# Damasko - Horrible customer service



## JanW

So I brought a used Damasko from the forums. As a used watch, I thought I would send it to Damasko Germany for general servicing, as well as do some general modifications (hand change plus fitting with a bracelet). I emailed Nadja, and was quoted a total service cost plus bracelet is around €900. Pricey, but a price I was more than willing to pay.

No problem at this point. I paid the bill, sent the watch and requested Nadja to send back the watch indicating that the watch is coming back to my country *from repair*, for customs purposes. She says she will do so. Then a few days ago I get a notice from my customs office, total customs cost: *$500* (equivalent in local currency). Apparently, there was no indication that the watch was for repair, and hence customs considered it a new watch and applied customs accordingly.

So I email Nadja and request something, anything, that they can issue to the effect that they sent the watch back to me from servicing. It's been nearly a week and *nothing*. Not even a cursory acknowledgement.

I am never going through official Damasko servicing again. I was also considering getting a Damasko chronograph, not doing that also. In the long term, I would think that good customer service would be good for a brand. This entire experience has tarnished my view of Damasko in general, particularly as I went through their official service.


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## Mirabello1

How did customs come up with the $500 figure.. was there a receipt with the watch for the full retail of the watch

Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk


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## JanW

They calculated it from the total invoice (service cost), which did not indicate repair. Which I specifically requested to be there for customs purposes.


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## daffie

Indeed terrible customer service  I would be fuming! 

I have heard stories before about the nonexistent cs of damasko. They really should begin making a strong effort. It's not optional...it should be standard practice! Especially within the price ranges of products we are talking about. 

After hearing your story I will strongly debate whether or not to purchase another Damasko in the future. My very first one is still on it's way and should arrive next week. 

Hoping Damasko are still able and willing to help you solve your issue... 

Sent from my SM-G930F using Tapatalk


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## Luke*

You could try and call them I know that's what I would do for sure.


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## timefleas

Something is wrong here. Your imposed fee suggested a duty rate well in excess of 50%, yet Indonesia only imposes 10% in duty fees for importing of watches (the world standard is on the average of 12%). You should not have paid the duty without first seeing the paperwork, and you could have contested it--once you pay, though, you accept it. In Indonesia, Japan and many other countries, one protection is to first register the outgoing shipment for repair with the post office, a document you can then produce when problems occur upon their return. While I do agree that the Damasko folks were remiss in not clearly indicating that the watch was being returned to its original owner after repair (which should have been done on the declaration of goods invoice), but I am equally puzzled as to why your fees were a staggering $500--even as a new watch, the fee should have been just over $100.


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## Nokie

> You could try and call them I know that's what I would do for sure.


Good idea.


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## StufflerMike

JanW said:


> They calculated it from the total invoice (service cost), which did not indicate repair. Which I specifically requested to be there for customs purposes.


From this post I take the invoice was made up for service costs, right ? Service costs and repair does not make any difference for customs. Why should a service bill indicate repairs when no repairs have been done ?
To add the bracelet to repair costs would be tax evasion, no ?

Call the complaints office. 500 is still way to much. Something is wrong with this exaggerated fee.


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## nepatriot

timefleas said:


> Something is wrong here. Your imposed fee suggested a duty rate well in excess of 50%, yet Indonesia only imposes 10% in duty fees for importing of watches (the world standard is on the average of 12%). You should not have paid the duty without first seeing the paperwork, and you could have contested it--once you pay, though, you accept it. In Indonesia, Japan and many other countries, one protection is to first register the outgoing shipment for repair with the post office, a document you can then produce when problems occur upon their return. While I do agree that the Damasko folks were remiss in not clearly indicating that the watch was being returned to its original owner after repair (which should have been done on the declaration of goods invoice), but I am equally puzzled as to why your fees were a staggering $500--even as a new watch, the fee should have been just over $100.


Yes, I noticed that too, but don't know what is customary for duty rates.

It almost sounds line they charged the duty fee based on a valuation of the watch? Such as a declared value or insured amount?


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## bpjacobs

nepatriot said:


> Yes, I noticed that too, but don't know what is customary for duty rates.
> 
> It almost sounds line they charged the duty fee based on a valuation of the watch? Such as a declared value or insured amount?



If you bought one of those rather nice ice-hardened steel/titanium bracelets - Manufactory Steel Bracelet | Watch-Manufacture Damasko - , a good portion of the 900EUR probably was for new product.


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## StufflerMike

bpjacobs said:


> If you bought one of those rather nice ice-hardened steel/titanium bracelets - Manufactory Steel Bracelet | Watch-Manufacture Damasko - , a good portion of the 900EUR probably was for new product.


Good point. However, 500 seems quite a lot. > 50 % ??????


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## blowfish89

The non-responsiveness, bad communication and general indifference towards customers of the Damasko Germany folks is really deterring me from getting another Damasko, especially a more advanced model (like the Si ones, as I wanted to get a 67Si). I absolutely love the watches, but it is embarrassing that their dealers (such as Watchmann, Page&Cooper and Gnomon) have praiseworthy reviews and shoulder the service responsibility, in contrast to dealing with the mothership in Germany.


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## daffie

blowfish89 said:


> The non-responsiveness, bad communication and general indifference towards customers of the Damasko Germany folks is really deterring me from getting another Damasko, especially a more advanced model (like the Si ones, as I wanted to get a 67Si). I absolutely love the watches, but it is embarrassing that their dealers (such as Watchmann, Page&Cooper and Gnomon) have praiseworthy reviews and shoulder the service responsibility, in contrast to dealing with the mothership in Germany.


I agree...this is putting me off as well. First Damasko is on its way to me but will have serious doubts whether to buy a Damasko again... especially one of the higher priced models like the DK10 with in-house movement.

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## bpjacobs

I think the problem may be lack of communication channels more than poor customer service; we haven't heard Damasko's side of things. If you consider that Damasko are now willing to custom make their standard line watches to the specifications of individual end-users, that suggests to me a strong intent to provide customer satisfaction. The company would benefit from a "face-person" to address customer enquiries. For example, Raphael Ickler, who founded Defakto watches, personally responds to emailed questions and tracks relevant Watchuseek forums. Jorg Schauer does a great job on the Stowa forum here.


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## nepatriot

Years ago I had a problem with an Italian dive watch, and decided to try to deal directly with manufacturer, a small company probably much like Damasko. Appalling customer service. After many weeks and complete frustration, I ended up working with the AD; the problem was resolved almost immediately, and a upgraded replacement watch delivered in a few days, with the option of comparing the original and replacement at my leisure so I could decide. 

The bad CS I had could be attributed to two things: language barrier, and the mfg not being geared up to dealing directly with their end consumers, outside limited interaction usually within their own country. What little I know about German culture, and engineering types in general, is they pride themselves on perfection, and don't like to admit mistakes. The several engineers I know are like a few doctors I know: they are never wrong, no matter how wrong they are. Confronted with the facts of an error related to their profession, they don't shrug it off as "sorry, my bad". Instead, they will quietly fix the problem, but on their own terms and time table. I have had several dealings with Japanese companies, where admitting an error is avoided at all costs. The traditional approach was to ignore; if unsuccessful, consumer-shaming was not uncommon. Only when the consumer relented, and even apologized to the mfg, was a quite solution offered up. This can infuriate western consumers, who will take to social media, or even the mainstream media, file complaints, and in general pile on more and more evidence, if the mfg does not quickly take ownership, apologize, and offer satisfaction. I have seen Nikon and Cannon let a relatively minor mfg issues needlessly fester into a major PR problems. They are adapting however, and in recent cases have gone quite the opposite, with immediate unconditional apologies, over communication, and a more Westen style "customer first" policy.

As bpjacobs some others have noted, this could be some of the issue here: Damasko does not seem to have a well developed process\protocol when dealing with their end user, especially outside Germany. When customers reach out to them directly, there is no consistency because these situations are "one off's": there isn't one person who handles these, and\or the employees who do are not trained CS professionals. The result is inconsistent customer experiences, or consistently poor experiences because the employees have other areas where they may excel, just not CS.

I know the OP did not buy via an AD, but they could perhaps use the USA AD network for a service issue? The OP could have perhaps bought the bracelet from via a US AD, and wrapped in the service too.


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## TheBigBadGRIM

nepatriot said:


> Years ago I had a problem with an Italian dive watch, and decided to try to deal directly with manufacturer, a small company probably much like Damasko. Appalling customer service. After many weeks and complete frustration, I ended up working with the AD; the problem was resolved almost immediately, and a upgraded replacement watch delivered in a few days, with the option of comparing the original and replacement at my leisure so I could decide.
> 
> The bad CS I had could be attributed to two things: language barrier, and the mfg not being geared up to dealing directly with their end consumers, outside limited interaction usually within their own country. What little I know about German culture, and engineering types in general, is they pride themselves on perfection, and don't like to admit mistakes. The several engineers I know are like a few doctors I know: they are never wrong, no matter how wrong they are. Confronted with the facts of an error related to their profession, they don't shrug it off as "sorry, my bad". Instead, they will quietly fix the problem, but on their own terms and time table. I have had several dealings with Japanese companies, where admitting an error is avoided at all costs. The traditional approach was to ignore; if unsuccessful, consumer-shaming was not uncommon. Only when the consumer relented, and even apologized to the mfg, was a quite solution offered up. This can infuriate western consumers, who will take to social media, or even the mainstream media, file complaints, and in general pile on more and more evidence, if the mfg does not quickly take ownership, apologize, and offer satisfaction. I have seen Nikon and Cannon let a relatively minor mfg issues needlessly fester into a major PR problems. They are adapting however, and in recent cases have gone quite the opposite, with immediate unconditional apologies, over communication, and a more Westen style "customer first" policy.
> 
> As bpjacobs some others have noted, this could be some of the issue here: Damasko does not seem to have a well developed process\protocol when dealing with their end user, especially outside Germany. When customers reach out to them directly, there is no consistency because these situations are "one off's": there isn't one person who handles these, and\or the employees who do are not trained CS professionals. The result is inconsistent customer experiences, or consistently poor experiences because the employees have other areas where they may excel, just not CS.
> 
> I know the OP did not buy via an AD, but they could perhaps use the USA AD network for a service issue? The OP could have perhaps bought the bracelet from via a US AD, and wrapped in the service too.


You make a great point.



nepatriot said:


> ...I had a problem with an Italian dive watch...


Locman Montecristo? Just curious. That's the only Italian watch I know and it's awesome.


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## myke

thats pretty sad. I mean you asked upfront for a repair invoice. I purchased a Dk 10 2 years ago . The watch is losing around 15 seconds a day. they wanted me to send it back but i am going to have it regulated here in Canada as i didn't want to have the watch shipped to Gnomon in Singapore and then to Germany and back to me and incur the shipping costs as well as the risk of the watch travelling so far. I feel for you thats a lot of duty to pay


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## sulpher

JanW said:


> I emailed Nadja, (...)
> So I email Nadja and request something, anything, that they can issue to the effect that they sent the watch back to me from servicing. It's been nearly a week and *nothing*. Not even a cursory acknowledgement.


That is something I have read quite a couple of times now. Nadja seems to provide really bad customer service and communication.

See here: Damasko DA46- is it any good?

I quote:


> There were a couple of examples of abysmal customer service, the worst one was when a customer from New Zealand returned a faulty watch under guarantee and they refused to accept delivery because duty was due and the watch was lost in the system. It still hasn't turned up and Damasko defend their position.
> The day-to-day running of dealer and customer relations is in the hands of a young woman who attended the Victor Meldrew School of Customer Care.
> (...)
> As one of their first authorised dealers who sold a LOT of Damasko watches, I'm not particularly happy how the relationship broke down; when I dealt with Konrad direct, everything was good.


Calling Damasko directly might give you a quicker solution than waiting for an email reply that takes days or weeks.


