronograph:
















The sherpa chronos are extremely sought after, therefore can be pricy, i have not had the chance to purchase one yet, its considered my holy grail. but here are my humble non Sherpas:


----------



## kazrich

Thanks for all that info crazyfist !
Your chrono's don't look humble to me - they look great.They all have a slightly Heuer / Autavia look to them. Does the one with the blue strap and date function have a blue dial ? 
Tell me, are they all late 60's / early 70 's watches and what movements do they use.


----------



## crazyfist

kazrich said:


> Thanks for all that info crazyfist !
> Your chrono's don't look humble to me - they look great.They all have a slightly Heuer / Autavia look to them. Does the one with the blue strap and date function have a blue dial ?
> Tell me, are they all late 60's / early 70 's watches and what movements do they use.


Yes, it's blue dial, with original Enicar strap and buckle. This model uses the valjoux 23, while the other two uses the valjoux 72, as you mentioned, the same as the early Rolex Daytona, and they are all from the same time period. And speaking of Daytona, the black subdials and white face Daytona is perhaps the most collectible as actor Paul Newman is pictured numerous times for wearing one, this is known today as the Paul Newman Daytona, and is the correct nomenclature for "Penda Dial". But this term is later used loosely for chronos with contrasting colored subdials and face. Hope this clarifies your Penda quandary.

Btw, welcome to the forum! That was a great first post. Hope you stick around. And post more pictures!


----------



## Zilladon

crazyfist said:


> Hey Kazrich,
> 
> The sherpa chronos are extremely sought after, therefore can be pricy, i have not had the chance to purchase one yet, its considered my holy grail. but here are my humble non Sherpas:
> View attachment 1195396


These 3 are gorgeous!! Sherpa or non-Sherpa, I'd take any one of them in a heartbeat! :-!

=Patti


----------



## Sunday Rider

Beautiful Chronos Crazyfist and Kazrich. I keep looking for these, but they are rare indeed.


----------



## Sunday Rider

Here's a senior citizen of the Enicar clan:


----------



## kazrich

Well Sunday Rider I think you might be right about the ' Clan '
Looks like Gallet, Racine and Enicar are from the same gene pool. 
Is that Racine a military watch ? It looks quite small and delicate and reminds me of my Gallet military from
the 50's / 60's I believe. By todays standards it's a small device with 16 mm. lugs. The movement looks basic but it still keeps good time
The Racine looks much older.

Richard


----------



## Sunday Rider

Kazrich you are pretty sharp. Gallet is who made the movement and that is what is signed inside the cover. The dust cover and the back of the watch are not signed. It is a military watch, but I am not sure of the year. It does keep great time. It is also heavy. The measurement is 17mm between the lugs and 38mm long. I like your band. I've tried a leather one this and it didn't look right. Where did you get your band?


----------



## ANev

Here is an Vintage Enicar I acquired on ebay. Offered it to my wife. Here on display with hers Omega Constellation.


----------



## Shum

I found this little lady Sherpa. It needs som cosmetic work but shows good time.


----------



## merl

Shum said:


> View attachment 1199973
> 
> I found this little lady Sherpa. It needs som cosmetic work but shows good time.


Looks nice, looking forward to the cosmetic work results!


----------



## kazrich

I like your band. I've tried a leather one this and it didn't look right. Where did you get your band? [/QUOTE]

This is a Nato nylon band. Ebay sells them for next to nothing.

It's one continuous band that threads through both lugs and sits under the watch case. If one of the lug pins drops out the other lug pin will keep the watch attached to your wrist.
Great if you're going into battle, but a pain putting on and taking off. Also the buckle ends up sitting in a weird place half way round your wrist. James Bond once wore one on his Rolex.
Being nylon also good for divers. Looks sort of trendy though.
Richard


----------



## Sunday Rider

kazrich said:


> I like your band. I've tried a leather one this and it didn't look right. Where did you get your band?


This is a Nato nylon band. Ebay sells them for next to nothing.

It's one continuous band that threads through both lugs and sits under the watch case. If one of the lug pins drops out the other lug pin will keep the watch attached to your wrist.
Great if you're going into battle, but a pain putting on and taking off. Also the buckle ends up sitting in a weird place half way round your wrist. James Bond once wore one on his Rolex.
Being nylon also good for divers. Looks sort of trendy though.
Richard[/QUOTE]
Thanks for the details. Cheers!


----------



## hns-panama

Just a little correction...

The real Bond strap story is told here:

Welcome To RolexMagazine.com...Home Of Jake's Rolex World Magazine..Optimized for iPad and iPhone: The Real James Bond Watchstrap Comes To Life

I just bought another similar strap and will put on my Hellas diver and take the vintage rubber dive strap and put it on the Seapearl 600. Not sure if it will work though. The rubber strap has curved ends. It may look a bit strange with the curved lugs. We shall see...



kazrich said:


> I like your band. I've tried a leather one this and it didn't look right. Where did you get your band?


This is a Nato nylon band. Ebay sells them for next to nothing.

It's one continuous band that threads through both lugs and sits under the watch case. If one of the lug pins drops out the other lug pin will keep the watch attached to your wrist.
Great if you're going into battle, but a pain putting on and taking off. Also the buckle ends up sitting in a weird place half way round your wrist. James Bond once wore one on his Rolex.
Being nylon also good for divers. Looks sort of trendy though.
Richard[/QUOTE]


----------



## Hartmut Richter

I don't think that either of those two movements were made by Gallet - they are probably both Fontainmelon (FHF) movements. Yours is likely a Cal. 28 or 281 derivative:

bidfun-db Archiv: Uhrwerke: FHF 281

...and the other looks like a Cal. 70 or derivative:

bidfun-db Archiv: Uhrwerke: FHF 70

The precise calibre codes should, of course, be under the balance wheels. For which you may have to remove the movement holder ring in at least the first watch.

Hartmut Richter


----------



## Sunday Rider

Hartmut Richter said:


> I don't think that either of those two movements were made by Gallet - they are probably both Fontainmelon (FHF) movements. Yours is likely a Cal. 28 or 281 derivative:
> 
> bidfun-db Archiv: Uhrwerke: FHF 281
> 
> ...and the other looks like a Cal. 70 or derivative:
> 
> bidfun-db Archiv: Uhrwerke: FHF 70
> 
> The precise calibre codes should, of course, be under the balance wheels. For which you may have to remove the movement holder ring in at least the first watch.
> 
> Hartmut Richter


That is very interesting. I assumed that the movement was by Gallet. I will take the cover off once more and see what is there. This has been an education. So are you saying these movements were made by someone else for Gallet, Like ETA made movements for the later date Enicars?


----------



## kazrich

I think that would make sense. I would imagine that a military contract could involve considerable quantities and the specification would be different to
a private watch being sold by a specialist retailer. No need for the movement to be ' interesting ' or look pretty. Watch would need to be sturdy and keep good time.
It would seem that many famous companies bought in movements from outside specialist and then might have ' tweeked ' them. The Enicar Sherpa Graph comes with a Valjoux 72 movement which I believe was also
used in the early Rolex Daytona as well as other big name watches.


----------



## Hartmut Richter

Personally, I am not aware of Gallet producing any movement of their own, at least not under their own name. They set up the movement (and watch) maker Excelsior Park who actually did produce a non-chronograph movement (Cal. 5 in 10.5''' or 5C in 11.5''') but that's about it. Since they then had no alternative, they would have used generic movements for everything else. Remember also that generic movements were and are not prominently marked so it was and is easy and common practice for the "end user" to put his name on the movement in a place where everyone can see it.

bidfun-db Archive: Watch Movements : Excelsior 5

Hartmut Richter


----------



## kazrich

Well Hartmut, I'm not sure that I understand.
Are you saying that the worlds oldest clock and watch maker ( apparently established in 1466 ) have not made any movements of their own ?
My Gallet Multichron 12 is a triple register chronograph and uses an Excelsior Park 40-68 movement. Gallet seem to consider this movement as ' In House ' as they financed
Excelsior Park and were apparently partners .


----------



## Hartmut Richter

I am sure that Gallet made their own movements many decades ago when the world relied largely on clocks and pocket watches. I am not aware of any Gallet *wrist watch* calibres ever made. Of course, if you regard Excelsior Park as equivalent to Gallet, their movements count as Gallet in house movements. However, to my knowledge, the two were never one company but always separate and for a time cooperating. Gallet never actually founded Excelsior Park but probably gave them the impetus for starting movement production which were used mainly by the two companies. I would therefore not regard EP movements as Gallet in house calibres.

From the Gallet website (http://www.galletwatch.com/new_time_line.html):

"1882


​A *strategic partnership* is formed with Jules Jeanneret & Fils, to supply mechanisms for Gallet's professional use line of hand-held timers and pocket chronographs.

.....

1918

Jeanneret-Brehm begins manufacturing under the company name Excelsior Park. Deriving the name from Jenneret-Brehm's previously registered "Excelsior" trademark, the English variation of the French word for "park" is utilized at the prompting of Gallet to support the collaborative efforts of the two companies in their marketing focus on the American consumer. The *cooperative relationship* of Excelsior Park and Gallet leads to the development of a number of time recording mechanisms, including the calibre 40. These new chronograph movements are utilized almost exclusively in Gallet and Excelsior Park wristwatches, with a small number supplied to the Girard Perregaux and Zenith companies when production capabilities allowed."

As one can see, the companies remained distinct.

Hartmut Richter


----------



## Sunday Rider

Well I took off the back, but cannot see the name under the balance wheel, and that is the extent of my talent at tinkering with watches. There are the three letters JXR on the "plate" that holds down the balance wheel. If those letters give any clue. I will have to dig up another old one and get more of this fascinating history.


----------



## Zilladon

Here's another Seapearl:

=Patti


----------



## Marrick

Sunday Rider said:


> Well I took off the back, but cannot see the name under the balance wheel, and that is the extent of my talent at tinkering with watches. There are the three letters JXR on the "plate" that holds down the balance wheel. If those letters give any clue.


JXR is indeed the import (into the USA) for Racine/Enicar Ranfft Watches, US Import Codes


----------



## Sunday Rider

Marrick said:


> JXR is indeed the import (into the USA) for Racine/Enicar Ranfft Watches, US Import Codes


So watches for different markets (countries) have these codes etched at the factory?


----------



## Marrick

AFAIK it was only the USA that required these codes - but yes, put on at the factory.


----------



## Sunday Rider

Thanks for the insight Marrick, and that link.


----------



## Sunday Rider

Well I went on line on the site here with the vendors and bought some NATO straps. Will see what happens and post my shopping experience here. The shipping was reasonable as well. On Ebay the band was cheap but shipping was outrageous. I used vendor Market Straps The online purchase was very easy. They are out of Spain.


----------



## Sunday Rider

Zilladon said:


> Here's another Seapearl:
> 
> =Patti
> 
> View attachment 1203843


That band looks great with this Enicar. was the dial redone?


----------



## kazrich

Does anyone know if the Enicar brand is still trading or are they manufacturing for someone else?
You tube shows this 2012 advert Enicar 2012 Ad Campaign Making of (Mini Yang
but they seem to have practically nil web presence. They do direct you to an email address at
[email protected] but simply don't respond.
Richard


----------



## Sunday Rider

I was on that site a year or two ago and it was active, but with more modern Enicar watches and some history.


----------



## Sunday Rider

Sunday Rider said:


> Well I went on line on the site here with the vendors and bought some NATO straps. Will see what happens and post my shopping experience here. The shipping was reasonable as well. On Ebay the band was cheap but shipping was outrageous. I used vendor Market Straps The online purchase was very easy. They are out of Spain.


I ordered the straps and they were shipped a couple of days later and I received them on Friday. So less than 1 week. That's great service, and the straps look great. Just in case anyone wants to use them.


----------



## msm5

This thread has been an interesting read. I had never heard of this make until a few weeks ago when I picked up a non-functional women's Enicar at an antique shop. It doesn't run, but the dial is in good shape and very cool. Not sure what to do with it, but for $5, I thought I'd figure something out. Sorry for the substandard pictures.


----------



## Sunday Rider

Hey msm5 that's a great deal, it is a very nice dial too. I find the Enicar Duraluminum back have a lot of wear and tear. They sure are lighter though. Hope you get it working without too much cost. Great find.


----------



## hns-panama

One of the not-so-nice aspects of Enicars are the fakes and less than original's for sale on eBay and elsewhere. Here is one that is screaming fake to me but I will stand corrected if there is a catalog shot:

Enicar UFO Extra Flat Anti Magnetic Shock Protected Swiss Made Wrist Watch | eBay

Case back is all that looks even remotely real. Shaved off the reference numbers. Dial is refinished. Crown is generic. Note no pic of movement...

The best we can hope for is when someone does a search on a Enicar UFO EXTRA-FLAT Anti-Magnetic Shock-Protected Swiss Made Wrist Watch, they will be educated by this thread.


----------



## hns-panama

International Enicar Watch Repair Guru List

Given the global nature of today's market, I think it would be real good resource to have a list of watchmakers who know Enicars, are not afraid of working on them, willing to actually solve problems rather than just replace parts. An added extra is someone who knows about Super Compressor Sherpa cases and their idiosyncrasies!

I have become a bit wary of sending out the Seapearl 600 for its servicing, etc. So having a list of solid pros who can service the movements, not ruin a Compressor case, deal with obscure parts, etc. would be a great service for all of us owners.

Please do list your recommendations including their contact information.


----------



## WatchFred

recent arrival:


----------



## Caleamon

WatchFred said:


> recent arrival:


Looks great! What year is it?


----------



## Raymond9010

Thanks for starting this thread, it brought back plenty of childhood memories for me, my father had a Enicar watch back in the 80s, he also had a Titoni, to him it was one of his priced possession, i didn't know what he was on about back then, i often see him winding it and looking at it. now i understand, i think he still have the watch, he doesn't wear it any more.


----------



## dasmi

Can someone suggest what the larger models would be?


----------



## HammyFan

Hi,
this is a great thread. I learned a lot about Enicars. I have a Sherpa Guide that is in ok shape but missing the inside bezel slider (not sure what it's called). It's been hard to locate a new or used one. Any suggestions out there? Also, I just got this Sherpa Date. I love it. I can't find any info on it. Can anyone tell me more about it? The crystal is real cloudy. Any fixes for that or should I look for a new one? If so, any suggestions where to find one? Thanks!
















Thx
Sorry, photos would not attach, so here is the link to the Auctiva photos from the eBay listing.

Auctiva Image Hosting


----------



## hns-panama

Nice pick up on the Sherpa Date.

What is case reference number? The photo of the back is partially blocked.

With that, we can better determine the proper crystal. (Though you may have to find a real watchmaker to sort that out. A new one is probably required. Do not lose or otherwise screw the the tension ring. A number of the Enicars I have seem to use custom rings.

Highly suggest your collectable SD be serviced by a real pro.

As for the Guide, please post some photos so we are certain what we are talking about. I think you mean the inner 24 hour ring.



HammyFan said:


> Hi,
> this is a great thread. I learned a lot about Enicars. I have a Sherpa Guide that is in ok shape but missing the inside bezel slider (not sure what it's called). It's been hard to locate a new or used one. Any suggestions out there? Also, I just got this Sherpa Date. I love it. I can't find any info on it. Can anyone tell me more about it? The crystal is real cloudy. Any fixes for that or should I look for a new one? If so, any suggestions where to find one? Thanks!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thx
> Sorry, photos would not attach, so here is the link to the Auctiva photos from the eBay listing.
> 
> Auctiva Image Hosting


----------



## dasmi

I'm thinking of grabbing this one on ebay. You all know way more about these watches than I...is there any obvious reason I shouldn't pick this one up, besides the case being rough?


----------



## HammyFan

hns-panama said:


> Nice pick up on the Sherpa Date.
> 
> What is case reference number? The photo of the back is partially blocked.
> 
> With that, we can better determine the proper crystal. (Though you may have to find a real watchmaker to sort that out. A new one is probably required. Do not lose or otherwise screw the the tension ring. A number of the Enicars I have seem to use custom rings.
> 
> Highly suggest your collectable SD be serviced by a real pro.
> 
> As for the Guide, please post some photos so we are certain what we are talking about. I think you mean the inner 24 hour ring.


The case number on the Sherpa Date is back of the case is 314962. the number on the inside of the back is 1-59 (is that the date it was made?) the markings on the movement is AR 1035 EZR. As far as the Guide, yes, the inner 24 hour ring is missing. I could also use a new crystal for it. The back of the case has the same 314962 number as the Date, as well as 148-35-01A and 1331505. Does that help?
Also, the Date has a Hadley USA riveted stretch band. I assume it's not original, am I correct? Thanks for your help.
wayne


----------



## crazyfist

Dasmi, based on the pics it looks pretty solid. The movement is AR-1010, one of the most robust Enicar movement. I've started to service Enicar movements myself and I've noticed the 1010s I've purchased has little to no issues. The case might be in rough shape, but if you put it on NATO strap or bund strap you won't have a problem. And of the price is right I'd say go for it.


----------



## dasmi

Any idea what the size of the case may be? The seller doesn't mention it. 

Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk 2


----------



## crazyfist

Judging by the year (mid 50s), I'd say 29-30mm.


----------



## HammyFan

hns-panama said:


> Nice pick up on the Sherpa Date.
> 
> What is case reference number? The photo of the back is partially blocked.
> 
> With that, we can better determine the proper crystal. (Though you may have to find a real watchmaker to sort that out. A new one is probably required. Do not lose or otherwise screw the the tension ring. A number of the Enicars I have seem to use custom rings.
> 
> Highly suggest your collectable SD be serviced by a real pro.
> 
> As for the Guide, please post some photos so we are certain what we are talking about. I think you mean the inner 24 hour ring.


The case number on the Sherpa Date on the back of the case is 314962. the number on the inside of the back is 1-59 (is that the date it was made?) the markings on the movement are AR 1035 EZR. As far as the Guide, yes, the inner 24 hour ring is missing. I could also use a new crystal for it. The back of the case has the same 314962 number as the Date, as well as 148-35-01A and1331505. Does that help?
Also, the Date has a Hadley USA riveted stretch band. I assume it's not original, am I correct? Thanks for your help. Wayne


----------



## hns-panama

That first number is the patent for the Super Compressor case. Yes, 1-59 is the manufacture date the Sherpa Date. The AR1035 is based on the AS1555N movement. Very nice. Enicar based a Chronometer on that one before developing the Supertest cal. 1124/5.

148-35-01A is the Guide's case reference number. The 148 tells me you most likely have a cal. 1146 movement. 35-01A is the specific case number

1331505 is most likely the serial number.

The ring is best sourced through another Guide donor watch as those rings are unobtainium for now. The crystal is best polished if possible as they are very tough to source an original. However, there is hope for you. See this thread for an aftermarket solution:

https://www.watchuseek.com/f11/enicar-sherpa-guide-433520-3.html

Correct on the band.

Good luck.



HammyFan said:


> The case number on the Sherpa Date on the back of the case is 314962. the number on the inside of the back is 1-59 (is that the date it was made?) the markings on the movement are AR 1035 EZR. As far as the Guide, yes, the inner 24 hour ring is missing. I could also use a new crystal for it. The back of the case has the same 314962 number as the Date, as well as 148-35-01A and1331505. Does that help?
> Also, the Date has a Hadley USA riveted stretch band. I assume it's not original, am I correct? Thanks for your help. Wayne


----------



## HammyFan

hns-panama said:


> That first number is the patent for the Super Compressor case. Yes, 1-59 is the manufacture date the Sherpa Date. The AR1035 is based on the AS1555N movement. Very nice. Enicar based a Chronometer on that one before developing the Supertest cal. 1124/5.
> 
> 148-35-01A is the Guide's case reference number. The 148 tells me you most likely have a cal. 1146 movement. 35-01A is the specific case number
> 
> 1331505 is most likely the serial number.
> 
> The ring is best sourced through another Guide donor watch as those rings are unobtainium for now. The crystal is best polished if possible as they are very tough to source an original. However, there is hope for you. See this thread for an aftermarket solution:
> 
> https://www.watchuseek.com/f11/enicar-sherpa-guide-433520-3.html
> 
> Correct on the band.
> 
> Good luck.


Thank you thank you. Great info on the crystal and kind of suspected the answer on the inner ring. Not easy to find You are correct on the Guide, it is a 1146. Yes, I do have an experienced watchmaker. I mostly collect Hamilton, Omegas, Zodiacs, but I'm really impressed with the Enicars I have. Again, thanks for the info. The search begins, but that's part of the joy of collecting. Wayne


----------



## Sunday Rider

Thought I would a couple of non-round Enicars.

Sherpa Date

















DDS 240



























Both keep wonderful time and have Enicar s/s bands. Not sure if the band for the Sherpa Date is the original or not.


----------



## hns-panama

Nice looking. Personally, I would have the case rechromed (Nickle if you are not allergic). See this page for an idea about rechroming:

Restoring & Replating a Watch Case [8/8/00] - TimeZone

Also, from a thread that I've been following:

https://www.watchuseek.com/f11/my-vintage-atlantic-worldmaster-21-jewels-restoration-906157-2.html

Always nice to see the results...

A couple of caveats though. The prep work is either your game or not. If you don't get it right, the results will be less than satisfactory. Also, the cost of re-plating plus a service will probably be more than what the watch is worth -- for now. Enicars are gaining more attention in the market place. I've seen prices move upwards over the past several years. Note: Under no circumstances am I implying they are an investment 

Either you like the watch or you don't. I think it has a lot of character.

Good luck in whatever you choose.



dasmi said:


> I'm thinking of grabbing this one on ebay. You all know way more about these watches than I...is there any obvious reason I shouldn't pick this one up, besides the case being rough?


----------



## hns-panama

An eBay Enicar Buyer's Guide.

Enicar Watch Buyer's Guide | eBay

Thought it was needed so I wrote it. If anyone has a suggestion or correction, please do let me know.

The "verrrry rare" and "UFO" listings were getting very annoying


----------



## dasmi

I ended up not bidding due to the small case size. I'm looking for something in the 36mm or larger range.


----------



## hns-panama

Then look for a 1145 or newer movement as they tend to be larger case models.

The Sherpa Guides, OPS, Jets, etc., are certainly in that range.



dasmi said:


> I ended up not bidding due to the small case size. I'm looking for something in the 36mm or larger range.


----------



## Sunday Rider

hns-panama said:


> An eBay Enicar Buyer's Guide.
> 
> Enicar Watch Buyer's Guide | eBay
> 
> Thought it was needed so I wrote it. If anyone has a suggestion or correction, please do let me know.
> 
> The "verrrry rare" and "UFO" listings were getting very annoying


Very nice write up. It is good to know what the abbreviations stand for. Thanks for writing that up.


----------



## kazrich

Did that get your attention !

This thread is now on page 35 of the vintage and pocket watches section. I want to know how they are going to fit page 45 into the titles when it arrives.
So to pad it out I thought I might contribute a bit of Enicar nonsense.
A friend recently asked what watch I was wearing. I told him it was an Enicar Sherpa. He asked if it came from the Webuyanycar.com people ( they offer junk money for your used car in the UK )
No I said Enicar not any car - Forget it - it's an Omega








I digress.
Sherpa Graphs were produced with many slightly different dials and hands. The main sweeping seconds hand is sometimes red or orange and is bold, racy and business like . 
Some have a more delicate wire like hand with a red blob not far from the tip. Some of these blobs are sort of heart shaped and others, like mine are circular.
Well after owning my watch for quite a few months , Dumbo has only just discovered why these artistic blobs exist !

Take a look at the Enicar Saturn ring on the dial



Click the chrono pusher and reset the seconds hand to 12 and observe where the red blob lands.



We now have a red planet !

Not a lot of people know that. Trouble is - not a lot of people care ! :-d


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## Sunday Rider

Kazrich, that is an awesome piece of information. Not sure I would have recognized it if I had one. Now I want to have one. But I will not hold my breath...Seems to me these watches are just getting up there in price.


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## crazyfist

dasmi said:


> I ended up not bidding due to the small case size. I'm looking for something in the 36mm or larger range.


Referring to my original post, Enicar is one of those brands who made larger case sizes in the 70s. The most common is the AR-160 Ocean Pearl cases edit: 36 - 38mm large. I took some pictures of my vintage Enicars next to my more modern watches, so you can see just how they fare up.

This is next to the modern Hamilton Khaki, which is edit: approx 39mm.








This is next to a modern day 7750:








Various Enicars compared to a Longines a HydroConquest behemoth, _the_ thickest watch I own, but you can see the dial face is not too shabby in size:








Of course, the V72 Chrono is pretty big, the size is slightly smaller than my modern Chronos, I'd imagine the Sherpa graph would be up to par:








Lastly, the dual crown divers are perhaps the biggest they offer, the largest is 42mm, bigger than the largest modern watch I own, the Khaki Navy is a modern day interpretation of inner bezel dual crown GMTs:









So if you enjoy larger cases on vintage watches, can't go wrong with Enicars.


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## WatchFred

joy indeed.


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## crazyfist

After over a year of lusting over the pictures on this thread, I finally obtained my holy grail, the sherpa graph! I could not be happier!

Here are some quick shots:



















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## WatchFred

a perfect pair, well done !


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## Sunday Rider

Oh man this thread is now killing me. So you guys are the ones bidding up the Sherpas on Ebay  Beautiful watches, now what are you going to do Crazyfist?


----------



## Sunday Rider

Here's one, lower in the food chain.










Keeps great time, and all that it needed was a cleaning.
I am really starting to like these NATO bands. Makes a watch so much lighter.


----------



## kazrich

Very nice and congratulations crazyfist . What a collection !
Your triple reg chrono looks quite petite compared to the Sherpa Graph and Super Dive.
Don't you think Sherpa's are quite heavy watches - at least you know if they have fallen from or been nicked off your wrist :-d
In the sixties The Hollies used to sing " Heavy makes you happy " - Maybe they were wearing Sherpa's ;-)


----------



## kazrich

Looking good Sunday Rider. Nice NATO style strap but might benefit from a good rub down with a bit of military spit and trench mud and
a strategically placed dollop of tank oil ........ But maybe just on the strap .

A watch with a Nato is hard to photograph unless it's on a flat surface. If you stand them up the straps are so light
that the watch keeps falling over


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## crazyfist

Sunday Rider said:


> Oh man this thread is now killing me. So you guys are the ones bidding up the Sherpas on Ebay  Beautiful watches, now what are you going to do Crazyfist?


I think there is still a lot of joy to be had with Enicar after the grail acquisition. I have a lot of projects that I'm really looking forward to complete. I just ordered three movements from vacheron_nl, looking forward to restore some of the pieces I got for cheap. Here are some pics of the parts I have from fixing Enicars, nothing spectacular, they are in a Ferrero Rocher chocolate box:










Second from left on the top row is awaiting part from Netherlands (vacheron_nl). The pallet fork pinion broke, I find this is very common with 50s Enicars.










Here are two complete AR-167s, loose cannon pinion, very common in AR-14x and AR-16x series of watches. Surprisingly the 50s Enicars rarely have this problem. Also, bidirectional winding mechanisms on AR-14x and AR-16x sometimes dysfunction and become unidirectional, this is the second most common problems with these watches. I think this is why later in the 70s Enicar made AR-16xD series, which is unidirectional to begin with, but it's overly complicated.



















Here's an overview of my spare parts:










I think it's great to stick with one inhouse brand, this way I've eventually come across most of the calibers and can save movements parts for future repairs, overtime I can buy really cheap broken Enicars that no one bids, and fix them for my own enjoyment 

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## Sunday Rider

Hi Crazyfist, I see that you are going to be busy for a long time. Is watch repair a hobby for you, or a profession? You sure know your way around them For some reason I like the looks of the Enicar and the story of make. I found it by accident as I was looking for parts to repair my grandfather's Omega pocket watch. No one would repair it, so I had to find parts on Ebay and then this one seller had an Enicar watch, that I found fascinating, so bid on it and won it. I've been hooked ever since, that was 6 years ago.


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## Sunday Rider

kazrich said:


> Looking good Sunday Rider. Nice NATO style strap but might benefit from a good rub down with a bit of military spit and trench mud and
> a strategically placed dollop of tank oil ........ But maybe just on the strap .
> 
> A watch with a Nato is hard to photograph unless it's on a flat surface. If you stand them up the straps are so light
> that the watch keeps falling over


It sure is stiff, I think I am going to have to tape it to my car tire and drive around for a while to give it that worn in look after I add all the ingredients you mention above;-). You can have a couple of bands and keep switching watches as long as they are the correct width. So far I am finding 18 and 20mm are what I need for the watches I have.


----------



## kazrich

Just stumbled across this interesting article re the Sherpa Super Dive and Chronoswiss automatic movements.
Very clear and easy to understand ( for the mechanical wizards on this forum ) :roll:

Please pay attention as i will be asking questions later 

The 70's Watch: The Enicar Sherpa Super Dive and the Chronoswiss Regulateur - Part 1 - TimeZone


----------



## crazyfist

Surely no self respected watchmaker stores his precious parts in a Ferrero Rocher chocolate box. I am an amateur hobbyist, and in all honesty, I've broken more watches than I've fixed... 

I started trying to fix watches on my own since I moved back to the States from China, where I worked for 4 years. I grew accustomed in having my watches serviced for 50 RMB (roughly 8 dollars). And I could not adjust to the service cost in the US no matter how much I make, especially for a watch that cost 8 dollars to begin with. So I just said screw it, or rather unscrew it, I bought the Bergeons and started to work on them on my own.

I think it's a wonderful hobby. I learn about history and I advocate "patience" to everyone around me.



Sunday Rider said:


> Hi Crazyfist, I see that you are going to be busy for a long time. Is watch repair a hobby for you, or a profession? You sure know your way around them For some reason I like the looks of the Enicar and the story of make. I found it by accident as I was looking for parts to repair my grandfather's Omega pocket watch. No one would repair it, so I had to find parts on Ebay and then this one seller had an Enicar watch, that I found fascinating, so bid on it and won it. I've been hooked ever since, that was 6 years ago.


----------



## crazyfist

kazrich said:


> Very nice and congratulations crazyfist . What a collection !
> Your triple reg chrono looks quite petite compared to the Sherpa Graph and Super Dive.
> Don't you think Sherpa's are quite heavy watches - at least you know if they have fallen from or been nicked off your wrist :-d
> In the sixties The Hollies used to sing " Heavy makes you happy " - Maybe they were wearing Sherpa's ;-)


I have rather girly wrists so yeah, the Sherpa graph is pretty hefty for my vintage taste. Ideally I like watches 36-38mm, the Sherpa jet is the perfect size for me. A while ago I happened upon a nos jet at a store in Beverley Hills 90210, it was outrageously overpriced, they asked me to give a counteroffer and I cut down 70%. The salesman went to the back, and came out 2 minutes later and agreed. I was overjoyed.


















Still has the sticker on the case back.

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----------



## crazyfist

kazrich said:


> Just stumbled across this interesting article re the Sherpa Super Dive and Chronoswiss automatic movements.
> Very clear and easy to understand ( for the mechanical wizards on this forum ) :roll:
> 
> Please pay attention as i will be asking questions later
> 
> The 70's Watch: The Enicar Sherpa Super Dive and the Chronoswiss Regulateur - Part 1 - TimeZone


Haha, very interesting to see this article here again because I happened to post the link back in the 3rd or 4th page of this monstrous thread. Just goes to show how far this thread has come.

I've read this article numerous time and will be happy to answer any questions. Granted I don't have a Chronoswiss with Enicar inside...now that I read this again, I'm very very...very tempted.

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## hns-panama

Terrific find.

I believe you use vegetable oil to remove the purple coating.



crazyfist said:


> I have rather girly wrists so yeah, the Sherpa graph is pretty hefty for my vintage taste. Ideally I like watches 36-38mm, the Sherpa jet is the perfect size for me. A while ago I happened upon a nos jet at a store in Beverley Hills 90210, it was outrageously overpriced, they asked me to give a counteroffer and I cut down 70%. The salesman went to the back, and came out 2 minutes later and agreed. I was overjoyed.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Still has the sticker on the case back.
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk - now Free


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## Sunday Rider

crazyfist said:


> Surely no self respected watchmaker stores his precious parts in a Ferrero Rocher chocolate box. I am an amateur hobbyist, and in all honesty, I've broken more watches than I've fixed...
> 
> I started trying to fix watches on my own since I moved back to the States from China, where I worked for 4 years. I grew accustomed in having my watches serviced for 50 RMB (roughly 8 dollars). And I could not adjust to the service cost in the US no matter how much I make, especially for a watch that cost 8 dollars to begin with. So I just said screw it, or rather unscrew it, I bought the Bergeons and started to work on them on my own.
> 
> I think it's a wonderful hobby. I learn about history and I advocate "patience" to everyone around me.


The chocolate box shows that you are resourceful!! I've bought the books, but don't have the nerve to wreck a watch yet. But I guess I should pick up some tools and give it a go on some of the basket cases. I've wrecked a few mechanical things in the garage and house, but am too ham fisted to work on something so intricate.


----------



## hns-panama

Hi,

Thought I'd share the finished Seapearl 600. See the photos from earlier in this thread.

For the record, I used the larger of the Seapearl 600 crystals I bought. It was G-S PA463-9 and the case ref. number is 100/61-aSN. I used a white trim ring from a Stella Armed WRA302.

























Cheers,

Hunter


----------



## southernstar07

Beautiful pieces! Will share my humble Enicar collection soon, though it's not as substantial as the others posted here. I really like the design of the brand


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## crazyfist

hns-panama said:


> For the record, I used the larger of the Seapearl 600 crystals I bought. It was G-S PA463-9 and the case ref. number is 100/61-aSN. I used a white trim ring from a Stella Armed WRA302.


Hi hsn-panama,

It looks great and congrats! I have a problem with my seapearl. The crystal came loose and I glued it to secure it. The reflector ring is also small, or smaller because it has been cut (sanctioned my me...stupid decision,I know)... Here's a pic, you can see there is a gap between the dial and the reflector ring:










Well my first question is do you know the actual size of the crystal that goes on to the seapearl? And where did you buy the reflector ring? The case ref for my watch is 100/61BaS. Thanks!

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## hns-panama

Hi Crazyfist,

Nice Super.

To answer your question, I measured the diameter of the original crystal then the case where the crystal fits. The opening is 30.1 if memory serves.

I ordered two Seapearl 600 crystals -- one was 30.15mm and the other was 30.65mm. The 30.65mm worked well with the Stella ring.

I suspect it is the same as mine at given your case number. I ordered the parts from Esslinger. The Trim Ring is a bit wider on the Stella which is what I needed to fill the wider gap between the dial and the crystal.

Crystals:
G-S PA463-9 
Stella Armed WRA302.

So far, so good.

Now if you ever open shop to service the 1010 movement, let me know 

Cheers,

Hunter



crazyfist said:


> Hi hsn-panama,
> 
> It looks great and congrats! I have a problem with my seapearl. The crystal came loose and I glued it to secure it. The reflector ring is also small, or smaller because it has been cut (sanctioned my me...stupid decision,I know)... Here's a pic, you can see there is a gap between the dial and the reflector ring:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Well my first question is do you know the actual size of the crystal that goes on to the seapearl? And where did you buy the reflector ring? The case ref for my watch is 100/61BaS. Thanks!
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk - now Free


----------



## crazyfist

Thanks a bunch! I was in a bit of dismay about the cut reflector ring, buy now I feel a lot better. 

The truth is I barely have time to service my own watches. I only have the weekends to indulge my hobby. I have serviced at least five AR-1010s now, and I must say I think it is the best Enicar movement, because I never ran into any unsuspected problems. And other Enicar calibers have many issues.

Maybe I can open up shop twenty years from now as a retirement job, haha. Meanwhile, I'm happy to provide spare parts should you, or any other Enicar aficionados wishes to resuscitate their beloved vintage.

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## Sunday Rider

crazyfist said:


> Hi hsn-panama,
> 
> It looks great and congrats! I have a problem with my seapearl. The crystal came loose and I glued it to secure it. The reflector ring is also small, or smaller because it has been cut (sanctioned my me...stupid decision,I know)... Here's a pic, you can see there is a gap between the dial and the reflector ring:
> 
> Well my first question is do you know the actual size of the crystal that goes on to the seapearl? And where did you buy the reflector ring? The case ref for my watch is 100/61BaS. Thanks!
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk - now Free


Beautiful watch. I love the lugs on those, they have such character. I wouldn't have noticed the space if you hadn't mentioned it. The older Enicar logo is so stylish! I wish they stuck with it for the later models.


----------



## hns-panama

Hi,

How wide is that case?

Mine is about 35mm if I recall correctly.

Some are 33mm.

Both the above without the crown.

Cheers,

Hunter



crazyfist said:


> Thanks a bunch! I was in a bit of dismay about the cut reflector ring, buy now I feel a lot better.
> 
> The truth is I barely have time to service my own watches. I only have the weekends to indulge my hobby. I have serviced at least five AR-1010s now, and I must say I think it is the best Enicar movement, because I never ran into any unsuspected problems. And other Enicar calibers have many issues.
> 
> Maybe I can open up shop twenty years from now as a retirement job, haha. Meanwhile, I'm happy to provide spare parts should you, or any other Enicar aficionados wishes to resuscitate their beloved vintage.
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk - now Free


----------



## kazrich

I thought I would try my luck and 'nick' this for under £ 100 if poss.
Look what happened :-d

ENICAR SHERPA 300 AUTOMATIC STAHL+SELTENE VERSION;NEAR NOS,SERVICED;165D! | eBay


----------



## hns-panama

LOL. I saw that but went for another lot instead. What a terrific find for the winner.

I wound up with:

















It is a bit of a bug, you know?

The Sherpa case and bracelet will probably clean up nicely. I have to figure out how I am going to restore the inner bezel though. I will probably clean up the case, sell it, and keep the bracelet. Original beads of rice bracelets are a find. Mainly bought it for that reason.

Also, there are some Zodiac Seawolf cases thrown in for good measure. I will probably clean them up and sell those to help offset the Sherpa case and bracelet. On the other hand, I may just see about restoring the one with the case back...

I am looking forward to dissecting the Sherpa case. Especially the glass. I am wondering what replacement I can use. That will be fun.

Cheers,

Hunter


----------



## crazyfist

kazrich said:


> I thought I would try my luck and 'nick' this for under £ 100 if poss.
> Look what happened :-d
> 
> ENICAR SHERPA 300 AUTOMATIC STAHL+SELTENE VERSION;NEAR NOS,SERVICED;165D! | eBay


Usually Sherpa without EPSA compressor cases are not that desirable. This one doesn't even have the "clam shell with shinning pearl" caseback etching. It just has an Ocean Pearl caseback. The movement is AR-165D, an updated version of the original AR-165. This version is unidirectional winding, (similar to the Chronoswiss Cal. 122.) Plastic movement holder in a Sherpa line, I think this example shows the blow Enicar was being delt by the quartz crisis. Great Condition nonetheless. I would not have paid more than $100 usd for it though.


----------



## hns-panama

Hi,

One new addition to my Enicar fleet. A cal. AR1145 Ocean Pearl with a NOS blue dial. Far prettier in sunlight but harder to photograph. Runs like a champ.









Also included some other examples too:

Got the older cal. AR1290 Seapearl Super A Supertest out and it will see some wrist time. I put the Tropic band on it while I send the Seapearl 600 out for service.









Sending this Supertest off to Canada for a case restoration. It's also a cal. AR1290 Supertest:









I have one cal. AR165 movement example:









Last but not least is a NOS-cased cal. 1145 Ocean Pearl.









Enicar's are addicting...

Cheers,

Hunter


----------



## crazyfist

hns-panama said:


> Hi,
> 
> How wide is that case?
> 
> Mine is about 35mm if I recall correctly.
> 
> Some are 33mm.
> 
> Both the above without the crown.
> 
> Cheers,
> 
> Hunter


Mine is 33mm 

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## crazyfist

hns-panama said:


> Last but not least is a NOS-cased cal. 1145 Ocean Pearl.
> 
> View attachment 1256151
> 
> 
> Enicar's are addicting...
> 
> Cheers,
> 
> Hunter


Very nice NOS 1145 there. i think the non Sherpa star jewels are very underrated. i get them when i can, they are 4-5 times cheaper than the sherpa models. if you like the watch for the movement, definitely get these. My 1145 star jewels auto says hi:



















On OEM buckle and strap:









Never get tired of the caseback etching:









And they are certainly very addicting. Some of 60s-70s gold tones:










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## primabaleron

Ultra Dive...


----------



## hns-panama

Anyone with thoughts about who might be able to refinish an inner bezel would be most appreciated!

Nice Ultra!



primabaleron said:


> Ultra Dive...
> 
> View attachment 1260903


----------



## primabaleron

One more..


----------



## crazyfist

Two sherpa stars, I find the shape rather Rado-esque.










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## Sunday Rider

A very nice pair for the collection Crazyfist. Very Rad-o indeed. Wonder if they have the sapphire crystal like the Rados did. It sure is the big chunky look of the 70's.


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## WatchFred

Super Dive today, just too lazy to set the date.


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## Jponline

Great info,
Wow ! such as great information. Thank you for sharing.


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## MMMD

New arrival... 1969 Sherpa Guide.


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## crazyfist

Sunday Rider said:


> A very nice pair for the collection Crazyfist. Very Rad-o indeed. Wonder if they have the sapphire crystal like the Rados did. It sure is the big chunky look of the 70's.


Because of your question I made a discovery that took me by surprise. I was writing to say these are from the 60s so they probably had mineral crystal. Then I went into my archive to attach an ad:









Now, I've never bothered to read these ads because...well...I thought I couldn't. But a closer look at the first words made me realize I should really pay more attention to these: Glace Saphir. I'm not a linguist but I'm sure that translates to Sapphire Crystal.

Awesome.


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## Sunday Rider

Here is the Rado, it is heavy too. Sorry for the thread drift....I know it should be an Enicar.


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## kazrich

Rado on the Enicar thread ?
Looks like your pic has been moderated :-d

Richard


----------



## Sunday Rider

The funny thing is I can see it using Chrome, but can't see it with Explorer.

I will try to link the picture from the computer, or upload it.


----------



## primabaleron

Brothers...


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## primabaleron

And my TROJKA


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## primabaleron

New/old strap


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## crazyfist

Do try this at home:



















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## hns-panama

Sacrilege?

Perhaps not. I had an extra vintage "Topps" flexible band in a drawer and decided to put it on the Seapearl 600. Given the heat and humidity here, an all stainless band is an attractive idea.

As it is my new daily wearer at the moment, I am finding it is quite comfy on the wrist.


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## Sunday Rider

crazyfist said:


> Do try this at home:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk - now Free


That's just obscene!!!!! Love it. :-!


----------



## Sunday Rider

hns-panama said:


> Sacrilege?
> 
> Perhaps not. I had an extra vintage "Topps" flexible band in a drawer and decided to put it on the Seapearl 600. Given the heat and humidity here, an all stainless band is an attractive idea.
> 
> As it is my new daily wearer at the moment, I am finding it is quite comfy on the wrist.
> 
> View attachment 1293306


How about the NATO bands for heat and humidity? I've started wearing them and find them very light weight and like them a lot. Not sure how the nylon will work in heat and humidity. But a stretch band.....you are not presenting that work of art very well. One of my favourite styles of Enicar.


----------



## hns-panama

I have one for my Hellas. Bond strap. Like it but the "coolness" (temp) of the stainless on my wrist is kinda nice. I've been pondering a brown croc strap too, but then, I wouldn't wear it much. I saw a neat thread showing brown straps with black dials and liked the look. 

Cheers,

Hunter


----------



## hns-panama

eBay Seller Warning

I´ve noted a rash of, in my educated opinion, fake Enicars and other watches being sold by Super-Store-Europe. Have a look at this one:

Enicar UFO Extrflat Mainspring Swiss Made Anti Magnetic Wrist Watch | eBay

Printing is so bad it's pathetic.

Now, further proof. Note the jet logo on these two dials:

Enicar UFO Unbreakable Mainspring Swiss Made Anti Magnetic Wrist Watch | eBay

Favre Leuba Rocket Unbreakable Mainspring Swiss Made Anti Magnetic Wrist Watch | eBay

Now he is promoting "Super".

Enicar '' Super '' Swiss Made Anti Magnetic Wrist Watch | eBay

Same case as the others!

Note the description as representing them as "Authentic". Also note his feedback hides his listings so it is much harder to see the item.

Sadly, his buyers are probably fooled long enough and leave good feedback before they realize what they bought.

Buyer beware.


----------



## Eeeb

I too hate 'private' listings on eBay. They might have some legitimate use but I find the most common use is to hide information so one can not easily do detective work on the seller... it is not commonly used to protect the privacy of the buyer.

I tend to avoid such sellers... looks like for good reason here!


----------



## hns-panama

Yep. This guy is so obvious. The same case style but he uses Enicar Ocean Pearl case backs (shaved, of course). He cannot use Seapearls since they are bayonet mounts. The Favre Leubas have the exact same case but the backs look like cheap stamped versions or perhaps a hoard of them were obtained and used?



Eeeb said:


> I too hate 'private' listings on eBay. They might have some legitimate use but I find the most common use is to hide information so one can not easily do detective work on the seller... it is not commonly used to protect the privacy of the buyer.
> 
> I tend to avoid such sellers... looks like for good reason here!


----------



## kazrich

Any opinions on this Divette ?
Not seen a bronze dial on these before. Doesn't look like the light has affected a previously darker dial.
Do you think it's a repaint or just well kept ?
Also not sure about the case back . 
Is the Divette supposed to be a ladies watch ( as in lady diver ) ?
Questions questions ------ :-d

Vintage Enicar Sherpa Super Divette Compressor Date 25J Auto Watch 60's Serviced | eBay
Richard


----------



## hns-panama

It is a very nice example with a bronze dial. Cool looking and looks appropriate to me. I would ask the seller to give you all the writing on the back. Post the case number. My case is for a 1125 movement so it is 125/004.

It is a man's watch for that vintage.



kazrich said:


> Any opinions on this Divette ?
> Not seen a bronze dial on these before. Doesn't look like the light has affected a previously darker dial.
> Do you think it's a repaint or just well kept ?
> Also not sure about the case back .
> Is the Divette supposed to be a ladies watch ( as in lady diver ) ?
> Questions questions ------ :-d
> 
> Vintage Enicar Sherpa Super Divette Compressor Date 25J Auto Watch 60's Serviced | eBay
> Richard


----------



## kazrich

hns-panama said:


> It is a very nice example with a bronze dial. Cool looking and looks appropriate to me. I would ask the seller to give you all the writing on the back. Post the case number. My case is for a 1125 movement so it is 125/004.
> 
> It is a man's watch for that vintage.


Apparently the case is inscribed Enicar Ultrasonic and the serial nos. is 731778. Also worth noting that the crystal has been replaced. 
The super compressor crystal should stand tall and the replacement looks more flat. I would have thought that it would be difficult to find a 
an original replacement and this must surely affect the value. The asking price is already very ambitious and bordering on Sherpa Graph territory ?
That said, it's an attractive thing.

Richard


----------



## primabaleron

The Joy...


----------



## kazrich

Well primabaleron that's a very nice Sherpa Ultradive ! 
I have a question re the Sherpa Graph 300. The case back has a bayonet type fit and I would imagine
that Sherpa 300 means it was originally designed for use in water ? Does the Graph have a compressor case ?
The crown is not ' screw down ' and I wouldn't let mine out in the rain let alone 300 ft under water 
The case does not mention the words water resistant or waterproof. 
Richard


----------



## kazrich

Thanks hns-panama for your valued advice on the Divette . I made a very cheeky offer and the vendor accepted.
On the wrist the Divette really is nicer than my pics. The dial colour is definitely NOT bronze as it was described. It changes with the
light and shimmers between rose gold and burnished copper. They did a good service and not only is it super accurate 
the bezel and winding crown operate deliciously. This will get a lot of wrist time this month !







Just been introduced to it's big brother









Richard


----------



## crazyfist

kazrich said:


> Thanks hns-panama for your valued advice on the Divette . I made a very cheeky offer and the vendor accepted.
> On the wrist the Divette really is nicer than my pics. The dial colour is definitely NOT bronze as it was described. It changes with the
> light and shimmers between rose gold and burnished copper. They did a good service and not only is it super accurate
> the bezel and winding crown operate deliciously. This will get a lot of wrist time this month !


Congrats! Wonderful addition and seriously drool worthy pictures! Can I request a wrist shot?

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk - now Free


----------



## crazyfist

kazrich said:


> Well primabaleron that's a very nice Sherpa Ultradive !
> I have a question re the Sherpa Graph 300. The case back has a bayonet type fit and I would imagine
> that Sherpa 300 means it was originally designed for use in water ? Does the Graph have a compressor case ?
> The crown is not ' screw down ' and I wouldn't let mine out in the rain let alone 300 ft under water
> The case does not mention the words water resistant or waterproof.
> Richard


Most of the Sherpas are compressor cased. Enicar calls this bayonet style 'seapearl,' some are noted on the dial, while others are noted on the caseback.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk - now Free


----------



## kazrich

Here you go crazyfist. The watch came with a rubbery nos Swiss Tropic divers band. I can't say that I really like it and have ordered up a black
water resistant leather croc.


----------



## crazyfist

kazrich said:


> Here you go crazyfist. The watch came with a rubbery nos Swiss Tropic divers band. I can't say that I really like it and have ordered up a black
> water resistant leather croc.


Nice!!

My boney wrists would shame a malnutrition-ed child from a third world country. Therefore I really appreciate these smaller sized Sherpas. Collection value aside, in all honesty the Guide is too big for my wrist, the Divette and Jet in my opinion have the perfect size for vintage divers, not too big, but incorporates substantial wrist presence nonetheless. What do you think?

BTW, try out the lume if you have a chance, I just love the lume layout on these Enicars.


----------



## primabaleron

This same..


----------



## kazrich

crazyfist said:


> Nice!!
> 
> My boney wrists would shame a malnutrition-ed child from a third world country. Therefore I really appreciate these smaller sized Sherpas. Collection value aside, in all honesty the Guide is too big for my wrist, the Divette and Jet in my opinion have the perfect size for vintage divers, not too big, but incorporates substantial wrist presence nonetheless. What do you think?
> 
> BTW, try out the lume if you have a chance, I just love the lume layout on these Enicars.
> [/QUOTE.
> Agreed.
> unless the watch has multiple complications and needs to be bigger than norm to enable the wearer to read the dials.
> I suppose a deep sea diver wearing a watch over a wetsuit would prefer a bigger watch.
> I reckon the Sherpa Graph is as big as I would go , but as an every day watch 35 - 37mm
> Is more comfortable.
> 
> Richard


----------



## kazrich

primabaleron said:


> This same..
> 
> View attachment 1306480


Similar but not the same. Your watch is the Ultradive and I think the case is larger.
It also has a bridge between the two crowns.
Richard


----------



## primabaleron

kazrich said:


> Similar but not the same. Your watch is the Ultradive and I think the case is larger.
> It also has a bridge between the two crowns.
> Richard


I mean: The same, which I presented here earlier 

Yes, I know. Ultradive is 40mm without bridge and crowns


----------



## hns-panama

Epic.

Thinking I will go ahead and keep my case and do the Divette...

Stunning.



kazrich said:


> Thanks hns-panama for your valued advice on the Divette . I made a very cheeky offer and the vendor accepted.
> On the wrist the Divette really is nicer than my pics. The dial colour is definitely NOT bronze as it was described. It changes with the
> light and shimmers between rose gold and burnished copper. They did a good service and not only is it super accurate
> the bezel and winding crown operate deliciously. This will get a lot of wrist time this month !
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Just been introduced to it's big brother
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Richard


----------



## korny

greetings gents!
there's an enicar that i'm interested in getting for my better half but have no idea of its authenticity. wondering if you guys could lend me a helping hand here, many many thanks.

link: FS: New Old Stock Swiss Made ENICAR Roman - $200


----------



## Kaspers

Since I saw the Enicar Ocean Pearl on the first post on this thread, I really wanted to get one. Looking at Ebay I was delighted to find that there where a lot of them to choose from. I did notice that there where quite a lot of them from Chinese sellers, but after reading on this forum about the Chinese connection I found it quite natural.


The problem is that when I study these offered watches closer, they have so me many different characteristics, though claiming it is the same model and that they’re all genuine. It seems like they all have genuine calibres and case back, but the dials, cases and hands varies a lot - and my own conclusion is that most of these watches must be more or less reworked.


What characteristics should definitely be represented on the Ocean Pearl, and which should not? I have done quite a lot of research on the internet, which has just made me more confused. I think I need help from a true connoisseur


----------



## hns-panama

Welcome.

Glad you asked first before buying. There are quite a few non-original out there now. One in particular from the EU who shaves the casebacks and never shows the movements on his watches. Buyer beware.

China has some good sellers. I have bought from one and was pleased with my purchase.

From what I have seen, OPs are screw back cases. In fact, I cannot recall seeing a bayonet style case with an OP marking. That doesn't mean it did not happen though. I suspect there might be a few bayonet cased OPs out there when they changed over to the more industry standard screw back case.

OPs almost always have the newer caliber 1140 and higher calibers in them.

Beyond that, the OPs I see on eBay are generally from Indian sellers with repainted dials. Brightly colored, dirty movements, etc.

I have several. Remarkable accuracy and lovely to look at, OPs with cal. 1145 installed are very well crafted and are very nice dress watches that you can adjust up or down with the change of a strap.
















Note the shimmering effect on the dials. The blue OP is stunning in the sunlight. Sadly, my picture doesn't do it justice.

Basic advice is to get photos of the movement and good ones of dial before buying. Note the color of the movement's gilt it should be consistent. If it is not, ask for more photos with better lighting, preferably sunlight.

Good luck.


----------



## hns-panama

Probably real though the non-original crown affects the value.

I would love to see more pictures from Enicar catalogs to prove certain models existed.



korny said:


> greetings gents!
> there's an enicar that i'm interested in getting for my better half but have no idea of its authenticity. wondering if you guys could lend me a helping hand here, many many thanks.
> 
> link: FS: New Old Stock Swiss Made ENICAR Roman - $200


----------



## crazyfist

When in doubt, the best course of action is to post your quandary here before pulling the trigger, and we'll help you out. 
Hns panama has great advice. I'll add what I can.

It seems like you ve got the movement bit down, now to the dials. Many OPs from china are genuine and are in great condition than what you actually find in Chinese antique markets, so i i say they are worth the price. But one chinese seller to my knowledge offer redials. I've bought two Enicar Seapearls from China, both satisfactory purchases. On the star jewels models, one definitive way to tell that the dial is original is the sunburst dial effect, here's an example:










And another:










However, by no means if it does not have sunburst it should mean otherwise. But sunburst effect is very hard to reproduce for redialers.

The one on the left is the most popular model out of china, AR-160, I have quite a few:












Kaspers said:


> Since I saw the Enicar Ocean Pearl on the first post on this thread, I really wanted to get one. Looking at Ebay I was delighted to find that there where a lot of them to choose from. I did notice that there where quite a lot of them from Chinese sellers, but after reading on this forum about the Chinese connection I found it quite natural.
> 
> The problem is that when I study these offered watches closer, they have so me many different characteristics, though claiming it is the same model and that they're all genuine. It seems like they all have genuine calibres and case back, but the dials, cases and hands varies a lot - and my own conclusion is that most of these watches must be more or less reworked.
> 
> What characteristics should definitely be represented on the Ocean Pearl, and which should not? I have done quite a lot of research on the internet, which has just made me more confused. I think I need help from a true connoisseur


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk - now Free


----------



## kazrich

korny said:


> greetings gents!
> there's an enicar that i'm interested in getting for my better half but have no idea of its authenticity. wondering if you guys could lend me a helping hand here, many many thanks.
> 
> link: FS: New Old Stock Swiss Made ENICAR Roman - $200


That's a nice looking dress watch. A couple of things to possibly consider.
I have never owned a Swiss watch that failed to proudly advertise the fact that it was ' Swiss made ' or ' Swiss '. 
If it's not on the dial it's usually on the case back - I can't see it anywhere ? Maybe it's so deep in the dial that the camera can't pick it up.
The bottom half of the dial looks a bit empty and lost - It looks though it might have once said ' Swiss made ' ? :roll:
The link appears to be a couple of years old ? Is it still for sale ?
Richard


----------



## korny

kazrich said:


> That's a nice looking dress watch. A couple of things to possibly consider.
> I have never owned a Swiss watch that failed to proudly advertise the fact that it was ' Swiss made ' or ' Swiss '.
> If it's not on the dial it's usually on the case back - I can't see it anywhere ? Maybe it's so deep in the dial that the camera can't pick it up.
> The bottom half of the dial looks a bit empty and lost - It looks though it might have once said ' Swiss made ' ? :roll:
> The link appears to be a couple of years old ? Is it still for sale ?
> Richard


believe it or not, it still is! which really got me wondering about its authenticity.. he re-posted them on a singapore watch forum which was how i got to know of it.
he has quite a few on sale, here's another 1 of them:
FS: New Old Stock Swiss Made ENICAR "Star Jewels" - $200

btw, thanks hns-panama! how could you tell the crown is non-original for this watch? how much do you think is a fair price for the watch? sorry if asking is against the rules, but its just that the world wide web doesn't have much info on enicars


----------



## Kaspers

Thanks Crazyfist for the quick reply. I have just purchased an AR-160, which very much resembles the one to the left on the last picture of your post. Now I'll cross my fingers that I won't be disappointed when it arrives from China  Your help is much appreciated, and helped me to take the decision.

I will post a pic of it when I get my hands on it.



crazyfist said:


> When in doubt, the best course of action is to post your quandary here before pulling the trigger, and we'll help you out.
> Hns panama has great advice. I'll add what I can.
> 
> It seems like you ve got the movement bit down, now to the dials. Many OPs from china are genuine and are in great condition than what you actually find in Chinese antique markets, so i i say they are worth the price. But one chinese seller to my knowledge offer redials. I've bought two Enicar Seapearls from China, both satisfactory purchases. On the star jewels models, one definitive way to tell that the dial is original is the sunburst dial effect, here's an example:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And another:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> However, by no means if it does not have sunburst it should mean otherwise. But sunburst effect is very hard to reproduce for redialers.
> 
> The one on the left is the most popular model out of china, AR-160, I have quite a few:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk - now Free


----------



## Kaspers

Thank you. Your advice has resulted in a purchase from a Chinese seller. A great looking watch which I hope turns out to be to my satisfaction 



hns-panama said:


> Basic advice is to get photos of the movement and good ones of dial before buying. Note the color of the movement's gilt it should be consistent. If it is not, ask for more photos with better lighting, preferably sunlight.
> 
> Good luck.


----------



## hns-panama

Looks to me like the crown doesn't have the Enicar Saturn logo on it. Hence my comment.

I looked again and although I am always open to differing opinions, I still am not seeing it.



korny said:


> believe it or not, it still is! which really got me wondering about its authenticity.. he re-posted them on a singapore watch forum which was how i got to know of it.
> he has quite a few on sale, here's another 1 of them:
> FS: New Old Stock Swiss Made ENICAR "Star Jewels" - $200
> 
> btw, thanks hns-panama! how could you tell the crown is non-original for this watch? how much do you think is a fair price for the watch? sorry if asking is against the rules, but its just that the world wide web doesn't have much info on enicars


----------



## Nordwatch

Here are my Enicar watches with caliber 1292. Case is marked 1064-12 CR. Does anyone know when they were manufactured?


----------



## hns-panama

Nordwatch, mid-fifties. More or less.

That's the largest caliber they used at 13.5 L.

Nice collection!


----------



## WatchFred

late Mr. Racine, new to the family.


----------



## howards4th

WatchFred said:


> late Mr. Racine, new to the family.


NICE!!!:-!


----------



## Reich

hns-panama said:


> eBay Seller Warning
> 
> I´ve noted a rash of, in my educated opinion, fake Enicars and other watches being sold by Super-Store-Europe. Have a look at this one:
> 
> Enicar UFO Extrflat Mainspring Swiss Made Anti Magnetic Wrist Watch | eBay
> 
> Printing is so bad it's pathetic.
> 
> Now, further proof. Note the jet logo on these two dials:
> 
> Enicar UFO Unbreakable Mainspring Swiss Made Anti Magnetic Wrist Watch | eBay
> 
> Favre Leuba Rocket Unbreakable Mainspring Swiss Made Anti Magnetic Wrist Watch | eBay
> 
> Now he is promoting "Super".
> 
> Enicar '' Super '' Swiss Made Anti Magnetic Wrist Watch | eBay
> 
> Same case as the others!
> 
> Note the description as representing them as "Authentic". Also note his feedback hides his listings so it is much harder to see the item.
> 
> Sadly, his buyers are probably fooled long enough and leave good feedback before they realize what they bought.
> 
> Buyer beware.


Thx for this thread and enlightening me. I won an auction today from this seller. I was really excited getting Oris for 15 gbp.
But then i saw Enicar for 1gbp so i decided to bid on it and get it cheap aswel and ship 2 watches at once but then again "Shocktested" "Colombo/Space Style"
on both watches from slightly different manufacturers...













Then I started to dig and digged out this manual:
Enicar Watch Buyer's Guide | eBay (thx [email protected])
Led me to this site and topic.
Retracting an offer, dont buy from the turkish fraud.


----------



## Eeeb

Nice buyers guide which specifically references this thread. I assume eBay's 'hns' is our 'hns-panama'?


----------



## hns-panama

Eeeb said:


> Nice buyers guide which specifically references this thread. I assume eBay's 'hns' is our 'hns-panama'?


----------



## WatchFred

Eeeb said:


> Nice buyers guide which specifically references this thread. I assume eBay's 'hns' is our 'hns-panama'?


assume so too - excellent guide, might be well worth to add this to the articles section ?

congrats, outstanding work.


----------



## Reich

Authentic?


----------



## kazrich

Looks good to me. It's certainly an attractive looking watch b-)


----------



## kazrich

Who wants some Enicar Chrono facts and questions ? Not that it really matters because you're getting some anyway 
It's possibly already living somewhere in this thread but ----- here is an extract from the 1968 Chronosport catalogue. 
These people sold discounted sports chrono's by post in the UK.



Here's the Enicar offerings





and here's the price list



Here's the questions

Sherpa Graph. 'This chrono has been the choice of more than one world motor racing champion'
Well, we know about Jim Clark but who is, or were the others ?
60's candidates would be Jackie Stewart, Denny Hulme, Phil Hill, Graham Hill and John Surtees. Does any one know who else wore the Sherpa ?

The copy says that Sherpa Graph is waterproof to 160 ft , yet Aqua Graph to 325 ft. I can only think that Enicar would have provided
them with such precise information. Yet they both use the same EPSA brevet 314962 super compressor case ?

Sherpa Jet is the most expensive Enicar on offer and was pitched at a similar price to the Heuer Autavia GMT. What was in the spec of the Sherpa Jet 
to justify a higher price than a triple register chrono ?

Richard


----------



## crazyfist

Reich said:


> Authentic?


Looks all right to me. Personally I'm really fond of these EPSA-STOP cases, they bring more character to the watch. Did the seller provide a shot of the exterior caseback as well? Just note that the case might be polished.

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----------



## crazyfist

Great history! I really like reading these old ads.

As for your last question, I think they meant Sherpa jet graph, which is chrono with 2nd time zone, it's the last watch on page 19.

Anywhere to find a complete scan of this catalogue?

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----------



## kazrich

Here it is - every watch in the catalogue

OnTheDash - The definitive guide to Heuer


----------



## Reich

Thx for responses lads.



crazyfist said:


> Looks all right to me. Personally I'm really fond of these EPSA-STOP cases, they bring more character to the watch. Did the seller provide a shot of the exterior caseback as well? Just note that the case might be polished.
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk - now Free


Here it is:


----------



## hns-panama

Reich, FYI, the case back is on wrong. The I and O hash marks correspond to the stem. O meaning open and I meaning closed. Be careful how you open it again. Go easy. When closing, Line up the O with the crown and turn clockwise to close it.

Nice looking watch!


----------



## hns-panama

Thanks all!



WatchFred said:


> assume so too - excellent guide, might be well worth to add this to the articles section ?
> 
> congrats, outstanding work.


----------



## Reich

hns-panama said:


> Reich, FYI, the case back is on wrong. The I and O hash marks correspond to the stem. O meaning open and I meaning closed. Be careful how you open it again. Go easy. When closing, Line up the O with the crown and turn clockwise to close it.
> 
> Nice looking watch!


thank you sir.


----------



## kazrich

I would be interested to know how you guys are removing your bayonet type case backs.

Richard


----------



## hns-panama

LG Adjustable Opener though I am real -- repeat -- real careful with it.



kazrich said:


> I would be interested to know how you guys are removing your bayonet type case backs.
> 
> Richard


----------



## hns-panama

Latest addition to the Enicar collection. Little Supertest 33.


----------



## hns-panama

You are most welcome.



Reich said:


> thank you sir.


----------



## hns-panama

Here is Super Store Europe's latest work:

Enicar UFO &apos;&apos; Super &apos;&apos; Shock Protected Swiss Made Anti Magnetic Wrist Watch | eBay

LOL.

The dial printing is far from Enicar quality.

Fake.


----------



## Kaspers

As promised I'll post a picture of the Ocean Pearl, that i recently got from a Chinese ebay seller. I'm very pleased with it. I fitted it with a brown croc style Hirsch strap, but I'm looking to get steel bracelet for it as well. Any suggestions for where I should look for that?


----------



## crazyfist

Kaspers said:


> As promised I'll post a picture of the Ocean Pearl, that i recently got from a Chinese ebay seller. I'm very pleased with it. I fitted it with a brown croc style Hirsch strap, but I'm looking to get steel bracelet for it as well. Any suggestions for where I should look for that?


Congrats on a beautiful Ocean Pearl! Hopefully, your experience will let others be more confident when purchasing from Chinese sellers. Although the dial looks plain on these Enicars, they are _genuine_, as opposed to some of the more attractive looking Enicars from India. And the best part is, when you open them up, they look like this:









As for bracelets, my experience is that these OPs have 19-19.5mm lugs, making it difficult to find one suitable. Make sure you don't get one that's 20mm, because it won't fit. That's my only advice, good luck and enjoy!


----------



## kazrich

Seaweed not a problem for an Ultra Dive !


----------



## HOROLOGIST007

Hi
I am going to be lazy here cause 46 pages is too much to read
Has anyone posted or own the WWI pear shaped Enicar watch with compass built in. Produced 1918.
Its shape is like a spoon, watch at top compass below.
If so can you point me to it or post pictures.

Thanks
adam


----------



## WatchFred

HOROLOGIST007 said:


> Hi
> I am going to be lazy here cause 46 pages is too much to read
> Has anyone posted or own the WWI pear shaped Enicar watch with compass built in. Produced 1918.
> Its shape is like a spoon, watch at top compass below.
> If so can you point me to it or post pictures.
> 
> Thanks
> adam


Assume you mean the one below, Adam ? Do not own it, but it listed on the bay some weeks ago; then withdrawn. Found it interesting, so I saved some pics.


----------



## HOROLOGIST007

Yes, thats exactly it, and the advert
Darn I missed it!!
Thanks
Could you email me those pics at
[email protected]
Thanks again
Adam


----------



## hns-panama

Pics here:

Enicar Compass watch 1918


----------



## HOROLOGIST007

hns-panama said:


> Pics here:
> 
> Enicar Compass watch 1918


Hi
Lovely piece, thanks for posting the link
Expensive!!


----------



## primabaleron

New one


----------



## kazrich

primabaleron said:


> New one
> 
> View attachment 1372597


Yum Yum , very tasty. If you manage to remove the case you should find a lovely gilt Valjoux 72 ticking away inside.
Congratulations , the Sherpa Graph not only has the same movement as the Rolex Daytona, but is also a Super compressor with triple registers and has the Jim Clark connection. A winning combination that's making nice examples hard to find.
Richard


----------



## primabaleron

For service is no problem, because my watchmaker specially made ​​tool to open


----------



## hns-panama

Just received my new bespoke strap for the Seapearl 600. Probably going to make a few traditionalists a bit worried 

The entire process of buying the strap is now posted here:

https://www.watchuseek.com/f222/buying-bespoke-strap-some-thoughts-982008.html#post7361375

However, I will spare you the longish read by posting the photos here:


----------



## Eeeb

hns-panama said:


> Just received my new bespoke strap for the Seapearl 600. Probably going to make a few traditionalists a bit worried
> 
> The entire process of buying the strap is now posted here:
> 
> https://www.watchuseek.com/f222/buying-bespoke-strap-some-thoughts-982008.html#post7361375
> 
> However, I will spare you the longish read by posting the photos here:


The strap and dial are a genius match - both geometric and distressed. Nice!


----------



## hns-panama

Thanks so much, Eeeb.



Eeeb said:


> The strap and dial are a genius match - both geometric and distressed. Nice!


----------



## Sunday Rider

Great strop "H". The story is wonderful. Love the combination. You sure have a good eye, I never would have thought of getting a strap like that.


----------



## hns-panama

Thanks Sunday.

Believe me, Fish was not on the radar screen when I started looking around. CADstraps did the heavy lifting. I just refined it to my liking. He suggested dark or light grey threads. I went with gold as it helped with the US Navy's connection with Enicar dive watches.



Sunday Rider said:


> Great strop "H". The story is wonderful. Love the combination. You sure have a good eye, I never would have thought of getting a strap like that.


----------



## Steelwrist

First of all, what a great thread! I've read all 47 pages and have learned a lot along the way. Thank you all for that.

I'm a casual collector and lately I've been drawn to the old Enicar watches. There's just something special about them, I think, and I love their - in general - subtle and elegant design and finish. Today my first one arrived. It's in excellent condition and keeps time nicely. After about seven hours it's still spot on. Being a noob when it comes to Enicar I'm not able to date it very well, but from what I've learned so far I'd say that it's a fairly late model, and I'm guessing it doesn't have an in-house movement. The numbers on the case back are 270-054-049. The 2 gives it away, am I right?

But in-house movement or not, I'm very pleased with it. Being a steel fan I've put it one an aftermarket Enicar bracelet. Not the best quality but it works. It will definitely not be the last Saturn on my wrist.


----------



## hns-panama

Welcome to the addiction, I mean, club 

Just be real careful about what you buy.

Looks like you made a nice purchase.

Caseback photo and perhaps a movement shot would be nice to see.



Steelwrist said:


> First of all, what a great thread! I've read all 47 pages and have learned a lot along the way. Thank you all for that.
> 
> I'm a casual collector and lately I've been drawn to the old Enicar watches. There's just something special about them, I think, and I love their - in general - subtle and elegant design and finish. Today my first one arrived. It's in excellent condition and keeps time nicely. After about seven hours it's still spot on. Being a noob when it comes to Enicar I'm not able to date it very well, but from what I've learned so far I'd say that it's a fairly late model, and I'm guessing it doesn't have an in-house movement. The numbers on the case back are 270-054-049. The 2 gives it away, am I right?
> 
> But in-house movement or not, I'm very pleased with it. Being a steel fan I've put it one an aftermarket Enicar bracelet. Not the best quality but it works. It will definitely not be the last Saturn on my wrist.
> 
> View attachment 1382047


----------



## Steelwrist

Thank you very much!

Yes, here are a few pictures. I have yet to learn a harmless way to remove the back (remember, I'm just a casual collector. Any tips?), so you'll have to settle for the seller pic of the movement. I know that the numbers doesn't match and that it may be a franken that ought to be cornered by an angry torch carrying mob and killed with fire, still, I'll give it a loving home 

NB: The crown is original.


----------



## hns-panama

You have an ETA 2752 movement but if you look at the base caliber versus what you have, you can see how nice Enicar's finishing was:

bidfun-db Archive: Watch Movements : ETA 2752

As for the case back. Suggest leaving it alone or having a watchmaker take it off for you and replace the gasket just for precaution. Then you will see the innerds 

Enjoy!



Steelwrist said:


> Thank you very much!
> 
> Yes, here are a few pictures. I have yet to learn a harmless way to remove the back (remember, I'm just a casual collector. Any tips?), so you'll have to settle for the seller pic of the movement. I know that the numbers doesn't match and that it may be a franken that ought to be cornered by an angry torch carrying mob and killed with fire, still, I'll give it a loving home
> 
> NB: The crown is original.
> 
> View attachment 1382208
> 
> View attachment 1382210


----------



## Steelwrist

You're right. I'm only beginning to learn about the mechanisms and should probably stick to cheaper "training watches" when fooling around with their little souls. That's what I've been doing so far anyway. 

That aside, I'm i right about it being a franken? 



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## hns-panama

Regarding Franken, nope, don't think so. Looks real to me.


----------



## Sunday Rider

Beautiful watch Steelwrist, welcome to the club. The movement looks great. Looks like no one has messed with it as there are now run away screwdriver marks and gouges.

The earlier models are what I like as well.

You can get a case back opener, something like this: CAD $ 14.44 - Watch Back Case Opener Repair Wrench Tool Set, Free Shipping On All Gadgets!


----------



## Steelwrist

Thanks, Rider. Been eyeballin' her all day at work  Still keeps time well. I think it gains about 20 seconds pr. 24 hours, something I can easily live with!

Anyone know (+/-) when it's from? My uneducated guess would be somewhere between '75 and '80 ...

And that case back opener is exactly the type I've been considering for while. My old caliper would do nothing but hurt a back like this one


----------



## crazyfist

steelwrist, congrats on the purchase! I've always wanted to get an Enicar with ETA 275X movement. 2750 is the base movement and I suppose 2752 is with the date complication. I dissected an 2750 once, to give you a better understanding of the engine, here's what I wrote:

https://www.watchuseek.com/f11/depth-analysis-eta-2750-a-939542.html


----------



## Steelwrist

Very interesting piece, crazy. Thank you. It's nice to learn even more, especially since I already like this watch very much. 2750 will definitely be on my radar in the future. Another one on my list is 165 (thanks to you and other fine Enicar fans here), and right now there's actually an AR165D on its way - should arrive soon actually. Would of course also like to add a 160 at some point. I'm thankful for all the good information here, it will surely help me to avoid dumb mistakes when establishing a little Enicar collection. 

Oh, and by the way, I notice that you mention ybl.worldstore in the thread. That's actually where I purchased my 2752


----------



## Nordwatch

This thread does not have an Enicar with Felsa cal. 415 Bidynator? Here is mine. I think this movement only was used for a short period.


----------



## crazyfist

steelwrist, I'm glad you enjoy the write up. Yes, this forum is very educational, and I love learning things from other knowledgeable members here.

Personally, I think AR-165 (esp. D suffix) and AR-160, along with AR-1010 are the most robust in-house Enicar movements. I think you made a good choice. I've wanted to do an indepth analysis of the 16X series for a long time, perhaps next weekend...

I'm very happy you're satisfied with the Chinese seller ybl.worldstore! Chinese sellers have a bad rep on ebay, but in the vintage watch world, I think they fare _much_ better than some other regions notorious for selling fakes or frankens. I've bought several watches from China on ebay, all very satisfactory! If only you guys can go to the antique markets in China, it's vintage watch heaven!


----------



## crazyfist

Nordwatch said:


> This thread does not have an Enicar with Felsa cal. 415 Bidynator? Here is mine. I think this movement only was used for a short period.


I have the same watch! 

View attachment 1383636


Both are Bidynators.
View attachment 1383638



Don't see too many of these. I believe the AS autos were more common for Enicars of this period, before they developed the supertest auto.


----------



## Kaspers

Just got a new Enicar 340 Automatic. Don't know much about it. I got it from the internet, since I thought it was a beautiful watch and I like Enicars.























The weirdest thing is that I don't like to wear it that much, and I'm already considering to pass it on. Maybe it's the faceted crystal? I really don't know, and it's not very rational, but then again collecting watches really isn't


----------



## Steelwrist

Very nice Enicar - I love that style. And the condition seems excellent. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Hawkes3004

Hi All, New to the forum. Mostly a collector of Casio atomic and just received an mtg1500. But this thread of interest because among others, brietling, tissot and dare I say swatch! I have a jet graph sherpa 300 which I inherited. Silly question....does anyone know how to make it work? ie even make the hands move let alone the chrono.


----------



## kazrich

Hi Hawkes3004 and welcome to the forum. Sounds like you have a nice watch.
Is the watch fully wound ? 
Is it ticking ?
Does the crown pull out and if so are you saying that the hands won't turn or are they difficult to turn ?


----------



## Steelwrist

The AR165D has arrived. I'm pleased with this one!

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Hawkes3004

Hi Kazrich, it's not ticking, all hands are set at 12 so it's like it was stopped on purpose. Crown feels tight to pull out and not keen on forcing it.


----------



## kazrich

Hawkes3004 said:


> Hi Kazrich, it's not ticking, all hands are set at 12 so it's like it was stopped on purpose. Crown feels tight to pull out and not keen on forcing it.


Do you have a picture of the watch dial and back of case ? 
I would take it to a watch maker and ask them to open the back and present you with an
estimate for repair and servicing. Don't attempt to remove the back yourself as the bayonet
multi facet back is likely to get damaged without the correct tool.
The Sherpa Jet Graph in good order is a well sort after watch, so could be worth restoring.


----------



## Hawkes3004

Hi Kazrich, I hope the pictures came out ok.

Sent from my C5303 using Tapatalk


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## Hawkes3004

and another, pulled the crown and hands move. Still no tick and no life. I believe there is a guy called Cheam watches about 100 miles from me (but close to relatives) that still works on enicar so I may take it to him to have a look. Thankyou for your help Kazrich.

Sent from my C5303 using Tapatalk


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## kazrich

That's a very nice inheritance ! It's important that you establish that the Valjoux 726 movement is intact and serviceable. The case back still looks pretty clean so be sure that the watchmaker
has removed this type of back before.
Take a look at page 44 of this thread. I recently posted a copy of 1968 Chronosport adverts. This will show you the comparative value of your watch when new.
Are you located in the UK ? Someone on this forum may be able to recommend a good watch maker close to you.


----------



## Hawkes3004

Thanks Kazrich, yep I am in the UK so I will put out a shout for a decent watch maker close to home (anyone else reading, thats Wiltshire/Hampshire/Dorset borders).

Sent from my C5303 using Tapatalk


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## kazrich

If you can't find anyone local, my man in Southampton has been looking after my Enicar's
for the past year and works on chrono's. PM me if you want his details.


----------



## Steelwrist

So, this one arrived yesterday, a 280 062 001 with a nice creamy dial. I got to own it for just about an hour before my wife activated her sweetest eyes and talked it out of me. Women and their strange powers!










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## hns-panama

"There are two times to never argue with a woman. When she's tired and when's she rested." My dad told me that, long ago and it serves me well.

Oh well, time to get another Enicar!

Just be cautious about what you are buying for now, until you get a feel for the brand and its characteristics.



Steelwrist said:


> So, this one arrived yesterday, a 280 062 001 with a nice creamy dial. I got to own it for just about an hour before my wife activated her sweetest eyes and talked it out of me. Women and their strange powers!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Steelwrist

Haha, true. And yes, now there's a hole in my little collection - better fill it up soon! And about being careful: absolutely. All the good information here is vital, and so is your bay-guide, hns, and I've read all of it several times. I also think it helps that I used to collect (and semi-repair) vintage LCD's before I fell in love with the old mechanical clocks; when shopping for them you also have to be very careful and KNOW what to look out for. Knowledge is - as usual - the difference maker.


----------



## hns-panama

Appreciate the kind words... Thanks.


----------



## kazrich

I am in possession of a metallic anthracite case for an Enicar watch. It's apparently nos.
It's not a PVD finish but more like a smooth silk metallic automotive finish. The case design is clearly 1970's
and looks most attractive. I've not seen a case like it before. Can someone enlighten me as to the model and 
style of dial originally fitted. I would imagine that the movement was an Enicar 167 automatic from the screw type case back ?
Richard


----------



## hns-panama

167 movement with day date functions.

You can find this movement with a dial on eBay in other style cases.

Measure dial opening and ask seller for dial diameter if possible.

Nice looking case.



kazrich said:


> I am in possession of a metallic anthracite case for an Enicar watch. It's apparently nos.
> It's not a PVD finish but more like a smooth silk metallic automotive finish. The case design is clearly 1970's
> and looks most attractive. I've not seen a case like it before. Can someone enlighten me as to the model and
> style of dial originally fitted. I would imagine that the movement was an Enicar 167 automatic from the screw type case back ?
> Richard


----------



## kazrich

The case is 36mm without the crown. I already own this case and have seen many Enicar's with the same
shape but never with the same metallic finish.


----------



## Steelwrist

That's a mighty fine looking case, kazrich. Add a 167 with a black or silver dial, throw on a black steel band and you have a killer watch right there (that I believe is missing in my collection, ahem)!


----------



## hns-panama

It's back:

1916 Vintage Antique Enicar Mens Military Compass Egg Shaped Porcelain Dial | eBay



HOROLOGIST007 said:


> Yes, thats exactly it, and the advert
> Darn I missed it!!
> Thanks
> Could you email me those pics at
> [email protected]
> Thanks again
> Adam


----------



## hns-panama

And here is a little test... See the following listing:

ENICAR SHERPA 1960ER GUIDE GMT AUTOMATIK MANUFAKTUR SAMMLERUHR * UNGETRAGEN | eBay

See the problem?


----------



## hns-panama

It's a Seapearl day!

I'll show you mine if you show me yours.

1957 Seapearl Super A with cal. 1290 Supertest using an EPSA Compressor Type 1 case:


----------



## kazrich

kazrich said:


> I am in possession of a metallic anthracite case for an Enicar watch. It's apparently nos.
> It's not a PVD finish but more like a smooth silk metallic automotive finish. The case design is clearly 1970's
> and looks most attractive. I've not seen a case like it before. Can someone enlighten me as to the model and
> style of dial originally fitted. I would imagine that the movement was an Enicar 167 automatic from the screw type case back ?
> Richard


I knew I'd seen it somewhere ! 
It was on this thread ! :-d
Here it has been adapted to take chrono pushers with a Seiko movement for the Enicar Mantagraph - a seriously nice watch. 
Iv'e got a drill if anyone else can supply the movement and dial









Scroll down this page

https://www.watchuseek.com/f11/joy-collecting-vintage-enicar-watches-726015-14.html


----------



## Pedro Pereira

Hello Enicar fans worldwide 

I'm about to purchase a Enicar DDM 260

What you think about this one?

RELÓGIO DE HOMEM ENICAR AUTº - Lojas na Internet - #220284257


----------



## hns-panama

Well, it looks like it is in very good condition.

I would ask for a picture of the movement though.


----------



## crazyfist

hns-panama said:


> It's a Seapearl day!
> 
> I'll show you mine if you show me yours.
> 
> 1957 Seapearl Super A with cal. 1290 Supertest using an EPSA Compressor Type 1 case:


The line has never worked for me, but always worked on me...










And an cool ad (mostly because of the other things on the page) of the same seapearl to accompany it:










Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk - now Free


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## crazyfist

kazrich said:


> I knew I'd seen it somewhere !
> It was on this thread ! :-d
> 
> Scroll down this page
> 
> https://www.watchuseek.com/f11/joy-collecting-vintage-enicar-watches-726015-14.html


You know a thread has gotten wonderfully long when a link of the thread itself is posted within the very thread. (I hope I worded the sentence correctly!)



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## super-b

After reading this I will be taking a closer look at this brand. Thanks for sharing


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## hns-panama

An informational quick note:

I finally acquired the tool to remove the crystal from my Super Divette case. I had thought about using my crystal lift for a fleeting moment and then thought the better.

I found a Longines Admiral Crystal and Case Wrench from Dashto.com.

On the original envelope, it says it is a 1200 model.

It came with 5 interchangeable rings. I used the largest which is just a tad bigger than the 33.1 crystal diameter.

Mine looks like this one:









No affiliation with the seller, by the way.

If you intend on removing an EPSA Super Compressor crystal, I highly recommend this type of wrench as it is less likely to break the very, and I do mean very, hard to come by replacement. Let alone the special tension ring inside.

So, in order to protect the crystal, I wrapped the edge with tape where the wrench insert makes contact and that helped tighten the fit a bit more. I compressed the wrench and pushed the crystal with my thumb. Popped right out. Whew.

Moral of story: Take your time, use gradual pressure, and for goodness sake, measure twice and push once 

Additional note: This works for the non-stepped crystals like Sherpa Jets, Super Divettes, etc. Tall flat sides and not the like the crystals on a Sherpa Guide.

Cheers,

Hunter


----------



## T5aus

*Re: The Joy of Collecting Vintage Enicar Watches- Sherpa Super Jet*

This one I picked up from a retired Qantas pilot who purchased it new back in the 60's (C1964)


----------



## rainbowfix

*Re: The Joy of Collecting Vintage Enicar Watches- Sherpa Super Jet*

Hi guys, badly need some good opinions on these pieces...







Wrong hands ultradive? Hands from OPS perhaps? 







Should be super graph instead of sherpa graph?
Many thanks in advance.


----------



## Pedro Pereira

hns-panama said:


> Well, it looks like it is in very good condition.
> 
> I would ask for a picture of the movement though.


Thanks for the help...


----------



## reteper

Hello forum great thread
Hoping you may be able to shed some light on this little gem, what the movement is and the date of manufacture?
Its stamped 15 jewels swiss, 18K gold case.




















Thanks


----------



## hns-panama

Most likely an Enicar 412 movement. About 1950, I'd say.

Nice watch.

Welcome to the forum and the club.



reteper said:


> Hello forum great thread
> Hoping you may be able to shed some light on this little gem, what the movement is and the date of manufacture?
> Its stamped 15 jewels swiss, 18K gold case.
> 
> View attachment 1411994
> View attachment 1412001
> View attachment 1412002
> 
> Thanks


----------



## patty1629

Hi All, I am new to this forum, and hoping to find some answers about this watch. Any info would be appreciated.
I believe it is from the 1950's or early 60's. In searching, I haven' been able to find a similar shape. It is a square, the face is white and has ENICAR (with logo) Ultrasonic Automatic 21 Jewels an Swiss at the bottom. The back also has the ENICAR logo, a weird shape 
with the number 105 in it, 18K 0.750 and another weird shape, then the following : 1 0 0 6 8 A G
The pictures are not of great quality. The band is not original, and I think the crown has been replaced. I don't know how to open it to see the movement. Not sure if it is worth it to take it into shop to have it checked out.


----------



## HOROLOGIST007

patty1629 said:


> Hi All, I am new to this forum, and hoping to find some answers about this watch. Any info would be appreciated.
> I believe it is from the 1950's or early 60's. In searching, I haven' been able to find a similar shape. It is a square, the face is white and has ENICAR (with logo) Ultrasonic Automatic 21 Jewels an Swiss at the bottom. The back also has the ENICAR logo, a weird shape
> with the number 105 in it, 18K 0.750 and another weird shape, then the following : 1 0 0 6 8 A G
> The pictures are not of great quality. The band is not original, and I think the crown has been replaced. I don't know how to open it to see the movement. Not sure if it is worth it to take it into shop to have it checked out.


Hi and Welcome
Thats a GREAT intro.
Lovely looking watch
A


----------



## Sunday Rider

Welcome to the site Patty1629. That is a beautiful Enicar. I don't see too many square ones around. I am sure those with more knowledge will chime in soon about the watch. I think the strange shapes maybe the stamps for the gold plating. Hope you find a good watch maker that open it for you.


----------



## crazyfist

Nice you watch you have! 18k no less! I believe you'd need a watchmaker's pocket knife to open the caseback, better leave it to a professional.

The case shape would be similar to this one in the ad:









I have the same watch in the ad, it houses a AR-1010 movement. Very reliable.









Welcome to the club!


----------



## robokendall

Asking all Enicar experts! Im just about to buy this, just want your opinion before i go for it? Cheers!


----------



## hns-panama

Just know you are buying it with a refinished dial. Hands may not be original. Your call. Nice watch though. 1140 movements are solid.

For the money, I'd take this one though:

Vintage Swiss Enicar 17J Manual Watch | eBay



robokendall said:


> Asking all Enicar experts! Im just about to buy this, just want your opinion before i go for it? Cheers!
> 
> View attachment 1424663
> 
> View attachment 1424664
> 
> View attachment 1424665
> 
> View attachment 1424666


----------



## Balancewheel

Been some time since I last visited, have not really found anything worth reporting until now. I've trawled through all 52 pages of this thread hoping to see this one but it's not pictured, picked it up today in a charity shop for a ten pound note. I hope the pictures will identify it if they're good enough. No day window, lower half of dial printed '25 jewels'. Rear of snap-on case cover 010/036. Crown has no knurling, it's smooth but does not look worn, no 'logo' on it. The case is gold plated and quite thickly, there are marks between the lugs the 6 end but too small for me to make out. The case is 35mm excluding the crown and total thickness is 9.5mm. Can anyone enlighten me on this watch?


----------



## hns-panama

Looks like a 1010 movement. 25 jewel version. The caliber is shown under the balance wheel...

The crown is unusual though. Haven't seen a flush looking one like that. Suspect winding would be tough with anything but dry fingers. It may be a replacement. A few more pics of the side might help.

Suggest you have it serviced too.

Nice find.


----------



## Balancewheel

The movement under the balance wheel is marked 1010. The crown looks original and yes,it s difficult to wind it but I would wager that it was originally without any knurling as there are no vestiges of any and is he same diameter as the barrel. The movement looks very clean, I know you can't really tell how clean it really is by how shiny the components look but it's keeping perfect time over the last 24 hours so I'll leave it alone. Here's a couple of shots of each side of it. The band doesn't do much for it, I'm going to get a nice 18mm brown leather strap for it, there's a market stall in town that sells good quality ones for 3 quid.


----------



## hns-panama

Sounds like a plan.

The case opens with a very thin case knife opposite side of the crown. That enables you to remove the movement and dial as a unit. I have a similar case in stainless.

The 1010 is very robust. Enjoy it with pride!


----------



## Balancewheel

I've discovered how the back comes off. To remove the movement as a whole the crown would have to be unscrewed from the stem on this one I could get a new crown but would have to take it to he watch doctor t determine the size and the stem/thread size


----------



## zeeshan

i have found an Enicar belonged to to my grandfather, wound it up and it started working. can anyone give me any information about this particular piece.


----------



## hns-panama

Welcome. Very nice piece. Need a photo of the back and I highly suggest you not run the watch before having it serviced. Odds are the movement is in dire need of a service. Educated guess on movement is Enicar's version of the Venus 170 or a Landeron 148. Either one demands a competent watchmaker to deal with the service. Do not try to open it if you do not have the experience and the proper tool. Rather, a decent watchmaker can at least open it and have a look at what you have. From there, it is getting a referral for a proper service provider.


----------



## WatchFred

Venus 170 w/ 3&9 subdials ? probably not


----------



## hns-panama

Yep. Probably not. Leaning towards the Landeron 148.


----------



## zeeshan

Thank you. I did not wind the watch any further after reading your post. Unfortunately there are not many skilled watchmakers here in Pakistan, and there is always the fear of them replacing or removing the parts out of the watch. The back is completely worn out, I guess it’s a sign that the watch saw regular usage. There is something of a four leave clover outline with the Enicar logo in the middle and four different lines of text in each clover pace on them is still readable it says “anti-magnetic” and the other read “steel case”. The other two are not readable at all.
It would be really helpful if someone could tell me about this particular model i.e. the name or the production period and any other information that might be useful.

Thanks, 
Zeeshan


----------



## WatchFred

recent arrival, not seen too often; Sherpa Super Divette


----------



## manan

I found my Grandfather's Enicar watch in old stuff and want to restore it now. It's a black dial with Gold Plated case ( I guess ).
It's a day and date model with ENICAR automatic written on dial but no Enicar Logo.
Ocean Pearl I guess it's written on back
The numbers at back are 147-01-02 and AR 1147 inside. It has a date inscribed inside the back cover by hand 4-12-74
the watch is working but has 3 cracks on it's glass and I can't find a new glass in local market. 

