# Zenith El Primero 36'000 VpH - my first luxury watch



## schizophrenia (Jun 2, 2017)

Of all the watch brands, I have been eye'ing on Zenith for a years. The other day I was just browsing through Instagram and saw a photo of the vintage Zenith El Primero 1969 and had a crush on it. I started doing research and found the Zenith El Primero Original 1969 (38mm) and Zenith El Primero 36'000 VpH (42mm) are the successors of the original 1969. So I started researching on the background of Zenith and the watch as well as the price. Finally I got it over the last weekend and am in love with it. 

Here are some photos, though this watch should be nothing much exciting to most of you.


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## Baric (Aug 23, 2014)

Congratulations on a great watch. Mine says hi... (internet photo)


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## EnderW (Mar 16, 2015)

Congrats. Looks great!


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## elchicomalo (Dec 10, 2015)

Big congrats, may it bring you perpetual high-beat happiness!


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## Atleo (Aug 6, 2016)

This example and these references look amazing. Congrats!


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## omeglycine (Jan 21, 2011)

Congratulations. Thank you for sharing some great pics of a splendid watch.


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## Shazzyk (Aug 26, 2016)

Nice. Really like the movement trough display back.


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## schizophrenia (Jun 2, 2017)

Atleo said:


> This example and these references look amazing. Congrats!
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


took me a while to get these photos done. I only have a mobile phone, you know. haaa


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## schizophrenia (Jun 2, 2017)

Baric said:


> Congratulations on a great watch. Mine says hi... (internet photo)
> which one do you own? exactly as the one in photo? that's a really good looking one
> 
> 
> ...


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## Atleo (Aug 6, 2016)

schizophrenia said:


> took me a while to get these photos done. I only have a mobile phone, you know. haaa


Srsly I thought those pics were great. This model may be on my short list.

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## schizophrenia (Jun 2, 2017)

Atleo said:


> Srsly I thought those pics were great. This model may be on my short list.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


the newer model of this tricolor will be available for sales in July this year with the less overlapping subdials. the only letdown is the "36'000 VpH" will be gone.


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## Baric (Aug 23, 2014)

schizophrenia said:


> Baric said:
> 
> 
> > Congratulations on a great watch. Mine says hi... (internet photo)
> ...



Yep, that exact watch, its the 42mm 36'000 VPH, blue dial, Charles Vermont limited edition. I love blue.


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## schizophrenia (Jun 2, 2017)

Baric said:


> schizophrenia said:
> 
> 
> > Baric said:
> ...



That's really cool...


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## Atleo (Aug 6, 2016)

schizophrenia said:


> the newer model of this tricolor will be available for sales in July this year with the less overlapping subdials. the only letdown is the "36'000 VpH" will be gone.


I didn't realize that. Why is that? New movement or is there a functional advantage to not having such a high beat?

These models are harder to find used as it is. Compared to a Rolex or omega at least. I'll be interested to see the newer model and how the aesthetics compare. The overlapping sub dials isn't for everyone but it is a very unique feature.

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## EnderW (Mar 16, 2015)

Atleo said:


> I didn't realize that. Why is that? New movement or is there a functional advantage to not having such a high beat?
> 
> These models are harder to find used as it is. Compared to a Rolex or omega at least. I'll be interested to see the newer model and how the aesthetics compare. The overlapping sub dials isn't for everyone but it is a very unique feature.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


face-palm.
The movement will still be good-old 36kvph El Primero.
The text on the dial is being removed. Seems like Zenith is trying to simplify some dials, so they are removing "Automatic" and "36,000 vph" from dials, but watches will still be both automatic and high-beat.


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## EnderW (Mar 16, 2015)

Atleo said:


> I didn't realize that. Why is that? New movement or is there a functional advantage to not having such a high beat?
> 
> These models are harder to find used as it is. Compared to a Rolex or omega at least. I'll be interested to see the newer model and how the aesthetics compare. The overlapping sub dials isn't for everyone but it is a very unique feature.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


As far as your 2nd point....
Rolex makes about 1M watches annually.
Omega makes 800K annually
Zenith - <35K annually

Hence number of Zenith watches available in used market (and in new market) is very small in comparison.