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## Bender.Folder

Bracelet is 600€ and fitting around 60, shipping same. (prices given to me when I inquired for fitting one an older DC56)

So a full overhaul is around 240€ shipping exluded..so you paid 500 USD on an around 700 bracelet with fitting work and shipping...If we exclude the repair, thats about 75% tax fee...

Too expensive to be true imho ..but on damasko side, not selling you the bracelet eu vat free and the rest also is their mistake... But overall for example here in Swiss, when a french customer decides to send his Omega or Rolex himself to Bienne and gets it back, he gets charged a custom fee on the overhaul and shipping, about 20%...Cant escape paying VAT...


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## StufflerMike

> ...not selling you the bracelet eu vat free ...


I read OP's post twice this morning, However, can't find OP did mention this.


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## Bender.Folder

Anyway this is the second thread about poor Damasko experience but no real proof or answers in the end...Speaking german I always got fast and accurate replies to my e-mails. Except language bareers and missunderstanding on both sides which can happen, this seems fishy..


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## kaneloacsta

This is one of the reasons I chose to go through an AD for my purchase. They already have a relationship with Damasko and my AD speaks my native language.


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## timefleas

More than 20 replies and we haven't heard anything more than the original 2 posts from the OP--I honestly think this is one of those situations where we really didn't get all of the facts, and to go much further with it is just adding suppositions to conjectures. Moderator Mike makes a good point that a lion's share of the transaction, the cost of the bracelet, was indeed a _purchase_, and not a repair, so the wording of the commercial invoice (used to assess customs fees) really couldn't have simply stated repairs (thus, Damasko was not necessarily in error here), and certainly _some _assessment of fees was justified. Was the total really $500 as claimed? Was there a misunderstanding between the OP and the duty officer, if one actually did contact him? Who knows, and to read anything more into the situation is pure speculation--I look forward to an update from the OP.


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## lvt

Maybe the custom officers think that you bought the watch brand new and they find the watch's MRSP online then they used that info to make the calculation.

But based on the average import taxes on the region, it could have been the import taxe for a watch that costs more than that, for example a Rolex or Omega.

_I'm a professional [desk] diver._


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## Andy Chen

Given that this sub-forum is sponsored by Damasko, I'm surprised that a spokesperson hasn't given the company's side of the story here.


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## timefleas

Andy Chen said:


> Given that this sub-forum is sponsored by Damasko, I'm surprised that a spokesperson hasn't given the company's side of the story here.


This forum is "dedicated to"--not "sponsored by"--and again, I am pretty sure we don't have the whole story, and can't imagine what Damasko could say in this situation, given that.


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## sefrcoko

timefleas said:


> This forum is "dedicated to"--not "sponsored by"--and again, I am pretty sure we don't have the whole story, and can't imagine what Damasko could say in this situation, given that.


Actually this is an Official forum, otherwise it would be under the Watch Brand section. See the Damasko sticky:
https://www.watchuseek.com/showthread.php?p=28165538


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## daffie

timefleas said:


> More than 20 replies and we haven't heard anything more than the original 2 posts from the OP--I honestly think this is one of those situations where we really didn't get all of the facts, and to go much further with it is just adding suppositions to conjectures. Moderator Mike makes a good point that a lion's share of the transaction, the cost of the bracelet, was indeed a _purchase_, and not a repair, so the wording of the commercial invoice (used to assess customs fees) really couldn't have simply stated repairs (thus, Damasko was not necessarily in error here), and certainly _some _assessment of fees was justified. Was the total really $500 as claimed? Was there a misunderstanding between the OP and the duty officer, if one actually did contact him? Who knows, and to read anything more into the situation is pure speculation--I look forward to an update from the OP.


Agreed. Even myself, I kinda jumped to conclusions after first reading the story. Waiting for the OP to clearly state more on this...


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## timefleas

sefrcoko said:


> Actually this is an Official forum, otherwise it would be under the Watch Brand section. See the Damasko sticky:
> Welcome to the new Damasko Uhren Forum on WatchUSeek


Thanks--I stand corrected. Still, _what_, exactly, should they respond to, if indeed they assume the role of sponsor here (until we get a fuller picture from the OP)?


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## Chris Stark

Andy Chen said:


> Given that this sub-forum is sponsored by Damasko, I'm surprised that a spokesperson hasn't given the company's side of the story here.


Yes, agree. There are always two sides to a story.

However, Damasko may not have a dedicated staff or enough staff to respond to every situation that may occur on multiple forums/blogs/websites, or it may simply be their policy not to respond unless contacted directly by the distressed customer.

Whatever the case I hope it gets sorted out.


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## blowfish89

I have never seen an official Damasko response on any thread in this forum, so I doubt they read it.


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## maedox

I sent my Damasko in for regulation recently, through Toptime (AD in Slovakia). Quick, painless and free of charge. I only paid shipping to the AD. 
It seems Damasko doesn't really have the capacity to handle direct customer interaction, but I have always gotten quick answers on questions to the AD, which they in turn forwarded to Damasko.


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## Happy Acres

blowfish89 said:


> I have never seen an official Damasko response on any thread in this forum, so I doubt they read it.


 I wonder why that is.


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## zunka

I think they have to manage customers expectations regards to toll fee. This cannot be first time something like this has happened?


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## StufflerMike

To set the record straight:

A) Delivery note, ref. 20161131 of 11 August 2016, clearly stated "your repair of 04 August 2016"
B) Invoice written in German and English as well, amount 905,21 Euro, clearly stated "your repair of 04 August 2016" and "export delivery, free of sales tax", 
C) European Union export form, MRN 16DE 880443840237E3 filled in correctly as well; under title "Art des Geschäftes" (nature of business): 67 (= return consignment after repair)

Horrible customer service ? I do not see it.


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## daffie

stuffler said:


> To set the record straight:
> 
> A) Delivery note, ref. 20161131 of 11 August 2016, clearly stated "your repair of 04 August 2016"
> B) Invoice written in German and English as well, amount 905,21 Euro, clearly stated "your repair of 04 August 2016" and "export delivery, free of sales tax",
> C) European Union export form, MRN 16DE 880443840237E3 filled in correctly as well; under title "Art des Geschäftes" (nature of business): 67 (= return consignment after repair)
> 
> Horrible customer service ? I do not see it.


Huh...where's this information coming from?


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## StufflerMike

daffie said:


> Huh...where's this information coming from?


Make an educated guess ! Clue: not coming from Sinn.


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## PsyenceFiction

JanW said:


> So I brought a used Damasko from the forums. As a used watch, I thought I would send it to Damasko Germany for general servicing, as well as do some general modifications (hand change plus fitting with a bracelet). I emailed Nadja, and was quoted a total service cost plus bracelet is around €900. Pricey, but a price I was more than willing to pay.
> 
> No problem at this point. I paid the bill, sent the watch and requested Nadja to send back the watch indicating that the watch is coming back to my country *from repair*, for customs purposes. She says she will do so. Then a few days ago I get a notice from my customs office, total customs cost: *$500* (equivalent in local currency). Apparently, there was no indication that the watch was for repair, and hence customs considered it a new watch and applied customs accordingly.
> 
> So I email Nadja and request something, anything, that they can issue to the effect that they sent the watch back to me from servicing. It's been nearly a week and *nothing*. Not even a cursory acknowledgement.
> 
> I am never going through official Damasko servicing again. I was also considering getting a Damasko chronograph, not doing that also. In the long term, I would think that good customer service would be good for a brand. This entire experience has tarnished my view of Damasko in general, particularly as I went through their official service.


as someone from Indonesia, there is a x/m law indicating we are not allowed to receive a second hand product. meaning, you can buy your watch from outside but not allowed to service it outside of Indonesia. and IF you do so, your good is considered as new thus imposed upon tax.

happened to a friend too


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## Gerrard8

Yes, I actually had some first hand information this summer, as I visited Damasko at Barbing.

I first had email communications with a Damasko employee, Janine, everything went fine. I went to their premises on time, the same lady met me and present the Damasko watches. Very professional and to the point introduction. Janine then brought the DA45 black from workshop, the one I planned to buy. 
So far so good.


Then I noticed a small cloudy area on the dial next to 6 O'clock marker. I politely requested to get this fixed, or if they can find another dial for me. I must say Janine is very helpful. She came back and forth twice, unfortunately, all the white dials she took out were with some small black dots or in the worst case: a small cloudy area. 
Then the founder's daughter (sorry, I forgot her name) intervened. She first did not want to acknowledge this is a quality issue, and claimed the dials are made by a third party supplier, therefore they can not control the details and quality. I politely said that this not your fault, but I would appreciate if you can help to find one without black dots or small cloudy area. 

In the end, none of the 4 or 5 watches they brought to me were without black dots. In the whole process, the founder's daughter left me an impression of arrogance, aggressiveness, and not comfortable to deal with. I decided to compromise to take away the one with only one small black dot.

To summarize:

Damasko watch in general is with very high quality. The white dial version seems prone to have some small dirty dots or cloudy dots. This is probably an issue for the fully luminous paint coated dial, in the coating process, the dust or impurities could not be fully controlled. I am not sure whether this can be solved by a premium coating supplier. I would think so given today's technology. Hopefully, there will be some expert opinions on this.  
Janine is very professional, and efficient.  
The founder's daughter is not friendly, not nice. I did not feel comfortable to talk with her. 
Just my subjective opinion and two cents.


blowfish89 said:


> The non-responsiveness, bad communication and general indifference towards customers of the Damasko Germany folks is really deterring me from getting another Damasko, especially a more advanced model (like the Si ones, as I wanted to get a 67Si). I absolutely love the watches, but it is embarrassing that their dealers (such as Watchmann, Page&Cooper and Gnomon) have praiseworthy reviews and shoulder the service responsibility, in contrast to dealing with the mothership in Germany.


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## nepatriot

Gerrard8 said:


> Yes, I actually had some first hand information this summer, as I visited Damasko at Barbing.
> 
> I first had email communications with a Damasko employee, Janine, everything went fine. I went to their premises on time, the same lady met me and present the Damasko watches. Very professional and to the point introduction. Janine then brought the DA45 black from workshop, the one I planned to buy.
> So far so good.
> 
> 
> Then I noticed a small cloudy area on the dial next to 6 O'clock marker. I politely requested to get this fixed, or if they can find another dial for me. I must say Janine is very helpful. She came back and forth twice, unfortunately, all the white dials she took out were with some small black dots or in the worst case: a small cloudy area.
> Then the founder's daughter (sorry, I forgot her name) intervened. She first did not want to acknowledge this is a quality issue, and claimed the dials are made by a third party supplier, therefore they can not control the details and quality. I politely said that this not your fault, but I would appreciate if you can help to find one without black dots or small cloudy area.
> 
> In the end, none of the 4 or 5 watches they brought to me were without black dots. In the whole process, the founder's daughter left me an impression of arrogance, aggressiveness, and not comfortable to deal with. I decided to compromise to take away the one with only one small black dot.
> 
> To summarize:
> 
> Damasko watch in general is with very high quality. The white dial version seems prone to have some small dirty dots or cloudy dots. This is probably an issue for the fully luminous paint coated dial, in the coating process, the dust or impurities could not be fully controlled. I am not sure whether this can be solved by a premium coating supplier. I would think so given today's technology. Hopefully, there will be some expert opinions on this.
> Janine is very professional, and efficient.
> The founder's daughter is not friendly, not nice. I did not feel comfortable to talk with her.
> Just my subjective opinion and two cents.


Interesting. Just a few observations\comments.

First, you mention DA45 "black", then comment on the white dial. The DA45 has a white dial, not a black dial. Did you originally mean DA44? Then switched to the 45?

Second, if all the watches you saw had this same issue, blemishes on the dials, that would indicate a QC issue on the dial. Third, if Damasko was presenting these to you for sale, there is a second QC issue: a defective watch should not make it through final QC and get cleared for sale.

