# Ball Trainmaster Worldtime Chronograph (Black)



## xvfasttrip (Nov 13, 2008)

Hello all, just wanted your opinion on this watch from the Ball watch fan point of view. 

I thought the Ball Aviator GMT would be the last watch I purchase this year but turns out I still want one more...

Specifically a world timer that is somewhat dressy enough that it would looks good with a suit at work, party, etc. 

My budget for "the last watch of the year" is quite flexible as long as under $10k. 

So the issue at hand is, a choice between the Zenith Doublematic and Ball Trainmaster Worldtime Chronograph Black-face (love the Zenith Traveller Alarm but it is out of budget).

I thought I was sure on getting the Zenith Doublematic but the Ball is looking very tempting at the moment.

+/-
Zenith have awesome features: 36,000 bph, 30-minutes chrono, world time, alarm, alarm power reserves
Ball features: 28,800 bph (if I'm not mistaken), full 12 hr chrono, world time, gas tube

What's pulling me towards the Ball is the fact that I think it looks classier/dressier then the Zenith. Yes, the Zenith is big at 45 mm, but I am not sure if it has the sparkle as a dress watch (seems too aviator-ish for a dress watch).

Unlike the Ball Aviator the Zenith is more of a serious purchase (more than $5k is a serious purchase for me) and there's something in me that wanted to go with the value watch that Ball brand offer but am afraid I would still have the lust for the Zenith. 

Basically, I love the features in the Zenith; but will it get attention/look of a classy expensive timepiece in a party/events even with a shinier croco band? Or maybe I should just get Rolex GMT II 18k/SS?


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## dmunz (Oct 22, 2009)

Wow, I really like that Zenith (Oh Rob...)

The problem with Ball is the lume. Once you get used to it it is very hard to like a watch that doesn't have it.

I have the regular WorldTime and it is my daily dress watch so you won't go wrong there. But I would be very tempted by the alarm...

EDIT: Hold the phone Nelly. I just Googled the Doublematic and I'm seeing an MSRP of $13K. That busts your $10K limit. If that is the right pricing, the Ball is a much better value.

FWIW
DLM


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## bg002h (Mar 28, 2010)

I'm a huge Trainmaster Worldtime Chronograph fan. Dressy. Functional. Sophisticated. The Lume colors are great. It's a full 12 hour chronograph. Its a pretty cool set of complications. You could buy 3 of them for the price of the zenith. 

I really like the alarm feature too...I'd rather buy a few Balls though...


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## samanator (Mar 8, 2008)

If you have the means the El Premiro is a Horological Tour De force with more of an aviator history. That being said the Ball is actually much better looking and a more interesting detailed dial configuration. The Ball actually IMO looks like the higher cost piece based on these pictures.


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## mick arthur (Feb 21, 2011)

I think the Ball fits your requirements better. The Zenith has too much going on; its multiple crowns are poorly placed/designed in my opinion.


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## xvfasttrip (Nov 13, 2008)

Thanks guys. Samanator and mick arthur are on the ballpark, the Ball simply looks more expensive and the Zenith pusher looks like it is from a Casio. 

The two features pulling me toward the Zenith are the alarm w/power reserve and on-off indicator, as well as the 36,000 bph. 

But why does the Ball looks more expensive in my head?


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## gtuck (Feb 3, 2012)

Bremont has a new and gorgeous Worldtimer (ALT1-WT) as well, but costs considerably more than the Ball.


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## DDD3333 (Sep 11, 2011)

The Trainmaster Worldtime is a very pretty watch but too small for my taste (I have the EMII Worldtime Diver).

However that shot of the Zenith is not very flattering and the reality is that it really exists in another more sophisticated world. A better feel from the watch can be found at this 'aBlogtoread' video on You Tube

Zenith Pilot Doublematic Watch Hands-On - YouTube

There is another Chinese video from Basel World that shows the alarm working and the wind-down indicator on the face itself which is very very cool (its circles around and changes from green to red!)....sadly the Zenith is also in another world budget-wise.

