# Thoughts from long term owners of the latest generation Santos?



## Stchambe

I'm seriously considering getting one of the new, medium-sized Santos as a simple, everyday casual sports watch.

Are there any long-time owners who would like to share their thoughts on the watch, and if your opinion of it changed over time?

Kind of a tossup between the Santos and the new 36mm Explorer. Had a 39mm Explorer its proportions started really bugging me for some reason.

pics from the Dink, for fun


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## Seaswirl

Going on two years with mine, and still enjoying it. It’s very comfortable with a very unique aesthetic. Nice change of pace from the rest of my collection. I didn’t think it would be very versatile, but I wear it with everything north of tee shirts and shorts.


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## usccopeland

I have the all black ADLC (large). Mine came with the interchangeable leather and rubber. It's more casual than the bracelet but as an everyday casual watch I think it would work well in the metal. I have enjoyed owning it. Wears smaller I feel, due to the case shape.


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## SaddleSC

As a long term owner (for nearly two entire days) I am still as in love with this watch as the day it was purchased


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## Rozebol

Looking forward to responses as the Santos is likely to be my next piece too. Really like the ability to dress up/down with ease. Would really be torn if there was an ADLC in the medium size!


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## MackyP

I've had my TT large for two years now. I started a thread recently that I'm falling out of love with it. I have the 2 calf tan straps, blue gator, brown gator, black gator along with 5 OEM deployants but still not as happy anymore. To come and think of it, it costed more that a GMT Master, which I would most probably cherished forever. Problem that piece couldn't be attained. At the time, I could have purchased a bluesy though.

That being said, I ordered a grey gator strap which is arriving tomorrow. I'm hoping the spark ignites again.


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## HarrisLam

This watch, in particular the latest version with the curved rims, gets universally raving reviews even from watch enthusiasts. You can't really expect otherwise in these forums. 

This watch is full of win.


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## Pun

I've a Santos Medium TT for more than 2 years and it fits well in my rotation. I'm just satisfied with the looks, performance and quality of the watch. And I consider myself a tough customer to satisfy. Just my 2 cents.


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## smalleq

Stchambe said:


> I'm seriously considering getting one of the new, medium-sized Santos as a simple, everyday casual sports watch.
> 
> Are there any long-time owners who would like to share their thoughts on the watch, and if your opinion of it changed over time?
> 
> Kind of a tossup between the Santos and the new 36mm Explorer. Had a 39mm Explorer its proportions started really bugging me for some reason.
> 
> pics from the Dink, for fun


There is a really nice video on youtube that compares and discusses these two exact watches that you should check out. (though I think its the previous 36mm Explorer, but it should work well enough)


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## Stchambe

smalleq said:


> There is a really nice video on youtube that compares and discusses these two exact watches that you should check out. (though I think its the previous 36mm Explorer, but it should work well enough)


Yup, saw that video, unfortunately it didn't really tell me much.

Good to see a lot of positive responses. Was actually hoping to hear some negatives but maybe there aren't many. I had thought, based on positive feedback, the Octo Finissimo would be a watch I would really enjoy but after two weeks of ownership there were some aspects of the design that I couldn't get over.

The only negative thing I've heard about the santos is its kind of a scratch magnet, but I personally think scratches would look perfectly natural on the watch.


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## SaddleSC

Stchambe said:


> Yup, saw that video, unfortunately it didn't really tell me much.
> 
> Good to see a lot of positive responses. Was actually hoping to hear some negatives but maybe there aren't many. I had thought, based on positive feedback, the Octo Finissimo would be a watch I would really enjoy but after two weeks of ownership there were some aspects of the design that I couldn't get over.
> 
> The only negative thing I've heard about the santos is its kind of a scratch magnet, but I personally think scratches would look perfectly natural on the watch.


I have been collecting and flipping watches for nearly 20 years and one rule that usually holds true is that watches considered to be icons of the brand, e.g., Omega Speedmaster, Rolex Submariner, Cartier Santos, tend to be icons for a reason. They are nearly perfectly executed, but more importantly, they are timeless.

I also own the 39mm Explorer and the Santos is a similar kind of watch. You can dress it up and down. It works with a suit just as well as it does with a t-shirt and jeans. I think you would LOVE the Santos...keep us posted!


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## 829maxx

Rozebol said:


> Looking forward to responses as the Santos is likely to be my next piece too. Really like the ability to dress up/down with ease. Would really be torn if there was an ADLC in the medium size!


That was my exact thought! In the meantime, I decided to purchase the older Santos 100 ADLC medium which I have to say is really enjoyable and I now I don’t really care if they release the new one in medium. 










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## mjrchabot

I never gave Cartier a second look in the last 14 years of watch collecting. Then, one day I went down the “Santos hole” and bought one shortly thereafter. It absolutely exceeded all expectations I had of the watch; experiencing it in the metal is a whole new ball game.

I own the medium in steel.

The pros:

Relatively light for a steel bracelet
bracelet is extremely comfortable, articulates on the wrist beautifully
the tech in the bracelet is super convenient, the ability to resize or swap straps without tools is awesome
extra calf leather and deployment clasp included
8 years warranty
My AD, who carries other prestigious brands, has repeatedly said Cartier has the best after sales support versus any other brand
8.8mm thick
movement even has some resistance to magnetism
owning a piece from a brand as revered as Cartier
100m WR makes it a perfect daily watch

The cons:
- none

Don’t be alarmed by the high polish bezel, it’s no more prone to scratches than any other watch with high polish, like a GS for example. As mine takes on some swirls, I grow even more fond. It’s also a lot more versatile than you’d expect - I wear it with anything from business to jeans and a tee and feels right at home.

If you want one, act quickly I’d say. My AD told me that Cartier will be changing their model in 2022. Expect them to reduce supply to bring their product to a demand level like Rolex.



































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## stebesplace

I've now taken delivery of my Medium Santos, and within 24 hours the bracelet already popped off after I took it off. I realized that the bracelet itself wasn't fully seated, except it was, but i had to futz with the grey plastic button to make sure it was seated. I've lost a lot of confidence in the design, and need to play with it on on a secure environment since the watch fell 2 feet to the ground. My heart stopped! I read somewhere here that someone else had the same issue, so we'll see if this happens again, but I'm pretty sure it has to do with the tab connection, tight tolerances, and checking to see that the button is flush when the end link is seated, mine was slightly depressed still.


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## mjrchabot

stebesplace said:


> I've now taken delivery of my Medium Santos, and within 24 hours the bracelet already popped off after I took it off. I realized that the bracelet itself wasn't fully seated, except it was, but i had to futz with the grey plastic button to make sure it was seated. I've lost a lot of confidence in the design, and need to play with it on on a secure environment since the watch fell 2 feet to the ground. My heart stopped! I read somewhere here that someone else had the same issue, so we'll see if this happens again, but I'm pretty sure it has to do with the tab connection, tight tolerances, and checking to see that the button is flush when the end link is seated, mine was slightly depressed still.


Sorry to hear that… I’d take it back to the AD/boutique to look at to see if it’s working correctly. I’ve been pretty active with mine and swapped the bracelet and strap a few times and have had no issues with the bracelet loosening. 


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## usccopeland

stebesplace said:


> I've now taken delivery of my Medium Santos, and within 24 hours the bracelet already popped off after I took it off. I realized that the bracelet itself wasn't fully seated, except it was, but i had to futz with the grey plastic button to make sure it was seated. I've lost a lot of confidence in the design, and need to play with it on on a secure environment since the watch fell 2 feet to the ground. My heart stopped! I read somewhere here that someone else had the same issue, so we'll see if this happens again, but I'm pretty sure it has to do with the tab connection, tight tolerances, and checking to see that the button is flush when the end link is seated, mine was slightly depressed still.


Yikes. Hate to hear of a drop so soon after getting a new watch, even if only two feet. I had some difficulty with the system at first but it got easier quickly. Congrats on the new watch. Enjoy!


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## usccopeland

stebesplace said:


> I've now taken delivery of my Medium Santos, and within 24 hours the bracelet already popped off after I took it off. I realized that the bracelet itself wasn't fully seated, except it was, but i had to futz with the grey plastic button to make sure it was seated. I've lost a lot of confidence in the design, and need to play with it on on a secure environment since the watch fell 2 feet to the ground. My heart stopped! I read somewhere here that someone else had the same issue, so we'll see if this happens again, but I'm pretty sure it has to do with the tab connection, tight tolerances, and checking to see that the button is flush when the end link is seated, mine was slightly depressed still.


Aside from this issue, how are you liking it so far?