Finally, why did you put up with this? Why did you buy a watch from them if it was not perfect, and you were treated poorly?

I have a DA47, and there are no black dots, or cloudy area, that I can detect. Using a magnifying glass. I haven't heard of this before, in all I have read on these watches. But you went 5 for 5 with black dots on the dial? And the owner's daughter essentially agreed by passing this off as "OK" at first, then blamed their supplier, and finally said they could not control their supplier's QC?

Sorry, that seems odd .... you can control your supplier's QC very easily and simply: reject the delivery.

Were you by chance looking at "factory seconds"?

Did the owner really agree with you that there were dots and other blemishes on the dials?

Or were they unable to see these things, and finally ended up saying something like "these dials are painted, so perhaps what you are seeing is normal for that process"?

I can say that under higher magnification, angled to the light a certain way, I can see a slight "sparkly" texture to the white dial. To the naked eye I can see some texture to the numbers, which also appear to be painted on. But I see no blemishes or black dots.


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## Gerrard8

So many questions, in short:
DA45 black means watch case with black coatings.

They agreed that they saw the same black dots, and the founder's daughter just blamed their suppliers (just one detail to show her arrogance, especially together with her tone). She did not accept this is a quality control issue, the way she said it means this issue is very normal for the white dial Damskos, she meant this is not an issue at all, at least it is not Damsko issue. 

The reason they explained is that the coating process could not avoid some impurities or dirties. I am not convinced though.

All the 4 or 5 watches they presented to me are with this issue, one in particular is with small cloudy area. Maybe they are "factory seconds", I am not sure. But would like to hear opinions from the other Damasko owners who have white dial watches. 

I picked one with the smallest dot. It is a tool watch, if it is a dress watch, I would not buy it even the black dot is very small. After one month with it, I noticed another small black dot, this one could be small particles from movement (coming through date window?) 


I also visited the other two companies, Holger from Muhle and Lisa from LIMES are both nice. Damasko founder's daughter is in a different league, in a poor one, for sure. 




nepatriot said:


> Interesting. Just a few observations\comments.
> 
> First, you mention DA45 "black", then comment on the white dial. The DA45 has a white dial, not a black dial. Did you originally mean DA44? Then switched to the 45?
> 
> Second, if all the watches you saw had this same issue, blemishes on the dials, that would indicate a QC issue on the dial. Third, if Damasko was presenting these to you for sale, there is a second QC issue: a defective watch should not make it through final QC and get cleared for sale.
> 
> Finally, why did you put up with this? Why did you buy a watch from them if it was not perfect, and you were treated poorly?
> 
> I have a DA47, and there are no black dots, or cloudy area, that I can detect. Using a magnifying glass. I haven't heard of this before, in all I have read on these watches. But you went 5 for 5 with black dots on the dial? And the owner's daughter essentially agreed by passing this off as "OK" at first, then blamed their supplier, and finally said they could not control their supplier's QC?
> 
> Sorry, that seems odd .... you can control your supplier's QC very easily and simply: reject the delivery.
> 
> Were you by chance looking at "factory seconds"?
> 
> Did the owner really agree with you that there were dots and other blemishes on the dials?
> 
> Or were they unable to see these things, and finally ended up saying something like "these dials are painted, so perhaps what you are seeing is normal for that process"?
> 
> I can say that under higher magnification, angled to the light a certain way, I can see a slight "sparkly" texture to the white dial. To the naked eye I can see some texture to the numbers, which also appear to be painted on. But I see no blemishes or black dots.


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## nepatriot

Thanks. Very interesting experience and, if all you say is so (always 2 sides to a story), this is concerning: Damasko's reputation is superior engineering, which by definition should include attention to detail. I would expect their watches to be well above average, especially since the movement (ETA's, not referring to their own) are very common. If the experience is as you say, I would not have made a purchase.



Gerrard8 said:


> So many questions, in short:
> DA45 black means watch case with black coatings.
> 
> They agreed that they saw the same black dots, and the founder's daughter just blamed their suppliers (just one detail to show her arrogance, especially together with her tone). She did not accept this is a quality control issue, the way she said it means this issue is very normal for the white dial Damskos, she meant this is not an issue at all, at least it is not Damsko issue.
> 
> The reason they explained is that the coating process could not avoid some impurities or dirties. I am not convinced though.
> 
> All the 4 or 5 watches they presented to me are with this issue, one in particular is with small cloudy area. Maybe they are "factory seconds", I am not sure. But would like to hear opinions from the other Damasko owners who have white dial watches.
> 
> I picked one with the smallest dot. It is a tool watch, if it is a dress watch, I would not buy it even the black dot is very small. After one month with it, I noticed another small black dot, this one could be small particles from movement (coming through date window?)
> 
> 
> I also visited the other two companies, Holger from Muhle and Lisa from LIMES are both nice. Damasko founder's daughter is in a different league, in a poor one, for sure.


----------



## bpjacobs

Maybe its a bad batch; the DA watches with white dials have been out for years and there aren't any threads on blemishes. I remember seeing a DA-45 on eBay a few months ago and in the description, the owner commented he had recently sent it to Watchmann to get the dial replaced as it has a yellowish mark on it.


----------



## WatchMann

bpjacobs said:


> yellowish mark on it.


 That one had water damage inside.


----------



## happyscrappyheropup

My DA47 Black is dated from early August (no idea what that means for production date) and I don't see any issues with the dial.


----------



## JuicyFruit1983

Quality pic. Never noticed the green on the second hand before. Love these damaskos and the da47 is a fave. Looks like going through a good AD is the way to go


----------



## Vig2000

stuffler said:


> To set the record straight:
> 
> A) Delivery note, ref. 20161131 of 11 August 2016, clearly stated "your repair of 04 August 2016"
> B) Invoice written in German and English as well, amount 905,21 Euro, clearly stated "your repair of 04 August 2016" and "export delivery, free of sales tax",
> C) European Union export form, MRN 16DE 880443840237E3 filled in correctly as well; under title "Art des Geschäftes" (nature of business): 67 (= return consignment after repair)
> 
> Horrible customer service ? I do not see it.
> 
> 
> 
> daffie said:
> 
> 
> 
> Huh...where's this information coming from?
> 
> 
> 
> stuffler said:
> 
> 
> 
> Make an educated guess ! Clue: not coming from Sinn.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
Click to expand...

Educated guess: Duh, obviously coming from Damasko, but strange to see this information posted by a third party and not by the OP himself, provided that he was so inclined to post this.


----------



## Andy Chen

My DA47 has no issues whatsoever either.

It gains maybe just 10 seconds a month.

Btw, it'd be good if Gerrard8 posted some pictures of these black dots.

On another separate, if related, note: http://www.standard.co.uk/lifestyle...r-is-driving-the-internet-crazy-a3342941.html


----------



## daffie

Vig2000 said:


> Educated guess: Duh, obviously coming from Damasko, but strange to see this information posted by a third party and not by the OP himself, provided that he was so inclined to post this.


Thank you. Exactly the point I was making, which Mike S. chose to disregard completely :think: Very strange indeed, my thoughts as well. Mike would do well explaining himself (my guess is...he won't).

But anyhow...not too important anyway. It is rather clear to me that Damasko customer service is far from a point which is considered to be normal and comfortable for the customer.

I have never before encountered such stories where a manufacturer completely disregards their customers...fail to acknowledge any faults of their own, plainly refuse to solve any technical issues which clearly would have to be caused by the manufacturing process of the particular watch of the customer, nor will they even extend any (small) courtesy to their own customers...at all. To be honest, I find this really baffling :-x

I have a feeling Damasko are over-extending themselves, not being able to provide for the large increase in orders lately, and being the small company they are, fail to address this increase in demand properly, and also apparently have decided they have little to no time for anything else...for example say customer service. They really should address this if they expect to do as well or better in the near future with sales. Maybe I'm wrong, and most customers will not be aware of this beforehand (myself included). But still, it may have a negative impact on sales in the future.

So why did I chose Damasko over some others like Sinn and Fortis? Firstly for the fact Damasko is a relatively small family company, and they manufacture many items in-house. Both are very appealing to personally. Secondly Damasko watches are technically at the very top-end, but at a relatively small price-point. Now sadly I'm not so sure any more about the reasoning behind my first point...

Let me say this to conclude...my DA46 is incredible, and I still enjoy it very much. It runs dead-on (!) time when wearing it, and runs +3 s/day at night when off the wrist. The look&feel are fantastic, and I feel rather blessed when wearing it b-) But...I most probably won't be buying any new Damasko's in the future (I had a couple of other Damasko models on my wishlist). I find this to be a real shame...and Damasko CS is to blame.

*rant / constructive comments / user experience & thoughts...over*


----------



## Vig2000

daffie said:


> Thank you. Exactly the point I was making, which Mike S. chose to disregard completely :think: Very strange indeed, my thoughts as well. Mike would do well explaining himself (my guess is...he won't).


This...



daffie said:


> But anyhow...not too important anyway. It is rather clear to me that Damasko customer service is far from a point which is considered to be normal and comfortable for the customer.
> 
> I have never before encountered such stories where a manufacturer completely disregards their customers...fail to acknowledge any faults of their own, plainly refuse to solve any technical issues which clearly would have to be caused by the manufacturing process of the particular watch of the customer, nor will they even extend any (small) courtesy to their own customers...at all. To be honest, I find this really baffling :-x
> 
> I have a feeling Damasko are over-extending themselves, not being able to provide for the large increase in orders lately, and being the small company they are, fail to address this increase in demand properly, and also apparently have decided they have little to no time for anything else...for example say customer service. They really should address this if they expect to do as well or better in the near future with sales. Maybe I'm wrong, and most customers will not be aware of this beforehand (myself included). But still, it may have a negative impact on sales in the future.
> 
> So why did I chose Damasko over some others like Sinn and Fortis? Firstly for the fact Damasko is a relatively small family company, and they manufacture many items in-house. Both are very appealing to personally. Secondly Damasko watches are technically at the very top-end, but at a relatively small price-point. Now sadly I'm not so sure any more about the reasoning behind my first point...
> 
> Let me say this to conclude...my DA46 is incredible, and I still enjoy it very much. It runs dead-on (!) time when wearing it, and runs +3 s/day at night when off the wrist. The look&feel are fantastic, and I feel rather blessed when wearing it b-) But...I most probably won't be buying any new Damasko's in the future (I had a couple of other Damasko models on my wishlist). I find this to be a real shame...and Damasko CS is to blame.
> 
> *rant / constructive comments / user experience & thoughts...over*


...and this.


----------



## Gerrard8

Per request, please find the photo attached here, if some of you, like Mr Chen, think this is illusion, judge with your eyes and head.
Not just mouth.



Andy Chen said:


> Btw, it'd be good if Gerrard8 posted some pictures of these black dots.
> 
> On another separate, if related, note: Optical illusion: Mind-boggling â€˜count the dotsâ€™ brainteaser is driving the internet crazy | London Evening Standard


----------



## Gerrard8

Get your point, and do not disagree.

I do not mind if Damasko is to come and give their side of the story if they have.
Will they come? Wait and see.



nepatriot said:


> Thanks. Very interesting experience and, if all you say is so (always 2 sides to a story), this is concerning: Damasko's reputation is superior engineering, which by definition should include attention to detail. I would expect their watches to be well above average, especially since the movement (ETA's, not referring to their own) are very common. If the experience is as you say, I would not have made a purchase.


----------



## sefrcoko

Gerrard8 said:


> Per request, please find the photo attached here, if some of you, like Mr Chen, think this is illusion, judge with your eyes and head.
> Not just mouth.


Thanks for sharing, it is definitely frustrating when a nice watch isn't up to par and after-sales support is lacking.