Can I find the replacement Glass for this model in India or anywhere. I tried to look online and found one on e-bay (someone from Australia) but it shows a silver lining around corners, whereas my watch does not have silver lining.


----------



## HOROLOGIST007

manan said:


> I found my Grandfather's Enicar watch in old stuff and want to restore it now. It's a black dial with Gold Plated case ( I guess ).
> It's a day and date model with ENICAR automatic written on dial but no Enicar Logo.
> Ocean Pearl I guess it's written on back
> The numbers at back are 147-01-02 and AR 1147 inside. It has a date inscribed inside the back cover by hand 4-12-74
> the watch is working but has 3 cracks on it's glass and I can't find a new glass in local market.
> 
> Can I find the replacement Glass for this model in India or anywhere. I tried to look online and found one on e-bay (someone from Australia) but it shows a silver lining around corners, whereas my watch does not have silver lining.


Hi and welcome
In general a replacement glass/crystal is not a problem.
Watch probably needs a good service, but a day/date is a nice piece
Can you post pics? We love pictures here!
Thanks and enjoy a great heirloom
Adam


----------



## hns-panama

Hello Enicar owners,

Would love to see photos of a movement ring for a Guide, Jet, Super Divette, etc. They fit either the 1125,1126, 1145, 1146, 166 calibers. Different views would be great. 

It is the one part I am missing for the Super Divette. Wondering just how different they are from normal rings.

Cheers,

Hunter


----------



## hns-panama

The crystal you found is correct. It has a removable silver tension ring inside.

Whether your watch had a gold one or not, the glass is correct for that case. The other question will be finding a gold tension ring and for Enicars, that can be an issue. Some models have wider rings than others. I know this through experience.

You may have to order several different 32.1mm tension ring crystals from different manufacturers. In fact, you may need to order a few 32mm crystals as well. Try Stella, GS, and Sternkreuz models. If you are handy with a micrometer and removing the movement and dial from the case, measure the dial diameter. Then you know how small the inner diameter of the ring must be.

The following are the ring diameter sizes for GS crystals:

Tension rings for both the ET and DT crystals are 0.80mm wide.
The wall thickness varies slightly with the diameter.
For example: ET 25.0 wall thickness is 0.50mm and ET 31.7 wall thickness is 0.60mm.
DT 30.0mm wall thickness is 0.75mm and DT 33.1mm wall thickness is 0.80mm.

So that gives you some possibilities.

I would order the factory crystal. I have bought a few items from that seller. Very good service. You will also have the exact diameters of the tension ring from the silver one inside.

Find a good watchmaker experienced with Enicars and have them fit it along with a service.

Good luck.



manan said:


> I found my Grandfather's Enicar watch in old stuff and want to restore it now. It's a black dial with Gold Plated case ( I guess ).
> It's a day and date model with ENICAR automatic written on dial but no Enicar Logo.
> Ocean Pearl I guess it's written on back
> The numbers at back are 147-01-02 and AR 1147 inside. It has a date inscribed inside the back cover by hand 4-12-74
> the watch is working but has 3 cracks on it's glass and I can't find a new glass in local market.
> 
> Can I find the replacement Glass for this model in India or anywhere. I tried to look online and found one on e-bay (someone from Australia) but it shows a silver lining around corners, whereas my watch does not have silver lining.


----------



## malus65

*Re: The Joy of Collecting Vintage Enicar Watches- Sherpa Super Jet*

Finally I can give a useful contribution to this tread, I found a wonderfull Sherpa Jet onthe Bay. I was looking for this watch for years, but came across a affordable and optical nice example, till a few weeks ago  
I'm really out of my mind with this watch and like to share it with you.
There is also a question for you: who can tell me what kind caliber is inside?
I made a few nice shots:


ESJIMG_6196140413 by Malus65, on Flickr


ESJIMG_4028140413 by Malus65, on Flickr


ESJIMG_4006140413 by Malus65, on Flickr


----------



## hns-panama

*Re: The Joy of Collecting Vintage Enicar Watches- Sherpa Super Jet*

Malus65: Easy. It is either a 1126 or a 1146. Look on the case back and let us know the case reference number. Probably begins with a 148. If so, it is a cal. 1146.

Really rare chance it is a later 166.

All three movements have the 24 hour complication.

Really nice find and I congratulate you!


----------



## crazyfist

Hi Hns-panama,

I got your pm about it as well. I finally got around to take some pictures of the movement rings. The good news is that, the Sherpa Jet and Sherpa Guide's rings are the same size. So That should make the hunt easier for your.

Here we have a Sherpa Jet. The unique thing about the sherpa movement rings is the two screws that holds the movement to the ring as well as to the case. Here I have the screws removed, so you see a hole and an opening on the movement ring.









Here we have the sherpa jet movement and the movement ring.








Here's the sherpa guide:








Here we see the identical movement rings for both Jet and Guide. The downward opening at the seven o'clock position is for the crown stem. The 12 and 6 o'clock opening is for the small plates to that the screws fix the movement to the case. 








Lastly, the movement rings do fit snugly in the case, so I don't suppose a non-sherpa ring will fit.



hns-panama said:


> Hello Enicar owners,
> 
> Would love to see photos of a movement ring for a Guide, Jet, Super Divette, etc. They fit either the 1125,1126, 1145, 1146, 166 calibers. Different views would be great.
> 
> It is the one part I am missing for the Super Divette. Wondering just how different they are from normal rings.
> 
> Cheers,
> 
> Hunter


----------



## hns-panama

Brilliant!

Many thanks!

I may have to have one made.



crazyfist said:


> Hi Hns-panama,
> 
> I got your pm about it as well. I finally got around to take some pictures of the movement rings. The good news is that, the Sherpa Jet and Sherpa Guide's rings are the same size. So That should make the hunt easier for your.
> 
> Here we have a Sherpa Jet. The unique thing about the sherpa movement rings is the two screws that holds the movement to the ring as well as to the case. Here I have the screws removed, so you see a hole and an opening on the movement ring.
> 
> View attachment 1457005
> 
> 
> Here we have the sherpa jet movement and the movement ring.
> View attachment 1457006
> 
> 
> Here's the sherpa guide:
> View attachment 1457008
> 
> 
> Here we see the identical movement rings for both Jet and Guide. The downward opening at the seven o'clock position is for the crown stem. The 12 and 6 o'clock opening is for the small plates to that the screws fix the movement to the case.
> View attachment 1457009
> 
> 
> Lastly, the movement rings do fit snugly in the case, so I don't suppose a non-sherpa ring will fit.


----------



## malus65

*Re: The Joy of Collecting Vintage Enicar Watches- Sherpa Super Jet*

Thanks for your comment  Yes, it reference number is 148-35-02 so cal. 1146 is on board. Thanks!


----------



## hns-panama

*Re: The Joy of Collecting Vintage Enicar Watches- Sherpa Super Jet*

You're welcome.

Next step is finding the right watchmaker to have a look at the movement and keep it serviced. Be very careful with the star gear...



malus65 said:


> Thanks for your comment  Yes, it reference number is 148-35-02 so cal. 1146 is on board. Thanks!


----------



## malus65

*Re: The Joy of Collecting Vintage Enicar Watches- Sherpa Super Jet*



hns-panama said:


> You're welcome.
> 
> Next step is finding the right watchmaker to have a look at the movement and keep it serviced. Be very careful with the star gear...


Have you experience with this? Any advice is welcome. I have a wellknown watchmaker who has experience with compressorcases. I go there to check the movement in order to prevent future reparations.


----------



## hns-panama

*Re: The Joy of Collecting Vintage Enicar Watches- Sherpa Super Jet*

90 percent of the battle is having a watchmaker who knows a Compressor case! LOL.

The star gear is usually broken when inexperienced people try to change the crown gasket or they press the crystal so tight that the gear can't move and then they turn the crown. Viola. A very expensive gasket or crystal change.

Fortunately, the crystals are very thick so they can be polished or even turned by a pro if the scratches are deep. I just used Poly Watch on my Divette. Probably one or two more applications to go but it is working fine and I am patient.

Yours looks like it is cosmetically clean so the movement is the only critical area to look at.



malus65 said:


> Have you experience with this? Any advice is welcome. I have a wellknown watchmaker who has experience with compressorcases. I go there to check the movement in order to prevent future reparations.


----------



## malus65

*Re: The Joy of Collecting Vintage Enicar Watches- Sherpa Super Jet*



hns-panama said:


> 90 percent of the battle is having a watchmaker who knows a Compressor case! LOL.
> 
> The star gear is usually broken when inexperienced people try to change the crown gasket or they press the crystal so tight that the gear can't move and then they turn the crown. Viola. A very expensive gasket or crystal change.
> 
> Fortunately, the crystals are very thick so they can be polished or even turned by a pro if the scratches are deep. I just used Poly Watch on my Divette. Probably one or two more applications to go but it is working fine and I am patient.
> 
> Yours looks like it is cosmetically clean so the movement is the only critical area to look at.


Thanks for the advice, but what do you mean with star gear? Is this the gear train or are it the jewels? How is this affected by the crown gasket?

Stef


----------



## hns-panama

*Re: The Joy of Collecting Vintage Enicar Watches- Sherpa Super Jet*

The star gear is connected to the upper case crown and turns the inner bezel. It engages the bezel from underneath. The bezel is held in place by the all important tension ring inside the crystal. Hence the collective wisdom of not buying an EPSA twin crown Super Compressor without the tension ring or with a non-functioning star gear -- unless you need parts. Do NOT force the upper crown to turn. It should work smoothly and fairly easily. About the same force as winding. If you sense more resistance, stop and take it to your watchmaker.

See this pic for a sample:

http://thumbs2.ebaystatic.com/d/l225/m/mOGk98pWLJlMTU-xWyMCudA.jpg



malus65 said:


> Thanks for the advice, but what do you mean with star gear? Is this the gear train or are it the jewels? How is this affected by the crown gasket?
> 
> Stef


----------



## malus65

*Re: The Joy of Collecting Vintage Enicar Watches- Sherpa Super Jet*



hns-panama said:


> The star gear is connected to the upper case crown and turns the inner bezel. It engages the bezel from underneath. The bezel is held in place by the all important tension ring inside the crystal. Hence the collective wisdom of not buying an EPSA twin crown Super Compressor without the tension ring or with a non-functioning star gear -- unless you need parts. Do NOT force the upper crown to turn. It should work smoothly and fairly easily. About the same force as winding. If you sense more resistance, stop and take it to your watchmaker.
> 
> See this pic for a sample:
> 
> http://thumbs2.ebaystatic.com/d/l225/m/mOGk98pWLJlMTU-xWyMCudA.jpg


Thanks a lot for your kind explanation! I will visiting a proper watchmaker with experience with Supercompressorcases in the next few weeks and take your advise with me. Meanwhile I will fully enjoy it. 
So happy with it )


----------



## MMMD

Recent arrival with EPSA case dated 10/56. I believe this is very similar to the automatic model that went up Everest with the Swiss team earlier that year, though later advertising would suggest that the Everest watches had fancy "turtle" lugs.










Thinking of the courageous men who lost their lives there on Friday. Peace to their families and injured comrades.


----------



## locolockman

*Re: The Joy of Collecting Vintage Enicar Watches- Sherpa Super Jet*



malus65 said:


> Finally I can give a useful contribution to this tread, I found a wonderfull Sherpa Jet onthe Bay. I was looking for this watch for years, but came across a affordable and optical nice example, till a few weeks ago
> I'm really out of my mind with this watch and like to share it with you.
> There is also a question for you: who can tell me what kind caliber is inside?
> I made a few nice shots:
> 
> 
> ESJIMG_6196140413 by Malus65, on Flickr
> 
> 
> ESJIMG_4028140413 by Malus65, on Flickr
> 
> 
> ESJIMG_4006140413 by Malus65, on Flickr


I am lucky to have the same watch in near the same condition. I watched the auction in the Bay to see what it would sell for. I was happily surprised but not too much. It is one of my favorites. Congratulations

Sent from my SPH-L710 using Tapatalk


----------



## hns-panama

*Re: The Joy of Collecting Vintage Enicar Watches- Sherpa Super Jet*

Persistence Pays Off...

Finished resurrecting my Super Divette from a sad state and possible fate. I found it among a small lot of parts looking forlorn and for the right home. I bought it more for the beads of rice bracelet than the case. However, when it arrived, I started investigating what was needed to bring it back to life. One thing I knew I wanted was a different look. I found an unusual dial and inner bezel combination that caught my eye.

It is now basically complete with the exception of taking it to my watchmaker to adjust the lower end piece as it's not fitting right.

From this:
















The inner bezel was essentially useless and is up for reprinting at a later date. The lower crown I had in my parts box and is shown added here:









From a basket case (pun intended) to this:

























This one is a keeper along with its Seapearl 600 grandfather.

I polished the case with a Cape Cod Cloth and for the crystal I started with a 3-sided nail buffer to remove the major scratches and finished with Polywatch. There are a few small dings that I left in to remind myself how it started and to reduce the stress of future dings that accompany a thick watch.

Thanks to all who provided advice and encouragement!


----------



## kazrich

*Re: The Joy of Collecting Vintage Enicar Watches- Sherpa Super Jet*

Congratulations Hunter, that's a very impressive transformation. See how the dial changes colour according to the
ambient light. Can you put a rough date to your Super Divette ?
Richard


----------



## malus65

That is wonderfull work you did for that Super Divette! It looks great. Today I took my Jet to a watchmaker for a check and I took the opportunity to take a few pics from the caliber. Al in al it is in need of service because the oil is dry. Next week I will bring it there and we shall see what the condition is. Here it is next to my Sherpa Date with handwound caliber.

ESJIMG_4211140509 by Malus65, on Flickr

ESJIMG_4210140509 by Malus65, on Flickr


----------



## hns-panama

*Re: The Joy of Collecting Vintage Enicar Watches- Sherpa Super Jet*

Thanks! Appreciate your help.

As for the date, I´ll pop open the back and advise. I think it's 1965 though.

You were right about the dial. Sadly, I have not captured the bezel well. It is a shiny, mirror-like background and not flat or like the dial. It really pops in the sun!



kazrich said:


> Congratulations Hunter, that's a very impressive transformation. See how the dial changes colour according to the
> ambient light. Can you put a rough date to your Super Divette ?
> Richard


----------



## hns-panama

Stunning, Malus65! Artwork, really. 

Thanks for the kind words. I've been grinning for the last two days wearing it.


----------



## holler

*Re: The Joy of Collecting Vintage Enicar Watches- Sherpa Super Jet*



hns-panama said:


> Thanks! Appreciate your help.
> 
> As for the date, I´ll pop open the back and advise. I think it's 1965 though.
> 
> You were right about the dial. Sadly, I have not captured the bezel well. It is a shiny, mirror-like background and not flat or like the dial. It really pops in the sun!


Really really nice Hunter !!!


----------



## hns-panama

*Re: The Joy of Collecting Vintage Enicar Watches- Sherpa Super Jet*

Found a few pics of case back and see no date. Hmmm. No I am wondering where 1965 came from? Perhaps it was the serial number, which in this case is 637336. That and the thinner crowns versus the thick ones.


kazrich said:


> Congratulations Hunter, that's a very impressive transformation. See how the dial changes colour according to theambient light. Can you put a rough date to your Super Divette ?Richard


----------



## kazrich

*Re: Crikey it's green*

Look what the postie delivered today.
I really like some of the shimmery dial effects on various Enicar's and couldn't resist this Ocean Pearl.
I know old watches should show some patina, but the vendor was honest enough to advise that the case
had been polished and the cal 1147 rotor had just been serviced. As this will be a modestly priced
occasional work watch ( used occasionally for work - not a watch that only works occasionally :roll: ) I pushed the button.
In the metal it could easily pass for a 6 month old watch but I think it dates from the early 70's . Iv'e only seen a couple
of Enicar's with this dial colour. In the sun it's light olive grinning through silver grey. In low light it subtly changes to khaki with
cream on gold hour / minute markers. 
Over the last couple of days it's kept perfect time . My only other Enicar's are Sherpa's so I was expecting 
a budget entry level quality. Wrong again !. Easily the equal of a couple of previously owned Omega's.


----------



## Peerke

*Re: Crikey it's green*

Here are some pics of my Enicar watches. After I got my first Enicar from my aunt last year (it belonged to her late husband who died in December 2012), I started to search for Enicars and I ended up with a couple of watches of this magnificent brand.
My first Enicar was in a very poor state, but I had it fixed and now it's running like new. The watches I have are not NOS but they are in a used state, and they show it but that's OK by me.

My first Enicar. Hand wound AR160 caliber




The second one I bought is an automatic with a day indicator in Dutch. I am from The Netherlands so this is extra nice for me. WOE is for Woensdag (= Wednesday).





The 3th one that I bought was even more vintage. It's an Enicar Ultrasonic from 19??.
This one was not running but I saw that the seconds hand was bend and stuck underneath the minute hand. So I fixed it and this one is also a good runner.





The next one, I bought together with 4 other watches. It was really cheap. The seconds hand was loose and so was the rotor. I'm not a watchmaker but this was an easy fix and now this one is also running very accurate. I have some troubles setting the date though.



The last one I want to show is a Sherpa D(ate). This one was running but the hands weren't moving. So I brought it to a watchmaker and he repaired it. I have it back since today. I polished the plexi ( as I did with all of these watches) and an hour ago I ordered a new strap. For there's an 18 mm strap mounted while it's supposed to be a 19 mm.



Anyway...these are my Enicar watches and I don't think they are the last ones. I really like this brand and like the models they had as well and I wear them a lot.
Thanks for watching.


----------



## kazrich

*Re: Crikey it's green*

Nice little collection , but I think you may need the help of Doctor crazyfist to help with your growing addiction - He knows about such matters :-d
Your deep bronze auto day date also has the number of the day of the week next to the written text. Very considerate of Enicar to think
of future owners living in countries that don't understand the country of origin .


----------



## Hessu

*Re: Crikey it's green*

I got a 70's Enicar Ultrasonic cal 167D, but sadly wheels of automatic bridge (1480 and 1481) are worn out and need replacement. Cousins.co.uk do have 1481, but no 1480. So I am in the search of repairs. I am in impression that 1165, 1166, 1167 are the same movement. But does 1147 have also the same automaticbridge? Any ideas where to look for.







The watch has a dial with arabic date.







167D


----------



## hns-panama

*Re: Crikey it's green*

I have an Enicar reference sheet for the 167D showing that they are unique to the 167D. Probably need to buy a working parts watch or find a NOS unit.



Hessu said:


> I got a 70's Enicar Ultrasonic cal 167D, but sadly wheels of automatic bridge (1480 and 1481) are worn out and need replacement. Cousins.co.uk do have 1481, but no 1480. So I am in the search of repairs. I am in impression that 1165, 1166, 1167 are the same movement. But does 1147 have also the same automaticbridge? Any ideas where to look for.
> 
> View attachment 1499759
> The watch has a dial with arabic date.
> 
> View attachment 1499761
> 167D


----------



## malus65

I don't know if it is allowed, but a friend of mine has a nice Sherpa Date for sale. It is the one with cushion case with handwound cal. AR 161. Price is very good I think and so is the condition of the watch. It is recently serviced. The original sales thread:

Horlogeforum.nl, hèt forum voor de liefhebber van horloges. :: Horlogemarkt.nl - (Ver) Kopen en Ruilen :: TK Enicar Sherpa 600


----------



## malus65

The watch seems to be OHPF at the moment...


----------



## gt.bay

*Re: The Joy of Collecting Vintage Enicar Watches- Sherpa Super Jet*

Hi everybody! I'm Giuseppe from Italy! I need an help from all Enicar lovers! 
I purchased this Sherpa Guide some months ago, it's a good one (it's my first Enicar!!) but during the service a wheel had big problems.....it was cracked and it was impossible to save it!

The movement is a 1146 B AR and the movement part broken should be the 255 part, that it's a specific part for the GMT funcion (that's what I understand....maybe I'm wrong). Is there anybody who's able to help me? I could be interested also to buy a complete movement!!


giuseppe.totaro et gmail.com

Thanks a lot, best regards!
Giuseppe


----------



## crazyfist

*Re: The Joy of Collecting Vintage Enicar Watches- Sherpa Super Jet*

Hello friend,

If it's the 24-hour wheel it would be very difficult. But judging from the movement chart, part 251 seems to be the 24-hour wheel, 255 seems to be the regular 12-hour wheel. Of course, I could be wrong. You should make sure with your watchmaker.

If part 255 is the regular 12-hr wheel, then AR-141, (1)144, (1)145 will do (avoid 147 day-date because the hour wheel tend to be taller), and these are very easy to come by on eBay. AR-16X series of automatis could aslo work, though I have to check...

Good luck!


----------



## gt.bay

*Re: The Joy of Collecting Vintage Enicar Watches- Sherpa Super Jet*

Ok thanks a lot, I'll try to ask better......
I'm scaried it will be the 251 part......
Ciao! Giuseppe


----------



## chand8

I have a Unicar Ultrasonic 17 Jewell Automatic with a calibre 1034 movement inside. It looks like 1950's made but ask all you experienced folks if this is correct. For some reason I cannot upload picture from my computer. Appreciate assistance please.


----------



## crazyfist

50s is correct.



chand8 said:


> I have a Unicar Ultrasonic 17 Jewell Automatic with a calibre 1034 movement inside. It looks like 1950's made but ask all you experienced folks if this is correct. For some reason I cannot upload picture from my computer. Appreciate assistance please.


----------



## lennet

Hi guys,

i am urgently looking for a plexi for my recently purchased superdive. I need this: 144-35-03 silver ring non stepped size 366mm!
May anybody help me....?

Thx and greets

Bernd


----------



## hns-panama

Hi Bernd,

Well, you picked a tough one. Crystals are hard enough with the smaller cased EPSAs. I assume you still have the tension ring? Still have the original crystal?

If so, why cannot it be polished? Cracked?

It may well be that you will have to order various 36.6mm crystals (high dome) and see how they fit. The real key appears to be the original tension ring as it keeps the bezel in place.

Cheers!



lennet said:


> Hi guys,
> 
> i am urgently looking for a plexi for my recently purchased superdive. I need this: 144-35-03 silver ring non stepped size 366mm!
> May anybody help me....?
> 
> Thx and greets
> 
> Bernd


----------



## lennet

Thx for answering.

This is mine:



Plexi is not scratched but chipped between 10 and 11!

Cheers


----------



## hns-panama

I looked at the original listing on eBay. Photos were well done. Just enough to hide it. I can see why you'd feel the need to replace it at first glance. However, it does lend a bit of character to it. 

That said, this model and its siblings have very difficult parts to source.

You might ask your watchmaker about using a lathe to reduce the chip down a bit. There is plenty of thickness to work with.


----------



## hns-panama

You might try to fit a GS PA 482-10. It is for an Omega but does have a fitting for a tension ring.


----------



## hns-panama

Another possibility is the Sternkreuz HW366.


----------



## lennet

Ciao ragazzi and thx for helping me! I´ve get an offer of a nos-plexi from am german Enicar-enthusiast...!

And shure i´ll got for it!

Perhaps i won´t replace it at the moment but have to safe it for bad times! Or i let replace it - i donnot know now! 
Thx for helping me and lovely advices!


----------



## e.francois

Hi everyone! Have been a silent reader for more than a year and decide that i cant help it anymore.. This forum is just awesome and have helped me a lot with my research! My first post goes to this great thread about enicar.. really love the built and its colorful model.. Just sharing one of my enicar here.. Cheers!


----------



## MMMD

e.francois said:


> Hi everyone! Have been a silent reader for more than a year and decide that i cant help it anymore.. This forum is just awesome and have helped me a lot with my research! My first post goes to this great thread about enicar.. really love the built and its colorful model.. Just sharing one of my enicar here.. Cheers!
> 
> View attachment 1560016


Thanks for sharing. Your Sherpa Guide looks a lot like mine. I haven't seen very many with the red/blue internal bezel.


----------



## e.francois

Nice looking Sherpa! Indeed, red/blue 24hrs marker is harder to find these days..  Also sharing a graphomatic that I got recently..


----------



## rainbowfix

A real joy with this.


----------



## kazrich

Great looking early Graph !


----------



## rainbowfix

kazrich said:


> Great looking early Graph !


Thanks, here's another one. Super n orange. A real joy too.


----------



## kazrich

Two lovely examples of Enicar EPSA Super Compressors. Have they been restored or just very well looked after ?
Have you yet experienced the joy of removing the bayonet case back ? :-!


----------



## rainbowfix

kazrich said:


> Two lovely examples of Enicar EPSA Super Compressors. Have they been restored or just very well looked after ?
> Have you yet experienced the joy of removing the bayonet case back ? :-!


The graph is all original imo. Just a light polish by seller. The super dive is with original finish.... the bezel is broken though... the crown can move but not the bezel...I guess they are just well looked after.  I found it real hard to open the caseback.. was able to open 1 or 2... horb ball n jaxa opener can't do much to those stucked casebacks ... may I know what kind of opener do you use to open the epsa caseback?..


----------



## gverso

hello all Enicar lovers !
I am the proud owner of 3 AR Divers : a long sought after Enicar Jet, a cute Enicar Divette, and, my latest addition, a (Polish? MWxxxx engraved) Enicar Super-Dive (the 2nd SD I own).
Unfortunately, I can not wear the Super-Dive as much as I would like to because she is not reliable by stopping without notice. 
I took it for cleaning and oiling. I took it back 2 times because it keeps stopping. I'm not sure the person I brought it to did anything to it, to be honest (for example, the gasket has not been changed). Now, I would like to find someone serious, who knows the super-compressor case, who knows about Enicar, and who will fix my beloved SD for good. Do you know or recommend anyone in France or in Europe? (at reasonable cost)
Thank you very much for your assistance,

G


----------



## hns-panama

Pictures!!!!!

Please 

Welcome to the club.

PMed you with a suggestion. Not certain a link to another forum would be allowed 



gverso said:


> hello all Enicar lovers !
> I am the proud owner of 3 AR Divers : a long sought after Enicar Jet, a cute Enicar Divette, and, my latest addition, a (Polish? MWxxxx engraved) Enicar Super-Dive (the 2nd SD I own).
> Unfortunately, I can not wear the Super-Dive as much as I would like to because she is not reliable by stopping without notice.
> I took it for cleaning and oiling. I took it back 2 times because it keeps stopping. I'm not sure the person I brought it to did anything to it, to be honest (for example, the gasket has not been changed). Now, I would like to find someone serious, who knows the super-compressor case, who knows about Enicar, and who will fix my beloved SD for good. Do you know or recommend anyone in France or in Europe? (at reasonable cost)
> Thank you very much for your assistance,
> 
> G


----------



## kazrich

rainbowfix said:


> The graph is all original imo. Just a light polish by seller. The super dive is with original finish.... the bezel is broken though... the crown can move but not the bezel...I guess they are just well looked after.  I found it real hard to open the caseback.. was able to open 1 or 2... horb ball n jaxa opener can't do much to those stucked casebacks ... may I know what kind of opener do you use to open the epsa caseback?..


Enicar must have had a special tool to remove the casebacks.
My special tool is my watchmaker and he definately uses a Jaxa. Even he struggles a bit to remove them.
I think that's why nearly all Sherpa casebacks are badly scratched.


----------



## hns-panama

Sherpa's disease...

There is a special tool. It is a case back wrench to fit all the sides (usually 14, IIRC) on the back.

Best advice when using a Jaxa is to have a good one, along with a high quality case holder. Put case holder in a vise!

Otherwise, let your watchmaker deal with it.



kazrich said:


> Enicar must have had a special tool to remove the casebacks.
> My special tool is my watchmaker and he definately uses a Jaxa. Even he struggles a bit to remove them.
> I think that's why nearly all Sherpa casebacks are badly scratched.


----------



## Shum

These special case back keys were used for most brands in the past so you could find them on the net. I have around 100 differet ones and they sure are great as you don't scratch the backs.


----------



## gverso

hns-panama said:


> Pictures!!!!!
> 
> Please
> 
> Welcome to the club.
> 
> PMed you with a suggestion. Not certain a link to another forum would be allowed


Thx. I know FAM, I will look in that direction though and ask assistance. 
I welcome any recommendation for an "Enicar-proof" watchmaker in Europe to take care of my SD 
Cheers


----------



## rainbowfix

Black Enicar sherpa OPS. Well worn PVD.... like a well worn pair of jeans....


----------



## fatehbajwa

A small query for all the Enicar experts. I came across this Enicar watch a few days back. My watchmaker serviced it and as per him, it is an authentic Enicar.
What got me thinking was the day wheel.....it is in a Chinese (or maybe Japanese) script.

Were Enicar watches made with this kind of day wheel or do you think it is a later replacement?


----------



## SilkeN

A friendly "hallo" to the enica fans. Here I've a nice couple which are in my personal eyes "enicars" but I'm not sure how the "enicarfraction" feel about it:
















But I hope you enjoy them.

Kind regards Silke


----------



## hns-panama

Best guess is that it is real. Asia was a huge market for Enicar.

Nothing is really "rare" there.



fatehbajwa said:


> A small query for all the Enicar experts. I came across this Enicar watch a few days back. My watchmaker serviced it and as per him, it is an authentic Enicar.
> What got me thinking was the day wheel.....it is in a Chinese (or maybe Japanese) script.
> 
> Were Enicar watches made with this kind of day wheel or do you think it is a later replacement?
> 
> View attachment 1585096


----------



## seikoswede

First of all, a huge thank you for Crazyfist for starting this amazing thread! Kudos!

And secondly thanks to all you knowledgable members who take time to contribute and teach us who hasn´t fallen so deep down in the Enicar abyss. Yet! ;-)

I have read through all of the 59 pages here and it kickstarted me to register and post, although I have been a frequest reader for quite some time.

I managed to pick up an Enicar a few weeks ago at a local car boot sale for a mere 4 bucks, or the equivalent as I live in Sweden.
Enicar isn´t a total stranger to me as I have seen pics on other forums but I hadn´t owned one or even handled one before so I decided to take it home.









It´s a Sherpa with decent exterior, and it has, as I have greatly learned here, an EPSA Super Compressor case.
Crown is signed but I forgot to take pics.

When I got home and examined it closer the back just came loose so it was easy to see the EPSA logo plus the month and year of manufacture, November 58.









And as you can see, someone has used the wrong tool on it!









It is running but I haven´t wound it much as I intend for it to be serviced or at least cleaned and looked at by a competent watch repairer before I do so.

To my novice eyes the watch looks legit but can you knowledgeable gentlemen shed any more light on this?

The interior:









I haven´t been able to make out any serial number inside since my eyesight isn´t what it used to be. Need to buy a magnifying glass!
But the back says 100/116 and BaNS (Seapearl case, SS, Sherpa case, Sweep second, right?).

I also wonder if someone knows when this model was introduced and when Enicar started to use the Seapearl logo (or designation) for their Super Compressors back sides?
And also, does anyone have a catalog from this era, showing pics of watches like this one? It would be fun to see what type of bracelet or strap they had.

All the best!

Jim


----------



## hns-panama

Welcome to the club 

I'd say you've done extremely well for a first Enicar.

You may have one of the first runs of the new Sherpa case. It still has the Seapearl designation though. Given it shows 1958 on the inside, I think that is close to the approximate timeframe. It is certainly one of the first models with the branded EPSA SC case as denoted by the 314962 brevet number.

Curious to know the caliber. Probably a 1010. Also, a pic of the crown would be good.

See this page and scroll down to the middle where you will see a few ads for Sherpas and do note that not much longer after 1958, it was shortened to Sherpa. A few of the ads clearly state Seapearl cases for the Sherpas models.

Especially this one:

http://s9.postimg.org/mrtamzvzj/1957_enicar_sherpa.jpg

Get it serviced and enjoy your terrific find!



seikoswede said:


> First of all, a huge thank you for Crazyfist for starting this amazing thread! Kudos!
> 
> And secondly thanks to all you knowledgable members who take time to contribute and teach us who hasn´t fallen so deep down in the Enicar abyss. Yet! ;-)
> 
> I have read through all of the 59 pages here and it kickstarted me to register and post, although I have been a frequest reader for quite some time.
> 
> Snip--------------------------


----------



## rainbowfix

Marshmallows n Stick...
It's an ultradive day.... er.. desk diving..


----------



## seikoswede

hns, thank you ever so much for your prompt and very informative answer!

I am very happy to have found this little gem. It may not be as colorful as many other Enicar watches, and is a bit ordinary looking but I like it still.
And with this new information, I like it even better! It always gives that little extra when you find an early specimen no matter what you collect.

I will provide pics of the crown and the movement when I return home next week and I will use a digital camera instead of my iphone to get petter pics.

Forgive me for asking but is there a link missing? I can only see one link to one ad and you wrote:



> A few of the ads clearly state Seapearl cases for the Sherpas models.


Nevertheless, that ad was interesting and added an extra bonus to me being a Swede. Apparently, Enicar watches were used by the Swiss-Finnish-Swedish International Geophysics Year Expedition. Whatever that was?? 

I´ll be back soon with more pics!

Thanks again!

Jim


----------



## hns-panama

Most welcome.

Yep. Missing one link:

Gli orologi Enicar: la storia

Sorry about that. Scroll down towards the middle of the page and you will find a number of advertisements for Sherpas.


----------



## rainbowfix

Crazy Jet!!!! Any info on the correct part number for this poor guy crazing crystal? Please help me get this guy looking great again!
Thanks.


----------



## WilliamT1974

Got this one on the 'bay awhile back.









It has a 1009 movement. I borrowed the brass tabbed ring from a Chinese parts watch. I also replaced the cannon pinion a few days ago.









Inside of the case back.









Case back.









I'm curious about the stains on the back and lugs. Reminds me of the time I took my gold Cross pen to school and used it during chemistry class, which resulted in nitric acid stain spots.

Something else must have happened to the watch as the lugs don't line up. It's been twisted or something. It will balance and rock back and forth on the top right and bottom left lug. Makes finding a strap a little difficult. May need intervention from a watchmaker. Otherwise, it would be in the daily wear rotation.

The brass ring is in there because the movement was loose in the case even with the back screwed down tight. Wish I knew its history. I bought it from someone in Great Britain and paid more than I should have cause I really wanted it lol.

It was sold non-working and I really enjoyed servicing it.


----------



## Preston

My entry, Seapearl with admittedly a hard to read sterling silver dial made into a shell pattern.










Peace, 
Preston


----------



## hns-panama

Hi,

You are in luck.

Enicar Plexi Glass Reference 148 35 02 332mm Diameter | eBay

Close to you as well.

Need I say be careful with the tension ring?

Cheers!



rainbowfix said:


> Crazy Jet!!!! Any info on the correct part number for this poor guy crazing crystal? Please help me get this guy looking great again!
> Thanks.
> View attachment 1596074
> 
> View attachment 1596075


----------



## DLCPhoto

Hello. Hope you all can help me.

Below are photos of an Enicar Stopwatch that I have had since I was a boy. I'm guessing my Dad gave it to me around the late 1950's. Don't know if it was new, or how old it was at the time. Has a lot of sentimental value to me, and has been sitting in a drawer for a long time.

I had it repaired once, and the hands they put on are obviously grotesque. And it's no longer working. I'm considering having it re-repaired, with more authentic hands put on it.

I'm looking for any information on this watch - approximate year, model number, anything that might be helpful to anybody hoping to repair it. I'm also curious as to whether it has any monetary value, although that is a secondary concern. On the one hand, if it's worth nothing, it might be foolish to spend any significant amount of money repairing it. On the other, if it were to have some value monetarily, it might make sense to repair it.

Here are the photos:





































The last shows a number (109975) along with some very fine markings which are harder to make out.

Any information on this watch appreciated, or a link to where I could post it to get additional information.

Thanks.


----------



## anzac1957

This is my first Enicar.. not going at present.. looks like the balance pivot is the issue.. so don't know what will be happening.. fix or find another movement..




























Is anyone able to shed light on what movement/calibre number would have been inside this watch originally? 15 jewels on dial and 16 jewels on movement..

Cheers


----------



## rainbowfix

hns-panama said:


> Hi,
> 
> You are in luck.
> 
> Enicar Plexi Glass Reference 148 35 02 332mm Diameter | eBay
> 
> Close to you as well.
> 
> Need I say be careful with the tension ring?
> 
> Cheers!


Hi Hunter,
Thanks a lot, this is just what I needed.... Hope this guy will look all gorgeous again..


----------



## hns-panama

Welcome!

Get it fixed. A terrific example. Major point is to find a good watchmaker to do it right and then keep it serviced.

It will need better hands, you are correct. See this page:

La Mesure du Temps: Enicar - Chronograph

The hands can be found, even new. Or at least a close enough match.

Value? Not done here but head over to ebay and do a search on Enicar and Valjoux 92. Do the same on Google image search. You will quickly find what you need to know.

Wonderful heirloom!

Get it fixed and wear it in good health.

Cheers!



DLCPhoto said:


> Hello. Hope you all can help me.
> 
> Below are photos of an Enicar Stopwatch that I have had since I was a boy. I'm guessing my Dad gave it to me around the late 1950's. Don't know if it was new, or how old it was at the time. Has a lot of sentimental value to me, and has been sitting in a drawer for a long time.
> 
> I had it repaired once, and the hands they put on are obviously grotesque. And it's no longer working. I'm considering having it re-repaired, with more authentic hands put on it.
> 
> I'm looking for any information on this watch - approximate year, model number, anything that might be helpful to anybody hoping to repair it. I'm also curious as to whether it has any monetary value, although that is a secondary concern. On the one hand, if it's worth nothing, it might be foolish to spend any significant amount of money repairing it. On the other, if it were to have some value monetarily, it might make sense to repair it.
> 
> Here are the photos:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The last shows a number (109975) along with some very fine markings which are harder to make out.
> 
> Any information on this watch appreciated, or a link to where I could post it to get additional information.
> 
> Thanks.


----------



## DLCPhoto

hns-panama said:


> Welcome!
> 
> Get it fixed. A terrific example. Major point is to find a good watchmaker to do it right and then keep it serviced.
> 
> It will need better hands, you are correct. See this page:
> 
> La Mesure du Temps: Enicar - Chronograph
> 
> The hands can be found, even new. Or at least a close enough match.
> 
> Value? Not done here but head over to ebay and do a search on Enicar and Valjoux 92. Do the same on Google image search. You will quickly find what you need to know.
> 
> Wonderful heirloom!
> 
> Get it fixed and wear it in good health.
> 
> Cheers!


I very much appreciate your help here!!

Now to find someone to repair it. I'm near Charlotte, NC - if anybody knows of anybody capable of properly repairing this in this part of the country, please let me know.

Thanks again!

Don Cohen


----------



## GhentWatch

Dear Enicar enthousiasts.


Is it possible for an Enicar Super Dive to have the crownguard of an ultradive and have number 144/35/03 on the caseback?
Seller claims he bougt it new in 1965 and that no parts were ever changed.


Would 400 euro be nice for an example with some work?


Cheers


----------



## DLCPhoto

DLCPhoto said:


> I very much appreciate your help here!!
> 
> Now to find someone to repair it. I'm near Charlotte, NC - if anybody knows of anybody capable of properly repairing this in this part of the country, please let me know.
> 
> Thanks again!
> 
> Don Cohen


Well, I've received several quotes for repair, replacement of new hands from my local area, along with a few vintage watch repair shops around the country. They're all in the $600 to $650 range.

Are these estimates realistic? I'm new to this field, and was expecting something perhaps half or less of that cost. Does anybody know of any more cost-effective way of getting this repaired?

From the little I've learned, the watch is not likely to be worth more than a few hundred dollars in a restored/repaired state, so it doesn't seem to make much sense to spend $600+ to repair it.

I did get a less expensive reply, from a company that seems to be legit, on Ebay, but it is in the country of Cyprus - a company called Localtime LTD. I'd be really concerned that if I shipped it out there, I would never see it again!

Any advice appreciated.

Don Cohen


----------



## primabaleron

Sherpa Date with 1145


----------



## WatchFred

DLCPhoto said:


> Well, I've received several quotes for repair, replacement of new hands from my local area, along with a few vintage watch repair shops around the country. They're all in the $600 to $650 range.
> 
> Are these estimates realistic? I'm new to this field, and was expecting something perhaps half or less of that cost. Does anybody know of any more cost-effective way of getting this repaired?
> 
> From the little I've learned, the watch is not likely to be worth more than a few hundred dollars in a restored/repaired state, so it doesn't seem to make much sense to spend $600+ to repair it.
> 
> I did get a less expensive reply, from a company that seems to be legit, on Ebay, but it is in the country of Cyprus - a company called Localtime LTD. I'd be really concerned that if I shipped it out there, I would never see it again!
> 
> Any advice appreciated.
> 
> Don Cohen


Don, here's an Enicar R92 that should help you with your search for the correct hands. watch was serviced by Craig Bergsma of chronodeco.com in Oregon; Craig does not like his prices to be discussed publicly, but they are very, very fair consideringt the quality and reliability of his work.

Andreas Gregoriades of Localtime Cyprus is also a very nice and reliable person, I see no reason at all you would not see your watch again, I know nobody I'd consider more trustworthy and shipping risks are realistically minimal.


----------



## DLCPhoto

WatchFred said:


> Don, here's an Enicar R92 that should help you with your search for the correct hands. watch was serviced by Craig Bergsma of chronodeco.com in Oregon; Craig does not like his prices to be discussed publicly, but they are very, very fair consideringt the quality and reliability of his work.
> 
> Andreas Gregoriades of Localtime Cyprus is also a very nice and reliable person, I see no reason at all you would not see your watch again, I know nobody I'd consider more trustworthy and shipping risks are realistically minimal.


Thanks very much for this reply, WatchFred. I'll check in with Craig and see what he might be able to do.

Regarding Andreas, he came across to me in our email exchange as completely professional, and I sensed no 'red flags' whatsoever. Your endorsement is certainly reassuring in this regard. Perhaps I should reconsider this option.

Don


----------



## d3nzi0

My first Enicar. Absolutely gorgeous..


----------



## hns-panama

Welcome!

Before and after pics please!



rainbowfix said:


> Hi Hunter,
> Thanks a lot, this is just what I needed.... Hope this guy will look all gorgeous again..


----------



## bobbee

Don't know if these have been posted already, but I love them...


----------



## kazrich

The Enicar chrono keeping good company with the 1968 Porsche 910 / 8 Bergspyder 
Richard


----------



## d3nzi0

Here's a better pic of mine..


----------



## WilliamT1974

Bought this one awhile back from a Chinese seller on the auction site. Had a lot of issues, but it's getting better. I added a set of Seiko 5 Sport hands.


----------



## kazrich

Nice to see more Enicar's and owners joining the club :-!
Which reminds me of a watch I bought recently. I now know a fair bit about Sherpa's, but am at 
a total loss as to what I bought on a whim for the price of 2 coffee's and a couple of cream cakes.
My initial suspicions arose when I realized that only me and 2 other people in the world fancied it . Too late - It was mine.
It was advertised as circa 1960's but I'm not so sure.
The creamy dial is lightly foxed and pretty plain, but has no Ultrasonic or Seapearl type markings.
The country of origin seems to be missing , but looking below the 6 under strong magnification, SWISS is reflected from the bottom of the case.
The light rose gold plated case is not far off 38 mm without the crown with 20mm. lugs and looks even bigger on the wrist.
The clip on case back has no Enicar brand markings .
The manual wind movement looks like salmon pink gilt and I think it may be AR 1182 ? 
The seconds are registered on an engine turned sub dial ( more 50's than 60's ? )

Any observations or info on this super accurate time keeper would be much appreciated .
Richard

Here's some pics


----------



## Preston

Preston said:


> My entry, Seapearl with admittedly a hard to read sterling silver dial made into a shell pattern.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Peace,
> Preston


To update my entry. Opened it up to see what's inside, an AR 1010 but I also discovered that the previous owner's suspicion about it being recased is indeed true. He told me straight out during our trade discussion but it is still a dissapointment.

It's still a beautiful watch that keeps excellent time though so that's cool.

Can't help but wonder though, with a dial like that I bet the original case was a beauty as well.

Peace, 
Preston


----------



## hns-panama

I think you are right about the 1182. There is one movement only for sale on the Bay right now. Looks a lot like yours though the markings are different.



kazrich said:


> Nice to see more Enicar's and owners joining the club :-!
> Which reminds me of a watch I bought recently. I now know a fair bit about Sherpa's, but am at
> a total loss as to what I bought on a whim for the price of 2 coffee's and a couple of cream cakes.
> My initial suspicions arose when I realized that only me and 2 other people in the world fancied it . Too late - It was mine.
> It was advertised as circa 1960's but I'm not so sure.
> The creamy dial is lightly foxed and pretty plain, but has no Ultrasonic or Seapearl type markings.
> The country of origin seems to be missing , but looking below the 6 under strong magnification, SWISS is reflected from the bottom of the case.
> The light rose gold plated case is not far off 38 mm without the crown with 20mm. lugs and looks even bigger on the wrist.
> The clip on case back has no Enicar brand markings .
> The manual wind movement looks like salmon pink gilt and I think it may be AR 1182 ?
> The seconds are registered on an engine turned sub dial ( more 50's than 60's ? )
> 
> Any observations or info on this super accurate time keeper would be much appreciated .
> Richard


----------



## Brekel

Hi, posted my question in another thread already, but would really like some help identifying my vintage enicar (now with better pictures). On the dial it says Ultrasonic and Sherpa. On the back there's a mention of Seapearl, Sherpas (with an S at the end), incabloc, eniflex, stainless steel, antimagnetic, 97/1BeNS and Brevet 314962 (very hard to read so I could be mistaken. Can anybody help telling me some more about this watch.









Verzonden vanaf mijn iPhone met behulp van Tapatalk


----------



## Tony C.

Not something seen every day...


----------



## jackruff

Tony C. said:


> Not something seen every day...


Super OAO? What does it all mean??


----------



## Brekel

Managed to make a clear shot of the back of my enicar (took out the Canon 700D).







Hope this helps with the identification of my Enicar.

Verzonden vanaf mijn iPhone met behulp van Tapatalk


----------



## Tony C.

jackruff said:


> Super OAO? What does it all mean??


Actually, I was referring to the Geneva stripes, a finishing touch that is rarely found in Enicar movements. The reference that you mentioned most likely has something to do with the model: Ultrasonic Supertest Seapearl


----------



## hns-panama

It means "Super A" Not sure why they put the O´s on the ratchet wheel. Super evidently refers to the Seapearl case, which is the bayonet mount. A seemingly refers to the Supertest movements. I note that the cal. 1010 Supers do not have the A on the ratchet wheel.

The cal. 1290s I have are Super A Supertests and have Geneva stripes. It is a large caliber at 13L. On top of that, they are Compressor cased though not the later Super Compressor model. A type 1 Compressor.



jackruff said:


> Super OAO? What does it all mean??


----------



## Tony C.

hns-panama said:


> It means "Super A" Not sure why they put the O´s on the ratchet wheel. Super evidently refers to the Seapearl case, which is the bayonet mount. A seemingly refers to the Supertest movements. I note that the cal. 1010 Supers do not have the A on the ratchet wheel.
> 
> The cal. 1290s I have are Super A Supertests and have Geneva stripes. It is a large caliber at 13L. On top of that, they are Compressor cased though not the later Super Compressor model. A type 1 Compressor.


Excellent info! Thanks!


----------



## MMMD

Tony C. said:


> Actually, I was referring to the Geneva stripes, a finishing touch that is rarely found in Enicar movements...


The Geneva stripes might even be circular... unless you want to call it "snailing." 
Not an in-house movement, but one of the more nicely finished Schild movements (AS 1361N) I've seen. Mesmerizing, really...


----------



## bobbee

MMMD said:


> The Geneva stripes might even be circular... unless you want to call it "snailing."
> Not an in-house movement, but one of the more nicely finished Schild movements (AS 1361N) I've seen. Mesmerizing, really...


I knew I had seen this design before...









Dr. Evil's time machine!


----------



## Space Noodle

I know this is changing the current topic (still in keeping with the Enicar thread) but I thought this was the best place to ask: How is Enicar pronounced? Is it a hard 'c' or more like a 's' sound as in the name Racine? I have looked around on various sites but can't seem to find the answer?? Thanks!


----------



## derelict

I am sure that this has been covered, and probably by Crazyfist himself but I am 100% on my next few watches being Sherpas. I am a history teacher, loving imperial era (less so the actual imperialism...) specifically, and them being worn to the top of Everest is intriguing to me. Far more so than 'first watch on the moon'. Problem is that they seem to have been FAR more popular in Asia (India and China) than here. 

So, that brings me to my question, of which I have tried various search keywords and not found an answer: trusted sellers? Most of the Indian stuff I see is redialed, customized, and generally not appealing. The things I see from Chinese sellers look the part but make me pause.


----------



## crazyfist

The thing is very few Sherpa models made it to China. You'll find plenty of Seapearls and Ocean Pearls, not a whole lot of Sherpas. In fact, I've only seen a sherpa once out of China. Yet somehow, Sherpa Guides are abundant in Indonesia. 

AFAIK there are two prominent Chinese Enicar sellers on the bay. I've purchased several Seapearls from seller ybl.world with good results. Safest bet is to post the watch you like here and get a second opinion before pulling the trigger. 

Good luck!


----------



## crazyfist

I pronounce the "car" in Enicar, as two of my watchmakers do the same, and one of whom claims to be an Enicar authorized retailer way back in the haydays.


----------



## kazrich

Space Noodle said:


> I know this is changing the current topic (still in keeping with the Enicar thread) but I thought this was the best place to ask: How is Enicar pronounced? Is it a hard 'c' or more like a 's' sound as in the name Racine? I have looked around on various sites but can't seem to find the answer?? Thanks!


I have never heard it pronounced as Enisar. Car part of Enicar always pronounced as in motor car or anycar.


----------



## Space Noodle

Thanks kazrich and crazyfist. I just had my first (so far) Enicar serviced by a watchmaker I was recommended to see in my town. Now running smoothly (it was gaining) and looks great. Just need to get a different band.


----------



## kazrich

derelict said:


> I am sure that this has been covered, and probably by Crazyfist himself but I am 100% on my next few watches being Sherpas. I am a history teacher, loving imperial era (less so the actual imperialism...) specifically, and them being worn to the top of Everest is intriguing to me. Far more so than 'first watch on the moon'. Problem is that they seem to have been FAR more popular in Asia (India and China) than here.
> 
> So, that brings me to my question, of which I have tried various search keywords and not found an answer: trusted sellers? Most of the Indian stuff I see is redialed, customized, and generally not appealing. The things I see from Chinese sellers look the part but make me pause.


Sherpa's were , and still are highly regarded watches. but Enicar sold millions of watches in hundreds ( if not thousands ) of different styles and variations.
A lot of them were named Sherpa and many apparent Sherpa's never left the factory as a Sherpa - So you need to tread carefully. I personally keep to Super compressor cased
Sherpa's because they are universally highly regarded and understood, and were originally priced at the same level as Heuer Autavia and just under Rolex. 
The trouble being that a UK or American vendor may well have purchased the watch from an Asian dealer so you don't really know where it's spent the last 50 years.
Sherpa's are not cheap so these are the buying rules that I follow if bidding on ebay.
1. No fuzzy camera phone pictures - What serious vendor asks over £ 1000 for a watch and only spends 30 seconds photographing it ?
2. No clear movement image - no bid
3. Iv'e just opened a drawer for the first time in 40 years and I found this ( Enicar Sherpa Graph ) and it seems to work I think - avoid avoid
4. Try and buy from watch sellers with 100 % positive feedback.
5. Buy from trusted sellers from all countries , but remember to calculate the duties and tax if from outside your own country.
6. Post any intended purchase on this forum before biding - Don't worry we won't nick it if it looks nice ;-)

Also worth keeping an eye out here

Buy a Enicar watch | Compare Enicar watches online - luxury watches on Chrono24

Good luck with your search


----------



## GlennSim

Sherpa divette 'restored'...


----------



## derelict

kazrich said:


> Sherpa's were , and still are highly regarded watches. but Enicar sold millions of watches in hundreds ( if not thousands ) of different styles and variations.
> A lot of them were named Sherpa and many apparent Sherpa's never left the factory as a Sherpa - So you need to tread carefully. I personally keep to Super compressor cased Sherpa's because they are universally highly regarded and understood, and were originally priced at the same level as Heuer Autavia and just under Rolex.
> 
> Buy a Enicar watch | Compare Enicar watches online - luxury watches on Chrono24
> 
> Good luck with your search


I am aware of the different versions. The Divette, GMTs, and Jets really do it for me. A Seapearl eventually as well. They seem to have been much more popular, or prevelant as that is not the same thing, in Asia than here. I try to avoid anything from India due to shabby and questionable "servicing."


----------



## crazyfist

Playing with some toys this weekend.










Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk - now Free


----------



## Space Noodle

crazyfist said:


> Playing with some toys this weekend.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk - now Free


That Boss DS-1 is a legend in its own right.


----------



## SilkeN

Hallo enicar fans,
I'm just back from our custome office and have open a parcel with the following content:









It's only temporary mine because it should be a gift for a friend. Before I give it away I'll do some work on the steel case but I've to vsit another friend to open the case. It run perfect and I bought this watch as served. It's always better to have a look on the movement. Unfortunately my victorinox pocket watch opener do't work on it . I just know its automatic and without fast setting for the date. Therefore this is wrong . But I know Enicar always make solid watches and I was completely flashed by this fantastic dial. (Sorry about the pills. I didn't saw them outside.)

Kind regards Silke


----------



## o.v.e

Verdammt, I haven't been around a while, and now look at how many pages this thread has...
My latest Enicar:


----------



## kazrich

SilkeN said:


> Hallo enicar fans,
> I'm just back from our custome office and have open a parcel with the following content:
> 
> View attachment 1650592
> 
> 
> It's only temporary mine because it should be a gift for a friend. Before I give it away I'll do some work on the steel case but I've to vsit another friend to open the case. It run perfect and I bought this watch as served. It's always better to have a look on the movement. Unfortunately my victorinox pocket watch opener do't work on it . I just know its automatic and without fast setting for the date. Therefore this is wrong . But I know Enicar always make solid watches and I was completely flashed by this fantastic dial. (Sorry about the pills. I didn't saw them outside.)
> 
> Kind regards Silke


Mine looks pretty similar and does have date quick set by the following.

Change day - between 9.00 and 12.00 and back
Change date - between 10.45 - 2.00 and back


----------



## SilkeN

Thank you I've been now visiting a friend and you're right. Thank you. I was too geecky and the seller told me it wasn't there. The movement is a 1147b. 








Kind regards Silke


----------



## d2ok13

Hi guys,

I'm new around here and I think this is the best place to ask some questions as I see a lot of Enicar fans.
An acquaintance wants to sell these 2 watches but I have some concerns, I hope you can help me. I've took the time to look on all 65 pages on this thread but couldn't find something similar, I've heard about a lot of franken Enicars from China and India so... Did also some research and I think the calibers are 1020 on the black dial and 1010 on the golden one, please see some pictures.



















My questions are:
1. The crowns don't fit in the image or at least on the first one, on the second one is authentic?
2. The movement ring is missing on the gold one, or is just me not seeing?
3. On the black dial watch, the hands looks a little bit off, that blue looks nice but unnatural.
4. The price is 75 euros for both (or 100 us dollars), do you think the price is right? He will sell it only as a pack, I would like to have the golden one cleaned and use as a dress watch, I like it but I don't want to over spend, at this price I'm sure I can find some old automatic but this one kind of caught my attention. And if I'm getting both I will like to get a NATO strap for the black dial one.

Thanks, I hope is not much trouble!


----------



## o.v.e

I would probably not buy them at that price. The steel one has a black dial (sorry, that is too obvious ;-)). I can't make it out on the picture, but black dials on a 50ies watch are suspicious, they were not too common. If the dial is original, I think it is interesting. The crown is not original, but then - You'd need to have her serviced anyways. A standard neutral crown, or a vintage Enicar one can be had at little money.
The golden one - look at the lugs, where the gold plating has worn off. Don't bother. Neither look like the typical Frankenstein Enicar. These are easily recognizable by their colorful dials. Be aware that they are both probably only 32 - 33 mm in diameter, pretty small by todays standard.


----------



## d2ok13

Thanks o.v.e.!
Yes, I know that is 32 mm diameter but I have a thin arm so won't bother. I have a Seiko that is 35mm and is perfect! I was looking on ebay for the crown and is $20 (shipping included) plus the servicing and cleaning, new straps... I think I will pass on this even I love the golden one. Thanks a lot!


----------



## crazyfist

Hi D2ok13, I think the dial on the black one is original. I have one with the same movement but with plated case. I believe I got it for $28 including shipping. It's the one on the right:









Here are some similar ones from my collection. I post these here as a reference for anyone hoping to verify their Enicar's authenticity.


----------



## hns-panama

Crazy, 

Where did you find the bund straps? They look great!


----------



## SilkeN

Yes ..link please..I'm searching and until now unable to find 19 mmm cool straps .


----------



## crazyfist

I get the bunds from eBay seller NATO-international. I've seen many of their products here on the forum. They're a bit expensive, but the quality is the best out of their competitions. I'd recommend it.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk - now Free


----------



## Sunday Rider

Awesome pictures Crazyfist. I am going to use them as screen savers!


----------



## kazrich

Hi Guys, I recently bought a 1969 Sherpa Super Jet on a whim. It was allegedly previously owned by an airline pilot and 
the pictures made it look in a ' very used ' but honest and original condition. 
After nearly a week on the bay nobody seemed to want it. Could be that the brutal forensic highly magnified images made it look well past it's sell by date ?



But - On closer examination everything looked in order

Untouched second generation dial with original checker board GMT 24 hour hand, and correct bright red second hand.
Twin Enicar cross hatch crowns
Correct and not too badly abused Sherpa 600 oyster case back
Apparently smooth 24 hour time zone bezel.
Only me , and 2 other people from the planet Saturn fancied it - So in the end I almost won by default.
My thinking was that at worst case I could keep it for spares , or maybe have it professionally re dialed.
When it arrived I thought he had sent me the wrong watch - it looked really nice ( why do sellers show images at X 5 magnification ? )
I polished up the acrylic crystal and case with chrome cleaner and the cloth turned 'Super Jet' black. The dial does show a bit of even foxing but this just adds to it's charm - so no re dial thanks.
My watchman did a service, and as with my other Enicar's it's super accurate and sooooooooo comfortable to wear.
Crazyfist might be able to confirm that famous old Chinese proverb
' One Enicar Sherpa EPSA Brevet 314962 Super Compressor, leads to another - and another - and another -------


----------



## crazyfist

Congrats! Super jet is super rare! I saw one at the NAWCC fair and the guy wanted almost 3k for it! The trio look stunning!


----------



## Petey007

Dear all, it seems I have just bought my first Enicar, could you please help me with dating the watch?The guy I am buying this from says 1960s but to me it looks 1970s, thank, peter


----------



## hns-panama

Petey007: Mid to late 60s in my opinion. I have the same watch.


----------



## crazyfist

Recently acquired a 33 jewels sherpa divette, with its Jet cousin:










It had a loose cannon pinion (one of most common problems I see in vintage Enicars), so I gave it a complete overhaul. Alas, the mystery of the jewel count is thus revealed.










At the top, we see six extra jewels, useless, around the jewel designed for the auto winding mechanism. Two more jewels on the intermediate wheel, for no reason at all. A clearer pic here:










Base movement has 25 standard jewel, 8 extras make it 33. Don't know what people we're thinking back in the day, some of these jewels could really help out the pin lever boys!

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk - now Free


----------



## WatchFred

thanks for revealing that Jewel mystery !

recently landed: Super Jet


----------



## hns-panama

Hello, fellow Enicar enthusiasts,

Some of you may have seen this case on the Bay.

I bought it because of the push button on the upper left hand lug. Another Enicar mystery to solve. Will have to wait until it arrives and I can have a look under the hood to see what engineering puzzle I have gotten myself into.

Should be fun.


----------



## i20rider

How did I do??


----------



## Martin_B

Just found this thread by accident. Let me add some of mine:


----------



## crazyfist

i20rider said:


> How did I do??


You just robbed the place. 

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk - now Free


----------



## i20rider

Haha it was about time I haven't had a come up in a long time lol


----------



## GhentWatch

crazyfist said:


> You just robbed the place.
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk - now Free


I´ll give you 100 bucks for it.


----------



## i20rider

Haha I bet


----------



## hns-panama

Case back photos always appreciated!

Nice clean Enicar.



Martin_B said:


> Just found this thread by accident. Let me add some of mine:


----------



## WatchFred

S30 Yachting, R234


----------



## paulmlemay

My Star Jewels arrived today. First Enicar. I love it but desperately need a decent strap.


----------



## i20rider

Anyone know the lug size of the ultradive. I'm thinking of getting a mesh band.


----------



## Skv

i20rider said:


> How did I do??


Wow. Care to double your money by selling it to me? ;-)


----------



## GhentWatch

i20rider said:


> Anyone know the lug size of the ultradive. I'm thinking of getting a mesh band.


Mine is 20mm if I´m not mistaken. BTW, that bezel and dial looks SO fresh.


----------



## trim

Seriously. WOW!



i20rider said:


> How did I do??


----------



## i20rider

Youmireme said:


> Mine is 20mm if I´m not mistaken. BTW, that bezel and dial looks SO fresh.


It's the cleanest one I have ever seen it's in unbelievable shape. But I'm actually missing the tiny bezel around the out side..


----------



## GhentWatch

Once mine returns from the watchmaker you´ll see a really clean one but with tons off patina  Your´s looks like it has never been out under the sun.

BTW try not to break your crystal. Mine had some pitting and I am waiting on a custom made crystal again now. It´s gonna cost me... Normal crystals for 42mm SC are as rare as hens teeth.





BTW after doing a ton off research I am still a bit lost. Anyone care to join me on this discussion? I have a few questions for the true gurus.

1) My enicar Ultradive came with a dial marked super-dive. And I am 100prct sure it came out off the factory like that because I bought it from the first owner and he promised me it has never been redialled. Anyone ever heard off Enicar using some spare parts? Maybe it´s a transitional piece? 

2) I tried to compile a list about every Sherpa ever made. And I am a bit lost when comparing the casebacks off all the types. But I always thought the caseback with the 14 points was the constant to determine an Enicar an Enicar Sherpa and that all sherpas should have a compressor back. But this doesn´t seem true? The medallions on the caseback always seem to differ just slightly. Marked Seapearl, Seapearl 600, Sherpa 600 , Sherpa 300 , The marking with the jumping shark And even some without the medallion and just the enicar sherpa engraved in a sort off clover shape (these only on the Sherpa date 600 and the Dive) . etc.. What is correct now? 

3) When did Enicar start renaming their Ocean Pearl and Seapearl line to Sherpa and started using the compressor backs?

I have seen nearly all Sherpas:
Basic Renamed Oceanpearl /Seapearl Sherpa
Sherpa 600 Date
Sherpa Dive


Sherpa Super Divette
Sherpa Super Dive
Sherpa Ultra Dive
Sherpa OPS

Sherpa Guide
Sherpa Jet
Sherpa Superjet

Sherpa Graph
Sherpa Jetgraph
Sherpa Aquagraph
Sherpa SuperGraph


Did I miss one? 

So what do you all think?


----------



## i20rider

I have a question for the enicar experts. I picked up an ultra dive a few weeks ago and have worn it a lot. It has kept ok time. A little slow like 3-4 mins a day. But it hasn't stopped since I bought it. Well I switch watches and didn't wear it for a few days and let the reserve run out. I pick it up today and wind it up. The second hand ticks just fine but the minute hand will run for 2-3 minutes then stops. The second hand continue to tick on. Any ideas on what's going on.

Also if you bump the watch the second hand moves


----------



## crazyfist

i20rider, the canon pinion is loose. It's an extremely common issue for Enicar autos, or for any other vintage watches for that matter (except ETA powered ones), and especially those with day/date. In other words, your watch is useless, just give it to me instead, eh? Haha. 

No, seriously, it's an easy fix. Takes about 15 minutes to tighten the cannon pinion. My watchmaker charges me $25, then he told me I can do it myself with a nail clipper. It's pretty effective. If you have no background servicing vintage watches, best take it to a professional.


----------



## hns-panama

Sherpa Date
AquaLung
Sherpa D
Sherpa DD
Star Diver
320
Electric
World Time
Steward

I have seen references to over 130 different types of Sherpas so your UltraDive could have certainly come out of the factory that way.

The introduction order for the case technology was something like

Seapearl (Threaded case back)
Seapearl with EPSA Stop bayonet style (A forerunner to the Super Compressor.)
Sherpa (Super Compressors are common to Sherpa cases denoted by the 314962 brevet number.)
Ocean Pearl

Sherpas being the most robust of all.



Youmireme said:


> Once mine returns from the watchmaker you´ll see a really clean one but with tons off patina  Your´s looks like it has never been out under the sun.
> 
> BTW try not to break your crystal. Mine had some pitting and I am waiting on a custom made crystal again now. It´s gonna cost me... Normal crystals for 42mm SC are as rare as hens teeth.
> 
> BTW after doing a ton off research I am still a bit lost. Anyone care to join me on this discussion? I have a few questions for the true gurus.
> 
> 1) My enicar Ultradive came with a dial marked super-dive. And I am 100prct sure it came out off the factory like that because I bought it from the first owner and he promised me it has never been redialled. Anyone ever heard off Enicar using some spare parts? Maybe it´s a transitional piece?
> 
> 2) I tried to compile a list about every Sherpa ever made. And I am a bit lost when comparing the casebacks off all the types. But I always thought the caseback with the 14 points was the constant to determine an Enicar an Enicar Sherpa and that all sherpas should have a compressor back. But this doesn´t seem true? The medallions on the caseback always seem to differ just slightly. Marked Seapearl, Seapearl 600, Sherpa 600 , Sherpa 300 , The marking with the jumping shark And even some without the medallion and just the enicar sherpa engraved in a sort off clover shape (these only on the Sherpa date 600 and the Dive) . etc.. What is correct now?
> 
> 3) When did Enicar start renaming their Ocean Pearl and Seapearl line to Sherpa and started using the compressor backs?
> 
> I have seen nearly all Sherpas:
> Basic Renamed Oceanpearl /Seapearl Sherpa
> Sherpa 600 Date
> Sherpa Dive
> 
> Sherpa Super Divette
> Sherpa Super Dive
> Sherpa Ultra Dive
> Sherpa OPS
> 
> Sherpa Guide
> Sherpa Jet
> Sherpa Superjet
> 
> Sherpa Graph
> Sherpa Jetgraph
> Sherpa Aquagraph
> Sherpa SuperGraph
> 
> Did I miss one?
> 
> So what do you all think?


----------



## i20rider

crazyfist said:


> i20rider, the canon pinion is loose. It's an extremely common issue for Enicar autos, or for any other vintage watches for that matter (except ETA powered ones), and especially those with day/date. In other words, your watch is useless, just give it to me instead, eh? Haha.
> 
> No, seriously, it's an easy fix. Takes about 15 minutes to tighten the cannon pinion. My watchmaker charges me $25, then he told me I can do it myself with a nail clipper. It's pretty effective. If you have no background servicing vintage watches, best take it to a professional.


Well that's good news. Thanks for the information my friend. 
Also is there a trick to removing these super compressor case backs. I didn't have much luck.


----------



## hns-panama

Well, it arrived.

What we have here is a very early EPSA Super Compressor case. I note the EPSA Stop marking on the inside case back as well. More common to the earlier brevet number. The 314962 denote a Super Compressor. It lacks the cross hatch crown though.

The push button is more like a plug. The stem doesn't go all the way inside the case though the hole does go all the way through. See photos below. Perhaps it is for some sort of internal bezel though it could be something that EPSA dreamed up for Enicar to fiddle with. I am thinking is was for something movement related.

As for the movement, given the date on the case back (5-57) we could be looking at a larger caliber 1120 or 1121 versus the older 1010. It is not an automatic size case back. An automatic 1125 movement ring works but is too tall to close the case back so it will require a manual wound Super Compressor cased 1120/1 caliber and dial so that hunt is already underway. If anyone has one, please advise 

I also noted "Eniflex" on the case back. Seems to me that was dropped soon afterwards.

So, opinions and thoughts are welcomed as to what kind of animal species we have here.



hns-panama said:


> Hello, fellow Enicar enthusiasts,
> 
> Some of you may have seen this case on the Bay.
> 
> I bought it because of the push button on the upper left hand lug. Another Enicar mystery to solve. Will have to wait until it arrives and I can have a look under the hood to see what engineering puzzle I have gotten myself into.
> 
> Should be fun.


----------



## hns-panama

You either need a Jaxa wrench and a very sturdy platform with a case holder on it or a similar sized dedicated case wrench. I use a Jaxa on mine but am careful not to slip. Cover the back with tape. It may help prevent damage if you slip. Repeat, may. Remember that Sherpas are Bayonet mounts and require only a quarter of a turn. Look for the markings on the back and on the case between the crowns.

If the markings are not near the crowns you need to be very careful when turning. Look at photos of the inside of these cases and the spacing of the lugs on the case backs.



i20rider said:


> Well that's good news. Thanks for the information my friend.
> Also is there a trick to removing these super compressor case backs. I didn't have much luck.


----------



## Space Noodle

hns-panama said:


> You either need a Jaxa wrench and a very sturdy platform with a case holder on it or a similar sized dedicated case wrench. I use a Jaxa on mine but am careful not to slip. Cover the back with tape. It may help prevent damage if you slip. Repeat, may. Remember that Sherpas are Bayonet mounts and require only a quarter of a turn. Look for the markings on the back and on the case between the crowns.
> 
> If the markings are not near the crowns you need to be very careful when turning. Look at photos of the inside of these cases and the spacing of the lugs on the case backs.


I have a cal.1010 Seapearl with a compressor case back and found a YouTube video showing how easy it is to remove the caseback with a stressball. Personally I used a case holder and then put on rubber gloves and was able to exert enough pressure to make the quarter turn necessary to remove and then re-attach the case back. I found I just needed something that was going to give enough grip without being able to do any damage to the watch. Unconventional but it works.


----------



## Space Noodle

Sorry used a pic that shows it not all the way closed. I did get it closed tight


----------



## GhentWatch

*Re: The Joy of Collecting Vintage Enicar Watches- Sherpa Super Jet*

Wopuld love to hear from you guys what makes a Sherpa Graph a Super Graph. TheBezel and that´s it?


----------



## twelve199




----------



## twelve199

sorry for poor resolution / small pic


----------



## malus65

Wow. those look awesome!


----------



## Popeye328

Anyone knows how to remove the stem on an Enicar sherpa 600 with AR160 movement?
I push the stem push button and can pull the winder 4mm out but then is seems to get stuck and I don't want to use more force.

Any ideas?

Fixed....I looked at the shape of an intact stem and came to the conclusion it could not be caught by the mechanism only by dirt in the tube. I used some force and it came out, very dirty and bend thought.


----------



## rainbowfix

Enicar mantagraph n seiko.
















Anyone have any idea what's the sign/insignia mean on the crystal? It is printed on the underside of the crystal... :think:








with a nice NSA bracelet .


----------



## twelve199




----------



## i20rider

Mesh band came in. Love it. $75 at tourneau. I got it for $8.00 + free shipping on Amazon lol


----------



## GhentWatch

If only I felt they were comfortable I would wear my UltraDive on a mesh too.


----------



## i20rider

I love the feel. He'll I love this watch so much that it doesn't even work half the time and I still wear it lol. Sad I know 
The cannon pinion is lose so I just check it every 5-15 minutes. 
I think I have a problem haha


----------



## Vintage1982

Hey guys,

This is my first post on WUS. My name is Melvin and I'm 32 years old. I live in the Netherlands and I'm quite active on the Dutch watch forum. I've been in the Royal Dutch Airforce for 12 years and I'm currently a translator for the Ministry of Foreign Affairs. Vintage Omega watches are my main focus but recently I purchased an Enicar and I'm wondering what I've got.
































On the caseback it says Sherpa 300 and Seapearl but on the dial it says Star jewels. How confusing. Doing all the work is an AR 1145.
Directly below the logo are two numbers: 828956 and 144/39/01. Between the lugs it says Plaque G20 EPSA.

Can someone please help me with more information?


----------



## GhentWatch

i20rider said:


> I love the feel. He'll I love this watch so much that it doesn't even work half the time and I still wear it lol. Sad I know
> The cannon pinion is lose so I just check it every 5-15 minutes.
> I think I have a problem haha


Not to expensive buying a new pinion, had to buy one too. Cousins has them in stock. And some other suppliers too.


----------



## Vintage1982

Please, anyone? See my post above 

Melvin


----------



## Marrick

I'm sorry no one has replied yet. See this thread https://www.watchuseek.com/f11/help-identifying-enicar-watch-1018704.html which has a lot of relevant information.

Epsa (E. Piquerez S.A.) was the case maker. See https://www.watchuseek.com/f74/what-i-really-like-about-epsa-compressors-590461.html

Hope that helps.


----------



## Vintage1982

Hey thanks!! Doesn't seem to be a super compressor then. I'm amazed by the quality of the movements Enicar used.
I've seen quite a lot of Enicar watches but never one with the date at the 6 o'clock position. Is this unusual?

Melvin


----------



## Hessu

The case is not properly locked. When it is shut "I" should be on line with crown and when you open the case "0" on line with the crown.

Yes, Enicars are confusing with sub brands, there is a double signing Sherpa and Ultrasonic or Sherpa and Star Jewels and then there is third name Seapearl for Compressor case.


----------



## hns-panama

That is a SC case design though the Brevet number (314962) is missing. Welcome to the whacky world of Enicar. Keeps you guessing.

Dates at 6 are not too rare with the 1125 and up movements. They are less common though.


----------



## Vintage1982

Hessu;1
The case is not properly locked. When it is shut "I" should be on line with crown and when you open the case "0" on line with the crown.[/QUOTE said:


> Ok, thanks for mentioning. Didnt't even notice it. I'll make sure to properly close when I'm done with the overhaul of the movement.
> 
> Melvin


----------



## Vintage1982

Thanks, that helps a lot. I like whacky watches


----------



## crazyfist

I've wrote this before (but of course this thread is so massive now even I can't find the post). Star jewels is a term used in regards to the movement. Sherpa and Seapearls are often used to describe the case, which usually are EPSA compressors, but not always. An Enicar watch can be 'star jeweled' and Sherpa at the same time.


----------



## hns-panama

Crazyfist. You win the 700th post in this thread award. Not bad considering you started it!


----------



## Sunday Rider

crazyfist said:


> I've wrote this before (but of course this thread is so massive now even I can't find the post). Star jewels is a term used in regards to the movement. Sherpa and Seapearls are often used to describe the case, which usually are EPSA compressors, but not always. An Enicar watch can be 'star jeweled' and Sherpa at the same time.


I forgot this gem of a piece of information. Thanks for the reminder. I almost thought Vintage 1982's Enicar was in the wrong case.


----------



## Vintage1982

Haha I was very glad to read this post. I wasn't sure about the case as well. All those different markings had me thinking of a Frankenwatch  Thanks crazyfist.


----------



## HammyFan

Hi,
I am a watch collector and have a few Enicar watches and really love them. I recently acquired this Sherpa Jet 33 and had some questions for the experts. It has the 33j AR 1126 movement and has the 126 mark on the back of the case as well. It does not have the Brevet on the back of the case nor does it have the compressor symbol on the inside if the case. The questions: why does it not have the compressor symbol? Is it before or after they used the compressor case? 
What year is it from? Are the hands correct? I've seen these hands on Enicar chronographs but not Other Sherpas. Also as you can see, a previous owner had his name and marker numbers engraved on the otherwise mint dial. It doesn't bother me in the least as to me, it's part of the history. 
Thanks in advance for answers and any other info you can give me on this watch.


----------



## Vintage1982

Well I've learned some things recently and it applies here as well. It is a SC style case, it just doesn't have the brevet number. Why the brevet number and logo are missing, will remain a mystery I suppose. Because of the movement it must be from the early 60's. Are you sure about the 33 jewels? I've only heard about 25/30 jewel AR 1126 movements.
Because of the way the lumen of the hands matches the lumen on the dial, I would say that they are original. I'm not 100% sure though.

Grt Melvin


----------



## HammyFan

Thanks for the info. Yes it is 33 Jewels. See picture. I assume it is why it has "Jet 33" on the dial.


----------



## Vintage1982

Ok, curious. Thanks for the clearification. It must be an 1126N then, because of the ballbearings in the rotor.


----------



## hns-panama

It appears to be Supertest movement without the serial number. Interesting. Perhaps they made that caliber in two variations. Supertest and non-Supertest.

Roland's database shows an 1126 in Supertest, IIRC. 

The case is a EPSA SC. It is an early one for the Jet. Not Enicar SC cases show the SC symbol or even the Brevet number. Whacky fellows at Enicar.

Cannot swear to it but I have seen those hands on a Jet before. I have a feeling they were done to differentiate the 30 jewel movement and the 33 Jewel movement. 

By the way, the case back is on wrong in one of the photos. When open the O on the back should line up in between the the crowns.

I assume you will have it serviced, etc? Be careful with that upper crown. 

Cool watch with an unspoken history.


----------



## HammyFan

hns-panama said:


> It appears to be Supertest movement without the serial number. Interesting. Perhaps they made that caliber in two variations. Supertest and non-Supertest.
> 
> Roland's database shows an 1126 in Supertest, IIRC.
> 
> The case is a EPSA SC. It is an early one for the Jet. Not Enicar SC cases show the SC symbol or even the Brevet number. Whacky fellows at Enicar.
> 
> Cannot swear to it but I have seen those hands on a Jet before. I have a feeling they were done to differentiate the 30 jewel movement and the 33 Jewel movement.
> 
> By the way, the case back is on wrong in one of the photos. When open the O on the back should line up in between the the crowns.
> 
> I assume you will have it serviced, etc? Be careful with that upper crown.
> 
> Cool watch with an unspoken history.


Wow thanks for the information. Other than this thread (and I read through all 71 pages), there is very little info on these watches. (unless you can point me to other sites) 
yes, I knew the case back was in the wrong position (it was the seller's photo). I was very careful to remove the case back and put it back in the correct position. It's been running for a few days and keeping great time, but yes it will get serviced. Do you agree it's early 60s? Anyway to validate it with any numbers on the watch?
I'll post a picture of all my Enicars which is only 6 or 7. Happy Thanksgiving.


----------



## GhentWatch

hns-panama said:


> Not Enicar SC cases show the SC symbol or even the Brevet number. Whacky fellows at Enicar.


Not true. My UltraDive mentions a brevet number.


----------



## HammyFan

Youmireme said:


> hns-panama said:
> 
> 
> 
> Not Enicar SC cases show the SC symbol or even the Brevet number. Whacky fellows at Enicar.
> 
> 
> 
> Not true. My UltraDive mentions a brevet number.
Click to expand...

I believe hns-panama meant was that not all Enicar SC cases have either the SC symbol or the Brevet number. So it could be a SC case with no markings, correct hns-panama?
Also, here is my Enicar collection.


----------



## GhentWatch

HammyFan said:


> I believe hns-panama meant was that not all Enicar SC cases have either the SC symbol or the Brevet number. So it could be a SC case with no markings, correct hns-panama?
> Also, here is my Enicar collection.


Ah excuse me. The phrase left some room for interpretation 

I saw that jet on Ebay but decided no to buy it due to the engravings. Wear it in good health.


----------



## hns-panama

Yep. missing the key word, "all" as in not all of the Enicar SC cases have the EPSA markings including the brevet numbers.

Sorry about that.



Youmireme said:


> Ah excuse me. The phrase left some room for interpretation
> 
> I saw that jet on Ebay but decided no to buy it due to the engravings. Wear it in good health.


----------



## malus65

Can anyone help me put with this question? Recently I found this nice Sherpa Date 33 in not working order. At the moment it is at the watchmaker but does anyone know if it is possible to replace the plexi for this one? Any help much would be great.

image by Malus65, on Flickr


image by Malus65, on Flickr


----------



## Vintage1982

Sure, why not? Might be an armoured glass though. I've seen them on a couple of Enicar watches.


----------



## HammyFan

Vintage1982 said:


> Sure, why not? Might be an armoured glass though. I've seen them on a couple of Enicar watches.


I have a Sherpa Date pictured above. I've been trying to find a replacement crystal for a long time since mine is cloudy and cannot be polished out. It's 31.6mm with a date window. The problem with the GS replacement crystals is that the retainer ring diameter is too small so the dial cannot rest on it. (it slips through) and the original retainer ring won't fit on the GS crystal. Let me know if you have better luck than I did.


----------



## Vintage1982

So it's an armoured arylic glass? What colour is the tension ring?


----------



## HammyFan

Yes it's an armored plastic crystal. Here is a better picture of mine.


----------



## Vintage1982

Looks like a chrome ring. Maybe try a Sternkreuz one.

https://www.cousinsuk.com/product/calendar-lens-chrome-ringed-glass-acl


----------



## HammyFan

Vintage1982 said:


> Looks like a chrome ring. Maybe try a Sternkreuz one.
> 
> https://www.cousinsuk.com/product/calendar-lens-chrome-ringed-glass-acl


Thanks. I'll check out the website, but would love to hear from someone that has success with using a replacement crystal for the watch pictured. Thx


----------



## malus65

I think mine can be polished a bit. But if someone knows where to find a replacement plexi then I would be pleased to hear.


----------



## vforce305

Hello guys, I've been long be a silent reader in WUS.
Finally I can joined in WUS & found the great thread including this thread  Btw I've picked up a enicar sherpa guide 600 GMT automatic cal. Ar 166. It's in a good shape, not much polish like many enicar sherpa has been much polished especially in backcase. This one in pretty good engraved & shape. But I have a problem, when that enicar on my wrist in vertical hand position & sometimes in 1-2 hrs the watch was stop moving even in normal position, always like that. Must lil' bit shaking again, even I have manually wind the crown 30-40 times. 

But if I don't wear that enicar on my wrist, it runs good & keeping time. So the watch stop only when on wrist in 1-2 hrs later. It's so weird problem for me. Maybe the rotor/mechanism was dirty?? Or the mainspring has been weak, please for the advice. Little advice so appreciated

I don't know how much bph beat in this enicar type maybe 19.800 bph/21.800 bph like a seiko?

Thanks before  Regards from Indonesia


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## crazyfist

If it's fine when you're not wearing it, what position did you leave it? Try different positions. Chances are it's the hairspring that either needs cleaning or adjustment. The hairspring could be dirty or bent out of shape. The best course of action is simply get the watch serviced. Welcome to the forum and to the wonderful world if Enicars!


----------



## vforce305

crazyfist said:


> If it's fine when you're not wearing it, what position did you leave it? Try different positions. Chances are it's the hairspring that either needs cleaning or adjustment. The hairspring could be dirty or bent out of shape. The best course of action is simply get the watch serviced. Welcome to the forum and to the wonderful world if Enicars!


When I not wearing it, i just put in usually flat position in my table. I just observe, i try if goes to vertical position the balance wheel looked more slowly beat. Yeah I think a kind like that too, but just lil' bit weirdo hv a problem like that. Maybe have a possible if my enicar more have trouble bcs I always winding manually the crown to up the perform of the mechanism? Yeahh thanks i like enicar model, i hv enthusiast in vintage watch, nice to know you bro


----------



## WatchFred

Dear Enicar aficionados, trying my luck here as Borel is out of stock: does anybody know about a source for a cal. 1146 minute wheel, please ?


----------



## GhentWatch

WatchFred said:


> Dear Enicar aficionados, trying my luck here as Borel is out of stock: does anybody know about a source for a cal. 1146 minute wheel, please ?


Did you try Cousins?


----------



## WatchFred

Youmireme said:


> Did you try Cousins?


thanks; yes, I did, none available


----------



## hns-panama

Here ya go:

Enicar 1146 1166 166D 1126 24 Hour Minute Wheel Part Number 263 | eBay


----------



## ppstore

Hi I'm new in this forum and for more than 15 years ,I've adquired Enicars . Its my favorite brand
i live in Lisbon /Portugal they are very hard to find . in the past they were not sold year only in ex-colonies namely Angola or Mozambique.I have some sherpas, dual time, mantagraph , super dive , graphomatic and some simple automatics
my last aquisition is an automatic sherpa 300 / space age design
regards


----------



## ppstore

Some more enicars
and some more


----------



## grandpasoldwatch

I got this old watch from my gramps and i'm just wondering what the value of this is. I've been browsing and doing some research on enicars and haven't seen any of them like this. I'm not really looking for sell however, i might consider for the right price lol.


----------



## hns-panama

Sorry. No valuations done here. Suggest reading the forum rules.

Your watch has an ETA movement in it. Caliber 956 most probably.


----------



## solarman102

You are right about the moon, the Enicar never got there. However, in 1958 the US Navy purchased and tested several watches, including an Enicar. The Enicar passsed a rigorous test and was used on what the Navy describes as "100 working dives" in 1959. That full report is on this blog site, section 8, on my computer.
I purchased a brand new Enicar Aqua Graph from Ken Burns Jewelers in 1972. At the time the retail price was $350.00. A lot for a watch in those days. I still have that watch, and I am delighted to see that you also have one in your collection. It is a fine watch. I recently purchased an Enicar Supertest off of Ebay. I sent it in to be completely overhauled and I just received it back today. The movement serial number is 144324. I am trying to find out more info on this watch, such as age, etc. If you have any ideas, I'd be happy to hear them. Thanks for listening.


----------



## hns-panama

Which caliber Supertest? 1290, 1124, 1125, 1126, 1145?



solarman102 said:


> You are right about the moon, the Enicar never got there. However, in 1958 the US Navy purchased and tested several watches, including an Enicar. The Enicar passsed a rigorous test and was used on what the Navy describes as "100 working dives" in 1959. That full report is on this blog site, section 8, on my computer.
> I purchased a brand new Enicar Aqua Graph from Ken Burns Jewelers in 1972. At the time the retail price was $350.00. A lot for a watch in those days. I still have that watch, and I am delighted to see that you also have one in your collection. It is a fine watch. I recently purchased an Enicar Supertest off of Ebay. I sent it in to be completely overhauled and I just received it back today. The movement serial number is 144324. I am trying to find out more info on this watch, such as age, etc. If you have any ideas, I'd be happy to hear them. Thanks for listening.


----------



## solarman102

Thank you for replying; Caliber is not stamped on the movement, only the serial # 144324 and SUPERTEST. The case would likely have had the caliber number, however, for whatever reason, my Enicar is in a stainless steel Waltham case, which does me no good for info purposes. Also, movement and dial both say "25 Jewels". I don't know if that is any help, but that's what I got.


----------



## hns-panama

Anything stamped under the balance wheel?

It may also be stamped under the dial.

Go here and search on Enicar:

bidfun-db Archive: Watch Movements

Then on the movements I mentioned. Let me know which one it most resembles.

Cheers!



solarman102 said:


> Thank you for replying; Caliber is not stamped on the movement, only the serial # 144324 and SUPERTEST. The case would likely have had the caliber number, however, for whatever reason, my Enicar is in a stainless steel Waltham case, which does me no good for info purposes. Also, movement and dial both say "25 Jewels". I don't know if that is any help, but that's what I got.


----------



## solarman102

That is a very informative site. I spent several hours pouring through the calibers you provided, and the others in the list. Oddly, my movement is not listed. My movement is manual wind and the bridges and plate are gold colored. The winding wheel is 7.3 mm and the click wheel is 7.6 mm, almost the same size. The click wheel is stamped "SUPERTEST". The main bridge is stamped 25 Jewels.
The closest I could find was 1120, but there are differences. 1120 bridges and plate are steel in color. It is 17 jewels and is not stamped SUPERTEST.
The SUPERTEST watches I found were the calibers you provided, however, they are automatic and have either 30 jewels, or star jewels.
The size of the winding and click wheels is interesting because 1120 was the only movement I found in which both wheels were almost the same size, like mine. In all other manual movements the click wheel was enormous when compared to the winding wheel. So, 1120 differs from my movement (at least visually) in three ways: 1) Number of jewels, 2) Steel plate and bridges, 3) Lack of SUPERTEST stamp. The similarity is that other than that, it is visually identical. 3 screws in the winding wheel (many examples only have 2 scews), 3 jeweled bearings in the main bridge (some examples only have two), and other than color, the bridges are identical.
I am going to try to send a photo of my movement. I don't know if I know how to do that, or if it will be successful, but I will try.
Harold.


----------



## solarman102

file:///Volumes/MACOCT2014/Watch%20Gallery%20E%20to%20I/Enicar%20Supertest%20mvmt%20144324.jpg

This is my attempt at sending the photo. It doesn't look like it worked. Lets see if it gets better at your end.
Harold.


----------



## GhentWatch

solarman102 said:


> file:///Volumes/MACOCT2014/Watch%20Gallery%20E%20to%20I/Enicar%20Supertest%20mvmt%20144324.jpg
> 
> This is my attempt at sending the photo. It doesn't look like it worked. Lets see if it gets better at your end.
> Harold.


Didn´t work, you can try uploading the pics on tinypic. and hsare the link.


----------



## hns-panama

Yes, it could be a 1120 Supertest. Until we can see the photo, I am thinking you have a 25 jewelled version of the 1120. That is something I have not seen before so looking forward to the photo. If you look at the 1010 caliber for comparison, you will find a 17 jewel steel version and 21, 23, and 25 jewelled versions in gold.

I am also thinking that the 1124/5/6 Supertest versions were in rose gold but need to look at that a bit more. I've seen 1125s in yellow gold but not Supertest models. Welcome to Enicar.



solarman102 said:


> That is a very informative site. I spent several hours pouring through the calibers you provided, and the others in the list. Oddly, my movement is not listed. My movement is manual wind and the bridges and plate are gold colored. The winding wheel is 7.3 mm and the click wheel is 7.6 mm, almost the same size. The click wheel is stamped "SUPERTEST". The main bridge is stamped 25 Jewels.
> The closest I could find was 1120, but there are differences. 1120 bridges and plate are steel in color. It is 17 jewels and is not stamped SUPERTEST.
> The SUPERTEST watches I found were the calibers you provided, however, they are automatic and have either 30 jewels, or star jewels.
> The size of the winding and click wheels is interesting because 1120 was the only movement I found in which both wheels were almost the same size, like mine. In all other manual movements the click wheel was enormous when compared to the winding wheel. So, 1120 differs from my movement (at least visually) in three ways: 1) Number of jewels, 2) Steel plate and bridges, 3) Lack of SUPERTEST stamp. The similarity is that other than that, it is visually identical. 3 screws in the winding wheel (many examples only have 2 scews), 3 jeweled bearings in the main bridge (some examples only have two), and other than color, the bridges are identical.
> I am going to try to send a photo of my movement. I don't know if I know how to do that, or if it will be successful, but I will try.
> Harold.


----------



## Dastan Phoenix

A watch that belong to my grandfather, during the French occupation in Algeria, it's an Enicar Sherpa 600 Super divette... as you see it's realy messed up and need some serious repair, got any instructions or ideas how to do it ?


----------



## solarman102

I went back and looked at the 1010 and saw what you were talking about. There was a 25 jewel version. When I first looked at it I did not pay much attention to it because of the differences in the winding wheel, and the color of the bridges and plate. So at closer inspection I think you may be on to something.
Ghent watch sent me some advice I am still trying to decipher on sending a pic to this site. He says to upload on tiny pic or use the share link. I have been searching this site trying to find references to those so I can use one of them.
As soon as I figure it out I will send that pic.
Harold.


----------



## solarman102




----------



## solarman102




----------



## solarman102

Of course, it was easy...but one slight glitch. We are on page 74 on my computer, but pic went to page 75. I sent it again but same thing happened. If you can't find it let me know. One way or the other I'll make it work.
Harold.


----------



## solarman102

Just a note: Thanks. You got me on the right track. I sent the pic.