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## stebesplace

mjrchabot said:


> Sorry to hear that… I’d take it back to the AD/boutique to look at to see if it’s working correctly. I’ve been pretty active with mine and swapped the bracelet and strap a few times and have had no issues with the bracelet loosening.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


I’m going to take it back when my alligator strap comes in, have them take a look. Thankfully there doesn’t appear to be any damage, at least that I can see. It was also annoying the QR sticker on the back has left a residue that goo gone mostly took care of.


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## stebesplace

usccopeland said:


> Aside from this issue, how are you liking it so far?


Absolutely love it. I have 7.5” (19CM) wrists and prefer the medium over the large. The large is great too if you want the bigger look, but I opted to have something a little more discreet, and the medium ticks all the boxes.


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## MackyP

stebesplace said:


> I've now taken delivery of my Medium Santos, and within 24 hours the bracelet already popped off after I took it off. I realized that the bracelet itself wasn't fully seated, except it was, but i had to futz with the grey plastic button to make sure it was seated. I've lost a lot of confidence in the design, and need to play with it on on a secure environment since the watch fell 2 feet to the ground. My heart stopped! I read somewhere here that someone else had the same issue, so we'll see if this happens again, but I'm pretty sure it has to do with the tab connection, tight tolerances, and checking to see that the button is flush when the end link is seated, mine was slightly depressed still.


That was me! Happened when I got home from the boutique. Ran back to them within an hour and told them what had happened. They replaced it without any questions asked. One end clearly did not snap on securely as the other. Not sure if it was the case or the bracelet itself. I just asked for a replacement as it dropped from 4 feet high.


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## stebesplace

MackyP said:


> That was me! Happened when I got home from the boutique. Ran back to them within an hour and told them what had happened. They replaced it without any questions asked. One end clearly did not snap on securely as the other. Not sure if it was the case or the bracelet itself. I just asked for a replacement as it dropped from 4 feet high.


Ahh yes, 4’!!! That’s pretty high. I’m going to play with it a bit more and see, taking the bracelet on and off, and if I can’t get it to seat properly, I’m being it back.


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## heineken4u

The Explorer and the Santos are nothing alike accept for the fact they both tell time. It's a ridiculous comparison. 

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## smalleq

heineken4u said:


> The Explorer and the Santos are nothing alike accept for the fact they both tell time. It's a ridiculous comparison.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G991U1 using Tapatalk


Two watches that are roughly the same size, on stainless steel bracelets, 100m wr, with origins in adventure/exploration, from historically relevant brands, at similar price levels, that can be worn in a wide variety of occasions. Yep, nothing alike. 

Got to look a little beyond the obvious aesthetics, but there are definitely people who are cross shopping these and given the issues around procuring Rolex sport watches these days, it’s happening more than you think.


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## MackyP

smalleq said:


> Two watches that are roughly the same size, on stainless steel bracelets, 100m wr, with origins in adventure/exploration, from historically relevant brands, at similar price levels, that can be worn in a wide variety of occasions. Yep, nothing alike.
> 
> Got to look a little beyond the obvious aesthetics, but there are definitely people who are cross shopping these and given the issues around procuring Rolex sport watches these days, it’s happening more than you think.


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## heineken4u

smalleq said:


> Two watches that are roughly the same size, on stainless steel bracelets, 100m wr, with origins in adventure/exploration, from historically relevant brands, at similar price levels, that can be worn in a wide variety of occasions. Yep, nothing alike.
> 
> Got to look a little beyond the obvious aesthetics, but there are definitely people who are cross shopping these and given the issues around procuring Rolex sport watches these days, it’s happening more than you think.


They look nothing alike. You bring up the fact that they both have 100m water resistance? Seriously? And share similar origins? Lol okay. 

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## smalleq

heineken4u said:


> They look nothing alike. You bring up the fact that they both have 100m water resistance? Seriously? And share similar origins? Lol okay.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G991U1 using Tapatalk


Watches don’t have to look similar to be relevant in a comparison to each other. This isn’t a hard concept to understand.


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## heineken4u

smalleq said:


> Watches don’t have to look similar to be relevant in a comparison to each other. This isn’t a hard concept to understand.


I find that very hard to understand. They have more things less in common with each other than similarities. The lack of a screw down crown for example, more polish, a square face, and Roman numerals of the Santos are just the obvious differences. Not sure how hard it is for you to understand that is, to me it seems quite obvious. 

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## smalleq

heineken4u said:


> I find that very hard to understand. They have more things less in common with each other than similarities. The lack of a screw down crown for example, more polish, a square face, and Roman numerals of the Santos are just the obvious differences. Not sure how hard it is for you to understand that is, to me it seems quite obvious.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G991U1 using Tapatalk


Yes, those are obvious differences (though the Explorer has a similar amount of polish) and I’m not pretending they look the same, but do they have similar use cases for potential buyers and are they at similar price points?


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## heineken4u

smalleq said:


> Yes, those are obvious differences (though the Explorer has a similar amount of polish) and I’m not pretending they look the same, but do they have similar use cases for potential buyers and are they at similar price points?


Price points aren't even similar as 39mm Explorers are like 10.5-12k, and the new Explorer is a 36mm. So again, not comparable. 

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## telim80

I've had mine for a year and half and agree with all the positives people mentioned above.

One nitpicky issue, the bracelet doesn't fit my wrist perfectly, and I wish there was a way to make some micro adjustments. Obviously a very personal thing and could be completely different for others.


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## smalleq

heineken4u said:


> Price points aren't even similar as 39mm Explorers are like 10.5-12k, and the new Explorer is a 36mm. So again, not comparable.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G991U1 using Tapatalk


Did you even read the thread?
The MSRP of the new 36mm Explorer and the Medium Santos (35mm), the two watches the OP was thinking about and the two watches in the linked YouTube video, are within $300 of each other.


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## mjrchabot

smalleq said:


> Did you even read the thread?
> The MSRP of the new 36mm Explorer and the Medium Santos (35mm), the two watches the OP was thinking about and the two watches in the linked YouTube video, are within $300 of each other.


Better off not engaging him… just go read his other posts - he’s like your belligerent uncle at holiday gatherings. Best to ignore.


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## stebesplace

telim80 said:


> I've had mine for a year and half and agree with all the positives people mentioned above.
> 
> One nitpicky issue, the bracelet doesn't fit my wrist perfectly, and I wish there was a way to make some micro adjustments. Obviously a very personal thing and could be completely different for others.


I agree the bracelet could use some level of micro adjust, since it’s playing in the ‘sports watch’ league. Even a half link, though butterfly clasps may be harder to have micro adjust? Regardless, I end up wearing this slightly snug since I don’t wear it as frequently as my YM or others that have lots of adjustment.


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## Stchambe

thanks to @smalleq for trying to bring some civility back into the conversation.

As a follow-up, I walked into a Cartier store the other day. They didn't have the all-steel version in stock but they did have a two-tone which I tried on. Ended up asking them to order an all-steel, which should arrive in the November timeframe.


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## Stchambe

stebesplace said:


> I agree the bracelet could use some level of micro adjust, since it’s playing in the ‘sports watch’ league. Even a half link, though butterfly clasps may be harder to have micro adjust? Regardless, I end up wearing this slightly snug since I don’t wear it as frequently as my YM or others that have lots of adjustment.


I have JLC bracelets with butterfly-style clasps and micro adjust on both ends, so I don't think its a matter of technical complexity.

I've had good luck in the past with fitment of bracelets that don't have micro adjust . Fingers crossed that my luck continues.


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## smalleq

Stchambe said:


> thanks to @smalleq for trying to bring some civility back into the conversation.
> 
> As a follow-up, I walked into a Cartier store the other day. They didn't have the all-steel version in stock but they did have a two-tone which I tried on. Ended up asking them to order an all-steel, which should arrive in the November timeframe.


When I was debating between the mid-size and the Large, the only ones I could actually try on were the two-tones as well, while not ideal, it was definitely provided me with enough confidence to order the one one I ended up buying.



Stchambe said:


> I have JLC bracelets with butterfly-style clasps and micro adjust on both ends, so I don't think its a matter of technical complexity.
> 
> I've had good luck in the past with fitment of bracelets that don't have micro adjust . Fingers crossed that my luck continues.


I've had some problems in the past with bracelets not offering enough adjustability _cough_ Grand Seiko _cough_, but the Cartier hasn't seemed to be an issue for me so far.


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## Pun

Stchambe said:


> thanks to @smalleq for trying to bring some civility back into the conversation.
> 
> As a follow-up, I walked into a Cartier store the other day. They didn't have the all-steel version in stock but they did have a two-tone which I tried on. Ended up asking them to order an all-steel, which should arrive in the November timeframe.