I don't feel you're being judged or doubted here. This forum just thrives on pictures. You know the old saying..."if no photos then it didn't happen" lol


----------



## kvik

I purchased my first Damasko directly from them. I quickly discovered the lugs on one side were longer than on the other. I was offerered a case replacement, which I accepted. When the watch was returned, I experienced a similar issue with local customs as the OP. I was charged import taxes based on the accompanying invoice, which stated a value for the new case. I was then able to reclaim the VAT by providing the customs with additional documentation, but this was a time consuming process. When the watch with the new case arrived, I immediately noticed that this time the lugs were of different thickness. The watch had already been away for a month or so, I had been forced to pay additional VAT for the new case, and now I was looking at a possible second repair. Needless to say that I was frustrated and dissappointed. I made this clear to Damasko in a probably too harsch mail, and I never heard another word from them. Eventually I sold the watch on, I just couldn't enjoy it as much after this experience. I also decided that if ever I would buy another, it would be from a dealer, not directly from Damasko.

A few follow-up comments..

Because of my experience it became publicly known that the final finishing of the lugs was done by hand, apparently allowing for slight variations. This is/was also why the new bracelet has/had to be individually fitted to the cases of that era. It is my undetstanding that todays cases (with Made in Germany on the dial) are fully machine made, and therefore don't suffer the variation issue.

Had I known beforehand about the potential lug variation, I would just have accepted it as part of the Damasko charm/uniqueness. However, particularly on WUS there is an aura of perfection surrounding Damasko. It creates a level of expectation, which will be hard to match in real life. I guess this kind of fanboyism is inherent in all specialist forums. 

I think the Damasko family take great pride in their products. It is a business, yes, but I am sure that to them it is more than that. To accept shortcomings is not easy for anyone. I do think they should address the customer service aspect in a more professional manner, and not let personal offence, or the like, get in the way of things, at least if they insist on selling directly. I don't think I have ever read of a poor dealer experience, most (if not all) of the dealers seem to go out of their way to provide the best possible buying/owning experience.

Rounding it off..

I now have another Damasko watch, purchased from a dealer. I simply like the way their watches look and feel. This one is not particularly accurate (the first one was very accurate), and the case has got several brush marks already. However, it is my daily beater, I like it, and it tells me the time/day/date. So, I am happy with the watch as it is.


----------



## Gerrard8

Thanks for commenting. 
Of course, I do not mind Andy Chen asking for photo.

But the purposely found and added link in his post is unnecessary, redundant and potentially below par.

I also reflected upon damasko watches, particularly the ETA based ones. 
I still appreciate their technologies, especially the hardened case.
But, I also ponder whether these technologies are really necessary and value adding ones. The biggest argument could be the hardened case, even this for me at least seems less important than I originally thought. For many watches I have, I might have some small scratches/marks in daily use, but these are also nice track records and ownership experience. 
I would not scratch my watches against rough wall purposely anyway. Then even damasko could not survive scratches like this either.

Having said these above, I still respect what damasko have achieved in nearly 20 years. Much better than some of their peers, which just put ETA movements together with cheap parts.

Unfortunately, there are so many nice watches there. I am seriously considering to flip damasko and get a Muhle Glashutte S.A.R flieger chronograph.



sefrcoko said:


> Thanks for sharing, it is definitely frustrating when a nice watch isn't up to par and after-sales support is lacking.
> 
> I don't feel you're being judged or doubted here. This forum just thrives on pictures. You know the old saying..."if no photos then it didn't happen" lol


----------



## Andy Chen

Gerrard8 said:


> But the purposely found and added link in his post is unnecessary, redundant and potentially below par.


I might point out that "unnecessary" means redundant, and I have no idea what you mean by "potentially below par". The link is not up to the usual standards of other links or not up to the standards of other optical illusions?

You probably mean I was being provocative in posting the link to the optical illusion. If you had taken offence because you think I was provocative or insulting, I apologise.


----------



## daffie

Andy Chen said:


> I might point out that "unnecessary" means redundant, and I have no idea what you mean by "potentially below par". The link is not up to the usual standards of other links or not up to the standards of other optical illusions?
> 
> You probably mean I was being provocative in posting the link to the optical illusion. If you had taken offence because you think I was provocative or insulting, I apologise.


Well me personally, I had a blast with that particular link...man that optical illusion is something else, especially when you follow the tips and discover how to find all dots


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## StufflerMike

Gents, please hold your tongue. Even innuendos can violate rule 2.


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## Happy Acres

Andy Chen said:


> posting the link to the optical illusion


This thread needed some levity, well done!


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## timefleas

Doesn't it bother anyone that this is the most replied-to thread on this "officially-sponsored" Damasko forum, besides the "show us your watch" thread, where this thread is essentially one where many if not most have used this as an opportunity to take different pot shots at Damasko, venting, ranting, accusing, etc., while the original OP has never returned to clarify or qualify his original assertions, and we are left with innuendo and implications, even from the moderator? Most sponsored forums would have closed this thread long ago. I encourage folks who actually like the brand to show their appreciation by not encouraging this thread to continue to denigrate the brand, and to post on more constructive, positive issues in other new or old threads.


----------



## Vig2000

timefleas said:


> Doesn't it bother anyone that this is the most replied-to thread on this "officially-sponsored" Damasko forum, besides the "show us your watch" thread, where this thread is essentially one where many if not most have used this as an opportunity to take different pot shots at Damasko, venting, ranting, accusing, etc., while the original OP has never returned to clarify or qualify his original assertions, and we are left with innuendo and implications, even from the moderator? Most sponsored forums would have closed this thread long ago. I encourage folks who actually like the brand to show their appreciation by not encouraging this thread to continue to denigrate the brand, and to post on more constructive, positive issues in other new or old threads.


Absolutely not and I completely disagree. The whole point of an open forum is the free expression of ideas, thoughts, and commentary, which most definitely includes venting, ranting, and raving. Yes, it would have been nice for the OP to chime in further at least out of courtesy, but he is certainly under no obligation to do so. Despite that, I'm still quite curious as to why the moderator is in possession of information that ostensibly belongs to the OP. I can only speak for myself, but if I were the OP, I would not want the information that the moderator posted to be displayed in a public venue such as this.

Closing this thread would be tantamount to shutting down the free expression of thought, which a forum of this caliber ought to encourage. I don't see this thread as denigrating the brand, but rather establishing an open-air dialogue and discussion regarding what is apparently a known and enduring weak point with Damasko-namely, their poor customer service. There's a track record that shows many others complaining about this issue. These things can and should be discussed not only for the benefit of current and potential customers, but for the benefit of Damasko as well. Without so-called "pot shots" coming from Damasko's core customer base, then the status quo will only continue to persist and thrive, and therefore no meaningful change will be realized from Damasko's end.

There's a reason why this is the most commented thread on the Damasko forum. And I would hope all these comments resonate with Damasko and prompt them to address this issue in order to take the appropriate action and to effectuate demonstrable change.


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## timefleas

Vig completely missed my point. I actually agree with him regarding the moderator's rather odd allusions and revelations regarding additional shipping details that the OP did not provide--however, my basic point was that it was a sad state to see that the second most popular thread here is one that essentially anti-Damasko--their customer service, their quality control, and so forth. I know of no other forum, brand sponsored or not, where the main thread is basically a vehicle for attacking the brand. 

While I do see obvious benefits from dialogue disclosing problems about any brand, I think it is unfortunate that the headline feature here in the Damasko forum is noting what is wrong with it. For all that was discussed, it appears that the OP's accusations were completely unsubstantiated, and for that reason alone, I contend that the discussion should have been closed. Usually an unsubstantiated attack on the brand in an officially-sponsored forum is so treated, here on the WUS. Other issues, such as spots on dials (?), or whatever, could have, and I think should have, been discussed independently in separate threads, if deemed necessary.


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## CastorTroy3

What's Demaskos motivation here .. Banish one customer who rants out for ever about how Damsko screwed them over right or wrong. The community sides with customer as back fire again. I plead the 5th in this case.


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## KozoneAdventureTours

Why did you send to Germany? Most of their watches have an ETA movement, which are very cheap to service and can be done by your local watch guy. Unless you have their in-house movement ... now that's a different story.


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## happyscrappyheropup

JuicyFruit1983 said:


> Quality pic. Never noticed the green on the second hand before. Love these damaskos and the da47 is a fave. Looks like going through a good AD is the way to go


Thanks.










The green is custom from Damasko.

-- Wayne


----------



## nepatriot

I'd buy from an AD vs direct from the mfg on most things, unless there is a clear advantage from the mfg. Such as better discount than a dealer can offer. Of better service. Or an outstanding factory tour, and something unique if you buy at the factory. 

A friend, years ago, bought a Harley. He ordered it at the factory, and opted to pick it up there when ready. He got some personalized service, some unique options, and something like a plaque on the bike I believe. For him, a motorcycle enthusiast and HD fan, it was an outstanding experience that he still raves about (this was at least a dozen years ago). 

That said, mfg's have to be careful about inviting the public in. Especially if they are not set up, have the right people, and have integrated this into their "marketing". IOW, the public will share their experience on places like this, so if it's not something you want out there, then don't do it.

I don't see what Damasko is getting from this, or the consumer. P&C wrote about their visit and tour, but they are an AD, and this was part of their marketing Damasko in England; IOW, what they published was going to be polished up to help them sell watches, no warts would be shared.

The few consumer experiences I have come across seem to suggest that Damasko is not customer friendly. Nothing wrong with that. Just keep the general public out. 

Can you imagine what reviews of many if not most 5 start restaurants would look like if customers could go into the kitchen and critique the master chief about the meals on the menu? 

In my limited experience with watches and cameras, better to go through a good AD. 

With different countries, the public has different expectation of CS. Same for the MFG. When we use an AD in our own country, we are (or should be) dealing with someone who knows what their customers expectations are. They can then earn their keep by being the middleman\translator to the mfg. We don't need to see the warts.


----------



## Happy Acres

nepatriot said:


> When we use an AD in our own country, we are (or should be) dealing with someone who knows what their customers expectations are.


 Well said. In the limited number of times I have contacted a manufacturer directly, I found they have very little experience or finesse dealing directly with the end customer. I much prefer the experienced retailer (who also speaks the same native language)


----------



## myke

I purchased A DK 10 around 2 years ago. it has been running slow since the start. It was minus 5 seconds and has now gone as far as minus 15 seconds a day. i contacted Damasko and they advised me to send it back to Gnomon in Singapore and they would ship it back to Germany and regulate and send back to me. I have since brought the watch to a watchmaker here in Ontario for regulation and I should get it back next week. Kinda disappointed with the problem as I recently picked up a Seiko 5 that keeps better time for 70 dollars US. Not bashing here just disappointed as this is watch I plan to keep.


----------



## sulpher

A little "misregulation" is no reason to dislike the watch, though. Mechanical watches also change their pace over time, that is normal.
Just get it regulated (like you did) and enjoy it.


----------



## myke

i understand but when you pay 3500 dollars of a watch with a high tech movement i expected much better timing from the start. Thats why I bought the in-house movement



sulpher said:


> A little "misregulation" is no reason to dislike the watch, though. Mechanical watches also change their pace over time, that is normal.
> Just get it regulated (like you did) and enjoy it.


----------



## MrDagon007

Inhouse is cool but not many will be more accurate that a well adjusted Eta.


----------



## Mirabello1

Dagon said:


> Inhouse is cool but not many will be more accurate that a well adjusted Eta.


Soooooo True

Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk


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## zed073

myke said:


> i understand but when you pay 3500 dollars of a watch with a high tech movement i expected much better timing from the start. Thats why I bought the in-house movement


I totally agree Mike.
I wonder how much time is spent regulating the watch before it ships?

It would be nice if the OP would let us know if there has been an update with his situation.

My son has been considering the purchase of a Domasko. After reading through this thread
I may recommend he look into something else. IMHO Domasko CS could be raised a few notches.


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## StufflerMike

zed073 said:


> I totally agree Mike.


Mike or Myke ?



> I wonder how much time is spent regulating the watch before it ships?