Harold.


----------



## hns-panama

Hi,

Well, for starters, you will need the inner bezel and the crystal. The later can be found on eBay from an Australian seller. The former is much harder to find. By the way, the crystal is the same as a Sherpa Jet.

You will also need either one new Enicar crown or buy two matching crowns. Again, eBay is sometimes the best place to find them. I think two are on there now.

The movement is a 1145 Enicar and will need complete servicing. Bank on that. Looks like you will need a donor movement too. Screws are missing.

Hands are a tough one too. They can be had with a lot of patience. eBay beckons.

The dial can remain as is since it has a story to tell. Your own grandfathers.

Figure a good $400 to 550 in parts not including servicing the movement. Assuming the parts are found at a reasonable cost.

That and finding a good watchmaker where you live.



Dastan Phoenix said:


> A watch that belong to my grandfather, during the French occupation in Algeria, it's an
> Enicar Sherpa 600 Super divette... as you see it's realy messed up and need some serious repair, got any instructions or ideas how to do it ?


----------



## hns-panama

That helps a lot but not enough to accurately ID without further research.

Though one avenue can probably save you a bit of time. The movement info is most likely under the dial.

If you are not open to that route, then I suggest looking at ETA movements as they were used by Enicar.

11.75 L size is one attribute to look for.

A pic of the front would be good too. Sometimes we can tell the age by the hands and dial.



solarman102 said:


> Of course, it was easy...but one slight glitch. We are on page 74 on my computer, but pic went to page 75. I sent it again but same thing happened. If you can't find it let me know. One way or the other I'll make it work.
> Harold.


----------



## Dastan Phoenix

Hi , what you just said it's just chineese to mee , not sure I did uderstand the all of it but I'll do my best. can you give me more information on this watch, like the year of production, its price, the Enicar company, If I have more chance to get my watch repair in Switzerland since it's a swiss watch ... and what does starjewels means ? 
Thank's again really apreciated your help.


----------



## solarman102




----------



## solarman102

I sent a pic of the dial. As you can see the dial has seen better days, and so have the hands. I have not made up my mind if I want to restore them myself or let someone else do it.
As for removing the dial at his time to see under it, I am not ready for that yet. Although I am an experienced clockmaker many years ago, watches are not simply "small clocks". They are a different animal and must be respected for their own unique characteristics. I am now in the process of procuring the tools necessary to dismantle them, repair them and rebuild them, just like I used to do with clocks. I am also using books and the internet to learn the proper procedures so that I can be sure I am doing it right. I really wish I could enroll in a school of watchmaking, but the pressures of work and home make that avenue very impractical.
Harold.


----------



## ericsoundmixer

Happy New Year from China! I must admit I knew nothing about Enicar until I saw this little gem in a Shanghai antique shop. I'd be grateful for any help in determining the age of the watch. Thanks!


----------



## bigcountry

My mother in law has given me an Enicar watch that was her grandfathers so it it quite old. Unbelievably it works perfectly after not being worn for decades! I wound it a few times and put a new strap on it and it is running like a charm. I'm struggling to find any information about it though and was wondering if anyone here could help. Curious to find out exactly how old it is and anything about the movement etc.

On the face it has an Enicar logo with ultrasonic beneath it. It says 21 jewels and has the word swiss below the 6 maker.

On the back it says antimagnetic at the top, Swiss on the right, 100/145 sp on the bottom, stainless steel back on the left, surrounding an Enicar logo with the Saturn and rings, all inside a four leaf clover type shape.

The crown has the faintest Saturn and ring logo. It is almost completely gone.

From what I can tell it appears original and very old. I've not opened the case to view the movement, as I'm not really sure what to look for.

I'll post some pics if anyone is interested. Thanks in advance for any light anyone can shed!


----------



## bigcountry

http://imgur.com/oUhXwOI




http://imgur.com/JKKiGfu


----------



## solarman102

Hi,
This should get you started.

bidfun-db Archive: Watch Movements

This is a link another member sent me. The information on this site is very exhaustive. If you find out the caliber of your watch you can cross reference it and get a good idea of the year your watch was made.
The link I gave you will take you to "movements" which is full of all kinds of info you probably didn't know. You can navigate out of there and get loads of other info.
One piece of advice tho, I suggest that if you really treasure this time piece that you not run it. By now the oil has likely hardened and running it will cause damage to the movement. Take it to a reputable watchmaker and let him or her overhaul the watch. That job will most likely cost over $100.00 if no other problems are found, but if you like the watch it is well worth it.
And by all means, send some pics. I am an Enicar owner and I love to see other Enicars that are out there.


----------



## solarman102

Enicar not only made a high end watch, their watches were good to look at, front and back. And your watch is no exception.
If you decide to get the watch serviced, it would be a good idea to replace the crystal too. The dial may need refurbishing, or you may leave it as it is.

Really nice watch!


----------



## bigcountry

Thanks for you help! That's much appreciated. I'll let it wind down now until I can get it in for a service. Thanks again!


----------



## solarman102

Hello,
You made a great purchase! Congratulations.
I put a link that another member gave me which may be of some help to you.

bidfun-db Archive: Watch Movements

That link was very informative in my case.


----------



## GUTuna

My first Enicar purchase is on its way! It. Is an Saturn Matic. This one has Arabic day/date markings and an oval shape. It is running an AR 167, as seen here.

As this is my first Enicar, any help with who could service this is appreciated! I live in Washington, DC. But I am willing to mail it out for a good Enicar servicer! Thanks!


----------



## solarman102

This is for anyone out there who has found themselves in the same predicament as myself. Most of you, like myself, probably own more than one watch. And you likely have worn each of them at one time or another. And you have different reasons for owning each watch. You may like a particular caliber movement because of it's history, or a chronograph because you use the functions of it, or maybe a watch is just to your liking, the style of it really fits with who you are.
All these factors came into play with me and deciding which watch to wear often gave me a headache. So, after much thinking, I finally hit on a solution that for the first time is actually working.
I made a list of all the wearable watches that I own. I did not want to sort the list in any particular order, however, I did allow myself to mix them up on the list. As an example, I made sure that retro watches (1950's and 60's) were not all clumped together. Nor were chronographs or automatics, etc. There is an even representation throughout the entire list of each watch type. And to make the list really well balanced, I even included a QUARTZ watch. I also have a large collection of quartz, many of them solar powered, but I seldom wear them. (I prefer a well made mechanical watch from Omega, or Enicar or Heuer etc.) The quartz watch selection is only listed as QUARTZ.
I hung this list on my bookshelf. Each day I wind my mechanical watches after I get home from work. At that time I look at the list to see which watch I wear next. For instance, if the list goes Seiko, Omega, Bulova, etc, and I am wearing the Seiko, then once all the watches are wound, I take off the Seiko and put on the Omega. Tomorrow I will put on the Bulova, etc. When I get to the quartz watch, I simply choose from whatever quartz is on the shelf, without really looking. After all, I only need to wear a quartz watch once during the list. When I get to the end of the list, I start over again. I never change the order of the list and I get to wear them all during the course of the year.
This system works for me, but if anyone has a different method of tackling this problem and wants to share it, I'd love to hear it.


----------



## kazrich

Interesting method, but might I ask why you wind all your watches every day ?
Your mechanical watches are subject to wear and tear and this will drastically shorten their lives. 
Parts are becoming more difficult , if not impossible to find and you will soon need to find donor watches to keep them working.
If your watches have been serviced and have clean oil, I would maybe wind them night before use.
This is one reason that I am starting to off load old day / date watches - the mechanisms can be a pain to maintain and they rarely add
anything to the aesthetics of a watch. Lets face it, if you didn't know what day of the week it was - your probably sloshed out of your mind anyway.
I tend to fully wind each watch at least once every 2-3 weeks and never use winding machines for automatics. 
I keep a gold 50's Enicar and I forgot that I had it. It was left in a draw for a couple of months and when I wound it at Christmas it kept time
within a couple of seconds a day. It's simply not necessary to wind them every day.


----------



## solarman102

I wind them every day on the theory that if they are not wound the oil dries up and much harm is then done to pivots and parts that are meant to touch. I believe that if a watch is serviced every four to five years the wear on the parts will be very negligible. If your system is working for you I won't knock it.
Thanks for the input!


----------



## twelve199

Really


----------



## John MS

solarman102 said:


> I wind them every day on the theory that if they are not wound the oil dries up and much harm is then done to pivots and parts that are meant to touch. I believe that if a watch is serviced every four to five years the wear on the parts will be very negligible. If your system is working for you I won't knock it.
> Thanks for the input!


I don't think running the watch will do much to keep oil from drying out. 
Oil thickens from evaporation as well as dust accumulating in the oil.


----------



## kazrich

twelve199 said:


> Wonderful Blonde Sherpa Graph, late 1960s, 1st pick up of 2015. We so excited & it's not even Friday.


Well done - A great way to start the year !


----------



## solarman102

VERY nice watch!


----------



## GhentWatch

twelve199 said:


> Wonderful Blonde Sherpa Graph, late 1960s, 1st pick up of 2015. We so excited & it's not even Friday.


Shame it is a bit off mix-an match watch. It has been redialled and the original bezel is missing so they used rhodium-coated bezels that´s starting to spot.
And the case has been polished to death.

All depends on your preferences offocurse but I hope you didn´t pay top dollar for this one!


----------



## twelve199

kazrich said:


> Well done - A great way to start the year !


Thank you!!!


----------



## kazrich

GhentWatch said:


> Shame it is a bit off mix-an match watch. It has been redialled and the original bezel is missing so they used rhodium-coated bezels that´s starting to spot.
> And the case has been polished to death.
> 
> All depends on your preferences offocurse but I hope you didn´t pay top dollar for this one!


It's difficult to tell from the angle of the picture, but do you mean an outer rotating bezel ? Because only the Sherpa Jet Graph and Aqua Graph used them. 
It may have been re dialed or the dial might just be very well kept or nos. It has not been re painted.
Enicar made many versions of this dial. Most are reverse Panda ( silver sub dials on a black background ) I have seen them with both
white background with white sub dials and white with silver sub dials. That particular watch looks to date from circa 1969 / 70.
The red second and 30 seconds sub dial hands are also correct for those years.
The EPSA Super Compressor case has been polished to a similar condition as when new. To my knowledge they never offered a satin or ' distressed ' look case.
The case certainly doesn't look over polished to me.


----------



## twelve199

Thanks Kazrich! 

He is correct - The outer bezel ring has been replaced and the rhodium is spotting - it and the crystal are being replaced.

However - the dial is original & the case has not been over polished. 

The original capture was terrible so I filtered the heck out of it so that may have misguided him. 

We are in love with it - I have only seen this and an all "cream" dial (sub registers not silver like this one)


----------



## GhentWatch

kazrich said:


> It's difficult to tell from the angle of the picture, but do you mean an outer rotating bezel ? Because only the Sherpa Jet Graph and Aqua Graph used them.
> It may have been re dialed or the dial might just be very well kept or nos. It has not been re painted.
> Enicar made many versions of this dial. Most are reverse Panda ( silver sub dials on a black background ) I have seen them with both
> white background with white sub dials and white with silver sub dials. That particular watch looks to date from circa 1969 / 70.
> The red second and 30 seconds sub dial hands are also correct for those years.
> The EPSA Super Compressor case has been polished to a similar condition as when new. To my knowledge they never offered a satin or ' distressed ' look case.
> The case certainly doesn't look over polished to me.


I have to disagree, but I have seen more pics off this particular watch.
Watch has been redialled (although original part I think)

The case has been overpolished at the lugs. I am not talking about the ´shine´ the original case has 3 facets on the lugs. With a very fine flank that gives the watch a distinct geometrical contrast to the roundness off case and dial. Here the third flank has been almost lost due to uncareful polishing. Although the pics probably make it seem worse than it is but the bottom left lug looks well rounded off.

(I know since my ultra-dive has nearly the same case)


----------



## kazrich

That's the problem with watch photography. I keep a Sherpa Graph , a Super Divette and a Super Jet. All are EPSA cased with
triple faceted lugs. All the lugs look perfect in the 'flesh' , but in some photo's the lugs can appear to have a double facet.
The dial on my Graph could pass for being 2 years old when viewed with the naked eye ( or reading glasses ). Under X 10 magnification on my monitor
it looks all of it's 46 years.


----------



## twelve199

.


----------



## solarman102

You have a good eye. I dismissed those "spots" as simple reflections. But on closer examination I see you are correct.


----------



## twelve199

Enicars & Guitars


----------



## Sunday Rider

solarman102 said:


> This is for anyone out there who has found themselves in the same predicament as myself. Most of you, like myself, probably own more than one watch. And you likely have worn each of them at one time or another. And you have different reasons for owning each watch. You may like a particular caliber movement because of it's history, or a chronograph because you use the functions of it, or maybe a watch is just to your liking, the style of it really fits with who you are.
> All these factors came into play with me and deciding which watch to wear often gave me a headache. So, after much thinking, I finally hit on a solution that for the first time is actually working.
> I made a list of all the wearable watches that I own. I did not want to sort the list in any particular order, however, I did allow myself to mix them up on the list. As an example, I made sure that retro watches (1950's and 60's) were not all clumped together. Nor were chronographs or automatics, etc. There is an even representation throughout the entire list of each watch type. And to make the list really well balanced, I even included a QUARTZ watch. I also have a large collection of quartz, many of them solar powered, but I seldom wear them. (I prefer a well made mechanical watch from Omega, or Enicar or Heuer etc.) The quartz watch selection is only listed as QUARTZ.
> I hung this list on my bookshelf. Each day I wind my mechanical watches after I get home from work. At that time I look at the list to see which watch I wear next. For instance, if the list goes Seiko, Omega, Bulova, etc, and I am wearing the Seiko, then once all the watches are wound, I take off the Seiko and put on the Omega. Tomorrow I will put on the Bulova, etc. When I get to the quartz watch, I simply choose from whatever quartz is on the shelf, without really looking. After all, I only need to wear a quartz watch once during the list. When I get to the end of the list, I start over again. I never change the order of the list and I get to wear them all during the course of the year.
> This system works for me, but if anyone has a different method of tackling this problem and wants to share it, I'd love to hear it.


That is interesting.

I have one of those automatic watch winders (room for 4), but gave up on it, when the collection grew. What I do now, is switch watches at the beginning of the month. So that all the watches have stopped on around the 1st. This way I don't have to fiddle too much, except with the ones that have the day of the week. It is simple and combine that with a few NATO bands, I look forward to the beginning of each month for the "new" one. My wife and kids shake their heads and think I am nuts.

For some reason, I have no desire for a quartz watch except for when I travel. I have a Timex Iron man, that seems indestructible.


----------



## solarman102

Your method seems simple, and less time consuming than my system. If I understand correctly, you switch at the beginning of the month, meaning you wear the same watch for a month, then switch it the next month. At this rate, you would only wear 12 watches a year (except for traveling), so it would take longer than a year to give each watch it's turn.
My reason for the solar quartz collection is that I am heavy into solar power. I have built a solar system to power part of the house, saving money on the electric bill, as well as ensuring I have power after a major storm. I have also taken out 6 provisional patents on electronic circuits I have designed which incorperate solar cells. So solar powered watches have a special meaning for me simply because of my involvement in the industry. I completely understand that would not be the case with most people, especially those on this site who appreciate the fine craftsmanship and quality of a mechanical watch.


----------



## Sunday Rider

Hi Solarman, now I know the reason for your forum name. Then you have a great affinity for all things solar and I can understand why a solar watch would hold special interest for you.

You are correct that I rotate through 12 watches a year, and sometimes I wear one that I like for 2 months. I also cheat and will put on one of the wind up and automatics that have no date. I will wear them for a day and then back to my monthly watch before the power reserve runs out. 

Today I was wearing my 60s vintage Enicar Seapearl, with date. When I got home I threw on the 50s vintage Benrus self winding non-date watch. I will wear until tomorrow morning.

I've been doing this for few years, and now find there are ones I like wearing more than others.


----------



## Thinkfloyd

From ebay, perhaps the "woes" of collecting Enicar watches... Ladies and gents, I give you the super rare "Ultrdsonic"!









The same seller seems to have done 6 redials with the same spelling...


----------



## solarman102

I know how you feel. I purchased an Enicar SUPERTEST on Ebay. When I received it I found out why there were no pics of the back of the watch. The case is a Waltham! And the winding crown is not Enicar signed, so is not an Enicar crown. I opened the watch. It is a genuine SUPERTEST movement, so I am happy with that. But I would really have liked the whole watch to be Enicar, not just the movement and dial. If I can find the actual case that goes with the movement I would pick it up. But I know my chances of finding that are slim to none.


----------



## kazrich

Thinkfloyd said:


> From ebay, perhaps the "woes" of collecting Enicar watches... Ladies and gents, I give you the super rare "Ultrdsonic"!
> 
> View attachment 2643834
> 
> 
> The same seller seems to have done 6 redials with the same spelling...


It's a known fact that in the 60's Enicar wanted to satisfy potential buyers looking for a combination of
dress watch and sports watch. They decided on fitting a bright orange sports second hand to a dress watch.
Not entirely satisfied with the result they christened it Ultrasodit. Not a lot of people know that








Could be a rare piece.


----------



## Thinkfloyd

solarman102 said:


> I know how you feel.


I definitely didn't buy it


----------



## Peerke

Here is my latest Enicar related purchase. A watch display


----------



## Peerke

And again another Enicar that has found its way towards me.


----------



## Peerke

Some more Enicars in my tiny collection of 12 Enicars.
My Enicars are not, what you call, NOS but they show the hard life they've got. Those were toolwatches back in the days, and they still are today.









The last one is my Enicar Supertest with 23 jewels. I can not find a second one as they start with 25 jewels in every description. The set lever spring was broken, but Cousins had one in store. There is an AR 1125 ticking underneath the bonnet. This one runs very accurate nog.


----------



## solarman102

Very nice collection. I especially like the 3rd from the bottom, (antimagnetic with sub sec dial---can't read the jewels).


----------



## german

My contribution - a bit strange with blue "jewels" on dial. Somebody tried to improve it?
I think should try to remove these "jewels" and put extra lume points to hide the traces.


----------



## Peerke

solarman102 said:


> Very nice collection. I especially like the 3rd from the bottom, (antimagnetic with sub sec dial---can't read the jewels).


Thanx. It says 17 jewels.


----------



## solarman102

As far as cars and watches go, I am a "factory specs" type guy. I believe the way they made it is the way it should stay.
However, I must say those stones were applied very well (at least as they look on my screen) and I think they give a balancing contrast to the dial.


----------



## Thinkfloyd

german said:


> My contribution - a bit strange with blue "jewels" on dial. Somebody tried to improve it?
> I think should try to remove these "jewels" and put extra lume points to hide the traces.


I say leave it as it is, it's pretty unusual, and I'd say it was done a long time ago, maybe even at purchase? Perhaps they didn't have any 25 jewel movements and wanted to make up the difference


----------



## futurejock

Hi Dogen,
I love your collection. It's amazing. I especially like the divette. Does the name imply it can be worn by a female?
three questions:
1) Which is your favorite?
2) IF you began collecting another brand, which might you choose?
3) What is an Enicar "tool-watch"?
PS I agree with a previous poster, your collection deserves to be shown again under a more prominent title. But I am a newbie at WUS, maybe an old timer can get behind this and show you how to do it. Personally I'd like to see more discussion about Enicar in these forums.
Best


----------



## uniformblackstore

Hi everyone,

This Enicar watch belonged to my late grandfather and has recently become mine. I haven't seen anything exactly like it here.

It's a (deep breath) Seapearl ultrasonic automatic supertest rubyrotor with a 30 jewel movement. He always bragged about how many jewels it had 

The movement is an AR1124, which was scribed into the rotor by hand. You can kind of make it out in the photo below, to the left of the Enicar logo.

I have seen one like it but not with a red second hand, perhaps this was modified? The crown doesn't have a logo on it either. Seems to be working fine, but I've dropped it off with a watchmaker to give me a quote on a service. Would like to wear this as a daily, love it.


----------



## Stigmata

twelve199 said:


> Enicars & Guitars


Gorgeous watch and desreves a bump.


----------



## lennet

Hi guys,

i looked a long time for this version. Paid 1,200 € to an scammer in India but never got the watch.

Now my girl donated this Sherpa Diver to me. It was special made for the army of poland.
Look please at the military marks at its side:



Cheers

Bernd


----------



## twelve199

Stigmata said:


> Gorgeous watch and desreves a bump.












A little closer for Stigmata  happy Friday Everyone


----------



## Crezo

Some beautiful examples here. I picked up my first enicar for my dad for his birthday last year.

Always keeping my eye out for some nice ones, but prices seem.to have rocketed recently!


----------



## Renny

I'm just waiting on my first one landing in the next few days. A very unusual looking watch compared to most of the ones on here so I'm not convinced it is genuine. I look forward to getting opinions when it arrives, even if it is dubious it looks pretty cool so I'll probably just enjoy it for the appearance.


----------



## solarman102

Great. Waiting for the pic.


----------



## vandervenus

Hello everyone,

Having been a silent reader on this thread for quite a while now, I found it time to share my growing collection of Enicar watches. 
First of all, I want to thank all the contributors on this forum for sharing their immense load of insights and pictures of their watches. That has truly helped me avoiding the fakes and prevented me from spending to much money on frankenwatches. That being said, it also got me hooked on collecting Enicars, especially the Sherpa line. Of course my collection will never be as awesome as that of Dogen ;-)

This is my current Enicar collection:















In the next couple of posts, I'll upload more detailled pictures, if you'll allow me. Also, I will ad two more that are on their way to Holland as we speak (Star Diver and a rather special Jet) and a SuperJet that's in my watchmakers workplace, getting a new crystal. 






















Thanks for reading,
Martijn


----------



## Renny

Having looked at more of this thread I've realised that my decision not to follow a nice looking example up recently was wrong. I decided that there was no way a dress dial watch would have a bright orange second hand, it appears that with Enicar they often did. 

Every day on this website is a learning experience.


----------



## vandervenus

The first Enicar I ever bought was this one. I got it of eBay a couple of years ago with no knowledge of the brand. Heck, I didn't even have any knowledge about watches at all. Till then I only had one watch, a Diesel quartz, that was given to me by my wife some birthdays ago. I just stumbled upon this Enicar while looking for a vinyl record. Strange, right?

The first thing I noticed was the fantastic dial that was totally seventies, just like me. I liked it instantly. Second, I found the Saturn-logo to be very attractive. I work at an advertising agency, so I'm a fool for distinctive logo's. Also, it was amazing to discover that the brandname Enicar was in fact Racine spelled backwards!

This Enicar has been with me for a while now. And although I don't wear it that much, it will always be special for being the first of my Enicars. I guess everyone on this forum will know what I mean.


----------



## Hartmut Richter

Two very nice wrist alarms with Lemania Cal. 2980 there in the watch box (same as the Lemania 980 used in the Omega Memomatic but without the minute precision on the alarm setting). What I always found interesting is the positioning of the lume dots on the dial: they form a (near) perfect rhomboid (only the one at 3:00 is missing).....

Hartmut Richter


----------



## Renny

Right so my eBay lucky punt has arrived and as I suspected it is very suspect. Point 1 not an Enicar case back. Point 2 not an Enicar crown. Also the movement and dial are sitting off centre in the case, something not visible in the sellers photos.

I took a wild shot as was very cheap and looked interesting and had a black case as seen on page 50 of this thread. The dial seems kosher and until I get the case open I'm not sure of the movement. My suspicion is an Enicar movement and dial chucked inside an interesting case. Still it has kept perfect time for 12 hours and is a nice kitch looking watch. I don't mind being stung if it is for £20 as sometime you get lucky. Not this time though. I'll wear it though as it is interesting looking if nothing else.


----------



## vandervenus

Hartmut Richter said:


> What I always found interesting is the positioning of the lume dots on the dial: they form a (near) perfect rhomboid (only the one at 3:00 is missing).....
> 
> Hartmut Richter


Yes, that is very special. My Jet and SuperDive have got this feature too. The Jet and the Memostar I own are both NOS, so the lime dots do light up a bit in the dark. It's a beautiful thing. I'm gonna try to take a picture of it soon. In the meanwhile here's some daylight pics of the Memostar. I got it from Germany a couple of weeks ago. I've compared it to the Omega Memomatic and I must say that the Enicar has stood the test of time way better than the Omega. That's something that I like best about Enicar: even the funky and wild ones, like the Guide and the Star Diver, still look like they could have been designed last year!


----------



## hns-panama

Well, you basically called it.

Without seeing the movement I'd say you have an Enicar dial in a generic case. The hands are generic too.

The problem I have is when sellers try to pawn off these watches as original.

I am looking at an Indian seller's watch right now. I know the dial has been repainted a horrible color, however, the rest of it is original and it has the parts I need in one fell swoop. Indian sellers have good parts watches. I can sell the remaining parts I don't use. The seller is being honest enough to say the dial was repainted so that at least is a point in his favor.

Enicar sold a lot of watches in Asia so that's the place for parts for some models. Lesson learned...

Bottom line for you is if you are happy with the inexpensive watch you bought. Wear it with an interesting story to tell.



Renny said:


> Right so my eBay lucky punt has arrived and as I suspected it is very suspect. Point 1 not an Enicar case back. Point 2 not an Enicar crown. Also the movement and dial are sitting off centre in the case, something not visible in the sellers photos.
> 
> I took a wild shot as was very cheap and looked interesting and had a black case as seen on page 50 of this thread. The dial seems kosher and until I get the case open I'm not sure of the movement. My suspicion is an Enicar movement and dial chucked inside an interesting case. Still it has kept perfect time for 12 hours and is a nice kitch looking watch. I don't mind being stung if it is for £20 as sometime you get lucky. Not this time though. I'll wear it though as it is interesting looking if nothing else.
> 
> View attachment 3000634
> View attachment 3000642
> View attachment 3000674


----------



## hns-panama

One thing that stands the test of time -- the majesty of simplicity. Enicar nailed that on so many models.



vandervenus said:


> Yes, that is very special. My Jet and SuperDive have got this feature too. The Jet and the Memostar I own are both NOS, so the lime dots do light up a bit in the dark. It's a beautiful thing. I'm gonna try to take a picture of it soon. In the meanwhile here's some daylight pics of the Memostar. I got it from Germany a couple of weeks ago. I've compared it to the Omega Memomatic and I must say that the Enicar has stood the test of time way better than the Omega. That's something that I like best about Enicar: even the funky and wild ones, like the Guide and the Star Diver, still look like they could have been designed last year!
> 
> View attachment 3004426
> 
> View attachment 3004458


----------



## Habitant

Well, I'll admit that I've teased you Enicar fans here on WUS. Hey, I mean how many pages are you guys going to run to before you start your own category? Haha. Truly great to see such passion and interest in the brand. Anyway&#8230; I finally joined the Enicar club, as this little beauty today. It's a manual wind cal. 1010.
Needs a new crystal, which I've ordered. Crown? On order. And needs to be overhauled, as the service history is unknown. But in my opinion, a very pretty little thing. I'll post when it's back up and running.


----------



## vandervenus

I'd like to introduce to you the second and third Enicar in my collection. I bought them about a year ago. Both are Star Jewels. I'm not sure what movement is inside, because I usually don't open them up. Changing straps on the other hand, isn't that hard. I've bought quite some Tropic straps lately, since I found out that they fit me best. They don't get sweaty, they don't tear out the hairs on your arm. And they look great on most Enicars.


----------



## hns-panama

Show us your case backs and we can give you an idea of what movement is inside.


----------



## monoennio

Hi all,
Mauro and I'm writing from Italy.
I went to discover your forum because I was searching some info about my Enicar Sherpa Super Divette.
I have it at my wrist from 1967 and many years ago it had subsituted the caliber (I was a little bit wild boy).
Now I discovered on other forum that subsitution was from AR 1145 to AR 1165.
You have here many beatyful watches so I want show you my Sherpa.
Sorry, my english is very basic 
Beautyful thread.
Mauro


----------



## vforce305

Hello guys, i just picked up Enicar Sherpa 600 Day Date EPSA Case, first that normal, pushing the crown for change date ok. But when i cleaned the body, i release the crown and put it out with the movement while I clean the inside body of sherpa. After that I put in the movement but suddenly when I put in the crown lil' bit hard, take it out and put in again but won't pushing the date & can't wound manually. Just can do set hours and jamming in 9 o'clock. Maybe can somebody help me? Bcs i feel bad, maybe the gear for pushing pump date/gear for manually wound are broken? Thats why the hours are jamming? I can't wound the crown anymore after 9 o'clock. I just think weird why like that, i put it crown normally not with force. Thanks b4 sorry for my bad english

Btw that's the pict of sherpa 600 mate, lil'bit hard to find the references


----------



## yomero

Hey there everyone!

Longtime lurker, first post, first Enicar.

I've been restoring a piece found for very little in a very sorry state. Decided to share this one with you as I've not seen a similar example after trawling through the whole thread. Oh boy I'm in trouble :roll: Now I'm lusting after the Pearls, the Sherpas, the lot.

The case has some nasty bangs showing abuse from previous owners and watchmakers. Very light polishing to remove all tarnish and keep as much as possible from the original 20 micron plating. A first attempt at polishing the acrilic got out most of the damage from the crystal.







Fairly small piece, 30mm w/o crown but I just love how it sits on my 6.75" wrist. Darkened close-up so you get to see the art deco elongated numerals a bit better, I've saw 12 and 6, some seldom 9s but never full arabics. Could it be non-original?







Back case is marked Ultrasonic (Cleaning process) 1/13 PS (Plated, central seconds)







It houses an A.R 980 movement with 25 Jewels








There are a couple of markings on the caseback a crude "X XI 69 M" and a finer "VII 68" with a couple of hallmarks/signatures? which I guess might be related to manufacture or arrival to dealer 








I want to take the movement out to clean the dial as I've done to other vintages I own, however after removing the winding stem and the two screws at 6 and 12 I'm unable to remove the caliber. I can turn it almost a whole turn in either direction but just can't extract it. Any ideas? Several blade tips have been broken trying to gain leverage in the small space left in the case. Flipping it and tipping gently won't get it to budge either.

Your help will be greatly appreciated since local watchmakers won't clean it, they want to redial it.

Kindest regards!


----------



## vandervenus

hns-panama said:


> Show us your case backs and we can give you an idea of what movement is inside.


Thanks! I was only able to take a pic of the Star Jewels with the brown dial. The otherone has the markings polished off.


----------



## vandervenus

One of my favorite models right now is the Enicar chronograph I bought from chronomatic.com. Truly in a wonderful shape and all original. I love that big green seconds hand and the way the subdials are devided into black and red. It came with the original steel band, but I replaced it with a blue Tropic. Wears really comfortable, I must say.


----------



## hns-panama

Caliber 161.

A very well crafted one at that.

The 160 does not have a date function. 161 does. Both are manual wind.



vandervenus said:


> Thanks! I was only able to take a pic of the Star Jewels with the brown dial. The otherone has the markings polished off.


----------



## vandervenus

Here's my Sherpa Guide. I believe it is a mark III. I got it from a French seller. It runs flawless and it looks very nice: original crowns, crystal, hands, steel band and bezel rings are all in good condition. 

My question is why most of these Sherpa's look like they have been tortured with a set of pliers? Almost every example I have seen has a damaged bezelring and pointer. Were they so fragile? Or is it age, combined with heavy use?
Also, I'm curious to find out how many different versions were made. There seems to be an endless range of dials, innerbezels, outerbezels and pointers. Are there specific rare combinations?


----------



## hns-panama

Simply put, they were/are tool watches and were used as such. Wear it long enough and you will see why.

The bezels are apparently made of soft metal so they are prone to wear around the outside. You were luck to find one relatively unscathed.

Wear it with pride!



vandervenus said:


> Here's my Sherpa Guide. I believe it is a mark III. I got it from a French seller. It runs flawless and it looks very nice: original crowns, crystal, hands, steel band and bezel rings are all in good condition.
> 
> My question is why most of these Sherpa's look like they have been tortured with a set of pliers? Almost every example I have seen has a damaged bezelring and pointer. Were they so fragile? Or is it age, combined with heavy use?
> Also, I'm curious to find out how many different versions were made. There seems to be an endless range of dials, innerbezels, outerbezels and pointers. Are there specific rare combinations?


----------



## solarman102

My Enicar Supertest arrived in a stainless steel Waltham case, not shown in the Ebay pic. I opened it and was relieved to find a Supertest movement inside, serial # 144324. Hope you have the same good luck I did.


----------



## solarman102

REALLY nice. Too bad the original company is not still in business.


----------



## Habitant

The marks inside the case back you refer to are almost certainly watchmaker's service dates.

To remove the movement, it sounds like you need to undo the movement screws (as you described), but then invert it, remove the bezel/crystal and push it gently from the back and remove it from the front.

"...they want to redial it." Dial doesn't look too bad in your pictures!



yomero said:


> Hey there everyone!
> 
> Longtime lurker, first post, first Enicar.
> 
> I've been restoring a piece found for very little in a very sorry state. Decided to share this one with you as I've not seen a similar example after trawling through the whole thread. Oh boy I'm in trouble :roll: Now I'm lusting after the Pearls, the Sherpas, the lot.
> 
> The case has some nasty bangs showing abuse from previous owners and watchmakers. Very light polishing to remove all tarnish and keep as much as possible from the original 20 micron plating. A first attempt at polishing the acrilic got out most of the damage from the crystal.
> 
> Fairly small piece, 30mm w/o crown but I just love how it sits on my 6.75" wrist. Darkened close-up so you get to see the art deco elongated numerals a bit better, I've saw 12 and 6, some seldom 9s but never full arabics. Could it be non-original?
> 
> Back case is marked Ultrasonic (Cleaning process) 1/13 PS (Plated, central seconds)
> 
> It houses an A.R 980 movement with 25 Jewels
> 
> There are a couple of markings on the caseback a crude "X XI 69 M" and a finer "VII 68" with a couple of hallmarks/signatures? which I guess might be related to manufacture or arrival to dealer
> 
> I want to take the movement out to clean the dial as I've done to other vintages I own, however after removing the winding stem and the two screws at 6 and 12 I'm unable to remove the caliber. I can turn it almost a whole turn in either direction but just can't extract it. Any ideas? Several blade tips have been broken trying to gain leverage in the small space left in the case. Flipping it and tipping gently won't get it to budge either.
> 
> Your help will be greatly appreciated since local watchmakers won't clean it, they want to redial it.
> 
> Kindest regards!


----------



## GhentWatch

ANyone know which windingdirection the AR1145 has?

Was thinking CCW.


Cheers


----------



## vandervenus

This little Sherpa 300 (at least, that is what the backside says) is a real treat for the eye. The dial looks like it was fabricated yesterday. I got it online and was quite surprised by the size when it arrived. It's about 35mm without crown. I was expecting to get large diver, like the SuperDive. But I'm still very happy with this Sherpa. I usually wear it when sporting. It makes a perfect match with a fitness bike


----------



## vandervenus

The Sherpa Jet is such a sophisticated watch. Just look at the colors, the black and red checkered hand, the terrific case... It has a great backstory too, being the watch of choice for the pilots of Swiss Air. I think this is the watch Don Draper would wear on a daily base. My Jet is NOS with the original bracelet still present. I searched so hard for this watch, that I ended up with two. The other one I sold to a fellow Dutchmen, who likes to visit this forum too. He's a huge Enicar enthusiast, building a very nice collection which I'm sure he will show on this forum sooner or later ;-)









The Sherpa Jet is serious business
.


----------



## GhentWatch

Awesome to have a fellow Enicar Enthousiast close to home


----------



## flacousa

I own an Enicar Ultrasonic 21 jewels 18k - It has a rusted stem that needs replacement to fit a new crown but need help locating the right stem, when I looked in eBay and other sites they want to know the "caliber" and I have no idea what the cal is, hope that someone here can get me some info on the watch caliber. Inscribed on the case back is 100/67 AG 105 enclosed are a couple photos to aid ID the watch.
















Note: Found it! The caliber that is, now to search for the stem.
Caliber AS 1361N = (1034) and the stem should be W2056
Once I get it working I'll share the story of this watch that has been in my possession for the last 36 years.

Sent from planet earth


----------



## Stigmata

vandervenus said:


> Here's my Sherpa Guide. I believe it is a mark III. I got it from a French seller. It runs flawless and it looks very nice: original crowns, crystal, hands, steel band and bezel rings are all in good condition.
> 
> My question is why most of these Sherpa's look like they have been tortured with a set of pliers? Almost every example I have seen has a damaged bezelring and pointer. Were they so fragile? Or is it age, combined with heavy use?
> Also, I'm curious to find out how many different versions were made. There seems to be an endless range of dials, innerbezels, outerbezels and pointers. Are there specific rare combinations?


Theyre forty years old and are sports watches.
They were not worn by office types .. and theyre not sport watches.
They each have their very own history and tale.
Mostly lived a life in SE Asia.. most likely Indonesia
People didnt buy them because they had an office job and they were a fragile watch.
They bought them because they could take a pounding under any kind of conditions. Thats how they were marketed and thats how they existed..
Thats a nice example by the way...
Short lug and a 14X movement.


----------



## vandervenus

Stigmata said:


> Theyre forty years old and are sports watches.
> They were not worn by office types .. and theyre not sport watches.
> They each have their very own history and tale.
> Mostly lived a life in SE Asia.. most likely Indonesia
> People didnt buy them because they had an office job and they were a fragile watch.
> They bought them because they could take a pounding under any kind of conditions. Thats how they were marketed and thats how they existed..
> Thats a nice example by the way...
> Short lug and a 14X movement.


I'm not sure about the movement. I made a pic of the backside and it looks like it says 166-35-04.


----------



## vandervenus

This SuperDive dates from the late sixties. It's supposed to have been used by the Polish marine. There are certainly some indications that this could be correct: the watch has got a grey innerbezel, it is signed on the backside with a MW-6677 code and also, I bought it from a guy in Poland. Of course, that doesn't have to mean that the watch is 100% authentic. 

The thing that makes me doubt a bit, is the condition of the grey innerbezel. It looks to good to be over forty years old. The seller didn't know the exact history. Also, I read on a German forum that there are fakes on the market. The MW-code on the side or the backside is forged to make a collectors item out of an ordinary SuperDive. I must admit that the Polish marine origin adds something special to the watch.

Anyway, if this one turns out to be not a 100% original, it's still a damned fine watch that is very reliable and makes heads turn.


----------



## John MS

vandervenus said:


> This little Sherpa 300 (at least, that is what the backside says) is a real treat for the eye. The dial looks like it was fabricated yesterday. I got it online and was quite surprised by the size when it arrived. It's about 35mm without crown. I was expecting to get large diver, like the SuperDive. But I'm still very happy with this Sherpa. I usually wear it when sporting. It makes a perfect match with a fitness bike


You have some lovely Enicar watches, congratulations. I especially like that Jet.
I enjoy a Sherpa Guide with the original bracelet. Unlike most examples the rather fragile cities ring is pristine. I believe it is made of aluminum or pot metal and the paint is not durable at all. The watch is currently on a Rios perforated leather strap.


----------



## vandervenus

Hi John,

That is one terrific Guide. Looks NOS to me. I read that some forummembers rather don't want to wear their NOS watches, cause if the risk of scratching them or worse. While I can understand that, I like to show 'm off as much as I can ;-)


----------



## John MS

I choose to wear my watches too, including the ones in new condition. For me it's the best way to enjoy them.


----------



## vandervenus

This Sherpa Jet arrived today from Australia. The seller told me he replaced the old case with a NOS example. I don't know if this Jet originally had a black and yellow bezel, but I kindda like it. It's really funky. But the best part of this Jet I think is the silver dial. It's all shiny and bright when hit by the sunlight.

I have not yet decided if I want to keep the red strap. I have a 19mm Tropic Star that's ready to go, but than again I think the red leather adds a nice touch and it gives the watch a more vintage feel. Choices, choices...
















Here comes the sun


----------



## yomero

Habitant said:


> The marks inside the case back you refer to are almost certainly watchmaker's service dates.
> 
> To remove the movement, it sounds like you need to undo the movement screws (as you described), but then invert it, remove the bezel/crystal and push it gently from the back and remove it from the front.
> 
> "...they want to redial it." Dial doesn't look too bad in your pictures!


Thank you very much! :-!

Your instructions worked great. I was able to clean the hands and dial, pics doesn't show much but in person but dial stands out a lot now, a nice pearlesence has become apparent.








Qualified labor costs are very low here South of the Border. I was charged $10 USD for clean, oil and adjust for this one at from a posh, reputable jewellers in the commercial district. The local market is used to low prices, but doesnt value crafstmanship nor quality much, so most watchmakers will do the bare minimum to your piece and will try force you into unneeded quick jobs like glass and case swaps, repaint dials and others to make a quicker buck.

I'm still looking for a watchmaker that is willing to charge me more but offers more attention to detail. Yes, the movement was very well regulated to about -2secs a day (but only face up, one day on the wrist and it is another story) and cleaned, but only were it was needed, the bridges weren't polished to remove some light rusting and you won't believe the amount of grime inside the case and between lugs that it had.

Again, I appreciate all the info and advice. Happy to learn so much about watches

Regards!


----------



## vandervenus

yomero said:


> Qualified labor costs are very low here South of the Border. I was charged $10 USD for clean, oil and adjust for this one at from a posh, reputable jewellers in the commercial district. The local market is used to low prices, but doesnt value crafstmanship nor quality much, so most watchmakers will do the bare minimum to your piece and will try force you into unneeded quick jobs like glass and case swaps, repaint dials and others to make a quicker buck.
> 
> I'm still looking for a watchmaker that is willing to charge me more but offers more attention to detail.


Those prices are ridiculously low. Having an allround watchmaker in Holland swapping a simple glass will cost you about €35 - €60. A service (cleaning, oil and adjust) usually is somewhere between €75 - €150. Specialized watchmakers are becoming a rare breed in my country. They have watches literally piled up in their workshops. I phoned one a couple of days ago about working on my SuperDive and he said he wasn't going to take new orders for the next 3 months...


----------



## gverso

Gentlemen,
Can you advise how to remove the winding stem from AR 1145?
thank you for your pictured-assistance ;-)

G


----------



## GhentWatch

vandervenus said:


> Those prices are ridiculously low. Having an allround watchmaker in Holland swapping a simple glass will cost you about €35 - €60. A service (cleaning, oil and adjust) usually is somewhere between €75 - €150. Specialized watchmakers are becoming a rare breed in my country. They have watches literally piled up in their workshops. I phoned one a couple of days ago about working on my SuperDive and he said he wasn't going to take new orders for the next 3 months...


You should ask on HorlogeForum.nl plenty of decent watchmakers.
How many Enicars do you have now?


----------



## vandervenus

GhentWatch said:


> You should ask on HorlogeForum.nl plenty of decent watchmakers.
> How many Enicars do you have now?


Thanks for the heads up. I know the forum you mentioned. Actually, the watchmaker I phoned I got from that forum. He's supposed to be really good, hence the waiting list. I'm specifically looking for a watchmaker in my area, because I don't won't so send my watches by mail. Had some bad luck with that lately...

At this moment I own 16 Enicars. I was also expecting a NOS Star Diver, but that's not gonna happen I'm afraid. The seller hasn't been able to locate it in the last four weeks. There's still a change it might turn up, so fingers crossed. In the meantime I purchased a very nice Graphomatic. Unfortunately it was delivered with the crystal lying off. Nothing that can't be fixed, and the watch seems to be in good condition, with all the functions working.


----------



## Clem Vannstein

Anybody know anything about an Enicar "Durit" Ocean Pearl with an AR167 and a brass or copper bezel. Red second hand?


----------



## hns-panama

I will post a new thread in case some Sherpa Guide owners miss this post.

GS now has your XHD 35 1/4 crystals in stock. I asked them almost a year ago to make a new batch and they did. As I do not have one, I didn't follow up for a while. But, good news, for those of you looking for a new one, they got em.

See this great post for replacing the crystal yourself. Be very, repeat, very careful with the tension ring. That is key for making it work right. You must reuse your original as it keeps the revolving inner bezel in place.

https://www.watchuseek.com/f11/enicar-sherpa-guide-433520-3.html

Good luck!


----------



## vandervenus

Clem Vannstein said:


> Anybody know anything about an Enicar "Durit" Ocean Pearl with an AR167 and a brass or copper bezel. Red second hand?
> 
> View attachment 3185986
> 
> 
> View attachment 3186026
> 
> 
> View attachment 3186122


I have serious doubts about the case. This watch is on eBay, right? I've only seen one other Durit lately, but that looked totally different. It was some kind of 'driver watch', which you have to wear on the inside of your wrist. That looked rather fishy to me also. Everytime I see an Enicar on the bay that is advertised as 'super rare', my spider senses start tickling.


----------



## yomero

Vandervenus, hope you get that crystal on the Graphomatic back again soon, it looks sweet! And may that Super Dive gets serviced soon too.

If it helps, there's an underside to being in this corner of the world. Yes, I can pamper my pieces and take them to the watchmakers very often to have work done on them super fast, for very little. However shipping costs and taxes are brutal and wages aren't that attractive. I'm a Chemical Engineer with an European MBA and 10 years of experience in my field at a world class company looking for a job. I'm shooting for $17,000 Usd a year and even that's proving hard to find.

So the collection grows at a very moderate pace. That means I get to think a lot and research very well all acquisitions which is half the fun.!  

Out of those 16, which one gets the most wrist time?

Cheers!


----------



## vandervenus

Hi Yomero,

Building a collection in a moderate pace was something I planned to do too. But once infected with the Enicar virus, I got kindda carried away. I had serveral watches for sale, so that generated the funds to buy the high end models. But recently I moved with the wife and kids to another house and that has put and end to my shopping craze ;-) The Graphomatic is the last big purchase for now. Unless a NOS Star Diver comes along off course.

These Enicars get the most wrist time:


----------



## Stigmata

Red date 14x movement
Black date 16x movement

Those compressor cases were not made by Enicar . they were made by the legendary EPSA company who also made similar compressor cases for IWC Longines JLC and a galaxy of other watch companies in the hurly burly halcyon days of swiss 60s 70s watches.
Enicar was throwing in moments into the watches for Sherpa range because they had quite a market.
Most of the 16x examples will be found in the short lug version of the GMT Guide.. Which really is a fabulous watch. I'm fortunate enough to own three one pretty much mint.
So many Enicars ended up in Asia because they were so reliable.
There are all kinds of stories about the Guide being an ex military watch. Is a myth as far as I was able to establish. It was just a great watch at a great price point that was marketed as very robust and reliable.
I've checked the military story with people that were quite high up in the chain of command under Suharto. I have to call it an unfounded story.
Getting back to EPSA compressor cases.. There is a heap of information if you Google " epsa compressor watches"
Because you can still find many relatively cheap ( though some examples are astronomical in price) they're always going to have sound investment potential add well as great looks.
On a side note. I just picked up another jump hour..


----------



## cruisaire

My first, an Ultrasonic Seapearl with an AR 1010 inside.

20150308_182243.jpg Photo by cruisaire | Photobucket
20150308_182113.jpg Photo by cruisaire | Photobucket
20150308_182203.jpg Photo by cruisaire | Photobucket


----------



## Stigmata

i have an ultrasonic also. a friend of mine who is a huge enicar collector and boutique watch manufacturer rates the 1010 as an "indestructable " movement


----------



## DaBaeker

vandervenus said:


> View attachment 2980194
> 
> View attachment 2980202
> 
> 
> In the next couple of posts, I'll upload more detailled pictures, if you'll allow me. Also, I will ad two more that are on their way to Holland as we speak (Star Diver and a rather special Jet) and a SuperJet that's in my watchmakers workplace, getting a new crystal.
> View attachment 2980218
> 
> View attachment 2980242
> 
> View attachment 2980266
> 
> 
> Thanks for reading,
> Martijn


I'd almost kill for the sherpa Jets.


----------



## vandervenus

DaBaeker said:


> I'd almost kill for the sherpa Jets.


Than I guess I'm lucky I live on the other side of the world ;-)

Here's another Enicar that I added to the collection recently. It's a watch I got from Barcelona that is in almost NOS condition. My guess is that this one dates from the late seventies, but I'm not sure.
I switched the original bracelet for a mesh. Somewhere in this gigantic thread I saw exactly the same watch with the same mesh band. Good inspiration deserves following.


----------



## rainbowfix

rainbowfix said:


> Crazy Jet!!!! Any info on the correct part number for this poor guy crazing crystal? Please help me get this guy looking great again!
> Thanks.
> View attachment 1596074
> 
> View attachment 1596075


Thanks Hunter... the new crystal make the watch looks great again....


----------



## DaBaeker

rainbowfix said:


> Thanks Hunter... the new crystal make the watch looks great again....
> 
> View attachment 3261698


one of the best looking 60s super-compressor watches made. I am kicking myself for not buying a few of the 'Jet' models 6 years ago when they were trending at <$200 usd


----------



## vandervenus

DaBaeker said:


> I am kicking myself for not buying a few of the 'Jet' models 6 years ago when they were trending at <$200 usd


Wow, where they really that cheap back than? I've been searching the web for quite some time now on Enicar Sherpa (Super)Jets, and I've come across a couple of them in NOS condition that were priced around €1.000 - €1.300 in 2008 and after. I'd say that's about the same price they're going for today.


----------



## Stigmata

Lovely transfomation 

great watch .. i have one coming.


----------



## DaBaeker

I now I understand the 'joy of collecting vintage encore watches'. when doing google research on the brand this thread is starting to become a legend for source info. and its such an earnest title. i remember seeing this years ago and thinking, "how funny". so I finally 'get' it. the brand that is:

New and newly cleaned up by myself: mid-late60s Enicar Sherpa Guide 600 GMT:



the next pic- where-its noticeable that I did what probably many Sherpa Guide owners all try at least once-which is to touch up the tip of the red bezel pointer with red sharpie! It doesn't look too bad in life but looks awful in the pic. luckily-it does absolutely nothing and rubs off in a few minutes. having a scuffed bezel pointer tip is evidently the price one has to be willing to pay in order to enjoy a vintage Enicar Sherpa Guide. Otherwise I believe this model is all original. Its been very well worn (and dented and dinged) for many years. It reminds me of an old russian tank. A bit clunky with some rattles but keeps on ticking. Seller was original owner and yep-he lived his whole live in the humid enviornment of Indonesia. But he actually had service receipts dating back 25 years or more that I can't read anyway! (and so much for the stereotype of the 'bad' SE Asain seller. This guy was a sweetheart who stressed he didn't polish or clean up watch so buyer would know it wasn't messed with. Its possible the second hand is not original. I don't know how to tell) I think I read where over 95% have worn bezel tips and worn outer bezel edges and most have been well worn and used as tool watches-not showy vintage pieces. so thats that. If I wanted to spend a small fortune-I could have found a minty Sherpa but it just didn't seem like as much fun.


----------



## vandervenus

Is that a silver & black innerbezel? That's sweeeeet. Lovely Sherpa and what a joy it is wearing one of these 

This thread is a treasure indeed. If you can understand German, there's a terrific thread on Uhrforum.de too. I can make some translations if anyone's interested.


----------



## Stigmata

DaBaeker said:


> I now I understand the 'joy of collecting vintage encore watches'. when doing google research on the brand this thread is starting to become a legend for source info. and its such an earnest title. i remember seeing this years ago and thinking, "how funny". so I finally 'get' it. the brand that is:
> 
> New and newly cleaned up by myself: mid-late60s Enicar Sherpa Guide 600 GMT:
> 
> 
> 
> the next pic- where-its noticeable that I did what probably many Sherpa Guide owners all try at least once-which is to touch up the tip of the red bezel pointer with red sharpie! It doesn't look too bad in life but looks awful in the pic. luckily-it does absolutely nothing and rubs off in a few minutes. having a scuffed bezel pointer tip is evidently the price one has to be willing to pay in order to enjoy a vintage Enicar Sherpa Guide. Otherwise I believe this model is all original. Its been very well worn (and dented and dinged) for many years. It reminds me of an old russian tank. A bit clunky with some rattles but keeps on ticking. Seller was original owner and yep-he lived his whole live in the humid enviornment of Indonesia. But he actually had service receipts dating back 25 years or more that I can't read anyway! (and so much for the stereotype of the 'bad' SE Asain seller. This guy was a sweetheart who stressed he didn't polish or clean up watch so buyer would know it wasn't messed with. Its possible the second hand is not original. I don't know how to tell) I think I read where over 95% have worn bezel tips and worn outer bezel edges and most have been well worn and used as tool watches-not showy vintage pieces. so thats that. If I wanted to spend a small fortune-I could have found a minty Sherpa but it just didn't seem like as much fun.


second hand is original.. look great ...never seen silver...

there are a zillion original combinations for this watch

it was doing so well .. they didnt really change the watch.. though later they had the short lug version...
what they were doing is manufacturing minor differences as so they dont look all the same and people would be put off.


----------



## vandervenus

The Graphomatic returned from the watchmaker with a brand new crystal. Fortunately it turned out to be an easy and very affordable job. I got it from a seller in Italy. It belonged to her grandfather (a man of good taste obviously). Knowing that, I'm gonna take extra good care of it.


----------



## GUTuna

The joy continues...now on "The Colonial" strap from NATOStrapCo.


----------



## davige

I think it's from mid-sixties. Original owner was my father.


----------



## vandervenus

OK, this one is going to ruin me financially, but it is the missing link in my collection (Sherpa Ultradive aside): the Enicar Sherpa Star Diver. If Olympic swimchamp Mark Spitz and funkstar Bootsy Collins would have a love baby, it would look exactely like this. I've been looking out for this crazy diver since I first saw a picture of it here on this forum. And now I finally found it, thanks to Raul from Italy. 

Hopefully I can put it on my wrist next week. Here are a few pictures from the seller.


----------



## GhentWatch

Glad to know you don´t have an ultradive (yet). Makes me feel a bit special


----------



## vandervenus

That Ultradive is something else. Man, I really want to add one to my collection some day. But it's part of the fun keeping a couple of Enicars on my wishlist (Sherpa Graph, Jet Graph to name a few). 

I consider everyone who has at least one Enicar watch to be special. With all due respect for the collectors of Omega, IWC, Rolex, Heuer and other big brands; Enicar enthousiasts are a different kind of breed to me. It's the kind that prefers vinyl over MP3, a movie theatre over Video On Demand and a Ford Capri over a Tesla with a battery.


----------



## Peerke

My 12th Enicar is a real NOS one, with day indicator in Dutch.
The beauty of the dial can not be captured on photo. It's magnificent the way the colors change when the sunlight is striking the dial.

@vandervenus: I live near Eindhoven. I know the city quite well. I went to Technical School there.


----------



## vandervenus

Peerke said:


> My 12th Enicar is a real NOS one, with day indicator in Dutch.
> The beauty of the dial can not be captured on photo. It's magnificent the way the colors change when the sunlight is striking the dial.
> 
> @vandervenus: I live near Eindhoven. I know the city quite well. I went to Technical School there.


Hi Peerke,

Thanks for the heads up! I like that Enicar a lot. Never seen a day indicator in Dutch on a watch. Wear it on thursdays, combined with a black suit, and you're The Don :-d

Can you maybe advise me a good watchmaker in the Eindhoven region? Also, I'm really curious about your 11 other Enicars |>


----------



## GhentWatch

vandervenus said:


> That Ultradive is something else. Man, I really want to add one to my collection some day. But it's part of the fun keeping a couple of Enicars on my wishlist (Sherpa Graph, Jet Graph to name a few).
> 
> I consider everyone who has at least one Enicar watch to be special. With all due respect for the collectors of Omega, IWC, Rolex, Heuer and other big brands; Enicar enthousiasts are a different kind of breed to me. It's the kind that prefers vinyl over MP3, a movie theatre over Video On Demand and a *Ford Capri over a Tesla* with a battery.


Ofcourse!


----------



## Stigmata

i picked up an enicar super jet... back cover is loose so im thinking thats a seal...
and the reflector pretty dirty,,, hopefully the watchmaker can organise all that along with a service... apart from that seems in great condition..

ill post up some before and after photos ... (hopefully they look different )

i have way too many enicar super compressors now... so some will need to be shed.


----------



## vandervenus

The Enicar Sherpa Star Diver got in yesterday. Looking really minty with firm reds and deep blacks in the outer bezel. The hands light up pretty nice in the dark. Also, not a scratch to be seen on the crystal. Just some light marks on the back. I love the pvd case and crown. Makes the colors look all radiant. For me the Star Diver is the pinnacle of seventies diver watches. The design, the size, the name: alle perfect!

Here's a first photo on the wrist


----------



## gverso

gverso said:


> Gentlemen,
> Can you advise how to remove the winding stem from AR 1145?
> thank you for your pictured-assistance ;-)
> 
> G


Hello everyone,

can anyone help me with removing the winding stem (with instructions), please?
cheets,

G

Sherpa jet/sherpa divette/sherpa dive


----------



## craghawk

Dear,

Yesterday, i've gotten an old broken watch from my Uncle and that watch was Enicar. The first time i look at it i thought it a normal watch, but when i search information about Enicar, then i realized i dead wrong. However, i don't know exactly what my watch is? Can anybody know what is my watch? Type? Year?... i want to fix it.
Attach is my pic


----------



## vandervenus

craghawk said:


> Dear,
> 
> Yesterday, i've gotten an old broken watch from my Uncle and that watch was Enicar. The first time i look at it i thought it a normal watch, but when i search information about Enicar, then i realized i dead wrong. However, i don't know exactly what my watch is? Can anybody know what is my watch? Type? Year?... i want to fix it.
> Attach is my pic
> View attachment 3479722


I think your are right: this watch doesn't look like an original Enicar. The logo on the dial appears to be washed out, there is no Enicar signing on the backside and the crown doesn't look like Enicar. But on the other hand, Enicar produced millions of watches for their markets in the far east. I'm discovering new models of this brand every day. I mainly collect the ones from the sixties and seventies, but Enicar has been around much longer.

If you can get the screwback off, you can have a look at the movement. Than you'll know for sure if it's Enicar or not.


----------



## GhentWatch

vandervenus said:


> The Enicar Sherpa Star Diver got in yesterday. Looking really minty with firm reds and deep blacks in the outer bezel. The hands light up pretty nice in the dark. Also, not a scratch to be seen on the crystal. Just some light marks on the back. I love the pvd case and crown. Makes the colors look all radiant. For me the Star Diver is the pinnacle of seventies diver watches. The design, the size, the name: alle perfect!
> 
> Here's a first photo on the wrist


one more to want next to the chrono...


----------



## TPL1979

Greetings - I'm new to forum but want to add a picture of my Enicar Sherpa Graph. This was originally purchased by my Dad in the 1960's and passed down to me. It really never gets wrist time as the movement does not keep good time. Original plastic crystal has some crazing but I've recently acquired a replacement from GS.

I'm currently searching for an experienced watchmaker/horologist that has knowledge and ability to overhaul the Valjoux 72 movement and bring this time piece back to life. Recomendations are appreciated.

Tom


----------



## GhentWatch

TPL1979 said:


> Greetings - I'm new to forum but want to add a picture of my Enicar Sherpa Graph. This was originally purchased by my Dad in the 1960's and passed down to me. It really never gets wrist time as the movement does not keep good time. Original plastic crystal has some crazing but I've recently acquired a replacement from GS.
> 
> I'm currently searching for an experienced watchmaker/horologist that has knowledge and ability to overhaul the Valjoux 72 movement and bring this time piece back to life. Recomendations are appreciated.
> 
> Tom


You wouldn´t be interested in selling this piece?


----------



## TPL1979

Probably not. It's got significant sentimental value since my Dad passed a few years back... I'm going to try my best to have it repaired and add it to my wrist rotation.


----------



## GhentWatch

TPL1979 said:


> Probably not. It's got significant sentimental value since my Dad passed a few years back... I'm going to try my best to have it repaired and add it to my wrist rotation.


Cheers to that man! Wear it in good health!


----------



## vandervenus

I finally succeeded in getting my wife to wear an Enicar. It's a quartz Privilege model from 1983. It came with the original box and papers, thanks to Gabriel from Barcelona (he might be on this forum too). I think I'm even happier with the terrific box than with the watch. 

A happy couple: on the left is the Privilege, on the right an NOS AR167 model that I got last year. Also, a pic of the box with a Sherpa Jet as the topmodel.


----------



## vandervenus

April turns out to be my lucky month: after getting my hands on a Sherpa Star Diver I finally hunted down a Sherpa Ultradive! It's in all original shape, with an unpolished case (used, but not abused), beautiful 'old school' hands (notice the double lollypop seconds hand) and a nice matching leather strap. The inner bezel shows wonderful patina. I believe the crystal is original too. This watch doesn't hide its age, but boy it is a beauty!


----------



## GhentWatch

We twins now?


----------



## vandervenus

GhentWatch said:


> We twins now?


Not yet. I still haven't got a Roamer Stingray :-d


----------



## pjhollenstein

*The original Enicar Sherpa. The real Enicar 1956 Lhotse Expedition watch?*

Because of this Enicar advertisment from 1957 it is commonly believed that the climbers of the Swiss 1956 Lhotse Expedition wore Enicar Seapearl 600's.









However, Albert Eggler, the leader of the Swiss Everest expedition describes the Enicar watches that his group used as "Enicar *automatic*" wrist-watches, while the Enicar 600's have manual-winding movements. It is thus often assumed that Albert Eggler's referral to „automatic" wrist watches is an error.

I don't believe that this assumption is correct, and another, earlier Enicar advertisement from 1956 supports my assumption. It refers to the reference 100/76 AaNS as Everest watch.









According to the Enicar Watch Buyers Guide:
100 = cal. 1010 (usually) and automatic cal. 1034 and 1035. 
76 = case reference, in this case a turtle lug compressor case
*A = Automatic*
a = all stanless steel
N = Sherpa case, 100% is water resistant to 20 atm 200 m water depth 
S = S = Sweep second (Central)

So the reference 100/76 AaNS would actually match with the notes of Albert Eggler.

A little while ago I was able to find such an Enicar 100/76 AaNS model, which I believe is the real Enicar Everest watch.

It features a turtle lug compressor case with the original large Enicar signed crown that is similar to the one of the Seapearl 600, and an Enicar 1034 automatic movement. On the back it is already called „Seapearl", but still with the early non-script lettering that was only used for the very first Seapearls in 1955/56. From 1956 onwards the common script Seapearl writing was used for all watches.

The date stamp inside the caseback dates this watch to 5-56, the exact month of the Swiss Lhotse Everest Expedition.


----------



## DaBaeker

pjhollenstein said:


> However, Albert Eggler, the leader of the Swiss Everest expedition describes the Enicar watches that his group used as "Enicar *automatic*" wrist-watches, while the Enicar 600's have manual-winding movements. It is thus often assumed that Albert Eggler's referral to „automatic" wrist watches is an error.
> 
> I don't believe that this assumption is correct, and another, earlier Enicar advertisement from 1956 supports my assumption. It refers to the reference 100/76 AaNS as Everest watch.
> 
> According to the Enicar Watch Buyers Guide:
> 100 = cal. 1010 (usually) and automatic cal. 1034 and 1035.
> 76 = case reference, in this case a turtle lug compressor case
> *A = Automatic*


 I would have to agree that the 'assumption' is not correct only because if I were taking on a climb like that and knew I could avoid having to wind a watch and expose wrist and an automatic would run continuously-I would jump at the chance to dump a manual for an automatic. Besides-how could he 'mistakenly' think he had an automatic? Would he forget what kind of icepick he used? What boots? Don't think so. At least I wouldn't but I have an almost eidetic memory-a curse mostly.


----------



## MMMD

pjhollenstein said:


> *The original Enicar Sherpa. The real Enicar 1956 Lhotse Expedition watch?*
> 
> ...The date stamp inside the caseback dates this watch to 5-56, the exact month of the Swiss Lhotse Everest Expedition.
> 
> View attachment 3616202
> 
> 
> View attachment 3616218


Very cool. I've no doubt that the Everest expedition watches were automatics; I'm sure Eggler was a very detail-oriented man who would have gotten that detail right. But with all that glare from ice and snow, and those dark nights on the mountain, I would have chosen something sportier, with a black dial and lots of lume, like this Sherpa automatic (AR 1034) with a case-back date of 10-56.










Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## pjhollenstein

MMMD said:


> Very cool. I've no doubt that the Everest expedition watches were automatics; I'm sure Eggler was a very detail-oriented man who would have gotten that detail right. But with all that glare from ice and snow, and those dark nights on the mountain, I would have chosen something sportier, with a black dial and lots of lume, like this Sherpa automatic (AR 1034) with a case-back date of 10-56.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


What a beauty! I would have to agree that the dial used was probably more similar to the one of your watch... Thanks for sharing!


----------



## hns-panama

They were automatics and some had a few more features like altimeters, probably attached to the band but Enicar may have crafted something special for the climbers knowing how important the mission was. 

Given the above, I think it is probable that the watch choice was not a last minute decision but rather Eggler spoke with Enicar about his requirements well before hand putting the actual manufacturing date closer to the beginning of the year as they would have tested the watches before they left.

Anything with Sherpa on it came after the the climb.


----------



## GUTuna

Very excited as a recent eBay find showed up today and in even better condition than I had hoped. It's a nearly mint Sherpa Star on a vintage Champion bracelet. I had been trying to find one of these for awhile and happened to find a great seller.


----------



## vandervenus

GUTuna said:


> Very excited as a recent eBay find showed up today and in even better condition than I had hoped. It's a nearly mint Sherpa Star on a vintage Champion bracelet. I had been trying to find one of these for awhile and happened to find a great seller.


Terrific find! My Sherpa Star says Hi! :-!


----------



## Stigmata

TPL1979 said:


> Greetings - I'm new to forum but want to add a picture of my Enicar Sherpa Graph. This was originally purchased by my Dad in the 1960's and passed down to me. It really never gets wrist time as the movement does not keep good time. Original plastic crystal has some crazing but I've recently acquired a replacement from GS.
> 
> I'm currently searching for an experienced watchmaker/horologist that has knowledge and ability to overhaul the Valjoux 72 movement and bring this time piece back to life. Recomendations are appreciated.
> 
> Tom
> View attachment 3551850


Thats a beauty!!!


----------



## ppstore

Some enicars from Lisbon/Portugal
graphomatic
jet sherpa
super jet
mantagraph


----------



## ppstore

Some enicars from Lisbon/Portugal
graphomatic
jet sherpa
super jet
mantagraph


----------



## Sunday Rider

There are some beauties there ppstore.


----------



## vandervenus

ppstore said:


> Some enicars from Lisbon/Portugal
> graphomatic
> jet sherpa
> super jet
> mantagraph


Congrats! You have some very nice Enicars. I would love to see more photos. I'm curious about the third watch from the left. Is that a watch with two dials?


----------



## vandervenus

It's been a busy month for the Enicar collection. Finally I found a fresh looking Enicar Sport watch with crispy hands and a beautiful aged dial. I put it on a NOS Rado strap that was stored for over 25 years at my watchmakers shop.









Next is a DDM 260 from Spain. Totally NOS with the original Enicar strap. I'm not a big fan of golden cases, but I guess it fits the seventies design quite well.









An last but not least I found this gorgeous Sherpa Ultradive. It's a mark II, with the red seconds hand. Everything is original, except for the white inner bezel that has been professionally redone. I didn't see it in the original shape, but according to the seller it was restored without changing any details. Usually there's a black and orange outline on the edge of the bezel, although I have seen one example of a bezel without the outlines. Anyway, there are so many variations with hands (especially seconds hands with no, one or two markers) and bezels, that it's hard to say what's original and what's been altered. The case was ultrasonically cleaned, not polished. It's hard to believe this watch has been around for more than 45 years.


----------



## pedromoliveira

Here goes my one and only Enicar (for the moment):












































The last pic of the movement is from before I got some work done. Unfortunatelly, when I got it, the dial was already as you can see in the pictures. Someone messed with it and not in a very good way. :-( Still I like the watch. I hope one day I'm lucky enough to find another dial similar to mine to replace it. As we say here in Portugal: "hope is the last thing to die"!


----------



## Ard

Hello,

An accidental Enicar vintage owner here but I must say the watch is growing on me rapidly. I bought this watch from a book seller and it did not run. I opened it up and could see that someone had opened it in the past and pinched the gasket when putting the case back on. The gasket had dried and deteriorated and was obviously into the movement, so......... I do a little tinkering but a watch like this is beyond my abilities and I sent it away to someone who could put it in order.

I was going to wait for the strap to arrive before joining into this thread but you know how that went.....









The case is approximately 36.5 and 40 with the crown, I ordered a fine grained alligator strap in black and I think I'm going to keep this watch. I'll post more pictures when I get the strap on it.

Ard


----------



## Ard

I've been scanning pages on this thread and haven't came across another of these triple date moonphase types. I figured there would be a bunch but it seems not. If you run into a post with one in it please quote the post and write something so it will appear here and I won't have to read through the rest of the pages I have not seen yet.

Not that I don't enjoy the watches but I checked the first few then jumped to page 40 and went through to 70 so far. When done on the top end I'll go back to the starting post and read the first 40................ So if you find one, feel free to let me know please.

Ard


----------



## Stigmata

Yeah, it's pretty rare. I have only seen one before and I'm kicking myself I didn't buy it.


----------



## ppstore

A very strange enicar the mecanism inside is a true Enicar the caisse and crown not original
anyone have any explanation
i think it could be an Enicar with an non original caisse


----------



## DaBaeker

also...a sherpa date with a dive bezel? I can't remember if I ever saw one like this before.


----------



## hns-panama

Yes, it is a re-case. The dial (and I assume the movement) is Enicar. It would be interesting to see the movement.


----------



## pedromoliveira

Hello there:I posted this exact watch a couple of weeks ago here in the forum, because I suspected the case was not original (and I was right). It's a shame because the dial looks quite nice and it would look great in it's original case.


----------



## ppstore

Thanks for your opinions, anyway its nice to have this Enicar, with non original case, I have an original crown for it,


----------



## howards4th

Ard said:


> Hello,
> 
> An accidental Enicar vintage owner here but I must say the watch is growing on me rapidly. I bought this watch from a book seller and it did not run. I opened it up and could see that someone had opened it in the past and pinched the gasket when putting the case back on. The gasket had dried and deteriorated and was obviously into the movement, so......... I do a little tinkering but a watch like this is beyond my abilities and I sent it away to someone who could put it in order.
> 
> I was going to wait for the strap to arrive before joining into this thread but you know how that went.....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The case is approximately 36.5 and 40 with the crown, I ordered a fine grained alligator strap in black and I think I'm going to keep this watch. I'll post more pictures when I get the strap on it.
> 
> Ard


That is an AWESOME watch |> LOVE IT!


----------



## ppstore

Here is the photos of the inside mechanism


----------



## pedromoliveira

The watch still looks nice despite the case not being original. In any case, maybe in the future you find an original Enicar case and you can use the dial and movement


----------



## ppstore

It's what I think and it's funny to have a kind of franken Enicar


----------



## primabaleron

My Trojka


----------



## vandervenus

primabaleron said:


> My Trojka


What a magnificent line-up. We have a lot in common ;-)
May I ask you where you found the strap for the Super-Dive? It's awesome!


----------



## primabaleron

I found this strap on Ebay (Chile), but poor quality finally...


----------



## vandervenus

That's too bad... I kindda like the snakeskin look. But than again, these Enicar divers look good on almost any strap.


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## Stigmata

The 1964 case with the AR 1126 24 jewels as distinct to the 33 rubirotor


----------



## Stigmata

33


----------



## Stigmata

The first is a33 rubirotor '65 AR 1126 . it has extremely unusual hands and dial markers. The shorter cross hatch original super compressor crowns.the second is the first guide I bought which is my daily beater. It's a 1146 movement with cross hatched enicar crown but taller than the 33.
The third is a '64 case AR 1126 movement . it's very sharp and in extremely good condition. I love the early hands.
I have a few enicar guides as well as other Sherpas.
What's interesting with the Guides is that even though Guides are less common. They come in all different dials.. Hands.. Markers.. Crowns.. Cases.. External bezels and internal bezels as well as different shades of red through to orange and yellow pointers 
They thought they were onto a winner so obviously had a heap of different combinations over the years to keep the watch interesting.
Outside of their marvelous chronos.. In sure enicar saw the Guide as their just important watch.


----------



## Stigmata

Oh that's a super jet my apologies. In finding it difficult to navigate the mobile version of whatuseek


----------



## Stigmata

I can't downsize the '64 on here.. I'll do them later from computer I'm getting awfully confused . the point I was trying to make is to show side different versions of the guide.


----------



## Stigmata

Enicar Sherpa guide. T again


----------



## vandervenus

That's a nice collection of Sherpa Guides, Stigmata. I read there are three different cases: the earliest version has extremely long lugs, so the total watch measures more than 50mm, which is huge for that period. I have a Guide with short lugs, the case variation of the mid seventies. I noticed that the later the model, the more colors it seems to have in the bezel and the ring with the cities.


----------



## Stigmata

Some of the early models also have colored cities with more orange and green in some over others.. Though I saw one example of much more orange and red with green than anything if seen prior it was on a short lug. At first glance I thought it was defect but on closer inspection it looked very authentic..
I'm sorry about the jumbled format of photos from my phone and it's browser it was difficult to attach and rather confusing
I'll endeavor to put my collection up as they're all quite different though I haven't bought any sort e lug nor AR1166 calibers versions as I haven't seen any examples I like yet..
I have eight Sherpa Guides now I think.
But what is evident would be variety of versions and combinations even through the early to mid period.
Even when i got one Guide I ended up wanting more combinations to collect
Most I needed to send off to my watchmaker to get them humming again. My watchmaker is great with enicars. Most of us here are philEnicarists.. Saving as many as we can from an almost certain death.
Many of these watches are over our approaching fifty yards old now.
What's astounding is they're a fifty year vintage watch that easily at 43 mms fits the tastes of the modern world.
At a time where the watches were only 34-36 mm these must have seemed huge to people in their time. The dimensions would have been extraordinarily beasty for their time.
They're certainly a watch with character
.. And who works have thought about a travel watch suitable for airliners butin a 600 ft diver case? It's an oxymoron of sorts in itself.. But what was hatched is a funky vintage watch for us an iconic sixties and seventies watch. We can easily wear it today and into the future
It didn't make the cut to survive what was a purge on the Swiss watch industry.. But while it was alive it most certainly made a huge splash and was no shrinking violet.
Why was this watch found in great numbers in sth east Asia?
Simply because the movement is indestructible.. It's pretty bullet proof and the watchmaking skills there were almost non existent. My 33 had never been opened and cleaned .. Though it was still chugging along nicely when I got it. No mean feat for a watch dated 1965 in the inner case.
On something else about that... I had an opportunity to buy a gorgeous super jet. The dial said it was a '33'... The movement was an early mid sixties AR1166 movement .. However there was am inscription a name and then '1975'. So what's obvious is these watches were assembled/ sold to to ten years after you might think..


----------



## vandervenus

Thanks for your indepth comments on the Guides. I would definitively like to see your complete collection of Guides (also, that Super-Jet wasn't bad eighter). 

I'm just curious: you live in Asia, right? How are the prices of these used, but not abused, Sherpa's in your region? Here in Holland you can't find them anywhere. I'm totally dependent on eBay, forums and traders. And if a decent example shows up, you have to pay top dollars for it.


----------



## Stigmata

Hi vandervenus.
I'm in Australia and I'm using my phone so excuse the punctuation.
Prices in Indonesia have been steadily rising.. 
Be careful what you buy and whom.. There are some amazingly fantastic people to buy from and the opposite also exists.
Factor in a service regardless.. 
Things to look out for are overly zealous polishing.. Back case with no detail is almost the norm.
Make sure it's the indigenous dial.
Crowns often have broken stems you might not know till you receive it.. Always ask.
These crowns are super rare.
Make sure the i red pointer is intact even if it's no longer rotating and has sunk.. Because you'll find it next to impossible to find.
It's definitely a case when buying these of buyer beware.
Movements can be found.. But the hardware is very difficult to find the days.
I'm in Indonesia often and have some great contacts...
Just ask questions


----------



## DaBaeker

Question for any vintage Enicar expert:

I just started into Enicar with a recent purchase of a Sherpa Guide GMT which luckily is in all original but pretty beat up (i know, normal) but working condition. I haven't seen a suitable second purchase for 'my price' until today. I rather rashly bid on a Sherpa date without doing much research and fully expecting to loose with a pretty cheap bid. I know -no research- is a HUGE no-no especially for the beginner collector. But my 35yrs + and 50+ watches experience just gave me a good hunch the seller didn't really know how to advertise nor what he had. Not a watch seller. He took crappy but legible photos and I think I may have done ok. I'll know for sure in a few days after which I'll post pics. But for right now I have only one concern and that is the second hand:

The watch is a Sherpa date with what sure looks like an original black dial, baton hands, single signed crown(also looks a bit large for original but not sure. its an enicar) and a red/orange second hand. Style of the second hand is an exact match of the correct reddish second hand on 60s Sherpa Guide 600 GMT but I can't find any photos of a Sherpa date, single crown with a red hand like this.

Anyone seen a red second handed Sherpa date in sherpa 600 case? The watch is rather plain and says on the back (though I can't make out everything yet) : Sherpa 600 with oyster pearl logo. Ultrasonic. sea pearl (can't make out the # but ends in xxxxxx88 or xxxxx89-01 w brevet 314962 . Oh its an automatic of course. 

Am I stuck for any info until I can post pics or any of the true Enicar experts have any opinion. thanks and again-pics to come soon

p.s. I can take any news-good or bad since I got the watch a what I think is a pretty ridiculously low price <$70usd and the watch . I'm told, is keeping accurate time as of now


----------



## Stigmata

Hands were often interchangeable within reason.
For seconds hands I've seen all kinds of metallic on the early models through to orange, different shades of red, yellow and white.. Which makes it difficult of your following as an enicar starter.. But you soon learn the method to the madness.(.All original on Sherpas.) They used particular styles
Probably fine..
But post a photo when you're ready we would all love to see..


----------



## DaBaeker

Stigmata said:


> Hands were often interchangeable within reason.
> For seconds hands I've seen all kinds of metallic on the early models through to orange, different shades of red, yellow and white.. Which makes it difficult of your following as an enicar starter.. But you soon learn the method to the madness.(.All original on Sherpas.) They used particular styles
> Probably fine..
> But post a photo when you're ready we would all love to see..


Okay, Thanks for that. And yeah-the reason I went for even w/o knowing about the second hand is its an exact match to my Sherpa GMT so I figured at least it might probably be Enicar.

I'll definitely post pics when received (and after a good polywatch session)-I curious to know what others think about the crown. Its the same size as on my Sherpa GMT 2-crown which just looks a bit too beefy for the 'date' and a little suspect. But then I thought- "well, its in a sherpa 600 case which is beefy and maybe the Sherpa Dates did use same crowns as other sherpa 600s. So-I'm looking forward to submitting this for opinion. I'm finally at the point in my collecting when if its a pricey watch I'm going for I know how to do my due diligence w/o fear of getting ripped off but I have the luxury of accumulated knowledge that allows me to get away with the occasional impulsive gamble every now and then.


----------



## Stigmata

An obvious question is where was the source?


----------



## DaBaeker

Stigmata said:


> An obvious question is where was the source?


not sure what you mean. If you mean where did I find it? On the bay. I know many here despise that site but I have had about 90% good experiences on eb*. Both as a seller and a buyer. I am a big proponent of 'buy the seller' and use feedback as a serious tool. But in this case-as I said-I could tell this seller bought at estate sale-didn't know jack about watches and simply took 3 pretty bad images but good enough where i'm certain the dial is original, minute hands are 97% orig. and second hand and crown remain to be determined (but its almost 100% they are auth. Encore even if not orig.)

* funny-after 18yrs on EB as a serious antique seller and a pretty successful buyer of vintage watches I still feel that many members eyes roll and I get defensive. But that is just me-It has nothing to do with members offering advice. I suppose I can link to the auction which might make things easier.As I said b4-it was <$75 so its not like it will kill if it turns out to have some problems. I'm hoping my 'hunch' works out. I've a fairly good 'hunch' track record*

*the two bad ones were a vintage Seiko Bellmatic which was a waste of $80 and an Omega chronostop which was a more serious rip-off and which I was refunded. sO here we go:

Vtg Enicar Automatic Sherpa 600 Date Mens Watch Working Condition | eBay


----------



## Stigmata

I'm not an expert on the dates. They're not common.. But I think on the surface that looks pretty genuine to me..
Seconds hand is common on some enicar watches.
The rest I can't say as I'm unfamiliar with that model but on the surface.. I'd give it the thumbs up as a date and me being uninitiated but seen plenty of enicars..


----------



## DaBaeker

Stigmata said:


> I'm not an expert on the dates. They're not common.. But I think on the surface that looks pretty genuine to me..
> Seconds hand is common on some enicar watches.
> The rest I can't say as I'm unfamiliar with that model but on the surface.. I'd give it the thumbs up as a date and me being uninitiated but seen plenty of enicars..


Yup. I'd say I might be a notch beneath you I true A nicer vintage expertise. But it will be fun for me to find out just how well I might have done(or how embarrassingly bad) what excited me enough to bid was the beefy compressor s
Sheep's 600 case thinking it was awful chunky for a plain date. And then the giant a nicer crown? I figured I either had a curious but frankens oddity that I could wear so often--or--had something interesting, not really rare, but interesting and compatible with my'64 sharps got guide. A bit excited as I think no the<$75 usd mashes it a good, maybe not an outrageous, but decent price gamble, though I have no idea what a cleaned up, serviced would sell for. Nor for a good while my man. Thank very much again


----------



## Stigmata

Sometimes you need to roll the dice but even as spare parts in my opinion that's a no brainer.
Without knowing the Date series of say one way or another you didn't lose and potentially you have a gorgeous watch with a clean up..


----------



## primabaleron




----------



## Stigmata

King of watches in my opinion.... The above chrono .. You will not see that every day.
Just gorgeous!


----------



## vandervenus

DaBaeker said:


> not sure what you mean. If you mean where did I find it? On the bay. I know many here despise that site but I have had about 90% good experiences on eb*. Both as a seller and a buyer. I am a big proponent of 'buy the seller' and use feedback as a serious tool. But in this case-as I said-I could tell this seller bought at estate sale-didn't know jack about watches and simply took 3 pretty bad images but good enough where i'm certain the dial is original, minute hands are 97% orig. and second hand and crown remain to be determined (but its almost 100% they are auth. Encore even if not orig.)
> 
> * funny-after 18yrs on EB as a serious antique seller and a pretty successful buyer of vintage watches I still feel that many members eyes roll and I get defensive. But that is just me-It has nothing to do with members offering advice. I suppose I can link to the auction which might make things easier.As I said b4-it was <$75 so its not like it will kill if it turns out to have some problems. I'm hoping my 'hunch' works out. I've a fairly good 'hunch' track record*
> 
> *the two bad ones were a vintage Seiko Bellmatic which was a waste of $80 and an Omega chronostop which was a more serious rip-off and which I was refunded. sO here we go:
> 
> Vtg Enicar Automatic Sherpa 600 Date Mens Watch Working Condition | eBay


It looks authentic to me. I have added a pic of my Sherpa 300 diver and as you can see it has the same set of hands.


----------



## DaBaeker

vandervenus said:


> It looks authentic to me. I have added a pic of my Sherpa 300 diver and as you can see it has the same set of hands.
> 
> View attachment 4217946


Thanks. That is a very nice diver you have. Its so funny to me...For years I've seen this never-ending thread pop up and every time I did I thought, "how quaint. Those guys much sure be a quirky and fanatical bunch"... to focus so much on , what I then thought, was a low rent and odd Swiss brand. I really had no idea about the company. But I always liked the total of the thread. Such pure enthusiasm. And now, after 30yrs of collecting I stumbled upon the Sherpa Guide 600 GMT. Mine is by no means even close to a pristine example but its beefiness and GMT function attracted me as I have a few GMTs. Now I find myself one of those 'quirky' guys and have started reading up on the history of the co. and where most where sold and so on a so forth. And as for placement in the mass-market swiss luxury watch biz? Maybe Enicar doesn't rank as high as some other well known brands but it certainly is not a 'low-rent' company and many models hold their own very nicely when compared to Eterna, certain older Seikos, and maybe a few Omega and Longines. (I won't argue this point as I am still learning. My collecting has recently taken of in 3 entirely new directions: a) early 70s 'heq' quartz,
b)Eterna-matics from the 50s and c) these two Enicars. And thats after a good 10yrs of mostly Omega, Rolex and Longines w assorted old divers and chronographs mixed in.

So again-thanks for that pic as at least I now know the the hand-set on my 'date' exist in the same combo on another Enicar. Any idea what the difference in the 300 and 600 cases were (other then the obvious depth) Are Sherpa date 600s common? And are the 600s all the super-compressor type of closure?

I don't know where this 'date' will take me next but thanks for the pic and the info. good luck


----------



## Stigmata

vandervenus said:


> It looks authentic to me. I have added a pic of my Sherpa 300 diver and as you can see it has the same set of hands.
> 
> View attachment 4217946


That's a beautiful watch!


----------



## Ard

I finally received a strap for my Enicar today! Actually I got 2 but stopped with this black buffalo grain and enjoyed wearing the watch for the first time. The second strap is a crocodile grain Hadley Roma in dark navy blue, I was hoping it would complement the blue date numbers and the date hand, time will tell.




I've had the watch in the winder while waiting for a strap (rubber band held it fine) and after 6 hours of wear it was obvious the watch was considerably slow. This meant opening for some advancement and offered a good opportunity to show you the case back and movement.




I expect it will take a couple days of constant wear and more adjusting but I'm hoping for decent accuracy from this watch. I really like it, I've been wearing dive watches for the past 2 years and this weightless watch is a joy to wear!

Ard


----------



## Stigmata

1966 pretty good condition Sherpa guide.
This LG is haunted.. I'm having all sorts of problems downloading.
Today they're upside down on the upload..


----------



## vandervenus

DaBaeker said:


> Thanks. That is a very nice diver you have. Its so funny to me...For years I've seen this never-ending thread pop up and every time I did I thought, "how quaint. Those guys much sure be a quirky and fanatical bunch"... to focus so much on , what I then thought, was a low rent and odd Swiss brand. I really had no idea about the company. But I always liked the total of the thread. Such pure enthusiasm. And now, after 30yrs of collecting I stumbled upon the Sherpa Guide 600 GMT. Mine is by no means even close to a pristine example but its beefiness and GMT function attracted me as I have a few GMTs. Now I find myself one of those 'quirky' guys and have started reading up on the history of the co. and where most where sold and so on a so forth. And as for placement in the mass-market swiss luxury watch biz? Maybe Enicar doesn't rank as high as some other well known brands but it certainly is not a 'low-rent' company and many models hold their own very nicely when compared to Eterna, certain older Seikos, and maybe a few Omega and Longines. (I won't argue this point as I am still learning. My collecting has recently taken of in 3 entirely new directions: a) early 70s 'heq' quartz,
> b)Eterna-matics from the 50s and c) these two Enicars. And thats after a good 10yrs of mostly Omega, Rolex and Longines w assorted old divers and chronographs mixed in.
> 
> So again-thanks for that pic as at least I now know the the hand-set on my 'date' exist in the same combo on another Enicar. Any idea what the difference in the 300 and 600 cases were (other then the obvious depth) Are Sherpa date 600s common? And are the 600s all the super-compressor type of closure?
> 
> I don't know where this 'date' will take me next but thanks for the pic and the info. good luck


The funny thing is that I've been collecting Enicar watches for only a year. This very thread got me excited. It was about 60 pages long, if I remember correctly. I bought a very simple Star Jewels back than, not knowing anything about the brand at all. But I was fascinated by the logo and the beautiful colorful dials. When searching for more information, I ended up here.

Meanwhile, I'm totally hooked on the brand. I own at least 20 Enicars by now and the collection keeps growing. I always feel connected to the 'underdog' kind of brands: Rega audio, Enicar watches and Apple computers (as you know they used to be the underdog 20 years ago when I started working with computers).

This thread is such a goldmine of information and great watch stories. I'm happy to be part of it.


----------



## Stigmata

This is an AR 146 ( red date) if I remember correctly case is a super compressor from 1966 ? ( memory) back of this has the text detail almost gone.. The bezel is a bit faded but cities still easily read. Except the ding between Sydney and Manila.. But still in goodish condition . the watch has the types of hands I love... The crowns are signed but are the mk 3 crowns.. These have no crosshatch pattern. 
..


----------



## Ard

Hi,

Does anyone know where one of these can be purchased?



I keep telling myself I don't need another watch but this watch is different. At least it has a fresh look to me and I would wear that. They are on the Enicar website and are a 39mm watch.

Pretty sharp..........


----------



## hns-panama

China.

\


Ard said:


> Hi,
> 
> Does anyone know where one of these can be purchased?
> 
> 
> 
> I keep telling myself I don't need another watch but this watch is different. At least it has a fresh look to me and I would wear that. They are on the Enicar website and are a 39mm watch.
> 
> Pretty sharp..........


----------



## vandervenus

Ard said:


> Hi,
> 
> Does anyone know where one of these can be purchased?
> 
> 
> 
> I keep telling myself I don't need another watch but this watch is different. At least it has a fresh look to me and I would wear that. They are on the Enicar website and are a 39mm watch.
> 
> Pretty sharp..........


This is the first of the new Enicars that I like since a Chinese company bought the rights of the Enicar brand a couple of years ago. It has some nice details that pay tribute to the Enicars of the sixties and seventies: the caselugs, the colors in the bezel. Very nice! I'm very curious how this watch feels on the wrist. Older Enicars are heavy, chunky and exactly the way I like it. These newer models feel lightweighted, almost like plastic. I don't know if and where they are sold outside of China and Japan.

Do you know what kind of movement is inside?


----------



## Ard

No, I don't have a clue of what's inside the watch. I was hoping they were still a Swiss product but when reading the use of language in the website text it seemed the source didn't have a good understanding of English.


----------



## DaBaeker

I guess we should all give thanks to 'crazyfist' whomever and wherever that is. I can't recall another thread quite like this one.
Kind of like a one-stop grand special Enicar central hub. A forum within a forum. It definitely would not be the same as a stand alone forum. It's part of the WUS vintage personality.


----------



## DaBaeker

so-excited to post on this 'joyous' oddball thread. Received my <$75 gamble today as expected. And as expected it was a mess physically. But that is the extent of my skills however-I do a decent job. In fact-I can't believe how damn fine looking this Sherpa date really is. Males me wonder why I didn't notice the brand before.

Anyhow-my chief interest is finding out what anyone knows about a plain non-diver Sherpa date with only 1 crown being ion the 600 compressor case. I did take off the back and photographed the diver helmut case-back and movement-but they got erased by accident. I'll post enough pics to satisfy the Enicar fans here but I will just post the ref #s since the serial is too hard to photograph in my available light.

I have not been able to find a single other example that is a plain Sherpa Date that is in the 600 sea pearl case. All the pics and models I can find are either Sherpa Guide GMT or Divette, Jet or asst. other 2-crown inner bezel models. Its not that I think mine is rare or so unusual-I'd just like to confirm with another image. It would be hard to believe that a watch from an estate sale thats been bored and stored for over 30 years is some kind of franken. [also-the case-back gasket is melted into gunk -which I've encountered before-and I have still to deal with that. Luckily it is contained to the outermost groove and hasn't got beyond the outer movement ring and compressor tangs. But I've seen this with old and original Omega gaskets. Still-i'm wondering why a sherpa 600 would not at least be branded as a dive watch.

Shoot-I wish I wasn't so tired to remove back again and post movement pic. But here's whats on the back:

a)Enicar-SS-ultrasonic-incabloc-sherpa 600. brevet:314962 and oyster logo.

b)serial# 1067804

c)model #: 144-33-01 [4]- funny looking-not exactly same font

d)Seapearl with a '0' under the'e' and 'a'.

e) crown: signed with saturn logo

pics:









so... any thoughts about this in terms of 100% original/authentic, or anything not good i am unaware of?