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## schizophrenia (Jun 2, 2017)

Atleo said:


> I didn't realize that. Why is that? New movement or is there a functional advantage to not having such a high beat?
> 
> These models are harder to find used as it is. Compared to a Rolex or omega at least. I'll be interested to see the newer model and how the aesthetics compare. The overlapping sub dials isn't for everyone but it is a very unique feature.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk





EnderW said:


> face-palm.
> The movement will still be good-old 36kvph El Primero.
> The text on the dial is being removed. Seems like Zenith is trying to simplify some dials, so they are removing "Automatic" and "36,000 vph" from dials, but watches will still be both automatic and high-beat.


sorry for confusing you Atleo. EnderW is right it's the "text" being removed on the dial. It's quite a face lift in the 2017 version. I actually like the text very much and therefore didn't want to wait for the newer version and bought this old version.


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## Greenbird007 (Jul 2, 2016)

schizophrenia said:


> sorry for confusing you Atleo. EnderW is right it's the "text" being removed on the dial. It's quite a face lift in the 2017 version. I actually like the text very much and therefore didn't want to wait for the newer version and bought this old version.


I have the same tri-color 42mm as you, love it to death, just gorgeous...best looking chrono IMO

Apparently the new ones will look like this, 6 o'clock subdial underneath, no 36000vph and the chrono second hand is silver now instead of red. I think it's losing a lot of character, even if the minute counter is easier to read, I'd take the old one anyday.


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## schizophrenia (Jun 2, 2017)

Greenbird007 said:


> I have the same tri-color 42mm as you, love it to death, just gorgeous...best looking chrono IMO
> 
> the new ones will look like this, 6 o'clock subdial underneath, no 36000vph and the chrono second hand is silver now instead of red. I think it's losing a lot of character, even if the minute counter is easier to read, I'd take the old one anyday.


i didn't expect "chrono second hand is silver now instead of red" ... it really would lose it's character if it did.


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## Alex_TA (May 7, 2013)

Greenbird007 said:


> I have the same tri-color 42mm as you, love it to death, just gorgeous...best looking chrono IMO
> 
> the new ones will look like this, 6 o'clock subdial underneath, no 36000vph and the chrono second hand is silver now instead of red. I think it's losing a lot of character, even if the minute counter is easier to read, I'd take the old one anyday.
> 
> View attachment 12071666


Now THAT is tri-color!


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## Greenbird007 (Jul 2, 2016)

I've just gotta say, I love the tri-color zenith 36000. For all of the drama it seems to inspire, it's just the most unique, beautiful watch, gets lots of questions/compliments. Congrats on getting such a great watch, it's kind of cool that there's not that many out there, we're kind of in a secret club 
I mean yeah a daytona is a great watch for sure, but these are just something else. I don't care about the money or the prestige. These just have a little magic in them.


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## schizophrenia (Jun 2, 2017)

Greenbird007 said:


> I've just gotta say, I love the tri-color zenith 36000. For all of the drama it seems to inspire, it's just the most unique, beautiful watch, gets lots of questions/compliments. Congrats on getting such a great watch, it's kind of cool that there's not that many out there, we're kind of in a secret club
> I mean yeah a daytona is a great watch for sure, but these are just something else. I don't care about the money or the prestige. These just have a little magic in them.


indeed it's beautiful watch. 
As I said to my friends, if they want to get a watch for investment purpose, Zenith apparently is not the best option. But aesthetically and craftsmanship (with history) wise, Zenith seems good value for money. 
sometimes i wonder why Zenith is so underrated that it's investment value never holds.


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## Scribeliever (Mar 4, 2017)

Wonderful!


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## Atleo (Aug 6, 2016)

I'm not offended by the newer version but I agree the older one pops a little more. Either are great and congrats on your purchase. 


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## EnderW (Mar 16, 2015)

Greenbird007 said:


> I have the same tri-color 42mm as you, love it to death, just gorgeous...best looking chrono IMO
> 
> the new ones will look like this, 6 o'clock subdial underneath, no 36000vph and the chrono second hand is silver now instead of red. I think it's losing a lot of character, even if the minute counter is easier to read, I'd take the old one anyday.


