# Fortis reportedly filed for bankruptcy



## rayaring

Fortis reportedly filed for bankruptcy

https://horologium.com.au/2017/11/29/industry-news-fortis-in-bankruptcy-debt-deferral/


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## Alansmithee

Sad news but the first of many smaller brands in the current climate.


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## anrex

Sad news.


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## BEEG

Ugh, I hope they'll manage to pull it trough till May next year. The current CEO was having businesses in China, maybe he can find financing from there...


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## CGSshorty

Fortis has not filed for bankruptcy, is not insolvent, is still in full production mode and will have no layoffs.

Here is the official press release directly from the company:

Fortis Uhren AG has voluntarily applied for a temporary composition, which has been approved by the court of Solothurn on November 20, 2017.

The company’s board of directors and management have taken this measure to enable the continuation a restructuring program, which will assure the healthy contingency of the company. 

Contrary to media reports the company is not experiencing any acute liquidity problems, but was not able to depict the continuation of liquidity during one year. As correctly stated there are currently no executions against Fortis Uhren AG.

During the composition Fortis Uhren AG will work on a restructuring plan with its creditors to ensure the legal and economical existence of the company.

It is the declared goal to finalize this process with no layoffs in the company and no interruptions in the operational sides of the business.

We thank you for your understanding and continued support.

Fortis Uhren AG


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## bentelus

Dear FORTIS-Fans,please find below the official statement by FORTIS.FORTIS UHREN AG has voluntarily applied for a temporary composition, which has been approved by the court of Solothurn on 20 November 2017.The company’s board of directors and management have taken this measure to enable the continuation a restructuring program, which will assure the healthy contingency of the company.Contrary to media reports the company is not experiencing any acute liquidity problems, but was not able to depict the continuation of liquidity during one year. As correctly stated there are currently no executions against FORTIS UHREN AG.During the composition FORTIS UHREN AG will work on a restructuring plan with its creditors to ensure the legal and economical existence of the company.It is the declared goal to finalize this process with no layoffs in the company and no interruptions in the operational sides of the business.We thank you for your understanding and continued support.FORTIS UHREN AG


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## PolishX

Good to hear, was gonna be a little annoyed if I just got a watch from a company folding up shop


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## Alansmithee

Em.. that really says that we hope to work it out and the *goal* is to survive - in that situation, creditors can collapse the company as they try to make sure they get paid or start to stop providing materials.. 

So they might be ok but nobody enters this process for fun...


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## Room237

I thought about getting a Fortis, but realized that a Rolex may be a better choice. This thread really helped make my decision.


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## PolishX

Wow, Really you were considering a Fortis then went Rolex ? Troll very much ? The watches aren't even in the same class. Nice try


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## Bradjhomes

Room237 said:


> I thought about getting a Fortis, but realized that a Rolex may be a better choice. This thread really helped make my decision.


The worst part is that you made the same trollish comment on another Fortis thread the other day and no one took the bait.

If all you want to do is troll, your time here will be brief.


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## Jashley73

*bentelus* - I follow you on Instagram, and I assume that you work for Fortis.

My one recommendation to Fortis, from a buyer's perspective, is to bring out some of the existing watches with different _dial_ options. If you guys had a Marinemaster in navy-blue dial & bezel, with yellow/green hands for example - I think you'd have trouble keeping them in-stock... Same for the "Classic" & "Official" Cosmonautis lines too - A navy blue dial/bezel combo, especially on the "classic" cosomonatis would be killer.

I mean no disrespect, but I would scrap then entire "Terristis" line as well. The styling of the watches looks completely ad-hoc, and doesn't scream "good, clean design" like the rest of the Fortis lineup. The designs don't stand up on their own, and they don't "fit" with the rest of the lineup either...

I personally think the Aviatis-Pilot line works very, very well as a "dressier Fortis" option. Expand this series with white/silver/navy blue dial options, and brown/navy blue strap options and you'd have a much more appealing line of "dress Fortis" watches than what's in the Terristis line now. These Aviatis-Pilot watches have a much more coherent design on their own, and they also "fit" very well within the rest of the Fortis lineup too.

