# Steinhart vs. Stowa



## manofrolex (Jul 9, 2012)

I have been browsing the forums for a while now but honestly it is hard to keep up with all the comments out there.
Can someone tell me if it is worth spending the $ on a Stowa Flieger (the one I am looking at ends up at 743 euros: cosc + deployment buckle). However when looking at Steinhart and one cannot help looking :-d I see a Nav-B vintage in Titanium for 362 euros. Now granted not cosc but even if you take away the 160 euros for a cosc Stowa you pretty much have 2 Steinhart for 1 Stowa and in Titanium. Last time I checked Ti is more expensive as well so I am not getting the price diff. I understand the Stein is not waterproof which is a drawback imo. Does anyone know if they have a plan to make a h20 proof one any time soon because if they do I would be tempted to go for the Stein especially with the cost diff? I own a Triton already so I am not afraid to by Stein.
Any pointers would be good

btw: I am not too worried about the historical reality of the watch in the sense that I don;t really care if it looks exactly the same as the so called 5 or so brands that built Nav-B's way back then.


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## James_ (Sep 5, 2011)

I've been thinking about this. It's a hard decision! Maybe if you bought the Steinhart, you could use the money saved to make it waterproof (if possible). Maybe get the gaskets changed?


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## Ira G. (Dec 26, 2010)

Tough question. All I know is that I have bought three Steinhart's in the past 1 1/2 years. My Omega, Breitling, and other "status" brands do not get anywhere near the wrist time they used too. Is the Stowa going to be a better made watch, more than likely. Is it more historically significant, absolutely. Are you really going to notice these things when that gorgeous Vintage is sitting on your wrist, not likely. Worst cast scenario is you buy the Steinhart, decide you do not like it, sell it to me, and go buy the Stowa. :-d:-d:-d


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## manofrolex (Jul 9, 2012)

Ira G. said:


> Tough question. All I know is that I have bought three Steinhart's in the past 1 1/2 years. My Omega, Breitling, and other "status" brands do not get anywhere near the wrist time they used too. Is the Stowa going to be a better made watch, more than likely. Is it more historically significant, absolutely. Are you really going to notice these things when that gorgeous Vintage is sitting on your wrist, not likely. Worst cast scenario is you buy the Steinhart, decide you do not like it, sell it to me, and go buy the Stowa. :-d:-d:-d


awesome response but I am not much of a flipper. I have a Oris Rectangular Moon Phase that I used to wear all the time but now it just sits there. I am sure I could get decent $ for it but it is too much effort so in case I wear it again for some dressed up occasion.


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## senna89wc12 (Feb 27, 2009)

I currently have the Stowa Flieger and the Steinhart Nav B-Uhr II auto. Both are excellent timepieces. Exterior wise both look very similar. Something to keep in mind why the Stowa Flieger is more expensive:


The temperature-blued steel hands made by Universo, which are extremely well made and look fantastic. This must have driven the price up as their hands are expensive.
The better brushed case finish (grinded by hand) compared to the Steinhart.
I guess the brand name Stowa, and the fact that Stowa was one of the 5 original manufacturers who made the original B-Uhr watches make them more desirable and expensive.
Stowa has the handmade German silver rotor with B-Uhr engraving and better decoration on the ETA 2824-2 like the blue screws. I think the 2824 used in the Nav B is not decorated.
Sapphire crystal caseback vs the solid case back of the Nav B. Sapphire crystal back costs a bit more I think.

There is no doubt that Stowa Flieger is a better watch which has better case finish and excels in the finest details. *The Steinhart however is still the bang for the buck of all the other Fliegers I have ever come across*.


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## a tired smile (Feb 5, 2012)

Truth be told, although I love Steinhart's Ocean series, I have never liked their pilot style watches. Something about them just seems off to me. 

I would definitely recommend the Stowa. I absolutely love my Stowa Flieger Baumuster-B.


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## manofrolex (Jul 9, 2012)

a tired smile said:


> Truth be told, although I love Steinhart's Ocean series, I have never liked their pilot style watches. Something about them just seems off to me.
> 
> I would definitely recommend the Stowa. I absolutely love my Stowa Flieger Baumuster-B.


seems that the general consensus is that Stowa is a better watch and Stein is a great deal for the money. A tough call to make but based on this I am leaning towards the Stowa and the fact that you don't have to worry about dunking it in water by mistake and be facing serious clean up time.


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## usc1 (Jun 25, 2007)

senna89wc12 said:


> View attachment 787944
> 
> 
> I currently have the Stowa Flieger and the Steinhart Nav B-Uhr II auto. Both are excellent timepieces. Exterior wise both look very similar. Something to keep in mind why the Stowa Flieger is more expensive:
> ...