----------



## Hessu

The dial looks like Thailand gray (an eBay seller from Thailand has several Zeniths with this color on sale). Omega did gray dial with Chronostop at 1968 being first of gray dials, this Ocean pearl case by EPSA is from early 60's. It also looks to have Chronostop's second hand.







Here the indexes are slightly different, but basically the same watch.


----------



## DaBaeker

Hessu said:


> Omega did gray dial with Chronostop at 1968 being first of gray dials, this Ocean pearl case by EPSA is from early 60's. It also looks to have Chronostop's second hand.
> 
> View attachment 4267778
> Here the indexes are slightly different, but basically the same watch.


Yes. Good point. I have one of those geneva chronostops. Maybe one of the reasons this jumpd out at me so much is because it does resemble the grey dialed Omg CS and the second hand is exact. The dial does not look re-done but by "thailand" do you mean the fact that it was an 'Asian market' Enicar-or that you think the dial was re-done or Enicar made it to resemble the chronostop in a less expensive alternative?
This watch is exactly like mine except dial and index markers. If your right-it means I was dating mine a little too early. Chronostops came out in 69. Someone who knows how to date encore will tell me what my #s mean. thanks for the pic.*
I do not see anything beneath the 'Swiss' on the cream dial but my dial has the slightly more 'correc't T-swiss made-T. for lumen hands and index
which both have.


----------



## Hessu

I did mean gray dial is a redialed by innovative tiny little hands and minds. Open it up to see if there is corrosion on steel parts, like those asian watches usually have. If you look carefully this has T above 6 o'clock index.


----------



## hns-panama

It is an EPSA Super Compressor case. Not all SCs are twin crown.

This case had a when new rating of watertight to 600 feet, not that I would do that now.

The movement should be a 1145 as that is what the 144 stands for. 33-01 is the case reference.

Given the size of the markers, I'd say it is original including the second hand. Makes sense if you compare it to earlier versions with smaller markers with standard hands.

The O under the a and e in Seapearl is the reference for Open when you turn the bayonet back. There should be an I too. That shows closed when the case back is turned to close it. They both align with the crown.

Is it a dive watch? Not really. More like a very good active sports watch that had a very tough case to withstand water and knocks. That it doubled as a great looking dress watch is frosting on the cake. By the time this watch was made, Sherpa was their well known trademark and they used it accordingly.

Note the lume pattern. Enicar was pretty slick with them.

Nice find. And yes, it was a fair price.



DaBaeker said:


> so-excited to post on this 'joyous' oddball thread. Received my <$75 gamble today as expected. And as expected it was a mess physically. But that is the extent of my skills however-I do a decent job. In fact-I can't believe how damn fine looking this Sherpa date really is. Males me wonder why I didn't notice the brand before.
> 
> Anyhow-my chief interest is finding out what anyone knows about a plain non-diver Sherpa date with only 1 crown being ion the 600 compressor case. I did take off the back and photographed the diver helmut case-back and movement-but they got erased by accident. I'll post enough pics to satisfy the Enicar fans here but I will just post the ref #s since the serial is too hard to photograph in my available light.
> 
> I have not been able to find a single other example that is a plain Sherpa Date that is in the 600 sea pearl case. All the pics and models I can find are either Sherpa Guide GMT or Divette, Jet or asst. other 2-crown inner bezel models. Its not that I think mine is rare or so unusual-I'd just like to confirm with another image. It would be hard to believe that a watch from an estate sale thats been bored and stored for over 30 years is some kind of franken. [also-the case-back gasket is melted into gunk -which I've encountered before-and I have still to deal with that. Luckily it is contained to the outermost groove and hasn't got beyond the outer movement ring and compressor tangs. But I've seen this with old and original Omega gaskets. Still-i'm wondering why a sherpa 600 would not at least be branded as a dive watch.
> 
> Shoot-I wish I wasn't so tired to remove back again and post movement pic. But here's whats on the back:
> 
> a)Enicar-SS-ultrasonic-incabloc-sherpa 600. brevet:314962 and oyster logo.
> 
> b)serial# 1067804
> 
> c)model #: 144-33-01 [4]- funny looking-not exactly same font
> 
> d)Seapearl with a '0' under the'e' and 'a'.
> 
> e) crown: signed with saturn logo
> 
> pics:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> so... any thoughts about this in terms of 100% original/authentic, or anything not good i am unaware of?


----------



## DaBaeker

hns-panama said:


> It is an EPSA Super Compressor case. Not all SCs are twin crown.
> 
> This case had a when new rating of watertight to 600 feet, ...........
> 
> Note the lume pattern. Enicar was pretty slick with them.
> 
> .


Yes, noticed their styling of the lume pips is nicely done. thanks for all that info. feel satisfied now. needs to be regulated now -cleaned as well (though the movement looked pretty crisp and golden)


----------



## kazrich

The price rise and rise of the Sherpa Graph :roll::roll:

Enicar Sherpa Graph - one of the best valjoux 72 chronographs ever made | eBay


----------



## DaBaeker

kazrich said:


> The price rise and rise of the Sherpa Graph :roll::roll:
> 
> Enicar Sherpa Graph - one of the best valjoux 72 chronographs ever made | eBay


wow! $4K....big increase.


----------



## GhentWatch

DaBaeker said:


> wow! $4K....big increase.


Look at the bids.

A 0 feedback bidder pushing the price up 2K.

I have had it with fake bidders on these pieces. That sherpa in that condition shouldn't go over 2000Euro. (not by a long shot)


----------



## hns-panama

Cannot agree more!

Shill bidders. Look for it to be back on eBay soon.

Seller made the mistake of not allowing bidders with 0 feedback.



GhentWatch said:


> Look at the bids.
> 
> A 0 feedback bidder pushing the price up 2K.
> 
> I have had it with fake bidders on these pieces. That sherpa in that condition shouldn't go over 2000Euro. (not by a long shot)


----------



## vandervenus

GhentWatch said:


> Look at the bids.
> 
> A 0 feedback bidder pushing the price up 2K.
> 
> I have had it with fake bidders on these pieces. That sherpa in that condition shouldn't go over 2000Euro. (not by a long shot)


I had my eye on that bidding and couldn't believe the winning bid. For a beaten up Sherpa that price is just insane. The winner is someone with a feedback number of 27, but it is clear to see that the price was driven up. I bought mine just recently and I have to admit I paid over €500 more than I probably would have a year ago. But than again, it is in pristine state, almost NOS.

A month ago a NOS Sherpagraph was sold on Chrono24 for €3250. That, combined with the tale of the $15.000 bid on the Jim Clark Sherpa, led to a recent price explosion that is beyond believe. Very curious to see where it leads. I'm holding on to all my Enicars, that's for sure.


----------



## GhentWatch

vandervenus said:


> I had my eye on that bidding and couldn't believe the winning bid. For a beaten up Sherpa that price is just insane. The winner is someone with a feedback number of 27, but it is clear to see that the price was driven up. I bought mine just recently and I have to admit I paid over €500 more than I probably would have a year ago. But than again, it is in pristine state, almost NOS.
> 
> A month ago a NOS Sherpagraph was sold on Chrono24 for €3250. That, combined with the tale of the $15.000 bid on the Jim Clark Sherpa, led to a recent price explosion that is beyond believe. Very curious to see where it leads. I'm holding on to all my Enicars, that's for sure.


Last week a Super-Dive (with ultra dive dial but that is besides the point) which needed a serious service, new crystal the works went for 1200EURO.
So let's say 1700Euro for a superdive in very-good condition.

Just insane the prices they are commanding. I have given up hope of finding a Sherpa Graph for normal money. Bought My roamer VJ72 chronograph for WAY less than what they are asking right now as well.

Heuers are also seriously in the rise again.


----------



## DaBaeker

GhentWatch said:


> Last week a Super-Dive (with ultra dive dial but that is besides the point) which needed a serious service, new crystal the works went for 1200EURO.
> So let's say 1700Euro for a superdive in very-good condition.
> 
> Just insane the prices they are commanding. I have given up hope of finding a Sherpa Graph for normal money. Bought My roamer VJ72 chronograph for WAY less than what they are asking right now as well.
> 
> Heuers are also seriously in the rise again.


definitely insane price increases. i didn't check on the bidders. even a pristine vlajoux encore chronograph could have been had by me last week for just under $2k which I thought was way too much! Bur agree-hold onto enicar


----------



## kazrich

I don't think the prices are insane in today's market - Still just 10 % the price of an early Rolex Daytona with pretty well the same movement.
Enicar made large quantities of good quality but often unexceptional watches.
Ford made large quantities of good quality but often unexceptional cars.



They also produced the GT40 with four consecutive Le Mans victories.



Same company, but a car from a different planet.

From Enicar we have middle of the road very nice quality watches ---- and we have Sherpa's.
Same company, same planet of Saturn, but a totally different proposition.

There are collectors of Jim Clark watches
Collectors of Super Compressor watches
Collectors of Enicar bayonet back Brevet 314962 watches
Collectors of Valjoux 72 watches
Collectors of triple register chronographs
Collectors of reverse panda chronographs

The Sherpa Graph has has all of the above. What's not to like ? Why should values stay low?
All Enicar Brevet 314962 prices are on the rise - Great style and quality is timeless ( excuse the pun ).

Richard


----------



## vandervenus

kazrich said:


> I don't think the prices are insane in today's market - Still just 10 % the price of an early Rolex Daytona with pretty well the same movement.
> Enicar made large quantities of good quality but often unexceptional watches.
> Ford made large quantities of good quality but often unexceptional cars.
> 
> They also produced the GT40 with four consecutive Le Mans victories. Same company, but a car from a different planet.
> 
> From Enicar we have middle of the road very nice quality watches ---- and we have Sherpa's.
> Same company, same planet of Saturn, but a totally different proposition.
> 
> There are collectors of Jim Clark watches
> Collectors of Super Compressor watches
> Collectors of Enicar bayonet back Brevet 314962 watches
> Collectors of Valjoux 72 watches
> Collectors of triple register chronographs
> Collectors of reverse panda chronographs
> 
> The Sherpa Graph has has all of the above. What's not to like ? Why should values stay low?
> All Enicar Brevet 314962 prices are on the rise - Great style and quality is timeless ( excuse the pun ).
> 
> Richard


Hi Richard,

I totally agree on your analysis: the Sherpa-line is from another planet and deserves to be properly valued. I also agree that the way prices are developing is a result of demands and offers in the market. However, the current market is deliberately disturbed, because fake bidders inflate prices on eBay. That's what happened at the bidding on the beaten up Sherpagraph and it will happen again. I suppose the buyer didn't have a clue what he was doing and was just trapped in the rush of not wanting to miss out. But for everyone else who wants to have an honest chance of getting their hands on a realistically priced Sherpagraph it's very frustrating. Driving up prices is prohibited in many markets and can have serious consequences. But when it comes to collecting art or luxury goods, everything goes.


----------



## Stigmata

Just understand the market and what it is you're prepared to pay for a watch.
Enicar Sherpas have been on the rise in the three or for years I've been watching and buying them.
V,72 Graphs have been flying...
But you do need discipline and patience and even if you miss out on one or two you'll understand the market place better when three comes up.
For the record I don't think that particular watch was definitely overpriced .. But it wasn't at the price point id have jumped in for it.
There are people who will pay top dollar for what they want and be done with it.
I stupidly missed on a graph at 1800 Australian dollars $1450 US not long ago because I was unprepared. By the time I could scratch my backside the watch was sold by the collector.
Life always has options.. Prices are a mental obstacle to what we want to attain.
Graphs have been undervalued in my honest opinion
They're a seriously amazing watch... People pay that kind of money for modern ETA movement watches that are so ho hum . they lack personality and apart from the name they're badged with they're just so far removed from the history and the soul of the house they come from.
I'm always looking for a bargain.
But it needs to have a history.
It needs to have personality.
There should be done mystique to the watch.
It should be unique.

The graph has all those things in spades.
Something many modern watches at the same price cannot claim..

Problem is most of is love our watches cheap and at bargains.
Somebody going in to buy Swatch Omega Planet Ocean needs to pay retail price.. There will be s devaluation as soon as he puts it on his wrist.
Those watch people don't understand us... We don't always understand them..
One thing is for sure.. There's no fixed retail price on what a vintage watch is worth.
It can either be a bargain or it can break records..
The ihuman intangible of emotion kicks in.. Or inexperience
When Enicars kick in with big prices were all disappointed it's not flying under the radar any longer.
But we should also be happy the brand is finally getting the genuine recognition it deserves..


----------



## TheBH

Five different NOS Enicar watches.












From the left
MRO Star Jewels ref 180-90-01 (original price NOK 600 = US $ 77)
Sherpa Super Divette ref 144-35-01 (original price NOK 687 = US $ 88)
Sherpa 320 ref 167-10-01 (original price NOK 838 = US $ 107)
Automatic ref 147-01-13 (original price NOK 458 = US $ 59)
Sherpa Star ref 982-15-01 (original price NOK 605 = US $ 77)

The Sherpa Super Divette With Squale HAI (Norwegian for shark)


----------



## laikrodukas

Why would collector(buyer) be happy of rising prices is beyond me


----------



## Stigmata

Haha ... Everybody who spends a small fortune buying something even for himself is happy when there is a price spike..
On the other side of the coin these things also can create bubbles.. In which case when it's time to sell you can lose a bit.
But as a collector we all like to know we're not buying something we like. So that if we had to sell it, it's worthless or you lose..
And let's face it ,these watches are never going to make you rich anyway.. So I doubt anybody buys them for that reason... It's just we don't want to lose either..


----------



## Tony C.

My understanding is that these single crown Sherpa Diver 600 models are relatively uncommon. Is that the status quo opinion?

Cheers,

Tony C.


----------



## Stigmata

Uncommon...
Yes... There are people who concentrate on that kind of watch.
Just pay heed to the details.
There's an enicar guide on eBay right now going already around 300 that isn't right..
It's an early case with a late caliber and the hands are a mix of both eras... As are the crowns... Obviously cobbled together in every way
I wouldn't be looking at that one myself..
You need to pay attention to detail.


----------



## Tony C.

Thanks. I own the one posted above, and know it to be correct. I was just curious about the relative rarity of the specific model.

Cheers,

Tony C.


----------



## Stigmata

It's rare.. Worth holding onto in my opinion. Know a couple of people here who look for them and you have a great example.
It's certainly been kept as intended.. It hasn't been shielded from a life's outdoors work


----------



## Tony C.

Thanks, and yes, it's one of those that has been used, but the patina (especially the faded bezel) looks really good, and there are no signs of abuse.


----------



## ppstore

Hi 
this one was my second Enicar bought 20 yeras ago is a gold watch with a case back witn an Enicar logo


----------



## ppstore

Here are the phtos


----------



## Stigmata

Does the back have a reference number?


----------



## ppstore

Yes it does. it's a little fade but I'try

166-01-01


----------



## ppstore

Sorry
it's
165-01-01


----------



## Stigmata

Great movement the 16x series. It was used as the base for chronoswiss watches


----------



## ppstore

The super Divette and the super dive
the Divette is on Pvd supposing for better luminosity in the dives. Probably more scarce than the Divettes on steel
not quite sure


----------



## ppstore

This is an old publicity in LUANDA/ Angola still there from the sixties


----------



## vandervenus

ppstore said:


> The super Divette and the super dive
> the Divette is on Pvd supposing for better luminosity in the dives. Probably more scarce than the Divettes on steel
> not quite sure


Congrats! Very nice divers, especially the Super-Divette. I love it when Enicar divers have a Tropic strap. Easy to wear and splendid looking.


----------



## kazrich

ppstore said:


> The super Divette and the super dive
> the Divette is on Pvd supposing for better luminosity in the dives. Probably more scarce than the Divettes on steel
> not quite sure


Nice watches, but why do you show them upside down ?
My understanding is that the PVD finish is anti shark or other dangerous fish attack. They are attracted to shiny surfaces.
I even take my Sherpa's off when washing the dishes - You never know what's lurking under the plug hole.


----------



## Dracha

Hi All,
I have a few enicars but one in particular I'd like some more info on 
does anyone have a reference list that can link a certain serial number to an assembly year ?

i.e. serial number 836263 ref 072-32-01 , which year was this manufactured ?
thanks 
Rene


----------



## ppstore

Hi 
this is my enicar graphomatic/lemania / enicar
some sellers say that this watch have a GMT function?
My watch is full operational but I never be able to use this function, even when I pull the crown clock or anti-clockwise
anyone can help me?


----------



## vandervenus

ppstore said:


> Hi
> this is my enicar graphomatic/lemania / enicar
> some sellers say that this watch have a GMT function?
> My watch is full operational but I never be able to use this function, even when I pull the crown clock or anti-clockwise
> anyone can help me?


Nice one. My Graphomatic says Hi!








I've had this watch for a couple of months now and I can assure you it does not have a GMT function. It's a chronograph watch with a Lemania movement. The yellow pointer counts the minutes, and the lower register displays the number of hours. It's a stunning piece of work really. You can quick set the date by pulling the crown to first position and moving it clockwise. 
Enjoy your watch!


----------



## ppstore

Hi as I supposed this enicar doesn't have Gmt function , but as I've said some adds ( 2 times) talk in GMT function in Enicar/ graphomatic . it's a Lemania caliber 1340 automatic 22 jewels. Mine was bought here in Lisbon N.O.S , 10 years ago
regards


----------



## ppstore

My other two


----------



## ppstore

Super jet 100% original
super dive crowns not original , 
sorry about so bad photos


----------



## ppstore

My other two


----------



## Okapi001

Is this a legit Enicar? Inside is the cal. 160.

On the dial is Sekou Toure, first president of the Guinea.
I have found a reference that he, or rather his son allegedly owned the Enicar watch factory.
Google translated from French:


> On April 11 [1984, after Sekou Toure died], Radio France Internationale communicates at one of its broadcasts goods that rumor attributed to former leaders:...
> His son Mohamed possess:
> $ 75 million in Switzerland
> an assembly plant ENICAR brand watches in Switzerland


----------



## DaBaeker

vandervenus said:


> Nice one. My Graphomatic says Hi!
> View attachment 4578978
> 
> 
> I've had this watch for a couple of months now and I can assure you it does not have a GMT function. It's a chronograph watch with a Lemania movement. The yellow pointer counts the minutes, and the lower register displays the number of hours. It's a stunning piece of work really. You can quick set the date by pulling the crown to first position and moving it clockwise.
> Enjoy your watch!


I think this is a version of the Lemania 1340 which is the basis for the Omega SM1040. I still don't see how it has a GMT function unless you are playing some how with the 24hr register. Isn't the hand function as follows:
-short white hand:regular hours
-long white hand minutes
-yellew pointer elapsed minutes
-orange hand elapsed seconds
-register @9 regular seconds
[email protected] 6 24hr time

what do you consider a GMT-or am I mistaken in this version of Lemania 1340?

nice looking enicar btw!
-


----------



## vandervenus

Hi DaBaeker,

You're absolutely right, except for the register @6: it's scale goes up to 12 instead of 24. All in all this is a great chrono. I saw a couple of different versions of the dial and the inner bezel. Different in colors of the hands and the design of the registers. Does anybody know how many variations were made?


----------



## vandervenus

ppstore said:


> My other two


Awesome Super Jet! It's amazing that it doesn't resemble the older model of the Super Jet al all. As far as I know, there is no version of the regular Jet with this type of cast either.


----------



## hns-panama

Interesting piece but highly doubtful on owning the Enicar factory. Possibility exists he may own the building in which Enicar built, but I rather doubt that.



Okapi001 said:


> Is this a legit Enicar? Inside is the cal. 160.
> 
> On the dial is Sekou Toure, first president of the Guinea.
> I have found a reference that he, or rather his son allegedly owned the Enicar watch factory.
> Google translated from French:
> 
> View attachment 4584978


----------



## hns-panama

Yes, nice Super Jet.

Though I must admit I love the one key detail (which Enicar loved to do) of the Jet -- the 24 hour hand. The red and black checkered effect just sings.



vandervenus said:


> Awesome Super Jet! It's amazing that it doesn't resemble the older model of the Super Jet al all. As far as I know, there is no version of the regular Jet with this type of cast either.
> 
> View attachment 4599658
> View attachment 4599666


----------



## hns-panama

Those cases look big. How do they wear on the wrist?



ppstore said:


> My other two


----------



## hns-panama

Look inside the case back, many times the date is stamped there. At least that is when the case was made. Now, knowing Enicar, they might have completed it some time after 

Re: The Joy of Collecting Vintage Enicar WatchesHi All,
I have a few enicars but one in particular I'd like some more info on 
does anyone have a reference list that can link a certain serial number to an assembly year ?

i.e. serial number 836263 ref 072-32-01 , which year was this manufactured ?
thanks 
Rene​


----------



## hns-panama

Love the Super Divette in black. Nice find.



ppstore said:


> The super Divette and the super dive
> the Divette is on Pvd supposing for better luminosity in the dives. Probably more scarce than the Divettes on steel
> not quite sure


----------



## Stigmata

The great thing about the Sherpa line is the variety,, the red and black barbers pole gmt hand was introduced later 
I prefer the earlier hands without the red and black hand ..I like all though...


----------



## hns-panama

Agreed. The variety is astounding.



Stigmata said:


> The great thing about the Sherpa line is the variety,, the red and black barbers pole gmt hand was introduced later
> I prefer the earlier hands without the red and black hand ..I like all though...


----------



## vandervenus

hns-panama said:


> Those cases look big. How do they wear on the wrist?


My Memostar has an identical case. It's big, but it wears surprisingly comfortable.


----------



## Sunday Rider

Wow, I've not seen a Memostar before, it is beautiful.


----------



## GUTuna

My latest Enicar in serious need of service.


----------



## wongerik

dogen said:


> My dear friends of enicars,
> it's nice to see the interest of the enicar-watches. I have a little collection of sherpas an I would like to show them in the next weeks.
> Here a small overview for the beginning :
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks for looking.
> 
> Cheers dogen


Hi there dogen,

What a great collection!!!

I have recently acquired a Sherpa Graph and was looking for the right crown and hence come upon your thread...

Was wondering whether you would have a spare crown?

Attached is the URL of what I am looking for...

Enicar - Album - TinyPic - Free Image Hosting, Photo Sharing & Video Hosting

A User's tinypic most recent media in Enicar

Enicar - Album - TinyPic - Free Image Hosting, Photo Sharing & Video Hosting

Thank you so so much

Erik
[email protected]


----------



## hns-panama

Keep an eye on ebay seller esa-9162-9164.

He has some Enicar SC crowns that may, repeat may be what you are looking for:

Enicar Sie Kaufen 1 Dieser 6 Spezialkronen | eBay



wongerik said:


> Hi there dogen,
> 
> What a great collection!!!
> 
> I have recently acquired a Sherpa Graph and was looking for the right crown and hence come upon your thread...
> 
> Was wondering whether you would have a spare crown?
> 
> Attached is the URL of what I am looking for...
> 
> Enicar - Album - TinyPic - Free Image Hosting, Photo Sharing & Video Hosting
> 
> A User's tinypic most recent media in Enicar
> 
> Enicar - Album - TinyPic - Free Image Hosting, Photo Sharing & Video Hosting
> 
> Thank you so so much
> 
> Erik
> [email protected]


----------



## wongerik

hns-panama said:


> Keep an eye on ebay seller esa-9162-9164.
> 
> He has some Enicar SC crowns that may, repeat may be what you are looking for:
> 
> Enicar Sie Kaufen 1 Dieser 6 Spezialkronen | eBay


Too late ate gone in a flash.... Will try to email him thank u vm


----------



## vandervenus

Looking back at that incredible collection of Dogen I wonder: will anyone ever be able to build such a collection ever again? There are 25 watches in that box. Some of them are worth $3.000 - $4.000 by now. There's even a Supergraph present that could be worth a couple thousand more.
Let's say the average watch in that box is worth $2.000 for collectors. That means there is over $50.000 worth of Enicar watches in the box. That amount might be doubled within the year seeing how prices have been rising lately.


----------



## Stigmata

only a cashe up fanatic would try it..


----------



## wongerik

Stigmata said:


> only a cashe up fanatic would try it..


I think the price rise in particular for Enicar Sherpa Graphs.... largely for its history with Jim Clark 

It still hasn't reach the prices of Jo Siffert Heuer Autavia yet... so more room to go I think


----------



## vandervenus

wongerik said:


> I think the price rise in particular for Enicar Sherpa Graphs.... largely for its history with Jim Clark
> 
> It still hasn't reach the prices of Jo Siffert Heuer Autavia yet... so more room to go I think


This weekend I saw a Sherpa Jet (black and white bezel, barber pole GMT hand) advertised and gone in a flash for €2.750... It was supposed to be in near NOS state, and judging from the pictures it was pristine, but I think that was a lot of money for a regular Jet.

We had a discussion on this forum a couple of weeks ago about the way the market works. Sure, Enicars are in high demand right now and that's completely understandable. The brand finally gets the recognition it deserves. But if I want to add a Aquagraph in the near future, I probably have to rob a bank.


----------



## WatchFred

afraid there is quite a bit more room to go with Enicar prices; yes, the Aqua Graph are lovely watches


----------



## vandervenus

WatchFred said:


> afraid there is quite a bit more room to go with Enicar prices; yes, the Aqua Graph are lovely watches


Watchfred, I will sell my kidney to get my hands on this one ;-)


----------



## wongerik

WatchFred said:


> afraid there is quite a bit more room to go with Enicar prices; yes, the Aqua Graph are lovely watches


Vintage 1960s Swiss ENICAR Aqua Graph Chronograph Valjoux 72 Sherpa 300 Ref 2342

There is 1 available on EBAY

=)


----------



## Apollonaught

:edited due to posting in the wrong thread lol.

Great Enicars guys,sorry for any confusion.I thought it was the WRUW thread,since i can`t delete this,i`ll leave this here.


----------



## wongerik

wongerik said:


> Vintage 1960s Swiss ENICAR Aqua Graph Chronograph Valjoux 72 Sherpa 300 Ref 2342
> 
> There is 1 available on EBAY
> 
> =)


What do you guys think of these divette? the orange one hands look wrong but the silver one look ok

I have never seen the orange one b4 anywhere you guys think its legit?


----------



## GhentWatch

Second one:

All the hands are repainted to a non-existant colour scheme. Dial and bezel has been relumed.
I'd steer clear


----------



## Stigmata

I don't have a problem with relume but hands are a massive off


----------



## vandervenus

Why would anyone want to repaint those hands? And why in these awfull colors? Looks like the 1 - 12 markers have been painted too.


----------



## GhentWatch

Stigmata said:


> I don't have a problem with relume but hands are a massive off


If they didn't use that disgusting mint colour I wouldn't be so opposed either.


----------



## Stigmata

What colour should modern lume be?


----------



## wongerik

GhentWatch said:


> If they didn't use that disgusting mint colour I wouldn't be so opposed either.


Thanks for the honest feedback....I think the 1st one silver dial as well has a repaint of the bezel as well.....the numbers are not as crisp....

These watches are from japan.... they have a Breitling Super Ocean Ruined as well.. Maybe i should tell the owner not to do it anymore..but I might sound offensive in Japanese Culture

Cheers
Erik


----------



## GhentWatch

Stigmata said:


> What colour should modern lume be?


Any colour you want basically.

Or you use plain white if you want to go all 'New-Look' OR you go all patinated lume which is fairly indistinguishable from old lume.
I've had some off my watches touched up because the lume had become very fragile, so I asked my watchmaker to apply a very thin layer off lume over the existing lume and mix the colour. It took some trying to get the colour just right but I can only see the difference under a blacklight.


----------



## Sunday Rider

What about the movements on those watches? That is a key thing. You can always look to find the correct hands and have the lume done correctly later. If the watches are the right price. If they are way over priced, then would agree to pass.


----------



## GhentWatch

Sunday Rider said:


> What about the movements on those watches? That is a key thing. You can always look to find the correct hands and have the lume done correctly later. If the watches are the right price. If they are way over priced, then would agree to pass.


You can bet your behind that those watches will not be 'bargain'priced if someone went through the effort to repaint and relume.


----------



## wongerik

GhentWatch said:


> You can bet your behind that those watches will not be 'bargain'priced if someone went through the effort to repaint and relume.


Its 1500USD and 1400 USD i think...... is that cheap enough?

I didnt ask for the movement.... The most important thing to me to a watch is the dial..... If it is repainted then I wouldnt want it....


----------



## vandervenus

wongerik said:


> Its 1500USD and 1400 USD i think...... is that cheap enough?
> 
> I didnt ask for the movement.... The most important thing to me to a watch is the dial..... If it is repainted then I wouldnt want it....


I had my eye on a Sherpa Graph from a Japanese seller some time ago. The case and movement looked outstanding. But some parts were obviously redone with orange accents on the hands and in the register. Also, the dial as a whole looked suspicious. I passed on it, thought the price was right, especially for a watch as popular as the Sherpa Graph.


----------



## kazrich

I've only just caught up with what I believe to be the official Enicar website.
It seems more a lifestyle statement than anything too detailed with product information.

This statement is a real corker !

*SHEER BRILLIANCE OF HAUTE HOROLOGY**Enicar is one of the C.O.S.C.'s top 10 certified chronometer watch producers and till date remains an unrivalled name with a range of over 300 flawless timepieces that ooze refinedness and perfection. As a watchmaker, Enicar values time and the implacable pursuit for transcendence.

*s

Errr - thanks for that.

*1951
Enicar took a great step forward with the design of Sherpa jet watches, which were designated by US Air Force during WWII. After war period, Sherpa Collection entered Asian market with gusto to offer Asians both the advanced complications in aviation timing and later on, the mountaineering timing. Today, Sherpa Collection still remains as one of the most remarkable models.
*

I thought the earliest Sherpa Jet would have been early 60's ? Has anyone seen a WW11 or 50's Enicar Sherpa Jet ?

That said, the latest Enicar Sherpa Sport 11 looks rather nice.

Enicar: CH328 Sherpa Sport II (Adventure Collection)

Can anyone tell me

1. Are these watches actually made in Switzerland ?
2. What automatic movements do they now use ?
3. Where do they sit in the Far East market place, compared to Longines, Omega , Tag and Rolex ?
4. Are most of the images out of focus or am I due another visit to Spec Savers ?

Website

Enicar


----------



## WatchFred

cousins on mesh


----------



## vandervenus

kazrich said:


> I've only just caught up with what I believe to be the official Enicar website.
> It seems more a lifestyle statement than anything too detailed with product information.
> 
> This statement is a real corker !
> 
> *SHEER BRILLIANCE OF HAUTE HOROLOGY*
> 
> *Enicar is one of the C.O.S.C.'s top 10 certified chronometer watch producers and till date remains an unrivalled name with a range of over 300 flawless timepieces that ooze refinedness and perfection. As a watchmaker, Enicar values time and the implacable pursuit for transcendence.
> 
> *s
> 
> Errr - thanks for that.
> 
> *1951
> Enicar took a great step forward with the design of Sherpa jet watches, which were designated by US Air Force during WWII. After war period, Sherpa Collection entered Asian market with gusto to offer Asians both the advanced complications in aviation timing and later on, the mountaineering timing. Today, Sherpa Collection still remains as one of the most remarkable models.
> *
> 
> I thought the earliest Sherpa Jet would have been early 60's ? Has anyone seen a WW11 or 50's Enicar Sherpa Jet ?
> 
> That said, the latest Enicar Sherpa Sport 11 looks rather nice.
> 
> Enicar: CH328 Sherpa Sport II (Adventure Collection)
> 
> Can anyone tell me
> 
> 1. Are these watches actually made in Switzerland ?
> 2. What automatic movements do they now use ?
> 3. Where do they sit in the Far East market place, compared to Longines, Omega , Tag and Rolex ?
> 4. Are most of the images out of focus or am I due another visit to Spec Savers ?
> 
> Website
> 
> Enicar


Hi Kazrich,

I asked myself the same questions as you did (except for the necessity of a visit to Spec Savers). As far as I know, the new Enicar line is only available in stores in the Far East (China, Japan, but correct me if I'm wrong). I see them occasionally on eBay and Amazon Japan, but that's it. I'm almost certain these watches are produced in China, but I can't find any detailed information on the matter.

The last couple of weeks I was in contact with the owners of the Enicar brand and they have the same trouble with getting their hands on original brochures and other documents from the past as the Enicar collectors do. My guess is that most of the archives were lost after the bankruptcy of Enicar in the late eighties. The brandname is now being used to profit from the fame it still has (in Asia Enicar was more of a household name than in the rest of the world), so it represents some market value. I'm not gonna give my opinion on the new models, cause I never saw one in real life. I don't know anything about the quality. What I do know is that they haven't got the same appeal to me as the classic Enicars: the divers and chrono's from the sixties and seventies.

Maybe Stigmata can share some insights?


----------



## kazrich

Hi Vandervenus ,
I do agree that they don't have the same appeal but ------ I am warming a bit to that Sherpa Sport 11 in the Adventure collection ( runs for cover  Is there a doctor in the house ?). 
It's way too large at 43 mm but the detailing is quite attractive in the photo's. A ceramic bezel and unusual bracelet and some nice Enicar detailing. As you indicate, you would need to hold it and examine it closely to form a valued opinion, but it appears that the Sherpa is still ' top of the range '.
As regards country of origin, I don't think any country in the world would allow watches clearly marked Enicar Swiss Made on the dial to be made in China ?
If you look at the Adventure Collection CH327 Neeham , they show the automatic movement. This also clearly states ' Enicar Swiss Made 25 Jewels.' I would imagine Swiss Made on the dial and movement
can only mean one thing ---- Made in China ?
The mystery continues.
P.S. The Enicar advertising agency claims that Enicar watches are made in Switzerland.

http://i-cgx.com/enicar-can-social-media-101-year-old-watch-brand/


----------



## Stigmata

Enicar and the enicar are two different companies and only have the name in common.
Enicar was a massive watch company in many parts of Asia and especially in China.
When it went under a Hong Kong company took the name and chronoswiss took the movements.
I'm pretty sure originally enicar HK was using ETA movements.. Towards the end the Swiss enicar company was also using some ETA and Seiko movements in a range of watches.
I'm not sure if these newer Chinese enicar watches are using ETA or another movement nowadays. ETA don't sell movements to anybody anymore so they can have better control of the ETA brand which was used by just about everybody at one stage.
The new enicar is supposedly still a massive brand in China and has a huge budget in advertising.
Testament to what the watch was decades ago and how widely accepted it was there.
But the two can't be brought together. They're not the same company. 
They only share the name. BC / AD


----------



## vandervenus

kazrich said:


> ...If you look at the Adventure Collection CH327 Neeham , they show the automatic movement. This also clearly states ' Enicar Swiss Made 25 Jewels.' I would imagine Swiss Made on the dial and movement can only mean one thing ---- Made in China ?
> The mystery continues.
> P.S. The Enicar advertising agency claims that Enicar watches are made in Switzerland.
> 
> Enicar social media and digital marketing


Thanks for pointing out the pictures of the movement. Indeed it states 'Swiss made', but that doesn't prove much IMO. Maybe the movement was engineered in Switzerland, but produced in China? You see that a lot with hifi brands, for instance NAD. It's designed and engineered in Britain, but mass-produced in the Far East (with all kinds of quality issues as a result...)

Enicar claims that their watches are made in Switzerland. I would love to know where this production plant is located, or which Swiss company provides Enicar with their movements.


----------



## kazrich

WatchFred said:


> cousins on mesh


Looking good on mesh Fred.

My mob are into leather tonight


----------



## vandervenus

kazrich said:


> Looking good on mesh Fred.
> 
> My mob are into leather tonight


Great collection! I love the Super Jet and off course the Graph. What is the original color of dial of the Divette? Was it silver and has it aged to brown/yellow?


----------



## kazrich

vandervenus said:


> Great collection! I love the Super Jet and off course the Graph. What is the original color of dial of the Divette? Was it silver and has it aged to brown/yellow?


No, the original colour was gold as shown . This changes according to the light. At night under artificial lighting it takes on a rose gold tint. I've also seen this colour dial on a Super Dive and a Sherpa GMT
Considering this watch must be nearly 50 years old, when seen on the wrist it could almost pass for new. Under intense magnification the tritium lume is degrading a tad but Enicar definitely 
made quality watches back then.





My cleaner also enjoys wearing this watch ;-)


----------



## Sunday Rider

kazrich said:


> My mob are into leather tonight


There is nothing like good fitting leather to show off those round objects.


----------



## dmcevoy

I'd like to ask the Enicar community here for some advice and insight, especially those with knowledge of repair and parts for vintage movements. I picked up an Enicar Super Jet about a year ago. It appeared to be in decent condition (for the price paid anyway),and the photos of the movement with the back off looked clean enough in the listing. When it arrived it would run readily, however I noticed that it would lose time, and even occasionally stop, despite having manually wound it that day. So I brought it to my watchmaker who found rust damage on the movement further in, close to the dial. He said he cleaned the rust the best he could but was having a hard time getting it running well. I believe he was basically trying to perform a complete disassembly, cleaning and adjustment service, and didn't recommend any particular parts replacement. After that it was fine for about a month, then began running slow again, to the tune of -10 minutes every 4 hours.

So I brought back to the same watchmaker, who expressed some regret at having taken it on in the first place, but took another stab at it. I did say that if he wanted to replace any parts to get it running again to just let me know, but nothing was mentioned. So he had said that he found what might have been the problem, a loose balance cover, and the watch was back in my hands. This time it ran well for about 3 days, and is now losing about 10 minutes every two hours.

So, I love this watch (I don't need to tell you guys how great the Super Jet is), and really would like to save it, and if it needs some new parts to get it working again, it would be worth it to me . Clearly, I know nothing of watch repair myself, but I'd like to throw this out to the community, and ask whether anyone can give some insight on what parts might need to be replaced based on what I've described, a source for Enicar parts, or even a recommendation for a watchmaker known to take on hopeless causes or perform minor miracles. Thanks to all.


----------



## vandervenus

dmcevoy said:


> I'd like to ask the Enicar community here for some advice and insight, especially those with knowledge of repair and parts for vintage movements. I picked up an Enicar Super Jet about a year ago. It appeared to be in decent condition (for the price paid anyway),and the photos of the movement with the back off looked clean enough in the listing. When it arrived it would run readily, however I noticed that it would lose time, and even occasionally stop, despite having manually wound it that day. So I brought it to my watchmaker who found rust damage on the movement further in, close to the dial. He said he cleaned the rust the best he could but was having a hard time getting it running well. I believe he was basically trying to perform a complete disassembly, cleaning and adjustment service, and didn't recommend any particular parts replacement. After that it was fine for about a month, then began running slow again, to the tune of -10 minutes every 4 hours.
> 
> So I brought back to the same watchmaker, who expressed some regret at having taken it on in the first place, but took another stab at it. I did say that if he wanted to replace any parts to get it running again to just let me know, but nothing was mentioned. So he had said that he found what might have been the problem, a loose balance cover, and the watch was back in my hands. This time it ran well for about 3 days, and is now losing about 10 minutes every two hours.
> 
> So, I love this watch (I don't need to tell you guys how great the Super Jet is), and really would like to save it, and if it needs some new parts to get it working again, it would be worth it to me . Clearly, I know nothing of watch repair myself, but I'd like to throw this out to the community, and ask whether anyone can give some insight on what parts might need to be replaced based on what I've described, a source for Enicar parts, or even a recommendation for a watchmaker known to take on hopeless causes or perform minor miracles. Thanks to all.


I think the Super Jet has the AR 1125 movement inside, although I'm not sure. I own a Super Jet myself, but I never got a look inside. My Super Jet runs a bit fast, about 1 minute a day. But I think that is totally acceptable for a watch that is almost 50 years old.

I know from my own experience that it's hard to find a decent watchmaker that wants to work on a vintage Enicar. However, I found a watchmaker that is currently working on my Jet (the regular, not the Super Jet). He is doing a complete revision and the has connections to the necessary parts. He charges €250 for a full service on a GMT watch.

Also, forum member Ghentwatch might have some good connections. And there's a guy in Cyprus with his own shop that performs services and repairs on Enicar watches. His name is Andreas, and the name of his shop is LocalTime, http://www.facebook.com/LocalTime.Online Maybe he can help you.

Cheers,
Martijn


----------



## GhentWatch

dmcevoy said:


> I'd like to ask the Enicar community here for some advice and insight, especially those with knowledge of repair and parts for vintage movements. I picked up an Enicar Super Jet about a year ago. It appeared to be in decent condition (for the price paid anyway),and the photos of the movement with the back off looked clean enough in the listing. When it arrived it would run readily, however I noticed that it would lose time, and even occasionally stop, despite having manually wound it that day. So I brought it to my watchmaker who found rust damage on the movement further in, close to the dial. He said he cleaned the rust the best he could but was having a hard time getting it running well. I believe he was basically trying to perform a complete disassembly, cleaning and adjustment service, and didn't recommend any particular parts replacement. After that it was fine for about a month, then began running slow again, to the tune of -10 minutes every 4 hours.
> 
> So I brought back to the same watchmaker, who expressed some regret at having taken it on in the first place, but took another stab at it. I did say that if he wanted to replace any parts to get it running again to just let me know, but nothing was mentioned. So he had said that he found what might have been the problem, a loose balance cover, and the watch was back in my hands. This time it ran well for about 3 days, and is now losing about 10 minutes every two hours.
> 
> So, I love this watch (I don't need to tell you guys how great the Super Jet is), and really would like to save it, and if it needs some new parts to get it working again, it would be worth it to me . Clearly, I know nothing of watch repair myself, but I'd like to throw this out to the community, and ask whether anyone can give some insight on what parts might need to be replaced based on what I've described, a source for Enicar parts, or even a recommendation for a watchmaker known to take on hopeless causes or perform minor miracles. Thanks to all.


Hi
Dmcevoy.

Still enjoying the Racine chronograph I hope? I see you got another Enicar/Racine watch awesome!
Can't be off much help with the piece as I am not that knowledgeable about watchmakers across the pond.

Have your watchmaker check the Canon Pinion, which are notorious to have 'wobble' in AR movements and may cause the bad running.
You can check this yourself by filming the seconds hand and see if it runs on time. If it does run on time the problem is with the minutehand caused by the canon pinion.

Regardless, If you want to throw in the towel I'd buy it off you


----------



## dmcevoy

Greetings Ghentwatch,
I'm well, and enjoying that Racine chrono very much. Thanks for your insight. I'm seriously considering taking the TimeZone beginner watchmaking course, that way I can tell a watchmaker to "check the cannon pinion" without sounding like a fool. But I will try that video timing trick that you mentioned. As far as the future of this watch, I won't continue to bother the same fellow with it, but won't rush to sell it either. I think I'll just set it aside for a while until I encounter someone state-side who's up to the task. A recent listing for a Super Jet on the bay stated that the movement reference was AR 1146B. Looking that up on Roland Ranfft's website appears to be correct for a 24 hour function and 24-jewel movement. Another possibility with 24-hr function is the 1126, but it's rotor is stamped 30 Jewels, and mine is only stamped "Star Jewels"

Thanks also Vandervenus for your reply.


----------



## GhentWatch

dmcevoy said:


> Greetings Ghentwatch,
> I'm well, and enjoying that Racine chrono very much. Thanks for your insight. I'm seriously considering taking the TimeZone beginner watchmaking course, that way I can tell a watchmaker to "check the cannon pinion" without sounding like a fool. But I will try that video timing trick that you mentioned. As far as the future of this watch, I won't continue to bother the same fellow with it, but won't rush to sell it either. I think I'll just set it aside for a while until I encounter someone state-side who's up to the task.  A recent listing for a Super Jet on the bay stated that the movement reference was AR 1146B. Looking that up on Roland Ranfft's website appears to be correct for a 24 hour function and 24-jewel movement. Another possibility with 24-hr function is the 1126, but it's rotor is stamped 30 Jewels, and mine is only stamped "Star Jewels"
> 
> Thanks also Vandervenus for your reply.


I might sound like it but I can't even do a basic service on watches so I am by no means an expert. However I do know some fancy words


----------



## hns-panama

The case back number should give you a clue as to which movement you have.

148-XX-XX is a 1146 for example

If it says 12X -XX-XX, it will be the 1126.

Star Jewels means the 1146 if you have a 24 hour watch.



vandervenus said:


> I think the Super Jet has the AR 1125 movement inside, although I'm not sure. I own a Super Jet myself, but I never got a look inside. My Super Jet runs a bit fast, about 1 minute a day. But I think that is totally acceptable for a watch that is almost 50 years old.
> 
> I know from my own experience that it's hard to find a decent watchmaker that wants to work on a vintage Enicar. However, I found a watchmaker that is currently working on my Jet (the regular, not the Super Jet). He is doing a complete revision and the has connections to the necessary parts. He charges €250 for a full service on a GMT watch.
> 
> Also, forum member Ghentwatch might have some good connections. And there's a guy in Cyprus with his own shop that performs services and repairs on Enicar watches. His name is Andreas, and the name of his shop is LocalTime, http://www.facebook.com/LocalTime.Online Maybe he can help you.
> 
> Cheers,
> Martijn


----------



## vandervenus

hns-panama said:


> The case back number should give you a clue as to which movement you have.
> 
> 148-XX-XX is a 1146 for example
> 
> If it says 12X -XX-XX, it will be the 1126.
> 
> Star Jewels means the 1146 if you have a 24 hour watch.


Unfortunately the backside of my SuperJet is totaly unreadable... It was heavily bitten by the polishingmachine. One of these days I might open it up, just out of curiousity.


----------



## Stigmata

Can tell from the date window which movement not the caseback which is often misleading


----------



## Stigmata

Red dates AR 14x
Black 12x and 16x


----------



## vandervenus

Stigmata said:


> Red dates AR 14x
> Black 12x and 16x


I'm glad I read your reply before opening the case. You probably saved me some serious scratches.
The date is red, so that makes it a 14x movement.


----------



## Stigmata

Most are the 146 movement imho. most sherpas use this movement for guides and dive , jet series


----------



## dmcevoy

Interesting, thanks Stigmata. My Super Jet also has a red date. Anyway, I was concerned that the case # would not be all that reliable anyway because having come from the Bay, it's entirely possible it's not the original caseback on my piece. For example mine says "Sherpa 600" above the clam, but I've seen others that say "Sea Pearl".


----------



## kazrich

You will find that the very early Super Jet that does not have the red second hand or the red / black GMT hand
may just say Seapearl. Both versions should be inscribed Brevet 314962 indicating that the case patent is for an Enicar
bayonet type Super Compressor made by EPSA. My own later Super Jet also says Sherpa 600 above the shell.


----------



## Stigmata

The enicar Sherpa watches were put together sometimes with no uniformity.
It's not rare to find different movements in watches that state otherwise on the case back.
It's one of the delights of the enicar Sherpas. It's a mixed box of chocolates..
Towards the end there they were really throwing watches together to get them out to the market ..
Using older cases with newer movements .. Hands etc.. But there are instances of this right throughout.. 
There are so many different examples...

None of this detracts from the quality though the method wasn't orthodox.

They just used up all their stock of spare parts I reckon..


----------



## GhentWatch

Stigmata said:


> The enicar Sherpa watches were put together sometimes with no uniformity.
> It's not rare to find different movements in watches that state otherwise on the case back.
> It's one of the delights of the enicar Sherpas. It's a mixed box of chocolates..
> Towards the end there they were really throwing watches together to get them out to the market ..
> Using older cases with newer movements .. Hands etc.. But there are instances of this right throughout..
> There are so many different examples...
> 
> None of this detracts from the quality though the method wasn't orthodox.
> 
> They just used up all their stock of spare parts I reckon..


Dials were interchangeable so it is not that rare to see SuperDive,Sherpa Ops and Ultradvie dials mixed up, same with the chronographs.


----------



## vandervenus

kazrich said:


> You will find that the very early Super Jet that does not have the red second hand or the red / black GMT hand
> may just say Seapearl. Both versions should be inscribed Brevet 314962 indicating that the case patent is for an Enicar
> bayonet type Super Compressor made by EPSA. My own later Super Jet also says Sherpa 600 above the shell.


Very early hands: check
Seapearl on the back: check
Red date: check
Brevet 314962: probably


----------



## Stigmata

Nothing wrong wiith authenticity there.
My super jet looks the same
Early hands .mid movement.
Caseback says 1965 but maybe was put together years later.


----------



## Stigmata

GhentWatch said:


> Dials were interchangeable so it is not that rare to see SuperDive,Sherpa Ops and Ultradvie dials mixed up, same with the chronographs.


That's one of the things to look out for.
I've never seen enicar factory mix the dials up but I have heard dealers admit. That they mix and match to conjure up a watch.
Most times the enicar will be left alone and sold as is or with that polishing on the back which is just too common..
It's very rare I've seen tampering.
Enicar just isn't a brand sought enough for too much time and imagination.
Even as it's prices have risen.
Omega. Rolex etc .. Different kettle of fish.
Enicar is a brand that can just flick at a price more than the price they bought it.
They didn't polish the back. Usually that happened in the watches lifetime after visiting a watchmaker who didn't know about the quarter bayonet turn.
If they have a nice caseback with full detail they're very quick to point it out.
Great dealers in south east Asia are invaluable.
Some can be prickly.


----------



## gr8sw




----------



## GhentWatch

Stigmata said:


> I've never seen enicar factory mix the dials up but I have heard dealers admit. That they mix and match to conjure up a watch.
> M


My ultradive has a superdive dial BUT I bought it from the first owner and am 100% sure it came out the factory like that.


----------



## Stigmata

The tricky thing with what enicar was doing especially late was getting watches out.
The Sherpa was a popular sports watch so they were pumping them out.
To tell you the truth I'm envious of your watch and if it's come from the original owner there's no reason to believe otherwise.

If it had 'guide' on the dial it would be different.


----------



## GhentWatch

Stigmata said:


> The tricky thing with what enicar was doing especially late was getting watches out.
> The Sherpa was a popular sports watch so they were pumping them out.
> To tell you the truth I'm envious of your watch and if it's come from the original owner there's no reason to believe otherwise.
> 
> *If it had 'guide' on the dial it would be different*.


And coming from Indonesia or someplace there.


----------



## kazrich

vandervenus said:


> Very early hands: check
> Seapearl on the back: check
> Red date: check
> Brevet 314962: probably
> 
> View attachment 5023081
> 
> View attachment 5023089


That's a lovely old 'Super Jet ' you have there !.
I wonder if 60's pilots might have had something to do with the styling evolution of the Jet and Super Jet range ?
Glancing quickly at the GMT hand when evaluating the time on the early models might have been a tad confusing, as all the hands are similar in material and only differ in size.
I wonder if Enicar then decided to make it a bit more obvious and introduced the red / black checker board effect GMT hand and red second hand to avoid any confusion? 
Or do you think it was merely a later 60's updated style statement or maybe something else ? 
These watches definitely mellow well with age. The original white bezel ( morning ) section evolving into a delicious creamy antique ivory. Yum Yum.
I think it's true to say that more people have commented on my Super Jet than any other watch. Pictures don't always show the slight dome on the crystal
that catches the light and draws attention to the other styling cues. Also a very comfortable watch to wear. A real Sherpa gem.


----------



## Stigmata

Ive seen enicar watches out of uk eu and America tampered as well...overall most people dont bother .but never for a moment think only Indonesians will do that.

keep your eye on eBay for heaps of examples of Europeans more so than Indonesians playing with enicar .


----------



## Stigmata

I reckon that it was modernisation upgrade... facelifts 

great point.question


----------



## Stigmata

I mean Sherpa.

Indonesia sellers mostly look at the watch as turnover commodity... good or bad example .... they want to sell as is and get the next one up....


always be careful


----------



## vandervenus

kazrich said:


> That's a lovely old 'Super Jet ' you have there !.
> I wonder if 60's pilots might have had something to do with the styling evolution of the Jet and Super Jet range ?
> Glancing quickly at the GMT hand when evaluating the time on the early models might have been a tad confusing, as all the hands are similar in material and only differ in size.
> I wonder if Enicar then decided to make it a bit more obvious and introduced the red / black checker board effect GMT hand and red second hand to avoid any confusion?
> Or do you think it was merely a later 60's updated style statement or maybe something else ?
> These watches definitely mellow well with age. The original white bezel ( morning ) section evolving into a delicious creamy antique ivory. Yum Yum.
> I think it's true to say that more people have commented on my Super Jet than any other watch. Pictures don't always show the slight dome on the crystal
> that catches the light and draws attention to the other styling cues. Also a very comfortable watch to wear. A real Sherpa gem.


It's a pleasure to wear this one. It sits very nice on the wrist, even though it's huge (especially for a sixties watch) and my wrist is quite tiny. Also, the small crowns don't stick into my hand like the later and bigger crowns tend to do.
I agree with Stigmata that the change of colors and types of hands is probably a style issue. I don't think that Enicar was the kind of company that spend to much attention on individual requests for product alterations. But I surely would like to hear other opinions on my assumption.

And yes, a Super Jet is a real crowd pleaser, especially the early models


----------



## ppstore

Hi 
the ,GmT hands of all enicars are squared red ann black? Mainly all the jet graphs 
or the first series were in red?
i think that all GMT hands are squared? Aren't they?
regards


----------



## kazrich

ppstore said:


> Hi
> the ,GmT hands of all enicars are squared red ann black? Mainly all the jet graphs
> or the first series were in red?
> i think that all GMT hands are squared? Aren't they?
> regards


No, not all.
If you go back one page take a look at the earlier Super jet belonging to Vandervenus. It's not red, black or checkered red black.


----------



## ppstore

Hi
Let me rephrased the question
Are all the Gmt hands of the sherpa jet graph squared? Or they could be in red? 
My opinion is that all Gmt hands of the jet graph are squared , but I can be wrong. Is one for selling around here with a non squared gmt hand, and the seller says that is original????
regards


----------



## vandervenus

ppstore said:


> Hi
> Let me rephrased the question
> Are all the Gmt hands of the sherpa jet graph squared? Or they could be in red?
> My opinion is that all Gmt hands of the jet graph are squared , but I can be wrong. Is one for selling around here with a non squared gmt hand, and the seller says that is original????
> regards


I've seen non-squared GMT hands on Jets, SuperJets, Guides and Jet Graphs and they were all completely red. The ones I've seen looked authentic. If you have doubts than ask the seller for more pictures. Normally it is not hard to spot hands, lumedots and bezels that were repainted: they appear to be much fresher/newer than the rest of the dial or the cast.


----------



## ppstore

This wstch is now on Ebay


----------



## vandervenus

ppstore said:


> This wstch is now on Ebay


Isn't that the same watch that was sold earlier this week? Strange to see it listed again. It looks nice and authentic to me, but it is definitively not a bargain. Also, The bezel has some wear, the hands have lost their lume and the pushers show some dark spots. There was another Jet Graph this week on the Bay with an all black dial. That looked ourstanding, almost NOS. One thing is sure: Enicar prices are exploding...


----------



## Stigmata

The upward trend has been obvious for a while
. the v72s are launching out of the stratosphere.
Smart people were on these last decade ( unfortunately I'm not smart and continue to miss out on them)
The others like the ultra dives. Ops. Super dives.. Super jets and good condition guides or with unusual and rare configurations plus jets, divettes and GMTs etc will continue to have strong interest and appreciation.
I also think the fifties divers and heathways will begin the strong interest that deserve.


----------



## GhentWatch

vandervenus said:


> Isn't that the same watch that was sold earlier this week? Strange to see it listed again. It looks nice and authentic to me, but it is definitively not a bargain. Also, The bezel has some wear, the hands have lost their lume and the pushers show some dark spots. There was another Jet Graph this week on the Bay with an all black dial. That looked ourstanding, almost NOS. One thing is sure:* Enicar prices are exploding...*


And to be fair. I don't think an Enicar Graph should be worth more than a Heuer Autavia.

(The Heuers are rising but not as severe)


----------



## Stigmata

Pure elegance give me the Sherpa graph anytime...
But it's all personal


----------



## bobbee

Thought you guys might like these...

...1944-1975. Dates are in root record.


----------



## GhentWatch

bobbee said:


> Thought you guys might like these...
> 
> ...1944-1975. Dates are in root record.


Awesome Bobbee, Actually got a solid gold Enicar Ultrasonic Seapearl coming in that looks A LOT like those watches in the advert!


----------



## vandervenus

That is a great ad! I'm gonna try and do a remake with my own Graphomatic and Memostar in the near future. My wife is a photographer and she likes a challenge.


----------



## GhentWatch

The ads are a pretty close match for my Seapearl in 18K Gold. I haven't seen a lot off these in solid gold.










Probably going to sell this one as I don't wear dress-watches.


----------



## vandervenus

Guys, I just took a look at my Ultradive and it scared the hell out of me. There's a tiny piece of metal on the loose between the dial and the crystal. Don't know what the hell it is. The watch works fine: top crown operates the bezel and I can move the hands with the lower crown just fine. What can this be? I'm gonna let my watchmaker have a look, but suggestions of what could be wrong are appreciated.


----------



## kazrich

I believe it's a known and well respected Enicar 'complication'.
Once every 40 years the dial displays old Russian and American space debris orbiting the red Planet.


----------



## vandervenus

kazrich said:


> I believe it's a known and well respected Enicar 'complication'.
> Once every 40 years the dial displays old Russian and American space debris orbiting the red Planet.


That's OK with me. As long as no aliens show up. Don't wanna have to call the Men in Black.


----------



## hns-panama

That little fella is the case clamp, which means you may have a screw loose inside the case! Do not wear it. Handle with care and get it to your watch maker.



vandervenus said:


> Guys, I just took a look at my Ultradive and it scared the hell out of me. There's a tiny piece of metal on the loose between the dial and the crystal. Don't know what the hell it is. The watch works fine: top crown operates the bezel and I can move the hands with the lower crown just fine. What can this be? I'm gonna let my watchmaker have a look, but suggestions of what could be wrong are appreciated.
> 
> View attachment 5203530
> View attachment 5203538
> View attachment 5203554


----------



## vandervenus

Thank you good sir for the warning. I will get it to my watch guy this weekend. 
I wore it for 20 minutes before realising there was someyhing spooky behind the crystal. As far as I can judge, everything is functioning OK for now. Will transport with care.


----------



## vandervenus

Here's the first candidate for the contest Enicar Frankenwatch of the Year )









It's for sale on the Bay in case you're interested. This one will surely sell for an astronomous price, since it's a one of a kind.


----------



## AdamOfAus

Hi all,

Have wanted an Enicar for some time now and finally picked up an Automatic model from someone here in Australia (who had repackaged it from someone they bought it off in the states).

On the back is the usual bit and 125/001.

Came with a nasty "leather" strap and had ordered a Eulit nylon strap for a vintage Tudor of mine but instead fitted it to this Enicar. It is 16mm (suitable for the Tudor), so I am looking for another Eulit nylon strap in 18mm size.

I guess I've always been attracted to Enicar not being widely known in the English speaking world and that Saturn logo is quite cool too.

Watch is in pretty good nick and came up real nice after I gave it a polish. I will be looking to swap out the plexi-glass some time soon though.

I'd also like to have a watch maker give it a look over and service as the automatic rotor is actually audible inside if you give it a shake and listen carefully.


----------



## hns-panama

Nice pick up.

Frankly, I would just get some PolyWatch and polish the crystal. It looks nice enough and I have good results with mine.

You can start with a three-sided padded nail buffer with the second roughest side, then the final polishing side. Taking care not to polish the case. Tape should be used to cover the bezel and lugs.

After you polish with the buffer, use the PolyWatch. Works for me. 15 minutes and you are done.

By the way, if you have Brevet 314962 on the back, it is a Super Compressor case.

Enjoy.



AdamOfAus said:


> Hi all,
> 
> Have wanted an Enicar for some time now and finally picked up an Automatic model from someone here in Australia (who had repackaged it from someone they bought it off in the states).
> 
> On the back is the usual bit and 125/001.
> 
> Came with a nasty "leather" strap and had ordered a Eulit nylon strap for a vintage Tudor of mine but instead fitted it to this Enicar. It is 16mm (suitable for the Tudor), so I am looking for another Eulit nylon strap in 18mm size.
> 
> I guess I've always been attracted to Enicar not being widely known in the English speaking world and that Saturn logo is quite cool too.
> 
> Watch is in pretty good nick and came up real nice after I gave it a polish. I will be looking to swap out the plexi-glass some time soon though.
> 
> I'd also like to have a watch maker give it a look over and service as the automatic rotor is actually audible inside if you give it a shake and listen carefully.


----------



## AdamOfAus

hns-panama said:


> Nice pick up.
> 
> Frankly, I would just get some PolyWatch and polish the crystal. It looks nice enough and I have good results with mine.
> 
> You can start with a three-sided padded nail buffer with the second roughest side, then the final polishing side. Taking care not to polish the case. Tape should be used to cover the bezel and lugs.
> 
> After you polish with the buffer, use the PolyWatch. Works for me. 15 minutes and you are done.
> 
> By the way, if you have Brevet 314962 on the back, it is a Super Compressor case.
> 
> Enjoy.


Thanks for your response mate.

This watch has the G10 EPSA bit on the side of the case and as below on the case back, so pretty common kind of old Enicar I think. I like it all the same though. Genuine and unmolested (to my eyes).










Thanks for those tips on restoring the glass, I'll give it a go.

Cheers,
Adam


----------



## hns-panama

It appears you have a bayonet case back. I can see the "O" for open mark below the second "s" in Swiss. Super Compressor logo should be inside.

If I were you, I'd crack the case, get the movement serviced and while you are at it, pop out the crystal and give it a polish. You might consider using a Cape Cod Cloth on the case but you have to be extremely light in your polishing. Do not rub. Think of it as a baby's forehead. Soft...

The solution in the cloth will do a lot of the work. Be careful of the edges as you wipe.

Good luck.



AdamOfAus said:


> Thanks for your response mate.
> 
> This watch has the G10 EPSA bit on the side of the case and as below on the case back, so pretty common kind of old Enicar I think. I like it all the same though. Genuine and unmolested (to my eyes).
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks for those tips on restoring the glass, I'll give it a go.
> 
> Cheers,
> Adam


----------



## kazrich

Important recently unearthed horological history. I think we probably didn't need telling, but -----


----------



## vandervenus

After seeing the Enicar ads member Bobbee posted a week ago, I got excited and I found the original ad with the Graphomatic and Memostar. It was sold by an online shop in the USA that sells vintage clippings and magazine ads. This one is from 1973 and it was originally printed in a Swiss lifestyle magazine.

The cool thing about the ad is that the watches are depicted in the correct size. Scale 1/1. I took a photo of my Graphomatic next to the printed one 😀 Gonna toy around with it some more and think of a way to do the 'remake'.









It's too bad that vintage documentation on Enicar is almost non existant... I would really love to have the original brochures, print ads and in store materials.


----------



## FrenchKiss

https://boldwatches.wordpress.com/2015/05/23/enicar-sherpa-graph-classification-and-marks/

Sherpa graph classification


----------



## laikrodukas

Sorry for interrupting the sherpa fun 


















What caliber is this? :/


----------



## kazrich

Has the new owner of this very nice Graph paid a substantial premium for this watch 
because it has a box and original bracelet ?
It says ' reserved '. If the asking price ( or close to it ) was paid is this a record ( or a wind up )?

Enicar 1960s Sherpa Graph UNPOLISHED original band box 1st Owner for £4,530 for sale from a Trusted Seller on Chrono24


----------



## vandervenus

kazrich said:


> Has the new owner of this very nice Graph paid a substantial premium for this watch
> because it has a box and original bracelet ?
> It says ' reserved '. If the asking price ( or close to it ) was paid is this a record ( or a wind up )?
> 
> Enicar 1960s Sherpa Graph UNPOLISHED original band box 1st Owner for £4,530 for sale from a Trusted Seller on Chrono24


I was asking myself the same thing. I'm not sure what the price of a Sherpa Graph Mk IV is (thank you Boldwatches for classifying the different models), but I was on the hunt for a Jet Graph and Aqua Graph, and they were offered for more than €6.000. Both were in great condition, close to mint.
So, let's say this Sherpa Graph goes for the same amount. The premium for the box and bracelet would be €200. But who says they came with the watch originally? It's not difficult to find a nice vintage Enicar box and a bracelet on the Bay, right?

UPDATE: the Sherpa Graph is SOLD: http://www.exoticwatches.net/browse.asp?C=71&P=1


----------



## twelve199

Whoa - it would be nice to know what it sold for: asking is a touch over $7000 USD. It appears to be in wonderful condition. Agree with Vandervenus - a box & bracelet can be added - but it is listed as a 1 owner piece.


----------



## kazrich

Quick Saturday quiz before I go out.
Which watch is the odd man out ?


----------



## hns-panama

Top right.



kazrich said:


> Quick Saturday quiz before I go out.
> Which watch is the odd man out ?


----------



## kazrich

hns-panama said:


> Top right.


Nah


----------



## Watchmeister321

Beautiful watches. very good taste.


----------



## Sunday Rider

kazrich said:


> Nah


Top left! Only one without leather strap.


----------



## kazrich

Sunday Rider said:


> Top left! Only one without leather strap.


Spot on !!
Your a winner and a legend in your own lunchtime !


----------



## hns-panama

Nope.

The top right is not a Super Compressor case.



kazrich said:


> Nah


----------



## vandervenus

Hi guys,

I'm thinking of changing the subject op this immense thread to "to obsession of collecting vintage Enicar watches", for I've bought some heavyweights recently and the end is not in sight.

First, I got my hands on a OPS (second generation I guess) that looks absolutely new. Well, it was in a vault for god knows how long, so that might be the reason. It's got a full black PVD case and minty dial and hands. It was love at first sight. Here's a pic:








Second, I won a 'best offer' auction on a Jet Graph. It was from a seller I already bought from, so that gave me confidence. The outer bezel of this Jet Graph is a bit on the rough side, but the digits are still very well readable. Also, the red pointer is in nice condition. There are a couple of oddities: the pointer is tent shaped in stead of house shaped. I only came across one other Jet Graph with a tent shaped pointer, so I think it's authentic. The GMT hand is a slim red needle in stead of the well known red/black checkered hand. I have seen this variation on several other Enicar models, but never before on a Jet Graph. The seller assured me that everything is 100% original. I have no reason to doubt him. I guess this particular example has some rare variation, which makes it extra special I suppose  The Valjoux 72 movement is nothing less than a treat. It runs soooo smooth!








Since I've been spending like a madmen, I have to let go a couple of my Enicars... I'm selling my Ocean Pearl chrono, Valjoux 72 and possibly my Grapho-Matic. It hurts like hell, but is a sore consequence of The Obsession of Collecting Vintage Enicar Watches ;-) If anyone is interested, I listed both in the Sales section. Cheers!


----------



## WatchFred

wonderful pieces, congrats.
yes, it is an obsession, I'm afraid


----------



## ch.lauterbach

Nice Enicars! I think the GTM Hand of the JetGraph is not original!


----------



## vandervenus

ch.lauterbach said:


> Nice Enicars! I think the GTM Hand of the JetGraph is not original!


Can you explain why you think so? I've seen this variation on Super Jets too, more than once.


----------



## DaBaeker

vandervenus said:


> Can you explain why you think so? I've seen this variation on Super Jets too, more than once.


The GMT hands are usually a bit thicker some with a unique chequered pattern on them and some plan. I've seen some Personally, I havent seen a 24hr hand on a Jet this thin but then I only recently became interested in the brand. I would be glad to know if this variation is legit as I may have passed over a few examples thinking the hand was incorrect.


----------



## ch.lauterbach

Yes on the old Version of the SuperJet or the Jet you see sometimes the thin gmt Hands but usually only painted on the tip. On a JetGraph even the older models with the "lolipop second Hand" the GMT is thicker and with checkered pattern. This is the reason why I think this Variation is okay for Jet or Superjet but not original for JetGraph. Chris


----------



## vandervenus

DaBaeker said:


> The GMT hands are usually a bit thicker some with a unique chequered pattern on them and some plan. I've seen some Personally, I havent seen a 24hr hand on a Jet this thin but then I only recently became interested in the brand. I would be glad to know if this variation is legit as I may have passed over a few examples thinking the hand was incorrect.


Did you pass over more Jet Graphs with the same GMT hand as mine? That may prove that the hand is original after all. 
Oh well, I'm happy with this Enicar. And how knows I might buy a Guide for parts or repair and replace it in the future.


----------



## vandervenus

ch.lauterbach said:


> Yes on the old Version of the SuperJet or the Jet you see sometimes the thin gmt Hands but usually only painted on the tip. On a JetGraph even the older models with the "lolipop second Hand" the GMT is thicker and with checkered pattern. This is the reason why I think this Variation is okay for Jet or Superjet but not original for JetGraph. Chris


Hi Chris,
Thanks for your reply. I did see an identical GMT hand on a Sherpa Guide once or twice. The thing is, I find it hard to believe that the rest of the watch, including hands, is original and the GMT hand is not. The only explanation would be that this is a complete frankenwatch, build on an existing case an movement with possibly a new dial and sought together hands. I'm not saying it's impossible, but I find it very unlikely.


----------



## kolakk

WOW! Congrats!


----------



## Sunday Rider

I think this thread is the reason that Enicar watch prices are going through the roof! But that is good and bad I guess.


----------



## kazrich

vandervenus said:


> Hi guys,
> 
> I'm thinking of changing the subject op this immense thread to "to obsession of collecting vintage Enicar watches", for I've bought some heavyweights recently and the end is not in sight.
> 
> First, I got my hands on a OPS (second generation I guess) that looks absolutely new. Well, it was in a vault for god knows how long, so that might be the reason. It's got a full black PVD case and minty dial and hands. It was love at first sight. Here's a pic:
> View attachment 5595673
> 
> 
> Second, I won a 'best offer' auction on a Jet Graph. It was from a seller I already bought from, so that gave me confidence. The outer bezel of this Jet Graph is a bit on the rough side, but the digits are still very well readable. Also, the red pointer is in nice condition. There are a couple of oddities: the pointer is tent shaped in stead of house shaped. I only came across one other Jet Graph with a tent shaped pointer, so I think it's authentic. The GMT hand is a slim red needle in stead of the well known red/black checkered hand. I have seen this variation on several other Enicar models, but never before on a Jet Graph. The seller assured me that everything is 100% original. I have no reason to doubt him. I guess this particular example has some rare variation, which makes it extra special I suppose  The Valjoux 72 movement is nothing less than a treat. It runs soooo smooth!
> View attachment 5595801
> 
> 
> Since I've been spending like a madmen, I have to let go a couple of my Enicars... I'm selling my Ocean Pearl chrono, Valjoux 72 and possibly my Grapho-Matic. It hurts like hell, but is a sore consequence of The Obsession of Collecting Vintage Enicar Watches ;-) If anyone is interested, I listed both in the Sales section. Cheers!


Stunning, beautiful watches !!

DON'T DUMP THAT SECOND HAND ON THE JET GRAPH.
Just because you can't see it on Google, doesn't mean that it's not original.
I've just taken another fix for my 314962 habit o| sniff sniff 
The latest fix also had a second hand that I assumed was incorrect because I couldn't find a Google image. It came with the original 
instruction book and it transpires that the owner was correct in insisting that it was original. He should know, as he was given the watch from new !

Bit busy just now but will explain soon.

BTW Vandervenus am I correct in taking a very wild guess that you might possibly be from Holland ?
It's just, I can't help but notice the

Orange highlights on your trainers
Orange highlight on your NATO
Orange second hand on the OPS
Orange second hand on the Jet Graph
Orange hand on the Jet Graph minute register

Or perhaps you just enjoy eating oranges ?

Whatever, 2 orangeinal additions to your collection !


----------



## Stigmata

Quite a few enicar threads on the net especially from Europe. The brand has been rediscovered.
I must also withdraw a statement where i said the 165/7 movement was on a black date
There are many with a red date.
Though the 145/7 are always red . The 125/7 always black.


----------



## Stigmata

Quite a few enicar threads on the net especially from Europe. The brand has been rediscovered.
I must also withdraw a statement where i said the 165/7 movement was on a black date
There are many with a red date.
Though the 145/7 are always red . The 125/7 always black.


----------



## vandervenus

kazrich said:


> Stunning, beautiful watches !!
> 
> DON'T DUMP THAT SECOND HAND ON THE JET GRAPH.
> Just because you can't see it on Google, doesn't mean that it's not original.
> I've just taken another fix for my 314962 habit o| sniff sniff
> The latest fix also had a second hand that I assumed was incorrect because I couldn't find a Google image. It came with the original
> instruction book and it transpires that the owner was correct in insisting that it was original. He should know, as he was given the watch from new !
> 
> Bit busy just now but will explain soon.
> 
> BTW Vandervenus am I correct in taking a very wild guess that you might possibly be from Holland ?
> It's just, I can't help but notice the
> 
> Orange highlights on your trainers
> Orange highlight on your NATO
> Orange second hand on the OPS
> Orange second hand on the Jet Graph
> Orange hand on the Jet Graph minute register
> 
> Or perhaps you just enjoy eating oranges ?
> 
> Whatever, 2 orangeinal additions to your collection !


You guessed right: I'm from Holland. And to celebrate that, I just added this Guide to the collection ?








It's not that I'm a huge patriot. I like my Enicars seventies style, with lots of glamrockin' metal and wild tangerine colors ???


----------



## kazrich

All to often many of us ( me included ) see a watch and think, wrong this incorrect that or worse still , that's a Franken. Here'e a cautionary little tale. 
I recently secured another Sherpa Graph to fix my unfortunate 314962 habit. I had two minor reservations regarding the purchase.
1. The tacky old box was inscribed ' Star Jewels '.
2. The red tipped second hand couldn't be correct ? so I figured I would need to source another one.
It transpired that the vendor had owned the watch from new and it was given to him in 1966 as a gift. It came from an Enicar dealer in
Kingston Surrey, across the road from Bentalls Dept Store. He wore it frequently, but then decided to use smaller watches as he thought the 
40 mm case was too large. He assured me that everything was totally original. The deal had already been agreed so it was not necessary for him to 
embellish his story.
Inside the lid of the box was a pleasant surprise - An original little instruction manual written in English - not seen one of those before. 
I had always presumed that any Sherpa would have come in a fancy box. Wrong again - It's constructed of cardboard with embossed white wallpaper currently
being held together with vintage sellotape :think:





Never mind, the magic box also contained the pups nuts !!! 





Here's the booklet





The black and white life sized image of the watch in the booklet showed that the second's hand is probably correct. It's needle shaped and the tip is darker than the rest.


I eventually stumbled across an earlier model with a similar but orange tipped hand.



I'm sure that many Sherpa's have been sold with the nearest Generic Enicar box to hand. The correct manual would have then been stuffed into the lid. The manual is
just fractionally tight for the lid to ensure that it didn't drop out and get lost.
Can't remember what the point of this post was, but here's a pic of it getting to know the 1969 Graph


----------



## Ard

That's a beautiful Enicar, my triple date moon phase says hi


----------



## Hessu

Saw this Enicar at sales site bidding closing and not a single bid. I got it for 34€. It looks pretty basic, but it's beauty is just that!
Dial is a glossy enamel paint job and the hands are dark blue. Original logo-crown. A big case, 35mm at crown level, big lugs make the big granpa feel.























It has in house cal 161.














The strap is Hirsch Rally, the old version.


----------



## vandervenus

kazrich said:


> All to often many of us ( me included ) see a watch and think, wrong this incorrect that or worse still , that's a Franken. Here'e a cautionary little tale.
> I recently secured another Sherpa Graph to fix my unfortunate 314962 habit. I had two minor reservations regarding the purchase.
> 1. The tacky old box was inscribed ' Star Jewels '.
> 2. The red tipped second hand couldn't be correct ? so I figured I would need to source another one.
> It transpired that the vendor had owned the watch from new and it was given to him in 1966 as a gift. It came from an Enicar dealer in
> Kingston Surrey, across the road from Bentalls Dept Store. He wore it frequently, but then decided to use smaller watches as he thought the
> 40 mm case was too large. He assured me that everything was totally original. The deal had already been agreed so it was not necessary for him to
> embellish his story.
> Inside the lid of the box was a pleasant surprise - An original little instruction manual written in English - not seen one of those before.
> I had always presumed that any Sherpa would have come in a fancy box. Wrong again - It's constructed of cardboard with embossed white wallpaper currently
> being held together with vintage sellotape


What a fantastic story and what a unbelievable find! It proves that the images you see on Google don't are the last word in what is authentic and what not.


----------



## WatchFred

@kazrich: superb addition, congratulations !


----------



## FrenchKiss

For info, Vintage Enicar Sherpa 300 Aquagraph Watch Rare Chronograph Diver Valjoux 72 | eBay


----------



## KP-99

I am enjoying my nice Enicar Super Dive:

























Best regards,
Peter


----------



## kazrich

Lovely watch Peter !!
My Super Divette says Hello.
These dials change from light gold to copper gold depending on the light.


----------



## vandervenus

FrenchKiss said:


> For info, Vintage Enicar Sherpa 300 Aquagraph Watch Rare Chronograph Diver Valjoux 72 | eBay


Now on the Bay: a broken Aquadive without crown and pusher and an Ultradive with SuperDive dial and incomplete set of hands. Both will grab a small fortune.


----------



## GhentWatch

vandervenus said:


> Now on the Bay:Ultradive with SuperDive dial .


To add to the above discussion about 'correctness'

This appears to have been a mistake made in the Enicar factories. As my example came from the first owner who had nothing to lose by telling me this. Never serviced so I doubt it had another dial fitted.


----------



## kazrich

GhentWatch said:


> To add to the above discussion about 'correctness'
> 
> This appears to have been a mistake made in the Enicar factories. As my example came from the first owner who had nothing to lose by telling me this. Never serviced so I doubt it had another dial fitted.


Don't ask me to quote where I read it, but I seem to remember reading that The Polish Navy commissioned Enicar UltraDives with SuperDive written on the dials. I think it had something to do with laws or taxes
at the time, but they were proper Ultradive watches. Or maybe Enicar didn't want to sell exactly the same watch to the military, thinking that might dilute their brand, so they changed it slightly ?


----------



## KP-99

Nice patina. I love such dials!
Great Divette |>


----------



## vandervenus

I have no doubts that your Ultradive is an authentic watch, even with the Superdive dial. At least you have a complete set of hands and two signed crowns. Point is, incomplete Enicars grab more money nowadays than other brands in mint condition.


----------



## Royston Berwick

Hi,I have just put an image of a Enicar watch on Watchseekers,I am trying to find out more about the unusual logo at the bottom.I have had a few replies but knowbody seems to know.I have checked the dial with a jewelers loup and it is definately an original (not a repainted Indian one),also bought from a guy in England whose father died a couple of years ago and has quite a collection of quality Swiss watches including Rolex Omega etc,this is the first watch he has sold so far and does not know any history apart from it was one of his fathers favourites.John Ms put me in touch with you saying you may be able to help.I do have quite a selection of watches but this one is facinating me.If you can help in any way I would be most grateful,sorry I have gone on a bit!.Kind Regards Roy.


----------



## GhentWatch

kazrich said:


> Don't ask me to quote where I read it, but I seem to remember reading that The Polish Navy commissioned Enicar UltraDives with SuperDive written on the dials. I think it had something to do with laws or taxes
> at the time, but they were proper Ultradive watches. Or maybe Enicar didn't want to sell exactly the same watch to the military, thinking that might dilute their brand, so they changed it slightly ?


Could be. Or just a later piece with some leftover stock.

I think mine was bought in '66 by the first owner. Who was a professional diver in the mediterranean and later moved to Belgium.


----------



## kazrich

Royston Berwick said:


> View attachment 5724978
> Hi,I have just put an image of a Enicar watch on Watchseekers,I am trying to find out more about the unusual logo at the bottom.I have had a few replies but knowbody seems to know.I have checked the dial with a jewelers loup and it is definitely an original (not a repainted Indian one),also bought from a guy in England whose father died a couple of years ago and has quite a collection of quality Swiss watches including Rolex Omega etc,this is the first watch he has sold so far and does not know any history apart from it was one of his fathers favourites.John Ms put me in touch with you saying you may be able to help.I do have quite a selection of watches but this one is facinating me.If you can help in any way I would be most grateful,sorry I have gone on a bit!.Kind Regards Roy.


Hi Royston and welcome. I'm pretty sure that the watch didn't leave the factory with that logo. No serious manufacturer would want to dilute their brand by affiliating themselves with other organisations. 
However, a couple of years ago I owned an Enicar with a FAPLA script and yellow logo on the dial. FAPLA was a 1970's military army fighting for the liberation of Angola. I wouldn't have thought that Enicar 
would want anything to do with showing support or bias for any ones military ambitions. I guess that the army bought some stocks and had a local watchmaker stamp them up. The watch is similar to the post on page 111
by Hessu.
I would imagine that your watch might have been stamped up for possibly Mason's, clubs or any organization really. It's a very unusual logo but I don't think it has anything much to do with the watch.
Is it a swan turning back to pluck it's feathers ?


----------



## vandervenus

Interesting logo on that Enicar. Could be a swan, like Kazrich assumed. I instantly tought of a fountainpen, or a postoffice. Perhaps it's from a custom made batch ordered by a company for their business relations or personnel.


----------



## twelve199

c1966 Enicar Sherpa Graph looking dashing on her bespoke white rally strap!


----------



## kazrich

That's a beauty Twelve199. I always used to think that some of the dials on Sherpa Graphs were replacement or redials because they looked too good to be true.
I now think that the tight EPSA cases keep them looking like new if they have been kept out of the sun. Even the multi coloured tritium lume keeps it'd shape.
I was looking at my own under intense magnification to identify the colour scheme. 
I see the colours on my own watch like this.
Applied hour markers - Look a bit like Monopoly houses and are gold with a thick white roof on top.
The feet in front of the markers are creamy peach
The paddles on the hour and minute hands are lemon
The tips of the paddles are orange

This is all making me hungry, so I shall find a biscuit or ---------- eat the watch


----------



## GUTuna




----------



## wongerik

Hi friends, would anyone know where to get a winding stem for the enicar sherpa graph that measures 1.16mm in diameter?

Thanks 
Erik


----------



## vandervenus

Gentlemen, I have a replacement bezel coming in for my Jet Graph. It's not new, but a definitive improvement over the current one. I like to replace it myself and would appreciate some pointers. Can the bezel be 'popped off' by using a small screwdriver of knife? Is there a risk that this might bend or break the red ring or pointer? Or should I just take it straight away to the watchmaker? Thanks in advance for your suggestions.


----------



## GhentWatch

vandervenus said:


> Gentlemen, I have a replacement bezel coming in for my Jet Graph. It's not new, but a definitive improvement over the current one. I like to replace it myself and would appreciate some pointers. Can the bezel be 'popped off' by using a small screwdriver of knife? Is there a risk that this might bend or break the red ring or pointer? Or should I just take it straight away to the watchmaker? Thanks in advance for your suggestions.


What are you going to do with the old one? I have a Jet Graph coming in which might benefit from your bezel.


----------



## vandervenus

GhentWatch said:


> What are you going to do with the old one? I have a Jet Graph coming in which might benefit from your bezel.


Sure, I think we can work somerhing out! But first I'm gonna try not to mess up the swapping of the bezels ;-)

Is your new Jet Graph by any chance the one that was on Timezone this week? If so, that bezel is not a total loss, a few dents aside.


----------



## Akkorn

My first Enicar, but certainly not my last. 29 cents at a local thrift store & running!


----------



## Sunday Rider

Hello Akkorn, great find and what a bargain. I love that design and that dial. Those Duraluminium cases are light and fragile, sometimes they feel like they are plastic, and the gold tone peels off them, just be careful with them. I have 2 or 3 of those cases, and each is very unique and I love them! Congratulations!


----------



## Stigmata

Kind of twists off if it's like the guide.
Some are tighter than others.
I'd let the watchmaker do it V.
Cheers


----------



## Phranz

[email protected] Sherpa Graph experts!

I have seen this dial, but never in combination with such hands.
What do you think about? 
Could it be legit?

thx for any help on this
Franz


----------



## kazrich

Could be OK.
I've not seen a white dial later ( 1968 / 69 ) panda dialed Graph.
The hours,minutes and second hand look the same graphite / black material.
The white dial has ' cut into ' the 3 registers in a way that I have not seen before.
The slightly smaller size registers and lume markers without ' feet ' and the lighter grey tachy scale are also in keeping with a later Graph.
Enicar made many variations on the Sherpa Graph dial and this might be one of the later options - and a rarity ?
Do you have images of the case back and most important, the Val 72 movement ?


----------



## laikrodukas

Maybe they are correct but the lume is different(from hour markers) or gone?


----------



## kazrich

The closest late Graph's I can find with a white dial are





Neither appear to have much , if any lume on the hands.

It could be, that late in the models production run that the dial designers were instructed to make a minimalist subtle stainless steel , stark white and black with minimal lume version ?
Or maybe someone with too much time on their hands has been playing with Photoshop ?
Either way, I think that watch on a satin beads of rice bracelet would have looked rather nice in the shop in the late 60's / early 70's.
Not sure if those ' cheese sections ' cutting into the chrono dials are possibly a trick of the light ? as they are not uniformly spaced. 
I quite like it.


----------



## vandervenus

The seller of that Graph states it is NOS. It appears to be a new seller with only 7 feedbackscore on the 'Bay. The design of the dial in combination with the hands is stunning I think.

Saw a great and rare variation of a white dial Super Jet on Instagram a short while ago. Looks like a NOS too. It makes me wonder what else could be in the vaults of NOS sellers.


----------



## kazrich

Are you guys operating on the so called ' Dark Web ' and does ebay have a site there ? cos I can't see it on ebay worldwide search. Do you have a link ?


----------



## vandervenus

kazrich said:


> Are you guys operating on the so called ' Dark Web ' and does ebay have a site there ? cos I can't see it on ebay worldwide search. Do you have a link ?


The seller is located in Germany. This is the link I used:
Vintage Enicar Sherpa Kaliber 726 Valjoux ! (NOS - New Old Stock) 1969 / 40 mm !

He put up only two pictures. I trust the movement will be fine, but I would definitively want to see more close ups of the dial.


----------



## Phranz

Thanks @ all for your considerations!

I am very curious what the winning bid will be for that one.....


----------



## roccosiffredi

wonderful....!!!


----------



## twelve199

Pics of case from seller.

Have not seen hands before - but they fit really well and match the indicies in size & design.

If this thing is truly a later Sherpa Graph in NOS condition in this rare configuration we are all going to be kicking ourselves for not jumping on it.

Pics suck but that's what the dude sent.


----------



## twelve199

The case back of the eBay watch also appears to be in incredible shape from bad pics.

Seller seems helpful but the pics are not great.


----------



## vandervenus

twelve199 said:


> The case back of the eBay watch also appears to be in incredible shape from bad pics.
> 
> Seller seems helpful but the pics are not great.


These pics are virtually worthless. The only thing they show is an unscratched case. We need close-ups of the dial and hands and at least a shot of the movement. It's a big risk to buy it since nobody on this forum has ever seen this configuration. On the other hand, it might be a unique opportunity to add a grail watch to the collection.


----------



## twelve199

Totally agree. I am beginning to feel similar to other posts here - that it is very late in the production, probably toward the end and that's why the hands differ from others. Also agree - it's either a very well presented "put together" or it's an absolute Grail Sherpa Graph that we will kick ourselves for not jumping on it. The seller insists its NOS & original. Wish the pics were better & wish we could see the Movt as well



vandervenus said:


> These pics are virtually worthless. The only thing they show is an unscratched case. We need close-ups of the dial and hands and at least a shot of the movement. It's a big risk to buy it since nobody on this forum has ever seen this configuration. On the other hand, it might be a unique opportunity to add a grail watch to the collection.


----------



## twelve199

Meanwhile, let's enjoy a beautiful Thursday! Let's see everyone's wrist game today!


----------



## Phranz

Well, the above discussed very attractive Sherpa Graph was sold for 4810€ (USD 5120.-)

I was bidding on it but did not get it .....

Maybe I was wrong in my judgement, that a 4th generation piece is not as desirable as an earlier one?

But it feels right for me and I do not feel any regrets and have to say
congratulations to whoever owns this outstanding piece now!

And the best thing is, the hunting, which I feel is the most fun part in this weird passion can go on, as a winning bid for me would have been actually a little bit insane, best to say about *grin*

regards Franz


----------



## kazrich

I am almost certain that I have seen a later early 70's version of a Graph with a typical 70's style case but not in that colour.


----------



## vandervenus

Wow, €4810... that's a big sum, though I seem to remember there was a Buy It Now price of €5.500 before the first bid got in. By the way, that first bid was done by me. I liked this Graph a lot, but I was not 100% convinced it was all authentic. 
Phranz makes a point on the level of desirability of the four generations of Graphs. It would be fun to found out if there are large differences in market prices


----------



## vandervenus

Sorry... double post.


----------



## MMMD

A recent addition, thankfully complete with thick, _introvabile_ acrylic crystal.



















Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## vandervenus

Check this out: it's an Enicar Sherpa Super Jet Dive! If you want it you can make an offer on the 'Bay ;-)


----------



## kazrich

I need to lie down.
I can't get the sound of sirens and bells out of my head !


----------



## Jonedwards2010

I can't seem to upload pics, but was wondering if anyone knows anything about the enicar I picked up at a thrift store...it is identified as 1064-12-CR on the back. Duraluminum is under that type. Thanks!


----------



## Trash_Gordon

My new one. Enicar Sherpa DD 600 (i know there is a spot on the dial :roll: )


----------



## Danny4

Does anybody know where i can source another crystal? This one has some crazing.


----------



## hns-panama

Write Chris and ask if he still has one.

Enicar Plexi Glass Reference 148 35 02 332mm Diameter | eBay



Danny4 said:


> Does anybody know where i can source another crystal? This one has some crazing.
> 
> View attachment 6300666


----------



## Danny4

hns-panama said:


> Write Chris and ask if he still has one.
> 
> Enicar Plexi Glass Reference 148 35 02 332mm Diameter | eBay


Thanks! I'm waiting for an answer from him.

There is also someone on the bay selling the entire case plus plexi NOS, but that's not really what i want, but maybe the only option.

http://www.ebay.nl/itm/ENICAR-Sherp...523888?hash=item1a09cc26b0:g:2xoAAOxy63FS26S0

What do you think, would that devaluate the watch?


----------



## hns-panama

Peter's cases apparently have the later rounded edge crystals versus the older style having straighter sides.

Your call as to what you want.

Yes, value is affected to some extent but keep the original with the watch if you sell it.

Warning, whatever you do, be real careful about that tension ring. Don't lose it and your watchmaker needs to know that it holds that rotating bezel in place so you can't just clamp it down with a cystal press.



Danny4 said:


> Thanks! I'm waiting for an answer from him.
> 
> There is also someone on the bay selling the entire case plus plexi NOS, but that's not really what i want, but maybe the only option.
> 
> ENICAR-Sherpa-Jet - Uhrgehäuse (g/s) | eBay
> 
> What do you think, would that devaluate the watch?


----------



## Danny4

thanks for your reply.

I think i'm going to pass on that NOS case. Rather just have a new plexi and keep the vintage look. 

I'll tell my watchmaker about the tension ring when i bring the watch in for servicing.


----------



## kazrich

For me It's been an expensive last quarter in 2015. This Sherpa 314962 lark gets more and more costly, so Iv'e started a mini collection ( er --- 2 to be precise ) of 1960's Aquastar's.
Nobody's heard of them either, but it shows I'm not a watch snob and I prefer to back a worthy underdog. 
We all suffer from the same addiction on this thread so enjoy Christmas ( Is it still legal to call it that, or does that now offend someone somewhere ?) and all the best for the new year.
My Sherpa's are already sloshed by the looks of it and I haven't even introduced them to the Aquastar's yet. :-d


----------



## vandervenus

Best wishes to you too, and thanks for that jolly picture &#55357;&#56842; Your Enicars are stunning, especially the copper colored Divette.