I'd suggest you to take two tone Santos as its steel is of better quality than all steel model. Its also not very much expensive than all steel. Two tone Santos is also as iconic as Rolex two tone datejust. Just my 2 cents..


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## MackyP

Pun said:


> I'd suggest you to take two tone Santos as its steel is of better quality than all steel model. Its also not very much expensive than all steel. Two tone Santos is also as iconic as Rolex two tone datejust. Just my 2 cents..


I read that too in regards to the metal blend better on the TT. I will compare when I get a chance, with my wife's SS Santos.


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## IllCommunication

Stchambe said:


> thanks to @smalleq for trying to bring some civility back into the conversation.
> 
> As a follow-up, I walked into a Cartier store the other day. They didn't have the all-steel version in stock but they did have a two-tone which I tried on. Ended up asking them to order an all-steel, which should arrive in the November timeframe.


Good stuff. I have had mine for almost 3 years now. It was my go to for a long time and now its fallen into a rotation. I dont love it any less. Its just an all around phenomenal watch. It looks great, its eye catching and unique, its got a GREAT story, and you can wear it with most anything. 

You wanted some negatives so here you go. it gets scratched and scuffed a lot. like A LOT. it doesnt bother me at all but I imagine others who are less wabi sabi than I am would go insane. and the big kicker is utter and desolate landscape of third party straps to fit the quickswitch system. The system itself is awesome, I love it. Its so easy to swap straps (my breguet has screw pins so it takes forever) but i basically have either cartier designed straps or i have to get my hands on a used strap to cut up to make a new one. 

So would I buy it again? In a heartbeat. I LOVE it. My Breguet was my lust watch (I was after it for over 5 years) and I STILL rotate it with my Santos.


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## thedonn007

I was going to buy a Santos a few months ago, but went with a Tudor BB58 instead. Now I am thinking about going after the Santos again. I don't regret getting the BB58, but I still feel the Santos calling for me.


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## smalleq

IllCommunication said:


> ...the big kicker is utter and desolate landscape of third party straps to fit the quickswitch system. The system itself is awesome, I love it. Its so easy to swap straps (my breguet has screw pins so it takes forever) but i basically have either cartier designed straps or i have to get my hands on a used strap to cut up to make a new one.


Delugs is working on a solution right now. They won't be super cheap, but will be less expensive than the OEM solutions and will have a lot more options for material!


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## IllCommunication

smalleq said:


> Delugs is working on a solution right now. They won't be super cheap, but will be less expensive than the OEM solutions and will have a lot more options for material!


If Ken pulls that off, hes my absolute hero. I don't mind paying for Cartier's straps, they are high quality and really nicely done, BUT they are limited. Gimme a rubber and some exotic leathers please!


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## Perfectionist

mjrchabot said:


> If you want one, act quickly I’d say. My AD told me that Cartier will be changing their model in 2022. Expect them to reduce supply to bring their product to a demand level like Rolex.


No Dangit No !!

Has this been confirmed - or was the AD just using "salesmanship" (aka lying!) to make you pull the trigger lol?


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## NightScar

feel like theyve been sayign that about cartier for years, like a good ten years ago ive been told Cartiers trying to stop discounts and they are monitoring it very carefully but it was never really true

they dont need to be like Rolex, theyre #3 in turnover behind Rolex and Omega when it comes to swiss brands, they sell a lot and most of them are to women who could care less about the movement and they wouldnt have introduced the tank must in quartz as an entry level for the brand if they want to go the Rolex route and be on that upper echelon of the watch world

I highly doubt ADs know that much about Cartiers future plan, if you ask all of them a year ago what was Cartiers plan for this year I imagine none of them would have guess the colored must would make a comeback, most of them do not even know whats going on with the delivery of Tank Musts in the US

but I could also be completely off base, i dont claim to be an expert but sharing my experience and what I have seen around for years


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## NightScar

IllCommunication said:


> If Ken pulls that off, hes my absolute hero. I don't mind paying for Cartier's straps, they are high quality and really nicely done, BUT they are limited. Gimme a rubber and some exotic leathers please!


id definitely love a rubber strap for the medium santos, seems like they offer more options for the bigger sized brother just like more dial variety

the medium santos never gets love from cartier


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## mjrchabot

Perfectionist said:


> No Dangit No !!
> 
> Has this been confirmed - or was the AD just using "salesmanship" (aka lying!) to make you pull the trigger lol?


I already owned the Santos before he said this… definitely not “salesmanship”. AD went to high school with my brother, very genuine and text each other often about general watch talk. 


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## quakeroatmeal

Why would they discontinue a watch just released in 2018?

The Santos and Tank are some of the most "unchanged" watches in history, it doesn't make sense to discontinue and redo the design so quick....

Unless I misunderstood.


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## Pun

I second about their discount being dried up lately as their supply. Their Must Tank range is an example. It's selectively released with very little discount with the ADs and no discount with boutique.


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## MackyP

IllCommunication said:


> If Ken pulls that off, hes my absolute hero. I don't mind paying for Cartier's straps, they are high quality and really nicely done, BUT they are limited. Gimme a rubber and some exotic leathers please!


Sorry but who is Delugs and/or Ken?


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## NightScar

delugs makes watch straps and do some customs, if you browse their website, they already make some that fits the dantos dumont 









Handcrafted Watch Straps | Delugs


Premium leather watch straps handcrafted with only the best quality full grain leather. Shop ready stock and custom made watch straps. Fast worldwide shipping.




delugs.com


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## NightScar

Pun said:


> I second about their discount being dried up lately as their supply. Their Must Tank range is an example. It's selectively released with very little discount with the ADs and no discount with boutique.


the colored tank musts are gon be impossible to get a discount on because they’ll only make so much and only this year but the regular tank must and solarbeat are regular mainstays and once the production ramps up, they’ll have plenty in ADs and discounts will be available

i mean you can easily buy the large tank must on the website right now and been sitting on ADs, its just the solarbeats thats still waiting to arrive so those will likely sell at retail for the first few that comes into the store


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## mjrchabot

quakeroatmeal said:


> Why would they discontinue a watch just released in 2018?
> 
> The Santos and Tank are some of the most "unchanged" watches in history, it doesn't make sense to discontinue and redo the design so quick....
> 
> Unless I misunderstood.


Who said anything about discontinuing the Santos? Never going to happen 


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## mjrchabot

NightScar said:


> feel like theyve been sayign that about cartier for years, like a good ten years ago ive been told Cartiers trying to stop discounts and they are monitoring it very carefully but it was never really true
> 
> they dont need to be like Rolex, theyre #3 in turnover behind Rolex and Omega when it comes to swiss brands, they sell a lot and most of them are to women who could care less about the movement and they wouldnt have introduced the tank must in quartz as an entry level for the brand if they want to go the Rolex route and be on that upper echelon of the watch world
> 
> I highly doubt ADs know that much about Cartiers future plan, if you ask all of them a year ago what was Cartiers plan for this year I imagine none of them would have guess the colored must would make a comeback, most of them do not even know whats going on with the delivery of Tank Musts in the US
> 
> but I could also be completely off base, i dont claim to be an expert but sharing my experience and what I have seen around for years


While they may not know anything future model releases (why would Cartier share that anyways), they can certainly get a pulse on where the brand is moving from a sales and marketing perspective. After all, they see the brand from a far different point of view than you and I being merely “consumers”.

For example, I bought my Santos medium a few months ago (with a handsome discount). I was at this same AD a couple weeks ago and he never received a steel Santos medium for the showcase; he still had the TT Santos medium in the showcase from a few months ago. He said they are not getting anymore watches from Cartier for the rest of the year. Yes, you heard that right… no incoming from Cartier for the next 3 months. He’s also the only Cartier AD in the region, next one is a 4hr drive away.

So based on his experience with the brand, he’s in the best position to read between the lines. If Cartier was ever going to try to create that “Rolex demand”, now would be the time to do it. Low interest rates (aka, “Cheap Money”) is here to stay for a while so the demand for luxury goods will hold strong.

Just my 2 cents…


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## NightScar

Ummm, not getting anymore stock because there is a shortage due to the pandemic closing down factory is no indication that they are going the Rolex route.

I highly, highly doubt they get nothing else this year when most havent even received their stock of Tank Must (solarbeats and the enamel colored dials) in North America. I am about 99% sure they'd get some Tank Must before the year ends.

But hey he is the sales associate and can simply claim "they just send em when they want to just like Rolex".

I get it, this dude is your cousins, aunts, ex-husband in-laws, brother... but I have dealt with a lot of Sales Associate and about 90% of the time, I know more with whats going on that them.

If they are going the Rolex route, you wouldnt have gotten a "handsome discount" on the Santos especially if they feel like its gon' be a drought for them and get not much else in the future?