I would totally agree. Stowa has a better finish. The additional cost of the Stowa is up to the buyer. If you are seeking the look of a flieger and do not care too much about the fine details of the watch, then the Steinhart will more than good enough.


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## a tired smile (Feb 5, 2012)

jmanlay said:


> seems that the general consensus is that Stowa is a better watch and Stein is a great deal for the money. A tough call to make but based on this I am leaning towards the Stowa and the fact that you don't have to worry about dunking it in water by mistake and be facing serious clean up time.


Another thing to keep in mind is that Stowa's are made to order and you don't pay until it's about to ship. The general wait time is about 3 months, so that's plenty of time to save up extra cash for it.


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## pavel36 (Mar 20, 2012)

senna89wc12 said:


> I currently have the Stowa Flieger and the Steinhart Nav B-Uhr II auto. Both are excellent timepieces. Exterior wise both look very similar. Something to keep in mind why the Stowa Flieger is more expensive:
> 
> 
> The temperature-blued steel hands made by Universo, which are extremely well made and look fantastic. This must have driven the price up as their hands are expensive.
> ...


To add to this list a 5 ATM water resistance Stowa has over Steinhart..

I currently have Steinhart "Nav.B-Uhr II vintage TITANIUM", i also have Laco Munster and i my Stowa (no logo) pilot was suppose to be here by now, but delayed for a month (ordered in April).. 
I can't comment on the quality of stowa pilot yet, but I do have Stowa Marine Automatic, that come in the same case as the Stowa Pilot, and the quality of that case to notch..
I still like Steinhart Pilot, but i do like my Laco better.. The lume on the Laco beats any other lume i have on other watches. 
The laco look and feel somewhat different from both Steinhart or Stowa, it has a more authentic WW2 feel to it. At first i did not care for that aspect much, but now i really like it. Another thing about Laco pilots.. dealing with their store and support is a pleasure. 
From the moment i placed an order on the Laco website, to the time i held the watch in my hands in Canada - 2 days.
Plus i had to call them cause there was a problem paying via PayPall... they answered the phone, talked to me in english and then followed up with the email.. 
anyway.. sorry, i did not mean to have this post to be an advertisement for a different watch maker.
I love steinhart watches (mostly divers) and have in total 5 of them. And Steinhart too cam through with the warranty and support when i needed it on one ocasion....

as a summary to my verbal diarrhea here: steinhart pilots a good value for the price you pay. Stowa - better quality and value (you can see the sales corner, they are usually sold for the same price they were bought or more in no time..)... for stowa you have to wait though.. As i have mentioned I've been waiting for mine since April. 
As an alternative, look into Laco watches. - also better quality, also an original manufacturer of the WW2 pilots, more authentic look - and no wait to get them.

Good luck with your choice.. .. and yeah... there is no wrong choice..every one has their own taste and likes.. enjoy..

P.S. that is my Laco


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## senna89wc12 (Feb 27, 2009)

pavel36: Nice Laco! I agreed with you totally. The Stowa and Steinhart looks more contemporary while the Laco is more in tune to the original B-watches. One more thing to add, the C1 lume used in the Steinhart Nav B-Uhr II auto is much weaker than the C3 used in the Stowa.


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## pavel36 (Mar 20, 2012)

thanks for the Laco complements...

I just wanted to mention one more thing.. with regards to comparing these pilot watches: the size..
Steinhart is larger than any of the mentioned above 
Diameter: 
the Laco 42 mm (though they do have 45 mm versions too, as well as 36mm and even the original size of 55 mm if u can find it)
Stowa: only 40mm
Steinhart: 44(some models 47mm)

So if you have a large wrist stowa will look smallish on it.. On my 7.25 it looks somewhat delicate... 
Stowa will look more delicate comparing to Steinhart also because Steinhart case is thicker... 

Actually in the beginning when i was choosing the pilot and tried to decide (at the time between Laco and Stowa) the size end up being a decisive factor....
but then I endup ordering Stowa anyway. I like pilot watches and felt that my collection will not be completed without Stowa..


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## senna89wc12 (Feb 27, 2009)

You are right. The size does matter for most people.

Having had the Stowa for over two years now, I still feel that this is the best watch I have ever bought. Something in this watch that makes it special for me. The size however feels a bit small as time passes.. It is still a very wearable size and it fulfills the dress watch role in my collection. My Flieger is the special edition 2801 which the flat case back makes the watch feels even smaller on the wrist.

I absolutely love the 44mm case diameter and 14.2 case thickness of the Steinhart. It feels "just right" on my wrist. It has the heft that the Stowa doesn't have, which I think is important in a pilot watch. I guess it is right that once you have worn a big watch, you can't go back to a smaller size.

I did own a Laco 42mm pilot with the Miyota movement briefly and the size is just right. 