I hope you receive the criticism & suggestions well, and take them for what they are - not a "critic's" review - but feedback from what one of your customers "wants" to see/buy from Fortis, that isn't already there... I really hope you all work through the financial issues and continue in business for many, many years. I love my Flieger-Professional, and hope that Fortis is around for years to come, to add more of your watches to my collection. _(In Navy & Silver dials...!)

All the best & God Bless!
_


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## Gerrard8

I am sorry to hear this. 
I bought a flieger pro, and have been considering cosmonauts classical chrono ceramic AM.

They are great value for money. Unlike some micro watch assemblers, they truly have know-how in watch making. 
Compared with some other brands at this price, I found they use better materials, such as case, dial, glass etc..
Maybe this is one reason they are in trouble, just like honest people are vulnerable to be punished. 

I hope they survive through better marketing, and low cost design twists, as Jashley suggested. Not through cheaper and lower quality materials.


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## 74notserpp

I too wish they get through this. 
I have 3 beauties. A Flieger Pro Chrono, Pilot Pro Chrono and Marinemaster Chrono.
The value for money is superb, and even more so with the latest pricing policies in North America and Australia.
Personally, I tell friends to look at Fortis because the quality is amazing for the price especially when compared to other brands. I also like many Fortis posts on Instagram, so hopefully every little bit of exposure helps.






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## FLUGZEUG

I sincerely hope they do resolve their difficulties without have to sell their soul to an Asian holding company or compromise on manufacturing/materials. After I retired from the Navy, I came across a great watch that was built like a tank. The Spacematic impressed me from the moment I saw it, with a solid very comfortable bracelet with screw link pins. What closed the deal was the innovative crown protector, a screw down surrounded by a shroud. The brand name also had a bit to do with it too!

*Semper Fortis*


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## PJR

I've owned two Fortis watches. A limited edition 24 hour watch (since sold) and a B42 Flieger. It doesn't come as a surprise to me that the company is in trouble and sought bankruptcy protection. 

Fortis has suffered under lackluster management and marketing. Their North American sales and warranty service are a joke. When Gevril was the official agent my dealings with them were unsatisfactory. Now it is Watch Buys who may be better but they are primarily an on-line operation. While some of the newer Fortis designs are appealing and prices have come down somewhat IMO watches get sold more often when buyers can see them in person at storefront ADs. 

Fortis watches are reasonable value for the price but certainly nothing special. You can get watches of equal quality from Alpina, Longines and Oris to name a few. Meanwhile, other similar brands, notably Oris, outshines Fortis with a far better dealer and service network. 

My B42 was bought on impulse from an AD in Eastern Europe for a price that was at least a third less than the North American price at the time. I have no complaints with it but it is not superior to watches in a similar price range from other makers.

Hopefully Fortis can come through there current problems but if it doesn't the company has only itself to blame.


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## Gerrard8

Regarding marketing, I do agree. And do not understand how Fortis could underperform for such long.
For example, even until now, there is nearly no existence of Fortis in China. A very small and almost unkown representative (third party) only.. Foris sell hundreds of watches per year in China?
This could be either ignorance or arrogance, either way, it is a sort of shame (if not crime) against Fortis themselves.

On the other side, their recent price (especially at US and Australia, I do not understand why P&C at UK increase price back after dropping) is much lower compared with many others. 
I have been following some German micro brands, for example, Archimede, with truly in-house case (and hands now), is a great value for money, compared with some other German peers. Their 7750 powered chronograph is around 1800 euro. 
Fortis Classical Choronograph (even with ceramic bezel) is at the same price.

It is difficult to find another cheaper one with quality at this league. 
Oris and Longines are more expensive, not to mention Tag, IWC...


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## 74notserpp

Not sure if this is related, but I went to check the Page and Cooper site and they no longer stock Fortis.


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## Thiudans

Watchbuys still has them. I spoke with Watchbuys about the bankruptcy and they said it is not a but deal. Time will tell.