Over a couple of days on a seperate workplace until the watchmaker is convinced he did it right. However, parcel services do not handle parcels with care........





> My son has been considering the purchase of a Domasko. After reading through this thread
> I may recommend he look into something else.


Yep, do that if you think there is one watch in the world zero % of owners complained about. What you read and heard is in the range of ‰ and people often tend to forget about the majority of happy campers which I have been part of since 2003 owning 6 Damasko with no. 7 in the pipeline.


----------



## whineboy

To zed073 - buy through an authorized dealer and you will be insulated from most (if not all) customer service issues.


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## cb1111

stuffler said:


> ...Yep, do that if you think there is one watch in the world zero % of owners omplained about. What you read and heard is in the range of ‰ and people often tend to forget about the majority of happy campers which I have been part of since 2003 owning 6 Damasko with no. 7 in the pipeline.


 It must also be noted that forums will frequently draw complaints. In many cases you'll get a post of "my watch is running xy seconds, is that normal and how can I fix it". It is so seldom that you get an opening post of "All I want to say is that my xyz watch is terrific, easy to read, keeps perfect time and is a real stunner."


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## Vig2000

cb1111 said:


> It must also be noted that forums will frequently draw complaints. In many cases you'll get a post of "my watch is running xy seconds, is that normal and how can I fix it". It is so seldom that you get an opening post of "All I want to say is that my xyz watch is terrific, easy to read, keeps perfect time and is a real stunner."


Alright, all I want to say is that my DK10 and DC67 Si are terrific, easy to read, keep perfect time, and are both real stunners.

So, there...


----------



## Sylus Grey

Vig2000 said:


> Alright, all I want to say is that my DK10 and DC67 Si are terrific, easy to read, keep perfect time, and are both real stunners.
> 
> So, there...


I second this sentiment in regards to my DA36 and DA47:-d


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## voiceman

I'm very happy with my Damasko DA-35. Keeps great time and looks great. I appreciate the "head's up" on the Customer Service issue raised by the OP. I won't be sending my watch for repairs to Damasko since mine was purchased "used" and is out of warranty. However, I believe that Damasko requires you send them the watch if you elect to add a bracelet since it has very tight tolerances. Based on the Customs issue identified by the OP, I probably will stick with the strap.


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## shapz

Hi mate.....I've read bad reviews on other forums about Page&Cooper however with regards to servicing and excessive pricing and communication.


----------



## RIKFR

I have read this thread with interest, as I am in the process of acquiring a DC58. Nothing I have read has discouraged me from the brand, particularly as the original complaint from the OP has been unsubstantiated. There is a lot of truth in the fact that dissatisfied customers are much more likely to give voice to their feelings than satisfied ones are to praise, yet in my research on Damasko products I have read many, many more positive reviews than negative. I can't wait to receive my DC58.


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## hwa

I just read this thread from start to finish, as I recently acquired a used DA36 on bracelet (formerly owned a DA38 Black, which I sold for lack of a bracelet).

Couple thoughts: I just don't see any CS problem with the OP. Essentially, I see a rant by the OP over his own country's tax/customs/duty rules, which Damasko doesn't and cannot control. The OP fails to explain any of it, but Mike has disclosed the forms, and if they're accurate, they give lie (or at least evidence of a major language barrier) to the OP. And, a subsequent post by someone (sorry, can't recall who it was) who explains the customs issue in Indonesia, which goes a long way towards explaining what happened here. It certainly appears that OP either was ignorant of or tried to circumvent Indonesia customs rules, got burned, and is taking it out on Damasko. Meanwhile, OP hasn't been back to respond to any of this. I'd like to see the specific communications between OP and Damasko; I'm betting it wasn't all sweetness and light coming from OP. 

Second, as to the white dial issue, something is definitely missing from the story. I agree that, that macro pic magnified to fill by desktop shows an imperfection, but why buy the thing if you're going to complain about it? It always makes me shake my head when a company sells a watch to a guy who whips out a loupe in the store and wants to see multiple copies of the same watch. Even if that conversation went as described here, if I were the salesman, I would have urged the customer to spend his money elsewhere because evidently the product wasn't to his liking. Talk about alarm bells, and here they are, ringing. Again, this is not a CS problem; this is a problem of a customer who was dissatisfied from the start, bought the product knowing of the imperfection, and then took to social media to rail about service.

For my part, when I bought my 38 Black, I inquired into the possibility of after-market bracelet. ADs in the US answered my questions accurately and responsively, and I sold the watch as a result. All good. When I got the 36 and wondered whether I could exchange the yellow second hand for blue, I got an almost immediate response from Nadja, a couple more emails followed back and forth. I don't love the answer she gave me, but she gave it to me politely and professionally.


----------



## pc27b

in one of the threads i asked about how to find out if my older da36 needed to be sent to germany for the steel bracelet fitting. the moderator told me to contact damasko. i did and received a reply that it did need sent there. 

asked for a price and received that.
told them i wanted to go ahead with steel bracelet, they replied with address to send it too
watch was held up in customs, after contacting damasko, they got it released
they sent me an invoice when finished (here is the only issue i had. i did not have paypal, or know i could pay with paypal, and a my bank wire fees coupled with their bank wire fees are high) if i would have been familiar with paypal before the transaction, i wouldn't have had to pay those fees.
all my emails were answered quickly
received tracking # email and watch arrived on time in the usa and in the box that i packed it in, with an excess of "air bags" and styrofoam peanuts!
enjoying the watch on a bracelet now


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## themeister

What the hell is up with their prices?! Regular maintenance, whatever that is, costs 260 EUR. Parts sold separately. Case refinishing done separately (costs 60 EUR). Terribly disappointed with their aftersale offering and conduct, I'm almost regretting buying the watch. I'll know more soon, sending it in for the first time. Honestly, if this goes bad I'd sell the watch in a heart beat and never look back if the watch wasn't a gift.


----------



## StufflerMike

Nov 2016: ding at 6
Jan 2017: scratches
May 2017: dropped

Selling it without some repair might become difficult.


----------



## Happy Acres

themeister said:


> What the hell is up with their prices?! Regular maintenance, whatever that is, costs 260 EUR. Parts sold separately. Case refinishing done separately (costs 60 EUR). Terribly disappointed with their aftersale offering and conduct, I'm almost regretting buying the watch. I'll know more soon, sending it in for the first time. Honestly, if this goes bad I'd sell the watch in a heart beat and never look back if the watch wasn't a gift.


Really? You have to come on here swearing and moaning? Those prices are on the reasonable side. Tone down the hyperbole and get real.


----------



## GreatScott

Rolex is about $750 the last time I checked, so it is all relative. Yep, they are all the expensive, just like this hobby. It is my understanding that a full maintenance includes taking it all apart, cleaning, and new oil, etc. it is a big deal and would take me a lifetime if I had to do it myself, so again, it is all relative.


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## omeglycine

For a 3 handed automatic, Breitling charges $490 for a complete service, which is considerably more than the €260 (plus another 60 for case refinishing) Damasko charges.

https://www.breitling.com/multimedia/pdf/sav/sav-1219.pdf


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## MrDagon007

omeglycine said:


> For a 3 handed automatic, Breitling charges $490 for a complete service, which is considerably less than the €260 (plus another 60 for case refinishing) Damasko charges.
> 
> https://www.breitling.com/multimedia/pdf/sav/sav-1219.pdf


Actually, checking XE, $490 is currently approximately 436 euro. More than Damasko incl case refinish.

Of course 260 is not a trivial amount, German staff costs are significant, and in the end totally inline with industry practice. 
In theory a service at a local repair shop might be cheaper but in a Damasko they have to watch out not to damage the little lubrication cell around the crown stem, not trivial.


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## GreatScott

Why is this posted in the customer service thread, it really has nothing to do with their customer service.


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## themeister

Except a Rolex costs an order of magnitude more than a Damasko. Also, taking it apart and oiling it shouldn't cost 260 EUR, no matter what it is. People take apart cars and oil them for way less. In fact, regular service of my sedan, which incidentally also costs orders of magnitude more than a DA36, costs less than 260 EUR. I fully understand mechanical timepieces are a luxury, and can absolutely appreciate that. In the case of Breitlings and Rolexes, that is. For a 1000 EUR tool watch with a very common movement and a few patents it is definitely not unreasonable to state that 260 EUR to take the watch apart and oil it is too much. That it would take you a lifetime to do so is both a gross exaggeration and a completely irrelevant point. Industry practice is one thing, and that's a valid argument. "German staff costs" is nonsense. Is there any profession on Earth that earns more per unit time than a moderately competent watchmaker? At least include a free first service, or a free case blasting. Something, anything. "Service" the watch 5 times and you could've bought another. That's some damn expensive oil...


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## themeister

Of course it does.


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## omeglycine

MrDagon007 said:


> Actually, checking XE, $490 is currently approximately 436 euro. More than Damasko incl case refinish.
> 
> Of course 260 is not a trivial amount, German staff costs are significant, and in the end totally inline with industry practice.
> In theory a service at a local repair shop might be cheaper but in a Damasko they have to watch out not to damage the little lubrication cell around the crown stem, not trivial.


Of course. Not sure why I typed less; was making the point that Damasko charges considerably less.


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## whineboy

themeister, watch a few disassembly videos on YouTube and you'll see how time-consuming and demanding that work is (The Watch Repair Channel is great).
If you figure it takes the watchmaker 3 hours to disassemble, diagnose and reassemble your watch, 260 euros is 90 an hour. Your plumber probably charges more.
Swatch charges $190 to overhaul a Hamilton. Swatch charges $550 to overhaul an Omega. Face it, pricey watches cost more to repair, we may not like it, but that's the cost of admission.
Swatch Group U.S. 
With that benchmark for factory service, I think Damasko's 260 euros is reasonable, especially considering a Damasko's seal structure.
And, as others have said, German labor costs are significant.
When you buy a fancy car you accept repairs are gonna cost more. Same with watches.


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## whineboy

GreatScott said:


> Why is this posted in the customer service thread, it really has nothing to do with their customer service.


Deleted in the interests of world peace.


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## MrDagon007

themeister said:


> Except a Rolex costs an order of magnitude more than a Damasko. Also, taking it apart and oiling it shouldn't cost 260 EUR, no matter what it is. People take apart cars and oil them for way less. In fact, regular service of my sedan, which incidentally also costs orders of magnitude more than a DA36, costs less than 260 EUR. I fully understand mechanical timepieces are a luxury, and can absolutely appreciate that. In the case of Breitlings and Rolexes, that is. For a 1000 EUR tool watch with a very common movement and a few patents it is definitely not unreasonable to state that 260 EUR to take the watch apart and oil it is too much. That it would take you a lifetime to do so is both a gross exaggeration and a completely irrelevant point. Industry practice is one thing, and that's a valid argument. "German staff costs" is nonsense. Is there any profession on Earth that earns more per unit time than a moderately competent watchmaker? At least include a free first service, or a free case blasting. Something, anything. "Service" the watch 5 times and you could've bought another. That's some damn expensive oil...


Let us look at watches that play in the similar price range like Sinn or Longines. If you send it back to the factory then I expect a similar price as the Damasko.
Sinn might be a good comparison, they have watches with a special capsule and filled neutral gas, these would require special handling, much like damasko's special lubrication cell.
Anyway as I said I expect a similar price from Sinn or Longines. Anybody has experience?


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## Shikyo

themeister said:


> Except a Rolex costs an order of magnitude more than a Damasko. Also, taking it apart and oiling it shouldn't cost 260 EUR, no matter what it is. People take apart cars and oil them for way less. In fact, regular service of my sedan, which incidentally also costs orders of magnitude more than a DA36, costs less than 260 EUR. I fully understand mechanical timepieces are a luxury, and can absolutely appreciate that. In the case of Breitlings and Rolexes, that is. For a 1000 EUR tool watch with a very common movement and a few patents it is definitely not unreasonable to state that 260 EUR to take the watch apart and oil it is too much. That it would take you a lifetime to do so is both a gross exaggeration and a completely irrelevant point. Industry practice is one thing, and that's a valid argument. "German staff costs" is nonsense. Is there any profession on Earth that earns more per unit time than a moderately competent watchmaker? At least include a free first service, or a free case blasting. Something, anything. "Service" the watch 5 times and you could've bought another. That's some damn expensive oil...


