# Guide to Determining the Age and Originality of a Poljot 3133 Chronograph



## polmax3133 (Jun 13, 2011)

Two of the most challenging aspects of collecting Poljot chronographs are determining their age, and whether or not they are in original form. I have always been amazed at how little information is available in regards to dating these watches. This is especially true of the early chronographs produced during the Soviet era, where hard evidence indicating year of production as well as catalogues are few and far between. So here's hoping this guide will help all those interested in determining the age and originality of a Poljot chronograph.

A 3133 Chronograph appears on the front cover of Poljot's 1982 Catalogue:








Unfortunately, I will not be able to add sufficient information to allow you to pinpoint an exact year of production during much of the Soviet era. However, after cross-referencing a chronograph with the following information, you should be able to narrow the age down to within a few years. In most cases, you will have to rely on more than just one element to determine a) the approximate age of the chronograph, b) whether or not it has been repaired at some point, and c) whether or not it has been frankened together using available parts. In addition, you can expect to see a replacement part or two on many of the older chronographs that can confuse the dating process.

I would welcome any information that would help identify the age of a particular early model chronograph, and I will be happy to make changes/updates when necessary. However, if you have previously posted information about dating a 3133, or have posted images of a 3133 movement, I have more than likely already viewed it and taken it into consideration - and thank you for that. What we need now is hard-evidence such as a chronograph with papers from the late '70s or early '80s. Even circumstantial evidence such as Dad or Gradpa "received this watch in 1980 while serving in the military" or "when visiting the Soviet Union", or possibly an engraving that indicates the latest possible production date. Again, if it's already "out there", I've probably seen it.

The majority of watches and photographs in the following presentation are from my own collection. However, my conclusions are by no means based on my collection alone. I am simply using my own images, whenever possible, to avoid having to make numerous and sometimes impossible requests. Thanks to those who have, unknowingly, provided images for this presentation, as I have no record of where I copied them from.

*The Balance Wheel*

By the beginning of 1993, all Poljot Chronograph movement are fitted with a new silver alloy balance wheel. Checking the balance wheel is a quick way of determining which side of Q4-1992 a Poljot chronograph is on. However, there's always the chance that a well worn chronograph from the '80s has been retrofitted when serviced.

A "Made in Russia" in '92 chronograph with brass balance wheel:








A NOS "Kosmos-1992" with brass balance wheel:








A NOS "Space'92" tagged June, 1993 with a new silver alloy balance wheel:








A "MADE IN RUSSIA" stamp appeared on the balance wheel bridge between 1997-2004:















*The Chronograph Wheels*

A switch from silver to gold coloured chronograph wheels took place ca. 1983 - around the same time the chronographs became available to the public. Often you will see a mix of silver and gold chronograph wheels due either to repair or franken-work. See examples of both versions in the images below.

*Chronograph Bridge Stamps - Model Number Stamp

*The Initial Model Stamp - 1976-1990

Font type: OCR-B 







Note that on the "3" the open end of the top bar extends out equally as far as the open end of the bottom bowl.

Early Poljot 3133 chronograph: 








Late Soviet era Poljot Chronograph 1990:








Second Model Stamp early-"SU 3133" - 1990-1993

Font Type: OCR-B

An "SU" is prefixed just prior to the break up of the Soviet Union.








A late Soviet era early-"SU 3133" stamp 1991:








A Russian early-"SU 3133" stamp 1992:








Frankenmakers will fit this movement to an original or reproduction '80s dial because it has the "SU" stamp, and in most cases a brass balance wheel. Later model movements are also fitted with fake bridge stamps and brass balance wheels:







Having cross-referenced the above chronograph with the information in this document, one should be able to conclude that this is the ultimate 3133 frankenchrono! :-(

The bridge stamp has been faked - "23 JEWELS" in latin on a so-called '80s OKEAH?

Different era bridge stamp - "SU 3133" on an '80s OKEAH?

"SU 3133" + "23JEWELS" in latin never happened.

The dial is a reproduction, the hands are wrong...

Just about everything about this watch is not right. The movement is a late-'90s fitted with brass balance and faked chrono bridge stamp. And here's the kicker... it can be all yours for the "Buy It Now" price of $625US! b-)

Third Model Stamp late-"SU 3133" - 1993-1995

The font-type is a bolder modification of the previous stamp.








Note that:

A)On the "3", the open end of the bottom bowl extends out further than the upper bar.
B)The right stem of the "U" is leaning slightly to the left.

NOS "Space'92" tagged June, 1993 with late-"SU 3133" stamp:








NOS "Kosmos 1994-1996"" with late-"SU 3133" stamp:








Forth model stamp - 1995-1997

The "SU" is removed prior to the 1996 Olympics in Atlanta, Georgia, USA. A coincidence? Maybe. Poljot produced numerous commemorative watches for the 1996 Olympics.















NOS Poljot "Body Guard" 1996:








Poljot "Casino" 1997:








Fifth model stamp - 1997-present-day

A new stamp with a "P" (which presumably stands for "Russia") prefixed to a bolder version of the original style number font.