And your watches has to sell out to go the Rolex route, its not Rolex (who make close to a million watches) thats shorting the market, the watches are there they're just eaten up buy grey markets which Rolex cant control. In comparison, Cartier makes about 500k watches and now they're plan is to make less and prevent discounts? Who would buy from them then? Most of their buyers are women who cares more that they are wearing Cartier jewelry than handcrafted watches with in-house movements and are third behind Rolex and Omega in turnover and their plan is to f that all up? To make less money?

The excerpt below is from 2017 and the plan has seemingly worked and you're sales associate is saying Cartier doesnt like this outcome?

*A few years ago, when the watch industry was enthralled with China and its seemingly limitless appetite for luxury timepieces, Cartier, flush with cash and perhaps some hubris, seized the opportunity to court men with the introduction of several inventive and highly complicated watches, each priced at more than $100,000.*

_*Today, however, Cartier has done an about-face: “Previous growth was primarily male-driven, more linked to gift giving,” said Antoine Belge, a Paris-based analyst at HSBC. “Growth in the next 10 years in China will come from women becoming increasingly independent financially.” (Beijing’s continuing crackdown on gift-giving doubtless has something to do with the change, too.)

Mr. Linz of Watch Advisor said, “Cartier will reduce its engagement in men’s watches because it turns out that men are not so interested in Cartier watches as women. The Cartier client wants style, icons, history, emotions.” He referred to the revival earlier this year of Cartier’s iconic Panthère collection of women’s watches, which now includes an entry-level steel model for $4,000.

“This makes it attractive for customers who’d otherwise go for a Longines, a Frédérique Constant,” Mr. Linz said. “This may push sales down in the beginning, but if the strategy works correctly, it will bring many more hundreds of millions in turnover.”*_



And to drive the point home, in 2020:

*Richemont Group*_ (*18.2% *of the market), whose star performer is *Cartier*, which alone accounts for *40.7%* of the revenue generated by the conglomerate. The next closest best sellers of the group are *IWC *(*2.7%*), *Jaeger-LeCoultre* (*2.1%*), *Panerai* (*1.6%*) and *Vacheron Constantin* (*1.5%*). _


So the Richemont Group saw this and said, "we're making too much money off of Cartier, our plan from a couple of years worked, lets slow down a bit because we aren't Rolex..."?

In my .02 cents, if he thinks this is how Rolex creates their demand then he doesnt know much nd id trust him less.


----------



## NightScar

__
http://instagr.am/p/CU_NsFQLqcD/


----------



## Axel Brass

I see the Original Poster already ordered but as an opinion for others…

I really like my Santos Medium and it’s design, especially with the bracelet, is striking. As others noted, love the tool-less swap and tool-less bracelet adjustability.

If I could improve on the watch, it’s be an addition of an the fly micro-adjust in the butterfly clasp. It’s annoying when I get hot or cold to take out a link and put it in my pocket.

If choosing between the modern Explorer 36mm and the Santos - I’m considering an Explorer now myself 

Santos key wins, is being more unique, carrying a very heritage as the first pilot watch, but without the implications (can be good or bad) of the Rolex brand.

Explorer wins in terms of resale and implications - again good and bad of being a Rolex.

Right now with a 36mm Explorer I’d be hard pressed to make a decision, but I think I’d still go with the Santos first… and not like an Explorer is available at the AD anyway.

If I could improve on the watch, it’d be an addition of an the fly micro-adjust in the butterfly clasp. It’s annoying when I get hot or cold to take out a link and put it in my pocket.

The front polished bezel scratches do show easily, but I plan, as it detaches, to polish and eventually be replaced by Cartier if it bothers me enough during service.

Still, love wearing my Santos, and look forward to the new design.


----------



## quakeroatmeal

mjrchabot said:


> Who said anything about discontinuing the Santos? Never going to happen
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


I was just responding to someone else saying they'd be changing the model again, after the recent release in 2018!


----------



## dantan

I have owned my Cartier Santos for over three years now.

I purchased it as soon as Cartier released this model back in 2018.

It is my most-worn Watch.

Back in mid-2019, when I travelled to the US of A and Canada for seven weeks, I wore it all-day everyday.

I love my Santos; very accurate and reliable. I got it really wet a few times with no issues whatsoever.

A few months ago, I purchased the new 36mm Rolex Explorer, which is a wonderful Watch, too.


----------



## mjrchabot

NightScar said:


> Ummm, not getting anymore stock because there is a shortage due to the pandemic closing down factory is no indication that they are going the Rolex route.
> 
> I highly, highly doubt they get nothing else this year when most havent even received their stock of Tank Must (solarbeats and the enamel colored dials) in North America. I am about 99% sure they'd get some Tank Must before the year ends.
> 
> But hey he is the sales associate and can simply claim "they just send em when they want to just like Rolex".
> 
> I get it, this dude is your cousins, aunts, ex-husband in-laws, brother... but I have dealt with a lot of Sales Associate and about 90% of the time, I know more with whats going on that them.
> 
> If they are going the Rolex route, you wouldnt have gotten a "handsome discount" on the Santos especially if they feel like its gon' be a drought for them and get not much else in the future?
> 
> And your watches has to sell out to go the Rolex route, its not Rolex (who make close to a million watches) thats shorting the market, the watches are there they're just eaten up buy grey markets which Rolex cant control. In comparison, Cartier makes about 500k watches and now they're plan is to make less and prevent discounts? Who would buy from them then? Most of their buyers are women who cares more that they are wearing Cartier jewelry than handcrafted watches with in-house movements and are third behind Rolex and Omega in turnover and their plan is to f that all up? To make less money?
> 
> The excerpt below is from 2017 and the plan has seemingly worked and you're sales associate is saying Cartier doesnt like this outcome?
> 
> *A few years ago, when the watch industry was enthralled with China and its seemingly limitless appetite for luxury timepieces, Cartier, flush with cash and perhaps some hubris, seized the opportunity to court men with the introduction of several inventive and highly complicated watches, each priced at more than $100,000.*
> 
> _*Today, however, Cartier has done an about-face: “Previous growth was primarily male-driven, more linked to gift giving,” said Antoine Belge, a Paris-based analyst at HSBC. “Growth in the next 10 years in China will come from women becoming increasingly independent financially.” (Beijing’s continuing crackdown on gift-giving doubtless has something to do with the change, too.)
> 
> Mr. Linz of Watch Advisor said, “Cartier will reduce its engagement in men’s watches because it turns out that men are not so interested in Cartier watches as women. The Cartier client wants style, icons, history, emotions.” He referred to the revival earlier this year of Cartier’s iconic Panthère collection of women’s watches, which now includes an entry-level steel model for $4,000.
> 
> “This makes it attractive for customers who’d otherwise go for a Longines, a Frédérique Constant,” Mr. Linz said. “This may push sales down in the beginning, but if the strategy works correctly, it will bring many more hundreds of millions in turnover.”*_
> 
> 
> 
> And to drive the point home, in 2020:
> 
> *Richemont Group*_ (*18.2% *of the market), whose star performer is *Cartier*, which alone accounts for *40.7%* of the revenue generated by the conglomerate. The next closest best sellers of the group are *IWC *(*2.7%*), *Jaeger-LeCoultre* (*2.1%*), *Panerai* (*1.6%*) and *Vacheron Constantin* (*1.5%*). _
> 
> 
> So the Richemont Group saw this and said, "we're making too much money off of Cartier, our plan from a couple of years worked, lets slow down a bit because we aren't Rolex..."?
> 
> In my .02 cents, if he thinks this is how Rolex creates their demand then he doesnt know much nd id trust him less.


Ok I concede… must be great being the smartest guy in the room all the time. 

Sorry - but I’ll still trust the intuition of an AD over a hobbyist. Just because you don’t trust ADs, doesn’t mean there aren’t good ones out there. 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## NightScar

ok, i guess we just not gon’ ignore logic in the conversation then

id believe the insiders working in the industry too but those that isnt trying to sell a watch and wrote those articles from ny times who has spoken to the ceo’s and actual “insiders” who actually knows what the company has planned for the future than someone is in the “industry” just because they just happens to work at a cartier store who has something to gain from it

hobbyist? you think i quoted those things from someone on WUS?

lol

im not asking you to listen to me but to those who has spoken to actual people in charge at cartier/richemont group and has studied trends and then reports them as they see it from the likes of New York Times but hey silly me

and also i trust numbers and the number i posted looked great and they seem to be at about their goal so it makes no sense to make a drastic change that affects that

and do you, if you walk in the store one day before the year ends and see the tank musts in the cases that wasnt there before, are you gon call him out on it?