It's good that no one is forcing you to get it serviced for that price.


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## StufflerMike

themeister said:


> Of course it does.


Imho it does not since you had no horrible customer service yet. You are complaining about service prices prior to any service being done by Damasko. However this may be I would like to ask you to mind your wording. One of your posts and follow up quotes got deleted though.


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## Camera Bill

I can't believe this thread is still going. I've had less than stellar run ins with Damasko's C/S but you know what, I love my DA46. Wear it almost everyday.

They serviced the watch, at the time they didn't accept Paypal, I moaned about it and they agreed to accept it. It got hung up in customs, after a few weeks and many emails they sent the necessary paperwork. At the end of the day they did a great job servicing my watch (I dropped it while changing a light bulb, it landed in the kitchen sink and broke a ceramic coffee mug.) I needed to replace the bezel and have the column wheel repaired. While it was there I had the outer AR coating removed, always bugged me.

If I lost this watch I would definitely replace it. Only gripes, I wish it had a longer power reserve and a higher end ETA movement.


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## Vig2000

themeister said:


> Except a Rolex costs an order of magnitude more than a Damasko. Also, taking it apart and oiling it shouldn't cost 260 EUR, no matter what it is. People take apart cars and oil them for way less. In fact, regular service of my sedan, which incidentally also costs orders of magnitude more than a DA36, costs less than 260 EUR. I fully understand mechanical timepieces are a luxury, and can absolutely appreciate that. In the case of Breitlings and Rolexes, that is. For a 1000 EUR tool watch with a very common movement and a few patents it is definitely not unreasonable to state that 260 EUR to take the watch apart and oil it is too much. That it would take you a lifetime to do so is both a gross exaggeration and a completely irrelevant point. Industry practice is one thing, and that's a valid argument. "German staff costs" is nonsense. Is there any profession on Earth that earns more per unit time than a moderately competent watchmaker? At least include a free first service, or a free case blasting. Something, anything. "Service" the watch 5 times and you could've bought another. That's some damn expensive oil...


Welcome to the world of capitalism! Complaining about servicing costs of a luxury watch is like complaining that water is too wet.


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## themeister

How do I delete posts on this forum?


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## themeister

Again, a DA36 is hardly a luxury watch. Someone said a plumber probably charges more than 90 EUR an hour. Delusional much? I'm not complaining about the price of servicing luxury mechanical watches, just tools that cost less than five times the price of their single "regular maintenance".


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## Shikyo

themeister said:


> Again, a DA36 is hardly a luxury watch. Someone said a plumber probably charges more than 90 EUR an hour. Delusional much? I'm not complaining about the price of servicing luxury mechanical watches, just tools that cost less than five times the price of their single "regular maintenance".


There are plenty of watches you buy for under 260,- Euro. Sell your DA36 and buy few of those in return. You clearly aren't enjoying your watch, so why keep it?

How much do you think the service should cost if 260,- Euro is too much?


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## Vig2000

themeister said:


> How do I delete posts on this forum?


You cannot.



themeister said:


> Again, a DA36 is hardly a luxury watch. Someone said a plumber probably charges more than 90 EUR an hour. Delusional much? I'm not complaining about the price of servicing luxury mechanical watches, just tools that cost less than five times the price of their single "regular maintenance".


Many of my non-WIS buddies will easily argue that any watch costing over $50 is considered "luxury." The usage of the term "luxury" is relative.

I'll posit the same question to you: Delusional much? You keep complaining about the cost of servicing your Damasko, but the fact is your complaints don't merit much of anything since Damasko has every right to charge whatever they want. If you do not like what they charge for servicing, then go have your watch serviced elsewhere; it's as simple as that. You certainly have every right to keep complaining, but your constant complaining will get you nowhere fast.


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## elbilo

themeister said:


> Again, a DA36 is hardly a luxury watch. Someone said a plumber probably charges more than 90 EUR an hour. Delusional much? I'm not complaining about the price of servicing luxury mechanical watches, just tools that cost less than five times the price of their single "regular maintenance".


When you pay premiums for features that are not essential to the basic function of telling time, then you are in luxury watch territory. It may not be shiny and look luxurious, but the DA36 is most definitely a luxury watch.

Damasko is no different than any other luxury watch brand regarding relatively high service fees. Time spent repairing/maintaining a watch is time away from assembling a new one that would earn them a greater income. Independent watchmakers may charge less because all they do is repair/maintain watches. If they were being taken away from a task that would earn them more money, then they'd certainly increase their service fees to reflect that. The best watchmaker in my state, and certainly one of the best in southern New England, charges a premium for all services. Why? He is certified by Rolex and services many, so time spent tinkering with an ETA is time away from a Rolex, so his service fees reflect that.

Hopefully your local watchmaker can repair at a more reasonable cost. Damasko CS didn't live up to your expectation, but hopefully you'll still enjoy the watch. I just got a DA36 a few weeks ago and really enjoy it! I reached out to Damasko about purchasing 2 of their strap changing tools and another bracelet tool, but never received a reply (been about 2 weeks). It's annoying because I want the tools and the online stores I looked into are out of stock. Their unresponsiveness does take away a little from my view of Damasko, but it doesn't take away from my enjoyment of the watch!

Best of luck on getting your DA36 back in proper order, and when it is, I hope you enjoy wearing it!

** Update on my CS situation: Yesterday I replied to the automatic email response (from Isabella) I received from my first email, requesting to order the tools, and I received a prompt reply! For some reason my email wasn't in their queue. I understand glitches occur. Anyway, I was able to order the 2 strap changing tools and extra bracelet tool! What little was lost in my view of Damasko is restored. **


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## StufflerMike

themeister said:


> How do I delete posts on this forum?


Yon can't. Read rule 14.


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## erikclabaugh

Anyone that would send a Damasko to the factory for service deserves whatever they charge unless it is one of the new in house movements. You can get a Damasko serviced for a little over $100 at any normal watchmaker. 


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


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## wtma

Service done by manufacturer always costs more than independent watchmakers. It applies to all brands. Whether it's expensive or cheap, it's definitely subjective and hardly a topic to complain. We would've had hundreds of threads already on WUS if everybody complaining why Patek would charge $30k for their watch.


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## MrDagon007

erikclabaugh said:


> Anyone that would send a Damasko to the factory for service deserves whatever they charge unless it is one of the new in house movements. You can get a Damasko serviced for a little over $100 at any normal watchmaker.
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


Probably if the movement doesn't need to be taken out. If the maker needs to remove the crown stem then he will likely damage the proprietary lubrication cell during extraction or reinsertion.


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## whineboy

themeister said:


> Again, a DA36 is hardly a luxury watch. Someone said a plumber probably charges more than 90 EUR an hour. Delusional much? I'm not complaining about the price of servicing luxury mechanical watches, just tools that cost less than five times the price of their single "regular maintenance".


In 2006, plumbers charged $100/hour and up: https://terrylove.com/forums/index.php?threads/how-do-plumbers-decide-on-what-to-charge.10145/

And, in 2017, "The cost of a plumber ranges from $160 to $430 for a typical job with the average cost per hour ranging from $45 to $150."
2017 Plumbing Costs | Plumbing Price Guide - HomeAdvisor


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## whineboy

erikclabaugh said:


> Anyone that would send a Damasko to the factory for service deserves whatever they charge unless it is one of the new in house movements. You can get a Damasko serviced for a little over $100 at any normal watchmaker.
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


If I had a watchmaker by me I could have confidence in, yes, local service for an ETA movement makes sense. But I don't know of one (NYC is quite the watchmaker desert), and my watches are very important to me. So, rather than take a chance, I prefer to spend more and know that the work was done correctly.


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## StufflerMike

erikclabaugh said:


> Anyone that would send a Damasko to the factory for service deserves whatever they charge unless it is one of the new in house movements. You can get a Damasko serviced for a little over $100 at any normal watchmaker.


Might be not valid in case you dropped the watch and the crown tube is somehow affected, Crown | engineering | Uhrenmanufaktur Damasko


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## erikclabaugh

stuffler said:


> Might be not valid in case you dropped the watch and the crown tube is somehow affected, Crown | engineering | Uhrenmanufaktur Damasko


Good point.

Also, my post came out a little snarkier than intended. The whole manufacturer service thing is a pet peeve of mine. In general, prices are too high, waits are too long, and policies are exploitative at best (e.g. "Sorry, we can't replace your bezel without a full service."). Imagine if you took your car in for an oil change and they told you it would cost $10,000, take six months, and they had to rebuild the engine. It's just crazy.

Still, I agree that there are times the manufacturer service is required.

Okay, rant over.


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## nepatriot

whineboy said:


> If I had a watchmaker by me I could have confidence in, yes, local service for an ETA movement makes sense. But I don't know of one (NYC is quite the watchmaker desert), and my watches are very important to me. So, rather than take a chance, I prefer to spend more and know that the work was done correctly.


Surprised to hear that about NYC and the metro area. Even here in southern NE there are several certified AWCI watch makers. A quick search on their web site comes up with 2 CW21 certified in NYC.

Fortunately you are in the USA and can send it to your AD, who has Damasko authorized service available in the US. Saves on postage, no customs to deal with, and appears to cost less (Germany is a very high cost of labor country).


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## whineboy

nepatriot said:


> Surprised to hear that about NYC and the metro area. Even here in southern NE there are several certified AWCI watch makers. A quick search on their web site comes up with 2 CW21 certified in NYC.
> 
> Fortunately you are in the USA and can send it to your AD, who has Damasko authorized service available in the US. Saves on postage, no customs to deal with, and appears to cost less (Germany is a very high cost of labor country).


nepatriot, I'm sure there are good watchmakers in NYC. But the few I've stopped to see haven't made me feel good. I'd ask for a rough, non-binding estimate to do a full service on an ETA 2804-2 and would be told I'd have to leave the watch. A few I read about on Yelp also seemed to have issues. Right now I'd rather not name names.

When my DA46 needs work, it's going back to WatchMann.


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## nepatriot

whineboy said:


> nepatriot, I'm sure there are good watchmakers in NYC. But the few I've stopped to see haven't made me feel good. I'd ask for a rough, non-binding estimate to do a full service on an ETA 2804-2 and would be told I'd have to leave the watch. A few I read about on Yelp also seemed to have issues. Right now I'd rather not name names.
> 
> When my DA46 needs work, it's going back to WatchMann.


That's exactly where I would go with my Damasko. He looked after another Damasko I had, and did a great job.


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## oso2276

MrDagon007 said:


> Probably if the movement doesn't need to be taken out. If the maker needs to remove the crown stem then he will likely damage the proprietary lubrication cell during extraction or reinsertion.


Independent watchmaker serviced my DA36 over a year ago. I cannot tell if he managed to damage the self lubricacion cell but my watch works just fine.

Enviado desde mi Moto G (5) Plus mediante Tapatalk


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## purplehero

Where did you find the quotes for service and case refinishing? In the past I have been told by the manufacturer case refinishing can cost 100EUR or more.


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## amr ashraf

Camera Bill said:


> I needed to replace the bezel and have the column wheel repaired. While it was there I had the outer AR coating removed, always bugged me.
> 
> .


Do you have to replace the bezel for being scratched OR the bezel mechanism was broken from the impact?
Thanks


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## Camera Bill

amr ashraf said:


> Do you have to replace the bezel for being scratched OR the bezel mechanism was broken from the impact?
> Thanks


The bezel mechanism was unharmed, just the insert replaced.