NOS Poljot "Alpha Group Sniper" 1997:








Aviator with MakTime 3133 assembled in 2010:








*Chronograph Bridge Stamps - 23Jewels Stamp*

A conversion from Cyrillic to Latin on the "23JEWELS" stamp was introduced with the "Fifth model stamp - 1997-present"(see above).

*Chronograph Bridge Stamps - Movement Serial Number and Poljot Crown

*Assuming that the top of the chronograph bridge is where the jewels are located, for the vast majority of Poljot chronographs we are use to seeing a 4 or 5 digit serial number rotated counter-clockwise approximately 120 degrees from the normal horizontal position - with the lower part of the numbers being closest to the centre of the chronograph bridge. The top of the number is to the left, and the bottom is to the right. Some of the earliest models, however, are a mirror image of this with the top of the numbers being closest to the centre of the chronograph bridge(Image 1).

There are more than a few examples of this.

Also, note the head of crown/stem release push button on all of these movements is protruding instead of being machined hollow. Want to know if you have an early Poljot chronograph movement? Check this button!

Image 1:








Image 2:








Image 3:








Image 4:








Some versions have the Poljot crown stamped on the bridge(2,3), and some do not(1). Also note than neither of the above examples has a Poljot crown stamped on the main body of the movement.

Now, the question is which of the bridge stamp variations came first?

The most logical explanation would be the initial bridge stamp had the mirrored serial number without the Poljot crown(1); followed by version two which had a Poljot crown added(2); then version three with the cast about modern application of the serial number with crown(3); and then version four with the crown eliminated from the bridge stamp and placed on the main body beside the balance wheel as seen below.

*EDIT: Another version with the protruding crown release button on the movement. This version has the crown stamp on the main body of the movement, indicating that is the newest version of the early 3133 chronograph movements. The chronograph is very similar to the one pictured in the 1982 catalogue(see above).






*








A typical mid-80s bridge stamp:








Of course, this is just my own theory. However, any other scenario would involve an extra flip-flop of the serial number at some point.

Whatever the case may be, the lack of a Poljot crown on the main body of the movement, and the protruding stem release button head, are the two common properties that enable you to date a movement to the early years of production. Plus, if you were to take into account serial numbers on the high side of 5000, it's not hard to imagine movements with these bridge stamps running into the early '80s. According to a few sources, production of the 3017 chronograph was approximately 5000 unit per year, and there is no reason to believe it was much higher for the pre-1989 3133 chronographs. Again, if anyone has some hard evidence--I'd love to see it!

Moving on from the so-called military-issue period, the only change of significance made to the serial number was in 1989 when it was changed from a 4-digit number to a 5-digit number. At this point during the era of Perestroika, projected production would have been in excess of 10,000 units per year and hence an extra digit would have been necessary.

An early 5-digit serial number "04226" 1989:








A complete bridge stamp overhaul took place in 1997 with a noticeable downsizing of the serial number font.








*The Date Ring
*
The San Serif font on the early date ring prints is slightly bolder.

An early '80s aviator model sporting a replaced chrono second hand, repaired second and chrono minute hand, a replaced crystal, and the original older date ring print:








A mid-80s Aviator with a slightly more refined print of the same Sans Serif font on the date ring:















A new thin and tall Gothic-style font replaces the old Sans Serif date ring font in 1988.















Over a decade later, just Prior to the demise of Poljot, a new and much bolder font made it's debut in 2001.















*The Chronograph Reset Lever*

Converted from a two-piece adjustable to one-piece non-adjustable between 1986-87. Another easy way to date your chronograph.








*Dials, Bezels and Cases

*To keep things manageable, I'm going to limit coverage to the late-seventies and majority of the eighties. Juri Levenberg's numerous catalogues, available through his eBay store, adequately cover the hundreds of dials available throughout the nineties.

Documented history of the early Poljot 3133 chronographs is, to say the least, vague. According to numerous sources(all repeating the same thing), the military-issue OKEAH was produced first, followed shortly thereafter by the military-issue Aviator Sturmanskie, and then we jump ahead 5-years to the release of the 3133 movement for non-military use in 1983 - with nothing more than a few links to spaceflights for other pre-1983 models. Beyond 1983, however, you can find a much greater degree of information, mostly imagery, supplied by sources across the internet.

A quick reference timeline chart:








First, I'd like to touch on something all the chronograph dials have in common; the machining of the chronograph eyes. There are a few different variations. On the early dials, the ridge connecting the sunken chronograph eyes and the main face of the dial has a curved slope:







Note the slight curvature at the far end of the the painted indices adjacent to the chronograph eye.

Some mid-'80s dials had what looks to be a trench around the vertical walls that connect the sunken chronograph eyes and the main face of the dial.








Later versions are simple straight cut right angles:








*The so-called "Civilian" dials*:




































Not all of the colour variations (silver, black or blue) are listed.

A high-resolution scan of the chronograph(3) alledged to have been worn by Berezovoy on the T-5 Soyuz mission between May 13 - December 10, 1982:







At the time new to Poljot chronographs, Serif-type fonts began to appear on Poljot watches ca. 1980.