----------



## vandervenus

Just like Kazrich I expirenced an expensive fourth quarter of 2015. I managed to get my hands on a nice Ultradive (had two in the past, but they both had to make room for other Enicars), an all black dial Aquagraph and a very close to mint Jet Graph.

Here's a sneak peek of the Jet Graph:

View attachment 6401569


----------



## kazrich

Fantastic, clean and rare Jet Graph vandervenus. Stunning looking watch.


----------



## Molliedooker

Think you might be looking in wrong area if they have never heard of aquastar. Try dive and yacht forums.


----------



## twelve199

Merry Christmas & Happy Holidays fellow Enicar aficionados 🏽 our latest.


----------



## Giotime

I am trying to get a beginners knowledge of vintage Enicar. Is there a source I can go to that will list all available models and history. Model names and types seems confusing to me to just follow the thread. Trying to find listing of entry level ( least sophisticated) to most advanced (call it either most sophisticated or most desirable or collectible).?


----------



## kazrich

Giotime said:


> I am trying to get a beginners knowledge of vintage Enicar. Is there a source I can go to that will list all available models and history. Model names and types seems confusing to me to just follow the thread. Trying to find listing of entry level ( least sophisticated) to most advanced (call it either most sophisticated or most desirable or collectible).?


Well Giotime, can't you ask an easy question like
' Whats the meaning of life ' ?
This thread is the fountain of all Enicar knowledge , and if you allocate just 15 minutes a day to the thread starting on page one , all will be revealed ------ by March 2022.

Alternatively one of our resident experts hns panama wrote this brilliant and instructive piece for ebay ---- Well worth reading.

Enicar Watch Buyer's Guide | eBay

All Enicar watches are well made, but collectors tend to go for the EPSA Super Compressor cased Sherpa models.
Always ask here for advice before buying anything Enicar. We promise not to ' nick ' your prospective purchase whether it's £ 6 or £ 6000


----------



## Giotime

Lol. I did sorta realize that I was asking for the answer to Life, the Universe and Everything. And I was looking for a shortcut to enlightenment. You did a good job to get me started. Thanks.


----------



## vandervenus

In addition to Kazrichs comment I would advice to visit Instagram and search for 'Enicar' or 'Enicarsherpa'. You will find the most popular models, collections and collectors fast. It's an easy way to spot the models of your taste. I posted a pic or two myself &#55357;&#56841;


----------



## vandervenus

My new and minty Jet Graph is off to the spa for a full service. The chrono didn't properly reset to zero, which is not a surprise for a watch that was hardly worn in 46 years.

In the meanwhile I'm wearing this awesome Aquagraph that I bought from a Japanese seller. I love the all black dial. Makes it look bold and meannnnnn


----------



## kazrich

Two nice and unusual Aqua Graph's from twelve 199 & vandervenus - A silver / gold ( or is it white ? ) and all black.
Just In case you haven't seen this about the Aqua Graph

https://boldwatches.wordpress.com/2015/09/11/enicar-aqua-graph-1967/

And a prototype worn by a current racing driver

https://boldwatches.wordpress.com/2015/10/08/enicar-aqua-graph-prototipo-monza1967/

Interesting that Enicar rates the water resistance of the Aqua Graph at 325 ft, yet my latest acquisition ( Aquastar Deepstar ) always
claimed to be the worlds first production chronograph with a genuine static water depth rating of 10 atmospheres which is 330 ft. ( slightly more than the height of Big Ben )








Aquastar only started manufacturing watches in 1962, and I think the earliest Deepstar dates from about 1964 / 65 .
Does anyone know when the first Enicar Aqua Graph was produced ?


----------



## Phranz

sorry, erroneously posted, and do not know how to get rid of the foto o|


----------



## kazrich

This apparently comes from a 1970 Japanese or Chinese watch catalogue . Any idea what the middle top watch is ?
I think it either says Sherpa or Aqua Graph, but what's with the black plain unscripted plastic bezel ?
And, is that a small winding crown at 9 O clock ? 
I believe that the Sherpa line was considered too expensive for the Chinese home market. The bottom right watch looks like
Western market Sherpa Graph, but possibly a bit smaller and cheaper ?
We should be told.


----------



## Danny4

still looking for a replacement crystal for my enicar sherpa jet. anyone any ideas where i can find one?


----------



## vandervenus

kazrich said:


> This apparently comes from a 1970 Japanese or Chinese watch catalogue . Any idea what the middle top watch is ?
> I think it either says Sherpa or Aqua Graph, but what's with the black plain unscripted plastic bezel ?
> And, is that a small winding crown at 9 O clock ?
> I believe that the Sherpa line was considered too expensive for the Chinese home market. The bottom right watch looks like
> Western market Sherpa Graph, but possibly a bit smaller and cheaper ?
> We should be told.


Hi Kazrich,
I have some more pages from that brochure, but the quality isn't much better. I think the watch in the middle top is an Aquagraph. The outer bezel is black and the numbers are printed in a tiny font, in silver-gray. The pressing quality of seventies brochures is not good enough for such small details.
My guess is that the one on the lower richt is a non-Sherpa chrono, Valjoux 72. I've seen an all black dial version of that one recently. Very nice watch with a 36mm case.


----------



## Stigmata

That's hot! Gorgeous and I know you love those stick hands.
Happy new year mate!
Happy new year all!


----------



## philt68

what a total and UTTER disaster! i've been bitten by the enicar bug hard! please can someone sell me all the sherpas they own at a bargain price?  i did manage to get my grubby mitts on a mint super divette, but that has just made things worse...where can i find more of these magnificent beasts?


----------



## philt68

i almost forgot-the watch that got me started, purchased last week! i know, i know, i'm late to the party..


----------



## kazrich

Very nice Enicar.
No cure I'm afraid - you're heading for credit card meltdown.


----------



## vandervenus

philt68 said:


> i almost forgot-the watch that got me started, purchased last week! i know, i know, i'm late to the party..
> 
> View attachment 6618258


Hi Phil, congrats on your beautiful Divette. You own a model that I never had in my collection, so I'm actually a bit jealous. 
For the rest: be prepared to sell your car, wife and kidney to pay for your Enicar hunt...


----------



## Neeko

I have a bit of a puzzler for you: I picked this up a couple of weeks ago, cleaned and serviced prior to my purchase. The dial has Enicar and the case back has Eterna. I have no pic of the movement (yet) but when I do I will post it here. Comments on my (dual) brand watch? BTW, the serial on the caseback puts it at about 1946 build date. Don't know if the caseback was from another watch or?


----------



## hns-panama

Okay Enicar experts, I am stuck restoring a "Rubyrotor" automatic rotor for an 1124/25/26 movement. Any ideas on where I might find parts and or at least the part numbers? Borel and the usual suspects show the ball bearing parts.


----------



## SFoskett

My Divette looks a lot like yours, philt68! But mine has this contrasting face that brings out the deep black ring.










I liked it so much I picked up this Star to keep it company!


----------



## vandervenus

Neeko said:


> I have a bit of a puzzler for you: I picked this up a couple of weeks ago, cleaned and serviced prior to my purchase. The dial has Enicar and the case back has Eterna. I have no pic of the movement (yet) but when I do I will post it here. Comments on my (dual) brand watch? BTW, the serial on the caseback puts it at about 1946 build date. Don't know if the caseback was from another watch or?


While I'm not an expert on Enicars from the fourties and fifties, I would say you got yourself a nice frankenwatch. Obviously the dial and caseback don't match. But I wouldn't be surprised if the set of hands is from a non-Enicar source too. Enicar produced enormous amounts of low priced, good quality watches for the Asian market and this is one of them. If it has an Enicar signed movement, you can enjoy the watch for many years to come.


----------



## Neeko

vandervenus said:


> While I'm not an expert on Enicars from the fourties and fifties, I would say you got yourself a nice frankenwatch. Obviously the dial and caseback don't match. But I wouldn't be surprised if the set of hands is from a non-Enicar source too. Enicar produced enormous amounts of low priced, good quality watches for the Asian market and this is one of them. If it has an Enicar signed movement, you can enjoy the watch for many years to come.


Thank you (Dankie) for your reply and this information, I thought as much after more research. I will try and get a pic of the movement and can hopefully solve this mystery. Frankenwatch or something else, I am already enjoying this watch, it runs great.
Thanks again.


----------



## Danny4

I've read somewhere that the lip nautic ski crystal might also fit the enicar sherpa jet.

Does anyone know this?

This lip nautic ski crystal is a super compressor watch with a 333mm crystal. The sherpa jet has a 332mm crystal.

Here are the replacement crystals.

Replacement Crystal Glass Verre Plastic FOR LIP Nautic SKI | eBay


----------



## hns-panama

I've heard the same thing though I have two observations.

First, the tension ring is the key aside from the diameter. A qualified watchmaker can put that thick crystal on a lathe and reduce the diameter in no time. That's a plus for those old crystals. You can buff them out for many years...

Second, the Enicar tension ring fitment into the LIP. Have the watchmaker look at that deal. The ring holds the rotating bezel in place so the fit is critical.


----------



## jlo3

Hello, new poster here

I've recently come across this Ocean Pearl (?) Enicar watch

















Markings on the back read

144/39/06

What do these particular numbers mean?

Also as you can see from the images, it's in quite a sorry state. 2/3 of the arms have fallen off, but mechanically it still works! I gave it a light shake to wind it up and it still ticks away.

How should I go about restoring this watch? Or should I let a professional do the job...?


----------



## laikrodukas

If You have to ask then yes pass it to professional


----------



## hns-panama

Professional!

You need the right tools to open the case, reset the hands, and the list goes on... Welcome to the wonderful world of Enicar.

See here for the numbers:

Enicar Watch Buyer's Guide | eBay

What you have is a 1145 caliber movement inside of an Ocean Pearl case as indicated by the 144 on the back. Suggest spending a bit of time reading through and getting to know what you are dealing with. You can begin by giving yourself a pat on the back for choosing as terrific looking watch. The dial is killer. Well worth saving this one. Perhaps not in money but in having a keepsake or just plain appreciation of Enicar's art.

As for the case, you have two options. First, have the professional clean the case and polish the crystal while he or she is servicing the movement. Figure a good $200 average for that movement service. Higher or lower depending on where you live.

Then, you can delve into the spares game with a bit of advantage. Some of us have been doing it for a while now. Almost like genealogy when you find a missing ancestor. Those parts can be a nightmare to find depending on the model.

I cannot quite tell if your is stainless or plated gold but here is where you find out a bit more about this company. Keep an eye eBay listings from a vendor (esa-9162-9164) as some of us have dealt with him -- quite favorably I might add. Here is a photo from an old listing of the same case number as yours:









The listing includes a New Old Stock (NOS) case with glass and tension ring. Use the old ring from your watch glass (assuming it is gold plated) and viola, looks very nice. That is assuming you want it to look newer rather than older with the patina of age. In which case, you would want to replace crystal but keep tension ring for reuse, lightly polish case to remove some of the minor scratches and grime, and enjoy a great example of Enicar's creative dial thinking.

Enjoy!



jlo3 said:


> Hello, new poster here
> 
> I've recently come across this Ocean Pearl (?) Enicar watch
> 
> View attachment 6695346
> 
> 
> View attachment 6695354
> 
> 
> Markings on the back read
> 
> 144/39/06
> 
> What do these particular numbers mean?
> 
> Also as you can see from the images, it's in quite a sorry state. 2/3 of the arms have fallen off, but mechanically it still works! I gave it a light shake to wind it up and it still ticks away.
> 
> How should I go about restoring this watch? Or should I let a professional do the job...?


----------



## hns-panama

As an FYI to those interested in opening their Seapearl casebacks, have a look at this thread.

https://www.watchuseek.com/f11/3d-printed-enicar-seapearl-case-tool-2770610.html

3D printing is going to have a profound impact on watchmaking and repairing. Especially as metal becomes cheaper to print along with finer tolerances. It may just motivate more young people to become watchmakers.


----------



## brawijaya80

You Know, it easy to hunt Enicar in my place...but i cant take a risk anymore... im quit..
Some find will get me lucky.. some find will get me loss......
This my last Enicar...


----------



## Danny4

hns-panama said:


> I've heard the same thing though I have two observations.
> 
> First, the tension ring is the key aside from the diameter. A qualified watchmaker can put that thick crystal on a lathe and reduce the diameter in no time. That's a plus for those old crystals. You can buff them out for amy years...
> 
> Second, the Enicar tension ring fitment into the LIP. Have the watchmaker look at that deal. The ring holds the rotating bezel in place so the fit is critical.


Thanks for your reply.

I just came across this one, i bought it immediately. It's the exact same dimensions as the sherpa jet. You think this crystal will work with the sherpa jet?

Enicar Sherpa Super Divette 144 35 01 Genuine Glass NOS RARE | eBay


----------



## hns-panama

It should. Use the tension ring from yours if at all possible or at least have your watchmaker compare the two. By the way, the crystal comes out with a special tool.



Danny4 said:


> Thanks for your reply.
> 
> I just came across this one, i bought it immediately. It's the exact same dimensions as the sherpa jet. You think this crystal will work with the sherpa jet?
> 
> Enicar Sherpa Super Divette 144 35 01 Genuine Glass NOS RARE | eBay


----------



## philt68

i have a value question-i've found a glorious jet graph gmt, but he wants 4100 euro...is that a crazy pants price?


----------



## philt68

ooh that's tasty!


----------



## masoluca

Dear all, 

i need help with enicar ultradive crystal.

I need to replace the crystal of the watch but i really don't know the correct reference of the crystal.

I have some NOS crystal for Enicar sherpa graph (36,60 mm) do you know if they are the same of ultradive's ones?


----------



## vandervenus

philt68 said:


> i have a value question-i've found a glorious jet graph gmt, but he wants 4100 euro...is that a crazy pants price?
> View attachment 6713202


It's not cheap, that's for sure. But given the recent rise in prices for Sherpa's it's not exceptional. This Jet Graph has got the right GMT hand, and outerbezel and red pointer are in good condition. But.... I saw this one on an online auction in december. I know this for a fact as I too bid on it (the black hand in the right sub register gives it away). It was sold for less, obviously. I'm not gonna mention the figure on this forum, but you can look it up for yourself. Now, I don't think that there is anything wrong with selling a watch that is in high demand and making some profit on it. You be the judge if you think this profit is in reason, given the fact that the seller got it only four weeks ago.


----------



## vandervenus

You can't swap an Ultradive crystal with a Sherpa Graph one. They're both very different. The Ultradive chrystal has got a metal tension ring that holds the inner bezel in place. It's a very, very precise job replacing it. More bad news: crystals for SuperDive, Ultradive and SuperJet are rare as hens teeth...


----------



## philt68

thanks vandervenus for the insight..that's what i was thinking...and apologies btw, i've been stalking you on instagram haranguing you to sell me all your sherpas!  

i'm more tempted by the sherpa ultra dive, for some reason, than i am by this one...which is rarer, out of interest? is there any way to know?


----------



## philt68

actually, as a newbie, i've been thinking about this -i like almost ALL the sherpas, with the exception of a couple, so what makes some more collectible than others? rarity? aesthetics? the jim clark thing? the number of complications?


----------



## philt68

for instance, i find this kind of appealing-at first i thought it was a frankenwatch, but according to a friend of mine, it's all real...


----------



## vandervenus

philt68 said:


> actually, as a newbie, i've been thinking about this -i like almost ALL the sherpas, with the exception of a couple, so what makes some more collectible than others? rarity? aesthetics? the jim clark thing? the number of complications?


Good question Phil. I think it's safe to say all 40mm EPSA cased Enicars are in high demand. And every Enicar chrono with a Valjoux 72 movement leads to mass hysteria ;-)
But not every Sherpa is unconditionally loved. Take my Sherpa Star Diver. I love it to death. But most find it too seventies, clunky, weird or plain ugly.


----------



## masoluca

vandervenus said:


> You can't swap an Ultradive crystal with a Sherpa Graph one. They're both very different. The Ultradive chrystal has got a metal tension ring that holds the inner bezel in place. It's a very, very precise job replacing it. More bad news: crystals for SuperDive, Ultradive and SuperJet are rare as hens teeth...


Thank you very much for the information.
Do you know the code of the crystal? For example enicar sherpa graph glass code is gs-pa482.

Thanks!


----------



## kazrich

philt68 said:


> actually, as a newbie, i've been thinking about this -i like almost ALL the sherpas, with the exception of a couple, so what makes some more collectible than others? rarity? aesthetics? the jim clark thing? the number of complications?


All Enicar Sherpa EPSA Super Compressors are collectible. They are top quality watches that sold at Heuer Autavia and Rolex prices when new. It's taken a long time for
the vintage watch world to wake up to the Enicar Sherpa. Many moons ago, I started a thread and listed some bullet points in favour of the Sherpa Graph. It's got plenty
of bullet points in it's favour !

https://www.watchuseek.com/f11/why-your-watch-deserves-respect-10-bullet-points-1051763.html


----------



## vandervenus

masoluca said:


> Thank you very much for the information.
> Do you know the code of the crystal? For example enicar sherpa graph glass code is gs-pa482.
> 
> Thanks!


Sorry, can't help you with a code... Luckily I never had to change a crystal. Maybe Kazrich or hns-panama know?


----------



## Snowflake1

Enicar rubymotor supertest seapearl

having followed this thread for many months with much interest I was inspired to dig out my old Enicar Supertest from the drawer where it has stood dormant for at least 20 years. For obvious reasons, it lacks a winder and stem. I took the plunge and have decided to restore the watch to its former glory and start wearing it. It still runs but I really want to get it fully serviced and repaired. I managed to source a new winder and stem from a supplier in India. I'm looking for a watch mender who would be comfortable with this work and I wonder if you can recommend a watch restorer who might be able to take it on. In the Hampshire / Winchester area of uk. Much obliged.


----------



## hns-panama

Apparently, Super -- Dive, Jet, OPS, and UltraDive crystals are 36.7mm in diameter and 6.5 mm high.

One sold on eBay back on July 1 of last year. Price not known but the seller was in the UK if that helps at all.



vandervenus said:


> Sorry, can't help you with a code... Luckily I never had to change a crystal. Maybe Kazrich or hns-panama know?


----------



## hns-panama

What you have there is a 1125 Supertest movement, if the dial can be believed.

For certain, have a pro look after it. They can be regulated to a very high level of accuracy.

Ask if they know about Enicar bayonet-style case backs. If not, tell them it is not a screw on case back.

Parts can be an issue and some watchmakers may not want to spend the time hunting them down. Tell them to make a list of what it needs and you will see about what parts you can find.

Personally, I'd get rid of the metal band and go with a croc or something similar. More photos of the case back and the movement when you can would be appreciated.



Snowflake1 said:


> View attachment 6727690
> Enicar rubymotor supertest seapearl
> 
> having followed this thread for many months with much interest I was inspired to dig out my old Enicar Supertest from the drawer where it has stood dormant for at least 20 years. For obvious reasons, it lacks a winder and stem. I took the plunge and have decided to restore the watch to its former glory and start wearing it. It still runs but I really want to get it fully serviced and repaired. I managed to source a new winder and stem from a supplier in India. I'm looking for a watch mender who would be comfortable with this work and I wonder if you can recommend a watch restorer who might be able to take it on. In the Hampshire / Winchester area of uk. Much obliged.


----------



## kazrich

Snowflake1 said:


> View attachment 6727690
> Enicar rubymotor supertest seapearl
> 
> I'm looking for a watch mender who would be comfortable with this work and I wonder if you can recommend a watch restorer who might be able to take it on. In the Hampshire / Winchester area of uk. Much obliged.


PM sent


----------



## masoluca

hns-panama said:


> Apparently, Super -- Dive, Jet, OPS, and UltraDive crystals are 36.7mm in diameter and 6.5 mm high.
> 
> One sold on eBay back on July 1 of last year. Price not known but the seller was in the UK if that helps at all.


Thanks for the help!

I was wondering if it is possible to install the GS PA482 10 (omega crystal) which is a 36,60mm crystal "for tension ring".

What do you think about it?


----------



## Shum

I forgot to post my latest Enicar.








From the 60's and looks real nice.


----------



## hns-panama

Here is an auction sure to interest all Jet owners.

Enicar Very RARE Super Divette Jet 33 Superdome Plexi 33 1mm 6 7mm High NOS | eBay



Danny4 said:


> Thanks for your reply.
> 
> I just came across this one, i bought it immediately. It's the exact same dimensions as the sherpa jet. You think this crystal will work with the sherpa jet?
> 
> Enicar Sherpa Super Divette 144 35 01 Genuine Glass NOS RARE | eBay


----------



## hns-panama

Two observations:

1) Need to make certain tension ring will work with it.
2) Suspect that water resistance will be an issue given the smaller diameter. That said, you really aren't going to go swimming with it anyway, so it only has to survive a rain storm.



masoluca said:


> Thanks for the help!
> 
> I was wondering if it is possible to install the GS PA482 10 (omega crystal) which is a 36,60mm crystal "for tension ring".
> 
> What do you think about it?


----------



## kazrich

Enicar Sherpa Graph | eBay

:think: :roll: :roll: :roll:


----------



## vandervenus

kazrich said:


> Enicar Sherpa Graph | eBay
> 
> :think: :roll: :roll: :roll:


Holy Macaroni! I thought this kindda money was only asked for Sherpa Graph MkI models. It's very nice, but not even close to NOS.


----------



## Snowflake1

Enicar rubymotor supertest 30 jewels.
All is not as it seems! hns-Panama was right to be cautious about my Enicar, earlier post.
Now it is with the watchmaker (thanks Kazrich). It reveals that movement is a 1145 star Jewel with 24 jewels. Not a 1124, 30 Jewel calibre with correct supertest inscription and serial number.
compressor case has a serial number etc so the only conclusion is that movement has been changed to lesser grade. Why.
I got the watch circa 1980 and it was last worked on by a watchmaker in 1975 so the movement was changed relatively early in its life.
I have noticed one interesting thing on 'thewatchblog.com' relating to Enicar 1145 rubymotor 30 Jewel Sherpas etc, they had 24 Jewels even when marked 30 on the dial
Food for thought.


----------



## Snowflake1

Ref previous post, Enicar supertest, correction the site mentioned ref Jewel numbers should read the
'thewatchspotblog.com'


----------



## Stigmata

I've seen this before.
Enicar just married parts to churn them out. Usually they did it with harmony but on rare occasions there's a total mismatch. Which can make the whole thing tricky.


----------



## JOSE G

Here is my Chronoswiss Orea.
Chronoswiss calls it Manufacture caliber C.121 (Basic Caliber Enicar 165).
I believe is from the 60s.


----------



## hns-panama

A little help from the Sherpa and other Enicar super compressor owners out there, please.

I ordered the case back tool from a 3D printer company but that got me to thinking about the plastic case back gaskets. I pulled one from one of my super compressor cases and did the measurements. Now playing with the modeling tool to have it printed.

Post your caseback number and the precise measurements -- noting that the gaskets seem to slant down from the outer edge to the inner edge on one flat side -- and we can help each other. If you are already proficient at the modeling end, let me know and I will defer to you. If you are an expert at 3D printing, I would love to know which material is best to have it printed with. Compressor gaskets are harder than rubber as I suspect they must be due to the compression factor of EPSA SC cases.

By the way, those gaskets are very tough to find as in not out there. They seem to have been created especially for EPSA.


----------



## Stigmata

My watchmaker had to modify from another gasket to get mine right.
He couldn't get one from his usual sources.
Works good.. Is tight but he reminded me.. New gasket .. Original or not.. " don't go diving or even swimming "
I'm happy! Crown on that particular one is tight!


----------



## kazrich

Enicar Reference. 2303 (pre Sherpa ) & 2343 ( Sherpa Graph ).

Question . Were these official Enicar reference numbers ? ref 2303 is an earlier number than 2343, but is it necessarily an earlier model ?

I was reading this article in Hodinkee, but i'm not entirely convinced by the author.

Scroll down to the article.

https://www.hodinkee.com/articles/bring-a-loupe-november-20-2015

They title the watch Ref 2303
They show a 36 mm Enicar chrono with 3 display registers that looks similar to a Sherpa Graph.
It runs on a Val 72 engine
It's smaller than a Sherpa Graph, 36mm without crown
It just says Enicar under planet Saturn
The case back of these watches don't show an open clam / shell , so are they still are EPSA compressor cased ?

All of a sudden, articles are dating these ref 2303 watches as 1956 :roll:

Really ?

They are very attractive, but 1956 ?
I had always assumed that this model was a slightly cheaper version of a Sherpa Graph ?

1956 with a lollipop seconds hand ?
1956 with those paddle hands ?
1956 with Enicar not signed through Saturn ?
Iv'e even seen this 2303 reference with stick hands and bold orange seconds hand ( maybe it just progressed like the Sherpa Graph ? )

Strangely enough, I would have agreed with the actual vendors link that Hodinkee gives to the sale of the watch, and date it as 1967 ish.
It made a very healthy 3100 euro's ( well over estimate ).

For me it just doesn't look like a mid 1950's watch. 
Opinions ?

Richard


----------



## Datreedude

Don't know if this question was asked, I did not read through all the posts on here, but how many Enicar collectors also collect Racine's?? Just curious.....


----------



## kazrich

No Racine , but I keep a Gallet Multichron 12 and a Galco.


----------



## Sunday Rider

I have 2 old Racine manual wind watches. Love the old look of them.


----------



## hns-panama

Just an FYI regarding the 3D printed Seapearl case back opener.

Had mine printed and delivered today. Outstanding. Worked like a charm on my Jet and a Seapearl case.


----------



## Neeko

As promised here are pics of the movement. (I finally received my watch case tool). The case back is Eterna but the rest is Enicar, and now we all know! It does run very smooth.

I also opened my vintage Velona - it's the first pic. My father used to wear this way back and it still runs now!






























Neeko said:


> I have a bit of a puzzler for you: I picked this up a couple of weeks ago, cleaned and serviced prior to my purchase. The dial has Enicar and the case back has Eterna. I have no pic of the movement (yet) but when I do I will post it here. Comments on my (dual) brand watch? BTW, the serial on the caseback puts it at about 1946 build date. Don't know if the caseback was from another watch or?


----------



## Danny4

had a NOS crystal installed today. Looks as good as new


----------



## hns-panama

Now don't you feel better? 



Danny4 said:


> had a NOS crystal installed today. Looks as good as new
> 
> View attachment 6914410


----------



## QWatchQ

Danny4,

What are the particulars on a NOS crystal for these Super Jet watches? Do you have a picture of the packaging?

Here's my very early example of the SJ 33 in need of a NOS crystal. SuperTest cal. 1126

My watchmaker just bought the stock of an old watchmaker and Enicar crystals were part of the stash.


----------



## Danny4

hns-panama said:


> Now don't you feel better?


yes i do, thank you


----------



## Danny4

QWatchQ said:


> Danny4,
> 
> What are the particulars on a NOS crystal for these Super Jet watches? Do you have a picture of the packaging?
> 
> Here's my very early example of the SJ 33 in need of a NOS crystal. SuperTest cal. 1126
> 
> My watchmaker just bought the stock of an old watchmaker and Enicar crystals were part of the stash.


I have a 36mm jet, i don't know about the super jet crystals, sorry


----------



## Chandlerl

Just Picked this up off of eBay... can anyone tell me anything about it?

Mens Watch Enicar Sherpa | eBay


----------



## Montag84




----------



## hns-panama

I would get it serviced asap as he told me he has never opened it nor does he have the tools to do so.

If he has let it sit that long, then get it to your watchmaker for an appraisal of the movement. Odds are the oils are dry.



Chandlerl said:


> Just Picked this up off of eBay... can anyone tell me anything about it?
> 
> Mens Watch Enicar Sherpa | eBay


----------



## Chandlerl

Thank you, Luckily I can do that myself as I am A watchmaker. I was just looking to get into Enicar's and this one caught my eye. Would you say that was a good price for it?



hns-panama said:


> I would get it serviced asap as he told me he has never opened it nor does he have the tools to do so.
> 
> If he has let it sit that long, then get it to your watchmaker for an appraisal of the movement. Odds are the oils are dry.


----------



## kazrich

Chandlerl said:


> Thank you, Luckily I can do that myself as I am A watchmaker. I was just looking to get into Enicar's and this one caught my eye. Would you say that was a good price for it?


A very very ambitious asking price in my opinion. Always best to alert thread members BEFORE pressing the button.


----------



## Chandlerl

I payed $200. Too much? I really enjoy the looks of it though so im not too worried about price . They are great looking watches.



kazrich said:


> A very very ambitious asking price in my opinion. Always best to alert thread members BEFORE pressing the button.


----------



## hns-panama

Heh. I paid $.10 for my first Enicar. Not including shipping. It's not the first one so much as the 15th that'll get you 

I offered him $20 because he had no other photos and especially one of the movement. I heavily discount any watch being sold without photos of the movement. Highly suspect in my opinion. That said, I have done so in the past and have been pleased with the surprise inside the case -- aka a Supertest movement inside a "normal" case. I'd say those days are gone now that people are asking about values instead of parts.

I revisited another watchmaker in my area who gave me his updated servicing price list. $230 for an automatic with a date complication. $220 without. I have a few I will be checking him out on.


----------



## Domo_de_Piano

Hi there, I'm new to the community and been enjoying reading and learning. I got my first Enicar after doing a lot of background research on the brand, it's history, notable pieces and innovations, and eventual demise.

Was not particularly looking to make the purchase when I did, but hey, when the opportunity presents itself, you move on it right? 

A lot of what I have been able to read about are the mid century-ish examples. The one I got seems to be from towards the end of the company's run in the 80's. I don't have an exact or even general idea of early , mid , or late 80's ie pre '88

Have yet to take to my watch specialist to get assessed for servicing, etc. But was wondering and hoping another member either has one, similar to, or seen, or knows some about this Ocean Pearl - date model.

The strap seems very similar in style to an old Rado I picked up that Swatch confirmed was from 82-85 or so, although the styling cues of this lend me to believe and hope it leans more post 86? If anyone can provide clues of what kind of movement to expect or should be in there, or anything else about it, would be great. I'm new to collecting and newer to sourcing vintage pieces.

Attached a few photos hope it helps. Oh yeah, I did not get it from an Eastern market seller, soured this one in North America, but seller was not really a watch dealer or big re seller. Had a good but short track record of being honest and serving well.


----------



## twelve199

Anyone know of an available Sherpa Graph Dial for sale?


----------



## hns-panama

Contact Peter Wyse.

Enicar 1 Zifferblatt Valjoux 72 232 | eBay


----------



## twelve199

hns-panama said:


> Contact Peter Wyse.
> 
> Enicar 1 Zifferblatt Valjoux 72 232 | eBay


Thank you! What a wonderful resource!


----------



## rahulg

Such a great resource for someone rather new to the hobby. In their heyday, Enicars, along with Roamers, Titonis, and Favre Leubas were popular in India as well, from what I understand. Although only a small handful of the better-off could afford these Swiss beauties, Enicars remain a memorable brand among older enthusiasts.

Thanks for such a great thread.


----------



## wongcheok

hns-panama said:


> Contact Peter Wyse.
> 
> Enicar 1 Zifferblatt Valjoux 72 232 | eBay


Wonder if he's still got dials stashed away, or if they've all been snapped up by Enicar prospectors...


----------



## hns-panama

He has some dials and other parts but a lot of the prime stuff was bought years ago. Look at what he's sold in the recent months.

I bought one of the prototype cases. Haven't a clue what the pushbutton / plug does but it is there. It is an EPSA Super Compressor case too. What function it might serve remains a mystery...



wongcheok said:


> Wonder if he's still got dials stashed away, or if they've all been snapped up by Enicar prospectors...


----------



## vandervenus

That is an absolutely amazing case! Makes you wonder if Enicar was building some sort of chronostop watch like Omega did. Or maybe there was a secret 007-ish lasergun in there. Would be perfect to kill those evil Swiss mountain goats!


----------



## hns-panama

Yep. Evil goats.

The hole goes all the way through to the inside of the watch. Given the SC design, and 314962 patent number, one would think it might affect pressure performance.

What the heck it might push against, I don't know. Not only that, there is no spring or seal capability that I have seen.

No wonder we have such a disease collecting them 



vandervenus said:


> That is an absolutely amazing case! Makes you wonder if Enicar was building some sort of chronostop watch like Omega did. Or maybe there was a secret 007-ish lasergun in there. Would be perfect to kill those evil Swiss mountain goats!


----------



## jeffrois

I just bought a 1969 vintage Enicar Sherpa Guide GMT...The watch is in in good cosmetic condition, but, the hands do not set properly. The movement winds OK and ticks fine...when I pull the crown to set the watch it does not engage the hands...I have bought another Enicar automatic movement, Cal. 167 and I am wondering if it will fit as a replacement for the original AR 1146? 

Regards Jeff Smith, Canada


----------



## smeagal

Got this one recently looks like a replacement crown the dial and movement are nice shame about the case


----------



## hns-panama

In a word, no. Most of the parts are interchangeable. Take it to a good watchmaker. Worth it.



jeffrois said:


> I just bought a 1969 vintage Enicar Sherpa Guide GMT...The watch is in in good cosmetic condition, but, the hands do not set properly. The movement winds OK and ticks fine...when I pull the crown to set the watch it does not engage the hands...I have bought another Enicar automatic movement, Cal. 167 and I am wondering if it will fit as a replacement for the original AR 1146?
> 
> Regards Jeff Smith, Canada


----------



## Hessu

My new Enicar. Today got it's first wrist time.















Cal 1010. The barrelbridge has lost most of it's plating. Other ways it is just fine







I have had this non-branded Gay Freres bracelet and now finally I think it has found it's place in the universe.


----------



## beeman101

My enicar SherpaStar


----------



## skullkid

i've just purchased an enicar with i believe an AR140 movement.

i've never owned a manual watch before - how do i ensure i don't over-turn/tighten to winder? thanks a lot


----------



## busmatt

Unless you're going to use a pair of pliers or something else mechanical to wind it or you turn green when angry, then there's little chance of over winding, just wind it to a natural stop, if the main spring should break ( it does happen) as happened to me once, then the spring was weak and needed replacing so go ahead and enjoy your watch

Matt


Brought to you by HYPNOTOAD


----------



## aero-engineer

Friends, I need your help to understand is this timepiece has any collectable value or not? I see there is non signed crown, rotating bezel index in good condition, the Seapearl caseback which not related to the dial information. Is this watch franken or not?










Отправлено с моего iPhone используя Tapatalk


----------



## vandervenus

aero-engineer said:


> Friends, I need your help to understand is this timepiece has any collectable value or not? I see there is non signed crown, rotating bezel index in good condition, the Seapearl caseback which not related to the dial information. Is this watch franken or not?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Отправлено с моего iPhone используя Tapatalk


It's impossible to tell if this is a franken. For starters, there is no picture of the movement. The crown could be legit, although most Enicars (say 90%) carry signed crowns. Apart from that, I like it. Dials, case, bezels and hands are authentic. The biggest problem IMO are the lumedots. The dial and hands were obviously relumed. I think that's really distracting.


----------



## aero-engineer

I agree, to relume was bad idea... If I buy it is there any chance to fix the lume to more authentic?


----------



## Tony C.

smeagal said:


> Got this one recently looks like a replacement crown the dial and movement are nice shame about the case


Can anyone decipher these numbers (and the letter "M" below them) on the case back?

100/19-10

Anything to do with anti-magnetism?

Cheers,

Tony C.


----------



## Danny4

aero-engineer said:


> I agree, to relume was bad idea... If I buy it is there any chance to fix the lume to more authentic?


No it's not fixable. The watch is ruined because of the relume job IMO. It's done sloppy and to make it worse, the lume is green.

I'd search for a better example if i were you.


----------



## hns-panama

Is the case chrome or gold plated?

100 will normally mean either the 1010 series or the 112X series movements. This looks like a 1010 back. The other numbers are related to the case model.

Edit: I looked at your earlier post. 1010 for sure.

M usually means plated brass.



Tony C. said:


> Can anyone decipher these numbers (and the letter "M" below them) on the case back?
> 
> 100/19-10
> 
> Anything to do with anti-magnetism?
> 
> Cheers,
> 
> Tony C.


----------



## Huang I-Lan

Hey everyone, i'm about to buy an Enicar Sherpa 600 automatic but im not sure if its a fake or not. Can you guys help me out?



























This are the pictures they sent me.

Thanks in advance!.


----------



## Sunday Rider

That back does not match the front. You should also have a picure of the movement. From these pictures I would have doubts about buying this watch.


----------



## hns-panama

Having a bit of fun watching the Sherpa Graph parts market go crazy.

Enicar Sherpa Graph Crystal 36 60mm PA 482 NOS 6 for Sale | eBay

Someone is overpaying bigtime for Sherpa Graph crystals. G-S 482s are in stock and available for $20 plus shipping from G-S. Do the arithmetic


----------



## hns-panama

That back probably belongs to a Sherpa Date model.

For certain, if it were a Sherpa, that would be on the dial. Enicar wasn't stupid with that name.

It appears to be a Franken.



Huang I-Lan said:


> Hey everyone, i'm about to buy an Enicar Sherpa 600 automatic but im not sure if its a fake or not. Can you guys help me out?
> 
> View attachment 7351050
> View attachment 7351066
> View attachment 7351074
> View attachment 7351098
> 
> 
> This are the pictures they sent me.
> 
> Thanks in advance!.


----------



## kazrich

hns-panama said:


> Having a bit of fun watching the Sherpa Graph parts market go crazy.
> 
> Enicar Sherpa Graph Crystal 36 60mm PA 482 NOS 6 for Sale | eBay
> 
> Someone is overpaying bigtime for Sherpa Graph crystals. G-S 482s are in stock and available for $20 plus shipping from G-S. Do the arithmetic


Now that the marketplace has firmly established that a series 4 Sherpa Graph in OK condition is a 4.2k Sterling watch
Parts prices are bound to go through the roof !


----------



## hns-panama

Yep. In this case, the seller played on the greed factor and won. *$369.38! 
*



kazrich said:


> Now that the marketplace has firmly established that a series 4 Sherpa Graph in OK condition is a 4.2k Sterling watch
> Parts prices are bound to go through the roof !


----------



## Stigmata

are the GS crystals the exact profile? 
And no , I didn't buy those


----------



## hns-panama

Apparently so. 

Non-Sherpa Chronos measure 33.5.


----------



## Stigmata

the gs enicar Sherpa guide plexis work.. but theyre not exact...the allow a tiny gap 
if its the same with the graphs plexi... id pay overs for the real thing...or theyre no exactly the same...


did u see the price enicar Sherpa guide city bezels achieved?
id pay that...and actually did 


very little exists NOS for enicar Sherpa

I know people with a few graphs or whatever.. he might be one..


----------



## gasket

After reading this thread, I've been enthusiastic in acquiring my first Enicar, much thanks to crazyfist.
Anyway, I've come across this mint specimen right here, but don't know much about the model, movement, and all the nitty-gritty.
Any info about this will be appreciated. Thanks in advance!

_**Photo not mine_


----------



## crazyfist

Gasket, 25 jewels are usually powered by ETA movements, likely from the 27XX series of automatics, which would date the watch to the 80s era. The "Swiss Movt" at the bottom tells me the watch was possibly made in Hong Kong, and not Switzerland, so it's a good chance this was made after HK bought the company during the quartz crisis. A nice piece. If the price is right I'd move on it!


----------



## hns-panama

Question for Enicar Chronograph (non-Sherpa) owners.

Have you ever replace the pushers and if so, do you know the size used? 

This would be for a 72 cased movement.


----------



## ultra7k

Is it common for the writing on the case back to be worn off? Or is this a tell tale sign that it's a frankenwatch?

It's advertised as a 160 cal, and the markings on the movement seem to match....but the case back...has no writing but does have the logo.


----------



## hns-panama

Pictures would help...

Lots of casebacks are sanded or polished to the point that the writing is gone. Points off for that. Seapearl or Ocean Pearl?

Franken is a possibility. The dial, hands, and the case are indicators along with the inside of the case. Is it consistent with other Enicars? Is the condition consistent?

Generally speaking, a good vintage watch ought to be fairly consistent with wear. A stunning dial with very worn hands and case deserves special attention. I have a Supertest model with a great dial, hands and movement but the gold plated case was showing a lot of wear. However, it's an EPSA compressor case with excellent sealing properties so I'm 99.9% sure the watch is original. Hence, I am going to have it replated. It should be stunning when finished.



ultra7k said:


> Is it common for the writing on the case back to be worn off? Or is this a tell tale sign that it's a frankenwatch?
> 
> It's advertised as a 160 cal, and the markings on the movement seem to match....but the case back...has no writing but does have the logo.


----------



## ultra7k

hns-panama said:


> Pictures would help...
> 
> Lots of casebacks are sanded or polished to the point that the writing is gone. Points off for that. Seapearl or Ocean Pearl?
> 
> Franken is a possibility. The dial, hands, and the case are indicators along with the inside of the case. Is it consistent with other Enicars? Is the condition consistent?
> 
> Generally speaking, a good vintage watch ought to be fairly consistent with wear. A stunning dial with very worn hands and case deserves special attention. I have a Supertest model with a great dial, hands and movement but the gold plated case was showing a lot of wear. However, it's an EPSA compressor case with excellent sealing properties so I'm 99.9% sure the watch is original. Hence, I am going to have it replated. It should be stunning when finished.


It looks a bit like this. I went through this thread and didn't really see any cases like this, so it kinda makes me think it's a frankenwatch...but it was cheap so...listing had it as a 1970's model.

View attachment 7558906

View attachment 7558914

View attachment 7558922

View attachment 7558930


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## kazrich

OK Enicaristi ( :think: suppose it doesn't really quite roll off the tongue) has anyone noticed that some ' old money ' watch collectors have recently 
been trying to talk Enicar down a notch , by inferring that when the watch market ' makes a correction ' Enicar will be pushed back to where it belongs.
Nobody actually says it, but the inference is grinning through the veneer.
They seem to think that because 30 years ago, that if a watch wasn't branded Rolex, Omega or sometimes Longines in the mid to upper market range it should be classified as an ' also ran '.
They still fail to accept that more recent collectors were looking outside the box at tragically under valued watches such as Enicar. They seem to think
that given a decent budget to play with you, should only think Submariner or Man on the Moon.
Now, after rave reports from Hodinkee , Bold Watches and Fratello Watches - The penny has finally dropped ! ;-)

Fratello appraisal - Enicar Sherpa Super Jet

#TBT: Enicar Sherpa Super Jet |>


----------



## vandervenus

The piece on the SuperJet was very insightful and further proof of the many qualities of the brand. Enicar is here to stay, regardless of what others say. In terms of brandstory, Enicar ticks all the right boxes: it's got a strong history (Himalaya expedition, airlines and pilots, racing sport icon Jim Clark), brilliant in house developped movements that keep my watchmaker amazed, outstanding designs that were way ahead of their time, big bold supercompressor cases, and so on.

I appreaciate Enicar as a collector and frankly I don't care about the market value. I'm not an investor. But since the Sherpa line is being recognised by watch enthousiast as something special, something that stands out from the mainstream, I wouldnt be surprised if prices of non-chrono models like the SuperDive, UltraDive, SuperJet and OPS will continue to rise.

As I commented on the article on Fratellowatches, I think we need a good reference book. I think the Enicar community can provide the pictures needed to make a great book. Been playing with this thought for some time. I think we can do this


----------



## kazrich

vandervenus said:


> As I commented on the article on Fratellowatches, I think we need a good reference book. I think the Enicar community can provide the pictures needed to make a great book. Been playing with this thought for some time. I think we can do this


Have you got a copy of Enicar Watches ( 1913 - 1988 ) ? by Nico Van Dijk ?
Not very comprehensive , but an interesting 68 page booklet .

ENICAR watches (1913-1988): Amazon.co.uk: nico van dijk: 9781471090141: Books


----------



## vandervenus

I know that book. I borrowed it from a friend once. Don't want to disrespect the writer, but I tought it wasn't really a book. More an essay with low quality pictures. I'm aiming for a book like Omega and Rolex have, with beautiful pictures, interviews with experts and enthousiasts and an extensive overview of models (mostly Sherpa I guess).


----------



## kazrich

vandervenus said:


> I know that book. I borrowed it from a friend once. Don't want to disrespect the writer, but I tought it wasn't really a book. More an essay with low quality pictures. I'm aiming for a book like Omega and Rolex have, with beautiful pictures, interviews with experts and enthousiasts and an extensive overview of models (mostly Sherpa I guess).


Yes agreed , but the author is building a website with the same copy and images ( under construction ). I stumbled across it last week. At the bottom of the page it stated that Enicar had threatened to take
legal action against him for some reason. Maybe because he clearly states that there is no connection between the new and historic Enicar ? Unfortunately I now can't find the link.

I've been looking at a plain looking 1958 Sherpa with a Super Compressor back. The back however states Sherpas ( with an S ). I know that the Sherpas pre dates the Sherpa but why would
they present the dial and case back with slightly different names ?
The vendor assures me that the name Sherpas was so well respected that Enicar kept the name Sherpas on the caseback for a short time ?
Thoughts anyone ?


----------



## hns-panama

So, as an Enicar fan/collector/enthusiast, you pickup a prototype case no one knows anything about because it has a pushbutton on the upper left lug. We've only determined it might be a hole for a laser beam to nail Swiss goats, but I digress.

Given the state of the market -- EVERYONE HAS AN ENICAR NOW -- one might be thinking: How do I create one that no one has? 

Therefore, some criteria need to be met:

Super Compressor Case w/ 314962 marking on caseback
Black Sherpa dial

I had the case and the dial but needed a wee bit of help from G-S to find the right combo of Ever-Tight and a wide trim ring. They came through flawlessly. Crystal arrived today and it only a matter of putting it together. 

It has the venerable 1010 caliber inside and is ticking away just fine.

I think I nailed it:


----------



## vandervenus

You nailed the strap too! Have you tought of an official name for this beautiful creature?


----------



## hns-panama

Thanks.

Already changed it to a black strap for fun. (She who must be listened to suggested black.) Might go with brown croc for a laugh. That's the fun thing. It's not an approved model so why not experiment a bit? Also, I found a good deal on a glazed black rough croc strap. Might have to have that for giggles.

Name?

"Sherpa Goat Herder"

"FrankenSherpa"

Seriously though, I think perhaps "Enicar Sherpa Homage" might be appropriate. Sort of covers all the bases.



vandervenus said:


> You nailed the strap too! Have you tought of an official name for this beautiful creature?


----------



## vandervenus

hns-panama said:


> Thanks.
> 
> Already changed it to a black strap for fun. (She who must be listened to suggested black.) Might go with brown croc for a laugh. That's the fun thing. It's not an approved model so why not experiment a bit? Also, I found a good deal on a glazed black rough croc strap. Might have to have that for giggles.
> 
> Name?
> 
> "Sherpa Goat Herder"
> 
> "FrankenSherpa"
> 
> Seriously though, I think perhaps "Enicar Sherpa Homage" might be appropriate. Sort of covers all the bases.


I like Sherpa Homage. Here are some other suggestions:
"Sherpa Special" (quite obvious)
"Sherpa Rolex-Killer"
"Enicarrari" (could be a whole line of custom 'improved' Enicars that kick ass)
"Sherpa Lengnautic" (my favorite, an ode to all the divers made in Lengnau)


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## Snowflake1

Just collected my Enicar supertest from watch maker, many thanks Kazrich. Very happy with the finished watch after service etc. Looks great I think. Ref my previous post page 122 about the movement. It seems that is does have the 30 jewels and is 1125N movement with roller bearing rotor.


----------



## hns-panama

Well, from your photos on page 122, I am asking where is the serial number on the movement? It is not where it should be for a Supertest 112X series.

Mystery continues.



Snowflake1 said:


> Just collected my Enicar supertest from watch maker, many thanks Kazrich. Very happy with the finished watch after service etc. Looks great I think. Ref my previous post page 122 about the movement. It seems that is does have the 30 jewels and is 1125N movement with roller bearing rotor.
> View attachment 7654450
> View attachment 7654466
> View attachment 7654466


----------



## Snowflake1

Thanks HMS Panama- you are right the serial numbers are not present on movement so assume movement changed prior to my ownership circa 1980 ish.
think I'll just enjoy it as it is from now on. Mystery unsolved!


----------



## kazrich

kazrich said:


> I've been looking at a plain looking 1958 Sherpa with a Super Compressor back. The back however states Sherpas ( with an S ). I know that the Sherpas pre dates the Sherpa but why would
> they present the dial and case back with slightly different names ?
> The vendor assures me that the name Sherpas was so well respected that Enicar kept the name Sherpas on the caseback for a short time ?
> Thoughts anyone ?


After a bit of research I can now answer my own question.
It's true.

The Sherpas name did pre date the Sherpa, and many late 1950's clover leaf backed watches dialed Sherpa do have a back that clearly states Sherpas.
It seems that either Enicar had some left overs and couldn't be bothered to change the script for the sake of an 'S'. Or they wanted to use the pedigree of
the respected Sherpas name to give the new Sherpa model more substance.
Not a lot of people know that. Trouble is, not a lot of people care ! :think:


----------



## hns-panama

I guess Enicar was as much a marketing company as a manufacturer.

Sure wish the company archives were available.

I have a friend who is resurrecting a brand. I suggested that those archives are worth a lot more than they might know. It's also a goldmine for marketing ideas.



kazrich said:


> After a bit of research I can now answer my own question.
> It's true.
> 
> The Sherpas name did pre date the Sherpa, and many late 1950's clover leaf backed watches dialed Sherpa do have a back that clearly states Sherpas.
> It seems that either Enicar had some left overs and couldn't be bothered to change the script for the sake of an 'S'. Or they wanted to use the pedigree of
> the respected Sherpas name to give the new Sherpa model more substance.
> Not a lot of people know that. Trouble is, not a lot of people care ! :think:


----------



## Stigmata

ill be picking a blue dial Sherpa guide up pretty soon.
ant wait to see it in the flesh.. I have only seen 3 for sale in all my time interested .. this one is the nicest and couldnt resist though I had to take it with a very nice cushion case later version,
(not complaining)


----------



## twelve199

Grateful to have been able to acquire this rarity. Thanks Martijn


----------



## vandervenus

Fantastic catch Aaron! Now let's hunt down that white dial ;-)


----------



## hns-panama

New DiverTight crystal for the Seapearl. This is the first generation Compressor I bought. Supertest movement. Fantastic runner.



















Sent from my Z10 using Tapatalk


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## kazrich

Hi Hunter ;
That's a wonderful thing !
I've recently reeled in a couple of 1950's Enicar's - both with EPSA 314962 cases. One's a Sherpa , the other a Seapearl. If I might ask about your Supertest.
1. Does it say 'Supertest under Enicar ? If so, it looks like a letter or two short ?
2. Size of case without crown.
Do you have a pic of the back, the engine or both ?
3. What year is your Supertest ?

Thanks
Richard


----------



## twelve199

vandervenus said:


> Fantastic catch Aaron! Now let's hunt down that white dial ;-)


Yeeeeees!!!


----------



## hns-panama

Thanks.

This is a Super A model. Mid-fifties.

About 36mm if memory serves. It is a Supertest movement but marked Super A.

Let me see about a photo.



kazrich said:


> Hi Hunter ;
> That's a wonderful thing !
> I've recently reeled in a couple of 1950's Enicar's - both with EPSA 314962 cases. One's a Sherpa , the other a Seapearl. If I might ask about your Supertest.
> 1. Does it say 'Supertest under Enicar ? If so, it looks like a letter or two short ?
> 2. Size of case without crown.
> Do you have a pic of the back, the engine or both ?
> 3. What year is your Supertest ?
> 
> Thanks
> Richard


----------



## aero-engineer

Hi! My Enicar Sherpa Guide GMT with short lugs, the numbers on the back: 166-35-04 and Brevet 314962. The bezel and inner bezel with red triangle are NOS. 

And I am looking for spare the 24 hours inner ring the black/white version and the hand set, especially I am interesting for the second hand. If anyone knows where to find them please advise!


----------



## R35GTR

Hi everyone,

New to the forum and wanted to post an Enicar I recently picked up! This is my first purchase in the vintage watch arena. Not sure if it's authentic since I have little experience but took a risk on it. Anything that you see and could comment on would be greatly appreciated. I believe that the crystal has been replaced and the dial repainted as well as it having an unmarked crown.


----------



## kazrich

Hi ;
Welcome to the thread !
I think your watch looks pretty authentic and I don't believe that the dial has been repainted. That sunburst satin effect is not easy to paint on evenly.
The dial has a few marks, but I think they are some sort of debris possibly from the 'lume'. I would imagine it's not too noticeable on the wrist ?
I would have thought your watch dates to the mid 70's. A standard Enicar crown should be quite easy to source.
Enjoy !


----------



## R35GTR

kazrich said:


> Hi ;
> Welcome to the thread !
> I think your watch looks pretty authentic and I don't believe that the dial has been repainted. That sunburst satin effect is not easy to paint on evenly.
> The dial has a few marks, but I think they are some sort of debris possibly from the 'lume'. I would imagine it's not too noticeable on the wrist ?
> I would have thought your watch dates to the mid 70's. A standard Enicar crown should be quite easy to source.
> Enjoy !


The dial looks surprisingly brand new while on the wrist. That's what lead me to believe it might have been repainted. But I'm happy to hear you may think otherwise! Now I must acquire more! Something about these watches really catches my eye. Sort of a complete opposite of my daily Cartier Ballon Bleu and Breitling Chronomat!


----------



## Sunday Rider

Good to see an older "regular" Enicar R3GTR. The watch looks good to me, the only things that seems odd, and that could be my error, are the hour and minute hands.


----------



## kazrich

Hi Guys ;
I just calculated that I need some therapy - I only seem to be buying one Enicar every 8 months since I started collecting old watches. 
Most of my Enicar's are dark dialed 1960's sports watches but recently I've secured a couple of 1950's light dialed examples.
I already had a gold plated cream dialed late 50's / early 60's super accurate Enicar, but let me share a couple of 1950's newbies.
Both have EPSA Brevet 314962 cases with AR1010 motors.

Firstly this 1958 Seapearl with a totally flat 14 facet EPSA case. My understanding is that this was waterproof to 5 ATM and was a standard compressor back.
I wouldn't expect such a super slim watch to have such decent waterproofing.









Then this 1957 Sherpa Sports watch.



The pre Sherpa's were called Sherpas ( with an S ). When
that name evolved to Sherpa the new Sherpa's case back remained as Sherpas for a short time . I believe
that the water resistance rating was 10ATM. I think this was an early Super Compressor ?
I'm unsure because it would seem that the EPSA Brevet 314962 merely refers to the fact that the Enicar caseback is secured by a quarter turn bayonet type action.













I'm now running out of space in the Enicar box, but I'm getting to like the earlier 1950's 'unloved' Enicar sports watches.


Unfortunately, properly informed knowledge of 1950's Enicar ' Sports' watches still seems to be a trifle nebulous.
Anyhow, I now keep 3 light dialled Enicar's ( Yes I know some of you have way in excess of 100 ! but I'm very slowly catching up  ).
I now keep 7 Enicars ( + 2 boxes ) , One things for sure - They really are beautifully made and innovative watches.


----------



## hns-panama

Kazrich,

Superb. Simply superb.

Yes, the 314962 cases are indeed Super Compressors. Sometimes marked as such and other times, the brevet number speaks for it. Stamping the diver helmet might have been left for the more expensive Sherpa models.


----------



## hns-panama

Those can be correct for that period. I've seen 1145 cased with dauphine hands like that.



Sunday Rider said:


> Good to see an older "regular" Enicar R3GTR. The watch looks good to me, the only things that seems odd, and that could be my error, are the hour and minute hands.


----------



## Sunday Rider

Kazrich, those are beautiful additions. That style and era are my absolute favourite. Most of the ones I have you can barely make out the writing on the case back. Those are gorgeous. Well done!


----------



## arogle1stus

crazyfist:
Stunning watches. Just stunning IMO

X traindriver


----------



## kazrich

I've read that in July 1954 the AR 1010 caliber was the first Enicar movement to be awarded a ' certificate of accuracy ' of the Neauchatel ( forerunner of the COSC ).
Does that mean AR1010 is officially recognized as a chronometer or merely ' pretty accurate all considered '.
In 1922 the Swiss Association for Chronometrie stated that a chronometer is a watch which has received a certificate of accuracy by an astronomical observatory. 
Enicar's logo shows the planet Saturn which they could see through a telescope , so does that count ? :think: 
Apparently The automatic Supertest 300 caliber wasn't officially a chronometer, but Enicar tested each watch over a 3 day period with a maximum tolerance of 5 seconds !
Apparently each individual watch was sold with a dedicated certificate showing the recorded results !
Anyone seen or own such a document ?


----------



## kazrich

I found an answer to my own question. 
Look at this !


----------



## vandervenus

Here's another frankenwatch that has to be seen to be believed. This Enicar combines the body of a Jet with the dial of an Ultradive, the hands of a who-knows-what and the movement of a Glycine. Well, at least the seller is honest about the dial in the description.

ENICAR SHERPA COMPRESSOR DIVER&apos;S WATCH - SOLD AS IS | eBay


----------



## kazrich

Hmmm 
That reminds me, does anyone want to buy a lovely 6 series BMW with a Ford Fiesta engine , worn out Chinese budget tyres and imitation M3 stickers ?
I will of course want top dollar because it's more economical than the standard cars power plant.


----------



## aero-engineer

Dear friends, is anyone has some manuals for Enicar Sherpa Guide GMT and others Enicars? If so, I kindly ask you to scan it and show us such documents. Thank you!


----------



## vandervenus

kazrich said:


> Hmmm
> That reminds me, does anyone want to buy a lovely 6 series BMW with a Ford Fiesta engine , worn out Chinese budget tyres and imitation M3 stickers ?
> I will of course want top dollar because it's more economical than the standard cars power plant.


Starting bid for this UNIQUE piece of watch history is $949,- That's a steal guys!


----------



## kazrich

aero-engineer said:


> Dear friends, is anyone has some manuals for Enicar Sherpa Guide GMT and others Enicars? If so, I kindly ask you to scan it and show us such documents. Thank you!


Hi aero-engineer

I'm not sure that they came with manuals as such. More like very brief operating instructions.
My 1966 Sherpa Graph was purchased from the original owner and came with instructions that fitted tightly into the lid of the cardboard box it was originally sold in.



The ' instructions ' were merely a single sheet of paper folded in half and printed in blue and black on a white background. The back cover gave 
information about the Super graph.


----------



## gr8sw

Sherpagraph... these all-black dials seem very rare compared to the pandas...


----------



## twelve199

kazrich said:


> Hi aero-engineer
> 
> I'm not sure that they came with manuals as such. More like very brief operating instructions.
> My 1966 Sherpa Graph was purchased from the original owner and came with instructions that fitted tightly into the lid of the cardboard box it was originally sold in.
> 
> 
> 
> The ' instructions ' were merely a single sheet of paper folded in half and printed in blue and black on a white background. The back cover gave
> information about the Super graph.


Love seeing this stuff!!! The paperwork showing the white dial super graph is soooooooo wonderful to see!

AK


----------



## aero-engineer

Is anyone has something for Sherpa Guide GMT?


----------



## hns-panama

Well, here is part of the Guide.



aero-engineer said:


> Is anyone has something for Sherpa Guide GMT?


----------



## hns-panama

Here is the best info I have seen on the Guide. In German from our friends over on the uhrforum.de forums. I ran it through Google translate:

https://translate.google.com/transl...-bei-uhren-mit-gmt-funktion-t53877&edit-text=

Cheers,

Hunter



aero-engineer said:


> Is anyone has something for Sherpa Guide GMT?


----------



## vandervenus

twelve199 said:


> Love seeing this stuff!!! The paperwork showing the white dial super graph is soooooooo wonderful to see!
> 
> AK


That's so great to see. We had a discussion about the variations of dials for the SuperGraph (also known as The Unicorn) and this proves not only that there's a white dial version, but it also shows it has steelpan subdials.

We Enicar enthousiasts need a reference guide. I'm aware of the booklet by Nico van Dijk, but that's not the kind of guide I have in mind. I'm talking about a book that can compete with the likes of Omega and Rolex. A fully illustrated ode to Enicar, with photos of private collections, comments by watch experts and Enicar fans and as much original archive stuff a possible. If we join forces we can make this work, can't we?


----------



## kazrich

That might be difficult vandervenus as there are so many grey area's re Enicar history as I recently experienced whilst searching for
1950's light dialed super compressors. It takes plenty of detective work to assemble parts of a vast jigsaw. You can then begin to see the
outline of the true but woefully incomplete picture. 
You can then see an evolutionary pattern emerge.
I now keep EPSA cased light dialed Seapearl and Sherpa's from 1957 and 58. Both case backs show a similar Enicar quadrifoglio design seen on Jim Clark's first
execution Sherpa Graph from 1960. You can definitely see the family ' Seapearl ' case back evolving and then changing circa 1964. But it's difficult to be sure
because adverts from that age only show the dials. I then have to assume that if 10 Google images from various forums all show similar case backs, they are
probably correct as luckily Enicar's are not often forged . From my experience most vendors are genuinely selling old Enicars exactly how they left the factory.
Even manufacturers literature can be unhelpful.

Please see points A - D and the advise given for 'B'. 
Looks like I own a couple of Frankens . Does anyone know where I can get these revolving bezels for my Sherpa Graph's :-d


​








Attached Images


----------



## vandervenus

Thanks for your feedback kazrich. It's insightful as always. 
You're probably right about the jigsaw that the history of Enicar is. That's what makes collecting Enicar so exciting. Maybe the Enicar bible shouldn't be about giving an exact history. Maybe it could be about the fantastic designs and their appeal, the way the brand was ahead of it's time, the link with the Himalaya expedition and their sports sponsoring (Jim Clark). And we could add different theories about the evolution of the designs, model names and so on. 

I've been playing with the idea for a book for some time now. Last year I even got in contact with the Chinese company that currently holds the rights on the brand. I think that will be the real problem to tackle. There will be no book without the permission of the owners of the Enicar brandname. At first they were interested in this idea. But after a while, they became rather vague about their intentions. Two e-mails later and all communication was gone. I never heard from them again...


----------



## primabaleron

The Week is too short for me...


----------



## vandervenus

Fantastic collection and what a great choice of straps and bracelets!
Here's my selection of 40mm case Enicar watches. I'm one short of a full week ;-)


----------



## kazrich

vandervenus said:


> Thanks for your feedback kazrich. It's insightful as always.
> You're probably right about the jigsaw that the history of Enicar is. That's what makes collecting Enicar so exciting. Maybe the Enicar bible shouldn't be about giving an exact history. Maybe it could be about the fantastic designs and their appeal, the way the brand was ahead of it's time, the link with the Himalaya expedition and their sports sponsoring (Jim Clark). And we could add different theories about the evolution of the designs, model names and so on.
> 
> I've been playing with the idea for a book for some time now. Last year I even got in contact with the Chinese company that currently holds the rights on the brand. I think that will be the real problem to tackle. There will be no book without the permission of the owners of the Enicar brandname. At first they were interested in this idea. But after a while, they became rather vague about their intentions. Two e-mails later and all communication was gone. I never heard from them again...


Maybe a separate thread is needed , so as not to hijack or dilute the best Enicar thread on the web. Crazyfists legendary thread holds a wealth of knowledge , but to collate all the
relevant information would be a heroic task.
Perhaps a thread that invites owners and enthusiasts to identify and pass on any research or knowledge they may possess regarding

History
Models & model development
Dial types
Case backs
Movements
and any other points of interest.

A tightly controlled thread was recently started inviting owners to post images of their Excelsior Park movements which seemed very useful. 
It would be essential that any new thread concentrated only on history and not ' how do I open my Super Jet with a pair of pliers and a chisel ? '
I'm not sure how that might be monitored.


----------



## DaBaeker

kazrich said:


> Maybe a separate thread is needed , so as not to hijack or dilute the best Enicar thread on the web. Crazyfists legendary thread holds a wealth of knowledge , but to collate all the
> relevant information would be a heroic task.


to collate? omg! it takes me forever to just scroll through the pages of posts.


----------



## vandervenus

kazrich said:


> Maybe a separate thread is needed , so as not to hijack or dilute the best Enicar thread on the web. Crazyfists legendary thread holds a wealth of knowledge , but to collate all the
> relevant information would be a heroic task.
> Perhaps a thread that invites owners and enthusiasts to identify and pass on any research or knowledge they may possess regarding
> 
> History
> Models & model development
> Dial types
> Case backs
> Movements
> and any other points of interest.
> 
> A tightly controlled thread was recently started inviting owners to post images of their Excelsior Park movements which seemed very useful.
> It would be essential that any new thread concentrated only on history and not ' how do I open my Super Jet with a pair of pliers and a chisel ? '
> I'm not sure how that might be monitored.


I just stumbled upon a fantastic article on thespringbar.com. Author Rob Fraser wrote a splendid piece on single crown Enicar models, with a LOAD of information about movements, dials, cases and so on. He also added a timeline and categorization that helps us collectors to find our way in the misty history of Enicar models.

But hear this: this immersive article is the first of a series! Next up is a post on 2 crown models and after that we'll get the chapter on 3 crown Enicars and hopefully chrono's. Check it out: Enicar Sherpa Collectors Guide Part 1 - The Spring Bar

EDIT: just found out there's already a new thread about the article. Should have used the Search button, I know, I know.


----------



## crazyfist

Very nice box, Kazrich! Did that come with a watch or did you just got the box?


----------



## crazyfist

Sold the Guides in favor of Jets. Had the collection on bracelet for a while before I came to my senses. Now they're mostly on leather.

















































Some chrono love. Member Hotsauz brought over his newly acquired Glycine V72, which is on the bottom.


----------



## sabby.marol

Sabby


----------



## sabby.marol

Enicar Sherpa Star Day Date

Sabby


----------



## kazrich

crazyfist said:


> Very nice box, Kazrich! Did that come with a watch or did you just got the box?


Hi crazyfist , I was about to ask if you were still collecting Enicar , then you just posted the answer before I asked !!
WOW what a collection. A1+++++ !! Fantastic.
I have to agree with a couple of points.
I do prefer most watches on leather because I find metal cold and clamy in the winter and hot and sticky in the summer - not a great combo ?
Having said that, your ' beads of rice ' style bracelets really do look good.
I really like the Sherpa Guides but ---- they are just too big for my wrists and I would never wear them. I would rather fund something I would wear unless it's a watch of historical rarity.

As regards the box. Thankfully it didn't come with a watch because i have been advised that the Enicar ' Signiture of Time ' logo indicates it came with a post 88 watch.

The very heavy box measures 20 x 16 x 8 cms. and a carpenter has advised me that the Zebrano 'piano' wood has been veneered in either Coromandel or Macassar . This was never a cheap box.
The grey interior is a velveteen material.





The box appears to be made for a watch, a spare watch head ( this section is shallow and has a well fitted lid ) and a spare strap.





The new Enicar owners seem to have carried forward with the old philosophy of making cases difficult to open. The lid closes firmly and is secured by a couple of strong magnets ---
that hold it very tightly closed so you need to find a special technique to open the *""*"** thing ! :-d
That said, it's the nicest watch box I've seen from any watchmaker and possibly better than anything that originally came out of it.


----------



## crazyfist

Hi Kazrich, I really like your seapearl. The seapearls are so underrated. I'd say they're the next best thing to an EPSA Sherpa. I believe I posted some pics of mine about 50 or 60 pages back, but no one seemed to care about them then. I also noticed they're featured on the Enicar Sherpa Collectors' Guide. Good to see the 'pearls are getting the proper attention. Wear it in good health!


----------



## vandervenus

crazyfist said:


> Hi Kazrich, I really like your seapearl. The seapearls are so underrated. I'd say they're the next best thing to an EPSA Sherpa. I believe I posted some pics of mine about 50 or 60 pages back, but no one seemed to care about them then. I also noticed they're featured on the Enicar Sherpa Collectors' Guide. Good to see the 'pearls are getting the proper attention. Wear it in good health!


Mr. Crazyfist, I never got the opportunity to thank you for starting this life changing thread on the forum. It is because of this tread that I'm totally broke, but in good company of 16 Enicars (more or less).


----------



## crazyfist

LOL Mr. Vandervenus. You are not broke, because your 16 Enicars are now worth more than the deficit of the Republic of Congo. 



vandervenus said:


> Mr. Crazyfist, I never got the opportunity to thank you for starting this life changing thread on the forum. It is because of this tread that I'm totally broke, but in good company of 16 Enicars (more or less).


----------



## ultra7k

I picked up an Enicar a month or so back off ebay for $20 or so, it was listed as a 70's model. The caseback looks to have been smoothed out as the detailed information has been polished off. Looking through the many Enicars in this thread, I've not been able to see a case that's similar to mine, which makes me wonder if it's some sort of frankenwatch? The listing had a picture with the caseback off showing the movement (i've included the auction picture of it), but I wonder if someone could provide a bit more detail? Thanks in advance!


----------



## Stigmata

crazyfist said:


> Sold the Guides in favor of Jets. Had the collection on bracelet for a while before I came to my senses. Now they're mostly on leather.
> 
> View attachment 8047362
> 
> 
> View attachment 8047378
> 
> 
> View attachment 8047386
> 
> 
> View attachment 8047394
> 
> 
> View attachment 8047402
> 
> 
> View attachment 8047410
> 
> 
> Some chrono love. Member Hotsauz brought over his newly acquired Glycine V72, which is on the bottom.
> View attachment 8047418


Awesome


----------



## Danny4

I'm looking for a enicar sherpa jet beads of rice bracelet. anyone know where i can find one or have one for sale?


----------



## rafbid99

Has anyone any thoughts on the current ebay advertisement for a Seapearl GMT. The watch dial looks 1959, and the Star Jewels movement about 1965+. Despite the movement, has anybody seen a Seapearl GMT before?


----------



## rafbid99




----------



## vandervenus

Hi Trash_Gordon,

I owned the same watch. On the back there was a strange inscription, "30 god krivaja". Any idea what that means?


----------



## kazrich

Hi vandervenus ,
I think it's Icelandic for ' remove caseback to change the battery ' :-!


----------



## Trash_Gordon

Mine doesn't have this inscription. Probably it's something like "30 years married".


----------



## Danny4

does anyone know the crown size for a sherpa jet? 

there is someone one ebay selling them, and it says they are 6.25mm

But mine measures about 5.5mm. Am i measuring wrong or is the guy on ebay wrong?


----------



## hns-panama

There are at least two different crown sizes for Jets that I know of. 

The first is the thinner one with the cross hatch and logo. The second is thicker without the cross hatch but with the logo. Diameters are the same at 6.25. I am not certain about the thinker crown with the cross hatch design and logo. I have a Super Divette and the later Jet from 1969.

What you may have is either a replacement crown set from a Sherpa single crown model such as a Sherpa Date or yet one more collector conundrum courtesy of Enicar


----------



## Danny4

thanks! i just bought it


----------



## Stigmata

Blue steel..


----------



## mooieklokjes

Love Enicar! I had a chrono with Valjoux 23 inside.









Verstuurd vanaf mijn D5803 met Tapatalk


----------



## brettwas

Question for the experts:

I recently came into possession of a peculiar piece. It's Super Dive, but with a combination of features I've never seen before.

From what I can tell, it is either a total franken, or a very early Super Dive.

It has an early case, and an early bezel that differs from a typical super dive bezel, in that it has a split marker at 60, with hash marks up to 20, then dots around back to 60.

The inner dial is glossy without the word 'automatic' under the Enicar logo, and a marking indicating a 33 jewel movement at the bottom of the dial.

The movement checks out to be a 33 jewel AR1145, and the Seapearl caseback shows a model number '145/00' which corresponds correctly with the movement. 

(Since this if my first posts, WUS isn't letting me include images. I'm hoping I can follow this post up with the pics.)


I've done some digging, and the case and bezel are identical to that of a very early pre-super dive 2 crown diver, but the dial was different. I have also seen an ad from 1964 introducing the super divette that shows essentially the divette version of the watch I have, with a smaller version of the split marker bezel, pics of both below.

If the first version of the super divette had this type of bezel, I would assume that the first version of the super dive would have the same, albeit larger bezel. Though I have never seen an example.

Can anyone confirm whether they made a watch like this, or if it's a franken? Thanks in advance!


----------



## brettwas

Other images mentioned in the above post:


----------



## Gloria Wong

Hi, I'm totally new to watch collecting and am amazed by this history of vintage watches. I just came across this particular Enicar watch. It's from a sort of second hand marketplace and the owner doesn't know very much about it. I was wondering if anyone knows anything about this watch model?
There is a crack on the crystal that I'd get replaced while servicing it.


----------



## vandervenus

brettwas said:


> Other images mentioned in the above post:
> 
> View attachment 8463218
> View attachment 8463234


Hi brettwas, what a great piece you have. You have done your homework. I think it's safe to say that the dial as well as the bezel are genuine Enicar parts. If that makes the configuration 100% correct? Hard to say. Could be thrown together, could be totally original. Just because it's not traceable by Google doesn't make it a franken.

Where did you find it? Maybe the former owner can throw some light on the origin of the watch.


----------



## mook1980

Hi i was hoping someone could tell me about a couple of Enicar watches that have been handed on to me neither were running so I had both serviced i'm not looking for a value just some history maybe a year. Thanks

This is the first the second will be back with me in a couple of weeks


----------



## vandervenus

mook1980 said:


> Hi i was hoping someone could tell me about a couple of Enicar watches that have been handed on to me neither were running so I had both serviced i'm not looking for a value just some history maybe a year. Thanks
> 
> This is the first the second will be back with me in a couple of weeks
> View attachment 8499514
> View attachment 8499498


Looking at version of the logo on the dial, I would say it's a late seventies / early eighties model. Could you provide the numbers on the caseback, so the movement type can be checked?


----------



## vandervenus

Meanwhile on the Bay: a truely unique Enicar piece. Collector's item, totally original, untouched, unpolished, very, vey rare. It's a 3 day auction, so let the bidding war begin!


----------



## hns-panama

LOL. Careful. Someone just joining this thread will take you seriously. Just look at that dial. Horror or horrors!



vandervenus said:


> Meanwhile on the Bay: a truely unique Enicar piece. Collector's item, totally original, untouched, unpolished, very, vey rare. It's a 3 day auction, so let the bidding war begin!
> View attachment 8500858


----------



## hns-panama

Probably a 165 movement. About 1966 to 1970. A very good movement. Case back most likely reads 165-39-65



mook1980 said:


> Hi i was hoping someone could tell me about a couple of Enicar watches that have been handed on to me neither were running so I had both serviced i'm not looking for a value just some history maybe a year. Thanks
> 
> This is the first the second will be back with me in a couple of weeks
> View attachment 8499514
> View attachment 8499498


----------



## kazrich

Like my watch ?



I think It's an Enicar 
Come on - only another 4877 views on this thread until the big day chaps !!


----------



## mellowturtle

Hi,Does anyone know anyone that may have some spare beads of rice band for an Enicar Guide? Or generic vintage beads of rice bands in general. I'm looking for one for a Sherpa Guide 22mm and also a 20mm beads of rice band. I prefer the vintage look as opposed to the yobokies variations. I can only seem to find 18-19mm vintage bands. Any leads would be helpful!


----------



## shelfcompact

Hi all,

Thanks to a very cool member here I've acquired an Enicar Sherpa Guide of my own.
It needs a general service to get it running smoothly again and I've been considering the two most popular service suggestions IWW and RGM.

Is there anything I need to know about how either are equipped to handle vintage Enicar, or should I be looking at someone else?
Perhaps someone has used them for their piece before?

Any info is appreciated!
Thanks!



mellowturtle said:


> Hi,Does anyone know anyone that may have some spare beads of rice band for an Enicar Guide? Or generic vintage beads of rice bands in general. I'm looking for one for a Sherpa Guide 22mm and also a 20mm beads of rice band. I prefer the vintage look as opposed to the yobokies variations. I can only seem to find 18-19mm vintage bands. Any leads would be helpful!


You may try this guy: Tropic rubber dive straps, NSA Swiss bracelets items in Heuer type racing straps store on eBay!


----------



## mellowturtle

Thanks!


----------



## twelve199




----------



## QWatchQ

UltraDive


----------



## robbery

twelve199 said:


>


Wow, beautiful!!


----------



## journeyforce

Here is mine. I bought it from an eBAY seller based in the USA. He/she was selling a batch of Enicars that were from a collector's estate. This watch looked new and still had its tag on it. The watch has a multifaceted crystal, however unlike a lot of this style, the faceted part of the crystal is on the dial side(internal) and the external part is smooth to the touch.


The hands look small for this model but the watch looks to have been untouched and unopened so it looks like these hands are supposed to be on this watch. I have also seen a Enicar that is similar and has the small hands also. It keeps great time and it is a handwinding/ automatic movement


I tend to wear this watch a lot since I got it. It is now on a leather strap


----------



## KP-99

Enicar Super Dive with champagne dial

















and now with original curved tropic with Enicar clasp









Best regards,
Peter


----------



## DaBaeker

Beautiful! When/Why did they start-or stop-to use the 'Super-Divette' on the dial? always wondered


----------



## kazrich

DaBaeker said:


> Beautiful! When/Why did they start-or stop-to use the 'Super-Divette' on the dial? always wondered


The Super Dive and the Super Divette are similar EPSA Brevet 314962 cased watches. 
The Super Divette was sized at approx. 36mm without the crown. The Super Dive at 40 mm without crowwn.
The dials were mostly black, but were also in the rarer champagne.
Here's my own Divette from 1965 ish. The case shape and date position changed slightly in the late 60's - very early 70's.


----------



## kazrich

Question . 
Is the earlier Enicar Super Divette ( as in my last post ) the only Enicar EPSA cased Super Compressor that is not marked with any Brevet number ?
My own caseback is not marked 'Sherpa' above the central open oyster as the slightly newer versions are. It's inscribed Seapearl instead. Many earlier
Super Divette case backs also seem to have very shallow inscriptions without the Brevet number or Sherpa on the back.
On the inside of the caseback mine shows the divers helmet 
and EPSA Swiss Case. Enicar Watch Co. Swiss.
No year is shown.
All my other Enicar SC's are inscribed with the Brevet number on the back.
Opinions ?


----------



## shelfcompact

Where does the Ultra Dive fall into the Divette and Super Dive picture?


----------



## kazrich

Super Divette is 36mm without the crown. Super Dive is similar but 40mm . Ultra Dive as Super Dive also 40 mm but with large crown guards. All EPSA Super Compressors.


----------



## BestVintage4You

Enicar watch can be both Super Dive and Super Divette in 36mm case, as well, as in 40mm case. One difference is that Divette was made with priority to French market. In France in that time 50s-60s, and all over the world too, with help of Jacques Cousteau was popularized diving. By the way, Divette means nothing, except it's just a river in France and play of words. In my collection is one mint 100% original Enicar Sherpa Super-Dive in 36mm EPSA Super Compressor case, model 144-35-01 from 1966-68. Here is some photos of it.


----------



## emonje

Picked this one up couple of days back. 
Second hand was hitting the Minute hand & getting stuck when I got it.

Opening up the back & fixing it didn't take too long. Working nice so far.


----------



## Copeau

I join the club !


----------



## j.mcwhorter

Hi all! I just recently picked up this Enicar Sherpa Super Divette. However, I noticed the dial isn't quite like almost all other examples that I've seen on the internet. Underneath the "Enicar" up top it says "17 Jewels" as opposed to "Automatic." Also, the date wheel is black, not red. And it only says "Swiss Made" at the bottom, with no Tritium T's (either side or above the 6 o'clock marker). I'm under the impression this may be an early model? The caseback is very worn, but I believe the model number (?) is 125/004. I figured this would be the best place to get some insight on this watch. It's in remarkable shape and on the original beads of rice bracelet. The bezel rotates smoothly and it keeps great time. I had my watchmaker take a look at it and the rotor is a little sticky, but nothing a good service/cleaning won't take care of. Here's some pics of it! Thanks in advance for any info you guys can provide!


----------



## kazrich

Hello J. MCWHORTER -Welcome to the Enicar money pit :-!
Your Divette might be an early version circa 1964. If your caseback reads 125/004 I would imagine
the movement inside is AR 1125 which has 25 - 30 Jewels. So it's unclear why it's marked prominently on the dial as 17 jewels.
Do you have a clear picture of the back of the watch or movement ?
Enicar made many variations of all styles and many do show slight differences. The fact that your watch doesn't say Automatic may also
indicate that it's an early example.
If you observe the first advert in this link, the Super Divette watch shown ' New diving watch model for 1964 ' also doesn't say automatic. However it appears to have
some kind of coin edge case ( or maybe that's just the drawing ) - I've never seen one like that either.

Enicar Sherpa Diver (2 Crown Models) - The Spring Bar

Maybe the earlier Divette's didn't use tritium and still used radium lume ?
It's good that your internal bezel moves smoothly as they are very difficult to source .
Super Divette's are classy watches and wear really nicely - enjoy :-!


----------



## journeyforce

My Enicar sport arrived back from the watch maker and works like a champ

It is now dressed on a 18mm bond nato (seen in the last picture) because the leather strap(seen in the first pics) did not really cut it for me

The pics are a bit lame as I was taking them in a hurry


----------



## vandervenus

kazrich said:


> Hello J. MCWHORTER -Welcome to the Enicar money pit :-!


Haha, that totally cracked me up


----------



## vandervenus

Hi Journeyforce, beautiful piece, congrats!
I uses to own identical ones and was impressed by their wrist presence for such a modest case (34 or 35 mm if I remember correctly). I sold one it to a friend of mine because he needed "a simple, light weighted and no-******** watch". Still wears it daily.


----------



## journeyforce

kazrich said:


> Hello J. MCWHORTER -Welcome to the Enicar money pit :-!
> Your Divette might be an early version circa 1964. If your caseback reads 125/004 I would imagine
> the movement inside is AR 1125 which has 25 - 30 Jewels. So it's unclear why it's marked prominently on the dial as 17 jewels.
> Do you have a clear picture of the back of the watch or movement ?
> Enicar made many variations of all styles and many do show slight differences. The fact that your watch doesn't say Automatic may also
> indicate that it's an early example.
> If you observe the first advert in this link, the Super Divette watch shown ' New diving watch model for 1964 ' also doesn't say automatic. However it appears to have
> some kind of coin edge case ( or maybe that's just the drawing ) - I've never seen one like that either.
> 
> Enicar Sherpa Diver (2 Crown Models) - The Spring Bar
> 
> Maybe the earlier Divette's didn't use tritium and still used radium lume ?
> It's good that your internal bezel moves smoothly as they are very difficult to source .
> Super Divette's are classy watches and wear really nicely - enjoy :-!


Or Enicar did not bother with putting the T on the dial to indicate tritium. My 1950's Enicar sport has no T on the dial but the lume is not Radium (my watch maker confirmed it) I had originally thought it was Radium but looking closer I saw that the lume was just aged and there were no radium burns on the dial.

Perhaps these watches were for a market that did not mandate that a T or R be on the dial to indicate which lume it was?


----------



## journeyforce

vandervenus said:


> Hi Journeyforce, beautiful piece, congrats!
> I uses to own identical ones and was impressed by their wrist presence for such a modest case (34 or 35 mm if I remember correctly). I sold one it to a friend of mine because he needed "a simple, light weighted and no-******** watch". Still wears it daily.


Hello. Thanks. It is about 35mm without the crown and does wear fine.


----------



## j.mcwhorter

kazrich said:


> Hello J. MCWHORTER -Welcome to the Enicar money pit :-!
> Your Divette might be an early version circa 1964. If your caseback reads 125/004 I would imagine
> the movement inside is AR 1125 which has 25 - 30 Jewels. So it's unclear why it's marked prominently on the dial as 17 jewels.
> Do you have a clear picture of the back of the watch or movement ?
> Enicar made many variations of all styles and many do show slight differences. The fact that your watch doesn't say Automatic may also
> indicate that it's an early example.
> If you observe the first advert in this link, the Super Divette watch shown ' New diving watch model for 1964 ' also doesn't say automatic. However it appears to have
> some kind of coin edge case ( or maybe that's just the drawing ) - I've never seen one like that either.





journeyforce said:


> Or Enicar did not bother with putting the T on the dial to indicate tritium. My 1950's Enicar sport has no T on the dial but the lume is not Radium (my watch maker confirmed it) I had originally thought it was Radium but looking closer I saw that the lume was just aged and there were no radium burns on the dial.
> 
> Perhaps these watches were for a market that did not mandate that a T or R be on the dial to indicate which lume it was?


Interesting thought about the lume markings, or lack thereof. I actually came across that ad on The Spring Bar while doing some research before I made the purchase, and it was what really helped calm some nerves about whether or not it was authentic, especially up to that point not having seen a similarly laid out dial. I have a few shots of the caseback (albeit very worn down), I'm working on getting some shots of the movement when I can get together with my watchmaker.









I was taking photos just now, and when I moved to get a good close-up of the '125/004', I noticed something EXTRA FAINT right above it.









Any idea what those markings could be? Are they something that SHOULD be there? Can anyone decipher it?









I think I can make out 50XX1X. Here it is zoomed in and I tried to clean up the mess a bit.


----------



## j.mcwhorter

Movement photos from the seller:


----------



## kazrich

journeyforce said:


> Or Enicar did not bother with putting the T on the dial to indicate tritium. My 1950's Enicar sport has no T on the dial but the lume is not Radium (my watch maker confirmed it) I had originally thought it was Radium but looking closer I saw that the lume was just aged and there were no radium burns on the dial.
> 
> Perhaps these watches were for a market that did not mandate that a T or R be on the dial to indicate which lume it was?


Can I ask if your watchmaker confirmed tritium via the use of a Geiger counter or by intuition ? 
Your watch looks mid - late 50's or maybe very early 60's to me and I believe Enicar started using tritium from circa 1963 / 64ish. Your dial has a very radium look to the colour and texture.
Many, if not most radium dialled watches do not have radium burns on the dial. 
Enicar tritium tends to be very generously applied and looks like icing on a cake when examined closely.


----------



## kazrich

j.mcwhorter said:


> Movement photos from the seller:


Movement appears to show AR 1125 consistent with the case. Still unsure where 17 Jewels comes from.
See Ranfft

bidfun-db Archive: Watch Movements: Enicar 1125

You will note that Super Divette's are EPSA Super Compressors but do not show the Brevet nos. 314962 anywhere. 
However, the inside of the case back usually shows EPSA and the divers helmet.



The older single crown Divette ( not Super Divette ) usually
shows the month and year.

I was told that my own Super Divette was made in 1965 /66. It also has the lightly engraved 6 numbers. Mine clearly shows 731778 which tends
to show that yours is pretty early as it's a 5XXXXX series ?


----------



## Danny4

My sherpa jet


----------



## j.mcwhorter

kazrich said:


> Movement appears to show AR 1125 consistent with the case. Still unsure where 17 Jewels comes from.


Curiouser and Curiouser. I don't have a photo of it, but the inside of the caseback does not have the diver's helmet on mine. It does, however, say "Enicar Watch Co." like yours. Same format, just no diver.


----------



## kazrich

It's still probably correct. The inside of the case back on my 66 Sherpa Graph just reads ' Enicar Watch Co. SWISS. No mention of EPSA or divers helmet.
Earlier versions show a helmet and EPSA with month and date. However Sherpa Graphs all appear to stamped Brevet 314962 on the back.
Super Divette's don't mention this but are EPSA Super Compressor cased.
Enicar , like most watch makers would not have expected that collectors would make a forensic examination of their product 50 years after production, so they
were constantly updating and using old stock as they saw fit. The quality would be the same and only a watchmaker would ever read it. Even he wouldn't be bothered
whether a caseback had a divers helmet. My guess is that he also wouldn't even know or care what EPSA was.


----------



## Sigmasailor

Came across this old Enicar (saved it from the bin actually) and would like to know what it is.
It is a gold piece (that seems to be rare with Enicar?) with a different back of any other Enicat I could find. The dat ate the 6 oçlock position is also out of the ordinary.

Does anyone here know what watch this is. I did manage to identify the band, strap or bracelet (what is the correct term for this?): it's a gold capped Fixo-Flex-s 585.


----------



## hns-panama

Welcome to the Pit, j.mcwhorter 

What you have is most likely have is a lower priced option for the Super Divette. I have a 1145 with 17 jewels and it is marked with Star Jewels. So I suspect that it was the excuse to offer that model at a lower cost than the 25, 30, or 33 jeweled versions. Enicar was noted for their "marketing." 

One thing I note on your movement. The rotor says Star Jewels and is a different color gold. It most likely is from a 1145 caliber movement as that branding wasn't used on the 1124/5/6 movements. 

The faint number is the serial number for the watch. 

Enjoy.


----------



## hns-panama

How do you know it is original?

From what I have seen and looking at these photos, this is a Super Divette with a replacement dial. Telltale sign is that Enicar would not have confused their ordering system using the same case back number as a Super Divette. Dealers around the world would have been pissed off receiving the wrong watch especially since the Supers were higher priced.

For reference: Super Dives are marked 144-35-02.

The dials are almost the same size between the Super Dives and Super Divettes so it is an easy switch.

What reference are you quoting about Divette's being named for a river in France? They were sold around the world.

Highly doubtful that it is original. In fact, I would bank on it being a Franken given the case size is wrong and the case back number is for a Super Divette. Enicar was weird with marketing but not with their model numbers.

Perhaps someone knows of an advertisement showing the model number?



BestVintage4You said:


> Enicar watch can be both Super Dive and Super Divette in 36mm case, as well, as in 40mm case. One difference is that Divette was made with priority to French market. In France in that time 50s-60s, and all over the world too, with help of Jacques Cousteau was popularized diving. By the way, Divette means nothing, except it's just a river in France and play of words. In my collection is one mint 100% original Enicar Sherpa Super-Dive in 36mm EPSA Super Compressor case, model 144-35-01 from 1966-68. Here is some photos of it.
> 
> View attachment 8874170
> 
> 
> View attachment 8874194
> 
> 
> View attachment 8874290
> 
> 
> View attachment 8874210
> 
> 
> View attachment 8874234
> 
> 
> View attachment 8874250


----------



## hns-panama

It is most likely a 1145 caliber movement. Get it serviced...

Case is most likely 14 or 18k gold. Need to see all the case markings.

Calendar at 6 isn't that rare. Enicar sold a lot of watches in many markets. Far East especially and even here in Panama.

Is that a hole in the case back? If so, I would have that repaired before wearing it. Easy fix for a good case restorer. I would only send the back for restoration. Leave the rest alone other than a nice microfiber cloth polish.

Gold cases were produced rather handily by EPSA. Search earlier in the thread about that. I posted something about their production line.

Nice dress watch. Very nice, actually.

Though the band is probably not original. I would replace that with something more befitting like a thin croc strap. But that is just me.



Sigmasailor said:


> Came across this old Enicar (saved it from the bin actually) and would like to know what it is.
> It is a gold piece (that seems to be rare with Enicar?) with a different back of any other Enicat I could find. The dat ate the 6 oçlock position is also out of the ordinary.
> 
> Does anyone here know what watch this is. I did manage to identify the band, strap or bracelet (what is the correct term for this?): it's a gold capped Fixo-Flex-s 585.
> 
> View attachment 9159842
> View attachment 9159850
> View attachment 9159858


----------



## hns-panama

Very nice!