That said, conversly the Ball worldtimers offer fantsic value for money...but, if money were no object I would not hesitate to opt for the Zenith.


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## darren2how (Jun 25, 2009)

The Trainmaster chronograph still stand out as you can see the time at the darkest days of night!


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## ~tc~ (Dec 9, 2011)

dmunz said:


> The problem with Ball is the lume. Once you get used to it it is very hard to like a watch that doesn't have it.


X2

That said, Worldtime + alarm would be my perfect travel watch.


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## xvfasttrip (Nov 13, 2008)

~tc~ said:


> X2
> 
> That said, Worldtime + alarm would be my perfect travel watch.


Let's ask Ball to make one then.


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## mick arthur (Feb 21, 2011)

xvfasttrip said:


> Thanks guys. Samanator and mick arthur are on the ballpark, the Ball simply looks more expensive and the Zenith pusher looks like it is from a Casio.
> 
> The two features pulling me toward the Zenith are the alarm w/power reserve and on-off indicator, as well as the 36,000 bph.
> 
> But why does the Ball looks more expensive in my head?


I think it does look more expensive. It would take a WIS to know the Zenith is actually more expensive based on the complications offered. Is the Zenith movement "in-house"? Any pics available of the movement?


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## ~tc~ (Dec 9, 2011)

mick arthur said:


> Is the Zenith movement "in-house"? Any pics available of the movement?


Im sorry, but did you seriously just ask that?

The El Primero is one of the most famous movements ever ... Named El Primero for being the first automatic chronograph (at least in Zeniths mind)


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## mick arthur (Feb 21, 2011)

~tc~ said:


> Im sorry, but did you seriously just ask that?
> 
> The El Primero is one of the most famous movements ever ... Named El Primero for being the first automatic chronograph (at least in Zeniths mind)


Fair enough. Definitely a stupid question on my part. Yes, I am familiar with the El Primero.

Here's a pic from zenith.watchprosite.com:









Here's a pic from Worldtempus.com:


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## mdatta (Apr 20, 2012)

Hard call, as I love both Ball and Zenith watches. I have also been looking closely at the GMT/Alarm watches. Another consideration could be the Jaeger-LeCoultre Master Compressor Extreme World, it runs about 12-15,000 USD, and has similar features as the Zentih Doublematic. When I compare those two (Zenith and Jaeger-LeCoultre) I think the Zenith looks more refined. When I compare these to the Ball Trainmaster Worldtime I think the Ball appears the most classy. For the money I think the ball is hands down the winner. If money is no object, or if an alarm is absolute, then I would go with the Zenith. My humble opinion. Milt


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## Mark9Fiji (Dec 3, 2011)

Of those two watches I'd choose the Ball Trainmaster World Time. While I think both are great watches the Zenith Doublematic's red dominance on one side makes the watch seem... cluttered in comparison to the single color-dominance of the Ball Trainmaster-Which leads me to choose the Ball Trainmaster of the two-it's a LOT more cleaner to me. 

BUT! If I was in your position, I would buckle down and save up for the Zenith World Traveler Alarm. Too much beauty inside and out to pass up on IMO. Check it out for yourself in person! I know it put's a smile on my face when I see it


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## samanator (Mar 8, 2008)

I've had two complete afternoons to spend at Toppers and they have both. I stick with my first observation that I feel the Ball is much better looking then the Zenith, but the Zenith has many complications built into it. I will comment that if you choose the Ball consider the white/silver dial. If you think the black looks high end I think the white version multiplies that by 2 or more. This piece in white really catches my eye. As always I suggest seeing both, since you may just like the black better. If only the non chrono WT version was this case and crown configuration. The saturn crown shape along with the globe dial pattern does not work for some watches, but for this one it completes and compliments the look.