Although it's clear that the dials with the Sans Serif font date back to the seventies, there is evidence to support both the San Serif dials, and the newer style dials with the slab Serif-type font, existed side by side through the early and mid-'80s:







Almost identical dials.

The chronograph(2) in the centre of the image below is identical to the one alleged to have been worn by Gorbatko during the Soyuz 24 flight between February 7-25, 1977. Somehow, it made it's way into Poljot's 1992 catalogue. Unfortunately, I have no evidence to suggest that the older Sans Serif dials survived into the '90s. Therefore, I can only assume that (in the absence of an image of the newer model [i.e. with Serif-type font]) an older image from a previous catalogue was used in it's place.







Note the positioning of the hands? For catalogue presentation, all Poljot watches had their hands positioned at 1:43. Also, notice the wrong hands on the model on the left, and the misaligned dial overlay! How did that make it to print?

*OKEAH
*
One the most sought after Poljot Chronographs, limited production OKEAH chronographs from the late 1970s are almost non-existent, and original 1980s models are few and far between in today's online marketplaces.

The chronograph alleged to have been worn by Razhdestvensky on the Soyuz 23 mission between October 14-16, 1976:








The one easily identifiable difference between early(late-'70s, early-'80s) and later model OKEAH dials is the slightly smaller font used to print the name "OKEAH".

A picture taken from the official Volmax web site with the same small font:








A Poljot catalogue image (probably from the early '80s) of an early OKEAH:







Again, for catalogue presentation, all Poljot watches had their hands positioned at 1:43. Also note the red time zone numbers on the rotating bezel, another indication of an early model.

And here is what I believe to be the definitive proof that this is the original OKEAH dial:














This watch has a later model of the original 3133 movement with the protruding head on the crown release button(see "Chronograph Bridge Stamps - Poljot Crown" above).

A mid-'80s OKEAH:







Military-issue OKEAHs have stainless steel cases. To date, I have no evidence of OKEAHs being produced into the nineties.

*AVIATOR STURMANSKIES*

Limited editions of the Aviator model were released up until it was replaced by the new grey painted version beginning in 1986. I own two of the older Aviator Sturmanskies. Both are fitted with stainless steel cases and stainless steel push buttons. I doubt this chronograph was ever available to the general public.

A mid-'80s Aviator Sturmanskie:








The early version of the new style stainless steel Aviator Sturmanskie 31569 - 1987:








How do you tell whether on not the case is stainless steel? It's not that easy. Check for wear-through on the chronograph push buttons and back side of the case - not the actual screwed down case back which is stainless steel on all models. The screw down stainless steel case back is a good excuse for vendors to claim "Stainless Steel".

A late Soviet-era Sturmanskie 31569 and 3133 -1991:








An excerpt from an early '90s Poljot catalogue: _"During the latest Soviet-German space flight the new design of watch "Schturmanskie" was highly appreciated by spacemen." _

An by modern-day collectors too! :-d

My late Soviet-era Sturmanskie:








*Replica Dials
*
There out there, so take a good look at the dial of any '80s chronograph before purchasing. The easiest way to tell if the dial is a reproduction is by checking for a contemporary application of luminance, as the colour, texture, and volume is way off.








*I hate to end on a sour note, so here's an awesome image of the still available Volmax OKEAH 3133:






*


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## aviator3133 (Sep 15, 2011)

Wow, great post Polmax! This should become a sticky post, a lot of great information there


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## frantsous (Feb 11, 2011)

Thank you!!! Great job! Hope you will continue on it! It's a very interesting subject and you know very well the 3133! So lot of things to learn from you!

About the crown's mark:









Do you know more about it. I asked because I saw some early 3133 with ou without it, but with the same range of numbers!

Also, about dial:

Here is an early model (beginning of 80's):









And here is a dial from the end of 80's:









So we can see the difference of the fonts and the big difference with the USSR.


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## Conchita Turtle (Feb 7, 2010)

Great thread!!!! :-!:-!:-!


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## Girolamo (Oct 8, 2011)

Great! Add to fav. Many thanks.


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## Argon (Apr 14, 2009)

Wow - a staggering amount of work there, Polmax, and a very valuable addition to the body of Russian watch knowledge. Thank you!


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## polmax3133 (Jun 13, 2011)

Thanks, guys! I've been meaning to put this guide together for some time now.

In regards to the dials you have, frantsous, the Sans Serif model has a thick black border around the date window, therefore I would suspect that it also has the silver coloured chrono wheels. Curiously, the Latin Sans Serif dial seems to have survived, alongside the Serif dials, well into the ‘80s with a more refined version of the date-window-border and gold coloured chrono wheels.

As for the Crown, I suspect that after deciding to stamp it on the chrono bridge, Poljot later found a problem that necessitated a relocation. Maybe it was too close to the jewel.


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## frantsous (Feb 11, 2011)

polmax3133 said:


> In regards to the dials you have, frantsous, the Sans Serif model has a thick black border around the date window, therefore I would suspect that it also has the silver coloured chrono wheels. Curiously, the Latin Sans Serif dial seems to have survived, alongside the Serif dials, well into the '80s with a more refined version of the date-window-border and gold coloured chrono wheels.


