# Spring Drive Service report



## Peter in the North (Aug 6, 2019)

Many people seem concerned about spring drive services, so I thought I would post this. I have had various watches serviced over the years: Patek, Rolex, Omega, all locally in Toronto, but I had never had a Seiko serviced, and as I now have several, I was wondering if I would have any problems when they came due. I have two GS spring drives (an SBGC003 and SBGY003), but this post is about my oldest; a SNR013. So not actually a GS. I bought it in 2007 as I had read about the spring drive movement and was interested in giving it a try. My SNR013 has a 5R66 movement (spring drive GMT). I have read here that this movement is identical to the GS 9R66 movement but has a lower standard of finishing.

The SNR013 has given no problems to date, and has consistently gained 8 sec/mth, which I find entirely satisfactory. As I am in Canada, I contacted the Seiko Canada distributor where I learned that the watch must be posted to them with the on line form filled in and included in the box. So last October I filled in the form, packed my watch and sent it via Canada Post across town to Seiko Canada. I got an email back a few days later to say that watches of this type (she didn't specify spring drive, but presumably that was it) must go to NJ for an estimate and that would cost $100 shipping and needed my approval. I said OK, go ahead. Next day I got another email saying that she had made a mistake and in fact the watch would need to go to Japan for an estimate and that shipping would be $125. Was that OK? I said 'yes'. (She didn't give any reason why NJ was not being used. (Perhaps too busy, or in the dog-house!)

About three weeks later I got another email saying that the watch would need a full overhaul and that the cost would be $520 (all costs are CDN) plus the quoted freight and tax. I gave the go-ahead.

On January 1, my visa was deducted the quoted amount and on January 2 my watch arrived at my door. I had visions of it being left at the door in a box as Amazon tends to do, so I was pleasantly surprised when the Canada Post person had me sign and show ID. It had been shipped directly from Japan to my house. In the paperwork it said that the power reserve indicator had had to be replaced but no direct replacement part was available, so a near equivalent was used. I saw that it was different, but I doubt if I would have noticed it they had not pointed it out. In any case it did not change the aesthetics of the watch, so I have no problem. (Seemed an odd thing to need replaced though.)

On getting it going, everything looked good. I took a look in the back (it has a display back) and was surprised to see an improvement in the movement! It is still my old 5R66, but the two biggest gears which I believe are associated with the main spring and the winding mechanism, and which had a very basic level of finish, were gone! They were replaced with nicely finished gears that look like those I have seen in the 9R66 movements. I don't know the rationale, but either the watch maker decided to take out the parts for aesthetic reasons or (more probably) she thought that these are hard working components, and only had one source (being the better finished ones) of parts to replace them with.

The other thing the watchmaker did was to regulate the daylights out of my watch. As I said, I was happy with the +8 sec/mth performance, but now, having worn the watch every day since it came back on Jan 2, it has not deviated as much as a second (estimate perhaps half a second). It would be interesting to know how this was done: by adjustment, change of crystal, or...

Overall verdict: Very happy. I can now consider sending my SBGC003 (Chrono plus GMT) which I bought in 2010 for it's tune up, probably later this year. This took less time and cost less money than many previous services locally. So durability and serviceability concerns can be laid to rest as far as I am concerned. Hope this was useful.


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## whineboy (Aug 12, 2012)

Great story, Sir. As a manual Spring Drive owner this is of real value to me, since I was told by a Seiko rep that those can't be serviced in the US, they must return to Japan. 
Even nicer is to hear how well they regulated your watch.


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## Charles Carroll (Sep 12, 2014)

Peter in the North said:


> Overall verdict: Very happy. I can now consider sending my SBGC003 (Chrono plus GMT) which I bought in 2010 for it's tune up, probably later this year. This took less time and cost less money than many previous services locally. So durability and serviceability concerns can be laid to rest as far as I am concerned. Hope this was useful.


Peter - This is the post I have been waiting for. It is *extremely* useful to me. It confirmed everything I have suspected about what I will do when and if it comes time to service my SBGA211. I cannot thank you enough for this Post.

Warmest regards,
Charles


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## Tonhao (Dec 23, 2017)

Thanks for a valuable report. It must be nice to see that they performed upgrades on your watch and dialed the accuracy in. Kinda surprised that the Seiko person bumbled the service location twice, when this information is fairly available.


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## FishingForFishies (Dec 30, 2019)

Great write up and glad to hear it all went well for you. This is a nice change from the usual horror stories from people who have gone through servicing. 

I imagine that like food reviews, a person is more likely to write up a bad experience than a good one. So we get some selection bias here. 

Story does make me feel better about servicing though, even though my watch is new and 4-5 years off from that.


