# Citizen 200m BN0220-16E



## 1386paul

The watch arrived yesterday, delivered in 4 days to my door here in Australia from Sakura Watches Japan. 
First impressions of the watch is the case finish, reminds me of a sandblasted effect which works well with the look and feel of the watch. The case is 46mm x 48mm excluding the crown with a 60 click bezel. The strap is soft with a nice laser etched buckle, and includes the dive extension the lug width is 24mm.
Cheers Paul


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## sheepdog812

Congrats! Enjoy in good health!


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## 1386paul

As an option I swapped out the rubber strap for a bead blasted 24mm bracelet.


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## Ticktocker

That's quite the case! I love it. That bracelet really should be standard issue for this watch. It really finishes off the whole look of the watch.


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## tsteph12

Straight up bad ass. Enjoy.


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## 2500M_Sub

Congrats the watch looks great, enjoy!!!

Regards

Ren


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Lepdiggums

Congratulations 1386paul, Thank-you for the super informative post!!! Looks awesome, I can't wait to see it on a regular basis 🤩👍


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## Lepdiggums

1386paul said:


> As an option I swapped out the rubber strap for a bead blasted 24mm bracelet.


Total awesomeness!!!!!!😁👍who did you pick up the bracelet from??? Totally amazingly quick shipping too!!


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## 1386paul

Lepdiggums said:


> Total awesomeness!!!!!!who did you pick up the bracelet from??? Totally amazingly quick shipping too!!


Hi mate the bracelet is a 24mm bead blasted option from Watchadoo.
These are no longer available, the seller does not offer these now they where a popular aftermarket option going back 5-10 years they where available in brushed, polished and bead blasted in sizes from 18 - 24mm.
I've been using this one on my Titanium Ecozilla with adaptors for years.
Cheers Paul.


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## Lepdiggums

1386paul said:


> Hi mate the bracelet is a 24mm bead blasted option from Watchadoo.
> These are no longer available, the seller does not offer these now they where a popular aftermarket option going back 5-10 years they where available in brushed, polished and bead blasted in sizes from 18 - 24mm.
> I've been using this one on my Titanium Ecozilla with adaptors for years.
> Cheers Paul.


Always the way ???thanks Paul. Enjoy your new monster ??


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## boy_wonder

Looks great, Congratulations on the new purchase. Am torn between buying discounted from Japan and paying the tax or waiting for it to hopefully hit the UK. Though it'll probably not be discounted. 
How does it wear, comfortable with those dimensions?
I had a ti ecozilla that wore well, the lighter weighted over its steel brother made it comfortable despite the size.


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## 1386paul

boy_wonder said:


> Looks great, Congratulations on the new purchase. Am torn between buying discounted from Japan and paying the tax or waiting for it to hopefully hit the UK. Though it'll probably not be discounted.
> How does it wear, comfortable with those dimensions?
> I had a ti ecozilla that wore well, the lighter weighted over its steel brother made it comfortable despite the size.


Its very comfortable to wear, it only weighs 90 grams on the rubber strap. Your average stainless watch bracelet weighs more on its own.


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## CitizenPromaster

Congratulations! It looks awesome. I don't think it can tempt me to break my "no dive watches" policy, but if I were to break that policy, this would be a top contender haha

An original 1300m for the price of this 200m homage would make me change my policy though ;-)

For those that didn't read the other thread, this watch is a homage to this watch from 1982:


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## davinator65

Nice bit of hardware there...


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## CitizenPromaster

You can really see that the bezel is Duratect TIC and the case is Duratect MRK.


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## CitizenPromaster

Most non-JDM Citizen watches are made in China and Thailand these days, and even this watch that is also sold in Japan is no exception, but notice how they omit this "CASED IN CHINA" information on Citizen.jp:


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## NC_Hager626

Very nice. I like the bead blasted case. Plus, the bead blasted complements the casing very well. Enjoy your new addition to your collection.


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## tsteph12

CitizenPromaster said:


> Most non-JDM Citizen watches are made in China and Thailand these days, and even this watch that is also sold in Japan is no exception, but notice how they omit this "CASED IN CHINA" information on Citizen.jp:
> View attachment 16009780


Here is a borrowed photo from Ebay seller in Singapore that shows caseback.


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## composer

Congrats Paul, what a beast of a diver! Never seen this model before. With all of Seiko's QC issues, I am looking into Citizen since they have better QC.


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## Simpleman1007

WOW! Great looking watch. congrats and enjoy!


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## CitizenPromaster

tsteph12 said:


> Here is a borrowed photo from Ebay seller in Singapore that shows caseback.
> 
> View attachment 16009900


Interesting, produced in the same month (16 = June 2021) and in the same factory (center digit = 5), but it doesn't say CASED IN CHINA.


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## 1386paul

CitizenPromaster said:


> Interesting, produced in the same month (16 = June 2021) and in the same factory (center digit = 5), but it doesn't say CASED IN CHINA.


This has opened a can of worms


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## CitizenPromaster

1386paul said:


> This has opened a can of worms


Well I've been trying to make sense of the serial numbers for a while now, and I've painted a pretty clear picture, but in this case the matter gets complicated by different rules for different countries regarding MADE IN JAPAN / JAPAN MOV'T / CASED IN XXXX.
My findings are here: Decoding the mordern Citizen Serial number for Date of Manuafacture? | WatchUSeek Watch Forums 
I'd like to use the picture of your caseback there if that's OK with you.


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## 1386paul

CitizenPromaster said:


> Well I've been trying to make sense of the serial numbers for a while now, and I've painted a pretty clear picture, but in this case the matter gets complicated by different rules for different countries regarding MADE IN JAPAN / JAPAN MOV'T / CASED IN XXXX.
> My findings are here: Decoding the mordern Citizen Serial number for Date of Manuafacture? | WatchUSeek Watch Forums
> I'd like to use the picture of your caseback there if that's OK with you.


Sure no problem


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## Chidling

Hello Paul
May I abuse your thread to post some pics of my BN0220?

I received it this week and am very impressed. I started calling it "Pattypan" 
This is exactly THE watch I was looking for for several months. I wanted some (preferably diver's) Citizen with Eco-Drive, titanium case and original look with clear legible dial and long enough minute hand. I wasn't able to find one, until I discovered this homage to 1300m professional diver. Ordered at sakurawatches.com, arrived in Czechia in 4 days by DHL.










It is my second Citizen (I have also NY0040) and first titanium watch. It looks very juicy, the case perfectly fits my 17,5cm wrist and the bezel has great grip. The motion of the bezel isn't very definite, I would prefer more ratchet clicking. But together with small drowned date window, this is the only criticism I can have. Although I have seen several pics of pieces with uneven chapter rings, my piece is pretty aligned and the second hand exactly hits the markers. The original rubber strap is very good - soft and comfy, much better than the basic Citizen straps with N.D. limits.



















I like Paul's combination with watchadoo bracelet. I used the khaki nylon strap as an alternative.










Here is my caseback for the CitizenPromaster's research. Japan mov't, cased in China. The caseback could have been decorated with some engraving. Diver's helmet or Promaster logo would be appreciated.










I fell in love with my Pattypan and believe it will amuse me for a long time


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## USMC0311

Chidling said:


> Hello Paul
> May I abuse your thread to post some pics of my BN0220?
> 
> I received it this week and am very impressed. I started calling it "Pattypan"
> This is exactly THE watch I was looking for for several months. I wanted some (preferably diver's) Citizen with Eco-Drive, titanium case and original look with clear legible dial and long enough minute hand. I wasn't able to find one, until I discovered this homage to 1300m professional diver. Ordered at sakurawatches.com, arrived in Czechia in 4 days by DHL.
> 
> View attachment 16065606
> 
> 
> It is my second Citizen (I have also NY0040) and first titanium watch. It looks very juicy, the case perfectly fits my 17,5cm wrist and the bezel has great grip. The motion of the bezel isn't very definite, I would prefer more ratchet clicking. But together with small drowned date window, this is the only criticism I can have. Although I have seen several pics of pieces with uneven chapter rings, my piece is pretty aligned and the second hand exactly hits the markers. The original rubber strap is very good - soft and comfy, much better than the basic Citizen straps with N.D. limits.
> 
> View attachment 16065608
> 
> 
> View attachment 16065609
> 
> 
> I like Paul's combination with watchadoo bracelet. I used the khaki nylon strap as an alternative.
> 
> View attachment 16065614
> 
> 
> Here is my caseback for the CitizenPromaster's research. Japan mov't, cased in China. The caseback could have been decorated with some engraving. Diver's helmet or Promaster logo would be appreciated.
> 
> View attachment 16065617
> 
> 
> I fell in love with my Pattypan and believe it will amuse me for a long time
> 
> View attachment 16065619


What a Tank of a watch! I'm intrigued.