Here is my early 80's latin Poljot:









Look like my old cyrillic Poljot:


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## polmax3133 (Jun 13, 2011)

Here's my oldie. I'm still on the lookout for a decent Cyrillic version.















Edit: I just noticed that hair on the movement! :-d


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## Vaurien (Jun 9, 2008)

polmax3133 said:


> Edit: I just noticed that hair on the movement! :-d


Oh my! I know it. That's must be an hair of my cat Ivan....:-| 
(I REALLY don' know how could it arrive into your watch :-d )


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## polmax3133 (Jun 13, 2011)

A dials section has been added. And a small but segnificant update to the "Chronograph Bridge Stamps - Movement Serial Number and Poljot Crown" section.

Vaurien, here's the culprit:







Her name is Mishka, and she also like to play with unattended watch parts! o|


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## mchap (Feb 7, 2008)

@Polmax3133, please could you tell us something more about the Poljot's 1982 Catalogue?


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## polmax3133 (Jun 13, 2011)

I had to retrace my steps through the deepest, darkest corners of the i-net to find these images again... but here they are:

CHINA WATCHES :: Zobacz temat - Katalogi z Radzieckimi Zegarkami

Only obtainable through a Google Poland search!

Unfortunately, the link to the catalogue is broken. Maybe one of our Polish friends can contact the forum member and arrange another upload. I was only interested in the cover, as it displays the only chronograph in the catalogue.

He has a Raketa `84 as well.


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## mchap (Feb 7, 2008)

:-!:-!:-!


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## michele (Feb 10, 2006)

Great article, and everything makes sense IMO. :-! I have just some doubts about the faked V-shaped bridge. I have seen a good number of bridges, and i have often found SU bridges in models that were produced 
much time after the USSR collapse. 

Moreover, for at least 4 or 5 times, i have found bridges marked as 31659 (typical of hacking-stop Shturmanskies) on normal, post-Soviet calibers 3133. I'm pretty sure that those watches were not frankened, they were often brand-new "basic" chronographs, the installation of a 31659 bridge makes no sense of those watches. I think that inscriptions on that bridge were quite mixed during the time. 

On that Franken Okeah, the most logical and easier solution for the frankenmaker would be to install a normal, easily available SU 3133 bridge in Cyrillic, quite than taking an engraving machine to write "SU" on an English-stamped bridge. Also, we should draw up statistics about dial/bridge language to check if they always match. 

Great source anyway, i have already moved it in the Articles section. |>


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## polmax3133 (Jun 13, 2011)

michele said:


> Great article, and everything makes sense IMO. :-! I have just some doubts about the faked V-shaped bridge. I have seen a good number of bridges, and i have often found SU bridges in models that were produced
> much time after the USSR collapse.
> 
> Moreover, for at least 4 or 5 times, i have found bridges marked as 31659 (typical of hacking-stop Shturmanskies) on normal, post-Soviet calibers 3133. I'm pretty sure that those watches were not frankened, they were often brand-new "basic" chronographs, the installation of a 31659 bridge makes no sense of those watches. I think that inscriptions on that bridge were quite mixed during the time.


Yes, as stated in the article, the "SU 3133" bridge stamp(s) were used between the years 1990-1995 - for the most part in the post-Soviet era. In my opinion, and I think I have adequate evidence to back this up, the bridge stamp is fake because "23 JEWELS" in English was never mixed with "SU 3133". Furthermore, if you examine the image closely, the "SU 3133" on the fake OKEAH is the earlier version(1990-1992). This is the first time I have ever seen a bridge stamp with "SU 3133" + "23 JEWELS" in English. I would be interested in seeing some more examples, if they exist. The switch to "23 JEWELS" in Latin, in my opinion, began in 1997.

_On that Franken Okeah, the most logical and easier solution for the frankenmaker would be to install a normal, easily available SU 3133 bridge in Cyrillic, quite than taking an engraving machine to write "SU" on an English-stamped bridge. Also, we should draw up statistics about dial/bridge language to check if they always match.

_Yes, if the frankenmaker actually had one available, and if he believed that the general public(eBay buyers) were actually aware that "SU 3133" + "23 JEWELS" in English was never mixed. I don't think they are giving us that much credit.

_Great source anyway, i have already moved it in the Articles section._ |>
Thanks for posting to the articles section Michele!


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## michele (Feb 10, 2006)

polmax3133 said:


> _On that Franken Okeah, the most logical and easier solution for the frankenmaker would be to install a normal, easily available SU 3133 bridge in Cyrillic, quite than taking an engraving machine to write "SU" on an English-stamped bridge. Also, we should draw up statistics about dial/bridge language to check if they always match.
> 
> _Yes, if the frankenmaker actually had one available, and if he believed that the general public(eBay buyers) were actually aware that "SU 3133" + "23 JEWELS" in English was never mixed.


As said, the "31659" bridges are an example of bridges added to theorically wrong movements (BTW, the Kosmos 1992 that you posted has exactly one of those bridges). The movement on the Okeah is clearly replaced (wheels and levers are totally wrong) and, given the general poor knowledge, it would be a useless effort to make a so precise "SU 3133" engraving.