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## 74notserpp

Thiudans said:


> Watchbuys still has them. I spoke with Watchbuys about the bankruptcy and they said it is not a but deal. Time will tell.


There are two ADs here in Oz that still stock them, so here's hoping all is well. 
I was a little surprised to not see them on the P+C site as they used to be big supporters of the brand.

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## gullwinggt

74notserpp said:


> There are two ADs here in Oz that still stock them, so here's hoping all is well.
> I was a little surprised to not see them on the P+C site as they used to be big supporters of the brand.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


I was surprised too, since I was watching some of their Fortis videos. Looks to me like it must have happened after Watchbuys became their online distributor. Makes sense if you think about it a Jeweler cannot compete with the likes of online distributor.


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## Jashley73

gullwinggt said:


> I was surprised too, since I was watching some of their Fortis videos. Looks to me like it must have happened after Watchbuys became their online distributor. Makes sense if you think about it a Jeweler cannot compete with the likes of online distributor.


Watchbuys sells in the USA. I thought Page & Cooper sold in the UK...? I can't see much competition between them...


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## impetusera

PJR said:


> I've owned two Fortis watches. A limited edition 24 hour watch (since sold) and a B42 Flieger. It doesn't come as a surprise to me that the company is in trouble and sought bankruptcy protection.
> 
> Fortis has suffered under lackluster management and marketing. Their North American sales and warranty service are a joke. When Gevril was the official agent my dealings with them were unsatisfactory. Now it is Watch Buys who may be better but they are primarily an on-line operation. While some of the newer Fortis designs are appealing and prices have come down somewhat IMO watches get sold more often when buyers can see them in person at storefront ADs.
> 
> Fortis watches are reasonable value for the price but certainly nothing special. You can get watches of equal quality from Alpina, Longines and Oris to name a few. Meanwhile, other similar brands, notably Oris, outshines Fortis with a far better dealer and service network.
> 
> My B42 was bought on impulse from an AD in Eastern Europe for a price that was at least a third less than the North American price at the time. I have no complaints with it but it is not superior to watches in a similar price range from other makers.
> 
> Hopefully Fortis can come through there current problems but if it doesn't the company has only itself to blame.


I don't think Gevril did anything good for Fortis in the US. Watchbuys at least got them to lower the pricing in this market which is necessary to compete with gray market sales. I don't necessarily think a physical AD is as necessary as competitive pricing, solid service department and good marketing. If a watch is dependable and good value you can start sales with marketing and then keep it rolling from exposure and word of mouth. I think Watchbuys has made a good start in the US and hopefully RGM provides better service than Gevril. Based on the old Fortis pricing here it made sense to give up factory warranty and save a bunch buying gray market as these are just ETA movements easily serviced. Why pay a bunch more to send it to Gevril to be scratched up and sent back in worse shape?


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## 74notserpp

Jashley73 said:


> Watchbuys sells in the USA. I thought Page & Cooper sold in the UK...? I can't see much competition between them...


Agreed. P&C were the Fortis AD in the UK.
I remember a while ago P&C were active here as Forum sponsors, but unfortunately had to stop as Fortis HQ were told that WUS is a US forum and they were upsetting distributors.
I don't see WB being as active as P&C were on here since...
A real shame IMO.

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## Jashley73

74notserpp said:


> Agreed. P&C were the Fortis AD in the UK.
> I remember a while ago P&C were active here as Forum sponsors, but unfortunately had to stop as Fortis HQ were told that WUS is a US forum and they were upsetting distributors.
> I don't see WB being as active as P&C were on here since...
> A real shame IMO.


To be fair, I think WatchBuys is a small outfit, and they probably aren't too concerned with spending valuable portions of their day online. They are extremely patient & giving with their time on the phone & email thru customer support. I'll trade their absence from the forum, for great service...


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## 74notserpp

Jashley73 said:


> To be fair, I think WatchBuys is a small outfit, and they probably aren't too concerned with spending valuable portions of their day online. They are extremely patient & giving with their time on the phone & email thru customer support. I'll trade their absence from the forum, for great service...