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## 1386paul

Chidling said:


> Hello Paul
> May I abuse your thread to post some pics of my BN0220?
> 
> I received it this week and am very impressed. I started calling it "Pattypan"
> This is exactly THE watch I was looking for for several months. I wanted some (preferably diver's) Citizen with Eco-Drive, titanium case and original look with clear legible dial and long enough minute hand. I wasn't able to find one, until I discovered this homage to 1300m professional diver. Ordered at sakurawatches.com, arrived in Czechia in 4 days by DHL.
> 
> View attachment 16065606
> 
> 
> It is my second Citizen (I have also NY0040) and first titanium watch. It looks very juicy, the case perfectly fits my 17,5cm wrist and the bezel has great grip. The motion of the bezel isn't very definite, I would prefer more ratchet clicking. But together with small drowned date window, this is the only criticism I can have. Although I have seen several pics of pieces with uneven chapter rings, my piece is pretty aligned and the second hand exactly hits the markers. The original rubber strap is very good - soft and comfy, much better than the basic Citizen straps with N.D. limits.
> 
> View attachment 16065608
> 
> 
> View attachment 16065609
> 
> 
> I like Paul's combination with watchadoo bracelet. I used the khaki nylon strap as an alternative.
> 
> View attachment 16065614
> 
> 
> Here is my caseback for the CitizenPromaster's research. Japan mov't, cased in China. The caseback could have been decorated with some engraving. Diver's helmet or Promaster logo would be appreciated.
> 
> View attachment 16065617
> 
> 
> I fell in love with my Pattypan and believe it will amuse me for a long time
> 
> View attachment 16065619


Nice pictures, I like the first picture showing the watch wet makes the titanium look a lot darker. I think your strap option really suit the watch well.


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## 2500M_Sub

Dang that watch looks great, trying to be patient and wait until it hits the US, but its getting tough. Congrats on that beast.

Regards,

Ren


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## Chidling

Thank you, guys.
As you said, Paul, the surface of the watch gets darker, when immersed in water.

The NATO strap suits the watch , but needless to say, this is not very "nylon strap friendly" case. There is not much space for the strap and sharp corner intercepts threading the strap through the lugs. I had to remove the spring bars, attach the strap and then insert the spring bars using small amount of force. And I have some thin NATO. Can't imagine using some heavy duty ZULU (to be tested, however I don't have 24mm).



















So this was purely informative and now let's enjoy the nice view on the Patty Pan


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## Chidling

As promised, I tested 22mm heavy duty ZULU strap during the weekend. Little bit tricky to install it, but it holds firmly and I think it is pretty wearable. The clearance isnt very annoying thanks to lugless design.
I would say it looks better with 22mm strap. In my opinion, Citizen should have done lug width 22mm.
The only thing which irrites me is the bezel action. It rotates very smoothly and very often I find it outside of the basic position. Do you also experience this?


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## TheBrownHope

2500M_Sub said:


> Dang that watch looks great, trying to be patient and wait until it hits the US, but its getting tough. Congrats on that beast.
> 
> Regards,
> 
> Ren


Why not try Sakura? I emailed Kota and he said more stock just came in. But said they've been selling out fast.


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## TheBrownHope

Chidling said:


> The only thing which irrites me is the bezel action. It rotates very smoothly and very often I find it outside of the basic position. Do you also experience this?


Yup, the bezel is pretty easy to turn... takes little effort really. Haven't really made contact with anything for it to happen but I would imagine if you slept with it on or something you'd wake up and that pip would not be at 0 😄

Question, has anyone tried an Isofrane or similar on the BN0220? Wondering if there is enough clearance for it to fit. Obviously need to use thinner springbars.


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## 2500M_Sub

TheBrownHope said:


> Why not try Sakura? I emailed Kota and he said more stock just came in. But said they've been selling out fast.


I really want to see them in the flesh so to speak, I am not a fan of the gold accents and was hoping I could do the blue, but from photos it seems the black dial gold accents is the way to go. So want to see them In person before I decide.

Regards

Ren

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Chidling

The gold accents are so nice!


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## Robotaz

TheBrownHope said:


> Yup, the bezel is pretty easy to turn... takes little effort really. Haven't really made contact with anything for it to happen but I would imagine if you slept with it on or something you'd wake up and that pip would not be at 0
> 
> Question, has anyone tried an Isofrane or similar on the BN0220? Wondering if there is enough clearance for it to fit. Obviously need to use thinner springbars.


I wear a Borealis fake Iso on mine because it's softer, but yes an Iso will fit fine. I think when you see and feel how flat this watch is that you'll probably be like me and want a strap that's thinner and lighter. My fake Iso kinda takes away from how light, flat, and comfortable the watch is.

Unlike Chidling, I find the stock strap to be very tough, inflexible, and uncomfortable, also taking away from previously mentioned positive traits of the watch. Some may love it.


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## Klesk

2500M_Sub said:


> I really want to see them in the flesh so to speak, I am not a fan of the gold accents and was hoping I could do the blue, but from photos it seems the black dial gold accents is the way to go. So want to see them In person before I decide.


I'm not a fan of the gold either. On the Citizen press release, there is a picture of the original 1300m watch from 1982 and it looks like the bezel has white markings with some touches of color on the dial and hands. If the new watch replicated the look of the original I would have jumped on it immediately; as it stands, I will have to see one in person to decided if the gold really bothers me.


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## Chidling

The golden accents of BN0220 look even better during the so called Golden Hour, when the Sun is setting.
Btw. the real color of the bezel paintings and dial wrtitings isn't very yelow. It's closer to brown, like honey or mustard.


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## Robotaz

I wasn't sure if I'd like the gold, but now wouldn't change a thing.

Looks very vintage to me and I like it. But, admittedly Seiko gold accents have been growing on me a lot in recent years.


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## Pee Dee

Just got mine from Sakura so I thought I'd share my thoughts and experience so far:

- My example had a severely misaligned chapter ring. Didn't expect that from Citizen but it was too much to ignore so I took it to my watchmaker today who corrected it as much as he could. I also took the opportunity to have him re-seat the second hand so it at least hits 12:00 properly.

- It wears more like a Seiko Turtle on my small 6.25 inch wrist. Very comfortable and the Ti+ Quartz combo makes it extremely light and delightful on the wrist.

- The 24mm stock strap which tapers to 20mm was surprisingly good. Soft enough and high quality, even came installed with spring bar tubes on the lugs and buckle. If not for the thickness, flared out vents, and oversized buckle which made it quite bulky on my petite wrist I would have no issues rocking it. But I agree with the Guy who said a thinner flat strap would suit it better, specially for smaller wrists. I've temporarily put it on a 20mm MN strap while waiting for my 22mm US chocolate bar with matt gold buckle. Using a smaller strap isn't an issue due to the hidden lugs and it still balances out well but probably 20mm is the smallest I'd go. 22mm will be perfect 

- While I got unlucky with the chapter ring alignment. My bezel action on the other hand was tight and precise for a 60 clicker. Nowhere as nice as a CWC 60 click bezel but definitely better than a Mido 60 clicker. No play between clicks too and won't dislodge accidentally.

- I wish the date window was bigger but the beautiful stardust effect on the matt dial distracts me enough in a good way to notice

- Lume is pretty much average, again very similar to a modern king turtle.

Overall for the price you'll be very happy with this. Specially if you can get one with no qc issues but for the price of admission it's one of the best in the price range. Even if you do get one with a few quirks it's nothing $20 and half an hour with your watchmaker can't resolve!


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## 1386paul

Pee Dee said:


> Just got mine from Sakura so I thought I'd share my thoughts and experience so far:
> 
> - My example had a severely misaligned chapter ring. Didn't expect that from Citizen but it was too much to ignore so I took it to my watchmaker today who corrected it as much as he could. I also took the opportunity to have him re-seat the second hand so it at least hits 12:00 properly.
> 
> - It wears more like a Seiko Turtle on my small 6.25 inch wrist. Very comfortable and the Ti+ Quartz combo makes it extremely light and delightful on the wrist.
> 
> - The 24mm stock strap which tapers to 20mm was surprisingly good. Super soft and high quality, even came installed with spring bar tubes on the lugs and buckle. If not for the thickness, flared out vents, and oversized buckle I would have no issues rocking it. I've temporarily put it on a 20mm MN strap while waiting for my 22mm US chocolate bar with matt gold buckle. Using a smaller strap isn't an issue due to the hidden lugs and it still balances out well but probably 20mm is the smallest I'd go. 22mm will be perfect
> 
> - While I got unlucky with the chapter ring alignment. My bezel action on the other hand was tight and precise for a 60 clicker. Nowhere as nice as a CWC 60 click bezel but definitely better than a Mido 60 clicker. No play between clicks too and won't dislodge accidentally.
> 
> - I wish the date window was bigger but the beautiful stardust effect on the matt dial distracts me enough in a good way to notice
> 
> - Lume is pretty much average, again very similar to a modern king turtle.
> 
> Overall for the price you'll be very happy with this. Specially if you can get one with no qc issues but for the price of admission it's one of the best in the price range. Even if you do get one with a few quirks it's nothing $20 and half an hour with your watchmaker can't resolve!