However, on the other side, i think that the (obscene o| ) current level of prices makes convenient for Frankenmakers to "improve the details" (as seen with the Shturmanskie and Strela dials, at least in comparison with the old, dear, recognizable "inkjet dials" made until some years ago).

So a fake SU 3133 inscription to "counterbalance" the English inscription, is probably a good investment for the frankenmaker. If that inscription is really fake, its precision and sharpness (perfectly sized and centered) is very worrying. :think:

Brilliant work! |>


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## polmax3133 (Jun 13, 2011)

Yes, you're right, I was going to mention that my "31659" Cosmos is actually a 3133, and my 31659 Sturmanskie is stamped "SU 3133". As we've seen in recent threads, this also happens with present-day Volmax chronographs.

_So a fake SU 3133 inscription to "counterbalance" the English inscription, is probably a good investment for the frankenmaker. If that inscription is really fake, its precision and sharpness (perfectly sized and centered) is very worrying.

_Let's keep an eye out for this on eBay. I wouldn't be surprised if the factory produced a batch of fake old-style chrono bridges. :-(


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## victorbrunswick (Oct 4, 2011)

This is a very informative thread which has filled a lot of gaps in the history of the 3133. I didn't realize that the Aviator Sturmanskie with the gray dial only dates back to 1986. Juri Levenburg's book claims that it dates back to the '60s!


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## polmax3133 (Jun 13, 2011)

And speaking of the history of the 3133, this is the 25th anniversary of the new Sturmanskie and 35th anniversary of the old Aviator. Somebody should have produced a 25th anniversary limited edition chronograph! b-)


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## Buddha Jones (Aug 18, 2010)

@ Polmax3133 - That is a TON of information, I am just going to have to ask you to approve my first 3133 purchase...


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## victorbrunswick (Oct 4, 2011)

I just came across another Okean on eBay. It has a five-digit bridge stamp (circa 1989-90) but an early adjustable reset lever which, combined with the brass balance wheel, would date it between 1983-85.

Rare USSR Military


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## polmax3133 (Jun 13, 2011)

No problem, Buddha Jones!

victorbrunswick, that eBay Okeah has the replica dial installed and who knows where the rest of it came from...

The very thing you are paying the extra $400 for is a forgeryl! :-(


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## kawhai (Aug 10, 2011)

polmax3133 said:


> No problem, Buddha Jones!
> 
> victorbrunswick, that eBay Okeah has the replica dial installed and who knows where the rest of it came from...
> 
> The very thing you are paying the extra $400 for is a forgeryl! :-(


See what you mean about the replica dial. Well, it's gone this evening (is evening for me) for $677. It had a brass case, although the seller does state this. Is a brass case legit for the original Okeah?

It really is a minefield when searching for one of these Soviet era Poljot chronographs!


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## polmax3133 (Jun 13, 2011)

kawhai said:


> See what you mean about the replica dial. Well, it's gone this evening (is evening for me) for $677. It had a brass case, although the seller does state this. Is a brass case legit for the original Okeah?
> 
> It really is a minefield when searching for one of these Soviet era Poljot chronographs!


No, I don't believe any were made with a brass casing. I would have to see one with some papers to change my mind on that. And yes, it is becoming a bit of a joke now with replica dials mounted on top of the frankenworks...


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## sanmosan (Apr 29, 2010)

Very good thread. Thanks a lot for the information.


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## theswitch (Apr 10, 2011)

On Dec. 11, 1993, Sotheby's in NYC auctioned off Viktor Gorbatko's Strela (white face) worn for the entirety of the Soyuz 24 mission. The auction was Sale 6516 "Vostok". The Sotheby's catalog for that auction lists the watch at Lot 117 with a photograph provided on the facing page to Lot 172. It does not resemble the watch described in this thread. Perhaps Viktor Gorbatko wore two watches on that flight. Does anyone have the reference for the cosmonaut having worn the watch described in this thread? Thank you.


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## polmax3133 (Jun 13, 2011)

theswitch said:


> On Dec. 11, 1993, Sotheby's in NYC auctioned off Viktor Gorbatko's Strela (white face) worn for the entirety of the Soyuz 24 mission. The auction was Sale 6516 "Vostok". The Sotheby's catalog for that auction lists the watch at Lot 117 with a photograph provided on the facing page to Lot 172. It does not resemble the watch described in this thread. Perhaps Viktor Gorbatko wore two watches on that flight. Does anyone have the reference for the cosmonaut having worn the watch described in this thread? Thank you.


This is from the March 16, 1996 Sotheby's catalogue:


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## Eduwatch (Oct 25, 2011)

Hi everybody:

just got acquainted with this amazing thread, full of very interesting info about 3133 chronos.

Thanks a lot Polmax.

It might be very useful for those searching an oldie.

Its not my case, since I'm about to (hopefully seamless) get a brand new OKEAH Final Edition, a limited series reissue promoted by the Spanish forum Hablemosderelojes.com (there's athread about this project here in WUS).


Greetings

Eduwatch


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## Paulo (Feb 14, 2006)

A late thank you for this excelent work Steve!