By the way, the V in the model number stands for the case back type. The little tab on the back rides up a small ramp on the case in order to open it. I have two like that.



emonje said:


> Picked this one up couple of days back.
> Second hand was hitting the Minute hand & getting stuck when I got it.
> 
> Opening up the back & fixing it didn't take too long. Working nice so far.
> 
> View attachment 8875746
> 
> View attachment 8875754
> 
> View attachment 8875762
> 
> View attachment 8875770


----------



## Sigmasailor

No, it's not a hole but a smallish dent. One problem: I see no way of opening the watch. No 'beginning' to put in a screw driver or knife: nothing. The back is all smooth. I dare not touch it since I have no idea what I would be doing anyway.
I'm already sure it's 18k (750 mark) gold; see next picture. Agree on the band; it doesn't do the watch any good.

Can polishing with some car polish and a microfiber cloth do it any harm? I would give that a try.


----------



## hns-panama

Watchmaker can handle it. It is a very, very small indent in the case back or case allowing a case knife to get a grip.

18K gold cases are an easy polish to some extent and again, I would have a watchmaker do it appropriately. Meaning not like new. Leave in some of the deeper scratches due to over-polishing reduces value. A light patina is better assuming you want to go that way. Many here would say leave it as is. 

Good to hear the hole is not through the back!


----------



## hns-panama

Sigmasailor,

Upon a closer look at the back of the case, I see what might be an indent curve to the right of the Enicar logo by the upper lug. Could be the lighting though. Suggest that you look all around the case with a magnifying glass or loupe and note any differences in the space between the back and the case. It may not be very apparent with just your eyes.


----------



## kazrich

Well done and many thanks crazyfist
A quarter of a million views on this thread !!!! :-!


----------



## QWatchQ

My recent purchase, a SeaPearl with cool looking turtle lugs... with SuperCompressor back and AR 1010 movement. Circa 1957.


----------



## j.mcwhorter

QWatchQ said:


> My recent purchase, a SeaPearl with cool looking turtle lugs... with SuperCompressor back and AR 1010 movement. Circa 1957.


WHOA!!! That thing is awesome looking! Nice find!

Also....Thanks to everyone for the information regarding my Divette, nice to find a community for such a funky watch brand that I hadn't even heard of a few weeks ago.


----------



## LeCorb

What a beautiful thread... hope my small collection can contribute to this vast collection of beautiful Enicars

Sherpa OPS & Sherpa Super Dive 








Sherpa OPS (2nd Generation)








Sherpa Super Dive








Sherpa Guide, 1967 (incl. papers)








Sherpa Jet II (with SuperJet dial)








Regards
LeCorb


----------



## kazrich

Welcome LeCorb and thanks for sharing those lovely Super Compressors !
Not sure what to make of the last one though. What size is it without the crown ?
Is it an early Super Jet hands with later Super Jet dial and 40mm without crown ?
Very nice pics by the way.


----------



## LeCorb

Dear kazrich
tanks a lot for your kind words.
You are absolutely right, the last one is not entirely consistent. It tends to be a Jet in the 2nd generation case having a diametre of 37,5mm w/o crown but obviously it is waiting for the correct dial.
A complete Jet 2nd Gen with the fitting jet dial is quite a rare bird while surprisingly you find them with the super jet dial more often. 
I had nice discussions with several long time Enicar collectors/experts. Of course some share the opinion that it is a franken put together in the last years when prices for vintage Enicars were rising.
But there where others who underlined that at in the last days of Enicar the company itself was putting together remaining parts. 
Unfortunately I have no papers and I only have the words of the former owner who had it for approx. a decade in his collection. 
But since I like the overall appearance of this Jet and I am not planning to sell her I hope it is okay to post some pictures.


----------



## hns-panama

The key is the case back number. They didn't mix those as their dealers ordered from them.

As for mixing parts, it was most likely in the 70s before they went under. In the 1960s, when most of these watches were made, they were still viable. How many do you see with ETA movements?

Most probably, the watches were used as intended and water got in or the watch damaged and the dial replaced with something handy.



LeCorb said:


> Dear kazrich
> tanks a lot for your kind words.
> You are absolutely right, the last one is not entirely consistent. It tends to be a Jet in the 2nd generation case having a diametre of 37,5mm w/o crown but obviously it is waiting for the correct dial.
> A complete Jet 2nd Gen with the fitting jet dial is quite a rare bird while surprisingly you find them with the super jet dial more often.
> I had nice discussions with several long time Enicar collectors/experts. Of course some share the opinion that it is a franken put together in the last years when prices for vintage Enicars were rising.
> But there where others who underlined that at in the last days of Enicar the company itself was putting together remaining parts.
> Unfortunately I have no papers and I only have the words of the former owner who had it for approx. a decade in his collection.
> But since I like the overall appearance of this Jet and I am not planning to sell her I hope it is okay to post some pictures.


----------



## hns-panama

I thought it would be a good idea to compare notes on Sherpa double crown case back numbers. Here is what I have found for the divers:

Super Divette: 125-04 / 144-35-01 / 145-003 / 145-004 / 165-35-05
Super Dive: 125-006 / 144-35-02 / 167-08-02
OPS: 144-35-03A (Black Case) 165-35-03 (probably the dealer marked an "A" on their order form to denote an OPS.)
Ultra Dive 144-35-03 / 165-35-03

Thoughts? Additions?

Guides and Jets are not too much of a worry. 

By the way, Super Jet dials are slightly larger than a Jet. I wonder if the same holds true for the Super Dive and Super Divette. I'd be surprised if they were not different.


----------



## baolamhuy

Hi everyone,

was wondering if someone in here know about the attched Enicar watch?


----------



## hns-panama

Enicar 690 movement probably from the 70s with a gold plated case.

690s were made with and without a center seconds hand.

Nice looking watch.



baolamhuy said:


> Hi everyone,
> 
> was wondering if someone in here know about the attched Enicar watch?


----------



## kazrich

hns-panama said:


> I thought it would be a good idea to compare notes on Sherpa double crown case back numbers. Here is what I have found for the divers:
> 
> Super Divette: 125-04 / 144-35-01 / 145-003 / 145-004 / 165-35-05
> Super Dive: 144-35-02 / 167-08-02
> OPS: 144-35-03A (Black Case) 165-35-03 (probably the dealer marked an "A" on their order form to denote an OPS.)
> Ultra Dive 144-35-03 / 165-35-03
> 
> Thoughts? Additions?
> 
> Guides and Jets are not too much of a worry.
> 
> By the way, Super Jet dials are slightly larger than a Jet. I wonder if the same holds true for the Super Dive and Super Divette. I'd be surprised if they were not different.


Hi Hunter ;
I keep both a single crown Divette ( approx. 1962/3 ish with external bezel ) and a twin crown Super Divette ( approx. 1965/ 66 ish with internal bezel )

Both are Brevet 314962 Super Compressors. I think they both have automatic AR 1145 movements yet the earlier single crown version shows a model number 100/2165 BANXS
which is consistent with other similar watches i've seen. Seapearl, automatic, Sherpa case, rotating bezel, sweep second hand ?
The twin crown shows 144 35 01


----------



## hns-panama

Yep. That follows what I have seen.

I added another Super Dive reference number to the list: 125-006



kazrich said:


> Hi Hunter ;
> I keep both a single crown Divette ( approx. 1962/3 ish with external bezel ) and a twin crown Super Divette ( approx. 1965/ 66 ish with internal bezel )
> 
> Both are Brevet 314962 Super Compressors. I think they both have automatic AR 1145 movements yet the earlier single crown version shows a model number 100/2165 BANXS
> which is consistent with other similar watches i've seen. Seapearl, automatic, Sherpa case, rotating bezel, sweep second hand ?
> The twin crown shows 144 35 01


----------



## jimialpinastar

Hi All,
I have an Enicar Sherpa Guide 33 which I am looking to get refurbished.
The main part that I would like advice on is the bezel. My watch has been painted black all round, is this part of the case or can it be removed does anyone know please?
Any advice gratefully received!
Thanks


----------



## hns-panama

Post pictures on a hosting site and link to it so we can see exactly what your referring to. 

The bezel is removable and you may have to buy a donor watch or find the part on eBay. If memory serves, I saw one not that long ago. 

Apparently, the upside to rising Enicar prices is that parts are now worth looking around for.


----------



## Aashdin

This is one of my Enicars with a "tiger eye" dial. Funky retro look


----------



## Derekthebeard

What do all you enicar masterminds think of this super jet? Does it look like a franken watch, a jet in a gmt car missing the bezel? Or does that metal bezel come off of the super jet model and maybe it was lost. Thanks and lemme know!


----------



## vandervenus

Derekthebeard said:


> What do all you enicar masterminds think of this super jet? Does it look like a franken watch, a jet in a gmt car missing the bezel? Or does that metal bezel come off of the super jet model and maybe it was lost. Thanks and lemme know!


Hi Derek, to me this looks original and certainly not like a frankenwatch. The outer metal ring is a piece that is pressed on the case, so yours is obviously lost. The thing is that it's virtualy impossible to find as a spare part. I know of collectors that have bought donorwatches just for that one missing part. Or maybe -and this is something I have never investigated- you can have a goldsmith make a replacement bezelring. Don't know if it is possible, but it might be worth checking it out.


----------



## vandervenus

hns-panama said:


> Yep. That follows what I have seen.
> 
> I added another Super Dive reference number to the list: 125-006


My OPS has reference 144/35/03A and Brevet 314962.


----------



## Derekthebeard

vandervenus said:


> Derekthebeard said:
> 
> 
> 
> What do all you enicar masterminds think of this super jet? Does it look like a franken watch, a jet in a gmt car missing the bezel? Or does that metal bezel come off of the super jet model and maybe it was lost. Thanks and lemme know!
> 
> 
> 
> Hi Derek, to me this looks original and certainly not like a frankenwatch. The outer metal ring is a piece that is pressed on the case, so yours is obviously lost. The thing is that it's virtualy impossible to find as a spare part. I know of collectors that have bought donorwatches just for that one missing part. Or maybe -and this is something I have never investigated- you can have a goldsmith make a replacement bezelring. Don't know if it is possible, but it might be worth checking it out.
Click to expand...

Does anything else look out of place to you at all? The gmt hand looks like it may have been touched up on the tip. The face seems to move a little bit when pulling the time crown in and out, have you ever heard of this issue?


----------



## vandervenus

Derekthebeard said:


> Does anything else look out of place to you at all? The gmt hand looks like it may have been touched up on the tip. The face seems to move a little bit when pulling the time crown in and out, have you ever heard of this issue?


I've seen the yellow tip on the gmt hand before. Also seen it in orange. But there's something else that strikes me as odd now: the set of hands is MkI, but the large crowns don't match with that. Usually, the MkI Super Jet is equipped with the small crowns. So, maybe a MkI dial and hands set was transported in a newer EPSA case, that was incomplete because of the missing outer bezel ring. It might explain the fact that the dial and movement appear a little loose when pulling the crown.


----------



## hns-panama

If the dial moves while operating the crown, most likely it is loose or nonexistent case clamps. Open it up -- carefully -- and have a look at them. also, check the movement to see if it is a 1146. Should be but with Enicar these days, almost anything out of the ordinary is "rare."


----------



## horology_biology

Derekthebeard said:


> What do all you enicar masterminds think of this super jet? Does it look like a franken watch, a jet in a gmt car missing the bezel? Or does that metal bezel come off of the super jet model and maybe it was lost. Thanks and lemme know!


There is a guy on Ebay selling NOS Jet cases at the moment.


----------



## horology_biology

A few of my favorite Enicars that I own 

Also a nice group shot on an original 1970's Enicar store display which I was super lucky enough to stumble across 
















Sherpa Graph MK1








Enicar Tiger PVD on a new Zulu








Enicar SuperTest Chronometer (not officially)








Enicar Sherpa Guide GMT


----------



## kazrich

Hello horology_biology ( bit of a twung twister that !) and thanks for sharing your addiction with us . You have a super collection there!








We do understand exactly how you feel and can refer you for counselling if your condition persists - but why fight it - You only live once







.
That early 70's advert is very interesting. Was it taken from a retailer or did someone set it up at an exhibition or trade fair maybe ? Whoever did the visual merchandising should be fired.
If that's a Sherpa Graph at the top right corner it looks a bit strange ? The case looks chunky and rounded and the dial registers looks deeper than usual ? Maybe a very wide angled lens has distorted it.
Also the display looks a bit jumbled and a couple of watches almost look late 50's early sixties ? Also Interesting straps including Nato and Zulu styles. An unusual image.
Great pics of your own watches - very nice . Keep em coming !


----------



## horology_biology

Thanks Kazrich.

Maybe I didn't explain it right. The pic is from my living room it's my display  

I was lucky to find the display unit on a second hand website here in Holland.

Regarding the Graph it's just the filters and the picture I had it checked out by a few people now and all is well


----------



## jimialpinastar

hns-panama said:


> Post pictures on a hosting site and link to it so we can see exactly what your referring to.
> 
> The bezel is removable and you may have to buy a donor watch or find the part on eBay. If memory serves, I saw one not that long ago.
> 
> Apparently, the upside to rising Enicar prices is that parts are now worth looking around for.


Here it is. I would like to replace the bezel. Is this possible please??


----------



## horology_biology

jimialpinastar said:


> Here it is. I would like to replace the bezel. Is this possible please??


It is totally possible. I actually noticed 2 Guide bezels sold recently on eBay. I think you should as it looks like someone just coloured yours in with a magic marker  (Maybe the dial also).


----------



## jimialpinastar

horology_biology said:


> It is totally possible. I actually noticed 2 Guide bezels sold recently on eBay. I think you should as it looks like someone just coloured yours in with a magic marker  (Maybe the dial also).


The black outer piece has been painted in black. The red pointer has also been badly painted. I will keep a look out...


----------



## hns-panama

First, here is your replacement dial:

Enicar 1 Zifferblatt | eBay

Second, the bezels are out there and I suspect a few NOS will pop up now that parts are actually worth the time to find and sell.

Third, I bought a set of Guide hands from the French seller just for my Jet. I bought two of the later version Guide and Jet 24 hour hands when I saw them for sale by Peter Wyse, the same good guy who has the dial for sale above.

Lastly, no the parts are not for sale as they are going to be used for my watches. Just wanted to point out that it is possible to find these parts but you have to be patient.

Good luck!



jimialpinastar said:


> The black outer piece has been painted in black. The red pointer has also been badly painted. I will keep a look out...


----------



## horology_biology

hns-panama said:


> First, here is your replacement dial:
> 
> Second, the bezels are out there and I suspect a few NOS will pop up now that parts are actually worth the time to find and sell.
> 
> Third, I bought a set of Guide hands from the French seller just for my Jet. I bought two of the later version Guide and Jet 24 hour hands when I saw them for sale by Peter Wyse, the same good guy who has the dial for sale above.
> 
> Lastly, no the parts are not for sale as they are going to be used for my watches. Just wanted to point out that it is possible to find these parts but you have to be patient.
> 
> Good luck!


I concur, this ebay seller is one to follow. He always seems to have NOS Enicar goodies popping up from time to time


----------



## hns-panama

Thusday Giggle:

Reloj Enicar Star Jewels | eBay

If the $10k price doesn't grab you the $30k shipping will...

LOL. You've reached the Enicar Twilight Zone...


----------



## hns-panama

One more:

Vintage Enicar Sherpa Super Dive Epsa Super Compressor 1967 Very RARE Watch�� | eBay

Serviced by an expert... Oh, really? Do note the expert left a huge gap in the case back gasket! LOL.

I wrote this guy asking about the reference number on the case back. He confirmed 145-003. I then let him know that it is a Super Divette and not a Super Dive. He wasn't having any of it  He said that "everyone is an expert" so I gathered he received more than a few questions about it. Needless to say, I edited the Buyer's Guide about then case back numbers and be careful about modular parts, etc. Heh.

Given the $2k spread between a Super Divette and a Super Dive, it isn't hard to understand why he is listing the watch as the latter...

Epic fun in the Enicar Twilight Zone!

*

*


----------



## Stigmata

My early Guide in for a clean


----------



## DaBaeker

I just posted a rather long -semi humorous- 'rant' type of thread on the vintage forum but the basic issue was my 60s Enicar Sherpa 600 Date. It is in near minty condition and worked beautifully until the minute hand started to 'slip' and then finally it wouldn't keep time at all except the second hand (along with the movement) kept running away at exactly the same time as when the hands were rotating. From past experience I assumed it was an issue with a pinion-either a minute hand pinion or a main pinion coming loose. I put it in the 'to-be-repaired' box about 8 months ago (and believe me, I tried everything a non-professional could possibly try to rectify the problem short of a hammer- but I did not want to risk digging any further then simple exploration -which, of course I found nothing at all since it was 99% on the other side of dial. It sat on my night table for over a week with me trying daily to see if anything but the second hand ran. I did learn it has over a 40 hour power reserve just with the second hand running. And so, then I put it away.

So its eight months later and I decided I would take the Enicar Sherpa 600 Date to a new watchmaker I heard a good thing about. I assumed it was a straight forward issue and permanent until repaired. I picked up the watch and gave it a quarter wind (its automatic) to check that the second hand still turns. It did and then after a few minutes I noticed the minute hand moved. So I set the time and set it next to my 'new' '73 Omega cal 1310 seamaster quartz. (which I am loving) An hour later they both read 12:10. At 16:30 the Sherpa was 30 sec. slower. And its still running this minute at about 40sec slower then quartz.

can any Enicar expert (and I'm not implying this is something particular to enicar) explain to me how a watch with two slipping-or not revolving- hands can sit for 8months and then start up working perfectly as if there never was a problem?

My other thread was about obsessive watch collectors and [imaginary]watch genies, gods and elves but I really have to wonder sometimes as this is the third time this happened to me over the past 4 years. A '61 constellation went from freshly serviced to kaput with no luck resurrecting any action and a full refund for c/s and then over a year later it too started up and continues to run perfectly well as I have about 2-4 years left on the lubricants from the 3yr old cleaning.

I know about luck and my grandmother taught me to not look gift-horses in the mouth. But what gives? Anybody else have miraculous self-repair stories.

and because I love this thread so much my pics:

My 60s Sherpa GMT. I only wish this ones slipping second hand would self-repair. I've been dying to wear this lately. And the prices skyrocketing into the stratosphere? Gives me a kick to wear a watch nobody will notice that is selling for 10x what I paid.




And the self-repairing watch in question:





As I said its in close to minty condition and I snagged it for <$75 last winter. I knew nothing about Enicar then except the Sherpa 600 GMT, Jet and Divette. But I saw this seller posted Sherpa 600 and I immediately made a bid. [I had been reading about the famed EPSA 600 compressor case] I was actually shocked I won it that low. I kind of expected a low 3 figure like $125. So-i was pretty stoked and it really kicked off my interest in Enicar in general.

My only question (other then the self-repair thing) is I don't see very many Sherpa 600 dates around. I see many more Sherpa 300 dates but I think they are mostly from the 60s. I think my Sherpa 600 might be from late 60s to early 70s. I will post a pic of back if needed. Its in great condition (except the camera picks up every single tiny surface scratch and amplifies them) other then the more typical 600 case backs that are worn to the bone. How common were Sherpa 600 dates? I know they aren't 'rare'. (the dreaded 'rare, :roll But I'm curious about the different sherpa dates I see. Seems like I see more Divettes, Jets and GMTs but that is probably because they are selling for insane amounts compared to just a year or 2 back. But then I have seen traditionally cased ( not the asymmetrical helmut cases) Sherpa 300 dates sell for over $400 recently so it seems Enicar is finally gaining the respect it deserves, yes?

Here is my Sherpa 600 date case back. I have no idea how to interpret enicar numbers. As f as I can tell my number is 1067804:


----------



## Stigmata

They're pretty robust animals but they almost always have come to this part of their existence in disrepair.
A collector I know considers them bulletproof.
I've seen enough to know they're most certainly not bulletproof.
Most have come from Indonesia and have had a tough life doing what they were built to be worn for.

In your case mate! Fantastic find! Just make sure it gets the attention it needs if you're going to wear it.


----------



## kazrich

Stigmata said:


> View attachment 9368530
> 
> 
> MucMy early Guide in for a clean


Too large for my wrists but that's epic |>"


----------



## EDL77

I just went thru some of my dads old boxes..and found some watches..in there was an old Enicar...still works...
Dad was into watches died when I was 17..
I'm 60 now...would like to give this watch a service.
Does anyone know a watchmaker that specializes in this brand? Or can anyone do it
Thx in advance!


----------



## kazrich

Hello EDL77. Well done !
Any competent watchmaker ( not a battery changer ) can service your fathers old Enicar. Looks late 50's / early 60's. Good luck


----------



## EDL77

> Hello EDL77. Well done !
> Any competent watchmaker ( not a battery changer ) can service your fathers old Enicar. Looks late 50's / early 60's. Good luck


Thx Kazrich! Great to know...! Appreciated!


----------



## Freddyark

I recently bought a job lot of watches in order to get my hands on a vintage omega. Included in the job lot was the usual collection of broken mechanical and Quartz watches, but one watch in particular immediately gained my interest. I gather it's an enicar Sherpa seapearl, I think dating from 1962 and an 1120 calibre (although I haven't had the back off yet). Serial number on the rear of the case is 314962. Looks like a possible redial as the dial is in great condition and has lume dots but no T next to Swiss made. Perhaps the dial is original, but the lume was added later? I've added some (poor quality) photos to show off the watch. I actually prefer it to the omega, so will be wearing it with pride. Any thoughts/observations on the watch gratefully received.


----------



## werc2

Here's my Sherpa Ops black. Any idea on value?


----------



## werc2

^ got anxious and sent to eBay to see what the market says.


----------



## kazrich

Freddyark said:


> I recently bought a job lot of watches in order to get my hands on a vintage omega. Included in the job lot was the usual collection of broken mechanical and Quartz watches, but one watch in particular immediately gained my interest. I gather it's an enicar Sherpa seapearl, I think dating from 1962 and an 1120 calibre (although I haven't had the back off yet). Serial number on the rear of the case is 314962. Looks like a possible redial as the dial is in great condition and has lume dots but no T next to Swiss made. Perhaps the dial is original, but the lume was added later? I've added some (poor quality) photos to show off the watch. I actually prefer it to the omega, so will be wearing it with pride. Any thoughts/observations on the watch gratefully received.


Hello Freddyark, that's a very nice watch ! 
314962 is not the serial number it's the Brevet ( patent ) number that denotes that your watch case was made by EPSA with Enicar's unique 14 facet
bayonet release Super Compressor back . In essence it's a wolf in sheep's clothing , and when new capable of static water resistance of 10 ATM ( 330 ft - the height of Big Ben ) - keep it dry now !
In the late 50's and early 60's Enicar swapped model names between Seapearl, Sherpa's and Sherpa and they look similar. 
The lume on the hands looks correct and original from your pics. I also think the dial looks original.
I keep a 34mm without crown Seapearl that dates to 1958. The dial also looks very clean but under magnification you can see the ageing . 
Don't attempt to remove the back unless you have the correct tools - Leave it to a watchmaker.
Your watch may pre date Tritium so won't show the 'T'.
Here's my 58 Seapearl also with a 314962 case and clover leaf back


----------



## Freddyark

Thanks for the information Kazrich, I like the look of your watch too. So I can assure the lume is Radium and the watch dates before 1960, unless it was added later during a service? I've been trying to find another with the same dial as mine, but they all seem to have 'Incabloc' or '17 jewels' under 'Sherpa'. I'm assuming there are many different dial styles, is there any way to date from the dial, or do I need the serial number from the movement?


----------



## kazrich

Hi freddyark , Here's a few clues to dating your watch.
1. Late 50's - early 60's the name Enicar is signed straight through the planet Saturn. 
2. Enicar pioneered the Ultrasonic cleaning process and proudly mentioned Ultrasonic on earlier models. They phased out mentioning it on the dial on later models.
3. The Dauphine hour and minute hands on your watch are consistent with a late 50's Enicar sports watch.
4. I have a similar watch with Sherpa on the dial, and like yours Sherpa's ( not Sherpa ) on the case back. Many with this strange configuration exist. They are correct.
5. Mine also has the earlier open 4 leaf clover on the case back. When the case is closed the '1' lines up with the crown. When open the 'O' indicates open. 314962 indicates that it's a EPSA Enicar bayonet release.
I can't see any evidence of either the watch hands or the lume 'plots' being re lumed from what I can see in your pics - that's what 60 year old radium lume looks like. Mine's similar.
The inside case back of my own early Sherpa clearly shows the EPSA Super Compressor divers helmet and 12-57 ( December 1957 ). Mine has ' turtle back ' lugs but I think your watch is late 50's.


----------



## dalrymple

Hello,

I'm new in this forum and it's been only a few months since I started to have interest in vintage watches... Recently I've inherited a few watches and one of the is an Enicar.

I took this Enicar along with the other watches to a watch repair in my town (Sao Paulo, Brazil) and they asked about $500 to restore it, since it's not keeping time correctly.

Do you have any information on this watch and any opinion on whether it is worth restoring it for that price?

Thanks so much in advance.


----------



## dalrymple

Another image of the same watch above... It is written 1090 / 12 G in the back.


----------



## dalrymple

PS: I'm sorry for the poor images...


----------



## kazrich

dalrymple said:


> PS: I'm sorry for the poor images...


Your watch appears to date from the late 50's or early 60's but has very little value in that condition. Your watchmaker probably didn't want the hassle to restore it.
I would imagine it may be worth $ 10 - $ 25 for parts only.


----------



## rafbid99

Hi J,

Certainly an early model, with the split marker at 12 on the bezel, and the broad markers at 5, 15 etc.

Possibly an AR1140 movement.


----------



## Freddyark

kazrich said:


> Hi freddyark , Here's a few clues to dating your watch.
> 1. Late 50's - early 60's the name Enicar is signed straight through the planet Saturn.
> 2. Enicar pioneered the Ultrasonic cleaning process and proudly mentioned Ultrasonic on earlier models. They phased out mentioning it on the dial on later models.
> 3. The Dauphine hour and minute hands on your watch are consistent with a late 50's Enicar sports watch.
> 4. I have a similar watch with Sherpa on the dial, and like yours Sherpa's ( not Sherpa ) on the case back. Many with this strange configuration exist. They are correct.
> 5. Mine also has the earlier open 4 leaf clover on the case back. When the case is closed the '1' lines up with the crown. When open the 'O' indicates open. 314962 indicates that it's a EPSA Enicar bayonet release.
> I can't see any evidence of either the watch hands or the lume 'plots' being re lumed from what I can see in your pics - that's what 60 year old radium lume looks like. Mine's similar.
> The inside case back of my own early Sherpa clearly shows the EPSA Super Compressor divers helmet and 12-57 ( December 1957 ). Mine has ' turtle back ' lugs but I think your watch is late 50's.


Thanks Kazrich, some really good information. I notice my watch has both seapearl and Sherpas on the back of the case, but I've seen a few others like that too. Im having the back taken off shortly, so should be able to get an accurate date. I'll post some photos of the movement when I do.


----------



## hns-panama

Enicar 1292 movement. Very robust and worth servicing and wearing with pride imagine the stories it could tell you if it could speak...

Lightly clean the case perhaps replace the crystal. Unless you know what you are doing, have the polishing and crystal replacement done by a watchmaker. Lose the bracelet and go with a nice croc strap. Brown or black.

Enjoy.

Values are not done here. Ebay...



dalrymple said:


> Another image of the same watch above... It is written 1090 / 12 G in the back.
> View attachment 9448578


----------



## Marconi Motet

I recently bought a Enicar Sherpa Divette. Unfortunately the bezel has been replaced. 
However I really like this watch. Do you guys think it´s possible to get hold of a original bezel?


----------



## internet.interface

Enicar gurus,

Another parts question....I bought an Enicar Sherpa Guide 600 GMT, but it appears that one of the crowns is not original. One has the grid as the background for the enicar logo and the other one just has the logo on a smooth surface without the lines. I think my era watch should have no grid. Are there any parts suppliers, or does anyone have a spare Sherpa crown they want to part with? Ebay has some crowns in Germany, but they are all too small. 
The other problem is a bezel that does not turn, but I will let my watchmaker deal with that, assuming he does not crack the crystal.


----------



## hns-panama

eBay...

I have seen a bezel for your watch and not that long ago. Enicar parts are starting to become a lot more valuable due to the price increases for Sherpas. I guess that is a good thing but I've been focused on older Citizens as of late...

You have another option for the crowns. Buy a NOS Jet case with the bigger crowns and sell the remaining for parts. eBay for that too.



internet.interface said:


> Enicar gurus,
> 
> Another parts question....I bought an Enicar Sherpa Guide 600 GMT, but it appears that one of the crowns is not original. One has the grid as the background for the enicar logo and the other one just has the logo on a smooth surface without the lines. I think my era watch should have no grid. Are there any parts suppliers, or does anyone have a spare Sherpa crown they want to part with? Ebay has some crowns in Germany, but they are all too small.
> The other problem is a bezel that does not turn, but I will let my watchmaker deal with that, assuming he does not crack the crystal.
> 
> View attachment 9545594


----------



## FreddyNorton

These watches are just amazing I hope to get one someday and will treasure it im sure.


----------



## internet.interface

hns-panama said:


> eBay...
> 
> I have seen a bezel for your watch and not that long ago. Enicar parts are starting to become a lot more valuable due to the price increases for Sherpas. I guess that is a good thing but I've been focused on older Citizens as of late...
> 
> You have another option for the crowns. Buy a NOS Jet case with the bigger crowns and sell the remaining for parts. eBay for that too.


Thank you. I already have a "saved search" on ebay for the term "enicar crown", but no dice thus far. I thought there was maybe a hoarder of vintage bits hiding somewhere....The Enicar Jet watches seem to start at $2000, so I can probably live with the mismatched crown, unless I see a watch being parted out.

BTW, I just measured my crown. The dimensions are 6.15 mm in diameter and about 3mm tall. I need the one with the logo and a smooth finish (not the cross-hatched finish).


----------



## hns-panama

A NOS Jet case is $260.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/ENICAR-Sher...573597?hash=item1c6cde03dd:g:2xoAAOxy63FS26S0



internet.interface said:


> Thank you. I already have a "saved search" on ebay for the term "enicar crown", but no dice thus far. I thought there was maybe a hoarder of vintage bits hiding somewhere....The Enicar Jet watches seem to start at $2000, so I can probably live with the mismatched crown, unless I see a watch being parted out.
> 
> BTW, I just measured my crown. The dimensions are 6.15 mm in diameter and about 3mm tall. I need the one with the logo and a smooth finish (not the cross-hatched finish).


----------



## horology_biology

There is a German seller on eBay that sells the exact crowns you want for cheap (around $12 each). He lists them every now and again.

I bought one from him for my Guide a few months ago and it correct for the watch. Just keep an eye on your saved listing search and it will pop up again soon.


----------



## internet.interface

found a crown, thanks WUS! Got a PM where someone had a spare.


----------



## KasperDK

Hey guys and girls, what can you tell me about this movement?


----------



## hns-panama

What is the number under the balance wheel?

Dial side photo?



KasperDK said:


> Hey guys and girls, what can you tell me about this movement?
> 
> View attachment 9593554


----------



## KasperDK

Couldn't see the number, as a matter of fact i couldn't even tell if there was anything there (Usually i'm quite good at reading those).

The front is this one:


----------



## hns-panama

Enicar Caliber 1012.

Nice example!



KasperDK said:


> Couldn't see the number, as a matter of fact i couldn't even tell if there was anything there (Usually i'm quite good at reading those).
> 
> The front is this one:
> 
> View attachment 9602578


----------



## KasperDK

Thanks Ranfft.de says around 1960, i thought it older than that going by the dial - I like it though, so i guess i have to look for a matching crown, cos this one is well used.


----------



## kazrich

I'm really enjoying the early EPSA cased Super Compressors.
I recently picked up this single crown Divette, and what a beauty it is when handled and seen it the flesh.
We often get used to vendors showing forensically detailed images of their 50 year old watches - and when they arrive, to the naked eye they almost look new !








Photo's really don't do justice to this lovely early Divette. The red inner pointer has faded over time and from the vendor's pics I assumed that the bezel was black. It's not. It's an amazing metallic titanium silver grey.
The watch is difficult to age when considering the following.

1 No 'T' tritium marking that I can see, so maybe radium lume ?
2. Clover leaf early 60's design 314962 SC case back
3. Star Jewels stamped on the AR 1145 automatic movement
4. Quick set date 
5. Cross hatched Saturn crown
6. Enicar signed under Saturn on dial
7. Ultrasonic not mentioned on the dial but is marked on the case back.
8. Fat 'tuning fork' hour and minutes hands

I've seen another 2 of these Divette's that are exactly the same apart from one of them did show the tritium 'T' the other did not.
Anyone like to hazard a guess at the date ? I'm thinking 1963 / 64 ish ?
Don't understand why these early Sherpa's are valued at barely 30% of their larger SC counterparts. Don't really care as I'm buying up the good un's



















It's getting to know it's Ultrasonic EPSA SC cased mates


----------



## vandervenus

kazrich said:


> I'm really enjoying the early EPSA cased Super Compressors.
> I recently picked up this single crown Divette, and what a beauty it is when handled and seen it the flesh.


Congrats on yet another beautiful Enicar! It looks amazing in that box, with the grey tropic strap. 
I was surprised to read your comment on the color of the bezel. Always figured it was black, like the Guide and Aquagraph.


----------



## Hessu

I got today my third 70's Star Jewel, a green one. Case number 140-54-05. Two others are 140-54-07. Slidgt difference on the case. All have cal 161.


----------



## brawijaya80

Lost love in bloom again.........could not resist, if you find this clean enicar come to me..........although the price is above average I have been selling..could not resist, if you find this clean enicar come to me


----------



## aero-engineer

My only Enicar - Sherpa GUIDE 600


----------



## internet.interface

That Sherpa is in an amazing condition. The bezel looks completely intact! I am still hunting for a proper crown for mine. And a watchmaker who is brave enough to unfreeze the outside rotating bezel.


----------



## aero-engineer

I am looking for mint hands set...


----------



## jvecer

Wow, what a beauty ... is this an MK3 or MK4?


----------



## kazrich

Who nicked the rest of it , but only one left so be quick ! :-d

VINTAGE ENICAR SHERPA OPS MILITARY AUTOMATIC. DIAL PARTS. EXCELLENT CONDITION. | eBay


----------



## jaspert

My only Enicar. Just came back from my watchmaker after a service. The bezel is almost ghosting around the edge.


----------



## watchdaddy1

jtbr said:


> My only Enicar. Just came back from my watchmaker after a service. The bezel is almost ghosting around the edge.
> 
> View attachment 10034538
> 
> 
> View attachment 10034546


Damn that's !

Sent from Galaxy S6 Edge via Tapacrap


----------



## govea

WOW


----------



## Jtragic

Hi guys, need some help with this one. Frankly, I never do this, but I ended up winning this on the bay. Apparently, at some point, I put what I thought was a lowball bid that ended up winning. I actually had forgotten about the bid until some time later when I got the alert on my phone. I did no research on the watch, can't really find anything on the model, could be a Franken, I have no clue. I happened to see it one night like the way it looked and ended up with it.

It's been running spotty, stopping every so often, so really it's useless right now as a timepiece. I got a refund for the watch and I guess the seller has been having a problem with it being a boomerang since he told me to just keep it. So now I need to know if it's worth having it serviced, or if there's a compatible aftermarket movement I can just throw in it. The movement is marked AR1145, but the rotor is marked as 33 jewels, and what I've found on the pink pages is the 1145 is supposed to be 24J? I'm at a loss right now so any input is most appreciated.


----------



## Dan S

Could it be that someone threw on a replacement rotor from the wrong movement? It's interesting that the dial says "STAR JEWELS", where the two words have two different fonts.


----------



## Jtragic

badbackdan said:


> Could it be that someone threw on a replacement rotor from the wrong movement? It's interesting that the dial says "STAR JEWELS", where the two words have two different fonts.


The STAR JEWELS made me at first think it was a bad redial, but images of other similar dials seems to show that's how the text was printed. The rotor OTOH could definitely be from another watch although the design is the same as the 1145.


----------



## Dan S

Would you mind posting a link of where you have seen this watch? The external tachymeter bezel is unusual, especially since it's not a chronograph.

Edit: Perhaps it would have been better to start this as a new thread, since this thread seem to be more a "club" for people to post their Enicar watches.


----------



## hns-panama

Franken for sure.

Case is not an Enicar.

I have a 1145 Supertest 33 jewel example. Odds are the movement and dial are from a gold cased Enicar Ocean Pearl cased watch.



Jtragic said:


> Hi guys, need some help with this one. Frankly, I never do this, but I ended up winning this on the bay. Apparently, at some point, I put what I thought was a lowball bid that ended up winning. I actually had forgotten about the bid until some time later when I got the alert on my phone. I did no research on the watch, can't really find anything on the model, could be a Franken, I have no clue. I happened to see it one night like the way it looked and ended up with it.
> 
> It's been running spotty, stopping every so often, so really it's useless right now as a timepiece. I got a refund for the watch and I guess the seller has been having a problem with it being a boomerang since he told me to just keep it. So now I need to know if it's worth having it serviced, or if there's a compatible aftermarket movement I can just throw in it. The movement is marked AR1145, but the rotor is marked as 33 jewels, and what I've found on the pink pages is the 1145 is supposed to be 24J? I'm at a loss right now so any input is most appreciated.
> 
> View attachment 10044842
> 
> View attachment 10044850
> 
> View attachment 10044858
> 
> View attachment 10044866


----------



## Jtragic

badbackdan said:


> Would you mind posting a link of where you have seen this watch? The external tachymeter bezel is unusual, especially since it's not a chronograph.
> 
> Edit: Perhaps it would have been better to start this as a new thread, since this thread seem to be more a "club" for people to post their Enicar watches.





hns-panama said:


> Franken for sure.
> 
> Case is not an Enicar.
> 
> I have a 1145 Supertest 33 jewel example. Odds are the movement and dial are from a gold cased Enicar Ocean Pearl cased watch.


Thanks for the input. Sorry to thread crash, i didn't realize the nature of the thread. Mods can you move to a new thread?

Sent from my QTAQZ3 using Tapatalk


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## hns-panama

No. This thread is fine as there are many more Enicar people following it and we don't mind helping. 

Sent from my Z10 using Tapatalk


----------



## Mirius

badbackdan said:


> Edit: Perhaps it would have been better to start this as a new thread, since this thread seem to be more a "club" for people to post their Enicar watches.





Jtragic said:


> Thanks for the input. Sorry to thread crash, i didn't realize the nature of the thread. Mods can you move to a new thread?


No thread crashing here.


----------



## Birky1

Hi I have just got this one can anyone tell me anything about it as I know nothing about Enicar watches but seems a nice watch









Sent from my Harrier Tab from EE using Tapatalk


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## kazrich

Did you buy the watch from India ? Hope you didn't pay more than $20 for it.
Really shocking and crude redial with runny smudged hand written ink. May be good for parts though ?
The strap looks OK.


----------



## WilliamT1974

I made the mistake of buying one from China that looked decent and ran well just long enough that it went past the return period, and another from India that had a great Star Jewel movement, but a horribly sloppy dial that didn't appear that way in the pics. Don't buy these on the cheap unless you're seeking parts because they'll just end up letting you down. 

Sent from my A0001 using Tapatalk


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## Freddo_in_Oz

Hi all, Not posted in this thread before but have always had high regard for the design & build quality of Enicars. 
I acquired this new steel "Enicar" bracelet in a job lot at a watchmaker's auction and have never seen one like it. 
It is not as well made as I am used to with Enicar products and I am wondering if anyone can shed some light on it. 
Many thanks, 
John


----------



## internet.interface

I am still looking for the Tap 10 Enicar crown, if any gurus with spare parts are hanging out in this thread. It is for the Enicar Sherpa GMT 600, and I need the non-cross hatched one. 6.15 in diam, about 3mm tall, 0.90mm (tap10) stem thread diameter and 2.5mm tube opening. Everyone on ebay is selling the tap 8, for some reason. 
On a good news...I did have a watchmaker loosen the external bezel. It now rotates freely!


----------



## DaBaeker

internet.interface said:


> I am still looking for the Tap 10 Enicar crown, if any gurus with spare parts are hanging out in this thread. It is for the Enicar Sherpa GMT 600, and I need the non-cross hatched one. 6.15 in diam, about 3mm tall, 0.90mm (tap10) stem thread diameter and 2.5mm tube opening. Everyone on ebay is selling the tap 8, for some reason.
> On a good news...I did have a watchmaker loosen the external bezel. It now rotates freely!


Just keep searching. And searching and searching and searching. Since the prices for all the super compressor Enicar Sherpa "Jet', 'GMT guide', 'diver' etc parts have skyrocketed into the =$2000 i many cases they are now nearly impossible to find. And if they are-expect sellers to price gouge out the wazoo.

(warning: long rambling story below. Its an 'enicar' story but still-fair warning. And for those who suffer through I'll post some pics of my sherpa guide)

The good news for you, i think, is crowns seem to be more readily available then other 600 enicar cases. But if you try to find the coveted notoriously breakable aluminum pointer ring, outer bezel ring or the inner 24hr ring. good luck. But as I said-just keep plugging away. I must have searched almost daily or 2-3 times a week at least for 'enicar sherpa gmt guide' and suddenly a month ago my eyes popped out when I saw a guy in ohio selling:
a) the outer city guide bezel
b) the red aluminum pointer ring *

*and even then it was slightly modified by a clever DIY owner many years ago. Its a quirky repair to say the least. The ring itself is perfectly flat and not warped but he must have broken it off and decided he could braise it back on. He succeeded but its slightly cocked and needs a file to straighten out the angle which I can do any time with a diamond file but not sure wether its worth risk of breaking again.

Anyway-the point was-that these three Enicar Sherpa parts would come up for auction by some seller parting out his spare sherpa guide was a truly rare occurance and it took me about 2 seconds to place a the first bid. I didn't even want to mess with sniping as I knew this would be a fight. I bid $86 for the bezel which I choked on a little but I didn't need one as much as the pointer ring. But still -I bid only $71 for the ring-pointer and all-becasue I hadn't seen another for sale anywhere for at least a year [except for the guys parting out old ones with $700 for the G.F. bracelet, $375 for pointer. $450 for bezel. etc.]

I really figured the enicar fanatics would be out and take advantage of this opportunity so I forgot about it completely as it was still 4.5 days left. So, I was pretty astonished when I won the pointer for $56. The bezel went higher then my bid but not by much. So-a sensible auction with sensible prices considering the inflated market. But again-I doubt Ill see that again for a long time. (i just looked and nada)

But I have seen both cross-hatched and saturn embossed crowns a little more often then the other parts. I guess all the tap 8's are for the gazillions of smaller Enicars out there as I only know about the sherpa 600 crowns and only remember them being tap 10.

Anyway-good luck with the search and with 2017 as well. It may take a while but it worked out for me**

**and I had SUCH rotten luck with my sherpa guide 600 in the first place. I found a Thai seller who was still collecting up all the sherpa's he could from the 60s as the vast majority were marketed as tough tool watches to the Asian market. He would list them for BINs of $375-$420 and would almost always take $50-$75 less. These were all described as "well worn" and he disclosed everything. In fact-the only NOS or minty GMT's were usually european sellers. But when I bought my sherpa guide and it arrived it was fantastic. worn a bit but freshly serviced movement and everything in decent state. There was still a bit of grunge in and around the lugs and in crevices and bezel so-its a peeve with me-I set to cleaning and detailing ever single sq. mm. In the process , I must have loosened the bezel and pointer but not enough to draw my attention. 
So-hours later I was walking the dog in the dense forrest in back of my house for about an hour. I must have gazed at the 'new' watch dozens of times. It was winter and dark about 6 and I glanced down just near my house and was horrified to see the bezel and pointer ring gone along with the crystal!!! yikes. I tried to be calm and sure enough the crystal was still between my sweater cuff and coat. But not the dang bezel&ring. When I tell you I searched ever single inch of a 1.4 mile rugged loop trail with a flashlight-you can believe I searched. And it should have been an easy find and any flash of metal stood out on the bare winter trail. But 3miles and hours later I was searching near the spot most likely to be the place (as I remembered the last time I checked ad saw bezel. Up and Down. I am an excellent finder of hidden things too. But in disgust I had to give up after 4hrs compulsive searching. I reconciled I would not likely find them again as they must have rolled into a hidden gullet.

I did look the next day but nothing. Then a week later as I was crossing the only small stretch od asphalt drive thats right near my house I saw in the middle od the road in a slush filled puddle a silver ring! Ther it was. In the exact spot I found it missing and was most likely to be. WHy I couldn't find it on day one remains a mystery. But when I picked uo said bezel I immediately saw it landed exactly where the few cars that traverse the road run their tires. Yes. It jad been run over probably a few times and the bezel was a little bent but not hard to straighten. The pointer was bent , cracked and weak. It cam apart in pieces. and hence-the only repair I could accomplish was an industrial clear glue which merely held it in round shape to fit inside the city guide bezel but have no ability to turn. In time I straightened the outer bezel to near perfect but the pointer ring was a loss. Ok. I'll wait for one to come up.

Then, later the same day a friggin mouse-yes-a tiny little moue that probably came in from the bitter cold snap and was frightened by what mice are frightened of and shot across the room to the other wall to escape. Unfortunately he shot himself right under my deaf dog who was sound asleep and startles easily due to his deafness. He jumped up , bumped a floor lamp which in turn fell over onto a table. The table where my enicar was just so happening to be placed. It knocked the watch off table and did the newly temorary repair of the bezel break? No. Did the balance staff jewel get knocked out because the watch must have hit at a freak angle since it wasn't even that hard? Yes. Some how I was able to put humpy dumpty back together but naturally the watch needs some attention from a watchmaker because it now will run well but intermittently-6hours fine-then stop. Start/stop.

I did consider it might be a jinx and that I should consider selling but then I also thought I'll be damned if im going to take a hit because of the bezel ring. So -it kind of made me more and more attached to the thing and when I finally found the ebay pointer I was able to put the thing back into very nice physical condition. Now it awaits a watchmaker to see what I did or what happened to the balance and if its just a piece of something in there. That it will run for many hours well is encouraging but I'm still not certain this watch is done with its streak of catastrophes. And is it 'ethical' for me to sell it to someone w/o disclosing its 'curse';-).

All of this has made me think twice about wether I should keep or rid myself of this iconic watch. We have been through a lot with more to come but I am not sure my nerves can take it. I already have a wife. Maybe a Sherpa Guide is a little too much to handle

good luck with the crowns. I expect you will find a crown sooner then you would find other sherpa parts

Here are my crowns with the newly broken original red pointer.



again:



and here it is a little bit happier but in need of some tlc by a watchmaker.


----------



## laikrodukas

DaBaeker that's one pain of a story :O


----------



## DaBaeker

laikrodukas said:


> DaBaeker that's one pain of a story :O


yes it is. but it makes the prospect of wearing it again- all that much sweeter. I just went and posted an even longer thread about my latest escapade but like those 8 watches-I bought this enicar 1.5-2yrs ago on a lark. I knew nothing about enicar and thought a two crown gmt was cool. then I discovered THIS thread which is a total trip and one of the best threads on the forum. And now-look whats happened to these mostly well worn sherpa 600s in the past 2 years. Jet, Guide, Divette,......skyrocket. Is it like omegamania of 2008 or is it just a trend. I mean really, look how beat up most of the sherpa guides are out there. I guess my bezel being run over will just add to its charm:roll: happy new year


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## laikrodukas

trend for sure, omega-trend, enicar-trend, cricket-trend(anyone remember those?  )


----------



## internet.interface

That was an awesome story and i am glad that you had persevered despite your Sherpa being obviously cursed. I really get annoyed with myself when I loose things. Only this Christmas season I have spent 3 hours looking for my lights. I do remember placing them somewhere .....where they would be much easier to find than the normal attic mess. I bought a lazy man's laser projection device instead ....because the lights disappeared. The same thing happens to a spare starter for my car. It is somewhere safe and obvious.

I am making progress. I found a new crystal, my outer bezel turns, and I have a reminder on Ebay for the crown. I did get my Sherpa from Asia, where the seller mentioned nothing about immobile bezel and mismatched crowns. But the dial is ok, hands correct, and the case in good shape. And it was $650.


----------



## DaBaeker

internet.interface said:


> That was an awesome story and i am glad that you had persevered despite your Sherpa being obviously cursed. I really get annoyed with myself when I loose things. Only this Christmas season I have spent 3 hours looking for my lights. I do remember placing them somewhere .....where they would be much easier to find than the normal attic mess. I bought a lazy man's laser projection device instead ....because the lights disappeared. The same thing happens to a spare starter for my car. It is somewhere safe and obvious.
> 
> I am making progress. I found a new crystal, my outer bezel turns, and I have a reminder on Ebay for the crown. I did get my Sherpa from Asia, where the seller mentioned nothing about immobile bezel and mismatched crowns. But the dial is ok, hands correct, and the case in good shape. And it was $650.
> 
> View attachment 10335362


Mine is exactly the same as your save for the 24hr ring. But you have a much nicer example. I think some of the Asian sellers are scouring their islands for as many of these old tool watcges as they can. It makes sense that most of the guys that would have been engineers and tool watch users are just past retirement age or older so their watches are being found in drawers and boxes stored away. As I said-mine was well worn before it came to me. But the movement is incredibly clean which means the seals held. My checkered 24hr hand is on the verge of flaking too. congrats on your project. cheers


----------



## dlmzdy

Hi I am new to the forum, and would like get some information on a watch I am looking at on E-bay. I think it might be a Frankenwatch, but don't know, but I do like the look. I am not to concerned about the watch being pure vintage, but would like to know if some of the bones are good on the piece.

*Vintage Enicar Ultrasonic Men's Wristwatch 17 jewels - ebay

*Key information I would like to know:

Movement information; Dating of watch; Dial

highly confident the Dial is redone.

The movement appears to be imported to the US based on the EZR and "unadjusted" marking?

But I don't know which movement number.

The Case back cover doesn't appear to be original it doesn't have any of the markings I have seen on other Enicar watches.


----------



## hns-panama

Welcome.

Enicar 1292 movement.

Dial is way too nice to be original as compared to the case.

Caseback probably not original. Stamped letters interfere with Swiss.



dlmzdy said:


> Hi I am new to the forum, and would like get some information on a watch I am looking at on E-bay. I think it might be a Frankenwatch, but don't know, but I do like the look. I am not to concerned about the watch being pure vintage, but would like to know if some of the bones are good on the piece.
> 
> *Vintage Enicar Ultrasonic Men's Wristwatch 17 jewels - ebay
> 
> *Key information I would like to know:
> 
> Movement information; Dating of watch; Dial
> 
> highly confident the Dial is redone.
> 
> The movement appears to be imported to the US based on the EZR and "unadjusted" marking?
> 
> But I don't know which movement number.
> 
> The Case back cover doesn't appear to be original it doesn't have any of the markings I have seen on other Enicar watches.


----------



## cakey007

Hello, It's been a while since I have been on Watchuseek but I am looking for more information regarding Enicars and more specifically what I understand is called the 'big eye' models. I have purchased a very nice white dial version and trying to find out more about them and information and even images are quite thin on the ground. 
Many thanks in advance for any help/direction
Carl


----------



## TopTime65

Can anyone help with info on installing inner red bezel insert on Sherpa Guide bezel? Have issues....


----------



## hns-panama

TopTime65 said:


> Can anyone help with info on installing inner red bezel insert on Sherpa Guide bezel? Have issues....


Photos and a description of the issues...

Sent from my SM-G570M using Tapatalk


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## mellowturtle

Although most of the inner pointer rings are the same size, not ALL of them are. Different era models were slightly smaller or larger in relation to their world time bezel/crystal dome/size. So not all of them are interchangeable.


----------



## silvsurf

Winter time  ...


----------



## silvsurf

.... and nice to have a sibling


----------



## silvsurf

I bought this ENICAR chronograph in 1991









Does anyone have an idea about the year of production? 1950ies?

Herbert


----------



## Trash_Gordon

Enicar Valjoux 72


----------



## slumpia

Just bought this vintage Enicar.

What model is this?
Is it genuine or fake?
Can I clean the dial or just accept it as it is?

Thanks.


----------



## kazrich

Looks like a late 50's or early 60's watch. Could be a very old redial. Minimal info on the dial ( not even the Planet Saturn ). To clean the dial
would cost at least five times the value of the watch so if it works it's best used as is.


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## daftis

Heres mine again next to its lesser known cousin. Need to find a tropic strap that fits it havent worned it yet. But the other one gets some wrist-time.


----------



## slumpia

kazrich said:


> Looks like a late 50's or early 60's watch. Could be a very old redial. Minimal info on the dial ( not even the Planet Saturn ).


But there's Saturn logo on the caseback.



> To clean the dial
> would cost at least five times the value of the watch so if it works it's best used as is.


It's working, but it is a little bit hard to wind the watch.


----------



## zztips

I have an ENICAR and on the back is engraved 167-01-15 automatic stainless steel back waterresistant it has day-date is gold color with a gold/brown face any idea how old or value


----------



## kazrich

zztips said:


> I have an ENICAR and on the back is engraved 167-01-15 automatic stainless steel back waterresistant it has day-date is gold color with a gold/brown face any idea how old or value


Please read the forum posting rules and note that we don't do valuations here. Look up 'sold listings' on ebay to give a general price guide. Even if we did valuations , it would be difficult to assess without detailed pictures of the dial and the movement so we can see if the movement matches the info on the caseback.


----------



## kazrich

I've been searching for a companion for my 68 Super Jet and recently picked up this much earlier example. The dial is ' silver pearl ' and the movement
is AR 1126 Supertest. I would date it approx. 1963 ish ? The watch has been ' mothered ' and handles and winds like a new watch. A totally different
look to the 68 but a great every day / dress watch / GMT watch for pilots who enjoy a 300 ft dip in the ocean







( hopefully not still in the cockpit ).


----------



## aero-engineer

Is anyone knows where to find some NOS/mint hands for my Sherpa GUIDE 600 Mk IVa with AR166 inside?


----------



## Giotime

My first Enicar...stumbled on it at yard sale. Was missing the stem and crown. 1010 movement which Ranfft dates to 1960's but inner casebacks has a number 3-56. Is this a 1956 date? Doesn't look that old. Aluminum bezel. 33mm case.
i got a correct stem and found the watch to set, wind and run accurately. 
2 things: could someone confirm the date of this piece or offer any other info....but most important how would I go about finding a signed crown that would fit this model? Possible?

Thanks. G


----------



## hns-panama

Correct date for that watch and movement. Early super compressor design. Crown are on eBay right now. Case tube can be replaced to adapt to a crown tube size. But probably the same. Get it serviced. Go light on any case polishing. Crystal should be fine with a little Polywatch.

Nice example.

Sent from my SM-G570M using Tapatalk


----------



## Giotime

Oh it was super compressed alright... Had to go to the superglue/bolt/ratchet to get the back off. Never done that before...Worked quite well actually.


----------



## Dan S

Giotime said:


> Oh it was super compressed alright... Had to go to the superglue/bolt/ratchet to get the back off. Never done that before...Worked quite well actually.


I have heard of super-gluing a hex nut to the case-back, but never a bolt. How does that work?


----------



## Giotime

Sorry Dan. Lazy terminology. 'Twas a hex nut. Worked great. Easy removal and cleanup with acetone.


----------



## rrchmnn

Pretty cool find - love that you're rehabilitating it. Wear it well!


----------



## kazrich

Giotime said:


> My first Enicar...stumbled on it at yard sale. Was missing the stem and crown. 1010 movement which Ranfft dates to 1960's but inner casebacks has a number 3-56. Is this a 1956 date? Doesn't look that old. Aluminum bezel. 33mm case.
> i got a correct stem and found the watch to set, wind and run accurately.
> 2 things: could someone confirm the date of this piece or offer any other info....but most important how would I go about finding a signed crown that would fit this model? Possible?
> 
> Thanks. G


Enicar in house AR 1010 movement is chronometer grade and easily pre dates 1960








Your watch dates to March 1956 and the EPSA STOP inscription is typical of that date, as is ULTRASONIC on the dial. When Ultrasonic was no big deal in the early 60's Enicar just inscribed it on the caseback.
When you close the bayonet case back , observe where the 4 leaf clover is not connected. When closed the little ' - ' should line up with the crown. When open the 'O' lines up with the crown.
Nice watch !


----------



## demonfinder

My first Enicar ...how have I done?













a solid little Eni alarm clock (1950`s I think ) .
it will be treated to a new glass as this one has yellowed and a quick check over by local clock shop. :0)


----------



## hns-panama

Well done, I'd say. Welcome to the club.

Sent from my AT&T rotary dial phone.


----------



## Giotime

Thank you Kaz. I am quite pleased "joyful" to have an Enicar with an in house movement. And thanks for the tip on proper position of the caseback. Never would have known that. Now for that crown!


----------



## Boleyn1895

Hi all.

My Dad left me a few watches when he died 2 years ago, one of which was this:















Unfortunately it has a few scratches on it but apart from that it looks amazing and works beautifully.

I can see the obvious markings: Ocean Pearl, 124/010, Ultrasonic Incabloc e.t.c but searching around doesn't bring up much but it did bring me here.

Does anyone have any further information about this watch, year of manufacture for example? because I have a feeling this may have been my Grandfathers watch as well as my Fathers.

Any help you can offer would be greatly appreciated.

Thank you.


----------



## hns-panama

Could be a very early Ocean Pearl. Never seen one in the wild. It most likely has a cal. 1125 in it. However, the 124 on the case back gives me pause for concern. Suspect that they put a date movement in that case and left it for historians like us to ponder life... I usually equate Ocean Pearls with the 1145 and later movements. They were no longer the compressor cases from EPSA. Screw on casebacks.

That is a keeper on many levels.


Sent from my AT&T rotary dial phone.


----------



## kazrich

The fact that Enicar is signed under the planet Saturn and not through it probably dates your watch post 1963.


----------



## Boleyn1895

Thank you.

This is really fascinating to me as it's a little more of my Dad I get to hold on too.

Can I assume then it's definitely genuine and not a fake? Are there fake Enicar's?

This really does mean a lot to me.

Thank you.


----------



## kazrich

Boleyn1895 said:


> Thank you.
> 
> This is really fascinating to me as it's a little more of my Dad I get to hold on too.
> 
> Can I assume then it's definitely genuine and not a fake? Are there fake Enicar's?
> 
> Your Ocean Pearl looks good to me. It might just have a date quick set. Wind the crown slowly until the date changes and then slowly
> Wind back to 8.00 Pm and then forward to 12.00 pm. Does the date change ?


----------



## Boleyn1895

Right.

Winding slowly forward it hovers between two dates at 12 and fully changes over at 01:05 with an audible click.

When winding back to 8 it starts to turn back and hovers between two dates but around 9ish it goes back to the current date, again with an audible click, so no it does'nt change.


----------



## kazrich

Boleyn1895 said:


> Right.
> 
> Winding slowly forward it hovers between two dates at 12 and fully changes over at 01:05 with an audible click.
> 
> When winding back to 8 it starts to turn back and hovers between two dates but around 9ish it goes back to the current date, again with an audible click, so no it does'nt change.


You will need to get your watch serviced, so ask the watch maker to check if it has an auto date change. I'm not sure when they started using them.
When you've got a spare 20 minutes manually wind through every date to verify that all the teeth on the cogs are still there and working.


----------



## Boleyn1895

I will do, Thanks.

I'll go through the dates tomorrow.


----------



## B.Frost

My only Enicar... well worn, but well-loved....


----------



## Stigmata

Boleyn1895 said:


> Hi all.
> 
> My Dad left me a few watches when he died 2 years ago, one of which was this:
> 
> View attachment 10617570
> View attachment 10617578
> 
> 
> Unfortunately it has a few scratches on it but apart from that it looks amazing and works beautifully.
> 
> I can see the obvious markings: Ocean Pearl, 124/010, Ultrasonic Incabloc e.t.c but searching around doesn't bring up much but it did bring me here.
> 
> Does anyone have any further information about this watch, year of manufacture for example? because I have a feeling this may have been my Grandfathers watch as well as my Fathers.
> 
> Any help you can offer would be greatly appreciated.
> 
> Thank you.


OK it's an early 60s watch 
The movement is the early 60s AR1125 
33 signifies the 33 jewels that come with that movement
I have the 'rubyrotor' version of the same watch (30 jewels) 
The dial is probably champagne and the movement would likely have 'supertesr" on the inside. This signifies that enicar tested it in one of their own in-house chronometer methods.
Great watches and almost indestructible movements


----------



## Stigmata

kazrich said:


> I've been searching for a companion for my 68 Super Jet and recently picked up this much earlier example. The dial is ' silver pearl ' and the movement
> is AR 1126 Supertest. I would date it approx. 1963 ish ? The watch has been ' mothered ' and handles and winds like a new watch. A totally different
> look to the 68 but a great every day / dress watch / GMT watch for pilots who enjoy a 300 ft dip in the ocean
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ( hopefully not still in the cockpit ).


Your estimate on your watch is on the money
Love it!
Congratulations
Excellent example of the first execution mk1
The black and white ( silver) on the early ones) is an excellent touch on these for those that have them.
Photos never capture their majesty in my opinion.
Gorgeous


----------



## Boleyn1895

Thank you so much.

I have so many questions that can never be answered now. My Dad was born in 1947, was it his and given to him as a gift? did he buy it later? was it my Grandfathers?

But learning as much as I can about this watch means the world to me.

Thank you.


----------



## LeCorb

Enicar Super Dive Ref. 167.08.02 & OPS Mark II Ref. 144/35/03A


----------



## aero-engineer

Short Lugs Sherpa Guide 600


----------



## casslee

HI ALL 
I have just bought an Enicar Sherpa Super Jet 600 for a gift. I would like to ask a few questions. 
1. The date does not alternate from red to black only has black numerals is this normal?
2. Have opened the watch and on the back casing and it has 2342 and underneath 5 - 69. Does this mean anything?
On the back of the watch it has Brevet 319462 and 148-35-02

Please help?


----------



## Dan S

2342 is the reference number and 5-69 refers to month and year.

Do you have some particular reason to be suspicious? The engraving and relief on the outside of the case-back have a sort of "laser-engraved" look to me, which seems different from most examples I have seen. Perhaps this is just an artifact of the photo (or characteristic of a later model), but I'm accustomed to seeing deeper/sharper engraving and stronger relief of the SeaPearl Oyster logo. However, it's hard for me to believe that someone would go to the trouble of tampering with this case-back, so I'll be interested to see what the experts say.


----------



## Danny4

The 1303618 number on the caseback appears to be engraved later on by someone, since it looks pretty sloppy.


----------



## Danny4

I also have never seen a minute and hour hand like this on a super jet


----------



## hns-panama

A few items of note.

First, 314962 refers to EPSA's Super Compressor patent number.

Second, the photo showing the caseback indicates it is not closed properly. The O below the word "Incabloc" indicates open and should be right between the crowns when it is. The straight line below the w in the word, "Swiss" indicates the case is closed.

Third, the inner bezel looks to be from a Jet. I have not seen any other Super Jet with this inner bezel width.

Where did you buy this from?


----------



## kazrich

casslee said:


> HI ALL
> I have just bought an Enicar Sherpa Super Jet 600 for a gift. I would like to ask a few questions.
> 1. The date does not alternate from red to black only has black numerals is this normal?
> 2. Have opened the watch and on the back casing and it has 2342 and underneath 5 - 69. Does this mean anything?
> On the back of the watch it has Brevet 319462 and 148-35-02
> 
> Please help?
> 
> Do you really expect much help when you have only supplied giant totally out of focus images . It must have taken you about 30 seconds to take the pictures, post them and ask for help.
> I've already wasted more than 30 seconds straining my eyes looking at them - so I'm out !


----------



## vandervenus

Danny4 said:


> I also have never seen a minute and hour hand like this on a super jet


It's not an unusual combination. I have a Super-Jet with the same hands, except for the GMT-hand.


----------



## vandervenus

hns-panama said:


> A few items of note.
> 
> First, 314962 refers to EPSA's Super Compressor patent number.
> 
> Second, the photo showing the caseback indicates it is not closed properly. The O below the word "Incabloc" indicates open and should be right between the crowns when it is. The straight line below the w in the word, "Swiss" indicates the case is closed.
> 
> Third, the inner bezel looks to be from a Jet. I have not seen any other Super Jet with this inner bezel width.
> 
> Where did you buy this from?


My guess is this is a Jet case with a Super-Jet dial. It reminds me of a Jet I once owned. There are still some NOS Jet cases on the market. They can be found for 200 - 300 euro.


----------



## ssmdive

I tried searching, I read about 50 pages of this thread trying to got more information. Can anyone help me better identify this watch?

Front of watch says ENICAR in raised lettering with the Saturn logo.
Under that it has in red script "De Luxe"
Lower it has: 
17 JEWELS
WATERPROOF
INCABLOC
It has raised lettering for 12-1-2-4-6-8-10 with arrows for 1-3-5-7-9-11
It has a Red arrow on top of the second hand.

On the back it has "57 1-9"
And around the back it has "ANTIMAGNETIC SHOCK PROTECTED WATERPROOF SWISS MADE STAINLESS STEEL" in a circle

I started a thread, but I am betting people here know more and can help better. They said 1949-1955

https://www.watchuseek.com/f11/inherited-enicar-need-help-identifying-2538546.html

It is currently at a watchmaker getting fixed. New crystal was needed and a good cleaning.

Any info? I have Googled as much as I can.


----------



## mellowturtle

Seems to me like the Enicar "Graph" trend has died down. Any thoughts?


----------



## kazrich

mellowturtle said:


> Seems to me like the Enicar "Graph" trend has died down. Any thoughts?


I think the supply of good examples has dried up .
A questionable Sherpa Graph sold recently on ebay. The tired looking dial looked wrong with the 'h' in graph sitting almost on top of the 3.0 o clock register.
It had zero lume colour. The odd white hands in the picture looked as though they had been 3D printed out of a white plastic picnic plate. 
It didn't even have it's correct Enicar cross hatched crown yet it still made an astonishing £ 3164 sterling. Bet he was pleased with that








Previously another Graph with a lovely and correct dial was advertised for an ambitious price with a totally shaved and polished caseback. This totally wiped out it's history ( and much of it's value ).
The vendor stated the reason for this may possibly have been that it was a prototype ? :-d 
Why would Enicar make a prototype 2-3 years after Graph production began ?
Proper, correct examples in fine condition are now hard to find and owners are holding on to them.


----------



## vandervenus

kazrich said:


> I think the supply of good examples has dried up .
> A questionable Sherpa Graph sold recently on ebay. The tired looking dial looked wrong with the 'h' in graph sitting almost on top of the 3.0 o clock register.
> It had zero lume colour. The odd white hands in the picture looked as though they had been 3D printed out of a white plastic picnic plate.
> It didn't even have it's correct Enicar cross hatched crown yet it still made an astonishing £ 3164 sterling. Bet he was pleased with that
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Previously another Graph with a lovely and correct dial was advertised for an ambitious price with a totally shaved and polished caseback. This totally wiped out it's history ( and much of it's value ).
> The vendor stated the reason for this may possibly have been that it was a prototype ? :-d
> Why would Enicar make a prototype 2-3 years after Graph production began ?
> Proper, correct examples in fine condition are now hard to find and owners are holding on to them.


Last week a Jet Graph was sold on Chrono24. It went in two days for 4900 USD. I contacted the seller to ask him for some time for me to collect funds, but I was too late. The fact that it looked mint and had a strong traceable history and yet went for a very reasonable price, doesn't prove that the Graphs are collapsing. This was a private seller that obviously wasn't in tune with market prices for these chronos. As Kazrich already mentioned: the good examples have dried up and the price that is payed for worn down ones is still high. Also, I think the supercompressors (Jet, Super-Jet, divette, Super-Dive, OPS and Ultra-Dive) are steadily climbing and so are the non-Sherpa chronos. But activity between buyers and sellers is slowing down.

Any thoughts guys?


----------



## JesseEads

Speaking of ProtoType Enicars. i have a FrankenWatch KeyWind Enicar. It's an ar-1292 wrapped in a key wind pocket watch. The face is some old 43mm Molnija Russia face so I won't post it.

I'm waiting on the key and about to oil the mechanism to see if i can get it to run. The crown pulls and I can set hour and minutes. The balance moves freely.

Here's a few pics:















Thanks,


----------



## laikrodukas

what the heck is that?


----------



## JesseEads

Like I said. It is an Enicar movement inside a key wind pocket watch case.

I can set the time with the lower crown (blue screw at the bottom. it pulls out to set). And the balance moves free. I ordered a set of keys but they were too small so I'm getting a 2mm key so I can wind it. I tried taking it apart and got stuck so I think I'm going to oil the balance and see if it'll run.

I posted the pics on nawcc.org and was told that someone added an 8 day arbor to this watch. They weren't sure why someone did this or why.

Here's some more pics.






























Thanks,


----------



## marcordb

One month ago I have found this post, and I am reading it daay by day... now I am ad page 47, but the aim is to read it at all... 
I found a simple Ocean Pearl hidden (forgotten) into a drawer, perfectly functioning after years. I didn't ever heard about Enicar but, thanks to my watch repairer, now I am discovering the world of Enicar... and I am fascinating!

Now I found this Enicar and I am thinking about buying it, but I am not sure if it is genuine or not... The dial appear in good conditions, and the watch is quite elegant







The back case does not look like the others I've seen on this thread, even if is engraved "enicar"







And also the movement... all the other I've seer were golden...








What do you think about it?


----------



## NoTimeToLose

I picked this up on eBay a couple of months ago for US $52.00. It keeps good time, and I really enjoy wearing it.

No idea if it's a Franken, and I don't actually care. It's a cheap watch from an interesting maker, and it makes me happy!

Of course, I'm now looking to add more Enicars to my watch box...


----------



## MacRulez4Ever

What's the different in the two Sherpa star divers. One has the "Sherpa" label under the enicar on the dial. 
And then there is one model with no Sherpa text in the dial ?


Skickat från min iPad med Tapatalk


----------



## vandervenus

NoTimeToLose said:


> View attachment 11216426
> 
> 
> I picked this up on eBay a couple of months ago for US $52.00. It keeps good time, and I really enjoy wearing it.
> 
> No idea if it's a Franken, and I don't actually care. It's a cheap watch from an interesting maker, and it makes me happy!
> 
> Of course, I'm now looking to add more Enicars to my watch box...


I think you did OK. The case looks genuine to me. I have a similar Enicar added as a pic. You can easily see the resemblance. 
Enjoy the watch mate. Many Enicars will folow ;-)


----------



## NoTimeToLose

Long-lost siblings!


----------



## Vikrama

Can somebody please confirm the authenticity of Enicar "Seapearl" 140-39-04


----------



## mellowturtle

The case and crown are obviously authentic. I would only be concerned that the dial might be refinished. The writing seems uniform and pretty well done... the star jewels 200 doesn't look quiet as crisp as the Enicar and Swiss Made writing but i'm not sure that means anything.

Experts opinions?


----------



## Vikrama

mellowturtle said:


> The case and crown are obviously authentic. I would only be concerned that the dial might be refinished. The writing seems uniform and pretty well done... the star jewels 200 doesn't look quiet as crisp as the Enicar and Swiss Made writing but i'm not sure that means anything.
> 
> Experts opinions?


 Thank you!
Regarding the dial, the indices and Enicar saturn logo looks neat and tidy...as you have observed, the text part may be a give away..does anybody have sea pearl photo of similar model?
Oh, the similar model photo reflects identical fonts..hmmm


----------



## TradeKraft

IG: Tradekraft


----------



## pamaro

my only enicar atm.


----------



## autoquartz

Any comments on this piece of Enicar Ultrasonic?


----------



## kazrich

It's a late (ish) 1950's Enicar with Dauphine style hands and possibly with a quick date function. Probably circa 35mm without the crown ? Do you have pictures of the movement or back ?
Turn the crown until it changes date at 12.00 o clock. Then wind back to 8 and then forward to 12 and tell us if the date changes.


----------



## autoquartz

kazrich said:


> It's a late (ish) 1950's Enicar with Dauphine style hands and possibly with a quick date function. Probably circa 35mm without the crown ? Do you have pictures of the movement or back ?
> Turn the crown until it changes date at 12.00 o clock. Then wind back to 8 and then forward to 12 and tell us if the date changes.











Apologies for the picture quality

What do you think?


----------



## kazrich

Do you have a picture of the case back ?


----------



## kazrich

Just got my earliest Enicar. It dates from July 1955 and it's an early EPSA cased compressor, Brevet 98243.
It's the American version of the Seapearl 600 and was marketed by the sports wear company Healthways - The 100 fathoms.
' Rather gaudy and strange looking ' was a miscellaneous comment made in the 1959 divers watch evaluation report from the US Navy Experimental Diving Unit ( EDU )
after very favourably testing the Enicar Seapearl 600. Really can't imagine why they said that ?








Maybe it's a trifle sudden and the seconds hand resembles 'exhibit 'A' from a police crime scene ?
Frightened the living daylights out of me ! 















These early single crown Enicar divers are becoming quite collectible - They are all EPSA cased and I'm fond of them


----------



## firmlyundecided

Found this at a local thrift store. Really don't know much about Enicar, save for a couple of articles I've read on the Sherpa. Seems like the Ocean Pearl isn't the most in-demand watch, but I thought it was cool! I've only seen photos of one other with the vertical indices. Didn't pull the trigger that day, mostly due to concern about dots on the dial (thought it may be moisture damage as opposed to natural patina), but considering going back to make an offer. Thoughts?


----------



## autoquartz

kazrich said:


> Do you have a picture of the case back ?


Alas, i didn't take a picture of that.

I do have a picture of the outer case....dunno if this helps


----------



## kazrich

autoquartz said:


> Alas, i didn't take a picture of that.
> 
> I do have a picture of the outer case....dunno if this helps
> 
> View attachment 11699442


Back of case with 4 leaf clover design confirms late 50's.
Movement looks like Enicar AR 1010 ( chronometer grade )


----------



## autoquartz

kazrich said:


> Back of case with 4 leaf clover design confirms late 50's.
> Movement looks like Enicar AR 1010 ( chronometer grade )


That sounds interesting, it says 25 jewels on the movement.
Can you tell me more about the AR1010 movement and why is it chronometer grade?

Many thanks!


----------



## kazrich

autoquartz said:


> That sounds interesting, it says 25 jewels on the movement.
> Can you tell me more about the AR1010 movement and why is it chronometer grade?
> 
> Many thanks!


July 1954 AR1010 was accredited chronometer status by the Neuchatel Observatory ( a forerunner of the COSC ). Derivatives of this movement were used in many Enicar watches.

bidfun-db Archive: Watch Movements: Enicar 1010


----------



## autoquartz

kazrich said:


> July 1954 AR1010 was accredited chronometer status by the Neuchatel Observatory ( a forerunner of the COSC ). Derivatives of this movement were used in many Enicar watches.
> 
> bidfun-db Archive: Watch Movements: Enicar 1010


Promising piece, the model is I believe a common watch though. This was retailed probably massively in Asia


----------



## STR8BYT

Beauty for sure


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Freddo_in_Oz

I tweaked this 1010 a couple of years ago as a present for my wife.

We were going to a watchmakers dinner and I thought it might be a bit of fun.
I have had the movement for decades and it the oil was pretty gluggy so I stripped and serviced it first.

My jeweller soldered the gold pendant shackle to the crown, I cut off the projecting centre wheel post and bingo... all done.

It does create some interest when she wears it wound up with the balance scooting along with a nice amplitude.

Originally I did not fit it with a plexi on the rear side, but with warmer weather I decided to do so to give the movement some protection from perspiration.

























Cheers,

John


----------



## georges zaslavsky

kazrich said:


> Just got my earliest Enicar. It dates from July 1955 and it's an early EPSA cased compressor, Brevet 98243.
> It's the American version of the Seapearl 600 and was marketed by the sports wear company Healthways - The 100 fathoms.
> ' Rather gaudy and strange looking ' was a miscellaneous comment made in the 1959 divers watch evaluation report from the US Navy Experimental Diving Unit ( EDU )
> after very favourably testing the Enicar Seapearl 600. Really can't imagine why they said that ?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Maybe it's a trifle sudden and the seconds hand resembles 'exhibit 'A' from a police crime scene ?
> Frightened the living daylights out of me !
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> These early single crown Enicar divers are becoming quite collectible - They are all EPSA cased and I'm fond of them


Nice enicar collection.


----------



## marcel2812

just got this one....any idea what production year it might be?
dial still look legit, case back seems to be heavily polished as the engraving on the side is almost polished off.... no idea why they did that in the past.....

just shoot out your knowledge guys!









Sent from my SM-G9287C using Tapatalk


----------



## TradeKraft

IG: Tradekraft


----------



## RTK-WGM

Hi, I would like to say hello and show my Enicars.


----------



## AAEnriquez

Welcome and hello to all your lovely Enicars


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## AAEnriquez

My regular Enicar.

I have an 18k gold model which was given to me when my grandfather passed away and that is kept safe at my parents place. When I go over next I'll photograph it.










Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Sansoni7

My Enicar:









Now, with a new look:









Thanks for see.


----------



## KasperDK

Can anyone tell me anything about this one, model age etc.? I need to find a crown and stem as these are broken.


----------



## flacousa

KasperDK said:


> Can anyone tell me anything about this one, model age etc.? I need to find a crown and stem as these are broken.


*Check eBay, mine had an ugly crown and found one in Germany, the stem in Australia *









Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


----------



## KasperDK

flacousa said:


> *Check eBay, mine had an ugly crown and found one in Germany, the stem in Australia *


Did all enicar watches use the same stem though?


----------



## flacousa

KasperDK said:


> Did all enicar watches use the same stem though?


I don't think so, from the old one I got the measurement

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


----------



## RTK-WGM

TripleDate by Enicar









Wysłane z mojego Lenovo P2a42 przy użyciu Tapatalka


----------



## Sansoni7

My Enicar with a movement caliber 1292 of the year 1955.
Photo in watchmaker where it is being reviewed.


----------



## AAEnriquez

I think Enicar is the Maserati of watches. Beautifully made, understated and wonderful performance. They are one of my favourite watches. I'll post a pic soon of my 18kt gold Enicar given to me by my grandfather 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## AAEnriquez

Sansoni7 said:


> My Enicar with a movement caliber 1292 of the year 1955.
> Photo in watchmaker where it is being reviewed.


Beautiful watch Caesar

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Sansoni7

AAEnriquez said:


> I think Enicar is the Maserati of watches. Beautifully made, understated and wonderful performance. They are one of my favourite watches. I'll post a pic soon of my 18kt gold Enicar given to me by my grandfather
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Hi AAEnriquez.
Tks.
I am also a fan of the Enicar and I will try to get more. ;-)
Maseraty?Yes!
Take a look at this beauty:

http://www.ranfft.de/cgi-bin/bidfun-db.cgi?10&ranfft&67&2uswk&Enicar_1292


----------



## RTK-WGM

Enicar Revelation









Wysłane z mojego Lenovo P2a42 przy użyciu Tapatalka


----------



## Leafy1967

My Super Graph. 
It was re-cased many years ago.


----------



## RTK-WGM

It's last purchase "DDF 250". Anybody know about DDx series? (example: DDG, DDS, DDF ??)


----------



## Sansoni7

Enicar AR1292 from 1955
bidfun-db Archive: Watch Movements: Enicar 1292
Tks for see.


----------



## Proby01

Good Morning.... How about a Jump Hour NOS... just found ?... ;-)


----------



## Sansoni7

Great....
I wish one for me....LOL
Congrats


----------



## TradeKraft

IG: Tradekraft


----------



## GUTuna




----------



## RTK-WGM

It's my Digital, but I've a problem with jump hour.









Wysłane z mojego Lenovo P2a42 przy użyciu Tapatalka


----------



## HoustonHorn

Just starting to get into Enicar watches and came across this for sale. Listing says Sherpa 600 diver but I'm not seeing any pictures in this thread or elsewhere that have this dial for any Sherpa 600 divers. Back case is extremely worn and barely visible.

Anyways, if it's legit I'd be interested but wanted to get a more knowledgeable opinion first.

Thanks!


----------



## Stigmata

HoustonHorn said:


> Just starting to get into Enicar watches and came across this for sale. Listing says Sherpa 600 diver but I'm not seeing any pictures in this thread or elsewhere that have this dial for any Sherpa 600 divers. Back case is extremely worn and barely visible.
> 
> Anyways, if it's legit I'd be interested but wanted to get a more knowledgeable opinion first.
> 
> Thanks!


Not anything I would be rushing off to buy
Franken

Sent from my Z2131 using Tapatalk


----------



## HoustonHorn

Stigmata said:


> Not anything I would be rushing off to buy
> Franken
> 
> Sent from my Z2131 using Tapatalk


Thank you. I was getting that feeling when I couldn't find anything like it and there is a LOT of material in this thread about Sherpas. I'm pretty new to watches and very new to Enicar but there is a lot of interesting stuff to learn.


----------



## AAEnriquez

HoustonHorn said:


> Thank you. I was getting that feeling when I couldn't find anything like it and there is a LOT of material in this thread about Sherpas. I'm pretty new to watches and very new to Enicar but there is a lot of interesting stuff to learn.


There's no bad Enicar Houston just some more common than others. I'm sure you'll enjoy them o matter which one you get

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## BrackAttack

Hey guys, I came across this Enicar but there seems to be so little information or other examples of it, so I dont know if its fake or what. It says Enicar Chronograph but thats it. Any help on this? Thanks!


----------



## Proby01

My Enicar collection is growing fast... 
here they are ... 
*Enicar MRO Star Jewels, Date - 1970's
Caliber AR 161*


----------



## Proby01

My Enicar collection is growing fast... 
here they are ... 
*Enicar MRO Star Jewels, Date ? 1970?s
Caliber AR 161*
View attachment 12303026
View attachment 12303050


----------



## kazrich

Well done. What does MRO stand for ?


----------



## Proby01

... and *Enicar Day Date - 1970's
Caliber AR 114B













*


----------



## Proby01

... and* Enicar Ultrasonic "time only" - 1956
Caliber : an interesting Felsa 1560 (HM 1560) 



















*


----------



## Proby01

... and a* Enicar Ultrasonic "time only" - 1960
caliber AR1292, nice large size... sub-seconds dial













*


----------



## Proby01

... and one of my favorites... the historical *Enicar Ultrasonic "Supertest 30 Ruby Rotor", Date - 1962
with the AR 1125 caliber













*


----------



## Proby01

... and the interesting* Enicar Sherpa Star, Date - 1968, Caliber AR 1145
View attachment 12303202
View attachment 12303210

*


----------



## Proby01

kazrich said:


> Well done. What does MRO stand for ?


thanks..... to be honest... I don't know but i will try to find out...


----------



## speedmistr




----------



## Monti

My first Enicar, a little well worn but I love the look especially the bracelet.


----------



## Proby01

I just added one more to my collection : a lovely green dial Enicar D 600 (don't know why I see a lot of pages where they call it the "comprssor" ?.... why would that be ?).... 38mm without the crown, nice solid size. Caliber 167D, automatic, I love this watch, should be a 1975 !


----------



## hns-panama

Proby01 said:


> I just added one more to my collection : a lovely green dial Enicar D 600 (don't know why I see a lot of pages where they call it the "comprssor" ?.... why would that be ?).... 38mm without the crown, nice solid size. Caliber 167D, automatic, I love this watch, should be a 1975 !
> View attachment 12350761
> View attachment 12350765
> View attachment 12350767


Not a compressor. Indian redial most likely.

Sent from my SM-G570M using Tapatalk


----------



## Proby01

thanks !.... I don't think is a redial, personally.... but anyway besides this.. do you know why in some pages this model (600 D) is called a "compressor" ?

thanks

Roby



hns-panama said:


> Not a compressor. Indian redial most likely.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G570M using Tapatalk


----------



## hns-panama

Proby01 said:


> thanks !.... I don't think is a redial, personally.... but anyway besides this.. do you know why in some pages this model (600 D) is called a "compressor" ?
> 
> thanks
> 
> Roby


Probably a mistake by the author.

Sent from my SM-G570M using Tapatalk


----------



## 147 05 01

hns-panama said:


> Probably a mistake by the author.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G570M using Tapatalk


The dial is authentic and Enicar Sherpas have a compressor case.

best regards from Vienna


----------



## hns-panama

The inside of the case back will tell all. Generally speakng, by then, Sherpas were caaed in Ocean Pearl scew back cases. 

As for dial, I would like to see other Sherpas with that color.

Sent from my SM-G570M using Tapatalk


----------



## 147 05 01

IMHO all Sherpas have a bayonet case/mount. I have never seen an original Sherpa with a screw back case.
As for dial: ebay item number 201982204909

regards


----------



## tylerstg

How is this thread still running.........


----------



## Proby01

thanks for the "compressor" case and dial info

regards from Milan

ciao

Roby



147 05 01 said:


> The dial is authentic and Enicar Sherpas have a compressor case.
> 
> best regards from Vienna


----------



## Stigmata

tylerstg said:


> How is this thread still running.........


Lots of interest in these watches

Sent from my Z2131 using Tapatalk


----------



## kazrich

tylerstg said:


> How is this thread still running.........


Do you not approve ?


----------



## kazrich

We seem to have lost the last 5 / 6 posts from yesterday and today ?


----------



## hns-panama

147 05 01 said:


> The dial is authentic and Enicar Sherpas have a compressor case.
> 
> best regards from Vienna


Sherpa Star. Screw back.

watches gallery: Enicar 1970s Mint Sherpa Star SS Automatic Watch

Later Sherpas are not always compressor cases. In this case, case back photos inside and out will show the EPSA patent number(s) and or the dive helmet logo indicating a compressor case.


----------



## hns-panama

Um, no. Not all Sherpas have compressor cases:

Vintage Enicar Men&apos;s Sherpa 320 Automatic Gold Tone Day Date Watch SPACE AGE ERA | eBay

VINTAGE ENICAR SHERPA - RUNNING - NEEDS WORK

Sherpa Stars are screw back. Enicar discovered that EPSA bayonet mounts were getting expensive to use and went with traditional screw back to lower costs. This is especially true after 1970 when Sherpa became more of a marketing device than a true indicator of strength and water resistance.

So, we are back to decent photos of the case back and looking for the EPSA compressor markings, which include patent number(s) or bayonet open and close markings.


----------



## hns-panama

Proby01 said:


> I just added one more to my collection : a lovely green dial Enicar D 600 (don't know why I see a lot of pages where they call it the "comprssor" ?.... why would that be ?).... 38mm without the crown, nice solid size. Caliber 167D, automatic, I love this watch, should be a 1975 !
> View attachment 12350761
> View attachment 12350765
> View attachment 12350767


By the way, the movement is almost certainly a 165D since the 167D had the day complication in addition to date. Hence the words D and DD on certain models.


----------



## QWatchQ

Sherpa Guide 33 with Supertest cal 1126, Mk I and II transitional

Working star gear.

ref 126/001


----------



## QWatchQ

nifty delay


----------



## QWatchQ

Nifty


----------



## HoustonHorn

Still new at all this vintage Enicar stuff although I did read the fantastic ebay buying guide by HNS-Panama. Thank you for all that information.

I've been looking to pull the trigger on a vintage Sherpa and came across this Sherpa Guide. Seems legit from what I can tell but figured I'd run it by the experts. I love the colors on it and the patina, but the colors are different from most Sherpa Guides I've seen. Does that raise questions? Is it authentic? I don't have a picture of the movement, so is that a concern? The back of the case is so polished down it is almost impossible read anything on it as well.

In any event, I really love this thread and it has given me a new appreciation for a watch brand I had minimal knowledge of until recently but is now a brand I really want to get more serious about collecting.

Thanks in advance!

Vintage Enicar Sherpa Guide 600 GMT with Blue Racing Dial | eBay


----------



## number 15

My NTM Enicar. I really like it but I am not totally sure what model it is. Case back is worn pretty bad but it has a dolphin and the numbers 147-01-02, if I am reading them right.


----------



## Stigmata

number 15 said:


> My NTM Enicar. I really like it but I am not totally sure what model it is. Case back is worn pretty bad but it has a dolphin and the numbers 147-01-02, if I am reading them right.
> 
> View attachment 12374401


Hmmmmmmm a redial probably started its new life in India
If you like it it's all good

Sent from my Z2131 using Tapatalk


----------



## Danny4

number 15 said:


> My NTM Enicar. I really like it but I am not totally sure what model it is. Case back is worn pretty bad but it has a dolphin and the numbers 147-01-02, if I am reading them right.


Looks like a bombay special model to me.


----------



## number 15

It did not come from India, but the reputable dealer did say he refurbed the dial. For the price I payed I have no issues. If it was a redial they did a pretty good job and payed attention to detail.

A quick google search found some Enicar with a similar yellow but not the same exact pattern, of course these could be Indian specials as well 
Enicar Swiss Made Mens Rare Authentic Vintage Automatic Watch... for $799 for sale from a Trusted Seller on Chrono24


----------



## QWatchQ

HoustonHorn said:


> Still new at all this vintage Enicar stuff although I did read the fantastic ebay buying guide by HNS-Panama. Thank you for all that information.
> 
> I've been looking to pull the trigger on a vintage Sherpa and came across this Sherpa Guide. Seems legit from what I can tell but figured I'd run it by the experts. I love the colors on it and the patina, but the colors are different from most Sherpa Guides I've seen. Does that raise questions? Is it authentic? I don't have a picture of the movement, so is that a concern? The back of the case is so polished down it is almost impossible read anything on it as well.
> 
> In any event, I really love this thread and it has given me a new appreciation for a watch brand I had minimal knowledge of until recently but is now a brand I really want to get more serious about collecting.
> 
> Thanks in advance!
> 
> Vintage Enicar Sherpa Guide 600 GMT with Blue Racing Dial | eBay
> 
> View attachment 12374273
> 
> View attachment 12374283


I'm always leery with a smooth back and it's always a calculated risk if no movement shot.

Google "Springbar+Enicar" and enjoy the read, Look at the Mark II Guide.


----------



## HoustonHorn

QWatchQ said:


> I'm always leery with a smooth back and it's always a calculated risk if no movement shot.
> 
> Google "Springbar+Enicar" and enjoy the read, Look at the Mark II Guide.


Thank you very much! I agree. I've asked if there is a picture of the movement. I did see in the sellers Instagram that he has a production number dating the watch to 1969. So would seem he got that information from somewhere that isn't readily identifiable in the information in the listing or photos. Would the production number be in the movement or the case-back/inside the case-back?

I did review the information on Springbar which is another great resource. It seems to be consistent with the Mark III from what I can tell. Everything seemed to match and look consistent except the blue dial but it does say Enicar made some different colored dials during that time frame.

Seller is on vacation so pictures of the movement may not be readily available until later in the week if they are available at all. As soon as I get more info I'll definitely post.

The seller is a WUSer with lots of positive feedback so that is a good sign.

I hope it's legit as I am trying to focus my watch collecting and this would be a great start along with my Pogue to getting into vintage watches. I think I really enjoy the hunt and the research and the history more than just buying a watch anyone can buy online.


----------



## Dan S

HoustonHorn said:


> Everything seemed to match and look consistent except the blue dial ...


This is a decent and complete example, with correct bezel, red pointer, and crowns, and the case isn't badly polished. The inner bezel has faded to some interesting colors. The bezel is damaged, but that's almost always the case, and I've seen much worse. So overall, I think it's definitely worth buying at the right price.

However, I really think a reality check is in order regarding the dial. Are you really going to let this seller convince you that this is some kind of rare blue dial? Use your eyes, the dial is black, maybe slightly faded to a dark grey.


----------



## HoustonHorn

badbackdan said:


> This is a decent and complete example, with correct bezel, red pointer, and crowns, and the case isn't badly polished. The inner bezel has faded to some interesting colors. The bezel is damaged, but that's almost always the case, and I've seen much worse. So overall, I think it's definitely worth buying at the right price.
> 
> However, I really think a reality check is in order regarding the dial. Are you really going to let this seller convince you that this is some kind of rare blue dial? Use your eyes, the dial is black, maybe slightly faded to a dark grey.