----------



## Perfectionist

Dang dudes, calm down - it's only a discussion lol... and you both make good points !!

No doubt Cartier has been carefully taking note of the crazy market over the past few years and feels pretty envious - so will attempt to raise prices if they can...

However, "deliberately" limiting supply is unlikely to help them as they are not really in the High Horology category - their watch movements are nothing special at all, nor have they shown any interest in changing this (like Bulgari for example) so will remain "decorative" pieces... as opposed to items worth collecting or "investing" in for the future.

This means there is a clear ceiling to their prices - if they start asking too much, then customers will just go elsewhere... I doubt we'll start seeing the S/S Santos being flipped for triple its RRP anytime soon!

(However, I'm gonna pull the trigger and get me a Tank Must asap just in case I'm wrong... dangit that AD sales guys is good lol!)


----------



## NightScar

i am as chill as possible, i do get sarcastic and im not good with words so it results in a wall of text and looks aggressive

im just pointing out what the reports and markets are saying opposed to what a sales associate says who has something to gain from selling someone a ballon bleu or pasha thats gathering dust by saying “this is it, this is all the cartiers were getting, theyre going the rolex route so these handsome discounts wont last long, buy now”

even if they dont intend you to buy now, planting that seed so around xmas when you get that bonus check, you might be more inclined to get what is claimed to maybe very limited in the future

the colored tank must is sold out because they havent arrived in the US and many greys bought em out but its not even selling at $1k over retail so they arent even touching rolex hype at all so why go that route?


----------



## MackyP

NightScar said:


> i am as chill as possible, i do get sarcastic and im not good with words so it results in a wall of text and looks aggressive
> 
> im just pointing out what the reports and markets are saying opposed to what a sales associate says who has something to gain from selling someone a ballon bleu or pasha thats gathering dust by saying “this is it, this is all the cartiers were getting, theyre going the rolex route so these handsome discounts wont last long, buy now”
> 
> even if they dont intend you to buy now, planting that seed so around xmas when you get that bonus check, you might be more inclined to get what is claimed to maybe very limited in the future
> 
> the colored tank must is sold out because they havent arrived in the US and many greys bought em out but its not even selling at $1k over retail so they arent even touching rolex hype at all so why go that route?


Maybe it's a must.




Just trying to bring in some joy in thread. All good points brought up, must I say opinions.


----------



## NightScar




----------



## MackyP

Two years plus, bezel still looks good. But then again, my arm automatically retracts by instinct when walking through tight spaces.


----------



## FullFlavorPike

I want a two-tone, medium Santos so badly it's not even funny, and these enthusiastic long-term owners make me want it that much more. 

Crossing fingers for an unreasonably big bonus at the end of the year.


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## stebesplace

I know it’s more expensive than TT, but I love the rose gold Santos. $16,300, arguably not worth it, double the price for bracelet, and won’t hold its value compared to other brands in precious metal, but my goodness it’s a stunner.


----------



## Stchambe

Ended up speaking to the botique a few days ago about the order. The watch is still scheduled to come in with their December restock. No discount.


----------



## smalleq

Stchambe said:


> Ended up speaking to the botique a few days ago about the order. The watch is still scheduled to come in with their December restock. No discount.


Maybe you'll get lucky like I did. I ordered mine mid June and was told I wouldn't get it until likely September. Two weeks later it arrived and I snagged it right before the price increase went into effect.


----------



## SwissArmyTenor

A little late to the party and only had it 3 months, but thought I'd bring my blue out to play  Satisfied so far.


----------



## cuibono

I bought my blue Santos as soon as it was available (01/2019 I believe) Wearing it as much as my Rolex Skydweller. Love the low profile, lightweight, and how easy it is to change bracelets. Would still recommend after all this time, it's not going anywhere 

Sent from my SM-G965W using Tapatalk


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## imslade

Stchambe said:


> Yup, saw that video, unfortunately it didn't really tell me much.
> 
> Good to see a lot of positive responses. Was actually hoping to hear some negatives but maybe there aren't many. I had thought, based on positive feedback, the Octo Finissimo would be a watch I would really enjoy but after two weeks of ownership there were some aspects of the design that I couldn't get over.
> 
> The only negative thing I've heard about the santos is its kind of a scratch magnet, but I personally think scratches would look perfectly natural on the watch.


I'm a two month owner of the all steel 39 w/date and absolutely adore it... I switch week to week with my Explorer 39. the scratches means that I have the only one like it on the planet... the bracelet is soooo comfortable and the strap is easy as well. One of the best sports/dress watches and I'm over the moon. Enjoy.


----------



## Stchambe

Picket up the santos today!

Ended up paying MSRP at a boutique. Staff was great and surprisingly knowledgeable about different Cartier models in general.


----------



## powerband

Stchambe said:


> Picket up the santos today!
> 
> Ended up paying MSRP at a boutique. Staff was great and surprisingly knowledgeable about different Cartier models in general.
> 
> View attachment 16264737


Congrats. I bought mine at the Cartier boutique as well. It was a great experience and the staff was highly knowledgeable also. I’d pay MSRP for that kind of experience and also the connection for any after-sales service. I was even treated to an extra Cartier alligator Easy-change strap valued at $400, at no cost.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## montelatici

Perfectionist said:


> Dang dudes, calm down - it's only a discussion lol... and you both make good points !!
> 
> No doubt Cartier has been carefully taking note of the crazy market over the past few years and feels pretty envious - so will attempt to raise prices if they can...
> 
> However, "deliberately" limiting supply is unlikely to help them as they are not really in the High Horology category - their watch movements are nothing special at all, nor have they shown any interest in changing this (like Bulgari for example) so will remain "decorative" pieces... as opposed to items worth collecting or "investing" in for the future.
> 
> This means there is a clear ceiling to their prices - if they start asking too much, then customers will just go elsewhere... I doubt we'll start seeing the S/S Santos being flipped for triple its RRP anytime soon!
> 
> (However, I'm gonna pull the trigger and get me a Tank Must asap just in case I'm wrong... dangit that AD sales guys is good lol!)


"as they are not really in the High Horology category - their watch movements are nothing special at all" LOL

As another WUSer wrote when responding to some fool who claimed Cartier made fashion watches:

"this watch (Cartier, ed.) *"is one of the most technically refined perpetual calendar watches ever made".*
It has a flying tourbillon and a perpetual calendar, both complications being haute-horology. This watch was first introduced at SIHH 2014, so not that long ago... Cartier didn't stop their technical innovations in the past (beginning of last century, when they were pushing some innovator ideas). 










Cartier Rotonde de Cartier Astrocalendaire Perpetual Calendar Rose Gold


Discover the incredible Cartier Rotonde de Cartier Astrocalendaire Perpetual Calendar Rose Gold in our detailed hands-on review.




www.horbiter.com


----------



## badgerracer

powerband said:


> Congrats. I bought mine at the Cartier boutique as well. It was a great experience and the staff was highly knowledgeable also. I’d pay MSRP for that kind of experience and also the connection for any after-sales service. I was even treated to an extra Cartier alligator Easy-change strap valued at $400, at no cost.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


I got the same deal when I bought mine at the beginning of the month (albeit from an AD instead of a boutique). They said it would take about a month to order it, so hopefully I will get it soon. The included strap feels really high quality, but I wish it was a darker color as it is a little too close to my skin tone 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## powerband

badgerracer said:


> I got the same deal when I bought mine at the beginning of the month (albeit from an AD instead of a boutique). They said it would take about a month to order it, so hopefully I will get it soon. The included strap feels really high quality, but I wish it was a darker color as it is a little too close to my skin tone
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Nice. Which color and hide type did you choose for your “gift” strap? I chose black alligator… though now I’m double guessing that I should have chosen the dark gray. (But I won’t look a gift horse in the mouth.)


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## badgerracer

powerband said:


> Nice. Which color and hide type did you choose for your “gift” strap? I chose black alligator… though now I’m double guessing that I should have chosen the dark gray. (But I won’t look a gift horse in the mouth.)
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


I also went with the black alligator. I have a New Years wedding to go to that I was hoping to have it for, but I guess I will be rocking the bracelet for that. Now that Delugs is making some Santos straps I might be picking those up eventually 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## mjrchabot

MackyP said:


> Two years plus, bezel still looks good. But then again, my arm automatically retracts by instinct when walking through tight spaces.
> 
> View attachment 16180767


I love the TT Santos, but I couldn’t justify the premium over steel… ~50% here in Canada. My AD is supposed to get me the 2021 TT DJ36 with gold fluted motif dial, can’t wait to try it. At least the premium there over the steel DJ is about 30%.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Pun

mjrchabot said:


> I love the TT Santos, but I couldn’t justify the premium over steel… ~50% here in Canada. My AD is supposed to get me the 2021 TT DJ36 with gold fluted motif dial, can’t wait to try it. At least the premium there over the steel DJ is about 30%.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


When I bought my TT Santos Medium in 2019 it was around 20% more expensive than all steel. It is justified as TT use more expensive steel than all-steel Santos.