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## s_marmotte (Feb 18, 2012)

Great work.  thx


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## Russ Cook (Feb 11, 2006)

polmax3133.Thank You,for all the time and affort,you have put into this subject.Very Interesting.

Best Regards,
Russ.


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## Tarquin (Dec 24, 2011)

This is an excellent article! Thank you Polmax.

I have been using it to cross-examine these pictures.






















I can't find much fault, other than the mixture of chrono wheel metal which could just be a repair. I think the hardest part is identifying a reproduction dial, but this one seems suitably aged?


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## Starman66 (Sep 2, 2009)

This ОКЕАН looks fine to me. The seller's watches always appear 100% original to my eyes, save any genuine repairs.
By the way, this is an excellent thread & so useful


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## Monter (Jan 2, 2012)

Great Poljots !!
My Chrono 

all of them were in military use. One of them is an early werk 3133


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## theswitch (Apr 10, 2011)

I found the answer in the 1993 Sotheby's "Vostok" catalog itself. Lot 117 is the white face Strela worn by Viktor Gorbatko during the entirety of the Soyuz 24 mission. Lot 121 is the "Polyet" with elastic band worn when he was in his pressure suit.


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## koutouzoff (May 3, 2011)

very interesting, no pictures of the catalogue?


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## mchap (Feb 7, 2008)

koutouzoff said:


> very interesting, no pictures of the catalogue?


https://www.watchuseek.com/f54/russian-space-history-sothebys-1993-1996-a-477656.html


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## koutouzoff (May 3, 2011)

Fantastic! This is a very precious document!
Thank you


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## GuySie (Jan 14, 2008)

Apologies for kicking an old thread, but I was trying to date my old Poljot Shturmanskie which I was told was airforce-issued because it has a 31659 movement.


(note new style date ring)

I have had the watch for a while but only recently obtained a caseback opener, which means I finally could take a look at the serial. I was hoping to find a serial database or some milestones to date against and found this post. First thing that caught my eye after reading this guide is that my serial number is HUGE. 5 digits, starting with a 9: 90941. A number that high would put in the late 90s. Reset lever is one-piece:



But it has the brass balance wheel:


And it does have the hacking lever so is a genuine 31659, I think?


And the watch and the movement do look beat to hell ancient - not a recent production model. Did I spend money on a franken?


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## polmax3133 (Jun 13, 2011)

Hey GuySie, 

That's very nice chronograph you have there! I wouldn't put any stock into the serial numbers other than 5-digits are roughly post-1988. I believe that during the late-eighties/early-nineties Poljot was producing tens of thousand of chronographs per year, so a serial number in the 90,000s is nothing unusual for that period. If fact, if you look at my web site (see banner below) you will find a similar chronograph in the early-1992 section with an even higher serial number. It does look as though someone hacked the bolts up a little during a servicing, but that's not too unusual.

With the brass balance I would date this one between 1989 and the first half of 1992, therefore most likely a Soviet-era piece. 

And by the way, there is also an updated version of the guide at my website.


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## GuySie (Jan 14, 2008)

Thank you! That helps me a lot! Am going to check out the updated guide now too


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## Dront (Jan 27, 2012)

Great thread ! Thanks ! But I still have some questions. Especially about 3133 OKEANs . First, can I assume that white lume and blue ring with red marks is an exclusive accessory of OKEANs , assembled in the first year or two of production ? Course the rest of OKEANs ewer produced where staffed with dark gray rinds with green marks and lume up to the end of production in 1985 . ( It is common opinion in Russia , that OKEAN as a navy equipment , assembled separately under military delegate control was newer produced since this year) .



Secondly , the chrono wheels set.



No doubt , the left one was assembled earlier than right one , despite it is much better condition. But both watches are genuine ! I've got them from former naval officers . I consider the left watch with complete steel wheels set to be assembled before 1980 (?) , and the right in the 1980-85 period. But there are some images of OKEANs with mixed wheel set. Have you any ideas of whether mixed set is a result of repairing , or a factory default equipment ? And I'm not sure about the year the steel set was replaced to brass wheels in production . May be someone correct me ?


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## polmax3133 (Jun 13, 2011)

*First, I'd like to mention that an updated version of this guide is now available at my web site. Click on the banner link at bottom of any my posts to navigate to polmax3133.com. 
*

Yes, the batch with white lume on both the indices, and hour and minute hands, are unique to the Okeans. It still difficult to say for sure when exactly this batch of Okeans was produced because a) too many of the older chronographs have a none original dial or movement, b) there is a very limited number in existence, and c) none of these original military pieces made it into the catalogues.

What is known is that some the earliest of bezel rings have slightly different number font than what has since become the standard. The font is slightly larger and the "4" has a small bar across the top instead of a point.

However, as you will see, both types of bezel rings are fitted to Okeans with white luminance.

So, which batch of Okeans was the very first?

Timepiece Tenderfoot owns what I believe to be the original Okean, and it's not even an Okean, it's a Poljot:









The lume looks to be in very good condition and it is green.

Here again we have the white lume, but with the supposed newer-style bezel:









This is supposed to be Rozhdestvensky's watch from the 1976 Soyuz 23 space flight.