All in all, the Stowa looks more elegant and beautiful, while the Steinhart looks bigger, more robust, and more muscular. It's like comparing a pretty, smaller woman (Stowa) with bigger but still beautiful woman (Steinhart).:-d


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## manofrolex (Jul 9, 2012)

senna89wc12 said:


> You are right. The size does matter for most people.
> 
> Having had the Stowa for over two years now, I still feel that this is the best watch I have ever bought. Something in this watch that makes it special for me. The size however feels a bit small as time passes.. It is still a very wearable size and it fulfills the dress watch role in my collection. My Flieger is the special edition 2801 which the flat case back makes the watch feels even smaller on the wrist.
> 
> ...


thanks for all the awesome comments.
I was torn, Steinhart, Stowa, Laco, Archimede...sooo many to chose from at least within a reasonable range (may be I will get one of each one day but I think my wife would notice :roll.
So let's start with one.
Even though I agree the Stowa looks like it is a overall better quality watch at least against Stein and Laco, I hooked a 45mm Laco today with the hand-winding 2804-2 movement today for what I think was a very reasonable price. I will post pics as soon as I get it which should be sometimes next week.

one question for you all out there? how frequently do you take your watch for maintenance of eta movement? is there some golden rule I should be aware of?


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## a tired smile (Feb 5, 2012)

jmanlay said:


> thanks for all the awesome comments.
> I was torn, Steinhart, Stowa, Laco, Archimede...sooo many to chose from at least within a reasonable range (may be I will get one of each one day but I think my wife would notice :roll.
> So let's start with one.
> Even though I agree the Stowa looks like it is a overall better quality watch at least against Stein and Laco, I hooked a 45mm Laco today with the hand-winding 2804-2 movement today for what I think was a very reasonable price. I will post pics as soon as I get it which should be sometimes next week.
> ...


5 years is the general time you should get it serviced, but many watches run fine for years without servicing. Many watches have likely been sitting on a shelf for months or years before being purchased.


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## Uwe W. (Jan 7, 2009)

a tired smile said:


> 5 years is the general time you should get it serviced, but many watches run fine for years without servicing.


That _is _the general consensus. My watchmaker has a different opinion: "Is it running okay? Good, then leave it alone. Worry about servicing it at the first sign that its performance is changing." With over 50 mechanical watches in my collection that's the approach to servicing I've adopted, otherwise I'd need a spread sheet to keep track of which was serviced when.


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## PabloM5 (Aug 2, 2012)

My reason for not going for one of Steinhart's great looking Fliegeruhren was utilitarian: it isn't waterproof and I'm not always careful... In my book it was a real mistake by Steinhart not to waterproof these great pieces - and one that I hope they'll remedy sooner rather than later. Untill then it's Laco for me: original producer, waterproof and in my prefered size of 42mm.

Cheers

Eske


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## manofrolex (Jul 9, 2012)

PabloM5 said:


> My reason for not going for one of Steinhart's great looking Fliegeruhren was utilitarian: it isn't waterproof and I'm not always careful... In my book it was a real mistake by Steinhart not to waterproof these great pieces - and one that I hope they'll remedy sooner rather than later. Untill then it's Laco for me: original producer, waterproof and in my prefered size of 42mm.
> 
> Cheers
> 
> Eske


I must admit that was a deal breaker for me when i bought the Laco. Just alone today i had to bathe the kids, wash the dishes, water the yard... and if my watch were not waterproof all i would have been doing is taking it on and off all day. I know what would end up to that watch in the long run, it would stay in the box and rarely see light of day so i would agree that not being waterpoof is a significant flaw. I have no idea if the original nav b's were waterproof but if they were then that would have been a nice thing to follow and just to make the watch more "user friendly". I have no idea what the cost is to a watchmaker to waterprof a watch but in general seals are usually not that pricey.


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## pavel36 (Mar 20, 2012)

pavel36 said:


> thanks for the Laco complements...
> 
> I just wanted to mention one more thing.. with regards to comparing these pilot watches: the size..
> Steinhart is larger than any of the mentioned above
> ...


I know the thread has been dead for awhile, but i thought i would add that after wearing stowa for couple of weeks it no longer feels all that small.. 
Here are the family picture of my stowa and laco.. 
I also do have the Steinhart Nav.B-Uhr II vintage TITANIUM 44 mm.. and will try to take a picture of all three side by side in a near future...

Love all of them.. each has a something special to offer...


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## manofrolex (Jul 9, 2012)

pavel36 said:


> I know the thread has been dead for awhile, but i thought i would add that after wearing stowa for couple of weeks it no longer feels all that small..
> Here are the family picture of my stowa and laco..
> I also do have the Steinhart Nav.B-Uhr II vintage TITANIUM 44 mm.. and will try to take a picture of all three side by side in a near future...
> 
> Love all of them.. each has a something special to offer...