To clarify, I didn't mean anything against Watchbuys for their customer service. 
P&C were active on here providing information and supporting the Fortis brand. They also did great YouTube reviews which I'll miss.

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## Gopher

I have purchased three watches (2 Fortis and a Sinn) through WB and have nothing but good things to say about their service. And given the number of brands they represent along with their limited resources, it would be tough for them to be active on the forums.


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## Thiudans

I think Watchbuys will ship to Australia for like $5.00 US.


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## eljay

Thiudans said:


> I think Watchbuys will ship to Australia for like $5.00 US.


Maybe, however Australians looking to purchase from an AD could be better off using the local distributor, Watchpartners, depending on the model.


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## Thiudans

I didn't know there was an AD in Australia, so yes, you are correct.


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## mr2manycars

To me, Fortis is in that akward pricing range where they aren't high end, and they aren't cheap. They should either up the quality and try to compete with omega tier brands at a lower price point, or drop it and try to compete with seiko tier brands.


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## 74notserpp

Thiudans said:


> I didn't know there was an AD in Australia, so yes, you are correct.





eljay said:


> Maybe, however Australians looking to purchase from an AD could be better off using the local distributor, Watchpartners, depending on the model.


There are two ADs that I know of.
Watchpartners and Definewatches.

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## Thiudans

I have a Fortis and a Hamilton. Both are well built and accurate (Hamilton ~+ 2spd and Fortis ~+ 3.5 SPD), both look great. But the Fortis is a cut above the Hamilton in build quality, in my opinion. Again, I like the Hammy a lot, but i think the fortis is built as welll as a $2000 to $3000 watch. 

The Hamilton lists for $1795 and the Fortis lists for $1462. I bought both from ADs (Hamilton for Below list via Topper, Fortis at list via Watchbuys). The Fortis cost only a little more than I paid for the Hamilton. I think they have already followed your business model.


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## eljay

74notserpp said:


> There are two ADs that I know of.
> Watchpartners and Definewatches.


Ahh, I didn't realise Define carried Fortis. I don't recall seeing Fortis in any of their print ads.

Interestingly "watchbuys.com.au" redirects to Define...


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## 74notserpp

eljay said:


> Ahh, I didn't realise Define carried Fortis. I don't recall seeing Fortis in any of their print ads.
> 
> Interestingly "watchbuys.com.au" redirects to Define...


Maybe about 6-8 months ago they started selling Fortis.

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## impetusera

mr2manycars said:


> To me, Fortis is in that akward pricing range where they aren't high end, and they aren't cheap. They should either up the quality and try to compete with omega tier brands at a lower price point, or drop it and try to compete with seiko tier brands.


As a privately owned company they don't have the financial backing of Swatch or Seiko Holdings so it's a big gamble to put assets into producing higher tier watches with higher prices that people will probably still consider a notch below Omega tier. If they drop quality and price then people will just ..... about lower quality and they also don't have the assets to put out a variety that would rival what Seiko has available. They still source their movements from ETA which is a Swatch group member. Seiko stamps out their own movements so they're way ahead on lowering their own cost. Labor costs are probably lower in all the Asian countries Seiko manufacturers in than at the Fortis factory in Grenchen Switzerland. Probably 1 year of revenue at Swatch or Seiko exceeds the combined revenue of the entire existence of Fortis. I see Fortis being like a family lumber/hardware store feeling the pinch of Home Depot. It's hard for them to compete and likely at some point they will no longer be a privately held company but another brand of a conglomerate or backed by Asian money.


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## Jashley73

mr2manycars said:


> To me, Fortis is in that akward pricing range where they aren't high end, and they aren't cheap. They should either up the quality and try to compete with omega tier brands at a lower price point, or drop it and try to compete with seiko tier brands.


I think either move would be suicide. I'm not sure what Fortis' profit margins are, but trying to compete with Seiko on the low-end? Are you kidding me? It would be a long and arduous road to try and compete with the Japanese/Asians on manufacturing en masse, where the economies of scale show a payback. The Japanese are the best in the world at automation & low-cost-high-quality manufacturing. And Seiko & Citizen have at least enough name recognition, that when people see them in the department store jewelry counter, they know they're "good enough" to spend their money on.