That MN strap looks great on your BN0220.
It will be interesting to see it on a 22mm strap as 24mm straps can look a bit oversized.


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## Pee Dee

Thanks mate, my thoughts too. I reckon 22mm is the perfect size. Good thing the spring bar gaps are hidden so no issues fitting one. The 22mm choco bar I ordered will be my main strap for this watch when it arrives and I'll surely post photos here. Thank you for the thread.

Move back to post 30, the natos there are all 22mm I believe.

By the way If you end up getting a 22mm MN strap Erica has these vintage tone hardware like on my 20mm one which matches the Ti color of the Citizen perfectly


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## Pee Dee

double up


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## Robotaz

I have noticed the dial is very slightly printed not perfectly, so that a seconds hand on the 12:00-6:00 side is perfect, and slight not on the other side. It’s not enough to care, but being a lifelong Seiko fan I notice these things. But mine hits perfectly on one side.


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## Pee Dee

Robotaz said:


> I have noticed the dial is very slightly printed not perfectly, so that a seconds hand on the 12:00-6:00 side is perfect, and slight not on the other side. It's not enough to care, but being a lifelong Seiko fan I notice these things. But mine hits perfectly on one side.


It could also change depending on gravity I think sometimes it misses sometimes it hits depending on your activity. My eyesight has deteriorated enough for me to worry about hitting the 58 other markers. As long as it hits 12:00 and 6:00 close enough I'm a happy man


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## Robotaz

Pee Dee said:


> It could also change depending on gravity I think sometimes it misses sometimes it hits depending on your activity. My eyesight has deteriorated enough for me to worry about hitting the 58 other markers. As long as it hits 12:00 and 6:00 close enough I'm a happy man


The gear train is fine. I checked that first. It's a slight asymmetry in the printing. It's more common that people realize. Only a nutty WIS would notice.


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## Chidling

PeeDee, congrats on your nice gift to the Father's Day. 
Yes, both black and red ZULU from post #30 are 22mm and in my opinion it looks better than 24mm not tappered straps. Original rubber tappers to 20mm at buckle, so it is OK.
I am quite sad due to inconsistent quality similar to Seiko. I asked sakurawatches to doublecheck the chapter ring and second hand alignment - they did it and mine is okay, but on the other hand I have loose bezel which rotates alone. You have tight bezel, but misaligned second hand and chapter ring. I don't think this watch is cheap enough to have such qualuty issues.
But at the end of the day, I am happy with it.


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## Pee Dee

Thanks Chidling, I hope Pattypan is doing well  Funny you mentioned giving instructions to Sakura about alignment. I actually left specific notes on my order when I checked out to check alignment of the chapter ring and pick me a good one.

When Kota emailed me saying he'll need 2 days to dispatch, I reminded him again but I still got what I got.

I think he orders the watches in as they sell on his site so there's really no way to "pick" he just sends what he receives so I have a feeling it's more luck of the draw than Kota actually following our instructions 

Regardless of these little imperfections there's so much good in the watch to celebrate and the price is definitely one of them!


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## Chidling

Pee Dee said:


> I think he orders the watches in as they sell on his site so there's really no way to "pick" he just sends what he receives so I have a feeling it's more luck of the draw than Kota actually following our instructions


May be


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## Pee Dee

As promised here are a couple of shots of my 22mm US Chocolate Bar on the Citizen. I'm liking the look although the fit is not perfect...

There's a bit of play on the lugs because the strap springbar holes of US straps are made bigger to fit a 2.5mm springbar where as the BNE springbars are around 1.78mm. I tried using 24mm/0.80mm fat 2.5mm springbars which fit the strap well but the 0.80mm bar tips are too small and get dislodged easily on the bigger case holes.

The OEM spring bars have 1.2mm tips so those lug holes are bigger and would probably require at least the standard 1.1mm tip from Seiko spring bars to sit securely.


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## Robotaz

Looks OK to me. I’m just trying to find something comfortable at this point.


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## Pee Dee

I just reverted to the stock rubber again. Was just too bothered by the US strap sliding due to the thinner oem spring bars. Even the oem lug tubes didn't help tighten the bar gap.

In terms of comfort the oem rubber is still the softest on the wrist. Just wished the vents were flat to minimize the chunk but at least it tapers fron 24 to 20 and thank goodness it didn't come with metal keepers


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## 2500M_Sub

I could not take it anymore and could no longer wait for this watch to hit the US. I ordered one from Iguanasell I believe they are in Spain 385 USD shipped FedEx. Could not pass it up went with the gold accent version. It will be the only solar watch in my collection. 

Regards

Ren


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## leets

I'm waiting for mine too... 
Opt for the black version where as the Green were nice too...


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## leets

My bad, duplicate post...


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## Robotaz

2500M_Sub said:


> I could not take it anymore and could no longer wait for this watch to hit the US. I ordered one from Iguanasell I believe they are in Spain 385 USD shipped FedEx. Could not pass it up went with the gold accent version. It will be the only solar watch in my collection.
> 
> Regards
> 
> Ren
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


$40+ cheaper than what I paid! I think you did fine. Well worth every penny at $400.


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## 2500M_Sub

Waiting is so hard, my watch got delayed in France and now is in Memphis. Should be delivered tomorrow instead of today. I cant wait!

Regards,

Ren


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## jwernatl

Chidling said:


> Thank you, guys.
> As you said, Paul, the surface of the watch gets darker, when immersed in water.
> 
> The NATO strap suits the watch , but needless to say, this is not very "nylon strap friendly" case. There is not much space for the strap and sharp corner intercepts threading the strap through the lugs. I had to remove the spring bars, attach the strap and then insert the spring bars using small amount of force. And I have some thin NATO. Can't imagine using some heavy duty ZULU (to be tested, however I don't have 24mm).
> 
> So this was purely informative and now let's enjoy the nice view on the Patty Pan
> 
> View attachment 16069760


nice with this strap.


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## Chidling

Probably the last pattypan of this season


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## 2500M_Sub

The watch arrived yesterday alignment looks pretty good bezel action is not too loose, my only gripe is that the tongue on the buckle is really thin metal, not sure why they penny pinched here because the buckle itself is pretty robust. Not a huge deal though. I do not have the cased in China text on my case back but that may not be required for watches being sold in Europe? Also I wasn't a fan of gold accents but they are fine on this watch actually.

Regards

Ren










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## Chidling

Have you brought it in Europe? Could you please share where? I, as an European, bought it in Japan and payed considerable costs for shipping, VAT and clearance 🤦‍♂️


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## 2500M_Sub

Chidling said:


> Have you brought it in Europe? Could you please share where? I, as an European, bought it in Japan and payed considerable costs for shipping, VAT and clearance


I purchased it from Iguana Sell from Madrid Spain. Lowest price I could find, 385 USD shipped FedEx to me in the USA, they are an AD for Citizen too.

Regards

Ren

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## Chidling

Thanks, octopus  I bought from Sakurawatches.com in Japan and with shipping to Czechia and all additional costs, it was 50% more. My bad, haven't googled enough.


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## 2500M_Sub

Chidling said:


> Thanks, octopus  I bought from Sakurawatches.com in Japan and with shipping to Czechia and all additional costs, it was 50% more. My bad, haven't googled enough.


I almost purchased from Sakura on more than one occasion but was being cheap and did not want to spend over 400 and with shipping it was over 4, so glad I waited and got a great deal from Iguana. I hesitate to event look through their site as I may be tempted to buy something else.

Regards

Ren

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## boy_wonder

Just picked up this one in the UK, Watchshop briefly had a 25% off code so I snapped it up. Glad I did as this is now excluded from the discount offer. So rather than £399 I paid £299. Great watch for the price, wears alot smaller than I thought, is very comfortable to wear. I like the stock strap, it's soft and unlike some other promasters the ridges aren't ridiculously huge.
My favourite part though is the case, the finish is bead blasted and is so tactile to touch, feels almost like stone. Rubbing it with a finger makes darker areas that gradually fade back and water darkens the ti too.
Negatives, only the date window which is tiny.
Mine arrived with a second hand a hairs width off perfection at 12 o'clock. Once I reset the time the second hand is now absolutely perfectly aligned all the way round. Did not expect that.
Chapter ring is spot on and the bezel is nice and tight. When I move it after the click it does move back a fraction but once still it is aligned its rock solid. Guess this is due to it being 60 clicks rather than 120 so there is a little more natural play.
A few days in I think this may well be one of my favourite watches ever. Love the retro look, the feel of it and how it wears.
I may pick up the green one too if I find it at a similar price in the UK.