I agree it's losing some character.

I'm indifferent to Automatic (before used to be Chronometer) text on the dial
I do like the new subdial layout, although no big deal.
However, losing 36,000 vph text sucks - it is not superfluous text, and it is a differentiator for El Primero as very few watches can boast that beat rate.
And also, losing red second hand reduces the impact of multi-color deal. Yes it's still tri-color, but the color spectrum is shifting more to monochromatic end of spectrum.
The pop of color is what I like most about mine.


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## Greenbird007 (Jul 2, 2016)

the only thing I would consider when it comes to the 42mm is the lug to lug. I have a 7" flat wrist and it's pretty close, I only have a few mm's of clearance on each side. If my wrist was any smaller I would have considered the 38mm. But I like the presence-y larger tool watch look, which the 38mm doesn't really have, unless you have like a < 6" wrist. 
Btw, I think the 38mm is gorgeous, just not as "in yo' face" as I would like.


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## schizophrenia (Jun 2, 2017)

Greenbird007 said:


> the only thing I would consider when it comes to the 42mm is the lug to lug. I have a 7" flat wrist and it's pretty close, I only have a few mm's of clearance on each side. If my wrist was any smaller I would have considered the 38mm. But I like the presence-y larger tool watch look, which the 38mm doesn't really have, unless you have like a < 6" wrist.
> Btw, I think the 38mm is gorgeous, just not as "in yo' face" as I would like.
> View attachment 12081570


in my opinion your 42mm fits so well. great choice.


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## schizophrenia (Jun 2, 2017)

to this El Primero owners, while officially it claims to have 100m water resistance, in face there are no screws on the winder and pushers. Would that still be considered water resistance especially for 100m? If so, how? I am totally curious.


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## gt0279a (May 18, 2009)

The red really makes the watch


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## gt0279a (May 18, 2009)

With regards to the 100m, I would say it's easily achievable with high quality seals for the crown / pushers and sapphire crystals.
I doubt you could get higher wr without adding screwed down elements though.

I remember the when the recent model Tag Heuer Carrera was 50m and they simply used better crown seals and upped it to 100m.


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## DeanSmith (Jun 1, 2016)

Love my Zenith El Primero Pilot Chrono (Zenith El Primero Caliber 4002 (307 parts, 36,000vph) and barely wear to keep it new, then got a Rolex, and another, and another, then soon didn't wear it at all. Sad to have it sit in the case, but it's such a nice watch. Congrats on the find.


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## schizophrenia (Jun 2, 2017)

DeanSmith said:


> Love my *Zenith El Primero Pilot Chrono (Zenith El Primero Caliber 4002 (307 parts, 36,000vph) and barely wear to keep it new, then got a Rolex, and another, and another, then soon didn't wear it at all. Sad to have it sit in the case, but it's such a nice watch. Congrats on the find.*


you should wear it more... unless you don't really like it.


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## gt0279a (May 18, 2009)

Greenbird007 said:


> I have the same tri-color 42mm as you, love it to death, just gorgeous...best looking chrono IMO
> 
> Apparently the new ones will look like this, 6 o'clock subdial underneath, no 36000vph and the chrono second hand is silver now instead of red. I think it's losing a lot of character, even if the minute counter is easier to read, I'd take the old one anyday.
> 
> View attachment 12071666


Looking at that photo again..that is the Gold or two tone model, which I believe have always omitted the 36000vph text and have hand gold seconds hands. They just updated the minute subdial to go over the hour subdial. On the classic Tricolor, the 36000vph text may go, but if the change is in line with the 38mm model, then the red hand would stay.


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## Greenbird007 (Jul 2, 2016)

I hope that you're right, the lighting makes it hard to tell if that's the new two-tone.
It would really be a shame if they lose the red second hand, it's such a part of its charm.


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## Robotaz (Jan 18, 2012)

Wow! Beautiful macros, man. We don't see that all the time, for sure.

Zenith makes some amazing watches. Enjoy that bad boy.