Outside of the watch enthusiasts community, Fortis doesn't have that. Not enough to help them in the low-end market, and certainly not enough to be considered fairly against the higher-end names like Omega, Rolex, etc...

What Fortis needs to do, is only slightly mix up their current offerings, and then focus their marketing efforts exactly toward people *1-* already familiar with names like Hamilton, Longines, Tag Heuer, and yes - even people looking for an Omega/Rolex, but who don't have the budget... and/or *2-* Target the people with that kind of money to spend, but looking to buy their first watch.

Fortis has some really great pieces, and they offer some excellent value. I think by trimming a couple models, and then offering some better color/variety options on the remaining models, and then marketing the crap out of them, they will do well...


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## PJR

Fortis should probably stay right where it is and not try and compete up or down. They've already made positive changes having adjusted their current line-up, dropped some of the goofier looking Spacematics, limited the "limited editions" and there is no sign of the clownish and often bizarre "art house" models like the "Frisson." Yeah, great idea. A watch people can't read. :roll: 

They changed their NA distributor from the under-performing Gevril to Watchbuys, established a reliable service center in NA, focused on on-line sales and are producing some new and very attractive designs. My experiences with Fortis were not encouraging but the Shoreliner Lighthouse and Terrestis series have definitely caught my attention. 

Whether this is enough to keep them solvent will be seen. If a conglomerate were to absorb them I'd prefer it be Swatch. Fortis models could fit in above Hamilton/Tissot and offer a different selection and similar quality to Longines.


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## Thiudans

PJR said:


> Fortis should probably stay right where it is and not try and compete up or down. They've already made positive changes having adjusted their current line-up, dropped some of the goofier looking Spacematics, limited the "limited editions" and there is no sign of the clownish and often bizarre "art house" models like the "Frisson." Yeah, great idea. A watch people can't read. :roll:
> 
> They changed their NA distributor from the under-performing Gevril to Watchbuys, established a reliable service center in NA, focused on on-line sales and are producing some new and very attractive designs. My experiences with Fortis were not encouraging but the Shoreliner Lighthouse and Terrestis series have definitely caught my attention.
> 
> Whether this is enough to keep them solvent will be seen. If a conglomerate were to absorb them I'd prefer it be Swatch. Fortis models could fit in above Hamilton/Tissot and offer a different selection and similar quality to Longines.


I would like to see them remain independent, but that may not be viable. They are pretty small potatoes--~ $12,400,000 in revenue per year.

OTH, Maybe LMVH would be s better suitor if it came to that? They lack a tool-watch/affordable brand--but that may be their business model. ISTM that Fortis is only marginally "better" than e.g. Hamilton and would cannibalize that brand, or vice versa. (I like my Hamilton a LOT).

On the other hand, Fortis seems like an ETA shop.....


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## impetusera

PJR said:


> Fortis should probably stay right where it is and not try and compete up or down. They've already made positive changes having adjusted their current line-up, dropped some of the goofier looking Spacematics, limited the "limited editions" and there is no sign of the clownish and often bizarre "art house" models like the "Frisson." Yeah, great idea. A watch people can't read. :roll:
> 
> They changed their NA distributor from the under-performing Gevril to Watchbuys, established a reliable service center in NA, focused on on-line sales and are producing some new and very attractive designs. My experiences with Fortis were not encouraging but the Shoreliner Lighthouse and Terrestis series have definitely caught my attention.
> 
> Whether this is enough to keep them solvent will be seen. If a conglomerate were to absorb them I'd prefer it be Swatch. Fortis models could fit in above Hamilton/Tissot and offer a different selection and similar quality to Longines.


Fortis colors was probably the worst thing ever. I wouldn't be surprised to see them become part of Swatch group. They already have a close relationship with ETA which is a Swatch company and in the same village.


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## PJR

impetusera said:


> Fortis colors was probably the worst thing ever. I wouldn't be surprised to see them become part of Swatch group. They already have a close relationship with ETA which is a Swatch company and in the same village.