Next we have an example of a piece with white lume and the old-stlye bezel, but no movement pick:









This Okean has a combination of white and green lume and newer-style bezel, and is pictured with a ca. 1980 Poljot 2616.2H:









Therefore, I believe that the white lume probably survived through numerous batches of Okeans. However, as stated, it's not likely we're going to be able to narrow down the production date windows (for individual batches) much beyond a fairly wide late-seventies through 1982.


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## Dront (Jan 27, 2012)

Thanks a lot ! And what is your opinion about "yellow" wheels equipped movements ?


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## polmax3133 (Jun 13, 2011)

The yellow running wheels began to replace the gold coloured wheels in the later half of the 1990s. By 2000, the supply of gold coloured runners had exhausted and the movements were fitted with all yellow runners.


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## Dront (Jan 27, 2012)

polmax3133 said:


> The yellow running wheels began to replace the gold coloured wheels in the later half of the 1990s. By 2000, the supply of gold coloured runners had exhausted and the movements were fitted with all yellow runners.


Do you mean this wheels ?



I consider it to appear in early 80-th at first "civil" versions of 3133 . And it is from solid brass , not gold platted . Am I wrong ?


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## polmax3133 (Jun 13, 2011)

No, those are the early gold-coloured wheels, I was talking about the newer yellow wheels. Here you see the yellow and gold wheels mixed together in a ca. 1996 piece:









The transition, in the early 1980s, between the older steel coloured wheels and golden wheels was much quicker, and completed by 1983. Beyond this point all model were fitted with all golden running wheels.

Many of the older steel coloured wheels have been replaced with gold coloured wheels after being damaged during servicing or frankenwork. Therefore, it's hard to determine whether or not the running wheels on movemnets from this window-in-time (ca. 1982) are all original.

Something else of interest for all to take note of, is this piece that I noticed had a very faint date (Mar. 1980) inscribed by hand on the inner case back:
















Newer-style dial:








However, it should also be noted that older dials have been replaced, presumably as a part of a watch maintenance at some point (as these dial often acquired moisture damage), therefore you cant assume that this newer-style dial dates to 1980 - but it may well be that the older dial, and white lume, were extinct at this point in time.


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## DolleDolf (Mar 29, 2012)

Great stuff. Terrific website polmax.


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## MrKilla (Nov 20, 2013)

polmax3133 said:


> *First, I'd like to mention that an updated version of this guide is now available at my web site. Click on the banner link at bottom of any my posts to navigate to polmax3133.com.
> *
> Next we have an example of a piece with white lume and the old-stlye bezel, but no movement pick:
> 
> View attachment 1448470


Movement...



Океан-Twelve thousand meters above Оcean ...


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## polmax3133 (Jun 13, 2011)

Thanks MrKilla, I did have a picture of that movement but in a different folder.

I was looking at some images and noticed another version of the original Okeah dial.

The difference is in the outer telemeter scale, which clearly has a different font-style.

The easiest way to tell them apart is to look at the "4" in the scale, with the older dial having a "4" with a horizontal bar at the top (green), and the newer dial having a pointed top (yellow).

Note that the late model telemeter scale on the old dial is the same as the telemeter scale on the second generation (final version) Okeah dial.























Another way to date these chronographs.


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## koutouzoff (May 3, 2011)

also note that the rotating bezel should have the same pattern at 4 o' clock, with the horizontal bar on the top.
Among the 3 Okean you show, only the last one has the right 4 both on dial and on bezel.

Mine has also the flat 4s, but the bezel comes from another watch:









Mechanism comes from an early Shturmanskie:









I found orange hands (large and small) and stainless steel pushers: when the watch will be fit with them it will be the perfect franken!


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## S.H. (Dec 5, 2007)

Those orange hands sure look nice; I wonder why they switched to red.


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## polmax3133 (Jun 13, 2011)

You can also get a steel coloured Valjoux jumper spring, but it's very expensive.


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## koutouzoff (May 3, 2011)

Hello, 

i have a question.

I noticed that silver Shturmanskie dials show 2 different fonts for 4 (40 and 45 minutes):

One version shows a four with the top being opened
the over version shows the four with the top closed.

What version is the older one?
Polmax tends to consider the open 4 as more recent... Mark Gordon presents it as an earlier version.

I have 2 specific versions of the Shturmanskie: silver with a red register and black dia. Both present opened 4...

pictures are from Mark Gordon's collection (I can remove if a problem) and from my collection:


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## Ham2 (Nov 25, 2010)

The earliest version of the silver dial (with the small font) in my collection also has closed 4s (dial and bezel). This watch also has a very early movement with the Poljot crown in the chrono bridge. If this is the earliest iteration of the silver dial then one can assume that closed 4s came first


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## koutouzoff (May 3, 2011)

is the crown of this watch chromed?


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## Ham2 (Nov 25, 2010)

The crown is steel. It just looks shinier in the picture.


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## Titomir (Jul 9, 2012)

polmax3133 said:


> ...I was looking at some images and noticed another version of the original Okeah dial.
> 
> The difference is in the outer telemeter scale, which clearly has a different font-style.