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## BrianBinFL (Jan 10, 2018)

To the OP, when you're wearing the watch is it mostly in a room temperature environment, or is it mostly outdoors? If mostly outdoors, how hot or cold is it where you are? Also, if you ever take the watch out of rotation for awhile I'd be very interested to know what your seconds per day is with the watch resting in the box at room temperature for an extended period - assuming you keep it wound. 

The Spring Drive geeks reading this know I'm trying to see if they set your watch for +0.2 SPD as they seem to set most Spring Drives, if they set it lower, or if your accuracy is due to excursions that depart significantly from room temperature.

In any event, thanks for the great write-up on the service you received and congrats and the improved accuracy.


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## peterbright (Oct 9, 2019)

Thanks for the report...very useful information!


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## Emceemon (Aug 11, 2015)

Thanks for that!!

Super happy to know this.

I have a SBBN033 and happy to know that it can be serviced in Japan if I want to. (I am Canadian too)

Have a good day and enjoy your piece!

Simon 


Envoyé de mon iPhone en utilisant Tapatalk


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## Randy63 (May 28, 2008)

Thanks for your report.

Has the service center in New Jersey been servicing Spring Drive watches?

Given a choice, when its time to have my GS SBGA419 serviced I'd rather pay the few extra dollars for shipping and send it off to Japan.


Randy63 (formally Mr. Blue)


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## Tonhao (Dec 23, 2017)

Randy63 said:


> Thanks for your report.
> 
> Has the service center in New Jersey been servicing Spring Drive watches?
> 
> ...


So last I checked Spring Drives had to be sent to Japan, but if you go to Seiko Service USA website they quote 9R calibers as well. 9R6 is $570, 9R8 is $880. I wonder if they do work on SD or quietly ship them to Japan and back. Given their ongoing global expansion, it wouldn't be surprising if NJ center can now service all calibers.


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## whineboy (Aug 12, 2012)

Tonhao said:


> So last I checked Spring Drives had to be sent to Japan, but if you go to Seiko Service USA website they quote 9R calibers as well. 9R6 is $570, 9R8 is $880. I wonder if they do work on SD or quietly ship them to Japan and back. Given their ongoing global expansion, it wouldn't be surprising if NJ center can now service all calibers.


Back in 2017 Joe Kirk posted the service sticky that is still available, it said most movements can be serviced here. I would expect that to still be true. The Seiko service page I found mentions other movements like Credor that do have to return to Japan. For those interested: https://www.seikoserviceusa.com/pages/serviceprice/

Edit: here's the bit about US servicing:


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## berni29 (Sep 8, 2007)

Hello

Another thank you for posting. I guess the PR indicator needle was damaged during service or had a fault/imperfection you had not noticed.

Berni


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Peter in the North (Aug 6, 2019)

BrianBinFL said:


> To the OP, when you're wearing the watch is it mostly in a room temperature environment, or is it mostly outdoors? If mostly outdoors, how hot or cold is it where you are? Also, if you ever take the watch out of rotation for awhile I'd be very interested to know what your seconds per day is with the watch resting in the box at room temperature for an extended period - assuming you keep it wound.
> 
> The Spring Drive geeks reading this know I'm trying to see if they set your watch for +0.2 SPD as they seem to set most Spring Drives, if they set it lower, or if your accuracy is due to excursions that depart significantly from room temperature.
> 
> In any event, thanks for the great write-up on the service you received and congrats and the improved accuracy.


Thanks! I suppose it is mostly in a room temperature environment which in our case would be 20C (68F). When I go out for my daily walk of about 45minutes, the watch is of course on my wrist and while the temp has been about 0C (32F) outside, (We are having an unusually warm winter so far!) I have on a warm jacket and gloves, keeping both me and it just right. I take it off over night and turn off the heating so that by morning the house is about 14C (mid 50's F) as we like a cool room to sleep in. In summer we let the indoor temperatures get higher during the day and at night, and of course no jacket if I am outside in the summer heat which may be as high as 30C (86F). (Any hotter than that and I stay indoors!) I have found that all three of my spring drive watches do not seem to vary at all either based on resting position over night or daily temperature inside or out. Even when I leave them wound but not being worn they each seem to do exactly the same thing as each did when being worn. This consistency is one of the things I like about the SD movements. I'm virtually certain the watch was not set for +0.2 SPD, but much better. In the same circumstances my latest GS SD (a SGBY003) bought last August, runs at about +3 sec/mth. and my SBGC003 has always run about +8 sec/mth. Hope this adds to your information.


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## Peter in the North (Aug 6, 2019)

Randy63 said:


> Thanks for your report.
> 
> Has the service center in New Jersey been servicing Spring Drive watches?
> 
> ...