Thank you very much for the comments. Very helpful. I don't disagree with you on the color of the dial. I think it is likely just black that has faded slightly. I'm not interested because he's claiming it's blue. It was just a verification of authenticity more than anything.

The price seems reasonable based on what I've seen and the condition. With the main caveat to that being whether the movement is true to the model of the watch.

The seller responded and is it out of town on vacation. He's willing to see if he can get the back off or take it to a jeweler when he gets back.

He did send some close up pics of the back of the watch and it appears to be marked 146-35-01.

This would be consistent with HNS's buying guide for a 1969 Sherpa Guide from what I can tell. There is a chance it says 140-35-01 which isn't clear if that is correct.

The other question is that the HNS buying guide states the following.

124/5/6 = cal. 1124/5/6 (If the movement has a serial number, it is their top-grade Supertest caliber.)
144 = cal. 1144 or 1145
146 or 148 = cal. 1146 (Later Sherpa Jet cases show 148 as an example)

My question is if it is in fact a 146, based on the above, does that make it worth less than if it was an 1126. Is the 146 top-grade Supertest caliber? It does have a serial number like the guide says. But does his note apply only to the 124/5/6 or other cals with a serial number like this one with 146.

Other than that, how much would a jeweler charge to remove the back? For peace of mind I'd include that in the price with the condition that if it shows it's the correct movement then I include that in the price I pay for the watch, if it doesn't then the seller pays and we renegotiate the cost of the watch (or I just walk from the deal).

Seller seems very reasonable so I don't think this is some elaborate scam. There is just some confusion between the various models and movements and with the high amount of inter-changeability between parts I just want to verify what I'm getting is what I'm paying for. Better to know now than when/if I ever try to sell it.

Thanks again!


----------



## Dan S

Use the eBay advanced search to find actual prices of sold watches. Don't go by asking prices, or inflated prices from internet sellers. These watches are quite common and sell in auctions all the time, so you can really judge a fair price. 

The movement will have a small impact on value, the particular model is more important (e.g. Mark I, Mark II, etc.). 

Showing pictures of the movement is part of the cost of selling a watch.


----------



## hns-panama

HoustonHorn said:


> Thank you very much for the comments. Very helpful. I don't disagree with you on the color of the dial. I think it is likely just black that has faded slightly. I'm not interested because he's claiming it's blue. It was just a verification of authenticity more than anything.
> 
> The price seems reasonable based on what I've seen and the condition. With the main caveat to that being whether the movement is true to the model of the watch.
> 
> The seller responded and is it out of town on vacation. He's willing to see if he can get the back off or take it to a jeweler when he gets back.
> 
> He did send some close up pics of the back of the watch and it appears to be marked 146-35-01.
> 
> This would be consistent with HNS's buying guide for a 1969 Sherpa Guide from what I can tell. There is a chance it says 140-35-01 which isn't clear if that is correct.
> 
> The other question is that the HNS buying guide states the following.
> 
> 124/5/6 = cal. 1124/5/6 (If the movement has a serial number, it is their top-grade Supertest caliber.)
> 144 = cal. 1144 or 1145
> 146 or 148 = cal. 1146 (Later Sherpa Jet cases show 148 as an example)
> 
> My question is if it is in fact a 146, based on the above, does that make it worth less than if it was an 1126. Is the 146 top-grade Supertest caliber? It does have a serial number like the guide says. But does his note apply only to the 124/5/6 or other cals with a serial number like this one with 146.
> 
> Other than that, how much would a jeweler charge to remove the back? For peace of mind I'd include that in the price with the condition that if it shows it's the correct movement then I include that in the price I pay for the watch, if it doesn't then the seller pays and we renegotiate the cost of the watch (or I just walk from the deal).
> 
> Seller seems very reasonable so I don't think this is some elaborate scam. There is just some confusion between the various models and movements and with the high amount of inter-changeability between parts I just want to verify what I'm getting is what I'm paying for. Better to know now than when/if I ever try to sell it.
> 
> Thanks again!


Sent you a pm, but quickly, I have a NOS blue dial for a Sherpa. So that fits with the blue on the inner bezel. I have seen blue dialed Guides before.

Supertest movements had serial numbers. I have a 1145 ST movement with serial number and ST marked on the dial. I bought it after I wrote the guide.

So, most likely, the Guide is correct.

Question. How do you know the movement has a serial number?

Sent from my SM-G570M using Tapatalk


----------



## Stigmata

Inside the case back in many instances


----------



## HoustonHorn

I was mistaken on the serial number. I got your PM as well. Thank you very much for the information.

The seller did offer to see about getting the case-back taken off. I may offer to pay for that assuming it confirms that the movement is correct. He did indicate he thought it was a 126 but was not sure about that. It definitely looks like it is a 146 and not a Supertest. Regardless I do like the watch. Definitely happy to hear the blue dial is likely legit. It can be difficult to tell on these older watches and it could easily be either blue or faded black.


----------



## HoustonHorn

HoustonHorn said:


> I was mistaken on the serial number. I got your PM as well. Thank you very much for the information.
> 
> The seller did offer to see about getting the case-back taken off. I may offer to pay for that assuming it confirms that the movement is correct. He did indicate he thought it was a 126 but was not sure about that. It definitely looks like it is a 146 and not a Supertest. Regardless I do like the watch. Definitely happy to hear the blue dial is likely legit. It can be difficult to tell on these older watches and it could easily be either blue or faded black.


I believe I'm straight on everything now. A huge thanks to HNS-Panama for his messages re: the various movements and dial color. Also thanks to everyone who posted info above.


----------



## HoustonHorn

Here is a picture of the movement in the Sherpa Guide. Send to be a 1166 compared to the case showing 145 or 146. So not fully authentic there. What does that do to the value?


----------



## Stigmata

Nothing
As long as it works well etc
The watch is fine


----------



## HoustonHorn

Stigmata said:


> Nothing
> As long as it works well etc
> The watch is fine


Fantastic, thanks!


----------



## hns-panama

HoustonHorn said:


> Fantastic, thanks!


Agreed. Enicar was certainly capable of sticking a newer 166 movement in some remaining 148 Guide cases. Is there a date on the inner case back?


----------



## Stigmata

This is common with enicar
Don't worry


----------



## QWatchQ

Seapearl 600, Tropic strap


----------



## RTK-WGM

Family together









Wysłane z mojego Lenovo P2a42 przy użyciu Tapatalka


----------



## hns-panama

I took a closer look at my Seapearl 600, which is the same model. In your photos, I can make out the seconds marks partially covered by the trim ring.

Mine looks like this:









So, the trim ring is certainly a replace ment for the chrome ring lost somewhere over the years. Here is what I wrote about the replacements:

"I used the larger of the Seapearl 600 crystals I bought. It was G-S PA463-9 and the case ref. number is 100/61-aSN. I used a white trim ring from a Stella Armed WRA302."

And there you are....

I would change the ring and crystal then post in my "If this watch could talk" thread.



QWatchQ said:


> Seapearl 600, Tropic strap


----------



## Jamie H

Hi all, I was looking for a new watch recently and ran across an Enicar dress watch at a local watch repair. It had originally been brought in for repairs and had been unclaimed for years. I had been given a new crystal, crown, mainspring, and band. After reading most of this amazing thread, I purchased it as most everything seemed to check out. I'm posting pictures of the face, back, and edge, but at this time do not have the tools to operand post a picture of the movement. I'll be returning to the watchmaker to get a chance to do that. The back is inscribed 100/142 LP, and there is a fine inscription on the case between the lugs saying Gold Plated G 10 Microns, and a small logo that I cannot discern.

My question is that, in all of the pictures I've been able to find online, I haven't seen a detail like this on the bezel, and I've only seen one face that seemed to be textured in a similar way, although that was not a good shot. I'd appreciate your thoughts.

Thanks,
Jamie


----------



## Stigmata

Nice fifties dresser
Enjoy


----------



## John MS

I believe that was called a linen style dial. Looks good with the bezel. Nice looking Enicar.


----------



## QWatchQ

hns-panama said:


> I took a closer look at my Seapearl 600, which is the same model. In your photos, I can make out the seconds marks partially covered by the trim ring.
> 
> Mine looks like this:
> 
> View attachment 12425525
> 
> 
> So, the trim ring is certainly a replace ment for the chrome ring lost somewhere over the years. Here is what I wrote about the replacements:
> 
> "I used the larger of the Seapearl 600 crystals I bought. It was G-S PA463-9 and the case ref. number is 100/61-aSN. I used a white trim ring from a Stella Armed WRA302."
> 
> And there you are....
> 
> I would change the ring and crystal then post in my "If this watch could talk" thread.


Thank you for your input and willingness to share with fellow enthusiasts. I will have my watchmaker line things up at servicing.

With mine, I Love the golden patina of the dial, markers and logo.


----------



## Proby01

Hi Enicar lovers, I need a bit of help : I have the chance to purchase, next sunday, a rather unique dial Enicar (probably 1970), TV shaped, with asymmetrical case, the reference on the back is 147-06-01. The inside of the glass is "faceted", nice.
The seller says it's the same case of the Mantagraph. Does anybody know what model this could be ? And also are the hands original ? they are very nice but I never seen an Enicar with these different color hands.... as it is an expensive piece (600 euros) I would seek opinions.... thanks in advance
Roby


----------



## Dan S

I found a similar watch. $600 seems extremely high to me. I doubt he can get half that amount.

La Mesure du Temps: Enicar - automatic


----------



## Proby01

badbackdan said:


> I found a similar watch. $600 seems extremely high to me. I doubt he can get half that amount.
> 
> La Mesure du Temps: Enicar - automatic


Hi Dan, and thanks for the quick reply, I think it is a bit on the high side the price. He tells me that the case is a bulky "asymetrical", like the Mantagraph... it' s a TV shaped but is thicker on the upper part than the lower.... Also the movement of this one I am dealing for should an 1147 which is a good Enicar caliber but not a "rare" one.... the one you kindly linked has a 167 caliber. You think that one sold for half that price ?... Can it be that much the difference ?.... I don' t know... 
what do you think about the hands ?


----------



## Dan S

I have no idea how much the other one sold for, but I just don't see why someone would pay even $300 for it, never mind $600. The hands on the one you are considering are completely wrong obviously, which greatly reduces the value. 

Just because a watch is uncommon doesn't make it valuable. I would offer him $150 or $200 at the most.


----------



## Proby01

thanks a lot for the advice Dan. 
I have several Enicars but cannot be knowleadgeable about many... this one, seen only in photo (sunday the guy will bring it over) made me wonder about the arms (you confirm that are not right) and the price. The Enicar 1147 is a good movement (used in the Sherpa Star) but not exactly a rarity.... He states that this is a very rare, unique case and dial etc... but just for the arms i am discouraged..

thanks again

ciao

Roby



badbackdan said:


> I have no idea how much the other one sold for, but I just don't see why someone would pay even $300 for it, never mind $600. The hands on the one you are considering are completely wrong obviously, which greatly reduces the value.
> 
> Just because a watch is uncommon doesn't make it valuable. I would offer him $150 or $200 at the most.


----------



## Dan S

I'm willing to believe that it's rare and you obviously love it. But Enicar made tons of different styles, so many of them are probably uncommon; and to be totally candid, these 1970s styles represent a fairly limited collector's market. Some people love them, but they are not as collectible (yet) as earlier watches. 

Another way to think about it would be to compare it to other Enicar watches of roughly similar quality/style from the 1970s; you will see that they are generally selling for less than $200, even in decent condition (not asking prices, actual sales prices). Unlike some of the Sherpa divers and chronographs, the conventional models are still modestly priced. And as you mentioned, the hands are a real turn-off.


----------



## Proby01

Hi Dan,
you are absolutely correct, I did look up similar models and calibers from that age... hence my being rather skeptical... and hence my asking.. thanks so much.

Back to watching solar eclips... even in Italy we are watching it.... youtube NASA... ;-)...

regards

Roby



badbackdan said:


> I'm willing to believe that it's rare and you obviously love it. But Enicar made tons of different styles, so many of them are probably uncommon; and to be totally candid, these 1970s styles represent a fairly limited collector's market. Some people love them, but they are not as collectible (yet) as earlier watches.
> 
> Another way to think about it would be to compare it to other Enicar watches of roughly similar quality/style from the 1970s; you will see that they are generally selling for less than $200, even in decent condition (not asking prices, actual sales prices). Unlike some of the Sherpa divers and chronographs, the conventional models are still modestly priced. And as you mentioned, the hands are a real turn-off.


----------



## frankaaro

Hi everybody!
I recently found an old watch on a flea market here in Oslo with no name on the dial and case-back, just the words «swiss made» at the bottom of the dial.
I assumed it was something fake, but picked it up anyway just because of the cool, clean dial. I opened it and it says «enicar watch co» in side the casebook and on the caliber.
It was working for a few days, but after I dropped it on the floor it stopped. The local watchmaker couldn't say more than that he thought it was pretty old, he guessed at 1920's or so.

I have been looking around for a few days, but I can't find anything that looks like it. It looks to me like this is either a fake or a franked-watch with a new dial. The only thing that bothers me is that there is nothing on the outside of the casebook but "enicar watch co" on the inside. Wouldn't a fake have at least some engravings on the outside?

I'm considering getting it fixed so that my wife can wear it. It is a bit small for me at 33mm, but she also loves the dial.

What do you guys think? Is this just garbage or should I put some money into fixing it?

Thanks,

Frank


----------



## Dan S

It's a solid SS case and a fully-jeweled Swiss movement, so it's not garbage. But it will never have much value due to the unbranded dial, which is probably not original. The hands are probably replacements. So this is a purely personal decision for you.

Clearly your watchmaker knows little about vintage watches if he seriously said that the watch was from the 1920s. I'd have to do more research to identify the movement, but I'm guessing 1950s.


----------



## frankaaro

Thanks Dan! I'm probably fixing this one, cool to know what it is though!

Frank


----------



## horology_biology

Stigmata said:


> Not anything I would be rushing off to buy
> Franken
> 
> Sent from my Z2131 using Tapatalk


Just to set this straight this is 10000% not a franken!

I have exactly the same Sherpa in my collection. Same case, dial, hands, caseback, caliber etc etc

If you do a search for Enicar Sherpa single crown models you will see the auto version on The Springbar blog.

IG: Horology_Biology


----------



## horology_biology

HoustonHorn said:


> Just starting to get into Enicar watches and came across this for sale. Listing says Sherpa 600 diver but I'm not seeing any pictures in this thread or elsewhere that have this dial for any Sherpa 600 divers. Back case is extremely worn and barely visible.
> 
> Anyways, if it's legit I'd be interested but wanted to get a more knowledgeable opinion first.
> 
> Thanks!


Just to set this straight this is 10000% not a franken!

I have exactly the same Sherpa in my collection. Same case, dial, hands, caseback, caliber etc etc

If you do a search for Enicar Sherpa single crown models you will see the auto version on The Springbar blog.

IG: Horology_Biology


----------



## Stigmata

The beauty of these forums is we can all give input
If you have one and you're 100% correct .. That makes me wrong! 
So that's great we've settled something here!
Thanks for setting the record straight


----------



## Tnt9




----------



## Stigmata

Another Guide and a blood orange juice


----------



## Jim44

I know very little about Enicar watches but I find them interesting. If someone with knowledge of the brand would be willing to share their opinions and/or any insights about the watch in this listing I would be interested to learn about it:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/132042544086

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## tmessenger

Solid movement watches looks to be in good condition and the seller has already been mentioned in this thread as reliable, nothing to be afraid of here IMO.



Jim44 said:


> I know very little about Enicar watches but I find them interesting. If someone with knowledge of the brand would be willing to share their opinions and/or any insights about the watch in this listing I would be interested to learn about it:
> 
> https://www.ebay.com/itm/132042544086
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Jim44

tmessenger said:


> Solid movement watches looks to be in good condition and the seller has already been mentioned in this thread as reliable, nothing to be afraid of here IMO.


Thank you!

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## LightDot

Well, in this example, the case back suggests a 140 calibre family, doesn't it? While the actual movement is a 161 calibre?


----------



## tmessenger

Sorry my bad not to notice.



LightDot said:


> Well, in this example, the case back suggests a 140 calibre family, doesn't it? While the actual movement is a 161 calibre?


----------



## Jim44

LightDot said:


> Well, in this example, the case back suggests a 140 calibre family, doesn't it? While the actual movement is a 161 calibre?


I noticed that too. I guess it is possible Enicar just used an older case with a newer movement (if I understand correctly the 161 replaced the 140). Also possible that someone replaced the movement (or the case) at a later date I suppose.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Dan S

Excited to join the club with my first Enicar, an early Sherpa Dive single-crown EPSA super-compressor. The inside of the case-back is marked with the date 7-58.


----------



## QWatchQ

badbackdan said:


> Excited to join the club with my first Enicar, an early Sherpa Dive single-crown EPSA super-compressor. The inside of the case-back is marked with the date 7-58.
> 
> View attachment 12497835
> 
> 
> View attachment 12497837
> 
> 
> View attachment 12497839
> 
> 
> View attachment 12497841
> 
> 
> View attachment 12497845


SherpaS on the case back.....nifty example.


----------



## Dan S

QWatchQ said:


> SherpaS on the case back.....nifty example.


Many thanks for your comment. It's my first pre-1960 diver, and I'm really enjoying it.

As I'm sure you are aware, the Springbar collector's guide is incredibly helpful (e.g. it describes the "Sherpas" caseback marking for this model). Unfortunately, the link to the guide currently seems to be dead; I hope it will be resurrected soon.

https://thespringbar.com/blogs/guides/enicar-sherpa-collectors-guide-part-1-single-crown-models


----------



## QWatchQ

Use Google cache


----------



## Jim44

QWatchQ said:


> Use Google cache


Can also try the internet archive (google "wayback machine")

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## tmessenger

1290 movement in like new condition, serviced it yesterday don't believe it has ever been apart. Timegrapher numbers are excellent, the dial is pearl silver quite striking in natural light.


----------



## OPChagall

badbackdan said:


> Many thanks for your comment. It's my first pre-1960 diver, and I'm really enjoying it.
> 
> As I'm sure you are aware, the Springbar collector's guide is incredibly helpful (e.g. it describes the "Sherpas" caseback marking for this model). Unfortunately, the link to the guide currently seems to be dead; I hope it will be resurrected soon.
> 
> https://thespringbar.com/blogs/guides/enicar-sherpa-collectors-guide-part-1-single-crown-models


It is back up. Looks intensely fascinating and comprehensive. The perfect resource in the search for my first Enicar. Thanks, Dan.

(To note: the guide focuses on single-crown Enicars. It promises two more parts to cover two and three crown Enicars, which don't appear to be out yet.)


----------



## Dan S

OPChagall said:


> It is back up. Looks intensely fascinating and comprehensive. The perfect resource in the search for my first Enicar. Thanks, Dan.
> 
> (To note: the guide focuses on single-crown Enicars. It promises two more parts to cover two and three crown Enicars, which don't appear to be out yet.)


Here are the other reviews that I know of:

https://thespringbar.com/blogs/guides/enicar-sherpa-pilot-2-crown-models
https://thespringbar.com/blogs/guides/enicar-sherpa-diver-2-crown-models


----------



## GraX

guys what can you say about this enicar?






mutex/ocfipreoqyfb/mutex


----------



## Dan S

GraX said:


> guys what can you say about this enicar? mutex/ocfipreoqyfb/mutex


At first glance, I strongly suspect a re-dial or total fake.


----------



## GraX

that was my suspicion also
mutex/ocfipreoqyfb/mutex


----------



## AAEnriquez

My vintage Enicar as given to me by my lovely grandfather, god bless his soul










It's 18kt Gold including the bracelet

I'm not sure how old but my father tells me it was bought in Italy in 1952 so that looks about right.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Stigmata

AAEnriquez said:


> My vintage Enicar as given to me by my lovely grandfather, god bless his soul
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It's 18kt Gold including the bracelet
> 
> I'm not sure how old but my father tells me it was bought in Italy in 1952 so that looks about right.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Looks very forties
Nice watch


----------



## laikrodukas

are those hands from 1910's pocket watch?


----------



## AAEnriquez

laikrodukas said:


> are those hands from 1910's pocket watch?


As far as I know it's original

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## laikrodukas

I highly doubt so, the dial is repainted and hands are from several decades away


----------



## Dan S

AAEnriquez said:


> As far as I know it's original
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Hands are not original, but it would be a cheap fix to replace them with something more appropriate, just some straight gold-colored hands without lume.


----------



## Proby01

you were correct, 165D indeed

thanks
Roby


----------



## Proby01

Over the summer, trip to the US, I lost it on the older style "Flexi"... Speidels, Kreisler, Fixo-flex etc... I been raiding old stores and got a few, I am now "re-braceleting" most of my collection, removing leather in favour of flexis.... including several of my Enicars, here are the first 2.. more to come :... .;-)


----------



## AAEnriquez

badbackdan said:


> Hands are not original, but it would be a cheap fix to replace them with something more appropriate, just some straight gold-colored hands without lume.


Don't forget this watch was bought in 1952 in Italy and has rarely been used and definitely not been repainted or re-handed here in Australia as far as I know. I can't see it being done in Italy either as it was near new then. I'll ask my father if he has any other history on the watch and I'll let you know.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Dan S

AAEnriquez said:


> Don't forget this watch was bought in 1952 in Italy and has rarely been used and definitely not been repainted or re-handed here in Australia as far as I know. I can't see it being done in Italy either as it was near new then. I'll ask my father if he has any other history on the watch and I'll let you know.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Sorry, but it's absolutely absurd to claim that those hands are original. Regardless of what your family says, it's not even a possibility. I understand that people develop family stories around watches. But this forum is about facts, and and hands like that were never used on this watch. It is very common for hands to be replaced.


----------



## Dan S

AAEnriquez said:


> Don't forget this watch was bought in 1952 in Italy and has rarely been used and definitely not been repainted or re-handed here in Australia as far as I know. I can't see it being done in Italy either as it was near new then. I'll ask my father if he has any other history on the watch and I'll let you know.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Sorry, but it's absolutely absurd to claim that those hands are original. Regardless of what your family says, it's not even a possibility. I understand that people develop family stories around watches. But this forum is about facts, and and hands like that were never used on this watch. It is very common for hands to be replaced.


----------



## Stigmata

Two more


----------



## bose91

My watch Enicar Day/Date. I must fix it because, for me, are beautiful (is a gift from my father)..


----------



## shelfcompact

New arrival. Need to find a good leather strap for it. 
Any suggestions? (color/type)


----------



## Dan S

shelfcompact said:


> New arrival. Need to find a good leather strap for it.
> Any suggestions? (color/type)


Beautiful example. Virtually any leather strap would look great (black, brown, tan, etc.), although it is a dive watch, so rubber or perlon/nylon are also appropriate. Sorry, I know that's not much help, but in this case it's really a matter of taste, and how you want to wear it.


----------



## kazrich

shelfcompact said:


> New arrival. Need to find a good leather strap for it.
> Any suggestions? (color/type)
> 
> That's a very nice example shelfcompact !
> 
> I keep a small number of 35 - 36mm divers in my Enicar collection and have been trying to ascertain what straps were originally available for them.
> It's not always easy to identify from original black and white images, and different markets may have offered different straps but I would guess the following might be close to contemporary options.
> 
> 1. 1956 / 58 Sherpas / Sherpa with silver dial. Plain flat black leather or stainless steel bracelet ( possibly beads of rice ).
> 2. 1956 Seapearl 600 or Healthways. Black leather or thin tapered black rubber Tropic ' Star ' strap.
> 3. 1963 Single crown Dive or Divette. Black leather or Thicker but not tapered Tropic style with heavily decorated edges and diamond shapes holes.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 1964 double crown Divette. Black leather , thin tapered rubber black Tropic 'Star' , or s/s bracelet as shown in the launch advert.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Either way, Sherpa Dive's and Divette's look good on most types of strap.
> 
> Here's mine


----------



## bose91

bose91 said:


> My watch Enicar Day/Date. I must fix it because, for me, are beautiful (is a gift from my father)..
> 
> View attachment 12586583
> 
> View attachment 12586585


Do you know what type of chassis install this watch? I want to take the original crown but I don't know which one to buy.
Thank you


----------



## dpa

Some wonderful watches... found my watch in a 2nd hand store in 94, major service earlier this year...


----------



## oscarfranciscovich

Anyone who has and/or can provide any info about this Enicar? I would like to buy one! The same model!

Thanks in advance!

Oscar


----------



## shelfcompact

kazrich said:


> That's a very nice example shelfcompact !
> 
> I keep a small number of 35 - 36mm divers in my Enicar collection and have been trying to ascertain what straps were originally available for them.
> It's not always easy to identify from original black and white images, and different markets may have offered different straps but I would guess the following might be close to contemporary options.
> 
> 1. 1956 / 58 Sherpas / Sherpa with silver dial. Plain flat black leather or stainless steel bracelet ( possibly beads of rice ).
> 2. 1956 Seapearl 600 or Healthways. Black leather or thin tapered black rubber Tropic ' Star ' strap.
> 3. 1963 Single crown Dive or Divette. Black leather or Thicker but not tapered Tropic style with heavily decorated edges and diamond shapes holes.
> 
> https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4465/37552243760_9336b1bf7c_b.jpg[IMG]
> 
> 1964 double crown Divette. Black leather , thin tapered rubber black Tropic 'Star' , or s/s bracelet as shown in the launch advert.
> 
> [IMG]https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4483/37140209863_667041925b_z.jpg[IMG]
> 
> Either way, Sherpa Dive's and Divette's look good on most types of strap.
> 
> Here's mine
> 
> [IMG]https://farm6.staticflickr.com/5716/30884850860_31c9dc7375_c.jpg[IMG]
> 
> [IMG]https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4452/37100637834_aaf455090c_c.jpg[IMG][/QUOTE]
> 
> Thanks much!
> I really appreciate the info here.
> 
> I figured a tropic strap as pictured would work. I use similar "new" and vintage NOS tropic straps on a couple other watches though.
> I like that gray one you have!
> 
> And if I could find that BoR for this watch as pictured in the advert, I'd be so happy. It looks great.
> Will keep a lookout for it.
> 
> Here's the bracelet that came with my particular watch. I'm not sure it's original to the watch, but it is Enicar branded.
> I can't warm up to the style though.
> 
> [IMG]https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4492/38078360081_c1136ab59a_b.jpg


----------



## HoustonHorn

Picked up a cheapie on eBay which came in today. Didn't have time to research it first but even if it's a Frankenicar I still like the look.

It's an Enicar Seapearl. The dial has a very interesting look to it which almost makes me think redial but everything else on the dial (text/markers/lume) seems legitimate. The bezel is also different from most I've seen although I did find a few that have that dial but on different Enicars.

Not sure about the text on the case back. Movement reference seems consistent but not sure what the V stands for. A- Automatic, a-all steel, S-sweep seconds. Also not sure about BREV. DEM. Brevet, Dem?

100/115 VaAS
BREV. DEM.

A few pictures.

Would appreciate any thoughts.


----------



## kazrich

Watch looks genuine to me. I'm pretty sure I've seen something similar but not 100 % sure.
Brev. Dem means patent requested / applied for. I'm minded to think that your watch dates to 1954 /55 because the case appears to
be an early waterproof EPSA Seapearl with a bayonet release back. If it were later than 1956 the patent had already been granted for 
Enicar EPSA compressor and Super compressor cases.
The 4 leaf clover design on the caseback, Enicar signed through the planet Saturn and Ultrasonic inscription on the dial were all phased out in the early 1960's.
I think that the Ultrasonic process of cleaning was used by Enicar from 1953. They refrained from marking it on the dial in the early 60's.
The Dauphine style hands are also more 1950's.
I would polish the scratches off the crystal or replace it.


----------



## HoustonHorn

kazrich said:


> Watch looks genuine to me. I'm pretty sure I've seen something similar but not 100 % sure.
> Brev. Dem means patent requested / applied for. I'm minded to think that your watch dates to 1954 /55 because the case appears to
> be an early waterproof EPSA Seapearl with a bayonet release back. If it were later than 1956 the patent had already been granted for
> Enicar EPSA compressor and Super compressor cases.
> The 4 leaf clover design on the caseback, Enicar signed through the planet Saturn and Ultrasonic inscription on the dial were all phased out in the early 1960's.
> I think that the Ultrasonic process of cleaning was used by Enicar from 1953. They refrained from marking it on the dial in the early 60's.
> The Dauphine style hands are also more 1950's.
> I would polish the scratches off the crystal or replace it.


Awesome information, thank you very much.

It is definitely a beauty and got it for cheap. Polished the crystal last night. Needs some more work but got rid of most of the scratches.

Here's the movement from the listing, don't have the inside of the case back.


----------



## 147 05 01

Hello HoustonHorn, hello kazrich
I have this watch with the same reference number and a similar dial. "V" stands for a special bottom on this watch. It is not a waterproof bayonet lock. It's a bit difficult to explain but the floor is easy to open. There is a notch in the housing and a wedge on the lid. Position the housing opener, a short turn and the bevel in the housing lifts off the pressure bottom cleanly.
.














best regards from Vienna


----------



## kazrich

Hello 147-05-01 ;
That's interesting. Can you please provide images of
1. The dial.
2. The inside of the case back.
Thanks


----------



## 147 05 01

Hello kazrich;

you will be disappointed, because the inside of the case back is absolutely unspectacular:


----------



## kazrich

Hello 147-05-01 , I thought that all 1950's 14 facet Enicar cases were bayonet release Compressor ( Brevet 98243 ) or Super Compressors ( Brevet 314962 ) produced by EPSA.
The angled facet's designed to accept an Enicar case removal or a Jaxa type tool. I've not seen one open the way yours does. I know that some much later Enicar's had screw back's
and they still featured multi faceted backs - but not from 1950's / early 60's.
I only keep 4 1950's Enicar's. 3 have similar looking backs to yours and are all clearly marked EPSA and dated on the caseback. The fourth has a plain back that pushes on
but is not marked either waterproof or water resistant. The closest in looks to yours is this Sherpa from 1957.


----------



## HoustonHorn

147 05 01 said:


> Hello HoustonHorn, hello kazrich
> I have this watch with the same reference number and a similar dial. "V" stands for a special bottom on this watch. It is not a waterproof bayonet lock. It's a bit difficult to explain but the floor is easy to open. There is a notch in the housing and a wedge on the lid. Position the housing opener, a short turn and the bevel in the housing lifts off the pressure bottom cleanly.
> .
> View attachment 12631701
> View attachment 12631703
> 
> 
> best regards from Vienna


That is very interesting and something I had not noticed. Mine is exactly the same.

Thanks for the info.


----------



## 147 05 01

Hello kazrich, I have checked my Enicars from this period and I only found Compressor/Super Compressor with 14 facet cases. All, except these two, are marked on the dial with Sherpa(s).


----------



## kazrich

Hello 147-05-01.
Thanks for sharing two great examples. I also keep a Seapearl from 1958. This is also an early Super Compressor model.



















However, I think that your Supertest dates to the early 1960's because
1. It's a later 33 jewel version
2. The caseback shows the pearl inside the open oyster rather than a 4 leaf clover.
3. Enicar is not signed through the planet Saturn on the dial. Saturn is above the Enicar logo.


----------



## 147 05 01

Hello kazrich,

Very elegant and stylish watch!

You're right, the AR 1125 was not produced until 1962.

What do you think about these two specimens? On both dials the Saturn is above the Enicar logo, but 120/013 has the clover on the caseback and 140/013 shows the oyster.


----------



## kazrich

Hi 147-05-01
I think that the difference in the backs is down to the transition from the 4 leaf clover design to the oyster shell design. Both are signed Enicar under Saturn and
probably date to the early 60's. If they are 34 / 35 mm without crown they are both unusual in having ' paddle ' hands as they are more often seen on the 36 and 40 mm Enicars
from approx 1961 - 1967.
According to the book Enicar Watches ( 1913 - 1988 ) over 100 Sherpa models were made and some were formally Seapearl's redialled as Sherpa.
This one is similar to yours but without the paddle hands.


----------



## 147 05 01

Hi kazrich,
thanks for the picture and the estimation of the production time of these watches.


----------



## Sansoni7

Mine...with a cork strap.


----------



## Jim44

Sansoni7 said:


> Mine...with a cork strap.


That strap looks great with that watch

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Sansoni7

Tks.
yes, the color of the strap is similar as the dial.


----------



## Sansoni7

Hi
Is this watch legit, or it has a «franken crown»?
Tks in advance


----------



## Evar

Sansoni7 said:


> Hi
> Is this watch legit, or it has a «franken crown»?
> Tks in advance


Do you have a better picture of the crown? 
I'm by no means an Enicar expert, I've never seen an Enicar like this so I am not one to say it is legit or not. I've not seen many Enicars with Roman Numerals, in General.


----------



## Evar

Currently my only one...


----------



## bmfang

I have a couple that are awaiting the day when I can be bothered fixing them up. But by my reckoning, they are some of the cheapest Enicar’s out there


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Sansoni7

Evar said:


> Do you have a better picture of the crown?
> I'm by no means an Enicar expert, I've never seen an Enicar like this so I am not one to say it is legit or not. I've not seen many Enicars with Roman Numerals, in General.


The crown has the symbol Enicar, so it is legit, i think.It seems to me that it may not be of this watch, since the distance to the «box» seems to me too much.
This watch has a 166 mechanism and will be from 1970.
Tks


----------



## SteveJoseph

Happy to say I’ve joined the Enicar club. The more I research the bigger fan I become. Here is a Sherpa Dive ref 100/224. I’m hoping someone might be able to clarify a few questions. Foremost, I know it is missing the bezel. My questions are:
- I believe the movement is an AR1125 which would date it to 1962. Am I correct in both?
-It is brevet 314962, is this a supercompressor case? The back reads BaANXS. Incablock seapearl. 

Lastly any other fun facts on the watch are most welcome. I look forward to learning more about Enicar and expanding my collection to finer examples.

Thanks!


----------



## soviet

It a joy of reading through this thread. I have learnt a lot about Enicar watches.  The Supertest AR 1290 is my favorite.


----------



## kazrich

Hi and nice watch.
1. Yes 1962 / 1963 looks correct . Any later the watch back would show an open oyster and pearl.
2. Brevet 314962 tells us that the case is a Super Compressor with a bayonet release manufactured by EPSA.
For the other markings please read the ebay buyers guide compiled by our own hnspanama.

Enicar Watch Buyer's Guide | eBay

Happy Christmas


----------



## SteveJoseph

Thanks Kazrich, very helpful! Merry Christmas


----------



## ekim89

Hey All! I am new here and I was hoping you may be able to help me out identifying my Enicar (I am guessing this is a frankenwatch?). I have images below, and from what I have seen on eBay buyer's guide, the crown is replacement because it is unsigned, and the "EZR" on the movement indicates it was imported into the USA. The caseback has text that reads 200/30P. I have searched on RANFFT and not sure if this is an Enicar 1696 movement (there is no sub-second, and the stick hands don't seem to be exactly correct...again leading me to think it is a frankenwatch). Perhaps I'll be pleasantly surprised to have something legit, but I am not holding my breath. Any help you all can provide would be much appreciated! Looking forward to my times here on the forum.

Regards,
Mike


----------



## ekim89

Probably supposed to be what Eeeb was showing on page 7 of this thread...


----------



## Cvp33




----------



## kazrich

Happy New Year and a healthy and prosperous 2018 from my boys on planet Saturn !


----------



## RTK-WGM

Happy New Year!


----------



## laikrodukas

Impressive stuff!


----------



## Kreyke

Left as fast as it came.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## laikrodukas

Kreyke said:


> Left as fast as it came.


what do You mean?


----------



## Kreyke

laikrodukas said:


> what do You mean?


Someone made an offer I couldn't resist. Haha.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## 44Kls

Hello,

a few months ago I bought an Enicar Automatic with a distinctive 1980s look at Ebay. The photos posted by the seller were by no means clear, but I took the risk. It turned out that the dial is incomplete, as it probably had a black (or gun metal) polystyrene frame around it, which is missing.

I am thinking auout re-dialing it or making a new frame. The second possibility seems more realistic, but I'm not able to find any photos, except another watch with a slightly similar dial and case, but in the gold colour. Possibly some of you have seen a watch like that in an old catalogue or in the web?


----------



## HoustonHorn

Looking for a replacement cross-hatch crown for a Mk III Sherpa Guide. There seem to be multiple sizes of cross-hatched Enicar crowns, what size and or specific part number should I be looking for?

Thanks


----------



## Stigmata

HoustonHorn said:


> Looking for a replacement cross-hatch crown for a Mk III Sherpa Guide. There seem to be multiple sizes of cross-hatched Enicar crowns, what size and or specific part number should I be looking for?
> 
> Thanks


Take a photo of what you have


----------



## HoustonHorn

Stigmata said:


> Take a photo of what you have


Don't currently have the watch, it's at the spa.


----------



## Stigmata

HoustonHorn said:


> Don't currently have the watch, it's at the spa.


They're mk 3 needed crowns
Could be plain signed or crosshatched signed


----------



## Evar

Does anyone happen to know the part number of the plexiglass for a Jet (mark I, 148-35-02)? Or a source where I could find the number?


----------



## HoustonHorn

Stigmata said:


> They're mk 3 needed crowns
> Could be plain signed or crosshatched signed


Thanks, it definitely has(d) the crosshatched crowns. One has been lost and needs replacement. Are the Sherpa Guide Crowns different from the Super Divette Crown - would the following crown work?:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Enicar-Cro...786038?hash=item41d7496676:g:fkYAAOSwYZ9ZpDgJ

There are a couple other, smaller crowns with the cross-hatch on ebay as well. Just not sure what size I need to be looking for.

Thanks!


----------



## Stigmata

HoustonHorn said:


> Thanks, it definitely has(d) the crosshatched crowns. One has been lost and needs replacement. Are the Sherpa Guide Crowns different from the Super Divette Crown - would the following crown work?:
> 
> https://www.ebay.com/itm/Enicar-Cro...786038?hash=item41d7496676:g:fkYAAOSwYZ9ZpDgJ
> 
> There are a couple other, smaller crowns with the cross-hatch on ebay as well. Just not sure what size I need to be looking for.
> 
> Thanks!


I think you need the next size up! Direct message him and see if he has any! I know he used to!
Tell him you need the larger crosshatched Guide crown if he has any


----------



## HoustonHorn

Stigmata said:


> I think you need the next size up! Direct message him and see if he has any! I know he used to!
> Tell him you need the larger crosshatched Guide crown if he has any


Thanks again, sent him a message. I'm so pissed they lost the original crown. Unfortunately there aren't a lot of good watch shops in Houston (especially ones that will work on Enicars) but I definitely won't be using this one again.


----------



## Dan S

Wouldn't it be easier simply to measure the size of the crown instead of asking the forum?


----------



## Stigmata

Usually it would! 
As A mk3 watch it can either be a larger non crosshatched with Saturn or plain Saturn
He needs a crosshatched signed of the larger variety


----------



## Bojack

Hello..I’m new to this forum and vintage chronographs. Have been researching and finding out all I can about Enicar for the past several months as I have come into possession of what I believe is a Sherpa graph mark 1 original. The watch runs perfectly but I believe it has not been serviced ever. I was hoping for some advice as to whether I should get it serviced, have the crystal polished or the hands relumed etc. Would any of these hurt the value. Any advice would be appreciated. Thank you for your time


----------



## Bojack

Just learning how to attach pictures and post. I'm gaining on it..slowly


----------



## Bojack

View attachment 12808023
So far I can only load one image at a time.


----------



## Stigmata

Bojack said:


> View attachment 12808013
> Just learning how to attach pictures and post. I'm gaining on it..slowly


It's personal but don't get the hands relumed if you should ask me
Watches are getting more and more appreciated if they're original.
Service? That's different! Make sure it's running well


----------



## laikrodukas

Case polishing if done profesionally can lead to great results but that is sadly very rarely seen...
Crystal polishing or changing is a must I would say, it will reveal the dial in a different dimension 
Reluming the hands with a matching color of hour marker lume would make it very nice


----------



## Bojack

Thank you for the feedback Stigmata and Laikrodukas. Any ideas on where I might start looking for an original replacement crystal.


----------



## HoustonHorn

badbackdan said:


> Wouldn't it be easier simply to measure the size of the crown instead of asking the forum?


Under normal circumstances, yes. But I don't have the watch and don't trust the people who lost the crown in the first place to properly size and replace it.


----------



## Stigmata

Bojack said:


> Thank you for the feedback Stigmata and Laikrodukas. Any ideas on where I might start looking for an original replacement crystal.


Try eBay
There is a guy who has the crystals there. If not let me know. There's quite a few people willing to help in the community


----------



## Bojack

I will do that ( check eBay ) and thanks for the tip. I have definitely been bitten by the bug and look forward to many years of learning about and collecting vintage watches so it is nice to know there is help available from a welcoming community.


----------



## SteveJoseph

I picked up my second Enicar, it is a Seapearl 600. The kicker...original box and band. Very excited to get my hands on this one. I know it’s from the 50s but if anyone can determine a specific date that would be great. Movement is an AR1120.


----------



## Stigmata

SteveJoseph said:


> I picked up my second Enicar, it is a Seapearl 600. The kicker...original box and band. Very excited to get my hands on this one. I know it's from the 50s but if anyone can determine a specific date that would be great. Movement is an AR1120.


Beautiful

Nice going


----------



## NoTimeToLose

That's brilliant - well done!


----------



## Bojack

Very nice sea pearl 600 and that box is awesome. Haven’t seen one like it till now and love it. Don’t know enough to help you with the dating but I’m sure someone does. Thanks Stigmata for the eBay tip, spot on for replacement crystal. Can’t get over that box SteveJoseph and the watch of course.


----------



## kazrich

SteveJoseph said:


> I picked up my second Enicar, it is a Seapearl 600. The kicker...original box and band. Very excited to get my hands on this one. I know it's from the 50s but if anyone can determine a specific date that would be great. Movement is an AR1120.


Nice watch and box !

Your watch is a middle to late 50's example of an Enicar diver with an EPSA bayonet release compressor case - Brevet 98243.
I keep the Healthways 100 Fathoms which is essentially the same thing . When new your watch was waterproof to 600ft in static water conditions.
When the back is removed by an experienced watchmaker ( don't try it yourself unless you have the correct tools ) you should find an inscription
that reads EPSA - STOP. .
underneath shows the date the case was made. Mine is July 1955.
Enicar owned their own radium factory and applied it generously, especially on diver watches, so take care when the back is removed.
Don't re lume. The lume never matches and can sometimes look strange and probably devalues the watch.

Here's my Healthways 100 Fathoms.




























Please follow this link for more info

https://thespringbar.com/blogs/guides/enicar-sherpa-collectors-guide-part-1-single-crown-models


----------



## SteveJoseph

Thanks all. Kazrich- funny you mention the Healthways version, that is on my short list. Thanks for the info as always!


----------



## SteveJoseph

Also what tool is used to remove the back? Given I plan on expanding the Enicar collection I should probably get familiar with this. Now you have me curious to see the date!


----------



## kazrich

SteveJoseph said:


> Also what tool is used to remove the back? Given I plan on expanding the Enicar collection I should probably get familiar with this. Now you have me curious to see the date!


My watchmaker uses a Jaxa wrench and it takes plenty of strength to release the bayonet. 
The back of your watch will probably show an open 4 leaf clover. On the open part of the leaf you will see inscribed an O ( open ) and a - ( closed ) aligning with the watch crown.
The picture of mine above shows this clearly.
The wrench comes with different adapters for different case backs and you must know which one to use. The tool needs to be attached very firmly to the caseback before you attempt
to turn it. I would practise with a very cheap watch before attempting a Compressor style back. Don't buy a cheap Chinese opener, you will need to be paying £80 for a decent quality wrench.
Someone was selling laser printed openers, but I'm unsure if they are still available and would require a different version for every watch case type and size that you have.
Most Enicar 14 facet compressor and Super compressor casebacks show evidence of deep scratches where openers have slipped in the past.


----------



## Dan S

kazrich said:


> My watchmaker uses a Jaxa wrench and it takes plenty of strength to release the bayonet.
> The back of your watch will probably show an open 4 leaf clover. On the open part of the leaf you will see inscribed an O ( open ) and a - ( closed ) aligning with the watch crown.
> The picture of mine above shows this clearly.
> The wrench comes with different adapters for different case backs and you must know which one to use. The tool needs to be attached very firmly to the caseback before you attempt
> to turn it. I would practise with a very cheap watch before attempting a Compressor style back. Don't buy a cheap Chinese opener, you will need to be paying £80 for a decent quality wrench.
> Someone was selling laser printed openers, but I'm unsure if they are still available and would require a different version for every watch case type and size that you have.
> Most Enicar 14 facet compressor and Super compressor casebacks show evidence of deep scratches where openers have slipped in the past.


Yes, an ordinary 3-prong case-wrench works, but as with any watch, you must be careful. As an amateur, I find that the hardest thing for me is actually holding the watch steady, so if I'm at all uncertain, I put the watch into a case-holder. If it's really hard to open, I put the case-holder in a bench-mounted vise. That way I can use two hands on the wrench, to push it down while turning it.


----------



## shelfcompact

Make a 3D printed Enicar case opener as detailed here:

https://www.watchuseek.com/f11/3d-printed-enicar-seapearl-case-tool-2770610.html










I had some printed for me at the local library for a few dollars and opened my watches in seconds.


----------



## EnsoSan

Ocean Pearl 147

Compliments to all Sherpa divers, do you ever sell your items?


----------



## Stigmata

EnsoSan said:


> Ocean Pearl 147
> 
> Compliments to all Sherpa divers, do you ever sell your items?
> View attachment 12829649


Nice 116* day date


----------



## AdmiralAdama

just picked up this enicar day date -- what you guys think?


----------



## wyatt66

Good evening everyone. I'm new to WUS and new to vintage watches. Just picked up an Enicar on the Bay, having read probably half of the posts on this 5 year old homage to Enicar.... kudos to all of you who have kept this going, and thank you to those who have shared your knowledge, experience, passions and stories. It has been fascinating, although I notice a lot of the images from photobucket have disappeared (is that just me)?

My new watch is a 1950's Ultrasonic Automatic with date (love the red counter), and it is stamped on the back '44', & 100-98 AMCS - I have read HNS-Panama's guide on eBay, so I expect to find a cal. 1035? (though I'm not going to try to look inside myself). It's keeping good time so far, but the (replacement?) crown is so worn it's difficult to turn. I tried moving the date on manually, then moving the hands back to 8, then forward again - it doesn't appear to have a quick date set, and the crown only has 2 positions, so I don't think I'm going to find an easy way to change the date.....

One thing confuses me, and I'd be interested to hear if anyone else has seen this..... when I turn the crown clockwise, the hands move backwards..... and vice versa. It's very unnatural. I didn't read anything about that in the 100 or so pages in this thread (got to about 60, then went to the end and started working backwards....).

i'd be really interested to read anything anyone has to offer about this model.


----------



## AVR2

Hi all,

I'm seeking information on an Enicar my father bought in Penang, Malaya (as-was) while stationed there with the British Army in 1958. It's a Seapearl 21 jewels, and as far as I know it's entirely original.

From what I can gather from Googling, Enicar didn't give most of their watches separate model names or numbers? The only information on the back that seems to be specific to the watch is "94/1 BaS", and after finding the Enicar Buyer's Guide on eBay I've been able to determine that the letters mean a Seapearl case, 100% stainless steel with a sweep second hand.

It still runs fine, although the second hand doesn't sweep smoothly in a continuous motion, it ticks very rapidly, maybe 3 times per second.

Would I be correct in thinking there isn't much I could be told about the watch other than by opening it up and discovering what part numbers it uses?

View attachment 12883151


----------



## Dan S

I can't access your attachment, but have you read the Springbar guides?

https://thespringbar.com/blogs/guides/enicar-sherpa-collectors-guide-part-1-single-crown-models


----------



## hns-panama

AVR2 said:


> Hi all,
> 
> I'm seeking information on an Enicar my father bought in Penang, Malaya (as-was) while stationed there with the British Army in 1958. It's a Seapearl 21 jewels, and as far as I know it's entirely original.
> 
> From what I can gather from Googling, Enicar didn't give most of their watches separate model names or numbers? The only information on the back that seems to be specific to the watch is "94/1 BaS", and after finding the Enicar Buyer's Guide on eBay I've been able to determine that the letters mean a Seapearl case, 100% stainless steel with a sweep second hand.
> 
> It still runs fine, although the second hand doesn't sweep smoothly in a continuous motion, it ticks very rapidly, maybe 3 times per second.
> 
> Would I be correct in thinking there isn't much I could be told about the watch other than by opening it up and discovering what part numbers it uses?
> 
> View attachment 12883151


You will have to have a watchmaker open the case for you and I would suggest you make certain they know it is not a screw case back.

Sent from my SM-G570M using Tapatalk


----------



## Sansoni7

AVR2 said:


> Hi all,
> 
> I'm seeking information on an Enicar my father bought in Penang, Malaya (as-was) while stationed there with the British Army in 1958. It's a Seapearl 21 jewels, and as far as I know it's entirely original.
> 
> From what I can gather from Googling, Enicar didn't give most of their watches separate model names or numbers? The only information on the back that seems to be specific to the watch is "94/1 BaS", and after finding the Enicar Buyer's Guide on eBay I've been able to determine that the letters mean a Seapearl case, 100% stainless steel with a sweep second hand.
> 
> It still runs fine, although the second hand doesn't sweep smoothly in a continuous motion, it ticks very rapidly, maybe 3 times per second.
> 
> Would I be correct in thinking there isn't much I could be told about the watch other than by opening it up and discovering what part numbers it uses?
> 
> View attachment 12883151


«Invalid Attachment specified. If you followed a valid link, please notify the administrator »


----------



## SirRotthyans

Thank you for putting this together, great read!


----------



## Stigmata

Blue dial guide









Sent from my SM-G950F using Tapatalk


----------



## Stigmata

similar watch with a variation at dial and the black NSWE inner bezel markers










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----------



## 147 05 01

Enicar 165 72 01









best regards


----------



## Vermonster

This is one of the best threads on this forum!

Sent from my moto x4 using Tapatalk


----------



## 147 05 01

... and here are once again 2 typical representatives of the 70s from my collection.

The first watch is an Enicar Sherpa 350 with an asymmetric case. The reference number is 167 21 01 and the dimensions of the watch are 40x37x12 mm. 
The day indication is in Spanish (MIE=WED).









The second watch is rarer and more special. It is the Enicar Super Quartz with the reference number 320 01 01 The case and the dimensions are similar to the Enicar 350 (40x38x13 mm). 
It is eye-catching that the band width at 12 o' clock is 24 mm and at 6 o' clock only 17 mm.
The special feature of this watch is the AR 320 movement: it is the only quartz movement developed and produced by Enicar. 
It is based on the manual winding movement AR 160.









best regards


----------



## NoTimeToLose

147 05 01 said:


> Enicar 165 72 01
> 
> View attachment 12965341
> 
> 
> best regards


Oh heck. I've not seen one of those before, and now I must have one!


----------



## Wally168

I am a new member and posting for the first time. I have an Enicar, but not a vintage one. Hope it's ok to share a photo here!


----------



## Stigmata

Wally168 said:


> I am a new member and posting for the first time. I have an Enicar, but not a vintage one. Hope it's ok to share a photo here!
> View attachment 12980043


I'm pretty sure that's vintage mate and congratulations

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----------



## kazrich

Hello Wally ; That's rather nice. Do you have an image of either the movement or the case back and the measurement not including the crown ?
How was it described when you bought it ?
Thanks


----------



## Stigmata

Quite an early Guide 33 . This one doesn't have the usual mk1 dauphine hands but some heavily coated tips on steel hands. ( beefed up to match the double markers on 12,6,9 that help define the 33 jewelled, '33' model of the early Sherpas..
The thin steel red marked seconds hand plus the moon crescent GMT hand are present!
I love the ghosting of the bezel and the city pointer.
The black and silver inner 24 hour ring are quite common in these very early 33s ( Guides, Super Jets and Jets) 
The other thing that's non negotiable from this era are the smaller cross hatched crowns.
The black dial here is beginning to bloom into a gorgeous cigar colour!
Powered by the in-house chronometer Supertest AR 112* movement!

I've had this one for quite a few years.when I did take it to my watchmaker he believed the movement had never been serviced ... (this sometimes is a plus!)
The watch is paired with a brown suede strap.

Guides have heaps going on but they also have heaps of character and personality. plexi crazing is mandatory on something like this!

it's the little details that set these watches apart for me..









Sent from my SM-G950F using Tapatalk


----------



## Wally168

kazrich said:


> Hello Wally ; That's rather nice. Do you have an image of either the movement or the case back and the measurement not including the crown ?
> How was it described when you bought it ?
> Thanks


Thanks Kazrich.
I will try to post an image of the back below.













The reason I said earlier this really wasn't a "vintage watch" was that I bought it new from an AD around 1998 in Hong Kong. I think it was a new model with a Vintage look. On the case, it says....2165.52.55" . Case is 35mm without the crown, and thickness is about 10mm. I like the patterns on the dial as well as the overall simple color scheme and us this as my dress watch to pass as a vintage...


----------



## Stigmata

Wally168 said:


> Thanks Kazrich.
> I will try to post an image of the back below.
> View attachment 12980995
> View attachment 12981001
> 
> The reason I said earlier this really wasn't a "vintage watch" was that I bought it new from an AD around 1998 in Hong Kong. I think it was a new model with a Vintage look. On the case, it says....2165.52.55" . Case is 35mm without the crown, and thickness is about 10mm. I like the patterns on the dial as well as the overall simple color scheme and us this as my dress watch to pass as a vintage...


might be a AR 1165 movement which probably makes it an late enicar
very vintage looking and the logo is late enicar
nice watch regardless

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## 147 05 01

Hi Wally,

very nice watch. I think the AR 2165 is based on the ETA caliber 2824/2.

best regards


----------



## Vermonster

Stigmata said:


> Quite an early Guide 33 . This one doesn't have the usual mk1 dauphine hands but some heavily coated tips on steel hands. ( beefed up to match the double markers on 12,6,9 that help define the 33 jewelled, '33' model of the early Sherpas..
> The thin steel red marked seconds hand plus the moon crescent GMT hand are present!
> I love the ghosting of the bezel and the city pointer.
> The black and silver inner 24 hour ring are quite common in these very early 33s ( Guides, Super Jets and Jets)
> The other thing that's non negotiable from this era are the smaller cross hatched crowns.
> The black dial here is beginning to bloom into a gorgeous cigar colour!
> Powered by the in-house chronometer Supertest AR 112* movement!
> 
> I've had this one for quite a few years.when I did take it to my watchmaker he believed the movement had never been serviced ... (this sometimes is a plus!)
> The watch is paired with a brown suede strap.
> 
> Guides have heaps going on but they also have heaps of character and personality. plexi crazing is mandatory on something like this!
> 
> it's the little details that set these watches apart for me..
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my SM-G950F using Tapatalk


It's just perfect. Thanks for posting the picture.

Sent from my moto x4 using Tapatalk


----------



## Stigmata

Vermonster said:


> It's just perfect. Thanks for posting the picture.
> 
> Sent from my moto x4 using Tapatalk


thanks mate! 
I have quite a few but love this one

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## Wally168

Hi Stigmata, 147 05 01,

Thanks! Now I know more about my watch's movement.


----------



## Calypso2

I haven't spotted this one on my marathon read to this point. *Enicar* *Star Jewels* Bought June 1966 in Hong Kong

Case No: 144-39-06 Serviced mid seventies and worn little since. Takes 46.5 hours to run down. Back reads: Enicar Ocean Pearl, Ultrasonic, Incabloc, Water Proof, Swiss, Stainless steel back, 144-39-06 (caliber 1145) 14X series, 1965-1975, 18000 vph, gold plated Been a very reliable watch, and checked in June 2017, it gains 20 seconds a day. 







Then there was this one below:

100/201 (AR caliber 1125)
BASP = Seapearl case, Automatic, Sweep second-hand, Gold Plate10 EPSA (case manufacturer)

_Note: __124/5/6 = cal. __*112*__4/__*5*__/6 (If the movement has a serial number, as on this one, it is their top-grade __Supertest caliber.)__ 112X series, 1960s, 18000 vph_

_Enicar also developed a water-resistant case with an unusual bayonet back, introducing it as the __*Seapearl *__ i__n _1955_. The Seapearl case is a bayonet mount meaning it doesn't unscrew. On the case back, above the word Seapearl and slightly to the right, you see two lines. The one of the left is for closed and the right is for open lined up with the crown.. That's all the distance you need to turn the back to open it! __(__Ocean__-Pearl __is screw back)








_


----------



## Calypso2

Saw this one advertised from India, and was curious. The 1125 caliber is an automatic, so how come on this manual wind? (It was inexpensive so worth a look)*
Enicar*Manual Wind, (India) (AR1125 but seems more like a franken 1120) Cal.140 17 jewel. Case back 140-39-01A

$53 ttl. Arrived 30/11/2017. Back cover grooves needed cleaning.- some corrosion. Crown detent not snappy and engagement not secure, it seems worn. Three lug pin holes had broken pins blocking them. Had to drill them out. Now using a Nato strap. General appearance of watch is good although back cover is scratched.. Adjuster was on max plus +. Lost 32sec in 6 hrs. First closed pins gap of adjuster which was wide open. Then adjusted it many times to arrive at consistent +13 sec/ day. Starts losing as watch winds down at end, which is normal..

05/02/2018 Checked power reserve from a full wind, 46hrs 34min
It turns out to be quite an attractive watch with nice lugs, and runs well. 
*Any comments on that movement?
*


















Pictures are the original advertisement and not good. The watch cleaned up very well, and looks very shiny presentable, much better than the old pictures would suggest.


----------



## hns-panama

Calypso2 said:


> Saw this one advertised from India, and was curious. The 1125 caliber is an automatic, so how come on this manual wind? (It was inexpensive so worth a look)*
> Enicar*Manual Wind, (India) (AR1125 but seems more like a franken 1120) Cal.140 17 jewel. Case back 140-39-01A
> 
> $53 ttl. Arrived 30/11/2017. Back cover grooves needed cleaning.- some corrosion. Crown detent not snappy and engagement not secure, it seems worn. Three lug pin holes had broken pins blocking them. Had to drill them out. Now using a Nato strap. General appearance of watch is good although back cover is scratched.. Adjuster was on max plus +. Lost 32sec in 6 hrs. First closed pins gap of adjuster which was wide open. Then adjusted it many times to arrive at consistent +13 sec/ day. Starts losing as watch winds down at end, which is normal..
> 
> 05/02/2018 Checked power reserve from a full wind, 46hrs 34min
> It turns out to be quite an attractive watch with nice lugs, and runs well.
> *Any comments on that movement?
> *
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Pictures are the original advertisement and not good. The watch cleaned up very well, and looks very shiny presentable, much better than the old pictures would suggest.


An Indian Franken explains why you have a 1125 automatic movement with a missing rotor in a 1140 case. And there you are.

Sent from my SM-G570M using Tapatalk


----------



## Prashant pandey

Enicar Tiger









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----------



## leftystevie

crazyfist said:


> I've joined Watchuseek for a while now, but I seldom wrote meaningful stuff. Today, I decided I want to share my passion for Enicar watches and its impact on the Chinese culture, as well as a look inside the classic AR160 movement. Enicar is a brand not discussed often on these forums, but hopefully, I will spark your interest too in this little gem of horology history.
> 
> View attachment 773952
> 
> 
> At the height of Enicar watches' success, I was yet to be born. Four years after I was born, in 1988, Enicar watch was sold to a Hong Kong company, although watches were still to be ensemble in Switzerland, the little magic that once existed was no more, and what are left of it are the nostalgic name and the ever familiar logo.
> 
> Enicar watch never made it to the moon, or to the deep seas. But in the late 60's, 70's and the early 80's, they did dominate the Chinese watch market. Enicar was imported as a Tier 4 brand, which meant it was a less expensive alternative for the Chinese to own a Swiss Made watch. In the Tier 3 were brands like Roamer and Titoni. And it was these three brands that made up the largest import watches in China, with Enicar alone importing two-hundred-thousand watches per year!
> 
> At the time, an Enicar watch costs 185 RMB (roughly $30), which is 30% more than the average Chinese monthly salary. (A Chinese domestic brand such as Shanghai and Shuangling cost half as much). It was said there were three items to own in order for a man to be eligible for marriage: a bicycle, a sewing machine, and a watch. Enicar's owner Mr. Racine (Enicar spelt backwards) is a good friend of the Chinese government and a jolly good man with a big nose. And while the Chinese government pressured him into lowering the price, he would get angry and refused to do so because it upheld the quality of his products.
> 
> AR161:
> View attachment 773953
> 
> 
> Like many of its peers at the time, Enicar was a bona-fide movement manufacture. Some of their well-known movements were AR140 - hand winding, AR160 - an improved, higher-beat version of the AR 140, AR161 -with date, AR 165 - automatic (later became the one of the base engine for Chronoswiss watches), and AR 167 - auto with day-date.
> 
> The AR160 is perhaps the most popular movement for Enicar. It encompasses all the top grade parts: top grade Nivaflex mainspring, top grade Nivarox balance spring, and top grade Incabloc shock protection system. The balance spring is made of berrylium alloy, polished steel on escapement wheel and fork. And to top it off, the movement itself is truly beautifully, the main plates are plated in gold and the bridge is decorated with mesmerizing stripes. My watchmaker once told me that the Enicar AR160 had the least failure rate during their heydays. And whenever he serviced them, he marveled at the workmanship.
> 
> AR160 Movement
> View attachment 773954
> 
> 
> AR160 beats at 21600 vph, an improvement from the 18000 vph of AR140. The movement is 26.2mm in diameter, which makes it one of the larger movements at the time, and resulted larger watch cases - typically 38mm.
> 
> View attachment 773955
> 
> 
> View attachment 773956
> 
> 
> There are two so called patents for the AR160. One is Star Jewels, and the other is called Oil-Stop. The former uses a jewel as a stud for the minute wheel. As far as watchmakers can tell, it offers no specialty whatsoever; and became known as merely a marketing gimmick. The later applies a type of stearic acid to places where oil is unwanted in the movement. But it would take a certified Enicar watchmaker to know not to touch these places when servicing a watch, and reapply stearic acid when necessary. Otherwise, the Oil-Stop is a defunct feature in most of the vintage Enicar watches today.
> 
> Roamer, Titoni, Enicar, and Certina
> View attachment 773963
> 
> 
> It was said that the case finish and dial design is what made Enicar fell into the Tier 4 category rather than Tier 3. Personally, I would say that Roamer and Titoni are only slightly better. And I enjoy the larger case size, and the engraved shark on the case back. The dial design at first glance is pretty much the same as every other watch on the Chinese market at the time, but after a closer look, you would see that the lume design is a hidden surprise.
> 
> AR160 Caseback
> View attachment 773958
> 
> 
> Dial:
> View attachment 773960
> 
> 
> I am too young to pretend that I collect Enicar for the nostalgia. But my father and the people in his age around me are not. And it brings a smile to my face whenever my Enicar, the most popular watch from the heydays gets recognized. And I love the conversations that it brings out, people taking about the life back in the day, how they saved up for a Swiss watch, and what a watch was meant to them. And for those of us who weren't around in the 60's and the 70's, aren't these kind of conversations part of the reason we like collect vintage time pieces?
> 
> View attachment 773964
> 
> 
> And let's show your Enicars if you have 'em!


According to what you described, I was born in the same year when Enicar was sold to a HK company. Few months ago I heard a similar story from my dad that my granddad bought a pair of Enicars (He has no idea about which model) for my grandma and himself back in 70s. It is similar because the things about the watch he mentioned (price and tier) are identical to yours!

I only started searching for vintage watches few weeks ago and this story popped up immediately. So I asked my dad last week where is the watch right now but he didn't have a clue. He's going back to my granddad's hometown in few days hopefully he'll have some information about that watch 

I noticed that you were living in Beijing when you started this thread. I live in Beijing and want to go to some places for vintage watch hunting. Any recommendations? Cheers!


----------



## crazyfist

leftystevie said:


> According to what you described, I was born in the same year when Enicar was sold to a HK company. Few months ago I heard a similar story from my dad that my granddad bought a pair of Enicars (He has no idea about which model) for my grandma and himself back in 70s. It is similar because the things about the watch he mentioned (price and tier) are identical to yours!
> 
> I only started searching for vintage watches few weeks ago and this story popped up immediately. So I asked my dad last week where is the watch right now but he didn't have a clue. He's going back to my granddad's hometown in few days hopefully he'll have some information about that watch
> 
> I noticed that you were living in Beijing when you started this thread. I live in Beijing and want to go to some places for vintage watch hunting. Any recommendations? Cheers!


I haven't lived there in years but I started this whole craziness by going to panjiayuan on weekdays, I'd skip work and go around lunch time. Don't go on weekends as it becomes a different place. I don't know how things are now. The air quality in Beijing left me no desire to ever return to that city.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## crazyfist

I haven't visited this thread for sometime, while I'm here I thought I'd share a few of my most prized possessions.



















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## leftystevie

crazyfist said:


> I haven't visited this thread for sometime, while I'm here I thought I'd share a few of my most prized possessions.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


These are some beautiful Enicars in great conditions. Thanks for sharing!

I think I'll start by going there on weekends and have a look first as it wouldn't be easy for me to go on weekdays.

I hate the weather here and it's no different from few years ago. But at the end of the day, it's my hometown, sometimes I just want to leave and I'm still here ?


----------



## 147 05 01

...and here a photo of a part of my treasures.









regards


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## ddillas

Here's a find from my late fathers collection... didn't know he had this (or the LeCoultre Futurematic) in the safe.

I've searched and can find nothing like it. Dial printing is Enicar logo with the name through the Saturn, waterproof, 17 jewels and ENISHOCK. Screw down flat caseback has 100/178 MS. Bottom of case near 6 o'clock has Plaque G10 and a Gr in a circle. Unsigned crown, red tipped sweep second hand and big domed crystal.

I can figure out some but haven't found another like it anywhere. I guess it's from the 1950's.

Can anyone identify and date this beauty?









Sent from my LG-H918 using Tapatalk


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## RTK-WGM




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## RTK-WGM




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## RTK-WGM




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## RTK-WGM




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## RTK-WGM




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## RTK-WGM




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## RTK-WGM




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## RTK-WGM




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## hns-panama

Well, I'd say you've been at it a while to acquire all these great examples and I applaud your discerning eye.

Super addition to the thread.


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## laikrodukas

insanity out of this world!


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## kazrich

Wonderful collection !!
Thanks for sharing


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## 147 05 01

Great collection! 
Some of the watches I would also like to have in my collection!

regards


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## eezee_az123

Roamer is a brand also very popular in the Middle East.


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## eezee_az123

All three brands are also popular and commonly found here in the Philippines, and you have them listed in the same way they are known and popular here in the Philippines. Enicar first, Titoni ( a bit more expensive ) second, then Roamer. I have multiples of all three in various models.


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## Gas79

I feel very exited to see so many Enicar here. Sadly I have just one but I love it...


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## SideEffects

Need info on Enicar watch,value.


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## kazrich

Please read sticky . We are not valuers on this forum. Please do your own homework.


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## SideEffects

thank you.


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## kazrich

Well Side Effects, please understand why my response to your first post was a trifle harsh.
You have entered a zone of possibly the Worlds most knowledgeable collectors of Enicar watches.
The contents of this thread shows watches totalling many millions of pounds in value. The owners have spent years researching various models and are unlikely 
to act positively to any ' What's this worth ' kind of question - especially as a first post.
It's customary to briefly introduce yourself to a forum with your first post, telling us why ' I need to know ' this that or the other.
It took me less than 30 seconds to find this with a slightly different dial.

https://www.chrono24.co.uk/enicar/v...nless-steel-valjoux-72-bj-1970--id7860194.htm

That's NOT a valuation, but rather what an optimistic vendor would like to achieve if he / she got lucky with a drunken buyer with the wind blowing in the right direction.
If you look at ebay sold listings of similar watches you will get an idea of current values. We don't do that for you here.
If you have specific questions regarding an Enicar watch I'm sure many members will be more than happy to answer them.


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## Pmnealhsd

Very interesting and informative! Thank you!


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## hns-panama

kazrich said:


> Well Side Effects, please understand why my response to your first post was a trifle harsh.
> You have entered a zone of possibly the Worlds most knowledgeable collectors of Enicar watches.
> The contents of this thread shows watches totalling many millions of pounds in value. The owners have spent years researching various models and are unlikely
> to act positively to any ' What's this worth ' kind of question - especially as a first post.
> It's customary to briefly introduce yourself to a forum with your first post, telling us why ' I need to know ' this that or the other.
> It took me less than 30 seconds to find this with a slightly different dial.
> 
> https://www.chrono24.co.uk/enicar/v...nless-steel-valjoux-72-bj-1970--id7860194.htm
> 
> That's NOT a valuation, but rather what an optimistic vendor would like to achieve if he / she got lucky with a drunken buyer with the wind blowing in the right direction.
> If you look at ebay sold listings of similar watches you will get an idea of current values. We don't do that for you here.
> If you have specific questions regarding an Enicar watch I'm sure many members will be more than happy to answer them.


What he said 

Sent from my SM-G570M using Tapatalk


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## Pmnealhsd

RTK-WGM said:


> View attachment 13080607


There is something godlike about this collection. 
I would like to express my appreciation for this, and for all of you on WUS. I'm learning so much here, and enjoying the process immensely.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


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## Stigmata

thought this one was the one to wear yesterday








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## As82

And this is my sherpa 600 d


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## Watcher1988

I am new to Sherpa and after reading some history i respect the brand more and more. 
Someone offers this model on a preowned website. Is there anyone known with this model?
It seems like an original but then again i do not have enough knowledge to make that judgement. See the pictures yourself...


----------



## Watcher1988

I am new to Sherpa and after reading some history i respect the brand more and more. 
Someone offers this model on a preowned website. Is there anyone known with this model?
It seems like an original but then again i do not have enough knowledge to make that judgement. See the pictures yourself...


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## Watcher1988

Excuse me for the double post... My pc just jammed...


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## kazrich

The Sherpa models were top of the Enicar range in the 1950's and 60's. Unfortunately in the 70's Enicar started to attach the Sherpa label to many run of the mill watches to help sales. This looks like a 70's watch.
It appears to be fitted with a Seapearl style back which many Sherpa's had with a bayonet fit , but the dial also looks odd to me. The S in Sherpa D is practically touching the E in Enicar. Sherpa D is usually placed just above Star Jewels towards the bottom of the dial between 5 and 7 o clock.The dainty looking hands don't appear to relate to the style of the watch and look like they have been re lumed. This style of Enicar watch usually uses thick baton style hands and hour markers. 
I would walk away to be honest.


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## Dan S

I agree with @kazrich, the dial and hands don't look right. I can't find any examples with numerals like that and there is no lume on the dial, despite the "T SWISS MADE T" markings and the lume in the (incorrect) hands.


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## 147 05 01

Hello Watcher1988, hello kazrich
in my collection is an Enicar Sherpa Quartz using exactly these hands. The clock has no bayonet but a screw-down case back.














best regards


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## kazrich

That's interesting 147 05 01. However your dial shows matching lume plots on the hour markers and the dial looks more balanced. However, Enicar did make many hundreds of styles and the
Watcher1988 example might just be another Sherpa variation from the 70's. Also what looks strange in a picture can look fine on the wrist. Either way I would still keep walking.


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## 147 05 01

Hi kazrich,

I agree, I wouldn't buy that watch either. I just wanted to show that both the hands and a similar dial were used by Enicar.

regards


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## Watcher1988

Thanks for all the help! I did not buy it eventually. But my interest in Enicar grew more on me though.


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## kazrich

Well errrrrrr emmm errr, yes dear quite -------- https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/ENICAR-S...651908?hash=item23a2785ac4:g:Q60AAOSwBnZbFZ9X


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## Gas79

Hi everybody. I need to replace the crystal of both my Shrerpa super divette. I know there is very hard to find the original one. Does anyone have experience with other not genuine parts?


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## MidnightBeggar

Hi All,

I have a '69 Sherpa Guide Mk III and I'm in the unenviable position of needing to locate a replacement red, bezel-ring for it. Does anyone know of any potential sources for this other than ebay? I'm starting to think that I'm probably going to have to wait for a fair-poor condition Guide to come up for auction to get just for parts but I sure would love it if I could simply buy this part.

I did try purchasing one that's listed as a "new" replacement one on ebay and its obviously not an original part as the dimensions of the indicator arrow are not at all the same... I could still use it as a service part (which I may do) but I'm very much wanting to find an original one. THanks


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## Dan S

These red rings are extremely hard to find unfortunately.


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## MidnightBeggar

Thanks Dan...That's what I was afraid of. Thinking that finding another watch on ebay may be how I have to go... Bummer


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## MidnightBeggar

Also, does anyone know the official name for this part and/or a catalog number? Thanks


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## hns-panama

Check out the uhrforum.de Enicar thread and ask there. 

Sent from my SM-G570M using Tapatalk


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## MidnightBeggar

I will indeed. Thanks hns-panama


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## hns-panama

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Rote-Stell...498609?hash=item48ae18af31:g:p00AAOSwrT1a71Ay


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## MidnightBeggar

Timely listing sir. Thanks. I actually have a variant of one of these (that was pictured in my post). Good for others to know about though.


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## Gas79

Gas79 said:


> Hi everybody. I need to replace the crystal of both my Shrerpa super divette. I know there is very hard to find the original one. Does anyone have experience with other not genuine parts?


Anyone can help me...?


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## Dan S

Gas79 said:


> Anyone can help me...?


Do you have a watchmaker who can help you? My watchmaker did not have any trouble fitting a generic replacement for my Enicar Super Dive from the crystals in his stock.


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## hns-panama

Why does it need replacing?

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## hns-panama

It may just need a good polishing unless there are cracks or deep marks.

They are quite thick so you can polish them very easily. I did it for mine and it was not in great shape to begine with.

Another possible source is this eBay seller:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Plexi-Enic...669099?hash=item5d7bb8d46b:g:HmkAAOSwd2xXPsFP

I am not positive, but I should think the glass is very similar to your watches.


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## mrs_LA

I have never seen lime green indices anywhere. Thoughts??

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## kazrich

Last time I saw green like that was whilst watching a scene from a film called The Excorsist.


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## Dan S

mrs_LA said:


> I have never seen lime green indices anywhere. Thoughts??
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


India? Bright colors seem really popular there.


----------



## mrs_LA

Lol @kazrich !

@badbackdan is it a redial, or just a release to Indian market? I know Enicar was popular in China... but not anywhere else enough to warrant limited releases


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Dan S

mrs_LA said:


> Lol @kazrich !
> 
> @badbackdan is it a redial, or just a release to Indian market? I know Enicar was popular in China... but not anywhere else enough to warrant limited releases
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


The photo is not very good, but I tend to say re-dial, since the minute markers look very uneven. For example, look at the uneven spacing of the minute markers adjacent (on each side) to the 5, 6, and 10 o'clock applied markers. It is a horrendous re-lume at the very least.


----------



## hns-panama

Green? Hmmmm. No. Enicar had taste...

Sent from my SM-G570M using Tapatalk


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## Gas79

The one I have doesn't have any experience with super compressor cases and could be very dangerous to bring it to him. Also the crystal he have in stock are not hi-dome type.


----------



## Gas79

They are both cracked


----------



## Gas79

Unfortunately they are both cracked. I've already contacted the ebay guy you suggested but seems he doesn't feel very comfortable with clarification about size and height of dome. He just replied me that the crystal is the right one for this model and nothing more. I'm not positive too.


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## hns-panama

It's the same case except one had the crown guards. 

The rest of it is the same.

Buy one and see how it goes. 

Sent from my SM-G570M using Tapatalk


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## 147 05 01

Hi hns-panama

Sorry if I misunderstood the problem. I believe that gas79 is looking for glasses for an Enicar Super Divette. If I follow your link (https://www.ebay.com/itm/Plexi-Enica...kAAOSwd2xXPsFP) but they sold glasses for an Enicar Super Dive. Enicar Super Dive and Ultra Dive (with crownguards) have a larger case and larger glasses than the Super Divette.

best regards


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## hns-panama

Sigh. You are correct. Super Divette. So a Jet Crystal works too.


Sent from my SM-G570M using Tapatalk


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## mrs_LA

badbackdan said:


> The photo is not very good, but I tend to say re-dial, since the minute markers look very uneven. For example, look at the uneven spacing of the minute markers adjacent (on each side) to the 5, 6, and 10 o'clock applied markers. It is a horrendous re-lume at the very least.


Oh I see that now. Good eye as always. I also noticed the writing in the bottom (SWISS MADE??) is covered by the hour markers and I was not sure if that was an indication of a redial. Here is another piece that has hour markers covering the writing as well.









With both pieces being covered, I didn't know if it was common practice with Enicar in some of its pieces back then, or that this seller just happens to have both watches cross some of the rules against proper redialing! Much of the similar watches I saw usually have SWISS MADE visible, with the hour marker in between both words.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Dan S

mrs_LA said:


> Oh I see that now. Good eye as always. I also noticed the writing in the bottom (SWISS MADE??) is covered by the hour markers and I was not sure if that was an indication of a redial. Here is another piece that has hour markers covering the writing as well.
> 
> View attachment 13219957
> 
> 
> With both pieces being covered, I didn't know if it was common practice with Enicar in some of its pieces back then, or that this seller just happens to have both watches cross some of the rules against proper redialing! Much of the similar watches I saw usually have SWISS MADE visible, with the hour marker in between both words.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


I think that one has "SWISS" on the left of the 6 o'clock marker and "MADE" on the right, but there is damage, so you only see "SS" on the left and "MAD" on the right.


----------



## dmcevoy

Hi,
I have a Sherpa Super-Jet with the original Enicar beads-of-rice bracelet. I need to shorten the bracelet a bit by removing some links, but don't see any of the traditional pins or markings for removable pins on the back side. Can anyone give me some tips on removing some links from these bracelets? It looks as if the only option is to (gently) bend open one row of the "rice bead" loops from the back, but wanted to check with you experienced folks before I try that. Thanks very much.


----------



## tylerstg

once every 3 years i check and this thread is still being talked in, how do you guys not have your own separate forum?


----------



## Gas79

Yep... it should be the same
Just to update you, I tried the G-S DT-33.1 and seems to work. Obviously not the same dome shape as the original one but much more cheap


----------



## Stigmata

The Joy of collecting Guides


----------



## 147 05 01

The joy of collecting Guides (Quote:stigmata)
















best regards


----------



## mmarc77

I've looked through this thread from time to time and Enicar has some very nice watches. This Star is my first one and is a solid, good looking watch with some nice finishes. It's a good size at a tad bit over 35mm w/o crown and has an AR 1141 movement. I love blue dials and this is a great shade of blue although there is a little bit of spotting. Not sure if the watch is original and the numbers are all correct but this really has held up well and is a nice timepiece.


----------



## Stigmata

there's some great stuff here


----------



## Stigmata

dmcevoy said:


> Hi,
> I have a Sherpa Super-Jet with the original Enicar beads-of-rice bracelet. I need to shorten the bracelet a bit by removing some links, but don't see any of the traditional pins or markings for removable pins on the back side. Can anyone give me some tips on removing some links from these bracelets? It looks as if the only option is to (gently) bend open one row of the "rice bead" loops from the back, but wanted to check with you experienced folks before I try that. Thanks very much.


yeah a watchmaker or jeweller can bend back and refold


----------



## Stigmata

wore this yesterday and I'll probably wear another guide today!


----------



## TheCowWatcher

mmarc77 said:


> I've looked through this thread from time to time and Enicar has some very nice watches. This Star is my first one and is a solid, good looking watch with some nice finishes. It's a good size at a tad bit over 35mm w/o crown and has an AR 1141 movement. I love blue dials and this is a great shade of blue although there is a little bit of spotting. Not sure if the watch is original and the numbers are all correct but this really has held up well and is a nice timepiece.
> 
> View attachment 13290341
> 
> 
> View attachment 13290343
> 
> 
> View attachment 13290345
> 
> 
> View attachment 13290347
> 
> 
> View attachment 13290349


I am looking to get one of those very soon! Nice to see it on someones wrist.


----------



## mmarc77

TheCowWatcher said:


> I am looking to get one of those very soon! Nice to see it on someones wrist.


It wasn't on my wrist long as my son who sells my collectables, including watches, mistakenly listed it on Ebay and sold it. I had just cleaned it up and put a strap on it and stuck it in a case which he decided to list some watches from, so now I will be looking for another Pearl as well as a Sherpa. Good news is a fellow WUS member ended up winning the bid.


----------



## TheCowWatcher

mmarc77 said:


> TheCowWatcher said:
> 
> 
> 
> I am looking to get one of those very soon! Nice to see it on someones wrist.
> 
> 
> 
> It wasn't on my wrist long as my son who sells my collectables, including watches, mistakenly listed it on Ebay and sold it. I had just cleaned it up and put a strap on it and stuck it in a case which he decided to list some watches from, so now I will be looking for another Pearl as well as a Sherpa. Good news is a fellow WUS member ended up winning the bid.
Click to expand...

Was that yours on ebay that just ended??? I got sniped hard at the end.


----------



## mmarc77

TheCowWatcher said:


> Was that yours on ebay that just ended??? I got sniped hard at the end.


LOL, it was and the sniper is a nice guy that is also a member here. And since you mentioned seeing one on a wrist, my wrist is 7 1/4 and it was a good size for my wrist, very comfortable and not too small.


----------



## TheCowWatcher

That's great! Hope he enjoys it! I wasn't able to watch the final minutes but thought this is the one I can get easily. Gotta love the bay. If he ever wants to move on from it then he knows who to get in touch with. Fantastic watch for sure, and i'll find another one some day.


----------



## 147 05 01

I bought some Enicar printing plates some time ago. Today I tried to be a pressman. 
Here are some results (which can definitely still be improved).


----------



## kazrich

What a great historical find !
Keep them safely.


----------



## Liizio

A new arrival for me, something I snatched from a local auction site.

I don't really know anything about it -or Enicars generally-, so any info and thoughts are much appreciated. I understand the "Supertest" means this one went through some sort of a accuracy test at one point?

How about the case? It is snap-on, but one with a gasket. So considered somewhat waterproof for the time?

I guess the crown is replaced?

Sadly the caseback is in a rough shape. It has the numbers 158795 and 1000 / 16.


----------



## 147 05 01

Hi Liizio,

the movement should be an AR 1290 with the large balance wheel. 
The large diameter of the balance wheel should result in a more precise movement.
I would not call this case waterproof rather splash water protected.
The crown must have been replaced.

best regards


----------



## TheCowWatcher

That crosshair dial is very attractive. Good choice! With some attention it will be a very good watch to enjoy.


----------



## Liizio

Many thanks guys! I'll need to source a new seconds hand and a mainspring, but i'm hopeful it will turn into a nice watch. An original crown would also be nice, but I doubt those are readily available.


Edit:

Nevermind, there seems to be a lot of enicar crowns floating around ebay.


----------



## hns-panama

Liizio,

Say hi to a few cousins.

The 1290 movement is a terrific timekeeper. The cases, at least for mine, are earlier EPSA compressors. Patent number 313813. So if yours has that number somewhere on it, then yes, they were "Waterproof" up to a point. Perish the thought now though.

Cheers!


----------



## saalto

TheCowWatcher said:


> That's great! Hope he enjoys it! I wasn't able to watch the final minutes but thought this is the one I can get easily. Gotta love the bay. If he ever wants to move on from it then he knows who to get in touch with. Fantastic watch for sure, and i'll find another one some day.


That was me, sorry to snipe it from you at the end, haha. I wish you the best of luck in finding another clean example like the one I got, just received it today and it is in great condition visually. The movement needs some attention, as I was having some trouble setting the hour and minute hand/hand winding however the seconds hand is running along currently. Will have to take it in for service and get it back in good running order again.

Spencer


----------



## TheCowWatcher

That's great! Glad you're a member here. I just got a call from service that my Ultrasonic will be needing parts replaced. Hopefully they can be tracked down. One of my favorite dials and sub second hand watches too.


----------



## Stigmata

gorgeous day to wear


----------



## Joe_A

I have joined the club!

















I am thinking I'd like to put the watch on either a gray/white rally strap or perhaps a golden brown rally strap?

Anyone have any source recommendations?

Cheers,

~ Joe


----------



## kazrich

Hi Joe and welcome to the Enicar money pit !
You have a very nice example of a Sherpa Graph indeed. I also keep a couple of these - a 1966 example similar to yours and a 1968 4th execution
They must have sealed them well in circa 1966 because so many dials look immaculate and they are not redials. Even the tritium lume on the 
minute and hour hand tips are often like new.
My 66 came with it's original box and instructions written in English. I reckon you will keep changing straps as the mood takes you.
My 68 currently sits on a grey and white perforated Rallye style strap and the 66 on a beige / light khaki nubuck leather strap which pictures badly
but looks great on the wrist as it contrasts well with the lume. I've also used dark brown leather with white stitching.
Beads of rice bracelet also looks good but lets face it , a Sherpa Graph would even look good held on the wrist by a blood stained oily rag.


----------



## Joe_A

Thank you, Kazrich,

The suede strap currently on the watch is perfectly fine as it is, but I'd like to try the perforated rally type in near-white and perhaps a honey-brown.

From my reading in the usual places, it seems the Mk III was manufactured in 1965 and 1966. I have seen a fellow on this site ask about a Mk III that he inherited and his s/n is 90xxxx. The place I bought mine from sold one previously s/n 30xxxx and mine is s/n 126xxxx so i figure late 1965 or perhaps 1966. Do you have any info on the s/n range versus dates.

It's just an item of idle curiosity for me. I have an Austin-Healey 3000 Mk III that was built in June of 1965, shipped to the US and registered in 1966 so there is a small connection between the watch and my car in terms of birthdays. 

~ Joe


----------



## Joe_A

Thank you to the moderator who removed my accidental duplicate post.

Am I missing an edit function in this forum?

I'm sometimes pretty sloppy on my first go . . . and I often edit my posts a couple of times just to get the typos fixed and to add nuance or to correct what may be an impression I may have inadvertently created as seen only in the rereading.

Kazrich . . .

Is there a place online where one may download copies of Enicar user manuals?

I do have info on the Valjoux 72 movement. There is quite a bit of info around on movements.

Cheers,

~ Joe


----------



## kazrich

Hi Joe ;
I bought my watch from the original owner. It was given to him as a present for graduating / passing exams in 1966.
The shop was in Kingston Surrey in the UK and he was given the choice of the shop. Clever lad picked the Enicar Sherpa Graph.
Although the watch was sold in 1966 it may have been made in 65. The serial nos. is 835***
I don't know of any register of Enicar serial numbers.
Regarding straps, I asked the seller how it came when new. He said he only ever changed the strap once and asked for the replacement to be exactly as original. 
That was simple soft black leather tapering from the 20mm lug down to the tip. No perforations or contrast stitching -all black slightly gloss leather.
The original box looks a bit budget by today's standards but came with a fold over sheet of instructions written in English in portrait style. 
The only other one I've ever seen is landscape style written in French. I guess Enicar assumed the new owner knew how to operate the chrono as the info
is mainly telling what it and other Enicar's can do rather than how.
When I get a moment in the near future I shall post pics of the instructions and you can print it off.


----------



## 147 05 01

At https://enicar101.com a very nice guy named Nico tries to build a register for Sherpa Graph, Jet Graph and Aqua Graph. I've had very nice contact with him. Perhaps you can support him in what he's doing.

best regards


----------



## 147 05 01

Hi, Joe_A,

I hope I can help you with that:

















best regards


----------



## Joe_A

Thank you!

I will reach out to Nico as well.

Cheers,

~ Joe


----------



## JimJupiter

147 05 01 said:


> At enicar101 a very nice guy named Nico tries to build a register for Sherpa Graph, Jet Graph and Aqua Graph. I've had very nice contact with him. Perhaps you can support him in what he's doing.
> 
> best regards


Thanks mate, seems I should follow this thread more often 
Regarding Serials and dates, this is why I started my project. There was no source in the web with clear classification of the different Graphs.

I have a list with more than 100 watches and their serials now. The more the better, so if you want to help me, any help is appreciated.

This is what I have so far for the Sherpa Graph:

Sherpa Graph MK I	1308 BaNCH	272.5xx- 272.9xx 5/60

Sherpa Graph MK Ib	1308 BaNCH	409.2xx - 409.7xx 11/61

Sherpa Graph MK Ic	1308 BaNCH	526.0xx - 527.7xx 4/62

Sherpa Graph MK Id	1308 BaNCH	562.xxx	6/62 6/62

Sherpa Graph MK II	072/001 617.4xx - 617.5xx 63 (estimated)

Sherpa Graph MK III	072-02-01 635.9xxx 63 (estimated)
641.xxx 63 (estimated)
835.1xx - 835.9xx 65 (estimated)
906.4xx 66 (estimated)
908.xxx 66 (estimated)
940.5xx - 941.4xx 6/66

Sherpa Graph MK IV	072-02-01 1.030.5xx - 1.030.8xx 9/67
1.261.7xx - 1.263.0xx 11/68

It's all still in developement. Last week I just found out, there is a 1963 Jet Graph so I had to adjust numbers and classification.

Best Nico!


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## JimJupiter

Hm, seems formatting got broken, maybe this pic is better:









Nico


----------



## Joe_A

Interesting compilation, Nico . . .

There was a thread started here awhile ago by aran121 wherein he requested information about his Sherpa Graph:

Search for Sherpa Graph and look for a post by Aran121 - It seems silly, but I am not allowed to post links as yet.

To my eye, the watch seemed clearly to be Mk III, yet Kazrich identified it as a Mk II. I am a n00b, so pay no attention to whatever it is that I suggest. Aran121's S/N is 908436 which places it as a 1966 Mk III in your table above.

Disclaimer: I wore the same Seiko chronograph nearly every day from the day I bought it in 1984 until the beginning of 2018 when I came down with a bad case of "collector's fever," so clearly I am not an horologist!

I purchased my Sherpa Graph just last week and have only had it on my wrist for three days. I purchased it as a Mk III and it certainly looks like a Mk III. My S/N using your formatting is 1.2623xx which would make it a Mk IV, assuming your table is correct.









It does not have the hands of a typical MK IV nor the chapter ring associated with the Mk IV.

I have not as yet opened the watch. I am waiting for the arrival of a 3D printed case tool that would allow me to open the watch without adding to the already copious marks and polish to the case back. perhaps, when I open it up, I'll know more.

In any case the same entity that sold me my watch previously sold a nearly identical Mk III with a S/N of 314xxx. This would put it in the range of a Mk I or Ib?

Up until now, I have used the springbar guide as a way of identifying Sherpa graphs by appearance only.

I am not permitted yet to post the link, but of course you'd be familiar with the guide.

I'd be curious about your further thoughts?


----------



## JimJupiter

Hey Joe,

thanks for your post, I try to answer as best as I could 

I. The watch of Aran121 is clearly a MKIII regarding my classification. Remember, its not an official one. Normally I change the MK Number when the Ref number is changing, like "1308 BaNCH" to "072/001" to 072 / 02 /01" or significant design changes.
1966 is also too late for a MKII.

II. Your watch looks like a MKIII, but has the Serial of a MKIV. Due to the facts, I think this watch is made of parts or got a swap case.