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## 2500M_Sub

boy_wonder said:


> Just picked up this one in the UK, Watchshop briefly had a 25% off code so I snapped it up. Glad I did as this is now excluded from the discount offer. So rather than £399 I paid £299. Great watch for the price, wears alot smaller than I thought, is very comfortable to wear. I like the stock strap, it's soft and unlike some other promasters the ridges aren't ridiculously huge.
> My favourite part though is the case, the finish is bead blasted and is so tactile to touch, feels almost like stone. Rubbing it with a finger makes darker areas that gradually fade back and water darkens the ti too.
> Negatives, only the date window which is tiny.
> Mine arrived with a second hand a hairs width off perfection at 12 o'clock. Once I reset the time the second hand is now absolutely perfectly aligned all the way round. Did not expect that.
> Chapter ring is spot on and the bezel is nice and tight. When I move it after the click it does move back a fraction but once still it is aligned its rock solid. Guess this is due to it being 60 clicks rather than 120 so there is a little more natural play.
> A few days in I think this may well be one of my favourite watches ever. Love the retro look, the feel of it and how it wears.
> I may pick up the green one too if I find it at a similar price in the UK.
> View attachment 16140552


I was hoping for the same here in the US but the watches have not been released here yet. Figured I would be able to pick it up on a screaming deal on some sort of sale but could not hold out any longer and not sure I would have done any better than I did. 
Congrats on a great deal.

Regards

Ren

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## CitizenPromaster

I see they are now on the UK website, but not yet on the EU website, nor the USA website, so I'm guessing the Spanish store sourced them from their UK franchise.
Citizen Watch | Promaster Collection



2500M_Sub said:


> I do not have the cased in China text on my case back but that may not be required for watches being sold in Europe?


I guess so?

Edit: It turns out that besides Citizen EU, Citizen UK, Citizen USA, and Citizen Italy, there is also Citizen Spain, and they have the same models as Citizen Italy and a few extra, and they already have the BN022X's, so the Spanish store simply sourced them from Citizen Spain. MSRP is EUR 379.
Citizen Watch Ibérica | Promaster


----------



## leets

boy_wonder said:


> Just picked up this one in the UK, Watchshop briefly had a 25% off code so I snapped it up. Glad I did as this is now excluded from the discount offer. So rather than £399 I paid £299. Great watch for the price, wears alot smaller than I thought, is very comfortable to wear. I like the stock strap, it's soft and unlike some other promasters the ridges aren't ridiculously huge.
> My favourite part though is the case, the finish is bead blasted and is so tactile to touch, feels almost like stone. Rubbing it with a finger makes darker areas that gradually fade back and water darkens the ti too.
> Negatives, only the date window which is tiny.
> Mine arrived with a second hand a hairs width off perfection at 12 o'clock. Once *I reset the time* the second hand is now absolutely perfectly aligned all the way round. Did not expect that.
> Chapter ring is spot on and the bezel is nice and tight. When I move it after the click it does move back a fraction but once still it is aligned its rock solid. Guess this is due to it being 60 clicks rather than 120 so there is a little more natural play.
> A few days in I think this may well be one of my favourite watches ever. Love the retro look, the feel of it and how it wears.
> I may pick up the green one too if I find it at a similar price in the UK.
> View attachment 16140552


May I know how do you reset the time ?


----------



## Chidling




----------



## Josh R.

Neat watch! What's the bezel diameter? I'm guessing 42?


----------



## leets

Since it is considered a square case, the case size is 46.5mm with a thickness of 14.3mm... 
Very nice watch... Special and stands out from the bunch...


----------



## zenskar

Love this watch. Bought one and my wife took it, so I bought another. First from a UK dealer came in a cardboard presentation case, but the one from Iguanasell in Spain came with the yellow Promaster dive case. They feel awesome to the touch and wear so well. Hard to choose between this and my NB6004, which is another titanium triumph from Citizen.


----------



## Robotaz

zenskar said:


> Love this watch. Bought one and my wife took it, so I bought another. First from a UK dealer came in a cardboard presentation case, but the one from Iguanasell in Spain came with the yellow Promaster dive case. They feel awesome to the touch and wear so well. Hard to choose between this and my NB6004, which is another titanium triumph from Citizen.


I have both, too. Great watches, although I have a couple tiny complaints with the 6004. 

The bezel action should be much tighter to be used as a real diver. Also, the finishing is a bit uneven if you look closely. The huge 1000m Zilla thats still out is at a much higher build and finishing level. Priced accordingly, so no big surprise. Other than that a very light, comfortable, and attractive watch.


----------



## zenskar

Agree on the bezel, but I've examined it under the loupe and the finishing (dial, hands, case) is uniform to my-admittedly, untrained-eye. Variations in QC? Lume could be better, however.


----------



## leets

My new toy... 🥰


----------



## Rojote

Cool. Looks nice on engineer style bracelet. Will wait until I can buy one 200-250 range.


----------



## lvt

Very impressive.


----------



## TheBrownHope

CitizenPromaster said:


> You can really see that the bezel is Duratect TIC and the case is Duratect MRK.


Care to elaborate? I'm not too well-versed with the Duratect stuff. But I have noticed a very very very slight color difference between the bezel and case. Your comment made me curious!


----------



## CitizenPromaster

TheBrownHope said:


> Care to elaborate? I'm not too well-versed with the Duratect stuff. But I have noticed a very very very slight color difference between the bezel and case. Your comment made me curious!


Well, I noticed a color difference too, and I know the bezel is Duratect TIC and the case is Duratect MRK, so I'm guessing that explains the color difference haha.


----------



## shez58

mine has a bezel misalignment...


----------



## TheBrownHope

CitizenPromaster said:


> Well, I noticed a color difference too, and I know the bezel is Duratect TIC and the case is Duratect MRK, so I'm guessing that explains the color difference haha.


 Gotcha. I honestly don't know the difference between the two other than... hardness?I I think you posted a more in-depth description of each Ti type from Citizen but I still didn't understand it haha

But the variation is so slight, the more you wear the watch and you get that "patina" from the Ti, it all just blends together and becomes unnoticeable. Mine got much darker since it was first unboxed.


----------



## CitizenPromaster

TheBrownHope said:


> Gotcha. I honestly don't know the difference between the two other than... hardness?I I think you posted a more in-depth description of each Ti type from Citizen but I still didn't understand it haha
> 
> But the variation is so slight, the more you wear the watch and you get that "patina" from the Ti, it all just blends together and becomes unnoticeable. Mine got much darker since it was first unboxed.


Duratect TIC is a coating of titanium carbide (which is black) and additional things, to get a “white” (metal color) coating on top of the titanium (or stainless steel) watch parts. Duratect MRK is a treatment where they harden the top layer of titanium by diffusing nitrogen (and other gas) into the titanium watch parts.
Usually on polished or brushed titanium the MRK is a bit more bronze/“warm” than TIC. On the bead blasted titanium the TIC also seems more grey in that photo I posted.


----------



## TheBrownHope

shez58 said:


> mine has a bezel misalignment...


This model definitely has it's QC issues, though very minor. As big and quirky looking as it is, and the way it's cased, I'm sure it's difficult for ALL stars to align perfectly. Even the Ecozillas never had the best alignment. 

And I have to mention, despite what a lotta guys say around here... Citizen is NOT without the QC issues like dial misprints and bezel/chapter ring/seconds hand alignment. I've owned plenty (maybe too many) of Citizen watches to know. The fact is, ALL brands suffer from these issues... even Rolex, albeit not as often as maybe Seiko (obviously larger production runs... it's all relative). It's really just luck of the draw, and some people are luckier than others. Just because every Citizen you owned never had issues, doesn't mean Citizen is immune to imperfection.

Sorry to go a bit off topic. It's a beautiful watch either way! Congrats!


----------



## TheBrownHope

CitizenPromaster said:


> Duratect TIC is a coating of titanium carbide (which is black) and additional things, to get a “white” (metal color) coating on top of the titanium (or stainless steel) watch parts. Duratect MRK is a treatment where they harden the top layer of titanium by diffusing nitrogen (and other gas) into the titanium watch parts.
> Usually on polished or brushed titanium the MRK is a bit more bronze/“warm” than TIC. On the bead blasted titanium the TIC also seems more grey in that photo I posted.


Thank you for that explanation! Had to hear it from the "PROmaster" himself. Yes, I noticed it especially when I first unboxed one.


----------



## CitizenPromaster

TheBrownHope said:


> Thank you for that explanation! Had to hear it from the "PROmaster" himself. Yes, I noticed it especially when I first unboxed one.


You are welcome.! I don't have any dive watches, and I want to keep it that way, but as a specimen of Citizen's titanium I find the BN really interesting and I'm tempted to buy a used example one day. Barely used examples are already being sold for around 23,000 yen (220 usd) on Yahoo. In a few years there should be used examples for 15,000 yen! I'm a patient man, most watches I buy are at least 10 years old haha.