Just to be clear, I didn't get asked if I would like it to go to Japan or NJ, I was told where it was going if I wanted an estimate and subsequent service. If you hand your watch to a GS dealer or send it to the Seiko distributer in your country it will go where they think it should go. If you really want it to go to Japan, you may need to find a way to contact the Japan facility directly and deal with them directly (presumably in Japanese). That is more hassle than I would want, so for me at least, I am happy to have Seiko take the decision. I would have had no problem if my watch (or future watches) went to NJ. Just as long as the service is high quality of course.


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## sticky (Apr 5, 2013)

Charles Carroll said:


> Peter - This is the post I have been waiting for. It is *extremely* useful to me. It confirmed everything I have suspected about what I will do when and if it comes time to service my SBGA211. I cannot thank you enough for this Post.
> 
> Warmest regards,
> Charles


Ditto what Charles wrote.


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## Peter in the North (Aug 6, 2019)

Thanks all for your kind replies. If I'm wearing a watch regularly and for more that just a day or two, then even if it is running fine, I like to get a service performed once the 10 year mark has passed. Of course if it stops or breaks before that time, then in it goes, but that has not been the case with any of my Seiko's. I do have a couple of GS watches that are now at the 9 year mark, so given your responses, I will probably report here on them later this year.


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## omeglycine (Jan 21, 2011)

whineboy said:


> Back in 2017 Joe Kirk posted the service sticky that is still available, it said most movements can be serviced here. I would expect that to still be true. The Seiko service page I found mentions other movements like Credor that do have to return to Japan. For those interested: https://www.seikoserviceusa.com/pages/serviceprice/
> 
> Edit: here's the bit about US servicing:


Thanks for posting the link. I am looking at a model with the 9r84 movement. $880 isn't cheap but is reasonable against the competition. Given the model (or models if I consider the other dial color) has been out of production for awhile, this helps in determining the initial amount I'm willing to offer, since I am assuming a service will be required sooner rather than later.


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## Degr8n8 (Nov 28, 2012)

Peter in the North said:


> Randy63 said:
> 
> 
> > Thanks for your report.
> ...


I feel that this is overly optimistic. Most reviews of the NJ service center are very negative, and I have had negative experiences myself. As for the positive reviews, I have yet to see one that nears the experience the OP had. That said, I am glad the OP had such an awesome experience which should be STANDARD for all GS owners. This means that NJ should up their game or customers should have the option to decide to send their watches to Japan for service, giving the consumer the opportunity to speak/vote with their money on what a standard of service should be.


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## MLsims (Dec 29, 2018)

Thanks for the report! GS is upping it's game in every part of it's business. So excited to see them to continue growing as a company.


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## eudaimonean (May 28, 2019)

Can only hope this level of service is becoming GS's new normal, with their push upmarket. Great service report OP. I too am of the "service every 10 years philosophy" and it sounds like your pieces are holding up quite well.


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## ahonobaka (Jan 27, 2017)

Yes, excellent feedback for Japan based servicing in my eyes. Hopefully NJ is also up to this level more recently, if anyone can chime in?


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## krayzie (Apr 21, 2007)

So this means the overhaul cost is standard when going back to Japan.

I've had Seiko Canada / Odyssey Time sent my 2008 made GS Auto SBGR001 9S55-0010 back to Seiko Japan for service back in 2017 and the total came to $791CAD tax in. When I got the watch back (they still allowed pick-up in person during the time), I found the movement to wind much more smoother and just feels more solid overall. I always wonder if they serviced it with MEMS parts. Of course I wouldn't know since my watch has a solid back. It was running +7 secs instead of the +1 secs when it was new. I was just glad it's running again as the watch was slowing down to -15 mins a day at 9 years old, which prompted me to get it serviced.

A few weeks ago I dropped off my 2011 made MM300 8L35-0010 for the same overhaul service (mainly for the gaskets as it is still running +4 secs) and I was quoted the exact same price. I'm currently waiting for it to come back from Japan hoping it will wind as smooth as my new Emperor Tuna.

Next time I goto Japan I will buy a Spring Drive Tuna.


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## WTSP (May 6, 2012)

Glad to hear you had a good Grand Seiko experience. I expect they swapped out the whole movement, which seems to be a standard practice for Seiko, but also for some mid tier Swiss brands like Ebel.


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## Doug2943 (Mar 14, 2019)

A stupid question, when you sent your GS back, are you sending with the original box, or a second container? As I now have four, three for me and one for the wife, someday I may have to know that answer...thanks


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## WTSP (May 6, 2012)

I don't own a Grand Seiko, but I expect the answer will be similar regardless of brand. Don't send the original watch box back with your watch for servicing. The service center doesn't need it, it will increase the cost of shipping as you should usually find a smaller container than the orignal watch box to send it. Also, the more expensive brands (but even more modest ones like Tissot) are likely return your watch in a branded service box.