Colors was a serious degradation of their brand. It would be like the Swatch Group putting the Omega logo on a Swatch. Just dumb. At least Fortis has split Colors off their main website and put it on a stand-alone site.


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## Gopher

Fortis is very underappreciated. I fault marketing and distribution for their issues. I have owned, Hamilton, Sinn, Omega, and Fortis. Coworkers have Rolex. I can say that Fortis quality is well above Hamilton, as good or better than Sinn, and not far behind Omega (but you don't get embellished or in-house movements, of course). And I have evaluated Longines at my AD, but Fortis is better.

Fortis value in my experience is second to none, especially with the new pricing. My collection now consists of only Fortis and Omega for that reason. I have tried adding others but keep getting drawn back to Fortis for its value and compelling designs.


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## Thiudans

Gopher said:


> Fortis is very underappreciated. I fault marketing and distribution for their issues. I have owned, Hamilton, Sinn, Omega, and Fortis. Coworkers have Rolex. I can say that Fortis quality is well above Hamilton, as good or better than Sinn, and not far behind Omega (but you don't get embellished or in-house movements, of course). And I have evaluated Longines at my AD, but Fortis is better.
> 
> Fortis value in my experience is second to none, especially with the new pricing. My collection now consists of only Fortis and Omega for that reason. I have tried adding others but keep getting drawn back to Fortis for its value and compelling designs.


They don't have the tech that Sinn has in their higher level watches. But with the new pricing they are very competitive. I hope they can pull through.


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## Gopher

Good point but the high-tech Sinn models are ~2-3x the price. I had a lower-tech model (356) in similar price range of Fortis (but still slightly more $).


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## PJR

Gopher said:


> Fortis is very underappreciated. I fault marketing and distribution for their issues. I have owned, Hamilton, Sinn, Omega, and Fortis. Coworkers have Rolex. I can say that Fortis quality is well above Hamilton, as good or better than Sinn, and not far behind Omega (but you don't get embellished or in-house movements, of course). And I have evaluated Longines at my AD, but Fortis is better.
> 
> Fortis value in my experience is second to none, especially with the new pricing. My collection now consists of only Fortis and Omega for that reason. I have tried adding others but keep getting drawn back to Fortis for its value and compelling designs.


I'd put Fortis on par with Oris, Longines, Tutima, slightly behind Sinn but further behind Omega. We completely agree on their marketing and distribution.

Although having heard of the brand, the first Fortis I saw were on a business trip in Sofia, Bulgaria. The AD had a large window display for the brand and a good selection of watches. The Canadian dollar was stronger at the time, Bulgarian currency was weak and the VAT-free European pricing made them very attractive. I came home with a B-42 Flieger.

The problems arose when a minor issue came up during the warranty period. When I bought the watch I noted the literature listed a Canadian service center. When contacted they informed me their relationship with Fortis had recently ended and I'd have to ship to Gevril in New York state. My less than satisfactory experiences getting this matter resolved with Gevril as well as having them replace a stripped crown on Fortis 24-hour a few years left me a little sour on the brand.


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## Gopher

Sorry to hear that. I have read horror stories about Gevril servicing. Fortunately, I have not needed repairs and have a local watchmaker who does my routine service. I have seven Fortis models and they have been great. The screw-down crown on my 10-year-old Pilot Pro is close to failing, so it will require repair in the next year or two, I figure. This is my only issue in over a decade with multiple watches, so I have been very impressed with the durability. Will see soon how the latest service center works out.

I find the Fortis cases very well done and refined for the price. My Sinn was rougher and others mentioned (not Omega) just looked and felt a bit cheaper. I have not handled Oris or Tutima.


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## nemozeco

Did the company restructuring period coincides with the release of the new models?


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## Ultralinear

Room237 said:


> I thought about getting a Fortis, but realized that a Rolex may be a better choice. This thread really helped make my decision.


Really?

Wobbling between Fortis & Rolex?

Ok...


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## Andras Gyorffy

They are now back on track with new models.


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