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## Camera Bill

Camera Bill said:


> The bezel mechanism was unharmed, just the insert replaced.


The coffee cup was a total loss.


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## Camera Bill

Had a request for a video displaying the bezel action of the DA 46, figured I'd share it for all:






For comparison here's my Omega 2201.50:


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## amr ashraf

Camera Bill said:


> Had a request for a video displaying the bezel action of the DA 46, figured I'd share it for all


Nice video

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## wtma

Thanks for sharing, the Damasko bezel seems to have better and easier grips.


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## powerband

wtma said:


> Thanks for sharing, the Damasko bezel seems to have better and easier grips.


Yes, and it sounds more robust.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Joshua87

I also had a HORRIBLE experience with Damasko factory service. By the end, I was completely mystified that a company that relies on a such a small market share would priorities 19 euro's over customer satisfaction. I own a Damasko DA36 Black and I had sent it into Damasko from Canada (which cost me around $100 just to ship) for repair as I dropped the watch. After 3 weeks I finally heard back from them giving me an estimate of how much their services would cost to repair, it was not cheap but I did not expect it to be and I was willing to pay their price. after another 2 weeks go by, I received an invoice for the amount discussed and a 70 euro shipping fee that was not discussed beforehand, but whatever. The only method of payment they accepted was a freaking wire transfer directly into their account. its not 1995, I think a company that sells their product on a global platform should be able to accept a credit card, or paypal, or something other than a wire transfer that cost me an additional $30.00 in bank fees on my end. NOW I get to the bad part...After paying their invoice in full and asking for them to finally send me my watch back, I was told that I still owe 19 Euro's because their own bank deducted that amount from the payment I sent over. None of this was mentioned on their invoice, and the total amount indicated on their invoice was paid in full. How in the world am I supposed to know to send additional money to cover their bank fees if there is no specific amount on their invoice? I guess they expect me to to use my physic abilities to know that their own bank was subtracting a fee for a wire transfer and I should add more money on top of the amount indicated on their invoice, makes sense right? After multiple emails back and forth I couldn't believe how stubborn they were and refused to send me my watch until I reimbursed them their banking fees. I decided to try and call them and discuss this over the phone at which point I was told that the person I was dealing with questioned Mrs. Damasko herself on what to do, and he was told that my watch would not be sent back to me until I paid them their banking fees. I think this is a form of blackmail no? Never again will I wear this watch and I plan on selling it the second it comes back. I will not wear a watch made by people who couldn't care less about their clients. I think this goes well beyond bad customer service, its just appalling. I urge you to spend you money elsewhere.


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## StufflerMike

I am doing a lot of overseas money wires. If I fill in the form I tick the box „all fees on payer“ (me) and all is done.


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## Vig2000

Joshua87 said:


> I also had a HORRIBLE experience with Damasko factory service. By the end, I was completely mystified that a company that relies on a such a small market share would priorities 19 euro's over customer satisfaction. I own a Damasko DA36 Black and I had sent it into Damasko from Canada (which cost me around $100 just to ship) for repair as I dropped the watch. After 3 weeks I finally heard back from them giving me an estimate of how much their services would cost to repair, it was not cheap but I did not expect it to be and I was willing to pay their price. after another 2 weeks go by, I received an invoice for the amount discussed and a 70 euro shipping fee that was not discussed beforehand, but whatever. The only method of payment they accepted was a freaking wire transfer directly into their account. its not 1995, I think a company that sells their product on a global platform should be able to accept a credit card, or paypal, or something other than a wire transfer that cost me an additional $30.00 in bank fees on my end. NOW I get to the bad part...After paying their invoice in full and asking for them to finally send me my watch back, I was told that I still owe 19 Euro's because their own bank deducted that amount from the payment I sent over. None of this was mentioned on their invoice, and the total amount indicated on their invoice was paid in full. How in the world am I supposed to know to send additional money to cover their bank fees if there is no specific amount on their invoice? I guess they expect me to to use my physic abilities to know that their own bank was subtracting a fee for a wire transfer and I should add more money on top of the amount indicated on their invoice, makes sense right? After multiple emails back and forth I couldn't believe how stubborn they were and refused to send me my watch until I reimbursed them their banking fees. I decided to try and call them and discuss this over the phone at which point I was told that the person I was dealing with questioned Mrs. Damasko herself on what to do, and he was told that my watch would not be sent back to me until I paid them their banking fees. I think this is a form of blackmail no? Never again will I wear this watch and I plan on selling it the second it comes back. I will not wear a watch made by people who couldn't care less about their clients. I think this goes well beyond bad customer service, its just appalling. I urge you to spend you money elsewhere.


That's a sad state of affairs for sure, but I said it before and I'll say it again: I personally would never again deal with Damasko whether it's buying direct from them or having them handle a repair. In my opinion, they are sorely ill-equipped to deal directly with their customers, your story as well as others' accounts being cases in point. Holding your watch hostage for EUR19 is a new low and is downright pathetic. Did they really expect you to send a wire for EUR19? If so, that's laughable on so many levels. And for them to accept a wire only speaks to how they are either unwilling or unable to adapt to a customer-centric approach. You're right, why not accept PayPal or a credit card and factor in the appropriate fees instead of holding customers' watches hostage? I don't know, Damasko, doing that just might do you a world of good.

Seeing that you're in Canada, WatchMann could've probably done the repair. If I need a repair done on my Damasko, I'm going though WatchMann for three simple reasons: Reasonable repair prices (unlike Damasko), fast turnaround time (unlike Damasko), and pleasant and responsive customer service (unlike Damasko). Notice a trend here? Honestly, an AD like WatchMann is Damasko's saving grace. If WatchMann is no longer an AD in the future, then see ya never, Damasko. It's a shame their AD has a stronger support network than the brand itself.

Sorry you had to go through this.


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## Vig2000

stuffler said:


> I am doing a lot of overseas money wires. If I fill in the form I tick the box „all fees on payer" (me) and all is done.


Victim blaming accomplishes nothing here. Instead of forcing him to pay via wire, how about accepting PayPal/credit cards and factor their fees into the cost of the repair (exactly like other comparable businesses do)? Doing that would've avoided this whole situation altogether.


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## StufflerMike

> Doing that would've avoided this whole situation altogether.


As does my way of doing business. Nothing wrong with your advice though.


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## 1165dvd

Holding a watch until the owner pays your company's banking fee is just a lousy way to treat a customer. No getting around that. 

Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk


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## Nadroj56

These stories are becoming more commonplace in this community. That’s a real downer. As a small brand this is the group that they should be catering to. Really souring me to Damasko. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## whineboy

Nadroj56 said:


> These stories are becoming more commonplace in this community. That's a real downer. As a small brand this is the group that they should be catering to. Really souring me to Damasko.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Well, in fairness, there are many posts on this forum praising Damasko ADs, for example, Watchmann in the US. I bought mine from him and had a smooth, easy and fast transaction.

Over and over we see posts on this forum alerting people that Damasko direct purchases may not be as easy as going through the AD because Damasko isn't good at direct. Potential new Damasko buyers on WUS, you've been warned that there is an easy way and a hard way, the choice is yours. For buyers not on WUS, I'm sure a quick Googling will lead to the same answer - IMHO it's not too much to expect someone spending $1K+ on a watch to do a bit of homework.

And it's not as if you save meaningful money with a direct purchase. So, unless it's for customization, why do it that way?


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## SimpleWatchMan

Honestly, I think it's unacceptable that Damako doesn't have credit card payment or PayPal for their transactions, especially for a more than 20 years old watch company. Every micro brands operating for the past 5 years that I know have these facilities to their customers now.

Of course I do agree with mod that it's their business decision not to, not ours.


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## Nadroj56

Please delete


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## Nadroj56

whineboy said:


> Well, in fairness, there are many posts on this forum praising Damasko ADs, for example, Watchmann in the US. I bought mine from him and had a smooth, easy and fast transaction.
> 
> Over and over we see posts on this forum alerting people that Damasko direct purchases may not be as easy as going through the AD because Damasko isn't good at direct. Potential new Damasko buyers on WUS, you've been warned that there is an easy way and a hard way, the choice is yours. For buyers not on WUS, I'm sure a quick Googling will lead to the same answer - IMHO it's not too much to expect someone spending $1K+ on a watch to do a bit of homework.
> 
> And it's not as if you save meaningful money with a direct purchase. So, unless it's for customization, why do it that way?


I understand what you're saying. But. Is basic friendly accommodating customer service really that much to ask from a brand?

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## whineboy

Nadroj56 said:


> I understand what you're saying. But. Is basic friendly accommodating customer service really that much to ask from a brand?
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


I'm not defending Damasko's CS - I'm just saying, 'you' [direct buyers] were warned.

I agree that it is certainly not a bad thing to improve the Damasko buying experience and aftercare.


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## noregrets

Fwiw, I had a similar very unpleasant repair experience dealing directly with Damasko, involving not only being told to reimburse fees but also feeling like my watch was being held hostage until I agreed to let them do an expensive regulation which I felt was not necessary but finally I caved and paid just to make the pain end. 

In my case, I tried to go through Watchmann but he told me that due to my issue I had to deal directly with Damasko. Had I known the future, I would have begged him to take care of it for me.

As a side note, they do take PayPal (or did in my case at least) but you have to reimburse all the associated fees.

Cliffs: fantastic watches, Watchmann is amazing, avoid dealing directly with Barbing at all costs (literally)

Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk


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## ndrs63

My recent experience with watchmann was great. Just like others posted here, fast, courteous service, and free delivery. I had an overhaul and repair, and took only 2 weeks. After reading this post, I am certain that I will never use factory services


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Vig2000

stuffler said:


> As does my way of doing business. Nothing wrong with your advice though.


You call it advice, I call it standard operation procedure, but you know, tomayto/tomahto.


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## Semu

Just a sidenote, I'm drooling over DC80 and hence wandered here. The issues sounds very German, not necessarily specific to Damasko. I lived there for a year and coming from civilized world with credit cards, most on the places dont have those in Germany. The whole country is cash-oriented and they might not see the need for Paypal/cc. Just saying, frequent issue in there, although changing slowly. 
Seems like I need to prepare some valium when I pull the trigger for dc80 (no AD here +within EU).


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## Psalty

Semu said:


> Just a sidenote, I'm drooling over DC80 and hence wandered here. The issues sounds very German, not necessarily specific to Damasko. I lived there for a year and coming from civilized world with credit cards, most on the places dont have those in Germany. The whole country is cash-oriented and they might not see the need for Paypal/cc. Just saying, frequent issue in there, although changing slowly.
> Seems like I need to prepare some valium when I pull the trigger for dc80 (no AD here +within EU).


Every German company I have ever dealt with, from Daimler-Benz to Sonor drums... it's the same story. They make great mechanical devices, but leave them alone to do THAT. Any outside request - or compaint - will be handled in an orderly fashion if and when they decide to respond. No amount of griping brings a better result.

If you want a mechanical device made in Germany - and where better, in my opinion, to buy mechanical devices? - it is best to buy from the network that the manufacturer has established for selling, and not to try to buy from the manufacturer who, after all, is in the business of manufacturing.

If you live close to Damasko, that network _might _include their shop. b-)


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## Hose A

Nadroj56 said:


> I understand what you're saying. But. Is basic friendly accommodating customer service really that much to ask from a brand?
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Sorry for your troubles. I sent a few emails asking about custom options on a Damasko purchase and the lady replied quickly and answered all my questions. That's my only experience with them, but their CS was great as far as I'm concerned.