III. You offen find the Serial 314.962 in offers. But thats not a serial, thats the patent number of the EPSA Case 

IV. Of yourse I know Springbar. It was a great first attempt,...but everything is on one page and in my opinion its not going into much detail. Also there are some Franken watches in the pictures 

Best Nico


----------



## Joe_A

Nico,

I feel certain at this point that I and a handful of others are bound to receive an education. ;-)

I. So we have resolved the Aran 121 issue and it is as I thought, a Mk III.

II. I am not sure what to do about my Mk III with a Mk IV s/n? It's a lovely watch and I am pleased with it, but I am also uncomfortable with the apparent mismatch. The seller and I will have a dialog about this issue. What impact do you feel that this mismatch will have on resale value?

III. Yes, even I should have recognized the first digits of the well-known brevet #, lol. In looking back at the seller's website, I found a photo of the case back and one can almost, but not quite, read the actual s/n. It appears to be x412xx with the final two numbers something like 66 or 96 and any of the sixes may also be 8s. The first number may be an "8," and if so, it would square with your table of information.

In my life, I give everyone the benefit of the doubt until I have very good reason to do otherwise. The seller appears to enjoy a fine reputation and I wouldn't want to injure it in any way at this point.

The next milestone for me will be to open the watch and confirm that a gold-plated Enicar Valjoux 72 resides within. I haven't found any information as to whether the movement has a visible s/n, but I have not seen such in any photos seen to date. I can say this much: it keeps good time! ;-)

Finally . . .

How do you determine with a certainly whether a watch seen on the springbar site is a frankenwatch or not? I understand that some things are obvious to the practiced eye, but there can be variations as well, no?

I hope we aren't engaged in removing some of the "joy" in the Joy of Collecting Enicars thread. So far, I am still joyful. ;-)

~ Joe


----------



## kazrich

So Joe ;
If the 3rd execution Graphs were possibly manufactured in 1965/67 and the 4th execution in 1967 /68 or later, who is to say that during the transition Enicar didn't sell both dial designs until they used up all the earlier stock of dials ?
Enicar didn't seem too bothered as they attributed the same reference number for both as 072 02 01 and they had totally different dial designs.
Don't forget that the the current names and style references have only recently been attributed to collectors attempting to make sense of the numbers. 
If you could time travel back to the 1960's into Enicar's HQ and mention Graph 2A 3B etc. etc. they wouldn't have a clue what you were rabbiting on about. 
Enicar would have, just like any other business used up old stock in new models, and it's possible that a retailer would offer different models of the same watch at the same price.
This is why there are so many different combinations of hands and script and numbers . The watches were all of the same high quality and customers couldn't make a quick Google image search
before going shopping. If they liked the watch they bought it - simple.


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## Joe_A

Kazrich, Thank you.

What you say about the various "Marks," is true in many fields. The first iteration of something that is subsequently reissued is sometimes referred to as the Mk I later on, only when there are subsequent "Marks." My Austin-Healey 3000 Mk III is but one example. You'll find a Mk II badge and a Mk III badge but no Mk I badge unless it's fake. ;-)

But in _*this*_ case I now understand that the manufacturer's reference number is what really counts and the Mk appellations are simply collector terms used recently, but not used by Enicar.

Moving along . . .

As soon as Nico's data appeared, I thought to myself: "This will be an opportunity to learn more on the subject no matter how the story turns out."

The dealer I purchased from is highly reputable and they are going to dig deeper for me as to provenance. Let's see what they turn up. They offer a lifetime guaranty of authenticity and apart from that, I am within an approval period during which I can return the watch for full repayment even without a reason.

As it stands right now, they will have to send "Big Tony" over to pry it from my wrist. ;-)

What I would want to avoid one day in the future is something like this: "Hey, I'll give you 75 cents on a dollar for your watch because your serial number doesn't appear to match the style." I bought the watch to enjoy it, not primarily as an investment, but one wants to feel good about its resale value as well.

Meanwhile, we may perhaps learn a bit more from them or from Nico . . . or not at all . . . as there may not be much more to know?

Thanks again,

Joe


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## JimJupiter

Hey Joe, I try to answer as best as i can 

_II. I am not sure what to do about my Mk III with a Mk IV s/n? It's a lovely watch and I am pleased with it, but I am also uncomfortable with the apparent mismatch. The seller and I will have a dialog about this issue. What impact do you feel that this mismatch will have on resale value?_

I have to take the point of kazrich first. I believe there are a lot of transitional watches, but just from one, to the following design. In the case of Joe, we have a case that dates to 11/68, where the watches normally have the triangle second hand, and the painted minute counter. His watch though, has the thin sub dial hands, that are typical for 1966 and earlier.

Pricewise, I would say it has no impact in todays market, cause the usual Enicar buyer is not educated in that field of research, cause there havn't been sources yet. Could change if there is a "Graph Watch Only" Book in the future and everyone knows about it.

I think they changed the case at some point, maybe the old one was overpolished. Enjoy the watch, its a beauty!

_The next milestone for me will be to open the watch and confirm that a gold-plated Enicar Valjoux 72 resides within. I haven't found any information as to whether the movement has a visible s/n, but I have not seen such in any photos seen to date. I can say this much: it keeps good time! ;-)_

No there is no extra serial number on the movement. But the bridge should be marked Enicar of course and be golden or rose-gold. There are also silver Valjoux 72's marked Enicar out there,...but I think they are for the other "non-Graph" references.

_How do you determine with a certainly whether a watch seen on the springbar site is a frankenwatch or not? I understand that some things are obvious to the practiced eye, but there can be variations as well, no?_

As I said, There are transitions and I also don't know everything  Its more the obvious ones 

And kazrich is absolutly right and I have to state it again. This classification is my classification, based on over hundred watches. Enicar maybe havn't such a system. All documents were destroyed when they went bancrupt so we will never now (I really hope some old Enicar employer has some boxes full of documents on his attic!!!  ).

Best Nico


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## Emancipator12

hi guys...

I hope someone can help me.

I am looking to buy my first Enicar.
And has found this for sale.

So I am hoping someone can help tell if it is "genuine" all the way through. (and maybe something about the age.) 
And not a "franken"

IF it's legit, how much should I pay for such a watch.
(I know it's hard to put a price on vintage watches)

thx in advance.

Dennis.

P.S: (The movement is stated to be a AR 1140)


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## Sansoni7

I think it is legit, but perhaps redial ?????


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## MidnightBeggar

Hey Enicar folks!

The springbar blog site is down unfortunately and I'm curious about some Mark II & III differences. Regarding this pics included, are these Mark II's? Does anyone know if Enicar was using the lollipop second hands and black/yellow GMT ring on Mark III's or was it II's only? Also, these particular dials had T Swiss at the bottom rather than the 'T Swiss - Made T' separated by the 6-marker, which was much more common; as well as painted logos as opposed to applied logos. Are these features of Mark II's?


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## TheCowWatcher

Latest addition. Very similar dial to my first Enicar. Little smaller but i'll get the measurements and further details tomorrow. So far it works like a charm and keeping excellent time. Still deciding to keep it for now.


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## userealwasabi

Yup agree, they are huge in China. Met someone from China recently and the first brand he mentioned was this!


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## Jimbo85281

I just got this in today and had some questions! Firstly, can anyone tell me approximately what year this is? The number below the pearl logo(which I believe is the serial) is 734651.

I think it has the 140 movement based on the caseback numbers but I'm not 100% sure. Any info would be great!









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## Dan S

Jimbo85281 said:


> I just got this in today and had some questions! Firstly, can anyone tell me approximately what year this is? The number below the pearl logo(which I believe is the serial) is 734651.
> 
> I think it has the 140 movement based on the caseback numbers but I'm not 100% sure. Any info would be great!
> 
> Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk


Looks like a very nice Sherpa. Probably an AR 1140, presumably from the 1960s. But @kazrich will know for sure.


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## Jimbo85281

badbackdan said:


> Looks like a very nice Sherpa. Probably an AR 1140, presumably from the 1960s. But @kazrich will know for sure.


Appreciate that info! I'm sending it for service so I'll get some movement pics when that's being completed. Is there a serial number archive somewhere?

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## JimJupiter

No there is no Enicar Archive, cause the company went bancrupt in the 80s and presumably all the documents were destroyed. Nevertheless I started a serial guide for the Sherpa Graph watches (enicar101.com). Since the serials were (mostly) given in chronological order, I can tell you that your watch is most likely from 1964. If you are lucky, a date is written in the inside of the case back. Nice catch by the way!

Best Nico


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## Jimbo85281

JimJupiter said:


> No there is no Enicar Archive, cause the company went bancrupt in the 80s and presumably all the documents were destroyed. Nevertheless I started a serial guide for the Sherpa Graph watches (enicar101.com). Since the serials were (mostly) given in chronological order, I can tell you that your watch is most likely from 1964. If you are lucky, a date is written in the inside of the case back. Nice catch by the way!
> 
> Best Nico


I just checked out your site. Awesome job! I'll have to ask my watchmaker to snap a picture of the inside of the caseback. But I can see how, based on your records it would likely be 1964.

Does anyone know if someone made a 3d printed opener for the caseback for these 34mm cases? I saw that someone made one for 36mm cases and maybe the 41 as well.

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## Jimbo85281

A few more shots of this beauty!









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## kazrich

Jimbo85281 said:


> I just got this in today and had some questions! Firstly, can anyone tell me approximately what year this is? The number below the pearl logo(which I believe is the serial) is 734651.
> 
> I think it has the 140 movement based on the caseback numbers but I'm not 100% sure. Any info would be great!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk


Nice looking watch.
Difficult to accurately date your watch because when Enicar realised how highly regarded the top of the range Sherpa models had become they used the Sherpa name more frequently.
As your Sherpa isn't a variant known to me ( unlike Jet, Super Jet, Dive etc. ) I can only look for design cues. 
Dial.
As Enicar is not signed through the planet Saturn it's probably post 1961. 
Your hour lume markers are shown as 'feet' and on a Sherpa Graph usually had matching paddle hands. Your hands look more in keeping with 1967/68.
Case. 
Your case looks pre 1969 /70 when some Sherpa's started to use 'cushion' shaped cases.
Case back. Earlier Brevet 314962 Super Compressor cases were either presented as a 4 leaf clover or later as Sherpa 300 ( 300 ft depth rating ).
After approx. 1967 they changed the inscription to Sherpa 600 with is deeper and looks more visually dramatic.
So, if your watch left the factory the way you bought it ( and I've no reason to believe otherwise ), I would guess at 1967 / 68 ish.


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## Jimbo85281

kazrich said:


> Nice looking watch.
> Difficult to accurately date your watch because when Enicar realised how highly regarded the top of the range Sherpa models had become they used the Sherpa name more frequently.
> As your Sherpa isn't a variant known to me ( unlike Jet, Super Jet, Dive etc. ) I can only look for design cues.
> Dial.
> As Enicar is not signed through the planet Saturn it's probably post 1961.
> Your hour lume markers are shown as 'feet' and on a Sherpa Graph usually had matching paddle hands. Your hands look more in keeping with 1967/68.
> Case.
> Your case looks pre 1969 /70 when some Sherpa's started to use 'cushion' shaped cases.
> Case back. Earlier Brevet 314962 Super Compressor cases were either presented as a 4 leaf clover or later as Sherpa 300 ( 300 ft depth rating ).
> After approx. 1967 they changed the inscription to Sherpa 600 with is deeper and looks more visually dramatic.
> So, if your watch left the factory the way you bought it ( and I've no reason to believe otherwise ), I would guess at 1967 / 68 ish.


Thanks for that! That's much more info than I expected. Is there anything about the ar1140 that I should let my watchmaker know about? Any weak points or parts that are usually replaced during service?

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## kazrich

The AR1140 is good movement, as are all Enicar in house designs. Your watchmaker shouldn't have difficulty working on it. The bayonet case back is not easy to remove but
a Jaxa style wrench usually works OK in the right hands.
See if you can take a picture of the inside case back for a date. Many 1950's Seapearl backs were inscribed EPSA - STOP with a month and year underneath.
Then Enicar became inconsistent with dating even on the same model some are dated and others are not. Your watch design was named as Seapearl, Star Jewels and Sherpa at different
times for different markets with very slight design variations. They all seem to use AR1140 and that's what makes them difficult to date.
It's possible that your Sherpa could be closer to mid sixties but for sure it's a 1960's watch.


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## Jimbo85281

kazrich said:


> The AR1140 is good movement, as are all Enicar in house designs. Your watchmaker shouldn't have difficulty working on it. The bayonet case back is not easy to remove but
> a Jaxa style wrench usually works OK in the right hands.
> See if you can take a picture of the inside case back for a date. Many 1950's Seapearl backs were inscribed EPSA - STOP with a month and year underneath.
> Then Enicar became inconsistent with dating even on the same model some are dated and others are not. Your watch design was named as Seapearl, Star Jewels and Sherpa at different
> times for different markets with very slight design variations. They all seem to use AR1140 and that's what makes them difficult to date.
> It's possible that your Sherpa could be closer to mid sixties but for sure it's a 1960's watch.


Is there any way to tell what market the watch was sold to? Were they sold in the US back then?

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## kazrich

Sherpa's were top of the Enicar range and were sold in quality watch retailers.
Although Enicar was ( and still is ) very popular in the Far East, I'm not sure if the Sherpa range was marketed there.
I would have thought they sold most Sherpa's to Europe and North America and reserved the Star Jewels versions for the
less affluent markets.


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## AKV

I recently got this - don't know much about it. Just enjoying it for now. My 1st vintage and 1st manual wind


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## kazrich

Nice watch and probably late 50's to early 60's.


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## Jimbo85281

Can you guys tell me if my caseback is closed properly? I see the line and circle mark on the caseback but I have no idea where they're supposed to be in order to show that it's locked down.

Before it's service last week, the small line was pointing at the crown. It seems like it's not screwed down enough now. Maybe too thick of a gasket was used?

Let me know!









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## Jimbo85281

Jimbo85281 said:


> Can you guys tell me if my caseback is closed properly? I see the line and circle mark on the caseback but I have no idea where they're supposed to be in order to show that it's locked down.
> 
> Before it's service last week, the small line was pointing at the crown. It seems like it's not screwed down enough now. Maybe too thick of a gasket was used?
> 
> Let me know!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk


Kazrich helped me out with this. It needed to be rotated so that the line was pointing to the crown. Thanks!

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## [email protected]

Hello,
I'm new to this community so I am not sure if I am posting this in the correct place. I have an enicar watch that I have not been able to find any reference for. It is an enicar alarm watch. I attached photos of the watch and would appreciate any help.


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## Dan S

[email protected] said:


> Hello,
> I'm new to this community so I am not sure if I am posting this in the correct place. I have an enicar watch that I have not been able to find any reference for. It is an enicar alarm watch. I attached photos of the watch and would appreciate any help.


Maybe try again ... and focus on the watch this time. You will generally get a better response when you make a bit more effort.


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## ashar_amu

What about this old beauty ..


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## laikrodukas

I am afraid that nothing about it


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## alexjt11

Hi, so I have a wierd one for you guys. 
I have an Enicar Minor, which has an Cal: AR 410, which is signed by Accurist. A previous post on this thread said that Accurist bought movements from Switzerland and then put them in their own watches. This is why I understand that it has been signed by them on the back of the movement, but the main puzzle is why it is back in an Enicar?
So I would just like to know if anyone knows what an Enicar minor is and why this watch is an enicar calibre signed accurist in an enicar?


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## Jimbo85281

New nos lizard strap for this guy. Perfect!









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## bigredhuskers

Love my enicar 









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## Kansas

I recently got this Enicar after happily discovering the brand recently. Love the Enicar logo and caseback with shark and Saturn!










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## Kansas

I'm curious how one tells an authentic Enicar beads of rice bracelet from a generic one which just has an Enicar clasp attached?


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## kazrich

Kansas said:


> I'm curious how one tells an authentic Enicar beads of rice bracelet from a generic one which just has an Enicar clasp attached?


Your answer is age.
Thousands of micro scratches and general signs of age and wear and tear. Enicar is now a very well regarded and popular vintage brand.
It's difficult to believe that fake Enicar beads of rice bracelets were being made 40/50 years ago. I would suggest that if the bracelet looks
correctly aged and possibly slightly battered ( especially where the clasp has been pushed in and secured thousands of times )the chances are
it's probably correct. The Enicar sign of Saturn on the clasp should be quite deeply embossed and not just tapped on with a punch.
The bracelets would never had been made 'in house' and there would have been design and supplier variations over a period of time.
On the top of the clasp most just show the Saturn logo. Others are also inscribed Enicar. On the underside of the clasp some say ' stainless steel '
others don't - but they are all stainless steel.
I keep a late 50's Sherpa Super Compressor on a beads of rice bracelet. The watch has 'Turtle' lugs and the bracelet fits perfectly.
I've no idea if the bracelet came from a later watch or that it's a genuine Enicar bracelet. However it has aged at the same rate as the watch.
However be careful what you wish for. Most new bracelets are a subtle and quiet brushed stainless steel. Jeeves might have described 
a beads of rice as " A trifle sudden ". The many facets on the bracelet really do put them in the category of male jewellery.
Light rebounds off every angle and they are shiny to start with. Nothing wrong with that, but they ain't shrinking violets. Here's mine.


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## Kansas

Thanks for the thorough feedback, your example looks pretty sweet. Do they have a solid feel/heft to them or are they light? I ask because I briefly had a franken-Enicar before quickly returning it, and was surprised with how light the beads of rice band felt and it also made a tinkling like sound when moving on the wrist. I assumed it was a cheap replacement with Enicar clasp added, 


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## kazrich

Kansas said:


> Thanks for the thorough feedback, your example looks pretty sweet. Do they have a solid feel/heft to them or are they light? I ask because I briefly had a franken-Enicar before quickly returning it, and was surprised with how light the beads of rice band felt and it also made a tinkling like sound when moving on the wrist. I assumed it was a cheap replacement with Enicar clasp added,
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Well, I'm not an expert in watch bracelets as most of my watches are on leather straps and I only currently keep 3 on bracelets.
However my Aquastar ( 37.5 mm ) is heavier than the Enicar ( 35.0mm ). The Aquastar links are bigger and thicker.










This I put down to the complexity of the BOR manufacturing process. To make the beads ' rice size ' and easily foldable and comfortable
I would have thought they would need to be slimmer to enable them to sit correctly on the wrist without showing gaps. The clasps on both
watches look to have the same depth and weight.
In essence the BOR weight is somewhere between a Milanese strap and a chunkier strap as seen on the Aquastar ( not an original Aquastar bracelet ).
It's a bit like chaimail - lighter is better.
When attempting to photograph a watch with a BOR bracelet they tend to fold in on themselves - but I'm pretty sure that's just the nature of the beast
and not a sign of poor quality
Mine doesn't 'tinkle' though and is reasonably comfortable to wear.


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## Kansas

Thanks Kazrich. I have also been thinking about radium vs. tritium in dials. Now, I know that Enicar used to have radium dials in the Seapearl, and I have also read that sites, at least here in the US, that painted radium dials and were later demolished still retained high amounts of radiation. 

Now, I know that Enicar switched to tritium dials in the 1960's. Yes, great, less radioactive and much shorter half-life. However, were their watches still produced in the same factory in which the radium dial watches were? Is it possible that a 'safer' tritium watch may have been exposed to radium particles? Has anybody actually tested a later edition Enicar watch with a geiger counter? I have a Mark IVA Guide incoming, and with a young child on the way I suddenly am getting the willies about radiation (why did I read articles about radiation??)


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## kazrich

Tons of info and opinions about radium on here and elsewhere. However I do share your concerns about possible radium exposure to a toddler.
Probably a tiny or insignificant risk if the watch is stored sensibly and not used on a daily basis but if in doubt -don't.
Not heard any scare stories regarding Tritium. Enicar apparently did make there own Radium but I don't think they produced Tritium. 
Even if they did, I would hardly believe they would cross contaminate it with Radium.
If Tritium turned out to be dangerous we might be reduced to collecting Swatch and Apple watches ?


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## Kansas

kazrich said:


> Tons of info and opinions about radium on here and elsewhere. However I do share your concerns about possible radium exposure to a toddler.
> Probably a tiny or insignificant risk if the watch is stored sensibly and not used on a daily basis but if in doubt -don't.
> Not heard any scare stories regarding Tritium. Enicar apparently did make there own Radium but I don't think they produced Tritium.
> Even if they did, I would hardly believe they would cross contaminate it with Radium.
> If Tritium turned out to be dangerous we might be reduced to collecting Swatch and Apple watches ?


My concern is not with the tritium so much, thanks to its shorter half life and Sherpa's being made in late 60's/early 70's so it would have largely degraded, but the possibility that radiation from radium use would have possibly been spread across the factory, thus affecting other watches.

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## Dan S

Kansas said:


> ... the possibility that radiation from radium use would have possibly been spread across the factory, thus affecting other watches.


Radiation is not contagious ... keep reading articles and forum posts. There is plenty of accurate information out there and this topic has been beaten to death in other threads.


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## Kansas

It has been discussed a great deal because it is a relevant issue. I'd disagree with the assertion that radiation does not spread, as numerous sites where radium was used continue to have radioactivity. In the case of my worry regarding watches potentially made in the same factory, I guess over the past 40+ years it's unlikely that any residue of radium particles could remain if it had ever been present initially.

Below are some articles referring to the ongoing issue of radioactivity from radium, published by reputable sites.

https://www.nytimes.com/2001/06/24/nyregion/residue-from-industrial-past-haunts-state.html

https://www.theatlantic.com/notes/2017/03/radium-superfund-legacy/519408/

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## Joe_A

I'm overdue to come back into this thread and report on things Sherpa Graph related, but first this:

*New Report Shows Radium Dials Might Pose Serious Danger*

Previously I'd been dismissive of the possibility that any old radium lumed watch could propose a significant risk these days, but the above article does give pause.

The possibility of inhaling radon gas is something that we should at least consider.


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## Joe_A

Back on July 31st I entered this thread for the first time indicating that I'd "joined the club" with the purchase of an Enicar Sherpa Graph Mk III. One may find my initial post on page 190 assuming a default pagination scheme.

At the time, I had just acquired the watch from *A Collected Man*, though I did not indicate where I bought it until now.

Here _was_ my watch:

*Joe's first Sherpa graph Mk III from ACM*

Rich (Kazrich) and Nico (JimJupiter) congratulated me on my having joined the club, but over the course of discussion an issue cropped up. My watch was clearly a Mk III in appearance, but the S/N of my watch was that of a Mk IV - S/N 1262347.

I mention the dealer's name today because they ultimately did right by me as I shall explain.

So what happened?

When I identified the issue to the seller, the seller gave me the option of sending the watch back for a full refund immediately, and they offered as much time to evaluate whether I wished to keep it or return it. I had the watch in my possession for about three or more weeks before I ultimately decided to return it. I received the full value of total cost to me and with no further questions asked.

So am I now Sherpa Graphless? 

Heck no!

I found another watch in Barcelona and this is the watch I currently have on my wrist today and most days lately:

*Joe's second Sherpa Graph Mk III purchased from Ancienne*

Ignacio Coll of Ancienne is another one of the "Good Guys" in my book.

Here are some comparison shots of the two watches followed by shots of the watch now on my wrist:

















There is a small issue with the second watch, one that I may eventually address: At some point the hands were part-painted white. Any qualified watchmaker should be able to remove the paint at my request.

Additional photos of the current Mk III

















I now have a very rare Mk 1d on the way in as well!

~ Joe


----------



## Kansas

Got my eagerly-awaited Sherpa Guide which I believe is a mark IV. So far I love it, taking it in to get inspected and cleaned tomorrow.










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## Joe_A

My previous post on the previous page hasn't garnered much of a reaction as yet though I appreciate the fact that Kansas did "like" what he read.

Let's see if this post gets more of a reaction. ;-)

Any Enicar fan or WIS who doesn't react, should call the undertaker, because obviously you've died but you don't actually know it yet. ;-)

Not long ago, I was interested in an "Enicar Gerhard Mitter" that was owned by a gentleman from Sweden named Lars. Lars' screen name is "Northflower," and he is a true gentleman. Lars had already sold on the Mitter, but he casually mentioned that he had a special watch coming up for sale should I be interested? The watch turned out to be an albino Sherpa Graph Id, one of only about 400 Ids produced in 1962. There are a number of things about this watch that make it possibly unique. It comes with an appropriate though not necessarily original box, guaranty, tag and original buckle and the watch is in very fine condition with some expected scratches on the cloverleaf case back.

What follows is the unboxing which took place just within the hour, so I'm pretty chuffed at the moment. This is a "joy" thread after all.









































I haven't taken any good photos as yet, but this one was furnished by Lars while we were negotiating for the purchase:









~ Joe


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## kazrich

Hi Joe - very nice Graph.
I really still don't understand the terminology 1D ? Are these just made up numbers and letters ? 
I can't see any reference for Sherpa Graph 1D anywhere. As I see it, your new watch has the appearance of an early second generation dial ( i.e. Enicar is NOT signed through planet Saturn ).
Also the 2 sub registers have the 'leaf' design which hints of very early second generation.
Where does the figure of 'about 400 ' come from ? 
Does your source have access to original Enicar factory production numbers - cos we would all love to see them !
Can I assume that the Valjoux 72 movement is copper coloured ?
Whatever, a very nice Graph for sure.

https://thespringbar.com/blogs/guides/enicar-graph-collectors-guide-1

Regarding your other Graph, I suspect the hands are not painted. My watchmaker uses Tippex correction fluid on the hands if they are difficult to read.
So maybe it might just scrape off. I think it looks OK . Maybe a watchmaker knows a good solvent for Tippex ? The later Graphs with thick 'stick' hands
where white ( plus a little lume ). This makes them very easy to read quickly.


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## Joe_A

Hello Rich,

The references to Mark Ia,b,c,d, Mark II, Mark III and Mark IV are indeed retrospective and as far as I am aware, are an invention of Nico, JimJupiter.

In the last year or so of my reading and hunting on the Net, Nico's way of referring to this family of watches seems to have caught on. He has similarly sorted the production of the Super Graph, Jet Graph and Aquagraph along similar lines.

Here is the source:

*Enicar 101*

As far as the numbers of each type are concerned, this is a deductive process based upon known (identified) serial number ranges as they are discovered:

*Enicar Graph Serial Number Reference*

Admittedly, the sample is small, but so far, the watches that have turned up have dropped neatly into one the S/N ranges.

As far as the manufacturer is concerned, there were only three reference models made:

1308 BaNCH (All Mark I - which includes my new watch)
072/001 (The Mark II)
072-02-01 (All the Mark IIIs and Mark IVs)

Nico looked at each of the three original references and further sub-grouped them by date range coupled with changes in physical appearance characteristics. Date stamped on the inside of the case is an additional factor. It's a logical thing, if inventive . . . and would be unrecognizable to anyone who worked for Enicar during its existence. ;-)

So the model I have fell into this serial number range:

561.8xx - 562.1xx

It's easy to extrapolate that the above range can only contain 399 watches. My watch S/N is 562.13x fits within the range and appears likely to be 1 of 399 until the day may come when another serial number range may be discovered.

I'm sure you've seen other people refer to these watches as Mark I, II, III and IV?

Don't we do the same thing with other brands such as when we refer to an Autavia 2446 as a Series II Jochen Rindt?


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## kazrich

I suppose it depends on whether model sub classification is based on serial numbers or significant dial design and manufacturers corporate logo change.That's why it's not a good
idea trying to be too logical about how a given manufacturer numbered their products. When Enicar changed to the newer Mk 2 Graph dial, it's conceivable that the new dials were produced
before the arrival of the re designed EPSA cases with Seapearl 300 backs. They would then have used up their existing stock of Mk1 EPSA cases - exactly the same quality case with the 
clover leaf design rather than Seapearl 300. Possibly they had 400 unused old cases and spare copper coloured V72 engines in the stockroom ? 
Casebacks are a mixture of with or without divers helmets. Some are dated, others are not. My Graphs Mk2 and Mk4 are just inscribed Enicar Watch Co. Swiss
Nobody on Earth or the planet Saturn will ever know.
BOLD WATCHES. shows a watch very similar to yours as a prime example of a series 2 design ( with Enicar script below Saturn, not through it ).
THE SPRINGBAR Graph classification quote ' All Mark 1 models had an applied logo with Enicar embedded in the Saturn image'.
Either way a very nice watch.


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## Joe_A

kazrich said:


> I suppose it depends on whether model sub classification is based on serial numbers or significant dial design and manufacturers corporate logo change.That's why it's not a good idea trying to be too logical about how a given manufacturer numbered their products. When Enicar changed to the newer Mk 2 Graph dial, it's conceivable that the new dials were produced before the arrival of the re designed EPSA cases with Seapearl 300 backs. They would then have used up their existing stock of Mk1 EPSA cases - exactly the same quality case with the
> clover leaf design rather than Seapearl 300. Possibly they had 400 unused old cases and spare copper coloured V72 engines in the stockroom ?
> Casebacks are a mixture of with or without divers helmets. Some are dated, others are not. My Graphs Mk2 and Mk4 are just inscribed Enicar Watch Co. Swiss
> Nobody on Earth or the planet Saturn will ever know.
> BOLD WATCHES. shows a watch very similar to yours as a prime example of a series 2 design ( with Enicar script below Saturn, not through it ).
> THE SPRINGBAR Graph classification quote ' All Mark 1 models had an applied logo with Enicar embedded in the Saturn image'.
> Either way a very nice watch.


Though I may have _sipped the Kool-Aid_ concerning my acceptance of these retrospective model subdivisions, I agree that there is some overlap during transitions. This seems to be true of all watches of the period. I'm pretty sure few expected that a $150 or a $300 watch would one day be sold for 100 times it's original cost, if only because it had an association with a celebrity of the time . . . or perhaps because it used a specific case back or had rare dial attribute.

The most rational among us commit irrational acts every day and there is very little that is rational in my opinion about collecting watches. ;-)

If you spend time on the Enicar101 site, perhaps you'll see what you are looking for: a tie-in with S/N range with dial design and logo change.

I imagine that you will agree that Enicar made more changes within the two-year life of the early 1308 BaNCH reference model than it did throughout the life of the later two references though there were also significant changes in the 072-02-01 reference as this encompassed what most of us now call the Mark III and the Mark IV.

Generally speaking, the Mark I refers to all the 1308 BaNCH models with the cloverleaf case back whether the dial had the old logo or the new logo with the brand separated from Saturn. This reference was introduced with radium lume but before the model changed, the hands were lumed with tritium. It seems there is significant overlap.

Nico shows up here now and then; he is cordially invited to speak for himself. ;-)

I was going to venture into my interpretation of the Ia, Ib, Ic and one Id differences and then I reconsidered. It's all there on the Enicar 101 site for anyone who is interested.

My new acquisition is still an early watch with a 1308 BaNCH cloverleaf back, but the logo has changed. This suggests that it may be regarded as a "transitional" model in that the logo now reflects all the later Sherpa Graph watches but with an early case back, early paddle hours and minutes hands with the longer extensions and with a red stick seconds hand. Lance hands are used on the counter subdials.

Perhaps there are only 400 0f these (so far as we now believe) because this design reflects an "in between" model?

But as you say, we are in agreement that it's a fine example of a fine and relatively rare watch among rare watches. ;-)


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## JimJupiter

Joe you did a great job explaining it, better than I could ever do with my limited English knowledge 

BTW if a caseback has a date inside or not is not random. They also fall into a specific serial range as far as I can see it. But since the serials are chronological, we can estimate a production date too.

I said it more than one time: This is a project for ME, since nobody before tried to classify the watches based on statistics. I don't say this is the truth. I am open for any discussion, cause this is how we learn, right? But since I now have 180 watches in my list, the sample isn't that small 

Happy new year everyone and happy hunting!

Nico

We need more pics here  :


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## Joe_A

Thanks Nico,

I haven't been able to open the case back of my new watch yet, though in truth I have only had it since noon on Friday and here it is Sunday night. ;-)

I have no trouble opening my other graph using the Bergeon tool below:









The new watch back is very tight and of course I do not want to cause damage. I'd prefer to find the perfect tool for the job. I do not intend to leave any otherwise avoidable marks on the watch.

Here is a shot of the back, better to look at then many, though not perfect.:









Note that the "l" mark is past the crown which indicates it was shut pretty tight. I should be able to turn it ant-clockwise as the Brits would say to where the "0" lines up with the crown - or so I think.

I did put it on a new dark charcoal gray leather 20/18 mm rally strap from Pebro along with an RHD (Robert Hollister "Bob" Davis) deployant.

The strap actually looks better than my poor photo.

When the sun comes out some day, I'll be able to take a few good photos. I tried with indoor lighting and the shots came out hideously bad. ;-)


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## jellytots

Hey all, my first time posting in this Enicar forum but really need some advice from you experts.

This super dive came up for sale yesterday and at a price that was probably too good to be true. The seller is a well established seller here and I probably should have done due diligence to check the authenticity of the piece, it was however advertised as having an original dial. Which after closer inspection of the not-great photos and subsequent sleuthing online I found that the same watch was for sale through another well known dealer prior to this sale and had high Res pics that would have sounded alarm bells already if I'd seen them first.

This is the watch in question and I think I've already convinced myself that it's a very poor redial.

https://www.watchuseek.com/f29/fs-e...sor-w-original-bracelet-ca-1960s-4859885.html

https://wannabuyawatch.com/product/...OBgDNfgXz4GD2UnVlkhvalvuqQATJJeUKzO7Zo-rV-L0s

I've contacted the seller and informed him that I'd be returning it for a refund, and hopefully it is resolved quickly and amicably. Guess I just needed some validation and confirmation that it is indeed not an original dial.

Thanks all

Eugene


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## Kansas

Yes it looks Indonesian - in fact I PM’d the seller when I saw his post, informing him of the dial and bezel not being original. No response...hmmmm


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## mrs_LA

Good evening everyone. I am about to purchase an Enicar Sherpa Sea Pearl for my upcoming birthday, and I found this one local to me. Dan S suggested that I would post the pictures here, but these are the ones that the seller sent me. I'd like to ask for some opinions on the originality of the watch.












































The dial is signed:
Enicar
Ultrasonic
17 Jewels

This is of the straight lugged variation, and from articles I have read that there are various dials, and casebacks. But the caseback are all EPSA.

I know the movement pic is not clear, but it says 
ENICAR 
WATCH SWISS CO

17 SEVENTEEN JEWELS
UNADJUSTED

it is different from the movement pic that I have seen online, which says 
ENICAR WATCH CO 
SWISS UNADJUSTED

And separately SEVENTEEN
17 JEWELS

Does anybody have any info regarding the movements in the sea pearl? Were there as many variants as the dial and caseback? Thank you!

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## Dan S

Now that I can see the photos, I think it's legit except for the crown. The dial is a bit rough but has a sort of charm to it at the right price. Unfortunately, the lugs and bezel are terribly overpolished; all the edges are completely gone and the lugs are thin. I don't think it would be acceptable for me.

Here's a minimally polished example for comparison:


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## Kansas

Mrs La I’d caution you regarding the radiation emitted by radium, if you are not already familiar with the use of it in vintage watches. I believe the Seapearl was rejected by the US military back in the day as it emitted a higher level than recommended level,


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## mrs_LA

Hi Dan,

Thanks for the observations. I noticed that the case was slightly polished, but the lugs don't seem to have lost its edges too much - maybe that's just to my untrained eye? I also noticed that the lugs have a slight chip to where the spring bar would be. I'll look into the crown in person - I know every crown is signed for this model, but you're correct that it might not be based on the shape of the crown.



Kansas said:


> Mrs La I'd caution you regarding the radiation emitted by radium, if you are not already familiar with the use of it in vintage watches. I believe the Seapearl was rejected by the US military back in the day as it emitted a higher level than recommended level,
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Thank you sir, I read about the all-radium dial. But has it not been studied that radium exposure is non-existent in a closed watch, unless the case has been opened?


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## Kansas

I wouldn’t say non-existent; while the greater risk would certainly be particles coming into contact with you if the watch was physically opened, there is still radiation being emitted, as well as radon. It seems to depend on what you are comfortable with, I recently read an article estimating about an increase of up to a third of the amount of yearly ambient radiation exposure as you would normally be exposed to as a resident of earth, if you were to wear the watch nonstop for a year. Ultimately up to you and how comfortable you are with it though.


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## mrs_LA

Thanks for the heads up. I just went through the radium post in the forum, which links to the hodinkee update on radium. One of the users though sent in test results that showed radium levels within 18” of his pocket watches were under the health risk. But good to know - might have to keep the watch in a well ventilated area.


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## mrs_LA

I picked her up 

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## Kansas

Nice watch, congrats!


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## mrs_LA

Kansas said:


> Nice watch, congrats!
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Thanks! My husband isn't too keen on the uncertain findings of radium. I tell him that goes with collecting vintage watches!

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## Jimbo85281

mrs_LA said:


> Thanks! My husband isn't too keen on the uncertain findings of radium. I tell him that goes with collecting vintage watches!
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Tell him it'll be safe in about 1600 years 

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## Kansas

Despite this forum member/seller [Bigwatch Guy] being aware the dial and inner bezel are not original, looks like it has been posted for sale on the bay - and listed as original no less. Future buyers beware,

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Enicar-She...3:g:rSEAAOSwzodcPOFq:rk:1:pf:1&frcectupt=true



jellytots said:


> Hey all, my first time posting in this Enicar forum but really need some advice from you experts.
> 
> This super dive came up for sale yesterday and at a price that was probably too good to be true. The seller is a well established seller here and I probably should have done due diligence to check the authenticity of the piece, it was however advertised as having an original dial. Which after closer inspection of the not-great photos and subsequent sleuthing online I found that the same watch was for sale through another well known dealer prior to this sale and had high Res pics that would have sounded alarm bells already if I'd seen them first.
> 
> This is the watch in question and I think I've already convinced myself that it's a very poor redial.
> 
> https://www.watchuseek.com/f29/fs-e...sor-w-original-bracelet-ca-1960s-4859885.html
> 
> https://wannabuyawatch.com/product/...OBgDNfgXz4GD2UnVlkhvalvuqQATJJeUKzO7Zo-rV-L0s
> 
> I've contacted the seller and informed him that I'd be returning it for a refund, and hopefully it is resolved quickly and amicably. Guess I just needed some validation and confirmation that it is indeed not an original dial.
> 
> Thanks all
> 
> Eugene


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## Joe_A

Thanks for the heads-up.

~ Joe


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## mrs_LA

Jimbo85281 said:


> Tell him it'll be safe in about 1600 years
> 
> Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk


All this talk of radium is making me very uneasy...

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## aeroman5

I saw this watch in an antique shop in Hong Kong but can't seem to find any details online. The dial says Enicar and Star Jewels, and the back has the number 140-20-03. Could anyone tell me anything about it? From earlier in this thread it appears to be from the 1960's or 70's. It also seems to have been a popular brand in China.

It was ticking but it will be unlikely the shop will open it up. It should also be noted it was next to a fake Omega Seamaster.

It was priced around US$40. To good to be true? Correct? or a steal?


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## Draven451

I'm not familiar with this brand but appreciate the history 

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## kazrich

aeroman5 said:


> I saw this watch in an antique shop in Hong Kong but can't seem to find any details online. The dial says Enicar and Star Jewels, and the back has the number 140-20-03. Could anyone tell me anything about it? From earlier in this thread it appears to be from the 1960's or 70's. It also seems to have been a popular brand in China.
> 
> It was ticking but it will be unlikely the shop will open it up. It should also be noted it was next to a fake Omega Seamaster.
> 
> It was priced around US$40. To good to be true? Correct? or a steal?


It's not a fake and probably dates to the early 60's. 
The condition doesn't look great and will probably cost at least another $ 200 to service it.


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## MechaMind

... Not only joy but maintenance , too.
A colleague of mine passed me a question.. as he could not get a hand on an original Bakelite lunette of an Enicar 600 Diver (US Navy version) .. (I hope I have specified the Model name right way, as I'm neither a watchmaker nor a collector but a precision mechanics only). He asked me if I could do him a pleasure and setup a replacement lunette from more durable material than the original.
Now,.. I'd have the possibilities, but as his watch has not even a little piece of the lunette left, I'd kindly like to ask if anyone here in could help to reconstruct the parts dimensions nessary to make a replacement. Especially the inner shape would be helpful .









Here is a modified picture from what I mean, taken from the web. Also tried to contact Enicar and asked them for help.
But it seems that I was not worth any efforts.. shame on a brand with such a website and such a remarkable history they instantly advertize with, but owww as soon as someone is asking them for support on reanimating that heritage.. they try to ignore him.. I removed my request on facebook after two weeks and now try to find other ways..


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## Dan S

MechaMind said:


> ... Not only joy but maintenance , too.
> A colleague of mine passed me a question.. as he could not get a hand on an original Bakelite lunette of an Enicar 600 Diver (US Navy version) .. (I hope I have specified the Model name right way, as I'm neither a watchmaker nor a collector but a precision mechanics only). He asked me if I could do him a pleasure and setup a replacement lunette from more durable material than the original.
> Now,.. I'd have the possibilities, but as his watch has not even a little piece of the lunette left, I'd kindly like to ask if anyone here in could help to reconstruct the parts dimensions nessary to make a replacement. Especially the inner shape would be helpful .
> 
> View attachment 13835447
> 
> 
> Here is a modified picture from what I mean, taken from the web. Also tried to contact Enicar and asked them for help.
> But it seems that I was not worth any efforts.. shame on a brand with such a website and such a remarkable history they instantly advertize with, but owww as soon as someone is asking them for support on reanimating that heritage.. they try to ignore him.. I removed my request on facebook after two weeks and now try to find other ways..


I don't know what a "lunette" is, but presumably it has something to do with the bezel. Are you going to replace the entire bezel, or do you have the bezel and just need to replace the bakelite insert? From your photo, I am guessing that you are proposing to manufacture the entire bezel, but maybe you can be more clear.

Also, you should be very careful with the model name. You are showing a picture of a Sherpa Dive, not a Sherpa Diver 600. It's possible that the bezels may be the same on the two models, but I'm not certain. All in all, you should try to be very careful and technically correct, or you may not get the right information. The best thing would be to also include clear, in-focus, comprehensive photos of the watch in question (perhaps with some dimensions), including the reference number from the case-back, which can be difficult to photograph. The reason we ask for photos is that we often get descriptions from non-experts that turn out to be incorrect once they provide photos.

There is no point complaining about the current Enicar company. They are not the same company that made the vintage watches.


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## MechaMind

Beg your pardon.. we should stay English here.. yes its the bezel which originally is made from Bakelite but due to time on most available watches it is eaten by time and gone forever. As I understood my colleage the early bezel were made from entire Bakelite and due to this there is nothing left..
And he wants to stay as authentic as possible. Later models do have a metal bezel with an Acrylic or bakelite insert (I' m not sure as I read about both). For me it is mainly learning..e.g I did this insert for a rare BP variant of the late 60th from acryl. The sherpa 600 is the only Enicar I found seeming to have an entire bakelite bezel.. there is also an older Tissot with bakelite bezel and as bakelite molds are of higher effort it could be, that the bezels were manufactured by external 3rd party and could fit on both watches.. both brands would had fabs in La Chaux de fonts as I read..








Ok I did not have the watch in my hand and so would have to ask about the correct reference number.

Its also not a complaint about Enicar.. but as the "new company" advertizes with the history of the old one, I was wondering why they simply do not tell that they have other priorities than keeping that heritage in mind..


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## Dan S

MechaMind said:


> Beg your pardon.. we should stay English here.. yes its the bezel which originally is made from Bakelite but due to time on most available watches it is eaten by time and gone forever. As I understood my colleage the early bezel were made from entire Bakelite and due to this there is nothing left..
> And he wants to stay as authentic as possible. Later models do have a metal bezel with an Acrylic or bakelite insert (I' m not sure as I read about both). For me it is mainly learning..e.g I did this insert for a rare BP variant of the late 60th from acryl. The sherpa 600 is the only Enicar I found seeming to have an entire bakelite bezel.. there is also an older Tissot with bakelite bezel and as bakelite molds are of higher effort it could be, that the bezels were manufactured by external 3rd party and could fit on both watches.. both brands would had fabs in La Chaux de fonts as I read..
> 
> Ok I did not have the watch in my hand and so would have to ask about the correct reference number.
> 
> Its also not a complaint about Enicar.. but as the "new company" advertizes with the history of the old one, I was wondering why they simply do not tell that they have other priorities than keeping that heritage in mind..


I hope that people will see your post. I would have recommended starting a new thread, since you have such a specific question. This thread is mainly for people to show photos of their Enicar watches.


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## MechaMind

I'd do so but wanted to take the greatest chance which was asking collectors of that brand I'm searching for information about. I think as soon as someone can help, the task will probably change to PN mode.. so your concerns may dissolve..


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## MechaMind

Ouups double post


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## kazrich

Dan S said:


> I hope that people will see your post. I would have recommended starting a new thread, since you have such a specific question. This thread is mainly for people to show photos of their Enicar watches.


Not sure if that response came out right Dan ?
Most posts on here are asking for advice on potential purchases or the correctness of their existing Enicar watches.
For any meaningful response it's usually necessary to show an image of the watch concerned.
However, that said some of the images are appalling and are barely worth a response.
Also nothing wrong with showing off your watch to fellow enthusiasts ?
Just like to say how disappointing it is to see member 'dogen' has deleted most of his Enicar Sherpa images from his Flickr account.
He first appeared on p8 in 2012 and treated us to beautifully photographed images of the finest examples of Enicar Sherpa's that I've ever seen.
Absolutely museum reference quality.
A few images still exist but maybe we should bombard him with PM's to reinstate them ( if he's still has them ).


----------



## Dan S

kazrich said:


> Not sure if that response came out right Dan ?
> Most posts on here are asking for advice on potential purchases or the correctness of their existing Enicar watches.
> For any meaningful response it's usually necessary to show an image of the watch concerned.
> However, that said some of the images are appalling and are barely worth a response.
> Also nothing wrong with showing off your watch to fellow enthusiasts ?
> Just like to say how disappointing it is to see member 'dogen' has deleted most of his Enicar Sherpa images from his Flickr account.
> He first appeared on p8 in 2012 and treated us to beautifully photographed images of the finest examples of Enicar Sherpa's that I've ever seen.
> Absolutely museum reference quality.
> A few images still exist but maybe we should bombard him with PM's to reinstate them ( if he's still has them ).


Yes, my post was too simplistic. My main thought was the value of creating a new thread (with a clear and detailed title) for the very specific question about the bakelite bezel dimensions, and I failed to characterize this thread in a fully nuanced way.


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## MechaMind

Hey guys, this separate thread , dan mentioned should not be a problem at all. I don't want to hijack this showroom thread which it mainly is. I also would not expect that the one who ownes one of those rare gems would take it apart to help me with measurement, the risk would be too high, to damage something, but perhaps I will come a little step further with a high res picture and the outher dimensions which would help me to reconstruct the visible geometry, left. 
My hobby is mechanics and from time to time I select special cases and parts to develope my own manufacturing processes on. So as the insert for the BP shown upon. I also did some tasks on rare plexi , glass, dials, indexes and gears. I understood that I would have to ask my colleage for the reference number to provide a base on which I perhaps could get the desired Information . Thank you for the hints, already given. I hope to come back as soon as I have the necessary data.


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## Dan S

MechaMind said:


> Hey guys, this separate thread , dan mentioned should not be a problem at all. I don't want to hijack this showroom thread which it mainly is. I also would not expect that the one who ownes one of those rare gems would take it apart to help me with measurement, the risk would be too high, to damage something, but perhaps I will come a little step further with a high res picture and the outher dimensions which would help me to reconstruct the visible geometry, left.
> My hobby is mechanics and from time to time I select special cases and parts to develope my own manufacturing processes on. So as the insert for the BP shown upon. I also did some tasks on rare plexi , glass, dials, indexes and gears. I understood that I would have to ask my colleage for the reference number to provide a base on which I perhaps could get the desired Information . Thank you for the hints, already given. I hope to come back as soon as I have the necessary data.


It looks like @longdele on IG owns one of these. Perhaps you can contact him directly through IG messaging.

__
http://instagr.am/p/BpmvsT-HwrL/


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## MechaMind

Thank you very much for that information. I'll try to contact him.


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## nedice

Wow this is one heck of a long and very interesting thread! Just came across this one and hoping for some info if possible:

DSC_2339 by Ned Doolittle, on Flickr









Overall, the large orbit oval is 32mm wide x 22mm, case itself is about 17mm round. Case back, Crown, Movement all marked Enicar. Case back #s 678619.

Thanks for any and all information!


----------



## mrs_LA

Apologize for back tracking a bit, but here is a video of the geiger counter being extremely hot to an Enicar Seapearl 600. Yikes!






The guy who made the video, eco8gator, actually sent me a private message. This was before I noticed that he had the same username on the YouTube channel. Informing me about a test he has done, and that the watch had a much higher output than some chest X-Rays. He had one, but sold his because he didn't want it around his kids. I have done the same, for the same reason.


----------



## Joe_A

There is a new thread posted on this subject over at Omega Forums. The title of the thread is:

*Radium - Geiger Counter Measurements
*
It's worth a read.

It may put some folks' minds a little bit at ease.

Edit: After reviewing the above video, I too would stay away from any radium watch with large lume plots such as the subject watch in the video. A point made in the post I refer to above is that most low-end Geiger counters do not distinguish between alpha radiation and gamma radiation, the former being less of a concern than the latter in small doses.

*Types of Ionizing radiation*

Disclaimer: I am only sharing what I have read. One must draw one's own conclusions.


----------



## hns-panama

Speaking of Seapearl 600s, FYI, I bought a crown on eBay that looked a lot like mine. In fact, I am happy to report it was a NOS crown!

Hen's teeth found.

If your Healthways 100 Fathoms or Seapearl 600 needs a new crown or has a replacement, here is your opportunity.

Cheers,

Hunter

Look for it on the Bay.


----------



## Old Navman

I have a few unfortunately not one ESG, Jet Graph or Aqua Graph. Anyway, today I "bumped" into one of the Enicars I have. Just a plain looking Ultrasonic with 25J movement. The watch works but needs some work around the keyless works as it's a bit stiff setting time, plexi change, a decent strap and an ultrasonic clean.


----------



## Freddo_in_Oz

I have had this Ultradive for a while.
I keep hoping I can find an original plexi for it, but have not been able to.
I have similar profile new divers plexis that I could fit, but would appreciate comments from those who know much better than I whether this is a good move or not...
Has anyone replaced the plexi on this model and are there any traps when removing it?

I keep swinging as to whether to keep it or sell it, can't come to a definite conclusion, I do like wearing it.

The bezel crown is pretty worn, but is original. The main crown is a genuine compressor crown but not branded so has been replaced at some time.

The back has suffered the usual gouges from ham fisted attempts to open it and looks like it has been heavily polished.

I do like Enicars but could not say I am up to speed on all the nitty grittys of the various models (years ago I posted pikkies of an AR1010 movement that I converted to an uncased movement pendant watch for my wife)

Thanks,

























John


----------



## MechaMind

Are the scratches on the plexy or are this in material cracks.. minor scratches could be polishes off with soft agent but crack usually go worse due to applied tension during the disassembly process.
If you would be unsure to have a fitting replacement first try to get a scan / measurement in installed state ( within the case) after successful removal check the fitting and so reconstruct the plexy geometrically.. with the gained data you either could search for a replacement or could ask for manufacturing a (quite expensive) one piece off part

As this watch seems to belong to the "Atomic Age" and Enicar is known for their radiating gems .. the inner side of the glass may carry residuals from the dial which can contain hazardous dust. .. That one doing the measurement and contaminating his tools should be aware of this..


----------



## 147 05 01

Perhaps this project is interesting for some Enicar collectors:

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/enicarbook/time-for-a-change-a-book-about-the-lost-watch-bran


----------



## Joe_A

147 05 01 said:


> Perhaps this project is interesting for some Enicar collectors:
> 
> https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/enicarbook/time-for-a-change-a-book-about-the-lost-watch-bran




I'm in!

;-)


----------



## bikehomero

Here is my Jet Graph:


----------



## TheJohnP

Someone already beat me to the punch about the Kickstarter, but here's what the cover for the Time For A Change history of Enicar book looks like.









And one of the pledge levels includes a vintage Sherpa Super-Dive MkIII








I AM NOT AFFILIATED with the project, just raising awareness to fans of the brand.


----------



## mrs_LA

Freddo_in_Oz said:


> I have had this Ultradive for a while.
> I keep hoping I can find an original plexi for it, but have not been able to.
> I have similar profile new divers plexis that I could fit, but would appreciate comments from those who know much better than I whether this is a good move or not...
> Has anyone replaced the plexi on this model and are there any traps when removing it?
> 
> I keep swinging as to whether to keep it or sell it, can't come to a definite conclusion, I do like wearing it.
> 
> The bezel crown is pretty worn, but is original. The main crown is a genuine compressor crown but not branded so has been replaced at some time.
> 
> The back has suffered the usual gouges from ham fisted attempts to open it and looks like it has been heavily polished.
> 
> I do like Enicars but could not say I am up to speed on all the nitty grittys of the various models (years ago I posted pikkies of an AR1010 movement that I converted to an uncased movement pendant watch for my wife)


John, the dial on yours is beautiful. I would maybe leave the switching of the crystal to a professional watchmaker? That dial is really going to be fragile for its age, and it would require plenty of care so as not to dislodge any of the luminous material on there, or chip any portion of the dial.



147 05 01 said:


> Perhaps this project is interesting for some Enicar collectors:
> 
> https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/enicarbook/time-for-a-change-a-book-about-the-lost-watch-bran




Thanks for sharing - very interesting. I wonder why this book wouldn't receive funding from publishers. Enicar S.A. is well known and quite sought after among collectors. Perhaps it may be because of its challenges, as stated by the author?

_...since the watch brand Enicar S.A. went out of business in 1984 and archives were lost, the content of this book can never be 100% factual correct. This is a work of art, design and photography, combined with storytelling._


----------



## kazrich

bikehomero said:


> Here is my Jet Graph:
> 
> View attachment 13940461
> 
> View attachment 13940465
> 
> View attachment 13940469
> 
> View attachment 13940471
> 
> View attachment 13940475


That's a very nice Jet Graph. Well done !


----------



## JimJupiter

Yes, please all support Martijns book, it will be great!

Time to show my latest additions 























Best Nico


----------



## Dan S

JimJupiter said:


> Yes, please all support Martijns book, it will be great!
> 
> Time to show my latest additions


Amazing bezel on the Supertest, Nico. Not something you see every day.


----------



## WengerTodd

JimJupiter said:


> Yes, please all support Martijns book, it will be great!
> 
> Time to show my latest additions
> 
> View attachment 13943277
> 
> 
> Best Nico


I REALLY like this one...


----------



## WengerTodd

JimJupiter said:


> Yes, please all support Martijns book, it will be great!
> 
> Time to show my latest additions
> 
> View attachment 13943277
> 
> 
> Best Nico


I REALLY like this one...


----------



## lelez

Hi to this beautiful group. I need help and I hope you can help me. I'm looking for the glass for my 40mm super-jet enicar. I would like to know if anyone has it, or anyway know the number of acronym I have to look for (pa etc ..). Also I'm also looking for 2 big crowns for my other super dive enicar. Can someone contact me? Also here I would like to know what measures I have to look for for the crowns

Thanks a lot to all!


----------



## o.v.e

Not too long ago there were glasses on sale on ebay. My own watchmaker (until I managed to find an original glas) did put a simple super-flat 36,6mm glas on - it was really only very slightly domed, so that it would actually keep the inner bezel in place, and it did not look too bad. This is just in case You don't find anything else at all. You can see below how it looked.









Please check this seller:
https://www.ebay.de/itm/ENICAR-Watch-Plexi-Glass-For-Jet-Aqua-Super-Graph-Sea-Pearl-Sherpa-Guide/132080259222?hash=item1ec098d096:m:mvQVWl_tums_g_BhsuLbQvg&frcectupt=true


----------



## o.v.e

Attention - Kickstarter campaign for a book about Enicar's history
(sorry, if this has been posted already):

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/enicarbook/time-for-a-change-a-book-about-the-lost-watch-bran?ref=discovery&term=enicar

Please help make it happen!


----------



## Kaspers

I have recently restarted my interest in vintage watches, and I wanted to start out knowing more about the ones in my collection I don't know too much about. I have searched high and low, but can't seem to find much about my Enicar Automatic 340. Anyone who can point me in the right direction  Thanks!!


----------



## Anders911

Hello fellow Enicar-lovers. 
What a truely wonderfull thread!
I recently purchased this, what I think is a 1958 Seapearl - it is stamped 11-58 inside the back.
I have searched the web but found no pictures of a similar watch.
Anyone familiar with this reference?














best regards, Anders911


----------



## Anders911

more pics!


----------



## Anders911

Two more watches (newer ones)
The one with the orange details doesn't seem to be redone - the markings are very sharp-edged. But I didn't find any similar anywhere - is it an Indian?


----------



## o.v.e

Important - if You do love Enicar, please check out this:

https://www.kickstarter.com/project...ange-a-book-about-the-lost-watch-bran?lang=de

Please help make it happen!


----------



## Chasovnik

o.v.e said:


> View attachment 13980555
> 
> 
> Important - if You do love Enicar, please check out this:
> 
> https://www.kickstarter.com/project...ange-a-book-about-the-lost-watch-bran?lang=de
> 
> Please help make it happen!


I've got the same one! I managed to find one NOS a few years back, got it for next to nothing (back before anybody cared about Enicar watches...those were the days...). I've got it now on a Tropic strap with an Enicar buckle, but I also have a sweet BoR, Enicar signed X3 for it too. Sadly, it just doesn't get any wrist time lately.

Cheers,
Jeremy


----------



## Chasovnik

o.v.e said:


> View attachment 13980555
> 
> 
> Important - if You do love Enicar, please check out this:
> 
> https://www.kickstarter.com/project...ange-a-book-about-the-lost-watch-bran?lang=de
> 
> Please help make it happen!


I've got the same one! I managed to find one NOS a few years back, got it for next to nothing (back before anybody cared about Enicar watches...those were the days...). I've got it now on a Tropic strap with an Enicar buckle, but I also have a sweet BoR, Enicar signed X3 for it too. Sadly, it just doesn't get any wrist time lately.

Cheers,
Jeremy

View attachment 14007201


----------



## Chasovnik

Here's a few of my favorites from my small, but growing collection. I can't afford the dual crown super compressors...or the chronos. Some day, I hope to have a big boy collection like some of you on this forum...


----------



## royalenfield

These are sooo nice... time to dig around vintage markets


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## marsavius

Wow!
https://www.ebay.com/itm/ENICAR-SHE...-WATCH-100-GENUINE-NEW-OLD-STOCK/312567764778


----------



## Stigmata

shadey Guide








Sent from my SM-G950F using Tapatalk


----------



## Rajesh Kumar

Please help me to identify this Enicar watch. Thanks in advance.


----------



## kazrich

It's obviously a ladies dress watch. The crown appears too large for it although
it does appear to show the Enicar Saturn logo, although your poor quality pictures
can only make us guess. Absolutely no idea if it left the factory in that case or with the fancy bracelet.
The market for ladies vintage watches is very limited so you are unlikely to find one like it on Google images.
The 'Star Jewels' inscription dates it at mid 1960's ish.


----------



## Shstl

Hey O.V.E please check your direct messages. By the way nice collection!!


----------



## SteveHarris

Recently picked this up.

For those who don't know we've setup a dedicated Enicar forum recently - www.enicarforums.com. Would love to see you and your watches there!


----------



## Joe_A

Steve,

Duly noted.

That is a beautiful Jet Graph, the best I've seen to date.

I don't own any vintage bezel watches because my eyes and my brain are (apparently) incapable of seeing past a banged-up bezel. I literally would not pay $1,000 for a Jochen Rindt 2446 that has been abused . . . so obviously, I will never own one in this lifetime. 

Your watch is stunning!

Cheers,

~ Joe

Just got my late Mark I back from the watchmaker along with a case opening tool to which I have added a handle:









Here is the tool and handle:


----------



## SteveHarris

Thanks Joe. Cracking watch from you too.

Love those and in super condition.

Nice idea with the case removal tool!


----------



## Stigmata

huge lume dots on this mk3 guide!









Sent from my SM-G950F using Tapatalk


----------



## Zec Richardson

Jamie H said:


> Hi all, I was looking for a new watch recently and ran across an Enicar dress watch at a local watch repair. It had originally been brought in for repairs and had been unclaimed for years. I had been given a new crystal, crown, mainspring, and band. After reading most of this amazing thread, I purchased it as most everything seemed to check out. I'm posting pictures of the face, back, and edge, but at this time do not have the tools to operand post a picture of the movement. I'll be returning to the watchmaker to get a chance to do that. The back is inscribed 100/142 LP, and there is a fine inscription on the case between the lugs saying Gold Plated G 10 Microns, and a small logo that I cannot discern.
> 
> My question is that, in all of the pictures I've been able to find online, I haven't seen a detail like this on the bezel, and I've only seen one face that seemed to be textured in a similar way, although that was not a good shot. I'd appreciate your thoughts.
> 
> Thanks,
> Jamie
> 
> View attachment 12425871
> View attachment 12425873


Oh wow. I have the exact same watch that belonged to my dad!
I haven't seen one like it before and today decided to have another search!
Unfortunately the strap was replaced in the 70's and I am trying to find what strap it should have and the crystal (glass) is badly scratched.

So if someone could advise me on what strap to purchase, I would be very grateful!


----------



## tschuls

I'm hooked guys.
got my first Enicar and I think its awesome.
great vintage 70s piece.

I think I have to keep collecting Benicar from now on. 
hope the book will be published soon, so I can get more information about the brand history.

what do you think?
does anyone have more information? caliber? year? etc....

Thank you


----------



## buchnoun

Hi to all, very nice to see such a dedicated enicar enthusiasts here 
I've discovered the brand not so long ago by buying to movement from ebay at a very cheap price. 
One of them is an AR 1010 17 jewels the other one is an automatic 25 jewels which I failed to identify so far.








The thing is I wanted to try servicing the AR1010 which was not working well. I have an ultrasonic cleaning machine
so I stripped down the movement and cleaned all the parts.









Unfortunately while I tried to take picture of the process I'm stuck for the reassembly ! my fault, I've made too many close up
and can't figure out where all the parts goes (I know it's a silly mistake 















I was wondering if someone here has done the same and maybe took pictures of the reassembly and is willing to share
his precious knowledge with? That would help me a lot to know in which order I have to put which part...

Maybe there is a documentation somewhere on the internet but despite my efforts I only found a part list which is not
too much help right now...

Thank you by advance for all the help you can provide
(excuse my english it's not my mother tongue


----------



## xpiotos52

Hi folks, new boy here & looking for some info. Purchased what I hope is an Ocean Pearl but very hard to find info or images relating to this piece. 
Then I found this forum. I think in all my looking I've only seen a couple pieces that are similar. Done a lot of reading here to get my bearings.
I'm hoping I've bought a genuine Enicar as this is my 1st dabble in vintage. You guys seem so knowledgeable , I'm sure you'll put me straight.
A day/date Auto, with what appears to be non wind able , a tricky way to change the date, which I learnt on this forum, 24hr wind to change the day. 
A 36mm case . 18mm lug gap. Hope all this info helps .












Have I got myself the real deal?


----------



## wl1150

Stigmata said:


> shadey Guide
> View attachment 14127777
> 
> 
> Sent from my SM-G950F using Tapatalk


Awesome


----------



## wl1150

Kansas said:


> Got my eagerly-awaited Sherpa Guide which I believe is a mark IV. So far I love it, taking it in to get inspected and cleaned tomorrow.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Gorgeous!


----------



## Doc_152

Scored this post-bankruptcy Enicar on a local auction for cheap. Needs work, but does technically function and keeps time. Needed a new bracelet,gonna try to move the enicar clasp, and its kinda dodgy on the day display. Hangs between days when i wants to.

Not often you see a rolex homage from a "big brand" like Enicar.


----------



## Doc_152

My father gave this Enicar to me about a week ago. Keeps great time, recently serviced and an insane power reserve. I dont know if it was built this way, or someone swapped in parts thst made it run longer, but currently i'm over 50 hours and still runs.


----------



## Hawkes3004

So this is my Jet graph which has just been cleaned by a great guy in Southampton UK after recommendation from another member. If I could find the red pointer insert for the rotating bezel I think I would be a happy man.


----------



## MidnightBeggar

Hadn't checked in on this thread in some time...glad to know it's plugging along


----------



## crazyfist

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## horology_biology

A few of mine

vintageenicar.com


----------



## Tone1298

horology_biology said:


> A few of mine
> 
> vintageenicar.com
> 
> View attachment 15372038
> 
> 
> View attachment 15372039
> 
> 
> View attachment 15372040


Cool!

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## sosa_dos

Some of my Enicars in my collection.





































Sent from my SM-N976V using Tapatalk


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## MidnightBeggar

Another shot of my guide


----------



## jbcollier




----------



## jbcollier

The top and bottom are newly serviced. The middle is a new arrival. I have a better bezel for it and it's now out for a service. Too bad about the extra lume on the hands. Note the barely discernible 33 on the dial. Very happy with that.


----------



## jbcollier




----------



## jbcollier

Wish there were modern designs as interestingly detailed as the Guides.


----------



## jbcollier




----------



## jbcollier

One more Guide?


----------



## jbcollier

Supertest today.


----------



## jbcollier

My first Enicar.


----------



## Russ1965




----------



## jbcollier

Here's another turtle and a Seapearl like the above but with a "Super" movement.


----------



## jbcollier




----------



## Russ1965

A modern vintage:


----------



## Russ1965

And another:


----------



## jbcollier




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## jbcollier




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## jbcollier




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## jbcollier




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## jbcollier




----------



## jbcollier

It has an incorrect, replacement crown. If anyone has a photo of an early Mini-Dive’s crown, I’d be grateful to see it.


----------



## TheCowWatcher

jbcollier said:


> View attachment 15478877


That is an absolute beauty! Hope to get mine fixed soon once I find a competent watchmaker.


----------



## jbcollier

I just love Enicar for their dial designs.


----------



## jbcollier




----------



## 147 05 01

Enicar 980 028


----------



## jbcollier




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## jbcollier




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## jbcollier




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## jbcollier




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## jbcollier




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## jbcollier




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## jbcollier




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## jbcollier




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## jbcollier




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## jbcollier




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## jbcollier




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## jbcollier




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## jbcollier




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## jbcollier




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## jbcollier




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## jbcollier




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## jbcollier




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## jbcollier




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## jbcollier




----------



## jbcollier




----------



## jbcollier




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## jbcollier




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## jbcollier




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## jbcollier




----------



## crazyfist

jbcollier said:


> Here's another turtle and a Seapearl like the above but with a "Super" movement.
> 
> View attachment 15471164


I sold you this one 

Plus a couple more I recognize in your posts. Wear them in good health my friend. 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## jbcollier

Thanks,I will !


----------



## jbcollier




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## jbcollier




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## jbcollier




----------



## RedVee

I am bidding on this as it looks very much like my Dads old watch. 
I'm hoping one of you could tell me an age range and model name ?


----------



## RedVee

RedVee said:


> I am bidding on this as it looks very much like my Dads old watch.
> I'm hoping one of you could tell me an age range and model name ?
> View attachment 15612805


I let sentiment and nostalgia overtake me and ended up buying this. 
From the sellers pictures it has Enicar Ultrasonic antimagnetic 010/036 on the back of the case.
Can anyone suggest an age range and / or model name ?


----------



## RedVee

RedVee said:


> I let sentiment and nostalgia overtake me and ended up buying this.
> From the sellers pictures it has Enicar Ultrasonic antimagnetic 010/036 on the back of the case.
> Can anyone suggest an age range and / or model name ?


Ok, it has arrived and looks even better in person. The seller has thoughtfully out a brand new leather single pass strap on it.

Could anyone advise on how I can date this and identify the model?

Edit: I took a closer look at the sellers photo of the movement.
It looks to have 1010 engraved on it
With maybe a B (or maybe a D) a line below.


----------



## jbcollier

You can find catalogs here:









Brochures & Manuals


On this page I show you some Enicar brochures, manuals and ads I collected over the years. If you have a vintage Enicar advertisement or a brochure you want to share, please contact me. …




enicar101.com





Search and see if you can find a similar watch listed. You could also post here:






Enicar Forums


Forum software by XenForo




enicarforums.com





More photos, especially of the back and movement would help. My inexpert guess would be mid-60s.


----------



## jbcollier




----------



## JimJupiter

RedVee said:


> Ok, it has arrived and looks even better in person. The seller has thoughtfully out a brand new leather single pass strap on it.
> 
> Could anyone advise on how I can date this and identify the model?
> 
> Edit: I took a closer look at the sellers photo of the movement.
> It looks to have 1010 engraved on it
> With maybe a B (or maybe a D) a line below.


Your watch is mid to late 50s. The 1010 was an Antons Shild based movement, before Enicar in 1960 launched there own movements. Unfortunately I don't have catalogs before 1960 yet, so I can't provide a pic with that.

Nico


----------



## RedVee

JimJupiter said:


> Your watch is mid to late 50s. The 1010 was an Antons Shild based movement, before Enicar in 1960 launched there own movements. Unfortunately I don't have catalogs before 1960 yet, so I can't provide a pic with that.
> 
> Nico


Thank you Nico, @JimJupiter . It seems to be running really well. I am beyond pleased atm. I am taking my 72 Seastar in for some work and will ask the watchmaker to open the back for me to take my own photos of the movement and gather the serial number.

If my Dads watch was the same as this, as I think it is (my sisters think it was a similar looking Omega), he had a gold expandable metal strap on his. I am toying with the idea of trying the same style strap. It seems to have been quite the style in the day.

Geoff


----------



## Mirius

RedVee said:


> I am toying with the idea of trying the same style strap. It seems to have been quite the style in the day.
> 
> Geoff


Avoid the one size fits all type with expanding lug filler as they gouge the inside of the lugs.


----------



## allbrainsno

Hi all,

I picked up a 1960's Sherpa Jet GMT from the (ref. 148-35-02) a few months ago and have been wearing it on a leather strap, but I am trying to find more information on whether the watch would have come with a bracelet when it was originally manufactured/sold in the '60s. Does anyone have any information that could assist me? I've seen several Sherpa Jets on BoR (both in pics on this forums, see JB's post from ~2 months ago above, and on original adverts for the watch), but not this specific reference.

Here's an example of my piece, pretty much a dead ringer for what I have (down to the rally GMT hand): 1960s Enicar Sherpa Jet GMT Ref. 148-35-02


----------



## 147 05 01

According to the brochure , the Sherpa Jet 148 35 02







was delivered on a simple black leather strap.


----------



## Tooslow

My only enicar. I like it quite a bit.


----------



## Neke

Todays find


----------



## RedVee

I wore my Enicar as I took my Tissot SeaStar into the watchmaker for a service and surgery on the date wheel.

I gave him a look and I told him I bought it because it looked very much like my dads old watch. He suggested the Enicar may even be mid to late 40’s. He had a little tray of Enicar bits including another AR1010 movement.

Anyway, he says to me that Enicar was known as a “hot” (stolen goods) brand in the day. He went on to tell me they came in on the ships for the wharfies to on-sell. (Wharfies are dock workers, stevedores).
Did your Dad know any wharfies? No idea I said, but he lived for a while in Alexandria (inner city Sydney), 2 doors up from the pub. He then says he probably bought it in the pub.

I thought it was a funny story anyway.


----------



## jbcollier




----------



## lhanddds




----------



## Koura

Hi,
A desk find, my dad's old Enicar Ocean pearl automatic.
Crown missing and hoping to find the correct measurements from you guys...
Also, I haven't seen one like this anywhere so other info would be highly appreciated!


----------



## Tickclic

I have 2 of these 1956 Enicar Seapearl 600.
The one with the intact loom on the hands came from estate the original owner. It's going in for servicing very soon.
It is one of the watches tested by the US Navy at the time to be considered as their issued dive watch.

This one didn't make it, no movable bezel. Rolex didnt either as too expensive. They went with Blancplain. Don't know how long this was the US Navy issued dive watch for their Frogmen. I found an article about this on the internet.


----------



## jbcollier

Seapearls can be very confusing. Here's one with "Seapearl" only on the back but in a compressor case. I like the patinated dial. Others may feel otherwise ;-)


----------



## jbcollier




----------



## ghce

Old thread revival time again.

I loved the OP Crazyfists initial post especially regards to Chinese culture back in the day though I must admit not much has changed in the last 50 years, still the same marital requirements though the game is a bit tougher these days, a bicycle just wont cut it any more lol.
Here are some examples of the stated brands though the first 2, the Roamer and the Enicar would never have made it to China at 25 and 44 jewels respectively as who could afford them! Well these 2 examples anyway however the 3rd one, the Titoni actually is a Beijing watch though at a much later time frame, even so the owner wouldn't have been worried by the requirement of a bicycle, if you could afford this watch a bike would not even be in your vocabulary and indeed you probably owned more than one apartment.










The Enicar which I just got back from my WM today as I only bought it last week is a high grade 25 Jewel AR1010B cal manual wind Ultrasonic and I would say its pretty rare, it looks even nicer inside with it gold flashed movement.
The photo looks a bit harsh in the lighting conditions I took it under, it looks much nicer in the flesh.










106 pages to this thread, It will take me a while to digest it all!


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## RedVee

ghce said:


> Old thread revival time again.
> 
> I loved the OP Crazyfists initial post especially regards to Chinese culture back in the day though I must admit not much has changed in the last 50 years, still the same marital requirements though the game is a bit tougher these days, a bicycle just wont cut it any more lol.
> Here are some examples of the stated brands though the first 2, the Roamer and the Enicar would never have made it to China at 25 and 44 jewels respectively as who could afford them! Well these 2 examples anyway however the 3rd one, the Titoni actually is a Beijing watch though at a much later time frame, even so the owner wouldn't have been worried by the requirement of a bicycle, if you could afford this watch a bike would not even be in your vocabulary and indeed you probably owned more than one apartment.
> 
> View attachment 15947340
> 
> 
> The Enicar which I just got back from my WM today as I only bought it last week is a high grade 25 Jewel AR1010B cal manual wind Ultrasonic and I would say its pretty rare, it looks even nicer inside with it gold flashed movement.
> The photo looks a bit harsh in the lighting conditions I took it under, it looks much nicer in the flesh.
> 
> View attachment 15947343
> 
> 
> 106 pages to this thread, It will take me a while to digest it all!


Congrats on the Enicar, my one says g'day


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## ghce

RedVee said:


> Congrats on the Enicar, my one says g'day
> 
> View attachment 15949769


That looks very nice indeed.

I received 2 of them from the same seller, a 21 Jewel in rough condition and the 25 Jewel in cosmetically better condition, unfortunately I had to rob the balance and balance bridge from the 21 jewel to get the 25 back to spec though I will keep an eye out for another movement to see if I can get the 21 up and running too.

These look really nice on your wrist and are so slim.

I have a couple of Enicar automatic star jewels sea pearls also but these manual wind ones were quite a surprise to me and look even nicer, the new fully serviced manual wind is running extremely accurately possibly even COSC standard but I haven't had it back from my Watchmaker long enough to make that call yet.


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## RedVee

ghce said:


> That looks very nice indeed.
> 
> I received 2 of them from the same seller, a 21 Jewel in rough condition and the 25 Jewel in cosmetically better condition, unfortunately I had to rob the balance and balance bridge from the 21 jewel to get the 25 back to spec though I will keep an eye out for another movement to see if I can get the 21 up and running too.
> 
> These look really nice on your wrist and are so slim.
> 
> I have a couple of Enicar automatic star jewels sea pearls also but these manual wind ones were quite a surprise to me and look even nicer, the new fully serviced manual wind is running extremely accurately possibly even COSC standard but I haven't had it back from my Watchmaker long enough to make that call yet.


I saw another 25 jewel come up on eBay locally (Five Dock in Sydney I think) at a good price and looking very nice.
The watchmaker I use was quite aware of the watches and movement when I showed him. 
My one seems close to perfect in running as far as I can tell. Only thing is I'm not sure what the power reserve should be, I seem to get around 28 hours. That is workable, how does
yours do?

Also, I ordered that Enicar book last week so I'm looking forward to that. Hope to find this little beauty in there somewhere.


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## ghce

RedVee said:


> I saw another 25 jewel come up on eBay locally (Five Dock in Sydney I think) at a good price and looking very nice.
> The watchmaker I use was quite aware of the watches and movement when I showed him.
> My one seems close to perfect in running as far as I can tell. Only thing is I'm not sure what the power reserve should be, I seem to get around 28 hours. That is workable, how does
> yours do?
> 
> Also, I ordered that Enicar book last week so I'm looking forward to that. Hope to find this little beauty in there somewhere.


I haven't timed mine yet for power reserve but looking at Ranfft site it says a 42 hour power reserve for this movement bidfun-db Archive: Watch Movements: Enicar 1010
I expect mine will do that as it's just had a full service. Normally I tend to run them for a full week first to see what the accuracy is like and I am about 5 days into that now and still less than 30 seconds out from getting it back from my WM.

There seems to be a range of different grades for these and looking at the finishing detail and the gold flash I would say mine ( and probably yours is a high grade movement, likely chronometer grade. Looking thru other Enicar watches where this same base movement is used they dont have any where near the finishing detail of this ie plain unplated unmachined every day workers watches.


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## Datreedude

My Enicar find of the day....









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## jbcollier




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## RedVee

My book arrived. Just had a quick flick through it - looking good. I’ll be getting stuck in soon.


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## jbcollier




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## crazyfist

jbcollier said:


> View attachment 15973024
> 
> 
> View attachment 15973025












Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## TheCowWatcher

Back from a proper service. 1950s Enicar Ultrasonic. Enjoy!


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## MidnightBeggar

Have been missing an Enicar in my lineup ever since I decided to part with my Sherpa Guide. This Super-Dive really grabbed me and I'm enjoying wearing it even more than the Guide. Enicar offered such wonderfully eclectic models that it's really just about finding a style and look that works for you. With this piece, I'm also trying an Erika's Original MN band... just seemed like a cool and different choice. It's tons of fun to wear, I love looking at it, and it really gives a look I just don't find with my other treasured watches.


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## jbcollier

It's an Enicar Jim, but not as we know it&#8230;


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## jbcollier

Been a while. Bit beat up and I have noticed so far a later indicator ring and seconds hand.


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## _MrTree_

Hi all,

is anyone up to give me a hand with my Enicar “quest”?









A difficult ENICAR purchase, almost a quest!


Hi all, I’m after a specific Enicar reference. It’s been years actually... Just now I’ve finally identified which dial matches my search. As many know Enicar pushed out lots of different dials in the Sixties... it’s this one, attached. Enicar Ultrasound Ref. 1000-11 P It was my grandfather’s...




www.watchuseek.com


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## avivalasvegas

Greetings all,

New Sherpa Graph owner here. I've always dreamt of owning a Sherpa Graph but always was beyond my means. Recently, an opportunity to purchase a MK3 came up and I jumped at it. I hope I did well? I thought I'd request thoughts from experienced owners about my most recent purchase here:









Enicar Sherpa Graph - A grail watch purchase. Any...


Just agreed to purchase this Sherpa Graph. Would love any thoughts on condition from other Sherpa Graph owners.




www.watchuseek.com





Many thanks!


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## jbcollier

Finally bought a digital watch!


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## Phaila

Hi, I just found this enicar. Is it common or a nice one? Thanks


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## jbcollier

Time for a dress watch:


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## jbcollier

Phaila, they are good watches but not particularly rare. Just search the model number 167-01-32.


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## DaleEArnold

Early Divers have Unusual Dials and Hands...Divers have a following and have a Great History..Take a look on the Web regarding Seapearl 600 and the tests performed by the S Navy on using Seapearl,Blancpain and Rolex..Very Interesting reading!


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## jbcollier




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## ghce

Phaila said:


> Hi, I just found this enicar. Is it common or a nice one? Thanks
> View attachment 16176934
> View attachment 16176935



Looks nice but with that colour scheme and dial look I would be thinking its from an Indian seller off of ebay however Enicar do have some unusual watches in their past.


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## ghce

I have bought 3 Enicars this week, ones at my WM now for a service, the other is in the post but the 3rd one is only a case, back, lens with no dial movement or crown but the stainless steel case is in such good condition I would like to restore a movement and dial to it but cant see any available at the moment the model is a 120/006 manaul wind which originally came with an AR1120 25 jewel movement.
Any one got one of these movements and dial kicking around that they want to sell on?

Cheers


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## Vontura

jbcollier said:


> View attachment 16181526


Fantastic condition! Don‘t see such a beautiful one that often.


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## Joe_A

I've got this one on the way in . . .












Perhaps a couple additional snapshots when it arrives.

Written about here:









Sweden’s Apollo Program: The Salvage of the Kings Ship Vasa in 1961


Some time ago a nice guy from Sweden came into contact with me, who wanted to know more about his Sherpa Graph watch. We had a nice talk, especially over the hands of his Sherpa Graph MK Ia which h…




enicar101.com





Cheers,

Joe


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## bzr

Glad I found this thread. I see Enicar stalls everywhere when I'm in China, and since my grandfather was a watchmaker, he likely worked on these (as well as Titus and Titoni). I picked this Sherpa Guide a few weeks ago—it was previously serviced, but I'm taking it to my watchmaker this week just to be sure.


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## ghce

bzr said:


> Glad I found this thread. I see Enicar stalls everywhere when I'm in China, and since my grandfather was a watchmaker, he likely worked on these (as well as Titus and Titoni). I picked this Sherpa Guide a few weeks ago—it was previously serviced, but I'm taking it to my watchmaker this week just to be sure.
> 
> View attachment 16244328


Nice find!,
Must look out for some when I am in China next.
Have been on an Enicar spree the last week buying and servicing 2 of them, more to come I am sure.
Here are the 2 from last week.


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## Joe_A

After a longish trip from Stockholm, my new-to-me Sherpa Graph Mark Ia - May of 1960 watch - finally made its way to its new home:










Color above is accurate - yes my shirt is _THAT_ ^ shade of green - and as one can see, the watch is much more attractive than the photos from the auction house would indicate as seen in an earlier post.

The base color of the dial is a mildly reflective metallic mid-gray pewter color and not flat in appearance as it ppears in many photographs.
The tachymetre scale is light silver and is textured and wider than on the later Graphs.

I have been asked whether the hour markers are painted black?

The alloy of steel used by Enicar for this reference appears to be a polished but blackened steel alloy. As one wears the watch and moves with it, the hour markers pick up light and appear to sparkle. The markers themselves are faceted - shaped like an inverted V, so when you look at them dead-on, the light is reflected away to the side and so they appear dark.

The Enicar logo is made of the same metal. Above it seems to be black, but see below:











With the light hitting it - and you - at the right angle, the logo lights up silver.

The effect is somewhat as seen with blued hands where they seem black often, but pop to a vibrant blue when the light strikes at a favorable angle of incidence.

Here are a couple of early shots. I'll put up a video when I have an opportunity. Only a video of the moving watch will capture the reflectivity of the dial composition.



















Cheers!

~ Joe


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## ghce

Joe_A said:


> After a longish trip from Stockholm, my new-to-me Sherpa Graph Mark Ia - May of 1960 watch - finally made its way to its new home:
> 
> View attachment 16286300
> 
> 
> Color above is accurate - yes my shirt is _THAT_ ^ shade of green - and as one can see, the watch is much more attractive than the photos from the auction house would indicate as seen in an earlier post.
> 
> The base color of the dial is a mildly reflective metallic mid-gray pewter color and not flat in appearance as it ppears in many photographs.
> The tachymetre scale is light silver and is textured and wider than on the later Graphs.
> 
> I have been asked whether the hour markers are painted black?
> 
> The alloy of steel used by Enicar for this reference appears to be a polished but blackened steel alloy. As one wears the watch and moves with it, the hour markers pick up light and appear to sparkle. The markers themselves are faceted - shaped like an inverted V, so when you look at them dead-on, the light is reflected away to the side and so they appear dark.
> 
> The Enicar logo is made of the same metal. Above it seems to be black, but see below:
> 
> 
> View attachment 16286319
> 
> 
> With the light hitting it - and you - at the right angle, the logo lights up silver.
> 
> The effect is somewhat as seen with blued hands where they seem black often, but pop to a vibrant blue when the light strikes at a favorable angle of incidence.
> 
> Here are a couple of early shots. I'll put up a video when I have an opportunity. Only a video of the moving watch will capture the reflectivity of the dial composition.
> 
> View attachment 16286335
> 
> 
> View attachment 16286337
> 
> 
> Cheers!
> 
> ~ Joe


I like your other Sherpa even better but this is nice too.


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## ghce

Just got this one back from my WM 20 minutes ago.
All I had was the case, glass and caseback, luckily he had the correct movement and dial for the reference a 25 jewel manual wind, unfortunately not the original crown but I will find one later.
Well pleased with this result as the stainless case was as close to new as you will ever find for a used unpolished case and far to good to go to scrap.

Another Enicar rescued!!

later on this week I will have another rescued Enicar to show that needed a new case, just waiting on the correct metal backed glass, the preview today with a new glass fitted was amazing, stunning and a joy to see, can't wait to get it in my collection.


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## Joe_A

What can I say? I'm enamored with this one at the moment. 










Edit: Replaced over-saturated shot.


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## ghce

Joe_A said:


> What can I say? I'm enamored with this one at the moment.
> 
> View attachment 16295068


It is certainly a stunner, you are a lucky man, they never turn up in this part of the world. Enicar didn't seem to have much of a sales base here in New Zealand as opposed to Asia and Europe where the brand was more prevalent.

I seem to have snaffled up 6 or 7 of them now from the local NZ market but they are getting harder to find and the pricing from when I got my first till now which is only about 3 years has more than quadrupled and the available pieces are far from show pieces when they do come up.


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## Jimbo85281

My favorite pickups of the year. Both 1967, only 1 month apart.
















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## Joe_A

Nice pick-ups!


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## jbcollier




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## jbcollier




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## ghce

This just back from my WM today.
lots of work and money but the result is stunning.


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## jbcollier

Finally found a Mk1 Guide. Needs work but I’m very happy indeed:


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## jbcollier

Polished the crystal and it looks much better!


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## RTK-WGM

Each of us has our own altar!





































I love Enicar watches.


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## DaleEArnold

Picked these up over the last month...ENICAR ,So Unusual and Unique....


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## RTK-WGM

*Show off your gadgets!!!*


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## BPoindexter

ghce said:


> I like your other Sherpa even better but this is nice too.
> 
> View attachment 16294814


Are these NOS Sherpas? They look FABULOUS. How does one go about finding in such good shape? Anything to it other than persistence / a good dealer?


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## DaleEArnold

Got this a few weeks ago...Returned from the Watchmaker adjusted and operating fine...

ENICARS make GREAT Collectables..Affordable and Very Unusual..


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## avivalasvegas

Enicar Sherpa Super Jet was a GMT watch that was marketed by Enicar to airline pilots, airline staff, and travellers, during the dawn of the Jet Age 1950's-1960's when improvements in commercial aviation technology led to increased world travel.

Enicar's Sherpa Jet series of watches competed directly with Rolex's GMT Master which was the official watch for Pan Am pilots whom often needed to track two separate time zones. The solution Rolex developed was to make an additional GMT hand which made a rotation every 24 hours (instead of 12 hours) and a 24 hour bezel which could be rotated to the corresponding GMT hand in order to track a second time zone.

Unlike Rolex which only had a single model, Enicar produced an entire series of GMT tool watches for Pilots and travellers which included the Sherpa Guide, Jet Graph, Sherpa Super Jet, Sherpa Jet, Steward, Stewardess, Sherpa Guide, and World Time models. Enicar's GMT watches became the official watch line for Japan Airlines, SAS, Swiss Air in the 1960's & early 70's.

In addition, Enicar produced all of its own movements in-house and was similar to a vertically integrated company (like Apple Inc.) in that they did not source their movements and watch components through 3rd parties like Rolex, Patek, and many other manufacturers at that time. Although Rolex is now considered a vertically integrated company, it only became so in 1990's after they began slowly purchasing their suppliers like Aegler (movements) and Gay Frères (bracelets).

Several models also used EPSA (Ervin Piquerez S.A.) 2-crown compressor cases made for deep sea diving and could be used underwater up to 600 ft. The early Rolex GMT Master models (6542, 1675) made from 1954-1980 were only capable of being waterproof up to 50 ft as an example.

All in all, Enicar's Sherpa Jet/Super Jet models were as good if not superior to Rolex's GMT Master but whose legacy was forgotten after the company folded and faded into obscurity in the 80's.

*Replicated from the Enicar Forums


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## jbcollier

I’m travelling but my son opened the package and it started ticking with just a few wrist swishes. It has so much patina I can enjoy it as a driving and riding watch.


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## Old Navman

jbcollier said:


> I’m travelling but my son opened the package and it started ticking with just a few wrist swishes. It has so much patina I can enjoy it as a driving and riding watch.


Good pick up, the dial appears to have some issues but I'm sure with a bit of TLC things can be spruced up.

Edit: Early 1960's Mark I Guide? with crescent 24 hr pointer. It looks like the original bracelet too which is always a bonus.


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## jbcollier

Patinated? Or, detonated!










I love it.


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## jbcollier

Another “user grade” super compressor…


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## Joe_A

Just today, I was privileged to add a new addition to my small collection of Enicar Sherpa Graph watches:

In the sunlight . . .










Under indoor lighting conditions:










Manufactured in November of 1961, a Sherpa Graph "Gray & White" retrospectively referred to as a Mark Ib.

This is a reference worn by Jim Clark:

Information here:









The correct reference of Jim Clarks Sherpa Graph


Almost every month we see at least two or three Sherpa Graph watches for sale, that are offered as “Jim Clark”. Of course we know of the connection between Jim Clark and Enicar, but doe…




enicar101.com





and here:









Jim Clark e l’Enicar Sherpa Graph.


Intorno al 1958 la ENICAR entro’prepotentemente nel mondo del motorsport sponsorizzando il grande Stirling Moss,e il motociclista Geoff Duke,iniziando una massiccia promozione dei suoi modell…




boldwatches.wordpress.com


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## CRS Delaware

WatchFred said:


> Don, here's an Enicar R92 that should help you with your search for the correct hands. watch was serviced by Craig Bergsma of chronodeco.com in Oregon; Craig does not like his prices to be discussed publicly, but they are very, very fair consideringt the quality and reliability of his work.
> 
> Andreas Gregoriades of Localtime Cyprus is also a very nice and reliable person, I see no reason at all you would not see your watch again, I know nobody I'd consider more trustworthy and shipping risks are realistically minimal.


Hi Can anyone give a me a time frame for when this watch was manufactured? I've had one for 50 years and no one has been able to date it exactly. Any help would be appreciated!


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## jbcollier

My grail watch just arrived. First time I have ever seen one outside of an Enicar brochure.


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## jbcollier

Looked for a Mk1 Guide for quite a while. Then, suddenly, I had three. One is nicely patinated so a good “driver”. Just got this early Mk1 with a silver dial back from the watch maker today…


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## Bevix

Just got this beauty in the mail today. The aftermarket bracelet works well with it, I think.


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## jbcollier

Got my “user” Super Dive back from an overhaul. Runs like a top!


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## gtawest

Hi, I recently picked this Sherpa 320 up locally and wondered if anyone could help me with its authenticity. Now I’ve got the bug to find one of the earlier Sherpas! Thanks


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## -bauhaus-

Hey everyone! I was at an antique shop today and found an Enicar Ultrasonic 21 jewel, looked identical to this one (but dial in better condition): ENICAR AUTOMATIC ULTRASONIC WATCH 100/145 #1797 Gave it a couple of turns on the crown and it started running, so I assume it's in working order.

Anyone know much about this model? Worth grabbing?


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## sazabi2001

My first and only Enicar at the moment, possibly not the ones you’re talking about here, but it’s an Enicar nonetheless. Very basic 6 jewels cylinder movement , possibly a version of AS 10.5” movement. Not entirely sure the age but it looks like some of the earliest watches of this brand.




















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## jbcollier




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