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## Robotaz (Jan 18, 2012)

schizophrenia said:


> sometimes i wonder why Zenith is so underrated that it's investment value never holds.


Even for WUS, that's a really complicated topic. General history, ownership, management, designers, etc.

To me, the ups and downs of Zenith are just part of a beautiful story that would be stale without the drama.


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## ccm123 (Feb 8, 2010)

Looks nice!


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## Greenbird007 (Jul 2, 2016)

you gonna post a wrist shot or what?!


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## schizophrenia (Jun 2, 2017)

Greenbird007 said:


> you gonna post a wrist shot or what?!


I actually posted before at "Who is wearing a Zenith today ?? Show what's on your wrist" but sure, let me repost one here.

View attachment 12185538


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## Greenbird007 (Jul 2, 2016)

Coolest watch...hands down...end of contest....out


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## RocketHurricane (Sep 27, 2013)

Does anyone have any leather strap recommendations for this model - El Primero 36,000 VpH 42? I don't like croc style straps like mine came with and I'm having a hard time finding anything that will fit the 21mm lug width. I have a 22mm grey suede from B and R bands that kind of fits but I don't think the color works.



















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## Greenbird007 (Jul 2, 2016)

RocketHurricane said:


> Does anyone have any leather strap recommendations for this model - El Primero 36,000 VpH 42? I don't like croc style straps like mine came with and I'm having a hard time finding anything that will fit the 21mm lug width. I have a 22mm grey suede from B and R bands that kind of fits but I don't think the color works.
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


You could talk to Valeriy at Aprell Workshop, he custom makes watch straps. Pretty reasonable pricing and he does exactly what you ask. My Zenith came with the thin edge dressy style strap which I don't like. He just made me a brown croc 21mm/18mm 115/80 4mm to 3mm taper flat strap for my tri-color so I can use the factory deployant clasp. He just put it in the mail to me, I could post a pic on the watch when I get it. He does every kind of leather even fish/chicken/cobra no joke. Go look at his posts here on the forum. Quality seems good, here's a shot he took of my strap before shipping.


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## Greenbird007 (Jul 2, 2016)

Also, if you like the suede but not the color, if you're a little handy, you could buy some angelus suede dye of the color of your choice and dye it, maybe a rich brown perhaps. That would cost you all of about 10 dollars  but get the suede dye not the leather dye.


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## Greenbird007 (Jul 2, 2016)

RocketHurricane, I just got my strap from Apprel, here are a couple pics


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## schizophrenia (Jun 2, 2017)

Greenbird007 said:


> RocketHurricane, I just got my strap from Apprel, here are a couple pics


very nice...


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## GreatLakesWatch (Aug 12, 2016)

Congrats on your purchase. I am seeing pics of them on the black croc strap more and more and think it looks fantastic. I have also seen dials of the reissue that has the 36'000 in black, now in red, or missing altogether. I forget which color the 1969 model had on the dial, but I think I like the black the best. The dials with the VPH missing just seems wrong to me. Has anyone else seen them with other dials?


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## b-lot (Jul 5, 2015)

RocketHurricane said:


> Does anyone have any leather strap recommendations for this model - El Primero 36,000 VpH 42? I don't like croc style straps like mine came with and I'm having a hard time finding anything that will fit the 21mm lug width. I have a 22mm grey suede from B and R bands that kind of fits but I don't think the color works.


Not leather, but I found the gunmetal grey nato strap from WatchGecko works really well with (technically the 38mm variant of) this watch. Not sure there's anything available in leather of that colour.
I tend to use 20mm straps on 19mm lugs, so I'm sure 22 will work on 21 as well.


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## RocketHurricane (Sep 27, 2013)

b-lot said:


> Not leather, but I found the gunmetal grey nato strap from WatchGecko works really well with (technically the 38mm variant of) this watch. Not sure there's anything available in leather of that colour.
> I tend to use 20mm straps on 19mm lugs, so I'm sure 22 will work on 21 as well.


I purchased the MODEL 2 PREMIUM - NAVY strap from Worn & Wound. I think the navy works well with the tri-color sub dials. It's a 20mm, but there website says they run wider, and it fills the 21mm lugs nicely. I'll probably pick up some in other colors now so I can have some variety. I don't have a photo handy but I'll try and post one next week.