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## xvfasttrip (Nov 13, 2008)

samanator said:


> I've had two complete afternoons to spend at Toppers and they have both. I stick with my first observation that I feel the Ball is much better looking then the Zenith, but the Zenith has many complications built into it. I will comment that if you choose the Ball consider the white/silver dial. If you think the black looks high end I think the white version multiplies that by 2 or more. This piece in white really catches my eye. As always I suggest seeing both, since you may just like the black better. If only the non chrono WT version was this case and crown configuration. The saturn crown shape along with the globe dial pattern does not work for some watches, but for this one it completes and compliments the look.


Thanks Samanator, I do have a lot of black dial watch so that is another plus on the Ball being available with the white. I have not seen the Zenith first hand yet and so I could not decide yet. But the Zenith with the silver dial looks amazing except that it only comes with the gold case and hefty price tag.


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## xvfasttrip (Nov 13, 2008)

samanator said:


> I've had two complete afternoons to spend at Toppers and they have both. I stick with my first observation that I feel the Ball is much better looking then the Zenith, but the Zenith has many complications built into it. I will comment that if you choose the Ball consider the white/silver dial. If you think the black looks high end I think the white version multiplies that by 2 or more. This piece in white really catches my eye. As always I suggest seeing both, since you may just like the black better. If only the non chrono WT version was this case and crown configuration. The saturn crown shape along with the globe dial pattern does not work for some watches, but for this one it completes and compliments the look.


Hi Samanator,

Are you sure they have the Zenith there? I check around and they said it is not release yet until mid October. I really want to see this one in person..


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## samanator (Mar 8, 2008)

I though I saw the watch in your picture in the case there. It's very different from other Zeniths. They are listed already on Chrono24 from other US sources, and the Watch Time Article on them was from April this year. Rob generally has it marked different if it is not yet available on his site.


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## samanator (Mar 8, 2008)

I think this picture from the Topper Event proves they have at least one of the Zeniths at a store. There are more pictures of it on the Bremont Forum.


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## puttslayer (Jul 26, 2012)

OK. I understand the anti-watch argument of "when would you ever be without the time." I like a watch. It is a great fashionable accessory and I find myself using it all the time. Especially when needing accurate time or when trying to be subtle. They keep you aware of how to use the day. But an alarm function is a little harder to rationalize. When would you ever be in a spot where you needed an alarm where there wasn't a better option? Camping? I like the Zenith, but as a Ball watch owner, know that you can't go wrong with Ball. They are fantastic watches at a superb value. I think after using the alarm function a few times, you'll long for the Ball as buyers remorse sets in. As a bonus, with the extra 5k you saved you can take it to a few of those additional time zones.


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## samanator (Mar 8, 2008)

puttslayer said:


> OK. But an alarm function is a little harder to rationalize. When would you ever be in a spot where you needed an alarm where there wasn't a better option? Camping?


Actually some people have found an alarm function quite useful. The Vulcan Cricket has been referred to as the presidents watch. I think Eisenhower was the first president to use this when traveling. JLC has continued to have an alarm watch for quite a while and they are popular models including the Navy Seal MC diver with the feature. I can see if you are on a flight and want to take a nap and want to wake up a half hour before you land it could be useful. Some people just want to be reminded of an event. When I travel I trust my things more than a hotel alarm clock. Now I do use my phone. The other device argument could be used for watches themselves, but we all seem to still find the need to have a few.


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## aaronchoo (Oct 3, 2012)

Hi guys! Aaron from Singapore here! Just thought I would share my opinions:
I'm really liking how the Ball TWC looks! Love the dial and am quite sure (as with puttslayer) I wouldn't notice the lack of alarm (which is more of a bonus imo).
Plus you save a butt load of money (Y)


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## dmunz (Oct 22, 2009)

samanator said:


> Actually some people have found an alarm function quite useful. The Vulcan Cricket has been referred to as the presidents watch. I think Eisenhower was the first president to use this when traveling. JLC has continued to have an alarm watch for quite a while and they are popular models including the Navy Seal MC diver with the feature. I can see if you are on a flight and want to take a nap and want to wake up a half hour before you land it could be useful. Some people just want to be reminded of an event. When I travel I trust my things more than a hotel alarm clock. Now I do use my phone. The other device argument could be used for watches themselves, but we all seem to still find the need to have a few.