----------



## Robotaz

TheBrownHope said:


> This model definitely has it's QC issues, though very minor. As big and quirky looking as it is, and the way it's cased, I'm sure it's difficult for ALL stars to align perfectly. Even the Ecozillas never had the best alignment.
> 
> And I have to mention, despite what a lotta guys say around here... Citizen is NOT without the QC issues like dial misprints and bezel/chapter ring/seconds hand alignment. I've owned plenty (maybe too many) of Citizen watches to know. The fact is, ALL brands suffer from these issues... even Rolex, albeit not as often as maybe Seiko (obviously larger production runs... it's all relative). It's really just luck of the draw, and some people are luckier than others. Just because every Citizen you owned never had issues, doesn't mean Citizen is immune to imperfection.
> 
> Sorry to go a bit off topic. It's a beautiful watch either way! Congrats!


My dial is printed asymmetrically and causes the second hand to be off on half the dial.

It’s actually a pretty sloppy execution, but for the money the style and function is still a bargain. I doubt I’ll ever sell mine just because it’s a lot of watch for so little money. It’s hard to replace with better.


----------



## TheBrownHope

Robotaz said:


> My dial is printed asymmetrically and causes the second hand to be off on half the dial.
> 
> It’s actually a pretty sloppy execution, but for the money the style and function is still a bargain. I doubt I’ll ever sell mine just because it’s a lot of watch for so little money. It’s hard to replace with better.


Well, you're not alone. I've handled two already (carrier mishap) and another buddy of mine has one. All a hair off due to the asymmetry. Even the minute hand goes off for a quarter or so of the dial. All had some sort of imperfection. But like you said, for the money it's no biggie.


----------



## leets

After my days with the BN0220, I can summarize it as below on my own preference term;

Pros: (what I likes about it)
1. It's design and color tone, where it stands out from the rest (most for being round case). Rugged looking. Friends will ask, what's the watch on you ?
2. Sand blasted feel and felt solid. Different from the rest. 
3. Changes to darker color when it comes contact with water.
4. It's light. You do not felt anything on your wrist.
5. The rubber strap is comfortable and it stays on well without the buckle moving up and down.
6. Being an Eco-Drive, it's accurate on time. Hahaaa! 

Cons: (what I dislikes about it)
1. The date window. It's too tiny. Maybe due to my age, my eye's can't zoom on it clearly fast enough. Citizen should make it bigger.
2. Back case cover where they should have a logo on it (Like the Fugu). Still, it's not a deal breaker but I would like to mention it here.
3. The lume can be better (wishes it can last much longer). It's bright but it don't last that long as I expected (comparing it with my Fugu and my other Seikos). 
4. The rubber strap got a bump up to keep the strap in place so that it won't come out loose where it really do stays in place BUT it is difficult to slide it out sometimes, to take my watch off. (not a big deal though) 
5. It should comes standard with a grey oxygen tank case.

Another point not pros nor cons where the Duratec case will slowly changes color bits by bits where it blends to favours you and being yours, uniquely. This definitely is Pros to me. I'm loving it. 

For the price... nothing beats it.
Worth the money spent and it's my daily beater now.

Shall I get the green one too ? Duratec DLC.
Hahaaa! 🤣


----------



## leets

How not to love it ?
Yummy~
😍


----------



## jwernatl

composer said:


> With all of Seiko's QC issues, I am looking into Citizen since they have better QC.


So true - horrible alignment and fitment from Seiko four that I own. Its unbelievable. Not one of my Citizens. 

Citizen is so underrated.


----------



## Terra Citizen

I wonder if the alignment issue, that is mentioned above, is related to the E168 movement. I have five Citizen watches with the E168 movement: four Promaster Tough and one Titanium Diver. All five of the watches have a subtle second-hand alignment issue with 4 indices, adjacent to each other. Alignment is perfect on the rest of the indices. The misalignment happens at different locations for each watch. No other alignment issues exist with the indices and tick mark between the dial and chapter ring.


----------



## shez58

Terra Citizen said:


> I wonder if the alignment issue, that is mentioned above, is related to the E168 movement. I have five Citizen watches with the E168 movement: four Promaster Tough and one Titanium Diver. All five of the watches have a subtle second-hand alignment issue with 4 indices, adjacent to each other. Alignment is perfect on the rest of the indices. The misalignment happens at different locations for each watch. No other alignment issues exist with the indices and tick mark between the dial and chapter ring.


Just notice that mine also has a second-hand alignment issue, but only around a 30-second mark. Your theory is probably correct.

Also, looking at the press release photos seems like all BN0220 has bezel alignment issues.


----------



## 1386paul

shez58 said:


> Just notice that mine also has a second-hand alignment issue, but only around a 30-second mark. Your theory is probably correct.
> 
> Also, looking at the press release photos seems like all BN0220 has bezel alignment issues.
> View attachment 16205711


I wouldn’t assume anything my alignment is spot on.


----------



## Chidling

Mine is well aligned, even the second hand almost hits the indeces, but the bezel action is very wobbly.


----------



## shez58

Chidling said:


> Mine is well aligned, even the second hand almost hits the indeces, but the bezel action is very wobbly.
> 
> View attachment 16206072


as for me, the bezel is 0.5mm misaligned on your photo too.

Watch is definitely not bad for the price, but when comparing it to the cheaper NY0125-83E model, which has much superior quality, and my Citizen BN2031-85E always hits all marks. 
I can self-align the bezel at the 12 clock mark, however, bezel action doesn't stop exactly at the 12 clock mark.


----------



## CitizenPromaster

@shez58 everybody needs a hobby, right?


----------



## CitizenPromaster

On a serious note, small misalignments on a dive watch DO NOT negatively impact the intended function (a timekeeping device as backup for a proper dive computer) at all, so while I understand it as a fellow watch OCD person, we can't blame Citizen or Seiko for the QC in their respective price brackets. And the price of the BN0220 is dictated by the titanium and the MRK surface treatment, the actual movement is one of the cheapest they have, and together with reasonable but limited QC that is probably how they can keep it affordable.


----------



## Robotaz

I just noticed that relojesdemoda.com has the green BN0228 for $300+ shipping. I bought a $2000 Seiko from them, so I can vouch for them.

Other two are out of stock. I will be watching for the blue 0227 to be in stock.

They also show the big BN6004 on bracelet at $634 + shipping, but not shipping till January, apparently.

That’s cheaper than the $700 I paid at Lucas Dive Store, and the $682 at gioiapura.it that @brandon\ turned us onto.


----------



## Terra Citizen

CitizenPromaster said:


> On a serious note, small misalignments on a dive watch DO NOT negatively impact the intended function (a timekeeping device as backup for a proper dive computer) at all, so while I understand it as a fellow watch OCD person, we can't blame Citizen or Seiko for the QC in their respective price brackets.


I agree. Just to clarify, the misalignments that I describe only happen on 3-4 indices. The second hand still hits all indices, just that on 3 or 4 of the indices, the second hand lands off-center. For the rest of the indices, the second hand is perfectly aligned with the indices. The misalignments I describe are very subtle and are mostly noticeable with the red second hand. It kinda disappears with the white second hands. Ultimately, I have accepted this and am very happy with the overall quality and aesthetic of the watches... I mean, I did buy four Promaster Tough variations, so I was not swayed at all.


----------



## CitizenPromaster

Terra Citizen said:


> I agree. Just to clarify, the misalignments that I describe only happen on 3-4 indices. The second hand still hits all indices, just that on 3 or 4 of the indices, the second hand lands off-center. For the rest of the indices, the second hand is perfectly aligned with the indices. The misalignments I describe are very subtle and are mostly noticeable with the red second hand. It kinda disappears with the white second hands. Ultimately, I have accepted this and am very happy with the overall quality and aesthetic of the watches... I mean, I did buy four Promaster Tough variations, so I was not swayed at all.


I have several top of the range Promasters with fancy movements, they all have hands that dont hit markers right in multiple places. It has to do with how the minute markers are printed more than anything I think.


----------



## Terra Citizen

I'm patiently waiting for the black/gold version to arrive in the USA but my optimism is waining. Such a cool looking rig.

Does anyone have the green or blue versions? Let's see more pics!


----------



## CitizenPromaster

Are they dumping unsellable stock of the DLC variants on the US, or what? Why the heck wouldn't they offer the MRK version? And why isn't (Northern) Europe getting any of them????? I think we are the only region that still doesn't get any variant.


----------



## Terra Citizen

CitizenPromaster said:


> Are they dumping unsellable stock of the DLC variants on the US, or what? Why the heck wouldn't they offer the MRK version? And why isn't (Northern) Europe getting any of them????? I think we are the only region that still doesn't get any variant.



I called Citizen this morning. They don't show the DLC variant being available and don't show it as incoming anytime soon to the US. That doesn't mean it won't ever arrive just that they don't see it in the system, yet.