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## mjrchabot

Pun said:


> When I bought my TT Santos Medium in 2019 it was around 20% more expensive than all steel. It is justified as TT use more expensive steel than all-steel Santos.


I can get down with 20% and I wouldn’t even think twice. However, 50% I cannot. Great bargain you got back then! 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Xaltotun

Stchambe said:


> Kind of a tossup between the Santos and the new 36mm Explorer. Had a 39mm Explorer its proportions started really bugging me for some reason.


I'm 1000% biased, but I think the 39mm Explorer is the _only_ watch one needs.


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## montelatici

Xaltotun said:


> I'm 1000% biased, but I think the 39mm Explorer is the _only_ watch one needs.
> 
> View attachment 16320057


Aren't there times you don't want to be identified as a poseur?


----------



## Pun

mjrchabot said:


> I can get down with 20% and I wouldn’t even think twice. However, 50% I cannot. Great bargain you got back then!
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


I'm sure that was the official MRSP difference in prices ..


----------



## Pun

Xaltotun said:


> I'm 1000% biased, but I think the 39mm Explorer is the _only_ watch one needs.
> 
> View attachment 16320057


Lately Rolex brand per se is associated with some kind of snobbery and new money. The shortage of their stock added the hype with the brand. Cartier, on the contrary, has more sophisticated image and still available on demand. Just my 2 cents...


----------



## Xaltotun

montelatici said:


> Aren't there times you don't want to be identified as a poseur?


Sure, that's why I sold my Submariner; I wasn't wearing it because it has become too recognizable, and indeed, favored by poseurs. The Explorer is not a poseur watch, it's discreet and not ostentatious, I can definitely vouch for that by experience.



Pun said:


> Lately Rolex brand per se is associated with some kind of snobbery and new money. The shortage of their stock added the hype with the brand. Cartier, on the contrary, has more sophisticated image and still available on demand. Just my 2 cents...


Not the Explorer. Submariner, GMT, Sky Dweller, yes. Explorer, not so much.

Cartier watches also can said to be poseur watches, by the way. Depends on how you wear them.

Edit: truth to be told, I am more and more interested in a Cartier 🤩


----------



## powerband

Xaltotun said:


> The Explorer is not a poseur watch, it's discreet and not ostentatious, I can definitely vouch for that by experience.
> 
> 
> Not the Explorer. Submariner, GMT, Sky Dweller, yes. Explorer, not so much.


I agree with this.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## NightScar

the explorer isnt quite airking/milgauss level but it is the less desirable of the bunch and i think it did become a little les spopular with it going back to the og 36mm size

of course its still reselling like crazy because of the crown logo on the dial but it feels like a more accessible watch in the rolex line-up


----------



## montelatici

Xaltotun said:


> I'm 1000% biased, but I think the 39mm Explorer is the _only_ watch one needs.
> 
> View attachment 16320057


Aren't here times you don't want to be identified as a poseur?


Xaltotun said:


> Sure, that's why I sold my Submariner; I wasn't wearing it because it has become too recognizable, and indeed, favored by poseurs. The Explorer is not a poseur watch, it's discreet and not ostentatious, I can definitely vouch for that by experience.
> 
> 
> Not the Explorer. Submariner, GMT, Sky Dweller, yes. Explorer, not so much.
> 
> Cartier watches also can said to be poseur watches, by the way. Depends on how you wear them.
> 
> Edit: truth to be told, I am more and more interested in a Cartier 🤩
> 
> View attachment 16320074


As a non-owner, why would you post in a Cartier group to promote your view that owning a Cartier is unnecessay if one owns a Rolex? I may criticize Rolex, and the newbie poseur owners which make up the majority of Rolex these days in a Rolex group, but I am a long time (and current) Rolex owner. I owned Rolex before Rolex was particularly popular. Your post, on the contrary, gives the appearance of trolling. By the way, Cartier watches are thankfully not yet, poseur material in the watch world. If they become so I will stop wearing them. I stopped wearing my Rolexes over a decade ago to avoid being associated with the poseur nature of many of the new Rolex owners


----------



## Xaltotun

NightScar said:


> the explorer isnt quite airking/milgauss level but it is the less desirable of the bunch and i think it did become a little les spopular with it going back to the og 36mm size


I thought the Air King was the less desirable of the Rolex stable?? Everyone loves to hate it, from what I've seen. I personally am found of its quirkiness and originality... (but I digress)


----------



## Xaltotun

montelatici said:


> Aren't here times you don't want to be identified as a poseur?
> 
> 
> As a non-owner, why would you post in a Cartier group to promote your view that owning a Cartier is unnecessay if one owns a Rolex? I may criticize Rolex, and the newbie poseur owners which make up the majority of Rolex these days in a Rolex group, but I am a long time (and current) Rolex owner. I owned Rolex before Rolex was particularly popular. Your post, on the contrary, gives the appearance of trolling. By the way, Cartier watches are thankfully not yet, poseur material in the watch world. If they become so I will stop wearing them. I stopped wearing my Rolexes over a decade ago to avoid being associated with the poseur nature of many of the new Rolex owners


I was merely - and *respectfully* - stating my *own* view of the Explorer, which was mentioned by the OP. So it was a direct response to the OP, hence totally valid post and definitely not trolling . I didn't think a respectful opinion would warrant personal attacks and quasi-insults (you would have seen it, if you had looked at how long I have been on this forum and my number of posts and Likes).


----------



## NightScar

Xaltotun said:


> I thought the Air King was the less desirable of the Rolex stable?? Everyone loves to hate it, from what I've seen. I personally am found of its quirkiness and originality... (but I digress)



thats why i said the explorer isnt on its level (lower level) as in in the more hated category and i put the milgauss in there with the airking because i do feel like it too doesnt get much love and wouldnt be susrprised if it get the “rolex update” next year as in very minimal but that will kick start its sale back up anyways


----------



## mjrchabot

montelatici said:


> Aren't there times you don't want to be identified as a poseur?


It’s all how you wear it… if you’re a *****, doesn’t matter if you’re wearing a G Shock, Rolex, or JLC, you’re still a *****. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## SaoDavi

Xaltotun said:


> I thought the Air King was the less desirable of the Rolex stable?? Everyone loves to hate it, from what I've seen. I personally am found of its quirkiness and originality... (but I digress)


I'm convinced that the Air King only exists as an inside joke for Rolex management. They just want to show that they could literally sell anything to people.


----------



## mjrchabot

montelatici said:


> Aren't here times you don't want to be identified as a poseur?
> 
> 
> As a non-owner, why would you post in a Cartier group to promote your view that owning a Cartier is unnecessay if one owns a Rolex? I may criticize Rolex, and the newbie poseur owners which make up the majority of Rolex these days in a Rolex group, but I am a long time (and current) Rolex owner. I owned Rolex before Rolex was particularly popular. Your post, on the contrary, gives the appearance of trolling. By the way, Cartier watches are thankfully not yet, poseur material in the watch world. If they become so I will stop wearing them. I stopped wearing my Rolexes over a decade ago to avoid being associated with the poseur nature of many of the new Rolex owners


It’s sad that you’ll let others dictate what you do. If you like the brand, whether it be Rolex or Cartier, who cares what others are doing? I buy watches that I enjoy and want to wear; if others view them as status symbols, that’s entirely up to them. Doesn’t ruin my ownership experience one bit. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## montelatici

Xaltotun said:


> I was merely - and *respectfully* - stating my *own* view of the Explorer, which was mentioned by the OP. So it was a direct response to the OP, hence totally valid post. I didn't think a respectful opinion would warrant personal attacks and quasi-insults.





mjrchabot said:


> It’s sad that you’ll let others dictate what you do. If you like the brand, whether it be Rolex or Cartier, who cares what others are doing? I buy watches that I enjoy and want to wear; if others view them as status symbols, that’s entirely up to them. Doesn’t ruin my ownership experience one bit.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


It's sad that you wear watches that impress others. I would rather not be viewed that way. But, more to the point, to come here and extoll the superiority of Rolex to Cartier in a Cartier group is trolling. By the way, I own a Rolex. I just don't wear it.


----------



## mjrchabot

Pun said:


> I'm sure that was the official MRSP difference in prices ..