I have a Cricket Dual Time that I wear when I know I'm going into a meeting that will run over. I set the alarm for about ten minutes past the scheduled end and just about everyone jumps out of ther skin when it goes off. I'm not quite sure how that would go over on a plane... b-)

I only wish I could find an actual Cricket GMT. The dual time is just a second 12 hour bezel that you rotate.

FWIW
DLM


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## samanator (Mar 8, 2008)

dmunz said:


> I have a Cricket Dual Time that I wear when I know I'm going into a meeting that will run over. I set the alarm for about ten minutes past the scheduled end and just about everyone jumps out of ther skin when it goes off. I'm not quite sure how that would go over on a plane... b-)
> 
> I only wish I could find an actual Cricket GMT. The dual time is just a second 12 hour bezel that you rotate.
> 
> ...


Is it really loud? I've wanted to see one in person, but have not yet. My understanding is it is much louder than a JLC.


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## dmunz (Oct 22, 2009)

samanator said:


> Is it really loud? I've wanted to see one in person, but have not yet. My understanding is it is much louder than a JLC.


It is loud, but it is more the actual sound (the trademark chrip) that does it. In all honesty, it is not as loud on the wrist as it is off like you see in some of the youtube videos. I'm still toying with going to the BMW event. If I do I'll bring it along and maybe we can compare it with the Zenith (if Rob still has it.) These really are cool watches but they don't make a true GMT so there are mostly off my radar. (All their watches are just timezone slide rules so you can calculate different times.) I picked up the dual time on an eBay drive by bid that ended up winning.

FWIW
DLM


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## xvfasttrip (Nov 13, 2008)

Saw the Vulcain Cricket world time at Tourneau, it is loud but not that loud. If you are in a quiet place let say a meeting room, then it is considerably loud. The alarm sound of the Cricket isn't very pleasant imho. JLC alarm is the best sounding out of all but I am very much curious on how the Zenith sounded in real life. I decided to pick up 116713LN, as my first Rolex; there goes my budget for the Zenith. 

To puttslayer: The alarm function is very much useful for us traveler. Let say you arrived at Hong Kong around 2 am and have to wait for 3-4 hours layover for the following flight. You are sitting in the lounge wanting to get a quick nap, the alarm function will ensure that you wake up on time without the need to turn on your cellphone and what not; plus, it vibrate on your wrist. Another use of it is if you have 3 hours layover and wanted to shop around that noisy airport. That vibration on your wrist will ensure that you are on time for your flight. Sometimes I can't even feel my cellphone vibrating in my pocket at a busy area; on the wrist, it is a different story.


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## veeman (Jul 6, 2011)

congrats on your purchase!!

honestly as others and yourself have indicated, you were comparing two watches at two very different price points. while the ball looks great, the lack of alarm i think would bother you, and you would soon probably my feeling is switch to a different watch. At these price points, my feeling is, you should not compromise on virtually anything because there are just too many brands and models to choose from numbering in the thousands when you consider all of the different luxury watch makers and all of their models. At these price points, a particular watch should just grab you emotionally with no compromises in terms of color, style, beauty, finish, durability, water resistance, complications, etc. You thought the zenith didn't look as nice as the ball and the ball needed an alarm to be perfect - that means you needed a different watch all together.


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## xvfasttrip (Nov 13, 2008)

That is true, but problem is: there isn't a watch in this price range that fulfill what I wanted. 

The grail list:
Tritium
Alarm
World time disc
Luxurious finish
Within my budget (under 13k retail)

Edit: Chrono is a plus as I do find it useful from time to time. But both scores on these as well.

Both hit 4 out of 5. Really, for me owning a watch is not about the price. But, like you said, its about emotional value the watch brings. If a watch have all that feature (granted its not a quartz), I don't care if it cost $500; I'll def still wear it all the time.

Now a new thing I really do want is a lighted up date or day date by tritium gas like the Ball GMT II. How freaking (sorry) useful will that be?


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