----------



## CitizenPromaster

Terra Citizen said:


> I called Citizen this morning. They don't show the DLC variant being available and don't show it as incoming anytime soon to the US. That doesn't mean it won't ever arrive just that they don't see it in the system, yet.


So the website is just BS?









And what happens when you pay?


----------



## Terra Citizen

I think I got confused, referencing the DLC variant. In the US, currently, only the Blue and Green dial variants are available. The black/gold variant is not available and not showing to be available anytime soon.


----------



## CitizenPromaster

Terra Citizen said:


> I think I got confused, referencing the DLC variant. In the US, currently, only the Blue and Green dial variants are available. The black/gold variant is not available and not showing to be available anytime soon.


Ah, well then my point remains: are they dumping the blue and green versions (with DLC case) on the US? I have the feeling that for every 10 gold models they sell only 1 of the other two.


----------



## Terra Citizen

CitizenPromaster said:


> Ah, well then my point remains: are they dumping the blue and green versions (with DLC case) on the US? I have the feeling that for every 10 gold models they sell only 1 of the other two.


They must feel that all of us Americans drink Four Loco and have frosted tips. However, I am kinda tempted to buy the green version.


----------



## CitizenPromaster

Terra Citizen said:


> They must feel that all of us Americans drink Four Loco and have frosted tips. However, I am kinda tempted to buy the green version.


Neato!


----------



## brandon\

CitizenPromaster said:


> Neato!


Oh my god. Riff Raff.


----------



## leets

Yes, the green is nicer tone of green too. 
Were still in doubt shall I buy another one ? 
Hahaaa!


----------



## CitizenPromaster

brandon\ said:


> Oh my god. Riff Raff.


I had never heard of "Four Loco" until you mentioned it, but I guess their name is a reference to it


----------



## TheBrownHope

leets said:


> Yes, the green is nicer tone of green too.
> Were still in doubt shall I buy another one ?
> Hahaaa!


I tried to make a request for a replacement strap on the Citizen US site for the green model so I could put it on my BN0220-16E. But the site doesn't recognize the model (yet). Definitely want to try that combo. I would swap the clasp obviously.

Photo below is not mine, but I did Photoshop it to reflect my idea.


----------



## Chidling

Diver's extension used when walking the dogs


----------



## shez58

on sale: Amazon.com: Citizen Men's Promaster Dive Super Titanium Eco-Drive Sport Watch with Polyurethane Strap, Black, 14.3 (Model: BN0220-16E) : Clothing, Shoes & Jewelry


----------



## Tuna holic

How is the lume on this beast?
Compared to say the Seiko tuna?

Very tempted to get one of these beauties to compliment my Tuna’s. Looks almost like citizens version of the solar Tuna.


----------



## cjbiker

Tuna holic said:


> How is the lume on this beast?
> Compared to say the Seiko tuna?
> 
> Very tempted to get one of these beauties to compliment my Tuna’s. Looks almost like citizens version of the solar Tuna.


I would say the lume is on par with a Seiko diver. I haven't done a side by side test, but it glows like a torch when I go to bed, and I can still easily see the time in the dark 8 hrs later.


----------



## cjbiker

I joined the Retrozilla club last Friday. Got the watch from Sakura. The stock strap is really good, but a little bulky for winter wear, so I swapped it for a thin Zulu copy strap that I got for free with some other straps. It actually suits the Citizen very well. 










I ordered a heavy duty 2 pc nylon strap from Clockwork Synergy, but I'm liking this one so much, I don't know if I'll swap it out. Loving the Retrozilla so far!


----------



## Chidling

BN0220 at the bottom of the deepest abyss in Central Europe. And yes, the lume is pretty good, same as Seiko divers, I would say.


----------



## adphi

Very cool and unique watch!


----------



## zenskar

Nice price of £199 if you are in the UK.


----------



## Chidling




----------



## Robert Bays

I just ordered the blue here in New Zealand yesterday. I'll post pics when it arrives!!


----------



## tonycro

wow, these look funky and absolutely gorgeous, I just wish they were cheaper to import to Croatia


----------



## CitizenPromaster

tonycro said:


> wow, these look funky and absolutely gorgeous, I just wish they were cheaper to import to Croatia


I've got one for sale within the EU, good as new in box (from Japan), €299 plus shipping.


----------



## CitizenPromaster

Don't get used to seeing a dive watch on my wrist! It's also for sale locally.


----------



## Patrick_R

Amazing looking watch. 
I’ve not seen these before. 

Thank you for bringing it to my attention.


----------



## Chidling




----------



## CitizenPromaster

Took some more photos to make some points.










The lug to lug is not big at all. Maybe I have flat wrists, but they are just average size (18.5 cm). It doesn't look bigger to me than the Pilot watches I usually wear, partly due to the relatively small crystal.










It's not all that high either, and it sits very flat on my flat wrist.










The silicon strap is surprisingly comfortable, and certainly seems sturdy enough for serious diving. It's so solid and tight in fact that it's a pain to take off, but maybe that's just my inexperience with dive straps or it being brand new.

I like it a lot more than I thought I would, but somehow I just can't see myself wearing a dive watch on a regular basis, and my car needs new tires more than I need this watch!


----------



## Munks337

Chidling said:


> View attachment 16619142
> 
> 
> View attachment 16619144


Your watch is a lot darker than others. I know titanium darkens over time but how long did it take to darken to this shade?


----------



## Chidling

To be honest I havent seen other than my watch in nature. But I dont think my is darker than others. I rather believe it is because my photos are usually little underexponed. Since I have the watch, I dont observe any color change.


----------



## Munks337

Chidling said:


> To be honest I havent seen other than my watch in nature. But I dont think my is darker than others. I rather believe it is because my photos are usually little underexponed. Since I have the watch, I dont observe any color change.


Ok, thanks I like the look of darker titanium. Cool watch!


----------



## Robert Bays




----------



## CitizenPromaster

CitizenPromaster said:


> Congratulations! It looks awesome. I don't think it can tempt me to break my "no dive watches" policy, but if I were to break that policy, this would be a top contender haha


By the way, my watch is from the same batch - the first ever batch - as the OP's one (his photo)


----------



## CitizenPromaster

Also, now that is has been released in Europe a few months ago, some Dutch webshops already started to discount it, and others are more or less forced to follow. MSRP is €399, but some offer it for €369, €360, and on the Dutch Amazon you can order one from Spain for €340 + €10 shipping, which comes to €350, but they had only 1 in stock.


----------



## CitizenPromaster

Don’t ask me how the lume compares to that of a Seiko Something


----------



## Robotaz

Munks337 said:


> Ok, thanks I like the look of darker titanium. Cool watch!


The media blast texture makes it darker than smooth titanium, too.


----------



## CitizenPromaster

Some real-life wear (not my watch)

















































I'm leaning towards keeping it though, it's quite unique...


----------



## nwdcguy

Just got mine from CreationWatches and arrived in under 7 days. 

I've owned many dive watches and this guy is a Japanese quality, value, and style beast for into vintage diver fans. $358 shipped for a SATISFYING piece. My PAM2394 got taken off for this guy.

It wears comfortably; light and thin on my 7inch flat wrist. The strap is soft no lint rubber and the matching clasp is clean.

Styling is Helson Bronze Shark Diver beef, plus Black and Gold Seiko Marinemaster old school, with G-Shock Frogman Japanese swagger, all delivered in a svelte profile. The etched and gold painted bezel insert numerals with the gold hands sets the piece off and contrasts beautifully against the grainy matte titanium. I don't have any other quartz analogs right now, but the ticking gives the watch utilitarianism. It looks like it belongs next to beatup scuba tanks, a double hose regulator, and a black skirted mask.

The bezel lines up perfectly, but the seconds hands are just a tiny bit askew from about 50 to 10 sec markers. A black date window would be nice.


----------



## CitizenPromaster

nwdcguy said:


> The bezel lines up perfectly, but the seconds hands are just a tiny bit askew from about 50 to 10 sec markers.


Same on mine, bezel is spot on (to my eye), but they didn't put a great effort in the dial print, so the seconds hand is off for a portion of the circle, but as I said, this is not the fault of the seconds hand, but due to the print.

I actually decided to keep mine.


----------



## Robert Bays




----------



## Robert Bays

Next to a solar tuna limited edition


----------



## CitizenPromaster

Good look at the dial (not my photo)









And an in-focus photo of the lume (also not mine)


----------



## CitizenPromaster

Some photos of the blue, still not a fan of the camo, why not just blue?


----------



## CitizenPromaster

Not a bad look this "Miro's Time NATO"


----------



## testudo

Just got mine awhile back, my first citizen. It has everything I want in a diver: round indices, screwdown crown and 200 wr, bezel with engraved minute markers all the way round and a date window. The design of the case is really unique, very ulitarian and brutalistic even. The blasted finnish looks cool and gives a really nice tactile feel. The square shape kinda reminds me of Bell&Ross and Panerai in some ways. The texture of the dial is beautiful in direct sunlight. Would be cool to see an automatic version with citizen's new 9050 caliper but ecodrive does suit the tool diver nature of the watch.