As for sending in the papers or warranty card, it may or may not be necessary. You'd have to follow the instructions provided by the service center.


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## Peter in the North (Aug 6, 2019)

Doug2943 said:


> A stupid question, when you sent your GS back, are you sending with the original box, or a second container? As I now have four, three for me and one for the wife, someday I may have to know that answer...thanks


The Seiko website specifically says NOT to send them the original box. Just package the watch well and send it with the form. Or you can hand it to a Grand Seiko AD and they will take care of it for you. I don't think the AD adds any markup, so the repair facility just gets a bit less.


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## Peter in the North (Aug 6, 2019)

WTSP said:


> Glad to hear you had a good Grand Seiko experience. I expect they swapped out the whole movement, which seems to be a standard practice for Seiko, but also for some mid tier Swiss brands like Ebel.


What about the serial number on the movement? How would they get back to the original? I am inclined to think that the cost of the spring drive movement is such that movement swaps are unlikely.


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## WTSP (May 6, 2012)

I can't say for sure that Seiko is doing this for Grand Seiko, but here's my perspective for Ebel which leads me to conclude that other brands are doing it.
Downgrading movement finishing, what's with the...

There's also this guy's experience with Zenith. Seems service centers swap movement to get out of a jam.
"Today, I am now the owner of a Zenith DEFY El Primero 21 with mismatch numbers and I have no paper trail from Zenith regarding this change. "
From the Editor: LVMH Service Center Turns the Warranty Repair of My Zenith DEFY El Primero 21 Into a Nightmare - WATCH COLLECTING LIFESTYLE


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## Jangus (Nov 19, 2019)

Degr8n8 said:


> I feel that this is overly optimistic. Most reviews of the NJ service center are very negative, and I have had negative experiences myself. As for the positive reviews, I have yet to see one that nears the experience the OP had. That said, I am glad the OP had such an awesome experience which should be STANDARD for all GS owners. This means that NJ should up their game or customers should have the option to decide to send their watches to Japan for service, giving the consumer the opportunity to speak/vote with their money on what a standard of service should be.


I sent a brand new Seiko, not Grand Seiko, to NJ because the bezel fell off (3rd gen Sumo) they charged me for the bezel and when the watch returned, I was able to remove the bezel with my fingers. I returned the watch and all they were willing to do was replace the bezel gasket. VERY dissatisfied with Seiko US service.


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## ocieb (Oct 20, 2016)

Thanks for the report. Always nice to be reminded that your watch is in the care of true craftsmen (and women)


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## dj-76 (Sep 5, 2010)

Pardon my ignorance but is it standard for service centers to charge for a service estimate?


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## Peter in the North (Aug 6, 2019)

dj-76 said:


> Pardon my ignorance but is it standard for service centers to charge for a service estimate?


It's never happened to me, and I have had watches serviced by brand service centers, and independents.


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## dj-76 (Sep 5, 2010)

Peter in the North said:


> It's never happened to me, and I have had watches serviced by brand service centers, and independents.


My bad, the 100 was for shipping. I read it wrong?


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## whineboy (Aug 12, 2012)

Peter in the North said:


> What about the serial number on the movement? How would they get back to the original? I am inclined to think that the cost of the spring drive movement is such that movement swaps are unlikely.


You got me thinking with this. I just verified that my 9S64 and 9S86 mechanical movements are serialized&#8230;. But neither of my 9R65 and 7R87A Spring Drive movements are numbered.

And to confirm, I looked over the Naked Watchmaker's disassembly of a Snowflake. No serial number that I could see.









The Naked Watchmaker


Spring Drive SBGA211 “Snowflake”




www.thenakedwatchmaker.com





Very strange that SDs aren't numbered. Haven't checked on the new 9RA5s.

Having a great time.
whineboy


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## palletwheel (May 15, 2019)

whineboy said:


> You got me thinking with this. I just verified that my 9S64 and 9S86 mechanical movements are serialized&#8230;. But neither of my 9R65 and 7R87A Spring Drive movements are numbered.
> 
> And to confirm, I looked over the Naked Watchmaker's disassembly of a Snowflake. No serial number that I could see.
> 
> ...


The serial numbers are for movements that need to pass the Grand Seiko Standard. They are used for tracking. Spring Drive movements are not subject to testing, so no serial number is needed.


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## whineboy (Aug 12, 2012)

palletwheel said:


> The serial numbers are for movements that need to pass the Grand Seiko Standard. They are used for tracking. Spring Drive movements are not subject to testing, so no serial number is needed.


Perfect. Thank you.
I'm embarrassed for not realizing this.


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## JoeyT (May 9, 2016)

Wonderful thread I have a SBGA229 and was curious how the service experience will be


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