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## drunken-gmt-master

Psalty said:


> Every German company I have ever dealt with, from Daimler-Benz to Sonor drums... it's the same story. They make great mechanical devices, but leave them alone to do THAT. Any outside request - or compaint - will be handled in an orderly fashion if and when they decide to respond. No amount of griping brings a better result.
> 
> If you want a mechanical device made in Germany - and where better, in my opinion, to buy mechanical devices? - it is best to buy from the network that the manufacturer has established for selling, and not to try to buy from the manufacturer who, after all, is in the business of manufacturing.
> 
> If you live close to Damasko, that network _might _include their shop. b-)


+1 based on my experience with Leica cameras & lenses (their CS isn't horrible, but isn't great compared to Japanese companies). Should I ever need service/repair on my Nomos, I hope they'll be the exception!


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## Foxtrott

Semu said:


> Just a sidenote, I'm drooling over DC80 and hence wandered here. The issues sounds very German, not necessarily specific to Damasko. I lived there for a year and coming from civilized world with credit cards, most on the places dont have those in Germany. The whole country is cash-oriented and they might not see the need for Paypal/cc. Just saying, frequent issue in there, although changing slowly.
> Seems like I need to prepare some valium when I pull the trigger for dc80 (no AD here +within EU).


Last week I bought a DA46 in the shop.
Payment with creditcard or bankcard was no problem. 2% discount if you pay with ec-card.


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## Igorek

I've bought rubber strap directly from Damasko without any problems.


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## X2-Elijah

Semu said:


> Just a sidenote, I'm drooling over DC80 and hence wandered here. The issues sounds very German, not necessarily specific to Damasko. I lived there for a year and coming from civilized world with credit cards, most on the places dont have those in Germany. The whole country is cash-oriented and they might not see the need for Paypal/cc. Just saying, frequent issue in there, although changing slowly.
> Seems like I need to prepare some valium when I pull the trigger for dc80 (no AD here +within EU).


Hmm.. This matches what I saw while living in Kiel (north germany) for 2 months in '17. Extremely cash-oriented society and store culture. Ofc payment with CC was possible, especially at stores selling non-everyday expensive things, but.. just the pervasive vibe was very.. nickel-and-dime oriented, so to speak.

So it would not be a surprise to hear that german companies would take umbrage with a bank transfer shared payment, or paypal surcharges, or quibble about percentages here or there.. Most likely it's a matter of principle for them, or at least a reflection of everyday culture...

The larger issue is that Damasko has a problem on their hands with European AD's, as in.. there's a lack of good options. Buying from damasko directly is probably the best way for us EU folk. The two UK-based locales (jura, P&C) have red warning flags all over, and there's no reason to go through a german-based AD, since the CS/interaction will be equivalent compared to Damasko directly.

I guess this is one part where Damasko would do well to learn or copy either Nomos or Stowa. Incidentally, just comparing the web-design approaches of Damasko, Nomos and Stowa shows the difference in perspectives.


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## ShaggyDog

X2-Elijah said:


> Hmm.. This matches what I saw while living in Kiel (north germany) for 2 months in '17. Extremely cash-oriented society and store culture. Ofc payment with CC was possible, especially at stores selling non-everyday expensive things, but.. just the pervasive vibe was very.. nickel-and-dime oriented, so to speak.
> 
> So it would not be a surprise to hear that german companies would take umbrage with a bank transfer shared payment, or paypal surcharges, or quibble about percentages here or there.. Most likely it's a matter of principle for them, or at least a reflection of everyday culture...
> 
> The larger issue is that Damasko has a problem on their hands with European AD's, as in.. there's a lack of good options. Buying from damasko directly is probably the best way for us EU folk. The two UK-based locales (jura, P&C) have red warning flags all over, and there's no reason to go through a german-based AD, since the CS/interaction will be equivalent compared to Damasko directly.
> 
> I guess this is one part where Damasko would do well to learn or copy either Nomos or Stowa. Incidentally, just comparing the web-design approaches of Damasko, Nomos and Stowa shows the difference in perspectives.


Sorry if I may have missed something earlier in this thread, but why do you say that Jura Watches and Page & Cooper both have "red warning flags all over"? Is that just for Damasko or are you just saying to avoid them in general?

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## StufflerMike

ShaggyDog said:


> Sorry if I may have missed something earlier in this thread, but why do you say that Jura Watches and Page & Cooper both have "red warning flags all over"? Is that just for Damasko or are you just saying to avoid them in general?


Done a search ?, probably not, there's a thread on Public on P&C with all info you want to know. And it is not just for Damasko.


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## X2-Elijah

ShaggyDog said:


> Sorry if I may have missed something earlier in this thread, but why do you say that Jura Watches and Page & Cooper both have "red warning flags all over"? Is that just for Damasko or are you just saying to avoid them in general?


As M. Stuffler said, it's more of an overall impression from reports on f8, f2, here and other subforums. In particular there have been threads about P&C "selling" a watch and only then ordering it from a manufacturer (with obvious long delays), and having funding/solvency issues. A forum search will get you those threads, for sure.


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## RKP

stuffler said:


> Done a search ?, probably not, there's a thread on Public on P&C with all info you want to know. And it is not just for Damasko.


I will never ever deal with Page&Cooper in my life, even if my life depended on it! Buying from them is easy but after they called me a liar and wanted to charge me 30% of a cost of a watch to fix small issue. Never again! Watchmann took care of the issue in less than $100. Biggest crooks I've experienced in retail! Disrespectful and not to mention it took a long time to even communicate anything with them. 
Watchmann treats you like a human they treated me like a pig. Sorry but that's my experience! 
Honestly hope they go out of business because they deserve to! Yes it sounds harsh but thats what they deserve for poor CS.


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## RKP

stuffler said:


> Done a search ?, probably not, there's a thread on Public on P&C with all info you want to know. And it is not just for Damasko.


I will never ever deal with Page&Cooper in my life, even if my life depended on it! Buying from them is easy but after they called me a liar and wanted to charge me 30% of a cost of a watch to fix small issue. Never again! Watchmann took care of the issue in less than $100. Biggest crooks I've experienced in retail! Disrespectful and not to mention it took a long time to even communicate anything with them. 
Watchmann treats you like a human they treated me like a pig. Sorry but that's my experience! 
Honestly hope they go out of business because they deserve to! Yes it sounds harsh but thats what they deserve for poor CS.


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## mike756

You know, I came into the Damasko forum looking for an alternative to Sinn USA terrible representation (through Watchbuys/RGM)...lol, looks like Damasko might not be any better.

In regards to servicing cost and Rolex, their current service cost for non-Vintage pieces is $750. However, this costs includes most internal components except for large parts (plates, automatic rotor, etc.) Their cost of replacement parts isn't too bad either and if you consider the cost of the watches themselves (and resale values), this price isn't too bad While you can find independents who charge less, they will charge you quite a bit for the internal parts that need replacing so in the end, cost maybe the same or higher than Rolex.


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## noregrets

mike756 said:


> You know, I came into the Damasko forum looking for an alternative to Sinn USA terrible representation (through Watchbuys/RGM)...lol, looks like Damasko might not be any better.


WatchMann (US AD) is fantastic. Go through him and not directly to Barbing and you won't have any issues.

Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk


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## Psalty

noregrets said:


> WatchMann (US AD) is fantastic. Go through him and not directly to Barbing and you won't have any issues.


Yes.


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## mike756

noregrets said:


> WatchMann (US AD) is fantastic. Go through him and not directly to Barbing and you won't have any issues.


Is WatchMann going to hold Damasko accountable for warranty issues? That's what matters to me...the fact that I even have to worry about it is already a red flag. Like De Niro's character in Ronin says, "If there's doubt then there is no doubt."


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## WatchMann

mike756 said:


> Is WatchMann going to hold Damasko accountable for warranty issues? That's what matters to me...the fact that I even have to worry about it is already a red flag. Like De Niro's character in Ronin says, "If there's doubt then there is no doubt."


Mike,

I am not sure I understand your question. We take care of our customers, and Damasko takes care of us. What exactly about that causes you worry? Please advise.


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## mike756

WatchMann said:


> I am not sure I understand your question. We take care of our customers, and Damasko takes care of us. What exactly about that causes you worry? Please advise.


My concern is this, will you take care of the customer even if Damasko won't take care of you because from the sound of it, Damakso doesn't always accept responsibility for their poor QC which is another worry in and of itself. I understand that it puts you guys in a pickle and if that's the case, I'd rather not place either one of us in this type of situation and I do that by avoiding the brand all together.


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## WatchMann

mike756 said:


> My concern will you take care of the customer even if Damasko won't take care of you because from the sound of it, Damakso doesn't always accept responsibility for their poor QC which is another worry in and of itself. I understand that it puts you guys in a pickle and if that's the case, I'd rather not place either one of us in this type of situation and I do that by avoiding the brand all together.


 Nothing like that has ever come up on our end. The bottom line is you, and no matter what we will never leave you hanging (they have never left us hanging either)


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## mike756

WatchMann said:


> Nothing like that has ever come up on our end. The bottom line is you, and no matter what we will never leave you hanging (they have never left us hanging either)


Awesome. I may not end up getting a Damasko but I'm browsing your website to see what else you have.


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## tsteph12

Dear Greg,

You are The Mann. I've been a member on this forum from its conception and can attest that without a doubt, you are a true pleasure to do business with and conduct yourself with utmost class. Watches I have purchased from you will so far will not be the last to be sure. All the best to you!

Tom


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## WatchMann

tsteph12 said:


> Dear Greg,
> 
> You are The Mann. I've been a member on this forum from its conception and can attest that without a doubt, you are a true pleasure to do business with and conduct yourself with utmost class. Watches I have purchased from you will so far will not be the last to be sure. All the best to you!
> 
> Tom


Thank you so much Tom, all the best to you too!


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## WatchMann

tsteph12 said:


> Dear Greg,
> 
> You are The Mann. I've been a member on this forum from its conception and can attest that without a doubt, you are a true pleasure to do business with and conduct yourself with utmost class. Watches I have purchased from you will so far will not be the last to be sure. All the best to you!
> 
> Tom


Thank you so much Tom, all the best to you too!


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## The watch knob

I'll third that for Greg. He responds to questions/inquiries very quickly. He helped my non-watch oriented wife buy me an anniversary gift, and he assisted me with a near purchase of a Damasko (DC 80 I wanted with 12-hr bezel then Damasko decided not to offer that) I ended up not buying.
With Watchmann here, there is no need to deal directly with Damasko, Greg has you covered.


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## WatchMann

Thank you Watch Knob! I understand now they will accept special requests for the 12 hr bezel.


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## river bum

Ive been browsing the Damasko Forum threads and trying to get a handle on what to expect if an issue arrises after purchase. Seems like most people are pretty satisfied with their Damasko watches. However....There are few who seem to report some major difficulty in dealing directly with Damasko on the service. After reading through this...seems like the ONLY way to purchase a new Damasko is to go through Greg and Watchmann. Im in the market for my next purchase and have narrowed it down to 3 different watches. One of those is the Damasko DC80. 

Gives me some good confidence purchasing though Watchmann after reading this


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## Vig2000

WatchMann said:


> Nothing like that has ever come up on our end. The bottom line is you, and no matter what we will never leave you hanging (they have never left us hanging either)


As an AD with presumably more insight than us Joe Schmo customers, can you perhaps shed some insight as to why they tend to leave their customers hanging? They may not leave you hanging as an AD, but sadly the same cannot be said when the customer deals direct with Damasko (hence this thread and many other customer complaints found elsewhere). I've read everything from them failing to respond to basic customer emails to them sending a warranty repair back to the customer that was not even looked at to everything in between. Are they just not equipped for direct sales, service, and communication? Is it a staffing/manpower issue? Are there any cultural or language barriers at play? Do they simply not care? I mean, this subforum is even sponsored by them and they _never_ contribute anything to it except the one measly post to their name from 2016, asking the forum to vote for them for an award. It's as if they perished off the face of the Earth and ceased to exist. Any insight that you may provide would truly be helpful.


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## WatchMann

Vig2000 said:


> can you perhaps shed some insight


I can only speak first hand of my own experience (as an owner as well), but I believe 100% that they strive to address every situation fairly and honestly.


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