Negatives:
-Some sort of engraved logo (promaster?) would look nice on the caseback.
-The valve on my scuba tank box isn't glued on straight 


















Are there any 24 mm titanium bracelets (blasted) that might fit it?


----------



## sky21

testudo said:


> Just got mine awhile back, my first citizen. It has everything I want in a diver: round indices, screwdown crown and 200 wr, bezel with engraved minute markers all the way round and a date window. The design of the case is really unique, very ulitarian and brutalistic even. The blasted finnish looks cool and gives a really nice tactile feel. The square shape kinda reminds me of Bell&Ross and Panerai in some ways. The texture of the dial is beautiful in direct sunlight. Would be cool to see an automatic version with citizen's new 9050 caliper but ecodrive does suit the tool diver nature of the watch.
> 
> Negatives:
> -Some sort of engraved logo (promaster?) would look nice on the caseback.
> -The valve on my scuba tank box isn't glued on straight
> 
> View attachment 16688767
> 
> View attachment 16688766
> 
> 
> Are there any 24 mm titanium bracelets (blasted) that might fit it?


Maybe one of these might fit?





24mm Citizen Bracelets


Cousins UK for 24mm Citizen Bracelets




www.cousinsuk.com


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## Robert Bays

I love my blue. The dial has a gloss over the blue camo print and it's great. Really love the hands and indices, the whole dial layout. The duratect Plus dlc coated case is very dark now after wearing it alot. And the lume....


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## CitizenPromaster

Robert Bays said:


> I love my blue. The dial has a gloss over the blue camo print and it's great. Really love the hands and indices, the whole dial layout. The duratect Plus dlc coated case is very dark now after wearing it alot. And the lume....
> View attachment 16698374
> 
> View attachment 16698375


The blue might not be my cup of tea, but I'm glad you are enjoying yours. It would be boring if we all have the same watch!


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## Robert Bays

CitizenPromaster said:


> The blue might not be my cup of tea, but I'm glad you are enjoying yours. It would be boring if we all have the same watch!


 It's my favorite watch right now! The bezel protecting the crystal so well makes it a great daily watch. Out out interest I tried to mark the back of the case with a tugsten carbide endmill (I'm a machinist) and it only left slight surface marks that rubbed off. Pretty impressive hardness!


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## testudo

The blue looks really nice! I feel an orange dial version would work really well too...


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## Batboy

Robert Bays said:


> Out out interest I tried to mark the back of the case with a tugsten carbide endmill (I'm a machinist) and it only left slight surface marks that rubbed off. Pretty impressive hardness!


Whoa!  

That’s impressive hardness and scratch-resistance.


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## testudo

Got the watch a month ago and set the time, in that time it has gained less than 0,5 s - nice!


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## CitizenPromaster

Just to reiterate, the international version, as identified by the packaging...









...does not say CASED IN CHINA on the caseback after JAPAN MOV'T.









Yet the case code and everything else is identical, which could mean there are watches with identical serial numbers, that can only be distinguished by the added CASED IN CHINA.









Unless they programmed the laser engraver to only add CASED IN CHINA to certain serial numbers destined for the Japanese Domestic Market, which is easy enough I guess. So far the JDM watches from June 2021 (162) seem to be #0XXX and the international watches from June 2021 (162) seem to be serial #1000+, so who knows...


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## testudo

testudo said:


> Got the watch a month ago and set the time, in that time it has gained less than 0,5 s - nice!


Two months now, still not even a second off 😯
Impressive!


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## Tuna holic

CitizenPromaster said:


> Just to reiterate, the international version, as identified by the packaging...
> View attachment 16779176
> 
> 
> ...does not say CASED IN CHINA on the caseback after JAPAN MOV'T.
> View attachment 16779180
> 
> 
> Yet the case code and everything else is identical, which could mean there are watches with identical serial numbers, that can only be distinguished by the added CASED IN CHINA.
> View attachment 16779181
> 
> 
> Unless they programmed the laser engraver to only add CASED IN CHINA to certain serial numbers destined for the Japanese Domestic Market, which is easy enough I guess. So far the JDM watches from June 2021 (162) seem to be #0XXX and the international watches from June 2021 (162) seem to be serial #1000+, so who knows...


Any chance of a phew photos with it on that black and grey neato in the photo??
Cheers.


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## CC

Received the Blue version the other day.
So light and comfortable.

Like it so much just ordered the Black version.

£199 @ Beaverbrooks (UK) for anyone interested....


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## Dave_timekeeper

Robert Bays said:


> I love my blue. The dial has a gloss over the blue camo print and it's great. Really love the hands and indices, the whole dial layout. The duratect Plus dlc coated case is very dark now after wearing it alot. And the lume....
> View attachment 16698374
> 
> View attachment 16698375


This looks nice! How good is lume in comparison with solar tuna? I’m deciding between two.


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## Robert Bays

Dave_timekeeper said:


> This looks nice! How good is lume in comparison with solar tuna? I’m deciding between two.


Excellent lume just as good. I actually prefer the citizen colour.


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## Pee Dee

Here are some quick snaps of the Asian Release BN0227-17X


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## Robotaz

Pee Dee said:


> Here are some quick snaps of the Asian Release BN0227-17X


That’s cool! I didn’t know about this until I saw your post.


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## Pee Dee

Robotaz said:


> That’s cool! I didn’t know about this until I saw your post.


Yeah it's a stealthy release along with that Beige dial/Gold Bezel variant in Singapore. 

So far I've only seen this full lume in Citizen's websites in Hong Kong and Singapore although all the sellers online seem to be HK based at this stage


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## Robert Bays

**** I need that! The bue has become my favorite watch, light, interesting, and a perfect tool watch.


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## inferno493

looking burly


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## Josh R.

I just got mine yesterday! It's great! If anyone is curious, the bezel diameter is 42.3, and the dial diameter is about 29.5. A very wearable watch, and I like the industrial-looking finish to the case.


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## CitizenPromaster

It took a while, but I just sold mine. It's on its way to a WUS user in the US right now, as weirdly there was no interest locally.

I liked having it in my titanium collection, so it was hard to let go, but it's better this way, because I wouldn't wear it as I'm in an exclusive relationship with pilot and field watches. 

Now for daily use I have a small field watch (unobtrusive), and for other times I have way too many pilot watches, that I barely wear but enjoy collecting.

Had I not started collecting watchest at all, I could totally see this BN0220-16E as my only watch.


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## CitizenPromaster

Behold, the new bulbous lume pip has made it to the BN0220-16E too.










This is the first example I've seen that has a serial number that does not start with 162 (June 2021, when they were first made).










This one was made in May 2022 (252), and since it is a European market watch, it does not say CASED IN CHINA after JAPAN MOV'T.


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## Rocky555

Did they improve the lume? Original BN0220 variant has poor lume, blue variant is much better.


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## CitizenPromaster

Rocky555 said:


> Did they improve the lume? Original BN0220 variant has poor lume, blue variant is much better.


I don't know, but the lume on my 162-serial BN0220-16E seemed fine.


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## Terra Citizen

Interesting that they changed the lume pip. Mine has the glass shield over the lume pip and says, "Cased in China" on the back.


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## CitizenPromaster

Terra Citizen said:


> Interesting that they changed the lume pip. Mine has the glass shield over the lume pip and says, "Cased in China" on the back.


They did so on pretty much all Citizen dive watches at the beginning of 2022.


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## cowsmilk

I got mine secondhand off of another forum in July of this year for a reasonable $250. While it’s not my first dive watch, nor is it my first titanium cased watch, it is currently my favorite so far from both of those categories. Like others have said, it fits really well for having such a big footprint. Plus it’s so darn light. It would probably be more unwieldy if it was stainless steel or even brass cased. The wrist strap was weird at first as the end that goes through the loops is fairly bulbous (by design, or so I’ve read) and makes donning it awkward, but I got used to it after a week. The different shape of the case is something I like as well.


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## Lepdiggums

CitizenPromaster said:


> Behold, the new bulbous lume pip has made it to the BN0220-16E too.
> 
> View attachment 16905601
> 
> 
> This is the first example I've seen that has a serial number that does not start with 162 (June 2021, when they were first made).
> 
> View attachment 16905602
> 
> 
> This one was made in May 2022 (252), and since it is a European market watch, it does not say CASED IN CHINA after JAPAN MOV'T.