Yes and? I’m not following your logic. I got 20% off my steel Santos. If I received a similar discount on the TT, I’m still looking at ~50% more than what I paid for steel. 


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## mjrchabot

montelatici said:


> It's sad that you wear watches that impress others. I would rather not be viewed that way. But, more to the point, to come here and extoll the superiority of Rolex to Cartier in a Cartier group is trolling. By the way, I own a Rolex. I just don't wear it.


Lol it’s hilarious you assume EVERYONE who owns a Rolex is looking your attention. In 14 years of watch collecting, I can count on one hand a non-watch enthusiast us struck up a conversation. And guess what? It was never a Rolex on my wrist. 

Keep riding that high horse of yours buddy - Merry Christmas! We’re not worthy to be in the same forum as you, your moral compass is so high. Teach us more. 

And by the way.. literally NOBODY here has “extolled” the superiority of Rolex. You seem to be the only person taking offence to nothing. The OP himself brought Rolex into the conversation. 


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## montelatici

mjrchabot said:


> Lol it’s hilarious you assume EVERYONE who owns a Rolex is looking your attention. In 14 years of watch collecting, I can count on one hand a non-watch enthusiast us struck up a conversation. And guess what? It was never a Rolex on my wrist.
> 
> Keep riding that high horse of yours buddy - Merry Christmas! We’re not worthy to be in the same forum as you, your moral compass is so high. Teach us more.
> 
> And by the way.. literally NOBODY here has “extolled” the superiority of Rolex. You seem to be the only person taking offence to nothing. The OP himself brought Rolex into the conversation.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


You say: *"literally NOBODY here has “extolled” the superiority of Rolex".*

What does the following say to you when viewed in a Cartier Group? Does that imply that one should buy a Cartier or that by buying a Rolex, they would have the only watch they need? 

*"I'm 1000% biased, but I think the 39mm Explorer is the only watch one needs."*

So, you stay on your high horse, wear your Rolex and continue to agree that a Rolex is the only watch one needs.


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## Pun

mjrchabot said:


> Yes and? I’m not following your logic. I got 20% off my steel Santos. If I received a similar discount on the TT, I’m still looking at ~50% more than what I paid for steel.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


There is some confusion perhaps. I read your post and understood that you said TT was 50% more expensive than steel model and tried to inform you that it was only 20% more expensive than steel when I bought it in 2019. Merry Christmas.


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## deepfriedicecubes

Xaltotun said:


> I'm 1000% biased, but I think the 39mm Explorer is the _only_ watch one needs.


Had a 39mm explorer once. It is great as a one GADA watch collection, but it doesn't work very well as part of a collection. Being a black dial dressy sport watch meant a lot of overlap with your other sport watches but never dressy enough compared to a dress watch. The santos would work pretty well as a one watch and as a part of a collection, as a white squared dial can be quite different from the rest of the collection, which for most ppl consists of at least one black sports watch.


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## SaoDavi

deepfriedicecubes said:


> Had a 39mm explorer once. It is great as a one GADA watch collection, but it doesn't work very well as part of a collection. Being a black dial dressy sport watch meant a lot of overlap with your other sport watches but never dressy enough compared to a dress watch. The santos would work pretty well as a one watch and as a part of a collection, as a white squared dial can be quite different from the rest of the collection, which for most ppl consists of at least one black sports watch.


This is some solid reasoning, IMO. 

Just this week I started to arrive at this same conclusion regarding my Aqua Terra.

In a moderate-sized collection, a "one-watch" GADA is superfluous as there is usually a better, more appropriate watch that could be worn.

Plus, the GADA is stealing one of the limited spaces that could be used for something else.


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## badgerracer

deepfriedicecubes said:


> Had a 39mm explorer once. It is great as a one GADA watch collection, but it doesn't work very well as part of a collection. Being a black dial dressy sport watch meant a lot of overlap with your other sport watches but never dressy enough compared to a dress watch. The santos would work pretty well as a one watch and as a part of a collection, as a white squared dial can be quite different from the rest of the collection, which for most ppl consists of at least one black sports watch.


I also agree with this sentiment. I have had the new 36mm explorer and the medium santos for about a month each now, so not super long. I have had them long enough to know that if I was to sell every watch I own but one, I would keep the explorer. But if I was to sell one of the two right now and keep the rest of my collection I would keep the santos. The santos feels much more special and unique and despite its dressiness I have no problem wearing it with jeans and a T-shirt (my attire most of the time). Still though there is probably no better one watch collection than the explorer 


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## mjrchabot

badgerracer said:


> I also agree with this sentiment. I have had the new 36mm explorer and the medium santos for about a month each now, so not super long. I have had them long enough to know that if I was to sell every watch I own but one, I would keep the explorer. But if I was to sell one of the two right now and keep the rest of my collection I would keep the santos. The santos feels much more special and unique and despite its dressiness I have no problem wearing it with jeans and a T-shirt (my attire most of the time). Still though there is probably no better one watch collection than the explorer
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


As an owner of both as well, I echo your comments! 
It’s odd how at home the Santos feels with jeans and a t-shirt actually. The Explorer is a great watch, and feels as tough as nails. However, the Santos feels very special and every detail seems well thought out. I felt this way from the moment I handled it for the first time. 


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## Chrono Brewer

Totally works from casual to black tie. Not sure if this combo dresses the Santos up or down, but I found a nice and _cheap_ titanium wedding band mostly brushed with polished flathead screws and midline. Look like they were made for each other. Link here for anyone with neurotic tendencies.


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## Brooke3

SaddleSC said:


> As a long term owner (for nearly two entire days) I am still as in love with this watch as the day it was purchased


Ditto (3weeks)


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## Brooke3

stebesplace said:


> checking to see that the button is flush when the end link is seated, mine was slightly depressed still.


Similar issue, though it didn’t result in a drop/fall. As I looked at the buckle (brand new watch and I was admiring it) I noticed that the spring pin (is that the term?) wasn’t quite set. You need to be sure you hear the _click_


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## Brooke3

Stchambe said:


> As a follow-up, I walked into a Cartier store the other day. They didn't have the all-steel version in stock but they did have a two-tone which I tried on. Ended up asking them to order an all-steel, which should arrive in the November timeframe.


I had a similar situation in Paris in December. TT were available, but no steel to be found in the Boutiques (I was looking for the medium).


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## Chrono Brewer

Brooke3 said:


> Similar issue, though it didn’t result in a drop/fall. As I looked at the buckle (brand new watch and I was admiring it) I noticed that the spring pin (is that the term?) wasn’t quite set. You need to be sure you hear the _click_


I often put it on and find just pressing the two sides from above doesn’t click and secure both; too much give against my wrist. Need to put a finger under the clasp for resistance and squeeze.


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## powerband

I’ve owned mine for an entire month so I want to ring in that this has been the most consistent time keeper throughout: +2 seconds per day no matter how it’s worn or what position it’s stored. When worn, no other watch I’ve owned in the past 20 years comes close to being as comfortable or better looking… and I’ve owned plenty. So, I am confident that I’ll leave a comment in this thread in a decade.


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## Jprocs24

Sorry to revive a thread from the past, but I'd like owners opinions on how you're enjoying your watches almost a year later? I'm thinking of picking one up. I am very curious on if the bracelet is a hair puller or if it's similar to Rolex in that it leaves my monkey arms alone. Cheers!


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## Pun

Jprocs24 said:


> Sorry to revive a thread from the past, but I'd like owners opinions on how you're enjoying your watches almost a year later? I'm thinking of picking one up. I am very curious on if the bracelet is a hair puller or if it's similar to Rolex in that it leaves my monkey arms alone. Cheers!


My assessment of more than 3 years of ownership is very satisfying. It's one of my







the most comfortable watch with zero issues, whatsoever.


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## Micjeffe

I’m holding off on a Santos because of the industrial screws vibe means - to me, it’s sport only (T shirt/polo/athleisure) and makes me want to pair it with something else with screws. 

Definitely not a do everything watch, but would probably wear it for most normal day to day occasions if I had one.


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## Chrono Brewer

Jprocs24 said:


> Sorry to revive a thread from the past, but I'd like owners opinions on how you're enjoying your watches almost a year later? I'm thinking of picking one up. I am very curious on if the bracelet is a hair puller or if it's similar to Rolex in that it leaves my monkey arms alone. Cheers!


Not once felt a pulled hair in the time I’ve worn it on the bracelet.


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## Pun

Micjeffe said:


> Definitely not a do everything watch, but would probably wear it for most normal day to day occasions if I had one.


With 100m water resistance I believe it can be taken as "do everything watch" as cartier style and finish qualifies it for other more classier places, except perhaps a black tie event.