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## schizophrenia (Jun 2, 2017)

b-lot said:


> Not leather, but I found the gunmetal grey nato strap from WatchGecko works really well with (technically the 38mm variant of) this watch. Not sure there's anything available in leather of that colour.
> I tend to use 20mm straps on 19mm lugs, so I'm sure 22 will work on 21 as well.





RocketHurricane said:


> I purchased the MODEL 2 PREMIUM - NAVY strap from Worn & Wound. I think the navy works well with the tri-color sub dials. It's a 20mm, but there website says they run wider, and it fills the 21mm lugs nicely. I'll probably pick up some in other colors now so I can have some variety. I don't have a photo handy but I'll try and post one next week.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk



Any photos of the watch with the straps to share?


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## Greenbird007 (Jul 2, 2016)

eric.mcghee said:


> Congrats on your purchase. I am seeing pics of them on the black croc strap more and more and think it looks fantastic. I have also seen dials of the reissue that has the 36'000 in black, now in red, or missing altogether. I forget which color the 1969 model had on the dial, but I think I like the black the best. The dials with the VPH missing just seems wrong to me. Has anyone else seen them with other dials?


 Here's one without the vph, kind of a different watch without it


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## schizophrenia (Jun 2, 2017)

Greenbird007 said:


> Here's one without the vph, kind of a different watch without it


so this is your new purchase? so this is also 42mm? What's exactly is the style number of this one? mine is 03.2040.400/69.C494


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## b-lot (Jul 5, 2015)

schizophrenia said:


> Any photos of the watch with the straps to share?


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## schizophrenia (Jun 2, 2017)

nice...


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## RossFraney (Mar 2, 2017)

It will never not amaze me how they managed to fit such complexity in such a small case. Congratulations, amazing purchase.


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## Greenbird007 (Jul 2, 2016)

schizophrenia said:


> so this is your new purchase? so this is also 42mm? What's exactly is the style number of this one? mine is 03.2040.400/69.C494


No...here's mine






same model# as yours...42mm


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## RocketHurricane (Sep 27, 2013)

Here is the Worn & Wound strap:



















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## asr53 (Mar 18, 2012)

Bloody hell watches that can talk lol.


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## vujen (Oct 8, 2015)

El Primero is always one of the best choices possible.
Congratulations, mate!


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## schizophrenia (Jun 2, 2017)

vujen said:


> El Primero is always one of the best choices possible.
> Congratulations, mate!


it feels like a more obscure and pragmatic brand. Hope it doesn't get influenced too much by LVMH to go the fashion way.


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## Level.5x (Jun 7, 2015)

schizophrenia said:


> it feels like a more obscure and pragmatic brand. Hope it doesn't get influenced too much by LVMH to go the fashion way.


I really can't see that happening...things look positive for the brand. Would you prefer going back to the now defunct, Zenith Electronics company owning Zenith, the watchmaking company, instead? Lol I'll stick with LVMH's ownership which has been nothing but good for the brand from what I've seen.


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## schizophrenia (Jun 2, 2017)

For the love of my Zenith El Primero, I made this video with my phone and my hand pulling the watch.


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## schizophrenia (Jun 2, 2017)

For the love of my Zenith El Primero, I made another one with my phone and my hand rotating the watch.


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## RSubmariner (Nov 8, 2015)

Does anyone have this watch with its original SS bracelet, how do you find it in person? It looks a bit to shiny/blingy on pics/videos. Great watch for that money btw.


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## schizophrenia (Jun 2, 2017)

RSubmariner said:


> Does anyone have this watch with its original SS bracelet, how do you find it in person? It looks a bit to shiny/blingy on pics/videos. Great watch for that money btw.


Maybe this post could help you? It's 38mm but it should be the same anyway
https://www.watchuseek.com/f27/just-got-my-38mm-36000vph-updated-subdials-pics-4495341.html


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## Greenbird007 (Jul 2, 2016)

Biver, I think may modernize the brand, hopefully they hang on to the traditional style as well


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