I guess it all comes down to each owner. 44-45mm feels right for me. I was hesitant at 1st but knowing a 45 is ok for me a Stowa 40mm Baumuster B seems too small imo. I have a Laco 45 and Alpina Startimer 44 and they both feel good so I am sticking to it. Anything > 45mm I feel would look odd as well. Might be able to swing a Steinhart 47mm but I think I would be pushing my luck


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## boylah (Sep 22, 2012)

pavel36 said:


> I also do have the Steinhart Nav.B-Uhr II vintage TITANIUM 44 mm.. and will try to take a picture of all three side by side in a near future...


Pavel36 - any change for some pix of all 3? I'm looking at a 44-45mm A-type (47mm too big) and debating between a Steinhart Vintage Titanium vs Laco. Stowa is last on list but hoping some pix will help me decide. I'm particularly keen to compare the colour of Steinhart's Titanium Vintage vs Laco's matt finish. Also, the vintage yellow markers vs Laco's white. Cheers! ;-)


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## pavel36 (Mar 20, 2012)

boylah said:


> Pavel36 - any change for some pix of all 3? I'm looking at a 44-45mm A-type (47mm too big) and debating between a Steinhart Vintage Titanium vs Laco. Stowa is last on list but hoping some pix will help me decide. I'm particularly keen to compare the colour of Steinhart's Titanium Vintage vs Laco's matt finish. Also, the vintage yellow markers vs Laco's white. Cheers! ;-)


here you go


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## Hl247b (Mar 25, 2013)

The introduction of the Steinhart Nav-B Uhr 44mm Premium with the Soprod A10 movement probably merits opening this discussion again. I was considering getting a Stowa until recently but am now in a quandry given they've run out of their Elabore ETA 2824 movements. Next available time is April 2014 ! However, they have a 2824 Top grade movements available for their fliegers priced around EUR 810 ! The Steinhart Premium with Soprod seems to be a great value at EUR 490 given the Soprod and 2824 Top seem to be comparable movements. Other than case finish, blued hands and the Stowa heritage, what else would I be paying the premium for if I was to get the Stowa? I'd appreciate comments and insight


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## Riker (Mar 31, 2007)

I really do believe the new Steinhart Soprod based Auto Premium Nav's have put some if not all other makers with similar watches on notice. The Soprod A10 used in the Premium is better than an Elabore 2824 & not far off the Top 2824. Regarding the case finishes I again believe they are not far removed from each other in quality & finish. I have seen the 41mm Stowa L.E flieger (same case used on their Marine) & it has a very nicely finished case that I liked very much but I did not see it to be that much better than a Steinhart case IMO. The Nav Premium auto is exceptional value but the one question some will ask is size of the watches. Stowa are well known for using smaller cases for their flieger watches which has been good for them where-as Steinhart use 44 & 47mm cases which they have made thinner to be more attractive to a wider audience. I would also say the case Stowa use for their flieger auto which is the case you would be considering is not as attractive as the L.E manual flieger/Marine 41mm case or the Steinhart Nav cases. Your biggest concern may well come down to size & to this I would suggest the 44mm Steinhart Premium Nav would be a perfect choice with it's new thinner case.

For near half the price the Steinhart Premium auto's are a very attractive buy. Of course, history is relevant here & Stowa has that but that could be seen as not such a big factor for todays watches. One of our members here has ordered one so no doubt within a week or so he will put up some pics & his opinion of the watch.



Hl247b said:


> The introduction of the Steinhart Nav-B Uhr 44mm Premium with the Soprod A10 movement probably merits opening this discussion again. I was considering getting a Stowa until recently but am now in a quandry given they've run out of their Elabore ETA 2824 movements. Next available time is April 2014 ! However, they have a 2824 Top grade movements available for their fliegers priced around EUR 810 ! The Steinhart Premium with Soprod seems to be a great value at EUR 490 given the Soprod and 2824 Top seem to be comparable movements. Other than case finish, blued hands and the Stowa heritage, what else would I be paying the premium for if I was to get the Stowa? I'd appreciate comments and insight


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## Tony A.H (Aug 2, 2009)

as you said. the Premium with Soprod is a Great Value. and agree with James. i'd get this Watch if the 44mm Diameter is Not a Concern.
you're going to like the Fit & Finish, the Caliber, Dial, Hands and the overall look of this Watch.. wait to you see it in the Metal. you'll me impressed .

Good Luck


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## sandymcg (Dec 16, 2012)

I own both the Steinhart Nav B in titanium, and a Stowa Flieger - I love the Steinhart (and subsequently bought an OVM because the Nav B was such great value), but there is a significant difference in dial quality between the two. E.g., the Steinhart lume is very thin by comparison. Not sure whether the Steinhart premium has a better quality dial, but the Steinhart/Stowa difference is about more than just movements.


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