Thanks for posting @CitizenPromaster 

Definitely not a fan of the new pip, as it just looks cheap to me unfortunately 😭😭


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## Lepdiggums

cowsmilk said:


> I got mine secondhand off of another forum in July of this year for a reasonable $250. While it’s not my first dive watch, nor is it my first titanium cased watch, it is currently my favorite so far from both of those categories. Like others have said, it fits really well for having such a big footprint. Plus it’s so darn light. It would probably be more unwieldy if it was stainless steel or even brass cased. The wrist strap was weird at first as the end that goes through the loops is fairly bulbous (by design, or so I’ve read) and makes donning it awkward, but I got used to it after a week. The different shape of the case is something I like as well.
> View attachment 16930873
> View attachment 16930872


Looking fantastic @cowsmilk 

Plus its rocking that awesome looking flat pip🔥🔥🔥🔥


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## Robert Bays

I'm still loving mine! It's so comfortable and light. The hardened titanium is standing up to my job as a machinist. They are releasing a limited edition whale shark model soon. I really want that too!


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## Robert Bays

Save the BEYOND - SYMBOL OF THE SEAS | PROMASTER Global Campaign - Official Site [CITIZEN]


CITIZEN PROMASTER global campaign “Save the BEYOND” . We examine the significance of whale sharks and the efforts being made to save them through interviews with marine scientist, dive instructor and marine biologist.




www.citizenwatch-global.com


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## cowsmilk

Robert Bays said:


> Save the BEYOND - SYMBOL OF THE SEAS | PROMASTER Global Campaign - Official Site [CITIZEN]
> 
> 
> CITIZEN PROMASTER global campaign “Save the BEYOND” . We examine the significance of whale sharks and the efforts being made to save them through interviews with marine scientist, dive instructor and marine biologist.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.citizenwatch-global.com


That’s a good looking watch, thanks for posting that.


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## cowsmilk

Lepdiggums said:


> Looking fantastic @cowsmilk
> 
> Plus its rocking that awesome looking flat pip🔥🔥🔥🔥


Mine is from June of 21 so yeah, flat pip!
Also, it has the cased in China stamp as well.


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## James_

Does the strap taper to the buckle and if so to what to?


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## James_

composer said:


> Congrats Paul, what a beast of a diver! Never seen this model before. With all of Seiko's QC issues, I am looking into Citizen since they have better QC.


I used to think Citizen has better QC than Seiko, but recently Citizens I've had and also looking at them in shop windows I don't think it's the case. The Fugu type watches I've seen in shops have misaligned chapter rings. I've looked at 5 Excaliburs in the past few months to try and get one with acceptable QC. All of them had various QC issues, the worst one being the dial moving when using the crown. Several had the bezel set too high so it would clatter sometimes against the case. Misaligned hands, spec of dust on the dial, misaligned bezels. The Excalibur I eventually settled on is the best of a bad bunch but still has some QC issues. 

Also got a titanium radio controlled Nighthawk a while back. The crown wouldn't unscrew so had to use a dish towel to get more grip on it. Second hand didn't hit any of the markers too. It also arrrived totally dead as in so dead it took ages charging outside to even get it to tick once every 2 secs, then another long time to attempt a sync which never worked so gave up. They are so confusing to set from dead. It was also quite tatty looking with the boxes being even worse, which is the sellers fault. Sent it straight back to Iguanasell, a supposed Citizen AD.

Lastly, the current batch of Citizen Excaliburs on bracelet have a manufacture date of 2018 at the latest. I contacted Citizen and asked them about it. They said they have no plans to make more bracelet verisons. So I went with the rubber strap verison which is 2021 manufacture date. The bracelet version I got with 2018 serial just felt like it wasn't a new watch. Strange feeling.


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## zenskar

Rocky555 said:


> Did they improve the lume? Original BN0220 variant has poor lume, blue variant is much better.


Got two of the original variant, flat pip, and both have excellent lume.


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## testudo

Time to set winter time on my BN0220, last time I set the time was in May when I got it and it's only gained a second. Are all Eco-Drives that accurate or did I get lucky with this one?


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## Robotaz

Mine has become beater #1. It goes with many clothing options, doesn’t show wear hardly at all, is ready to be grabbed and used, and looks good. I really like it.


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## Robotaz

testudo said:


> Time to set winter time on my BN0220, last time I set the time was in May when I got it and it's only gained a second. Are all Eco-Drives that accurate or did I get lucky with this one?


Luck.


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## fmc000

Indeed luck, usually eco-drives perform way better than the +-15spm advertised but normally in my experience they are in the +- 3 to 4 spm.


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## Yuli

Sorry to be that guy that posts about the same thing in multiple threads but I have just discovered this one after posting my own question. From the 20 pages I've seen, it seems misaligned bezels and chapter rings are not unheard of with this line of watches. 
One thing I don't think I've seen mentioned is the alignment of the indexes, particularly the 12 o'clock applied index on the dial. Because of it's unique shape with the point on the top center, it makes it quite obvious when it's not lined up with the corresponding marker on the chapter ring. 
I'm looking at a watch that exhibits this exact thing. It seems the chapter ring and bezel are well lined up but the dial is ever so slightly skewed to the right. It's not a huge misalignment, normally not soemthing that would bother me, but it's something that is made readily obvious by the point on the 12 o'clock index pointing to the right side edge of the corresponding marker on the chapter ring.




It's currently on sale at 60% but even so I'm wondering if i might just pay more for a different one that isn't so obviously off.


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## Yuli

Quite the odd development on this. I visited two branches of another chain to have a look at the same watch, it turns out they all have the same flaw on the same color watch but not on the blue variant. All skewed to the right, just as obvious as the others. Now I'm truly intrigued and curious about this. Maybe more of a batch issue than quality control? Would really love to hear from existing owners on their knowledge and experience.



Yuli said:


> Sorry to be that guy that posts about the same thing in multiple threads but I have just discovered this one after posting my own question. From the 20 pages I've seen, it seems misaligned bezels and chapter rings are not unheard of with this line of watches.
> One thing I don't think I've seen mentioned is the alignment of the indexes, particularly the 12 o'clock applied index on the dial. Because of it's unique shape with the point on the top center, it makes it quite obvious when it's not lined up with the corresponding marker on the chapter ring.
> I'm looking at a watch that exhibits this exact thing. It seems the chapter ring and bezel are well lined up but the dial is ever so slightly skewed to the right. It's not a huge misalignment, normally not soemthing that would bother me, but it's something that is made readily obvious by the point on the 12 o'clock index pointing to the right side edge of the corresponding marker on the chapter ring.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It's currently on sale at 60% but even so I'm wondering if i might just pay more for a different one that isn't so obviously off.
> 
> View attachment 17030268


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## wgobel7777

Mine has a very gritty feel when screwing the crown in or out. I've tried "exercising" the threads, but the titanium is so tough that it just won't lap in. Once sprung out from the threads, the entire crown and stem are buttery smooth ... it's just the threads that grind. It's not a big deal, but I still wonder how I might remedy it with a tap ... if I only knew the thread count and pitch. Doubtless metric threads. Anybody else have this grinding stem?


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## cjbiker

wgobel7777 said:


> Mine has a very gritty feel when screwing the crown in or out. I've tried "exercising" the threads, but the titanium is so tough that it just won't lap in. Once sprung out from the threads, the entire crown and stem are buttery smooth ... it's just the threads that grind. It's not a big deal, but I still wonder how I might remedy it with a tap ... if I only knew the thread count and pitch. Doubtless metric threads. Anybody else have this grinding stem?


No, mine is pretty smooth threading. I'd recommend using waxed dental floss to clean the crown tube threads, screw the crown down a couple of times, clean with the floss again, repeat a few times. Usually a rough crown is just some grit trapped in the threads, and this procedure has always helped.


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## wgobel7777

Has anyone got a diameter for that mineral crystal or a lead on a replacement sapphire crystal for this watch?


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## Robbie_roy

Ugh ... started looking these up again last night for some reason. And now here I am, a few YT videos later, multiple browser tabs open, and following this thread. How does that happen? The great photos in this thread don't help either  The heavy-textured titanium just looks great.

I wish some of my local shops carried the US models so I could check them out in person. But the full-lume BN0227-17X (Asia-only) is the one I am eyeing anyway. 

It's great to see that the sizing has not been a concern for those of you with 6.25"-7.00" wrists. Does anyone else have the G-Shock Casioak (GA-2100, etc.) and can comment if they are relatively similar on-wrist? The width and lug-to-lug seemed nearly identical. 

One video compared it to a Blastoise (Pokemon) for us 90s children out there, and I cannot unsee it. Makes it even more tempting!


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## Foch

I have the green version. I got a 1/2 off because they couldn't repair an older Promaster Aqualand. I like it, the weight is great for comfort. I have a pretty extensive collection of dive watches and this is my "Feather Weight". I have it on a matte black sharkmesh. My only real complaint is the elapsed time bezel. It turns way to easy. If I crash out with the watch on my wrist it moves in my sleep. As a dive watch I don't think it should be that easy. It's not deal breaker, just an oddity.


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