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## Jprocs24

Chrono Brewer said:


> Not once felt a pulled hair in the time I’ve worn it on the bracelet.


Glad to hear it! I'm hoping to go and try on the large Santos with the white dial, and the ADLC bezel version as well.


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## oztech

I have only had mine since Thanksgiving but I will say it is very comfortable and legible at the same time it is very classy.


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## Micjeffe

Pun said:


> With 100m water resistance I believe it can be taken as "do everything watch" as cartier style and finish qualifies it for other more classier places, except perhaps a black tie event.


I don’t know, for me think the screws/industrial design makes it hard for me to wear to classy attire, like suit & tie, tux, wedding, formal events. If you are wearing dress shoes, then I’d wear something different. Just my sense.


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## oztech

Not at all AP has screw heads around the bezel and it works quite well with a suit I have worn my Santos with a suit it works very well with almost everything.


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## Micjeffe

oztech said:


> Not at all AP has screw heads around the bezel and it works quite well with a suit I have worn my Santos with a suit it works very well with almost everything.


Those Royal oaks are stunning but same here - they belong on a sailing yacht captain, a tennis or a polo match at a country club - not a black tie event. It’s a quintessential “sport” watch to me, which works for 99% of all occasions, except those occasions that are really serious. That’s just how I see those designs.


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## Chrono Brewer

Cartier does make matching cuff links.









What kind of watch would you consider appropriate for a black tie occasion? Just a polished two-hander with a black or white dial? Speaking as one wearing a tux.


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## Micjeffe

Chrono Brewer said:


> Cartier does make matching cuff links.
> View attachment 17086056
> 
> 
> What kind of watch would you consider appropriate for a black tie occasion? Just a polished two-hander with a black or white dial? Speaking as one wearing a tux.


Something simple and elegant like a lot of Tanks, Piaget, iwc portofinos…


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## Jprocs24

Managed to try on the white & adlc bezel version today. The ADLC version was reflecting light like crazy, where the white cut it down and was far more legible.

Does anyone here have the ADLC bezel version that can chime in on real world reflections & legibility? The size, fit, and bracelet are phenomenal. It'll be a tough pick between this, the Speedmaster 3861, and Explorer II.


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## Jonathan T

I tried on a medium santos a few months ago. The medium fit so much better than the large. Loved it. Hope to be able to add it to my collection eventually


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## TwoToneHappyness

Jprocs24 said:


> Managed to try on the white & adlc bezel version today. The ADLC version was reflecting light like crazy, where the white cut it down and was far more legible.
> 
> Does anyone here have the ADLC bezel version that can chime in on real world reflections & legibility? The size, fit, and bracelet are phenomenal. It'll be a tough pick between this, the Speedmaster 3861, and Explorer II.


just get all three 
In my experience the Santos will be the most comfortable and versitile with the strap change mechanism. I have have a white dial santos and legibility is great, tried on a full adlc and didn’t have many issues with eligibility at all. I didn’t get on with the speed master - it’s too thick and bulky. The Rollie is very nice more like a cross between the other two and very solid but I am more of a Datejust man…


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## Stchambe

Jprocs24 said:


> Sorry to revive a thread from the past, but I'd like owners opinions on how you're enjoying your watches almost a year later? I'm thinking of picking one up. I am very curious on if the bracelet is a hair puller or if it's similar to Rolex in that it leaves my monkey arms alone. Cheers!


As a follow up to this thread:

I actually ended up getting one of the new 124270 explorers a few months after getting the santos. the two watches have rotated out of my collection as of a few months ago but I have been recently thinking about picking up a medium santos again. Kind of waiting to see what next year has to offer and quietly waiting to see if a smaller octo finissimo is announced.

After owning both the santos and the explorer for a while, I think @badgerracer's assessment is accurate.



badgerracer said:


> I also agree with this sentiment. I have had the new 36mm explorer and the medium santos for about a month each now, so not super long. I have had them long enough to know that if I was to sell every watch I own but one, I would keep the explorer. But if I was to sell one of the two right now and keep the rest of my collection I would keep the santos. The santos feels much more special and unique and despite its dressiness I have no problem wearing it with jeans and a T-shirt (my attire most of the time). Still though there is probably no better one watch collection than the explorer


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## badgerracer

Stchambe said:


> As a follow up to this thread:
> 
> I actually ended up getting one of the new 124270 explorers a few months after getting the santos. the two watches have rotated out of my collection as of a few months ago but I have been recently thinking about picking up a medium santos again. Kind of waiting to see what next year has to offer and quietly waiting to see if a smaller octo finissimo is announced.
> 
> After owning both the santos and the explorer for a while, I think @badgerracer's assessment is accurate.


I am actually right around the 1 year mark with both the santos and Explorer, and I think my thoughts are still mostly the same. The explorer has grown on me more over time and I really don’t know which I prefer. Both are without a doubt my 2 favorite watches in my collection. 

I will say although I have no problem wearing my santos daily, I am more conscious of it when it is on my wrist out of a fear of scratching the bezel. Right now my wife and I are in the middle of a cross-country move, and when hauling boxes to the garage I am more nervous around about banging it on a wall than my other watches, including the explorer. Which is strange because the explorer also had a polished bezel. Maybe it is because the allure to the santos is more of the case/bracelet/finishing whereas the explorer to me is more about the dial/hands? Or maybe it is because I think of the explorer as being more ok being a bit scratched up as a field watch compared to the santos being more dressy? 

That aside I still have no problem wearing it, and it is absolutely a favorite in my collection. More so than any other watch it has that special feeling that I don’t get from anything else. I bought a few custom straps from Delugs to wear with it when I want to mix it up from the bracelet and it looks stunning on them. I’m really hoping Delugs releases a rubber strap soon as I think that would do wonders to being out its sporty side


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## Micjeffe

badgerracer said:


> I am actually right around the 1 year mark with both the santos and Explorer, and I think my thoughts are still mostly the same. The explorer has grown on me more over time and I really don’t know which I prefer. Both are without a doubt my 2 favorite watches in my collection.
> 
> I will say although I have no problem wearing my santos daily, I am more conscious of it when it is on my wrist out of a fear of scratching the bezel. Right now my wife and I are in the middle of a cross-country move, and when hauling boxes to the garage I am more nervous around about banging it on a wall than my other watches, including the explorer. Which is strange because the explorer also had a polished bezel. Maybe it is because the allure to the santos is more of the case/bracelet/finishing whereas the explorer to me is more about the dial/hands? Or maybe it is because I think of the explorer as being more ok being a bit scratched up as a field watch compared to the santos being more dressy?
> 
> That aside I still have no problem wearing it, and it is absolutely a favorite in my collection. More so than any other watch it has that special feeling that I don’t get from anything else. I bought a few custom straps from Delugs to wear with it when I want to mix it up from the bracelet and it looks stunning on them. I’m really hoping Delugs releases a rubber strap soon as I think that would do wonders to being out its sporty side
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


I think we should stop equating rubber plastic as "sport". That's the Nike and Lululemon marketing influencing you. True gentleman's sport and luxury is metal and leather, if you're going plastic synthetics - at least carbon fiber.


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## Delugs

Micjeffe said:


> I think we should stop equating rubber plastic as "sport". That's the Nike and Lululemon marketing influencing you. True gentleman's sport and luxury is metal and leather, if you're going plastic synthetics - at least carbon fiber.


I never quite understood how or why sports watches are metal. Personally if I'm doing anything remotely sporty, I would prefer rubber. Care to enlighten? is it just a marketing thing that's been going on for decades and we've kind of just accepted it by now?


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## Micjeffe

Delugs said:


> I never quite understood how or why sports watches are metal. Personally if I'm doing anything remotely sporty, I would prefer rubber. Care to enlighten? is it just a marketing thing that's been going on for decades and we've kind of just accepted it by now?


Plastic is a fantastic material and cheap, for swimming or playing some football it's lightweight, water resistant, and if it rips probably not an issue since they're cheap (and durable, so not likely). I think that's how the athletic appeal crossed over to the "sport" territory.

I think it's fine if you're wearing a Casio, but to put one on a luxury watch feels off to me. I'm not playing rough sports or going swimming in a Santos. Although I might go for some golf. Metal or leather suits the sporty golf vibe just great IMO. I like the old etymological derivation of sport to equal "leisure" rather than athletics.

I am however definitely biased - I am generally antiplastic for their cheapness and environmental impact. Plastic has great uses in our world of semiconductors, transport, and materials properties like (insulation, barriers, etc). I am generally not a fan of it in fashion and luxury.


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## dantan

I have owned my Cartier Santos for over four years.

It remains my most frequently worn Watch, and it is as wonderful as when I purchased it.


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