Yup, this is my watch. This is exactly as the following model:









Also look carefully here:









Fonts are matching. This means there were at least 3 different early OKEAHs:


Curved 4 on both the dial and bezel
Curved 4 on a dial, but a sharp 4 on the bezel
Sharp 4s on both the dial and bezel


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## Kisifer (Aug 14, 2012)

Well lets see if I have learnt anything so far in this forum hehehehe. The following 3133 movement belongs to a civilian silver dial Poljot. I would like to make a try and date it. From the information I have got from here I would date it at the end of the 1980s. Around 1987-89. How close am I?? Could it be earlier or later than that? Thanks.


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## polmax3133 (Jun 13, 2011)

With a 4-digit serial number, all gold chrono-runners, and adjustable reset hammer, that would date somewhere in the late-1983 through 1986 window-in-time.


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## Kisifer (Aug 14, 2012)

Ohhh I was close enough  Thanks a lot for the clarification. Next time hopefully I will get it right


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## S.H. (Dec 5, 2007)

Hello!

I was wondering if this was replaced or original: secondary crown linked to the internal bezel, on a steel sturmanskie :


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## polmax3133 (Jun 13, 2011)

I don''t have anything like that in my collection, therefore it is most likely a replacement... but it does look a very close match!


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## S.H. (Dec 5, 2007)

Thanks!


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## Tomas Kitas (Oct 3, 2014)

Hello,
I bought this Poljot chronograph few days ago. And I start thinking after read this topic that my poljot is frankenmake, isnt it? Because I have nver seen this case with this kind of dial.


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## polmax3133 (Jun 13, 2011)

Hello Tomas, and welcome to the forum!

The watch is a perfectly fine, ca. 1992, Poljot chronograph. Enjoy!


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## Tomas Kitas (Oct 3, 2014)

Hello, polmax313,

nice to hear. Thanks!


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## dutchassasin (Feb 18, 2013)

Tomas Kitas said:


> Hello, polmax313,
> nice to hear. Thanks!


Keep in mind to resize the picture next time. Its too big to comfortably see on most screens


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## Tomas Kitas (Oct 3, 2014)

My mistake. It won't happen again. Sorry.


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## MrKilla (Nov 20, 2013)

Hello. I want to show you an interesting mechanism. 
*Poljot 3132.

   







*


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## Ham2 (Nov 25, 2010)

How does the 3132 differ from the 3133?


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## polmax3133 (Jun 13, 2011)

That`s very interesting, MrKilla! I like the video music! I think I remember Boris having one of those at some point in time.


I think the difference is that the winding stem is female, whereas normally it is male.


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## Ham2 (Nov 25, 2010)

polmax3133 said:


> I think the difference is that the winding stem is female, whereas normally it is male.


Thanks Polmax


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## kev80e (Apr 19, 2014)

I could be wrong but I think I saw somewhere that 3132 was a 3133 without the date.Will probably be corrected though.


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## kev80e (Apr 19, 2014)

Found it , of course it was on WUS. https://www.watchuseek.com/f10/poljot-cal-3132-a-616519.html


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## joecool (Nov 11, 2012)

Man i love this thread INFOTASTIC!!


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## Peter-Paul (May 13, 2015)

MrKilla, does that watch have a date calendar window at 6 o clock on the face?



MrKilla said:


> Hello. I want to show you an interesting mechanism.
> *Poljot 3132.
> 
> 
> ...


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## codybudro (Jun 18, 2019)

Old thread, but wonderful article! Thank you for putting it together! I am brand new to the world of Soviet watches, and as soon as I stumbled across the first 3133 on eBay, I knew I had to own one. I just purchased the black dial version with gold sub dials and black bezel, and can't wait for it to arrive (see photos at the end! Being a vintage guitar enthusiast, I quite enjoy the process of deducing details in order to narrow down the date range of a particular item.

Based on your information, I am concluding that my recent purchase can be dated to 1988 according to the details below. Feel free to check my work 

-brass balance wheel
-gold Chrono wheel
-"3133" bridge stamp, OCR-B font
-Crown stamp on movement body
-4-digit serial 120 degrees counter-CW from normal position
-hollow crown release button
-thin, tall gothic-style print on date ring
-1-piece non-adjustable reset lever
-#3 config on dial timeline chart
-trench around sub-dials border

Additionally, mine has a dome-shaped crystal, and I read somewhere that some early versions had this feature. Could it be original? Either way I like it.
Otherwise, the only inconsistency between my watch features and your research is that the #3 config on the dial timeline chart appears to end in 1987, but my date wheel was supposedly introduced in 1988 based on the font. I realize that parts can be swapped out, replaced and interchanged, but for all intents and purposes I try to keep an open mind and an optimistic attitude, especially when it comes to overlapping of particular eras in the history of manufacturing ? Regardless, speculating is part of the fun! Assuming mine is original, would this move the needle at all on the information you've compiled, or does this fall into an assumed "gray area"? Or maybe it's just a franky 

Once again, great work. Glad to revive this thread. Such cool watches. I'll probably end up grabbing another one with a gold/silver patina dial.


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